The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Response to Dave Smith: NO! Conspiracy Theorists and Anti-Semites Must Be Called Out. (good footage on YouTube)

Episode Date: March 14, 2025

Nuts and bigots are garnering millions of followers, spreading like cancer online. Noam insists that we can (and should) engage with arguments while at the same time identifying bigotry (and mental illness) for what it is. YouTube of this episode: https://youtu.be/laAHt7s-qcg Here is Dave's entire episode: https://youtu.be/7zRkdH8Zsw4?si=djHKKeFE6tFInT1I&t=4005

This is Live from the Table, the official podcast of the world-famous comedy seller coming at you on wherever you get your podcasts. I was going to say on Sirius, but we're not on Sirius anymore. We are available on demand. On Sirius. And as a podcast, and primarily on YouTube, because that's nowadays people like the multimedia experience. Noam is here, obviously. He's the owner of the joint. And by the way, the new room is scheduled to open late 2025. Hopefully New Year's. We could have, you know, be nice to have like an opening night.

New Year. That'd be great. That would be great. What was the old cable network? That said, if you don't get it, demand it. Was it? I don't recall that. Was it Fox News or something?

I don't know. But you probably Google it. I'm a little out of breath because I was a bit late, so I ran a little bit. Anyway, Perry L is with us. Perry L Ashton, brand author of On My Knees and The Only Wish I Trust is my own, available on Amazon wherever you get books. And, Noam, take it

away. We had a big, Dave Smith and I had a big Twitter feud, brawl. Actually, Dan was collateral damage of this Twitter brawl because Dave uh dave lashed out at day let's start with that well i i didn't even think he would see it to be honest with you but i certainly wasn't expecting the response i i i basically said he's a hostage to his followers no one's point is he doesn't condemn certain people candace owens jake shields he doesn't

condemn them he doesn't call them out for anti-Semitism, or forget about anti-Semitism, just for crazy shit. I said he's a hostage to his followers, basically. He's in a golden cage, as I put it. It's not a metaphor I came up with, but it's one that I used. And I didn't think that was an unfair critique of somebody that's a public figure. And then he came at me rather harshly. And I didn't even think he would see the tweet, to be honest. But he said, you know, you're a failure and I'm a success.

And that's basically what he said. And then there was another. Have fun doing your $75 spots. Well, that was another tweet. And I had to correct him that it was $125. So it was nasty. And he feels that I called him a liar. I mean, called him a liar.

The implication was he doesn't condemn people. Is that being a liar? Well, I guess you could spin it that way. But in any case, my attitude is he's a public figure. And I thought that was a fair critique. And he could certainly rebut that critique. But he went a little figure and I thought that was a fair critique and he could certainly rebut that critique but he went a little bit further anyway

I thought it was quite cruel of him to come at you that way a lot of comedians I've observed over the years can dish it out but can't take it and for someone who

understands what it means to struggle but can't take it. And for someone who understands what it means to struggle as a stand-up comic, and after all, who made it, you know, maybe I'm wrong about this, but it seems to me, achieved his success more as a result of political commentary than his stand-up work,

that, oh, our internet is down, as a result of political commentary than his stand-up work, that he would be more kind to you and less likely to be cruel, to turn a knife in somebody, a fellow traveler, as it were. You disagree with that, Dan? Well, yes, I agree with it, but from his perspective, I put the knife in first by making the comment that I made.

Well, listen, you're allowed, you know, it's like in schoolyard, kids fight, right? But they don't normally punch in the face, you know what I'm saying?

In certain contexts, we know certain places we don't go, even if we're going to have disputes. And there's a certain type of person in the schoolyard who reaches for a two-by-four and bashes someone over the head with it and says, what the hell are you doing? I know you're having a fight, but, you know, you don't do that. Right. And I think that what he did to you verbally was the equivalent of hit you over the head with a two by five. Well, and also he quote tweeted me, which which means that his followers will see it. He's done that before to me, which I think is, you know, unnecessary. But when you quote tweet somebody, all your followers see it.

So all his followers then piled on. I mean, I didn't read them, but I read quote tweet somebody, all your followers see it. All his followers then piled on. I mean, I didn't read them, but I read a few of them. Quote tweeting is a more aggressive way, I guess, to do it. I didn't like that Dave Smith

turned the knife into you like that. Do you have any last things you want to say about that before I move on to the... No, I think we covered it. All right. So we had a Twitter feud because Dave Smith and I, because these anti-Semitic... And it's not just limited to anti-Semitism, but these conspiracy theorists are just taking over right-wing MAGA, Twittersphere. It's a tremendous problem.

And one of the things that I've been harping on for more than a year now, right, is that these people, although they have various levels of craziness and various levels of, I would say, hatred, they never turn on each other. So Dave Smith, who would never say some of the crazy stuff that Candace Owens says, will never actually criticize Candace Owens. He doesn't have to turn on her either. He just has to. We're not asking him to hate her.

No, just to rebuke crazy stuff within his ranks. And so it becomes like a chain from the most outrageous, like Dan Bilzerian to Jake Shields to Candace Owens to Alex Jones to Tucker Carlson to Dave Smith and all the way. And it all kind of winds up on the Joe Rogan show in one form or another. And as I've said, it creates a kind of innocence by association, as opposed to guilt by association, that there's a kind of imprimatur that these people provide to each other so that the whole entity becomes sort of sanitized by the social click of it all. So for instance, he'll refer to her as the great Candace Owens or I forget after some crazy thing she tweeted. He writes, if you're trying to go after her for this, maybe it's because you can't actually take on anything she said. And he tweeted once, I'm truly impressed with Candace Owens. She's incredibly smart and thoughtful and willing to search for the truth no matter how controversial it might be.

We're going to play Dave Smith's rebuttal to me, but I just want to say that I was actually sounding this alarm before October 7th and before Israel and Jewish matters were the primary concern. I began to notice it early on when Tucker Carlson was still on Fox News. Tucker Carlson was someone who I have to admit, I often would say, Oh, good for him for saying certain things that no one else is saying. And then I began to see him, uh, I would check into something he would say about immigrants. And I'm like, no, that's not true. There's no basis for that. And then, um, during the, the Russiagate stuff, he would, um, and, and I was always a disbeliever of Russiagate. Oh, as you know,

always, always, always. But then he would say something like, yeah, we have some source within John Podesta's organization and he's turning over big stuff. Then he claimed that he had a gold standard source, that Trump wasn't even the central figure of the Mueller investigation, that it was really the Podesta brothers or Manafort. And of course it turned out to be completely untrue. I'd look into that and it would go nowhere. And then when COVID came, and again, I was, you know, I think always reasonable on COVID.

