The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - The Legendary Wid, Keith Robinson, and Mike Vecchione

Episode Date: October 1, 2017

The Legendary Wid is a renowned prop comic from Philadelphia. He recently performed at the Comedy Cellar for Dave Juskow's birthday bash, on a lineup that also included Dave Attell and Artie Lange. Keith Robinson and Mike Vecchione are prominent New York City-based standup comedians who may be seen performing regularly at the Comedy Cellar.

You're listening to The Comedy Cellar, live from the table, on the Riotcast Network, riotcast.com. Good evening, everybody. Welcome to The Comedy Cellar Show here on Sirius XM Channel 99. My name is Noam Dorman. I'm the owner of The Comedy Cellar. We're at the back table. I'm here with, of course, Mr. Dan Natterman. That would be me. Some Comedy Cellar regulars, Mr. Keith Robinson. Yo, yo, yo. Mike Vecchione.

Yo. And then we have a special guest. The legendary WID is a renowned prop comic from Philadelphia. Yeah. That's where Keith is from. That's right. Renowned. WID.

Renowned. He is, absolutely. Legendary. He recently performed, this is his big credit, he recently performed at the Comedy Cellar for Dave Juskow's birthday bash. That is a great credit. That is a great credit. It was a lot of fun there.

All right, wow. That's the worst credit anybody's ever accepted. I don't blame you. That's Stephen. You went through his resume and you picked Dave Justkow. That's the most recent thing. I wanted you to say clubs and colleges. Clubs and colleges.

And it also included Dave Attell and Artie Lang. Yeah. All right. Yes. So before we get into WID, there's a lot of stuff going on this week that we have to address. First of all, yes, last night was a special day here at the Comedy Center. Well, I don't know. I wasn't here.

I mean, I read that it was a special day. Apparently, it was another billion dollar night of sorts. Oh, I thought you meant the HarryAnton538.com

trivia contest. No, no, I'm talking about that one of the shows. I don't know which one. We had John Podhars and Harry Anton and Steve Kornacki of MSNBC.

Oh, all right. Wow. What? And Steve Kornacki. I just said that. Oh, Steve Kornacki of MSNBC. All right. Wow. What? And Steve Kornacki. I just said that. Oh, Steve Kornacki? Yeah, go ahead. No.

And here in the Comedy Cellar room, we had who? We had apparently Louis C.K., Jon Stewart. Aziz Ansari. Aziz Ansari. Pete Holmes, but he was on the schedule anyway. Okay. But he wasn't a special guest, that is. Okay.

And Amy Schumer brought in Madonna with her to go on stage and do some stand-up. So, yeah, that's pretty impressive. What did Madonna do? Also, by the way, Noam, sometimes these stars come, they don't tweet or Instagram. Madonna both tweeted to her 6 million

followers and Instagram to her 10 million followers, the comedy seller with the comedy seller handle LinkedIn. So that's, once again, I say, and I've said 10 million followers, the comedy seller with the comedy seller handle LinkedIn. So that's, once again, I say, and I've said it before, that the Lord loves Noam Dorman. Noam don't believe in the Lord.

Well, that's the irony of it, is that the Lord, the more Noam ignores him, the more the Lord is trying to get his attention. God is needy? God is a needy woman. God is like a third grade girl. Well, alright. But that's got to put a spring in your step there,

no. It's just the way I planned it, Dan. It's all coming together just the way I planned it here in Comedy Cellar Land. And that will, I assume, be good for the new Vegas room that's opening up, hopefully at the beginning of 2018, which we've discussed several times on the show. Were you aware that we're opening a room in Vegas?

I had no idea. I was in Vegas many times. Well, Witt is a great Vegas act. Witt is a great anywhere. Yeah, he really is. First of all, I didn't see Just Gal's birthday bash. I'm sorry about that. And I don't know if it went well

or not. However however I know that sold out A I know that A comedians generally bad mouth prop comics I'm the last prejudice that's allowed

prop comics are bashed all the time I get the high hat from everybody but I kind of like it because I'm a rebel in that way. A lot of people say they're rebels and they do this and they kind of conform. I went with what people told me not to do. They told me not to do puns and they told me not to do props. So I said, well, I'm going to do them. And I've been doing it for 30 years now, and we can see how far I got.

He's a comics comic. Comics love him. He opened mic night far I got. He's a comics comic. Comics love him. He opened Mike Knight when I started. Well, that might be. Given the fact that comedians don't like prop comics,

the fact that people as auspicious as Dave Attell regard you on their short list of people that they admire. I think that was the wrong use

of the word auspicious. What's the word? Yeah. No, there's a word for it. A gust? Rarified. I don't know. I like r? Yeah. No, there's a word for it. A gust. Rarified. I don't know.

I like rarified. Well, as they regard you on their short list of the comics they admire, that's a tremendous accomplishment for a prop comic. Well, I think for any comic, it's the same thing. I mean, you know, there's a short list of prop comics out there. Nobody wants to do it anymore. You don't see any new prop comics coming up. Why don't they want to do it anymore?

Because of the luggage rules? I think the separation from vaudeville to modern comedy. That's such a good line. Mike's always got good lines. That's all right. Keep going, Wynn. The separation from vaudeville to right now is a lot, you know, it's a lot further than when I first started out. You know, prop comics were sort of

accepted back in the day. You know, Lenny Schultz and Gallagher and those sort of people. And Rip Taylor. My father loved Gallagher. I hated Gallagher. Because of the watermelon thing? Of course, the watermelon thing. Did he say that?

That was seedy. That was really racial. of the watermelon thing? I hated Gallagher. Of course, the watermelon. Did he say that? You're one-liner for the fucking thing. That was really racial. Well, where does Carrot Top fit into the... Keith is taking a knee right now at that last joke. He's taking a knee

of the watermelon reference. I like that joke. That was good. We can get Jared here with his jumper if you'd like. You want to replace me with a grown man

wearing a jumper? Absolutely. I'm sorry. I guess... Esteemed. I guess esteemed. Do you predate Carrot Top? Yes. I'm sure that he was inspired by me

in some way. He told me at one time. I did this video called World's Most Tasteless Jokes. Remember those books? Yes. Yes. Okay. They did an actual film of that. Okay.

And I was out there and I did that. And that's when I had long hair and shorts and was kind of a hippie-like. Well, flowing out of each nostril. But it was, you know, he told me at one time that that's what inspired him because they used to watch me in the Southern University that I went to.

But he's a good guy. What about Frankie Pace? Frankie Pace was, of course, but he was more, he was more using one prop. You know what I mean? I use hundreds. No, no, Frankie had a whole,

first of all, Frankie Pace was the first comic on SNL. Yeah. He was a prop comic. Yeah. He used to destroy down here. He was one of those acts that- Well, he didn't have a lot of luggage.

