The Confessionals - 802: Aleister Crowley The Double Agent Sorcerer

Episode Date: October 21, 2025

Was Aleister Crowley truly the wickedest man alive, or a covert double agent hiding behind the mask of the occult? In this deep-dive with Joel Thomas of Free the Rabbits, he unpacks Crowley’s shadowy connections to British intelligence, the Golden Dawn, and secret wartime missions that blurred the line between sorcery and spycraft. The conversation drifts into the strange parallels between his sketch of LAM and modern alien imagery, whispers of early mind-control experiments, and a web of influence that may have stretched from ancient rituals to world wars. In the end, Crowley emerges not as a man torn between good and evil, but as one who fully embraced the dark to serve his hidden masters.Please pray for Tony's wife, Lindsay, as she battles breast cancer. Your prayers make a difference!If you’re able, consider helping the Merkel family with medical expenses by donating to Lindsay’s GoFundMe: https://gofund.me/b8f76890Become a member for ad-free listening, extra shows, and exclusive access to our social media app: theconfessionalspodcast.com/joinThe Confessionals Social Network App:Apple Store: https://apple.co/3UxhPrhGoogle Play: https://bit.ly/43mk8kZTony's Recommended Reads: slingshotlibrary.comMy New YouTube ChannelMerkel IRL: @merkelIRLMy First Sermon: Unseen BattlesThe Meadow Project: Stream HereMerkel Media Apparel: merkmerch.comSPONSORSSIMPLISAFE TODAY: simplisafe.com/confessionalsGHOSTBED: GhostBed.com/tonyCONNECT WITH USWebsite: www.theconfessionalspodcast.comEmail: [e-mail] Thomas: linktr.ee/joelthomasmediaMAILING ADDRESS:Merkel Media257 N. Calderwood St., #301Alcoa, TN 37701SOCIAL MEDIASubscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/2TlREaIReddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/theconfessionals/Discord: https://discord.gg/KDn4D2uw7hShow Instagram: theconfessionalspodcastTony's Instagram: tonymerkelofficialFacebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcasTwitter: @TConfessionalsTony's Twitter: @tony_merkelProduced by: @jack_theproducerOUTRO MUSICJoel Thomas - Plato’s CaveYouTube | Apple | Spotify

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Proualos all all before we get to this week's show, this is just your weekly reminder to

please continue to pray for my wife Lindsay. She is battling breast cancer right now

and we're praying for complete healing in Jesus' name. Thank you. Merkel. Media. This was all circulating around the base that a giant had been killed, but no one was supposed to talk about it. I saw three long, bony fingers, reach up underneath the door, curl up to grab it, and then disappeared.

When he came over to me, dude, he slithered over to me. And this giant comes out of the cave, and they're all first. And he starts running and firing at this giant. With a giant moves, he's got a spear in one hand and he's running really fast. And spears Dan holds him up like this. Somebody else, shoot him in the face, shoot him in the face. They basically decapitated. This is that spurs.

He's got spurs him when he got... Feel something pulling at my leg. And I look over and there are two small gray entities pulling it. And they're literally, I'm getting pulled off the bed. I reached my hand into this bush, and I touch air. Couldn't breathe and I couldn't move because I know I'm seeing a monster. Welcome to the show, everybody you're listening to The Confessionals Podcast. I'm your host, Tony Merkel.

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Link in the description for all your Merkel Media swag. And Merkelfilms.com. We have our newest documentary on there, The Meadow Project, and it is available for on-demand streaming right now. there is exclusive material that comes along with that stream. Two-night investigations, all packaged for you at Merkelfilms.com. Go check it out. Stream on demand right now. Now, today we have Joel Thomas coming in studio to lay some knowledge down with us on

Alistair Crowley's Double Life. It turns out he was not just an occult sorcerer. He was also a double agent. He was an intelligence agent for the British government. So he was an agent for the crown and an agent of darkness. Let's get to this conversation right now. Joel Thomas here in the flesh. What's going on, man?

It's up, man. Dude, you and I were just talking about a friend of ours, and I just got to give him a shout out, Scott Walker from the Freaky Deaky Deky podcast. Yeah. Dude, like, he is so creative. So if anybody doesn't know, the host of the Freaky Degu podcast is Scott Walker, and he is the one who designed the logo, the confessionals logo, Merkel Media's logo,

even the Tennessee logo that's on the table here. That's all Scott. And back in the day, I sold beard oils, Scott. He's the one who made the beard oils. He's the one who designed the awesome branding. All of that was Scott. And funny enough, I was just talking to Scott. and he and I are going to probably come out with the, that your beard oils again. So some insider baseball, if you're a member of you've already seen it on the, the Confessionals app,

and every time I say that, we get email. So let me just tell you, if you're watching this on YouTube, you do not have access to the members app because the systems don't connect. Members on the website, the professionalspodcast.com,

are the ones that get access to the app because they don't have an app if we didn't build one for them. Anyways, that is out of the way. And I posted it on there. about how we had the beard oils coming. And people really were excited about that.

But that's all Scott, man. And he just came out, he's coming out with a new podcast. I'm sorry for this. And it's, it's like, it's so creative and it's so him. I mean,

it's like, it's going to be a comedy thing, but it's going to be like, how would you describe his comedy? Is it like dry humor? Super dry. Yeah. But you,

you like, wind up laughing at things. You're like, oh, I feel bad laughing at this. Like, he shares his misery, but it's funny. No people that keep conversations going when you're trying to get out of a conversation. Like, you're slowly inching your way to the door. And they're just like, yeah, so anyway.

