The Confessionals - 599: The Conjuring House Experiments

Episode Date: November 14, 2023

In Episode 599: The Conjuring House Experiments, we are joined in the studio by Stacy Brown and the Outkast Paranormal crew. Stacy reached out to me, sharing that Outkast Paranormal was the last investigative team to explore the Conjuring House, where the owner gave them free rein, stating, "anything goes." With the property up for sale, the owner was less concerned about the methods used to elicit paranormal activity. The crew took this liberty seriously, attempting various techniques such as descending down wells, opening portals, and even experimenting with unconventional methods like burying individuals alive on the property.As they shared their experiences in the studio, we simultaneously recorded videos of the entire conversation. This interview plays a pivotal role in the final production of their documentary. You'll have the opportunity to not only listen to the full interview but also witness it in the documentary itself. The dialogue becomes an integral part of the film, guiding the narrative seamlessly from scene to scene.The Confessionals Members App:Apple Store: https://apple.co/3UxhPrhGoogle Play: https://bit.ly/43mk8kZBecome a member for AD FREE listening and EXTRA shows: theconfessionalspodcast.com/joinWatch The Shape of Shadows: https://www.merkel.media/stream-nowWatch Expedition Dogman: https://bit.ly/3CE6Kg0SPONSORSGET UNCOMMON GOODS at 15% off: uncommongoods.com/tonyGET EMP Shield: empshield.com Coupon Code: "tony" for $50 off every item you purchase! Listen to this episode for more information! Link: bit.ly/3YaMD1NGET SIMPLISAFE TODAY: simplisafe.com/confessionalsGET Hello Fresh: hellofresh.com/confessionalsfree Promo Code: "confessionalsfree" for FREE BREAKFAST FOR LIFE!!!Get Emergency Food Supplies: www.preparewiththeconfessionals.comCONNECT WITH USWebsite: www.theconfessionalspodcast.comEmail: [e-mail] to the Newsletter: https://www.theconfessionalspodcast.com/the-newsletterMAILING ADDRESS:Merkel Media257 N. Calderwood St., #301Alcoa, TN 37701SOCIAL MEDIASubscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/2TlREaIDiscord: https://discord.gg/KDn4D2uw7hShow Instagram: theconfessionalspodcastTony's Instagram: tonymerkelofficialFacebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcasTwitter: @TConfessionalsTony's Twitter: @tony_merkelOUTRO MUSICJoel Thomas - Walking In My SkinYouTube | Apple | SpotifyInstagram: @vanteslamusic

Merkel Media This was all circulating around the base That a giant had been killed But no one was supposed to talk about it Boney fingers Reach up underneath the door Curl up to grab it

And then disappear When he came over to me Dude he slithered over to me The giant comes out of the cave And they're all frozen And he starts running and firing at this giant But the giant moves he's got a spear in one hand and he's running really fast and spears dan holds him up like this

somebody else shoot him in the face shoot him in the face they basically decapitated and i look over and there are two push and because i know i'm seeing a monster welcome to the show everybody you're listening to the confessional's podcast i'm your host tony merkle thanks for being here if you've a crazy wild experience you want to share with me on the show go ahead and shoot me an email my email address is contact at the confessionals podcast.com. That's contact at the confessionalspodcast.com. Or go to the website to confessionalspodcast.com, hit the contact section, and you can reach me that way as well.

Either way works for me, just get a hold of me. If you want more shows on a weekly basis, every Thursday we drop member shows to members only. You can get those Thursday shows. You can get Tuesday shows ad free and overtime episodes when they're available right there on the website and on the confessionals app. All you got to do is go to the confessionals. Podcast.com slash join and become a member, and all that is yours, my friends. All right.

Today, we got some awesome guests in studio here from the great state of Florida. We have the outcast paranormal crew. How you guys doing? Good, man. Good. Yeah. Yeah. So this is probably the largest crowd I've had in studio.

My rule is for Max. We're breaking that rule today. But it's absolutely worth it. we have the Stacy are you state we have Stacy Brown here Stacy are you like the the the leader of the group or

is there a leader? Did you start it? Who started outcast paranormal? What's the history of this group? So it was funny because there was no plans for an outcast paranormal. I was making a film Monster of the Miaka invited all these knuckleheads to

come down and be a part of the crew he's a producer you know what I mean James lived in the areas. I had a local guy there Joey doing the film and that morphed into Outcasts we loved like the week was a blast you know I'm out there wading them through the gator infested water and like when I say there's like 30 Gators right there and we were just like cruising through and it was so much fun and it's like hey let's keep doing this you know and so that's that's really hot wow there was no intention so it was very random outcast coming together and

stuff. Did you have a direction as to what you guys wanted to do with Outcast Paranormal? I mean, you have this name Outcast. Obviously didn't start that way. So at some point, you're like, hey, we got something here. Let's start doing stuff. Did you have a direction of we're going to do Bigfoot? We're going to do everything. We're going to do movies. We're going to do documentaries. How did this all come together? Because what we're doing today is we're going to be talking about you guys and your experience at the Conjuring House. And just so people understand the Conjuring House and the situation going on right now. Stacey told me on the phone a couple weeks ago, it's changing ownership. And these guys are the last ones that go in and do a paranormal investigation. And the

owners, they said, we don't care what you do in here now because it's not our problem. So all rules are off. Do whatever you want. And these guys went in hard. Yes, they tried opening portals, but we're going to get there. So let's rewind a bit because before we get into the conjuring and stuff, that's a documentary that you guys did. but did you guys start out with that idea or what? Yeah, so, okay, because I've been making films already. I've made a few. I had done some stuff in TV, both in front and behind the camera.

And so we wanted to make some films in this space. Like, we like, because when you watch a lot of the paranormal media that's out there, it's, you know what I mean? It's kind of done all the same way. It's basically the same stuff, yada, yada. And then, you know, you have small town monsters over here. Very successful. Very good films.

Yeah. Right? We wanted to make a different flavor of ice cream. Mm-hmm. You know, let's go push some boundaries. Yeah. Let's, you know, a little bit faster-paced. You know, maybe we can do some jump scares and add some other elements because they've got it dialed in.

Mm-hmm. Right? but at the same time it's more of a traditional something you would see on National Geographic or you know what I mean? You wanted to do it outside the box kind of thing.

Yeah, outside of the box. If you ever remember the slurpy machines as a kid at 7-Eleven? Yeah, yeah. So when you go to, when you go into a house that something's followed this guy and has been abducting him for years and he was on a big show

and there's some really crazy stuff going on and you bring in a pre-slash rabbi slash occultist slash, you name it, and you do a blood-leading ceremony in that house. That's kind of, you know, that's the suicide, right? Remember suicide? You mix all the flavors. He's talking about new ice cream.

Stacey wanted to make suicide flavor. Gotcha. That actually is a great analogy. At the same time, there's issue with that because people, I don't know that people are ready for that, you know. we don't get the oh it's great film from everyone

you know you get they love it or hate it adamantly you know and maybe it catches on if it doesn't we're enjoying it yeah you know that's how I feel with my stuff too right I people it's like I've gotten the sense that people either loved expedition dogman or they hated it

but one of my the things that I think is the funniest thing is like it's obvious what I'm doing I'm going out into these environments seeing what happens, right? I'm documenting the journey. And one of the things that make me laugh the most is that people were like, well, you didn't film anything. Well, what do you want?

Do you want me to fake it? Because then you're going to be mad at me, you know? So, like, I'm just documenting the journey and trying to present it to you in an entertaining fashion. And fortunately, for me, for the shape of shadows, we were able to actually really put something out there that had stuff on it. And it was just like, it was really good.

So, but so that's kind of like outcast, paranormal, how you guys are going about things and pursuing your films. You got a great crew here. And it's not even a whole crew. We're missing, what, three people right now from the film? I'm missing quite a bit because there are two people in Oklahoma, you know, that were with us. But people come and go, too. Yeah, people come and go. You know how it is.

Yeah. It's kind of like a Queens of the Stone Age. You know, they just have constant different musicians. That's it. Yeah. No, I got you. I got you. And I wanted to just add to it, like, okay, so what's, what I love about you is, you know, your truck driver, but you had this passion and you decided to take this leap of faith and build the career you wanted, right?

So for us, one thing we kind of have all in common is, yeah, maybe we come from big footing, but we've always been ghost hunting. We've always been looking for demons, portals, angels, whatever. We're fascinated by the diversity that's out there. So if you're going to build your dream company and put your Avengers together, then we want to be chasing all of it because, you know, gather on all these stories from everyone, there's a lot more weirdness out there than mainstream is talking about, and it's going to take rogue outcasts like us, like yourself,

to bring that narrative to the public enough to where they become open to it, you know? And I agree with you, because it's like when you're, and you coming from the TV world, like when you're producing a TV show, you have so many factors involved. I mean, you're thinking about what's going to sell?

What's the audience, the general audience, going to perceive and be tolerable of? What are the investors and people who are trying to make money be willing to accept because they're thinking what's going to have the biggest return? When you do it like this independently, you now can just be like handcuffs are off. We're going to get weird. And we're going to have some fun. We still have to have some handcuffs. He's pointing at RPG.

What's this guy all about? He's doing some crazy stuff. Listen, guys, first of all, nobody's ever had sex on thermal camera while 100. I'm going to steal that from me. I'm going to be the first. If we put a thermal camera in our butt and ran through this area naked at night, not a bad idea, right? So you guys are really thinking outside the box. What inspires people to make that leap, to try new things, to not just go out there and knock on a tree?

It's people like us. It's the outcast. And there's more of us than there is of anyone else. I think we're finding that out, too. I think we're finding out that. And that's just in general. I mean, you're wearing Alex Jones shirt. So, but, like, that's just in general.

Like, we, like, we live in a world right now where we're starting to see that, I think the general population, there is now an overwhelming amount of people who are starting to look at the mainstream whatever, whether there's media or entertainment, history channel, whatever. And we're like, what you've been feeding us is no longer satisfactory. We're still hungry because we now know there's more out there that you're not telling us. that you're not telling us and showing us. And it's leaving the door wide open for people like us who are creating cool content outside those realms to say, yeah, there is more. And let's show you what we got here. And so I think you guys are doing a great job. I got a chance to review what you guys kind of did. And it's obviously very rough and everything that what you guys are doing. You're still building the film. And that's what we're doing here today. But I got a chance

to review your sessions and the different chapters of the Conjuring House experiment. Do you have a name for this yet? That's it. Conjuring House Experiments. Are you kidding me? I'm on fire. I'm rolling 20s today. Let's go.

Anybody who doesn't get that reference of rolling 20s, we'll stay there for another day. If you get it, you get it. You get it. But that's crazy. So this Conjuring House experiment, you guys go in there, like I said, and you just light it up. So leading up to this and stuff, how did this whole thing come together as far as, hey, we have an opportunity to be the last paranormal group to go in and investigate this place underneath this ownership and they're taking off the handcuff. How did that whole thing come together? So Corey Hineson owned the Conjuring House at the time, right?

I investigated the Bridgewater Triangle and a few other things with him. So we were buddies. And then he bought the Conjuring House, right? And now I have this friend that owns the Conjuring House. That's wild. I've been up there a few times, not only hang out, but hey, we have this really cool place. We can just do whatever. And he called me one day and was like, hey, bud, I've sold the house.

It doesn't close until this date. I know you've been talking about making a film up here. it's now or never no holds barred do whatever you want because they have a list of rules when you go in the house we broke every one of them

you know what I mean but he was like do whatever you want to figure out what's going on here you're more than welcome to come up and then I call James because these things yeah and we were like because we were trying to decide on our next

adventure you know to film and there was a couple options on the table and that wasn't one of them until you got the call. Yeah. And it just kind of fell in. And I was like, can we squeeze this? Can we work this? And then it was odd because then the experiments fell in.

It was almost like it was meant to be as cliche as that sounds because the second it booked, then I get a call from Jay Prather. Hey, I'm working on this new experiment. Would you like to help me set up and do it? And I'm like, hey, guess what I just booked for a week? You know what I mean? So it all fell into place. And I guess it could, you can say it worked great.

This is the first time we've all been in the same room together since then. Really? Yeah. There were some effects. Life got weird after. Yeah. I've got bad for a lot of us. Wow.

Yeah. And we're definitely going to get into that. So you guys kind of put all this together. And it sounds like you made the decision, we're going to go, and we're going to figure out how to, how, what we're going to do. in the process, but we're going to book it now because we have no choice. And so it's kind of like, as somebody on this end of things that it does it as well, that's like almost backwards. Because like you want to have an idea of what you would do if you had a chance to go to this

location. But it's like, hey, we're going here. What are we going to do? We're going to figure that out later. We're going, though, you know? That's the model. We're working on that, by the way. We're working on that. Story of our life. Let's back into this. Let's get her pregnant first and then marry her. That's wild. That's what I'm doing.

That is what you're doing. So you guys get up there and you arrive on scene. Now, you had been there. Has anybody else? I was from Rhode Island. So I had been there a long time ago, but not at the extent, like, exploring it in that manner. Yeah. But I was just excited to go back to.

Island. Now, you guys are getting there. You arrive. Before you start telling us what you guys started doing and all the things leading into that, let us let the audience know, and I told you this before earlier before you start recording, I was telling my neighbor what I was doing today because I said, yeah, I'm going in the office tomorrow. We're filming documentaries. He's like, well, what's about? And I said, you know, actually, you know, you know the movie The Conjuring. He's like, yeah. And I said, well, these guys went and did a crazy experiment at the conjuring house. And he had no idea there was a conjuring house, like an actual location. So if you could, for the audience listening, give them a little bit of a history of the house

and kind of why traditionally at least, maybe you guys have different perceptions and ideas about it now since you've been there and did what you did. But leading into that and stuff, what people relatively know the conjuring house for. Well, Ed and Lorraine Warren, people know that. that was a couple that was a pretty devout Catholic couple that went around and helped people that had demonic entities, possessions or whatever. And this is a real couple in the 60s and 70s that went around trying to help people rid these things from their homes. And they were asked to come out to this farmhouse in Rhode Island where a family had recently bought the home.

And when they went out there, a myriad of things happened. And it never really got solved. I mean, things from, it's embellished in the movie, but, you know, the woman getting picked up in a chair and thrown and, you know, horror movie stuff. So they made a movie out of it, right? And some of it's embellished, but then they made a franchise series after that, that is all embellishment. So a lot of people associate the conjuring house with this really slick series or franchise, another one of which is coming out probably about three weeks before our film comes out. There's another one coming out. Really? Yeah, we just saw the hotel last night.

We saw the advertisement. How random. What a coincidence. So, yeah, that was a real couple that did that. And that was probably their, if you want to call it, like their crown jewel case. So, yeah, when, you know, another thing I'll mention is before this happened, it almost didn't happen. Because we were going back and forth with the caretaker, Bill Brock and Corey. to try to get logistics going on this.

And Corey reaches out to me and says something about, because we had a window, right? And he said, I don't know if it's going to happen now or something. I'm like, what? And an article from the Wall Street Journal was released. And it's an interview with Corey, an interview with the new owner, the interview for what the house sold for, this whole well-written story.

And I'm like, wow, congratulations. He's like, no. We hadn't closed yet. This got leaked. this reporter released this too soon, this might blow everything up. Because, you know, new owner was upset, and they finally worked through that. So it was a series of those things where we're going to, no, he's not. He can't get out there.