No. Wade just had more stuff. Well, Wade, let's talk about- More jokes. But that's what I say. So Frankie Pace would come down, and he would kill. Right. And the comedians used to bad mouth him and look down their nose

and they broke this man down to the point where he started trying to go on stage without any props. Which wasn't his thing. You know, you gotta be the person that you are. And they basically, in a way, drummed him out of the... He might still be working, but they drummed him out of the business

in a certain way. And it was horrible. The guy was a... This guy was funnier than anybody. I haven't seen you, but go ahead. I'm working with Frankie in a couple weeks, and I've been on his podcast and things like that, and he and I were always friends and stuff like that, but it's hard to be on the same show with two prop comics. It's like two guitar acts. Or two prop comics. It's like two guitar acts. Or two clever comics. You know, or two,

yeah, or two people who are Two wordy, clever comics. Or two accordion players. No, I'm not. Something like that. I wasn't there at the time that Frankie was drummed

out of the business, as you say. I have to be They broke him. He's broken. He was, right? Well, you know, it's because of that

built-in prejudice that people have. I do have to be slightly skeptical. Granted, comics often look askance at prop comics, but the notion that they broke them doesn't accord with what I observe in the comedy business today. John Joseph is a guitar comic, not a prop comic, but a guitar comic, and beloved and not made fun of.

Impressionists that we have here are not made fun of or drummed out of the business? Who is an impressionist? Who is an impressionist? You know what I always get? I always get, I hate prop comics. Oh, except for you, Witt. Okay. That's like a...

I get a lot of that, too. Okay. I hate black comics, except for you, Witt. I was almost drummed out of the business once. You were drummed out of the business. Well, again, I wasn't there. How about Black Prop Comics? I thought you were shutting his mic off. He's going to applaud you.

Well, so this is kind of a Black Prop. Anyway, Dan has to try to find a way to support Cold War in anything I say. But the truth is that he was drummed out. That's all. But maybe he was. I did some room with that, too. He was not drummed out. Yeah. Well. But maybe he was. I did some room with that, too. He was not drummed out. Yeah.

Well, they, I mean, you speak to him. He did not like the business after a while, Frankie. Because? Frankie was a little bit bitter because of the way he was treated and the way that he was. But treated by whom? By the powers to be. And by his peers. By his peers.

By his peers and by the powers to be. People don't understand that you've got a lot of luggage when you come in there or that they think you're carrying your brain around in a paper bag. That's what those are. I want to tell you guys, and I've told this story before, but it always educates me in the back of my mind. I saw Eddie Murphy Raw in 1980. What year did it come out? 84 or something?

Raw was 86. 86? Delirious was 82-ish. All right, okay. So 86. And I came in here. The bar was over there. And the comedians of the day were there,

like John Heyman and maybe Hayvee. I haven't heard that name in a while. And they were hanging around. And these were the top comics working at the time. And I said, wow, I just saw Eddie Murphy Raw. It was fantastic. Boy, was that funny. And they're like, oh, come on. That guy's a hack. He's

a derivative guy. They put down Eddie... They made me feel like a total jackass. I literally questioned myself, like, wow, I can't believe I thought this was funny. Wow. Meaning, and they totally missed it. In retrospect now, the new generation of comics,

they love Eddie Murphy. Right. People can still recite it. People loved it at the time, too. Well, not comics. Really? Not comics. What?

The experts, in every genre and everything, they get that wrong. They get music wrong. I remember when I was a kid, the Bee Gees were considered to be ridiculous. Oh, man.

Meanwhile, they were selling all the records. They started a joke. But people who understood what was good and what wasn't good would talk badly about the Bee Gees and the Jackson 5 at one point. In retrospect, they were all wrong. They were all wrong. Go ahead. Well, they might not have been wrong. Maybe they were right.

Eddie Murphy would still hold up. Because they never said that those people aren't going to be popular. They just said they're not gifted musicians. But some people are popular and good. The point is, were they wrong? Yes, they were. The new generation of musicians all respects those guys.

Eddie Murphy started out at the Eastside Comedy Club. And he used to do it with Rob Bartlett and Bob Nelson. Okay. And a couple of his inflections. And he was how old at the Rob Bartlett and Bob Nelson. Okay. And a couple of the a couple of his... And he was how old at the time? Inflection. What? He was how old? Oh, he was 17, 18. Okay. And he was getting rides

from wherever he lived in the Bronx or Brooklyn or something like that. He was getting a ride out to Long Island to do this. In a hood somewhere. I know. Can you imagine? Somebody had to give him a ride. I couldn't get a cab. But a couple of, like his Jewish voice was definitely from somebody else. All right?

And a couple other voices that he did were from somebody else. But this was in the very beginning when he was raw. And he was influenced by these older comics who took him under his wing. They did the same thing to Rosie O'Donnell. They took the guys out on Long Island. They took care of, you know, of their comics. I mean, you know, both of those turned out to be two of the biggest in the world. But that was all Richie Minervini, you know, Jackie Martling, you know,

and that whole crew out there that took a lot of people under their wings. And that's where a lot of people started out there. Farmingdale. I wanted to ask you about, we talked about you lugging along a large amount of props. Eddie Murphy, I opened for twice back in Philadelphia. And he liked my act, and he encouraged me to do that. And he was laughing. My question is, when you have to go somewhere that requires a plane ride, how do you bring all your shit with you?

I used to be able, before 9-11, I was able to bribe anybody who would handle luggage at an airport. You just slip them $10, $15, they'd put anything on you. I used to take, onto the plane, I used to take, because this was before 9-11, I used to take an arrow, like a bow and arrow thing. With a real arrow. You know, because I did Cupid and stupid, you know, and things like that. But they would do that, and they would play with it on the plane. I mean, the stewardesses would go, hey, what's this, an arrow?

So, but after 9-11, I couldn't get anything anywhere, and I had to pay just like everybody else. 9-11 killed prop comedy. Is it fair to say that? It didn't help. It killed bribery at the airport. That's what it killed. 9-11, you could actually have a chance of getting onto an international flight

without a passport. It was all go ahead. Well, now if your license expired, they won't let you. There's a problem. If it's expired. Wow. All right.

So how much? Well, just real quickly, I just want to know what Noam thinks about bringing Witt out to Vegas and will he pay for the props to fly? Well, I've just been out. I was out two times this year in Vegas. Where did you work? I worked at the Rio. I'm just been out. I was out two times this year in Vegas. Where did you work?

I worked at the Rio. I'm in a band, okay? I'm a singer. I'm in a Star Trek band called the Roddenberries, and we do parody songs, and they had us out to the big 50th anniversary of Star Trek. Are any of these on there? Lou could cut into our show now,

one of these Star Trek parody songs. Can you find them? Are they online somewhere? Yeah. It's called, you know. Which is the best one? The Roddenberrys. We can play a little bit of one of them now.

Which one is the best one? The best one is called That Space. That's me singing. Okay, well, That Space looks good. Go ahead. Instead of That's Life, Frank Sinatra. Yeah, that space. That space. Frank Sinatra. Go where no man has gone before Yeah I might be back

Be back in four I said that space That space That was That Space by the Roddenberrys. Yeah, exactly. I mean, but we're pretty much sanctioned by the Roddenberry estate and all that stuff. And it's pretty good because I started singing when I was 54 years old.

And that's sort of like a fantasy of mine. So you haven't been performing comedy in Vegas. You've been doing songs. Oh, I did MGM, The Catcher Rising Star, all that stuff. So we're going to have a comedy club in Vegas. And Dan's a troublemaker, but nevertheless, absolutely. The folks like me. If you can go over, then that's fine.

That's the standard of everything around here. The folks like me out there, because I'm sort of middle of the road. Well, then why don't you perform here? What? Why don't you perform at the Comedy Cellar? Because of logistics. It's hard to get in. You know, you're talking to the owner.