And then I was talking to Ralph and Ralph said this and blah. And you're just like slowly just over time, like, yeah. Yeah. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, that's crazy. Really? Oh.

Oh, really? He said that to you? I didn't realize that he was that kind of guy. Oh, that's so funny. That's so funny. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah.

Yeah. You sure? All right. Yeah. And I'm just, I'm super proud of the guy. He's so, he's so creative. And I just, I love seeing people explore their creativity. Yeah.

And he's a prime example of that. So if anybody doesn't know Scott Walker from the Freaky Deegie podcast, check him out. Look up his new podcast. I'm sorry for this. And it's literally him just talking about life and just talking about the quirky things that people, you often wonder in the back of your head, because you never say out loud. That's him. I mean, he says some, I would say that it's definitely not a show to listen to a rap with your kids. But it's, you know, some adult content, I would say. But it's, it's still funny. So anyways, that would see that before before we started recording, I, I said, I don't know where this is going to go. Let's just see where it goes. Right.

And I was like, I introduced Joel and then start talking about somebody else. Oh, back to Joel now. So you came down and we're going to talk about Crowley today. But before we do, dude, we got to give a shout out to Free the Rabbits. I mean, that is a podcast. It's just over a year old now. It's been over a year, right? Yeah.

Yeah. So tell us about it. Like, what's the deal with Free the Rabbits? And why do they need freeing? Well, my best. biggest push to do this podcast, because I wasn't even sure I was going to podcast, man. I've told you that before. I stepped away from podcasting. I didn't know if I wanted to go back and do it. And frankly, man, I just got tired of the truther, conspiratorial stuff. And not that I was

tired of researching or any of that kind of stuff, because I enjoy that. It's a lot of fun. I think I just got tired of the community. I don't think it's a community. Community means people that come together and work together and help each other. I think it's the complete opposite. And I do think there's some good people. And I do think that hopefully there's been a turn over the past year or so with people trying to step away from the echo chambers that they live in.

But I just found that it was just a lot of people who hold theory. as truth. And if somebody doesn't believe their particular truth, they got to fight everybody over it. And you still see a lot of that. And I think for me, it was also seeing

the Christian perspective of that. And they were even worse. The Christians were the worst ones in the conspiratorial community fighting over everything. Yeah. You know, fighting over fake theology that doesn't exist.

It's just a theory. Now we're fighting over it. And I just got exhausted with it. it. And I said if I was going to come back in podcast, and I told you that if I was going to do it, I was going to do it in a way that I felt comfortable doing it. And I came with Free the Rabbits. And the concept is literally we can go down these rabbit holes, but the goal is not to live in those rabbit holes. It's to get out in the real world, touch grass, talk to your neighbor, do what God wants us to do. Connect with the people around us. You know, people,

scream to the rooftops behind these microphones about fighting the system, but when they get out there, they do nothing. Yeah. You know, what are we doing in our communities to help the people around us? You know, not just by monetary means, but, you know, what are we actually doing? And I think for me, that was a challenge for myself, was finding ways that I could get out in the community and help and also encouraging other people to do the same thing, because there's a lot of people out there that need help and us screaming behind our little screens about how we're here to wake people up. Yeah. I encourage people on my show that we're not here to wake anybody up.

We're here to spread love and compassion that Christ has told us to do. Yeah. If someone happens to wake up from a situation that God wants them to wake up from, he'll do that in his timing. It's not us to dictate that. And I think, too, with what I did with my podcast in all the research that I do, it's really for people to take it how they want to. I try to add in as much as possible things for people to find applicable to their own lives from whatever I talk about. So whether it's doing a case study on a historical person and how we shouldn't operate that way,

or if it's into, hey, this is how the government's operating over here, or whatever it is. I think that, you know, even cryptids, whatever it is, I think we need to be able to centralize that back to God and also teach people to live life, man. There's too many people living in misery, despair, depression constantly. And I've heard more about the world ending and doom and gloom than anything since 2020. And I think I just got exhausted with it. And that's not how we're supposed to live. It's just not, Tony. And I think that that was the main basis for me doing the podcast was to, one, not give a crap when anyone thinks and just do it.

Because I feel like it's what God wants me to do. And however people take it, they take it. They like it, don't like it fine. But at the end of the day, I'm going to try to bring as much positivity, even if I'm talking about dark topics, as much positivity is positive. for people to take that home with them because I just have seen too many people in whatever you want to call this conspiratorial space just not living at all. And they're comfortable doing that. And I also think they've used conspiracies as a reason for why they can't live life a full life. Well, I can't, I didn't sell my soul. That's why I'm not successful. Well, not everybody that's

successful sold their soul. We got to get out of that mentality too. Also the mentality that everybody in Hollywood's evil or everybody in entertainment's evil or everybody in politics is evil. Listen, there's a lot of negativity in those areas, but it doesn't mean everybody's part of it. Just like I always scream on my show, not everything's fake, guys. We got to get out of that mentality too, because once we start going on the road of everything's fake, then you don't trust anybody. Your paranoid all the time and you cut everybody off. And that's what I'm seeing more and more is people cutting off from everybody around them. Listen, all these theories that are going on in the Bible

right now that are not biblical at all, it's training people to not connect to people in the church. Because now it's like, well, if somebody doesn't believe in Nephilim the way I do, well, I can't go to church. I can't connect with those people because they don't see the word like I see the word. Then it becomes a Christian elitism. It's that Christian red pill. Yeah. So, like, it's, and a prime example of what you're talking about, even getting, like, worn down by it.