And it was a number of those, as you probably know, when you film, it's like everything that can go wrong may go wrong or may get different. You have a general idea, and then you just have that general idea knowing that that's actually not going to happen. And we're just setting off in a direction. and we're just working towards a goal here. Yeah. That's crazy.

How much did it sell for? 1.6. 1.6. Yeah. How much did you buy for? 500. Oh, what great. He offered me for 625.

What? And I was like, I don't want to really go to Rhode Island. This is right after he bought it. Bro. I can tell you why not. Rhode Island's the best. People like you. Okay, so, so off topic, but on topic,

buy that stuff and then flip it right? Oh, yeah, for sure. But like. You would have been. Like, you would have, you would have funded Outcast for how long? Yeah. You would have started for a million more. You know, because the only things I want to do is sit at the house with my cat and stay in

Walkiella County, Florida. But that house wouldn't let you leave. That house is perfect for you. That was the problem, but. Yeah. I wish, honestly, if you would have told me that, be like, yo, I'll buy for six and I'll flip that John for two. Like, I don't care.

But anyways, that's, that's really cool in the history of the Conjuring House. Well, the house, the house is older than the country. Okay. Yes. So this house was built, I believe when George, a few years before George Washington was even born. It's 1600s, right? Yeah. Yeah.

And so there's a road that runs through there. And that's the original road that connected, I think, Pennsylvania to New York or something like there were some road. Some, it's a horse and buggy road, right? But it still goes through the property. They still cut the rock walls. And then the thing about the place is the, what's his name? The war, King George, King, is that it? Who was?

The war was fought there. And in the yard, there's 12, I believe 12, buried soldiers in the yard. But all these natives died, all these people. And then just the whole area. You know, and then also it's smack dab in the Bridgewater Triangle. You know, King Philip. King Phillips War. That's what it was.

Yeah, I knew that it was. Was it 1635? Something like that, dude. But yeah, very terrible war. They don't even really talk about it a lot. But explain why they don't talk about it. Because it was so violent. More people died in that war than all the other ones.

Yeah, per capita. Per capita, it is the most brutal. And the majority of people that died, as Corey had said, you'll see in the film as well, is women and children. So who wants to talk about that in terms of expanding and, you know, running a country. Nobody, that's like the shady pass you don't want to talk about. But that house is only in the spotlight because of Ed and Lorraine Warren. Right. Like nobody would know about Harrisville, Rhode Island. I mean, it's in the, it's the middle of nowhere Rhode Island, which I know it's not very

big, but nobody would know about that unless they came to investigate. And the thing that we're finding in our research, the thing that we're finding, which you're probably finding as well, is we go to look at one spot. It's the house. It's the person. And then wouldn't you know it, all the weirdness tends to point to know it's the land. The land. And that's really kind of profound. And Stacey, I think you were the one that said or one of you where it was like,

no, this is a Skinwalker ranch. Yeah. But basically TV is like the new Ed and Lorraine Warren. If TV really put a spotlight on it, they could show that what it truly is because the neighbors have even more crazy shit going on. Right?

But nobody talks about that. Really. Which is fascinating. It's the whole place. Wow. They just don't want the publicity because look what happened. You get people showing up in your yard, you know, taking pictures at two in the morning. Guarantee you when the neighbors are ready to sell, they'll start advertising the paranormal activity for about two years and then they'll sell.

It's the best marketing they could ever do to double the value of that house. They'll have Zach Baggins coming out to buy the property, you know, or a Tony Merkel or something. I don't know. It depends on how deep. But that's really, and just to correct myself, it was 1675 when the war happened. So about 100 years before we were a country. country, you know. And so that's, and tons of bloodshed. So yeah, I mean, we find that with the Skimwalker Ranch area, you know, the space wolf research budding up against Skimwalker Ranch,

they have tons of activity on that property because it is the area. It's the land. And that's what we're finding a lot. And this is a very old ancient land that we live on all over this country. And, and so, yeah, I totally agree with you. I think that the history of this land and, and what happened here for centuries plays a lot into what people are experiencing. And if we would start paying attention more to it, I think that we would come to a lot more conclusions that provide possible ways of thinking that would give us answers than what we attend to do now because we're so caught up in Western civilization.

We're smart. We're science. We're this, we're that. We're beyond. We're not beyond anything. We're still the same here. humans species-wise that existed back then.

Nothing's changed. And I believe, personally, that we have a lot of lost technology. I think they were actually really smart back then, and things happened, and we actually lost technology. Hey, don't tell me that it's impossible because we got NASA saying that we lost technology on how to go to the moon. So I'm just saying, if that happened in the last hundred years, imagine 2,000 years. We could lose technology.

You can happen. And one other thing about the land that we didn't even know, or I didn't know before we went there, is there's a stone circle right next to the house that they don't. know how old that is. Really? Yeah, it's about, what, 30 feet in diameter? Yeah. Did they say they know what it's from, what it's for?

They call it the vortex. No. Yeah. Love it. Yeah. Love it. A lot of speculation. There's always a mix of legend and lore and mythos that goes with a house like that.

Yeah. And some things you can, it's like sifting through the fly poop to get to the pepper. They look the same, but some is and some isn't. So you hear, you know, you hear things and then you look at it's like, That's true. No, it's not. Maybe it is, or what this person said it was. So it's hard to tell with some of it.

But we're the ones that draw borders, right? Property lines, state lines. Yep. You know, 1600s, they didn't have a border that said, look, atrocities were committed here. There's an energy or whatever. And it only borders here, right? Because there's a new county, there's a county right here. We can't cross the line abnormally.

Yeah. Right? It doesn't make any sense. No, it doesn't make sense. So when you think about it, like you did, if you get something that borders it, there's a very good chance that it's going on there too. But the attraction is the house itself, right?

So everybody focuses just on the house. And we expanded that focus, and we probably come to a different conclusion maybe. Yeah. And that's even with wildlife. I mean, like, even in town we're in right now, they're like on my side of town, I'm on the outside of town over here,

kind of further away from the mountains. And they're like, we don't get bare out here. on on the like this side of town just about five minutes that way they're like oh yeah we get bear all the time and so when they're like we don't get bear out there i'm like that's a cute story bro like that's a cute story you just haven't seen one yeah yeah like or the wild hogs like you know i mean like it's just like no they don't know boundaries you know right so yeah i totally get it so all right you guys you know the history of the property you guys have this unique opportunity

you start getting an idea of what you're gonna what you're going to do so let's now start moving into these experiments that you guys performed. How many days were you guys at this location? Five. Five. That's a great. That's a great time frame right there. Most people, they're thinking a day in a day out kind of thing.

Five days gives you a lot of opportunity to do a lot of funky stuff and you guys did it. So you guys, with what you sent over to me, you began and ended with World Gate. Okay. So we're going to start with that. Worldgate Experiment 1. Go ahead and let the people know what the experiment is and some of the things you guys, and if you feel like Worldgate Experiment 2 needs to tie into it as well, that's fine. But start letting people know what is World Gate Experiment.

Okay, so World Gate Experiment was a guy named Jay Prather. Okay, a buddy of mine lives in Maine. he makes all this tech for ghost adventures, Nick Groff, whatever Nick's doing, Ghost Brothers, like, if you've watched one of these ghost shows, chances are they're using his tech in every single episode. Wow. Right?

And he's under the radar. He doesn't want people to know him. Too late down. Yeah, right? Shut off, Jake. He doesn't want the government to know about him. So he calls me up, tells him he's got this new experiment. He needs a...

He needs a crazy dude to ride, and I'm always willing to ride, right? That guy is uniquely qualified. Yeah, so anyways, what it is, it's an old Nazi experiment. Okay, the Nazis were using it to remote view on the Allied forces, right? So then, you know, Germany falls. We take all the scientists, CIA after their, you know, somehow when they get formed, they get a hold of this experiment and they try it

for like six years. Okay, they're doing basically the same thing, Jay was the Worldgate, right? They come out of that. I think in 2002, I want to say. In 2003, the documents were declassified. Okay?

And it details that reality is fake. all religions are real. We live in an energy hologram. This is their findings coming out of this, the CIA, right? It's just saying some dude on Facebook saying this. This is like, hey, this is what they're saying, but there's a page missing, page 25. And so they were doing it. I'm sure it tied into like with the MK Ultra stuff because it's, you know, kind of the same ballpark figure, late 70s, you know.

But then, would you know, it's not long before we go and do this, page 25 surfaces. Jay calls me, I got it, I got it, I got page 25, we're doing it, you know, and it just basically confirms that what he's doing is on the right path. Now, the CIA had done these experiments in a controlled laboratory, yada, yada. Jay Prather's wanting to do it in the most haunted locations in the world. Like, let's travel. You know, let's see what's really going on with the house or, you know, whatever else. And so that was the kind of just to it.

He changed it a little bit. You know, he made it his own. He, I guess he was inspired by it, you know, and then made this other little, like, dinner recipe out of it. And so that's what we were going to do. the Worldgate is influenced a lot with Dramatria. It's like universal numbers. So couldn't everybody do the thing? RPG wasn't able to be in the part of the experiment because, you know, Jay's calling us and getting birthdays and the date that's happening and all these numbers have to add up.

And then that's where he determines where you're going to sit. So Jay talked to me for an hour, and I understood a little bit of it. It's like name, name, rank, and serial number was about all I could give him. But he was trying to explain the science behind it, and it's a lot to take in, right? But he was, you know, he's like the mad sign, like, Marty McCligh, you know, or whatever he's like. Like, he's got the code there. But so he had a trailer he brought that was what? Command Center.

About 20-foot trailer. And it's just full of monitors and all this equipment. And literally, we got there. And while that's the first experiment, it took two days round the clock to set it up. Wow. I mean, we had cabling. It was two days of literally round the clock. And we are on a time crunch because it had to happen at a certain time.

on a certain day. Like Marty McFly, we had to have the clock tower strike, whatever, for the car to go, right? And so there was a lot of pressure because, as you know, things just only go right. And there's little glitches here and it's an old house and with electricity. It's a whole thing, man. And he literally had a Justin and his son, his son. Yep. That also helped and traveled with Ghost Adventures.

and they came up in this fully equipped van full of stuff, like utility van, like a tech would have. And those guys worked around the clock for two days to get it set up to where we can do it. It's not like we rolled up and like, okay, let's get some monitors and do this. It literally took 48 hours or more to set up. That's incredible. So what's funny is I'm the only one that did not line up with universal math.

And to this day, I'm still pissed about it because I say, I say bullshit. But it's not my experiment, so you've got to be respectful. But what's really interesting about it is as a modern neuronaut, like I experiment with psilocybin to help break down the barrier, the veil, as you call it, so that I can move through, you know what I mean, and be at peace and actually be able to have experiences where if I wasn't able to, I might be too nervous to have it. But what it seems that he's been able to do is create a hallucinogenic journey

without any drugs. So, and it's not just hallucinogenic. it's like astral projecting, interdimensionally moving, kind of that veil, whatever this holographic world we're in, whatever that in between is, he creates that around you. And what they were able to experience, which you'll see as you've seen in the film and would talk,

is extraordinary. I mean, it's absolutely, he's a baby CIA guy. He's like a rogue CIA agent that's going around and be like, oh man, let's go do this and let's hunt an ass. And but what happened to all of them, unless they are all lying, and you have a wide range of knuckle.

heads, right? Yeah. Then what he has been able to reproduce is what the CIA was able to produce. Wow. And that's pretty profound. And that's why I'll always be pissed because I wasn't a part of the, I wasn't in the spaceship. I wanted to talk.

So, like, with the numbers, right? We were having a weird thing to where I was available for two seats, right? And I'm like, did you put junior on the end of it? And he's like, oh, so then he put junior on it, and I wasn't available for a seat. However, Stacey Brown still was, put senior on it. And then I asked about a number. My father passed away in 2018. We had this number that he would get to me after he passed away to tell me he was all right.

And that popped up. Popped up when? In the math, in the numbers, in the form. of the experiment. So there was a seat for him. Right. For your dad. Wow.

It was wild. Yeah. But sorry. No, you're good. Yeah, it was to have that. So I didn't even get in on it because, you know, we're like, hey, now we can get somebody, maybe it's on the other side that can even help further this. Wow.

You know, so that was the reasons it had, it was so precise, the part you sit in the house where you're positioned at and everything was like dialed into that math. And then I asked Jay, I was like, did this number come up? He's like, yeah, what does that mean? And I was like, oh, bro, it's a wild. That was one of the experiences. And doesn't that kind of like lead into what actually happened there too? Yeah.

Right. And so in summary, this experiment is CIA ran an experience. experiment based off of Nazi's experimentation. Once it became declassified, all the documents are there except for one page. That page gets found. Jay Prather finds it, builds an experiment around it based off of universal math and frequencies, key here too, and positioning and timing, and all the physics that go into it, put that together, we bring it to the most haunted location in America and proceed with that experiment.

and we do it twice, right? The frequency was a big part of it as well. Like there has to be a certain frequency. Now when you hear of that, what does it remind you of? Skinwalker Ranch has this frequency, right? That they've discovered, does that. I'd be curious to find with Jay's frequency ranges on that. But it was a big to-do trailer full of equipment, two days to set up.

We set it up and ran with it. And the results that we had, although to each individual were individual, as a whole, it started, as they say, and Skinwalker, it poked the hornets nest. Something started to happen after that. And it's interesting because I remember seeing how when he was describing to you guys and talking to you guys about what you're about to do, he was over-the-top confident. Oh, yeah. But when I was watching it, I was like, dang, bro.

Like, you're really confident that because he was like, I'm telling you, I'm telling you, every single person here is going to have an experience. I think he even said if you're in, even if you're not part of the experiment, you're going to have an experience. And I was like, bro, like you're walking. It's very confidently, but hearing the process that goes into this experiment,

all the things that had to align and the depth that he went in with it, it makes sense that he was able to talk with such confidence. What were you going to say? Well, I was just going to say, RPG said hallucinogenic. I want to make it clear, I don't think any of us were having hallucinations.

That frequency opened something up and we were able to see something. And I've never seen anything that clear in my life just trying to visualize with my eyes closed. It was like watching a movie. And this is all through an audio track. Yeah. That's another thing I left out. He builds this audio track based on the math, your location and all that in the place in the house.

And I guess hallucination is the only way you can, like, I can only way I can get it across when I tell normal people about this that don't know what I'm talking about. And it's like an audio track made me see things. That were there. They were real things. Like I have tangible proof from it because we're breaking down. We're having similarities. Different people are having similarities.

You know what I mean? It's not like with a mushroom trip or something like that. No, I mean, like you guys were interacting with each other in another realm. Right. Like, we'll put it in Tony words for the show. People are used to hearing. Like, I don't remember if it was like this for the first one, but for the second one, at least I remember seeing you guys recap.

And there was interaction in the other realm amongst each other. And I remember there were several different times where this was brought up. But I remember, I think it was, I'm looking at my notes here, Austin and his dad, Justin, right? So Austin is the son, right? So Austin said that he was in the other realm interacting. You guys all were talking about hearing a female voice.

But Austin came up to you, Stacey, and shook your cot. And when he shook your cot in the other realm, you felt it. And so this is something that is, and you guys filmed the recap. So when you're talking about feeling something shaking you, that's when he interjecting.

He's like, oh, well, I actually shook you, you know? And so there was a lot of that. And then on top of it, like the things that were happening around you guys, as you were recounting what happened, there was actual activity happening. So what you guys did, and I'm not saying that, from my perspective, I'm like, you guys are a little crazy. But it takes crazy people to do this stuff.

