The Confessionals - 410: Investigating Waverly Hills

Episode Date: January 25, 2022

In Episode 410: Investigating Waverly Hills, we are joined by Trey. Trey got into paranormal investigating to prove that it was all a joke and not real. That concept changed during his first investigation, when he filmed a ghostly entity through a window as it moved back and forth. Since that first night, he has done many investigations, including multiple visits to the famously haunted Waverly Hills Sanatorium. But just as his entrance into paranormal investigationas was not for typical reasons, his exit was anything but typical as well, as Trey had a bigfoot encounter that pushed him out of paranormal investigating and into chasing down the legendary beast. Join The Confessionals on "The Spirits Are Inn" tour when we visit the Shanley Hotel in New York on April 8-9, 2022 as we have a two-day and one-night haunted adventure! Contact Creed and Jen at Educated Wanderer to reserve your spot today!Email: [e-mail]: 973-513-9001Website: educatedwanderer.com Become a member for AD FREE listening and EXTRA shows: theconfessionalspodcast.com/join MAILING ADDRESS:STE 36188 Glocker Way,Pottstown, PA 19465 SPONSORSGET Surfshark: surfshark.deals/confessionals GET Cerebral: getcerebral.com/tony GET SIMPLISAFE TODAY: simplisafe.com/confessionals GET Hello Fresh: hellofresh.com/confessionals16 Promo Code: "confessionals16" for 16 FREE MEALS!!! Get Emergency Food Supplies: www.preparewiththeconfessionals.com Get Beard Oil: bit.ly/2FbOhN5 CONNECT WITH US Website: www.theconfessionalspodcast.com Email: [e-mail] Subscribe to the Newsletter: https://www.theconfessionalspodcast.com/the-newsletter SOCIAL MEDIA Subscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/2TlREaI TikTok: @theconfessionals Discord: https://discord.gg/KDn4D2uw7h Show Instagram: theconfessionalspodcast Tony's Instagram: tonymerkelofficial Facebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcas Twitter: @TConfessionals Tony's Twitter: @tony_merkel

Merkel Media This was all circulating around the base That a giant had been killed But no one was supposed to talk about it Boney fingers Reach up underneath the door Curl up to grab it

And then disappear When he came over to me Dude he slithered over to me And this giant comes out of the cave And they're all frozen And he starts running and firing at this giant With a giant move, he's got a spear in one hand and he's running really fast. And spears, Dan, holds him up like this.

Somebody else, shoot him in the face, shoot him in the face. They basically decapitated. Feel something pulling at my leg. And I look over and there are two small gray entities pulling it. And they're literally, I'm getting pulled off the bed. I reached my hand into this bush and I touch air. couldn't breathe and I couldn't move because I know I'm seeing a monster. Welcome to the show, everybody. You're listening to The Confessionals. I'm your host, Tony Merkel.

Thanks for being here. I'm still struggling and fighting this COVID. So bear with me, friends, for the lack of enthusiasm on these recordings, I am all heart, no wind pipes. I have a hard time breathing right now. So if you have a crazy wild experience, you want to share with me on the show, go ahead and shoot me an email. My email, address is the confessionals at the confessionalspodcast.com. That's the confessionals at the confessionalspodcast.com. Or go to the website, theconfessionalspodcast.com, hit the contact section, and you can reach me that way as well. Either it works for me, just get a hold of me. If you want to hear more shows on a weekly basis, all you got to do is become a member to the website, theconfessionalspodcast.com.

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The food will last you up to 25 years on the shelf and the gear will last as long as you don't use it. It's always good to be prepared just in case that time comes where you're going to need to survive in a rough situation. You'll make sure you and your family are good to go. So you can do that at Prepare With the Confessionals.com. Also check out the YouTube channel. The YouTube channel is growing and we're continuing to trying to make it grow. The Dogman documentary will be coming out. soon. As soon as I'm better, I'll be talking to the guys about release dates, I'm sure.

And if you don't want to miss the Dogman documentary, make sure you're subscribed to that YouTube channel so that you don't miss out on this really good documentary. And before we get into this week's show, friends, I just remind you that we are still doing the Spirits Are In Tour on April 8th through the 9th this year, 2022. If you are interested in coming with me to the Stanley Hotel for a Haunted Night Adventure, You're going to want to contact Creed and Jen over at Educated Wanderer. All you got to do is email them travel group tours at AOL.com or you can call them 973-513-9-0-0-1 or just hit up their website, educatedwanderer.com.

Reserve your spot on this trip because the seats are limited and once it fills up, you won't be able to get access to it. So if you've been thinking about coming on the trip with us and going on this overnight adventure, and contact Creed and Jen and get your spot reserved today. Now, today we have Trey coming on the show today, and Trey is a longtime listener of the show, and he and I had a chance to sit down and talk about his investigations and how he got into paranormal investigations

because he didn't get into it because he believed in it. He got into it because he wanted to disprove it. And then how he got out of paranormal investigations was because of a Bigfoot encounter he had. It's really an interesting thought process he had as to why he got into. into paranormal investigating and then also why he got out of paranormal investigating into Bigfoot investigating. I'll let him describe it to you guys, but I really hope you enjoy this conversation.

Let's get the Trey right now. All right. Today we got Trey on the show. Trey, what's up, dude? Hey, man. How's it going, Tony? Doing good, man, doing good. Trey, man, you've been a fan of the show for a long time, man. I was just telling my wife before I came down here to talk to you that I remember you contacting me. I think it was in like the first few months of me podcasting, which was, you know, it feels like forever ago. So. Yeah, it's, it's been a while, man. It's been a while. I love for your show, man. And, you know, Wes obviously turned me over to it and I got it to it. And I don't know, I'm split between your two shows now because they're obviously different topics. But yeah, I've been listening for quite a while, quite a while.

Well, those are two good shows to be split between. So support, I support your decisions. So, but, so, man, listen, you were a paranormal investigator, and I know you got into it to prove that it was a bunch of BS. But if you could just kind of walk us into, you know, the origins of why you started doing all this stuff. And then, you know, we'll get into your experiences and how you feel about the paranormal now that you've been a paranormal investigator before. So, yeah, man, I'm going to say it's around 2004, I believe. when the Ghost Hunter show came out, I had never had an experience my entire life of anything paranormal. And then all of a sudden here's this show on TV and, you know, they're hearing Knox.

They're seeing this. And I'm sitting on the couch saying, that's bull crap, you know, that could be this, that could be that. And my girlfriend at the time was like, you know, there are groups around here if you think, because she was a firm believer because she had had experiences. And she's like, well, why don't you, you know, join one of the first. of these groups around here and go find out for yourself. And so that's basically how it started off. I said, you know what?

I can't sit here on an armchair quarterback this. I'll go out there and try. So I found a group, ETPRS, which is East Tennessee Paranoa Research Society, you know, joined up with them. And it was actually not one of those things that, you know, you just say, hey, I want to be in there. They make you take tests and, you know, try to look at pictures and see which ones were real, orbs and which one, I mean, it was like, it was a long process, but finally got into it. And that's where, that's where everything kicked off at. So was it, let me ask you, what was it something with

the testing and everything to get into this? I mean, were you honest with them and said, well, I don't even believe in this stuff to begin with? I mean, I'm absolutely. I was, I was known as the, the heavy skeptic when it started. Because I would just try to debunk everything, which honestly, on even a place that is truly haunted, you can still debunk about 90 to 95% of the stuff that goes on. I mean, even like I said, even if it is 100% haunted, most of the stuff, once you get in there, your mind starts playing tricks on you. But it's that other 5% in there that you just say, I don't have a clue what that is. I mean, I got lucky enough actually, I think I sent you the video, the very first investigation,

I went on that I was one of the two leads on there instead of just a background character. I caught a full body apparition on camera. I saw it with my eyes, caught it on camera, chased after it, and the thing just disappeared. I mean, that was the very first, you know, introduction I had into actually seeing or hearing anything. And that was, shoot, it had barely got dark that night. It was just, it was crazy how I got thrown into that. It's what kind of made me say, well, maybe they're, is a little something to it, or maybe I'm just, you know, tripping or something. I'm not sure.

