The Confessionals - 38: Mandalay Bay | The Untold Eyewitness Stories

Episode Date: October 9, 2017

On this special episode, we walk to Rick and Jeff about their experiences with the Las Vegas shootings on October 1, 2017. For their full written accounts please visit the website at www.TheConfessionalsPodcast.com Website: www.theconfessionalspodcast.com Email: [e-mail] Facebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcast Twitter: @TConfessionals Tony's Twitter: @tony_merkel Tony's Instagram: tony_merkel Tony's Facebook: www.facebook.com/tbmerkel

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Say 50% on the new Sleep Number 360 limited edition smart bed plus special financing only for a limited time. To find your local sleep number store, go to sleep number.com. Special financing subject to credit approval. Minimum monthly payments required. See store for details. I was trying to figure out what I was going to do for this week's show. As the week went on, I got a stronger and stronger feeling that I had to say something.

I had to address what happened in Vegas on Sunday night in some way. I wanted to show my respect. And I started brainstorming just simple ideas of a moment of silence for the victims to actually talking about what happened and sharing my thoughts on it, to doing an entire show where I read articles and just laid out information as to what happened on Sunday night, according to the news. But that didn't sit right with me because I didn't really trust what I was hearing from the news. I was hearing from alternative sources, people that were on the ground,

who experienced a totally different story than what I'm hearing from the mainstream media. Friday morning, I came across a guy who had access to, victims that were on the ground. And then Friday night, I got confirmation that some of these victims were willing to come on the show and share with me and the audience what they experienced in Vegas this past Sunday night. So tonight, we talked to two people who were there, who heard the gunshots,

who saw people get shot, they come on to share their experience, their account of what happened in Las Vegas, Nevada this past Sunday night. They're going to share some things with you that you have not heard on your mainstream media. And I just want you to ask the question to yourself,

why? Why is Tony a truck driver who was, work 60 plus hours a week, able to, in one evening, on a Friday evening after a long week of work, able to connect with two people who were there, experienced this horrific tragedy. Yet your mainstream media who do this for careers is their full-time job have not been able to uncover some of the stories you're going to hear tonight. Without any further delay, let's bring on Rick and hear what he has to say and what he experienced in Vegas. Okay, I have Rick coming on and Rick actually was found by another guy on Facebook who pointed

me in his direction. And Rick, you were in Las Vegas when this shooting happened, correct? That's correct. Now, we were talking a little bit before this recording started and you said that you're not originally from Vegas. you were visiting. Where are you originally from? Right. I'm from a little town, a sort of small town called Apple Valley. It's about 200 miles south of Las Vegas, just down I-15. Okay. So you were visiting, were you going to the concert? Yes, yes. That's what we were in town for. Back in March,

my wife had asked me if I would be willing to go to that concert with her. I like country. I'm a country fan, but she's, she likes it more than I do. I listen to all kinds of music and she, she's more, I mean, she does listen to more music, but she listens to country most often. So, okay. So basically what I want you to do right now is to just walk us through the evening and night's events. I mean, share with us how things developed for you, what you guys were doing, and just kind of paint the picture for the audience to hear what you have to say. And so they can picture what you went through. Right.

So leading up to that night, the first couple of nights, we were pretty gung-ho about kind of of fighting that crowd and getting up close to the stage. But after two nights of doing that, our group, we had, I was there with my wife and three of her girlfriends, actually. And we had discussed it earlier, and we decided we were going to hang back a little bit more. So we brought a blanket so that we could kind of sit down between sets and hang out. But we were on the astro turf that you can see from pictures on the right hand side of the venue when you're facing the stage, kind of near the VIP section. And we were maybe 20, 30 yards up on that astro turf.

We kind of in between acts, people would kind of clear out a little bit. So we moved up a few times during the night. So we weren't too far from the stage. But we weren't like fighting the crowd to get up to the front. And Jason Aldine, I believe his set started at 940. And, you know, we stood up and we started singing the songs and just having a good time like we were with all the other artists. And I don't know how many songs it was in at probably about five towards the end of the song, Any Old Barstool. somebody and I didn't see how they got there they were either dropped or thrown a string of firecrackers into the crowd about maybe 25 30 feet at the most probably in front of us and the pops from those firecrackers were very distinct

because I was close enough to them to pinpoint exactly where they were so as soon as they started going off I looked in that direction and I saw a little group in the crowd kind of like a push away from them, almost form a circle around them so that they wouldn't be standing right on top of them. And I could see small flashes coming from that area, like through the light in between people's legs. And that was right at the end of that song. And right after that, Jason Aldeen says, let's turn it up a little bit.

And I believe the song he started playing is when she calls me Baby. and the videos I believe that most people have seen from that, that's when you start hearing automatic gunfire. Now, I'm going to back up just a little bit. So from sitting on the blanket and from standing so much the other two nights, a lot of us had sore feet. So a few of us in the group had taken our boots off. And as soon as those firecrackers went off,

I was just on high alert. I don't think that's a funny joke. and and you know most people i'm pretty sure at that point had assumed it was a joke and and i did too but i didn't think it was funny and i was on you know kind of high alert because i don't like those kind of shenanigans and uh as soon as uh the the automatic gunfire started coming i knew right away something was wrong and so i i told our girls of the girls that were with me get your boots on we're getting we're getting the heck out of here you know I don't care what that is.

I don't like it. And so we got down and we started putting our boots on as fast as we could. And there was people in the crowd near us that were like, calm down. It's just firecrackers. And, you know, I've seen videos since then, too, that, you know, while this automatic gunfire is going on and people are running for their lives, I've heard, you know, on videos people say, no, it's fake. It's fake. Like, don't freak out.

It's just fake. And I think that those firecrackers that went off had the effect of making more people think it was fake. There's a thing in psychology called normalcy bias. And I can't remember the guy's name, but I read about it in a book when I was trying to collect my thoughts because I knew about normalcy bias already. And basically what it means is that your mind, when things like this happen, wants to normalize it, wants to normalize it, wants to rationalize it into not being what it is, being something that's more normal that you would expect. And about 75% of people in situations like this suffer from that. So that's what was going on all around us is people just not believing what was going on, you know, just trying to

rationalize it in their minds. And we were frantically putting our boots on. And they, you know, and that shooting just, that first folly just seemed like it went on forever. And I told the girls to basically take cover, get down. And at that point, those firecrackers that went off, I could tell exactly where that sound was. I pinpointed it right away. I could see it, which helped as well, I'm sure. But when the gunfire started, I could tell a general direction, but I had no idea exactly where it was coming from because it was coming from such a far distance away. And at the time, I didn't know that, but I just, I couldn't tell where it was coming from.

But I knew just based on the sound that it was kind of like to the right of the stage or behind and to the right of the stage, that general area. And so as soon as that first volley stopped, I told the girls, okay, we're getting out of here. Stay low and move. And we started to move and another one started going off. And so we hit, we hit the ground again. And that volley was pretty long as well. And when it ended, I just decided, okay, girls were running and we're not stopping. And so I told them, move, stay low, don't stop moving.

And so from that point, we ran back to the back of that Astro Turf area and to our right around. There was like a little bar at the back of that area where the main standing area was for the concert. So we ran around that bar towards a bank of porta potty's there. And at that point, people started realizing what was going on, I think. A lot of people reacted because what I was yelling at my group. And so when we started running, a lot of people started running as well. And there was just, there was people all around us and there was people falling. And I'm sure some of them tripped, but I know at least one of them got hit because I saw it. And actually, I forgot a detail here.

When we first laid down during that first volley, somebody around us was laying down, like a group around us started laying down as well. And somebody got hit there that was laying right in front of me. His body, you heard him cry out and he flinched and he kicked me in the head. And so, you know, it was very real to, to, to, anybody in my group and anybody right around there at that point. So when we started running, a lot of people started running. Fortunately, when we got to that porta potty area, I don't know if the people who got there before us pushed that fence open or exactly how it

got opened or knocked down, but there was a way out. So we funneled through that opening. And in the chaos of getting into that funnel, we lost two of our group. So I had my wife and her best friend and the two other girls, we lost in the chaos. But we moved out of that opening and there was a little like police SUV right there. And we briefly ducked behind it. And there was just, you know, it just seemed like volley after volley after volley, a fire came. And, you know, we couldn't tell where it was coming from. It seemed like it was coming from everywhere.

and there was, you know, there was people crying out and screaming and crying. And so we just kept moving. We were just, I told the girls we're going to move that way. And that way was essentially northeast because the sound was coming from our southwest. At least the initial sound that I heard, you know. And so we just kept moving. There was a little pony brick wall that we hopped over. And then there was a line of bushes that you normally wouldn't walk through.

It was just that thick. You know, it took all of your might just to push your way through it. And so we, we walked through those bushes and I pushed the girls through first. And a girl next to us had fallen over. And the stampede was trying to push through the bush, like while she was kind of falling, falling in the bush. And I was trying to hold them back and reach over the bush and help her up. and I was able to help her up and then I pushed through the bush and right there there was

some kind of building I don't know exactly what it was if it was like a little nightclub or a little apartment building I remember it was black cinder block and there were some people taking cover there but at that point I just didn't feel comfortable running into any confined space we didn't know what was going on so we kept moving around that building towards hooters hotel and when we got to the to the south side of Hooters Hotel. There are some people ducking in the back door there in Hooters. And again, I just, I didn't feel comfortable going inside a building that I didn't know what was going on inside.

And so, and at that point, I felt like we were just too close to what was going on. So we moved around to the south side of Hooters to the east side of the building. And at that point, things kind of calmed down in the crowd enough to where people weren't sprinting. You know, people were still trying to move, but, um, but it wasn't frantic as frantic as it was trying to exit the venue. And so, um, I asked my wife to call one of her two friends that we had gotten separated from. Fortunately, they kept moving as well. And, uh, they were actually just ahead of us. So we were able to pick out a landmark right there between Hooters and a motel six. There's a big sign. I can't remember what's on it. Um, but we met right there. And right as we were

meeting by that sign, all of the sudden there was a frantic stampede to get away from Hooters. And so I don't know what exactly was going on in the hotel or what was said. All I knew is there was a bunch of people trying to get the hell away from Hooters. So we did too. So we started running again. And we just kept moving down the street. Now, as we were approaching the McCarran Airport Terminal, this is one of the weird details of the night. We're walking on the sidewalk there on the south side of Tropicana heading east.