I brought her up before on the show, but Trish, she used to have an Instagram called My Tinfoil Hat. I think she started it in 2020. But recently in the last, I'd say six months, she totally flipped the script on the page. I don't think she has any other social media other than Instagram, but it went from My Tinfoil hat where she, She was, you know, talking conspiracy and the government is, you know, this, that, and the other,

which a lot of the stuff that she was posting was justified. Yeah. And there is a lot of justification to it to people's gripes with their governments and the conspiratorial angle. Yes, Rothschilds are real. Yes, there's conspiracies there. But she just felt really convicted that she needed to do a different spin, which is more of positive, faith-based. Right. And I don't want to speak for her.

just I can speak as to what I've seen on her her page since then. And she even posted about the whole Christian Red pill thing, which is what triggered in my mind. She talked about how it was a Chad GPT. I think I talked about it on the show before recently. But she asked ChatGPT if you were, I forget what she asked actually. So it's a bad example. But basically it was the idea that if Chad GPT was like Satan or the Antichrist,

how would you pull a Christian away from the church? something I can't remember. But I remember the one thing, one of the things was, like, I would convince, I would play on their pride and convince them that they, they're the only ones with the answers, the only ones that have the answers, and convince them to pull back from their, their church, their circles, because they don't know, I know, but they don't know. Yeah. And it's, it's that kind of, like, I would you say, Christian elitism, it's that, it's that pride and pull, and that, that's such a, a huge thing, right? I mean, the pride, I think gets looked over a lot. Like, yeah. The, the idea.

of, you know, I'm proud of you, son, and I'm proud of what I've built. And there's nothing wrong with being proud of things. But there is a danger and pride that I think just gets overlooked a lot. And because it's overlooked, it's preyed on a lot by these darker entities that are trying to trip you up. And so you and I and the team here, we were just having, it seems like, an all-day meeting. And, you know, that's one of the things that came up in the conversation was just like, no matter what direction everything goes, wherever we go with everything that we're trying to build here on the back end, like, we don't, we don't ever want to succumb to the public perception of who the world is saying we are. Like, our identity is in Christ,

our identities in what Christ has commissioned us to do. And outside of that, we're not concerned about what the perception is, good or bad. And that's basically killing our pride, you know. It's like we created things. Why do we create things? Because we have creativity. Why do we have creativity because it's been instilled to us by God. If we can just kind of get in this mindset of deflecting credit from us and just point to him, it's like, I say, I do it all the time with the show. The show has become what it is, right?

Some people love it, some people hate it. But the fact is, it is a successful show, and it's not because of something that I did. It's because God commissioned me to do it, and he was behind it the whole time. I did Amway for two years when I was in my early 20s. Guess what? I lost about $10,000. make any. Why? I don't think God was behind it, to be honest. I tried a cleaning company. I started a cleaning company a long time ago. That fell flat on his face. I started a car repair

company, a mobile car repair company where I would go to my clients after I get out a truck driving and work on their cars for them. That fell flat on his face. Like everything I've done, fell flat on his face. This is the only thing, though, that God has commissioned me to do. So, you know, as last I checked, one plus one is still equals two. So, so right, free the rabbits, It's a podcast, a show underneath Merkel Media, and people can find it on YouTube and any other podcast playing app. Are you on Rumble right now? Yes. You are on Rumble.

Okay, so we're uploading to Rumble. So if you're on Rumble right now watching this, just hop out over to Free the Rabbits, give it a follow. Rumble is one of those platforms that's like it's hard to get traction going. In fact, I had a meeting with Rumble and the guy who I'm working with, he went to my, channel and he saw I had like, I think it was like 2,500 subscribers. And he's like, oh, wow, you have 2,500 subscribers? And I was like, he's from Rumble and he's like, wow, you're doing really good. Right. I was like, what the heck? But yeah, I've been, I've been trying to get some gears turning over on Rumble and stuff just because there's a whole world of people out there

that don't want to touch YouTube. But that's why they're on Rumble and I want to reach them to. So anyways, people can check it out, Free the Rabbits podcast. And, you know, you do a lot of deep dives. I mean, I said this to you in the truck today, and I'll use this as an example, because he's been around a long time. If anybody's familiar with the history podcast, Carlin, Dan Carlin, thanks. Hardcore history with Dan Carlin.

I don't listen to it. I used to list to it here and there, but my dad was a huge fan. And his thing is, like, he'll do all this research, and he'll drop, like, I don't know, like six, seven, eight hour episodes, you know. And it's just like when it drops, you know you're getting quality and you know you're getting heavily researched things and you're going to learn something. You don't do those long of episodes. You break them up into parts. But essentially, if you took like your two, three, four parts series and you put them all

together, that's what it would be. But it's heavily researched. And so, you know, where this show is very story-based and conversational-based, I would say more conversational-based than even story-based anymore. But because this shows conversational based, yours is very heavy research base. And people are going to definitely learn a few things over there. So go ahead and check it out. Today, I want to get into Crowley. You and I have talked about Crowley over the years here and there on and off. And, you know, there's a documentary that is going to be dropping that you spent a significant amount of time on. I don't know what you can and cannot say about it, but if you can just tip them a little bit as to what is coming with that, because it kind of plays into our

conversation today, because what we want to do today is really lay out some information on who Crowley was. Everybody, when you say Alas or Crowley, first of all, how's the other way to pronounce it that they say? Crowley. Crowley. I'm still used to saying Crowley now, because I used to say Crowley until I found out it was Crowley from you. But, But, like, everybody hears about Alster Crowley as, oh, he was this giant Satanist, and he was basically Satan walking in the flesh. And answer is yes. But there is more to him than just that, that I don't know if everybody totally understands.