Yeah, so that video you sent, was that the one where you were filming it through the window? Is that the one in Philadelphia? That's it. I was inside of a barn and I, you know, look up out the window and I see this figure that's translucent figure because if you saw the video down, there's one single tree in that entire field and it's just right outside the window there, maybe 30 or 40 feet past the window. And this thing was moving back and forth. And I'm sitting here looking through the, you know, looking through the viewfinder, then looking up,

looking through the viewfinder, shining my light on it. Every time it passes in front of the tree, you can still see the tree behind it. And just at the point that I said, I'm about to go out there and see what this is. It moved to the right. It turned and it blinked out. And that's when I took off after it.

Of course, the volume is not good on that. I think all you can hear is me falling and bust in my butt trying to run out there. And we all, I had someone else go around the other back of the barn, and we come out with spotlights that shined all the way down the road a couple hundred yards away, and there's absolutely, absolutely nothing out there but that. And it was definitely an eye opener. It was, I still don't know what to make of it. But, yeah, that was my introduction to something like that.

So as somebody who didn't believe in this stuff, your first time going out there, you have this experience where you actually see an apparition and you catch it on video and all that stuff. I mean, in that moment, obviously, like you said, it was, you know, enlightening. Like, maybe there is something to all this stuff. But did you ever have any fear in that moment being said it was your first time out to do, like, ghost hunting? And you actually freaking catch one on video. I wouldn't say it was fear.

it was more, at that time, it was confusion because I was a complete disbelief. And then right there it is in front of your eyes and it disappears in front of your eyes. And it only took me two to three, even though I fell, it only took me two to three seconds to get out the barn door. You know, and there's nothing there. And it was disbelief more than fear. You know, I'm walking around the field and everybody's like, okay, it's gone. Let's go back in. I'm like, it can't be gone.

It was just right here. Like there's nowhere to go. So I finally had to drag me back into the house because that wasn't even where the stuff was really happening at from the homeowners point of view. I mean, they hadn't really, we just happened to go check that barn out. Most of the stuff had been happening inside the house. So, yeah, it was more disbelief than anything. And, you know, like I said, even catching it and seeing it and other people seeing it, it still, I still had doubt in my head that, okay, maybe. I'm just hyped up and maybe my brain's just showing me what I want to see or something.

But, you know, I guess it showed the camera what it wanted to see too because it's there. Yeah, and that's the thing. I mean, you catch it on video. And if it's okay with you, I'll link the video on the website of this episode. So other people can see it too. Because, I mean, when you sent the video, it stood out to me right away. I mean, I'm looking out this window and I see this figure and it's moving. And I'm just like, holy crap.

And since it's in the bar or you were in the bar when it happened, it's almost like, you know, like whatever's been haunting the house is like, wait, where are these guys going? Like checking you out. You know, I showed it to a lot of other people and they said it looks at the very last second before it disappears. It looks female for whatever reason. I don't know you just get that vibe off of it. But that was the report that we had from in the house was an older lady. her voice and a younger female child's voice.

And I had seen the young female child as a shadow person, but when I showed the homeowners that, they said, we have never seen anything that clear. You know, it's usually shadows and just voices. And we always, we used to do, every time we'd go to a place like that, we would have a person that would do like background on the area. Because here in East Tennessee,

I mean, not only where there are a bunch of Civil War battles fought, I mean, there were skirmish as fought everywhere. This is also one of the homes of the Cherokees, so there's burial grounds and everything to the points where I can go out in my backyard right now with a metal detector and pick up, you know, musket balls and stuff just from little skirmishes that happened right on the Tennessee River. I mean, so that's one thing about around here is you may be going to just a house that looks normal, but a couple of hundred years ago you have no idea what happened on that property before that house was gone. And I think that's what a lot of that stuff around here has to, you know, has to do with.

Yeah, that's really interesting. Yeah, I've always wanted, like, I'm really into like hunting for mysteries and, you know, lost treasures and things like that. I mean, that's really in my wheelhouse of interest. And I've never, I've never found anything, I've never even found an arrowhead, you know? I mean, my, my mom had a box full of them from when she was a kid. And I never, I never found anything like that. And so I lead a pretty boring life. But I mean, the fact that you find musket balls in your backyard, I mean, all I got in my backyard is a filled in swimming pool that, you know, left me with a bunch of rocky soil. Yeah. I've got a buddy at work that metal detection, like his biggest hobby. And he came over where I told you I'll work out, which is actually

just directly behind my house across the river is where my plan is at that we've worked. And he goes out there and I'm working. He's off work. He's out there looking around. He finds, I don't remember how it was a bunch of musket balls, but he also found a Confederate belt buckle and a union belt buckle within like 100 feet of each other, just in a circle. So there was something that went on, you know, like I said, just right over there.

And they don't really keep track of those little skirmishes. They do the major battles and stuff like that. But, you know, if a group of these guys get into it with a group of these guys, they don't really have record of that type of stuff. But I'm sure it was just where we're located at. It was everywhere. Yeah, I can only imagine. I can only imagine.

And you know, you're right. I mean, that's probably exactly what happened. You know, you hear about the big battles and stuff like Gettysburg, you know. But these guys ran into each other at other times, too. And, you know, when you see each other, things pop off, you know, literally. I mean, you know, just a few hundred rounds fired at each other. That doesn't sound like a lot. But when you get out there and start looking for stuff, you're like,

Holy crap, what the heck went on here? Back then it was probably just them, I don't know, taking pot shots at each other. And that is what it is. I don't know. Interesting. So, all right. So you're now a paranormal investigator.

You get accepted in this group. They're probably excited. They have a skeptic on hand so that they can, one, be more objective in their analysis, but also the challenge of turning you into a believer. So where do you go from here? here. I mean, with your experiences and stuff. I mean, did you go to, you know, every place and have an experience? I'm assuming that's not the case. No, I'm sorry. Go ahead. No, I was just going to say, I mean, because I know you mentioned about, you know, getting EVPs and seeing shadow people and

a bunch of other stuff. So where do we go? Yeah, after that, um, we did actually go to quite a few places and nothing happened. I'm not saying that I don't believe the homeowners or whatever, but It just didn't happen. So that was something else that kind of put doubt in my mind. I'm like, okay, if my first thing out here, I see this. Somebody messing with me because we've been on like five investigations since. I haven't heard or seen anything. And there's a little town that's in the same county here called Greenback.

And we went to this house. And they had everything from shadow people to audio, you know, voices and stuff like that. And, you know, like I said, this is about five investigations later. Do you remember when the prequels for Star Wars came back out and they made those R2D2 like little tray? They would bring like a little tray. You know, it's kind of a little gimmick where he'd be like a waiter and you could put batteries in it. And he would, you know, scoot across the ground and bring you drinks and beep, boop, boop, and all that stuff. So they had, we're going through and they're showing us where they've seen and heard everything else.

And we walk past this R2D2 unit and they're like, oh, yeah, by the way, that thing right there will turn on by itself. And we always broke up into pairs, at least pairs, sometimes three in the group. And the guy I was paired with his next police officer that had just moved around here. So everyone starts walking up to go to the room and he leans back to me. He says, get the batteries out of that thing right now. He said, I'll cover you. I'll watch for you to get the battery. So I go up underneath it and take the batteries out of it and stick them in my pocket.

You don't think anything else about it. We're up in the bedroom doing an EVP session that night. And we heard some disembodded voices, which for whatever reason, we did not catch on recorder, but we both heard them. I went into the closet to open it up and got instant vertigo and almost passed out. He had to bring me out, lay me on the couch. So I'm like, okay, I need some air. We go get some air, me and him do. We come back in, we're sitting in a living room doing another EVP session.

And all of a sudden this R2D2 unit kicks on. It doesn't move, but it starts beep, beep, beep. you know, doing the R2 sound. And he looked at me, he's like, dude, I told you to take the batteries out. And I reached my pocket, I was like, they're in my pocket. So we run over there, flip it up, thinking, okay, maybe it's got backup batteries in it or something like that. And we're taking it. This thing had no batteries in it at all.

So there you go. There's something else that I can't explain, man. I mean, and this is how it progressively got through these things. I went from not believing to see. in and hearing stuff that should not, should not be possible. And that was one of the, one of the bigger ones from one of these, you know, private residential places. So that was a wild night right there.