And this sedan starts moving up. And for some reason, at the time, I was looking back. And I believe by this point, Tony, that we were told by somebody that they had. heard that a shooter had stolen a police vehicle. And so we were nervous of all cars. We didn't know who to trust. And so I was just trying to stay alert of everything going on around me that could be a threat. So this black or dark blue sedan is pulling up on on East Tropicana. And there's a young female, maybe 20s or early 30s hanging out the window, like her torso is hanging out the window and she's pointing at us like gesturing with her hand and yelling and taunting the crowd.

And that was just, that's one of those details like my stomach sank. And I just will always, I'll always remember that detail. It will stick out in my mind forever. Because it felt like my instinct at the time and that hasn't changed. Like this person knows what's going on. And she, she hates us, you know, she hates us. Like she is taking joy in what everybody here is experiencing. And that's what it seemed like.

So we, I mean, she drove by. We kept moving towards McCarron Airport on Tropicana. As we got to the airport terminal, people were funneling into the airport. And we decided at the time that we were going to go into the airport and take cover, it seemed like they're going to have security here, right? It's a secure location. But then I started thinking, there's not that much. airport security and and this is once we walked in it just felt like such a confined space in

the entrance of that terminal so we got about five steps into the terminal and turned around and decided to leave and at that point we decided we're just going to keep moving down Tropicana maybe find a cab or something like that so we we moved down Tropicana and as we passed the airport terminal there was a little shopping center on the left hand side that looked like it had some shops open so we moved across Topicana. And at that point, one thing I'll remember forever too is, you know, the cars are stopping because there's crowds of people in the road and none of them had any idea what was going on. So we're telling people don't head towards the strip, like mass shooting on the strip,

go the other way. We're trying to yell to people as they're stopped and trying to figure out what's going on. And we move across the street to that center and there's a liquor store that's still open, but for some reason they're closing, which is weird because it's Vegas. I don't know if they heard about what was going on and wanted to get out of there or what. But thankfully, they handed us some water bottles because by this time, the girls are, they're starting to cry. They're very dehydrated. They're dry heaving and vomiting. And so we got some water. And at that point, My wife reminded me that my uncle is usually in Vegas on the weekends because he's a DJ and he works out there at a lot of the clubs and things like that. And so I gave him a call and fortunately he was home.

And we made a plan to meet up at the Vons, which is like I think it's like Maryland or Mary Gold. I can't remember. And Tropicana. So that's that's moving down past UNLV. It's quite a waste down. It's about we ran, I believe, about two. and a half or 2.7 miles. And we couldn't run the whole time, but when we weren't running, we were walking fast.

And so we just decided to move down that way. Sometime during that conversation with my uncle, he did mention an Arco gas station. And there's an Arco gas station between where we were then and that Vons. And so when we got there, we called him to try to see if he could get there. But Tropicana was closed down so he couldn't. And as we were at that intersection where the ARCO gas station is, there was a limo driver right there and some cabs stopped. And there was another group there and they got the limo driver's attention.

And we were pleading with him. We were trying to explain to him what was going on. So we were pleading with him to let us in and get us out of there. And I can't remember what he said or I don't know if I even heard it all the way, but it became clear that he wasn't going to let us in. So we moved over to a cab who was going to let us in, but then she told us that she could only fit four people. and I just remember feeling so fresh it.

It's like these people don't get what's going on, you know, who cares about how many seats you have right now. You know what I'm saying. Right. And so we moved across to the Arco. I called my uncle. That's when I found out he was blocked off and he couldn't get to get to that portion of Tropicana.

So we're going to have to keep moving to the Vons. Outside that Arco huddled behind like a block wall and a trash can. was a couple that my wife noticed the the woman wasn't visibly pregnant, but she was kind of holding her belly like only pregnant women do. And my wife asked her if she was pregnant and she was. And, you know, they were hysterical. And my wife stopped and set a prayer for them. And I remember kind of giving the guy like a handshake hug and telling him good luck.

And then somebody offered us a ride in a truck. And initially we got in the back of their truck and we found out that their plan was to go back towards Hooters because somebody was missing their sister. So we decided we didn't want to go that way. So we got back out of the truck. And I remember my wife's best friend, she could hardly move at this point. So we had to help her back out of the truck. And then we just kept moving down Tropicana and eventually got to Vons and to my uncle.

He drove us back around to, we were staying off the strip on West Tropicana, past the Orleans hotel at a time share. So that's, I think, at least about a mile away from. the main strip. So we drove south around the strip back to our hotel. And I decided that we weren't going to stay the night in Vegas. It's about a three-hour drive home. So we all got back and packed our stuff up and got ready to leave and hit the road as soon as we could. Wow. Wow. That's incredible. I mean, some of the things you just described to me, I'm trying of like hold back tears because I can't imagine the the heartache that people are going through

in the moment of not knowing what's going on. One thing I want to ask you before I forget, you said your wife's best friend had a hard time moving. Was she shot? No. Fortunately, none of us were shot. She was just, you know, I was holding onto my wife's hand and she was holding onto her friend's hand. She was just frozen. Like I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I talked briefly about normalcy bias. That's generally what people do in situations like that. They freeze. And so her tendency was to basically curl up in a ball and want to go in the fetal position essentially is what she wanted to do.

But we were dragging her to get her out of there. And fortunately, you know, she moved. But if we weren't there, I have no doubt in my mind she would have laid there and hoped not to get shot. Wow. It's incredible to me to hear some of the things you're telling me. Like, for instance, just a small act that you did where you were helping the one lady, I think you said you were helping her get through bushes or something like that, where she had fallen over and there's tons of people running.

And then you said about how you got into the pickup truck, and those people were going back towards Hooters to look for somebody. In that situation, from the outside looking in, I would think that it be chaotic, which it was, but people kind of out for themselves. And what you just told me, and I've heard of the stories of actually people going back into gunfire to pull people out, it really shows me the humanity that is in people still. And in a dark time, it kind of, it does kind of give you hope, you know? I didn't realize that, I'm sorry, go ahead.

I'm sorry. It really does. And I just, I wanted to kind of interject, what something really quick there is that, yeah, and we did see a lot of that. And one of, I didn't capture any images of the actual event. But the one image that sticks out in my head that I didn't mention is once we moved out of the venue, I looked back at the crowd. And I did this very rarely because I felt a strong sense of responsibility to get those girls out of there. My wife and I have two young kids. another girl we were with has a three-year-old daughter. My wife's best friend has older kids, but they're teenagers. And the other girl we were with, her mom already lost her brother, who was an Iraq and Afghanistan veteran who came home and got murdered by somebody he didn't even know. And so the initial thought in my head when I understood what was going on was I have got to get these girls to safety. And what I was getting at is when I looked back when we exited the venue, I knew people needed help.

And I briefly felt like I need to help more people. And I looked back and I saw this small squad of LVPD. It was four or five officers. And this was probably a minute or a minute and a half into the event. And they were in formation with no tactical gear, just their sidearms. and going in information to help people. And I'm sure there was dozens of squads like that that I'm sure saved, you know, tens, dozens, maybe hundreds of lives.

That's incredible. I mean, everybody's scared. And to hear the things that you're sharing, I didn't realize when you said girls that it was young girls. I thought I was thinking women, but you're saying they were minors. No, no, no, no. I'm sorry. They have minor children. Okay.

So my wife, we're in our 30s, and the other girls are, one girl's 30s, one girl's like 28. She has a three-year-old daughter. The girl that's in her 30s, her brother is the one who is the veteran who was murdered when he got back home. And then my wife's friend is older. She has teenage daughters. Okay. Backtracking here a little bit.

one, I didn't realize that the concert was multiple nights. I was under the assumption that it was a one-night concert. I didn't realize it was a festival. That's right. And so that kind of explains because they were saying there was thousands of people there, if I'm correct in saying that. And I didn't realize that it was multiple nights, but it kind of makes sense that there'd be thousands of people there on multiple nights.

Right. It was a three-night concert, and I believe the number that I've heard is 22,000. tickets. Wow. Okay. When you, when you saw and heard the firecrackers go off, do you think that was a signal as to things starting, or do you think that was just completely random that just kind of put you on edge for, you know, a more alert state of mind for what was coming? You know what? I've had somebody suggest to me that that could have been a coincidence, just somebody playing a joke. I'll say two things about that. Number one, there was no shenanigans like that any other night. And number two, the shooting started, like I said, my initial thought was the shooting started about 15 seconds after

that. I was able to find a video where I could pinpoint when the firecrackers were. And when the shooting started, it was 22 seconds later. That's one heck of a coincidence if that's a coincidence. So I believe that that was either a signal to the shooter or a psychological warfare tactic to soften his targets or both. So if you believe that the firecrackers were a signal as to things starting, then I would assume that you believe that this was a multiple shooter event. correct? I would say that I never physically personally saw another shooter.

At the time, I felt like there was gunfire coming from different locations because it sounded like shots were some shots were close and some shots weren't. And I'm pretty, I'm an avid shooter. I'm pretty savvy

with guns. Something a lot of people don't understand is that there's two sources of bang from a gun. One is the rapid expansion of gas, which is the direct result of igniting gunpowder in a confined space. And the other one is bullets reaching supersonic speeds. The same thing we think of when we think of a sonic boom from a jet. And so I've been around gunfire from varying angles and varying distances. I belong to a private gun range. I've heard people up at the rifle range shooting

when I'm at different ranges and I've been in the rifle range shooting with other people shooting. and my experience at the time was that bullets were coming from different locations. I don't have an eyewitness account of that, but that's what my ears told me. Yeah, the way I phrased that question, there was an assumption in there, and I apologize for that. Could you tell when you were in the crowd of people at the concert, when this first started happening, could you tell the direction of the gunfire coming in? Now, obviously, we know the shooter was, a shooter was up in the Mandalay. Could you tell that's where it was coming from at the time?

