The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Ethics, Veganism and Myq Kaplan

Episode Date: March 24, 2023

Myq has appeared on the Tonight Show, Conan, Letterman, James Corden, Seth Meyers, Comedy Central, Last Comic Standing, and America’s Got Talent. He has a one-hour standup special on Amazon, “Small, Dork, and Handsome,” and is a regular at The Comedy Cellar.

This is Live from the Table, a Comedy Cellar-affiliated podcast, coming at you on Sirius XM 99, Raw Dog, and the Laugh Button Podcast Network. Dan Natterman here, as per usual, with Noam Dwarman, the owner of the world-famous comedy club, perhaps some call it the greatest comedy club in the world. Periel Ashenbrand, our producer, is here. We have Nicole Lyons from upstate New York, originally. She lives here now in New York, and she does our sound. And Mike Kaplan is here. We have Nicole Lyons from upstate New York originally. She lives here now in New York and she does our sound. And Mike Kaplan is here. Hello, Mike. Mike has been here. He's a veteran. He's been here several times. And we always enjoy having him. Hello, Mike. How are you? Happy to be here. Thank you so much for having me back.

Mike, I don't know if you heard the news regarding the Comedy Cellar, but it's expanding. Wow. Congratulations. You don't mean that. Are we on video? No. Yeah, yeah. Okay, yeah. I absolutely mean it. You know it could mean I'll make more money. You know that, right? I want everyone to have more happiness.

So I hope it makes you some more happiness. I think it will make Noam happy. It will make him money, but hopefully more happiness as well. He bought the McDonald's around the corner. That's a very good question. Is there anything new with that, Noam? Just to recap,. He bought the McDonald's around the corner. That's a very good question. Is there anything new with that, Noam? Just to recap, Noam bought the McDonald's on West 3rd and 6th Avenue and is going to convert that into a comedy, another comedy cellar room.

That's wonderful news. I'm for fewer McDonald's in the world. Well, it was already closed. Well, I'm happy to know about it. It was between me and like an environmentally friendly vegan place. Hold on. Sounds like a joke. What's the question?

If there's any news. There's no news, but it's already starting. His question about happiness is interesting because if it makes money, the money's not going to make me any happier. That's for sure. You've got enough money. No more money will ever make you. Oh, the law of diminishing returns has totally kicked in on the money.

But the process of building the club, these are the happiest times of my life, is having projects. That will make me happy. Once it's open, it will bring me happy. Once it's open, it will bring me stress. It's a necessary defensive measure. Do you think you're maxed out on stress as well, or do you think that could always—

No, no. This is not the most stressful time of my life. That's wonderful. It's a defensive measure in a number of ways. First of all, the very property itself is such a prime spot. I have to be worried about who would take it if I didn't.

Number one. Number two, you know, I'm always worried about other clubs competing with us, so it's good to be bigger, and hopefully that means stronger, but when you get bigger, you can also get less agile.

But then I have kids, so this is a, one of the things that worries me is that you hear many stories about children at each other's necks when they inherit. Oh, so just give it all away. Don't give any of it to your kids. No. Okay. I offer solutions. So you're saying you have more stuff to hand out.

Yeah, so I'm thinking like, I'm already thinking about, in my own way, how to divvy up. I don't know. I don't know. How old are your kids? Well, they're young now. But this question of happiness, it's actually a very valid question

because it doesn't necessarily have to bring you more happiness. You seem like you're a guy who reads a lot of studies and you like empirical data. Have you heard anything by Arthur C. Brooks, a happiness researcher? I just met him. I was at a dinner with him last week. Did you listen to him? No. Yes,? I just met him. I was at a dinner with him last week. Did you listen to him? No.

Yes, I have listened to him. And he's been on this show, too, but I spoke with him personally. I mean, it's well known that money, after the basics have been covered, you know, food, clothing, and shelter generally doesn't buy too much in the way of happiness. No problem. So what does Arthur Brooks say about happiness? Oh, that

there's, I read his book From Strength to Strength about the two different kinds of intelligence that exist. Like, younger in your life you have fluid intelligence more and later in life crystallized, and that's why a lot of people like Bach, you know, a genius in his younger years and later a teacher, you know, not as

famous in his time as even his son was but over the course of time because he, like, zoomed out and was like, I'm just going to, you know, write everything down and codified and share it with the world in that way. So in the beginning, it's more of like,

you know, perhaps taking things in and alchemizing them and later stepping back and, you know, offering things more and alchemizing is like turned lead into gold. For those of you who can't see, I am sticking my middle finger up. We've discussed this before I forgot

somebody was on the show Arthur Brooks was he on our show? yeah oh and he was discussing different types of as you get older you don't

you have different types of he says pattern recognition he says if you don't lose your marbles you can be smarter than ever it's basically another way in my mind of saying you get wise

wisdom of age but he also says stuff about happiness I forget I'm getting old I can't remember but he said that essentially that you get wise, wisdom of age. But he also says stuff about happiness. I forget. I'm getting old. I can't remember. But he said that essentially that you get happiness from doing things that are fulfilling.

Oh, yeah. Human connection, friendships, relationships. Those are like the main source of happiness for most people. And it is. No, I brought up not the money, but the process of building the club. I assume, I mean, I imagine that envisioning what it's going to look like, looking at the plans, that's got to look like, looking at the plans, that's got to be very satisfying, you know, to be, I assume, to kind of imagine

what this brand new comedy theater is going to look like. Yeah. Have you heard of the difference between finite and infinite games? Games? Yeah, finite and infinite games. Like, so for games, like imagine, you know, most sports, baseball, there's a way

that it ends with a team winning You know most a lot of games have an ending that you're trying to aim for in those are finite games Infinite games is like catch when does catch end? It doesn't it's infinite You get the joy by doing the thing by throwing the thing So a lot of people think of like relationships like marriage. I get married and that's the end It's not obviously a marriage a relationship is an infinite game Hopefully where you get to continue you never hope to that's the end. It's not. Obviously, a marriage, a relationship is an infinite game, hopefully, where you get to continue.

You never hope to get to the end of it. You hope to just continue to get joy in the playing of it. So perhaps for you as well, there will be an end point to when the club is built. Are you married? I am with a woman for seven years

and plan to be with her forever. But you're not married. You know, in the old ways, I am. You said that with a total straight face, without irony. I don't know if you were kidding or not, but not really, you're not married. But go ahead. Yeah, I don. You said that with a total straight face without irony. I don't know if you were kidding or not, but now I realize you're not married. But go ahead.