We told it, which we didn't catch it on camera. We caught that on audio of it going off. And we finally told the homeowners later, yeah, on our walkthrough, I took the batteries out of it with you guys, without you guys, no one. And, I mean, they weren't upset about it, but it was just one of those things. that it happened. I have no explanation of how to happen. Yeah, that's interesting. So with that experience, I mean, how would a paranormal investigator define that experience then, knowing the batteries were taken out, it's still powered up?

How do you explain that? I mean, do you go to it being possessed or were there electromagnetic energies passed on through an entity or what? See, that's the hard thing to say. I mean, it could have been possessed. It could have just been residual energy from something from long ago that said, hey, you know, there's wires and circuits in here. Let me just put whatever energy I have in here to make this thing beep a few times. It could have been poltergeist activity, which I don't know about that. That's usually when you have younger, like teenage kids involved, and there were no kids like that. So it's hard to say, man, it's hard to get an answer on any of this stuff.

Even when you, like I said, when you see it, you record it, you can repeat the experiment, everything, you still don't have an answer for it. So I do not know. Like I said, I had just got done having a vertigo at that time. So I was kind of out of it. And it's just one of those things that were just like, well, that happened. On to the next, I guess. I don't know. Those people, I did notice a theme that did start showing up, though, on places.

where activity was happening, one of the biggest recurring themes were they were doing house renovations. For whatever reason, I had always heard that and thought, okay, that's just something they say. But no, that became a recurring theme, and these people were doing renovations on their house, and all this stuff was kicking up. So I don't know if, see, I even hate to say ghosts, because then that implies that there's an afterlife. life and if, you know, it's, I don't know. That's the whole problem with this situation is I've seen it. I've heard it. I've felt it. I've seen people get attacked by it, but I still don't have any answers for it. And it gets frustrating to a point. You know what I mean? Yeah. No, I get it. I mean, as somebody who listens to a lot of people's stories and stuff, there's oftentimes that they'll say

something that I'm just like, I don't even know how to define that. I have no idea, you know? And it's like, you'll often hear me say, well, I don't know. That's all you can do is just throw your hands up and say, well, that happened. Yep, I'm not crazy. Other people witnessing. I've, you know, recorded it. I don't know what to tell you. Your R2DT unit likes to work by itself without batteries.

Okay, let's take a break and talk about our first sponsor today, which is a new sponsor, StartMail. You see, I've been really excited about a lot of these sponsors to be getting focusing on security and safety. And Start Mail is just that. You see, many of you, I'm one of them, has free email accounts, right? Gmail, Yahoo, who doesn't have one of those email providers? I have multiple Gmail accounts I've made over the years. And the problem with these companies is that they're free and you think that's great, but the problem is it's not free. If you're not paying for it, it's because you're the product. If you don't pay with your money, it's because you're paying with your privacy. And in fact,

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United States. So you're stepping outside of the Patriot Act when you are taking advantage of StartMail. Also, last but not least, I will tell you this. You can do anonymous aliases and you have an unlimited amount that you can use with StartMail. So anytime you need a fresh email, you can just boom, it's done with StartMail. Right now, start securing your email privacy with StartMail. Sign up today and you'll get 50% off your first year. Go to startmail.com slash confessions. That's StartMail with a T, S-T-A-R-T, mail.com slash confessions for 50% off your first year. startmail.com slash confessionals. So when people bring a paranormal investigation team in like these private residences and stuff,

is it something that they're contacting you to have you help stop the activity or to confirm that they are actually not going crazy? It's a little bit of both. It depends. There was a couple of demonic cases that I was involved. Well, one, the entire group was involved in, but I wasn't there. because we had a priest and it got really anxious. Those kind of people are trying to get rid of it.

The people like I was talking about with R2D and T unit, they were wanting to get rid of it, I guess, but they were more wanting confirmation that they weren't going crazy. And, you know, like I said, that's also what kind of stinks when you go to someone's house and I believe the people wholeheartedly that this stuff is happening. But for whatever reason, when we show up that night, nothing happens.

I know that's got to be frustrating for that. them and it's a little mixture of both. Some people, some people want it to stay. They just want to, you know, document it. They want people to come in with infrared cameras and thermal cameras and catch it so that they have something that when they tell friends or family, they can say, oh, yeah, you don't believe me. Well, check this out.

They recorded this, you know. So it's all dependent on the situation. Like, I don't know, we'll go to, I've been to Waverly Hills Sanitarium and Louisville, Kentucky, four, five, I can't even say five, five or six times. And I can tell you right now, that place is 100% one of the most haunted places I've ever been into. But the people there, obviously, you know, that's a big place. They treat that like a business. They don't want that stuff gone.

They want you to come there, you know, experience something, record something, have your own piece of evidence and that kind of stuff. And so it's just different. It just depends on, you know, it's not. different throughout the people and the locations and all that kind of stuff. So what were some of the things that you've experienced since you've been to Waverly so many times? I mean, shoot, man, going there five, six times, and I can only imagine that you guys were getting some good activity if you kept going back. Yeah, I think there was another video essentially of our EMF detector that we had sitting up in a room by itself with just a camera on it.

and it wasn't two, three minutes after we walked out that this thing spins, it's on camera, it spins around, balances itself on its side, since it's there for five or seconds or so, it falls over. That was one of the better things that we caught on camera. We also, I don't know if you've ever been to Waverly, but the way they had the place set up there, it was kind of like in a V shape, not like a 90-degree deal. it was set up so that the nurses could be set in the middle of the hallway and see down both ends of the hallways in case patients came out of their room.

So we would sit in the middle. My brother was actually with me on a couple of these occasions. We would sit in the middle and it would be quiet, no wind or nothing. And I would be looking down one side. He'd be looking down the other. And you would just see shadow people darting in between rooms back and forth. And of course, I tap on his shoulder and say, dude, did you see that? that and as I'm tapping to look over there, I see one down his. And he's like, dude, did you

see, you know, it's back and forth, back and forth. And we go down there and we try to figure out, where is the shadow coming from? Well, there is no shadow because there is no light. And that's one thing about shadow people. When you, when you see them, it can be in pitch black and you can still see these things. They're somehow blacker than than pitch black, if that makes any sense. So that's kind of how I started putting a real shadow person in a context. It's like, okay, if it's pitch black here and I can still see movement, then that's something right there. There was also a, it wasn't really a kid's ward.

I guess it was one of the rooms that the kids hung out in and played in or whatever. And there were a bunch of balls in there, the other investigators, because the first time we went up there was just a month or so, a couple of months after the ghost hunters from the ghost. Center show had been there. So we went up there before it was actually open, you know, to the public public on the first occasion, maybe the, even the second occasion. It's now open. I mean, you can pay your money and go stay there. Anybody can do it now. But they had these little, like, beach balls and little bouncy balls in there. And you could sit there and talk and ask these

spirits or whatever you want to call them to play with the stuff. And all of a sudden, this freaking ball would start rolling across the ground. and I'm like, okay, it's got to be when. I'm checking all the windows. No, all the windows are intact. Shut the door, nothing's coming in. Okay, maybe it's sitting on an incline. Let's set it somewhere else.

It will be sitting there perfectly still for five or ten minutes, and as soon as you would ask it to move, it was almost like something kicked it, not with enough force to get it off the ground, but kicked it and got it rolling directly towards you. I mean, that's another one of those things. That right there actually creeps me out more than, some of the other stuff is when it has to do, for whatever reason, when it has to do with little kids,

if you're a little kid's voice, even if it's not menacing in the middle of the night and somewhere like that, it just, it sends chills down my spire, man. I would rather, I don't, I would rather see anything than that. You know what I mean? That, that right there just freaks me out for whatever reason. But let's see, oh, they, they had the thing out back. It's what they called the death tunnel. and they built this because it was a tuberculosis center at one point. And they were having so many deaths that they built a tunnel out back. So they'd go straight out the back door and it was underground. And it would come out in the parking lot because they didn't want patients to keep seeing people dying or holding out the window.

It was just not good for patient morale. And there's one spot you can get to in this tunnel where you're pitch black. You can't see either side because it's so long and so dark. and we had an EVP session there where we were asking questions and getting direct answers. You know, what's your name? And obviously, I can't remember it's been a year ago, but we'd asked what their name was. We would get a name in response. What are you here for?