It never occurred to me at the time that we were getting shot at from a hotel tower, but the general direction was very clear. The general direction from my location was southwest. And that's when I explained earlier that I felt like the shooting was coming from the right side of the stage or maybe behind the stage to that right side. That's the general direction that the shooter was in as well from my location. Now, how far away from you was the hotel? I mean, I've heard different distances.

Could you give me an estimate of how far you were away from the hotel? I believe the hotel was about 350 yards from our location. Okay. So that's, what is that? It's probably close to a quarter mile, I would say. Yeah, that's 400 yards is about a quarter mile. Yeah, so that's close. Okay. And could you tell maybe like what kind of weapons were being used or at least general idea by the sound of it? Yeah, I sort of. I mean, my initial reaction was that it was automatic gunfire. That turned out not to be exactly technically correct according to what the current story is. He had what's called a sloth.

fire or a bump stock, which simulates automated automatic gunfire by utilizing the recoil of a weapon to continuously pull the trigger each time the weapon recoils. So I assumed that it was automatic fire because that's what it sounded like, which is odd because there's been no mass shooting in America with automatic weapons. So I assumed it was automatic gunfire. I could tell that it was a rifle for sure. Rifles have a distinctly different and sharper sound than pistols. And I don't know that I could have told you what round that he was shooting. I've heard a lot of 5,56, which is what an AR-15 typically shoots. That platform can be multiple calibers, but your standard.

day R15 is 556 or also what's known as 223, which are basically an interchangeable round in the right gun. So that's probably what I, and when I'm thinking back, that's what I assumed we were getting shot at with. I don't know that I ever listened for the distinction between the sound of different types of rounds in that situation. I was more focused on getting the girls out of there. But I did definitely feel like I heard shots coming from.

different locations and primarily from different distances because people don't realize how fast the intensity of gunfire drops off at distance and it's actually more so than you would think than most people would think and so it's a distinctly different sound when somebody's relatively close to you versus somebody being that far away yeah now I've definitely heard people talk about that over the past few days and stuff. And I'm learning a lot because, I mean, just hearing what people talk about when it comes to the guns and the drop off and velocity, it just the more I hear, the more I feel like it just almost like simple math leads you to believe that there would have to be at least a second person involved. Now, when it comes to that guy that was shot in front of

you do you have any idea what happened to that guy i i really don't um like i said i was really focused on getting those girls out of there um at the time you know you there there was a tug at my heart change to try to help that guy but i also felt like we're under direct fire i don't know if i can do anything for that guy you know and so uh we just we tried to move out of there yeah that's understandable i was just curious because um that's got to be so, I don't know. Like, I just can't imagine what you were thinking and what you were going through. You know, you get kicked in the face by somebody who just got shot.

You're trying to save everybody that you're there with. And it's got to be like a split mentality where it's like you want to help somebody, but you also have to help the people you're with, like your wife and her friends, you know? Yeah. I heard somebody say over the last few days and I can't remember who said it. but um and it's it's a sad thought and it's sad that we have to even talk about this but basically he said you can't help somebody if you're dead and and you have to kind of assess what kind of likelihood you have of of of getting somebody out of there or getting them to

help versus uh you know being able to help them if you get shot too that's absolutely right I mean, bottom line is if you're down and out, there's nothing you can do for the people you're with and your loved ones. That's a hard decision to make in the moment for sure. When you were running away and I think you said you were approaching Hooters, do you know how far Hooters was from the Mandalay? I'm not exactly sure. I'd have to look at a map. If I had to give you an estimation, I'd say Hooters has to be. be at least 700 yards, 800 yards away from the Mandalay Bay. Is there a direct line of sight between the two buildings? From his story, I can't say for sure, but from where he was in the tower, I believe that

there probably was a direct line of sight from where he was to both the south and the west sides of the building. Okay. because I'm just trying to think, I mean, when you said about the people who were running from Hooters when you were approaching, it seems to, the way you described it, it seems like there could have been somebody in that vicinity posing a threat. But I was also trying to think maybe was their gunfire coming from the Mandalay and creating the illusion that there was somebody up close? I feel like these are questions that we're not going to have answers to for a long time, if ever. Yeah, I'll tell you that with a 556 round that he was shooting, generally the military says that's beyond the effective range,

which means, number one, the energy of the round at that point is not enough to reliably kill a target. And number two, the performance of the round to get out that far is very unreliable. So if you ran like a ballistics calculator on 5,56 at 800 yards, I can't tell you exactly what it would be off the top of my head. But your bullet drop would probably be 50 feet or more. That's pretty significant if you're trying to go for any kind of accuracy towards anything really. Yeah. especially in the heat of a moment like that.

I mean, I understand that it's a big crowd of people, and if you're just trying to spray bullets at people, but you still got to have some kind of sense of direction in order to hit a target, especially if you're outside that range. Right. And at that point, there's still people inside the venue.

So I don't see why a guy in his position in the tower at Mandalay Bay would be aiming for anybody much further outside the venue when there's still people trying to help people and get out of the venue. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Absolutely. Did you hear anybody talking about, you know, maybe post this event about something happening at Hooters or in that area that would make sense for them running away?

Yeah, I actually have somebody that I personally know who was inside Hooters. And I saw some other people talking about it. You know, some people claimed that there was a shooter in Hooters. I saw one guy post a picture that, definitely appears to be in the drive-through area of Hooters because I've been to that hotel a few times. I know what it looks like. And he said that police shot a guy outside of Hooters. And there was definitely something with a sheet draped over it in the photo. And he said they draped the sheet over it. So I have heard rumor of that. I can tell you from my experience, there was definitely a panic to get out.

And my friend that was inside told me something very odd. She said that at sometime like around 11 o'clock or so. And she's marking it based on the communication on her phone and what she remembers that a solo SWAT officer came in the back door of Hooters. And I said, excuse me, did you say a SWAT officer came in alone in the back door of hooters? And she said, yeah, I'm not an expert on police tactics, but I know a little bit about it. And I don't believe they move solo in a situation like that.

Yeah, it doesn't make sense. And I know people, if they hear that, they would say, well, there's a lot of stuff going on and there's a lot of distraction and people are going all over to place. So it would make sense that they got split up, but not with SWAT. SWAT, they move as a unit and they're trained for chaos. And it's all systematic for them. So if she actually saw somebody in SWAT by themselves, that's a big red flag. That's a really big red flag. Yeah, and so that that really kind of piqued my interest when I heard that.

I'll tell you one other story that doesn't come directly from me. I don't want to get too much into the hearsay thing, Tony. But I created a witness group for people who were there to share things that they saw. And I've been encouraging people to call the FBI with things that they've seen. But one lady who was in the VIP area told me that as her and her daughter were trying to find a way out of there and make it of there and take cover that she saw somebody in a uniform she said he was wearing some kind of a yellow vest and he he looked young with dark hair and he had a ladder the type that you lean on something not like an a frame ladder and he climbed over a wall right there by the VIP area with the ladder

and she grabbed it to then let her her daughter climb up over the wall so they could get out of there and he yanked the ladder out of their hands and took it over the wall with him that's absurd that's just bizarre right so i thought about that for about 12 hours and then i contacted her back and i said please call the fbi with that detail because i just i couldn't think of any reason any logical reason somebody would take that ladder with them once you're out there's no other wall to climb other than trying to make sure other people couldn't get out you know yeah that's bizarre and then when you hear the stories of the security guards that might have been shooters that have heard. I'm not sure if you've heard these stories, but I know there's one story that's been going

around the past couple days where, and it's actually a video on YouTube, it shows a security guard in the bottom left-hand corner of a video coming into the frame and looks like he squats down and pulls up some kind of rifle and fires it into a crowd of people. It's just hard to tell because you only see his back and what his motions are, which it looks like somebody would be crouching down and pulling like a rifle up. But it's just, it's too hard to tell with how fast the video moves. Have you seen that video or heard anything about the security guards acting out like that? Yeah, I have seen that video.

And I agree. It's just, it's not a good enough video to tell exactly what happened. But it does appear to be a security guard. It could be a police officer. I'm not positive. But it doesn't look like the police officers that I saw that. So unless I didn't see some that we're wearing a different type of uniform, it doesn't look like them, you know. But yeah, you can see him get down in a shooting position and it appears like he brings a rifle up and you hear shots right then too.

You can't tell exactly if they're coming from him or not. But the video then kind of like is not focused on you can't see him anymore. So it's really hard to say exactly what happened. But it is kind of weird. especially since the police didn't know where the shooter was and there would have been no reason to be aiming at anybody in the crowd and not that that wouldn't have happened but if that person actually did fire a shot

they weren't shooting at Mandalay Bay. Well, I mean, you tell me I've never been to Vegas. Do the security guards carry guns on them? I don't know for sure. I didn't notice any security guards with guns at the show. I wasn't really looking for it, to be quite honest, which is weird, because I usually notice that kind of thing. But I didn't notice any security guards with guns. Okay.

So I'm thinking with that video, you do see, it almost looks like light in front of him when he crouches down. And, you know, I've heard people suggest that maybe it was a flashlight that he was getting down and shining into the crowd. and I'm not against that idea at all. I just, I wonder what in the, and I wasn't there, so I don't know, but what in that kind of situation would make a security guard go into gunfire, crouch down, shine his flashlight around, and then get up and leave. Because I think in that video, at the end of that video, I think it's like a 30-second video, and at the end of that video, you do see a security guard kind of enter the frame again,

like he came from that direction, kind of looks back and walks out of the frame. Have you noticed that? I don't know if I noticed that in the video or maybe I didn't even watch it that long because I was looking forward to see if he was actually shooting. I'm not sure. But I can tell you this much, Tony, there definitely wasn't any security guards that I saw carrying rifles. Yeah.

