The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Live from the Table: Jason Salmon

Episode Date: April 28, 2023

Noam Dworman, Dan Naturman and Periel Aschenbrand are joined by comedian and actor, Jason Salmon. His multiple television appearances include Orange is the New Black, 30 Rock and 1 of 5 automobile based commercials you’ve seen in your lifetime. His new standup special, Biscuits & Gravity, is out now, on YouTube.

This is Live from the Table, the official podcast of the world-famous comedy seller coming at you on SiriusXM 99 Raw Dog and as a podcast wherever you get your podcasts. How are you? This is Dan Natterman. I'm with Perrie L. Ashenbran. She's the producer of the show. And Noam Dorman is with us. He is the owner of the ever-expanding comedy seller. Noam, how do you do? Noam is looking at his phone. I'm doing great. I'm just looking at an old picture of me and my wife from like, I don't know, 19...

19... It's hard. I have to figure it out. Probably the 90s. You met her in the 90s, right? Yeah, I met her in the 90s. Late 90s, it would be. How do you feel looking at that picture of your younger self? I don't mind.

I mean, I'm outraged at the idea of getting older, you know. But, yeah. I don't think I ever looked quite like that. There's something about that picture. I put it through like a photo restoration thing. I'm asking them to bring up the original from the office so I could see it. But I was a little boy. I look like a little boy.

Well, I'm always sad to see older pictures of myself because, you know, the differences. Even from five years ago, you know, the differences can be startling. And time does march on. Anyway, the comedy star is getting a new website. I think that's worth mentioning. It's a gorgeous new website.

Is it gorgeous? I think so. I didn't see it. The current website is kind of... I haven I think that's worth mentioning. It's a gorgeous new website. Is it gorgeous? I think so. I didn't see it. The current website is kind of... I haven't seen it. Go ahead. The current website's... I know some people like it because it's very simple and down-home and kind of no frills-y.

But this new website is extremely splashy. And when is it... I guess it hasn't gone online yet. So the old website... and when is it, is it, I guess it hasn't gone online yet. Oh, so the old website, you know, the old website,

that website was a new website, I don't know, 10 years ago and I went to a company to do that. It was the same company that did Howard Stern's website. I guess I shouldn't say their name on the air even though, whatever

and I didn't have a good experience and they charged me a lot of money. And, you know, it was like what I imagine a prostitute would be. They didn't really care about me. They just wanted, you know, like I paid my time, and they just wanted me out. So they gave me a website as quickly as possible. I was never really happy with it.

But at least it had like a time capsule look to it. So I felt like even though everybody criticized the website, it was still something about it that it wasn't like, if you look at the other clubs, a lot of them have like template websites. It looks like they downloaded a template. It looks like a strip mall type club. So then finally, this website. So I was able to work with somebody who's kind of a friend of mine and... The new one. Yeah. And he's a labor of love for me. He's a graphic designer and I have another guy who's

responsible for the coding. And this website is really going to utilize all our old pictures and stuff like that and digitizing video and stuff like that. So to really impart the feel of the Comedy Cellar as not just a stage, but as a gathering place for comedians,

a scene, like a historic location. Yeah, so when you go on the website, you'll see different pictures. There'll be a montage of pictures, like a, what do they call that when they're, like a slideshow, I guess, of pictures from the history of the Comedy Cellar, everybody from Jerry Seinfeld to Robin Williams to, I mean, you name it, I guess, is he right, Mitch Hedberg?

Yeah, and most of the pictures are them not on stage, of them hanging out, which that was, I think, the key decision that I made was that I, because at first, he was just giving me all these pictures of everybody on stage. I said, well, you know, actually, when I look at the pictures of the club, I'm much more drawn to the pictures of everybody hanging out in the olive tree, you know, various

people hanging out together, laughing, whatever it is. So I really weighted it much more towards pictures of these people just hanging out. There's a great picture like Jerry Seinfeld going over his notes in the stairs, you checking your phone at the podcast table,

stuff like that. I like that stuff. Pictures of amazing combinations like Louis and Robin Williams and Jim Norton and Bill Crystal and someone else famous is in that picture. Like just crazy combinations of people all hanging out. And there'll also be old clips on the website?

Well, it may not be when we first put the website up, but I definitely am digitizing hundreds of videotapes. So I'm going to put some – well, I don't think I'm going to have sound because I don't really want to play old performances. I have to get permission for everything, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But just like old crappy quality video, a few seconds here, a few seconds there of various people on stage, I think it's fun to see. Weren't you posting some old videos, though, on the Instagram site? I got permission for those.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I saw there was a Mitch Hedberg clip, I think. But you said there's no sound? Yeah, there's no sound. You put me in touch with his. He played here very seldom, as I recall, Mitch Hedberg. Yeah, but he played here.

Yeah, that's going back, obviously, quite a ways. For a while, he was here a lot. Oh, okay. Yeah. Maybe that was during the time that I wasn't here a lot. That's why. He took your spot for a while. No, no.

There was a time where I was in and out of this club. Through the 90s, I was sort of in and out of this club. I was in, I was out, I was in, I was out. And then the early 2000s, I started to become a fixture. So I was looking at- Staggeringly long time ago. It is a long time. So what do you think about Tucker Carlson being fired, Dan?

Well, you know that I don't necessarily follow these things closely. But obviously you have strong opinions. No, I don't. What do you think, Periel? I couldn't be more pleased. Why? What, you thought he deserved to be fired? I don't know.

I mean, I don't think he ever deserved to be on the air to begin with. I mean, I have no idea what, you know, if he did something or what, but I think he's disgusting and horrible. Just awful. Who wants it? Just spewing. Megyn Kelly has a discussion about this topic on her podcast today. Yeah. It was a little bit more. Well, what did she say? Did she like him? I don't want to

talk about it. But anyway, I would like to get on somebody... This is a very interesting topic. Tucker Carlson being fired and Don Lemon being fired. Well, I know that Roy Wood mentioned it. Roy, should I... I mean, he's doing the White House Correspondents and that's not a secret, I don't think. I don't think so. Not anymore. He was... I don't think it's a secret. I mean... No, it the White House Correspondents' Dinner. That's not a secret, I don't think. I don't think so. Not anymore.

I don't think it's a secret. No, it can't be a secret. He was here working out the material for it. The material is a secret. Yeah, a material I'm not going to get into. But he mentioned, I think he mentioned Don Lemon and Tucker. But it was very good. I don't know if you saw it.

