The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - The Captain and Tanael

Episode Date: October 16, 2021

TJ is a standup comedian born and raised in Haiti, currently based in New York City. He started performing standup in 2012 and quickly became a rising star in the NY scene due to his caustic wit, fearless approach, and conversational delivery. He's a regular in all New York comedy venues, including the world famous Comedy Cellar. His debut special January 3rd is available on Amazon Prime.

🎵 This is Live from the Table, the official podcast of New York's world-famous comedy cellar, coming at you on Sirius XM 99. And on the Laugh Button Podcast Network, Dan Natterman here with Perry L. Ashenbrand, the producer and on-air personality. Things sort of just evolved that way. It wasn't the intention at the outset, but that's how it is. We also have Noam Dorman, owner of the world the world famous comedy cellar and mandolinist extraordinary

you might have heard a few a little strumming there that he was doing for us we also have a comedy a relatively new comedy cellar uh regular comedian named well his name is tanel joaquin i believe that's right but everybody's calls him tj because it's easier and he was born and raised in haiti started performing stand stand up in 2012 and has quickly gained a lot of attention. He's a regular in all the New York comedy venues. And his debut special comes out January 3rd on Amazon Prime. What's that called? It's called January 3rd. Actually, it's already out there. That's the title. The title is January. Oh, it's debut special. January 3rd is available on it. That misread that. OK, well, we'll probably want to ask you why you named it that.

I guess there's a reason. And of course, not of course, but like almost every comic, he has a podcast. It's called Raw Beef with Sean Patton and Wilfred Padua. You are right the first time, of course. Yeah, of course. Every podcast. So welcome, TJ, to our program. I believe you're making your debut here with us. Yes. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. And why do you call your special January 3rd? There must be a story that that was that's the day I was born.

And I got to tape it on January 3rd, 2020 before the world shut down. Wow. Oh, OK. So you tape your special on your birthday. That's interesting. And yeah, that was nice. And you're a young man. I guess you're in your twenties or thirties, early thirties. Early thirties. Well, you're very lucky. I'm jealous of anybody that I had my chance and I blew it. How old are you, Dan? I'm 51 years young, but I'll be. Oh, you look great. Well, thank you. That's what people say.

And they can't all be lying. So I'll assume it's true. No, I'm how are you tonight? You seem a little off. Well, you know, we had we had that we had a kind of tragedy here. So, you know, an old member of a commissary committed suicide. No, I thought you were aware. Well, I have been made aware. So you're asking just so I would say that? No, I said I have been made aware as you had mentioned. Yeah. I'm sorry to hear that, obviously.

Did that bring the show down? Probably. No, I don't think so. I think it's important to talk about that sort of thing. Yeah. I think it's, we talk about this a lot on my podcast. Actually, I had a suicide episode recently. Yeah, I mean, I think that taking the stigma away from suicide

is really an important thing to talk about. What's the stigma? I think that, you know, people are always shocked when people kill themselves. And I think that people probably think about killing themselves a lot more than they let on, but you're not really supposed to talk about it. And if you're allowed to talk about it more, maybe it would be easier for those people to get help. You don't just kill yourself the first time you think about killing yourself is what I'm saying.

Right. It's like if you kill yourself, it's something that like you've been thinking about for a long time or you've thought about many times. And does the other stigma that it's selfish for somebody to kill themselves? And I don't think that's true at all. Yeah, I think that you have to be in unspeakable amount of pain. That's right. And it probably takes a lot of fucking balls to go through it. To call it selfish basically means you made it about you.

Yeah. The person who's alive. Right. Which is insanity. Why would you do that? I think that most people who kill themselves think that the world would be and the people that they love would be better off without that person, which is on some level. Yeah, I think that's people who murder. No, I listen. I have a lot, unfortunately, of people throughout the course of my life who, you know, were very close to me and family members who have done that.

So, you know, I'm, it's, you know, it's, it's really, really heartbreaking. And I don't know, I was, you know, I met your friend for the first time, you know, just a couple of months ago, you plopped me down at a table with several people and then disappeared as you are want to do and so i wound up you know really talking to him for i don't know two three hours and he was um now i understand go ahead go ahead sorry no he was just so dynamic and smart and funny and you know I mean he was drinking a lot um but he was really really happy to see you yeah well this was I mean I I don't know I don't know if I want to talk about it, but I say this, that I guess I, so this was a guy who was, I want to make this interesting to listeners,

but this was a guy who was extremely, extremely, extremely, extremely special guy, kind of just one of these guys who could hang with any group of people. He was a fantastic athlete. He was Manhattan darts champion, but he was also wouldn't call him an intellectual darts champion, but he was also, um, wouldn't call him an intellectual, but he, but he had an intellectual spirit. You know, uh, he, he, you could, he was interested in ideas and things like that. And, um, so he could basically hang out with any, and he was extremely funny.

He was a real queen bee. People used to flock to him. He could hang out with anybody. And then my father, no, I wasn't a musician, but he, but he had a very sophisticated uh musical ear he knew like he knew like underground hip-hop and he also knew brazilian music and he turned me on to gil scott heron in the 90s and um but he also you know like the beatles like he he was he was he was black Puerto Rican. So he also knew a lot of salsa music, but he was, he was very, very, very, very unusual guy. And my father loved him. And we were very, very, very close,

like every day hanging out close for many years. And then he had like a mental breakdown and he, he was acting crazy, a manic depression. And apparently he had this, it breakdown and he he was acting crazy a manic depression and apparently he had this is a common pattern he'd had this when he was like 18 and then it went away this is a common thing for people with manic depression apparently they they have an incident and then it it goes into remission as it were for many years and then can come back again as you approach your 30s or something so that was the pattern he had and um so then it's worse each time right the episode usually progressively gets no i don't i don't think he got worse and worse i think he got actually milder but anyway so without going into

the the the very upsetting and maybe too personal circumstances around the suicide. I just want to say that, you know, if you remember, I had another friend who died Glenn Miller, who was on this podcast. And he, at the time of COVID, he was blind and had HIV was a real cheerful podcast. He was blind and had HIV and I was on dialysis and he could not get through to get vaccinated. Remember, he couldn't find any phone number was busy signals. And he was both he was he was blind, incapacitated and high risk.

You know, so he was exactly the kind of person that you would think the government would prioritize itself to help first sick, disabled, elderly. These are the people you would think the bureaucracy would, would make job one, but they don't. And so, you know, I had to get him vaccinated. He ended up dying of something that wasn't related to COVID. But similarly in this situation, my friend who just committed suicide, he had an incident and the people who were there begged him, his family begged the cops. I believe this is true. Begged the cops to take him to a mental hospital. And they didn't. They took him to a regular processing and order protection and blah, blah, blah. And he wound up, you know, it's set across, set in motion some dominoes, which I truly think if led to his death. And once again, it just brings out to me. Now, this issue has been touched on many times since um you know the uh george

floyd and the issue of um people with mental issues and how the cops handle them and this is a very deep issue and in this situation you know they didn't and he had a he had a history like they could look it up they could have known he had but they didn't take him to a mental hospital and um and so the the result of that was that he ended up with an order of protection and couldn't go home um and this led to his i can't talk about it i just can't talk about it well um to switch gears to something a little less heavy i asked i signed uh the documentary on caitlin jenner on netflix, I didn't get a chance to watch it. I didn't get a chance to watch it.