I'm sick. You know, you're sitting there basically having a conversation with something. And that's another scratch. I mean, what do you make of that? And it's not just like random voices that are coming through your audio player. It's you're asking specific questions and getting specific answers. I don't know, man. That's another one of those crazy things.

Yeah. You know, at what point did you become a believer in all this? Honestly, it was after the, the, let's see, we went to the Greenback places. It was basically from the Greenback place. When I told you, we went to the house, the home in Greenback, Waverly Hills was our next one that we went to. It was a big gathering that we all did once a year.

So after, you know, the R2 unit kicks on and stuff and I have the vertigo and all that, then I go to Waverly Hills and all this is up to Sapt. And not to mention I'm sitting here having a conversation with something, that's when I kind of started being a believer. But I still didn't know what to, you know, put a name on it. I hate to say the word ghost because like I said, that implies that that's some, body that died. And if that's the case, well, those things should be around everywhere because, you know, billions of people have died over history. But also, I'm sitting here asking its

name and it's telling me its name. And we're having a full-fledged conversation. So I would say after that first Waverly Hills visit is when I started to say, okay, nobody's messing with me. You know, it's not my brain. I've recorded too much. That's when I started to actually believe this stuff. So you guys are at Waverly Hills, you're having these experiences. Did you go to, when you went to Waverly Hills, did you have an experience every time you went there? Every time I went there. Something happened. Every time. It was normally just shadow people and EVPs, but like you said, the K2 meter happened. You would always see shadow people in. And that place is so huge. You go up there with a group of eight or ten people. You guys can

walk around all night in pairs and never see each other. I mean, it's just, it's just huge. So, yeah, every time I went to Waverly Hills, and also when you go in there, like, you can come out at any time when they have basically, it's like a little conference area or whatever, where you, where they pay, where you pay to go in now, you could come out there, you know, get your lunchbox, get snacks, drinks, talks, talk about what's going on. Every time we would come back, somebody would have something on video or something on audio. Hey, check this out, check this out, check this out. And that's, like I said, that's just one of those places that I have no doubt in my mind is 100% on it. And it never, it never let down. So, yeah, it's a place to go if you ever

want to check out any of this stuff for yourself, for sure. So any skeptics out there that don't believe this stuff exists, just make a trip to Waverly Hills. And you're saying they'll change their mind. I guarantee you that will change their mind. Absolutely. Make sure you get away from the group. Take one other person with you. Go sit in some random room and just start asking questions. Start talking. Just like you're talking to someone that you think, you know, is there. Just talk to it and record it off. And if something visual doesn't happen, you would definitely get something audio out of that for sure. Do you have to talk? I mean, can you just sit in a, if you're a paranormal investigator, it seems like, I mean, I wouldn't

call myself an investigator of really anything. I'm just a dude that talks to people. But what I see on TV and YouTube and all that stuff, people do these EVP sessions, they get the spirit boxes out, all that stuff. I often wonder, if the place is really haunted, can you just not just sit down in a dark, quiet room and just sit there and wait for something to happen? Absolutely. You absolutely can. The story I was telling you about my brother and I, sitting there in the middle of the hallway, watching inside the hallway. We sat there for 20 or 30 minutes and did not say a word. And then all of a sudden we're getting shadowed people running toward us,

running from door to door across the hall. Of course, obviously then we start talking. We're like, oh, crap, did you see that? Yeah, I saw that. Did you see this? But no, we sit there for a good, you can go. I mean, you can talk to them. You can go there and sit there.

Sometimes you can walk directly in a room. As soon as you walk into a room, something might fly off the wall at you because something may not want you in there. And like I said, that doesn't necessarily mean that's demonic. That could just be a spirit that's pissed off. It doesn't want you there. I mean, it can happen multiple different ways. You can sit there for hours and finally something will happen.

You can sit there for 10 or 15 minutes asking questions or you can walk directly in a room and something happened before you even get settled. So it's all different. And it doesn't even have to be a night either. It can happen during the daytime as well. of course of course that that's one thing that i another thing that you know it's you know as somebody who observes a lot of these things you know the tv stuff or even on youtube a lot of times they do stuff at night because it's probably you know for the cinematic creep factor part partly because of that

but if a place is really haunted you know i don't think there's a time of day that the ghosts are like ah guys yo it's only two o'clock in the afternoon let's just wait a few more hours you know yeah it doesn't work like that actually one of the the best orbs that I ever saw. And one of my teammates actually got a picture of it was in broad daylight. This was an orb in a house, broad daylight, illuminating its own light. And it just blinked out. I mean, and I was in the middle of the day.

You know, not the middle of the day. It wasn't dark yet. It was probably four or five o'clock in the afternoon because we were there, you know, getting the run down and getting set up and all that stuff. But I can't even remember what house that was that. I want to say that was one in Knoxville. But, yeah, the best orb I ever saw was in the middle of the daytime. Was that the orb that you said you saw something happening on the inside of it?

Well, I didn't see it with my, when I saw it with my eyes, it just looked like a light. But when the picture was taken, which was a great picture perfectly in focus, and I wish I could track the lady down that took it. The inside of it looked, you know, what are those balls called it? You know, you put your hand on it, makes your hair and stuff stand up like that, electricity in the middle of it. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah, yeah.

They were real popular. Yeah, real popular back in the day. Yeah, it kind of looked like that. And it was a lot of different colors. And it was just like, I don't, it looked like electrical currents or something running to it. It's hard to explain.

I have tried my best to get a hold of that lady and get that photo from her as I was wanting to send that to you as well. But, yeah, that, that's what it looked like. it looked just like electricity flowing in the middle of it. Now, like I said, with my naked eye, it just looked like a white light. Never changed color on me or anything. It just kind of got smaller and smaller until it disappeared.

But the photo she got of it, there's multiple colors in there. It looks like electricity. It looks like one of those little static electricity balls from back in the day. That's what it looked like. Wow. Wow. That's interesting. I mean, it almost sounds like the way you're describing it,

it sounds like it has its own universe on the inside of it. it. Yeah. Yeah, that would be another way to put it. I don't know if you've ever seen that photograph that they have of, I guess it's the entire universe basically in one photo. Yeah. And you've got lines going from here to here and their clusters of galaxies and stuff. It's kind of like that, but with an electricity fill to it, if it makes any, I guess what kind of like what they show the neurons firing in your brain and stuff like that, it's kind of the same thing. And now I'm not saying every orb was like that, just that one that, that we saw in broad daylight and got a great picture of, that's how it looked.

Like there was a lot of stuff going on on the inside of it. Very interesting. Very interesting. I don't think I've ever heard that before about the orbs and stuff. I'd be interested to hear if other people have had similar experiences where, you know, they caught a picture, a really good picture of an orb, and they could actually see some kind of activity going on in the inside. Yep.

And that was, that wasn't a video. That was a still picture with a really good camera that she had. And she just, I guess, happened to set it up perfect and timing it at the right time because it was a great picture. It was our website is actually, I guess they, I don't know if they changed it or what. I haven't talked to these guys in years, but it was on our website on our homepage at one point. But the website's been either changed or taken down or it took me close to a month just to track down my videos that were, you know, my personal videos. I had to make phone calls and all that stuff. But yeah, that was a great picture.

I'd actually forgot about that until you'd mentioned that to me, but I guess I mentioned that in one of the emails or something. Well, actually, I can read minds. And so, no. I got you. Yeah. That's why you want me to put these headphones on. You want to make a straight.