I have Paul around here. Well, here, but me. Okay. I'll ask SC to get in. That means... I know. But the sense here is short. No, send me something.

I'll watch your video or whatever it is. Let me see. Why not? I love hacks. I love hacks and prop hacks. Everybody knows. He's not a hack. No, no. He's not. I'm both rolled and prop acts. Everybody knows. He's not a hack. No, no.

He's not. Why not? I'm both rolling in the water. No, no, no. He's not a hack. Listen, listen. Wade is not a hack. Hold on.

That was not the way. I didn't mean it all the way it sounded. I mean, like, the comedians disparage hacks and he disparaged prop acts. I do not think that being a prop act is a hack at all. As a matter of fact, it's way more talented than it's a real talent. However, the people that are considered hacks, I sometimes like them too. You know, I think you guys are like such snobs sometimes. People throw that around.

A lot of people who, you know, they complain about people stealing their stuff or they complain about not being a hack. I read a lot of old joke books and comic books. You know, I'm an antique guy. And so I know where a lot of people's acts actually came from. You know, it may be thinly disguised as... Call someone out. Who?

Yeah, yeah. Oh, shit. Oh, I'm not going to call someone out. No, don't put it out there and don't call them out. Okay, Keith Robinson. Okay. His entire act, okay,

is just like Eddie Murphy Raw. Yeah. You know how those... But the sets here, of course, they're short sets of 10 to 15 minutes. I mean, generally, you probably don't do sets at that length. No, but that's good because you bring a smaller bag. You bring a smaller bag, right?

Well, sometimes, whatever vehicle or whatever bag I have, I will do it in that. I will adapt to whatever situation I have to, and that's sort of because, you know, that's the way it goes. How do you define Mike? How do you define, Mike, how do you define hack? Somebody who just does easy, easy material. Stuff that you don't have to really think about it. Easy meaning that? It's you can finish, that you can finish. That the audience will laugh.

Yeah, you can laugh, you can kill with it. I mean, I respect a good hack. I respect a good hack in a way that he just goes, I like a guy who's a hack and knows that he's a hack. He's like, this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm doing. I get it. That's sort of like a good hack. I respect a good hack in a way that he just goes, I like a guy who's a hack and knows that he's a hack. He's like, this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm doing. I get it. I disagree with Mike. It's not easy.

Somebody who does something easy, somebody who does something familiar, more or less. Like if you talk about going to the bathroom, girls go to the bathroom. No, I disagree with that because you could do airplane jokes, but you could do them in a unique way. You could do unique angles on the topic. Do one now, Mike.

I have a whole airplane. It helps me in the Midwest, but it's not going to do my act on this podcast. I'm not going to be backed into this corner. But I have really good airplane jokes, Keith. Are they online? Can we find your airplane jokes online? You've seen it before, Noam. You saw it at the Fat Black.

You saw it. You're like, that's unbelievable. That's really great. But then again, you just said you liked hacks, so maybe I'm a hack now. I'm starting to think I'm a hack. Still no smoking on a flight. I just do other drugs.

I take one magic mushroom before I get onto the plane. And that's way worse. I hit the call button 40 times. And the stewardess comes up, but by then I'm calling her a waitress. Because let's face it, if it wasn't for gravity, she would be working at an IHOP. I'm like, excuse me, ma'am, I do not want to alarm you,

but there is a small dragon in the bathroom. He is breathing fire, and technically that is smoking. This is why I like hacks. Because the audience doesn't know that what the guy is doing is unoriginal. And the reason that the guy is aping what he's doing is because it is funny. So when you, in other words, it's fine to laugh at a hack because what they're doing is actually funny. Otherwise the hack wouldn't get anywhere with it. You guys just resent the fact that it's not original and you're right about that. And not respected. But don't say it's not funny. Otherwise, the hack wouldn't get anywhere with it. You guys just resent the fact that it's not original, and you're right about that

and not respected. But don't say it's not funny. You haven't really defined hack. Hack is somebody I believe who does something over the line of unoriginality where there's really nothing about an original take that they bring to it.

That's what I would say is a hack. It's just like it's been done before. There's nothing about you. I would agree with that. That's the definition that I would use. They bring nothing unique to the table. Do you agree with Noam? Yes, I do.

I probably agree with Noam more often than I disagree with Noam. But Noam highlights the disagreements and makes a stink out of it. But I would agree with that definition. But sometimes the person's personality is just kind of like such a magical charisma. I agree with that. That even then, it's like, whatever, because they're wonderful. Like, just their aura, that person is so appealing.

Yeah, but there's still a hack. You don't want to lose it. But there's still a hack. You can say all those great things about them, but at the end of the day, there's still a hack. But that aura is something original, too. So you give a little bit of credit for originality to a charisma that might be original. A lot of comics take themselves very seriously, and they take the art very seriously. And there's others who take it as whimsical.

And I think that they become hacks because they'll do anything to get a joke. And a lot of hacks turn into more seasoned comics as they drop their hackiness. Give me a music guy that you think is a hack. Somebody in music that you think is a hack.

No. I'd probably rather not say. No, no. In music, I would say Who's a hack? Oh, in music Come back to me, go ahead Anybody else have an answer to that? I'm trying to think of somebody as a hack

It's not a game show, no Michael Bolton, I don't know Michael Yeah, Michael Yeah Michael Bolton gets a rap for that They hate him They hate Michael Bolton

I hate Michael Ray Charles stuck up for Michael Bolton. He says, if you sing that good, I don't care what you're singing. And that surprised me, too. I like hacks. But I'm saying, when I hear Michael Bolton, there's nothing about Michael Bolton. I say, that's just, it's a retread of various things from other people. There's nothing about him particularly that I find original about the guy.

But he's a very good singer. He's very competent and does it well and polished. I'll like a Michael Bolton song, but I don't think I can't wait to hear the next Michael Bolton release because I wonder what he's going to come up with this time. Stevie Wonder, I'll be like, oh my god, what's next?

I think Witt said it. Anything to get a laugh, that's not good. Anything to get a laugh is not good because you could do the lowest brow shit to get laughs. Sometimes you have to restrain yourself when you know what that is. And especially it depends on what kind of audience he is. Mike says that he does hackneyed jokes or quasi-hackneyed jokes about airplanes. I don't think that's hack.

Are you calling Mike a hack? First of all, the man said hackneed, which is, you know, most people don't even realize that the word hack comes from hackneed, and they start saying hacky now. Hack is hackneed, but go ahead. But, you know, you are allowed a certain amount when you were doing it in the Midwest

or in Elks Club or something like that. The deplorable club hacks. Yeah. And the real world doesn't want to just hear about certain situations or they don't understand sometimes. I thought of another hack. Hillary Clinton. Well. And Rance Priebus.

We should have a woman president because we wouldn't have to pay her as much. I like that way. Kevin Brennan. That's cute. Saudi Arabia started to allow women to drive cars now. Kevin Brennan shares it on Facebook and writes slippery slope.

You don't get it? Whatever. I really laughed out loud. Kevin Brennan is not a hack. Oh, no, he's not. He's fucking great. See, I started because I had an... That's debatable. No, I love him.