He would just like, you know, when it came to the vaccine, he'd wheel out some person in a wheelchair and he'd say, look, the vaccine, you know? And then he would say, there's bioweapons labs in Ukraine. And he began, and then there's conspiracies. And then he was all and then he would say there's bioweapons labs in Ukraine. And he began and then there's conspiracies. And then he would was all into UFOs.

The U.S. government has physical evidence of crashed non-human made aircraft, as well as the bodies of the pilots who flew those aircraft. The Pentagon has spent decades studying these otherworldly remains in order to build more technologically advanced weapons systems. And I began to really worry about all this conspiratorial stuff. And then October 7th happened. And then it became closer to home for me because Jews became in the crosshairs for the conspiracy stuff.

But I have to say, I've always felt this way. Anybody who knew me 25 years ago would remember that when the movie JFK came out and everybody was lauding what a brilliant movie this was, I was furious. I'm like, no, this is bullshit. And by dressing up this bullshit in a beautiful package and glossiness with skill, this is going to become like an IV into the American bloodstream of what they think history actually is. And this is dangerous because untruth is dangerous. Garbage in, garbage out. In a democratic society,

which relies on its people and the wisdom of its people to make decisions, obviously it's essential that they're making decisions and forming opinions based on what the best entertainment we're capable of, of what is true and what's not. And when you have a whole group of people who begin to make decisions on things which are batshit crazy, bad things are going to happen. And unfortunately, anti-Semitism being the mother of all conspiracy theories, with very few exceptions, you find that people who are into conspiracies wind up at anti-Semitism's

door, as it were, even though they may not actually be anti-Semites. They might even be shocked. What? I don't care if my daughter marries somebody Jewish. I have Jewish friends. I don't have the least thing against Jews. But I have to say, this stuff I'm hearing about how the Jews are controlling that, and the Jews are controlling that, and the protocols, elders of Zion, this, you know, this rings true to me.

And by the way, if it is true, then you wouldn't be an anti-Semite, right? Like if it's actually true, then how can you call somebody anti-Semite if it's true? So this is where I am with Dave Smith, who I regard as a reasonable person. So I have been hounding him, as Candace Owens especially, began to say more and more crazy things. And he was like, you know, big upping her on Twitter, Candace and I are buddies, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'll read a very good quote here from Christopher Hitchens, which I would like to introduce as the context. So let me read the Christopher Hitchens quote. "'Antisemitism is a prejudice that may sometimes be, "'but usually is not lightly worn.

"'It has great appeal to pseudo-intellectuals "'and pseudo-esthetes,' is that how you say the word? "'Because it has a great gossipy power "'and can draw on history and mythology "'and concepts like blood and gold. "'It can seem to explain a lot. And it can form a bond between upper crust types and the plebeians, a bond of sturdy race and nation against the clever and the tricky and the hard to place.

I hope you can take this all in as it goes by. Now, this is the key sentence here, the last one. A dead giveaway in distinguishing the obsessive or morbid anti-Semite from the garden variety is an inability to stay off the subject. An inability to stay off the subject. And what I'm describing here with these people is an inability to stay off the subject. You know, and I was, I have like a partial list of the crazy stuff which is being said, like just in his crew, as I called it. LBJ was Jewish. People I don't think knew this, that LBJ was Jewish.

Stalin was Jewish. Which then kind of gets into the question of the media, who for a very long time tried to convince us that Stalin and Vladimir Lenin were anti-Semitic. And then I learned... Yes, they were literally a part of the Jewish cabal that, you know, and credit about crushing history, where if you even say that, which I'm saying it because I looked into it and I found a friend who understands Georgian and they're like, everybody knows that Stalin was Jewish. Theodor Herzl, the founder of Zionism, was not Jewish, but wanted Israel set up as a haven for pedophiles. I mean, just listen to how the incredibly brave and thoughtful and smart Candace Owens

is ready to search for truth. Many moons ago, before they decided to establish Israel as a country, Catholics and Christians were going missing on Passover. And then they would find bodies, okay, across Europe, and they were able to trace them back to Jews. They weren't Jews, okay? These were Frankists. across Europe and they were able to trace them back to Jews. There weren't Jews, okay? These were Frankists. This Frankist cult, which is masquerading behind Jews, still participates

in this shit to this day, okay? Why would you want, as a small nation that is the size of New Jersey, okay? Why would you want the pedophiles to flee there? Why would you want the pedophiles to be procreating? Hmm. Unless, unless the nation of Israel may have been established by some Frankists. And it's looking like Theodore Herzl's family was from the exact same area in Moravia and in Bohemia where the Frankist cult was founded. Crazy, crazy. When you get into his family, that like maybe he was not actually a Torah worshiping Jew. Like, I don't know. I'm just throwing out some ideas here. And by throwing out some ideas, I mean, I've read a ton of books and I figured it out. Okay. Kamala Harris is Jewish. And the evidence is pointing to, and there's no question. It's not even evidence, like nobody can dispute this, Snopes can't dispute this, Kamala Harris is Jewish.

The claims about Dr. Mengele doing all these experiments are beyond, you know, anybody's, nobody should believe them because they're too outlandish. They experimented on twins. I mean, some of the stories, by the way, sound completely absurd. I mean, like, the idea that they just, like, cut a human up and then sewed them back together. Why would you do that? Literally, even if you're the most evil person in the world, that's a tremendous waste of time and supplies. That just sounds like bizarre propaganda. The Holocaust is a gross exaggeration. Bullshit. Like, the Holocaust, it's bullshit.

Like, yeah, Jews were put in camps, but there wasn't 6 million Jews that died in the Holocaust. Just bullshit. Yeah, I guess since we're going here, I was just reading yesterday. I should have known this, but I was realizing the main guy was at Rudolf Haas. He's the main guy. The whole narrative is based around they tortured him for three days, five Jews. And the guy admitted, I can't remember, unfortunately I forget his name, but he admitted to torturing him for three days without sleep until finally he signed the paper saying he did the Holocaust. And they also threatened to torture and kill his kids, so he went along with it.

So the whole – and that is the whole man that it's based off of. That's – the whole thing was written around him. I mean there's obviously holes everywhere else. But it's like when you see that and the whole thing is based around it, it's like, come on. Am I going to – am I just going to keep pretending like I believe this bullshit? Is there going to be a time when I fucking, you got to be like, this is, this is fucking ridiculous.