Well, I would just say that I recommend it highly. It's very interesting. And I'm not a sports fan, but I love a good sports drama. And it gets into Bruce's winning the gold medal in Montreal, which was fascinating. What year was that? That was in 1976. Oh, wow.

You know, it was a big moment in sports when he won the. Well, apparently he had his period. So it was really amazing that he was able to. I'm not allowed to make a joke like that. OK, I'm not sure we'll find out. By the way, I'm not dead naming because Caitlin refers to him as Bruce. Right. At the end of the documentary, he says, no, that was Bruce that won that medal.

So I don't know that every trans person feels that way. Yeah, I mean, at some point in history, there was a man named Bruce. That man is no longer there. But, you know, I don't think that's dead naming to say that. Well, I think according to some, that might be or some trans people don't even want to acknowledge that their former identity that's right existed and and some i guess do and some would refer to bruce as a he and some as a she but caitlin seems to be saying it was a he his name was bruce he won wanted gold medal in 76 so so you know i've had

i have three friends of various uh um levels of friendship but one of them extremely close who became trans and um the other two i only knew uh but they were already uh transitioned and then um i met some other people peripherally through my friend who became, but anyway, that what I found from talking to them is that they're not that sensitive about these things. That's, that's been over and over. They're like, no, we understand that people close to us have trouble remembering and it's awkward. This is one of these things, which, you know, the squeaky wheel gets the grease or squeaky will gets attention but i think that in reality i mean anything if you do it with a with a disrespect that speaks for itself but i

don't but other but other than that i don't think people are i i suspect that the trans community is not up in arms about like if you refer to bruce jenner as bruce jenner because i understand you're trying to describe bruce jenner you know you're saying it's like latinx yes yes i guess yeah it's one of these things which which no real people real people don't use it but you have to say white people say latinx and like anybody who's it's young white liberals use that yeah yeah yeah right yeah, yeah. No matter Hispanic person who refers to themselves that way. Have you ever seen a trans or known a trans person or known of a trans person that seemed less,

say, a trans woman that seemed less feminine in their male incarnation than Bruce Jenner? No, my friend, he's been on his podcast i said my friend michael who who transitioned was didn't have a feminine uh bone in his almost not a feminine bone in his body he was a dancer but but you know that's not feminine well but uh no i mean he was banging women three at a time. I mean, this guy is a real man. I think he was like Fredo. I think that the point is, is that there needs to be a distinction made between, you know, people sometimes accidentally misgendering people and just blatant disregard for respect.

Yeah, wouldn't knowam said that fairly explicitly. But wait a second. But the other part of that is in some cases, it's actually very dangerous to misgender somebody. And you put people's lives at risk. Why is it dangerous? Because if you are in a place that's conservative, it can get you killed. I mean, there's... You're passing as a cisgender...

100%. I mean, in fact, there are documented cases of that happening in places like Alabama, and I mean, all you have to do is look it up. You're not... You mean like if somebody told me good job, it's not too Germany.

Yes. It's like, but I suspect that that's not that regular a story perry all, but all right. I'm just saying, I think like we shouldn't be cavalier and I'm not saying you are being at all. No, I'm just saying in general. I think that most trans people, people are aware that they're trans. And if you're passing is not trans,

I mean, why would you even stay in? So why would you stay in some KKK neighborhood if you know that your secret can get you killed? Like, why would you even stay there? It just seems like you're talking about very few people. But all right.

What was the Hilary Swank movie, Boys Don't Cry? That's the one, yeah. Yeah, I don't think I've seen that one. I mean, that's a true story. Yeah, well, as I was saying, like a true story. It's about a woman that became a man, and then when they found out she was a woman, in some small town in the South, I guess it was, and then when they found out that she was a man and then when they found out she was a woman in some small town in the in the south i

guess it was and then when they found out that she was a man they i think they were sorry a woman became a man when they found out she was a woman i mean he was a woman or he was born a woman they raped and killed him and yeah so this is a true story and and it's i just saying is that it's dangerous to assume too much from a single story to think that this is a widespread thing and also attitudes have changed quite a lot on top of that so well anyway you know on where you are yeah well anyway in any case everybody knows caitlin's story so there's no risk of revealing secrets there so what was so compelling about this document well two aspects were compelling number one the transition of of of bruce jenner to caitlin i'm getting a little

crackly on my sound and nicole i don't know this okay it's okay um but also i found the best part was the sports part the spot the part about this athlete who got 10th place at the Munich games in 72. And he, she talks about how she was watching the medal ceremony in 72. And the Russian guy who won the decathlon that year was getting the gold medal around his neck. And Bruce at the time said, that's what I want.

And that's what I'm going to get. And set and set a course toward that end and single-mindedly pursued gold in the decathlon got the gold became probably the most famous athlete in America at that time I mean I even know you know for me to know an athlete means that athlete is pretty damn famous because I don't pay me they're either famous or they're Jewish well if they're Jewish they Well, if they're Jewish, they're probably famous for being Jewish. We know.

Mark Spitz. How many famous Jewish athletes are there? Well, that's the point, TJ. Nicole, turn him up a little bit. I can't hear him. Yeah, there's Mark Spitz. There's Sandy Koufax. Who's Sandy Koufax? That's a baseball player from back in the day.

One of the greatest baseball players of all time. Are there any famous Jewish athletes now? Julian Edelman is about an eighth Jewish, but that's as good as we're going to get, so we've got to go with him. We've got to pin all our hopes on Julian. Not in the NBA? In the NBA?

Yeah. I don't think so, but I think there used to be back in the days when it was white people in the nba yeah i i don't think so but i i think there used to be back in the in the days when it was white people in the nba why why is it that nobody assumes discrimination when there's no jews athletes like what why why is like jews and why is jews in sports the one thing that people say well i guess those people just don't want to be athletes. Like in any, in any other context, you take, they say that, or do they say they're not good at it? Or do they say both?

Or what is it not good at? But any other context, you take a score and then you say, oh, there's something, there's something going on here. This is fishy. We know this is, this is a, this is, this is obvious discrimination. Like why are they not, why are they not more women firefighters? Oh, that's discrimination. That must be discrimination. But why are there not more women firefighters? Oh, that's discrimination. That must be discrimination.

But why are there not more Jewish firefighters? He was like, of course there's not Jewish firefighters. As you know, they pick and choose what they want to assume. Anyway. Well, in any case, just getting back to the documentary. So that's what I thought was the best. But then it got to the transition and the reality show and all that, which was interesting,

but not as interesting to me as just the raw drama of the 76 Olympics. And that was, that was, that was 72. It was when the, the, the Jewish athletes were killed. Right. They didn't go into that. They just talked about the decathlon that year. We can turn anything Jewish on this podcast. All three of you Jewish? We happen to be, yes. And so I always say when Periel asks me,

who should we book? I say any Gentile available. Because enough is enough. That's true. So you were born in Haiti? I was born and raised in Haiti. Yeah, I came over here in 2008. Under what circumstances did you come in

under dire circumstances or. No, I'm fairly lucky. I came with a student visa. Yeah, I came here to go to, you know, college. I went to school in Long Island and I spent two years. Then I realized it was kind of a waste of time and I dropped out and become a comedian.