I think he's going to do well. It's just weird because he goes on stage and he says he has to preface it by saying this. This might be of some interest. He has to preface it by saying, OK, I'm doing this this event. So I'm just doing jokes for this event. Then he says, good to be here at the White House Correspondents Dinner. So and then he's he's doing the jokes as if he's really there. So it's a little odd because he's saying like, President Biden is here. Hello, Mr. President. In front of the Comedy Cellar audience, but they enjoyed it. They had stopped having comedians, as far as I know,

hosting that after Michelle Wolf's performance. When was that? This is like six years ago. Michelle's was six years ago? That can't be right. It was like Trump's first year or something like that. That is like six years ago. Wait, Michelle's was six years ago? That can't be right. It was like Trump's first year or something like that. That is astounding. I mean, of all the

shit that happened a long time ago that I thought was last year. It's 2017 or 2018. Didn't she just skewer him? Well, yeah, so she had asked me to look at the video of her set before

and tell her what I thought of it, and it was great. But I say, oh, you know, that joke about Sarah Sanders. 2018, 2018. 2018, that joke about Sarah Sanders being from the, what was the show that she compared to? What's the show about the poor people? Nicole, what's the name of the show? I'll find it.

TV show. I'm still reeling from the fact that that was five years ago. What show? Can you say a little bit more about it? I've never seen it. Anyway, she compares her character from this TV show. Essentially, you know, saying she's ugly and fat and whatever it is. And I said, that's pretty harsh, Michelle. I don't know

how that's going to go over. So I did identify the one joke which would be the most controversial, but I had no idea. I mean, that was a huge event. Handmaid's Tale? Handmaid's Tale, yeah. Good.

So, but Michelle knew what she was doing. I mean, that really catapulted her career at that time. It was a funny, funny routine she did. But, you know, I'm just never partial to really mean jokes. I never have been. In this digitizing process, I found some old Lisa Lampanelli sets. And, my God, the stuff that she used to say.

Really harsh ethnic jokes. Yeah, they were ethnic stereotype jokes. I remember at the time being uncomfortable with them. I remember telling my father the stuff she's saying. And my father said, no, she's great. And he was right.

She's going to do a big star after that. But I was always a little squeamish about that stuff. Not offended. Offended wouldn't be the word. Just there's something about it that I didn't, like I feel not, I feel like not good laughing at some of that stuff. Right, right, right.

And you know me, I really don't care, but for whatever reason, but you at some of that stuff. Right, right, right. And you know me. I really don't care for whatever reason. But you could never say that stuff now. I mean, when Dice Clay was here not long ago and tried to camouflage his old material by saying, I used to be able to say this, but I can't say it anyway, it didn't go over. He had trouble with it.

Other stuff he did win over, but the old stuff. What were some of the jokes? Do you recall some of the jokes that Lisa was doing? No, I'll find a few. I mean, just... Well, you know, Don Rickles used to do that. I mean, Don Rickles, I saw an old roast of Don Rickles. I don't know who they were roasting, but, you know, of course, he's

roasting everybody in the room along with the roastee. And he was saying stuff like, he said something like Isabel Sanford, I think. Remember, you know, Isabel Sanford, the actress who played Wheezy Jefferson? Yeah. He said, okay, you're going to clean up afterwards or something like that. Like things that are just, he kissed, at one point he kissed Sammy Davis Jr. He said, I love this man.

He kissed him on the cheek and he says, did any of it rub off? I mean, just stuff that you cannot even believe. But that was, I assume, roughly the kind of stuff that Lisa was saying. No, it was worse. I believe the stuff was worse. So there's a funny routine. I mean, funny, but where it was like Sammy Davis Jr., Dean Martin, and Frank Sinatra. And Dean Martin is like, and Sammy Davis Jr. jumps into Dean Martin's arms.

And they walk towards Sinatra. And Sinatra says, I'd like to thank the NAACP for this award. And that always struck me as kind of funny. And not only because Sammy Davis Jr. obviously was in on the joke, which doesn't really cleanse it, but it's cute. It wasn't mean, you know?

But some of the mean stuff, I don't know. People might think I'm like, because I'm so anti-woke and everything, that I think everything is fine. I do think everything is fine, but that doesn't mean personally I've always... But let's be clear,

these jokes weren't brilliantly written jokes. It's not like people say, oh, you can't, comedy's not what it used to be. I mean, it's true you can't say those things anymore for good or for bad, but let's be clear, these weren't brilliantly written jokes. These were basic, easy jokes, like Isabel

Sanford going to clean afterwards or whatever, you know, stuff like that. Did it rub off on me? These aren't brilliant jokes. These are easy jokes. And I don't know that comedy is diminished, even if you believe that we shouldn't be so politically correct, whether you believe that or not. I don't think comedy has been diminished

because these jokes are no longer being told. They're also funny. They weren't good jokes. They're funny in certain contexts. So in a roast situation. So, like, for instance, we've seen roasts where, you know, some of the black jokes can be really, like, outrageous. Like, I don't know.

Can I say what? Like, things that upset me. No. Like, you can't say them? I mean, they're on the roast. And within that context of the roast, I will laugh at them because

the roast has different rules for a roast. So the same joke which I would laugh at at a roast, I wouldn't laugh at it ordinarily. So like in a roast, didn't rub off, or I think Rich Voss compared some black comic to King Kong one time in a roast, whatever.

Like you say you're just not supposed to say. Well, that's dangerously close to Shane Gillis, which got Roseanne Barr in trouble. Right. But the thing is, when you're at a roast, it's like there's rules. And it's like there's a Marcus to Queensberry rules in boxing match, but a roast is MMA or whatever it is. And in a roast, everybody knows, listen, you can say whatever you want.

The stuff you can't say, part of the fun of the roast is that now you can say it all. Well, even in a roast, there's limits. Jason Salmon is with us. Jason, we were discussing, you ever see these old Don Rickles roasts where he's making really crude racial and ethnic jokes? Yeah, they feel so dated. It's almost like a time capsule. It's almost like a, I think Sarah Silverman summed it up. She's like, if you haven't been insulted by Don Rickles, then you aren't in comedy. Like, she felt like that was, like,

this sort of coronation of her as a comic to have been insulted by him. It's almost like he spoke a language that went out of fashion before he died, but he was the only one who still spoke it and could get away with it. Well, then Lisa Lampanelli took up the mantle. We were discussing her before you got here.

But we were saying that you can't really do that anymore i don't think you could get away with i think with roasts there's a weird because there was a stretch of time where a bunch of that was a big thing going on uh they were putting stuff online all the time they were having all these roast battles and part of the thing was it's like this is a place where you know that these two people are friends. So they are play hating each other. And it sort of broke away all that. You're like, oh, this is not based on hatred. This is based on, can I get deep into you?