Yeah. I wanted more of a connection. Yep, that's exactly it. So to backtrack just a little bit, you're and I'm of this opinion but it sounds like you are as well where you if a place is actually haunted all I could do all I have to do is sit down in a room and just hang out and chill and something could happen you know I don't need to try to summon something in order for it to happen absolutely not no not in my experience anyways now doing that kind of stuff may help speed

the process up but you can go in there like I said and just sit hopefully if you're any of your listeners go to Waverly Hills. Hopefully as soon as you walk through the door, something will yell at you or something. Or something happened. You know, like I said, that could happen. I do have a lot more experience with actually just having a conversation, but that's, like said, that's not always the case. You can just go sit in the dark room and wait, especially after a few minutes when your

eyes adjust to the dark and you can see other, you know, see more of the room. That's a good, that's a good way to do it. A lot of people actually prefer it to do, prefer to do it that way instead of talking or whatever. Really? I wouldn't have guessed that because everybody I watch on TV and stuff, they're all about, you know, who's here? Tell me your name. I'm angry, you know? Well, I've got to, I can tell you a story in a minute about why you should not do that. But no, there were certain people in our group that they're, their way of it, you know, we all had our own little ways of doing things. a lot of times me and will the guy that was police off we would try provoking after you know so many minutes and so but some people they said they would just go in there and sit and be quiet and if it was a small place you'd walk in and say oh my gosh there's a ghost oh no wait that's just docs over there in the

sitting up there in the corner of me what but yeah um i can tell you about the uh the yelling at them and uh provoking them this was actually one of the scarier things that happened. I'd started, my brother got interested in this because he went to Waverly with me once. And like I said, we saw that. He wound up going back with me again. There's a place down here right past Chattanooga, Tennessee called the South Pittsburgh Hospital. It's closed down now. But you know, you can go there and know that you stay overnight if you have a group and do paranormal investigations there. And it was me, my buddy Will. I was telling you. about my brother and one of Will's friends. So there's just four of us in this entire hospital.

And we honestly weren't having a lot of activity. And we had set up our, I guess you want to call it, base camp up on the third floor where the receptionist would be out, you know, right there in the middle where the nurses and everything are. And there's a chapel down the hallway. And I had actually started to get irritated because this is the second or third time I had been there. and I'm trying to show my brother other stuff and nothing's happening. So on the wall, there was actually still some lab coats hanging up on the wall from when this place was open. So we decided to go down to the chapel and Will is going to stand up and basically just talk, you stand up at the altar, but not pray or nothing like that.

Just talk to what's going on. and I'm sitting, we're all spread out through the chapel, or it's kind of a small chapel, but we're all spread out through it. And I've got this lab coat on. And I get irritated and just start yelling as if I'm a nurse, you know, telling them they need to get back in bed. You know, you're not coming out to play. You need to go back to bed, blah, blah, blah. All of a sudden, my brother stands up and he said, Trey, my shoulders burning.

And I was, what do you mean it's burning? You know, so we stop what we're doing and we run over there. And it's on the back of his shoulder, so he can't see. it. He lifts his shirt up. Now I've got photos of this as well. Will and I come over there and he's and my brother's like, what's wrong with it? What's wrong with it? And dude, you can see Welts coming up on the back of his shoulder like claw marks. You could see them rising or something that just scratched you. And Will and I look at each other. We don't want to tell him what happened to freak him out, but he's like, man, it's burning. It's burning. So, you know, we just kind

of tell him, you know, calm down, be easy. We got out of there and we went back and And I got back to the receptionist area, and I'm thinking, great, I just provoked something into attacking my brother. This is not good. We did get activity, I guess. We finally took pictures of it and showed him, and it kind of freaked him out a little bit. And see, I had always told him up to that date that we don't, I didn't want to prove, I don't ever want to provoke these things because it's not something that you can punch back. You know what I mean? It's if they want to do something, I want to throw something at you or scratch you.

Like he got scratched, what are you going to do? But you're not going to do anything. But it had come to a point in the night where it was almost time for us to, you know, start packing stuff up because it was going to be daylight. And we started smack talking. And I guess we got what we deserved and what we were looking for because he got scratched. But the way he got scratched, like I said, we went over there. His shoulder was just red.

but as we were shining the light on it, you could actively see the welts start coming up on it. And there was only three of them, which was weird. There wasn't like a whole full hand or four fingers. There was three of them. But yeah, we got photos of that too. So that's one reason I would say not to provoke these things unless you're ready for something bad that could happen.

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So the three scratches, I mean, that's something that a lot of people talk about happening and stuff. I mean, how do you as a paranormal investigator view the whole three scratch thing? I don't know. I've seen three scratch. I've seen four, you know, like four nails.

I've seen just one like a, with a finger. I've, I've seen just about every spectrum on it except for five. I've never seen some way get scratched. I've seen like four fingers in a thumb. I've never seen that. Not to say that it doesn't happen,

but I've never seen it. I don't know. Like I said, this is one of the reasons I got out of this stuff because after close to 10 years of doing this stuff, I just kind of, well, I don't have any answers. I've got all the evidence in the world, but I have no answers. It's just every time I get something, it just makes me ask more questions, and it's about

to make my head explode. So I don't, I do have an answer for that for you. Was your brother involved in paranormal investigating before you? Because, I mean, you weren't a believer. Then you get involved. I mean, did he get involved because of you? He got, yeah, he got involved because he did not believe either. and he knew that I didn't believe to start with,

and then I started bringing him on these videos and letting him hear these EVPs and stuff, and he's like, you know, I want to go on one. I'm like, I don't know, man. And then finally, the yearly Waverly Hills come around. I believe that was the first time. Yeah, it was the first time. The Waverly Hills trip came,

and I asked people, I said, yo, my brother's very interesting, can he come? And that was the night that we sat and watched Shadow people for 20 or 30 minutes, just run up and down the hallways. So, yeah, he got into it because of me. He did not believe either at Star. He was even questioning some of the videos and audio and stuff I was bringing back.

But it didn't take him long, especially going to Waverly Hills for your first time. It won't take you very long to say there's something here. Was he scared during those times? He wasn't scared at Waverly Hills. He was having a blast. You know, he was hanging out with Big Brother and seeing the stuff. But when we were at the hospital here in Tennessee and he got scratched, he was trying to hold it off like he wasn't.

But I could tell in his eyes that he was freaked out. He was ready to go. Like I said, luckily we were just like an hour or so away from being let out of there so we could go and daylight coming up and all that good stuff. So we didn't have to stay very much longer. But yeah, he wasn't really freaked out at Waverly, but he was definitely, I could see it in his eyes. He was freaked out at the hospital for sure.

Yeah. Well, I can imagine, I mean, if somebody gets scratched by an entity, I mean, I imagine that's pretty freaky no matter who you are. Now, what are some of these demonic encounters you referenced and stuff? I mean, have you ever, like, is it like you spoke to a demonic entity or they've appeared or what? Okay. So there was only, while I was there, there was only two that I was involved in, and one of them I was not even present. They took the priest. They took the two founders of our group. and they took one lady, which I guess I could get into that one first because I did get to hear the audio and heard the eyewitness accounts from that. There was some, I can't remember how old. She was a teenage girl that was exhibiting possession times. And this is, you know, this is into the point where I'm in this room, like, okay, I've seen this and that. But I've never seen anybody. I've watched the exorcist.

Is that what you're talking about? It's just like the girl from the exorcist. and yeah, basically that's it. So apparently when that happened, the priest had his Bible, had a wooden crucifix. This is just one of the things that happened. And while he was saying whatever prayer,

he was saying, the crucifix snapped in half in his hand. There was a wooden crucifix. It snapped in hand. Once that happened, they swung the camera over toward him. You don't actually see the crucifix break on camera. They swing the camera over,

and you can see it broke in his hand, and then picture flies. off the while. And on the audio, you can hear this teenage girl start with this god-awful, god-awful laugh. It's something that you really don't, unless you're ready, you really don't want to hear that. That's one of the most of disturbing things that you'll ever hear of her laughing and talking. She was also speaking in the language that she did know. I'm not sure what language is because I have trouble with recognizing even some Spanish.

But yeah, that was a bad situation. I do know that it eventually turned out to be okay and she was fine months later. But after that first interaction between the priests and the few investigators that were there, they kind of locked all that stuff off to the rest of the members and took care of that

with other members of the clergy and stuff like that. So the one that, I was actually involved with. This was this lady that was living alone. She was a very religious lady, but she had just got a divorce from her husband.

Her husband had done a lot of bad things, including, I think, physically assaulting her and stuff like that, but we went up there. I was the only male, excuse me, I was the only male there, this lady that owns the place, and three female

investigators and me. and the main stuff was happening in her bedroom. She was hearing growls and just whispers and stuff like that. Now, every time I would walk in the room, Tony, nothing, it's like everything went back to normal for whatever reason. I don't know if it was because I was the only guy there or what, but when I would walk in there, everything would stop. But they had audio recorders and video recorders set up through the whole room.