So your parents are still back in Haiti? They are. Are you one of the upper class Haitians? Not upper but I would say I was lucky in my neighborhood. I was the kid where my parents got lucky enough that other kids would come to my house

to eat if there was no food at their house. So we did okay. Weren't upper class but weren't poor the term middle class doesn't even really exist in haiti but we did okay yeah so your family is still there but things are very things are very tough over there now right yeah it's it's pretty insane it's been like a crazy just couple of months because you have the the president's murder followed by the storm season then you have an earthquake and then there's been this whole thing happening in texas with the migrants who

got some crazy information that because there's there's a whole group of haitians who left after the 2010 earthquake and they went to south america chile uh venezuela a bunch of countries and apparently someone told them that the u.s was actually giving papers to any haitians who got in so they all got on this great migration and traveled across south america and got to the texas border and they got there they realized it wasn't true oh so now biden is sending a lot of them back. It's horrible. Yeah, it's pretty, it's a weird thing to have to live with. And just because that's your people. So it's a sense of shame all the time.

It's very strange. What is, growing up in Haiti, obviously a lot of Haitians want to come to the United States, but what was the opinion of the United States among the Haitians? Was it, America's great? We love America. We can't wait to go. Or America's imperialist. You know,

what, what was the sense growing up? Mostly the great part. Yeah. Cause you know, a lot of us have cousins who came earlier. So they, you know,

they would come every, every couple of years or so. So we would see how they live. You'd see that their success stories. So it's always this dream that a lot of us have to come to the U.S. And when you see something like Haitians being sent back at the border, does that, what is that, does that affect your opinion of the United States? Or do you just say, well, you know, they have an immigration policy and they're following it? Or how do you see it?

It's a little bit of both. Yeah. Because obviously, if you take 10,000 people and just put them in this country, what's going to happen to them? So a country has laws, but there's also the complicated subject of Haiti is partly the way it is because of America. So it's like, is there a duty on the American side to sort of help Haitians because Haiti isn't the state it is because of what America did? There's a lot of stuff that goes with Haiti was taken over by the U.S. for 19 years, 1915 to 1934. And then during the 90s with Clinton, there was a lot of stuff that went wrong where they really basically dropped chemical stuff in the uncertain beaches in Haiti that really set us back. There's just a lot of history there as to why it is the way it is. And it's very tricky to say, well, America owes us to take those people. I don't know if that's something I would say, but it's very complicated.

I think it's a totally reasonable thing to say. And I also think that. What it's 10,000 people, you know, it's not like it's a million people. And like, obviously, they were given information. They didn't just fucking show up here. Right. And I just think as a human rights issue, it's actually really. And the point a lot of people were making is America is taking a bunch of Afghans.

Of course. From what has recently happened. So why not do the same with Haitians? Of course. Yeah. And just like a moral, ethical obligation. Also, the way it was done was just so disgusting. Yeah.

The optics were horrible. Well, they were on horseback. I know that that was the whips. I mean, what the fuck was that? Oh, well, Perry, I mean, listen. Yes, no. I know. Listen, just to preface it by if the United States

wants to bring in 10,000 Haitians for humanitarian reasons, I'm totally fine with that. Being fine with that is not the same thing as saying that the United States has an obligation to do so. If people show up at the border from South America on some sort of incorrect rumor that they can come in, I mean, that's not, that doesn't create a moral obligation in the United States to

set policy. They can go back. They're not coming from Haiti. They're coming from South America. It's not like they're coming from an earthquake. They're coming from Venezuela. These countries are second world countries. They had a life there.

Complete shackles. Wherever they come from. What I'm saying is they're not coming from a disaster area. They're coming from South America. Yeah, it's between Chile and Brazil. Chile and Brazil. So, I mean, you know, and there is the, you know, precedent that gets set. That if, you know, you just show up and now we have to

come in. I mean, we have to, we have to at some point reckon with the fact that there's probably, and I'm not even exaggerating, a billion people in, you know, uncomfortable situations around the world who would get a ticket tomorrow if we told them they could come into the United States. It's just, you know, there has to be rules, you know. Listen, I would. In other words, if it was 10,000 people who showed up from an earthquake in Haiti, I would find that a human rights a lot. I find it a lot more of a human rights issue there. 10,000 people who show up from a country like Brazil or, you know,

what was the other country you said? Chile. Chile. I said, we'll go back to Chile. chile like you know it's like you're not here's what's wrong with chile see going back to chile or brazil is somewhat acceptable i think the the mistake they made was they took them back to haiti which is a place where a lot of them haven't been for 11 years oh that i can't were they not authorized to go back to were they illegally or undocumented in Chile and Brazil? Or were they allowed to live in those countries? No, the majority of them were documented

and they were living there. I guess it's this mindset that America is better. So if we get a chance to come to America, we'll come to America. And the last thing, as far as horseback is concerned, there was this awful misinformation that people were being whipped. And, you know, that was that what they had was retracted. But sure, the rumor still persists. But I don't know.

Was that retracted? I mean, I saw videos and pictures of it. No, you did not. You did not see a video or picture of anybody being whipped. Come on now. I did. What are you talking about? It was all over the news. You need, it was all, it was not, it was, it never happened. Nobody was whipped. Are you saying that there were not, there was nobody on

horseback with whips? That's what you're saying? It might have been, they had whatever reins for the horses. Nobody was whipped, but they were on horseback. And I don't know. I understand there's a look to that, but I don't know what the alternative is in terms of practical reality, in terms of being able to do that job. Well, and if it's in rugged terrain.

Yeah. You have to be above people. We have horses. We have cops on horseback in New York city for a reason there for a different reason, but that's a different animal rights conversation. That's not what I'm talking about. But I'm saying that there is a practical reason that cops are on horseback.

And I mean, you know, you're going to always take the side of humanitarian. Yes, I am. No, it's not, it's not, it's not a's not it's not a humanitarian side to somebody's humanitarian side that somebody's on a horseback no that you don't take 10 000 people and send them back to haiti and handle the situation the way it was handled it was horrible all right all right i like the diversity of opinion on this podcast well that's the point of this podcast and no one is never unlike me Noam is never afraid to say

what he means. Well, listen, I said again, I would take the... I'm not saying I don't want the Haitians to come in. God forbid, I'm not saying that at all. But I'm saying that I'm saying that, A, I mean, you're coming perilously close to

saying that Haitians, by definition, are in perilous circumstances. And I want to remind again that the story is these were Haitians coming from Chile, not from the disaster in Haiti. That got sent back to the disaster in Haiti. Well, I don't know why they're sent back. From there, they should go back to Chile. But it's being conflated as if. So what's your issue?

That we didn't let them in or that we sent them back to Haiti? Both. Well, OK, let's sent them back to Haiti? Both. Well, OK, let's take them one at a time then. OK, let me say if they came here from Canada, how do you think it would have been handled? Not 10,000 people. 10,000 people can come in from Canada. If 10,000 Canadians landed. But my dear friend Graham Kay got tossed out.

Not take 10,000 Canadians. Did he really? He came back eventually. I love him. I think he asked me to write some note like we really need him here or something like that. Did you? Does he have a green card now?

Is he safe? I think he's authorized to be here. Okay. Yeah yeah i got my green card in 2019 and the weight that that got off my shoulders just having that and just feeling less of a oh something might happen i can't do what i want to get a green card did you need what did you need to uh show did you need to show that that you bring something to the table that we can't yeah there's this thing called alien of extraordinary ability that's yeah to show that you bring something to the table that we can't show here? Yeah, there's this thing called Alien of Extraordinary Ability. That's it.