But like, you guys married realms for a period of time is how I would describe it. You guys took a realm that's unseen and this realm that is seen and you combined them. And you had interactions with each other, but other things as well. I think that's fair. I think that's fair to say. And the other thing is Jay instructed us. We had, he sent us audio beforehand. And he's like, I need you to listen to this audio in a quiet place, try to do it this much time each day and build upon it.

But I need you all to visualize a door to another realm or like a portal door. And the thing is collectively we're going to open it is the ultimate experiment that the Nazis, that the CIA and that we were going to try to do just in a place that the veil was thin, if it would seem, right? And instead of basically a C.E.5, it's a CIA-5. There you go. Yeah. We'll take that for sure. But yeah, it was just when it takes crazy people to do something like this, but how much worth is in knowing that these things exist? What are you willing to do?

Where are you willing to go? You know what I mean? And the thing Jay left out. And, oh, I didn't learn this until like months later. You can become, so the CIA says, untethered, where you don't come back, right? But your body's still alive laying there in that chair. He left that part out. He left that out.

I'd have done it anyways. But, you know, it was, because what it's doing, it's lower in your frequency of your brain from like 13 hertz down to like four. Yeah. And so you're in this theta state, I think it is. And then you're able to open up. And then you have all the people at once, intentions, you know what I mean, on a door, on opening a door. So you guys are having this intention of opening a door.

And I remember it might have been Austin, but somebody talked about what they saw, which was like every door they ever saw. combined into one camera man here. Joey. So resident skeptic. Yeah, which is great to have. But that description is something that's hard to fathom, hard to picture for somebody who isn't experiencing it, which is a common thing with a lot of this stuff. But you guys pursuing this opening a portal, opening another into another realm and stuff,

I mean, this is very dangerous territory. This is something that I personally feel is very real. And if you don't do it right, if you don't know what you're getting involved in, it could really backfire. So the fact that you didn't have all the information, you know what? And I'm not knocking a guy. Florida man. Everybody's got their own agendas in life, but Homeboy did it on purpose. He's like, I'm going to leave this out.

He's like, oh, well, we're doing this experiment. He's like, Stacey said, yes, we're doing it. Not to all the information, but, you know. The only ones that said, yes, probably. And you hear him in the movie, Stacey asks, what happens if we open this portal? And he says, well, we'll deal with that if it happened. Yes. And his intention was to open that portal down there in the, in the, that was the living room, really,

Yeah, the conjuring house. That was the focused area for where the portal was supposed to open. Now, we were scattered all over the house. You were there, right? You were sitting there. Right. So, you know, I'm imagining if it happened, we would know. Right. So the portal did open in my mind. It's just not in this realm, okay? Because what you guys did is you had to open a portal in order to do what you guys did and performed. the fact that you guys were able to do what you did, had the experiences, you had to walk through a portal if you want to call it that. You know, like you had to.

There's no, like, you had to walk through, like the door to this room is a portal to this room. You had to walk through some kind of portal. It just, you may not have it, like, you know, suck you in into another round with the cameras and document it all, right? Which would have been awesome, by the way. But tell me about, this experience then with what you guys had? What was it like? I mean, was it instantaneous? Like,

is it a slow progress to get to a point where you're now in this other state of existence? Like, we're talking about this other state of existence and stuff, but like, what is it like going from point A of, I sat down in this chair, we're about to do this experience. I experiment. I don't even have headphones on yet. I am very much in this realm to now. I'm doing something else that is so bizarre, weird. Like, what is that process like? And I'm imagining it's probably a little different for everybody. But, I mean, like, is there anything that you can describe for people to understand what it was like?

What did you experience? What did you see? Did you feel things? Like, did you hear things? What were the senses doing for you in that process? Well, I can tell you that for me, it's almost like you want to be when you go and into surgery, right? And they're going to put you under like, I'm going to remember, I'm going to remember the moment that I'm conscious to the moment that I'm put under. And you

never do, right? It's not like that. It was kind of like that where you don't really know at what point things start to blur. But like for me, I thought I was going to, you know, I had a preconceived maybe notion of what I would see or this door and this door would get closer, all this stuff in my head. And I end up, there's a tone that was playing within the first. frequency that was a higher tone and i see him stacey singing this tone or it's coming out of his mouth and i know he lost his father you know uh but then his dad's trying to follow the tone through clouds like his dad's walking trying to find stacey and it made me emotional and i'm like this isn't this isn't what i was supposed to like in my mind why am i seeing this but it was clear as day

you know what i mean i saw it i had an emotional response to it that is not what I signed up for or thought I signed up for. Like, why him and why his dad? You know, but then I forgot about, you know, they had a seat for his dad, you know, and the number that came up between him and his dad. And I was in the center of that where the, where everything was supposed to open. That's what I saw. Yeah, the portal was supposed to open directly in front of James. He was the, the guy to go through. And that was picked by the math. The numbers, Right. You know, I don't know, because I only did it the one time.

So I don't know if there was a difference in the two, right? The two experiments, because the whole trip, that whole week is like you're going up the roller coaster, right? It's slowly building and building and building. And then you drop off the end. And that was the end of the World Gate to the drop because then the house was the most active, I think, point. I had been at any haunted location, everything happening at once. But it was, for me, when I was doing it the second time, I'm sitting here messing with my headphones because I thought they wasn't working, and then all of a sudden they're working.

And I quit hearing the audio because I'm seeing everything. The audio is still playing in my ears, blasting in my ears. You just stop hearing it. You know what I mean? Your brain gets to where it's supposed to be. and we had sleep masks on to keep the light out and all that. They didn't even know I was wearing it. Like I'm seeing as if I'm not wearing it.

Like it wasn't, the things I was seeing were not like just like kind of little visions. No, I was vividly seeing it as I'm looking at you right now. And then you get brought back because the audience, we need to close the door now. You know, and that was the biggest thing because when you would see us afterward, we have plans afterwards, all right, hey, we're going to go and do this investigation. We're going to go sound it now and all this. You know, like a zombie. It's like I've been lobotomized. I'm just, you know what I mean?

Your brain, it takes like 30, 45 minutes for your brain to get back into where it normally sets. Because what you're doing is you're sinking the hemispheres. You have a left hemisphere and a right hemisphere ends. So once he sinks those, that's when you travel. and getting out of that because he brings you back out of it. The audio brings you back out of it, but I didn't want to leave.

I was good. You know what I mean? So it was probably different for everybody, but that was, they've just come to a point where I'm laying there. I'm like, oh, man, I'm going to fall asleep,

you know, yada, and then click. So I'm out. Maybe you did, right? Like, that's what I think's really fascinating. What does the experiment do?

It takes you down to a dream state, but you're awake. So maybe what he's really been able to, because the human mind is the most powerful thing, maybe the most amazing thing in this universe. And by lowering you down to your theta waves to where you would be dreaming normally, but now you're still wide awake, that veil is no longer there. And all these things you're seeing are the same things you would experience while dreaming. But now you're wide awake.

Because from my perspective, pissed off outside going, I didn't get to play in this reindeer game. I'm staying with Jay in his thing. And Jay's hilarious, by the way, you know, smoking sings. And he's just all twitchy energy. And he's like, man, man, we got to get this. and this is off, and then he'll run off and come running back in. And the long story short, I'm watching them. And what they will tell you is spectacular.

But from an outsider observing, they barely moved, they barely did anything. They were just sitting there. So that's me, and not trying to be a skeptic, but just watching. And you're expecting, yeah, Stacey to levitate and him to fly through the portal, but they didn't. So fascinating, like what was really going on. And I don't know, as an outside observer, and I want to. hopefully line up with the Universal Mass someday to do it, they were awake dreaming.

Or, but maybe awake dreaming is really awake jumping portals, traveling. Other realms. Yeah, I'm nesting, your godlike, you know?

It's interesting because what you're describing, what you guys described here, I made a note here. I just wrote down, movie shift, but unaware. And what I meant by that is, um,

in movies, when you have a trippy movie, there's a lot of times where, like, somebody is like they're sitting in a room and it's a haunted house or something and all of a sudden the shift happens and as the viewer you don't even know the shift happens until all of a sudden you see things that don't exist in this realm and all of a sudden you realize they just that that shift happened and that's kind of like what you are describing where you're you're in the natural you're

playing with your headphone and all of a sudden boom yep the audio is still playing but you don't hear and something, it's like you're here, but you're not here. It's something changed. And that's what you're, that's what you seem like describing. That's the way it was for me because there was a point where the, I just started seeing things. And during the first experiment, I was more freaked out about being in that room by myself in the dark than the experiment because I was skeptical. And I had not only visual, but I had audible and sensory experiences during the first experiment, but nothing that. would have scared me.

You know, I was seeing things and it was like I was looking at a, at a screen. But my eyes were closed and I had the, uh, the, uh, um, face mask on. But I could feel or almost hear like things around me. And I was making hand gestures. Like if I, something was over here at one point, I felt cold. And I put my hand out to try to see where the cold was at. But there was also a point because we had actually dug the grave for that one experiment during the day.

And there was at one point where I'm sitting there and I feel like I'm digging that grave. And I'm thinking about digging that grave and I believe I was moving my hands. I haven't looked at the footage to see if it was. But I didn't leave that first one feeling anything other than, man, I want to do this again. And then the second one, that was completely different.

it was dark. Tell them. Well, I mean, there's so much stuff that happened between there because I feel like the first experiment kind of opened something, started something. The second night we did the seance and it started a lot of activity in the house. And then the third night we did the second Worldgate

and it from the get-go was dark. I went from seeing through a screen to it being like my eyes. were open and I could see the room I was in but everything was shadowed but and all I saw were things moving around and I was hearing talking I thought the audio had been changed and there's a reason for that so right away I'm like something's wrong and then I start seeing weird crazy stuff like faces stone faces with glowing eyes and interesting and stuff I saw in the previous experiment but But like in the first one, I saw this white, this road with these white fences, snowy and these big white dogs jumping around going back and forth.

Oh, how cute. Yeah, but then I see it the second time. There's no dogs. And then it keeps going down from there. And it gets worse. And I saw Stacey in the second one. He was doing the experiment. I saw him standing outside a car facing somebody.

And then, of course, we find out later he had an experience inside a car. And it lined up with about the same time. I think we figured out. And that's what I was saying earlier, how you guys interacted with each other. And that's where the validity of this experiment comes in because you guys do the experiment together. You share notes afterwards and your notes are intersecting. Everybody has their own story. Everybody has their own storyline of what they experienced and what they went through.

But at certain points, your paths were crossing and you're describing things. That's fantastical in the most positive way. What was the goal for you guys with this experiment? Was it just to, hey, let's see what happens? Were you trying to accomplish anything particular or just to see, does this experiment work? The goal, and Jay stated it, was to open a door to the other side. We wanted to physically walk through. grew to another dimension.

Okay. And what happened was we opened a door to something because after that point, like Stacy said, everybody was in this kind of odd state where we kind of couldn't do what we were supposed to do next. Viscerally, I saw Richard after the second experiment, I heard a thud. He comes charging past me down the stairs. I look in his eyes and it looked like he saw a ghost. Or he was going to kill somebody or he was sick.

I didn't know what was wrong. He goes outside immediately and confronts Jay at his trailer saying, you added audio, you did something. Like you altered this. He was upset. I saw Stacy come up out of the basement, right? Yeah, he was in the basement. And he had that same wild-eyed looked and he's mumbling about stuff.

Like these guys were viscerally upset. But that's when you heard of the moan. That's when you heard to moan was after I went out the door, a woman moaned from the room I was in. Yes. I went out the door, what's going on? They heard a, oh, or something like that. Everybody went outside just to get outside. Justin and Austin, father and son, are standing by the doorway that leads upstairs to the birthing room, which is as creepy as it sounds.

Yeah. Right? And I'm standing about 20 feet away from them in the living room area where I had done, where I had done, where I had. had just got up for my seat and we hear, uh-huh. And we look at each other and all same thing. Did you hear that? What was? Woman moaning. No cameras. You know what I mean? Everyone's outside. We go towards them where the moan was. Up above the stairs, we hear another moan like it's leading us upstairs. We follow it. We get up to the door, the closed door of the birthing room and we hear on the other side of it.

And the young guy's like, it's in there. And so we open the door and we go in there and all it's sitting there's a creepy doll in a chair, right? Dude, it was like a horror movie.

I mean, at that point, I was like, I didn't need to see the doll. I'd rather see like a ghost than this doll right now, I think. But that happened, right? And again, people will go, well, you didn't get it on film.

I get it. I get it. It seems like a lot of this stuff is, we're dealing with some kind of intelligence. It knows what we're doing, right? If you deal with frequency and the math and everything and play its game, and it's like, well, this is, you know, now you have activity.

I think it has a say in like, well, here's what we're going to let you see, what you're not see and when, right? Not like you're going to outsmart it, you know. And it just, things started happening. It just started happening. And telling about what that was from. Yeah. So, okay, the two experiments, right?

So, like, the first experiment, we turned the generator on, right, to get stuff going. We did other experiments along the way to continue to amp up the house. There's a segment you didn't see that we cut out of the film called Scarity Cats where we took some random people. They didn't know where they were going. We brought them to the Conjuring House. And we said, hey, welcome to the Conjuring House. You're about to do this, you know. Ghost investigation. None of these people ever done that. They're scared and stuff.

You found were they ever. You found random people or what? When we say people, it's like seven-year-old women from Rhode Island that are like should be on. They were all ages. I mean, there were some old. 70 or seven? 70 or seven? No, no, there was a seven-year-old in there, though. It was like, if you shot like Golden Girls and then the Golden Girls' daughters or something, like they were like, they were cast out of, it seemed, you know, their reactions and everything. but they were like the people that, the last people you'd ever sign up for ghost hunting.

Because imagine if you took a group of people that would never investigate and had them investigate the house, it's twofold. One, it legitimizes it because if they have experiences, they have no stake in the game, right? But also, it energizes the house

with that fear to build up. Because what was the... Yeah, and what was the real point? To open a portal and to go get answers. What's really going on at the Conjuring House, at the Harrisville home?

What is going on? And what we got was what you mostly get when you do these adventures is more questions than answers. And did it create paranormal activity? Did it activate the house if you're asking us or you ask me for sure? They're following a moaning woman. There's a theme in this movie of hearing this woman through the whole film. You watch it. Every single one of us had interactions with a woman, among other things.

Wow. But yeah, man, that shit worked. So, yeah. And I think that what you referenced here earlier about seeing, stuff. I think that we are in a position right now in time where people that are listening to this podcast who are watching the film, they are, I think people are generally starting to come to the understanding that the least, how do I even say this, your eyes are deceiving. And seeing something means nothing when we're talking about interdimensional beings, interdimensional realms,

it is well what we're dealing with you don't need your eyes for is so far beyond eyes and catching on camera like you probably go on YouTube and caught on camera you know it's like a hot search right we are so far beyond caught on camera we we are dealing with interdimensional beings interdimensional realms things that are accessing our realm from other dimensions at will at will and we're over here, well, you guys are over here trying to figure out how to access that realm at will, like they access this realm. This is so far beyond seeing. And I think the experiments you guys did is just bonkers off the wall. What were you going to say, Rich?

