The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Noam Dworman, Dov Davidoff, Dan Naturman and Periel Aschenbrand

Episode Date: September 25, 2020

Noam Dworman, Dov Davidoff, Dan Naturman and Periel Aschenbrand

You're listening to The Comedy Cellar, live from the Table, the official podcast of New York's world-famous comedy cellar, coming at you on SiriusXM Raw Dog. Raw Dog. And on the Ridecast Podcast Network, Dan Natterman, co-host of Live from the Table, here with Noam Dorman, the owner of the World Famous Comedy Club. We've got Doug Davidoff

joining us tonight. It's all happening. A secret location in the Garden State, New Jersey Periolation brand. The producer as well as sounding board and female point of view desperately needed. Lightning Rod.

He's there as well. If you're not listening to Live from the Table, then you are not female point of view desperately needed. Lightning rod. If you're not listening to Live from the Table, then you are not where the action is in the podcasting world. So much going on this week. Let's start with the fat black pussycat gnome. I was there just last night. A word out of my skull,

I went downtown to see if anybody was hanging out at the Comedy Cellar Olive Tree. And as I passed by the Fat Black Pussycat, I noticed there were tables outside, and Steve King was sitting there, the bouncer. And apparently you guys have now outdoor drinking and dining at the Fat Black Pussycat. And you didn't have it this entire time. You just started it this week. I want an explanation. Why so long before outdoor drinking and dining at the Fat Black? Because we're getting ready for next week when they're going to allow indoor dining. Right. So we're just getting the place back up and running a week early.

Well, why didn't you have it all this time throughout the summer? Because we wouldn't have done any business. Okay. The quick answer to a rather long, or at least not enough business to offset the cost of opening. So if you're not really doing a lot of food service in a bar type environment, you know,

he's got a good point. He's got a business to run. The rule was that you have to have food. You can't just open as a bar. And, um, you know, the pussycat is not really known as a restaurant.

And on top of that, third street is a crappy street to sit outdoors, as opposed to McDougal Street, which is more pleasant. So having said all that. You have to cut off by 11 o'clock, right? Which diminishes the amount of time you can sell drinks, even if you were allowed to in the first place. Yeah. You know, I'm not proud of what I'm about to say,

but I'm so depressed and detached, I don't even really know what the rules are. I just, I mean the, the, the amount of money that these are chasing compared to the amount of money we need to even, breaking even is by orders of, I don't know, tens of thousands. I mean, it's just like, no. We have a day in the aisle tree where we're taking like $225 or something. Whatever.

So indoor dining is opening on the 30th. I'm told with 25% capacity. Yes. Um, is, is there going to be, you have a stage set up in the olive tree cafe with a plexiglass wall around. It looks like a dunking booth to be honest. Dunking booth.

And it should be a dunking booth, which might make it more interesting. But are, will you be allowed to put on shows there? Well, apparently if we're not allowed to have comedy we can have a girl jerking off behind there and you can put in quarters well i think that's allowed actually

like old time square a little nostalgia for dove and uh yeah yeah yeah i used to get fake id and then jerk off in a booth. That would be great. I do recall one time going to the old time square and I went to a booth or whatever and a woman pulled out her penis. Trying to convince me it was a clitoris. I was born at night, not last night. Last night. And you were also at Fordham Law School at the time so you're not she's not going to get one over on you and uh so I I uh exited forthwith but um that was before the Disney store and all those stores opened up in that area I went to um Times

Square probably 20-25 years ago and saw into one of those booths and saw a very attractive young woman shove a plastic camel up her ass. Yes, yes, yes. A plastic what? Camel. You heard the lady, Noam. It's a camel. Camel? Yes, like the animal camel, but it was a plastic one. But the shape of a camel, how does that go up an ass? Well, it's... It's small enough. Anything can go up an ass if reduced in size sufficiently. I mean, do you know the kind of... I saw a fantastic video.

...people shove up their asses? Do you have any idea what goes on in the emergency rooms, the kinds of things that people are inserting in assholes? Yeah, it goes pretty well. I believe a lot of that stuff is apocryphal. I don't believe people are really putting light bulbs in their ass Apocryphal is an excellent word

I once left one of those jerk-off booths and ran into a guy I knew taking a real estate class about a block and a half from the jerk-off booth It was very embarrassing and we had to take another class the subsequent week It was hard to make eye contact We sat three chairs from one another. You fist bumped, I hope.

No, no, just nodded. After that, we pretended not to know one another at all. So what else? I'm sure he had probably had some experience in those establishments as well, if he was any sort of red-blooded New Yorker You said who then either this individual you bumped into from the real estate class I would imagine of course he did of course he'd walk. Look he was in the same place I was I didn't bump into him at the at you know at a bakery I mean, I thought he was just like on the street as you walked out of the garden. Oh, no No, no, I was I was exiting a booth. I mean, probably flushed about the cheek with a capillary

because I had just loosened the goose, if you will. And then I ran into him as I left the booth. It was horrible. Yeah, well, but you know, you were both in the same situation. So it's just, it's sort of canceled. It is, but it doesn, he didn't, you were both in the same situation. So it's just, it's, it's, it's sort of canceled. It is, but it doesn't feel that way. I didn't go, Hey, you know, you jerk off and so do I. We shouldn't have any awkwardness between us. That's the thing about jerking off. When somebody catches you, we all know we all do it, but we still don't want to be caught doing it.

That's the thing about being human. Well, yeah. When I went to get my, well, you went to the suit, I went to get my semen count, my sperm count. Yes, yes. They give you like stuff and they give you a cup and you go into a room and they tell you to go jerk off and then you come out with this warm cup of jizz.

Oh, my God. It's embarrassing. I mean, well, it's more embarrassing if you have to come out and say, look, this isn't doing it for me. You got any trannies taking a shit? I had, you know, there was no dimmer. In the room where I had to jerk off into a cup in order to, you know,

deliver the sperm sample, they had no dimmer. So it was brightly lit. And it really was a bit challenging to get in the mood, if you will. Do they give you stuff to look at or are you supposed to bring your own? There were magazines and then there was a little TV on the wall, but it was a small clinical experience. And you sit on a wee wee pad in a hospital chair. It was terrible. And this was at NYU. This was no hayseed clinic.

I wasn't getting this done in Arkansas. What magazines are there? Whose job is it to select those? Can you imagine? Are you looking for work? But they should just have a computer there, I would imagine, with Wi-Fi.

You'd use your cell phone. When I went in, all I had was a plastic camel. A plastic camel. I leafed through a high society magazine because I'm turned on by well-educated women. I thought of my wife. I don't know about you pigs. Exactly.

No, I thought of his wife. That's why he was in there for a week and a half in the room. You should have said, I thought of your wife, too. Yeah, I put the magazine down. I thought I'd known his wife. Anyway, yeah, I mean, I went in there. I went in and came out. They told me they'd never seen someone finish so fast.

Yeah. I set the record. I had to do it twice. Yeah, anyway, you get used to it. You do what you got to do. You're not allowed to just bring it. I went to my office was in the Empire State Building. Is that where you went?

No, no. I was on the east side in the 30s at that NYU Pavilion. It's like Cedar Sinai, I think. Yeah, I went to the Empire State Building. Afterwards, I treated myself to the observation deck. Yeah, you should have done it on the observation deck. You know, that observation deck

is killing you. You can kill somebody that way, don't you know that? Yeah, exactly. It's the, the Empire State Building.

Who, who, who works there? It's kind of a dumpy building, isn't it? I mean, it's this iconic building that everyone knows,

but it's, it's kind of a dump, isn't it? It's like the comedy seller of a guy's game. Isn't it like low-end? There's a lot of businesses. A lot of like, there are law firms, and then there are just all kinds of businesses.

I don't think any really high-end law firm would ever be in the Empire State, like Cadwallad or Wickersham and Taft or a scale. I don't know where Cadwallad or Wickersham and Taft is located, but I do know that a big part of their balance sheet is associated with their ability to sell tickets on the observation deck.

That was one of their big wipeouts. Even though a lot of their commercial customers are paying their leases, their observation deck is all jammed up because of COVID. Anyway, we don't have to get through it. We still need sperm counts, but go ahead. How long does that take?