I showed how you're performing everywhere, and it cost a whole lot of money. It was a whole thing. But yeah, it was like five, six years of anguish, because I had to transfer from a student visa to a TPS, which is Temporary Protective Status. And from that, just gradually go to green card. Apparently, we took a lot of people from planet. We took a lot of people from Krypton on that visa.

I have an accent because I'm from a different place. That's how accents work. It's very interesting when you have an accent because you get to find out who's an idiot when you talk to people. You do. This girl came up to me recently. She goes, you have a bit of an accent. Where are you from? I said, I'm from Haiti.

I'm Haitian. She goes, oh, my God. That is, like, so cute. I've never been to Africa before. I was offended for a second. How the hell do you not know that Haiti is in Brooklyn? How is that even a question? I thought everybody knew.

I go by TJ sometimes because I have a really difficult and ethnic name to pronounce, so I use my initials TJ. But my real name is Thomas Jefferson, so I use that to make it easy for people, you know? I don't look like a Thomas Jefferson. I don't. Maybe one of his kids, but not him. You know what I mean?

This joke is how I find out who went to college in the audience. I have a thing with names. I like people's names. Because you meet somebody, they tell you their name, it's supposed to match the person. Sometimes I meet people and the name doesn't match. Recently I met an old guy, 97 years old, really old, almost dead at this point. This 97-year-old guy, you know what his name was? Kevin.

It's fucking weird. You can't be Kevin at 97. Nobody's going to sit by a fire listening to the wisdom of Kevin. Kevin doesn't know shit. He's trying to be a DJ. He owns a hoverboard. He owns a t-shirt with a picture of a cat. That's his crushing pussy.

That's the kind of guy Kevin is. You can't trust Kevin. That's also true for women. I've never met a beautiful young little girl named Gladys. I've never seen that. You know why? Because Gladys is a grown woman who's been through some grown woman shit. Gladys is friends with Courtney and Ashley.

Those are 90s babies. You know who Gladys is friends with? Gertrude and Eunice. Those are Gladys is friends with Courtney and Ashley. Those are 90s babies. You know who Gladys is friends with? Gertrude and Eunice. Those are Gladys' friends. She doesn't know Halle Berry. She knows Harriet Tubman. Now, is there stand-up in Haiti? Like, do you perform?

Did you ever perform? Now, that's an interesting question. I mean, Perial is generally not authorized to change subjects but i will give you that that is an interesting question stand up in haiti yes yes there is it's fairly new uh i performed there in 2018 in creole in haitian creole and english wow yeah it was was a little weird because it's so new that people don't know what to do with it. We have comedy, but it's very much farcical, just sketch and people dressing up as other people to make fun of it. But just a guy with a microphone talking, it's somewhat new. So you have to sort of hold the audience's hands and be like, this is what this is and all of it.

That was a festival. So you just did the festival in Port-au-Prince? In Port-au-Prince, yeah. I know JetBlue goes to Port-au-Prince. We were talking about that before the show. JetBlue goes, Delta goes, American Airlines goes. Wow, that's a lot of it. There was a festival. So you just did the festival in Port-au-Prince? In Port-au-Prince, yeah. I know JetBlue goes to Port-au-Prince. We were talking about that before the show. JetBlue goes, Delta goes, American Airlines goes. Wow, that's a lot of service to JetBlue. So, apparently, from what Will has told me,

Will Silvins is a household name in Haiti. Is that correct? Will Silvins wasn't even born in Haiti. No, but he has the accent. He has an accent. It's not Haitian, right? Yeah, Will has a speech impediment. It's a speech impediment that he has. Yeah, for years I thought it was a

Haitian accent. Will is giving us a bad name. He's a sweet guy, but sometimes I'm like, what's going on, Will? I played one night with Wycliffe at the Village Underground. I played guitar. What did you play? Were you guys on stage together playing music? On stage together, yeah. I was supporting Wycliffe at the Village Underground. I played guitar. What did you play? Were you guys on stage together playing music?

On stage together, yeah. I was supporting Wycliffe for a few songs. But that was before he, didn't he have some controversy? He ran for president of Haiti and then he got caught with money or something? What happened with Wycliffe? Yeah, he went for president, but he wasn't, at the end, he wasn't qualified because the constitution says you have to be a haitian citizen and you have to have lived in the country for five years prior to

the election is that the law they're planning on following over there in terms of political stuff they've been trying to hold on to they've been trying to change it aren't they like murdering people like left and right over there yeah it's pretty crazy but wyclef is also one of those success stories because he came here in well i don't remember the year but it was nine years old he came from a very poor part of haiti his dad was a pastor and he was sort of he just migrated to jersey and then he always knew how to play music from his dad's church and that turned into the wyclef from the fujis that we now know by the way if haitians can't get into america it doesn't quebec have a fairly liberal policy with regard to haitian immigrants there's a pretty nice uh sizable

haitian population in in canada in montreal for the most part but ontario and ottawa there's still a couple haitians there too because i know that because of the association with the French language, the Quebecers, I think, were encouraging, in fact. But I guess it's farther. I guess it's chilly. Yeah, it's very cold. There's a lot of adjustments you got to make. That's why, like, you'll notice the Haitians that are in Canada

are generally upper-class Haitians because they were able to travel to Canada as opposed to Haitians who might have illegally got to Miami oh wow because that's just the proximity of it you know if you don't have papers you're not gonna swim all the way to Montreal that's insanity so I by the way I was in Haiti a couple of times. You know, I mean, when I used to do cruise ships, Royal Caribbean Cruise Line actually basically owns a part of Haiti. There's like a part of Haiti called Labadi.

It's one of the most beautiful beaches that we have in the north, yeah. But if you're Haitian, you can't go there. Yeah. They walled it off. It's like, I mean, you can work there. It's like a little thing for tourists. It's like an enclave that I think Royal Caribbean literally owns it. That is so insane. And you dock there.

Ariel cracks me up. Go ahead, Dan. It's enraging. The most beautiful beach in Haiti and you can't go. The Haitians can't go there. Can they go there? Why don't you ask the Haitians if they're happy to have all the money that comes in from the Royal Caribbean cruise line that wouldn't come in if they didn't have access to that beach? Why don't you ask the Haitians if they're happy to have all the money that comes in from the Royal Caribbean cruise line that wouldn't come in if they didn't have access to that beach?

Why don't you ask them? Why can't the Haitians use it also? Some Haitians use it. I think they wall it off from like poor people. But middle class and upper class Haitians. I went, they didn't see Haitian one. See, Perrieau refuses to acknowledge hard difficult truths like for instance if you have a whole bunch of people coming from a cruise line number one they provide a tremendous amount of

money to an economy that has many doesn't have many things to make money from number one number two when you start allowing uh poor people this is harsh but it's true then you have all the crime and security problems that go with that on a beach filled with rich tourists so this is a this is harsh, but it's true. Then you have all the crime and security problems that go with that on a beach filled with rich tourists. So this is a this is a difficult logistical problem. And you can shake your head and roll your eyes about it. But the fact is, in real life, what would happen is they would find a different the cruise line would find a different beach and Haiti would be out the money. I am not disputing that that is a reality. My issue is with the solution. I don't think walling it off.

What's your solution? Horseback, what's your solution? Listen, the thing is that poverty is a terrible, terrible thing in the world. And there's no easy answers to this stuff. And everything seems harsh when you, any decision you make. But the fact is that these are very, very difficult things to do.