No, Kevin Brennan is... I love his comedy. I started because I had an antique store, and I used to tell the customers, with stuff that was all over the store, I would tell them that joke with, you know... And that's how I started in comedy by being. And so it was sort of natural for me.

It wasn't just something, oh, I'm going to go out and be a prop comic. It just happened that I had all this stuff and I would make jokes with the stuff. And so. That's great. An antique prop comic. Yeah. I mean, yeah. Old, old jokes.

Old jokes. Old, most of them racist. Can we talk about taking a knee? Go ahead. Yeah, yeah. I believe that every comic should mind his damn business and do what you do on stage. Absolutely. Don't worry about nobody else.

Yeah, that's true. How they're doing and what they're doing. I have to say. Mind your damn business and do what you do. No, I'm on numerous occasions have talked about how other comics are snobby. Are they trash comics? That may be. Have you ever heard Ray Allen talk about other comics?

Forget Ray Allen. I haven't... I'm an easy victim. That's why they talk about him. Are you saying forget Ray Allen because you're going to Aruba? I'm saying forget Ray Allen because he's not here. I'm saying, in general, I have not seen what you're describing. I have not seen that degree of snob... Most comics are fairly respectful to other

comics. I don't hear a lot of vicious bashing. I heard some vicious bashing. Where have you heard some vicious bashing. I heard some vicious bashing. Where have you heard some vicious bashing? I get the high hat. You know the high hat? I don't hear it here. And maybe because Comedy Cellar comics are secure in their own funniness,

they don't feel the need to bash. I'm not hearing a lot of bashing here at the Comedy Cellar. Are you in accord with that? Well, this is... No, look. I believe that every comic... Mike is a snotty comic. I'm not a snotty comic at all. Don't you scream, Mike. I believe that every comic... Mike is a snotty comic. I'm not a snotty comic at all.

Don't you scream, Mike. I'm sorry. Mike is very snobbish. Would you admit that? Absolutely not. I disagree with you again. I disagree with you that airplane jokes have to be hack and that I'm a snob.

You want to attack me some more? I have airplane jokes, too. I don't use them in the city, typically. How about women be so or men be so? And I don't use them in the city, not because I think they're hacky, but I think they'll be perceived as such. I think we're disagreeing

because black and white people are different. Am I right, everybody? Wait, Keith, so what are you saying about comedy style of comics bashing other comics? I've seen comics a long time ago. I'm not going to mention no names. Go after another comic so bad, it really hurt his feelings. This is Comedy Cellar Comics.

Right. You know, so, look. That kind of died with Patrice, though. No, it's not. Believe me, it wasn't Patrice. It was a lot of other people. Because people have snotty attitudes towards whatever. And I think that comics, mind your damn business, do what you do and be satisfied with that.

Period. Well, I'm not seeing a lot of it, but it may well occur. I'm seeing comics fairly respectful. I used to be more. But, you know, they won't say. But sometimes, like Keith and I, he didn't even need to say it. I can just see a slight twitch in his eyebrow. And I know exactly, and I'm like, yeah, you're right.

It's not like we don't have opinions and we don't think other comics are hacky, but there's not bullying or driving people out of the business. I don't think that is either. I don't think it is either. Absolutely. Because you know you're playing a different game. Only a prop back guy. Oh, there was another guy, and I don't know if I heard his feelings or not,

but there was a comedian magician, Charles Mount, who was also fantastic. And there was another guy, Joe Mulligan. All these guys. Charles Mount was a magician, and Joe depended on the guitar. And all of these guys felt, in a certain way, not respected. And all of them then tried to put down what it was that got them there, the magic or the guitar, and just go on stage.

But the feeling not respected. And it never really worked for them, and then they were kind of not heard from anymore. The feeling not respected can occur, but I don't think there's a lot of vicious bullying and insulting. I've been asked many times not to use the props. Because he knew he wasn't respected. Not everybody can be respected. All right.

What are you talking about taking a knee? Witt has a final thought. Many times that I understand when I'm getting a high hat or when people talk behind your back because I am. I am the ultimate prop comic because I have that much stuff. What about the puns? You do puns, too. You have a lot of puns. A lot of puns and a lot of props.

But I also, you know, I worked for 10 years at the Laugh House, okay? And I was the guy who, you know, 30, 40 people a week would come in, and I'd be the guy who would put them on and off and do that. But I didn't use props then, and I found it kind of, you know, I find it kind of comfortable not to use it, but I love using my props, and I love being myself with those props. I mean, that kind of defines me, and it will always define

me. That's because you're funny with them. But the thing is, we can't... But Witt was funny without props, too. Normally we play clips of comics. It's hard to do with Witt because it's so visual, but just to give the listeners an idea of the kind of stuff you do, would you mind if I gave out one of your gems?

Oh, you can say whatever you want. For example, he goes, he'll say something, and then he'll take out a not, which is frayed, and I go, frayed not, you know, for example. That's great. You know what? It's good, but not on the radio.

Not radio good. That's sort of a given. I do want to give the audience a sense of what he does. He goes, if he's killing, he'll take a baseball bat and a doll of Homer Simpson, and he'll smack the doll with the bat. He goes, I'm batting Homers here. That's funnier. They're both funny.

You have to see him do it. Obviously, he does it better than I'm explaining it. But within rapid fire and three or four jokes that go on with each one of those things, that's sort of what I do. You manage a doctor's office. I used to have to go to the doctor's office because I thought I was Tom Jones. Is that strange? It's not unusual.

And I like not to always know what I'm reaching for. I have a question for you. Robin Williams used to look out around and just pick up something and make a joke out of it. It looked like he was a miraculously spontaneous prop comic. Was he making those things up on the spur of the moment? How would Wynn know? He knows. Because prop comics, they keep tabs on each other.

You know what it is? It's memorizing. To be a comic like that, you have to memorize your ad libs. You have to know what your ad lib is before you actually do it. I'm pretty sure that he knew what he was doing.

You know that he borrowed from other people. Are you going to talk bad about Robin Williams? I kind of feel bad for him. He used my props. That's not talking bad. No, he used my props after I was done. He would come in in California and he would use them and have a great

time. Him and Rick Overton would use my props and do back and forth and things like that. I had a quote from him saying that after he saw my act, he goes, man, and I thought I was crazy. From Robin Williams to say that, I thought... By the way, Robin Williams

is a great example of a guy whose magical personality and charisma exceeded actually the words on the page of his jokes are not particularly compelling. But the guy, I mean, this is just a special guy. Right.

I agree with that. And because he's so special, you just couldn't ever call him a hack. He's, you know. I will say. No, keep white laughing. Whatever. Go ahead. Continue.

How about Jonathan Winters? Now, Jonathan Winters was very inspirational. Robert Williams loved. Yeah. Yes. And I was on two specials back in the day with Jonathan Winters was very inspirational. Robin Williams loved. Yes, and I was on two specials back in the day with Jonathan Winters, and he was very afraid of Robin Williams. He said, that guy stole me.

That guy stole me. And then Robin would come, and he'd go, oh, hi, how you doing? But Jonathan Winters was very much of a, he felt threatened by Robin Williams because, you know, there was so much alike. We hear that now. People complain about someone else stealing their essence. Yeah, their essence. Is it possible? I don't know. And it was, you can see it in it. I mean, that Robin Williams is sort of Jonathan Winters updated, you know.