And on multiple occasions, as soon as I walk, out the room, you would hear this crazy growl that sounded like my 100-pound pit bull was about to attack something. I mean, it sounded, it sounded bad again. And nowhere near as bad as the girl laughing, but it was no doubt about it, a growl. And they would say, try, try, try, come back. I'd walk back in there. Everything would go back to normal. So that happened on that. Another thing that happened is I decided, you know, there's two or three female investigators in there with this lady. And, okay, every time I go in there, it's just leaving. So there's no way I can do anything.

Well, there's nothing I can do about it anyways. But I decided to walk through the house and just kind of check out the rest of the house. And I have this on video as well of me walking through a house and with the camera, not saying a word. and I don't know how I got there, but the next thing I know, I'm up on the opposite side of her house on the third floor in the bonus room, just kind of staring at the wall.

Are you serious? It's there with me on video walking, you know, walking through the house, going directly up to the spot, and I kind of come to, and I'm staring at the wall, and I mean,

I'm just a couple of feet from it. It wasn't like I was looking for anything. I kind of shake the head and shake the camera, and I'm like, I've not even been in this room. where the heck am I? All right. So when you're on video, you're filming this whole thing.

Were you saying anything while you were on the way to that room? Was not saying a word. I did not, like we were doing a normal walkthrough of a house, you know, kind of peek your head into this room, walk down the hall, peek your head in this room. I went straight up to steps all the way to top, all the way down the hall, didn't stop, didn't say a word, and kind of came to when I was standing over there next to the wall. And that kind of freaks me out because, like I said, the last thing I had remembered was telling the girls, okay, I'm going to go do a walk around and check out other things.

And I don't remember walking up there, but it's on camera of, you know, it's not on camera. It's me holding the camera as I'm walking. How long did you stand facing the wall until you came through? It was as soon as, when the camera's on there is basically as soon as I got there and stopped is when I came to. because you can see the camera and me kind of shake a little bit like, oh, crap. And then I'm starting to turn around in circles. Like, where am I at? I've not been to this room yet.

And then me trying to find my way back downstairs because I hadn't been up upstairs yet. I mean, you know, so it was pretty instant once I got up there. But I don't know if that was trying to get me as far away as from where they were. So something could happen. They did get growled out while I was gone. but that was kind of a thing that just kept happening all the time every time I would leave. But I honestly kind of think that's what the whole, I don't know that if that was the purpose or if that's what happened, but it was, it just felt like it was, it seems to me like it was

trying to get me as far away from what was happening as best possible. But I said, I have no memory of walking up those steps and walking into that room. So would you classify that as a possession? I wouldn't think so No I did not I did not change any I mean I didn't change any

behaviors or nothing like that possession is a it's a hard thing to I myself would not classify as possession though I would just say something wanted me to go the opposite direction and I did

and I wasn't harmed I wasn't you know speaking in different languages. I just don't have any memory of walking up there, basically. That's it. I don't know, man. That's crazy.

That's crazy. As soon as I got there, it kicked out. And I don't know, maybe some people would classify this position, but I did not, I didn't feel any different after that. I mean, I was kind of freaked out for where I was at, but feeling different or anything. I don't,

I don't know. You could call it what you want. I mean, it could be, but it didn't feel like it to me. All right, so you don't classify it as a possession where, you know, you're vomiting green vomit and your heads turning around in circles and stuff. But, I mean, the way you're describing it to me, it sounds like there was an entity that didn't want you around and it led you to this room. But if you don't remember it and it just kind of happened, I mean, it had to have some kind of control over you some way, right? It's hard to tell because I don't remember I don't remember any of that.

I guess you could say that is possible, yeah, but I never had any long-term effects from it. As soon as I basically got, as soon as I got to the end of the room, which is on the other side of the house, I snapped directly out of it. I knew exactly what had happened. Well, not exactly what happened. I knew where I was not supposed to be at. and don't remember getting there. So I guess it just depends on how you look at it. That could be, I've never thought of it that way in my life,

but some other people may look at it and say, yeah. I find it really interesting because one of my passive things I do when I just need a break from editing audio or something, I hop on YouTube and I watch these guys do ghost hunting videos because I just find it fascinating. It's really interesting. and sometimes I see, you know, there's this, like the one time I was watching these guys and they were investigating this house and the one guy has something happening. He gets freaked

down and he's calling for his friend. He can't find his friend anywhere. He's gone. And he's like, where is? And he's walking around and stuff. And he goes out to the shed outside. And his friend's inside the shed facing the corner. And he's like, yo. And like the kid, the guy just like kind of snaps out of it at that time. But he's like, he had no recollection. of any time that it passed, he thought that they had to go into the house still to do the investigation. And he's like, we were just in the house, man.

Like, it was weird. Yeah, that, I mean, that kind of sounds like what happened to me, except for I didn't have any, like I didn't realize that we hadn't started the investigation, obviously. I knew that the ladies were downstairs in the bedroom. I knew what was going on. But it's, and almost, you know,

I'm trying to remember this loosely, because it was years and years ago, but it almost felt to me like when you're driving down the interstate a road that you drive all the time and you're just kind of driving, and sooner or later, three or four exits past, you're like, holy crap, I don't even remember, you know, driving this little portion, you know what I mean? But the only thing that kind of throws that off is I guess I had never been, that's the first time I'd been to that house. That was also the first time I had been upstairs, the first time I'd been in that room.

But that's kind of what I remember about it, is it just, seemed like one of those things is like, well, I guess I just walked up here and didn't really pay attention to anything. But then I start dissecting. And I'm like, no, that goes against all of the training I would have went through. You know, if I'm going to a new floor of a house that has activity in it, I'm not going to walk down the hall and up the stairs past seven or eight rooms and not even stick my head into one of them. And when I've got free reign of the house and go to one particular spot. So I don't know about that. Now you're kind of freaking me out.

I hope it was. I'm not trying to freak you out. It's just like, you know, to me, from the way you described to me, the way I'm hearing it is that, you know, you don't, you have missing time and you want to go into this room. You're staring at a wall. And for me, I have the imagery of the previous videos that I've seen. And to be honest with you, I was just watching the one yesterday. So it was fresh in my mind.

And I was just like, holy crap. Because I'm watching the video, I'm thinking myself, are these guys yanking my leg? I mean, come on, really? And then you're coming on and telling me that, yeah, that happened to you. It did, yeah. That's the only time, well, I shouldn't say it. So that's the only time I can remember it happening. And the reason I remember it happening is because I had my camera in my hand, which was recording.

That's, you know, not to say that it hadn't happened before when I didn't have a camera, I guess. but I just happened to have a video of that. And I don't know. Man, that's interesting. I find that so interesting. Wow. So, all right, we talked about Waverly Hills and how you investigated there. You had the shadow figures.

Your brother got scratched at Waverly Hills, right? No, he got scratched at South Pittsburgh Hospital here in Tennessee. That's what it was. That's what it was. Okay. And so we talked about these different locations, but you came into my neck of the woods. So, I mean, you've done investigations in Philadelphia, Tennessee, but you've also come to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to do the eastern state penitentiary, which, you know, I'm familiar with. I've been there myself. What kind of things have happened there?

Honestly, it was a great place to visit. We did have one, well, that's not true. We saw a few shadow people, but we did have one thing that happened, which the Chattanooga paranormal team that I went with, I believe they had. it on their YouTube still. You'll see a lot of investigators, especially on TV. They'll get these flashlights and they'll turn it to where it's just barely not on. You know what I mean? So they're like any small connection will turn the light on and they'll sit there and ask questions, turn, you know, blink once for yes, twice for no. We didn't want to do that. We used a push button the flashlight that you actually had to press the button into to turn this thing on. And we were sitting at what was one of the release points where the few people that got to leave that place because that place was a horrible place to be in the jail.

It was basically where you could go through there and then you were on your way out. And once again, it was toward the end of the evening. And the guys from Chattanooga Paranormal were basically antagonizing. And okay, if you can turn this flashlight on for us, we will let you walk out of here right now. And we just kept saying it. And they were giving it a count down there. They're like, oh, you've got so many minutes left. We're leaving.