But I have a question. So Dominican Republic, which shares the island of Hispaniola, is a more successful, has a higher standard of living as a country. What would happen if 10,000 Haitians showed up in the Dominican Republic? Can they go there? There's a lot of Haitian

immigrants there, but yeah, there's a decent amount where we've always been fighting over that Haitians will cross the border to go to the Dominican Republic. I don't think they would allow 10,000 Haitians in though. Yeah. It's ironic because I have a friend, a close friend who's Dominican and he's always like, you know, lambasting America because America is not taking enough millions of immigrants. We have millions and millions. Right. And I'm like, well, what about you taking some Haitians in the Dominican Republic?

He's got a million answers for me about that, you know? You're talking about Franco Murillo? Yeah, yeah. Only America is supposed to take, you know, everybody. Everybody. And God bless you, you know, America's benefited from immigration, no doubt. I'm just, I'm not saying America

shouldn't take immigrants, but everything has a limit, you know? What are we going to do? We're having problems. Authorization to ask TJ one more question. Sure. Authorization granted. Thank you. What do your parents and your family think about being a comedian? And do you get to do you go back there a lot? And, you know, like what's their impression of all of this? What's your first guess?

Well, I would imagine they first of all, I'd be interested in what they do. I'm going to make a guess if I can guess. Haitians, like pretty much any immigrant population, even though your parents are still in Haiti, but they want the kid to be a doctor. They want their kid to be an educated member of the professional class, not a clown. Yeah. Immigrant parents are also hacky because they all want

the same thing. No diversity of opinion. That's just what seems reasonable and expected. It's just what they want. It's safe. They want to brag to their neighbors

about having a clown. But if you become famous, they're going to be like, look, my son, you famous. That's a terrible Haitian accent. Not a Haitian accent. I don't know what. I don't know what that was.

But yeah, they don't like it. They don't like it? No, not at all. My mom is the worst about that. She really hates it. I went home and I did five shows and, you know, they tried to get her to come and she refused to come. Yeah. She's a pretty awful person.

That's horrible. Do you really think of your mother as an awful person? Yeah, well, it's just something I had to come to terms with. It's a very weird thing to say that your mom is not a great person because your mom is just, we have somewhat of a matriarchal society in Haiti. You got to reveal your mother. And I had to talk a lot with therapists with accepting that fact that my mom is so have you seen the sopranos no yes my mom is livia soprano basically oh my god that's a good tv

show to pitch by the way you talk about you talk about that haitian sopranos yeah that would be fun i actually have not haitianos, but in my computer, I have a treatment for a TV show that's something similar to that because there's so much stuff that goes on in Haiti. It's amazing. But I think that any immigrant sort of family would relate to that. Now that brings up an interesting point because now diversity in programming is, I'm not going to say it's the golden age because I don't know what tomorrow is going to bring.

Yeah. But right now we have, well, first of all, we were talking about it before the show. The Squid Games is a Korean show that's become the most popular show on Netflix or is about to be. Yeah. All kinds of shows, you know, Ali Wong had her, is becoming, you know, a big, or has become a big thing. Everything, you know, then there's our friend Gina Yashira's show. Yes. Bob Hart's Abishola on ABC.

The point is, it's diversity is in. You're diverse. Where's your show? Or have you been approached? Or is there anything? Well, I have a couple of things that I've been working on. The whole diversity is in thing. Some of it sometimes feels like a masquerade.

You know what I mean? It's just like I don't want forced diversity. I don't want you to just put a black person in a thing just to have a black person in the thing. Because then it becomes worse because then you're going to write these people based on what you think they should be as opposed to actually letting these people write what they want and you know i like diversity of thought a lot more than i like force racial and ethnic diversity because it's not genuine that's just not how people are because like every show. You see a show where everybody's friendship circle is diverse and you're thinking to yourself,

wait a minute, white people don't hang around with this many black people. Exactly. Like if you look at the Golden Girls, that's a show, a lot of people love it because every culture has that group of women in it. So it's a show about a bunch of white women, but it's actually a very diverse show

because I know a lot of Haitian women who love that show. i know a lot of haitian women who love that i know a lot of black american women for sure for sure because that's now if you just force it and just put a bunch of black women in there just for the sake of diversity the show wouldn't be the same because now you're focusing on the wrong it's like skin dip diversity it's not real but but we bought 22, as in the case with as in the Squid Games has shown us is that white people in America are not against watching Asians, a bunch of Asians, and probably wouldn't be against watching a show that focused on Haitian culture. That's right. People love good entertainment. I think, OK, does does this thing where people are tribal in nature? Yes, they want to see themselves. But I also think people will get out of that if they see themselves in other people. Like I watched The Sopranos and I told her of Livia. I'm like, oh, that's my mom. I never thought, oh, that's a white Italian woman.

Oh, that's exactly. I've seen a lot of shows with black women, black mothers. None of them were my mother. Livia Soprano was my mother. So that tells you a little bit about what the idea of diversity we're trying to promote. I think we go about it the wrong way because it's kind of, it's a little bit

bullshit. Did you hear, this is related, did you hear about this woman on ESPN who got suspended for making some remarks? A black woman on ESPN. Is it Rachel Nichols?

It might have been her. Carrie Champion. Oh, Carrie Champion got suspended. I love that. She's so cute. I mean, I can play it. Carrie Champion is what? I'm not familiar with Carrie.

She's on ESPN. She's a sports commentator. Yeah. And she's a black woman. Yeah. She's gorgeous. And she's great at her job. I don't want to appear sexist, Ariel. I'm just Oh, no. You're entitled to be

attracted to a woman. I like the idea that nobody would be offended by that but me. The men don't give a shit if you're being sexist. Oh, yeah. They all love it, too. Hold on. I can share it and play it. Hold on don't give a shit if you're being sexist. Oh, yeah. They all love it, too. Hold on. I can share it and play it. Hold on. Hold on a second.

Hold on. Remember how to do this. We advanced share sound optimized for video clip. Nicole is the share screen thing on multiple. No, no, I got I got I got it.

I don't know if you do. I do. Okay. You can see that, right? Yep. We got it. And I'll play it, and you're going to hear it. And it didn't work. What happened? Your porn is coming up.

Oh, shit. Is it really? That was weird that it did it. I'll try it again. Attractive woman? Yeah. She looks like Leanne Lord. Who's a con? We have to sit through the CNN commercial now.

Let me mute it for the commercial. I was going to play it and you can tell me what you think about this. I thought she got a total bum rap here. She seemed like she was just speaking her mind, and she got suspended. IMDb original series? IMDb now has programming? How is it that I don't have any?

I mean, there's so many TV shows. You'd think I could get a job. You can't get a gig at IMDb, Dan? Okay, here it comes. I hear that, right? Here we got it. They IMDB, Dan? Okay, here it comes. Up on Leverage Redemption. Hear that, right? All seasons of Leverage. Here we got it. They were wondering, they're like, why is it so important to you to say that you're biracial?

I'm like, I, because my mom's white, she's Irish-Italian, and my dad's black. And I'm like, why, why not? Like, I actually feel like I have the best of both worlds. Barack Obama chose black and he's biracial. I'm like, well, congratulations to the president. That's his thing. I'm like, well, congratulations to the president. That's his thing. I think that's fascinating considering his black dad was nowhere to be found, but his white mom and grandma raised him.

