The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Scrabble

Episode Date: March 19, 2022

David Stone is a Comedy Cellar superfan. He has played in Scrabble tournaments since the mid-1990s and was once rated within the top 50 players in North America. Katie Hannigan is a stand up comic and actor. Her television appearances include The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, Comedy Central, Just For Laughs New Faces and MTV. She is a Comedy Cellar regular. 

This is Live from the Table, the official podcast of New York's world-famous comedy seller. Coming at you on SiriusXM 99, Raw Dog. And on the Laugh Button Podcast Network, Dan Natterman here. And with me is Noam Dorman, owner of the world-famous comedy seller, Perrielle Ashenbrand, our producer and on-air personality. How did she get to be an on-air personality? I don't know. You didn't hire her for that.

It just kind of evolved in that direction. It's funny you should ask that. And with us, making her, I believe, debut on the Live from the Table podcast, if I am not mistaken, is Katie Hannigan. Hello. How do you do, Katie Hannigan?

Katie Hannigan. Thank you for having me. She's a comic, a comedy seller, a regular, a regular at Aruba Ray's Comedy in Aruba. In Aruba itself. In Aruba. And she has appeared on The Light Show with Stephen Colbert, Comedy Central, The Travel Channel, Oxygen Network, and MTV, just to name a few. Noam, I have one thing I wanted to bring up about last week's show, if I may. Last week we had on Ismail Lufti,

who's a practicing Muslim. You know Ismail. I do. Great guy. So every time he mentioned the Prophet Muhammad, he said, peace be upon him. He said that about four times at least. I didn't hear it. And Noam, well, of course you heard it,

but what's interesting is Noam didn't even notice. Noam was so into the conversation. It was obvious. It wasn't an issue of it not being. He said it as loud as he said everything else he said. My point is, how do we trust? It struck me. How do you trust eyewitness testimony?

You know, I mean, this shows you the. No, I am hard of hearing. I might not have heard it. You have selected. No, they don't say it as the... No, I am hard of hearing. I might not have heard it. You have selected. No, they don't say it as loud as... They don't say it as loud as... They kind of say it to themselves. It's not conversational.

No, I heard it perfectly well. Well, okay, I'm going to go back. We'll go back. Nicole, can you bring up the tape? You don't have it? All right. Good job, Nicole. Oh, we can't.

We can't. Because that would be interesting. Oh, we can't? We can't? Because that would be interesting. Oh, we can do it. We can put this off until next week and play it. But it struck me. Now, maybe you didn't hear it, but it struck me that it's human ability to kind of absorb everything they see and hear is limited. Yeah.

But you're right about what I would say, but I think you don't realize how deaf I am. I think I would have heard it otherwise because I'm pretty good as opposed to some people. I listen when people are talking. Oh, sure. It depends who's talking. Don't make me call your wife. Nicole, did you hear the peace be upon him? I did.

Yeah, and she's sitting all the way over there. So it might be an issue with your hearing. But, you know, because Perry, what you do sometimes is, you know, listen to the answer and you just go on to another thing and somebody will, I'll have to say,

wait, they didn't finish their point. Like, they'll be in the middle of a point, there'll be some sort of detour and then you'll, like, you just keep, hold on,

don't you remember they were about to make, they didn't finish that story. So, I am, I do listen. I'm trying to get better at doing that, not like interrupting. Marriage counseling

is good for that. Yeah, well that's where I heard that I should consider. Oh, you're into marriage counseling? I've been in, well I'm not going to marriage counseling. Wow, juicy. I've been in therapy before. Couples therapy? Yeah, I have been in couples therapy.

With Guy? A long time ago, yeah. Wow. By the way, no, I'm... Why, have you never been in couples therapy? I was one time before I was married, but it didn't end well. I told you, I ended with the therapist giving me a foot massage, and Juanita got really mad.

Shut up. There's no way that's true. It was massage therapy. No, it was talk therapy. And she was also studying reflexology, and she says, you're so stressed. And then she started giving me a foot massage, the therapist. And Juanita freaked out. That's amazing.

And walked out, and we never went back to therapy. By the way, do you know who Katie Hannigan is? I assume we can talk about your significant other. You can. Katie Hannigan is involved in one of the premier comedy couples working today. It's a love match. Do you know who her boyfriend is? No.

It's Mike Vecchione, our beloved Mike Vecchione. Oh, wow. I've heard all about you. You didn't know that either? Surprise. I didn't know either. But it's a phenomenon that is not altogether rare. Comedy, comedian on comedian love.

Do you find that it complicates or facilitates? Oh, it's the only relationship that I could have, I think. I tried to date so many normal people. I was going to date a lawyer for a long time. I was looking for a lawyer and it just doesn't ever work out because the schedule is not good. Why did you want a lawyer? You know,

I just had something in the back of my mind. I said, I think I want to date a lawyer. You know, are you a lawyer? No, I just had, I just,

nobody likes lawyers. Well, I know now. Yeah. They're very boring. And, uh, I dated a couple and I just was like,

Oh my God. Not to mention, you know, they're getting off of work as I'm going to work. So it would never, it would never. But it's also, they love comedians. Oh, my God. So much attention. Every lawyer event.

It's like, oh, my God, you're so funny. I was like, oh, I know. How do you set about meeting a lawyer? Like, go to a bar near? Well, get a divorce. You know, that's the first way. No, I just think I was doing it online. I was just looking

for a guy in a bow tie. And it never worked out. That's so funny. As a lawyer. Well, I have a law degree, as does Noam. I never practiced. Noam practiced, I think, for a brief period. No, I never practiced. You never practiced? No. But the one thing about dating another comic

is you probably don't get the adoration that you would get from a non-comic. It might be like, oh my God, they can't believe what you do. And Mike Macchione is like, yeah, I do that too. Well, no, I think it's different for men. Because I think women find, you know, being funny is considered a masculine trait. So if a man dates a funny woman, he finds it like very intimidating usually. And he likes to be the funny one. So with Mike, Mike's like very appreciative of my humor, I think, more than like anyone

I've ever dated. But when you guys, when somebody comes, I don't know, it just seems to me that when one person becomes successful and the other one doesn't, there's going to be some. Maybe they'll get lucky and nobody will get success. Yeah, it's a win-win. Well, I think that can happen. But I also think that I think Mike is the kind of guy that if Katie spread her wings and flew, would be rooting for her every step of the way. That's the sense that I get.

Well, we live together now, so we share more now. So if one of us gets a lot of money, then it's a win-win for both of us. Yeah, I think they're a solid couple as far as I can tell. But what do I know? I mean, you know, it seems good to me. By the way... Well, we're not in couples therapy,

so I'll tell you that much. It doesn't work. Couples therapy, just you, you, you, we talked about this. You can't be totally honest in couples therapy because if anybody in a couple actually said

what they were really thinking that the relationship would end, you'd say things that could never be unheard. And so it's just like you go to couples therapy and you have to, you have to offer a watered down version of what you really want to say and you have to manipulate it. I think it's a total farce. This is like the dark version of your fucking crazy

thing. That's not true. I mean, how are you supposed to have a relationship if you can't be honest with your husband? Let's say it's like, you know what? I just, my husband's penis is too small. You go to the therapist and say that. That's not a thing.

He'll never get it out of his head. So you have to find a way or something sexually. If you don't want to be with your husband because his penis is too small, then you should just get a divorce. I don't think you should stay with him and hating him for his tiny penis. I can't imagine that.

You make me sick. That's also ground. When you touch me, you make me sick. But that's also ground. When you touch me, it makes me want to cringe. Oh, my God. I'm just not attracted to you anymore. Yeah, I mean, I think that's... Divorce. But therapy is like, I love this person.

I want to work through it with them. You know, maybe we're not doing as great in the bedroom as we could be. Or maybe it's just, it's not about that. I mean, I feel like there are all sorts of things that... What did you bring up in your therapy? Well, I think it was more Guy who had, it was really difficult for him to be with somebody who was just so perfect.

Do we want to hear... Nicole, can we cut that out I hate to Who's our next guest Our next guest is Dave Stone But he'll be here He's a comedy seller super fan The Scrabble guy

I did want to hear Katie's Point perspective on Dave Chappelle's special I assume you saw it I didn't watch it Oh you didn't watch it No you know what I just decided I didn't feel

I don't feel like watching it And I'm not going to Oh you're not I don't feel like watching it, and I'm not going to. Oh, you're not obligated. I don't feel like watching it. And I didn't really hear that great of stuff. I heard some people said, oh, like one moment was good, but overall it was mediocre. So I just thought, why am I going to force myself to watch this? Because I'm a comedian.

I don't have to watch every, you know, if I want to watch something, I'll rewatch Killing Them Softly, an amazing special. Why am I going to waste my time watching? Who was Killing Them Softly? That was Chappelle's first special. Oh, that was Chappelle's first. I don't watch any of them. And it was fantastic.

But I watched this one because I knew we would discuss it on the show, so I watched it for that reason. I can't believe you saw this one and not the first. No, he didn't see it. He didn't see it because I think a lot of good TV has come out lately. I watch Squid Game. I'll talk about Squid Game all night long. I want to watch that.