And by the way, you get to Tucker Carlson. I know became enamored with David Irving, the Holocaust denier, David Irving's theories. The Jews installed Winston Churchill to pursue Zionist interests. But the biggest audience you ever had was you telling people that the reason the worst thing in human history happened was because the jews and put hitler in the fair

but like look i've told you before first i didn't know we were gonna talk about world war ii i wasn't prepared to talk about that i definitely know we're going to talk about churchill um and if you watched and i know you watched it if you watch the thing and there are a couple instances like this like you mentioned earlier when he was like what about japan why is japan doing fine and so forth where i felt like he's he was trying to draw me into like deep waters that i was not comfortable with and you can i think you could see it in the interview where like, I start to get a little shifty in my seat and less articulate because I'm a wry smile. Yeah. Yeah. And that wry smile, by the way, it was like, you know, it was, it was, it was sort of taken as like a knowing smile when, you know, really what, what it was a smile of like,

what are you trying to do to me here? You know? And so by the time I got to the David Irving argument, which is where that comes from, you know, the, um, the stuff about Churchill being bailed out by financiers in 38 and 40, which did happen. Um, you know, he had already asked me like twice, like, well, why would Churchill do this if it didn't make any sense to the British empire? And I kind of walked around and gave like a meandering answer. He said, well, why else? I did it again, kind of again off the top of my head because I wasn't planning on talking about this. He's like, well, why else?

And I'm like, well, you know, people have written about this. So what you're talking about is Tucker's baiting you to blame the Jews. You realize he's setting the trap. He says, why else, why else? And you could have said, Tucker, I'm not going there. If you're implying that it was the Jews, no. Yeah, no. Well, look, yeah, maybe. There's a reason I don't do interviews very often. Ukraine, as you may have heard, is led by a man called Zelensky,

sweaty and rat-like, a comedian turned oligarch, a persecutor of Christians, a friend of BlackRock. This is interesting. My God, really? Yeah, Bin Laden. Now, you know, Dave will say, and like the Ron Paul take, is that when neocons were saying that they hate us for our freedom, no. Actually, if you read bin Laden's letter, he tells us exactly why he hates us.

It's because of, you know, our involvement in the Middle East and Saudi Arabia and the Palestinian issue. All right, fair enough. Now this guy, Ian Carroll, which kind of just responsible for this whole flare-up this week on the Joe Rogan show, he's a rabid Israel's-behind-9-11 guy. So here's his tweet. Israel did 9-11. Now, this is fascinating, if you stop for a second, because just to think about the contradiction, bin Laden took credit for 9-11. So that would imply that bin Laden is now some sort of Israeli spy or Israeli asset, right?

Okay, well, if bin Laden is Israeli asset, then what are we supposed to take from that bin Laden letter that Dave and Ron Paul based their worldview on? Here's another of his tweets. Our country is controlled by an international criminal organization that grew out of the Jewish mob and now hides in

modern Zionism behind cries of anti-Semitism. But make no mistake, it is an international organized crime syndicate and has complete control over Washington. And then the subtweet is evidence of a Zionist mafia, how Israel controls the U.S. and the global

politics. The Jeffrey Epstein thing now is supposed to be like some descendant of the old Jewish mobsters are still kind of in control of America. And somehow with association with Israel, they set Jeffrey Epstein up as a honeypot as a way of, again, the Zionist control. Controls up now all the information that's getting disclosed supposedly this administration What do you have the least faith that we're gonna come to have seen for sure Epstein? And I think it's because of Israel I think that because I think I mean when you really dig into Epstein his entire network was Israel It was clearly he would like a who Barack was the ex prime minister and the ex head of Israeli intelligence So I'm not saying it was all of Israel. It was all an intelligence gathering and... And it was targeting Americans. It was targeting American officials and the American president.

And the CIA does have interest in those targets, too. Elements in the CIA does. Certainly they had help from the CIA, and certainly they had help from these other organized crime and intelligence operations. Israel's government is as vulnerable to the deep state effect as the American government. But I would argue that Israel's government is way more vulnerable to it because of the people

that founded Israel and the way it was founded. It was founded in a modern time, much more recently, by like it was a revolutionary founding. And I can totally sympathize with the Jewish desire to have that state like I get it But because of the way that happened the people that founded Israel Were a bunch of organized crime figures in America the Jewish mob that were helping with money and with arms trafficking to get the guns There because they had to have guns and it was the Rothschild banking family Sending a whole bunch of money and getting the declaration in the first place I think that it has grown cancerous to the Jewish faith in general, because Jeffrey Epstein is the perfect example

of this. Jeffrey Epstein was the world's most prolific and evil sex trafficker that we know of so far ever. And he very clearly was a Jewish organization of Jewish people working on behalf of Israel and other groups. And so that's a dark stain on Israel and on the Jewish people if you own it. We also went on the same show to say that Pizzagate was actually never debunked. This was a theory that the Democratic Party, including Hillary Clinton and her campaign chairman,

John Podesta, were involved in a child sex trafficking ring run out of a Washington, D.C. pizzeria or something like that. I'm not an expert. Oh, I left this one out. Ian Carroll also claims that Monica Lewinsky was most likely part of Jeffrey Epstein's sexual blackmail operation. And both Ian Carroll and Candace Owens are convinced that Israel was behind the killing of John F. Kennedy. And an ally. And we're not allowed to ask questions about JFK's shooting. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

The Mossad there on the day that JFK was shot. The arguments that he was having in the days preceding with their prime minister. The person who allegedly shot him, Lee Oswald Harvey, said he didn't shoot him, didn't kill him, and then he was shot by a guy named Jacob Rubenstein, who Muammar Gaddafi alleges was also an Israeli national.