Yeah, I don't have a paper from the government, but I am 100% committed forever and will marry my girlfriend. In comedy news, do we want to talk, because this is related to, first of all, current events generally, and comedy in particular, Trump may be getting indicted, and Chris Rock had something to say about that. What did Chris Rock say? Roll the tape, Nicole. I don't know if it's recorded anywhere, but first of all, Trump, just to review,

paid hush money to Stormy Daniels, and apparently, if that's considered a campaign expense, that's illegal, right? Is that the crux of the matter? If it's supposed to have been a campaign expense and he paid it privately, that might be a campaign

finance violation. It seems absurd to me. Okay, so anyway, so apparently he may be indicted. I think the grand jury has been convened or has been... It's been paneled. I was on a grand jury. The old saying is they would indict a ham sandwich. You said that?

I didn't say it, but that's the old saying. And, you know, that everybody, if you get indicted, if you go before the grand jury, you will get indicted, generally speaking, most of the time. Especially if you're Trump in New York. What did Chris Rock say? Chris Rock was at an event to give Adam Sandler the Mark Twain Prize for American Humor.

And he said, he said, arresting Trump is like arresting Tupac, he'll just sell more records. Apparently Rock said that Trump was just trying to protect his marriage by giving the hush money and it was sort of romantic more than anything else. But yeah, so

Rock... Chris said it was romantic? I assume he was joking. But he did say that this will just make him like T Tupac, even bigger. And it's, you know, for that reason, an unwise thing to do. Look, I don't know what I don't know. But I've always thought this was ridiculous top to bottom. On the law, it's ridiculous.

And we know it's ridiculous because the federal government declined to prosecute him. The former member of the Federal Election Commission wrote a long column about how it's ridiculous without getting into the details about it. Although you can Google Wall Street Journal, former federal elections commissioner column on it. All you have to know is this. What they're saying is that Trump was supposed to take campaign donations, like from little old ladies, right? And what he was supposed to do was pay his mistress to be quiet using campaign money. Now, don't you know that if it had come to light that Trump had paid off his mistress with campaign money, we'd be hearing now that that's illegal. He took campaign money and used it for personal

things. The fact is that people, when they're getting ready to run for office, they commit crimes. No, they get their teeth done, they lose some weight, they buy a gym membership, they might clean up their house, they spend

money on themselves to make themselves presentable candidates. Does that include having sex with prostitutes? She wasn't a prostitute. Isn't that actually the definition of a prostitute? I mean, if she's getting...

But that brings me to my next point. And then Chris Rock is right, and I said the same thing back there. What's lost in all this is that this was a consensual affair, and now when he's getting to run for office, this woman is trying to ruin him, and he's paying her off. Now, I know people don't like the idea of having an affair, but he's not the bad guy in this story.

She was a grown woman who chose to have sex with this grown man, and now is essentially saying, listen, I'm going to bring you down unless you give me some money. Now, where does the legality come in? You're not allowed to spend campaign money on an individual in excess of a certain limit? No, there's two ways. First of all, any money spent for of all, you're supposed to, any money spent for your campaign, you're supposed to report it to the campaign.

Number one. Number two, now this might be legal, but this is not, it's a misdemeanor apparently. It's a minor thing. He tried to hide it by having his lawyer pay it and then he reimbursed his lawyer. There may be some... I mean... Falsification of business records, I think, was what

they were talking about. There's some bullshit charge there. Nobody... So you may have technically broken the law. Yes, but listen. Everybody technically breaks the law. So shouldn't everyone technically bear the consequences? No. The law... You're not hard on

criminals? No, I not hard on criminals? No, I'm hard on criminals. However, there are so many laws on the books that it allows a prosecutor to then wield them in a bad faith way. Sounds like very progressive thinking, Noel. that you should smell a rat whenever they dust off, never use laws in order to get at people who are unpopular. And we should all be able to identify that and say, wait a second here, I hate Trump. But show me the list of other people who've been indicted for this crime because this seems a little weird to me.

Has nobody ever been indicted for this crime? I don't know the details. Okay. But if... So the details seem important at some point. No, no. The details are not important. I get it.

But he's not being indicted simply for that. He's being indicted for campaign violations. And that has been aired out. And the federal, more than one agency looked at that and declined to prosecute it. Even Bragg declined to prosecute it. And then he got a lot of flack for it. And now he's coming around again. It stinks to high heaven.

And like I said, Trump is not... Listen, Trump you. Oh, Trump you, man. If there was a crime there, I would get it. Like this guy was ripping... This university was ripping people off. So maybe it's like they're rewarding him with a criminal prosecution the same way that, you know, was it Scorsese? He didn't get the Oscar for the movies that he was supposed to,

but they gave it to him for The Departed because there's other, more like Capone, getting Capone on, exactly. They want to get him and they got to figure out a way to get him. That's exactly right. They do that all the time though. No, no, no. But it sounds like that Stormy Daniels was just really just doing the art of the deal. She was just very capitalistic of her. The prosecutor should never be looking to get people. I agree with you. I know you agree with me.

And like I said— Even in this case? I mean, I agree with the generality that he just expressed and and of all the things trump has done it's ironic and that the the time when he's actually kind of the sympathetic character i mean it's hard for anybody to see him that way but you know there's there's um you know people who who have a simple man trying to cheat on his wife and cover it up who among us yeah no like you know know. When you put it like that. He's getting extorted. And.

I don't think there's any good guys here, for sure. I agree with you on that. But. I don't think he's sympathetic. Does who. I mean, haven't presidents been having affairs since the beginning of time? Presidents. How about every man on the face of the earth?

Right. This is not a minor. This is not an unusual thing. Dan, are you going to take that from him? Well, I know Noam's exaggerating somewhat. There are men that have not had affairs, but their number is large enough that the point is valid. But so who cares? I mean,

why do you think Chris Rock like, you know, come on now, let's all grow up here, alright? I don't like Trump, but I know men who've had affairs. You know men who've had affairs? Do you know men who've had affairs. You know men who've had affairs? Do you know men who've had affairs? I don't know if anyone.

Do you know men who've had affairs? If men have affairs and if all of a sudden when they are getting ready to do something in their lives, they come from the past, they listen. I'm going to ruin you. Give me $150,000. She is not the sympathy. If it was somebody he sexually harassed and signed a nondisclosure agreement, even then I'd say, OK, I get it.

You know, he wronged her. He paid her off. Then he harassed her. And now. But this is not this was she never made any claim that Trump did anything bad to her. A hundred percent consensual. She is just trying to extort him. Can we move on to. So, you know, fuck that. Can we move on to Chris Rock's point, which I'm sure a lot of people have made, the same point that Kenobi made to Darth Vader. Obi-Wan, yeah. If you strike me down, you'll only make me stronger.