Oh, it's fantastic. I watched it as well. It's a lot of fun. I mean, you have to suspend disbelief. I don't want to give away any spoilers, but the whole thing is, you know, kind of ridiculous. But there are some there are a few plot holes, I would say. Yeah, I think it's a dystopian world and you're going to get that. Yeah, I don't think you can avoid plot holes in in that kind of a show but there are several so um but i i was able to put those aside you said plot holes

not potholes right no plot holes come come deaf go ahead go so potholes those two bad roads i did also watch another recommendation i have is the delorean uh mini documentary series, whatever you want to call it. It's like a three-part series on John DeLorean. It doesn't sound like a mini-series. It's a three-part documentary, a three-episode documentary, whatever you want to call it, on DeLorean who, of course, made the famous car that Katie may not remember because she's perhaps too young.

Is that the car they had in Back of the Future? It was a car in Back of the Future. He was kind of the opposite of Elon Musk. I mean, he was insofar as Elon Musk, everything he touches turns to gold, whereas DeLorean, it was like disaster after disaster. I mean, he was like a big deal in Detroit, but then he started his own car company

and it was like disaster and he got indicted for various... Even with a movie about the car and how awesome it was, he couldn't pull it off. You know, my son watched Back to the Future and he was extremely uncomfortable. He really, he's like, Daddy, I don't like this. I don't want to watch this.

I don't want to watch it. And it hit me exactly why. Can you think of why? The bullying. Is it the bullying? Nope. I feel like that made me. That was a good guess though.

He just doesn't believe that time travel is feasible. Nope. It defies. Let me give you more facts. We were all, the whole family was watching it together. The mom. Sleeping with the mom, yes.

He was so uncomfortable about the son having a sexual moment with the mom. Well, I don't think the son did have a sexual moment with the mom. No, they didn't actually have sex, but there was like this attraction. Doesn't he take her to the dance? Yeah. Well, there wasn't. No son did have a sexual moment with the mom. No, they didn't actually have sex, but there was like this attraction. Doesn't he take her to the dance? Yeah. Well, there wasn't. No, the mother was attracted to him. Yeah, that made.

But he was like, no way. Right. But it made my son. Yeah, you're right. But it made my son extremely uncomfortable. Just the thought of it. Just the thought of it was. He was squirming.

It's awkward to watch that stuff with your mom. Yeah. I watched the. I remember I watched the first episode of Game of Thrones with my parents and that felt uncomfortable because there's a rape and my mom she comments on everything she's he's gonna rape her like oh my god oh my god it's awkward any ladies in here you ever thought you were roofied turns out you just had 15 drinks that's how my girlfriends do it. You get that phone call, right? Morning after. You guys know what I'm talking about. Katie, oh my god, I don't remember

getting home last night. I think I was roofied. I'm like, oh my god, Lauren, well, what did you have to drink? Well, I just had like three or four martinis. I had a couple double gin and tonics, and then I had a shot of Patron, and then I had a glass of Pinot Grig and that was when I started losing consciousness. I'm like, listen, I don't want to jump the gun but you may have roofied yourself. It takes a pretty devious rapist to roofie someone then make sure they safely get to their ex-boyfriend's apartment at three in the morning.

Just put your right in a cab, you know? Suspicious. Yeah, my neighbor of ours was in Penthouse years ago. Like, my sister came up and said, Veronique is in Penthouse, and my father, not knowing what Penthouse was, bought the... I guess he didn't know it, or maybe he did.

A likely story. He bought the issue, and he brought it in bought the issue and he brought in the car and we opened it up we're like and my father's like oh my god it was very neat and and obviously very compromised i mean the cover of penthouse magazine was your father an idiot well i don't know that accidental molestation you know usually the cover of penthouse is not full nude i don't know but it makes it pretty obvious it's not you you know, the Atlantic. Well, in any case, he bought the issue of Penthouse, and we looked through it. Penthouse, entertainment for men or something. I guess that's Playboy, but, you know, it's pretty clear.

And then there's, like, the little blurbs of, you know, what the articles are about. I think it's pretty clear. Well, maybe it was clear. I don't know. We're going back a way. This was, like, in the early 80s. I love that her name was Veronique. I think it's pretty clear. Well, maybe it was clear. I don't know. We're going back a way. This was like in the early 80s.

I love that her name was Veronique. Well, yeah, her father was a French Jew. Her mother was Vietnamese. And apparently when you put those together, you get fire. Because she was, I mean, I was too young to be sexually attracted to her. Why? Because I was probably nine or ten back at that time. That's a bit young.

I was always attracted to the girls in my class at that age. That's good. That's probably much healthier. I had a high school teacher who was in Playboy. Dr. Rice. She was very pretty. And it was one of my friends. Her dad had the issue.

Wow. I know. I never looked at it. But I heard. Wow. And she was a teacher in your school? What did she teach? Art. And she was a doctor?

She was a doctor of art. Oh, well, that makes more sense. I had a teacher who dated Imus, Billie Dee Olsen. She dated Don Imus. She was super hot. Noam, do you have any thoughts about Trump's words? What did he say about Colin Powell? Okay. This was shortly after Colin Powell died. Do you have any thoughts about Trump's words? What did he say about Colin Powell?

Okay. This was shortly after Colin Powell died. It's really disgusting. And he said. Trump said something disgusting? No, it's like really. I find that hard to believe. He said as follows.

He said, wonderful to see Colin Powell, who made big mistakes on Iraq and famously so-called weapons of mass destruction, be treated in death so beautifully by the fake news media. Trump said in a statement released Tuesday morning, hope that happens to me someday. He was a classic rhino, Republican in name only, if that. Always being the first to attack other Republicans. He made plenty of mistakes. But anyway, may he rest in peace. This guy is unbelievable. Just another bid for attention.

I can't defend that. Can anybody defend that? No, it's totally indefendable. Is it indefendable because Colin Powell... Indefensible, thank you. Is it indefensible because Colin Powell has died or because the words themselves are untrue? Because he died.

And I'll say this. Hey. Hello, Dave. That's the Scrabble guy? That's the Scrabble guy. I didn't know he was a Scrabble guy. So, okay, but I will say this about that. Okay.

And this is not a defense of Trump because I find it awful what he said. But I will say the following. That when, for instance, like Rush Limbaugh died, when a conservative dies, the people on the left do the same thing. They say awful things about people who have died. And everybody on the left thinks, well, that's okay because they're right. Like he was horrible, so it's okay for us to say it. So let's just bear that in mind. Bear this Colin Powell in mind. okay because they're right. Like, he was horrible, so it's okay for us to say it. So,

let's just bear that in mind. Bear this Colin Powell in mind. Next time, like, Lindsey Graham dies or some right-wing figure dies, you will see that people on the left will say exactly the same sort of thing and nobody will have a problem with it. It's only when

it comes in the opposite direction that people realize what is, I think, true is that you should not speak that way about people who just died. It's just, it's not necessary and it's mean and it's... I mean, there are... Paul Powell was a patriot, obviously, even if he made a mistake about what was mass destruction.

I mean, there's exceptions to that rule, obviously. You know, if somebody... I mean, when Saddam Hussein died, you wouldn't have thought it inappropriate. Or when Osama bin Laden died, you wouldn't have thought it inappropriate to badmouth them. So it's not a rule that applies universally, but it's a general rule unless somebody is really bad. Yeah, I mean, unless you're somebody who's, you know, wanted for murder or, you know. But I think it's also because of who Trump is and like his, you know, quote unquote stature that it's just so fucking inappropriate.

Well, they'll say they'll say when Trump dies, rest assured, the people that are complaining about Trump's words about Colin Powell will will say bad things about Trump when he needs to I'll go even further if Colin Powell had not switched apparently switched party allegiance because he endorsed Obama I don't know if he's actually left the Republican Party but he was endorsing Democrats um when George W Bush dies people will say on like will say stuff about him and how he murdered him blah blah, blah, blah, blah. The only reason Colin Powell is being embraced by people in the middle and the left right now is because he seemed to have, I'm using quotes, seen the error of his ways and now has embraced Obama and Biden and all that. So they, I mean, it's all politics. So they love him now because he's one of the good ones.

But if he had remained a staunch conservative, unapologetic about the Gulf War, you'd be seeing people on the left saying this kind of thing about Colin Powell. So, you know, they're they're all hypocrites. That's my feeling about it. But I don't like it. And I like Colin Powell. Katie, any thoughts about all of this? Well, I just think, you know, Trump is he just peddles outrage culture. You know, he just uses it for attention. So I think he probably, you know, whether he sincerely thought that or not, I think that, you know, he just wants to stay in the public eye. So he just says stuff like that.

And then people who are on the left get outraged by it. You know, people, so many people are addicted to outrage and it just, it just only helps him. So I just think it's, you know, I just don't pay attention to it. I do. I do want to say, I agree with you. Was the other issue you wanted to talk about then? Cause I wanted to say something personal nature. Go ahead. Well, the other issues were, um, my birthday. Chappelle and Netflix.

That's an issue. Chappelle and Netflix. And there's a walkout from the trans employees of Netflix, I guess. How many trans employees are there? I don't know,

but there's some number. Is it trans employees or people who just support the trans cause? Well, that's what it said in the article. Oh, due to the Chappelle special? Because of Chappelle's

in protest about, what's his name, David Sarandos or whatever his name is. And he apologized, right? He said he didn't handle it well or something. I don't know about that. So do you have thoughts on that?

Or should we move on? Well, I spoke to two trans people about it yesterday. And transes? Anyway, I spoke to two trans people. Two trans people. And they both thought that Chappelle's... Why nod your head no? It's just funny.