Pardon? How long does that take? You go in there. I mean, how long does that take you guys to- It takes however long it takes. Well, yeah, but you don't want to luxuriate in there. I mean, it's embarrassing enough without going in and walking out 45 minutes later.

You want to get in, you want to get out, because it's the same person you have to deal with, and they all know what you're doing. When you walk up to that desk to sign in, it's very awkward. It's the only time in your life where you walk up and basically say, listen, I'm here. I'm going to sit down for 10 minutes before you call me in to jerk off.

I mean, it's a strange thing to do. When I went in, we were pounding on someone else's door, and the guy's going, I'm edging, I'm edging. Sorry, some man is here. What is it? I have good news and bad news. The bad news, always. What is it?

I can't do that. Okay, you can't do that. The good news? I know how to do it. Okay, I can't do that. Okay. You can't do that. The good news? I know how to do it. Okay. I'm on my podcast. I'll go upstairs, please.

Go. No. I'm going to sit. Okay. You sit there, but we're going to talk dirty. Go ahead. Go ahead, guys. No, no.

Listen. I don't think. I think we've said all there is to be said on this. Perrielle apparently is quite interested in this topic. It's kind of fascinating. If you agree to cut it out of the show, I'll do it for you right now, Perrielle apparently is quite interested in this topic. It's kind of fascinating. If you agree to cut it out of the show, I'll do it for you right now, Perrielle. I don't

understand why nobody's come up with a better system. Like, why do you need to actually have interaction with, like, a receptionist or a nurse? Like, the whole thing was fairly fucking demoralizing. Yeah.

You could mail it in, I suppose. No, you can't. I have a bit about this. I asked over the phone, can I drop it off? She said, we're going to need a fresh sample. They want a fresh sample.

Yeah, they have to have a certain amount of time. Right. It's like a pizza from Joe's. You don't want it two days later. You want it that night, baby. Yeah. And I took a sperm count, and then my wife, we found out Juanita was pregnant before I got the results.

Really? Yeah. Oh, wow. How long were you trying to get pregnant prior to going in for the test? No, I took it as soon as we decided we wanted to have a child. I see. I was 48 at the time. Right.

I decided to do it right then because that's what a lot of people do. They wait like six months, eight months. I said, why wait? Why wait? Let's find that right up front. That was smart. Yeah. And why don't we jump into the big story this week?

Ruth Bader Ginsburg has left us on Friday. Yeah. After a long battle with cancer, many years that she was not well, she has passed, leaving, of course, an empty spot on the Supreme Court and the subject of that empty spot that has occupied so much ink and so much bandwidth. There's going to be an announcement on Saturday.

Trump announced it tonight that the nominee will be announced on Saturday in the Rose Yard. And people are making a lot of this issue that apparently before she died, at least according to her daughter, I believe, or granddaughter or whomever it was, that she said that she doesn't want her most fervent wishes that there wouldn't be a replacement for her until the new president is elected. But of course, her dying wish holds no constitutional weight. Well, it's also a political wish in that regard. And so it would be the responsibility of the other side not to necessarily allow it, though you could make an argument for it, right, Noam?

I mean, the whole point is, if you want a conservative judge, what are you going to do? Wait till you might not get reelected, and then you won't get a conservative judge? Why would you do that? The dying wish is so stupid. What if Scalia had a dying wish? What if she had a dying wish to overturn Brown v. Board of Education? That's right. What a dying wish.

Exactly. Not the dying wish that's in accord with what many people – well, apparently, what the Republicans said the last time in 2016 that they wanted to. I don't think Trump should replace the justice. I think he should

forbear. I think that what McConnell did was, you know, pushing things by not giving Garland a vote. You know, people need to be clear. He didn't even allow Garland to have a hearing. I mean, you just, you know, he just shut it down.

And if I were Trump, what I would do is I would nominate a justice, a good one, and I would start the hearing and I'd say, listen, we're not going to have the vote until after the election. We're going to have the hearing now. And then I would strategically have the senators ask her a lot of questions to bring out the important legal issues that she would be facing. And essentially put this new justice on the ballot with me, I'm speaking as Trump, so that the base would have a motivation to vote and that to swing voters, Trump would look more fair and magnanimous by not ramming the justice through. That's what I would do. Of, just as the Trump base would have a motivation to vote, so too would be Trump opponents have a motivation to vote to not have this person, this conservative judge installed.

In other words, if Trump puts up a new judge, a new conservative judge gets confirmed before the election, it's a fait accompli. And perhaps people for whom Supreme Court justices are a main motivator to vote would just, on both sides might just say, fuck it, I don't need to vote because it's not as much motivation. There's already a conservative judge up there. You're right. You're right. That could be right.

I tend to think the other way, it still balances out the other way, but you're right. I think that swing voters, I mean, there's three options, right? There's the option that I just said, he has the option of not pointing anybody, and he has the option of trying to ram somebody through. I think ramming somebody through would be backfire for him. I think not doing anything, I mean, maybe that would annoy his base,

I think. So other three choices i there's only two real choices and that's a fascinating strategy you laid out though i guess there's inherent risk and you would have to balance that risk against the likelihood that you'll get enough swing voters to make a difference but ramming it through if you are a conservative would be the safest way to achieve the objective, I guess. The problem is somebody needs to break the cycle because then they're going to want to pack the court. And then, I mean, just where this is all going,

it just escalates up and it scares me, frankly. You know, the country is just not going in a good direction. No. What's the ethical thing to do here? What's really like... Trump has every right to say, I'm not party to anything that McConnell did or didn't do in 2016. And I'm the president and presidents in my position prior have nominated somebody.

And, you know, why wouldn't I nominate somebody? He's right about that. The purely ethical thing to do the purely moral thing to do would be to appoint a judge that you think is in line with your convictions good i don't think trump trump will appoint whoever is in line with him getting re-elected but if you're asking from a strictly moral consideration it would be i don't think roe v wade is good. Therefore, I'm appointing a judge that it might overturn or whatever, whatever things he's trying to get done on the court.

I mean, I don't see how the Democrats, I mean, the only ethical consideration here that the Democrats can complain about is the hypocrisy, I guess, because they were, I mean, Obama nominated somebody close, you know, in the last part of the, his term. Nobody said it was unethical. Can I ask a question? Do you acknowledge that nobody said it was unethical, Cariel? Yes, I acknowledge that, no. Why would Trump have ethical considerations here? But it's not a, I mean, none of this is a function of ethics.

If you're a liberal and you want to appoint a liberal, you would do so with expediency whenever the opportunity arose, unless there was another political strategy like Noam laid out. I mean, that's not even a question. McConnell did something which was shady, which I think, I'm no expert, but I think it violated the spirit of the Constitution, which he didn't even allow a hearing. I mean, he could allow a hearing and the senate the republicans had the majority in the senate so they could have allowed garland a vote on garland and you know they could have voted him down that would have been fine they were probably worried because republicans tend to be easier on on democratic picks than vice versa they probably worried that they would lose a few votes and garland might get through but um i think if j if James Madison were alive today,

he would find what McConnell did to be violating of the spirit of the Constitution. But I don't think he'd have any problem with Trump putting a nominee before the Senate now. Yeah. Okay. So can I ask a question and you'll excuse my ignorance here? We're used to that. How come Ginsburg didn't step down

a few years ago and... Good question. Like, allowed herself to be replaced with somebody that was, you know, why did everything rest on her? Don't you have a Jewish mother in your house? No, that's a good question. I mean, it's not like turning, you know, mid-80s was a surprise. I mean, and health had to be fading.

I can answer that. Turning mid-80s. a surprise i mean and health had to be fading if she were i can answer that turning 80s well can i answer first because no i'm a smart one but so maybe maybe we'll have the same answer well if yes her her dying was no surprise what was a surprise was trump's election perhaps if she knew ahead of time that trump was going to get into office she would have said all right i gotta get out of here now right Right, right, right. How would have predicted that? He had plenty of time, right? I mean, I don't know how it works. That's the question.