And I know your documentary explores parts of that. Right. So if you could just drop a little bit of information, let me know what's coming with that. And we'll just get right into the topic. Yeah, you're not wrong about Crowley being involved with a lot of nefarious things. And I would go a step further, too, because I think that a lot of times, the Christian blanket over things is Satanist, right? That's what we say.

And it's not wrong in the sense of like it's the umbrella, right? But to the person who isn't a Christian or someone who is outside of the framework of that that understands where Crowley comes from, that's when they're quick to discredit anything a Christian says because they don't really know a lot about Crowley and what he does. And I think that when I started really researching him deeply over the people, past one on three years now as far as what threads I was connecting, right? Because there's been plenty of guys out there, and we'll talk about some of them today that have written tons of biographies on him. And they all came from different angles. And I realized that none of them

were wrong. It's just putting all those angles together and realizing that this was a very multifaceted man, that he had so many layers to him, but he was very very very very. And he was very important to the trajectory of not only the modern occult movement, but also secret agencies, intelligence agencies. We're talking about secret societies, secret societies, the UFO movement that really kicked off during Roswell and on to now. So many of these things were tied directly to him. And yeah, some of the people that worked with him, of course, but he kind of was the central

figurehead of all that. And one of the things I want to do with the film was I was doing some research about a particular cryptid. And we can just say what they are, melonheads. And I found this crazy thread that tied to Crowley. And I was like, man, this is kind of wild. I was like, is there any more to it than just my imaginations and a couple of things I'll put together? So I started digging really deep. Talk to Ward. I think we were leaving a trip. And I was telling him about some the stuff I found. He said, that might make a good film. I started doing more research, started compiling all this research over months, and it worked out. So we sat down, we talked to Caleb, and Caleb loved the idea, and our goal was to hit all of the areas that the melon heads

had been seen over the years. Which is crazy that, you know, we're talking about cryptid melonheads and Crowley in the same conversation. I don't know how often Crowley comes up in the conversation of cryptids. Aliens, sure. But cryptids, that's an interesting angle. That's an interesting angle. And I think if we look at cryptids

from the lens of some of their connections to praetor humans, which would be your, quote-unquote, extraterrestrials or interdimensional beings. He called them praetor humans. So if we look at that connection,

it's not that big of a stretch. And then when we dig deep, into a lot of the levers, the books that he wrote about different rituals and different occult practices and just talking about specific works that he was presenting when it came to these connection, these entities. Again, it's not a stretch to say that some of these cryptids could also be tied into this. So then we started hitting all these areas up. We ended up finding a whole connection with Joseph Smith and Mormonism.

We ended up out in Salt Lake with Isaac White. And before you know it, the film just took a life with so on it. It was a month of filming, which is wild. I've never done that long of a filming stretch where we hit four different places. Three of the areas were where these melon heads were found. You were down like 30 pounds after the end of that month, just running gun. I know. We literally were just running and gunning. And we ended up finding some crazy things that we caught on camera, which I'm super jacked for people to see. It's one of the most compelling things that we've ever caught on camera. And in broad daylight.

Which is even crazier. Yeah. And, but it all leads back to Crowley and what his ties were with the governments. Now, you brought up an interesting thing when you started this whole thing out with the pronunciation of Crowley. That's kind of important to the film coming out too. Sure. Because there's a big tie with how that works. And most people think it's Crowley because that's kind of the Americanized way of saying it was always.

always Crowley. A lot of people said it, right? But in actuality, we have proof that it is Crowley. So he wrote a poem called The Convert. And in that poem, there were two lines. He says, where are you going so meek and holy? I'm going to the temple to worship Crowley. So we know holy's going to rhyme with Crowley. We know that for a fact. And we also know that when he used to introduce himself, he used to tell people, it's pronounced Crowley to remind you that I'm holy, but my enemies say Crowley and wish to treat me foul. So he used to make a joke about it when he met people, too. So I think that, again, it's the Americanized way of saying it. If you're anybody from the UK state, it's always Crowley.

They know it. That's where he's from. He's from Britain. So I think that's one of the things that I really wanted to nail down. I believe the film even starts out with me prefacing it with that piece of the poem because it's very important to the message that we're trying to give in that film. Yeah. And I think that the more you dive into these,

topics with Crowley and stuff, the more little pieces you uncover that actually, I guess, pulls back the curtain more on who the man was and what he really was all about. You know, like it wasn't a good dude, wasn't a good dude for many reasons. But like you said about the whole idea of, you know, the Christian umbrella is just Satanist. And it's like, yes, 100% good job on that test, but there's way more to this man than just a Satanist. Like he was, he had his fingers on a lot of things. And it honestly, and I'm sure you'd probably agree with me, it probably played a big role as to why we still talk to him about him today. Like when, ever since that film, because I knew you were talking about behind the scenes and stuff,

the more you start sharing with me, the more I looked at Crowley as more of an idea than a person. like an all-encompassing idea of a human being. Like, it's like there is, it depends on what day of the week is what you were going to get with him. Right. And the less I look at him as, oh, he's the Satanist. He's like, yes. But depending on what day of the week it is, he might be that double agent or triple agent. He might be the Secret Society, Mason.