Right, he was. That's what happens. Listen, this may be a pedantic thing to say, but early Beethoven sounds just like Mozart. Right. Influence. Sometimes overwhelmingly feel influenced by something, and it takes them a while for them to put it through their own processing,

and then it comes out something else. Ray Charles used to sing just like somebody else. He used to sing like... Elvis. There better not be no white guy. No, not King Cole. He used to sound just like Nat King Cole. You know that I used to have...

Sinatra tried to be like Billie Holiday. I used to have a catchphrase. What was it? Well, I only had it for like a week but it didn't work and it was too confining but the catchphrase was I'd never learn which actually I think

was a pretty good catchphrase because Louis Schaefer told me Dan Natterman writes a mean joke but no one remembers Dan Natterman. Louis Schaefer, he's the not gay guy. What's Dan Natterman? So I said,

I got to figure something out so I decided, I'd never learn and then all my jokes would be about never learning. That's a great, that's a great, learning. That's a great catchphrase. I think that's a great catchphrase. It is, except it's like...

But you have to say it after every joke. I never learn! Yeah, and most jokes don't have anything to do with I never learn. I can't say like... Keith, there's a little showmanship involved. You know, most of my jokes do not fit into the I never learn format. So it was very confining. So I just said, fuck it, it's too confining.

I just wanted to let you know that me and Keith have locked arms to the listeners out there to show our solidarity against America. That's like a Bennington commercial over there. Absolutely. Anyway, no, it's charming to get to what everybody's talking about, be it on Facebook, on Twitter, or face-to-face. Of course, the national anthem protests in the National Football League, which is a

professional sports league here in They know. I'm not a big sports fan. Keith, of course, is an African American, but he's got We don't have any proof of that. He's got a take on this. Jack is penis. But Keith has a take on this, which one would not

expect from an African American. Go ahead, Keith. What do you feel about it? What I feel about it? I feel like you should. Oh, you son of a bitch. Please speak it. Don't rap it. He said him. He said him.

That was real good, though. That's real good. Go ahead, Keith. No, I believe that, first of all. We know what you believe, but say it out loud. Go ahead, Keith. No, I believe that, first of all... We know what you believe, but say it out loud. Go ahead. This weekend's thing had nothing to do with the original Colin Kaepernick.

What exactly did happen this weekend? Because I'm actually not up on it. This weekend, dumb Donald opened up his stupid mouth and called them son of a bitches and, you know, they should respect the flag and da-da-da, da-da-da. Called who, though? The players. Had people still been taking knees?

No. The thing about it, he just brought it up. They shouldn't kneel. You've got to respect the flag, and da-da-da, ba-ba-ba. And what the thing that got everybody upset, or more or less the owners upset, is he said that people should boycott the league and they should, you know, turn off. Fire those players. That's what he said.

They should fire those players. So the owners got upset. So the owners got involved when they start to mess with their money. All right. You understand? Yeah, I understand. Like owners do, no? Yeah, like everybody does. Only when it mess mess with their money. All right. You understand? Yeah, I understand. Like owners do, no? Yeah, like everybody does.

Only when it messes with your money. I'm going to take a knee every day on your stage now. I think it's a fad. I think it's a fad. You know, I don't think it's going to last that long. It's not a fad. Colin Kaepernick brought it up because of police violence. That's not a fad.

That's something that's real. And that was real to him. And then Donald Trump, almost a year later, because Colin Kaepernick, they're not allowing him in the league. He's not around anymore. Is he a good quarterback? Yes. So you think they didn't sign him because he's controversial? Yes, absolutely.

I don't know enough about him. I do believe that, too. Yeah, I think that's pretty much a given. I do believe that. But he's a good Yes, absolutely. I don't know enough about him. Yeah, I do believe that, too. Yeah, I think that's pretty much a given. I do believe that. But he's a good backup, I would say. I'd say he's a backup. He took his team to the Super Bowl. He took his team to the Super Bowl.

He accompanied his team. But go ahead, go ahead. He took his team to the Super Bowl. He's responsible for them going to the Super Bowl? Absolutely. They had a great year that year. But be that as it may, I think it's pretty universally accepted that the owners don't want to touch him with a 10-foot pole because of this controversy. Right.

Because they felt as though, once again, their money's involved. They don't want their money affected at all. Let me just, I don't want to defend or not defend, but I want to ask you something. When you say that in a disparaging way, but the owners, presumably, they own these teams because they're running a business. And don't they have the obligation, in a sense, to say, well, you know, this is bad for business. Why would I want this? Okay, you know it's bad for business. Answer my question, please. Let me ask you this.

Losing is bad for business. Yeah, they have to weigh that against the other. You know, Colin Kaepernick is better than at least 16 of our starting quarterbacks that start now. He's better than them. And his team's just losing, but losing and they won't use him. So then it's not bad for business. It's actually worse for business to not use him. They just took that

stance because people were talking about that. And they said that it was a dip in the ratings in the NFL, but that wasn't because of that. Yeah, I think you're right. Everything is dipping in ratings now. But that's not where the crux of the controversy lies in terms of this

latest explosion of controversy that we see online. Well, the controversy now lies in terms of this latest explosion of controversy that we see online. Well, the controversy now lies in, first of all, whether Donald Trump as president of the United States should be telling private business owners who to fire, which there may be some legal issues there. It's apparently a government official is not allowed to do that. I don't believe there's any legal issues.

And secondly, freedom of speech. People are saying, how dare Donald Trump say that these people shouldn't be allowed to protest and take a knee. And that's really where the controversy seems to be. And where do you come down, Daniel? I come down as follows, and I'm glad you asked that question. If I come down, here's where I come down. Okay, Luke can cut it out if you get too honest. I personally would not kneel

for the national anthem I would stand up for the national anthem Why? Because we're patriotic It's a symbol of the United States It's not a symbol of anything It's a symbol of the United States Yes it is and of course I was raised

that way all through elementary school you stood up for that flag every morning at the Pledge of Allegiance. So it's drilled into me. Some of it is simply perhaps indoctrination, but it is a symbol of the United States. If you have a beef with the police, then that's fine to protest that. I would not protest it by protesting the flag itself, especially if there are members of the Marine Honor Guard on the field, as there sometimes are, during

the national anthem. He wasn't ever protesting the flag. Well, I don't know what he's protesting because I can't read his mind. He told you what he was protesting. He said, I will not stand for a flag of a nation that oppresses black people. I believe that was a more or less

exact quote. No. First of all, he was sitting down first, Colin Kaepernick. He was sitting down. Then a Marine, a Green Beret, came to him and said, look, it'd be much better if you just took a knee. Instead of what was he doing originally? Sitting down.

Okay. We feel much better if you just took a knee. So Colin Kaepernick decided to just take a knee that guy was a marketing genius and then it still wasn't good enough if he'd been sitting this would have gone nowhere take a knee is awesome

it's never convenient to protest protest is that's what it's all about that's why they call protesting that's why they call protesting because it has to bring something to the table they call protesting. That's why they call protesting? Yeah, because it has to bring something to the table. Testing people. Yes.

So you can't bring nothing to the table if nobody sees it and feels it. So everybody fuck their protests. Is this permanent? No, once you start this, how do you get out of it? How do you get out of it without appearing to When we're a colorblind society, I guess I'll say. How do you get out of it? Are they going to kneel it? How do you get out of it without appearing to... When we're a colorblind society, I guess I'll say.