And why would they, right? Yeah. I mean, I don't know. Do you think in that kind of panic, a security guard? might have snatched a police officer's gun out of his car if he needed it? Do you think it's a possibility? I guess anything's possible in that situation, but anybody, any police officer exiting his car at that point would have been taking his rifle with him. I mean, he would have left his sidearm on his side and brought his rifle with him. So any police car that you could likely access that maybe

wouldn't have had the doors locked, you know, I don't see the rifles being left inside. That's a great point. absolutely that doesn't make any sense at all i mean especially with what's going on you take your your firepower with you wow so let's let's talk about this woman that you described earlier hanging outside of an SUV uh could you tell anything about looks with her and stuff because you know there there's been people describing i think they said it was a Hispanic lady and her boyfriend earlier in the night saying that you know you're all going to die 45 minutes before the show start And then sure enough, this all happens.

Do you know what kind of like ethnicity this woman was or anything with her looks? Yeah. Okay. So I don't know if I misspoke or maybe you missed heard me, but it was a sedan, not an SUV. And she was hanging out the passenger side window. And she was like I think I said, in her 20s or early 30s, she was a small girl. Then I don't know how tall she was obviously because she wasn't standing up exactly. but she was dark skin, dark hair, like almost black or really dark brown hair. So yeah,

she could have been Hispanic. I can't say for sure that she was Hispanic, but she definitely could have been Hispanic. Okay. Yeah. And the way you described her, I just, in my mind, I picture somebody hanging out the car window and kind of just like, in my mind, I picture somebody who is drunk after a party leaving acting stupid. Is that kind of how it looks at it, it looks at, it like to you? It wasn't it wasn't like somebody who was drunk acting stupid. It was like somebody who was making a point. I don't know how to describe it other than that. Like I said, just like the bottom fell out of my stomach when I saw it because I could tell that this person seemed like happy at what we were all going through. Like she was yelling at us like just I could feel the hate

coming from her voice and the gesture of her arm and her hands. I understand. I understand completely. So it definitely seemed like vitriol towards you. Definitely. It definitely did. Okay. You know, this is a question I wanted to ask earlier.

I just forgot. And I think you said, I don't want to put words in your mouth. I've heard so many different stories. How long did the gunfire last? Do you know? From my own account, I don't know, but going back and looking at videos and things like that, it was about 10 minutes. I can tell you in that moment, it didn't feel like the gunfire stopped until maybe the time we were exiting the airport. And I don't know exactly how long that took us.

I could maybe go back and piece it together with my phone because I did make some phone calls to my parents kind of in between all that. but I can't say for sure off the top of my head. Okay. I'm just because I've heard anything from five minutes to an hour of gunfire. And so I'm trying to figure out what is it, you know, is it multiple shooters that people saw throughout the hour? Or is it, you know, one shooter that lasted five, ten minutes? It's one of those things where I think we're still in the early stages of piecing everything together.

you know, I'm not even sure how much of the information we're actually going to get, you know, as far as how long the firing lasted and things like that. It seems like, to me personally, it seems like things have been very odd how they've handled the information going out to the public. And, you know, it just makes me raise an eyebrow a little bit as to how things have been handled so far this week. as an experiencer of this, how do you feel as far as investigations have gone and things like that? What do you think? How do you think they handled it so far? Yeah, I mean, obviously they give press conferences about the investigation.

My one hope there is because of the information we're being told. I just kind of hope that they're playing it really close to the vest and they don't want to tip any hands. that being said in a situation like this where you have so many people who witness the event and people like me with stories to tell

of, you know, firecrackers being set off or something to that effect. I feel like the media is not really doing its job. The media is not the investigate, you know, they're not the investigators. They're not the FBI or Las Vegas Metro PD. They don't have anything to play close to the vest.

And so I think that they should be looking for stuff that sounds like it's coming from people who saw something that's credible, from people who have vivid, detailed accounts of what they saw, and be publishing that information and letting the people see it and see what they think. And I don't feel like that's what they're doing at all. And it's really frustrating to me. And it's frustrating to see things like Facebook and YouTube, try to shut down information that people are trying to put out there, especially videos that are firsthand videos or people who are giving their firsthand eyewitness accounts of what they saw. Why are you censoring that? I don't understand that at all.

Yeah, I don't either. For me, I look at that. And for me, that says there's an agenda at play. I don't know what that agenda is. I can theorize, but I don't know. But the fact that they are censoring firsthand accounts on social media the way they are, I know of a guy and I reached out to him. I'm waiting for him to contact me back. He's repeatedly had his story deleted off Facebook. And there was another video that was posted on Facebook of a possible gunfire from the fourth floor of the Mandalay. And that video has been taken down multiple times. And do I, Do I think it's gunfire? I don't know. Some people say that it was a strobe light. I don't know. I've never been to Vegas.

I don't know how all the lights and everything works in that city. But the fact that it's being taken down, it's very frustrating. And have you ever heard of the book or read it 1984 by George Orwell? Yeah. If you haven't heard of that book, please read it and learn something about oppressive societies and kind of the history of what we think of them. But yeah, I have. And that's what it feels like for sure.

It feels like they're just trying to control all the information flow. And, you know, if you put something out there, you're committing thought crime, you know. So it definitely feels like that. I think I know of the guy that you're talking about, the guy who's had his post taken down, because I reached out to him because part of his story was that he saw the firecrackers as well. And so that's what first piqued my interest on his story is, oh, you can corroborate what I saw, you know. And so, and I don't know anything else about what he saw because I didn't go towards the MGM, but that's his account. Let him tell it. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, if we're talking about the same guy, I really hope I can get a hold of him and talk with him and stuff because, you know, clearly he has a story that needs to be heard.

and, you know, I'm just trying to put together pieces and allowing people to come on, share their experience, and kind of give you guys a platform to kind of get your voice out there. I guess one thing I'm curious about, and I've seen other people comment on this, have you or your wife experienced any kind of PTSD after this? Because I've heard of a lot of people dealing with that now. I think I have maybe more mild PTSD. I was fortunate to be very focused on a mission during this and focused on getting those girls out of there. I wanted my wife to see our babies again. I wanted our friends to see their babies again.

I didn't want my friend's mom to lose her other baby. So I was just so focused on getting them out of there. And so because of that, I didn't focus on and see a lot of the things that some of the girls saw. You know, two of the girls in our group saw multiple people. Just, I don't know how to say, get blown away. And my wife is a person with high anxiety anyway. She doesn't want to leave the house right now. Like I said, I think I said earlier that she has an event tomorrow for her business that I'm covering for her because she just doesn't feel like she can do it.

So yeah, people have PTSD for me. I haven't been set off a lot and I have been out in public a little. bit. A couple of things have set me off. I didn't even realize that any old barstool was the song that the firecrackers started during the end of that song until yesterday when my wife and I were in the car and it came on the radio. And it just my my heart rate shot up, my anxiety shot up. And then I vividly remembered that song being on when the firecrackers started. So I went back and I started looking for videos because all the other videos, that I'd seen had started when the gunfire started, which was during when she calls me baby.

And so I went back and I looked for videos. And sure enough, it was any old barstool. There it was. I can imagine that as time goes on, there's probably going to be certain things that trigger your memories and other people's memories as to what happened here. Because it was such a traumatic event, I really appreciate you coming on and sharing your story. And I hope that people hear this and understand that there is more information out there to be gathered than what we're hearing right now. And you have to dig for it and you have to be willing and open-minded to hear what people actually have to say. Because like we were just talking about, I mean, the censorship is incredible right now, what we're seeing on YouTube and Facebook and Google. and it's something that I've never seen before. I mean, we've seen censorship here and there.

We've heard of people complaining, hey, this has been taken down, why? But this is like mass censorship. And it's kind of scary. It's kind of scary. And that's why I brought the book 1984 because, I mean, you're talking about thought police. You know, you're talking about controlling people's thoughts by what they actually remember. If you take it off YouTube, the masses will not remember it. And it's kind of scary to think of things happening that way. But I mean, I just look at it the way it is. I'm just like, well, that's kind of how I see it. And so I encourage people to kind of just, you know, look into things yourself. Don't just take the media's word on things and be able-minded as to how this all unfolded. Before we get out of here, do you have any parting words you'd like to say?

Yeah. Tony, I really agree with, with way. you just said when you were saying that I had a thought that I don't know that I've ever had before but I just feel like with this censorship with them trying to remove videos or posts of people especially people with first-hand accounts or videos that were directly there that are unedited I just feel like a force with a very specific agenda is trying to write the history books they're trying to control what our kids learn about in school in 20 years. And how horrible is that to filter that information and make it say what they want it to say instead of what actually happened? So, you know, I guess what that said, Tony, I just, I appreciate, you know, I've never met you before,

but I think I have a pretty good sense of what you're trying to do. And I appreciate it. I thank you for trying to put information out there from people who were there, from people who have vivid details and stories to tell. Absolutely, man. And I really couldn't agree with you more. People are going to say that's crazy. You were there and you say that to people and they're going to say you're crazy for thinking that way. But I agree with you 100%. I just heard on a radio program earlier this week that somebody said that they believe that in the future you're going to

be having CNN and these mainstream media writing your history books. And what you just described there is pretty essentially what they said. It's scary to think about. It's important for us to document and keep records for ourselves because if you're just relying on YouTube and Facebook to inform you on things, you're only going to know what they want you to know. and so I don't know what else to say after that. Rick, I really appreciate you coming on. I appreciate you giving people like me an avenue to tell their story, Tony. Thank you.

You're welcome. All right. If you have any other things you'd like to talk about, feel free to get a hold of me. Okay, thank you. We work hard at being healthier. And what we really need is better quality sleep. The new sleep number 360 smart bed intelligently senses your movements, and automatically adjust your comfort and support on both sides.