You know, can I hurt you, sort of? You know, can I do a thing that makes you go, oh, no? Well, that's what Dome was saying, that the rules are different. Anyway, Jason Salmon is with us, a comedian, actor, writer from Texas. Don't mess with Texas. Don't. Do not. He's been in Orange is the New Black, Red Dead

Red Dead Resemption 2. Have you not played that? No. Oh, that's a video game? 30 Rock. It is. A bunch of automobile commercials. Yeah, if you've seen an automobile commercial in the last decade, I was probably in one of them. Well, that's got to

be good for your bottom line. It is. It is. The commercial world. I never glorious. If Judy Gold were here, she'd be saying, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, because she has an issue with me relating things back to me. That's hilarious. That stuck with you. Back in the 60 me, me, me, me, me, me, me, because she has an issue with me relating things back to me. It's hilarious that that stuck with you. Even back in the 60s, it was me, me, me.

Well, I thought it was unfair. I thought it was unfair. I mean, I am, because of the podcast, my life has relevance to it. I feel like she's got a point. But I think I never did have any luck with commercials, but you have that look of just southern. I have a cautionary tale.

You know, NASCAR. That's my job in commercials. I am the guy you put up next to your product and you're like, if you don't buy our product, this is the direction your life goes. That was it. I am. I'm cautionary tale guy. Well, you look like your average NASCAR fan. I will tell you, I have done. I have met cautionary tale guy. Well, you look like your average NASCAR fan.

I will tell you, I have met tons of NASCAR drivers. I have done tons of NASCAR commercials, yeah. And more than that, you look like a black and white photo of you would look very similar to a Civil War tin tub. You know what? They showed a thing they were talking about when Kevin McCarthy was being voted on for Speaker, and he went to like 30-something votes or something like that. They're like, oh, the previous most votes was this guy.

And it literally, I was like, that looks like me. That looks so much like, and he was in a Civil War outfit. I was like, all right, yeah. Yeah, you look like you fought for the gray. Okay. His new stand-up special, Biscuits and Gravity. Yeah. Not gravy, gravity.

Gravity. On April 27th, it's out. Where is it out? On YouTube? YouTube. Coming out on YouTube. That's how it's being done nowadays. That is.

You do it yourself and you put it on YouTube. Uh-oh. I got a call. My wife says call me ASAP. Uh-oh. Okay. Well, I hope everything's okay. Well, I can take the beginning of it here.

I'm sure she just, she's just. She's listening in. She's oblivious to, I mean, I hope it's not tragedy. Cut it out of... Hi, is everything okay? I'm doing a podcast. What's the headline? Oh, it's good. Okay, okay. I'll call you later. Okay, bye.

Bye. Okay, no tragedy. Everybody's fine. Found some large checks we had in cash. This is... That is the opposite of tragedy. That is literally the opposite of tragedy. Biscuits and gravity now.

Yes. Is that... So what does that mean, biscuits and gravity? I mean, all of my subject matter is, I mean, I talk about everything. I talk about race. I talk about generational issues. I talk about gender. What's your feeling about race?

I feel like I look so much like the opposing side of any racial harmony that I feel like I have to work a little extra hard, you know, most people like say, Oh, I have a black friend. I go, I have a gay Muslim black friend. That's what I,

well, you also have the accent. Yeah. Yeah. The nothing about me. Like I always to an, to an audience, I feel like I just have to go,

I see it too. Whatever you see, you know, and look in certain places, it's like, okay. The elephant is in the room. Let's discuss it. Yeah. I mean, especially in New York.

I mean, especially the further out in Brooklyn you get, the more I'm like, hey, I get what you see. Just hear me out. Let me talk. Well, Vic Henley, the late Vic Henley, who used to work here. Yeah, love Vic Henley. He didn't look quite as Southern as you because he didn't have the mustache.

Right, yeah. And he had that gray hair. He looked like a... He always used to be blonde. But he had a thicker... I never knew him blonde. He had a thicker accent. I believe he was from Alabama.

He did. So Alabama trumps Texas, I think, on the scale of... It does. ...of what you're talking about. But he... And he had that accent, but he was quite a liberal guy. Oh, very liberal. You know, I don't know if you qualify yourself as liberal.

I always qualify myself as moderate. I feel like the spectrum is moving and not really me. So I mean, I feel that way. So you woke up conservative, even though you really always thought you were moderate. I woke up more liberal than conservative, definitely, yeah. But I always saw myself as moderate. But the problem is the spectrum keeps shifting, you know? So it's like—

Wait, you're moderate and now you find yourself considered more liberal? Yeah, yeah. Maybe where you live. Well, right. You live in New York City. I mean, I'm from Texas. So many of my friends just unfriended me completely because I was like, hey, maybe the guy died because somebody stood on his neck for a while. You know, and they're like, whoa, that's, you know, and they like. So you're a radical.

Yes, yes, yes. I'm more of a mathematician. That's what I'm really best at. So I just sort of go, all right, percentages. Do you discuss gravity in your special? Or is that just... Uh, no, but science. So I thought gravity, biscuits and gravity was a good pun to sort of go, hey, this is like a dumb guy talking about smart things. I don't know.

It's sort of the vibe I give off. Better than biscuits and science. Yeah, biscuits and science. Or biscuits and test tubes didn't work. I tried that with a market audience. Didn't, yeah, I got a lot of bad feedback. Do you talk about your dad at all? I don't in this, well, I do, I talk about conversations that I had with my,

well, I talk about explaining gender to my dad. How'd you do that? I related it to, he asked me about. Well, apparently Periel knows something about your father. Yes, yeah, my dad, in fairness has he has alzheimer's he's had alzheimer's for a while um and so he's progressed and he's pretty close to the end and it's you know it's one of those things that for me was was something that i'm an optimist so it's sort of like challenged the concept of being an optimist for me. So it,

uh, it's been an interesting journey with that, but I'm in a very peaceful place and I just, I was, you also put up all of these beautiful videos. Yeah. I film, I feed my dad when I go to visit him,

you know, cause he's at that state where he can't really, he can't feed him. He can't do it. What does he do when you're not there? Uh, well, I mean,

he's at a facility. So everybody, I mean, he's at a facility. So everybody, I mean, it's not, yeah. If he was depending on me to feed him, yeah, he would be. Because he can't. Well, that sounds pretty serious. What's weird is CrossFit. You're not going to believe this, but CrossFit when I'm not there.

That's what he's into. That's what he really, it's basically either me feeding him or extreme sports. How old is he? He's 75. That is very young. It is young. And he's legitimately had late stage Alzheimer's for over a decade. Wow.