They both thought that Chappelle was getting a bum rap. They thought that Chappelle's special was okay. They both... For whatever reason, they weren't that bothered by what he said. I think that... At first, it looked like Netflix was going to stand up against this and people were applauding Netflix. But I think now that even though they're going to ostensibly stand behind Chappelle, you're not going to see Netflix

greenlight any controversial projects in the future. So in the end, I think that it's another win for the forces of cancel culture, as it were, lack of a better phrase. I think that, I mean, that's what I said last week on the show, the issue, I mean, people should be able to say what they want. I don't like things that Chappelle said about Jews, you know, but I disagree with him, but I just think it's ridiculous that people can't say what they want to say. He should be able to say whatever he wants to say. David Stone is nodding in agreement. Let me introduce David Stone.

David Stone is a, there's no other way to describe him. He's a comedy seller superfan. Oh, thank you. Well, I see him here. I don't know how often you come to the shows here. I do. Like once a week you see a show? Talk closer to the mic. It used to be once a week or even more.

I think my next show is number 180. Now, do you know Andy Barron? He's another guy that comes all the time. I think we've seen each other. And he says that you ain't shit. That's true. He's right. He comes with his wife, right? No, I, yes, he does. He sometimes comes with his wife. So we've introduced ourselves, but we haven't competed

actively. I don't know what his number is, but mine's near 200. His number is, I would assume, in that competed actively. I don't know what his number is, but mine's near 200. His number is, I would assume, in that ballpark. I think I see him here more than you, to be honest. Now, that may be because he's simply better than you as a fan. He's more conspicuous. He is very conspicuous.

He's more conspicuous, or perhaps because he happens to be here when I'm here. It could be. These are all possible. Maybe he's a super fan of you. He wants to hear I'm here. It could be. He might be. So these are all possible. Maybe he's a super fan of you. He wants to hear more about Sheila. That could be. So what do you think about Chappelle, Dan?

Oh, you want to say something about Chappelle? No, I... Well, one funny thing I was going to address is that we don't actually have a single word for multiple people who are trans. And you were looking for it. And just before you said that, I looked it up, and there is no acceptable word like trans is well we used to have one but now it's considered right exactly so we don't have that word and i guess you know i don't think we need one we seem to be getting by just fine with saying a trans person or whatever but um people of trans well i should i'm wondering trans people no but right but there's not a single word like there is for you know other well we talk

about gay america do we talk about gay America. Do we talk about trans America? Because that used to be an insurance company. That's true. I just think it's an interesting thing to see where the language is headed, and are we going to develop a new term? I mentioned Dave Stone is a Scrabble grandmaster. I don't know black belt.

I don't know what the terminology is in that world. I think I'm probably now just a red belt. A red belt? I used to be a very active Scrabble tournament player and was at one point, well, I guess you have my introduction,

but I can do it for you. Well, that's actually Dan's job. Yeah, but I somehow don't have it, so go ahead. At one point, when I was actively

playing a lot, I was among the top 50 rated players in North America. Wow. And that sounds great, like if it were chess, but there aren't that many active

Scrabble tournament players at any one point. There might be like 2,000, let's say, maybe at the height of Scrabble play, maybe 4,000. But I was, you know, among the top players at one point. And then I just, you know, had family, had other reasons not to stay in it. And more recently, the dictionary changes kind of turned me off. So we'll talk about that. We're going to talk about the dictionary changes. But what's more important? When you lose a Scrabble game, what is usually the mistake? That your spelling was bad, your vocabulary was weak, or your strategy was off? Actually, there was a really interesting study that led to the Scrabble games that you see on Facebook and things like Words with Friends. But the one on Facebook was actually purchased by them from a

guy that I've played with. He was a top player, and he did exactly what you're talking about in the early days of AI, and he figured out what was wrong with his game, and it came down to those three things. Sometimes it was a strategic thing, sometimes it was a lack of word knowledge, and sometimes it was, you know, just bad luck, of course. So he figured out what he could do to improve his game, and it came down to learning more words, including certain kinds of words that come up more often, and then also figuring out certain strategic things that he was missing and figuring out what's the value, for example, of an S.

It says one on it, but it's actually worth eight or nine points of extrinsic value. Yeah, because it's so valuable to you if you know how to use it right. What is the rule in terms of the official Scrabble rule as far as which words are eligible? Because we have a million words that people use. I could say adorbs. I mean, that's a word that is used. Amazeballs, that's a word that people use, but yet I assume it's not in the dictionary or I don't know what's considered a valid Scrabble word.

Adorbs has not been accepted yet. I can guarantee it'll be in the next dictionary. So that dictionary you have is the official, like if it's not in there in terms of official Scrabble, you can't use it? Yes, and a little bit no. So this is the acceptable word list, except for a funny thing that happened a few years ago, and we'll talk about that. Okay, you have a presentation. You have, he has papers, and he's got a whiteboard, so go ahead. Give us your, give us your, give us your, are we finished with Chappelle?

I think so. Can I make my one personal statement, and then we're going to- Yeah, go ahead. So, you know, we talk about, so, like a dear friend of mine and a person who worked at the Altree for a long time died a couple weeks ago, committed suicide. And I brought this up last week, but it's really been bothering me and I just want to make the point again. I'm even thinking about pursuing it.

He was mentally ill and he had had numerous other mentally ill events. He was taken to Bellevue for observation more than once. And he had a fight at home and the cops came

with his sister. And the sister begged them to take him to the mental hospital. And the cops just wouldn't take him to the hospital. Instead, they took him to get arraigned or whatever the word is. So they got an order of protection and so they put him to get arraigned or whatever the word is. And so they got an order of protection.

And so they put him back out on the street. So he had no place to go, right? And he jumped off a bridge and killed himself. So we had a big memorial for him. It just occurred to me that if you see a person bleeding on the street, you would know to take them to a hospital. He needs medical attention. But for some reason, when we see a person having a mental bleeding, we don't take them to a hospital. Or we might not take them to a hospital.

We take them to jail. And this is wrong, right? This is wrong. And so I'm even thinking about getting a lawyer and trying to bring attention to this issue because it's clear to me that this man died and didn't have to die. And, you know, you don't know what the reason is. It could just be bad judgment. It could be bad training. It could be that the paperwork is more involved to go to a mental hospital than a—who the hell knows? Or any number of those things.

Well, also because a person might not want to go to a mental hospital. I mean, you have to deal with somebody's wishes, unlike a person that's bleeding on the street. No, they can take a person who doesn't want to go. Especially in a situation like that. Well, the person has to be judged to be not able to make decisions, which is a process in and of itself. Whereas a guy bleeding unconscious, you take him to the hospital, there's no issue. No, they also have to be either a danger to themselves or somebody else. The cops may not. I don't know how that decision is made. I don't know the procedures.

I want to educate myself on the procedures. And the cops, I don't know how all that works. However it works, it's not working as it should. I don't think the answer is going to be to hire a lawyer to go after anyone in particular, because unfortunately, I think that's been tried a lot and it obviously hasn't worked. And what we had going on in the 60s and 70s was much better than we have now. We've taken a big step backwards in terms of mental health and the way we treat it. My parents are both psychiatrists. I was going to say, my parents are both crazy.

This discussion comes up a lot, and I think the way to go, if you really want to pursue it, would maybe be to talk to people who are elected officials, the mayor, congresspeople. Good luck getting in touch with an elected official. I can't think of what else.

I mean, it really requires a groundswell, and unfortunately we don't have enough of that going on now, but I can't think of another way to fix this. Maybe you should tweet about it. I would like to get in touch with something. Just elected officials are another bugaboo of mine because it used to be years ago when I had various, you could actually contact an elected official.

You cannot get an elected official's office to call you back for anything anymore. Not Schumer, not Gillibrand, not that I want to talk to Schumer, but just somebody's office. You know, we're a fairly prominent New York business here. We had a problem last year. Couldn't get anybody. And calling Gillibrand's office, couldn't get anybody. I don't even know who the Congressman, the, the, the representatives, but years ago, I remember we had an issue and, um,

I contacted, uh, Senator D'Amato's office. And like an hour later, there's somebody on the phone. They sent me a big packet of information. They were actually there to serve constituents. I don't even know what the fuck these senators think their job is anymore. And then Schumer was out there talking about how this is a year ago july i think the the comedy clubs need a state you know the show business places need money they're all on life support we're gonna have our save our stages program and uh it was over more than over a year like 18 months people still hadn't gotten money

you think schumer would say something? He doesn't care. He was just about being in front of the cameras and registering people's brains that he cared about this issue. It didn't actually matter whether anybody ever got a dime. It didn't matter how many places actually went out of business. It is just, and listen, this is one thing Trump is right about. I mean, there mean, it is there's no bottom to how dishonest these elected. I don't think it's always been this way. Maybe it has been, but it is just horrible what's going on, especially in one party states like New York. And maybe as I'm speaking out loud, maybe that's part of it. Maybe now that it's so unlikely, so unlikely that any Democratic official in New York will really be challenged by the other party.

They don't give a shit. He's much more worried about AOC outflanking him on the ultra far crazy left than he is about constituent service. Listen, there is a very, very serious mental health crisis going on at this table. No, I'm serious. Which, of course, leads us to Scrabble. Go ahead, go ahead. I don't mean to cut her all off like you meant to. Go ahead.