Oh, I was just going to say, I think, you know, touching on what you're saying, there is an intelligence to this stuff where it decides what you can capture. Because like with the first experiment, I set up my personal camera to film. myself. And it didn't catch anything other than where it was sitting for about, what, two seconds, three seconds, you hear the handle on the dresser going, so it picked that up. The second time, I didn't set the camera up. And the second time, I felt like there was stuff all around me. I don't know, but I don't have anything now because I didn't set the camera up. But I, I mean, I was hearing my name. I was hearing voices. I was seeing. stuff because I was seeing the room.

So it's like it knew what it could do and when it could do it. And that's what really was freaky about it. I think we were we messed up. So we added the rock. Yeah. Okay. That rock. So everybody had their own rock, right?

And it was the pendulum. They were like, does this rock go to this seat? Anyways, I figured out which rock went to which seat. seat, right? And it almost felt like you were holding a lightning rod. Your hands would tingle, right, while holding it. And like I said, I didn't do the experiment the first time, so I don't know the difference, but the CIA talked about this place that you go to and it's called the absolute. And that is the perfect name for it, because the download of information that you're getting when you're traveling is insane, right? Like, you,

And there's still stuff today that I'm like, oh, wow, I didn't, I didn't remember that at the time. I didn't remember that in the moment, you know, but when I tell people what happened, how it was, I tell them, I feel like I went to heaven and hell, saw my future, my past, my present, in 47 minutes. That sounds like an NDE. Dude, it was weird. Like, I'm not scared to die anymore. I know when I die, that's where I'm going to go. and I'm fine with that. I didn't want to come back.

I was happy. In fact, I think you said that. Like, when you, he came up from the stairs all wild-eyed, and he was kind of muttering about something, you said something to that effect. Hey, dude, like, almost like he'd gotten the cheat sheet. And he's like, I'm not afraid anymore, man. I'm not afraid to die anymore.

I don't want to. That's some of the first words out of his mouth when he came up out of that basement. Like, don't get me wrong. I enjoy my life. I love doing what I'm doing, but I'm going to be all right. I see my kids.

Like, my phone was blowing up. And I get up and my kids, I see my kids at my sister's house, right? They're laying in the bed in my sister's bed. And they're like, what are you doing right now? Like, just got out of this experiment. They're like, a black mist just come through the house. Yeah. And then I see my girlfriend.

I'm like, what are you doing right now? Are you sitting in this spot eating something out of a can? You've seen the text message real time. Yeah, he just handed me his phones and read that. Dude, it was wild. It was the absolute. It was everything. I think what people have a hard time believing in religion is because maybe God isn't represented as he is.

Right. I think people think Zeus sitting up in the clouds with a beard, right? And it seems kind of silly. I don't think it's that at all. It's definitely not that. I think it's more of like the force, right? I think this absolute was that. You know, because it was the only thing I can link it to is like MDMA.

So back in the day when I was younger, party and stuff like that. you get so happy, you fork off of that, dude, this was like, I didn't want to come back. You know what I mean? Like, I thought I got untethered them good. You know, I've talked to people who have had near-death experiences, and they describe very similar things. They didn't want to come back. The love that they had there was so far beyond the love that they have here. I talked to this one woman here in Tennessee out towards the Memphis area, and she said that

the love of whatever you want to call, creator, God, whatever, she definitely, I mean, wasn't of the Christian theology that I am, but she said that the love that she experienced there with that, not anything else other than who she encountered there. As much as she loves her kids, her husband, she didn't want to come back. because it was so far greater than the love that she could ever experience here for those people

that she loves here. And she said that she had to come back or whatever. But like, I get it in the sense that I've heard this before. In fact, I was just texting with my pastor yesterday. There's a guy in our church who about a month ago, maybe more than a month ago, he died. And he came back. And he saw things on the other side as well. and I haven't had a chance to talk with them.

But I'm curious because it's a very common thing that when people die and they come back, they're like, I didn't want to come back, you know? And so you saying that, it almost sounds like you died, bro. It's hard to explain. You got to pull that mic if you're going to talk with RPG. I can't even hear you. I need to say this and I won't ramble. but when I got home, I landed on a plane.

The next day we went to Orlando to my brother-in-laws. I started talking about the conjuring. I get 102 fever. My back locks up and I lay in my nephew's bed for 14 hours, writhing in pain, delusional. Then it stops, right? Then a few months later, my brother dies. Then some months later, my son dies almost and is in the hospital and brought back.

My business goes to shit. I honestly feel like being at that center where there's some things, we talk about two things, and it's going to tie in here. We talk about the dark, right? Everything we talk about paranormal, people want to be the next Zach Baggins. And, you know, people will watch a 48 minute episode on Zach Baggins and believe in the darkness and believe in demons and believe in devil. You can't have one without the other. Right.

Because where does the Western world's ideas of demons and devils come from? It comes from Scripture. Period. end of story. That's where it started. But yet they don't want to believe in any other, any reliability of the rest of the scripture, right? Because why? It may convict them. Yeah. And it may mean I know I'm not, yeah, right? Right. So I went on a deep dive from that point till now into the study of that. By when I say deep dive, I mean theological scholars and atheistic scholars. The point they agree on is all the historical facts of it. There's 5,800 manuscripts or

partial manuscripts of the New Testament that we have archaeologically. It's the biggest collection of ancient history documents there is. Yet, Plato, we've got 35, Homer, we've got nine. Aristotle wasn't written about to 400 years later. But I'll believe that before I believe this hard evidence. Yeah. And you talk about the beginnings of the universe, right? Even Stephen Hawking agreed. The universe is expanding. That's a fact.

It's a fact. Therefore, it started at a zero point. And he, even Hawking, who is a staunch atheist, said, it's a zero point meaning there's no time, space, matter, or energy. It blew into existence. It's beyond physics. So for scientists, it sounds like God or intelligent design, but they won't say that.

They won't concede to that. They'll say, we just need to keep looking. You go to the cosmological argument for God. Now take that to the biological argument for God. Darwin had the theory of evolution. Totally true. People evolve. People's skin's different color in different regions.

Animals evolved. But what he couldn't account for and didn't account for was the single cell. Where did this life start? The single cell was thought to be out of primordial ooze. We find, as science goes, it's a, very complex series of proteins and amino acids, like very, not randomly set up to create a cell. And then what does that cell know to do through a DNA strand? Where does a DNA strand get its information?

It's not organically coming from the proteins or amino acids. It was best described as high-tech digital code, better than anything we have, is being fed into every cell. It is. It's an information download. Science can't identify where the information. is coming from. Sounds like intelligent design, but they'll stop short of that and say,

you know what? We don't know, but we're going to keep looking, right? So the case for God has more evidence than not, but people will choose to look at, I'll believe in demons and darkness, but I won't believe in this

where I probably have more evidence. Yeah, and I don't want to hijack the conversation away from the conjuring, our house, but I would say that based off of what you just said, if one exists, the other exists. And there's so many people who dive into the paranormal realms, doing investigations and all this stuff,

searching for the dark, right? And when they come to the conclusion of that, and you laid out a great explanation. And there's so much to it, but for proof of why we could believe in the manuscripts, if we're going to believe in Plato and things like that, the sheer amount of what we have. So if you go down that route of belief then,

and like, okay, well, okay, so these manuscripts are accurate. If I'm going to believe Plato, I'm going to believe this, and I have these experiences of these dark entities. I've witnessed them. I've experienced them without doing paranormal investigation, which means that these things can interact with me without me even trying, it happens. How many times do we hear about paranormal activity happening people's lives and stuff?

They weren't asking for it. They weren't going in doing experiments. They were literally existing in an environment and things happened to them. That was dark, right? Well, if we're going to go down the route of belief and everything, then we can say, all right, well, if that's true, then angels, true, God, true. And then we start looking into the depths of what's going on in the scriptures of old Testament. You guys can get me nerd in here. But like Psalm 82 talking about Elohim holding judgment

amongst the other Elohim, other gods, God holding judgment amongst other gods. What does that mean? Hold on the other thing. I thought there was just angels and demons. No, there's actually more. There's a whole hierarchy here. And then you start diving into all this stuff. And you start looking at, I think it's Genesis 28, maybe 18, something like that. But it's the story of Joshua's ladder and how the angels were ascending and then descending, which means that angels are always here existing around us. What does that mean? Well, it means the same thing as when we see all this paranormal activity happening,

this dark stuff happening at will, seemingly where it's happening to us. We're not asking for it, but it's coming through. The same, if that's happening, then these angels that they exist here right now in another realm here, the Bible talks about them serving us. There's so much stuff to it. So, well, you got me nerd in here. Listen, we could go on for hours on this. But the point being that you can't have one without the other.

Right. And also, if you think you're going to go play Ghostbusters and then come home and not be at risk to have your life affected, scripture talks clearly about you're not supposed to be careful. Right, right. You shouldn't try to communicate with the dead, period. and you do that, I walk away from it going, you know, my life was perfect the day before I got on that plane. The day after I got on that plane, all this stuff happened. Now, it could have just happened.

But in my heart, I don't believe that. I believe that I messed with something and I got the consequence of it. And it prompted me to go on another journey. And that other journey, you look at it and it's going, well, if you're going to believe in something, should make sense to understand what you're believing in, whether it's dark or light. Sure. And what I found was the majority of people that even identify as Christian don't use proper context, ancient history or content around Scripture at all.

It's a Velcro Bible. I'll pull this phrase. I'll pull that. It's taken out of contents. These books weren't, they're written over 1,500 years by 66 books by 44 authors over 1500 years of the Old Testament and new prophecies being talked about 500 years before by somebody that transpired 500 years later with no correlation. They couldn't text each other or go to a library and yet that correlates, right? But you wouldn't know that unless you looked into it. And I mean

looked into it, not with Joel Olstein, but like a theological, but because scripture, it's not any of that. It's not organized religion. If you look at it, the Pharisees were the enemies of Christ. You know, Rome was, too. It's, you know, people don't understand. They think it's something, this is just a Santa Claus book written by the church. And the last thing I'll say, because I can go on a geek squad on this, but is the resurrection event either happened or it didn't. The didn't, it's a house of cards. Atheist scholars agree on the history of the disciples, on Saul of Tarsus becoming Paul. They agree on all of it historically. The only thing they don't agree upon is the resurrection.

And if you dive into the evidence for that, if it was a courtroom, you could dive into that and say, yeah, the best explanation is it actually happened. But you don't get to that point by saying, nope, I won't look at it because I had a bad experience with church as a kid or I was told this or the evil in the world. Hell with it. I'm not looking into any of that. Now, I'll dig into the paranormal, but I'm not looking at that, right? It's the same thing. It's the same thing. And once you do, you realize it's the whole notion of what it means to follow.

of that is nothing like maybe your predisposition was or the world said it was or what your experience was. It's a whole different experience, but you're not going to be willing to have that experience unless calamity strikes typically or, I don't know, your life falls apart after you open a portal in a haunted house. Yeah. Well, I was going to say that maybe you are in a new reality. And so we're sitting here and it seems like it's all real, but you've knocked, you got we've been knocked on another path or at least those of you that participated in i mean that's how i feel with my own life itself like like like you you you shift existences through certain actions you do you guys did actions there that shifted your existence and uh like literally

what you're describing here is you came out a different person like you it changed you and so i listen we we are i i believe we live a supernatural existence whether we want to believe or not. We live in a supernatural world. I use supernatural a lot. A lot of people in these circles say paranormal. It's supernatural. It's super natural. And so anyways, let's reel it back. Let's bring it back here. That was Worldgate. And holy crap. I mean, I think we could talk another three hours, but my stomach's hungry. All right. We got pizza waiting for us for some time today. And we got a lot more to talk about here. So let's move into Austin versus aliens. Now, unfortunately, Austin and Justin aren't here, but you guys can tell what the experience was.

People will see it in the film. They, and this is where this kind of brings in the idea of this location being like Skinwalker Ranch. Because it's like, it's not the house, it's the land. And everything happens here. It's not just, boo, a spooky ghost. You know, it's a lot. Well, so Justin's spruce. Burrier was like a tech guy for ghost adventures for years, right?

And so he's the point of having him there on the team is like, if we had a, if we had a paranormal question, some equipment, something we should do, like trying to attract ghosts or something, because we're big footers, you know, we got this dude. He's been right hand man to Zach Baggins a long time, you know. And after the World Gate closes, Justin was scheduled to sleep in a tent in the woods by himself, right? And as they're going down there, he's hearing mumbling in the woods. He doesn't know what it is.

They think it's a person, right? And they're hearing knocks. He really doesn't know what that is. You know, I mean, he kind of has an idea, but he didn't realize he was like having a Sasquatch encounter right there to property. growl that happens. And I think the reason for the Austin versus the aliens title is some of the Dermotria come up with a phrase, Austin versus the aliens.

And then there was going to be three gray aliens. You'll hear him explain it, you know, in the interview. And it was just wild. Like, you got a whole house full of Bigfooters and you didn't think to come and knock on the door back, Stacy, you get up, guys. you know, which was, it was weird, but it very, it frightened them. They were in tears, you know, coming back out of that. And the thing that was weird, and so maybe it's a preconceived notion,

but the three gray aliens that were to come up, you know, like the Dramatra kind of more or less, I guess, predicted things that were going to happen, even though we didn't know that's what it was at the time. because then they see some figure run down the wall. And didn't they say it was pale or white or grayish? Pale or white. And here's another thing that like Ingrid Cold came up through the spirit box like three times through that whole week. You know what I mean?

And then he sees a tall man with a funny suit on. You know, he doesn't mention a grin or nothing. and then by two aliens, and he was seeing him, like, hovering over his tent. So the Austin versus the alien segment is him trying to get his ass down to that tent to stay in the night. But every time he gets down into the yard, more and more stuff starts happening. You know, it was very interesting. I didn't really thought they had caught anything. I don't think I even knew for, like, a day or two that they had this amazing experience.

Well, but that's what's so fascinating. You know, people talk about the Conjuring House. it's ghosts. So we brought them in because they're professional ghost people. Yeah. But then imagine that. You're thinking, ghosts, ghosts, and all of a sudden you're having Bigfoot activity. And now he's having visions of aliens, which it's funny that he's not afraid of ghosts at all. We'll go anywhere with ghosts.

But an alien? Yeah. And he says that. I ain't sleeping in that. No, he's almost crying. In the interview, he's like that. What do with that? You know, a ghost, yeah, it just passes through you, you know, if you're lucky or Dan Aykroyd

and it has sex with you. Yeah, right. But that's all perspective. And that's what we're dealing with here with all this stuff that people that dive into these things, whether it's listening to podcasts or watching these documentaries or pursuing these experience. It's all about perspective going into a situation. How do you perceive these topics?

Because people are going to be fearful of certain things and excited about other things. And clearly for him, his perspective is totally geared towards ghost hunting. he's done it professionally for his career. When it comes to all this other stuff, I don't know him, but I imagine he's probably like, yeah, I didn't really think about it that much, you know?

But if you ask me, it'd be kind of weird, you know, like aliens, yeah, okay. And all of a sudden, we're living in a world where our government's like, yeah, aliens exist. We have bodies, you know, it is what it is. And everybody's like, oh, yeah, whatever. We're living in a very weird world. Something, like we're talking about shifting

and coming out of the gate program different. Like, something happens. in this world where I think the world came out different. And you can go down in so many different ways of theorizing what that event was. But, you know, probably people listening right now, I mean, they're probably thinking like CERN. That's CERN, but seriously, I mean, like, if we're talking about the World Gate and opening portals, something happened where the entire world shifted. and I think that we're all living that and experiencing that.