So, you know, it all becomes just too crazy for words. So the U.S. is controlled by an international crime syndicate that pursues Jewish interests. The Jews framed Michael Jackson. Israel was behind October 7th. Wait a second. The Jews framed Michael Jackson. Yeah. And then like this guy, Dan Bilzerian, you know, sums it up nicely. I mean, do you not understand why Jewish people might feel a sense of victimhood given that six million of them were killed in World War II by a genocidal monster? Yeah, I mean, that figure's been revised, but, you know, I believe that Jewish supremacy is the greatest threat to America,

and I think it's the greatest threat to the world today. I truly believe that. So I'm like, Dave, this is a crew of people that you will never criticize. So I'm like, okay, so he comes back, you need to engage with their facts, don't call them names. And, you know, I have some respect for that argument, and this is why years ago, when I had wanted to do a debate with Holocaust deniers, because I felt it was getting a little squishy that we just say, you're an anti-Semite, you're an anti-Semite, where generations of people were growing up never really being introduced to the facts. Like, how do you know it was 6 million? How do you know, like, you know? And I said, you know, we shouldn't just ask ever people to take it on faith. So I

said, we should have a debate. And everybody told me I was crazy and I wasn't allowed to do that. But it's just an illustration of how much I do agree that we should engage with facts. However, we also should engage with patterns. And when someone has a pattern of making absolutely outlandish, obviously false arguments that hearken to thousands of years of similar theories, it is also fair to engage with that pattern, that inability to change the subject. When somebody puts forth the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, and you say, that's anti-Semitism. No, engage with the facts. Engage with Hitler's facts. Engage with all the facts. But engagement is not without its risks because what you do is you elevate and convert a notion that nobody took seriously and everybody had clarity about and turn it into a kind of reasonable minds can differ proposition. I mean, I can make an analogy that even in the law, which is also based on the weighing of facts, we have the concept of

a summary judgment. When a claimant fails to produce evidence sufficient to create like a genuine issue of fact, the case will be dismissed. And we even have punishment for frivolous claims. You can't waste the court's time. It's a cowardly and utterly dishonest answer. Fine, yes, engage with the facts. But be a man and engage with the pattern. And don't hide behind it. So, and, you know, there's virtually not a claim on that list that I think Dave would endorse. But what he will not do is say, you know what, someone who says 15 of these things, I got to admit, when you start making 15 claims about the Jews, not a single one of them, I can even give you the first factual to start creating the case that it's true. I got to admit,

there's something going on here that's more than meets the eye. And of course, this is dangerous to the world. It's particularly dangerous to Jews all over the world. It doesn't, it's not just confined to America, but affects foreign policy. One of the things that Tucker Carlson is now on, let me just, let me get to Tucker. Well, you know, I'll read, I'll play today's video first. So, so I hope you guys can hear it because our internet's not working in the room. So I'm going to play it tethered to my phone and then I'll just have to cut it in later. Okay. So here, tell me if you can hear it. It is wild to see the supporters of Israel demand that you label other people as anti-Semites, including people, say, like Candace and Ian, who bend over backward constantly to say, I'm not talking about all Jewish people here.

I love Jewish people. Most Jews are regular people and have nothing to do with this. I'm talking about this tiny cabal of people. And then Noam or other people like this will turn around and say, oh, you hate Jews because you blame 9-11 on the Jews. It's like, well, no, he didn't blame 9-11 on all Jews. He said Israel was involved in 9-11. By the way, hey, here's a wild thought. All the times you've heard me on the biggest platforms ever talking about the terror wars and the Al Qaeda and the war in Iraq and Syria and Libya and Somalia and the war in Gaza and 9-11 and all these things. Have you ever heard me say that Israel did 9-11? No. Okay. That's because I don't believe that. I've seen the evidence that

people have. I think it's actually that people really overplay it and it's really pretty weak and there's just no conclusive point. There's like, there's no conclusive case here that Israel was involved in 9-11. Now, if it came out tomorrow that Israel was involved in 9-11, it wouldn't exactly blow my mind and destroy my worldview, but it's not something I believe. I don't think that's right. But I also don't think it makes you a Jew hater to say that, especially when you're going out of your way to be like, no, no, no, I don't have a problem with Jewish people. I think there's this cabal within Israel, within the Mossad, who's working with elements in the CIA, who did this thing. That's not an anti-Semitic statement. It's not.

And it's not. All right. So this is let me stop there. So one of the things he does a lot, he gives an incredible amount of credence to somebody who says the magic words. I'm not talking about all Jewish people, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I spent some time today listening, reading Father Coughlin, the famous, you know, anti-Semitic preacher from the early, from the late 30s and 40s, and Henry Ford, and reading Dostoevsky, and actually just sampling various classic anti-Semitism.

Almost all of them will have something in there saying, I have no problem with the Jewish people. It's just blah, blah, blah, the bankers, and this, and this, and the communists. And it was, you know, Father Coughlin was saying in 38, when it started to leak out that the Nazis were turning the screws on the Jews before it went off the rails, he was saying, well, yes, we should, our heart should go out to these Jewish people. But, you know, they're not in such trouble in Germany.

But our heart should also go out to what the communists are doing, the Soviets are doing to the people in Russia. And by the way, almost all the communists are Jews. And then he makes a list of Trotsky and saying, I'm not saying all the Jewish people, I'm just talking about the Bolsheviks. And by the way, if you look at Candace Owens, she repeats these same lines today. Zelensky is a Bolshevik. People think that the greatest mass murderer was Adolf Hitler. And no, actually, if you want to talk about genocide, the fact that people in America don't know about what the Bolsheviks did to Christians,

where did the idea of a concentration camp come from? The Bolsheviks. The reason why we're not allowed to learn about these people, we don't talk about Henrique Dota, is because he's a Jew. I mean, locking down churches. And people tell me to go support Zelensky as he's shutting down churches. You want me to support this Bolshevik? I'm not doing it. Father Coughlin used to talk about how Jews were oppressing Christians. That's what the Russia thing was. The Jews are oppressing the Christians.

The communists are oppressing the Christians in Russia. Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson now talk about how the Jews are oppressing Christians all over the world now. Never mind that the Muslim world has slowly been eradicated almost of all its Christian populations. Somehow the Jews are responsible for persecuting the Christians. Coughlin also talked about the fact, quote, the present writer wishes to add that some of the authors are convinced that Lenin's mother was a Jewess. Precisely the same point that Candace Owens makes.

It's quite a coincidence. Don't you hear the echoes of Father Coughlin and Henry Ford? And like, is there nothing going on? And Charles, all of them, Charles Lindbergh. Well, he just said that he doesn't believe Israel did 9-11. Now, is that a new statement of his? That's the first time I, no, listen, if it is or it isn't, I would never say that he thinks Israel did 9-11. Obviously, I shamed him into, I believe I shamed him into saying just that because this Twitter, this tweet I wrote against him got, you know, like 300,000 views, which is a lot for me because I don't have many Twitter followers.