Like two years ago, a year ago, when her cancer came back. Two years ago, it would have been the same thing. Trump would have been there and replaced her. Two years ago, it would have been worse. Got it. Two years ago, it would have been worse. So no matter what, he would be the one responsible for appointing, even if she were still alive. Unless she had

stepped down while Obama was in. Okay. If she had known, I mean, there was actually no scenario because W.M. McConnell wouldn't give Garland a hearing, so she had stepped down during the latter part of Obama. It just worked out. She almost held out. I mean, she's a few months away from the election here, you know. How lucid do you need to be to not, I mean,

does there ever come a point where they tell you you can't be a judge anymore if you're on a, I mean, if you're barely conscious, you know. At what point in the throes of dementia or comatose are you no longer allowed to decide? Don't you remember, Dan, Justice William Douglas? I don't remember, no. Towards the end of his term, he was writing kind of pretty flaky opinions about who speaks for the trees and stuff like that.

Do you remember that? No, but... Yeah. Well, that begs the question, who does speak for the tree? Well, I think it's funny because it seemed so crazy then, but now it's perfectly... That would seem perfectly credible.

But there is an impeachment. They can be impeached. I don't know anything else. Wait, wait a second. Slow down. So how come she didn't step down while Obama was still in office? If everybody knew that the weight of this was so enormous, why wouldn't she have replaced herself?

Well, she was younger. She was like five, six years younger then. She was 33 years old then. No, I mean, she... She was in her 80s, though. I don't know. They stay. I mean, she didn't think

that Hillary was going to win, but like I said, it wouldn't have mattered because it was so close to the end of Obama's term. I don't know. You're saying she should have stepped down in like 2013 or something? I mean, I don't know. Maybe. I don't know. I mean, it feels like it's such a disaster now.

It's not such a disaster. Well, it depends what you think politically, if it's a disaster or not. Also, it wouldn't kill you to acknowledge that that was actually a good question. What was good about it? In other words, if Ruth Bader Ginsburg knew that she'd be up for replacement in order to make sure that there was somebody, a liberal on the court, that wouldn't

risk having to retire anytime soon or dying, she'd be preemptive. And I said that she didn't anticipate Trump getting an office, but I guess she could have anticipated a potential conservative president and tried to head that off, but they just never do that. Fair enough.

I mean, and, and, and listen, people have been screaming along about the Supreme court, even since we started this podcast. And, and in,

in that time, they legalized gay marriage. They upheld Obamacare recently. They, they upheld trans rights. I mean, this sky is falling thing about the conservative Supreme court, you know, putting black people back in chains and stuff. It's just bullshit. It's just bullshit. The conservative court I think is, is, um,

I think the only issues in play are free speech issues, hate speech. I think this is going on. I think we're all in favor of a conservative court on that. And the other issue is always on the horizon is Roe versus Wade. And, you know, I don't know. I guess they could overturn Roe. I don't think they would, though. Well, Roe could fall.

But then that's good news for the comedy seller. As tourists come to New York for their abortions, why not take in a show? Yeah, I did some research one time about Ireland. Ireland didn't have legal abortion. And apparently, even while abortion was illegal there, they had no fewer abortions than they have now. There might be a few states that outlawed abortion. while abortion was illegal there, they had no fewer abortions than they have now. And it's just, you know, there might be a few states that outlawed abortion.

I'm not sure how many. And, you know, I don't know. The sky would not come falling down. But for some individuals, I suppose that overturning Roe would be very bad and we shouldn't discount that. But it's not as if it would be nationwide bans on abortion. That's for sure. But what it would do, the positive side is that it would take this issue out of the national debate where it's been wreaking havoc for 30 years already. You know, it's just like it was a bad decision. It makes no I mean, it may not be a bad policy decision, but it makes no legal sense.

There's no right to privacy. It's certainly no right to abortion in the Constitution. You don't even need to know about the law to know that that's a crazy opinion, that there's a right to an abortion in the Constitution. This is what we're told. This is what we're told. You're running over your own bodies. Hold on. This is what we're told, that there's a right to abortion in the Constitution, and yet the death penalty, which was totally routine at the time they wrote the Constitution, is actually violative of the Constitution.

So they make it up as they go along. But anyway. Violative. I'm against the death penalty, and I'm for abortion. I'm just also – I can't mouth nonsense just because I agree with it. Logically. I can.

Roe versus Wade. You can Google it. There's a lot of very important liberals who have written about Roe. Noam is intellectually honest and moral. He's a spiritual and political leader in our community.

And you will all, what's that, Dan? What decision, Noam, do you think is on shaky or legal ground uh roe v wade or whatever the case was that that said that uh gay marriage has to be legal in every state roe v wade gay man the gay marriage case is on zero shaky ground because there is no constituent it's it's done people are used to it it's it's it's wrapped in the

fabric of society now the the the uh good fabric i mean it's just it's just it's done and and nobody really cares about it abortion i mean so long as there are people having abortions there's gonna be a lot of people who think that this is murder. And the truth is, science is not the friend of the people who say that it's not murder. I mean, every year, science shows us more and more

that these young fetuses look and behave like babies. It depends when. No, that's just the truth. It depends when. Well, we the truth. It depends when. Well, we have, my son Manny here, we have ultrasounds of him

at three or four months, you know, sucking his thumb. And, you know, it's like, you know, tell me that something sucking his thumb is not only, not only is not alive, but there's a constitutional right

to kill it. I mean, it's, you know, I mean, don't get me wrong. I'm for, I would like women, I'm not against abortion, but I'm saying let's not pretend that anybody who says, no, no, actually, actually, I think this is alive. And I think there's an issue here is like out to lunch. Most abortions take place before 20 weeks though so let's so how would you feel about legalizing making abortions illegal after 20 weeks i saw an ultrasound of dan at two and a half months old requesting a copy of love in the time of cholera um i'm not even sure it was published yet it wasn't it might not have been you're right. Perhaps that wasn't the book you were requesting.

Let me just look that up. Love in the Time of Cholera was published in 1985. Ooh, ooh. So that not only was I, not only as a fetus was I able to communicate, I could predict the future. You could predict the future. That's right. I have a book here written by a financial analyst who grew up in Russia, but he spent his career in the West. And it says, do we need to be free to be innovative, prosperous, or even happy. And what he's saying is where we're headed in terms of technology kind of removes some of the notions of liberty in the first place.

And even though the notion of liberty was so fundamental for our evolution and the industrial revolution, he's asking where do we stand right now on the trajectory of a technological future where the notion of freedom is utterly altered. Your cell phone will tell anybody with the technology to, you know, tap in, hack in, whatever the word you're going to use, where you are, what you're looking at and how long you're looking at it.

And also the notion during COVID of Asian cultures that have more regard for the group relative to the individual and how well they may end up faring in the next century or in the rest of this century i don't know i thought it was an interesting question it is an interesting question it's an interesting question it's a little bit um not necessarily clear there were two questions one do we need freedom to be happy? Two, the difference between the East and the West, certainly as it relates to the virus and the ability to put on a mask and follow rules. What does it say about how productive, you know, individualism is relative to the group? So, you know, they're big questions.

Well, I mean, what was it? I forget who the philosopher was, but I saw it in that documentary about Pete Hamill and Jimmy Breslin. And he talked about how he quoted a philosopher saying that everybody has a, like a public life or private life and a life that nobody knows about. And technology is really doing damage to the life that nobody knows about. Everybody knows about it.

There's no life that nobody knows. And that might be a necessary part. We may need that life. That might be a necessary part of happiness. That's right. And that's part of what he's asking. If we are diminishing the likelihood that an actual freedom is possible by way of this technology

that we've now integrated to the point where we can't put it down. We don't have an option. Did you guys, any of you see The Social Dilemma on Netflix? No, I haven't seen it. I know that everybody's talking about it. Well, you guys should all watch it, especially those of us with children, because basically it has all of these guys and women. You could have just said, except Dan.

I also mean anybody who's listening. Okay, go ahead. And Dan, you should watch it too. All of these people who were extremely high up at places like Instagram, Google, Facebook, and how basically the engineers have created an algorithm against which we stand no chance.

Like it's specifically geared to make us addicted to it. And with young children, especially, the suicide rates are astronomical compared to what they were before social media. Anyway, it's really sinister. It's like the guy who tweeted the like button on facebook and like what happens to your brain and right also profitability is correlated with what they call a filter bubble meaning the money is generated by providing you with whatever your biases already are right yeah yeah I mean we are our attention is the product right that's right that's being sold is our brains and our attentions

can I please have a source for your assertion that suicide rates are through the roof because I mean it's all in the film I mean it's all in there I question I'm not watching the film right now. I'm hearing it. Let's not. And I question that. Let's not get hung up. Sounds like a perielism.