Yeah. And did you know for over a decade? Yeah. Yeah. That's when it got diagnosed. Well, when did you first start to see symptoms? Probably about a half of a year before then. You just noticed that you didn't

realize it was symptoms until the doctor diagnoses it and you go, oh. So we're talking about a man in his mid-60s. Yeah. Quite, quite young. He just was... Before you say the symptoms, you have some hypochondriacs in the room that don't like to hear about symptoms. Well, believe me,

his symptoms are my dad's symptoms. I'm kidding. Well, whenever I say, on this podcast, whenever I say his, we know that Dan is the first choice. But no, my dad's symptoms were just, he was forgetting. He was just being mindless. But he had just retired. What did he do? He was a school administrator.

So he was a principal for a long time, and then he was a superintendent of a school system. And he was really good at going in failing schools and helping them structure themselves. He was like a human investment banker where they go and restructure something to keep him from going bankrupt. So have you checked his DNA, like the APOE gene? I have, yeah. I'm slightly greater risk, but I also have none of the lifestyle factors that he had. Like he only loved red meat, bacon. He didn't drink a lot, but he...

I just read an article that the lifestyle factors are overblown. I'm kidding, I'm kidding. I don't know. I definitely think... I'm just messing with you. I don't know. I mean, exercise, obviously. Yeah, and he wasn't

an avid exerciser. And exercising your mind. So they say, learning a second language. This is not why I study French, but I guess it could be it might be a side benefit. Well, I'm not going to lie. I've seen some of the symptoms in you since I've been here. So keep at the French. Okay.

That's all. I did get a joke out of it, but I don't want to me, me, me, me this thing. But if anybody's interested in hearing the joke. Well, let's hear your joke. And then I want to hear about his dad's gender. Go ahead. Well, my joke was that I'm studying Spanish because I read that it is the lazy onset of Alzheimer's disease. So if I get it, I'll get it later.

And then I guess I'll have it in two languages. And people will be like, Mr. Natterman, is this your wife? Yo no se. So that's the joke. It's not one of my killers killers but it's a B plus joke it's not my cousin Sheila level joke why are you explaining gender to your senile father

I am not are we supposed to use the word senile it sounds like a politically incorrect you can say senile he's not senile he's suffering from Alzheimer's senile would be I think that's more of a specific, there's medical terminology for that. I thought senile was the general term for all those.

I will say that, and I don't. You just fucking can't say anything anymore. I don't know. I don't know if you can say it or not. To me, it feels like an old word that I don't hear anymore. Senile always feels pedantic. I had a mulatto friend, and she was senile. I don't hear the word senile. You're not allowed to say she that I don't hear anymore. Senile always feels pretty good. I had a mulatto friend, and she was senile. I don't hear the word senile.

You're not allowed to say she. I can't say she. I'm not hearing the word senile a lot anymore. I hear dementia. Yeah, well, I think senile was when nobody knew what the specifics of brain degeneration was. And now we have names for everything. It's one of the things that I hate more than anything is this thing that all of a sudden words that were never, ever used in any kind of derogatory way.

A memo is handed out. You can't say this anymore. And then you get in trouble for it. Oh, yeah. Noam got furious. You can't say committed suicide. First of all, that's just one article. Yeah, yeah.

You have to say it was iffy about suicide? I was like, died by suicide. Because committed suicide sounds like crime? Yes. And died by suicide sounds like he was the victim. It's not that you can't say it. It's one guy wrote an article suggesting that you don't say it.

Right. But this is typical of Perry L's type. No, no. Don't start with that. Okay. Let me just talk. Let me just talk. You guys can say.

First of all, there are certain people. And you really are. I love you. I was just defending you the other day. To who? You're a husband. But. But. Honestly. But honestly, but you are exactly this type of person.

Here we go. Some journalist, somebody writes something, and because of the pipeline of how it's disseminated, as opposed to just saying it at dinner table, some particular publication, some blog, this becomes like a commandment. And then people of a particular political persuasion, per y'all, they adopt this like they don't think for themselves. Oh, you shall not say committed suicide.

And then they'll say, he committed suicide. What does it matter with you? You're not supposed to. I'm like, why can't you say committed suicide? You're just not supposed to say it anymore. No, no, no, no. Now listen. I did some work on it.

I'm going to defend myself. You're going to. You'll have time. So I looked at ChatGPT and did hard, you know, restricted Google searches. Committed acts of kindness. Committed. The word committed is used in many, many contexts other than committed murder. The problem is. Wait, wait. contexts other than committed murder. The problem is—

Wait, wait. Obviously, in the committed murder, it's the word murder which is the problem. It is not committed. The verb that you used to describe it, you know, you can commit bad things. Like I said, you can commit acts of kindness, whatever it is, that they think they can soften the connotation of the fact that somebody took their own life. Yeah. By changing the word committed, he died by – oh, that's not so bad. Like, well, I thought he committed, so he died by – oh, okay.

It's so stupid. It's so fucking stupid. And they do this all the time, And they do it in political context. And people like Perrielle that don't think for themselves. No, you're not. They heed this. They heed this. And this happened, like we talked about this before.

This happened. I'm glad you said you loved her. Look, this happened when they changed the word. Now, this is going to be shocking to the listeners, but you ask your parents, they'll tell you I'm right. This happened when they changed the word

from it sounds even, it sounds horrible even saying it out loud. It does. To, to, to Asian. I,

by the way, I just did a joke about that on our show. We'll discuss it in the bonus episode. Now, when I was a kid, there was only one word to, to describe. Right.

The descendants, essentially of, of China, the cultures that describe the descendants, essentially, of China, the cultures that descended from China throughout Asia. But it didn't include Indians and Pakistanis or Israelis who were also from Asia. Right. It included those people. The Far East. Yeah.

And then one day they said, well, no, you can't say Asian. How come? Well, didn't you see there was a PBS thing? It was never really any reason. And the people who were latest getting the memo were the Asians themselves. Because for years, you could still go to any Chinese. I mean, this or that. Well, they're allowed to say it.

I remember. No, they would. I used to have friends who were from China. They would continually use it. Yeah. Like they used it. It was kind of like the way Juanita reacts to Latinx. Latinx could have been the next version of it, except it just didn't take.

A bunch of people said, we shouldn't say Latino. We say Latinx. It's really exactly what happened. And they have some crazy rationale, but the rationale doesn't really hold up because the word was never derogatory. Oh, because rugs are orgy. Okay, that doesn't really hold up because the word was never derogatory. Oh, because rugs are, okay. That doesn't mean like, that's not like, okay. But you can have Israeli salad.

That's not a reason you don't call people Israel. No salad is Israel. Yes. But anyway, so, but what's, what's really galling about this particular example is that now you talk about the committed suicide. No, no. The Asian thing is, And this is interesting.

Now you see on college campuses Indians and Pakistanis joining into like student clubs with Chinese and Japanese, the Asian club, and this is simply because they changed the word. These cultures have almost... Something's

in common, but very little in common. They never considered themselves part of the same group. I don't. They never considered themselves part of the same group. I don't think they generally consider themselves part of the same group. There might be an example where they have a group in college campuses, but I think it's a general matter. When I was in college, there was a Korean cultural society. You're almost my age, Dan. The Caribbean American Student Association.