But I've always said, before he said that, I don't suspect he does think that's true. My complaint is that because he is generally presents as a reasonable person and is for the most part a reasonable person, he's sanitizing these other people. It's as if I had people who hate blacks, who think black, you know, whatever it is. And, you know, and I just won't ever, and I had them on the show and I discussed their views. And then someone says, as he did about Nick Fuentes, no, I don't think he's a racist. It's like, what are you doing, Norm? Why are you rehabilitating vile racism? You know, what game are you playing here?

You wouldn't tolerate this on any other view. You wouldn't tolerate this from the neocons. You correct their fucking punctuation, you know, if they get a fact a little bit wrong. But in this, they can say anything and there's literally no limit to it. I mean, Tucker Carlson says UFOs are later. Okay, so let me continue playing this.

And in the same way, talking about black crime in Chicago doesn't make you someone who hates black people. Look, no one, by the way, called Tucker Carlson an anti-Semite. Tucker Carlson. So let me, I've said a little about Tucker Carlson already, but let's remember that tucker carlson is enamored with david irving that he's now blaming our support for ukraine on uh he says that israel's interests are behind our support for ukraine if not for israel and that it's in israel's interest we would not be supporting ukraine he said this in his conversation with Glenn Greenwald. I do think that Russia is disliked by a lot of people in Washington because of the perception that they are detrimental to our interests in the Middle East and especially to Israel's interests in the Middle East, including their support for Bashar al-Assad in Syria,

the fact that they have a good relationship with Iran. It doesn't really always have a lot to do with the United States, but with the interests of other countries as well. So you think that's the prime mover here? Yeah, the Russians operate in Syria. They protect Assad in Syria. And as a result, they end up being antagonistic to Israel, which ends up being defined as U.S. interests as well. There's no separation between the two countries. But strictly speaking, this has kind of nothing to do with us whatsoever.

I mean, I don't, I honestly, for the past... Unless you see Israel as a part of the United States. You know, I'm not hostile toward Israel, but I think it's a separate country.

It seems to me it would be a separate country as well. It's often not treated as that. I'm just saying, but... Don't pay taxes there. I wasn't born there. So, he also, you know,

I can't help it. My mind works this way. We also found out in that Fox News case He also, you know, I can't help it. My mind works this way. We also found out in that Fox News case that Tucker Carlson came out. He tweeted, he texted to a friend. A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump's guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living shit out of him. It was three against one at least. Jumping a guy

like that is dishonorable. It's not how white men fight. It's not how white men fight. Now, I'm making a circumstantial case because the man has never said anything particularly about the Jews, but you know what?

Sophisticated people, sophisticated anti-Semites, or sophisticated people in the throes of mental illness, they know better than to say, you know, I hate these fucking Jews. It's very rare that you say that. Everybody I know who is a racist, I don't know many of them, but we all know one of them who became pretty prominent in the comedy community for a while. He would never admit he's a racist. He would say, kind of like, no, there's plenty of good ones. I just hate the bad ones.

So the label becomes in some way beside the point. It's the garbage of the garbage in and garbage out, which is the point. That in the end, this stuff is untrue and it's ugly for the Jews. Where it comes from within Tucker Carlson's heart, you know, I don't know. I don't know.

But mental illness has to be considered maybe part of the equation. Do you think the presence of evil is kick-starting people to wonder about the good? That's what happened to me. That's what happened to you? Oh yeah. I had a direct experience with it. In the milieu of journalism or just? Nope. In my bed at night and I got attacked while I was asleep with my wife and four dogs in the bed and mauled Physically mauled In a spiritual attack by a demon yeah by a demon claw marks on my sides on my left physical mark Oh, they're still there. Yeah, yeah

Year and a half ago on my ribcage and on my shoulder And I was just in my boxer shorts and I went and flipped on the light in the bathroom And I had four claw marks on either side underneath my arms and on my shoulder and I was just in my boxer shorts and I went and flipped on the light in the bathroom and I had four claw marks on either side underneath my arms and on my left shoulder and they were bleeding. Wait, they were bleeding? They were bleeding, yeah. They were actual claw marks. Well the next morning I woke up and I thought that was the weirdest dream I've ever had

and then I saw blood on my sheets and I realized that was not a dream at all. But yeah that happened to me. Do you think God a dream at all. But yeah, that happened. Do you think God allowed the demon? I have no idea what happened. All I know is I was dead asleep with my wife and dogs and I woke up with claw marks on my ribcage underneath my arms and it didn't even make sense. My arms would, anyway, whatever. I'm not, no one has to believe me. I don't care. I mean, normally if you show up at the hospital bleeding and they ask you what happened and you tell them you were mauled by demons,

they'll say, that's very interesting, sir. We'd like you to come right this way. We're going to hold you for observation because obviously you could be a threat to yourself or others. I mean, you weren't mauled by demons. Continue.

The guy who said the Jews precisely zero times ever. Tucker Carlson is actually an anti-anti-Semite. He's not, I've had multiple conversations with Tucker Carlson about this. Okay, maybe he has said that to Dave Smith. It's funny he doesn't say it more publicly. Instead, right after October 7th,

he had on some Palestinian priest or something, a Christian, a Palestinian Christian priest, not from Israel, but from the occupied territories, who turned out to be a Hamas supporter later on, you know, complaining about how Israel is persecuting Christians. Now, who thinks Israel is persecuting Christians? I've never even heard this. This is what he focused on right after October 7th. He says, why should our money go to a country that persecutes Christians? Now, that's, you know, anti-Zionism, anti-Israel doesn't make you anti-Semitic. It's such a soup.

But I haven't seen much from Tucker Carlson's show in a long, long, long time, which would indicate the kind of neurologic response of somebody who felt, oh, I should say something on behalf of the Jews because they are really getting it right and left right now. He seems to more be happy to add logs to that. By the way, have you called Tucker Carlson anti-Semitic? Because it doesn't seem like how you would phrase it if you did. I think that, I think... You'd be more likely to say, well, this seems to be an indication he could likely be. Listen, when somebody starts quoting or becomes enamored with David Irving theories about World War II, I don't know.

We don't have many labels available to us in the English language. What do you want to call it? It's something. What would you call it if it's not anti-Semitism? Rabid anti-Semitism. I mean, this is the thing. As I alluded to before,

anti-Semitism in this century, or at this time, is a little different because many of the people that we would call anti-Semitic, they don't care about having Jews in their family. They don't care about, you know, their daughter marrying somebody Jewish. They're not afraid of socializing with Jews. But this is the craziness to me of the blind spots.