How do you get out of it without... Are they going to kneel forever? How do you get out of it without appearing to communicate that what you're protesting has fixed itself? See, this is where it becomes such a separating force. I'm asking you a serious question. Let me say this because I heard WID say, are they going to do it forever?

Who? The people who are kneeling. You know who's kneeling. I heard WID say, are they going to do it forever? Who? The people who are kneeling. You know who's kneeling. No, actually, white people are kneeling now, too. No, they're not. Yes, they are. Some are. No, they're not.

Well, whatever, whoever. Stop making this a racial issue. You damn right. You know what I'm saying? I'm going to bring it to where it's supposed to be. I'm kidding. Of course it's a racial issue. Deal with race.

If a singer did it, I would say, shut up and sing. You know what I said to those guys? Shut up and catch the ball. If you could go back in history, hold on, if you could go back in history and you're there

and Marvin Gaye gets the offer to sing the national anthem, would you say, Marvin, don't do it? You're making an ass of yourself. You shouldn't be singing that national anthem. Whitney Houston,

you shouldn't be, I'm asking you seriously, you shouldn't be singing the national anthem. Well, you know, say Muhammad Ali, when he didn't get. I'm asking you seriously. You shouldn't be singing the national anthem. Well, you know, say Muhammad Ali. When he didn't get in service, everybody hated him. Listen,

can I just say something? I think that you think I'm being like clever here, but I'm not. I've said too many times that I think that the one population, I've said this for years, the one population in the United States that has every right to be ambivalent about the United States of America are blacks.

I get that. If I were black, knowing what happened in this country, I don't think I would hate the country, but I would have mixed feelings about it. So I respect that 100%. Nevertheless, I'm asking, like, how far do you take that?

It's a national pastime. If you have ambivalence, maybe you can separate those times for unity and times to express my beefs. But when you politicize everything, if black singers no longer will sing the national anthem, when everything becomes a form of politics, is that a plus? Is that a good thing for the nation? Does it help accomplish what you want to accomplish? As a white man, you don't get to tell black people how and where to protest.

No, only in the comedy cell do I get to do that. I'm not telling you that. I'm asking you questions. I'm not saying anybody should. You're like my fucking Facebook feed. You're just twisting things. I would like to yield my time to Keith Robinson, the senator from Philadelphia. This has become a Senate Judiciary Committee.

Taking back my time? Taking back my time? You can't reason with these people. What do you mean, these people? Comedians, I mean comedians. The question is not telling anybody how to protest. That's what you're doing. The question is, first of all, I said that I wouldn't protest that way, and people have a right to protest the protest,

so that people have a right to say, I don't like. Protest the protest. People have the right to. You have the right to kneel. And people have the right to say, I don't like you kneeling. I feel it's disrespectful. So I think everybody would agree with that. I don't go against what they're protesting.

Why mix it in with the game? It's just like when a singer I don't want to hear a singer Let's say it's 1965 or 66, whenever the year when they were trying to integrate in Alabama or wherever it was and it's right after they were hosing

black kids down with the hoses and the day after that it's a football time and the black players don't want to stand for the national anthem I would have a hard time arguing with them in such a clear cut case after that as a football and a black players don't wanna stanford national anthem i would i would have a hard time arguing with them in such a clear cut case but i think i think part of the problem to me knowledge odds be left

with a part of the problem to me is that this very issue is extremely complicated all the uh... social science that is done about the research the statistics paint a picture which is not what Colin Kaepernick believes that it might be. I don't know if the evidence is correct or not correct, but the issue with crime rates and

what's going on in Chicago and the fact that the police are simultaneously expected to deal with communities of high, high violence and then somehow never get in a cause. It's a very, very complicated and I'm sure racism is one component of it. That there seems to be something about this particular issue,

which is so complicated, that in a certain way, I find it not appropriate to just simplify it by this taking a knee. That's the way I feel about it. But I don't actually mind the disrespect to the flag. Let me tell you something. When he said, I just want to go to a football game and see football. But just the national anthem in itself, it's political. That's a political symbol.

But that's political. What does that have to do with the football game? Are you disturbed that they're singing a national anthem? It's just a tradition. As a matter of fact, they didn't always use to do it in America. But what I'm saying, the phoniness of it is like we just want to see a football game.

No. The national anthem goes, there's a down on his knee, and then he's up on his knee, and they're playing football. Okay, Keith, I get that. So you don't just want to see football. I didn't say that.

Let me finish. You hate to see that black man kneeling. No, I hate to see anybody kneel. I didn't even realize Colin Kaepernick was black until I read it. If it was anybody kneeling, I would hate that. It didn't look black to me. If it was anybody. It looks like one of my kids.

Now, look. You're victimizing yourself. If it was anybody. One at a time. If they were calling out a play, right? Yeah. In the middle of the play, a black guy kneeled and put his fist up. Then that interferes with the football game.

See, Keith. That's it. Keith, okay. Think of this phoniness. Okay, listen to me. Didn't Michael Bennett do that after he sacks a white player? He puts his black power fist? I like the guy who thwarted Keith.

Keith, Keith, Keith, Keith. You're putting words in somebody's mouth. I'm sure somebody feels that way, but nobody this age feels that way. But listen to me. I just heard it. What does it mean? As a guy who owns a club, I always compare it to the club. Let's take a red state, like, I don't know, a blue

state, like Alabama or something like that. No, red state. Alabama. Red state. So, someplace where you know that the overwhelming sentiment of the audience, of the crowd that's paying their money to come see this game, doesn't agree with this protest. So now you're imposing something which is unpleasant to the fans who aren't indirectly actually paying your salary and say, listen,

I'm going to put this in your face, fans. There is something that at least has to be a consideration. Like, I have very strong opinions. I don't want those opinions expressed on the stage in the comedy cellar, even if I might really kind of certainly make me feel good because I'm like, I say to myself, you know what? I don't care how strongly I feel about the state of Israel, let's say. There's a lot of people in the audience that totally disagree, and I don't want to impose this on them. They're here to have a good time, pay their money, and see comedy. I don't think it's the right place for me to do that,

and that doesn't have anything to do with how right I feel the cause is. Where is the right place then? Every place other than a captive audience where people have paid their money not for a bait-and-switch. They're coming to see this. They're coming to have a good time. Wait a minute. is the right place then? Every place other than a captive audience where people have paid their money for not for a bait and switch. They're coming to see this. They're coming to have a good time.

Wait a minute. Do people still see the football game on time? Yeah, but it's... I'm asking you, do they? Yes, they do. What it appears

with the football game? I mean, it's amazing it is on time, yeah. It's... What gets me is... It's opportunistic. It's opportunistic. That's what protests are.

Okay. You know what? Yeah. It's a tough issue. I think it's a tough issue. You know the reason we're talking about this now? Six months from now, when they start protesting. We're talking about the protests.

We're not talking about the actual problems. When people start protesting. We're talking about the protests. We're not talking about the actual problems. When people start protesting when people start protesting abortion and various other issues

that they feel strongly about at football games just like the Academy Awards what became what was once in a while somebody says

something political becomes every single time it's political I think we're going to say to ourselves you know what this is not a plus.