I mean, people, I don't think it's because the word Asian came into vogue that all of a sudden people from India feel themselves closer to people from China. Well, when you say Asian now, nobody knows what you mean. Well, they do. When you say Asian, we knew what you meant. Well, you wouldn't call an Indian Asian. Yes, they do. You'd call them East Asian or East Indian.

Well, now they have to put the problem. What kind of Asian are you? Oh, I'm South Asian. It's not that huge a burden, to be honest. See, I feel like the problem is the generalities. Every time we start generalizing. No, I mean, but that's the thing. Like when you talk about Asians, that's a general term.

If I was just saying, oh, this Korean friend of mine, nobody's like that. There's no problem, the more specific you get. The countries of China, Japan, and Korea, particularly, they actually have tremendous cultural similarity. They study the same Chinese characters throughout the million.

They have their difference, and I'm no expert on it, but I know just from knowing people from those cultures that the... What he's not saying is that they look similar. Well, they look similar it, but I know just from knowing people from those cultures. No, what he's not saying is that they look similar. Well, they look similar too, but that's not the point. The point is that they do all come from the same place, and much of

the Chinese stuff in various ways is still throughout Asian culture. Not Indian and Pakistani. Southeast Asia you're talking about. Yes, well, Asia, you know, whatever So anyway When they change these words

So the key What we're trying to get at is I explain gender to my dad By comparing him to an Asian woman Okay No, you mean Asian Southeast Asian, of course Not Thai

My dad's like, as long as they're not a northerner I don't care which continent Now you mean Asian? Southeast Asian, of course. Now Thai. As long as they're not a northerner, I don't care which continent. You mean like a Thai woman? Yeah, like a little boy. Noam just went on a fairly long monologue. I would like to put in my two cents. After he tells about the gender, why are we explaining gender?

Look up senile. It's exactly what it is. Senile is showing weakness or disease of old age, especially a loss of mental faculties. That's what senile means. It doesn't say that you can't say it anymore. I don't hear it anymore. But I'll be on the lookout for it. I don't hear it anymore, but maybe.

I will say that I think that's a factor of we just know so much more about brain science now. I mean, that word was around when we thought that if somebody, you know, was stuttered, we're like, oh, they might need to be put at home. You don't say stuttered anymore. What do you say? I'm kidding, I'm kidding. Spoke swiftly and repetitively. So how are you conveying gender to your father?

So, no, I was, so my dad was asking, he was confused, like, about, you know, he's like, what's going on, what's this, and what's that? And he was always curious. That's the thing that I, you know, he's like, what's going on? What's this and what's that? And he was always curious. That's the thing that I loved about my dad, still do. He's not really curious anymore. But he would ask questions. He's like, what's this about?

What's this about? What do you know about this? What do you know about this? And I was like, look, let me explain it to you. And so he asked me about gender reassignment surgery, and I compared it to gastric bypass? And I was like, look, let me explain it to you. And so he asked me about gender reassignment surgery, and I compared it to gastric bypass surgery because I was like, just people who are like. We'll cut that out in the call, okay?

Yeah, yeah, whatever you want to do. But, yeah, that is because it's like everybody's got their thing. Everybody's like, oh, I don't feel like this, and I want to change to be this. And for some people, it's gender. And for some people, it's weight. And for some people, it's hairstyles. There's a spectrum of where.

And so I was like, that was how I compared it. And in telling my dad about it, I'm like, it's sort of like this. We had an uncle who looked at himself and said, I don't feel heavy. I want to be thin. Well, I don't know that the analogy is a perfect one. Well, I would say it is. Stuttering is no longer an official diagnosis, according to DSM.

Instead, the name of the disorder has been changed to Childhood Onsen Fluency Disorder. No! Here's the thing. Here's the deal. Joe Biden stutters. It's a fluency disorder. No. Here's the thing. Here's the deal. Joe Biden stutters. He's a fluency disorder. No, no, no. Nobody was around who was currently alive for his childhood.

So he would get to say stutter. No, I just want to address your... I knew they would change it. It's like they... And eventually... My thing, it's all verbiage. I'm like, if you want to go from... which is is four syllables, to Asian, which is two syllables, boom. I'm in on Asian.

Even hearing the word **** was so jarring. It is jarring, right? It's amazing how jarring it was. When I said that, I was discussing rugs, by the way. When I remember that there was no other word. Like, it really wasn't like a word that people used as an insult. Anyway. I'm just excited for the video snippet of this podcast

that has me comparing ****** to Asians in this face. And it's just like, all right, here we go. We won't do that to you. Well, I just said if I could address Noam's monologue about how they changed the word. Now, you know, a monologue means that I was talking too much. Well, you were talking quite a bit. Soliloquy means that it was beautiful.

One article suggested that we don't say commit suicide. The fact is a lot of people view suicide as a selfish act. It's very misunderstood. A lot of people are ignorant about mental illness, like Noam Dorman on our previous episode, who thinks you should just buck up and suck it up. That's not what I said. I said if you don't actually

have some... I was saying if Bruce Springsteen doesn't actually have clinical depression, like something, and he's upset with his life, the best thing I'm going to say to him is, you know, get over yourself. You're Bruce Springsteen. You're indulging yourself.

Like the Godfather. You can start by being a man! That's what I think. I don't think that's necessarily bad advice to people sometimes. People can get caught up. But not to people who are actually suffering from clinical... There's a dynamic when you have

sycophants around you and you're famous and everybody caters to your every whim and you begin to get enamored with yourself and, oh, I feel... I feel a little under the weather today.

Oh, what's the matter? Oh, that's awful. Can I do anything for you? And that, you know, and you can get addicted to that. I don't know anybody that's talking about that in their biography.

But in any case, or autobiography, Bruce Springsteen brought it up in his autobiography because he was suffering deeply. Anyway. What was he suffering? Depression. But what was he, okay, but was it,

what was bothering him? I don't know. I didn't psychoanalyze. Is this fucking, he didn't mention it? I will say this. He was depressed. I mean, because you're so ignorant about depression, you don't realize,

it doesn't have to be attached to anything specifically. It's just an overwhelming sense of sadness and worthlessness. Which, by the way, has to be speaking for himself here. And it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with your life situation. Although, let's be honest about it, our life situations are all pretty shitty, considering there's no God and we're all dying. And that includes Bruce Springsteen.

Now that's where I draw the line. No God. By the way, anyway, so suggesting that we say die by suicide doesn't seem to me ridiculous. Now, as a general matter, words change. Okay, Afro-American used to be accepted. B**** used to be accepted. Cut it out, cut that out.