Well, we have to. At some point, we have to get to Scrabble. Go get to Scrabble. We'll talk about it later. What are your thoughts on playing a filthy word, like anal? I often find that. What's filthy about that?

That's such an interesting question. And I'm a father of three and a teacher. And that's the kind of word where, you know, if it comes up. At what cost? I try to address it and say, well, you know, I don't want to put someone on the spot. But it's more about what a person is comfortable with or not. So I remember when maybe 30 years ago, you know, a lot of kids were afraid to say vagina or penis.

And now it's a very common thing because I think we've turned the page in that regard in a positive way. Nicole, you'll bleep that out later. Go ahead. To say these are body parts and kids should be able to discuss them because it can be very important at times, right?

We don't want to make it so a kid can't discuss what part of them is hurting or something bad has happened, a person has touched them in the wrong place. We don't want to have them say something that doesn't make sense or is, you know, obfuscating something important. So it's great that we're getting to the point where we can talk about those words. And so now you're getting to an interesting question, which is what constitutes a dirty word or an offensive word or whatever. And this is a very problematic discussion, which is why I'm here.

Scrabble decided that certain words were offensive to the point of being slurs, and that they wanted to take them out of the dictionary. Like what? Yeah. So... You can't say the words? I'm going to say one. I'm really going to offend you. Ready? Bowhunk. Bowhunk? Now, what is that a slur for? Because I know sometimes... I just call them a bowhunk, so... The only time I've ever heard that word

is in the movie Sixteen Candles. Really? Sixteen Candles, yeah. That movie is actually... Long Duck Dong, I think, referred to somebody as a bohunk or something. Oh, I've never heard of it. Okay, so the history of that word is related to Hungarian, the hunk part, and it goes back

to when a lot of Hungarian and other Eastern European immigrants came over and displaced a lot of African American workers. And people who were at the very bottom of the totem pole in terms of working that got displaced by this influx of a large number of Hungarians. And so the term was a derogatory term for a white person of that particular background. So we got something like Hungarian, and that leads to hunky with a U, and then honky, and then bohunk related to the hunky part. So it's an obscure word for white person in a derogatory sense that got taken out of the dictionary. So I have this reference. What exactly is a bohunk, and why is everyone upset that Sam's sister is marrying one? It's a derogatory

term from someone of Hungarian descent or someone from central or southeastern Europe, and by extension, a brute or buffoon. And is one of 10 slang terms from 16 candles, according to this mentalfloss.com article. Okay. Next.

What else? So I'm just giving you an example of, of how crazy this deletion mania went. Who's in charge? Who's making those decisions? Oh boy. So let's go back. Some ball honks. Go ahead in charge? Who's making those decisions? Oh, boy. The international board of Scrabble. Some ball honks.

Go ahead. Some dumb ball honks. Some privileged ball honks. Let's go back to how it all started. Scrabble's been played since the 30s and 40s, and at some point, someone said, hey, we need an official dictionary so we can have official games and a rating

and all these other things and have championships. So early on, they used Funk and Wagnalls, a once-honored dictionary, and then there were certain omissions, too many omissions of good words. So they then said, look, let's take any word that's in all five of these dictionaries, like Merriam-Webster's and some other collegiate dictionaries,

any word that's in all five has to be good. I think they later changed it to three out of the five. And that came, that turned into the first Scrabble Players Dictionary, the official Scrabble Players Dictionary, OSPD, and then later editions, OSPD 2 and 3 and so on. But then at some point in 93, I think, or somewhere in the early 90s, a woman was talking with her friends. There are different versions of the story, but basically it came down to this woman. I think her name was Judith Grad, a woman in Virginia. She was an art gallery owner, and she liked to play Scrabble, and so did some of her friends,

who said, did you know that the word Jew is playable in Scrabble? And she said, well, why would that be playable? It's uppercase. And we know that you're not allowed to include uppercase words. So, for example, a person's name, like Daniel, wouldn't be included because it's not a Scrabble word. Proper else. Now, a word like Dan could be because it's a martial arts term.

So a word that happens to be a term's a martial arts term so a word that that happens to be a term like john i'm going to the john no problem we don't write it with an uppercase j that's homonym yeah so well right has many different meanings and so if we say i'm going to the john it happens to be lowercase um so now we have a source for all these words and judith grad says hey wait a second jews in here, what does it mean? And it says, to bargain someone. A derogatory, right? So not only is it...

Why is that derogatory? Now, at this table, it's probably a jokey word. Like, we would all say, yeah, I Jewed him down. I wouldn't say that. You better not. So I could say it to Dan with a wink, like the same way that an African-American player might say the N-word and there would be camaraderie with that word. It wouldn't be saying something negative.

Whereas if I say or if you said to me, I drew them down, I'd think, wow, that probably fell flat. You know, you maybe shouldn't be saying that term. Do you know what that word means? Should I use it in my act? So that's the beginning of the expurgation. When this woman pointed that out or had to point out to her that Jew was playable, she then went to the dictionary and found a bunch of words that were equally offensive to her. She said, why do we have these offensive words in a dictionary of a game that can be played by children and families?

And she had a point. So what ended up happening was this overreaction. The pendulum swung very far over. And thanks to her letter writing campaign, they removed all these words. And then the Scrabble players rebelled and said, we don't want to use a dictionary then, because that doesn't represent our values, which are that letters coming together in a string don't have a meaning that's intended to make you feel good or bad, or they're just letters. They're just representing words. Nothing wrong with that.

So Scrabble players, for the most part, were against the deletion of these words. And so the Scrabble players, on behalf of the players, the president of the Scrabble Association said, okay, we have a compromise. We're going to have a second list. We're going to have the one that gets printed, the dictionary here, and we're going to have a list

that later got called as a joke, the poo list of all the words that had been taken out, but were still playable. So you didn't have them in school Scrabble, which makes some sense, I guess. And they weren't going to appear on the screen in a televised game, which every so often ESPN would have, like, you know, have a championship. You couldn't play those words in anything that was going to draw a lot of attention and a lot of negative attention. So they were still playable, but not under certain circumstances so so actually i didn't realize so no cap no words that demand capitalization are allowed in scrabble so how do the germans play scrabble yeah italian is not uh no no i mean i couldn't be played that joke fell

flat but uh let me explain it to you. In German, every noun is capitalized. Right, so I'm sure, I guess in German, if I play that, you don't have to capitalize in that particular case. I was obviously, in German,

there's some other rule, but I don't know if you knew that, Noam. I didn't know that. In German, every noun is capitalized. So Italian cannot be played, but French can

because you can French with a girl or a boy and that's okay. In French kiss, you can also French fry. Something has a different meaning. So it has a lowercase meaning. You can't French, French kiss, is it, French with a girl or a boy, and that's okay. You can French kiss. You can also French fry. Something has a different meaning. So it has a lowercase meaning. You can't French.

French kiss is an adjective. It's part of a phrase to French kiss. Well, you can say we were Frenching, or we can French some fries. Adverb. It's an adverb, French. We can also French some fries, though. So then it's used as a verb, and it can take Frenching. What's Italianing?

That's just yelling at someone? So then why can't you juju somebody? Any word, I mean, in common vernacular, any word can be used as an adjective. Or an adverb.

You know, like I could say, I know-em-ed them. That means I just harangued them with this. It is an adjective. If I kissed her Frenchly, it would be an adverb, right?

Right. It's a French kiss. Two French, but two French kiss, that's a compound verb. Well, two French kiss would be a compound, right.? It's a French kiss. But two French kiss, that's a compound verb. Well, two French kiss would be a compound. Right, but we can still distinguish it by saying, I Frenched these fries.

Now, I just want to just jump in really quickly and say, okay, this is an interesting discussion, but there's two ways we can go. We can discuss Scrabblemore or the life of a superfan. Well, I actually want you guys to do one fun thing. Oh, a game. Yeah, pass those down, please. Okay, well, we're having a game out of the way. Oh, a game. Yeah, pass those down, please. Okay, well, we're having a game.

Uh-oh, I don't like the way these look. Pass those down, please. Is this a parallel? So you want each to take one? Everybody gets one pile. One pile? We got a pile of words. Don't say the words.

Don't say the words. Each paper has two words on it. If you'll be so kind, I tried to put words that were kind of related, but one of them, and I didn't say it. Did you pick these words for me

or this is random? Randomly. Okay. They're actually alphabetized, so the one on the left is coming before... There's a piece of paper with two words, a word on the left and a word on the right, and we each have... I have four words, and on each sheet, one of the words is not permitted in Scrabble, and one of them is, and I think you might be surprised at which ones.

Okay. Well, this is... Whoever wants to take a turn, go ahead. We'll start with Catherine. Okay. But we're ladies first. This is like getting canceled roulette. There is that possibility.

Katie. So feel free to... What do you want, Katie? Feel free to... So the rules are Katie has to go through each pair of words and decide what she thinks. I'm pretty confident. I'm pretty confident. I think that...

Should she say with the two words? She should read both words, I guess. Oh, okay. That's okay. My words are o-fay, which I don't know what that means, and whitey spelled with an E-Y or whitey spelled W-H-I-T-Y. But I think the word that is included in the dictionary is o-fay, even though I'm not sure what that is.