It's a phony premise to tell people where the place is. The national anthem is being sung, which is political. One guy takes a knee, it was just one or two guys, and everybody, oh, why

are they doing this? You know, Keith, you're right. It started at the times of World Wars, and singing the national anthem really was seen by almost 100% of the population, probably black people too in a certain way, as just, this is America, and there's a unity here. And we woke up 80 years later in a country where patriotism itself is controversial, and now the national anthem is seen as a political statement, rather than just a celebration of who we are getting together. Well, what's more patriotic than protest? That's the First Amendment. No, no.

That's a right. No, I don't think protest is patriotic or not. Yes, it is. No, defending people's right to protest is patriotic. The protest itself is not, in my opinion, nothing patriotic about protesting. It doesn't mean you love your country because you protest. It means you love your country because you respect people's protests. That's what I think.

You want to build your country to be a better place. It can be patriotic. The cause can be patriotic. The cause is that. Stop shooting niggers. Yeah, wanting, I will not say that word. You can't say that word. I can rap it.

Oh, yes, I can. Did you hear about the kids who were singing, these kids in college were singing along with the Kanye song, and now they're being investigated by the university because they used the N-word? I wanted to say something. He was being interrupted. Sorry, Witt.

No, I'm just thinking that it is not the right place to do that. Did he say white place? It's not the white place. I thought he said white. That was a Freudian slip. Sorry. But it shouldn't be done there because everybody will be protesting something different. If everybody was allowed to do that, there would be ten different things.

There's just as many problems in the world for other players who do not bring that up. The Dallas team had wanted to wear a small thing on their helmets to commemorate the cops who were shot in Dallas. And the NFL turned them down. But what does that mean? It means that... The NFL allows that. In other words... The NBA doesn't allow it. No, they'll say the NFL, it wasn't like, well, every protest is okay with us.

They pick and choose their protest. I can see where it's very effective. It's very effective because now it has people talking. And what it did was, we're discussing it right now for a long time. But we're not discussing how to eradicate police brutality at all. We're talking about the protests. But we're not discussing how to eradicate police brutality at all. We are discussing it. It's just the method that is used is kind of, you know,

it's invasive and it's self-indulgent. It's supposed to be invasive. This guy's got balls. I would say it to any singer, any songwriter, any white guy, any black guy, any green guy. If it didn't mean nothing. Shut up and catch the ball.

That's his bad mentality. Shut up. No, it's not a bad mentality. He's not just an empty tool to be your entertainer. This guy, Colin Kaepernick, gave a million dollars of his money. He's not just talking. That's when he thought he was going to get re-signed. No, he gave a million dollars of his money.

He's done a lot for the neighborhood. You have to go, Mike? Yeah, I have a spot. I have a spot here at the Comedy Cellar. I actually work. I want to tell you exactly what's going on in my mind right now. If I were... Because the biggest challenge is to really put yourself in someone else's shoes.

It's very, very difficult. And I wonder to myself, if I could carry over the exact same mentality that I have now, but I lived a life in black skin, would I see this the same? Would I see this the same or differently?

I don't know the answer to that, but that's what I... I think that is the moral requirement of everybody, and black people vice versa, to think about it that way. Really try to imagine what it is like to be there. I think I would think about it differently. I really would.

I can't imagine. I think I would. I think I would. I would too. And you might be more kind to hacks too if you had to look more in their shoes. I got to do a lot of airplane jokes. I'll see you guys.

Thanks for having me on. Mike is going to do his favorite airplane joke right now. Knowing him as a black man is very hard to conceive, obviously. Oh, you haven't seen me naked, did you? I've had girls with the lights out think I was a black man. I was brought up in the suburbs, okay? I had a perfect

childhood. Where? In Philadelphia? No, in Cranford, New Jersey. Right in the middle of New Jersey. The Venice of New Jersey. In a perfect place. So I would probably feel different. And, you know, if it was that much of a cause, yeah, I would kneel at a football game, probably. And, but I'm saying that it gets kind of like, it's too much, you know, when you want to escape something in a football game, I mean, it's, it's like you get blindsided, okay? And I feel guilty about what my ancestors did. I feel guilty about that.

But I don't want to always be held accountable for that. You don't have to feel guilty about what your ancestors did. I don't. Not your fault. It's not about that. We should feel upset about what the United States of America did. It's not about that. I don't even know what my ancestors did because we have very few records going back.

I don't think a German I meet should feel guilty about what their ancestors did. No, it's not about that. It's about police brutality. We are ancestors in the United States. That's what it's about. No, wait. I'm curious. We are ancestors back in the...

It's about systemic racism in our system. That's what it's about. Do you think things are getting better? No. Or do you think things are getting worse? I think things are getting better. Yeah, of course they're getting better. That's coming from a white guy.

Come on. Now you have to admit it. As far as police brutality and as far as representation. Wait a minute. There's been a song for every decade since the 50s about police brutality and it goes back

even further. I want to ask you another question. I think it's getting better. And it goes back even further. With body cameras. Right. I want to ask you another question. This is, I think this hasn't really been spoken about. I think it's getting better, but it's not going to get much better after. Right now, we're at the peak. Hold on, I want to say something. This is, I think, also part of the subtext here

that's not spoken about. People look at this and they wonder to themselves, do these people taking a knee to the national anthem, do they have a perspective and what is their perspective on the pluses and minuses of the United States of America? Do they still realize that despite their place on the totem pole, that there are still so many amazing benefits to this country that is not perfect, but that still you have these millionaires, you have people having tremendous ability to pursue their happiness, black and white, in an unprecedented level.

So I look at Kaepernick and I say to him, okay, he's protesting police brutality, maybe that's legit, but I say, but does he love the country? Does he hate the country? Does he put it in a spectrum of pluses and minuses of the country? Or does it just swell? Well, he should speak that way. How much more respect would he get if he said, listen, I love my

country. There's so many good things about United States of America. Have you heard him speak? I read some of the transcripts. I didn't hear him say that. I heard him speak. What did he say? He loves the country, of course, but there's so many things that still need to be fixed.

Okay. And we know that. But everybody has something they want to fix. Everybody has something they want to fix. There would be protests everywhere. You have kids. If people were... Wait a minute.

Why are most prop comics conservatives? Have you noticed that? Yeah. No, I was always conservative. Let me ask you this. I didn't notice that, but you may be right. You have kids with...

What? You have kids. No, I don't. You have nieces and nephews. Yeah, lots of them. So, if you've seen your nephews being shot down by police, right?

Of course I would be. And of course I don't like to. I just don't like to. Wait, wait, wait. Let him finish it. Okay, wait, wait. I'm sorry. You can't answer a question that you have.

All right, all right. Don't rub it in. I'm not finished yet. Now, if your nephews were shot down and the cops was let loose, you had four, maybe four of them let loose, four killed, four cops let loose. You had four, maybe four of them let loose. Four killed, four cops let loose. How would you feel? Of course I would feel terrible, and I would do anything by my means to do that.

And I don't disrespect anything that they're doing, but it is the wrong place to do it. And it is something that— What is the wrong place to do it and it is something that What is the right place? Well, the right place would be the place from a very utilitarian Or the field. No, the right place There's two ways to look at it.