Perhaps, but let's not get hung up on the efficacy of that one statistic and sort of engage with the notion. Periel honest Honest. All right, I appreciate that. We all want to keep everybody honest. She said astronomical levels. I mean, it's not like... It is. I can believe an uptick, but astronomical.

Yeah, like 600% higher than it was. It's like shootings in Bed-Stuy after they took the tip of the spear off the street. The genius liberals that yank the plainclothes guys that hop out of the cars. Anyway, but yes, what do I know? No, Mr. Blasio is really starting to get there. Depression and suicide rates are rising sharply in young.

This is from time. Then there, I mean, there's, I mean, there's all sorts of evidence. Well, you said very young children, but okay. I mean, you guys have to watch it and then you can come back. PBS, CBS News, teen suicide, social media, bullying, mental health. I mean, it's, you know. If you were going to, if you were going to commit suicide, how would you do it, Ariel? Me, I would probably OD on pills because I'm averse to pain.

I feel like I answered that really quickly. How would you do it, Dan? Hemlock? I guess you have to go to Chinatown for that. Don't tell me you've never thought about this, Dan. How would you kill yourself? Well, this is a morbid conversation,

but I think I would... You think? Pills, if I could get the right pills. Pills. But it's not so easy to get the right pills, necessarily. Dan once texted me, literally without context, I see it going no other way than by my own hand.

How would you do it, Dov? Oh, I don't know. You know, I mean... What is wrong with you? You're inclined, like heroin is the happiest answer, right? I mean, just while you go out. I mean, perhaps you know, I mean,

like a monk that lights them up. I mean, there may you know, I mean, what, like a monk that lights them. So, I mean, there may be a more politically expressive way to do it than passing away on heroin. I don't know. I don't know the answer. You would think that the painless way would be the one everybody would choose. I go to sleep in the car or whatever. Right. Right. But yet, like, like Robin Williams killed himself with some contraption where he slammed the door. Yeah, very strange. Yeah. What gives me hanging themselves? with some contraption where he slammed the door and yeah very strange what yeah what gets hanging

themselves i mean something in a prison but they do it in their bathroom and tony bourdain i mean was a heroin addict early in his life you'd think that hanging yourself wouldn't be an option i mean especially if you had facility with a spike and you know some fentanyl in the first place Weird right? Well, I mean hanging is very effective And so maybe there's a concern that another method wouldn't be as effective If for example if you put yourself in a garage and turn on the car if it's a Tesla, you'll be waiting a while If it's not if it's a gas-powered car, it could take some time and somebody might discover you.

I imagine a lot of hangings don't pan out. Who knows how to make it looser anymore? I've never heard of a hanging that didn't work like a charm. That sounds like something I would say. Where would you have heard of all of these hangings that didn't go as planned? I've never heard of a hanging survive.

That makes a good point. Who knows how to tie a noose? And they look relatively complex. You're thinking of a hangman's noose that professionals use. You don't need that. You just need a basic anything around the neck. No, no, no. You've got to have some dignity.

If you're going to end it, you use a professional noose. You don't need the Nuremberg trial noose. What about autoerotic asphyxiation? Oh, it's so erotic. Can we get to some of Trump's other Trump-related stuff? Yeah. Since we are the podcast of record, I've appointed us the podcast of record on all things Trump.

But, oh, I just, I look, according to Harvard, case, case fatality rates percent by suicide method.

I guess this means shows the people who die in an attempt to suicide using these methods. So 82 point, firearms are 82.5% effective. Drowning and submersion. I don't know how they do

that. 65.9. Suffocation, hanging 61%. Gas, 41%. Drowning and submersion. You're telling me 62% of people stayed down that didn't die on impact because they jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge? That's what it seems to say. Are you reading this in front of your child? Huh? Is Manny still in the room? He's playing with a rope. A number of factors are theorized to influence the lethality of a given method. The first is inherent deadliness.

For example, car exhaust with a high CO level will be more deadly than car exhaust with a low CO level. Second is ease of use, a method that requires technical knowledge and less accessible than one that is not. We should get the author of this on the podcast. Yeah, that sounds fascinating. Accessibility.

Drug poison, 1.5%. Cutting, 1.2%. Slitting your wrists, I guess. So there's a huge- Wow. Wow. I'm surprised that the hanging was that low, because like I said, I've never known or heard of a case where somebody survived a hanging.

I've heard of people surviving firearms, and even the Golden Gate Bridge, as we said. What's the pills? Pills, well, drugs, poison, ingestion, 1.5%. It's probably not so easy to- 1.5%. That's what it said easy to... That's what it said. It's not so easy to poison yourself. Well, cut yourself, apparently. Just the risks don't really do it.

If you're really serious about it and you want to make a statement, well, I would imagine, do they have jumping off a building on that list? One thing was 34%. Whoa, whoa, whoa. 34? What 34 what are you leaving off a two-story house 34 well okay i think hidden in a lot of this is you know is half-hearted attempts like some people they don't really want to die they sort of do it but they you know they jump but

they don't jump from the high who knows what goes on but um it says here that fire is rarely attempted. People rarely suffer from fire. There's also some... Sorry, go ahead. There's also some more eclectic means of it doing so, like suicide

by aircraft, which there's a few of those every year. Of course, there's suicide by cop. Well, yeah, but those are very... Once in a while, somebody pulls a pin on a hand grenade and doesn't throw it, I gather. I mean, somebody must have done that at some point. Suicide by cop, there's so many things that can go wrong. You want to keep the probability reasonably high.

I mean, I would think jumping off a tall building is a hundred percent people have people have survived uh skydiving without without the parachute going off yeah you know one out of every one million skydives somebody bounces off grass and doesn't actually expire but jumping off a tall building in an urban environment i gotta think unless you land right on the hood of a cab and bounce or something it's pretty good way to go. All right Manny's here now let's talk about something else. I want to talk about Trump at a recent rally or whatever it was in Minnesota apparently talked was talking about well let me read the quote. Let me get that. Hold on. Noam just said,

man, he's here. Let's move on. And I just thought we've been through masturbation, suicide, abortion, and the lack of freedom.

Anyway, go ahead. I don't know if there's any Tommy the Train news this week. So what did Trump say? I didn't hear anything. Trump said, he said, I'll read that. You didn't put the whole quote in, did you? Oh, yes, he says.

Okay, he says, in Bemidji, I think it's pronounced Minnesota, at the end of a two-hour speech, he said the state was pioneered by men and women who were tough and strong and brave the wilderness and winters to build a better life. You have good genes. You know that, right? Trump said trump said you have good genes a lot of it's about the genes the racehorse theory you think we're so different you have good genes in minnesota he said this in front of an all-white or primarily white crowd of course a lot of people are saying

this is a nazi ideology he's talking about eugenics he's talking about genetics he's talking about good genes in minnesota which is a notoriously white state. Notoriously white? You mean the one, the only state that voted against Ronald Reagan, that state? Well, people, as it may, it's a very white Nordic state. And so when you say that Minnesotans have good genes, people will draw the conclusion that you mean northern european is better at least that's how people are interpreting it and this is this is the this week's latest trump scandal so no i assume you have things to say uh about that i don't i mean it's a dumb thing to say i guess it to me it sounds like a very comics or like come from good stock like you're just saying you're you come from hardy stock i guess i i mean I don't think Trump's a Nazi.

Don't we realize by now that Trump's, the problem with Trump is not that he's a Nazi, is that he's a reckless driver. Right, it's just what's on his mind. There is no, his daughter converted. I mean, he's, you know, I mean, he's got Jewish people. He's more pro-Israel than anybody. He's not a Nazi.

Yeah, but he encourages this fucking white supremacist at every, this white supremacy at every turn. Really? Or do people just say that he's encouraging? I mean, he has, I don't want to take that back. He said in Charlottesville, although he didn't say what they said he said he he he he was properly condemned for uh both side ism but um other than that nine out of ten of the things have just been

bullshit like the stars that were sheriff stars and the ad ads and george soros is a i mean like it's all like like there's never been a better friend to jewish causes that's right ever ever what did benny mara say about that he didn't call him an anti-semite what did he say he said that he thought that trump uh could turn on israel if could turn on Israel if it was interested to do so. But then actually when I pushed back on it, he said, well, maybe you're right. He didn't even seem to be a firmly held opinion that he had. I don't trust him. The thing about Trump is that if I had that many people that were white supremacists waving my flag...