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See Store for details. I want to thank Rick for coming on tonight and sharing his account with us of what actually happened that night to him and his wife and friends when they were getting shot at in Las Vegas. One of the things that Rick brought up to me after we ended the interview is that he wanted to talk about a video

that he saw online where there was shooting from a distance. You can hear it off in a distance, and then all of a sudden you hear shooting up close and they overlap each other, showing you that there was more than one gun going off at one time. I'm going to play that audio for you right now. Okay, so as you heard there, you hear a gun off in the distance. You can hear it. It's dampened. And then all of a sudden,

you hear this very sharp sounding gun go off closer to the camera. And it wasn't going off as long as the other one. So people that would like to say that it's echo, the echo would actually be the same amount of rounds fired that you heard off in the distance up close if that was echo. Also, I would like to suggest. Now, I'm not a scientist. I don't know technicalities with things, but just from my perspective. When you hear an echo, it's because you're the one creating the source of audio. So when you're in a canyon, you yell out and you wait a few seconds and then you hear your voice bounce back to you. So you hear your voice twice. When you made the voice and when it came back to you, people who are in that concert having shots fired down to them, they're hearing the source

of the gun from a distance. They wouldn't hear the echo because the echo would be heard by the guy who's firing the gun, not the people who were receiving fire. Does that make sense? They're not the source of the audio so that you wouldn't hear the echo on their end. If anything, the shooter would hear the echo on his end. On top of that, you hear two different volumes, two different sets of rounds going off with different amounts of rounds being fired at the same time. To me, that seems like a multiple shooter situation. Next up, we're bringing on Jeff, and Jeff has an interesting story to share

because he was not at the concert when the firing was going on. However, he did experience gunfire two kilometers away from the Mandalay. Without any further delay, let's bring on Jeff and hear what he has to say about the experiences he had last Sunday night. Okay, next up I have Jeff coming on,

and Jeff was also in Las Vegas at the shooting on Sunday night, and he has a different perspective as to what happened because he was at a different location. Jeff, how are you? I'm good. I'm good. How are you? I'm doing well, man. I really appreciate you connecting with me and sharing your story here. I know we are in different time zones,

and we kind of crammed this whole interview in in a very short period of time to get it out to the people. So I really appreciate that. What happened on Sunday night caught the world by surprise, and you were there in Vegas, but you weren't at the concert. So if you could just start walking the audience through where you were at, what you were doing, and what transpired while you were there? Well, first of all, I think what needs to be said is that, you know, there were, from my perspective, and what I know, there were multiple events. that occurred around Las Vegas up and down the strip that night. It wasn't just centralized at Mandalay,

as has sort of been put forward in all the stories that people are hearing. I mean, if I were to kind of say one statement about everything I'm about to talk about it, my wife and I, we were in Vegas celebrating our 10th year anniversary, and on October 1st, we were involved in an incident with an active shooter at the Belagio. And there's no, there's no mistake in my mind about that. This is something that happened. And we were there. So we were leaving.

We had just seen the Cirque de Salé show. Oh, at the Belasio there. It closed just after, I believe about 11 o'clock, you know, just outside of 11, maybe about 11, 10 local time. And we were walking through the casino. My wife stopped off to use the washroom. and then we decided we were going to continue through the lobby of the Blasio. There's the beautiful ceiling, the flowers sculpture that's on the ceiling, and then they've got like a conservatory, like a gardens on the other side of the lobby there.

So we crossed through the lobby under the famous flower sculpture, and we entered the conservatory. And at that point, you know, people were standing around. They were, everybody had like cocktails in hand. They were kind of just hanging out. It was a very kind of jovial atmosphere. that point. You know, a big show had just let out. A lot of the audience had come out and sort of followed the same path. So people had just, they had a wonderful night. My wife and I included.

And so we were taking photos in the conservatory. And all of a sudden, there was just like this crescendo of screams that started behind us in the lobby. And you could just hear screams. That's the first thing I heard were these screams. And then I heard somebody yell. there's a shooter, there's a shooter. And then I heard distinctly like five or six pops, like pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. Like, like unmistakably, gunfire. Unmistakably. It wasn't flip-flops on the floor.

It wasn't, you know, the fountains outside. These were from right outside of that lobby area. And they were very distinct. I mean, I haven't, I haven't been close enough to a gunshot. previously to be able to conclusively say 100% that was that was gunfire but in my mind that's what that's what a gun sounds like from everything I've heard on you know television and in the movies and things of that nature that's that's that's a gunshot those were gunshots so uh so so so that that happened and that was about 1120 when we heard the shots and the screams and and and people yelling

and then as I said somebody yelling that that there was a shooter so I I reached back because there were at that point you could just hear the screams and see hundreds of people coming towards us through through the conservatory through the lobby there you could just see them coming so i reached back i grabbed onto my wife's hand and uh you know we we just started moving at that point we didn't know what was happening it was the unknown fact it was there a team of people coming towards us was there one guy like what what was the what was the the, what was the actual event that had occurred? Like, who was shooting and where were they coming from? So we just started running. We just started going along with everyone else. And I mean, I tell you, there's nothing, there's no scarier moment that I've experienced in my life. Because I thought at that point, I was like, this is, like, this is it.

Like, how are we going to get out of this? Like, this is the end. Like, we are going to, we're going to die here tonight. And that's sincerely, like, what I, what I, what. what I thought. I went into immediate, like, flight mode with my wife. And I was just concentrated, you know, moreover, not even just on getting myself out of the situation, but really I'm getting her out of the situation. Because we, like, we've got four little boys at home. And we took this trip as sort of a break away from them. But, you know, I, I wanted, I wanted her,

at least her, to be able to go back. So as a, as we're running, you know, I'm, I'm trying to figure out what my next deck is. Like, what do I do? So we, we ran through the conservatory. We get to the end. And there's a, to the right-hand side of us, there's a cafe, like, Cafe Bellagio, I think. It sort of looks out to the flower garden. And so we, we turned into the cafe, and we ran to the end of the section of the cafe that we were in and there was about a four-foot wall at the end of the at the end of the cafe there just like a wall to sort of separate the upper level from the lower level. So I don't even remember how I got on top of the wall. I just know that we ran, we hit the wall.

I actually lost my wife's hand at one point because there were so many people pushing. I mean, she felt down. There were people just pushing and panic everywhere. It was crazy. Tables were being tipped over. People were screaming. Glass was being broken all over the floor. And I lost her hand, quickly found it again.

And we got to the wall. I vaulted over the wall somehow. Again, don't remember exactly how that happened. I turned around to go now get her up the wall. And there were people clawing and pulling her back and stepping over her. And at one point, she stepped onto a table with someone else to try. try to get over the wall and the table actually like collapsed over both of them and uh or under both them i should say and she uh she she went down and i just like dug down and reached over the wall and

pulled her up like i like i like i probably could have almost dislocated one of her arms how hard i pulled her like i just i wanted to get her up onto that wall with me and as again as more people were coming more panic was ensuing there and um so so she made it over the wall and lost her shoes in the process and we were then, there's a kitchen door right behind that wall. So we ran through the kitchen door down into the basement area. And we were then moved by hotel security from that point into a ballroom. And I mean, no slight against anybody. who was involved in the situation.

But hotel security at the Bellagio that night, I mean, they, there was, they were, they were as panicked as we were, a lot of them. Like, it was that initial interaction that we had. And, you know, that, that first moment, it was, it was panicked for everybody. And there wasn't a plan, you know, nobody knew what to do. It was just, let's get everybody, you know, crammed into this, into this ballroom. So, so we did that. And I mean, there was a there was a young lady from Australia who was walking alongside us. And she took my wife's hand and invited us to come sit with them.

And, you know, we had to remain as calm as possible, I guess. But at that point, again, there was so little information. While we knew was that we had heard screams and gunshots and someone yelled that there was a shooter. And then this tidal wave of people and panic and us, you know, basically running for our lives. We felt that we were in imminent danger. And everybody did. It wasn't, you know, a calm saunter downstairs. This was like, we need to get out of here because if we don't, we're dead.

Like, we're going to die. So we get into the ballroom. And my wife, what was injured, she had bumps and cuts. And, you know, she was completely just like hyperventilating, lost her breath. And immediately we grabbed our phones and, you know, started to make calls to friends and family members. My wife's mom was at home back here in Canada with our little boys. And so we, she called and basically said, like, you know, this incident has happened. And, you know, we, like, we don't know anything, but this, like, not nearly as calm as how I'm saying it now, obviously.

Like, it was, you know, like the last call because we didn't know what was going on or if we were going to be able to get out of that. Because at that point, you know, we were in the ballroom, but still you're in this ballroom with, like, rows and rows of doors and two exits behind us. And, like, it was very open to people to come in and out of that space. So if at that point, as we had assumed, there was somebody in the hotel who was trying to hurt people, like, there was so many ways for them to make it into that room. So, you know, just being, like, hypervigilant and at the same time just not knowing what was going to happen. happen. So, you know, we were, we were in the ballroom for about an hour. And at that point,

the, there had been a couple different reports that people were reading online of, you know, multiple shooters taking over the Las Vegas strip essentially. And our phones were dying, people that were back in Canada who, because I posted on social media, I said, you know, like friends and family, like, we're okay. A lot of people knew that we were going to Vegas. There was a big deal. It was our 10-year anniversary. So we weren't private about it.

We were pretty excited. And a lot of friends and family were super happy that we were getting an opportunity to go away. And so we talked about it to lots of people knew. And so they were, of course, all concerned because they'd heard the news. And so we put that message out to them. And our phones were dying slowly at this point. So we were losing our connection to the story and to understanding what was happening. And they were also reporting to us that, you know, there were reports of a few different incidences along the strip.