Well, whitey obviously sounds like a negative word for a white person, but it has another definition which is silly, which is the adjective form of white, which no one has ever used. No one has ever said that wall is rather whitey. And yet that's okay because it has that other meaning. And ophé is another obscure word for a white person, and it doesn't even have a known etymology. So it's so old, we have no idea where it comes from,

and nobody uses it. And yet it was deleted from the dictionary. So she now goes to the next pair? If you wish or we can... Would I offend everyone by using that? So she got it right or wrong? She was wrong.

She guessed... I was wrong. We won't tell Mike. An obscure word. But thank you for playing. All right, Diane, you want to try? Well, should we just...

Or we can go through whichever you like. Well, this... Okay, I have two words, kike, which is a derogatory term for a Jew and Nazi. Kike means circle.

That's where it comes from, yeah. It does? The idea was that maybe some, it's possible that some of the early inhabitants came over and didn't know how to make their mark other than a circle or an X, and so that's where that term came from. They would do a circle at the asylum. What language is kike, a circle? It's in Yiddish, isn't it?

Yeah, I was going to say dramatic or... Yeah, it's related to the word for circle. Because Ku Klux Klan actually, I think, means family circle. And Ku Klux, there's some... I don't think that's from a language, though. Yeah, I think that might be Greek. Might be based on some Greek. Anyway, I'm going to say Nazi is the word that can be used.

Yeah. I think that's a fairly easy one. Nazi is playable in... It's a legitimate party. Right, and kajka cannot be played. Nazi has a. Yeah. I think that's a fairly easy one. Nazi is playable in... It's a legitimate party. Right, and I cannot be played. Nazi is a capital letter. I just asked you this. Somehow it got, in enough sources,

it's shown up with a lowercase letter, and so somehow it's been allowed. I can't say I've ever seen it lowercase, but apparently in some sources it was spelled with a lowercase. I've seen it lowercase on graffiti at synagogue. Oh, there you go. All right, So Dan got,

Dan, but hold on. I mean, I, I, obviously you're, you're not, you're not,

you're not making the rules. You're just reporting them, but the Nazi party, like the Democratic party, how could it, that would be uppercase, but all you can use a Nazi as a generic term.

I guess I get, I see. I see. Well, you want to, you want to take a communist. Yeah, that makes sense.

Okay. Okay. Right. I see. Ariel, you want to take that? Like a communist. Yeah, that makes sense. Okay, okay, right. I'm interested in how Dan got kike right out of the game. Yeah, it's very suspicious. Very suspicious, because if Katie had to say it, some of us might recoil. Okay, I have dyke and les, L-E-Z. So which one is permitted? Well, dyke as a derogatory word for lesbians is usually spelled D-Y-K-E, and this is spelled

D-I-K-E. I mentalist both spellings. So in either form, which one do you think would work? Well, the dyke, you put your finger in the dyke. Right. So Noam figured it out with you. I think you were going that way too, right? Or you stick your finger in the dyke. Right, right. That's what I meant.. I think you were going that way too, right? Or you stick your finger in the dike.

Right, right. That's what I meant. No, Perrielle has a... What are you talking about? All right, so you figured out correctly that that word has a... I could kill myself for helping her. I think she's about to get it wrong.

No, she didn't know what a dike was. Of course I did. What is it? It's the hole in the thing. What's a dike? She said water. The hole in the water comes out. There's like a hole someplace. There's not supposed to be a hole in a dike.

Right. A dike keeps the water out. I don't think I know what a dike is either. A dike keeps the water. A dike keeps the hole in the dam. No, the hole is not the dike. The dike is the little Dutch boy. Right, there we go.

Noam and I go back to the Dutch. Okay, so Les is not allowed? Les is more. Right. Okay, no more. I think that after this we should move on because this could take a while. No, no, this is good. Just have fun.

But I don't know how many you want to do. It's fun. I got two words and I'm having trouble. I got two words, faggot and Nancy. I said that a little too... Anyway. Now, I know that... You relished it.

Yeah, I didn't mean to. I know faggot is supposed to mean a bundle of sticks. Right. And I think that Nancy... I feel like that's also an adjective. I think I feel like that's an adjective, but just knowing... Oh, you've heard it in front of the word boy or something. Yeah.

Right. Yeah. Okay. They have a similar meaning, so one of them is permittable, and you can probably guess which one though. But is Nancy in front of a boy spelled with a Y? Because I would think just based on the fact that faggot is a bundle of sticks, that that ought to be allowable, except that maybe because it's so controversial, like the

word for stingy that you're not allowed to say anymore, which sounds like the N-word, maybe they just struck it from the... Right, but you got it right. Because it has that other definition, oddly enough, it's allowed in play, even though it's an extremely offensive word. That literally nobody uses with the other definition.

Right, unless you're in less... Unless you're talking about collecting a very small stick. Well, unless you sell in less like unless you're talking about collecting a very small stick. Well, unless you sell sticks for a living. I have heard on TV plenty of British shows where someone says, can you spare a fag? And they mean a cigarette. And not the longer word, and I never hear that

and you're right. So is fag allowed? Absolutely. Cigarette in England. They also say bugger, which you would think that's pretty offensive yeah why is that one permitted that's a good one

I forgot to include that on the list I mean doesn't that I don't want to say the meaning but I think it's pretty bad well yeah

it's pretty derogatory I think this is a fun game but I do have questions for Dave as a super fan well can I get

one here this one seems tough I have in front of me wrinkly as a super fan. Well, can I get one here? This one seems tough. I have in front of me Wrinkly. W-R-I-N-K-L-Y. That seems perfectly real. Which seems innocuous

and maybe it's supposed to be wrinkled and wrinkly is and then wrinkly is like something you'd say about like, but why can't it be

anyway? And Ho, H-O, is that how you spell like she's a hoe? H-O? That's H-O-E. That's H-O-E. H-O- like, she's a ho, H-O? Yes, yes. That's H-O-E.

That's H-O-E. H-O-E is something as a farming implement. Oh, you're right. Yeah. But the thing is, wrinkly sounds so innocuous. I would have to guess that wrinkly is the one in a lot of news. You're playing reverse. Is that a card?

You made a mistake. Oh, yeah. In fact, I brought that up as an example of a weird thing where in the plural, neither one of them is allowed. Not that you would normally pluralize wrinkly, but apparently it refers to someone, I guess, like me, who's old. If you're old enough, as you were saying, you could be wrinkly. And so wrinkly, I can say this is wrinkly paper, but I can't say look at those wrinklies. And ho has an acceptable definition, which is something you hear around Christmas time. It's an interjection, ho, ho, ho.

And as soon as you add an S to it, it becomes something that you hear in certain songs, and we can't allow that in Scrabble. So neither are allowed. Both of them are allowed. Both of them are allowed. In the singular, neither one is allowed. Neither are allowed in the plural. This is crazy.

It's arbitrary. Oh, and there's one fun one. I don't know how far you want to go with the game, and I'm happy to answer Dan's question. By the way, happy birthday. Thank you, David. And by the way, for my birthday, anybody listening, it is my birthday as we

record this October 20th in the year of the cock. Is when I was born. You can look up what, there's, well, every 12 years, the year of the cock. Buy my book as a birthday present for me. So if you want to buy me a birthday

present, buy the book, and then I'll get a little bit of money. And I read it, and I thought it was great. His book is great. Look through the sheets. We can't do them all, but anybody else? Boobies and poofs. Yeah, there you go with some plurals. Oh, I think it would be poofs, wouldn't it?

That's a derogatory. Boobie prize. Poof is slang for a gay person, I think. Right, but as the way, poof is a slang for a gay person, I think. Right, but as a singular, poof, it's just a sound.

A poof, or it's just something you sit on, too. An onomatopoeia. You know, I don't know why that didn't become

the definition. That should be, you're right, it should be completely permitted, and yet it can't be pluralized, but it can be

in the singular. She went up and poof, disappeared. Right, and the same, and then the other one you had was, oh,

boobies. Now, in the singular, it could be a same, and then the other one you had was, oh, boobies. Now, in the singular, it could be a bird. But as soon as you pluralize it, it can only refer, in that spelling, I guess, it only refers to the, no, no, I take it back. In the singular with an IE, that refers to a breast, and they took that out. It's such an innocuous word. It's a word that little children say. Wait, is tit allowed?

Yeah, it's also a kind of bird. A tit is a kind of? A tit bird, tit mouse. Tit mouse. It's a teat. What about tits? Well, because it's a pluralization of the thing that we just talked about, you can therefore use it. This could be a whole other game,

is guess the word that is allowed in Scrabble. Now we have yet another game. I just like the fact that there's a rogue faction of Scrabble players that are willing to risk it all and play the words that they want to play and be very offensive well look anybody can play

well they should form their own alt-right Scrabble if you and I played Scrabble we could say we're playing Renegade Scrabble whatever you want to say we're playing Renegade Scrabble

and we can use we could if I wanted to I could say Wrinklies and I could put that down if I was feeling so inclined and if I played in tournaments anymore I would actually say to my opponent, you're welcome to use any words that used to be allowed and were taken out,

as long as you're okay with my doing the same thing. Because I wouldn't want to feel like I was suddenly unable to play something that we both agree is a word. Or say like vanilla or hardcore Scrabble. What we say to our listeners is play Scrabble. We've always said this to our listeners. It's play the Scrabble you want. What we say to our listeners is play Scrabble as you, we've always said this to our listeners, is play the Scrabble you want to play. This is not tournament play and you do your thing. There's actually-

You want to play in a tournament, then you got to worry about it. My wife one time said to my father that she chewed somebody down. Really? Totally naively. Oh, wow. Anyway, I would- No concept that you weren't supposed to. She grew up so surrounded by that that she had no concept that chewing somebody down was something you weren't supposed to. No, she grew up so surrounded by that that she had no concept that chewing somebody down

was something you weren't supposed to say. Interesting. There was actually a suggestion, by the way, Dan, and you reminded me of this, by a person who was weighing in on both sides saying, what if we had tournaments where it said, play at your own risk, similar to what Noam has been saying

about swimming at your own risk here, right? You know when you go to a comedy show that you might hear things that are going to be offensive to certain people in the population, possibly even you, but you're also agreeing in advance that you know that that could happen. And his suggestion was,

why don't we just have a little disclaimer that says there might be words here that you're uncomfortable with, but swim at your own risk. People getting really wild in the Scrabble world. I am of the opinion, I've thought about this privately.