How many people does he have? Well, I don't know. Some number. Let's put it this way. They seem to be more enthusiastic about him than they've been about most presidents in the past 50 years, or all presidents in the past 50. That is to say, if I thought that people, that the perception was existed, that I was a white supremacist, even if I wasn't, I would, I would make more of an effort than Trump has to disabuse him of that notion. Now you may feel he's made enough of an effort.

I agree with you. I agree with what you just said. Yes. No, no, of course he does. But I heard Norm agreeing with that. He's just saying that Trump speaks off the cuff and people that do that are that much more likely to get themselves into hot water and he should take more care in communicating sensitive messaging. and have them, you know, fine tune them just the way we think they ought to be. And that's not really realistic in real life. It is an aspect of Trump, which is, fuck you all, I'm going to say whatever I want and I'm not going to disclaim and apologize and pretend that because I don't give a shit what you think about what I said. And that aspect of him, you know, I kind

of like that in a person. So for instance, when it comes to fighting wokeness, we will never have a president again who will not negotiate with the terrorists I call the woke. He does not give a shit. He won't say, I i'm sorry i hope you didn't misinterpret me he won't compromise he's like go to hell i don't give a shit police yeah you know and and and i think that trump's like you know i i i'm not i'm not gonna do it you know you think that's what i said fine now you're right dan're right, Dan. I wish that he would. But maybe if he was that easily spooked or whatever the word is, he would then start compromising on other things I wouldn't want him to compromise. I don't know.

Yeah, what you're saying is that the very thing that people, some people identify with about him is inextricably linked to the things that are challenging about his messaging. Yeah. What's the other thing? some people identify with about him is inextricably linked to the things that are challenging about his messaging. Also, you know, the notion of, of the alt-right being used, Eric Weinstein, Weinstein, who's really truly brilliant guy. He said, it's a one word argument. The left will use to,

to diminish somebody's ideas. And so took jordan peterson for example and somebody said the alt-right he said oh yeah it's not what look you know the alt-right like the beatles as well as well it doesn't mean that that they're they're they're racist um in a meaningful sense although the word racist now can mean that you have an observation that is unfavorable about a group of people i don't know what the word racist means right now but anyway yeah i thought i i i agree with you and and you know i said something the alt-right you can say that about i mean almost any of the alt-right likes uh wagner uh then wagner was a psychopath you, who can't you say that about? I have to acknowledge,

maybe I don't have to say it out loud, but I thought it, that there's only one politician, when we went through all that stuff with Louis and the Comedy Cellar and everybody was attacking us and blah, blah, blah, blah, all that went through, there's only one politician I'm aware of

who would have taken our side without even, without, without uttering one mealy mouth disclaimer, blah, blah, blah. That would have been Trump. He's like, yeah, good. You know, like Michael Che did that, you know, within our community, very few did and, and no politician, you know, would accept for Trump. So, you know, I just, to be honest, I don't, I give him a little credit for that while at the same time agreeing with what you said, Dan,

and all the while saying that I don't think the big problem with Trump is that he's a white supremacist. Let's remember that Joe Biden said that Mitt Romney was going to put black people back in chains. I mean, the hyperbole that comes out on both sides, out of the people who oppose a politician. And on the other hand, Trump did make those remarks about Mexicans

that was really offensive, the way he came. It wasn't quite the remark they said, he said, but I was offended by it. He never said it again. And yeah, that's probably music to the ears of white supremacists. So I'm not giving him a pass. I'm just trying to see it, you know, with all the subtlety and nuance. Yeah. Yeah. That all adds up. What else, Tom?

Any, any, so I don't know what else I mean, you know The flip side of this is That we went through You know, this white supremacy thing Like Trump, in the second Charlottesville Unite the Right march, they had 20 people.

20 people showed up to this nationally promoted second annual Unite the Right march. So that's, you know, some, it's not an unfair way of gauging how much support there is for this white supremacy in the country. But we went through months of scary rioting and looting right and we heard comment after comment that was music to the ears of the people doing that um and where was perry l complaining about that you know when the new york times was tweeting out property can be replaced i mean they fucking tweet out i property can be replaced. I mean, they fucking tweet out. Property can be replaced.

They have insurance. And, you know, like, you know, not a theoretical thing, while real things are happening, you know, and Biden finally, finally, finally comes out and says, I'm against polluting. Oh my God, he's so brave. He finally made a negative'm against polluting. Oh my God, he's so brave. He finally made a negative remark about polluting.

And isn't that so different from Trump saying, I mean, who are we kidding here? It's incredible hypocrisy. I feel like Noam is, if he had to vote right now, and he had to vote, he was legally bound to vote because you know, Noam doesn't like to vote and he had to vote right now.

I'm wondering whether he would pull that lever for Donald Trump. I would not vote for Trump because he's a bad president, but I'm not going to, that doesn't mean that I'm not going to, I'm going to have to jump on everything they say about it. Noam is an intellectually honest man. And that's why he's my political thought leader. Oh, thank you, Doug. I certainly know him. I put a lot of stock into what he says.

A lot of stock. You put all stocks into what he says. Who the hell else do you know that knows half as much? Nobody. You can go back to this podcast, and I haven't really changed my view. I always said I didn't think he was You did think he would. You were hopeful that he would be able to get

a lot of stuff done because he wasn't beholden to people. In particular, infrastructure projects. So, I mean, you I still don't understand why he didn't do that. Didn't seem like that panned out. I don't get it. I haven't heard a good analysis why he didn't, because that's the one issue that even when they lost the House,

he ought to have been able to have progress. Maybe it's just all the Russia stuff and all the impeachment stuff. I mean, they've just been at him for four years. Maybe that's part of the reason. I don't know. But what infrastructure would you have suggested? What infrastructure? I mean, the roads and bridges are crumbling apparently uh you know airports whatever whatever's needed i don't know i mean you see pictures of like what they have in china being so superior to us how about burying the fucking power lines in in gulf

coast cities or so they don't have you have blackouts every time there's a hurricane. Right. And in theory, that would generate value. It's like CapEx into a building or a company. It would generate long-term value in addition to creating jobs

and the velocity of money earned. I'm not even convinced that Trump, I think Trump handled COVID mediocrely at best or badly. But I don't even know if that made any difference. The only real thing I've seen

that clearly made a difference was that New York didn't shut down when they should have. That is the clear one. I mean, Trump should have encouraged mask use more. And that would have saved lives, I guess. But I mean, man, New York not shutting down. That was huge.

New York and New Jersey. That was huge. The country never recovered from that because that fed the infection throughout the entire country. My friend just drove from New York to New Mexico and she said the number of Trump signs is just astonishing. Why astonishing?

50% of the country is going to vote for him, or 48%. I mean, I think more than that. I think he's going to vote for him. Are you saying that the number of signs relative to the number of Biden signs was astonishing, or just the raw number? I think she meant both just that most of the country it seems the and i mean i can read you what she said and i mean also i think if she's from the east or west coast the notion that lots of people are behind Trump is just not as apparent in a

daily living situation. You don't see Trump signs in New York City. When you leave New York City, you go, oh, that's how he was voted. It's real. Can I tell you what bothers me, Perrielle? I've never been able to make this point to you oh my i highly doubt that don't you understand that a lot of this country correctly estimates that the democrats and the mainstream media hate them look down their nose at them think they they're rubes, think they're racist, and they will not vote for an institution or party that doesn't respect them. Yeah, of course not. And they are right about this, and we should all understand why they vote for Trump.

Who would vote for the party that called them deplorables? Yes. This is a party, they can accurately say, I'm repeating something I hear, but it's true. If you didn't know better, what does the Democratic Party care more about? Illegal immigrants or the white working class that have been victims of automation and stuff.

I mean, obviously, they care about people who don't even belong, don't have a legal right to, I mean, I want to rephrase that because, you know, I have tons of friends who are illegal immigrants. I think they care more about the people who are not citizens, who don't have legal rights here, than they do about that huge swath of America that Michael Moore used to be a liberal darling by championing. And it just kills me when, and you're very typical of your people you represent, when people still don't understand, of course they're going to vote for Trump.