So that kind of cemented it for us that this was a multiple person event. This was something that was happening for lots of people in lots of different areas. Like they were, this was a takeover or something, something of a bigger nature. And at that point, the, there was a police officer, a plain closed police officer was wearing a, a Las Vegas PD badge. But he walked to the front of the room and addressed the crowd and told them

that told us, I should say, that we, there was a, there was an incident involving one man, one shooter, and he was deceased. And so this was after, you know, the shooter at Mandalay Bay had been,

had been found deceased. So this was, this was the information that he was relaying. He was very, insistent on one shooter. I mean, that was a fact that he really tried to hammer home multiple times. You know, one shooter, one shooter, one shooter, one shooter.

Like, I don't know. There were so many times that he said that. And, you know, we were all standing there, like, well, Mandalay Bay, what about, like, what happened here? Like, what about the Pelagio? Because we understood, having, you know, walked the strip for a couple days, how far away Mandalay Bay was.

You know, it's about two kilometers. away from where we were. It's farther down the strip. So we thought, yeah, okay, that's your one shooter, but what about, like, what just happened here? What about us? What about the Bellagio? And he told us that we were free to go if we wanted to.

And so this was about an hour after that initial volley of gunshots that we had heard. So we, everybody just started to kind of wander out out of the hotel, out of the lobby. out of the lobby or out of the ballroom, I should say. And my wife decided that she wanted to go back and try to find her shoes because we're walking through the casino and we're walking, you know, through the lobby and there's glass everywhere. You know, glass from, I don't even know where the glass came from, but as we walked through that lobby, there was definitely glass there. So we went back through the conservatory to go grab her shoes. an employee had her shoes and was sort of taking them to the back because they were starting to clean up. So we saw the broken tables and all sort of the aftermath of the chaos.

And we're in the cafe Bellagio again. And we hear the screams again. And people just start running again. And so we're thinking like, what on earth is going on here? And so we go back down into the kitchen with a group. of people. And at this point now, everybody is trying to be really quiet because now it feels like there's somebody in the hotel still that, you know, they're, the police aren't aware of something because there's people screaming again. I did not hear shots the second time, but I did hear,

I did hear the screams and people started panicking and running. And then from there, we were brought back down into the, into the ballroom again, the same ballroom as before. And we remained there for about four hours. We were locked down till just after four o'clock in the morning. And, you know, social media reports coming in from Mandalay Bay. I overheard conversations a few times with the officer that was there. And, you know, the question of, you know, how they were going to get people out of the hotel safely came about a few times that I overheard him talking to somebody via phone, you know, how they were going to get people out, what direction they should have to. people travel. They locked the strip down to traffic and they just had foot traffic and they actually

started escorting groups of people at about four. They started escorting groups of people to their individual hotels, to the Aria and to the Caesars and to the hotels that were sort of in the direct area there. And then, you know, they let sort of everybody go out at about just after four o'clock, but they didn't let us leave out the front lobby of the hotel. So where we had originally heard those shots, we were not permitted to go back along that area. They sent us out sort of a farther back exit at the Bellagio. And then the area in front of the lobby there was was cordoned off. Like we couldn't get to that space. So, you know, it was it was just an absolutely terrifying night. One of, you know, it sticks with both of us. And I mean now, you know, we have a

situation where, you know, we, you know, there's nightmares and there's just, it's, you never forget something like that. So I think it's important for people to know, though, like this, this happened. I mean, there was an incident at the Bellagio that was more than just, you know, what's been reported and what's sort of being debunked by some of the mass media right now. Wow, that's pretty incredible with everything that you said because there's so many different things that make you question the narrative that's being pushed right now. When you first were in the Bellagio, and I believe you said you were looking at some kind of garden, right? Yeah, yeah, there's a big, like a, I call it a conservatory, but I'm not sure what the actual name of it is.

They have sculptures throughout the years. There were two big peacocks in this garden right now with natural flowers and pumpkins because it's fall and all this stuff. It's a beautiful space, really beautiful. Okay. So where you were at, was that closer to the outside of the building than the gunshots that you heard in, I believe you said it was the cafe that you heard of the gunshots? Where'd you hear the gunshots again? We heard the gunshots from the conservatory. The conservatory.

So that flower garden area, the lobby of the hotel, there's the famous flower sculpture in the ceiling, this beautiful lit, very colorful, awesome sculpture. in the ceiling, that's the lobby, and the check-in desk and all that's right there. And the conservatory is the next space that you move into if you cross through the lobby. So the shots sounded like they came directly from the lobby, like directly from behind us where we were in the conservatory. Okay. So there's, for generic terms, there's the entrance to the building, there's a lobby, and then there's the conservatory, right? Yeah. Yes. Okay. So you were at the conservatory and the gunshots sounded like they came from the lobby, which is between you and the exit of the building. Yes. Yeah. Gotcha. Exactly. So do you get the sense that the gunshots you heard

came in shortly after you were there and just started firing away? Do you think this might have been something where they were there and they decided to show themselves at a strategic time? I don't know. I mean, if they were there, I mean, that was part of my fear, too. because at one point they started letting, like, Bellagio guests go back up to their rooms and then come back down. So they could kind of cross back and forth from the hotel ballroom into their rooms. And so part of my fear was like, well, if there's an active shooter here or maybe multiples, like, they could, they could just go up to their rooms and come back down with, you know, weapons. And they know exactly where everyone is at this point. So I don't know if it was somebody from outside or somebody from inside.

You know, the shots may have come from outside, the shots may have come from inside, but it sounded from my, from my recollection, like they came from from the lobby, from directly either outside of the lobby or physically from within the lobby itself. But I don't know if it was somebody that entered the building or somebody that was already in the building. Because, of course, we were taking photos of the flowers. We weren't really looking at what was happening behind us at that point. And at that point, I'm assuming because everybody's comment. the building, most people, if anybody, nobody probably knows about Mandalay, right? I hadn't heard anything about it. We had been in, oh, which started at 930 local Vegas time, and didn't let out till just after 11. It's a 90-minute show. So, you know, there were, we were all,

like, a good, you know, a few thousand of us were on lockdown to, so to speak, inside of a stage show. So we hadn't heard anything at that point. There was no announcements or, you know, the show didn't get cut short. There was nothing, no panic or anything. It was just, you know, and the incident had occurred all the way through the show. Like, when we were in the show, Mandalay Bay was happening. And the interesting thing that I find is, like, at the point where we actually hurt shots, you know, the way the timeline that's being sort of publicized goes is that Paddock was already deceased. Like the incident at Mandalay was over and the shooter was dead.

So then there were the shots that occurred even after that. So after that incident was sort of was clear and everything had ended, we experienced what we experienced at Bellagio after the fact. Well, approximately what time of the night was it when you heard the shots? And also like building off that, how long of a gap was that from when Mandalay was done? Let's not even say when it began, but when it was over when the attic was dead. it was about the same time. From everything that I've seen online, I mean, the shots started approximately 1120 in the Bellagio. The last photo that either my wife or I took was right before that of the gardens. And so we have a timeline because we took those photos and then we were involved in that situation immediately at that point. So it was about 1120, which, you know, timeline wise, Paddock was deceased at 1120. So it happened right at the point that's being reported in the media as the Mandalay Bay incident being over. And from what I began, from what I've read, I believe the Mandalay Bay incident happened just after 10.

Like 10.08, I think is the one time that I've seen. So we were in the stage show. We were in O at that point. So, you know, we didn't hear shots until at least like an hour and 12 minutes after Mandalay had started. Yeah, and so that's interesting because you said Mandalay is about two kilometers away from Bellagio and dead men don't walk. So if this is a lone shooter, how is it that you're hearing gunfire two kilometers away at the same time the shooter is supposedly dead? Well, and people have suggested that maybe we heard echoes or heard the gunfire from Mandalay in the lobby of the lobby of the lobby. Langeo, and I mean, that doesn't work for two reasons. Number one, timeline, but number two,

distance, you know, there's just, no, we didn't, we didn't hear that fire inside of a building, you know, an hour and 12 minutes after it occurred and inside of the building that's two kilometers away. Like, that just doesn't add up. So, I mean, if, if you sort of think of it in a couple of terms, I mean, either, either there was something that happened that was separate from Mandalay. So, you know, maybe, maybe somebody starts shooting in the lobby of the Bellagio, like a citizen that isn't necessarily connected. I don't know. Maybe it is connected in some way.

Maybe it was police gunfire. I don't know. I don't know where the shots came from. But I know that there were shots. There was a weapon being actively discharged near the lobby of the Belagio Hotel and Casino at 1120 local time. That is something that I would feel comfortable giving that as my. as a sworn statement, I heard those shots. And there were multiple other people who were in discussions after the fact, like in the actual hotel, as we were locked down, you start talking with people.

There are other people who heard shots. One gentleman I talked to said, you know, he knows, he knows that he's a, he's a shooter. Like this guy has weapons and he said he smelled gun. He could smell the discharge. He said he smelled it in the lobby. So I don't know. But there was a, weapon. There was a weapon that was discharged in that area while we were there. You know, and it's, I find it interesting because you guys are ushered into the ballroom and then you're released and then ushered away again because somebody's yelling, there's a shooter, there's a shooter. And I believe you said after that second time that happened, you had heard a police officer discussing on the phone strategies on how to get people

out of the building. I guess this is like a two-part question because around roughly, what time of the night was it when you heard that officer discussing this? Because in my mind, it's not going to make sense as far as the timeline goes. If there's one shooter, why are they strategizing how to exit a building that late after the shooting? Yeah, you know, I think maybe a, maybe part of it at that point is that there's confusion, I think, with the officers. And maybe they don't quite, you know, they're trying to be certain, you know, because it would be a tragedy if they released, you know, however many people were in that ballroom out into the street and all of a sudden, gunfire opens up from somewhere else on the strip. So I think, you know, part of it was then being

conscious. But that was about 3 a.m. when I overheard that conversation about how they were going to safely get everybody out of the building. My wife had needed a break from the room we were in, so we were permitted to go to use the washroom. And he was in the hallway having that discussion on his cell phone with somebody that was, you know, obviously a part of the investigation. The, and I'll just say one thing, too, like when we were released out to the strip and we had to walk from the, like, we were actually staying at the MGM grand. So we had quite a, quite a walk back to our hotel. There was no, I mean, the monorail wasn't running. There was no traffic other than police cars on the strip.