Do you have any beef with that, or would you prefer to go back to those words? To which words? Are you outraged that it's no longer an acceptable word? We're not in a two-shot on this, are we? I don't know. Good. Words change.

It doesn't seem to be an overwhelming burden to adapt to it. I think the difficulty is that words are like clothes. People can wear them and influence people to believe that they're a certain way, and people can see you wearing them and make a decision that you're making a certain statement, but the fact is they're just shelter. They're just a container to contain the actual thing. And people who don't analyze words...

Go ahead. People who don't analyze words, which I would argue that most comedians overanalyze words if anything if there's any error it's on the side of overan over analysis but if people don't analyze words they can be fooled you can fool people with words all the time and and by throwing this word being dangerous and this word should be used even though it's a even though it's legitimately offensive to a group of people both of those are wrong arguments i think i think that words get weaponized the same way if i would give you my thumbnail having lived through its sketch of what

happened with that word that you said that rhymes with starts with n and ends with all you couldn't find a word that rhymed with it. There aren't any. So when I was a kid, that was the polite term. And you hear a million politicians' speeches in that era who talk about the black community as the n***a community. That changed during the civil rights era. And people started that. And I believe that organically came up within the black community itself, that they liked the term black.

James Brown has, I'll say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud, you know, all such things. And so that became the preferred term. And then the other word kind of faded away. It was never, it, it, it was never derogatory or considered derogatory. Now it's so uncommon that people assume it's derogatory. So that, that was a more organic thing. The Asian thing, it literally changed overnight. And it was different. And it didn't, as I understand, it didn't, it was not part of the expression of a movement.

It was more like Latinx, where the people actually who are being described by the term were almost the last people to get that thing. It wasn't like out of the Asian community. So we don't like this word anymore. But that's not the case with suicide. These people are all dead. I can't ask them.

Suicide victims. It's not like one guy wrote an article. I mean, this has been sort of a general movement. I didn't know that. I think you were sent a few articles. And there's like, and there's like a reason for it also.

Is the following true? This whole idea of changing a word to describe something and then making people who still use the old word the object of ridicule or criticism. This really exists on the left. No, I think it's across the board. Can you give me a right-wing word which has changed? Right-wing people say, you don't say that anymore. Woke. No, woke didn't change. Woke, they changed woke.

They changed woke from something where it's empathetic to a group of people who have been suppressed in some way. No, no, no. And then it became this whole thing. I'll let you think about that and retract it. That is not an example. I stand by it. I stand upon it as a soapbox. That is not an example of that.

It's part of the politics, and not just a moderate, it's part of progressive left-wing politics, to use words and the changing of words and the cordoning off words as off-limits as part of the battle. I have one.

That may be, but words do evolve. And sometimes... Yes, words do evolve. I grew up in that. So kids who have mental disabilities, mental disabilities... You can say that? Okay, go ahead. No, you don't use that word anymore.

You don't call people, or not even kids, but people with Down syndrome. There was a word that's now considered derogatory that used to be used. The M word. I assume you're. The R word. That's a whole step beyond. That's crazy because this, so the term, and I used to hear this word in grammar school, the term that they

used to use for Down Syndrome was horrifying. It was Mongolian idiot. They would call the Mongolian idiot. They would also use the word which is not for Down Syndrome. Yes, it was among other. It was for that and it was more broad, but that's a word

that is not used. You don't use that word anymore. It's considered a very derogatory term. Right. Now, whatever the word that replaces it Mentally challenged. Whatever it is, isn't it true that in 10 years time

that word will become imbued with some derogatory sense because it's the concept which people are trying to run away from. It's not the phonetic label that was put on. There was never anything about the word R-E-T-A-R-D that was derogatory. Now, Mongolian idiot is a horrifying term in so many ways. It's a cruel term on his face. It's comparing them to the looks of Mongolians.

It's making fun of their appearance. And also has the word idiot in it. So, of course, this was a bad. I never heard that. It's comparing them to the looks of Mongolians. It's making fun of their appearance. And also it has the word idiot in it. So of course this was a bad I never heard that. That's awful. This was an awful term. You get that. The word sounds horrible to our ears now like the word sounds

horrible to our ears. And you can't undo that. You can't fight City Hall. I'm not suggesting going back because the connotation is there. But there's no real not suggesting going back because the connotation is there. But there's no real logic to the fact that the connotation is there. I just want to defend myself here for a second.

You're making it like they say this and then I swallow these concepts. It's almost like the Matrix with you. No, but it's like a meme. You just see a meme. I understand. I no longer say... Literally.

I am a fan of a good meme. I no longer say committed suicide. There is... I mean, there's good explanation not to say committed suicide. Yes, there is. Somehow, for hundreds of years, it never occurred to anybody that you can't say committed suicide. Yes, I know. Somehow, for hundreds of years, it never occurred to anybody

that you can't say committed suicide. No, Dan explained it, because it's... Because in the particular case of suicide, there's a lot of misunderstanding. And people, anytime somebody, celebrity, commits suicide, I see it on social media all the time, how selfish they were to have done that. Yeah, I've seen so many memes about that.

People are not going to think it's any less selfish because they say he died by suicide. They say he died by suicide. Well, it might open up a discussion. I don't know. I agree with you. I'm not going to chastise or reprimand people who use the old language,

but I don't have a problem with the evolution of language. Can I make a related point? And I know Periel may not follow this. We need to give Jason Sam a little more air time. No, today, I believe, is the 75th anniversary of the State of Israel. Correct. And people were talking about Israel today on the radio. And it really made me think of this correlation of causation issues.

So Israel is now one of the most wealthy countries in the world, has one of the most technologically adept countries. It has one of the most—I mean, Israel is doing amazing in so many ways. If Israel were a totally failed state, people would say, well, what do you expect? This was an oppressed people who came over from the Holocaust with nothing on their back. They were victims of colonialism. There's a desert.

They have no natural resources. You could just pile on all the reasons why. Of course that's why they're doing terribly. Look at what... But that's not the case. And maybe even these handicaps,

these challenges were part of the reason that they overcame. I don't know. It's like Israel was never known, didn't even have a nation for 2,000 years. It certainly didn't have an army. And now they have maybe the best army in the world. Like they rose to that also.

Man for man. I mean, it's... Yeah. So the point is that just because you can point to, like you can make connections between things, but you really don't know if they're true. You're saying that intellectually I might not be able to follow that logic? I'm kidding.

So another example was Trump was never anti-vaccine. Trump was Operation Warp Speed. He loves the vaccine. He was so proud of his vaccine. And then somehow all the Trump followers became totally anti-vax. Well, he hid that he got the vaccine. No, he bragged about it in the debates. No, no, no.