And with just a few minutes left of antagonizing, this flashlight clicks on. And like I said, it's not one of those that they've loosened up real loose and it could short it. Now, this was one that you had to actually push the button in and turn on. That was pretty freaky. The bad thing about Eastern State, though, is it's so old and stuff is fall. Like stuff would fall from the ceilons and it would sound like footsteps because when stuff would fall, it wouldn't just be one tiny piece of paint that would call. If one thing fell, there would be three or four things fall.

So you would hear what sounded like footsteps. There for the first couple hours. We were like, holy crap, there's stuff all over the place. And then when my buddy's had a piece of paint from the roof fall off and hit him on the head and we're like, okay, well, there goes. all that. But the flashlight thing, I said, I've got it wrote down here. If you go to Chattanooga Paranormal Eastern State flashlight on YouTube, you can see that video. You can only hear me in the background. I said, holy crap, the flashlight just turned on. And obviously, they opened the door and they're like, okay, you're free to go now. But that was the biggest

thing that happened there. We did see a few shadow people, but like I said, the building, being so old, all of our audio was basically ruined because, like you said, every few minutes you'd hear something fall from the ceiling. And plus it was wet in there. So sometimes stuff would fall, land in water, which would give it a different sound. And it was, it was a, you know, a great place to go visit and all that. We just, it wasn't as active as say Waverly Hills or anything like that. Yeah. And that's a, that's the exact thing. that I've gotten when I went there as well. Like, I just didn't feel like there was much activity there.

Now, granted, I was there during the day and people say, I go at night, but I just don't think that I have to go at night in order for things to happen. And so it was one of those things where it was kind of like, for me, it was like a letdown. I was like, oh, man, I'm going to this legendary place. And then like nothing. I was just like, well. Yeah, when they open the gates to that place, you're like, oh, my God, if anywhere in the world is haunted, this place right here is haunted.

Because especially where it sits, I know you're familiar with the area. It sits kind of in like a part of town where there's restaurants like directly across the street and hard. It's in the hood. It's in the hood. It's like a thing right in the middle of it's like this huge castle looking thing. And it's just it's so old and decrep looking, but it's right there in the middle of like all this other stuff going on. And like I said, as soon as they open the gates and unless you're in, my first thought was, oh, my God, this is definitely got some stuff going on. But yeah, they, they, they, um, when they first built that prison, it was on the outside of the city.

I think they said it was like two miles outside the city. And then the city grew and grew and grew to the point that residential neighborhoods built up around the prison. And it was still being active. I think what, in the 1970s or something. And yeah, it was pretty light, pretty yeah. It got to the point where, you know, people were in a neighborhood throwing drugs over the walls to prisoners. And there was a, I think, a kindergarten center right across the street from the prison and all this stuff. It's like, hey, maybe we should shut this down now. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, Al Capone was there at one time. Yeah. I don't, do you remember seeing his cell? They had, like, knocked a wall out and made two cells for him. He had like a couch and not a radio, but like a stonograph, whatever the crap. Like, he had a sweet, basically, in this place. But their whole, their whole idea back then from what I remember the tour got telling us, at least when it first started was, these prisoners were sent to their room. They had a like a light in the ceiling or like a place in the ceiling for sunlight to come in.

And they were to pray. Like, I don't remember how many hours. That's what they were supposed to do is pray until they were forgiven, which, you know, they could be forgiven by God, obviously. But the prison guards are not going to forgive them and let them out. So their whole life, the rest of their life, they were stuck in that little room just staring at this little hole in the ceiling, praying. Yeah, I think the prison originally was made and created by the Quakers, if I remember correctly. Isn't that true?

Yeah, I believe that's right, the Quakers, yep. And I think even when they went outside that, like, they would just open up the back part of their cell, and they had like a little six-by-six, you know, fenced-in area where they could go out back. So that was their outside time. It was smaller than the room there. And the room was just barely big enough to fit a bed in. It was a pretty brutal place. Yeah, as far as I have activity, it was kind of a letdown, especially me, you know, flying from all the way down here and planning a whole couple of weekend or a weekend after all this stuff.

And it just, it was a kind of a letdown. But it is a really cool place. I mean, historically. Yeah, I agree. I agree. And like I said earlier, I absolutely love history. I mean, don't get me wrong. Easter State Pententary, very historical.

I love it. But for me, it's the lost history, the lost history, the mysterious lost history, you know, that I really kind of, I freaking love that stuff. So, you know, Eastern State's been really, you know, investigated a lot. And, you know, they do tours and, you know, it's a big business now. So I like the more off the beaten path kind of stuff. Yeah. And that's what I was telling you before we started, man, with the exception of Weaverly

Hills, most of the big stuff that I've had happened has been at private, private residences. Like, it's not at some, you don't have to go to some abandoned hospital or something like that. Because like I said, especially around here, man, you never know what these houses, what was, like for my house, example, you never know what was here before this house was built. You have no idea. I mean, it's, those are some of the best places to go. but in my opinion anyways. Yeah, I agree, man. I agree. So listen, before we wrap things up, though, I know we were setting out to talk about this per se,

but I just got to ask you, man. So the way you got out of being a paranormal investigator was you had a Bigfoot experience and you concluded that it would be easier to find answers about Bigfoot than it was the paranormal. So what was this experience that kind of made you shift your whole investigative field? All right. Well, I actually, I had to. The first one I had was in 2011 or 12. I cannot remember the year. I've tried. My buddies and I, when we were in high school, man, we always used to go camping on Friday nights. Everyone would go to football games. But no, we wanted, we would go camping because my buddy had a dairy, his dad had a dairy farm. So we had like 2,000 acres. You know, we'd sneak a few beers out there and go camping or whatever. So we decided to get back to. together, like I said, it's like 2011 or 12 and go out here to Cherokee National Forest and camping. Excuse me. And one of the things we used to do when we were younger is we would see we could get the coyotes going first

because we used to make them, you know, start yipping and hollering back. It was just kind of fun. And we decided to do that again. And we did. We got the coyotes going, which was cool. It's like, oh, man, I remember doing this. And about the time that they started going off, we heard the, The loudest, I can't even explain to you with this screen.

It was like, it was like a woman being brutally murdered. And it was far away. But I'm telling you, it was so loud. Everything shut up. The coyote shut up. Me and my buddies stopped laughing. The flights at the camp next to this came up. Like, it was freaky.

But I did not know that much about Sasquatch at that time. I knew, you know, I had seen the Patterson Gimmond film on, and stuff like. that, but I didn't really know a whole lot about that. I just knew when that happened, I went out to my Jeep and I got my gun. I was like, I don't know what that was, but I'm sleeping with my gun tonight. So I guess that was right about the same time that West started his show, and I just happened to find it. Sasquatch Chronicles, I found it, and started listening to it and had heard the intro back then. It has some of the screens in there.

So I got real into that. And one of his co-host at the time, I'm not going to mention his name, just told me that I should put up flyers to see, you know, if anybody else did see anything or heard anything around that area. And it took a little while, you know, five or six months. But I started getting emails from eyewitnesses. Most of them had had roadside crossings right in the same area. They had heard screams and stuff.

And I thought, you know, this is what. But it's got, you know, this is what I had to hear that night. So I had one older gentleman contact me, and this was a few years back. It was right around Halloween, and I'll tell you why I know exactly why it was around Halloween. He was fishing right there. You can, you know, just put you some waiters on, get there, and it's good for trout fishing, that type of stuff. And he saw one of these things come down to this creek and start drinking water. Now, he thought at the time, what he told me, he said, it was, you know, it was right at Halloween.

Like I said, he thought it was someone in a monkey costume. And he starts just cursing this thing out and yelling at it and all this stuff. And he said when it stood up, he knew instantly as soon as this thing stood up that it wasn't a person because it was so big. I don't have those notes in front of him, but I know it was over eight feet. I want to say eight and a half feet black. And like I said, when it was sitting down drinking water, he thought it was just somebody messing with him, it being Halloween. And like I said, you know, you don't mess with an old man that's fishing or hunting around here or you'll get the business. But he told me about that.