That's what I think about. I am of the opinion, I thought about this privately. I mean, that's what I think about. I am of the opinion that the idea that a word, hearing a word is actually seriously offensive to anybody, no matter what, I think that is a big lie. I don't think there is actually, I shouldn't say anybody, but I don't think, I actually, I shouldn't say anybody, but I don't think, I'd say one out of a million people who claim that they heard the word

and they can't tolerate hearing the word, one out of a million is telling the truth. I just think it is just totally bullshit that you can't hear a word which can be used offensively, but that you can't hear that word in a non-offensive way. And if you can't, then you are disabled as an adult.

Well, I don't know if that's true. I do think that the N-word, even if used non-offensively, and Marina Franklin, I think, we were having this discussion. Well, she's the one out of the million. I don't want to call her Maria Franklin. But I do. Out of a non-black mouth, even if used unoffensively, even if I said, well, I heard somebody say, and I used the word, and I was horrified by it, say that's what I said, but I used the word, I think people would be, yes, I think it would be upsetting to people. Because they've been trained at this point

to be offended by it. Well, that may be. When we were kids, you would hear it out of anybody's mouth all the time. But you said that it's bullshit, and I don't think with the N-word it is bullshit. I think people really are going to accept that. You have kids in college classes

where the professor will read James Baldwin out loud, and James Baldwin used the word. So they'll read it out loud, and James Baldwin used the word. So they'll read it out loud, and kids will be, I can't, this is violence. I think that's just a lie. You've got children, and I've done this already with my children.

What are you going to do with Mark Twain? Are you going to read to them? Well, I read my kids to kill a mockingbird, and I did not read the N-word. Well, you know, it's my book. To bring it back to my book, and then I do want to ask Dave about... See, that's not listening. I was in the middle of a story. You're know, it's my book. To bring it back to my book. And then I do want to ask Dave about. See, that's not listening.

I was in the middle of a story. You're right. That's not listening. That is not listening. That's correct. Well, because I've been trying to move things along. And, you know, and we have no. And to move things along, you saw an opportunity to talk about your book to move things along.

So go ahead. My book, very quickly, there's a character who uses the N-word. But I don't write the N-word. I write Nsterisk asterisk asterisk even though it's a black character i as a white writer chose made that decision i don't know how you feel about it i thought that was the right thing to do and i would have done exactly the same thing in your situation the book is iris before covid available available on amazon it is his birthday and it is so I, a plug, wouldn't be out of line. You should have been able to write it out with the A-H at the end, just like Quentin Tarantino does, just like in the Godfather.

Well, I was able. I just chose not to. I didn't think it was. I just chose. You have to do whatever you need to do to protect yourself from getting in trouble. How often do we get to have a super fan with us to answer all of our questions about how we can improve the comedy cellar? Oh, you've asked me this before,

Noah, I can't come up with anything other than that bathroom. What's wrong? You're in the bathroom here at the comedy cellar? It's like the soup Nazi, you know, where you have to walk in a certain way because there's no other way. The funny thing is that he asked you things we could improve and that's the one thing we actually can't improve because it's physically impossible.

It's physically impossible. No, no, but that's my joke. I know it's not to, you know, we all know that the bathrooms are a little bit of a challenge to use. Have you been to

the Fat Black rooms? Obviously, you've been to the Fat Black rooms. Oh, the bathroom's a little funny there, too. The bathroom's good. We renovated the bathroom. There's two rooms.

There's the Fat Black lounge and the Fat Black bar. Sure. You know, this is the second podcast this week I've heard talk about the Comedy Cellar bathroom. I listened to Coleman Hughes' podcast,

and he brought up the Comedy Cellar bathroom as an example to some philosopher. Sorry to go that way. I know you don't want to hear the whole story because we have to move things along, but if you listen to Coleman's most recent podcast, this Comedy Cellar bathroom and the difficulty of it challenges great intellectuals.

Why can't you make it bigger? It's fine if you're small. I have a great time in the bathroom. I just go right in. I don't mind it. You'll need a hook for handbags. I would never use it for number two. I love that Pariel said, I love that Pariel asked, why can't you make it bigger?

Well, you can. Can't you just knock down one of those walls a little bit? What do you think is behind that wall, Pariel? I don't know. Maybe the street or the end of our property? What is at the... No, because there are tables there. The key word is just.

Why don't you just? It's the beginning of so many arguments. Did you notice this at the end of the building? Do you notice it when buildings end? Speaking of bathrooms, the bathroom at the Village Underground is wonderful. Oh my goodness. There's a bathroom attendant there on

the weekends, and he has a bowl of candy. Not anymore. He didn't come back after COVID. No, but there was another guy with a bowl, but I'm just saying the candy is weak. You got mint Lifesavers. Come on, man. Can I tell you a funny

story about the bathroom? The bathroom in the Village Underground, when we first built it, we built it unisex. Because the bathrooms, there's individual rooms. There's individual rooms. So we built it as one big room with eight individual rooms, eight little bathrooms, and everybody would share the sink. Spent a lot of money. Building department came in and told us,

you're not allowed to have unisex bathrooms so we had to reconfigure the whole thing and separate it out so it was a and put a wall up and all kinds of stuff it was a beautiful bathroom and now only a few years later i believe you're not allowed to have single-sex bathrooms so now like it's just ridiculous. You are, but if somebody wants to use, if somebody says, I want to use the female bathroom, what are the criteria to allow that? If somebody says, I identify as a woman. But this is the key point, just for the listeners. It's not like a bathroom where you are peeing next to somebody in a urinal or anything like that.

It's like a bedroom. It is a door. Behind the door, you shut the door, and you are in your own room. It's a bedroom with a lot of toilets. It was the sharing of the sinks, which was the problem. You get that? It was the sharing of the sinks, which was the problem. A lot of places are like that now, though.

A lot of places. I have an issue, by the way, with regard to the bathroom at the Village Underground. I was in there. What can I tell you? I had maybe eaten too much hummus. Whatever it was, I was in there doing what I prefer not to do in a public bathroom. And I was in there for slightly longer than it normally would be. And the bathroom attendant or whatever, whoever the manager,

knocks on the door and says, hey, what are you, like, hey, man, I'm not going to identify the, actually, I don't know. I don't remember who it was, but somebody, some comedy seller employee

knocked on the door and said, hey, get out. What are you doing in there? It's like, I wasn't finished yet. You want me to talk to him? No, because I don't know who it is, but I mean, is that in line with comedy

seller policy? Do we interrupt a man when he's doing his business? Well, you could have been doing coke in there. I could have been, but it could have been at least a lighter is everything okay in there? You know, it would have been at least a better way of handling the situation. Are you sure it was even the bathroom attendant? It could have just been another person on the show.

It was a comedy seller employee, and I don't know who. I mean, he could have been saving somebody's life. He could have been assaulting somebody. You really shouldn't be doing that. And I'd prefer not to. Okay, he's got some more. No, no, wait, wait, wait.

Mr. Move-Things-Along. He's got more. Well, but I don't think we should talk about... The Scrabble is interesting. We broached the subject, And I thought it was interesting. He prepared. Let me see what he did. I understand that he prepared.

I prepared too. Let's just see what this is. I wrote out that whole... We have time. ...poo story. What is this? What is this? That's a list of words that are surprisingly allowed and words that are surprisingly unallowed.

Okay, let me read. Let's just read the words quickly. I would be careful. Let's just read the words quickly that are allowed. These are authorized words. You said them. I guess I've been overruled. Okay, let me read. Let's just read the words quickly. I would be careful. Let's just read the words quickly that are allowed. These are authorized words. You said them. I guess I've been overruled. On the left side? The left side will not be deleted. So we have words as relatively mild as ass and

arson, asshole. So those words are allowed. I don't know why asshole is allowed because they took out nookie, which is a pretty common... Nookie? Nookie means to get laid, or not to get laid, but to get a little action. I thought that's what it meant. Maybe it has a derogatory term towards a particular group of people,

but I wasn't aware. You can't say retarded. Now, that's an interesting thing. You can, because it has another meaning, like slowed down, right? So that was one of, one of you guys had that on your quiz.

It was me. Right, so that word was allowed, and yet, what was the other one on that side? Retardate. Right, I don't even know what that word means. I mean, I've heard, I can imagine it, but that word is not permitted.