I believe it was Kenobi who said that. I think that's correct. Mike Calhoun would be the one to ask about something like that. So by striking him down, in a sense, by arresting him, will this only make his powers grow stronger? As Chris Rock had said, does that seem to you correct? What do you think, Mike? It's very difficult to make predictions. You know, they say those who speak do not know, those who know do not speak.

I think that's from Taoism. Somebody said that. I knew you were going to say that. Go ahead. Yeah, of course. Man, I guess that's why you're not happy that I'm here. You're like,

you could just play both sides of the conversation, obviously. Truly, I don't know. It's like they say, it's hard to make predictions, especially with this, you know, strange character. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's very hard to predict even the past. But in this particular situation, can Yogi Bear say that? It's hard to predict, even especially about the future? I don't know. That sounds right. It depends on what you're referring to. If... He will sell

more books, that's for sure. Nobody cares. I mean, I don't... I think that it will make him more popular because if Noam is even pointing out that he... Poor Donald Trump is being extorted by this mean woman who, you know, imagine what people actually like him thing. Well, I think that it helps him in the following. So I don't know that it helps him in the general election.

It helps him in his contest with DeSantis. Not just because he's a sympathetic character and not just because people really don't like the idea of a president being indicted and what really, I mean, everybody knows is they're just trying to find, you know, find something. I don't know, they've been trying for years. But it will allow him to dominate the media for as long as this goes on and suck up all the oxygen. And Trump is an expert at parlaying this

kind of stuff into media attention. And that will make it harder for DeSantis to make an impact. They're both sickening. I appreciate Stormy Daniels' hustle. I think that Trump deserves exactly what he's getting, even if he didn't do anything wrong, because he would do the same exact thing. And to be fair, it's not that he didn't do anything wrong. If truly, as you're presenting him, he had a consensual relationship with an adult who he's allowed to, even if it's, not against the law, but against his marriage vows, against, you know, what many people would consider ethical, but he's legally allowed to, he didn't do anything wrong in having the affair. But then when she came to him to extort him, then what a, what a good, you know, sort of upright citizen would do is not try to pay her secretly. It would be, you know,

to be honest. Oh, shut up. Next question. Yeah. I think that's, I'm going to let that hang there in its self-righteous stupidity. You don't think a good person would try to be honest? I don't think. Next. I don't think that that's realistic. It's not realistic. I'm a good person, so I'm not going to tell you what I'm thinking. Do you think Melania even cares?

She was probably like, ugh. Yeah, I think she cares. Melania may or may not care, but the cunt as a presidential candidate. What, we're cunt? As a country, as a presidential candidate, it certainly wouldn't have helped them. But, I mean, I don't know.

All of these presidents, I feel like, always have affairs, and the country never gives a shit. Which presidents had affairs? I mean, JFK, Clinton, I mean, all of them. Who knows? Maybe many, right? Yeah.

More recent ones. Abraham Lincoln. Yeah. Well, with the speed. The more recent ones, we haven't heard. George W. Bush and Barack Obama. We don't know. Yeah, but I'm not saying all of them. I'm just saying, I don't think it's like a shocking thing. If you had to bet on Jimmy Carter having had an affair, would you bet he did or he didn't?

He seemed like a good, upstanding husband. You never know. That's what he seems like. I'm saying if you had to bet. You really only know yourself. So when you're seeing all this nefarious behavior out in the world, that's you projecting. If I had to bet, I would say no, but I wouldn't. You wouldn't say no with confidence?

No. No, we don't know. You're somewhat concerned. Isn't it wonderful that I just realized now that, you know, Republicans' favorite president, Abraham Lincoln, if he was gay, that was like the first LGBTQ president. Well, I think the weight of the evidence suggests that he was not gay. I've read a little bit about that. Bisexual? Pansexual? Well, Jamie Kirchick,

who wrote this whole book about gay, did not think the case was strong that Lincoln was gay. It's possible. He just loved a man deeply. As many men... I love many men deeply. Mike Kaplan... I love you. Well, thank you, Michael. Are you the one going

deeply, or are they going deeply? It really depends. They go either way. No, that you, Michael. Are you the one going deeply or are they going deeply? You know, it really depends. It could go either way. Come on, you know better. No, that's very childish. I think better of you know. Mike, you want to talk very briefly about your new album coming out? Impossible for me to talk briefly.

I'll do my best. Okay. Yes, I have an album that I recorded several years ago that I call Live In Between Albums. It was only playing exclusively on Sirius Satellite Radio, but it is now available this week widely everywhere. I recorded it between two albums that had themes, and these are a bunch of jokes that I just thought were a lot of fun that didn't fit either of the themes. So it's called Live In Between Albums. It was recorded in 2018. Yeah, 2017, released in 2018.

So there'll be no COVID jokes on it. That's absolutely correct. Unless you are a prediction, a seer of all things. Only COVID jokes, 2018 release. That would be quite impressive. Yeah, thank you for asking. I didn't write jokes when the first Fast and Furious movie came out because I was like, there can't be more of these.

But as of this recording, there can't be more of these. But as of this recording, there's eight. Does anyone think they could name all eight correctly? It's very tricky. It's real weird. I love them, and I can't. Like, I'm the one administering the test. And I could tell you when you're wrong a lot, but I couldn't tell you if you get it.

The first one, The Fast and the Furious. The second one, honestly, I think this is what really launched the franchise because it's the best sequel name that there ever was. Too Fast, Too Furious. Do you understand? I wish every sequel was named that way. Two Snakes, Two Planes.

Do you understand? How much I would've seen that movie? Two citizen, two cane. Do you understand? Two god, two father. Two, two Wong Fu, two thanks for everything. To die too hard. He died too hard. To die too hard. Ah, he died too hard.

To die too hard. It seems Shakespearean almost. And then it also says you're going to the Edinburgh Fringe Festival. Yes, and this August I'll be bringing my new hour show called Imperfect and doing it every night for the entire Fringe, like 25 nights in a row. Wow. called Imperfect and doing it every night for the entire Fringe, like 25 nights in a row. And yeah, I went in 2018 as well with my last themed album that came out in 2020. And I came on here and you were very gracious to have me to help spread the word about that. But yeah, I love the Edinburgh Fringe. So if you have any listeners that are over there, love to see you.

I think we probably do. I've never been myself. By the way, somewhat related, I saw Judy Gold has a new show. Oh, yeah. Yes, I can say that. Yes, I can say that. Yeah, based on her book. Yeah. I saw it last night.