And so Austin versus aliens, let me get back on track before I go crazy again, but Austin versus aliens, I thought that was very fascinating. One of the things that he was talking about while he was talking, one thing that kind of popped in my mind was because it seemed like he didn't get a great visual he saw, but he was like, I was thinking, man, what if he like, what if he encountered? counter to rake out there. Like, like, because people describe these rakes and you've seen videos and stuff, and it kind looks like an alien, humanoid, gray, pale, you know?

And I'm just like, man, imagine if, like, he would, if he, because that, to me, talking perspective, like, bro, I don't want to see no rate. That's pretty terrifying. That's pretty terrifying. Yeah. Which could be an alien. We don't know. Sure.

We really don't. And that's, I don't know. that for people doing these experiments, these adventures, if I had any advice for anyone, is to try and take a step back, try and world get yourself back to look at the big picture, because you're going to miss things. Because what he's basically saying is, I came there for ghosts and I'm seeing this, but he's not registering. He didn't come in and tell us because he didn't think that that could be possible.

You have to go in with a complete open mind if you're going to have stuff happen. And we're going to find out the answers because that's, at the end of the day, what the hell is the point of all this? we'd like to find some answers or encourage someone else to do so. You know what made it really authentic for me was his experience anyway was there's the house and there's Jay's trailer and then down a distance was his tent that he's supposed to stay in, right? People mill around and smoke break and stuff outside and them were inside

and he's supposed to be down there. I don't know if this bill or someone was reporting back like in between. They're like, dude, they were crying. Yeah, they come in the house and tears. And we thought, okay, well, we'll get the down. They didn't come in and tell us. And then the next day, they were really hesitant. And then they're talking about, we're going to go home.

We're going to leave. Really? Yeah, like, and we thought that they got in a fight, like a father and son fight is what I assumed. Because I guess the son was really upset. And we come to find that they just couldn't kind of wrap around, like, what they really think they thought they saw and didn't add up. And they were scared shitless, basically. And really, you think they'd run in like if they're embellishing. Hey, we just saw it.

It was not like that. It was almost hesitant to say very upset and pull it out of them. And they wanted to go home. And these are guys that are traveling around with, you know, hunting demons. Zach Beggins and crew. Fight me! So he said it was the first time, it was the first time I ever wanted to go home because I was scared.

Wow. That's incredible. Yeah, and they were quiet about it. And then we just found out what last night, when Joey was watching that segment, he was outside when the growl went off, and he heard the growl independently from them. Wow. You can grunt, Joey.

We can hear you. Another interesting thing, too, that didn't make the film. We have so much material that we, you know, you just have enough time to put in. But apparently nobody had slept in the basement of the Conjuring House for a while. So I decide I'm asleep in the basement. And I grew up in Rhode Island,

so I grew up in a basement. So for me, it's not that dingy, even though you're down there in the basement, and I found a snake skin like just on the floor. You know, so it's still a little bit of a dirt floor. So I decided I'm going to do it. So Austin says, well, if you're going to do it, I'll do it with you. You know, and he asks his dad, and his dad says, okay, cool.

So we go down there and I'm sleeping right near the well. Like, I want whatever's going to crawl out is going to crawl right over and plant one on me. Well, he's laying over by the stairs. And some people are just tuning forks for this, okay? Like, it never stopped affecting him the whole time we were down there. He's like, did you hear that? Did you hear this? Something touched my hair, something whatnot.

That video went on to what, on TikTok to get millions of views of him in the conjuring basement. And I think that's another thing that's kind of important is some people, it really happens a lot to and some don't. Because I moved my bed over there the next night and I slept exactly in the same position. I laid the same way. Nothing. And I did all my nights in that basement. And I didn't have anything scary happened to me during the night. But for him, they were so freaked out that he didn't even do it the second night.

And he was like, I ain't going down there again. The basement's the crazy spot in the house. You know, so I think also when you're doing these adventures, how do you prepare yourself for this, you know? Because you're going to have to have some level of strength to you, some level of armor, or you're going to be run out of this house, you know, which they almost were.

Thank God they didn't go. Because honestly, that, that, they are so animated. I can't wait for people to watch it because they are entertaining. Like they are on edge, like, you know, like they're a jollas. Oh, man, I need to start smoking cigarettes. I'm crazy. You know? Yeah, I'd tell you,

it was, it was very interesting to watch their perspective of how everything kind of unfolded for them. The growl is interesting because I've experienced something very similar

recently in Washington State. We were Bigfoot hunting. And I'd be interested to hear what you have to say about it. But, like, the growl for me was like, it was right there.

I mean, it was right there behind me. And Joel heard it too, and we turned around and it wasn't there. We went to the back of the RV. We're looking around. We don't see anything. But when we heard the growl, like, you know it's right there and you're going to turn around and there's going to be an eight foot tall, very large something standing over you. And it wasn't.

And so it's interesting that they heard that growl. too and stuff. And it makes you wonder, well, it makes you wonder a lot of things. If it was Bigfoot, is it that it's able to project a growl distance-wise, like, you know, vocalizations and stuff? Or is it more because it, you know, we're on the confessions here. So it's an interdimensional being. And it portal hopped, you know, and it was behind you, a grout and port-a-hopped over the tree line. And all of a sudden, you see it over there. And it's, I mean, I know it sounds crazy. But if you just take it for what I just said, you're like, well, that could be a solid explanation. It's just.

And if you go back to that, wasn't it the light they saw right after the growl, too? There was another thing. There was a light that shot down into the ground or? Yeah. I think that's what he said, yeah. It shot down right after the light went or after the growl happened, which was right behind him. Then as he's turning around looking for where it is, there's a light that comes down. You know, and then later on he started talking about how aliens wouldn't need to land.

He didn't think aliens would need to land their crap. They could just come and get you. They'd just be on you, be right there, you know. But it was really cool that all that stuff happened to them immediately after we tried to open the portal. And we thought we pretty much didn't do anything with it. We thought it was a, you know, failure. Yeah, outside, the first time outside got the activity. It stirred up things in the ground.

And so, hence, Corey, the owner, was of the mindset that this, it's the land, man. It's even the ground. People have taken rocks, Corey told us this. People have come on the property, snuck on, took rocks, right? Came back three days later, whatever, week later, came back, and there's a note and a rock. He didn't know when someone took a rock. There's a note in a rock saying, I'm so sorry, I took this rock. My life's gone to.

Yeah. So we brought you a rock. You're like, now I'm connecting it. Like, I'm sitting here a hole in this rock. I'm like, oh, this is a nice rock. This came from the... Joey, Joey, he only took it. Really?

Wow. So this is so... This is fully charged. He carries it with him everywhere. Wow. Like, we're on the plane. We land in Tampa and he's like, I got that rock. I was like, bro, what is wrong with you?

I'm trying to get home to my kids, dog. Wow, wow. Yeah, I went through my stuff before I left because I had the feeling one of them had stuck a rock in my stuff. And I threw my rock. I could hear it. I could hear it. When he was upstairs before he came down, freaking out, I heard some thudding and stuff up there. And I think I asked him something about the rock, and he's like, F that rock.

You know, he was upset. Like this, he threw it like, I needed this off of me when he was seeing all this stuff. Well, and that's when it all changed is when it threw the rock away. That's when everything changed was when I tossed it. That's when I think I had a spiritual experience because I threw the rock. I saw a green, I saw a pathway through a green pasture, and there was a little boy next to me. And I was holding his hand, and I said, did you do that? And he said, I had to.

And then after that, all the shadows, the chatter, all that stuff went away. and I still saw things after that, but it was different and it was distant. It wasn't right there. And the more I think about it, I think it was spiritual intervention is what I think, because I didn't experience anything bad after the Conjuring House like a lot of these guys did. They had some rough experiences. I didn't have that. But if I think about it long enough, I think it might have been my brother,

because he passed away the year before. And when my dad passed away in 2010, he made my brother promise to look after me. And then I go into this thing and I'm doing this and I'm having this and all this stuff and it's building and building and building. And I throw that rock and then boom, that happens. And then it all goes away. And then after that, everything's distant that I'm seeing.

So you made your brother's job real difficult. I did that all my life. He's like, come on, bro. I did that all my life. Wow. You know what's fascinating is some people can take an object and you can give it to them and they can hold it and they can tell you about it. What if the experiment that you guys participated in temporarily gave you the psychic ability to read the stone or have the stone through you project the reality that it knew, which could have been King Phillips War and bloodshed and shadows and just kind of chaos and you were like looking into it. Yeah. That could have been what happened. You guys temporarily.

All right, dude. You're going way out there too far away. Right now. You go on. No, no. We already went out. We're gone, man. We're interdimensional. We already traveled past through our galaxy. Part of the untethering, man. We're already untethering, man. We're past Venus, bro. Like, we're gone, man. That was amazing, but I didn't know that. That's the first time I heard that you thought that was your brother.

There's a lot of profound things between your dad and see, a lot of this. We never sat down and talked about it until. really right now. Yeah, because everything went bad for everybody. Like, I wanted to whip him when I was at the Conjuring House. Really? It got tenuous. I don't understand, you know, like, I can get aggravated, sure, but like, the house,

and they explained it in that interview, it makes you, I guess if you're an angry person or, you know, if you're not far to push that way, then I guess you could get that way real quick, but there was, it was weird because I was so ready to go home and then I didn't want to leave. You know what I mean? It was, I don't know, it's very hard to explain the emotions that, the dreams, the dreams when you're sleeping in that place, the dreams were out of this world. And if you're not a mentally stable person, it probably ain't the place for you. And so therefore I should stay at home. You know what I mean? Like, because it's, know yourself. He had said, sorry, if you're all done,

basically you have two weeks in that house. And after two weeks of staying there, it begins to change you. And you don't want people visiting. You want it all to yourself. Like Bill got into a fight with the owner, and basically said, you don't need to come here. He's like, this is my house.

You know, so it begins to change you. Now, what if doing these experiments, we just expedited that process? Because, yeah, there's the behind the scenes that, you know, you don't have time to put in it. But it got very tense. Whatever the anger, whatever the emotion, of that was moving through some people in the house, and it got really crazy. And we're not putting

that in, and there's just not time. It'd have to be a 10-hour film. But the house affected us as a team. So I would even warn people if you're going to go there, because people are starting to do shows now where it's a half an hour, or not half an hour, a month in a location. I mean, imagine we went there for one month? How many people, how many of us would be dead, vanished, untethered? You know, and unfortunately, the timing wise, at the beginning where Corey allowed us to come in. This new owner is not really of the ilk of us where we're, we've got this fascination, maybe an attraction for a reason to some of this stuff. She's like a former lawyer or something out of Boston. Why did she buy it? Now they're doing camping trip. It's like Disneyland paranormal now.

She's turning it into for money making purposes. I think it's like thousand bucks a night to camp on the property. So that investigation format, this is the last you're going to see. of that. I'm pretty sure. Unless you got money, unless you got money to go up in there. Unless you got that miracle money. Yeah.

Oh, man. That's wild. I can't believe, wow. Like, yeah, no, that's crazy.

I don't know why I want to keep touching that rock. Oh, here we go. Here we go. You know, you're the second person. On the second person to touch that? Yeah.

Really? They won't touch me. Good. Well, you know, now I kind of feel like, Now I kind of feel like like how Stacy was.

Yeah, Stacy's like, I wish I would have known that before I did the experiment. Thanks, bro. Wish you would have told me before I started touching the rock. Before you put it on my table. Now, you want to get even crazier? I dare you to drink this. I will not. I'm good.

I'm still struggling with the rock, bro. This is from the conjuring well. Are you serious? This is actual well-wower. I don't think it'll affect you that. But yeah. That's crazy You might end up on the adventure with us

So I don't know if you want that Wow Is this all the water you took from there Just the vial? That's it Why'd you just I would take a bucket Plain Oh yeah that's true

Wow that's wild That's wild He's stuck it up his butt For some reason to get it on the plane It's just All right thing gross about that It wasn't to get it on the plane It was just because

I just want to see if I could be a drug mule Yeah It was an audition. Wow. All right. So let's keep moving here. On the next thing here on the list, we had the segment you called As Above So Below. Why did you call it that?

Okay. So we had called it six feet under before that. As Above, So Below. It's like, I guess the things were the same in the absolute. Okay. But they're different. At the same time, you know what I mean? And that was really, I know there's a bunch of negative connotation.

Sure, Crowley. For whatever it's worth. With Crowley, he was on to something. He was doing real stuff. Like, do you want to experience it? You know what I mean? You don't have to be evil. I've done some, I've been on some Crowley rituals myself.

You are crazy. Well, like, Jesus. that I take my faith, my faith I take with me. And nothing's going to happen to me. You know what I mean? I got big brother here. You know, and that's the way I feel. Maybe I shouldn't dabble.

But then again, I'm the dog chasing the tire. I don't know what hell I'm going to do when I get it. You can't help yourself, bro. I can't help it. It's like, it talked to him. There's so much to like. It's like, everything's going good. I've got to burn it down.

If you look at my life, it's like, I'll be having a real good thing, but I've got to burn it down. Life is really good. Where's those matches at? Yes. It's like, is that a hobby? I'm going to get here. I'm not coming. I wanted to get here.

I thought I did. But you know what? It's time to burn it down and start all over again. That's, that's, yeah, I think that's why me and him hit it off so much. There's a lot of similar past there. But I felt that was an appropriate name, you know. Let's get in the earth. Let's get down into well.

Let's get the answers from there. You know. And so you did do that. And so with this experiment, tell people what it all tell. Because there was a lot going on here. Oh, yes. You guys were, you know, in multiple locations at multiple times. And so let the audience know what you guys were doing.

What was the thought process behind this whole experiment? So we went there with a list of experiments we were going to do. I think we did one of those, two of those being the seance in the world gate. Everything else got thrown out the window. So when we got there, Corey's like, land's haunted, bro. It's the land. I've been told you that. Why don't you build a coffin and bury me in the ground?

I was like, don't say that because I'll do it. And he's like, no, seriously, if you do it, I'll get in there. And I was like, damn, let's have a double S this method. We'll put R.P.G down in the bottom of the well. He has nothing to do. He's standing around, you know? We put him into the bottom of the well. We'll put Corey in the ground. We'll sit in the library and ask questions.

And let's see what happens, you know. And it was because there was a lot going on, the well water was 50-something degrees, 60 maybe. It was cold. It was chilly. We had to switch out, right? We had to switch. I mean, maybe we could have left you in longer. Well, it also depended because I was getting interesting answers to these questions.

But certain people, once again, line up. they're a better tuning fork for things. And just to explain, like, we should go in more detail just what the SD's method is, just so, you know, people basically understand that, like, you're filtering through these channels and you're listening for words to be spoken as, so you have the people up in the library asking questions

to the land, to the house. And then you have somebody buried in the yard, so in the dirt, and now you have somebody buried in the ground, but in water. So the goal was, hopefully, we become the tuning forks and as they're asking questions

they channel through us. With a spirit box. Yeah. So the spirit box is there was no way like putting him in the well and burying him in the yard. There was no way that were hearing us.