But hey, you do you. I'm going to do me. Joining us now to talk about this is Carrie Champion. She got suspended for this. Wait, Carrie Champion was not suspended. That girl was suspended. The girl who said she was going to be biracial. Yes. Oh, yeah, I'm sorry.

Whatever her name is. I'm sorry. I just read it. Which is the one that TJ wants to have sex with? Carrie Champion. But she's also very pretty. I would have sex with both of them. The other one that looked like Leanne Lord. At the same time. Also, Sage Steele is her name. Sage.

And what does she do for a living? She has CNN broadcast. She's an ESPN anchor. OK, OK. Page Steel, which does sound like a porn star to me. Age or Sage. Sage Sage Steel. That's what I saw. Sage Steel. I just sort of hold it.

So she got suspended or fired because she said she's biracial as opposed to just saying she said, because she said that about what the press, the president had, I guess they took it out because she said, well, what's up? Because she made a remark about Barack Obama's father not being there. Like she was. I mean, it's just crazy for them all to that. But she was saying Obama is also biracial, but he chose black. That's what she said. Yeah, she's saying what's

the matter, Perrielle? No, no, I was just going to go ahead. So she's saying, in my opinion, she was saying that she was pointing out that it's interesting that he chose to to in her opinion that he chose to embrace the black side of him, even though it was the white

side of him that raised him. Now it's... Ah, I see. But then she said, you do you, which is kind of obnoxious. His black father wasn't there. But what this woman afterwards, Carrie Champion, says is that, well, she's making an anti-black remark about the black dads or whatever is not being there.

But either way, she's she's she's biracial. She's speaking her mind. And this is crazy that people are getting suspended for it. Now, I'll tell you this. No Jew would get suspended for saying things that other Jews didn't like. Like if somebody went up there like Seth Rogen said, you know, I don't understand this Israel thing and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He got a lot of hot water for that.

People criticize him, but nobody said he should get fired. Like, like, it's just it's if I mean, I'm I just think that this is just wrong. And I and I I'm not black, obviously, but I can just imagine that if I were black, I might be like, why are they treating us like children? Like, why can't like, I don't have to agree with every single thing that every black person says. No. And what if it was a white person that said Barack Obama's father was nowhere to be found? Why is he identifying as black? Well, I'd be, listen, I'm okay with anybody saying whatever they want to say, really. But I would, if a white person said that it would have the additional baggage of being presumptuous. And, you know, I get that that would be a dicier issue. But she's actually talking about her own life experiences as a biracial woman.

And she's sharing with us what she feels, you know, about. And so what do you think, TJ? I think part of the problem we have now is social media and just this culture of presenting who we are as opposed to being who we are. It's created a lot of fake people. So whenever somebody actually speaks an opinion, that's how they really feel. Then we get terrified by that and we just go quickly to fire. I'm completely against firing someone for an opinion you can fire people for crimes or for hurting other people's

livelihoods but you cannot just get rid of somebody for saying something that they feel that doesn't hurt a group of people just the notion that somehow black people are offended by this so much so that ESPN has to get put this woman out of a job because of an innocuous statement that she made. That's just sort of infantilizing black people in a weird way. That's what it's doing. I agree with you. I'm happy you said it because I just on a human level, that's just what it seems to me like. And and and the fact that they don't treat other groups this way is part of that picture, because it's true. They don't treat Jews that way. Well, do they treat Asians that way? Because Jews are considered white.

No Asian is going to get fired for saying something controversial about Asians. It's all it's it's crazy what's going on. This poor woman, she's black or she's half black you know and i mean she gets i mean she's not fired she's suspended i suspect to give her her job back i they probably overshot but just just this this go-to thing now of firing or suspension it's too much it's i if i were to suspend her it would just be for using the obnoxious overused phrase. You do you. You know, it's right up there. It's right up there with full stop in terms of just phrases I don't need to hear again.

What about but I'll tell you something interesting or conflate. Can I tell you something? This is interesting. I use I use conflate today, but I use it properly. It's seldom I use it because it was exactly the right word at the right time. So my stepson, Nicholas is, is mixed race. And no, but this is interesting. He always had a resentment towards Barack Obama too. I never understood.

No. And I'm thinking maybe that's part of it. I don't know. Like he never really expressed to me what it was. And I used to get upset when he would criticize Obama because I knew that people would assume that he was getting it from me. So I was like, shut up about that Obama stuff. But I mean, like he never heard me saying bad things about Obama around the house. It was and he would say, you know, he's he's why does he say he's black? So maybe that's a somewhat common reaction that other mixed race people might have about. I don't think that's what it is. I think that Nicholas has a fraught relationship with his own father who's black and you're really the one who raised him. So he identifies you really as his father. But that's her point. What?

That was her point. But I'm saying, I think that that's why I think that the Nicholas's beef is specific. Well, when people see Barack Obama, they see a black man, you know, generally speaking.

So I think that this woman looks like a black woman to me. You know, the average person would look at this woman and say, oh, that's a black woman. Yeah. And it's a very tricky thing, because I think some of it might have come from slavery. The notion that no matter how little or how much blackness you have in you, you are a black person. But if you half white and half black, I don't think there's anything wrong with saying you biracial because you're from two very different races and possibly two very different cultures. Yeah, or it's just like how you feel too, right?

Like sometimes you identify more with one thing than you do with the other. Absolutely. Do you know, TJ, a slightly odd topic? Can I just answer that question? I think the right answer is this. When you are biracial, you are both. Half and half is a weird way to put it. She is a black woman. She is also an Italian woman. She is both. And she has every right to identify with all the black culture that she wants, as well as all the Italian culture that she wants. Just like my kids who are half, you know, they're well, they're half Jewish and then half Puerto Rican and half Indian.

But let's just presume for a second they were half totally half Puerto Rican. They can be totally Jewish and totally Puerto Rican. Right. Why? Why don't they don't have to choose? Yeah, they can embrace both fully. Yeah, but go on birthright and get a free trip. But the black thing, of course, when you are a group which is historically discriminated against, and when the world views you that way, first of all, it's natural for you, I think, to cling to that closer because that's the way the world treats you, as it were. I put that in quotes, treats you. But nevertheless, if your mother or your father, whoever it is, is Italian and you love your father and you grew up there and you

enjoyed that part of your culture, why would you want to be pressured to pretend you're not that you are that? Right. Yeah. So this is all silly. She should be able to say whatever she wants. I was going to ask a question because I know very little about Haiti, to be honest with you. But do you know your ancestry? I mean, African-Americans often been cut off from their ancestry and don't really know it. I was wondering if if Haitians who are off from their ancestry and don't really know it. I was wondering if if Haitians who are also African descended. Yeah. Do you know where you come from? You know, all those generations. I actually got curious about that two years ago when I did 23andMe.

And, you know, not surprisingly, I'm West African, like most Haitians, and I'm 34 percent Nigerian, 20 percent Congolese. And then there's Senegambian, which is a combination of Senegal and Gambia. There's a whole lot of stuff there, but it's just, it wasn't very like, Oh, that's cool. But it was just like, Oh, you know how many generations you go back in Haiti and when they came or do you have any of that? I think that told me that the last living West African ancestor I had was from 1870.