Oh, I know that she has a book. She has a show? Yeah, one-woman show she's doing now. Oh, it's a one-woman show. 59E. 59E. Okay. I saw it last night.

It was fucking fantastic. That's amazing. Can I tell you a funny thing about it? Sure. My mom knows that I like Judy Gold, and my mom is also a fan from way back, and so she has Judy Gold's book in her home, and whenever she saw the ad for the new show,

and she sent it to me, and it's a picture of, I think, Judy Gold with a ball gag in her mouth, and my mom's like, I don't know if this is going to be the show for me. And I was like, wow, that's when I learned that my mom knows what a ball gag is. Can we have a, I mean, obviously,

it would be nice to have Judy on the show to discuss her one-woman show, but can you give us a thumbnail sketch? Well, it's a show about... Censorship? About censorship,

but it also, she tells in a certain way the story of her life breaking into comedy, what it was like to be LGBTQ, what it was like keeping it into comedy, what it was like to be LGBTQ, what it was like keeping it a secret, what it was like to come out with it, how people reacted,

who her heroes, other females were. It's unbelievably good. So I get invited to these things, and I never want to go. First of all, I don't like to go see shows. You're in the right business. I don't. Like I've said many times, I've never been to a Broadway show,

and at intermission, it was like, oh, good, I'm happy there's another. What's your favorite? Have you ever seen a Broadway show that you did like? No, I do like them, but they're always too long for me. I mean, I like all the— Did you see Hadestown? I love that. No, I saw Book of Mormon, I like all the, you see Hadestown. I love that. I saw, I saw Book of Mormon.

I thought it was fantastic. Of course. But of course I like, you know, like West Side Story, Fiddler on the Roof, that kind of stuff. I didn't like cats anyway.

So I don't like to go for those reasons, but I also don't like to go to see anything that someone I know is putting on because I hate the having to tell them it was great. Having to be nice. Yeah. I mean, even when it is, I just, I just, that, that interaction is awkward for me. Can I tell you a story about my meeting Judy Gold for the first time at your comedy club in the Village Underground?

We were on a show together a couple of years ago before the pandemic. And I think she did a set and I told her it was good and she didn't care. And then I did a set and she said, that was really funny. And I said, thank you. That's very nice of you to say. And she said, what's nice? It's true. So I really like that.

So, but I saw Judy's show last night. And for one of the only times I could not wait to go tell her how great it was because it filled me with happiness for her. I was so fucking impressed. I praise. No, it's really, really good. I was so fucking impressed. I praise. No, it's really, really good. I'm excited. And she did this, you know.

I guess she had help. She had a director, an Asian gentleman. B.D. Wong. Oh, yeah. He's well-known. Awesome, yeah. He was on Oz. You ever watch Oz? No.

He was also on Vaughan Order SVU. Absolutely, yeah. And he played the party planner on Father of the Bride, I think. That could be. I think that's what Juanita said. Anyway, so I would just recommend to everybody to go see her show.

There is no way you will not enjoy it. Excellent. And speaking of things that give Noam joy, music night on Monday, every Monday night, there's music at the Olive Tree downstairs. It was more packed than ever. Is it growing? There were people, I had a friend of mine who said, I can't get in.

That, you know, they wouldn't let her in to the Olive Tree. You got to expand to a McDonald's. Yeah, well, it's. And have you thought about doing it another night of the week? I mean, this thing, the place is never more packed than when Noam and his band are playing music. And the band was fantastic on Monday. The band, when the band is good, it's

crazy how good they are. On a world-class level. They're amazing. Mike Davis did more songs, I think, than he normally does. No, about the same. Okay. But Sasha Allen, who sings with the Rolling Stones, was down. I mean, it's just fantastic. Sometimes it's not so good when we're not in the mood or we haven't rehearsed in a while,

but last night was, or Monday night, was just fantastic. How long have you been playing music? My whole life. So have you thought about doing other nights or just keep it special, keep it Monday? We have thought about doing another night. I don't like to be away from my family. I love playing.

The band actually took another gig, a regular gig now. They're playing tonight, but I'm not doing it with them at another club. I hope they're not too good without me.

Hilarious. But anyway, yeah, it is growing. And I sent Noam a compliment, and I meant it. Noam broke, they broke in a new song called Juanita.

Now, Noam's wife's name is Juanita. Regular listeners wouldn't knowam broke, they broke in a new song called Juanita. Now, Noam's wife's name is Juanita. Regular listeners wouldn't know that. And he broke in a new song. I guess it's a Calypso song. Harry Belafonte. Harry Belafonte. And I thought you did a great job with it.

Thank you, Dan. Thank you. Congratulations. Noam sang it. With Sasha. With Sasha Allen. Was Juanita there? Yeah.

That's why I did it. Oh, that's so sweet. But then the song is great, so I'm going to keep it. You love your wife. Yeah, well. Although in the. Oh, that's so sweet. But then the song is great, so I'm going to keep it. You love your wife. Yeah, well. Although in the song, Juanita's from Venezuela, but it's close enough. Where's your wife from? Brooklyn.

She's a local. She's Puerto Rican and Indian. But she feels more Puerto Rican than Indian. Yeah. Her attitude is more Puerto Rican than Indian. Yeah. Her attitude is more Puerto Rican. She looks probably more Indian. But her attitude is so Puerto Rican, it makes her look Puerto Rican. She feels like she doesn't fit in in the United States because she's not officially a state.

I wanted to discuss a topic that I always find fascinating because I think there's so many elements to it. And that's veganism. Mike, you're a vegan. That's true. And how long? Noam, if you'll indulge me on this topic. I assume you're not opposed to discussing it. You don't mind hearing about a vegetable?

And how long have you been a vegan? 20, 21 years, probably. Wow. But you're not, and you're mostly do it for there's there's there's three reasons people might be a vegan ethical biological ethical health and environment oh yeah i which of those three and what proportion are uh it was ethics that uh that brought me to it like not wanting to be a part of uh you know factory farming and animal suffering if i could avoid it and uh but then i feel like it's just a bonus. It's like all the reasons that you said.