Right. You know what I mean? So when things line up, that's very curious. That's interesting and the better it is. And so we did that and we ran into problems because Corey's, okay, one of the things that happened at that house consistently was

cameras just going off. Full batteries, great, great cameras, just off, off, sound issues. They said, like half of our sound is gone. We have two days of footage with no sound. Yeah. So we set up to do this amazing experiment, which no one had done there before, and almost immediately, Corey's camera out, and his audio is just messed up. So now it's just me.

So the experiment was supposed to link us to the room and kind of all put us together in this triangle, which is another theme that's going on. It just shuts down. So we try to try to get going. And then when we make the switch, it's almost as if we dial into the right channel. And suddenly the messages become a little clearer. He gets things that are starting to hit a little bit better. So my advice too would be when people are doing these things, stay flexible.

Don't go in rigid. Here's my box. And I got to stay in my damn box. Be able to be flexible and move because somebody may work better for it. And you did. You got in the well and there was more things popping out. Yeah, but soon as you came out, Corey started getting out. answers and started talking because I had actually asked, does Corey know we've started yet?

You know what I mean? And then you hear Justin hollering down this tube, breathing tube. Hey, do you know, we started? Are you alive? We married him, and then we had to have a tube for him to breathe and them to communicate. And so, yeah. Yeah. And then I got in there, and we both said Jesus, which wasn't an answer or the question. It could have just been a Christian channel. We flipped through. But there's a flash, a flash of light in the library. Okay.

No explanation. But then orb, I say orb right after. And that, for me, that was one of the weirdest things. They started talking about Jim Arnold. And then that's what that. That flash of light was very apparent on screen. Yeah. Because it happens so fast, but when it happens, before the people in the room got a chance to even react to it verbally, as the viewer, you notice it.

You're just like, what was that? It looked like a light ball blue. Right. And so what you guys are saying is it was a light within the room that just illuminated. Yeah, because at that point it was Bill and I, and that the center hub of the, you know, Stacy and the well, Corey in the grave and the communication. know, what are they getting answers to? We're like the center to hear it. And then there's this rinky-dink chandelier with really dim lights.

But somewhere offset in the ceiling, this light just flashes. And so we stop. The most visceral thing that happened to me physically was that right after that because I don't got a lot of hair in my forearms, but it was standing up. And my head was, it was static. I was covered in static electricity. And the bill's like, oh, dude, yeah, I am too. And the other camera guy that we had was Kevin.

Kevin's like, yeah, I feel that. Like, we all started doing it. And then when it ended, all at the same time, it said it stopped. Like, it stopped at a certain point. And talking to Corey, he said, yeah, that's more the, one of the more common things that we run into around here. You'll get a light flash. You'll feel electrical charge. That's exactly what we did.

And we stopped rolling. And Joey was trying to like, let's debunk it. let's try to find to see if it's a camera light, the lighting, or the chandelier. And I think we went through a series of it, and it's just like, I wouldn't any of those things. But those are the two things that really kept popping up. Some type of flashes of light and orb, but just light in general. And this damn woman who everyone kept hearing, whether it was moans, screams, or just footsteps or whatever, there was this presence of a woman. Is there any kind of legend or attachment to the property that you guys know of a woman that would explain?

that? So there's not no documentation of this lady dying on the property, but there's the crooked neck woman. In the basement, you'll see on the what do you, I think it was a toy box. I think it was a toy box

there's a few things that had drawings on it. One would be a desk too, like a turnover desk. It was in the 90s, okay, that it was a daycare down there, right? And all the children would see this crooked neck lady. walk around. Now, I seen the woman in the second

World Gate, she didn't have a crooked neck. Like, I was, one of my images was a golden tablet that then, like, changed, morphed into like dreads and I seen her face, right? So there was, and then we come out of that and we're hearing the woman talk, her moan. But yeah, the crooked neck lady is about it unless it was the Bathsheba thing. You know, or just the deaths on the land.

general. There's been so many deaths. There's been so many. You can't, you can't nail it down, but it was definitely, uh, there's, there's legend to the, the crooked neck lady and the bathsheba. So there's legend to a woman, uh, who hung herself in the barn. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep, which we investigated, Josh and I were in there. It's full of bat, guano. So you're going to leave the doors open. You can't, and we weren't allowed to camp in there because we could have died. Um, but once again, camera malfunctions. You got to figure we had How many cameras did we have?

And how many tech savvy people? Oh yeah. So you figure we probably had close to 20 cameras. Like with the ones Justin brought, you had not counting security cameras. We had rented cameras from lens renters. So we rented new stuff. You know what I mean?

And then we had stuff that we owned and we shouldn't have been having them problems. And that's something that I think people who are consuming this kind of content maybe don't understand what happens behind the scenes. A lot of times when you're watching people do these films and stuff, especially independent people, a lot of these people don't own the equipment. You go and you rent the equipment, you use it, and you return it.

It's a lot cheaper that way than buying things outright. And so when you're renting equipment, it is equipment that works. It's usually newer. It's functional. The owner who runs a business of running out their equipment, or maybe it's a service company. But it's not like you arrived on scene with cameras you bought in 2008. And you're like, I hope these things still work today. Like, this is all solid equipment. So when, when things like this happen, it really makes you scratch your head on it. Yeah, Joey's personal camera that

is using now to film this was overheating. And it's never done that before or since. So again, it was just another freak thing that was going on. Yeah, you got to figure, I know about cameras. Joey knows about cameras. Justin knew about cameras. Bill knew about cameras. I don't know if there was anybody else there. Kevin. Kevin had a camera rental company. And he's a DP.

So we have people that knew how to fix these problems and we should not have had this. And this is the only set I've ever been on that have had this. It didn't even this. He had a security system set up too where the house, you know, has security cameras everywhere. where that malfunction too, if I'm not correct. Because we were like, we could always go to that for some of it and that malfunction as well. Wow. And just to clarify, when you're doing the spirit box, too, a lot of it, you know, you'll just get a quick word.

But what's spooky is that sometimes something comes across and you can just tell that it wasn't like recorded or it sounds real. And the most profound thing I heard when I was in the well was a woman, you know, just really creepy. and it sounded different than the normal like, hello, Bob, you know, it sounded like a voice. And when that comes through, I don't know, to me, that's the trippiest part of doing that is when you hear a real authentic. Did trip you out in the moment? Well, you're already, I'm right, so a little caveat for this is.

The little caveat from everybody else, this man is scared to death of everything. Come on. Well, no, I have fear, right? But that's why I pursue it, you know, because I want it, I want it gone. But before I went in that in the well, Kevin, I believe, he says to me, he goes, hey, do you want to know what I saw in that well? And for me, no, I was like, no, I don't want to know because that's going to be in my head and it's going to affect my journey.

So no, don't tell me. So, you know, I go, I do the well thing. It's cold. It's scary. You know, it's extreme. Because what is this at the end of the day? It's like a rite of passage for adults. It really is.

You go, you're scared of it. You come out. You're like, yeah. I did it. I did it. My beard feels thicker. Yeah. But, God, God, I lost my point.

Oh. Oh, so he says to me. So then once it's over, he comes up to me and he goes, you want to know what I saw in the well now? And I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah. What did you see? Like Bathsheba, you know, it's like a thing. And he goes, no. And he's a very matter of fact guy.

He's like, no, it was the largest snake I've ever seen. And the biggest snake by far I've seen in this property. It was so large in the well when I looked at it. I didn't know it was a snake. And then it moved. And I went, and I go, you mother, you should have told me that because I would have never got in that well. It's never got in the well. He goes, the biggest snake.

just walks away. No! No! You know, because don't find in games until it gets real. Heck yeah! You know? Give me some

interdimensional beings. I am not trying to do that snake life. Give me aliens, get me ghost. Yeah. Wow. And he just smiled and laughed

and I went, okay, I got to rethink these things. Wow. Okay, so you got to have like rules of engagement. Is it physical, natural? Do I, like, like, like, if it's,

if it has something to do with the experiment, no. But if it's a snake that could bite my leg off, yes. Yes. Like, you freaking Florida boys, man, crazy. Wow. Okay. So, all right. We're talking about the well. So we can, yeah, let's just for my sake do it in this way because I want to kind of, because I know we jumped in the Worldgate and we talked a lot about World Gate too. So I want to jump into the well wishes. And then we'll bring it in for landing with the seance. Yeah. Okay. Because like,

Sam's crazy. So, uh, talk to me about the well wishes. And what is this whole thing? And what did you guys do? Yeah. So,

uh, while they were going to do the seance, I wanted to be doing something again. You know what I mean? And, and so I went, well, I'll,

I'll stare into the well. And for people that know what scrying is, Scrying is, it's divining. So you're trying to have a vision of either the future or something that you're focused on that you would like to see. And originally, Scrying was done into bodies of water. You look into a body of water and you're like, oh, wow, I had a nice vision. Well, and then it went on to be where they would take mirrors and they would cover the back,

make it dark. Yeah. I need like a floating mic. Yeah, it just follows me around. But anyway, so how perfect is the well at the conjuring house? And the goal is they're doing a seance. They're invoking the spirit. and they're trying to get them to talk.

While simultaneously, I'm sitting there, staring into a paranormal TV of sorts, welcoming them as they rise from the earth and come out and come above us, right? So really kind of a wild moment. Now, while I'm just simply staring into the well, scrying, trying to folks stay at, Jay had also made me an audio soundtrack to help me get into that low theta state and to be, you know, more open-minded to these things. So I sit there and, you know, I call it like going on a loosening journey or tripping. There's probably a better way to say it, but essentially you begin to see things.

Whether you want to see them or not, you sit there and once you finally reach a relaxed state, things start to happen. And one common theme, not to ruin it, you know, because you get to watch the movie and see it, but triangle-headed things. Yes. Everywhere, just these triangle and seeing the conjuring house, but then all these triangle-headed, like, entities, you don't know what to say, are like crawling all over and, like, you know, kind of looking at you, but not looking at you like they're going to eat you,

but just staring at you and to see something like that and, you know, it just, it's really intense. And to know what they're doing upstairs to make that experience even more powerful, you know, you're like, so what's going to come? And these dingbats, they don't tell me. I think it's like 27 minutes, no problem. I end up doing it for like an hour and a half. So my neck is tore up. Everything's tore up.

But once again, what was the most profound experiences there? Seeing the house and seeing and getting this, you know, it's weird. The water, it's just black. at shimmery and then it becomes like a screen, like smooth. And seeing the conjuring house and it's showing you that basically the conjuring house is connected to the ground and it's all connected, all of it, all of it. And we just happened to be standing in a spot and focusing all of our energy, which is basically amplifying what is happening here.

That was really neat. And it kept showing me, toward the end of it, there were these two entities. One look basically like a big foot, really big. was smaller, like a dwarf, or maybe it was a human, but it was smaller. Both with triangle heads. And we're sitting at a table, which this kind of solid stone table kind of came up with other people too. And they just kept trying to give me this black, this solid black. I couldn't tell if it was a vase or an orb or whatever, but it was just solid. And that's what was important. They just kept stressing, like, trying to give it to me. And I didn't understand it. I didn't,

I didn't know what to do with it, you know? But that was like the height of my vision. And come to find out afterward, which I did not find out. out till later, the property that the conjuring house sits on is a triangle. So what does that mean? I don't know, but that's the way the land's cut up. And outside of that, it was, the spookiest thing was sitting there and feeling like people were walking or somebody was walking in the room with me. Because I could, I could feel the impact underneath the car, you know, and I actually, you'll see it in the film, I actually turn and look and look around and then talk to the well. Was that you? Once again,

was it this crooked neck woman? There is definitely someone there. Some people say it's little children that are in the house. After coming out of this, for me, there is a woman in that house or a woman on the land that comes and interacts with you. But yeah, that was a super, super trippy to stare in that well, especially knowing that there was a snake that could come out, you know? Have you or anybody else, after the experience that you had looked into possible

triangle head entities to maybe connect dots on some things. And I haven't either, which I can almost guarantee you by a time I'm saying this now, people are already on their phones looking for triangle entities. But when you were talking about triangle entity, and I'm assuming the way you're describe it now, we're talking like triangle like this, like the point at the top and not the bottom. But I think what it really is trying to say is pyramid. right yeah but what is a pyramid right so like we have the food pyramid right and i i got this like when i was

watching it i just kept this idea of hierarchy kept on coming to my mind and how the property has all this stuff at the different categories cryptids demonic like aliens UFOs or all this stuff and it all gathers on the bottom but there's a hierarchy and as you go off higher there there's less of individual things happening. So like maybe, and this is where I'm going with this. My question is, is there, with a conjuring house, is there something, whether you guys experienced it or throughout the history that maybe people have always said, this happens, but not often. But when it happens, it's powerful. Because when you were talking about the triangle head entity, and now you're talking about the property lines being triangle and stuff, it just, the high

hierarchy keeps coming to my mind. And from my own curiosity, I was wondering, because, like, it seems like there could be a lot of things happening on the property, but is there something that happens rarely? But when it happens, whee, it happened, you know? Yeah. I mean, there's things that they told us we can't talk about, right? I think a lot of the things that it ended up in suicides.

Right. So I don't know to answer that question. You know, you have, what are the things that happen often, are the lights, the books flying off the shelves, the chair, wooden chair,

just slides across the floor, doors open in, you know, all that's normal stuff. You have the crypted stuff. That's really not. normal. You know, that, and then, you know, the, the few people that have had experiences there and then committed suicide. So, I don't know if that answers your question or not. It might be

something that people could look into and stuff philosophically, you know, but it's just, when you were talking about the pyramids and stuff, I was thinking, man, there's some kind of symbolism here. And just the idea of hierarchy kept up coming to me and, you know, when you said pyramid, I was like, yeah, food pyramid, because that's what I was saying, thinking about the food pyramid, how, like, as a kid, you're taught the food pyramid and stuff. And I was just like, I wonder if there's something to that. But I probably just not on track. I just think the feeling that I got was that it's under the land. If I had $10 million to truly explore this, I would go under. I would, I would tear it up. I wouldn't be surprised if underneath it

is a pyramid, whether it's around or whatnot. That tablet that I was shown, a tablet that I was shown, meant something. Yeah. I don't know where the hell I meant, but it was important. Talk about the tab. They kept showing us things. When I was in the, when I was doing Worldgate, you know, everything was going well, very good. I've seen my kids, you know, those happy times.

And I was leaning on the car window. I'm a child and I'm watching the telephone poles fly by. And I'm in the car with my mother, but it's not my mother. You know what I mean? And then I see this kid that I love and she's, I'm assuming it was my granddaughter, right? And then she turns her head like this to me and this like goiter or whatever you want to call it. This huge thing just grows on the side of her neck.

Like a tumor? Yeah. And then she looks at me, right? And I'm like, oh, man. Then this tablet shows up. Like that turns into a tablet. And it's got this ancient writing on it and it's gold. And I've been looking online and see if I can find anything that, like, throws me.

Oh, there it is. That's it right there because I feel that them showing me that tablet was part of what I'm supposed to figure out from this. But it's like chipped on the edges and it's gold. And then that kind of disintegrates into these dreads. And then it's the lady looking at me. And when the lady looked at me, that's the part of my experience. that I said I went to hell because that's when it was extremely negative. It was bad, you know.

But it was back over with in a few minutes, you know, it didn't take long and only to remember how I really got out of it. But I know when the lady stood there, I seen her face and it backed up and then seen her body and it was just a very negative feeling. But the tablet was right there with her. The tablet turned into her in my vision. you know, but I have no idea what the talent was. I'd assume it's probably somewhere around there.