And I just have to play this clip. I can't help myself. But these are the blind spots of Noam Dwarfman as he is calling me out. And he calls me Dwarfman. It's Dwarfman with an M. Is that anti-Semitic? What did Norman Finkelstein call you? He always gets names wrong. No, he got me right. He got me right. He got Destiny. He got Destiny. And Mr. Benelli. Benelli. Benelli. Blind spots of gnome dwarfment as he is calling me out

for not taking on what he calls my team. He goes, you won't criticize your own people. Okay, this is something that happened while they were having a conversation about me, which, you know, truth be told, the only reason I was watching. But here was my buddy Aaron Berg was on the Comedy Cellar podcast.

And of course, the topic was about me and not even anything I said, but about how bad I am because of what Candace Owens said or something like that. Here's the clip. And I want to see if you guys can... I played this on one of the members-only episodes, but I want the whole audience to see it here. So here's the clip. See if you notice anything in here that rings any alarm bells. Now, just to be clear, the topic here is me and how I'm not condemning anti-Semitism, how I'm not condemning the excesses of the anti-Israel side. Let's play the clip. It horrifies me. And they know very well that Dave's Jewish. Yeah.

And don't fucking think for a minute that they don't realize that it's advantageous to them to have a Jew on, to have a Jew on who gives them their kind of stamp of approval or acceptance. Yeah. And he's not the only Jew that is on that side. I'm sure. No,

but he, but he's the most prominent. Right. It's not about Israel. People don't like Jews. That's the point. It's that it's not about Israel. And there's a difference, and I didn't want to interrupt you, but I do think that this distinction is very important. There is a difference

between being critical of the Israeli government and being anti-Israel. But what I'm trying to do is I'm trying to segregate the whole Israel issue. They always tell us being critical of Israel is not anti-Semitism being critical. And they're right. So there's also a huge overlap. Yes, there's a lot. But I'm saying that. Fine. If you if you want to be the champion of the cause, being critical, Israel is not anti-Semitism.

Then at some point you have to be ready to identify anti-Semitism, right? Otherwise you're, you're, you're the one connecting them. So, so, so that point there is that they always want to say that being critical of Israel is not anti-Semitism and they're right, but then they will never admit that anything is anti-Semitism. So in some way, they are refusing to ever acknowledge, they claim, they sort of will tacitly allow you to say there is this other thing which is anti-Semitism, which is not related to being anti-Israel. But they will never identify anybody, anybody in that category. I've asked Dave on Twitter, can you name an anti-Semite? You know, Bilzerian or Shields or one of those. Now, Bilzerian will say the Jews are the greatest threat to planet Earth. Jake Shields will tweet, you Jews are sick, disgusting, and vile people. Now, how do I engage with those facts?

You want to engage with that? Should we look up, ask ChatGPT to list, you know, evidence of vileness in people? It's so dishonest what he's saying. All right, let's continue. Now what it is is when you call somebody an anti-Semite, it's like what happened four years ago when you would do racial jokes or you would

do satire and people would be like, that's racist. And it got to the point where so many people said that's racist. Racist just became a term where it's like, just stop with what you're doing. That's nearly what's happening with anti-Semitism now. And it's been prevalent for so long. And now it's rearing its ugly head way more than it ever had. I mean, the 40s, of course. But it's a huge thing. That being said, he's probably thinking, and I don't know how Dave thinks, but I bet he's thinking, look, freedom of speech is at the base of all of this. These people are allowed to have their thoughts.

Candace can have her thoughts. Jake can have his thoughts. The same way as when I go online and I see IDF videos where they're fucking massacring people and I get excited about it because I'm like, oh, that's payback. And when the pager thing dropped and I was like, I got excited about the pager thing. But the whole. Let me stop here. So this became a thing. So on Twitter, when Dave answered me, we're almost finished, Sally.

No, no. On Twitter, when Dave answered me, he alluded to something like, why would I even bother with this with no one? He won't call out people on his own team. And I said, Peril, when did I ever? And he alluded to something, being excited about massacres or something like that. And I immediately called Peril. I said,

what could he be referring to here? And Perry Ellis says, the only time I remember somebody being excited about massacres was when Norman Finkelstein talked about how October 7th warmed every fiber of his soul. And I couldn't think, I couldn't think, I couldn't think, because as everybody knows, I really don't tolerate talk like that, even privately. And I'm never afraid to push back on that stuff.

And I've done shows, you know, really upsetting people on my team. They say, why are you elevating that person? Why are you amplifying that person? Because I feel like I should engage with the fact. So, okay, I couldn't remember. Perrielle said she'd look into it. She didn't find it. So this is it. So this is it. So I'm going to tell't remember. Perrielle said she'd look into it. She didn't find it. So... This is it.

So this is it. So I'm going to tell you honestly. I remember it now. When he said the first part, I immediately said, what the fuck? It bubbled over my head. I said, what the fuck is he saying? And I was actually ready to have knowing I had to

intervene and say something you don't mean. Like I said to Leo Leibovitz, you don't mean this. Or I said to Ann Coul say something you don't mean. Like I said to Leo Leibovitz, you don't mean this. Or I said to Ann Coulter, you don't mean really deport everybody. You know, I have to understand. But, and let me just say as an aside, I don't know, he's not on my team,

I don't know Aaron Berg. He's actually a guy who performs with Dave Smith for the last 15 years. The Skank Fest. I've not said five words to this guy in my whole lifetime. I met him one time at Robert Kelly's backyard party. I made small talk with him. And the next time I've ever sat in a room with him was right there at that podcast. I didn't even know his views on Israel.

I was hearing it all for the first time. But anyway, he said that. And then in the next sentence, he said about the pagers. And I did a quick mental arithmetic in my mind that, oh, he must be using, it sounds to me like he's using the word massacre, which is something you wouldn't, is a word you wouldn't use to describe kind of a legal military action to describe kind of like, do you see that basketball game? It was a massacre. I mean, like somebody, and because the only example he gave was the pagers. And I was in the middle of making a point and I just continued to plow through with my point.