Obviously, you can be an unhealthy vegan. You can just eat potatoes all day. You can be an unenvironmental vegan if you have a private jet and fly it everywhere. But the environment, the health of the body, and the joy and non-suffering of animals, they're all reasons that I care about. Now, as far as the health of the body,

I had a friend of mine, a vegan, who basically kept harassing me until I watched The Game Changers. of animals, they're all reasons that I care about. Now, as far as the health of the body, I had a friend of mine, a vegan, who, she basically kept harassing me until I watched The Game Changers, which was a documentary. I think Arnold Schwarzenegger was involved in it. Anyway, it's about veganism, and it's basically, its emphasis is on veganism as being a healthier, or vegetarianism, as being healthier. That was the, did you see it? I haven't seen it, though I also will say

that I don't advocate harassing people into veganism. Okay, well, she was harassing me into watching it and perhaps indirectly into becoming vegan. Are you vegan now? I'm not vegan, but the Game Changers main point was how good it is physically. But from what I've read from my, doing my own research,

which, you know, where that can lead, you know, but from my own research, I think the case for veganism as being necessarily healthier is not a strong case. I don't think anyone would, any, like, reasonable person would make that point because,

I mean, so I'm saying that your friend is unreasonable and you're unreasonable to bring it up to me but i will respond to it uh i will say that uh when people say like where do you get your protein like i think there's a lot of you know lack of information out there like it's very possible it's very simple to be vegan and be healthy it doesn't mean that that it's... Well, look at you. We know you're getting your protein. But Mike, you're a child. But Mike, this is what I'm saying, and maybe you misinterpreted. I'm not saying you can't be healthy as a vegan. Oh, yeah. I'm saying you can be just as healthy as a non-vegan, according to much of what I've

read. I'll say this, though. For the people who say, like, where do you get your protein? I always want to ask them, for most of the people that say it, I'm like, have you ever seen a vegetable? Because I'd say that there's many more unhealthy meat eaters than unhealthy vegans. I'm saying, of course, what you're saying is true. It's possible.

But I'd say in practice in the world, a diet... That's probably true that if you are a vegan, and one of the reasons that vegans do seem to live longer statistically, well, I mean, one of the theories is because vegans are going to be healthier individuals anyway. If you're taking that step to be a vegan, you're probably going to the gym, you're probably not smoking, you're probably a drug user.

It's about being mindful about your own experience. But my point is that a diet including meat can be a very, very, very healthy diet if done correctly. Or fish. Yeah, I will say that that is technically true, and you haven't convinced me to do it. Now wait, it's not just on me, right?

You won't wear wool? I will do my best to avoid animal products of any kind in my life. I understand I live in the world, and I can't track down the sources of every item that I own. And also, I know that in the making of vegetables, sometimes animals get caught in threshers. I had this thought. There's a lady comes to my house.

I have poodles. And the lady comes to my house. She has this mobile grooming thing. And she came and we let the dogs go too long. And she sheared the poodles. And they were so much happier when they came in the house. And I was thinking like, well, if this was wool, the lamb would be happier that we sheared them. So my understanding of this, number one, I love the Dalai Lama and how he once answered a question when somebody said – he's like, that's a very good question, and the answer is simple.

I don't know. But I will say that I'm not positive of all the effects of wool farming. And I am pretty confident that sheep have been bred to have thicker wool coats. So I think that it is like human intervention that made them so laden in the first place, which doesn't necessarily make it easier to decide what to do now, but I take your point, and I don't know. No, but they're also, I've read about this because I'm a vegetarian, I'm not a vegan. Well, you're a pescatarian, I thought. I am a pescatarian. Then let's be clear.

Which is basically a kind of racist, but go ahead. Let's be honest. The way that they shear sheep is off unless you're getting like small farms that they cut them. They're not, I mean, they're charmed horribly. I told this story. I have a very good friend, Oz.

He's Turkish and he's a vegan. And I go through this all the time. I say, well, Oz, why won't you eat an egg? An egg's not fertile. I said, I want to eat eggs because they have a factory farms. I said, well, Oz, why won't you eat an egg? An egg's not fertilized. I want to eat eggs because they have factory farms. I say, well, what if it was organic eggs?

No, even what they call organic is free range. So what if you own the chickens and you let them run around free range and they dropped eggs? You can't even not have them drop eggs. You own chickens and you treat these chickens better than they'd ever be treated in the wild. But now they drop eggs. Would you eat the eggs? He's like, and he has some reason. No,'ve ever been treated in a while, but now they try to say, would you eat the eggs?

He's like, and he has some reason, no, he wouldn't eat the eggs. I'm like, okay, Oz, what do you think about abortion? He goes, oh, it's a woman's right to choose. You know, I have a, I, I, just to be clear, I have a brand new joke about, about vegans being pro-choice. I mean, it's like, it's like, it makes no sense to me. He wouldn't eat an unfertilized egg from his own pet chicken.

But he's like, a six-month-old fetus has a woman's right to chew. Well, he's not eating it. But it makes no sense. And you are pro-choice, I assume, like most vegans. I can't speak for all vegans

or most vegans. You understand, a fetus is a little person and an egg is not even fertilized. Can I let Mike answer the question? I will say that a fetus is, by definition, I think there's disagreement

over when personhood begins. But are you pro-choice, generally speaking? Yes, I'm a pro-choice person. Of course he is. He's a vegan. Some are not, but most are from what I've read.

And sincerely, to respond, if you were talking to, I have a friend who is essentially vegan, but also does own chickens and does eat the eggs of those chickens because it's not about just joining a team and then doing everything

according to the rules of those teams, even if they have to bend over backwards to be like, well, now this. It's about taking everything, you know, as it comes and being like, well, does this make sense to do? Is this the kindest thing I can do? Is this the most reasonable,

intelligent thing that I can do? More power to him. Are you pro-choice throughout the pregnancy? I mean, I'd say I take it as it comes. I'd say in general, I think the law needs to be that you can get abortions when you need them. And then the question of when you need them. Even a few days after birth? Yeah, I think, you know, in ancient Greece, they waited like a few months. Like, they wouldn't name the child. They were like, I don't know about this one. Like, if a woman theoretically wanted an abortion at eight months, and there was nothing wrong with the baby, and it was not a threat to her health, should the law allow for that? I'm certainly not the expert to ask about this situation.

But you certainly would not use the placenta in your shampoo. I mean, well, no, I think the placenta, if you're using the, like, who's, I don't want to waste about this situation. But you certainly would not use the placenta in your shampoo. I think the placenta, if you're using the placenta, I don't want to waste the placenta. Are you, when we talk about the ethics of veganism, are you more concerned with how animals are treated or the fact that they are dying? Treated.

So in other words, if we were to treat a chicken or a cow wonderfully and they had a great life and then one day they get killed, but they don't even know it's coming. It's a wonderful hypothetical, but I just learned today on my podcast. But would that be acceptable? Would you eat meat? I just want to say that I feel like this question is like sort of immaterial because chickens could live 12 years. In the system, most chickens live 30 days. So just the thing that you're

imagining doesn't happen. It's not... I would love a world... I know, but I'm just trying to gauge whether or not you feel that... Taking the life of the animal... I don't want to take the life of it either, but it's the suffering that's more important. I'm with you. I don't like it.