You know, maybe it's something that's just put there a long time ago. Don't you wish you would have bought that house now? Oh, too. Yeah, maybe a whole different conversation, right? Yeah, if I bought that house, nobody would be allowed. It would be my private playground, and I'd be like, it would just be figured out. And when we keep talking about places like Skinwalker Ranch, and whether you believe the show or not, Clearly, they bring in high-tech, high-tech, right?

And what's it all leading to? We got to drill into the mesa. There's something there. Underground. It's all underground, underground, underground. Underground, there's a triangle. There's a, where all the things happen. There's this triangle.

And Corey's convinced he lived there for a number of years, that it's the ground. It's the ground. So if there's spots, like you said, where the veil's thinner or, or, and whatever that means, right? That's a term we use because we can reconcile on our head visually. what that would look like. Why, you know, there's spots. Clearly, there's spots like that. And what's involved with all these spots, you know,

paranormal activity, cryptids, lights, craft, aliens, whatever you want to call it. It all seems to have a common theme, and it's always about how do you stir up that activity? And most cases, like you said, is there a hierarchy where you do certain things and you're going to get to a different level of engagement, I guess

would be the way to look at it. Like, how do you engage at a higher level? Like, these boys are here for five days, and they've got these frequencies playing, and they're doing these things, you know, seem to stir it up, you know? So is this house actually located within the Bridgewater Triangle?

Yeah. It's part of a bigger, you know, it's part of a bigger thing. Yeah. Again, it's a triangle again. And see, some of the things been talking about or bringing up, as we're talking here, it brings up things maybe we hadn't even thought about since we left or even had a chance to talk about. So now as you bring

them up, now we're going to go back and go, you know, when Tony said this about that, never thought about that. You know, let's look into that. So then your viewers will be doing it when they listen to it. Between now and then, we're probably going to be doing the same thing. Yeah, absolutely. I hope so. I would love, if there's anybody out there listening, if it is pyramids. Our pyramids, do they amplify the activity? Meaning, we should take our experiments to the pyramids of Giza, you know, around the world, find these and see if it's more intense there or if it's easier to attain, you know. I'll tell you what. Oh, boy. What do you got? Um, so one, you bring in out the pyramid, the great pyramids and stuff, they talk about them being generating

stations, your energy, right? But I got a guy next month coming here in studio. who worked within the DOD. And supposedly he knows, at least knows of, if not knows where there are pyramids, or at least a pyramid in the Smokies. Now, this is not going to be a pyramid that would be you'd be able to see with the negative eyes. Probably buried, right?

But if I could find this location, I want to, we'll open up the new generating system. Free energy for everybody in Tennessee. You know? We'll start there. But yeah, man, I'll tell you, I feel like Mike's about to fall off this, Stan. But that's fascinating stuff.

That's really fascinating. All right, so let's start transitioning into the Seance conversation here. This was, of everything that you guys did that I saw, I was like, the Seance was the thing. There was other things that I was like, I don't know if I'd do that. The Seance, I was like, Absolutely not. Never will I ever, you know? And you guys are like, okay, cool. Hands on table, you know? And I was just like, yo, these guys are crazy.

Right. So who is the guy? Tell me the background of the guy, because I know you talked to me about the guy before. Tell me about this guy that did the seance. Yes, Carl, yes, yes, yes, is Carl. Yes, is a comely wench. The spirits are saying now I'm picking up something. My, yes, Joseph, young Joseph, with your bearded dragons here I'm surrounded by. We make fun of that because he is not in studio right now, by the way. He was kind of like a permanent Renaissance festival guy. Yeah. Right? But he was the original guy.

First person to investigate the house. Ever. Ever. Yeah. Back in the day. Yeah. Wow. And he's got, it's interesting, he's got like a twin brother.

And it's kind of like the devil on your shoulder and the angel on one. Like the other one's like, he's a priest. He's a priest. Are you serious? Yeah. He has brothers of priests. Oh, my gosh. Right?

And so, and then here's Carl, like, deep into all this other stuff. Like, you see pictures of Carl's Facebook page, and it's like the crow mask with the big black nose. Are you? Yeah, and then he's all in. And you see these guys over the years are, you know, they collaborate on stuff. It's just the oddest thing. I went on a werewolf hunt with Carl years ago, right? There was in, what's the big city?

Providence, right? Island. There was a werewolf being reported in town. In town. Wow. In the city limits. They had like a few acres, maybe seven to ten acres of wooded area in the town around this pond or maybe it was a river.

There was a werewolf being reported there around these apartment complexes. And so I met him there. And, you know, he's a luciferian, to guess, right? Super chill dude, though. fun to hang out with and you know once again they told us the gloves were off I told that to

Carl and I think what Corey thought because it's my understanding Carl's not allowed there anymore because of this because of what you guys did because of what we did wow so and it could be wrong

but my understanding what I've been told but so Corey's like yeah Carl's done it for ghost adventures yada yada it's the same old thing man have fun enjoy it you like it you know it's cool some stuff that happen and but you know do whatever and i told carl said hey bud the gloves are off let's do it and he's like you really want to go for it and i said what do we need you want to cut ourselves what do you want to do you know because like i just want to experience it right and if we have to do these methods then we got to do these methods uh and so we didn't think nothing of it

Come night of. We're sitting there and Carl breaks out this wand. Yeah. And like the rock will turn people away from touching it once they know what it is or there's a certain aura to it. When he sat that wand on the table, I was like, oh. I didn't know if I wanted to. I mean, I did, but it was like, this is your time to get out, you know. And then so the gloves are off and we went for it.

And it starts, you don't hear it in the film, but it starts with Lucifer's hymn. He's playing a certain song, right? And then he recites some words, you know. And me leading into it, I was really, really excited. You know, I was like, okay, Carl knows his stuff. As a demonologist and Luciferian and all that, he's your guy. one to do occult kind of things. And plus he's had a history

of the house. I believe he was there for the Warren seance, the original seance. You know what I mean when the girl flew across? Wow. And he has stories from the house. He's been going there for years. And I hope that I hope that's not true that he's not allowed to go back there because it was not his

fault. It was mine. You told me the gloves are off. I relayed the message, hey, bro, we need to see it. We need to do it. Let's get it done. bro, let's make some believers. I got a cameraman and don't believe. That's not your fault.

That's Corey's fault. But yeah, another thing is I was trying to prove to my buddy that this stuff exists, you know, and he's filming it, but he's a skeptic coming to the house. Staunch skeptic, bro. You know, he's got to see some stuff. And, well, I hope he's seen some stuff. But it was, it was wild, you know. I don't know what everybody else thought going into it, but I was, like, prepared. I was ready for this.

You know what I mean? It was the most excited thing that we were going, exciting thing that we were going to do in my book going into it. But, you know, what did you, how did you feel about it? You know, I was still riding off the while the World Gate for me and hearing the moan, when I was in that library and that light flash and I physically, when you physically see and feel something, I kind of had that feeling of like, I'm good, man.

I'm like, I experienced something in the conjuring house that was legit. And there's no way to debunk it. And you got static electricity and other people felt it. I thought I was kind of just chill with it, right? So I was kind of like, I'm just going along for the ride. I didn't have, I didn't know what to expect. But at this point, I'm like, I don't know, maybe I'll get the tingleys again or something. But, you know, that one, whatever he laid out there, too, it just looked like, it almost looked like it, to me, felt like an artifact.

like something real, like, okay, now you just brought in some kind of artifact here into the mix. So there was something to it, right? And as he's going along, we're hearing Knox, like on the walls and stuff a little bit. And I'm like, oh, it's really going to happen. And like, this stuff is happening. And there was this door that was open about that much. And as you saw, too, you just look out at the corner of your eye and it kept moving. Like, this door was moving open and closed a little bit.

and Joey the skeptic cameraman you had a little bit of you heard something in your ear or what or what yeah yeah and he kept moving towards that clock

too that didn't work and so there was just some stuff bubbling up like noises door moving a little bit here and there and it seemed like how long did that go on for was an hour in 40 minutes

yeah it didn't seem that long at all to me while we're doing it you know at all but you know Josh isn't here clearly but when he was telling tell him the part about the candle I think that's how it started oh yeah so okay we get into it because you start feeling tingling in your hands

before you go any further let me ask you a question about the seance stuff I've never done a seance you know never gonna do it Highly recommend it. Nope, pass, hard pass. I'd rather step myself in the eyes. I saw you guys lifting your hands off the table at times, even the main guy doing it.

I was always in the impression that you shouldn't be doing that. Is that just false or what? To my understanding, we didn't even have to put our hands down. Right? Like, this is coming from him, though. and I'm trusting this guy. Mm-hmm. Okay.

But he wanted us to put our hands down. It wasn't necessary. I think it was about like the shots of brandy at the beginning. Yeah. He had some type of liquor for everybody to take a shot up before we did it. But as we're keeping our hands down there, you start to feel it's like they're getting charged. You can feel it up into your elbow. and then it's up into the back of your neck,

and then my face is burning. My face felt like it was on fire. Is that a similar experience for everybody? I felt the tingling at one point when I had my hands on there. And that's what I think it more, like you could feel something a little bit, so you're kind of testing it, like is my hand falling asleep because I'm just laying it here. But it even Carl referenced in that sance, too, it felt like his hands were being moved a certain way. But beyond that, mine was more.

When Josh was having these moments, you know, and Stacy, too, it was more out of a concern for them. Like my attention kind of diverted and then I kept seeing that door move. And so I'm starting to be like aware of what's going on around me. It was very hard for me to focus in the moment of what, you know, Carl and following along what he's saying because stuff was kind of happening. You know what I mean? Yeah. And so like Carl said we give ourselves to you. And that was another point in the seance where it was like, all right, we just turned on the turbo button.

You know what I mean? And I'm over here in the moment. You can do whatever you need to. Scratch me, do whatever you got to do. Show me. Show me you can do these things. Almost like Zach Baggins calling it out, you know. But then I tell everybody I was, because I keep getting these messages in my head.

And it's your gut feeling, right? So what's coming from your gut feeling? Lean into that. What are you thinking right now? Lean into it. So I'm like, okay, everybody put a task for the demon or the energy to do. Think about it in your mind, what you want it to do. I'm looking at this candle.

And I'm like, put that candle out. Put that candle out. I'm saying this stuff in my head. Put that candle out. Put that candle out. Josh reaches up and puts the candle out. And I'm like, you know, what I mean? And then Josh doesn't know he's done it.

Yes. You know, and Joey's like, why did you do that? Why'd you put the candle on? And it's like, what are you talking about? And he's like, turn your hand over. And there's wax on it. And so Josh is a diabetic. Yeah. Okay. It's one of the only people, I think, in the world who has changed. Because if you're a diabetic and you acquire diabetes, you get type 2, right? if you're born with diabetes, you have type 1. Josh never had diabetes, and then now he's type 1.

They like study him down at Shans. They study him and his daughter. He goes down there every, I think, six or eight weeks. But anyways, we thought maybe something was happening to him, because you see he's rubbing the back of his neck. And then he goes to put his hand down, and it just slams on the table. Right? And you can see Carl, Carl knows what's going on. Carl's not telling us that this is all par for the course.

You know what I mean? Carl's just like looking at him. And you just start seeing the muscle on his arm jumping, like spazzing or something. Very strange. And then we're hearing footsteps around the table. Joey moved to the fireplace. The fireplace has got a little brick like lay out in front of it.

He moves to the fireplace to make sure it's not the floor creaking from him. But it's not. There's footsteps going around the table. And then what happened? Then we're getting into it. And I get sick. And I'm like,

I feel like I have to throw up. I go outside and throw up what you don't see in the film, and we'll play the clip right now. No, but Bill's girlfriend was directly above us in this closet mirror gazing, and you see her hair lift up in the back. Really? She screams and runs out of the house, and it's the same time that I get sick. And I'm outside throwing up. And then I come back in for round two.

Right? And we go further. Carl's like, all right, we're going to give it a little bit longer. You know, we're going to see what else we can do. And, you know, Carl starts like, I don't want to, I want to move my arms up. You know, he's like, he's talking about how this thing is making him feel and stuff. Carl? Yeah. Carl, the guy that's leading the seance. And with seance, it's a lot of, because like with Bill, he's sitting there and he's just kind of observing like what the world's

going on, you know, with a sance, you have to kind of lean into the thoughts you're getting because that's the point of it. The thoughts that you're getting are from that thing trying to communicate with you. And so if you ignore these thoughts, then you're blocking that communication, right? And so there comes a point where I feel like somebody has stuck me with a frog gig in the gut and they're turning it. Right. And my legs keep wanting

to come up. Right. And so I'm like doubled over. I'm hurting. I'm like for some reason uncontrollably saying no. No. No.

And then boom. Josh had his table. You automatically are like. Yeah. Because I thought he maybe he fell out. Because he was having real struggles with his diabetes at the time. But he just went straight up, you know, head down, face plan. So I kind of put my hand on him.

I'm looking like, do we stop this whole thing right now or do we not? And Stacey's over there, like, legs spasming and still got puke on the side of his face or something. I think where I messed up is like before I threw up, I started reciting an Alistair Crowley hymn. And so. I think where I messed up is. Fast forward. He's got vomit stuck in his beard. But yeah, so then Josh does that. And what's happening is Carl's trying to reel it back.

He's trying to get the thing out of here. We're done. You need to leave, yada, yada. And the pain's getting worse. Josh doesn't just slam his head one time. He picks it up. Does it again. This happens.

How many times? I think he did it three times. Yeah, he does it like in succession. Three times mocking the Trinity is the only thing I can think of that. Like, why does it always happen in trees? Plus, we had been asking for a knock. Yeah, we've been, we got knocks. And they use his head.

Boom, boom, boom. And then Carl's like, goodbye, goodbye, goodbye. And slams the table. It's over with. I'm like, oh, I just walk outside. Corey's like, take your shoes off. He's like, come over here, hug this tree. He's like, damn it, he's cussing at me.

He's like, you're so susceptible to this stuff. Why do you do these things? Yada yada. He's like, hold that tree. And I'm like, what if that's poison? He's like, hold the tree. I'm going to slam you into the tree. Corey's a huge.

Big boy. Like combat veteran. You know, he's a big guy. And so he's got me out in the yard wrapped up around this tree hugger. Hippie. It's so funny. And then he's like, he's like, hug in me. And he's like, you can cry now, dude.

You can cry now. I'm like, oh my God, bro. This is so. It was wild. It was wild. But that was the most intense seance I'd ever been in. And I would do it again because there's a certain kind of feeling you get when you do want answers. Okay, now you're getting answers.

A knife in the stomach. It's a certain feeling you get. Can we go further? Does that dial off? You know, is it get to a point where it's like you've got to rip the Band-Aid off? Does that go away? There's when you said we're left with questions. Those are the questions I had.

So Josh, right? Yeah. Yeah. Head Slammer. Josh. Yeah. Okay. So Josh, what is his recollection of that event?

None. None. Even the head slammer. So afterwards, I insisted that he has that thing where you're phone and you check your blood sugar. There's insulin level. I insisted that he do that right after that to make sure, like, we headed towards diabetic coma, was this that? It was totally normal.

Because, like, no, I already took my stuff. Totally normal. And then asking him about the stuff he's looking at you with that blank look like. You could see it in his eyes. What were you talking about? He didn't. What are you talking about?