There's a lot of different angles to this guy. So I guess where do we go from here? I mean, where are we going to go as far as like how do we want to break down who Crowley was outside of the Satanist angle? Well, I definitely want to talk about what caused him to make that really hard turn when he was younger. Let's do that, yeah. Made him really despise Christianity because there was a big moment in his life that really changed that course. And when I read about that and I see it, I can see how that will change anybody, how that, you know, when I do research on different people throughout history or even people that are around now, right, especially if they have ideologies that are different than mine or especially if they're doing things that I would consider evil, right? I try to understand what got that person to that point because we're all human.

And there's this idea that people, when they go so far, they've lost humanity, which I don't think that's true. I do think that God is willing to take us back with whatever. And I think that that's absolutely true in the Bible. We've seen, you know, some of the characters in the Bible, do some of the most despicable things. David. Of course, yeah. King David, man. He's probably one of the worst.

For sure. But if you think about it, all these people have done these things. And when I start looking at these characters, I start realizing that there's this other layer to why they got to where they wanted to. Now, Crowley's interesting because depending on who you talk to, you're going to get a different idea of Crowley. You're going to have the people that don't believe in the occult, the supernatural, they think he's a charlatan. They think that his writings were gibberish. They were the writings of madman. They don't make any sense.

And if you're looking at it from that angle, I can see your point. And I can also see the point of him being a charlatan. I think that was a part of his character. I mean, he was always pulling the mask over his face and letting people see what he wanted them to see. But I also think that leads into another part of him, which was his work for the British intelligence. Pretty much when he left Trinity College in Cambridge all the way until he died, he was working with various organizations. And we'll talk a little bit about that here. And the other part is the occult part.

This is the part that people look at him as the anarchist. They look at him as flipping the bird to Christianity, but not just Christianity, just organized religion, right? He kind of represented that. And I think honestly, if you would have talked to him, he would have despised being called a Satanist. I don't think that was something that he really cared about because he didn't believe in that the same way, right? He enjoyed being called the wicked man on the earth for a while, but as he got older, he actually moved really away from that. He got really entrenched in Buddhism and Taoism and all these different Eastern mysticism. He was really trying to find peace there towards the back end of his career.

He was really trying to step away from being looked at as this evil person. But you got these different writers like Richard B. Spence, who has done tons of writing about him being a secret agent in general and actually reached out to a lot of these different various organizations. And we're going to talk a little bit about that here. Tobias Churton was another one and Richard Krasinski who actually is part of the OTO and he was a big part of who I read before we got deep into the film because we had to go to Detroit and just so people know, we went undercover into a place where some big things happened with Crowley and nobody knew why we were there. We got what we needed and left. But at the end of the day. It'll be shown on video and we're going to be able to represent it the best way we can.

We left. We ran out of there. They were chasing us with their pitchforks. I'm kidding. But no, I totally get it. So I have a question to my mind here that I don't want to sidetrack off of, but you did say it maybe it plays into this, what you're going into. But you mentioned about how towards the end of his life, I don't want to jump over his whole life right now. But towards him in his life, he started having this change where he didn't want to be known as the most evil man in the world and things like that. Do you have any inside perspective as to why that might be, why he wanted to change his perspective? I think he got exhausted with feeling like people were looking at him a certain way. Also, he started releasing more

sound bites about him being a secret agent and being part of British intelligence later on in his career too. Really leading up to 1947 when he died, which was three months after Roswell. which is also very interesting because of him really being the first to give us the modern depiction of a gray alien, which was lamb. And that was during the Amalantra workings, which was in 1918 in New York. I won't talk a little bit about that here too, but that's when he was going into the astral, and he was meeting with this wizard Amalantra there. And this is where the egg imagery comes from. We'll talk about the egg UFO.

That's one of the first images that he saw when he and the story. scarlet woman at the time, Rody Minor, were actually in the astral. So they saw this egg in conjunction with this wizard Amalantra. Was he in the astral when he encountered Lamb? Yes. Really? Yes. Interesting. Okay. And the interesting part about Lamb is there's not much said about him. He never really reveals what he talked to Lamb about. That's never been talked about. All he did was say he met Lamb as a part of these amelotra workings and he drew him and that was pretty much it. That's it. Don't you think that having the picture of Lamb drawn I feel like it's such an important piece of history that I'm not even sure Crowley understood

how important that would play. You know, what are we like 70 some years later? You know, it's like I'm not sure he understood the gravity of drawing lamb and how we would see lamb today and then compare that image to the culture of what we have today and all the people who are encountering lamb-like entities. And then what they're saying when they encounter these lamb-like entities, it's like you start following the rabbit trail. And all of a sudden, you're like, hold on a second. Like we know all the way back in the 40s Crowley drew this entity. that he met apparently in the astral that looks a lot like gray entities.

Anybody who doesn't know what we're talking about, L-A-M, no B on the end, L-A-M, you can find it easily. But it's like, now we have people who are saying, this is what I saw, and we can say, okay, that looks like lamb, and this is what is telling me. And you're like, huh, interesting. You're just starting to see these patterns and how things are lining up in the deceptions

that are trying to take root in our culture. I feel like Lamb is such a key piece to that. And maybe that's why we don't know what exactly was said because in the grand scheme of things, that's not what was needed. It was more of we need the image. Like they need the image. I don't know who they is anyways.