I haven't eaten veal in like 30 years. Well, that's, I mean, real pure evil. Yeah, it's some of the cruelest. Yeah. I mean, and comedians. It's hard to argue, I think, the ethical superiority of veganism. I think it's hard to argue against it.

The only argument you could make is human happiness, which counts for something. If I may. And how much does it count for? Well, you asked, remember the question you asked me? Well, I asked you that. I can ask Mike a similar question, but Mike wanted to address the issue of human happiness. I will say.

Which is not zero. It's not completely irrelevant. But it's not completely irrelevant, but I do think it's, you know, as the only human, as the only animals, as the only creatures on the planet that we know of that can truly like morally reason, I think it is our obligation to think about those that, you know, we have power and dominion over. And if we have the power to harm something, I think we have the responsibility to not harm it if we can. I will, here's my one argument that I

do think is the best case against veganism. I don't know if there's an answer to this. So this is my impression of the best argument against veganism is, I don't wanna. That's the only, like, truly, I think that's the human happiness argument. That's the human happiness argument. Right, but I think that. And there are those that might argue that there might be an argument to be made that certain people have certain dietary needs.

No, no. What about drugs? Do you not take life-saving medicine because it's tested on animals? If I know, I don't know all of the details. They're all tested on animals. You know that. Don't start.

I don't. I don't know all the details. Bullshit. So human happiness does count for something at a certain level. In other words, if happiness is, and this is a question I posed to Perriel a few weeks ago, if by human happiness we mean we just enjoy a good meal, you don't think that's sufficient reason to be a vegan. However, if human happiness involves your health, then you would say maybe it's okay to eat meat.

I'm not. Suppose you've got migraine headache. I'm fine for you to say that. If you had a child and the doctor told you your child needs to eat meat to survive, of course you would give the child meat. I mean, it's again, I mean, I don't, I don't have children and don't plan to have children. No, no, no. I think you can answer.

What kind of monster are you? This is, you would let your child die. What kind of monster are you? Would you let your child? Making up this monster, making up this dying child. It's an easy hypothetical. So you wouldn't let your child die rather than eat eggs. I mean, this doesn't seem like

a realistic thing. I feel like there's many more realistic, practical things to talk about than that gotcha philosophy. But philosophy is a discipline that involves hypotheticals that are not realistic. We're philosophers on this. Yeah, I'm a philosophy major in college, and ethical philosophy is about practical

application, not about only philosophy. Come on, come on. That's 100%. Have you read Peter Singer? Yeah, well, Peter Singer was on our show. And as I'm sure you know very well, his entire deal is that it's our responsibility as humans to avoid suffering or avoid doing things that cause us suffering, provided that it doesn't cause us to suffer more.

So in that case, you could keep her out. But the rub is what constitutes us suffering more. Well, Noam's example of having a dying child. Noam had an extreme example that the child would die without meat. Or even get sick. But what about my example to you? A few weeks ago, you get terrible migraines if you don't eat meat. Great news.

They are working on cultivated lab meat, and I would be very for any child or adult who would die without meat to live with lab-grown meat that is really on its way. This podcast is going to go on and on like a game of catch. I mean, I just answered your question. Until you admit. Until you admit. There's lab-grown meat.

It's no animals harmed, and everyone lives. That you admit. There's lab-grown meat. It's no animals harmed and everyone lives. That's the answer. That you would feed your child an egg for it to survive. Lab-grown meat. Or non-lab-grown meat. Serious person. Wait, so do the thing. My question to Perrielle was, I forgot the precise question.

It was like if she's suffering terrible migraines. Once a month. Once a month, a terrible, like her whole day she was incapacitated unless she ate meat. Once a year.

Unless... Well, I forgot exactly how I phrased the question. Well, I said that I would eat it even if I, like, even more. How... I was avoiding any... You would have...

Yeah. You would avoid meat to... If it was once a month, you said you would have a meat diet to avoid that migraine. For sure. But if it was once a year, you would deal with the migraine.

No, I would still eat meat. Okay. No. I'll deal with it when I get to it. Well, so again, like Peter Singer, unless we suffer more is his calculus. He's a utilitarian. I call bullshit on the whole concept of ethics. But us suffering more, but the point I'm making is that us suffering more is a subjective question.

What does it mean to suffer more? For you, one migraine a month would be too much. Well, what does it mean to suffer more is a great philosophical question that I think is important to talk about. Well, what do you think it means to suffer more? And under what circumstances would you say it's justified for us to eat an animal because otherwise we'd be suffering more? And under what circumstances would you say it's justified for us to eat an animal? Because otherwise we'd be suffering more. I mean, I haven't thought about it enough and I don't know the answer to the question, but I do believe there are ways to measure, you know, how much pain can be caused by like a certain blow to a human compared to a certain blow to an animal. Like,

and whether you're slicing a part of an animal off or whatever you're doing, there are ways to empirically measure how much pain is caused. I'm not saying that I know how to do it, but I'm saying that there are potential answers to that question. This is what I want to say. Yeah. Ethics are nonsense.

Well, you brought this up before, but I'm not sure that that's true. Linguistics are nonsense as well. Ethics are the following. Game theory. In other words, if I do this, then they'll do it. And if there's not a rule against this, it could happen to me.

So it's better off to have certain rules that we call ethics. And I believe a genetic disposition. I think there's some of this genetic. Little children respond to injustice. And a conscience is a biological— You're saying morality doesn't exist. There's no such thing as morality. A conscience is real. It's obviously evolutionarily selected for because, as we know, society with people who don't have consciences can't work, like sociopaths. Sociopaths.

Sociopaths are characterized by not being able to have any sense of guilt. And you can't, that's never going to work. They're out there. So you don't think in terms of morality, you think in terms of practicality. Like, it's comforting to think in terms of morality, but, I mean, just look at the animal kingdom. I mean, obviously the universe

doesn't recognize morality. These animals eat each other, kill each other. Like, there's no... Well, the animal kingdom. I mean, obviously the universe doesn't recognize morality. These animals eat each other, kill each other. Like, there's no... Well, the universe is full of humans as well. I'm saying we've imposed ethics on everything. So you would say if I just went and punched Periel on the nose, which I would not do, and she has a beautiful, perfect nose, by the way,

and she never had a nose job. It's true. And, you know, a lot of Jewish girls do have nose jobs. And Periel has made it a point to say that she has not. But were I to do that, Noam, how would you characterize that action? As immoral, or as just as socially

impractical? No, it is immoral, because we define morality that way, but I'm just saying like, this notion that there's an objective ethics, it's a system that we've embraced to make us, because it feels good. You don't think that minimization of suffering has... It has value.