You couldn't, you know, call an Uber or a cab. So people had to walk. And when we were walking down the strip, I mean, there was a very distinct police presence. We saw SWAT in the lobby of the Belagio. There was a SWAT team member that was in the lobby. And this is before the second push down into the ballroom, by the way. When we were told we could leave after an hour, we walked through the lobby. And there was a SWAT member that was there standing in the lobby of the hotel.

But then as we left, like when we went to go back to the end. MGM Grand, there was literally a police officer probably every 30 feet all the way down the strip. And they had, you know, automatic weapons ready. Like the strip was completely locked down. Nobody was getting in and out of that space without, you know, being seen by a police officer. And it was, you know, we were told to have our key cards out so we could show that as identification. So they could identify us and know that we were actually staying at hotels. So they were definitely alert and looking.

for someone was the thought that we had at that point. And that was even as we were told to leave at 4 a.m. I mean, they seemed to be actively investigating and trying to ensure that the strip was locked down and safe. And there were no other people that were trying to harm citizens at that point. Okay. Now, you mentioned just a few seconds ago about a SWAT member. I think you said, was the SWAT member in the ballroom with you guys? No, no. The SWAT team personnel that we saw was standing in the lobby of the Belagio when we were tall, after we were told to leave the first time, when we went back to get my wife's shoes, he was standing in the lobby. And there was luggage. People were checking in and had just kind of abandoned luggage and things, obviously, because there was an incident. And then we saw the SWAT member at that point.

Okay, so you saw a SWAT member just by himself, right? Yep, standing by the doors, the entranceway to the Belagio Hotel. And he was checking in people, he was actually doing something? No, he was just standing there with his weapon. And this was after the paranoia of the gunfire, right? The first round after we had been told to leave the ballroom, because things were at that point safe. So this was after we'd been down there for an hour. And then how long after you saw him did somebody yell gun?

And I'm asking this question, I just realized it probably sounds cryptic to you, but I had just interviewed somebody who said they also saw a SWAT member by themselves and it struck them odd because they don't ever remember seeing SWAT members by themselves anywhere else. And they thought that maybe that they weren't suggesting anything that they were just saying that it struck them odd that a SWAT team member would be by themselves. And in the conversation, I kind of concurred to that because anytime I've ever seen SWAT, you know, on TV, rating houses or something, they're always doing things systematically together in a team. And I'm just asking that for that reason. You know, here's here's here's a, this is what I can say. You know, I agree. I mean, the media portrayal of SWAT, but I've seen they've always sort of moved as a unit. So what in thinking back on it, yeah, that is pretty strange.

But no, he was just a singular swat with full tactical gear, helmet, whole nine, and a weapon. And he was standing at the sort of the entranceway to the lobby of the Bellagio, just him by himself as we were crossing through to go back and look for my wife's shoes in the cafe at that point. Now, this was, we did not see him in that first exchange. This was after the initial panic and we had been released from that first ballroom. As we were coming back through, we saw the singular SWAT guy by himself. And I know it was a SWAT guy too because my wife had made a comment about how she had never seen a SWAT personnel before at that point. And so it was kind of like, oh, gee, like this is like something obviously happened here because there was a SWAT team member right there waiting. But yeah, there was a singular SWAT, just one guy.

Okay. Yeah. And I don't want to, you know, suggest anything that, you know, they were up to no good kind of thing. I mean, I know my previous interview, I did, you know, find it odd myself that they were by themselves. But, you know, who knows in these kind of situations, how everything's handled. I mean, you're more than likely undermanned in these kind of situations because you're basically locking down an entire city trying to make sure everybody's safe. And I imagine everybody's pretty spread thin. Well, and see, that was that was another, like, another thing that we, like, that had crossed my mind. And I don't know it, but I was like, maybe the gunfire that we heard, like, was that crowd control? Like, maybe that's a technique that we're not aware of. Like, maybe they fire off their guns to control a crowd. I don't know. But in that, in that first, that first exchange, you know, you go back after, like, at later, like, five, six in the morning, like, when we're back at the hotel and we start to try to process the whole thing. I don't know. I don't know what the techniques that they use in an active shooter situation are. I doubt it. I doubt that came from a SWAT member or law enforcement. But I don't know. I do not know.

Yeah, it's all speculation. And it is what it is. I'm the kind of person that I will go there. I will think outside the box a little bit and just speculate because I operate underneath the assumption, not the assumption, but I operate underneath. the context of, you know, a good detective is a conspiracy theorist in a sense because they go onto a crime scene and they theorize how things conspired. And that's how you solve mysteries. And so I tend to ask some questions that are kind of like a little on the outside of the fence, but for a purpose. When you were running away initially and the whole crowd was going, what were you feeling in that moment when, especially when you kind of like lost contact with your wife, physically for a few moments. I mean, like, I have a wife, and we just celebrated 10 years of our wedding in June. And, oh, congrats. Thanks. So I can't imagine what you were going through. You're

celebrating your 10-year anniversary with your bride. This is going on. You're scared, and all of a sudden you see her getting trampled on by a crowd. Like, what was running through your mind? Well, you know, we had just, like, we got into Vegas on Friday night, and we were there. And we were there, Friday, Saturday, we went and had amazing experiences, saw fantastic shows. The whole weekend was just, like, picture perfect. Like, we were having such an amazing time. Vegas was so good to us. And so then Sunday night, you know, the show we were seeing, we had, we bought tickets well in advance. We were both very excited. It was a show that my wife had been looking forward to for years. Like, she saw clips of the show like 10 years prior before we even made it there and was like,

someday I want to see that show. So we saw the show and it's a beautiful, surreal, just beautiful imagery and it's uplifting. It just makes you feel incredible. And so we went from this very high, wonderful feeling of, you know, just having seen this spectacle to just fear and panic and feeling like we were like I was making plans to put myself between my, my wife at that point and whatever was coming at us so that she could make it back home to our children, like to our four boys. Like it was, you never know how you're going to react in one of those situations. And so when you're faced with it, I mean, you don't even know where to go mentally.

Like it's still, like I still, like I close my eyes and I think back sometimes. And I feel the fear just as real as I felt it, you know, at that point today even. Like it's still there. It's still very, very raw, very present. My thought was, you know, I need to get her out of the situation and back to Canada. As in whatever, however that's going to happen, that's what I needed to do. And that's what I felt I needed to do at that point. So you start making plans.

You start looking around for, you know, exits and tables and, you know, things that you're going to be able to use in order to survive the situation. And that's, that's, you know, where I found myself at so many points, so many moments throughout that exchange when we were running. it was just like I have to get her out of here. Like I need to get her out of here as quickly as possible. Yeah. I can only imagine your thoughts running through your head because everything you're describing is like I have filled in my heart, in my gut that I was there, you know, because I just put myself in your situation. Post this event, this whole week that you guys have been back home, have you or your wife or both you experienced any kind of PTSD on this? Oh, undoubtedly.

Yeah, like we've spent, the life isn't back to the way that it was previous just yet. I mean, you know, my wife just finished having ultrasounds and x-rays and things to, because she had, you know, some what she, what we thought was damaged to one of her ankles and then she's got bruising all over. So we had ultrasounds for internal, you know, bleeding and things of that nature. Once we got back to Canada, we had, we sent something. for all that work and her doctor sent her for all that work. So physically, she's still really, you know, she's in, she's in not the worst shape that she could be. Obviously, there could have been much more than happened, but still, she's banged up. But as far as PTSD, I, I don't doubt it for a second that that's what we're both experiencing right now. I mean, just, just last night,

I had another nightmare about, you know, going, going right back to that situation. So sleep has been, hard to come by you know emotionally you know my wife was in a crowd she took one of our children to uh he's he does some athletics and she took him to his practice and she was in a crowd and she she made a comment about how that made her feel and how she she started to just spontaneously cry because she felt uneasy about that um so yeah 100% like we're we're both we're both we're both actively seeking counseling right now uh for for that because you don't like you you You think it happens and you forget about it and you move on, but you can't be that afraid and have that much adrenaline and that type of emotional experience and have it just erase itself the following day. No, we're dealing with it every day.

And I mean, it's only been a few days. I'm sure it will get better over time. But, no, it's raw. It's still very raw. Kind of backtracking here. when you were escorted out of the ballroom the first time, and then I think you said you guys ran, did you say you ran back to the kitchen the second time?

Yeah. Okay. When you were allowed to leave there, you weren't allowed to go the same direction that you initially were going the first time you were allowed to exit. Is that correct? Correct. Okay.

So to me, that kind of, suggest something happened in that direction that you're not allowed to go in that direction now. Is that how you feel? Well, they didn't let us go back to towards the lobby. They, they us out a different exit. You know, I don't know if it's near the rear or where it is exactly, but I know that we didn't, we did not exit out the standard lobby. That section was, we were not permitted to go back there. Okay. And I don't know why. I don't know if that was a safety thing or if there was something that they had occurred there, but the entire collective of people that left the Blasio Hotel was ushered out a very specific exit, which was not the

traditional entrance or exit for that hotel. So you're at home, you're dealing with this stuff, and you've told people what happened to you. And you mentioned earlier about how people are suggesting that, you know, well, they don't see this on the news. What are you talking about? Do you get a lot of people or has anybody like outright refuted you saying that can't be? Or do people generally believe what you're telling them? You know, I, I'm fairly active on social media and I had shared my story on my social media page. And yeah, there were people that had posted that, you know, the media, you know, the reports show that there were no shooters at the blog. that it's this is this is this is all conspiracy BS is what one one poster had said

people suggesting that we heard echoes or the sounds of televisions from in the hotel that were just replaying the Natalie Bay incident yeah like there are there are people who who were not there who are directly following the narrative that the media is putting out that are refuting it and saying nope there's no way And I guess I don't blame them in a way because the story that everybody's being sort of spoon-fed right now is very, very direct and very, you know, it's one story, which is interesting because, you know, we live in an era of this alleged fake news and all these media outlets where sometimes you'll hear one media outlet report a story that you only hear on that particular media outlet. You kind of go, well, maybe this is a concocted story or what's their source. But every single media outlet is reporting the exact same story about the Vegas incident, which to me, you know, that kind of feels like there might be a manufactured narrative there. Because nobody's saying anything that's a little different.