I don't know if it's like if that was a divine thing that God was actually in control of it. It's like, this is as far as it goes or what. But I just feel like on my end of things, when I make certain arguments often, I come back to Lamb. lamb and who brought us lamb you know and and all those those kind of things so um anyways i feel

like we're jumping to the end already so and lamb is interesting because you mentioned that he didn't know the significance when he put that image out there and i don't think he did initially but i do think the back end of his career and maybe that's the cause of his death and i've questioned the cause of his death in conjunction with roswell happening the same year and the fact that he was releasing more and more things that it didn't seem like that he was supposed to be releasing towards the back end of his career. Are you suggesting that he was Kennedy? I'm not the only person that suggested that. So several writers have also suggested that it's very odd that he died within three, four months right after that happened.

So what if Crowley would have came out and said, well, actually, this is a government operation. So one of the things that's talked about Roswell, we'll talk about real quickly before we jump back to Crowley. But with Roswell, there's a lot of different ideas what Roswell is. Some people think that it's a complete government operation. It's government craft. It crashed. It covered that up. Or it was a government sci-up for the crash to fake like they were aliens

and then put the alien imagery in the zeitgeist so that they could trick us in the future when it comes to the threat of alien activity. I would go a step further. I would say that, yes, I think the government was involved, but I don't think that the craft was necessarily government craft. I think that it was more or less whatever these entities were, were a part of this craft, and the crash was meant to happen, and that these entities, whether in conjunction with the government or not,

crash this on purpose to then cause this. influx of technology that we got outside of this. You know, there's been tons of people talk about reversing the technology that happened at Roswell. And then the entities that were captured. We know about the one entity that they had there that was captured for like a year. And then all of a sudden, according to Bill Cooper, just starts talking English one day and said, all right, you know, I'll go ahead and get you to the people. And then they have these meetings behind the scenes, broker these deals.

However, I think that there could have been shadow governments that actually knew what all this was going on to manipulating it. So if you got a guy like Crowley, who has been a part of this whole plan all along, and then it gets down to the back end of his career, and he's seeing this, maybe he's not going to be so quiet anymore. Maybe he doesn't care. And that kind of goes back to what we were saying before. Is there an element of pride in Crowley? He's like, listen, they're going to bury, they're going to hijack this idea, this whole thing. I'm not going to get any credit for it. And it's the pride aspect, right?

And I can kind of back up what you're saying here because it hasn't been released yet, but it will be released before this will be released. I had a guy in here probably about two, three weeks ago. And I can't even go into a great detail about how I met him. But him and I were both at the same event. And it wasn't a secret society meeting, guys. It was a conference. It wasn't an Amway convention either.

But he is one of three guys leading an entire organization that is infiltrating groups. Let's just put it that way. They're all former, like, higher-end military guys. Like, he was special forces. And the three guys that are leading it are all Christians. And I think that the whole motivation behind it was to really do some research, dig, and find out what's going on here. and they can't like it's not like the government well I'm sure the government does commission such groups to do but um they did it on their own and they started making connections within uh people

within people in our government and started talking to them about what they're finding you know people they deemed safe to talk to and um one of the things that he said uh in my first phone call with him and the team is emphatically they all agree on this that uh, uh, they believe that what we're dealing with is technology coming from another realm that it was sourced and created by fallen angels. And I had to kind of get them to clarify that on the phone call. I said, are you guys talking about fallen angel with technology? And there's a bit of a pause.

And it was just like, yes. I almost like they weren't sure because I don't think they listened to the show a whole lot. And they're just like, how deep can we go with this guy as far as weird goes? But they're like, yes. And they said, these crashes that we're having, they said, are happening. And those claiming that we're shooting down these craft out of the sky, that is happening. But it's by design. They discovered that the more they looked into it, they realized that these crafts,

this technology is being gifted to humans for advancement in our own technology. and it takes you right back to the original idea of, like, the book of Enoch, where, like, the fallen angel teaching humans things that they weren't meant to know how to do. This is part of that program. This is modern day roll out of it. And so sometimes they crash them. Sometimes they allow them to be shot down. But this is an exchange program that this is more me talking than them, I think.

I think they might agree with me. But an exchange program from my perspective that is, mutually agreed upon within segments of our own leadership and governments around the world and this other side. Not everybody. Like, you know, this person that was in here, I can't even say his name. Like, we just call him the person on the recording. But it was like, he doesn't want to say certain people's names and say that they're being nefarious or malicious. He doesn't believe that. But he believes that there is this grand, scheme and play on this whole thing. And it just takes you right back down to the basic level,

the bottom level of this, which is what we got on to anyways, which is the Crowley and lamb connection idea. It's like this is not something new. This is something that's been around for a very long time beyond Crowley. Like this is something that this is a game plan that's been constantly rolled out through the millennia, just having different faces, different names, different tools of operation. And it's just, it's wild when you start looking at all the stuff. and you just start realizing that, like, truly, it's not just one thing. A lot of this stuff, it's a lot of this stuff, and it's a lot that's connected in its own way. Yeah, absolutely.

And I believe that Crowley was cultivated from childhood. And I think that he was definitely spotted out by whatever entities that they knew that, hey, this is the guy that we need to push. You know, sometimes you find the guy that's right, what you're looking for. And Crowley was very intelligent. I mean, he excelled in Cambridge. As a matter of fact, when he first got there, he didn't because he was so bored because he was just so smart. And he just didn't care for a while. And then he started finding his niche when it came to the occult.