He talked about the vaccine stuff. Like he hid when he got the vaccine. He didn't talk about it until later. That's not true. Until later. Only later. No, as a matter of fact, it's just not true. During the debates, he bragged that there's going to be a vaccine by the election day and the –

No, he – The New York Times back-checked him. He loved Operation War Speed. He was never anti-vax. He might have later on toned it down because his followers had become so anti-vax. But my point is this. If Trump had been anti-vax and then all his followers were just as anti-vax as they are point is this. Right. If Trump had been anti-vax, and then all his followers were just as anti-vax as they are now,

everybody would say, well, of course, it's Trump. He made them anti-vax. And if somebody says, well, maybe they're anti-vax because Trump said that stuff, but maybe they'd still be anti-vax even if Trump had taken credit for the vaccine. People would say, are you fucking kidding me? You expect me to believe? You really don't? Isn't it obvious that he's responsible for the vaccine, people say, are you fucking kidding me? You expect me to believe? You really don't?

Isn't it obvious that he's responsible for the fact that they're anti-vax? But the fact is you really, causation can be so mysterious and you can make your best guess. So having said all that, I don't believe that these words have anything to do with anything.

Nobody does or doesn't do anything because of some dumb word. You can draw an association between committed and people don't understand. They think it's selfish, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, that's true. You think it actually has any real-world impact? Well, I don't. Is there a word?

Sorry. Jason, Jason, you've been under. Is there a word that you think currently is undergoing that? I found out this committed suicide. So, well, okay. I don't know if that's going to catch on. Again, I don't think I haven't heard that catch on. It already caught on.

It's a thing. If you were talking to somebody. And look, I don't know what the, I've never heard of the committed suicide thing myself. So I am as caught off guard as you. No surprise. Look at me. No chance I'm going to commit suicide. That's the end.

Or I'm sorry. If you do it, it'll be with a shot. Yeah. I don't commit to anything. That's the word that really gets me on that phrase. But if you were talking to somebody and you're like, oh, they committed suicide. And they're like, look, if you don't mind, my son, you know, died that way. If you don't mind not saying committed because it, you know, if that were happening in front of you, would you be, would you be like, all right, I'm cool with that.

Of course. The thing is that when I look at a word, I'm just giving you a baseline for how I look at a word, is if I feel like it's something that I can be empathetic to, then I will do it. If it's something that I think is pure absurdity, here's where I don't agree. I did a show for a college, and it was me and and an asian comic friend of mine and and one other guy and they were offended by everybody and i'm like what offended you and they were like that one guy was making fun of asian people i'm like he was making fun of his parents i'm like that you can't be offended by an Asian man making fun of his Asian mother for how she raised him, because that is very specific. You're making a good point.

So first of all, I always, I do use the words that everybody expects you, because if you dig in on this, like I said, you can't find City Hall. It becomes like a political statement. I have no problem. I'm totally, like I said, it sounds horrible to say that old word. I get it, because that's, but the,

the, the, the movement to change the word is what I object to. People, I mean, they don't even know

the history of the word, so the word has a connotation now, and if you, and if you use it anyway, you're choosing, I want to, I want people to interpret people to hear me say something

that I know is going to bother them. I'm not that type of guy. I'm happy. I don't care about the words. But this whole movement to take words and change them, and it becomes a never-ending quest. Yeah. And there will, I mean, put it this way,

there will never be a time when these people who think that way say okay, we're good now, the language is perfect, just leave it alone let's just disband let's just abandon this, our work is done here, we've cleaned up the language no, it's just nature, they will always find new words, and they'll always find new reasons to be

offended, because they're seeking out the offense they're seeking out the ability to put other people on the defensive. They're seeking out the ability to make people uncomfortable. They love the endorsement of being offended. It's all disgusting. Maybe. And that might be the true in many cases.

On the other hand, sometimes these word changes might have committed suicide. It's a legitimate explanation. It's not just a random thing. Maybe try to phrase it in a way that makes the person who committed suicide sound more like a victim. That's rational. It's logical. It's not designed just to shame you. Maybe it is, but also there's a rational basis.

They're victims? Yes, they're victims. That's the whole point. That's the whole point is that they're victims of their mental illness're victims. That's the whole point. That's the whole point, is that they're victims of their mental illness. And not everybody gets that. And because not everybody gets that, it's worth a discussion.

And you're making it sound like people change the language just so that Noam Dorman will have to keep up with all this shit, and they could say, hey, Noam Dorman, he used a bad word. Maybe there's some of that, but some of these are rational. What do you think about when somebody dies?

When a member of the comedy cellar community dies, Estee calls me up, she says, so-and-so passed. It doesn't say so-and-so's dead. I don't like the word passed. You don't like the word passed. What do you like, kick the bucket? Died. He died. He died is fine, but the point about suicide specifically that Dan's saying is true. There is very serious misunderstanding around suicide.

People who die by suicide are often thought of that they've done something selfish. That's not going to change. That's my point. It's not going to change. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe it is going to change. It's still kind of like a taboo subject.

But things do change. Do you think that... It's not going to change. It's still kind of like a taboo subject. But things do change. Do you think that I would put this out to you as well? And I mean, just being around comedy in general, like doing comedy and being around it. Do you think that has increased your valuation of words? Like, are words, you think they're more powerful or less powerful because of what you know about how people shape words into narratives in their comedy? Do you think comedy

has made them seem more valuable, more powerful, or less powerful? That's a good question. I don't think, well, it's because I've been a comic more than half my life. It's hard to remember what I was like before,

but no, I don't think so. I feel like, to me,, I don't think so. I don't. I feel like they've, to me, words are not powerful at all, but can be used for good and bad in a lot of ways. As comics, of course, we have to, very oftentimes,

one word can make a difference. It can be a joke that doesn't do very well. But what's crazy is both of those words mean the same thing. And you're like, but you know that if I just change this word, that will change the entire way you perceive this entire

idea. Right. Although they might mean the same thing, their connotation, their impact. Right. But all of that is beyond the word itself. The word itself technically is the same meaning. Right. But you know how the word

will affect somebody, and that's what makes good comedy. I mean, for me, that's always been the challenge of comedy. So words are extremely important. They're important, but they're not powerful on their own. It's the understanding of how you use them that makes them powerful. It's like a bullet's not powerful until you put it into a gun and point it at somebody.

I would say that on the right, what they do dig in on, and this is disgusting, is on pronouns. Like when they want to call somebody who's transgender by their biological pronoun. What is the matter with these people? On the right, I don't know. I couldn't tell you. A lot is wrong. I think it's the culture of outrage. So you're agreeing that the evolution of words, in this case the evolution of pronouns, is valid.