They read the way you talk about them. They know how you think about them. They know what AOC thinks about a fucking guy in Ohio who works for a living. When I'm with my brother and all the PhD Manhattan people that they hang around, I could say any, no matter how disparaging, how I would communicate about white working class people I grew up with that have Chevys sitting in their front yard on cinder blocks. If I have an observation about Bed-Stuy having lived there, I'm not sitting in an armchair on the Upper West Side. It is reflexive defense of any minority population. If I talk about Hasidics or if I talk about white working class people,

you won't get a peep out of the jury. They're so reflexively hypocritical and full of shit. It's incredible. I don't know if that's necessarily fair. Whenever anybody wants to let me talk. All right. Well, okay. Well, go on, Dan. Go ahead. No, no, I was kidding. We're very all talk. No, no, I'll go after Dan. That's fine.

Well, there's truth in what you're saying. On the other hand, you know, Hillary did not call white working class people deplorable. She called Trump voters deplorable. And yes, Trump voters are going to vote for Trump. It's sort of a tautology, I guess you would call it. But was she calling white working class people deplorable or was she calling Trump voters deplorable? But isn't the more important notion is what Noam was talking about, the Democratic Party not communicating to a broad base of people. It's not just about Hillary. So that's fine.

And I am fully aware of that. And I am also the first one to admit that there is certainly an intellectual elite in this country. And there's certainly a class system. But if you for one fucking second think that people like Trump with all of his wealth and privilege give a fucking shit about the white working class people whose Chevys are on cinder blocks.

I mean, to me that is just like beyond preposterous. These people- The argument isn't that Republicans genuinely care. It's that Democrats don't even pretend to care. And Republicans do pretend to care? They certainly pretend to, yes. I think the Republicans do care. That's their constituency. She's saying Trump doesn't care, which I wouldn't argue, but certainly, but Perry Elton, correct me if I'm wrong, it used to be the other way around. Democrats used

to be the party of the white working class. It's like why Biden went to Scranton. And somehow because of messaging, the white working classes ended up more in the camp of conservatives. And it's a massive overshadowing. What about the white working class? What about everyone else? Listen, I don't understand this doesn't care. Like, I never really understood. What is your opinion about Trump? Like, if he doesn't care about them, then why doesn't he just abandon them so he can win re-election?

I mean I think they're all a lot of them seem to be voting for him. But I'm saying like what does he what you think? He cares about getting re-elected that's what he cares about. All right I get your point but I'm saying is that Trump's been talking about this stuff for many many years he's a He's an American of a particular generation. And I mean, I understand he's got personality flaws and he might care, but he would cut somebody loose in a heartbeat if it impinged him in some way.

But I think he cares about the the rock what's that spread rock rid rock ribbed america you know well his track record as a business um man certainly would would suggest otherwise owing people money and saying well i owe you a hundred thousand dollars but i'm only going to get... Okay, so Perrielle, you're right. I mean, we know he's a shady businessman. Okay. But are you prepared now

if I unearth all the lying and cheating and stuff that Joe Biden has done? Are you prepared to hold that against Biden? Like the fact that his son was getting paid a million dollars while he's vice president of work in Ukraine. I mean, like, what the hell is that? Can you name something that Trump did, which was less, more corrupt than all that? And without getting into details, I know people will say, well, that was his son, but no, not his son, because it's all understood. And then

Biden went golfing with the guy from Burisma. And there's a picture of them all understood. And then Biden went golfing with the guy from Burisma. And there's a picture of them all together. And he lied about his law school graduate. And he plagiarized. And he makes stuff about his wife. I mean, they all fucking have stuff you can attack them on. Okay. Yeah.

By the way, can I just, if I want to just circle back very quickly to Perrielle's assertion about suicide rates and social media. This, according to Time magazine, depression and suicide rates are rising sharply in young Americans, according to a new report. But it also says that it's a tough question to answer and that the evidence is not consistent as to whether this is because of social media or not. Okay. Well, watch the movie and tell me. And everybody, I mean, is there a fundamental question, a philosophical question about whether or not we believe in equal opportunity? and you certainly have to help do your best to facilitate that. Because if we believe in the equivalency of outcome,

which is a very Marxist idea, and that we should diminish a lot of standards, I mean, it seems as like part of the poll left and right is the equivalency of opportunity relative to equivalency of outcome, which tends to be really dangerous. Bill Maher, who's obviously on the left, in the same way that I'm on the left, but described it as prioritizing feelings over the truth. And he saw that as a major liability for the left politically.

And so isn't that the fundamental question? We can call it minority, you can call it black, white, whatever you want. It's do you believe that we're going to be better off not having a level, a kind of, you know, what aligns itself with the Martin Luther, with the notion that judge me by my character. The notion of judging you by your character is to say an equivalency of opportunity is what's owed,

not an equivalency of outcome. Of course. And why has that become a conservative notion as opposed to a reasonable human, what's it called, human's not to say that racism isn't real. It's to say, if that's the narrative for every fallback, how can we move on with our lives? What can we possibly do to repair the notion of 300-year-old structural anything, but to acknowledge and to create equal opportunity? Because outcome will be a net negative. You'll be speaking Chinese in 30 years. You can't measure an outcome. Look at Europe. I mean, they don't have equality of outcome there.

The progressives see inequality of outcome as evidence. Yes, that's what I mean. That's right. And it can be. And it certainly can be. Of course it can be. Of it certainly can be. Of course it can be. Of course it can be. Yes.

But they see it as proof. And it's not. I mean, you can make some very simple arguments. And they're really powerful. And they get said so much that they somehow lose their impact. But Nigerians, which you would assume suffer from, I mean, they look black like everybody else.

They suffer from more money than the average white family. They do extremely well. They earn more. So whatever the racism that is going on in America, for whatever reason, it doesn't hold them back. Now we can,

we can go a step further and say, well, so then the natural question would be, okay, what's going on different in Nigerians than what's going on in the Americans? And we would say, well, they're not like, they're not descendants of slaves, the Nigerians. Correct. I think that's probably that that could be the reason it also could just be that not immigrants well it could also just be that they're not immigrants and immigrants in general have a certain you know work yeah brazen a little moxie right that that that we're we're calling the very best uh of the nigerians, the ones that come here, are already more, you know. But no matter how you slice it,

to a rational person, an intellectual honest person, they would feel the need to, if you say, listen, this is a racist country, and that's the reason for the outcomes. And then I say, well, actually, well, here's a group of black people, a big group of black people who are actually doing better than me. And an intellectual honest person would say, oh shit, I better think about that. You know, I gotta integrate,

I have to come up with a theory that allows for that as well. You know, I'm not saying, but they don't. They go, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah, bah. Noam couldn't be more right. And I'll substantiate that with another example. I heard a psychologist talking on NPR about how Asian students are outperforming everybody,

white, Jews, if you want to break that down, to get into Bronx Science and any of these competitive public schools in New York City. And the argument was, well, Black and Latino people don't grow up with parents that have the same level of education and facility with the English language. So you can't expect them to do as well. And they gave a test study of children of Asian immigrants, first generation. And in their home, they spoke Chinese or Korean. know, from, or Korean. And the students were still outperforming their white, black, and Latino counterparts. If you're intellectually honest and you don't begin to question culture, you're either stupid or you're blind.

There is no other way to begin to approach that. You can come up with different sort of philosophies as to why something happens but the notion that the left seems to go like this when you approach when you sort of deliver what is clearly a comparison that at worst needs to be considered of course you have to have to, if you have a theory that you believe is true, it has to be able to explain the real world. It's like climate models get criticized sometimes. Exactly right.