And you know what? In retrospect, I'm sorry I did, because it is ambiguous what he said. And so I called him today, and I asked him, and I spoke very frankly with him. I said, listen, if that's what you mean, I said, I will, you know, I would have had no problem rebuking you because it's not like I was not even in the bind that Dave Smith is. He's not a friend of mine. In other words, it's not like if Dan says something and I say, oh, shit, or you. This guy I basically just met minutes before. Now if he's saying something half-cocked about killing, God forbid, Palestinian children, I have no reason in the world to hesitate to say, what the fuck's the matter with you? So he called me back. I didn't

get the call. And he left a voice message. I asked him to respond to it. So do you have it, Tiana? Yeah. Hey, no, it's Aaron Burr. Just wanted to clarify my remarks in case they weren't clear enough. I do fully support the massacre of the Hamas army. It does excite me as I watch what happened on October 7th. So it feels like payback. And I also got very excited when the Pager incident went down. That took a lot of thought and foresight. Hope you're well.

Bye. All right. I don't know. Adam, Aaron Berg from Adam's at the expression. He could be lying right now. He could be cut. I don't have a,

I am not my, I don't listen. It's a lot for any human being to say privately, but let alone publicly, I love it when I see the Palestinian children massacred. So my, except for Norman Finkelstein, who really, and even, you know, to be fair, Norman Finkelstein,

he didn't say he loved the massacre. He said, I love the faces of the Palestinians, like their relations, seeing their arrogant Israeli overlords humbled. That's what he said. So, maybe it's a distinction without a difference. I don't know. But just to be accurate, that's what he said. So,

on the face of it, it's tough for me to believe that Aaron really meant he wants to see Palestinian children mowed down. But... He didn't say that, and I don't think he meant that. I think it was really when i when i re-heard it yeah when i re-listened to it today because i yeah don't remember it yes the word massacre i i i felt that aaron was saying it certainly was ambiguous at a minimum and could be interpreted

as him saying that when innocent palestin, it's exciting. Of course it could be. Of course it could be. It was ambiguous. And I think that Noam was so wanting this. I thought that you were just kind of like just you were on such a tear that you kind of maybe didn't process it and you misunderstood it. No, I can't lie. I do remember it. And because I've had this experience more than once when a guest says something and I have to make a quick, because obviously if I can confront it at that moment, I can get drawn into a whole nother conversation and then have to forfeit the point I felt I had to, but just, but just a few things, but he, but he seemed

to clean it up. I might've even wanted to get back to it, but I didn't get back to it. But the distinction is I'm not covering for him, but also nobody would ever think that I would cover him. If, if Dave Smith tweeted at me, did you let Aaron Berg say this on your show? I would have immediately answered, oh yeah. No, I have no use. If that's what he meant, I have zero use for

a guy like that. He says that's not what he meant and he has no history of it, but of course not. Why would I spend two seconds defending someone like that? As I said to Dave, I'm not in the same awkward bind that Dave is because I'm not surrounded by these crazy bigots and lunatics. We have said numerous times on this show, you have said numerous times on this show that every

civilian death is a tragedy, especially children and women. You have said that. I mean, I can't even count the number of times. But did he say especially women? I don't remember that part. No, I didn't say especially women. No, you know, I appreciate what you're trying to do, but you're not putting it like I have ever put it. It's not my language. It might not be your language,

but my point is that you have gone out of your way on many shows to clarify that you take no joy or no pleasure i'll tell you what i did say on the show it's a better illustration of what you're saying i criticized the rabbi at trump's inauguration when he was talking about the terrible condition of the hostages and i said do you think maybe you could say a word for the terrible palestin Palestinian children dying? I remember saying that. And when I was in Auschwitz at the 80th anniversary, one of my criticisms of the speeches of Auschwitz is like, you're describing all the things that happened to the Jews in Auschwitz.

And the elephant in the room, the bubble over his head, it kind of sounds like what's happening to poor Palestinian children. And I felt like you need to address that, explain why it's different, but let's not pretend like every person in the room is not having, making that mental connection. The mental connection itself was, is bad. I'm always sensitive to anybody who seems to just, either because they don't care or because it's, the cognitive dissonance is difficult for them to deal with. To just pretend like it's not happening. This has to weigh heavily on any Jewish person or anybody who

defends Israel here. That there's tremendous people dying. These are people dying. Children. And women. And of course, Aaron goes on later, you know, maybe it's on this clip, you know,

or someone did, I don't remember. It becomes more and more difficult as you hear that the hostages were kept in the homes of civilians, as you see video clips of the civilians in jubilation, you know, as a, you know, hostages on the back of a truck to determine

who is Hamas, who's not Hamas, who's responsible, who's not responsible. These are very difficult things. But as a fundamental issue of humanity, that you can't lose sight of the fact that this policy that you're defending has to be justified in the light of the people being killed. And those could be your kids, my kids, their kids, and they're innocent. Innocent life is innocent life. I've said this many, many times, and it's not for show. I believe it, all right? Whatever. And I support Israel. One thing I think that, I mean, you alluded to it, but one big difference is even if somebody says something that for whatever reason you don't condemn on the show,

um, whether it's because you, you know, you, you don't want to create an awkward situation or, or you're, you lose your train of thought. If confronted after the fact,

you'll say, you'll, you'll, you'll give your opinion. Right. Exactly. Dan, let me say that part of what's unfair here is

that you take a thousand hours of shows, or maybe that's an exaggeration, but you know, hundreds of hours of shows, and you comb through them and you find, aha, here's an example of something, you know, he didn't do it here, and pretend that that's the pattern, when actually that's a totally dishonest use of evidence. The pattern is

exactly the opposite, as opposed to Dave, where what I'm describing is the status quo. This is what he does. I can't even find one counterexample. He didn't catch me within hypocrisy because there is no hypocrisy in me. I have no love lost with anybody who, forget about just anti-Semitism, I get furious at people who don't stick to facts. I don't want to hear your goddamn conspiracy. If some Israeli came in here and tried to tell me that actually, you know, Hamas gives a lot of money to the Bidens and they control the Biden administration and blah, blah, blah. I'd say, can you back that up? No. You know, then go F yourself.