I think a retardate is like a person who's... It's the same thing, right? But the particular word retarded has, like, I slow down, you know, or retarded. Like a music. Retarded your progress. Right, exactly. But you can say dotard, because that's what Kim Jong-il called Trump, right? So another fun one.

Octoroon, you can't say. That's on the list of words you can say. Oh, you can say. You can say pussy. It won't be deleted. Right, because it could be cat. Like a cat.

Right, because it has that meaning. So the same issue we had with other words that we've talked about. You can't say ballsy? You cannot say ballsy. Is it offensive terms? So strangely enough, right,

some of the words are so strange. Can't say fart? Right. Well, careful. No, no. That's a word that they took out of the dictionary, but allowed to be played still. So, in other words, it's not in here, but it's on the pool list, as they call it. It's allowed to be played, an official play, but not for the school version.

Right. You got it. But the word that, if it's a strikethrough word, then you can't play it under any circumstance. And that was where Nookie came in and another relatively inoffensive one that I moved over. By the way, yeah, feminazi is allowed. What's wrong with pissant? It was offensive, but they left it in, so that's a word that they kept in. Jism, you can use.

Now, are you allowed to say, are you allowed to- It says it right here on the list. It says offensive terms. Oh, no, it says expurgated. Now, why can you say- No, no, but it's only not in this dictionary, but it's on the pool list. Jism is on the pool list. It says offensive terms. Oh, no, it says expurgated. Why can you say... It's only not in this dictionary, but it's on the poo list. JISM is on the poo list.

JISM. Why can't you say... Why are you allowed to say JIP? I don't know. That seems like a huge oversight. I don't use that word anymore, and I haven't for a long time because I know it offends

a large group of people. So what do you say instead? Jew. Cheap. Hey! October 20th, Nicole. Mark it down. I think a big surprise was between the words red skin and red neck, which one was disallowed?

Red skin, I would think. Wouldn't that make sense? It's a type of peanut, so it stays in the dictionary. Oh, a red skin peanut. I want to meet these people. I mean, this is like so nonsensical. A nerd off. Twat.

Twat. Yeah, they can't. I don't know why they disallow that. It's a body part. It's not a slur. Oh, Nancy with an E at the end. I'm pretty good, actually, that I write Nancy Boy. Can we ask?

Yes, go ask. Oh, you're suitably impressed by that. Can we ask David Stone what he thinks about the fat black pussycat rooms as opposed to the Comedy Cellar original room and the Village Underground? I'll tell you an interesting thing that ties it all together

because... You can tie it all together, that's fine too. One of the things I loved about the... You can say what you want because I can always cut it out, but the thing is that it's so ballsy and Nancy-ish for Dan to ask you a question like that knowing that

you could say something really negative about the room and then it would go out on the air to comedy seller fans and do damage. But go ahead. Speak freely. Go ahead. I think you probably know that I love every aspect of the cellar. So when you guys... Well, first of all, when I came down here for the first time, it was like 2012. And I met Artie. And right away, we hit it off.

This is Lang, not Fuqua. No, Artie Fuqua. And he took me up to that cool area on the top, that little area in the top of the Fat Black. Oh, you don't want to take a black light up there. Go ahead. Okay. No, it was a beautiful moment. We hung out and talked about family. Which isn't allowed. Go ahead. don't want to take a black light up there go ahead okay no it was a beautiful moment we hung

out and talked about which is a lot right he had all right sorry to turn things down but he had just he had just lost his son so we were talking about family and children and i you know i i have children of my own and i just couldn't imagine what he was going through so we had this lovely talk that was so much deeper than anything i expected and that's where we became pretty fast friends and so then fast forward a couple years and Will Silvins has the idea to turn Fat Black into New Joke Night, right? And I thought that was such a brilliant idea

because I go to the cellar week after week, sometimes several times in a night, and I hear the best of it, but I wonder where are they working on this? I want to hear the stuff that's in progress because I'm looking at the comedy as a true art form and one of the most difficult ones because it's something you can't practice at home. So you can only do it as, you know, a person in front of an audience truly. And where were we

ever going to get to see that? And there it was at the Fat Black. So that was really cool. And so I love that space. It's different. Obviously, it's like at the time I went, it was all couches and it had sort of an odd configuration. And I'd always try to sit in the front row or nearby. I love that space. It's not the physically most configuration, and I would always try to sit in the front row or nearby. I love that space. It's not the physically most comfortable, but I don't think it has to be. I think it's just a great space, and it works.

But the bar is really good, in my opinion. So here's an interesting thing about that new joke night. So there have been comics, white comics, who have tried out jokes that had the N-word in them. And I thought, oh, that's really interesting. Because then I saw those same jokes around the corner, and they had taken out that word. It just didn't work.

I think they figured out, I don't really, it's not right. I'm getting people to focus on the wrong thing. It's ruining the joke more than it's adding to the joke. Oh, you can't say the N-word anymore. No, but this is just a few years ago. Yeah, but no, things were very fatty. It's so supercharged. I had a joke in my act probably over 20 years ago with the N-word, and I did it I think twice and then just said,

I'm never saying that word ever again on stage. Right. And then even jokes that make fun of people who happen to be black, even if it's something that we can relate to in one way or another. So one of my favorite comics is Phil Hanley, and he had a joke that involved pornography, and he took out the idea that the people involved were black because it wasn't necessary for the joke,

and it could maybe hurt some people's feelings, and he changed it. It was an interesting progression. Do you know which joke I'm referring to? No, I don't know that. I mean, maybe if you named it, I would know. I don't know if I can even go into specifics. I'm certainly not going to ruin Phil's joke.

I think that's the case with a lot of things though like I had a joke that had the word like was about that I said the word rape and like you could just see that everybody just like tensed up and then Lenny Marcus told me that I should try

doing the same exact joke and just change the word rape to sexual assault. Right, right. I heard you talk about that. And that worked, right? It did. Word choice is so,

it's such like a game of, you know, switching things in and out and seeing what works and what doesn't and trial and error. But it's crazy just for like one minor change. Well, I think, no, Lynn Cobblers has a joke. It's more than a joke. It's an entire series of jokes.

It's a chunk. It's a chunk. It's a chunk. It's what we call a chunk in comedy. And it is her, I mean, I don't know if she still uses it as a closer. Yeah, just a couple of scenes. But it annihilates,

and the whole thing is about rape. But it's because she's a woman, and she's turning it around, and she's really hammering the point home, which is that she's raping the rapist. And, of course, that means that she's taking power from someone. But the point is, rape is not a no-go word necessarily. Yeah, that's true. That chunk is brilliant.

I've seen her do that. Whereas the N-word for a non-black person is, I think, more or less a no-go word. Are you still allowed to use, say, chunk in Scrabble? Because that's a derogatory term for a fat Chinese person, I thought. Yeah, both. Right. Is that true? I don't know if you want to keep that in there.

It's a joke. I know. There's no word. As far as I know, there's no word for a Chinese person that has been taken out because they all have some other... You guys didn't give me enough credit for that. That was clever. No, that was great. But as long as it has another meaning,

that's officially allowed. I don't know. This whole thing seems very fishy to me. What whole thing? The way that they're making up these rules of what's okay... Again, this is official Scrabble rules. Anybody playing at home is welcome to play by the rules that they want to play by.

Right, sure. The problem is that I can understand in school Scrabble how it might make some parents upset. I never played Scrabble in school. It's a new thing. They're trying to make it more popular. Like school chess has been popular. That's a big chess program. There are a lot of people who play in...

People don't want their nerdy kids running around saying fart, trying to make friends with the cool kids. Do you live near the cellar that you come here so often? Near enough, up to my side, but it's just straight shot on the sea. They actually took out for a while the word pee. And when I say take out, they put it on the Poo list, meaning it wasn't in school Scrabble. On the P list. P is on the Poo list. Exactly.

And Poo is on the Poo list. I think they later put it back in as a variant of the spelling of the letter P-E-E. But you couldn't put a D on it because then it was the verb peed or ing. So there's all these obscure words. My opinion is they might as well just not do it and say what we talked about before, you know, swim at your own risk.

And then maybe make certain alterations for things that are going to be televised because it could violate FCC standards or people's good taste or whatever. And it's tricky, but I think it was handled better. Forget about the FCC. I'll see it on streaming and get the good stuff. Can you say blowjob? Yes. Only, again, not in school scrabble, but yes, in the official, you know. Why?

What's the other meaning for blowjob? No other meaning. It's on the pool list. It's not a derogatory term, right? So it's not offending someone in the same way that Ofe, theoretically, would be offending some ancient white person. Can you say quiff? I think so.

That's a medical term. I think that's... Say that to your doctor. He is looking up... You know what? It's not going to be in here because this is the... Non-Poulos.

Yeah, exactly. Is there a Poulos dictionary? Yeah, it was hard to get a hold of. I had to ask a friend who still plays in the Scrabble, you know, in the club that I used to go to here in the city.

Get in a brown paper book cover. No, but is there like an actual... This is the Poulos book? Yeah. I've got... I think there's another copy. Okay. Noam but there's like an actual... This is the Poulos? Yeah. I think there's another copy. Okay. Noam, you can look at this. Is this a single page? Why does it feel thick? I just happen to find it. You're printing on cardstock?