It's a human... Is intrinsically good? I agree with you. Let me agree with you. We can argue about, by the way, how to go about minimizing suffering. We minimize the suffering of people we know. We don't give a shit about the suffering of people we don't know. We minimize the suffering for our pets. We don't give a shit about animals suffering of people we don't know. We minimize the suffering for our pets. We don't give

a shit about animals in the wild. Who's the we you're talking about? Peter Singer talks a lot about that, too. Well, I'm a genius, then. But not giving a shit, it doesn't, I don't think that makes your point. We minimize the suffering of people we know because that's really what

it's about. That's what we make this film about. We're not trying to minimize suffering. We don't minimize our neighbor's kids suffering over our own kids suffering. But should we? No, we shouldn't because it makes no sense to do that. No, but that's actually such an interesting point. If you have the resources you give to charity, you're minimizing the suffering of people you don't know. I assume you give a certain amount of your income, which is substantial, albeit not at the level of perhaps of a hedge fund manager.

But for a club owner, pretty substantial. I assume you would give some percentage of that to charity. May I say, Noam, I agree with you that ethics and morality are a human construct in a way. Like gender. The same way that a house is a human construct that has value. And so we live in houses because we houses didn't exist. And then we created them and we live in them because they are comfortable and they help us and ethics and morality, if you are correct, which I agree you are to a degree that they are also helpful things that are valuable. I will say that Buddhism, which I've been studying about

recently a little bit from Instagram and bumper stickers, like you do. Buddhism, one of its main goals, like in becoming a Buddha, in becoming enlightened, in becoming a Bodhisattva, the goal is the increase of happiness. Is that how you pronounce it? I thought it was Bodhisattiva. Yeah, Bodhisattva. And then there's, what is it besides the Sativa? There's the other kind of, that's the...

The Indica. Yeah, the Bodhi Indica, yeah. So the... Oh, is that why that weed is called Sativa? It's not. It's unrelated. They might be connected etymologically. There it is. So the goal of the Buddhist in general is to increase the happiness and decrease the suffering of all sentient beings.

The Bodhisattva is said to love every sentient being with the same kind of love that a loving mother loves a child. And so it is not common. But he unfortunately gives us no guidance as to which beings are sentient. But according to Periel, it's not the fish. We're all hypocrites as well. Wait a second. I agree with that. You love those poodles so much and yet you would happily

eat a pig or a cow, right? Yes. But that's my point. And then my... Well, your point is circular. You're saying that because we do it, we should do it, but that is not... I'm not saying we should. I'm actually sympathetic

to animals. I don't eat very much meat. She knows it. I'm not. I know you don't. And then my other question is. And you know, which is unfortunate because the best item on the menu here at Theolatry is the steak. And by the way, we've asked you on a couple of occasions to, of course, you're not obligated, but we have brought up the idea of introducing the impossible burger. Beyond burger.

Or the beyond burger. You keep saying you're going to put them in the kitchen. On the menu. Yeah, for some reason Liz is resisting me on that. What I'm worried about, but I... I know, we know. You can repeat it if people haven't heard. Too woke a comedy club?

No, what I'm worried about... Let's see what Mike thinks about this argument. What I'm worried about is that our grill is not... You want to have a dedicated area? So there'll be crop contamination. It's not segregated. And so people will say, well, then you just have to tell the customer,

blah, blah, blah. But I'm afraid somebody won't tell the customer. Then the customer will get furious that they were given a Beyond Burger with meat on it. I think that's a very valid thing to think about. A loud club, they might not get it. Yeah, I don't think that's necessarily... I mean, I don't know all the ins and outs and economics and space of your business.

Like, if there was a way to have a small segregated portion of the grill. Okay. So, maybe over at the new McDonald's. That one. So, assuming, by the way, but Mike, assuming that he cannot solve the problem of a segregated grill, do you still advocate for Impossible and or Beyond Burgers at the Comedy Cellar Olive Tree? Yeah, I'd say just you have to have no more

meat, just only Impossible Burgers and Beyond Burgers. I don't mind ordering some Impossible Burgers for you or for Perrielle to have on hand because they're frozen anyway. I'm just saying to give them to customers, it sounds like I'm asking for trouble that somebody's going to get outraged. Mike, would you eat an Impossible Burger on the Cellar Grill?

I wouldn't want to. But you would ask. Anybody who doesn't eat meat would generally ask. It's like having a peanut out. Some people would assume that if you have— What if it's on the menu? No segregated grill. How are they going to know the difference?

Just lie to them. Well, then, if they don't read it, fuck them. By the way, she's not kidding. I understand. And I do think if you put it on the menu, then that is, I think that is enough. Enough is enough. Enough for what? What if they don't read the menu? Too bad.

I mean, then you're in the right. No, I don't want to. Look, you're outraged all the time. First of all, when people go to a restaurant and order a salad, isn't there a chance that some piece of meat might fall into the salad? I mean, isn't there a chance that some piece of meat might fall into the salad? I mean, isn't there always a chance? Okay, let's assume that somebody... That the chef has meat on

his hand and he's mixing the salad? And he didn't wash his hands and he just urinated? Let's assume... Just listen to me. I'm not eating here. Let's assume that the anguish and upsetness that a person has if they find out that they've eaten some meat is analogous to the physical effects of somebody with a peanut allergy eating peanuts. Let's just compare the mental anguish.

That's real. Obviously, if we're talking about peanuts, I would never just say, well, it's on the menu. It's their problem. They could wind up in the emergency room. I'm saying that somebody's going to find out. Somebody's going to deeply upset them. Why am I going to go through this? And it's almost certainly going to happen at some point.

So what do I want? Would somebody that's that strict, a vegan, eat here in the first place knowing that there's meat in the damn kitchen? Yes, sooner or later it will happen. No, but I'm saying. No, Dan's saying that already. Already it could happen.

A vegan could come in here and say, I'll just have the hummus. Not just here. No, no, no. And the chef had meat. There was a little piece of meat. Well, anything could happen, but I'm not responsible. But if I'm marketing an item to vegans... No, you're marketing an Impossible Burger.

Yeah. You have to make it very clear. A big campaign. The Impossible Burger, not for vegans. There was a place that I heard once that had on the menu a hypocrite burger that was like a veggie burger with bacon on it. So it'll be like that. I used to eat that.