And his original idea when he went to Cambridge was to be a diplomat. And he ended up swerving from that. And we'll get to that in a second. I do want to talk about him as a child and why that he went there. So he was born in 1875 and his dad, Edward and his mom, Emily, and they were what I would consider Victorian middle class. Everybody thinks he came from a super wealthy family. I would say the best way to present Victorian middle class would be bottom tier upper class.

So they made money. They had money. And as a matter of fact, when his father did. died if he just would have managed his money correctly, he would never have worth the rest days of his life. Who Crowley? Right. All right.

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to live this crazy high lifestyle. And you got to, you wonder where you got the funding from. And we'll get that out too today because he got tons of funding his whole career where he's just getting mysterious checks constantly. He's traveling everywhere. He hit every place in the world.

And he really moved around with impunity. He really didn't have anybody holding him up anywhere he went, which is really wild. So he's a kid and they were in this community of Quakers, but they weren't Quakers. They were a part of what they call the Plymouth Brethren. And the Plymouth Brethren were this almost cultish offshoot of the Quakers. So they were very doom and gloom, tomorrow, Jesus is coming, it's death. That's how crazy they were. And in most cases, people consider them very cultish. They weren't open-minded. They said that,

the Bible is the only thing will ever read. So it wasn't like they would even look at anything else. It was just the Bible. That's it. And I mean, I guess to some point, I get the idea of the Bible is the word. But the way they took it was to another level. And that ended up killing Crowley's father. because Crowley's father ended up getting this mouth disease. And instead of going to conventional surgery, which he would have been perfectly fine, they would have just cut out whatever it was, from on occasions look like some sort of mouth cancer or something they could have easily taken care of. Well, the Plymouth brethren were like, no, no, no, no, no, no.

God's going to heal you. and we're going to use this speculative electrical method to fix it. No, he died. He straight up died, and Crowley, who was 11 years old, saw all this happen. So he pretty much made a pack with himself that he was going to take down Christianity from that point forward. Not that this needs to be the reason or anything, but do you have any information on how close he was with this dad? Because, I mean, listen, if I, if somebody, if I believe that an organization, organization, a thought process, killed my dad, and we weren't super close, but he was still my dad,

and I loved him, I'd be pretty ticked. Yeah. But I guess maybe it depends on, you know, the closeness. Like, if he was like, like a daddy's boy kind of thing, like that could drive you down some really dark places. He was very close to his father. So they did drive him pretty much to madness. And as he got older when he really got involved in the occult, and he was very tied into

Egyptian, I guess. and Egyptian mythology and really the gods of Egypt. Because if you look at the Lima, the religion that he started, and then, of course, the AA, which is the organization that pushed the Lima, everything was centered around Egyptian gods. Horace. He envisioned himself as Horace. He would call himself Horace many times, you know, Baphomet, many other names. We're going to talk about the fact that he changed his names a lot. That has to do with him working for British intelligence because, you know, depending on where he was, he would use completely different monikers at completely different.

Matter of fact, Richard B. Spence said that if he would have been able to choose the job, he would have been one of the best actors on the planet. Like, he could have literally gone into whatever version of Hollywood was around and become that. He was that good at being able to slip in and out of different personalities. You know, maybe some of that had to do with entities as well, but he was very good at playing into whoever he was around and getting them to believe whatever he wanted them to believe. So he viewed himself as Horace because of his dad dying, and he viewed his dad as Osiris, which was Horace's dad. And he viewed Set, which was Osiris's brother as Christianity.

And Set kills his brother, Osiris, in the myth of the Osiris story. And how it all goes down, ISIS goes and gets the pieces of Osiris and say this the best way on this show without getting too descriptive. She puts together a certain piece of him to inseminate. herself and that creates Horace. That's very good way of putting it. So, right. You're the one that makes the social media context. You're actually, you're looking out for yourself and making your job easier.

Yeah, because otherwise I'd have to do the little B. So Horace becomes the product of that. And he grows up hating set. He never knew his dad. But he grows up hating set because he never got to connect with his dad. Now, obviously, there's different versions of the story. The thing about Egyptian mythology is there'll be 15 different origin stories for a god, right? But that's kind of the centralized theme.

So the way he viewed himself was I'm Horace and I'm getting revenge on Christianity because my father died. Now, because he was driven such madness, his mom ended up despising him. And he and his mom butted heads all the way up until he ended up going to live with his uncle. and his aunt. So that happens later, but she's the one that called him the beast. She used to call him the beast of the apocalypse. Now, imagine if your mom... Because she was still in that, really, in that strong Christian, Quaker, or whatever it was, cult faith thing. Right. Okay. She's literally calling her son. It wasn't Quakers. It was what was it called? Plymouth Brethren. Plymouth Brethren. Right. Okay. So imagine your mom calling you the beast of the apocalypse.

And not doing it jokingly, but she's calling you that. And instead of it making him angry, he just relished in it. And he's like, I'll just become the beast. And that's why he used to sign everything is the B-666,66, the beast. It wasn't necessarily because of this connection to Satan. It was really a middle finger to his mom. Wow. Wow.

He had mommy issues. Big time. I mean, isn't that the story for all these bad guys? It always comes down to having mommy issues. Geez. Thanks, Mom. Tom, really did a number on the world. Calling your son a beast.