We're not here to hear your dumb conspiracy theories. It sounds like anti-arab garbage to me all right i'm almost done about the patriot thing yeah but but the whole um theory of free speech and i absolutely i'm not asking any of these people to be censored i even want to have a holocaust denial debate at the at the underground years ago i remember people, I was crazy. How would you cater that kosher? Um, uh, it's, it's, it's that the principle of free speech is based on the presumption that you're going to have people battling things out in the marketplace of ideas. I'm not asking Dave. All right. Just stop it. Mike, I appreciate it. We're done. We're done here. Okay. So

if you could just get past the point at the end that no one gets completely wrong, the whole principle of free speech is not predicated on the idea that you're going to have debate. Free speech is a value in and of itself. Um, and that it's wrong to rob someone of their ability to speak, but regardless of any of that, that is one of the benefits of free speech, but it's not predicated on that is one of the benefits of free speech, but it's not predicated on that. This might be where I'm going to lose it on this guy. First of all,

he is right that there is a theory of free speech that's like kind of the- The human right. No, no. That it's like the fulfillment of the moral autonomy of the self. And maybe this is something like we learned, I can't, I'm going to screw it up,

like Immanuel Kant or somebody would talk about free speech this way. But in most political contexts, specifically in like the libertarian world that he lives in, the heterodox world, free speech, the Bible on free speech is On Liberty by John Stuart Mill. And if you read, I just pulled it up here now, so I was texting. If you read On Liberty by John Stuart Mill. And if you read, I just pulled it up here now, so I was texting. If you read On Liberty by John Stuart Mill,

it is all about the fact that we need free speech because without free speech, we never know what is true. And only through everybody being able to speak whatever their version of truth, will we be able to have a clash of ideas and eventually determine what is or isn't true?

That's what I meant by that's the whole point of free speech. Now he can say, you know, Noam is, you know, he's alluding to that, but there's also this. Instead he tries to make it sound like I'm stupid. Like I'm not, like I said something ridiculous and he's laughing in his fucking hour. Like I'm, I mean, and the thing is, I'm presuming he has read John Stuart Mill.

So I don't know where he's coming from on that. But I brought it up here. So at the very end of John Stuart Mill's essay, we have now recognized the necessity of the well-being of mankind, blah, blah, blah, and the freedom, the expression of opinion on four distinct grounds. I'll try to edit them. I should have prepared this. First, if any opinion is compelled to silence, that opinion may or ought, we can certainly know, be true. To deny this is to assume our own infallibility.

Secondly, talking about the truth of it. Secondly, though the silenced opinion be an error, it may be and very commonly does contain a portion of truth. And since the general or prevailing opinion on any subject is rarely or never the whole truth, it is only by the collision of adverse opinions that the remainder of the truth has any chance of being supplied. Thirdly, even if the received opinion be not only true but the whole truth, unless it's suffered to be and actually is vigorously and earnestly contested, it will, This is why I was talking about the Holocaust. That's the danger of the Holocaust.

You just always hear it's true. You always hear it's always true. But you never have it tested. It becomes just like a religious belief. And not only this, but fourthly, the meaning of the doctrine itself will be in danger of being lost or enfeebled and deprived of its vital effect on the character and conduct, the dogma becoming a mere formal profession, inefficacious for good, but cumbering the ground and preventing the growth of any real

and heartfelt conviction from reason. This is what I intuited years ago about the Holocaust. It was just becoming a dogma. And this fucking guy has the nerve to laugh at me like I don't understand the importance of free speech. This is the importance of free speech. And yes, and I do have sympathy for it. We do. There is something fundamental about just liberty,

to be able to say what you want, to express your blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But you know, if there was such a thing as absolute falsity, we do have laws, libel, slander laws, that do try to prevent you from saying things which are known to be untrue and damaging or unfair to other people. So, and the reason we hesitate on that is not because we feel people are exercising their personal moral autonomy by slandering someone. The reason we struggle with it is because we understand that if we don't allow some latitude for that, we will damage the debate that is necessary for a democratic society.

We're not worried about damaging the personal moral autonomy of people who want to say untrue things about people. This is why the whole New York Times versus Sullivan, he makes me so fucking angry. I'm sorry, because it's so, I don't know if it's dumb or it's mendacious or both treacherous. I don't know what's going on. What he said to you was so cruel. I'm no longer inclined to give him the benefit of good faith, the benefit of the doubt of good faith. Can I say something?

Let's listen to him once more. That is one of the benefits of free speech, but it's not predicated on that. But can you believe this, Rob? I mean, is this not like just the most insane thing ever? And by the way, to preface, I love Aaron Berg. I've known Aaron Berg for like 20 years. He's a friend of mine.

I'm not saying anything bad about him. But could you imagine being in the middle of a conversation where you're criticizing me for not calling out the bigotry on my side. And you're sitting there and you're making the point that the whole thing about free speech is that you got to push back against bad ideas. Aaron Berg in the middle of all of this says that he gets excited when people are being massacred and no one even thinks to give it some pushback. All right, we'll stop here. I address why we didn't push back. I'm sorry. I didn't push back. And like I said, there's no evidence ever that I don't push back on these things. I said,

why I didn't push back now that I have pushed back balls in Dave's court to do the same thing, but to compare, uh, I mean, Dave is just, I mean, I read the list. It bothers me so much because I can't believe there's any good faith in this all too clever avoidance of the obvious. These people are just spouting out one retread anti-Semitic, classic anti-Semitic theory after another. The pile gets higher and higher. It is now on the Joe Rogan show. He is the most important media figure in the world. It's not limited just to the borders of the United States of America.

It's going out to the entire world. And as I once said to Dave, and he didn't like it, I believe many of these people are using him as a useful idiot. Because he's Jewish. Jake Shields will talk about my Jewish friends, my Jewish friends. Yeah, he does have Jewish friends. He's not lying. Go ahead. And then we'll get to Sally Jewish friends, my Jewish friends. Yeah, he does have Jewish friends. He's not lying. Go ahead.

Well, that's essentially what Dan said, which enraged Dave so much, right? And I just wanted to call out because I think it's really interesting that after this whole performance of just engage with facts and don't call them names the horrible things that he said to you just i don't care about that well i mean you might not care about that but why would you predicate your entire position on this statement and then you do the exact opposite instead of engaging with what dan said which whether you like it or not, it was a fair point.

It was something that was a reasonable and legitimate thing to point out. No, Dan took a personal swipe at him a little bit. But but as I said, not like that before you came because he belittled Dan. He says you're a failure in your career and all kinds of cool stuff. But he said, shut the fuck up, which was so rude. And my analogy was that when kids fight in the schoolyard, you know, they'll have fisticuffs, but they won't punch each other in the face.

Like, you know, there's like a certain context, you know, and the kid who does actually take a two by four and hit somebody over the head, the other kids say, what are you doing? You're having a schoolyard fight. So Dan was still clearly to any ration to any like sensitive person hilarious dan he's like kind of he's addressing what's going on here like i'm criticizing dave for this and dan saying well maybe it's because you're captured by your audience

dave and dan and then dave said well you're a failure like this is you know okay so