But now it's snowing, and then they adjust the theory to account for it. Doesn't mean you have to throw the whole thing out. You gotta change it. You have Sam Harris and Eric Weinstein. Sam Harris is a lifelong Jewish neuroscientist intellectual with a meditation app who's being called a racist by the left because he's intellectually honest. He doesn't have a racist bone in his body and he's not at all on the right politically. It seems incredibly hypocritical to me

and intellectually dishonest. And here's the thing, and I'm going to add to that. And this really is the heart of the matter. Because the theories are not tethered to the real world. Yeah, they're not. They are relegating future generations

to these problems. The soft bigotry of lowered expectations. Because if you want to attack a problem and you're not actually attacking the problem, you're not going to solve the problem. You're not going to solve the problem. So what they're doing now, more and more,

is they're putting their energies and this is really sad what liberalism doing i don't want to keep talking about race but is that you don't hear very much about how they can help minority kids do better in school anymore what you hear more and more about is just changing the standard getting rid of the, getting rid of the test, getting rid of the SAT, redefining concepts as white supremacy. It's like, okay, but at some point, these kids are going to have to sit behind the computer and write some code or do some math or write a letter. And how did you help them? Like if they can't do well on the SAT, are they going to magically grow a vocabulary when they actually need it? So it's

just, it's disgusting what they're doing. I had said on a previous podcast, if I was a Republican, if I were Trump, I would be, I was trying to win the black vote. If I was trying to win the black vote, I would say, look at the Democrats. They think you can't do it. Everything they say, they think you can't do it. They don say, they think you can't do it. They don't want to help your kid do better on the SAT. They want to get rid of the SAT. Why is that? Why would they get rid of it if they thought he could do it?

That's right. Noam Dorman, 2024, he's got my vote. And by the way, of course they can do it. Of course they can fucking do it. There are charter schools where black kids are doing way better than Asian kids. Listen, we're not interested in, it's the prioritization of feelings over the truth, of outcome over opportunity.

And we will all be poorer because of it on every level. We will all be poorer because of it on every level. We're all, we will all be worse off. Now, let me tell you something about Perrielle. First of all, Perrielle, I want to remind you that on this podcast, on this podcast, we had more than one expert who testified to the fact that Kamala Harris,

who is likely to be president very soon, Kamala Harris put innocent people in prison knowing they were innocent. Kept, Harris, put innocent people in prison, knowing they were innocent, fought to keep innocent people in prison, also fought to keep a man on death row, who she had good reason to think might have been innocent. And I would like you to tell me why that somehow bothers you less than Trump not paying a contractor who had recourse to the courts. I articulated very clearly when we had Laura Bazelon on that I thought that that was horrible. Right. But you still would never met.

What I'm saying is that you're comparing actual human rights violations, like Fidel Castro level human rights violations, to a shady business practice where they have a lawsuit or whatever it is that they work. I mean, it's so, so yes, Trump's a sleepwalker. The fact that this bothers you while you know the person you're going to vote for kept people in prison who are innocent is astounding to me. Hold on, let's just admit the following. You don't really care about any of it, except as we weaponize it against the candidate who you want to vote for. I don't want to vote for bullshit. And I was very clear with my position when we had her on and I maintain that.

And I was, when I'm talking about Trump, it's not me. He was a shady businessman. It's like, this is the character of a person. As opposed to keeping an innocent person in prison? No, I said that was, why are they mutually exclusive? Because I'm saying that Trump is not- Why can't both of those, why can't they both do horrible things? Tell me something that Trump did,

which compares to keeping an innocent person in prison. Well, they seem to be sterilizing women in these ICE detention holdings against their will. I mean, I would say that that's probably up there. Did you read that in a meme somewhere? Dan, did you read about Trump sterilizing women? I don't think I read that anywhere. I think I might've heard something about that,

but I don't know. I wish there was some technology which I could give you a 10 second reputation. I won't a second, but listen, Joe Biden, have you read his stories about where he claims- Can you answer me now? Is that bad to do that? I mean, can we condemn that?

Sterilize women? It's bad to do what? I mean, can we condemn that? Sterilize women? It's bad to do what? I'm serious. I would argue that we should be able to sterilize a lot more people, both men and women, depending on the criteria. It has nothing to do with immigrants or ICE. I know lots of white people I don't want to reproduce. So it's not race-based. I would I'm an equal opportunity sterilized. Be that as it may it says here in this article I'm seeing daily news. People detained by US immigration authorities will no longer see a Georgia doctor who's been accused of performing hysterectomies on women without consent. A government spokesman said Tuesday, Dr. Mahendra Amin has been accused of sterilizing multiple women

without explaining the procedures at a detention center, the Associated Press reported. That's a government policy. That's a rogue Indian doctor. Sounds like a rogue doctor who, I don't know that he's Indian, but his name is Mahendra Amin. What do you think he was? Well, it could be Pakistani, I suppose. You're right. You're 100% right. In any case, it's not Trump. Joe Biden is a plagiarist liar in most recent example

detailed by the washington post biden made up a story in which he as vice president displayed personal courage traveling to a war zone uh taking fire uh he says it was a moving story this is the god's truth he concluded my word is a biden but his words of biden isn't worth squat the post showed reporting that biden got the time period and location the heroic act and the type of metal in the military branch of the regular recipient wrong as well as his role in the ceremony which is a nice way of saying biden lied about an act of military heroism to aggrandize his own role in the story he never faced any fire anywhere he didn't even pin a medal on the guy. There's story after story after story about Biden about this stuff. He's a fucking liar and a plagiarist.

I mean, they're all, can you believe this is what we're choosing from in America? Yeah, it's very sad. Well, I wonder, Noam, if people in general had to run a business and deal with brass tacks and run cost-benefit analysis, whether they would be so, I don't know, so loose and reflexive with regard to not asking for a more, you know, character-based, I'm not saying this well, but you know what I mean. Like if, you know, character based. I'm not saying this well, but you know what I mean? Like if, you know, it's the, it's the difference. I was reading Skin in the Game by Nassim Taleb. And he said, you know, several hundred years ago, if you were a French banker that was lending at 40 to one and your bank collapsed, they would chop your head off. And his point was, if you have skin in the game and you're not an academic,

I don't know, I should make a more careful argument. So I'm going to pull it back. I don't mean to disparage academics. I have a lot of respect. But if you have to make a decision that has repercussions in the real world, you'll be much less likely to create equality of outcome and much more likely to ask for equality of opportunity.

I agree with you. And I don't know if I respect academics. Well, Nassim Taleb has a big problem with anybody who doesn't have skin in the game. And by definition, an academic with just a conceptual skin in the game doesn't have real skin in the game. I mean, I respect academics.

You love academics. What are you talking about? You invite them on the show, Farrah. I respect academics when it comes to chemistry and biology. You love these guys. I like to talk to academics, but usually I like to debate them. Yeah, but you like to talk to them and you know that they're smart and they're not just talking out of their ass.

Don't bat academics around like a cat on a ball. So respect may be the wrong word. I mean, respect has different connotations. I don't disrespect them, like hold them in contempt. But I do find that more and more and journalists they don't know what the fuck they're talking about in terms of the real world they just they haven't lived in it and more and more now not only they not lived in it but their parents didn't live in it they're the children of people who didn't live in it we've talked about this i

mean used to be journalists had resumes where they used to be, you know, on store owners or were in the military or, you know, very, they were, they were tough people and now they're just Harvard elites. And, and, I mean, I can't remember the last time I spoke to an academic about the things that I deal with and they had anything but fairytale notions about what it was really like to run a business. They have no. That's absolutely right. I shouldn't, parrot that. I mean, when I'm in business and who I hire that has to be responsible for showing up on time and completing what's going, I don't have

the luxury of being politically correct in making my determination. I have to complete something. I can be politically correct all I want from inside of a professorship with, you know, what's it called when they can't fire you? You know what I'm looking for. Tenure. Tenure. Tenure. If you got tenure, I can sit in a leather chair and go, you know what I know? Did you see that article in the times about that homeless village? They put in that one room in the, in the, in the uber liberal enclave on the Upper West side and all of them ran out and said, Whoa, not here.

We didn't want to be liberal here. Yeah. Well, what would you say right before that about, about the professor and tenure? What were you saying right before that about, um, about the professor and tenure? What were you saying right before that? I was, I was saying that it's a luxury to generate politically correct notions. Oh,

I remember that skin in the game. So one of the things I've, I more than once heard this, we're talking about like affirmative action or, um, diversity and stuff like that and they will say all the time this is one of the stupidest things they say and it goes like well when you have two equal candidates you would give the nod to the you know the diversity

pick i'm like when has there ever been two like there's never there's never ever not once in my entire life that's right chosen between two equal candidates that's right there's six of one half dozen the other like what you have to do well what i think is more important the friendly one or the smart one you don't like i have to make a judgment but two equal this is and they and they put tremendous they use this this this argument of well it should just be when two people are all things being equal, two equal candidates, undergirds like 80% of this entire scheme that they're putting forth, you know? And it doesn't exist in real life. In real life. Go ahead.