And he said he was shocked when it stood up. And that was kind of drew me back to that area. And the ghost hunting stuff was starting to taper off because it was like, well, if I want to keep doing this, first of all, I've got every. everything on camera. I've got all this audio, but I've got more questions than I started out with. I don't have any answers. I'm not going to find any answers. It's just not going to happen. I was like, well, maybe I'll start checking this out. So that's why I put those flyers up and talked to that old man. And I don't know, a few months later, I went back to real close to the area where he saw that app. And I didn't have hip high waiters on. I just had waiters on. I just

had waiters that came up to my knees and I parked a little far down from him. And I was trying to figure out a way to cross that creek because across that creek, there's a mountain that goes straight up and it just goes back for miles. There's nothing there. I wanted to get on top of that mountain and see, you know, what was back there. So I'm going down through there, trying to find a place to a cross and I hear a snap. It's honestly, it sounded like a gunshot. And I thought, well, you know, there's nothing over there.

Maybe that was a gunshot because there's nothing. in those woods. Keep going a little farther, and I'm testing out the water in a place to see if I can cross without getting wet, and I hear another pop. And it's almost at the same time I'm looking up. I hear pop, and I see the back of an arm reach up and grab a tree and pull up the left. I'm guessing it's his left leg. Never saw foot, never saw a hand, never saw face.

So I can't say this for 100% certain. But I saw an upper extremity, grab a tree. pull up a lower extremity and then it go up the hill. I kind of thought maybe it was a bear because we do have bears here, but this was an orangish-reddish color. And it also outstretched its arm to pull itself up. So I was like, okay, screw this. I don't care if this water's deep or not.

I'm going across the creek, just go across the creek, trying to not break my ankles on the rocks and stuff. And I get up there and I get, I don't know, my 20, 30 feet, up there and I'm laying on my side. Matter of fact, my pistol's digging into my leg because it's vertical straight up and I'm laying on my side thinking, dude, what are you doing? You're chasing after, even if it's just a pair, why are you chasing after this? You know, reality starts kicking in.

What the crap I'm doing chasing this thing. I'm sitting there for a minute and I'm thinking, okay, this thing's got to be close because this thing is, you know, it's a straight uphill. I'm going to sit here and see if I can hear anything. And Tony, I didn't hear a word. I didn't hear nothing. The only sound I heard was the water, the rocks from the water down below. And so this thing was moving up the hill.

And, you know, I've ran into bears quite a bit. When they run from you, they can't help themselves. They break down, destroy everything in their path, trying to get away from people. They're scared of them. But this thing, the only sounds it made with a few pops that I heard. And when it took off the hill and I took off across the creek, I never heard another sound from it. No, that doesn't mean it didn't just get up there and sit somewhere where I couldn't stay it because it was vertical or maybe it got away. It was moving a heck of what fashion when I was.

That's my little encounter there. And like I said, I can't say for 100%, but it was something on two legs that pulled itself up with a tree. I did go back down and wind up looking to that tree that it grabbed and it had ripped some of the bark off where it grabbed it, but it didn't uproot the tree. And, you know, bears, if they get around the tree, that's the only reason they would grab one is to knock it over and get the grubs and stuff underneath it.

But this thing was using like a stepping stick to get up the hill. So, yeah, after sitting there for about 10 minutes, I thought, God, I'm an idiot. I'm sitting here with a 9 millimeter on my hip. This could be a, you know, Sasquatch, what am I doing? Yeah. I got back in and left. But, yeah, that was my, I still, I still do, you know, take reports and go out and meet people.

And my nephew's, my nephew is fascinated by the subject. He was so excited. He actually got to do the intro the other day on one of the shows. But, yeah, you know, take him out hiking and camp him. But for whatever reason, the past year or so, the reports that I've been, getting have died down a lot. When I first started getting one three or four years ago,

I mean, I was getting one after another after another. Sometimes I'd go out and meet two people on the same day in the same area. But for like in the last year or so, I don't know if it's something to do with the weather and maybe they've taken a double, you know, another route or something,

but I just haven't had that many here lately. But so, but yeah, like I said, after all the paranormal stuff and you have all this stuff happen. and all I can do at the end of the day and just, like I said, throw my hands up and say, well, that happened. I don't know how to explain it, but it happened. I figured, you know, I've had these kind of small experiences and some people telling me about Bigfoot.

You know, it's got a rich area around here. Bigfoot does anyways in the East Tennessee Mountains. There's a lot of wilderness here. I figured, heck, probably be easier to check this out as if I could find any answers. But I'm kind of stuck in the same boat on that now because the same way. you get in there and every time you think you know something, something else comes up. And it's frustrating. So, yeah, that was my little venture from paranormal to Bigfoot.

That's interesting, man. Yeah. I just had a dogman setting in the town that I live in last year. And the report just came out not too long. Like, I think it was this week or last week. And I sent it to some friends and stuff. And my one friend was like, well, I got my nine. And I was just like,

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Good luck with that, my friend. Good luck with that. Yeah, I started taking it, which it's not going to matter, but I started taking my 12-gauge with me when I would go. I'm like, all right, if this thing coming after me, at least I could put a slug in its eyeball or something. But yeah, that's my exact fault when I was laying on the side of the hill. I'm like, what are you doing, dude? You've got bear spray, which is going to make you taste a little better. And you've got a 9-millimeter glock. You are screwed.

And the hill was so steep. If I would have ran up, I would have been running into it. If I went down, I would have face planted into the frigging river. Like, I wasn't going anywhere. So it was just one of those, I don't know, I just got over-excited and took off doing something stupid that I should have never done. But I couldn't hold back. But, you know, I learned my lesson there. Yeah.

I got a shotgun that will put a hole in your shoulder when you shoot it. And so, you know, I'm like, maybe I'll start taking that out with me. Some bigger. Better than a non-millimeter. Yeah. Yeah, I had to jump through hoops to get this thing, too. I mean, it took me eight months to get it because, well, I'm not going to get into it. But, yeah, it's legit.

But, Trey, man, I appreciate it coming on the show. And, you know, you mentioned about, you know, I think you said your nephew or something with recording. Do you have your own show? No, no, no. This was on West, on West, I got you. You know, he does a little intro or whatever. Yeah, he got to say, hey, this is Kaysen from East Tennessee.

And you're listening to, he just thought that was the coolest thing in the world. His dad called me and said he's bouncing off the walls, calling all his friends, famous, oh, great. And we just took him camping. Actually, a couple of weeks ago his first camping trip of the years.

So he's, he's, he's real. that. He's in a survival. He likes to try to start the fire with just a flint steel and all that stuff. So he's going to be a little outdoors when when he grows up, that's for sure. Well, that's sure, everybody. I really hope you enjoyed it. And if you did enjoy it, please share the show with your friends. I don't care where or how you share the show. Just share the show if you enjoyed it. That's the best thing you can do to help this show grow is to share with your friends. So thank you very much, friends for being here. Thanks for listening on a continued basis.

And until next week, stay safe. Take care and remember the truth of such a free. But first, it'll piss you off. Bye. Awaken from the forest and the depths of the abyss. This creature is a paradigm of time lost and time itself. It fears no one. It adheres to no rule that man can create. It forges its own path and yet its path remains hidden from the world. The sphere of his existence is beyond most comprehension as it exudes its power quietly

but transcendent. It needs no one's approval to exist, but yet its very existence is sought after by many. It watches. It learns. Adapt to the ever-changing environment around it, even as the environment is wrought with corruption. It battles the corruption only when pressed or for the protection of others like it. It is a mirage that few will ever understand. It's a cornucopia of knowledge from an era long. past. It's free. It's Bigfoot.

My fantasy's always consisted of making it big. My soul was nothing more than a bargaining chip. Marketing is what they tell you to do and what you're willing to give. Larkin to the fullest extent. I don't wait. I shoot first like high on a roadie and these people don't understand me like reading anokian. Stretch thin. Like pulling in accordion. My heart ain't primordium. All these historians telling us lies the genocide.

Everything is medicalized. Politicians selling the ride. I betta-a-die where the relevance lies They're dressing alike Reptillions My resilience is brilliant I'm here to lead the rebellion on heli and salient

alien with no melanin I'm a Yeti ain't hiding from Armageddian Come