From Kaepernick's point of view or someone who's committed to the cause the right place would be the place where you're most likely to further the cause. I don't know I don't know if this is furthering the cause you know how you know

it's furthering the cause because we're still talking about it he did it a year or so ago and dumb Donald is still talking about it do you think people are more sympathetic to the cause now than they were prior they're bringing more and more light to it

they're bringing more light to it maybe you're right. They did. It's very effective. It's very effective what is happening. And it is probably reaching their goals by having people talk about it more. As an American, I truly feel this way. We're so divided in so many ways.

I would like to see certain places where people could just come together and forget their skin color and forget their thing for one afternoon to all be together. Now, it doesn't have to be football. I'm not crying about the flag, but there is something that's been lost in terms of the social fabric

that every single thing is political now. So here's what you're saying. But maybe it's outweighed by this. I'm politically correct So here's what you're saying. But maybe it's outweighed by this. I'm politically correct. Here's what I'm saying. You're saying I would like an hour or two just not to think about racism. That's another way to put it, yeah.

Right. No, I don't think about racism. I spent 23 hours out of the day not thinking about racism, Keith. You know that. But you will soon. No. That's really not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that the country

needs to have the proper combination of focusing on its faults, not sweeping them under the rug, trying to make them better, and also showing that we have something else that binds us, which is that not everything

is about our race and our ethnicity and our religion and whether we're pro-life or pro-choice. Those ideas can conflict in certain times, but they are also both things that I would like our nation to accomplish. Address our cause and still be unified. And at least, it would be nice if we all agreed that at least the anthem is not in and of itself intrinsically political, nor is the flag. It's absolutely political. Talk into my key.

It's absolutely political. The flag, what does that have to do with football? Well, the point is the flag is a symbol of the United States. No, no, no, no, no. What does that have to do with football? It's a tradition. I told you it started during war times. Do you remember after 9-11, everybody was singing America the Beautiful?

Everybody was singing it. But it's still political. Okay, okay. I'm not going to. I'm not going to. Political. All right. If you don't want to protest, then why would you want the flag?

Well, if you don't like the national anthem. But it's not political because all it's saying is, we love America. Now, if you think that that's political... Is it bad to say that? Whoa, whoa, whoa. So what if I don't love America? Fine, you don't love America.

But you're going to get a lot of flack for it. And that's what's happening. Talking to Mike. I'm guessing these white folks. Well, it must feel so good to be able to say that, Keith. I know. I know. That must be such a pleasure to be able to say,

you white folks, and nobody thinks you've crossed the line. Nobody even has to give you an excuse for it. These white folks. Let me make it better. I'm sorry about that. You're not doing crackers. Putting on the ritz. All right. I'm putting on the ritz.

What ethnic group are you a belong to, WID? Me? Are you just a regular white guy? I'm mush. I'm a mutt.

I'm from, you know, 18 different things. Probably, maybe Canadian. I don't know. Well, that's not an ethnic group. Yes, it is. Canadian's not ethnic. What are white Canadians? What ethnic group are they?

White people. No, white is not an ethnic group. Of course it is. White is a race. French is an ethnic group. Canadian is not an ethnic group in any case. Neither is American. Canada is a melting pot like America.

Probably French, German, Scottish, Irish, you know. Anyway, we're at 60 minutes. So, Whit, it was great. Like, I didn't know what to expect, but the fact that you like to talk politics and you're kind of a man after my heart. I want Keith to know one thing. Go ahead. I want Keith to know that is a brilliant thing that they're doing by bringing attention to what they're doing. And it is a brilliant thing. But I just think that it's kind of intrusive to do that.

And it kind of makes me uncomfortable. Good. That's what it's meant. That's exactly what it's meant to do that. It kind of makes me uncomfortable. That's what it's meant. That's exactly what it's meant to do. It doesn't make me uncomfortable because I never watch football. It makes me uncomfortable because it is anti-American

to kneel during the Star Spangled Banner. You couldn't do that. When I was growing up and if you didn't stand during the National Anthem, they'd hit you in the head. That's old school, and that's wrong. It's not anti-American.

It's anti-cops killing unarmed black men. That's what it's anti. All right. Learn what it's for, and then deal with that. It's working. I want them to deal with it. Come on, now. What else you got to say, now?

No, no. I didn't like your Facebook post Oh look at the point No I really think this is an issue It depends what you put as The arguments on both sides are legit It depends on what you prioritize You know That's why I come back to

I really think that it's because I think the issue is so murky to begin with That this bothers me because I could see A it's because I think the issue is so murky to begin with that this bothers me. Because I could see a certain cause. Like I said, I don't want to repeat myself about the 60s. Where I say, well, of course they're not going to stand now. Right. But this issue, this is a tough issue.

The issue for me is not murky. It is. It's clear. It's just as clear as day. Well, you should read some of the stats. It's clear. I don't think anybody feels that way against what they're protesting. But I know most black people feel it too.

You know what I feel? When Eric Holder exonerated Darren Wilson, who shot Michael Brown, that was really the case that really started all this, the hands up, don't shoot. And the black president and the black attorney general wrote a report, or a release report, saying that Darren Wilson actually was was correct in what he did that Michael the witnesses lied that nobody says that on the show and Hillary Clinton still brought Michael Brown's mother on stage with her at the convention I felt that was a every bit as much a lie as anything Donald Trump has ever said much more sophisticated and now wait now hold on hold

on hold on I'm almost finished Keith listen Keith now wait I'm on my knee stop it. I'm out. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. I'm almost finished. Keith, listen. Keith, now wait. I'm on my knee. Let me finish. I'm taking a knee. Keith, please. I'm barely taking a knee.

This is important. And just like I said, put yourself in a black person's shoes. And I say to myself, if I was one of these cops, especially cops who are being shot now, and I know that this cop who had been maligned actually was exonerated,

and yet they're still calling him out there as a murderer. Because as a black man. You need to realize that would outrage you also. No, let me take this. And if you can't, then you're not doing what you want other people to do. I still don't believe Darren Wilson. You don't have to believe him. I don't believe him.

You don't have to believe it. The point is that the United States government investigated this. Wait a minute. You don't have to believe it. The point is that the United States government investigated this. You don't have to believe it. And they showed all the racism. You are ducking my question. They showed all what's going on. They showed all the systemic racism. If you were a cop.

The cops lie all the time. All right. This is why. And you see, when you start talking like that, I feel less sympathetic to the whole cause because it's a one-way street. No, it's not a one-way street. You expect people to stop and think about what it's like to be in your shoes and then you make no attempt to stop and think what it's like

to be in another person's shoes. Cops were shot hanging out at their police cars as a response to this kind of shit. People were dying and that's fine. Not because of Michael Brown. Hold on. Yes. Because of Flandreau Castro. All of it. And the truth is that if that's the way it is

because of what really happened, that's one thing. But if there's real facts out there which are false and they've actually been uncovered and still nobody's acknowledging them and Hillary doesn't acknowledge them and the president doesn't acknowledge them and one out of 50 people that I meet have any idea

at all that Darren Wilson was even exonerated. They don't know. It was buried. It was buried. Darren Wilson lied. You think that, but Eric Holder and the Justice Department... Oh, his eyes turned red. Get out of here with that. All right, we're done. We're done. Keith,

you're out of here. Wow. That was much more political than I thought it would be. Good night, everybody. Good night. Shake that off.