My philosophy on pronouns is that that's only words that people use about you when you're not around, like in reference to you when you're not around. Like in reference to you when you're not around. To me, pronouns to the left is like flags to the right. It's like you're putting a lot of importance on something that's basically a symbol for something that's the more important thing. So a flag is a symbol of a country. A pronoun is a symbol of a proper noun named person.

So I find the they thing difficult to wrap my head around and to really understand, and it doesn't really work, and you have sentences that you sincerely and literally don't even know what the sentences mean. But what I'm saying is that if you have a trans woman who is living the life of a woman and you purposely refer to her as he, that is aggressive.

It's a nasty fucking aggressive thing to do as if it really hurts. And that's, you know, it's hateful. Yeah. It's just, it's a nasty fucking aggressive thing to do as if it really hurts. And that's, you know, um, that, it's hateful. Yeah.

Um, that, that's not, and, and there's other, there's a whole, but we've talked about the whole other issues on that whole thing,

which, you know, I'm like on sports. Yeah. You know, I'm open to the, I'm very open to the idea that maybe, that maybe, uh, biological women should only compete with biological women.

But that's not mean. Yeah. No. That's not mean. Yeah, I think taking that, but it's all based on the culture of outrage. I mean, it helps people be outraged if you go, you know what? He did this. He won the women's thing.

And it's like, all right, you can have a legitimate discussion. I grew up in athletics and sports, and there's a legitimate discussion about somebody, even if they take hormones, which they don't know. Which, by the way, like the NCAA, the woman who transitioned to a woman and won the NCAA. They set out for two years, followed all of the rules like the NCAA rules allowed all of that.

And I think there's a legitimate discussion from both sides. But you have to eliminate the outrage. The second you throw in the outrage, the second you start calling the swimmer a he, and the second you start, you know, saying that no matter what, anybody transitions, they should still be able to do every single thing they would have been able to do in their other gender. You know, I think both of those are like a little unreasonable. I think there's a discussion, but that's the problem. Discussion is boring. The idea that a transgender,

a trans woman boxer could be allowed to kick the shit out of a biologist is just too far for me. Especially in something that is a one-on-one.

A trans woman swimmer, as much as that is an advantage, you're like, well, it's not endangering the well-being of another swimmer. If they have a biological advantage, I'm, as is known, I'm open to the idea that maybe they shouldn't compete. But if you can convince me that they don't have a biological advantage. I think the weird thing is, is nobody understands fully the science of the hormones, but the weird thing about that one is that that was a fully grown male athlete that transitioned. And that is where you're like, well, physiologically, the man's body is longer.

And now the muscle mass went down significantly when the hormones were taken, but your body's already longer and it's got a different perspective and you've trained as a man. That's like somebody training on steroids and stops taking steroids. They still got significantly stronger while training on steroids. I sometimes wonder if back in high school if I had transitioned to a girl and competed on the women's swim team, if people would be outraged that I was losing by less. But I can't process in my head how anyone would believe that somebody's like,

I want to win this race the swim race especially swimming i'm like because that's where that's not a big money sport because i was like i want to win this swim race uh so badly that i am going to change genders because i can't i just can't imagine any i can't get a tattoo because i don't think there's a design out there that would that would make me do something to my skin. So for me, I'm like, I don't understand how anybody would. I don't think people would transition just to win a race. Right, right. I can't rule out the possibility.

But that's the thing is I'm so far removed from fully understanding that, that even any opinion I offer on it is an ill-informed opinion because I can't conceive of that at its base. To the extent that there seems to be some sort of social contagion. I mean, without getting into the trans thing specifically, we know that sometimes a high-profile suicide will all of a sudden spark a bunch of suicides. So if there can be a social contagion to die by suicide. Good. See how awkward that sounds?

Progress. If there can be a social contagion to take one's own life, then you could imagine a social contagion for any lesser thing presuming that killing oneself is the ultimate thing right so

so anything is possible in certain numbers but there was just a story today about some marathon I think in England where the man had been

a back of the pack runner and in his first race as a woman he led the pack. Did you hear the story about the woman that transitioned to a male and won swimming stuff? Because there's a real athlete that did that in college too. I haven't heard that.

Was that one of Bill's memes? Yeah. I didn't hear that one. We should pause and Google for that one. It's funny because I was legitimately I was thinking of a way to go up there And make a joke like a very anti-trans Sounding joke

And this woman transitioned to a man It's outrageous She should have been competing with the women Getting back to Biscuits and Gravity Before we wrap things up My comedy is very... Do you have any trans humor? Well, the part where I explain gender to my dad

is trying to say that... How long ago is this, though? It's a long time ago, but I grew up Generation X, and I think there's an interesting component of being Generation X, and it's part of a Gen X joke that I have on the album.

I've got this bit. It's like a 12-minute bit. What's part of a Gen X joke that I have on the album. I've got this bit. It's like a 12 minute bit. What's the definition of Generation X? Generation X is born in 1965 to 1980 basically.

That's a big span. It is a big span but that's sort of breaking it up that Baby Boomers and then Generation X and then Millennials and then Generation Z.

Gen Z. And then whoever's out there now is I don't know what generation they are. They don't like the word generation. Regeneration. They're regeneration.

But my Gen X joke is basically talking about, I grew up watching Boy George and listening to David Bowie and listening to Prince, so gender fluidity for my entire childhood was just like, this is where all the great music comes from. So for me to be able to empathize with a transgender person sort of saying I might

not be this thing that we're all supposed to be. I'm like oh that makes sense because neither was Prince and I love Purple Rain. Where'd you shoot it? I shot it out in Pottstown down in Pennsylvania with Soul Jewels. They got this new thing that was like a barn structure, this new venue,

and I was like, it feels home. Jason, Sam, and Biscuits and Gravity, do you mind? No, if we wrap it up, we do have to do a bonus show, so I like to keep it tight. Let's wrap it up. Okay, Biscuits and Gravity coming soon to YouTube. That's how it's being done now. Yeah, it is.

It's all do-it-yourself, and you seem like the do-it-yourself look to you. I do. You look like you're all right your way around. I'm not nearly as good around tools as I look like I am. Well, Jason, and you're not as conservative as you look. Jason, Sam. DYI termination. I like the ring of that.

DIY, do-it-yourself termination. As opposed to suicide. He diedmon. DYI termination. I like the ring of that. DIY, do-it-yourself termination. As opposed to suicide. He died of a DYI termination. Well, that's something to consider. Self-termination. Thank you, Jason Salmon, for being with us. Thank you.

Perry Lashenbrand, our producer. Thank you. Thank you, Noam, of course. Without whom, none of this would be possible. And Nicole Lyons, our audio wizard. Thank you very much.

We'll see you next time. Bye-bye.