It's coffee fee. Oh, coffee fee. I don't think they allowed that one yet. These are the words no longer approved. Will cause challenge plays to be ruled invalid. Abo, abos, blackamore, blackamores, botches. B-O-C-H-E, bosh. A bosh.

That's French for the Germans, what the French used to call Germans during the war. It's a putting together of cabbage head. Bogtrotter. I didn't know that. Bogtrotter is an ancient one for an Irish person. Puntang. Oh, I'm offended. Cockteaser.

What's wrong? Why can't you say blowjob but not cockteaser? Go figure. Why can't you say poontang? Again, that's a real mistake because that's a body part, and I don't think that could be offensive as a slur. So it violates their own rules, and it's kind of inconsistent, along with nookie.

Colored. Coloreds. You can say color, but not coloreds. Right, I colored in the page, but you can't stick an S on it because then you're definitely referring to a group of people in a derogatory way. No cunt, no cunts. No dago, no dagos. Faggier.

But again, you just said a word that is A, a very common word in England when you're talking to your mates, and B, a body part. So that should be permitted, and they took it out anyway. Can't say heebs. Look, we have to underline that the Scrabble, these are, there's a man-made list, and so there's going to be things that you, you know, that you may not agree with.

You can't say mulatto. Right, but you can say octoroon, which I thought was a related kind of word. But mulatto... But you can, octoroon, which I thought was a related kind of word. But mulatto— But you can, however, say mulatto. Mulatto was—I guess has become a negative word, a derogatory word, but I didn't know that. Yeah, I didn't know it was like— But it came from a derogatory place, and I think eventually people realized, oh, that's like mule?

Like, that's not a positive thing to say. So I can understand why they took it out. But you can say half-breed. Well, you can say it, but it's not a positive thing to say. So I can understand why they took it out. But you can say half-breed. Well, you can say it, but it's not permitted in Scrabble. It's not permitted? I don't see it on the list here. It would have to be hyphenated.

That's why. What about Milano? The cookie? The cookie, yeah. I think you'd have to capitalize. Peckerwood. Yeah, Milano. I didn't realize

that came from a bad place. It was people playing it like... Yeah, I heard that years ago, and I finally realized, oh my God, I could never say that again. I've heard black people describe people as mulatto. They didn't... I mean, I think it's something...

I think it goes back to your generation. Like, we're old enough to have heard that in the same way that your wife said Jude, thinking it was just a normal way of saying to bargain, and didn't realize it had a negative connotation for a lot of people. But this is also interesting that... Ignorance of the law. If a word, which was always innocuous, bargain and didn't realize it had a negative connotation for a lot of people. But this is also interesting that if

a word which was always innocuous takes on an offensive connotation, we will respect that and strike it. As long as it doesn't have an oculus meaning, right? What's oculus? I'm making it up.

So as long as it doesn't have a mild meaning, like red skin, the peanut. But if we find a word which is currently I'm making it up. Opposite of innocuous. So as long as it doesn't have a milder meaning. Wait, let me finish. However. Skin the peanut. But if we find a word which is currently totally innocuous and somebody uncovers the fact that 200 years ago its derivation was something offensive. That's ophé. We can't tolerate it. Right. We have to all learn the fact that this was once.

It's such bullshit. It draws attention to words that no one ever thought about, like buckra and ofe and these other words that you're like, what does that even mean? And they have to go look it up where, not in the Scrabble dictionary. And those are, again, obscure terms for a white person in it. And again, it's not that I don't respect the idea of trying to be respectful to people.

It's just that I just think it's such a lie. I just think that the notion that grownups can't handle a word. So you know what? That word originally was offensive hundreds of years ago. Oh, okay, that's interesting. But it's not anymore. No, we can't handle that. We can't comprehend that.

We treat ourselves like we're just, I don't know what the word is. Like just, what's the word? You're a Scrabble guy. What's the word I'm looking for? Dangerous. No, I think the opposite. I think you're treating ourselves as if we're made out of paraffin or something. Like we're just, you know, onion skin that we that college professors have to give before they do something that we would think of as pretty mild or fair game or whatever from the past. Now it's all trigger warnings. So I think we've become a very sensitive society. And by the way, it's not worldwide. England didn't go this way at all. They rebelled and said, no, we're absolutely not changing our dictionary.

And the vote that they took there was pronounced favor of keeping the dictionary as is, whereas here it was more like 50-50. And there's a lot of Yiddish words on this list. You're talking about shiksa, goy. They have their own version. So are there a lot of scrabble refugees living in it? There are some, yeah. Yeah, there's a decent number.

Yeah, all the Yiddish words are taken out like goy. It seems like a pretty mild word, and shiksa is... I find that offensive. Yeah, I'm sure you do. So, yeah, they took those out. Well, the ironic thing is that they were Yiddish words, so they had to bring them in at one time. They weren't English,

so it had to require the exception to bring them in, and then they had to usher them right back out. Is that correct? Correct? We are up. Noam, I don't know how much more time you want to do we're good I think about an hour twenty I do want to give

Katie Hannigan an opportunity to plug whatever she has coming up if anything I do you know what I'm actually going to be releasing my own podcast with a fellow comedian Sarah Talamash and I will be releasing our first podcast it's called Lady Journey

and Sarah Talamash is also in a comic comic relationship. She is married to Joe List. Yes. And we'll be talking about we'll be dishing and we'll be going on journeys together. And we will be talking about organizing. And our first episode is coming out on Halloween. So Lady Journey, please, please find it. I know I don't want to point out the fact that you're not Jewish. But do you think releasing a podcast on Halloween is actually not a day that people are doing other things on Halloween?

I know. But it's a brunch. It's a brunch podcast. Bad business sense. It's for middle-aged women. And Halloween is not a big holiday for us. Middle-aged women? They have kids. Oh, have a little Halloween brunch.

Middle-aged? How old are you? I'm 35. That's not middle-aged. Okay, well, that's the age range. Once you get to 30, it's Halloween. If I went out with a 35-year-old woman, people would say she was too young for me. So that can't be middle-aged.

Well, how old are you? You have to do the formula. Maybe you're old. 59. Maybe you're old. So you have to the formula. 59. Maybe you're old. So you have to divide it. Divide by two and add seven. Yeah, and I can't really do the math on an odd number like that.

I mean, make him 60 and then be 30. 27. So you're 27. It's close. Look, he did that math so fast. Yeah, you would be old enough for me. Not that I would, I'm just saying. Well, thank you.

He creeped me out. I know what he meant. I'll be writing the Scrabble board about that one. Dave, if you're a lover of great literature, and I know you said you enjoyed my book. I did. Although, who knows? You know, you might be just saying that. No, I loved it.

It was objectively a fantastic book. Dan, I was imagining it as a movie the entire time I read it, and I was loving it. It was so detailed. Yeah, some movie substitutions. You really felt like you were living it. Absolutely. I read it in a day the entire time I read it. I'm looking forward to being picked up by some movie subscribers. You really felt like you were living it. Absolutely. I read it in a day and a half. I couldn't put it down. I felt the same way. Although I did put it down, but then I picked it back up. Iris Spiro, Before COVID,

available on Amazon. Periel also has books. What's happening with the audiobook? How come you did not have an audiobook? We'll get to the audio. What's happening with the live podcast question and answer for his book? Remember, you said you were going to make an exception to your live podcast. Can you guys just do it without me? I am too stage fright to go on stage and do a live podcast.

He doesn't want to do it. We'll discuss it later. Perry L. also has books available on Amazon. The Only Bush I Trust is my own and on my knees. Both memoirs available on Amazon. The Only Bush I Trust is my own and On My Knees, both memoirs available on Amazon. Perelash and Brand. I also want to say that it's also my father's birthday today. Oh, okay. What do you think about

that? And I believe it is Joey Cole, I believe, another comedian, also his birthday today. Probably others as well. I'd say Super Bitch. And on that note. the comedian also his birthday today probably others as well it's a great say super bitch and on that note is there anything david you would like to say or promote or i'll promote my own birthday which is on the day that we were going to release or you are going to release your

podcast on halloween all halloween well happy birthday to you. You can enjoy my podcast, Lady Journey. That's what I'll be doing. Great. And by the way, Noam, we interviewed, when should we put up the Rick Wakeman episode? Because... I'm trying to get another musician. I want to cut it together.

I'm going to cut in some sound clips of Rick Wakeman. I'm going to try to really make it interesting. Because I did say in the episode that he'll be at City Winery October 25th, so whatever. Did you guys miss me? How was it without me? It was kind of good.

It was very, I mean, music nerds will enjoy the episode. It was very, very. I'm going to make it more interesting. I'm going to spruce it up. So it wasn't that interesting without me. No, it was, but I just, he referred to things that a lot of people wouldn't understand, but I can fix that. Do you know who Rick Wakeman is, David?

No, I don't. He was in Yes, the band Yes, and he also did a lot of solo work. He played piano or keyboard for David Bowie, Space Oddity, and also Morning Has Broken, Cat Stevens. He was the keyboardist for that. He wore a cape. He was a big

rock star. Did you ask him about the cape? No, I don't know anything about the cape. Anyhow, podcast at ComedySeller.com for comments, suggestions. Do you want to hear more Scrabble talk? If so, let us know. What do you think about the pool list? Questions, comments of any kind.

Have you read On My Knees? Do you have thoughts about that? Email us. We want to hear from you. And we will see you or speak to you or you'll hear from us next time on Live from the Table. Thank you.