He wasn't connected. Yeah, like, I don't, what do you mean? You know, for the people that say that's a put on, his arm is spasming. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, you can see, we catch out on camera. His muscles are involuntarily moving. Yeah, he's going through the same thing now, mind you.

Carl's rubbing the table. He's like, I just feel like I run up a driveway. He's like, I want to raise my arm and all this stuff. I'm like, give into it, guys. Give into it. Let's keep going. That's the problem. You.

Yeah. Yeah. Bingo. You identified it. Yeah. He identified it himself. And the thing was, Bill, Bill wasn't experiencing anything. You weren't really experiencing anything.

And I wasn't, but I was distracted. Yeah, that... Because there was so much going on around. Right. Because I'm right next to that door that goes to the kitchen, and I'm sitting next to Carl. And that door is just constantly inching open. I mean, like, just, you can hear it. And then you can hear, I think it was the library door or the clock door at the same thing.

And then there's movement around us. And right before you got sick, not right before. In my mind, I didn't, you know, when I, when it happened, it was like, I saw the shadow, the door flew open to the conjuring house. The front door flew open. And then he got sick and she screamed and he ran out. Now, in watching it back, there was a little bit of time between all that. But I saw a shadow. And I even say, I saw a shadow go across. And then the door comes open. And there's nobody over there and nobody out there. And then you get sick and run out. It's like something opened the door for you. And Michelle screams right as you get sick. And she said something like, are you guys done?

you know, what's going on or something like that. But it was just boom, boom, boom. Yeah. And it was the timing. But going back watching that, when you're watching Josh, when he's sitting there, I was watching him before he hit his head. You can see he's not connected. He's blank and he's doing this.

He's ramping up to that. And then all of a sudden it's boom. And he slams his head down. And he's got no clue. Yeah. Wow. One thing that like Alster Crowley would do to prepare himself to have it, experiences is to not sleep as much. Real simple, but it just lack of sleep will bring you closer to

the veil closer. And we're staying in the conjuring house, which now that we know, like you stay there, it's going to poison you to some effect. So you have this group of individuals who are intentionally willing experiences to come to them while simultaneously not taking care of their body the way you need to to be fully cemented in this reality. And for some people, some people can drift farther. And I think the diabetic does play into it. I don't think it was, but the fact that he was already in a week in state, now we're not, we weren't eating well, we weren't sleeping well and nothing.

For a week. Yeah, for a week. So we were breaking down and getting closer. So that's why I think it was just so profound and especially profound for him. He was already kind of dreaming in a sense. You know what I mean? Yeah, it was pretty, whether people believe it or not, watch the whole thing and see that that it's building and it's building and it's building.

And we don't understand it. You know, maybe someone out there can explain it more. Oh, well, he had this motor skill thing that went off and da-da-da-da. Okay. It's a lot of coincidence. It's a lot of coincidence because you have skeptics. You have people that they weren't. He's puking.

He's slamming his head. They're just watching. But shit's going on all around. Yeah. So all that's made up. Yeah. He brought up a good point about lean into it and listen to it. At some point, half of us leaned into it like Josh.

and Stacey and Carl, and the other half became observers. Like, we were distracted by what was going on, and I started focusing on listening and wanting to see the door move and wanting to hear the little knocks and watching Stacey, like, build up because I knew, like, he's going to snap. I don't know in what form, but puked. And then Josh was just kind of knowing he's diabetic and look kind of catatonic, and then slammed his head.

And now it's like, I'm just watching now. you know so wow that yeah that whole that whole thing is just it's wild uh how it all kind of unfolded uh you were down at the well he was doing the well while we were doing this yeah i'm hoping whatever they're stirring up is going to come greet me first at well yeah you know yeah so but i was having my vision triangle heads yeah uh no the only thing i was going to say is you know i was a late addition to this whole thing. And very early on, I even joked with Stacy. I felt like the guy had that responded to the human bait ad, you know, because my prior

experience was a Bigfoot expedition with Stacy, and that's how I met him when we stayed in touch. But the two things I said I wouldn't do was Ouija board or seance. And, of course, they asked me to do a seance. So I'm not going to say no. I still have never done a Ouija board, but I've been present for it. See, Josh. Yeah.

I've known Josh for a really long time, and that dude will follow me, hey, we're going to do this, we're going to do that. Like, just think about the spots I've taken you. Josh's been like 10 times into that, you know, and he leaned into it. Leans into it. And that was, I felt bad afterwards. You know, it's like, shh. Is there any, and maybe this is a good way to transition. to the after effects.

You guys leave. You guys, you know, had, I don't know if it was a hitchhiker effect or what, but life was different after this experience for a week. With Josh, has there been any of that?

I mean, what I saw on camera, which you guys are describing, I'm like, Homeboy looks like he got possessed. Like, has he experienced anything since? Here's a part.

about Josh, the story that's not in the movie. Josh sees in the first world gate. He's seeing his family laughing. He's seeing, he's seeing faces. But he's seeing only the dead people. And his granddaddies there, who is still alive. So we had a guy named Jerry that was there. He came over from the Lizzie Borden house, friend of ours.

And he pulled me aside and he says, Stacy, claims to be a psychic. Okay. I hear that a lot. I don't put much in it. You know what I mean? But he's like, listen, I had a dream about Josh's mom last night, and she's crying. Something's wrong. I need to tell Josh that he needs to call her.

But I don't want to go up to him and telling me because Josh looks scary to Jerry, right? Very intimidating. I was like, dude, Josh is teddy bear, bro. I don't know if you're telling him what the hell you want to, you know? If anything, he's just going to tell you get a hell out of his face. Josh goes or Jerry goes and tells Josh. Josh's like, okay, I'll call her. Josh's granddad dies when we're in the line getting on the airplane going home.

Passes away, right? Remember we were at the airport and he gets the call? And it was like, dude, what's the coincidence? There are chances of a coincidence like that. You know, so it was wild. He had immediate effects there for a while. You know, I wish he could, I wish he was here so he could speak about him, you know, and I don't want to tell his business like that. But I think everybody that was involved in that seance had some negative stuff immediately or in the following months.

I know Joey's house had some trouble, tree catches fire, the, yeah, flooding in your house and things like that. like so my property was stolen from me and sold out from under me like there was there was a bunch of a bunch of stuff that went on there's very negative following that experience could it be from that experience have to do it again you know to see yeah she's always like he corroborative and repeatable yeah we're just got to say we're applying the scientific method here yeah got to dive back in Harder next time. Everybody, open yourselves up. Yeah, it was possessed.

I want to go back again just to make sure I can get possessed. I guess, yeah. Yeah, repossessed. It didn't stick. It lasted for a while, but I wanted to stick. Jeez. So anybody else have anything? I describe mine.

I think, you know, we don't have to rehash the year I've had, really, since then. Yeah. Well, I just think it's, I wasn't in the actual seance. I was doing the well-wishers, but I had nothing negative afterwards. So I know everyone had a bunch of befall them. So I don't know what that means, even though I was kind of linked to the experiment, so to speak, but I didn't know death, know anything crazy. So let me ask you this.

This is a thought that I have. You're not part of Worldgate, and now you're not part of the Seance. Why not the Seance? Seance, I don't know why you weren't a part of the Seance. You told me. There's a part of the film that we just don't have time to put in. but the energy in that house was getting very violent and very mean. And since he was most open to it, it was kind of channeling through him.

So at certain points, some of us were just trying to do our own thing and trying to figure out how to make it work. And I was kind of like you. It's not like I'm a big believer, but I also, why am I going to mess with that? Like, I could do something else. Worldgate, I wanted to be in. Like, I'm still pissed. Like, I'm pissed on it.

Traversing universes? Are you kidding me? Who doesn't? Seance, whatever. And originally one of the ideas, too, was to have stuff. to cut back and forth to, to break it up. We didn't know it was going to be so good. You know, so now you would have this where we could go back and forth between me and the well.

Is anything happening now that they've vamped it up? You know, he's hitting his head in the table. Are you seeing Bashiba? Are you seeing demons? What, what's going on? So, but you know, and when you do these things, it evolves and it changes. And for me, there were no negative effects at the end of it. But that could be because I was not sitting at that table.

You seem like a very positive person. I wonder if even if there was something negative going on, you'd be like, yeah, that's good. would. Yeah. Super positive. I would see, I would see how it was positive.

Well, when I bang my head, now I, you know, now I can start listen to heavy. Yeah, like a demon,

a demon appears in front of R.P. G. And he turns into Mark Wahlberg. You good, bud? Huh? You all right? Well,

not. I'd make love to me. Hey, man. You know? That's what's the difference. I'll tell you, the first time meeting you, R.P.G was at the,

uh, at the, uh, the, the, uh, the smoking Mountain Bigfoot conference. And I, I remember walking away

and I'm like, this guy just makes you feel loved. Like, he just makes you feel like like, like, if you've known him for a long time and you're just like, man, I just feel like I feel like. I'm the oddball on this team. You know, like everyone's rough and gruff from really badass pass. And I'm like, dude, have you ever hug five bunnies at the same time? I know. He's just such a kind person.

He's the mom of the group. He's in there making us jelly sandwiches as we're getting right. He's pissed. So he's standing there pissed. You know, we're working. And I'm sitting there making sandwich and I'm looking at everyone's, you know, we're working. We're working hard, right? And my natural instinct, I'm a caretaker. I care for people.

I want to care for people. So I'm just going to make sandwiches for everyone if they want it. Like that's maybe not what other people think. But I look at him, like, you got to eat something. You have something. He just looks at me. And he's like, you're the team mom, like an insult, right? And I went, yeah, I am.

And you're the team dad. And he's like, oh. But like, you know, like, I accept it. I want to care for all them. I mean, at the end of the day, what we're doing, yeah, is, is scary. Yeah. Right?

You know, and I think you need at least one person on the squad that's gonna shit, positivity and light on it. That's you, man. You know,

now if there's an experiment that really needs, and maybe that's why I wasn't in the seance, you know? And this is coming fresh right now. Maybe I wasn't, because I might have messed it up

by sitting there being so positive instead of diving deeper like they did, you know, so maybe there's a reason. Yeah, and that'll come out in time. But,

oh yeah, absolutely, man. We all, we're all kings and queens and amazing. And anyone takes that away from you, you tell him the f-off, you know.

There was the part where you got, you yelled at everybody. Oh, yeah. I don't know if you remember that. I'm not that guy. I snapped. Yeah. Bro, it's jacked and screaming at everybody in the house. Get out, rock, roll, roll, raw, raw, raw.

And nobody understands why. I'm like, what the hell's going on? Yeah. I, it was after the second Worldgate and all the stuff was going on. And people were milling around and were like, we need to go. now when it's active in film. And I've mentioned it a few times and then something just popped in my head.

And I said, everybody get a person with an effing camera. We're here to make an effing film. And break it up right now. Like I snapped and that's, I never do that. Like, that's not my nature. I mean, it was in my past. But it brings out, it brought out the, I mean, I've never done that.

Right? Never. And Corey said, if you stay at this house long enough, you're going to get this little thing on your shoulder that's going to tell you, get the last word in, make them pay, let them know. And that started to leak out in us. And it's not like, well, that makes people, but it started leaking out. Yeah, because Stacey, yeah, we all had like a blowup.

Yeah, it sounds. I know Stacey, did I know I did, yeah. It sounds cheap, you know, and like, cliche, but that house, I don't know how you could live there. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know how, like, Bill stayed there two years. How the hell did you do that? Although after what, like he said he had thought about suicide and stuff got, you know,

it got so bad he had to leave. But it is. Like, even the kids, the daycare. Right. That's, right? That's kind of weird, right? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, kids, I mean, say they're there for eight hours a day.

I mean, that's hard on the kids. Like, I'd like to do a follow-up with those kids now, right? Let's see, or what their life's been like. Could you imagine if you could track down some of those kids? That's a documentary itself. Yeah, that is a great idea. Bill just told me that this morning on the way over here when I was asking about the crooked neck lady. Because I didn't know.

I didn't want to come in here and talk about it. I was like, yeah, we had these experiences with a woman. There's stuff drawn. Is that BS or not bad? He's like, dude, listen, one of them kids I got a hold of. And he, this guy's a military guy. And so when he was there in 1990, he would play with this kid Matthew every day. He would play with Matthew in the basement.

They play in the yard. all over the place. One day Matthew doesn't show up, and he asks where Matthew's at, and they're like, who in the world are you talking about? Are you, sir? Yeah, and then they tell them that the house had burned. There was a fire at some point, but they couldn't find a record of a child dying there. But it doesn't mean it didn't happen down the street, you know, because the way I look at that,

the way I look at that property is it is a light in a sea of darkness. and so therefore all the energy is drawn to it like a moth to a flame. That's exactly how I viewed it. What about the boy that, I'm sorry, the boy that drank the poison or something and then crawled up into the rafters and died. That was the only story I had heard about the house about a boy dying. I just don't remember that boy's name. I don't remember neither, but this guy was a bill that actually tracked one of those guys down that had stayed there was in the daycare, you know, and he's playing with it. kid didn't exist that's correct yeah right that's but didn't we all growing up i had an imaginary friend

i didn't you didn't you nothing not like that my sister had multiple oh i had no full on like everything to where there was not really intervention but talking to is about it's not real you have to let that go so did you see it i it's so long ago i don't remember i just knew that i had not and it wasn't just one i had multiple good buddies and our culture tells you to release that and that's not real. And then it just, you're just blind to it, you know, afterwards. I wonder. I wonder what that is. Yeah, no, I actually... Schizophrenia? Is that accurate or...

I thought about talking with my sister about it sometimes when I first started the podcast because I think I texted her once and I said, remember your imaginary friends? Yeah. And I'm like, do you think they were imaginary? And she's like, what we should talk about some time? And we never talked about it. Right? Well, like, so when you're a child, you're, you're, you're, brain hasn't formed into two hemispheres yet. It's still one. And that was the purpose of the World Gate to get our mind back into that state when we were childhood. Children see these things way more than everybody else. And that's what you're trying to do. Hemisink is to sync up the two you know, hemispheres so that you can have these visions and stuff like that. So.

Well, I think we're going to bring this in for a landing. There's so many. so many things. This has just been a fantastic conversation. I think that these guys that everybody got a chance to listen to are absolutely bonkers crazy, but it takes the bonk of crazy guys to do the things that nobody else is willing to do. And I appreciate you guys coming and sharing about this experience. Before we get out of here, what's the idea as far as this film goes? Are they going be able to find it on, because we're recording right now before it was released. It's still in production. So what's the idea? Are people going to be able to find it other places other than YouTube? Yeah, it won't be on YouTube. It's going to be Amazon, Apple, all those

streaming VOD services, because I'm trying to, as soon as we get done here, go to the house, start working on this, at least have this part in the movie done by Friday. maybe a little bit of trimming down on it, because I think what we handed you was an hour in 30 minutes. Yeah, 35, yeah. Yeah. So we got to see how that feels. It feels long, you know what I mean?

Because, like, the seance is an hour and 37 minutes. I cut it to 51 minutes. I was like, I don't know what else to do. And then RPG's like, all right, here. And then I think we've got it down to 20-something minutes now, you know, but you don't want to bore people. Yeah. Be looking for this, the conjuring house experiments.

Awesome. Yeah. Well, I appreciate you guys being here. everybody listening right now. Thank you very much for tuning in to another heater of an episode. We are going to be back next week for another one, but these guys were awesome. And until next week, stay safe. Take care and remember the truth was such a free, but first it will piss you off. Bye.