I mean, what I'm worried about, too, is the naivete associated with not understanding sustainable business models. And I'll give you an example. The city of New York that's going to run a budget deficit, as they raise taxes on the wealthy, wild crime goes up and they incentivize people that have a choice to leave. One percent of that elite pay roughly 45 percent of all of the taxes in New York City. Crazy. It is an unsustainable model, and it is a negative reinforcement cycle if you drive

those people out. And when I heard AOC talk, it's as though she's never run a business. Oh, she has no watch guitar. But can I just clean up something I said? Because I want to make it very clear. It's not that I'm saying that the diversity pick is always, you know, it would be the bad pick, just for the record. It's, you know, we've had transgender managers, we've had black managers, black female managers, you know, many women managers. I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying that if you want

me to start picking rather than based on merit, where merit, any color, sex, anything can be the better choice. I'm saying they have this thing like, well, if you find that you have only five males on the show, I'm not saying you need to put a woman on this show as a quota, but I'm saying that, you know, if you have two exactly equal comedians, you should put the woman on. There's never two exactly equal comedians.

I've never heard anybody make that argument with regard, at least to the comedy lineups. I've heard the argument that we need more diversity on the show without getting into whether or not they're equal or they're not equal. His name says Simon came in with a whole list of a breakdown of who was on the show and percentages. And he wanted to see the percentages.

I just I generally hear people saying there's not enough. Yeah. And again, and again, we have plenty of women on the show all the time. But, you know, go tell some other business owner that they should put out a less good product for their paying customers. Because you've decided that, you know, there's some social... Like, fuck that. I have paying customers and they have the right to see the best show. And thank God we have the best comedians and there's plenty of women.

But I mean, come on now. I want more white people on the NBA. Put them on there. Jackie Mason said it. I take it back. I want more Chinese people or brown people. I want more Indians, more Indian people. You know, forget about the white people.

I want to see more Indian and Asian people of color on the NBA. I don't care about you. I know you have to feel the winning team, but you have other things you have to worry about too. That's right. You have other things you have to worry about too. You know how few Chinese basketball players there are? What the, you guys are up to something NBA.

You must be up to something. Right? I mean, you tell me why there's no Chinese basketball players. It's so fucking true. It's such hypocritical bullshit. It's incredible. And they're all, and anytime I hear a notion delivered like that, it's somebody who has never had fucking skin in the game. You don't know what you're talking about. You can't run a business or a city on academic notions of how things should work if things were fair. It's unsustainable.

But this is what they won't give somebody like me. Dan wants to wrap it up. They won't give me this. I see myself, my business's success, my business's success is exactly as important to me as an NBA team's desire to win. Yes. I will not compromise one fucking inch on that. But liberal America doesn't see it that way.

They see me as some blah, blah, blah, some enemy, whatever it is. That's sports. Yeah, of course the sports team has a right to win. Yes, yes. to me, whatever it is. That's sports. Yeah, of course the sports team has a right to win. Yeah, of course you're going to put the fastest runner on the track and field Olympics. That's sports. But you have other things you need to consider. No, I have to win. This is how I feed my family. This is what I'm spending my life doing. I'm going to die. What is it? I spend my life. This is it. I'm spending my time doing it. And I'm going to do it as best as I possibly can. And that means having the best goddamn show I can.

And if I'm being racist or sexist, by all means, you know, the law can come in and punish me because it's illegal to do that stuff. But if I'm not, you know, that's it. But it's also even if we wanted to, even if your inclination was to just choose the lineup based on sex or race what would happen is let me explain this to everybody who's never been in business you'd go out of business and then it wouldn't matter what you wanted after that because somebody who didn't have a bullshit notion of how things work would would sell more tickets than you and they would they would draw from your public anyway.

You get the point. And the other irony is, we've talked about this too, that they're also full of shit because in the end, I don't know of a more diverse place than the places that I've been running for years. It's incredibly diverse. Incredibly diverse. I won't say the name out loud, but you go to the wedding

of one of our wokest comedians, the only person of color you'll see is the person serving drinks and my wife. That's right. And my wife. They live in totally white worlds. You've seen this over and over and over again.

People of color are something they read about in books. You couldn seen this over and over and over again. People of color are something they read about in books. You couldn't be more right. You don't have to keep telling him he's right all the time. He's the voice of reason. Don't tell him that either. He certainly does not need to hear that. We need his voice on a national level. Well, I don't know about that. Anyway, you hear that? You hear that? Come here.

This is my beautiful son. Look at him. Look how handsome he's getting. Your father is a great man. And like Moses and Abe Lincoln before him, he spoke the truth. He couldn't lie. What's that?

You mean like Abe Lincoln? Your father is a great man. Like an Abe Lincoln. You mean like Abraham Lincoln? Yes, exactly. You like that. All right. All right.

Podcast at ComedySeller.com for comments, suggestions, queries, compliments. What are you talking about? I'll tell you this. My daughter, when she comes home, she learned all of it. Last year, she learned all about Sonia Sotomayor. She learned all about Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Last year, before she died.

I learned all about Ruth Bader Ginsburg this year. I said, did anybody ever teach you about clarence thomas no i say how petty are they if you i invite everybody listening anybody who's still listening google clarence thomas and read the wikipedia page about his life this man grew up in a shack they moved to the first place that had indoor plumbing. He barely spoke, he spoke some like, wasn't Patois, but some sort of dialect like that.

He realized his English wasn't good. He went back to learn better English. He has an American success story. You agree with his politics, disagree with his politics. You would think they would hold him up as an example. No, no, no, no, because he's not a reflexive liberal, no. Thomas Sowell is's not a reflexive liberal, no.

Thomas Sowell is another thing. I think that's why. Oh, no, hurry up. I mean, at least I've listened to NPR. I have not heard one black conservative. I read it was like on Fox or a conservative site. It was a black attorney saying black lives matter, have a legitimate, and he outlined the argument. And then he said i've heard

nothing about um um uh what's it single parents fatherless homes he goes if black lives matter care that deeply about the black community they would also involve a number of personal responsibility aspects okay but don't be careful not just blaming on races yeah because i'm not i'm not trying to that that really wasn't where i wanted to go in terms of, you know, I'm not criticizing the, I'm not talking about... I'm just talking about a black person with an alternate point of view. That's right.

What I'm saying is that when Clarence Thomas dies, I guarantee you, my kids will not be coming home learning about the fact that he's an American success story of color. No less, probably more significant, faced more headwinds, broke more molds than Ruth Bader Ginsburg did, simply because they don't agree with his politics.

Yes, and that's what Thomas Sowell, and that's what this black attorney was writing about. It's so upsetting to me. And I'm telling you that if I were in charge of the schools, I would go out of my way to make sure that I wasn't petty that way. I would make it say, well, yeah, of course. This is an amazing biography Clarence Thomas had. Of course we should teach our kids about it. They're too young to understand liberal and conservative Supreme Court stuff. Carry on. They don too young to understand liberal and conservative Supreme Court stuff.

Carry on, they're not going to understand that stuff. But what they should know about is that a poor black child who grew up in Mississippi was appointed to the Supreme Court. Thomas Sowell wrote Basic Economics, was educated at Harvard, grew up in Harlem. And when his family moved into the projects, they were proud because back then there were some sort of requirements associated with gaining entry. There should be a voice for black people that also have an opinion that we don't hear on NPR and CNN and MSNBC. Well, our friend who actually wrote a beautiful love letter to Thomas Sowell, you can look at him, our friend Coleman Hughes will be on the Bill Maher show this Friday night.

Coleman's hit the big time. There he is. I'm sorry, Clarence Thomas is from Georgia, not Mississippi. And now we have to go. Dan has to go. Dan has to go. I have to read Harry Potter. You know, we've been at, you know,

I think it's long enough. It's been long enough. You're right. Podcast at ComedyCellular.com for, as I said, questions, comments, suggestions, constructive criticism, salutations, stock tips, what have you. Also want to tell everybody,

I'm reading The Stand by Stephen King, which is a pandemic novel. Yeah. It is pretty damn good. It is good. Dad, are you guys done yet? Okay. The Stand by Stephen King is available.

Where books are sold. We'll see you next time. Good night, everybody. Bye, everybody. Bye.