It's all the exact same, the same terminology, the same, you know, they're all using the same story. So I don't know. I don't know what's happening. I don't know who is sort of at the helm of this. whole thing, but I guess to answer your question, yeah, there are people who are listening to the stories, Tony, and they directly are refuting our experiences, and it's frustrating because, you know, we were there, we had the experience, and, you know, as I said, I would, I would give a sworn statement saying that, you know, my wife and I were involved

in a situation with an active shooter at the Bellagio on October 1st. There's nothing in my mind that will push that aside. That is what happened. I was there firsthand. I experienced it. And yeah, that's that's that's that's the story. And it's a story that's being corroborated now by, you know, hundreds of other people. I'm seeing stuff come out online and on YouTube and, you know, people are telling their stories and sharing their stories. So, you know, you can't, you can't keep that story quiet. It's going to become public knowledge. There's enough people that were there that experienced it and you know we're not all we're not all hearing flip flops and echoes that there were gunshots we we heard gunshots that night yeah i i agree with you i mean i've said it before

if the media was doing their job i wouldn't have to be doing this show you know like if they if the media would reach out to you and people like you getting your accounts of what you actually saw and what you heard because you were there then we'd be probably further along in this And I'm very curious as to how long they're going to play this game of denying your accounts. Because like you just said, I mean, they can't go on forever denying this with all these people saying that a different story. However, I really could kind of see them just pushing it off, pushing it off until this whole thing dies off. Because one thing with our culture is it moves so fast in this social media driven culture now. and people are so quick to move on to the next thing that I think if they push this off long enough without coming out with anything, the next thing will pop up and everybody's going to start forgetting about Vegas.

100%. 100%. Is that the plan? Is that the goal? Maybe it is. I don't know. Well, you know, and I think sometimes we even do it to each other. I had one of my followers on my social media feed posted their experience because they were in the Excalibur.

and you know which is like right across from a concert area there where um where where so many people were were killed that night and um they they she said that you know she said she knows that a gunman ran through the Excalibur before they were locked down um and she was told that by a security personnel at the hotel at the casino so there was a gunman that ran through the Excalibur and they were locked down they were locked down they were. weren't released there until 530. So, you know, and this is something that was not reported in the media, but so she posted her story, you know, that, you know, about about this on my feed. And immediately, you know, there were people who refuted her claim and started, you know, posting negative

things. And so she deleted it. So the story went away. And so, you know, I think it's important if you're, if, you know, some of your listeners are listening and they were there and they experienced it, like, don't start to feel like you're crazy and shrink away and stop telling the story. No, no matter what people are saying, stick to your message. You know, stick to that story. Do not do not change that story or erase that story because somebody says that it didn't happen. You know it happened. So you need to tell as many people that story as possible because that story needs to be told. So don't, you know, if you have a story and I'm hearing reports of people having their posts deleted on social media and, you know, your friends and family telling them that they're, they didn't experience it.

And, you know, as somebody who is there and, you know, speaking to any other person who was at the Belagia or any other hotel that had an incident on October 1st, like, let's, let's keep telling these stories, guys. Let's not, let's not be, you know, kind of forgotten as a voice because there was something that occurred, something that we experienced. And, you know, there weren't necessarily deaths that occurred at these other spaces, but there is part of a, part of a story there that I think is part of this bigger event that happened at Mandalay Bay. So, you know, the truth needs to kind of come to light. And eventually, I think it will if we all continue telling this story. Yeah. And as far as I'm concerned, the confessionals, this show is a place for people. to come and share their experiences. So if anybody's listening to this show and was there and needs an

outlet to share their story, I'm very much available to record with you and allow you to come on and share your story. Depending on how many people start contacting me, I might even open up an additional show on another day of the week just for these people's stories to get out. It all depends on, you know, how many people are, start contacting me. But, you know, I put out a show every Saturday night. And I'm more than willing to put out a show every Sunday night as well for this specific event. When you mentioned, you mentioned about the Facebook and the censorship and stuff, that's something that's very real going on. And that's not even just from people who are hammering other people and then they're deleting their posts. But Facebook themselves are deleting

posts of people that were there. There was a guy, I'm not going to mention his name, because I have not actually had direct communication with him yet, but he posted his account on Facebook, and it got deleted, and I think it got deleted more than one time. And YouTube, there was a video going around of a possible fourth shooter, or not fourth shooter, another shooter on the fourth floor. And that was earlier this week, and I saw that video, and the video was deleted a couple times. And I think it's on YouTube again now, but there seems to be active censorship going on with this. And it makes you feel like there's, like you said earlier, that there's the same talking point by all these channels and news heads. And I'll tell you a

story real quick that I haven't told anybody yet. But I have a private Facebook account that I keep for just friends and family because I have a lot of people on my Facebook because of the show and things like that, that, you know, I tend to want to have a little bit more of a private life as well. And I had that profile open and I started having problems with it this week. And I actually got locked out of it early this week. And then I got locked out of my public profile earlier this week as well. The more I started talking about what was going on in Vegas, I was actually in the middle of talking to somebody about coming on my show and scheduling an interview, not for Vegas,

but for something else. I was in the middle of chatting with him. And I got locked out of my account for a few hours before my wife was able to get me back in. in and my private account has since been deleted by Facebook. They deleted my private account. And I don't know why. They don't give me a reason. They just locked me out. They asked me to verify my identification and I had to do some things like upload a picture of myself and they said they'd get back to me. And it was days. And then I think it was yesterday or a day before I tried logging on and they said this account has been deleted. And is it revolving around this whole event in Vegas? I doubt it.

but I don't know why they did that to me. But my point is saying that is there is censorship going on from the organizations themselves. And I'm not sure why. And I'm not sure where they get off doing that, especially some of these organizations, you know, claiming they're trying to stop all this fake news and all that stuff. And then they go and add to conspiracies like censoring people who were actually there at the event. You know, it was like the following day. I think it, what day was it now?

It was right after I was on my Facebook account. And one of my suggested, there was a suggested app that popped up as an advertisement. And it was for a game called Sniper 3D, which is a shoot, like a first person shooter, a little pocket game for your phone. And it directly shows people being like gunned down from afar in this, like a sniper on top of a roof, basically gunning down people. And it was right in my timeline. Like it was like Facebook.

Sometimes I wonder like if, you know, maybe. And I know like they monitor us as much as they, as we think they do. I'm sure they do. Maybe even more so. But then, you know, if they took just five minutes and looked at my timeline, they could see that, you know, maybe he just posted about this experience he had where he encountered a shooter. So now we're trying to sell him a game where the goal is to shoot.

kill people. Like, it was it was targeted advertising at its absolute worst. Right. Um, so, you know, I, I think there's a lot that, you know, Facebook is getting wrong and that there, there's, there's stuff going on there too. I don't know what, but yeah, it's, uh, yeah, absolutely. There's, there's a reason why people are having these experiences and things are being shut down and, you know, the, the truth is kind of being, being silenced a little bit. And I don't know what it is, but, you know, hopefully this, uh, this edition of the program that you're doing, you know, allows others to have their stories heard and to have their stories be put out there so that, you know, they can't delete everything. They're not going to delete every single podcast and post. And I mean, now, like I posted my account on my social media feed.

And it's been, it's been seen by almost 19,000 people. So it's, you know, the story's not going to go away anytime soon. Absolutely. I absolutely agree with you. Well, Jeff, before we get out of here, do you have any parting words you'd like to share with people that may be either. experienced something in Vegas as well or even the people who have not but have heard the stories? You know, I think if you weren't there, you know, understand that there are people who were there and that their stories are credible. I mean, we experienced these things. They happen to us. If you were there and you are now experiencing, you know, something that you don't understand, like how you feel or why you feel a certain way, just kind of know the symptoms of PTSD and get get some help in that regard too because that's the type of thing that can go

undiagnosed for months and confessor and can really can really change your life in a in a not so positive way so you know if you weren't there believe those of us who were and if you were at the belagia or any of the other hotels that may have had incidences occur or you know heaven forbid you're at the route 91 festival and you were there and you you saw you know people lose their lives in front of you. Get help. Reach out. Get as much help as you can. Absolutely. I couldn't have said it any better. Jeff, I really appreciate you coming on. And if there's anything I could do for you or if you ever have anything you'd like to share with people, just let me know. 100%, Tony. Thank you for giving at least one voice a platform to have this story be heard by

even more people. I absolutely appreciate it. Absolutely, man. I really just, I just want to spread the truth around, so thanks for coming on. No problem. Anytime. Well, that's Jeff in his account of what happened to him and his wife at the Bellagio, two kilometers away from Mandalay. I want to let you guys know that I am going to be providing the video portion of the audio I played for you after Rick's interview. I'll be putting that on the website along with other videos.

The website is www. the confessionalspodcast.com. that's the confessionalspodcast.com. And if you're somebody who has experienced the horrific tragedies in Vegas, and you'd like to come and talk to me about what you experienced firsthand, please get a hold of me. My email address is the confessionals podcast at gmail.com. That's the confessionals podcast at gmail.com. You can also go to the website.

There's a tab for the connection section. If you click the connection section, you'll be able to reach me that way as well on the website, the confessionalspodcast.com. Also, I want to let you know that we are planning on pushing back tonight's original episode for Wednesday night. So if you're tuning in to listen to that, it will be available Wednesday night at 6 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. I hope everybody has a good week.

Take care and stay safe.