Wow. Yeah. But Haitians were brought for the first time. West Africans were brought to Haiti in 1503. So it's very far removed. But what was impressive was when I sent it in and they sent me the DNA stuff, they somehow knew that I had very recent Caribbean ancestry because none of that information is given. It's just a spit that you put in a tube and you send it away.

And they gave me all the African stuff. And then they made sure to say, this is where in Haiti you have your most recent ancestry. And it was very, very, like, accurate to, like, to the T. Like, they have a little map and they show you this darker area is where your ancestor might have been. And it's actually the area where I'm from. By the way, TJ, when you did the 23 to me, when you did the 23 and me, you didn't make the same mistake I did. Did you? You spit in the tube, right? Because I know like men don't like to read directions. That's all I said.

You would think that I've told this before. You would think the obvious, but you're not supposed to send them the obvious. They don't want that DNA. Is there a native population in Haiti, like of Amerindians? No. And I talk about this a lot. It's something that I wish we had. Who was there when the French and the Africans? There were a little population of Native Americans

sort of called Ayoaks and Tainos. And they were similar to like the Ancas in Peru and like the Aztecs in Mexico. Sort of very similar culture of Native Americans, but you know, a different twist on it. But when Christopher Columbus and his people came,

they kind of decimated all of it. So there's nothing left. Yeah, we don't have any of that, unfortunately. It's very sad. But it might be that you have some of that in you. Possibly. That may be how they figured out that you're from, or maybe they just, they compare you to the other people

that they know are from Haiti. Yes. I don't know how they do that. I don't know how they do that. Yeah. All right, well, TJ. I guess a little less interesting than I do No, I find it very interesting

I think that We're out of time I'm looking forward to seeing TJ on stage Oh, you haven't seen it? Well, we're not quite out of time We have a few minutes Okay, go ahead How long have you been here at the Cellar? I got passed officially on July 3rd

Yeah, it's been a few months Were recommended by yes i was recommended by uh will the haitian og will sylvans uh sean pine janelle james and emma willman yeah we don't i mean recommendations like it that janelle is really funny how that doesn't really have any weight right no i mean recommendations just mean esty will take a look at your tape right. That doesn't really have any weight, right? No, I mean, recommendation just mean Esty will take a look at your tape. Right. But it doesn't have any additional weight than that. Yeah, if I went in bum,

I don't think Esty would be like, oh, but... Yeah, but Emma liked him. Yeah, so... I think you still have to prove it, so... No, but there is this awkward thing when somebody like famous, famous recommends somebody and they suck.

That's a dicey situation. How do you deal with that? Does that really happen very often, though? Not often, but it happens. In the end, we don't use them. Yeah. Sometimes I'm sure it's done like I owe this person a debt.

So what if Ray Romano and he would never do it? This is just a hypothetical said. Hey, no, I'd really appreciate it if you used I mean, if you use this guy like, you know, I consider it a personal favor if you use him every week, every weekend on every show. We'd have to do it. Yeah. So you wouldn't be like Robert De Niro in Casino where you said he's you know, with that old cowboy said, made Rob Robert De Niro hire his nephew or something.

I can't do it. You know, I just you know, these are my nightmare scenarios. I hope it never happens. Yeah, Ray wouldn't be just to be clear, Ray Romano would never do anything to put you in an awkward situation. But I'm just using that name and throwing it out there. Who's the most likely famous person to do that? Let's build it. Who would do it?

Well, no one's not going to say. None of them. None of them. None of them. The famous people, at least to the extent that I know of them, are tremendously deferential to us and what we need to run our business. None of them have ever, ever thrown any weight around in any way whatsoever. It's funny we're talking about this because just today I discovered, you know, Facebook, they don't throw away any messages. Would you exchange messages?

Although I usually delete them because I'm sort of obsessive compulsive. But somehow I saved a message I stumbled on from Whitney Cummings from 2008 asking me to recommend her to Esty. Oh, wow. So I thought it was an interesting bit of... Did you do it? I probably did.

Was it 2008? It was 2008. She said, can you recommend me to Esty? And I probably did. You don't know because you deleted the message. No, I deleted the response. You text him and he deletes it. Drake, did you get my text?

But this was a Facebook message. And I think that keeps it, even if you delete it, it comes back. You can't really delete a Facebook message permanently. But I'm sure I did because my policy is to is to when anybody says recommend me to Esty, I recommended to Esty and then let Esty deal with it. OK, Dan, you forgot a very important talking point with all due respect to your policy about not letting me pick subjects. But if I pick the subject, then yeah, that's obviously not the same thing.

I emailed everybody about doing a live podcast. I can't do that. For Dan's book. You can do it. I get too much stage fright. You'll be okay. You're on stage every Monday playing music. It's different.

Well, he knows what he's doing when he's playing. Well, he knows what he's doing when he's playing. Well, he knows what he's doing when he's talking about your book too. Noam is highly opposed to doing it live. If we can, we'll work on him a little bit more, but then we have to let it, at some point we have to respect his wishes and let it slide,

but we'll work on him a little bit more. Can I do it by Zoom? Can I do it live via Zoom? Well, no, because then I'm going to be on stage with him alone. And you've read the book and you love it. Read the book. Well, read my book and then I'll read your book.

I've written two fucking books. Nobody here has read them. Yeah, that's disrespect. That's sexism. It's totally sexist. Well, maybe Hatem would like to do it because Hatem was going to do something with me anyway. And. Ariel, you're refusing to read Dan's book? No, of course not.

I'm going to read it. But I do think that there's a little bit of a double standard. I mean, you've never said to Dan, Dan, are you not reading Periel's book? Look at him. Are both your books autobiographies? No, Periel's book's a memoir, so it is autobiographical. Mine is a novel with autobiographical elements to it.

Oh, nice. Is it funny? I'm sure. Well, I think so. I think it's funny, but it's also poignant, bittersweet, profound. Wow. It's got everything in there. You know, there's even a little bit of sci-fi in there.

You're a good salesman of yourself. It's great. I actually started reading it and it's really wonderful. I won't read Cariel's book, but the thing is, if you wrote the book since... Don't read them. I don't care, but don't give me shit about not reading something else. I don't care. You just do a good impression of someone

who does care. But anyway, if you had written a book, you know, contemporaneous with this podcast, I think I would read it. Some book that you wrote 10 years about President Bush. I mean, that was my first book. My second book is not about Bush and neither is my first book, by the way. And then I know people have read it and read them and they're very explicit. And I don't want I don't want to I don't want to picture you, you know, with a penis in your mouth. And I just don't mind.

Do you have a book, Noam? Are you the only one in this room without a book? Yes. I don't have a book. Well, do you have a book, TJ? No. There's probably one. And you probably could get a book deal, by the way.

Phil Hanley just got one. I actually talked to an agent about a book, yeah. Noam should write a book. Noam should write a book. What, a novel? No. You should write a book. No one should write a book. What a novel? No, you should write a book just like about, you know, call it like racialized America and one of those books like that's going to get you on TV.

You should write like a political, you know, like how you are. And you could you could do it could be tales from the comedy cellar. No, he doesn't. He doesn't want to write that. But Fred Kaplan could get you in touch with his agent. I bet you could get it could be tells from the comedy seller. He doesn't want to write that. But OK, Fred Kaplan could get you in touch with his agent. I bet you could get a book deal. I I'm less and less interested in politics. I find myself I'm barely reading it. I'm barely

keeping up. But like I know there's this there's this and that story about this woman or disappeared or is murdered or something. That's a hot story. I have no idea how to cut it. Dan was obsessed with this story. It was an interesting story. Yeah, I haven't really paid attention over to find out.