A veggie burger and a hamburger. I think there is a market. Really? There is a market of which I am part of, of those of us who are not vegans. Like, Mike, we haven't made that choice. Yet. Are we getting to the bottom of this?

You want to... Right, everyone's selfish. But we, but we, we prefer to minimize suffering if we can. And we'll eat an Impossible Burger if available. I said, I'll get you one. That doesn't sound good on air. Huh? That doesn't sound good on air, slamming that thing on the table.

I have, I do have a question. Is your girlfriend a vegan? She is. Okay. And what if she decided, well, Okay, and what if she decided, well, no, but what if she decided that she didn't want to be one anymore? She can do whatever she wants to do.

You don't care. A vegan man does not tell his woman what to do. I love her forever. Yeah. She was a raw vegan long before I met her as well, so it's just one of the- A raw vegan? She was, yeah.

She ate mostly like fruit and nuts each thing for a while. I do want to discuss, you know, we have you till seven if you want to join us. Wait, what's a raw vegan? She was, yeah. She ate mostly like fruit and nuts each thing for a while. I do want to discuss, you know, we have you till seven if you want to join us. What's a raw vegan? Only raw food. Raw food. Nothing cooked above a certain temperature. Why? What is that?

Is that an ethical thing? No, no. It's some kind of health thing. As a vegan, I have done a lot of shows for animal rights conferences and vegetarian food festivals. And when I'm performing for like a majority vegetarian vegan audience, I'm like, I don't know. Normally, I'm in the minority. Normally, I'm like, it's us against the world. But in here, I'm like, who can I make fun of?

I'm like, the raw vegan. I don't understand. Is this true? Like on dating apps now? Here, look. There you go. A raw vegan diet combines veganism and raw foodism. The diet includes foods that are plant-based, raw, and unprocessed.

Raw vegan diets exclude animal products such as meat and dairy products and foods that need cooking. People may choose to follow a raw vegan diet to try and improve their health. Listen, this is ingenious for you will be able to get a higher, at least one category above what you could get on the open market because there's just fewer men to go around. And of course, this is probably all female heavy anyway. It's brilliant. Become a raw vegan. Telling you guys. Or just start pretending. By the way. Become a raw vegan, telling you guys. Or just tell people you are.

Is veganism more, forget about raw veganism, but is veganism more female? Are there more female vegans than? I think we're all non-binary now. There's definitely more females and effeminate men combined than there are. Present company excluded. Do you consider yourself a macho man, Noam? No, not at all. But I'm not effeminate men combined than there are... You consider yourself a macho man, Noam? No, not at all. But I'm not effeminate. Well, I don't know if you just called Mike effeminate.

No, I was... I embrace my feminine side. On a scale from one to Harrison Greenbaum, you're not an effeminate man. Well, look, none of us are macho men. That sounds very Harris-ophobic. I'm not calling you effeminate. It'd be fine if you did. But that's not the same scale. Macho

is not the opposite of being effeminate. Who's macho? Give me an example of somebody we know. What is the opposite of effeminate before we get to Perrielle's question? One time I did the Stress Factory and in the green room Vinnie Brand was like, what's the manliest thing you do? As like a serious question. And I was like, well, I guess I'm a different kind

of person than this guy. So Vinnie Brand. That's macho. That's macho. I don't think that... Dan is not macho at all, but no one would ever call him effeminate. No. But look at the way I'm sitting. I've got my left leg crossed over my right knee, and I have my hand up in this.

I'm biting my nail. I accept. But nonetheless, this seems somewhat feminine. Well, there is a category, I think, for masculine Jewish men that might be different. Israeli. No, that's macho. Not all of them, but even the effeminate Israeli guys

have some macho... What kind of man do you like, Nicole? A more feminine man? I know you're dating a musician. They tend to be more feminine, I would think, musicians. Wouldn't you say? Yeah, I'm kind of like middle of the road. I don't like a big football player that has no thoughts in his head.

You know what I mean? I like a guy with feelings. Feelings are feminine, yeah. She likes feelings. Facts are masculine. Feelings are feminine. My wife always says she doesn't like, I don't like those big muscle guys. And then all she fixates is on The Rock.

What's the name of the play? Jason Momoa. Jason Momoa. I'm like, what the fuck is going on here? She fixates on the biggest fucking, hyper-masculine dudes. I don't like those muscles. Like, something's rough with her. Well, that's like they say, depending on the time of month,

women are attracted to, heterosexual women are attracted to different types of men. Like, she wants to get impregnated by The Rock, but she wants you to raise her kid. That would be the ideal situation. Touche. You got me. Okay. Okay. I do think you're effem kid. That would be the ideal situation. Touche. You got me. Okay. Okay. I do think you're effeminate.

I accept. We would like to keep my ground for... I propose maybe we put in some of Mike's album into the show. I'm sure. I hope they'll do that. And then we'll have our hour and then we can get Mike to join us for a little bit of our bonus show after. I'm out. You guys.

Wait, no, no, no. I have a question since this is the only time I'm going to get your undivided attention.

Um, look how nervous he's like, Jesus. I'm trying to pay attention now. Um, can you talk a little bit about clips

because there's a rumor going around and I just want to have clarity even better if it's recorded so you can't say I got it wrong. Okay, go ahead, Perry. I have to ask you a question. Have you not learned from Dan not to bring stuff like this up

on the show? Well, then you have to talk to me after the show. I can't do that. Noam loves clips. Noam, I told you that Mike would be a dynamite guest. I always liked Mike. I was questioning whether we should do just,

usually you come on as a guest with me, and I actually do like your input when I have guests. I appreciate it. Yes, you know, because you're like a. I always love coming here. I never know what I'm going to get. Today, when I walked into the room, it was a very loving you again.

And now here we are. No, if you saw the, actually, when she suggested it, I said he's one of my favorite guests. I said that. That's exactly what I wrote. Yeah. From the bottom of my heart. Like, sometimes out of sight, out of mind, I haven't seen you, whatever it is. Yeah.

So, it's good that you asked to come in. Anytime we have, like, a political guest or whatever it is, he's very, very excellent. I know. He did say, quote, unquote, he's one of my favorite guests. I would like to utilize Mike a little bit for our bonus episode. So I don't know. I mean, if you have a problem with that, let me know. Why doesn't Noam join us for our bonus episode?

He could certainly do that. Well, I mean, I can continue talking. Yeah, but that's not a bonus episode. We have to say goodnight and then start again. Okay. Goodnight, everybody. Okay. That's our show.

Thank you. We'll see you next time. Thank you. Okay. So now.