The boyfriend did it. I think there's still well, it's very likely that he did, but I don't know if they found him yet. He may be dead. I suspect he's dead. Isn't Dog the bounty hunter looking for him? Didn't he say that he was? Yes, he's looking for him, but. No, I'm I think that the kind of let's not call it a live

podcast, even though that's what it'll be. It'll be you interviewing Dan about his book. You can certainly manage doing that for like 40 minutes at like the pussy. Why? Why do you think people are going to come watch that live? Because Dan's an interesting guy.

Yeah, but they hear us on the podcast. Yeah, but then we could sell books afterwards. The audience could ask Dan questions. Listen, can you ask your friend who owns Stand Up New York if we can do it there? Sure. That's fine. Yeah, I'll do it at Stand Up New York.

Will you be the host at Stand Up New York? He's being a wise ass. Are you going to host it at Stand Up New York. Will you be the host at Stand Up New York? He's being a wise ass. Are you going to host it at Stand Up New York then? I'm just saying, if it's a risk, he'd take it. I'd rather he take the risk. He doesn't see how we're going to fill the room with that on the bill. I mean, maybe we should just do a comedy.

Tem's idea was to just do a comedy show and then, so it's a comedy show anyway, and it'd be good with good comics on the show. And then I could talk about the book and say, if you can buy a copy, you know, I guarantee I'll do whatever you want. Oh, thank you. That's how I like to hear you, honey. We could sell out the pussycat on like people.

Well, but you have to figure out a way to pitch it. That's satisfying because the average person goes to the comics on their website. Dan Adam talks about their book. I mean, if it's a comedy, you know, it'll be a special show. We'll put together a special show. It could be comedy, too. I'll come watch it. I would love to see to be able to hear

or read the bubble over TJ's head about Perrielle. Like he just meeting her. Like, what does he think of her? You know what? You are the only person that finds me insufferable. Well, the truth is, no, I'm a pretty good friends.

No, I'm invites Perrielle over his house. Perrielle spent more time in Noam's house than anybody else. So at the end of the day, he finds you quite sufferable. No, but you know what he said to me? Because we, our families were quarantined together by accident. You bought me this shirt. Did you buy me this shirt? No, I bought you the one with the Puerto Rican stuff on it. You didn't buy me social distancing expert?

No, I bought you backyard or quarantino backyard and something. Did you buy me trophy husband? No, I did not buy you trophy husband. I bought you the AOC shirt. All right, go ahead. And he, I mean not buy. OK, go ahead. I bought you the AOC shirt. All right. Go ahead. And he I mean, literally because and our kids are really good friends. But for like 18 months, we were locked in. We were the only people that I saw was him and his wife. And I adore his wife.

And no. And all we did was just argue politics to the point that my husband and his wife were just like, I cannot sit at a table. And I could see that. And Noam said, and you should listen to this. I'm listening. You're deleting. I don't want to take too much more time. Noam said, I don't know what horrible thing I did in my life that of all the people in the world to get stuck in a house arguing politics with it had to be you. Yeah, well, I don't remember saying that, but I... But he was probably being at least half kidding. I think I put it...

I'm sure I had a more pithy way to express it. I was like, I must have been Mussolini in a previous life. All right, well, are we out of time now? Well, that's are we out of time now? Well, we're technically never out of time, but, you know, it's it's it's we like to keep it tight.

And TJ, I guess he has to be on stage at some point. Can Lou cut in? Can Lou cut into this special? Oh, he's got plenty of time. A couple more questions. I'll answer them. Can Lou cut into this episode

some of TJ's publicly available stand up? Sure, of course. Yeah, yeah. I can put I can send you guys some. So TJ's special January 3rd is available on what platform? Amazon Prime. Amazon. Is this called January 3rd because it's kind of like a little like this January 6th and this is January 3rd.

That was before. That was way before. Has no relation whatsoever. Oh, it's not three days before. It's a year and three days before. It has no relation whatsoever. Oh, it's not three days before. It's a year and three days before? Yes, it was 2020. January 6th happened, what, 2021? Yes, it happened this year.

Yes. Yeah. Oh, well, just... There's no way around it. If somebody sees January date, they're going to somehow associate it with January. Yeah, it's the joke now. Whenever people go on stage,

they just say January 6th. Everybody knows what it is. It's very... It's in there. Yeah, it's the joke now. Whenever people go on stage, they just say January 6th. Everybody knows what it is. It's very, it's in there. Yeah, it was my birthday and it happened to be on a Friday. So I was like, oh yeah, I'll just take my special that night. And it was really cool. And also his podcast. Raw Beef with Sean Patton.

Now, Sean Patton, we should have you and Sean Patton together. He's to me one of the biggest talents in comedy. There is that guy so much. He's insanely good. He's incredibly gifted. All right. Well, Perry, I will work on getting that. Yeah. Father, I'm what I said. I'm so no, Sean. Do you know him, Perry?

I don't know him at all, but I'm just over the moon that. I'll put you guys in touch. Finally authorize us to just be allowed to have comments on. That note, you guys don't normally have. Well, oftentimes we'll have a journalist on or somebody or an intellect. We just started or an intellect. Those things are mutually. I actually looked you guys up. You had somebody that actually I like a lot.

Coleman Hughes, you had him on the podcast. He is. He's an old friend of ours. I like your lot. Coleman Hughes. You had him on the podcast. Yes. He's an old friend of ours. I like the work that he does. TJ, he plays with me at the Altree Monday nights. He's in my band. Coleman and I. Oh, he does? Okay, I'll come by Monday night before my shows and check him out.

Coleman and I are really close friends. We haven't had him on in a while because he's got a podcast now that's doing quite well. And I guess he's busy. And he does come here every Monday to play his trombone. I just don't like to ask my friends to do the podcast. He would do it. Coleman would do it. But yeah, but I'm not sorry.

I'm happy that you that you are a fan of Coleman's because he's a he's he's a very substantial intellect, in my opinion. Yes, he's very, very sharp and is also very brave in talking about ideas that black people might call him a coon for talking about, which is a very I really hate this part of the culture where if you don't share the opinions that the public has decided that's the you know, knowing him very, very well. He's not he is not one of these guys who's, you know, trying to disassociate himself from his race or his. That's right. He embraces his blackness. I mean, I hope I'm not I'm just saying it sounds funny coming out of my mouth, but he embraces who he is very deeply. Yes, I feel that way. Yeah. He just follows logic where he feels it takes, you know, and is willing to have uncomfortable conversations. Yes.

Yes. And that's what we're supposed to do. If you're a comedian or an intellectual, you gotta go to places where it might be tricky to go. Yeah. Oh, that's terrific. I'll be,

I'll look forward to introducing you guys. So pod. So if you're talking, we're talking about my book, it is available on Monday. So we were talking about my book. It is available on Amazon.com. Iris Spiro Before COVID is what it's called. Oh, okay. That's the title.

And Perry L's books, The Only Wish I Trust is My Own and On My Knees, also available on Amazon.com. Also highly rated on the Amazon one to five star system. Podcast at ComedySeller.com for questions, comments, suggestions, guest ideas, etc. Thank you, TJ. And we'll see you next time.

Have a good time. Adios. Au revoir.