That's crazy. And it's really wild. And instead of that, obviously, he starts this religion, Thelima, which is this movement that became this idea of following one's true will. It's all about will. Everybody's heard, do a thou wilt shall be the whole of the long, right? And there's several other phrases that are. used with the Lima as well. But he gets this from writing the book of the law, which the

entity Iowas wrote through him. And this is when he's in Cairo in 1904. And this is when he gets this connection to Iwas who basically moves through him to help him write this book of the law. And from this book of the law creates the religion of the Lima. And that's the basis of everything at that point for him. And then that's where you get like Jack Parsons and Kenneth Grant, all these guys did offshoots of that. And the Lima becomes this massive worldwide thing. And this is all because of his father pretty much being killed by the Plymouth Brethren because they wouldn't just take him to the doctor to get fixed. And then obviously his mom hating him because of that too, which is just super wild. And, you know, as he gets older, the idea of him being this anarchist isn't quite true either

because he played that up. But at the same time, he always had this longing to be this English gentlemen because he craved the spotlight. He craved the adulation. Social circles. Social circles. And as we're going to get into, he's working for British intelligence the whole time.

What better secret agent can you have than the one that's saying I hate the government? Perfect. But at the same time, doing whatever they want. See, Crowley used everything to his advantage. He used the governments to his advantage, all to get his own means. Yeah, he was,

funneling things to the government. He was giving them information. He was helping them out. But all of this was for his own selfish game, too. It was, you scratch my back, I'll scratch your back. And then he's playing double agent, triple agent with other different countries. Yeah. And just to give an offshoot to that point, and I won't go deep down that rabbit hole. I did an entire episode on the Lusitania. But the Lusitania was a freighter that used to bring people to and from the UK to the United States. It would stop other places too, but it was originally built to be a warship and Crowley used to travel on it. Well, when Crowley was in the state during the 1914 to 1919 stretch, and we know this through mainstream

knowledge about Crowley, that he was working with German intelligence in New York. He was working for this paper called Propaganda. What years was this, do you know? So 1914 and 1919 is when he did his stretch in the United States. During that period of time, he works for Germany. Wow. But here's the best part. This is pre-Hitler. It's getting to that.

Wow. When you get to, this is pre-World War I. So at the time, it's ramping up overseas. World War I is getting close to culminating. We've got all kind of friction going on all around the world. The one country that's not getting involved is the United States. So the UK wants the United States to be a part of the Allies. So Crowley is in bed with the Germans.

Or that's what mainstream will tell you, right? But in actuality, he's a double agent working for British intelligence. And what he's doing, he is funneling the Germans info to push them to, in the propaganda papers, which he helped write for, by the way, to make the Americans angry at the Germans. He's basically telling the Germans the flex on America because they ain't nothing. Really, what he's doing is he's trying to incite the Americans to join the war because British just tell them to do this.

Not only that, he is funneling info about the Lusitania to the Germans saying that they have weapons on board. So now they have a U-boat waiting close to the U-K where it's going to come dock. He's got this whole thing set up through British intelligence to win the Lusitania goes to the U-K. This U-boat hits them with torpedo, blows up, kills all these Americans on it. And that was one of the biggest catalysts to drag the United States into World War War So Crowley was actually one of the biggest catalyst to start World War I in bringing the U.S. into it because he was a double agent working with British intelligence. And check this out. What were the Germans really into?

The occult. Think about it. The Uber Minch. So they were into the cult well before Hitler came out of Israel. Wow. Wow. That's wild. And just think about a guy who is that well adept into the mystery schools and alchemy and the occult.

And he can come in there and showcase all these things. They believe him. And they don't even think he's working for British intelligence. This is the best part. But here's the other part. He doesn't get extradited by the U.S. Nothing happens to Crowley. He's still just kicking it in the States.

Okay. So, so I'm trying to do mental judgment. gymnastics is keeping up with this. So he's a double agent, or he's an agent for the UK, living in the States, talking to the Germans from the States. Working for the Germans. Working for the Germans in the States. The U.S. were trying to prosecute him through the British, but then through that, the British don't because he's working for him. And then he's got the U.S. over the barrel, too, because of all these other things he's involved with, because from all He's also working with the U.S. on some things.

So he's just playing everybody, and that's why he just never gets hit. Did he ever officially work for, what would be the OSS, I suppose, before CIA? So here's the thing about when Crowley started in British intelligence. And we'll definitely get to that here in a second. But when he started with British intelligence, they didn't have what they have now. British intelligence is just British intelligence, and you just had all of these kind of rogue organizations going on in the time in like the late 1800s, early 1900s, you didn't even have MI5, MI6 yet.

You just had these rogue organizations that a lot of times didn't even know each other. Sometimes they'd be having the same goal, but they'd be working against each other because they didn't even know who was on what team. That's wild. Yeah. That's before all got centralized, right? And it's kind of that way in the U.S. too, because until you really got until the point of the CIA. I mean, obviously, you've got Hoover and you've got the FBI and all these

organizations that start coming out around the 1940-ish, 50-ish when all this stuff starts happening. It was a lot of that. A lot of very undercover groups that people don't really know about, and a lot of them didn't even know each other. And I think that's why a lot of this stuff started getting centralized because they were budding heads with each other, not even realized they had the same goal. but he was part of that like early group, early group. Wow. Right. So he goes to Cambridge.

And the reason why he ends up in Cambridge is because his uncle, Jonathan Crowley, and Aunt Annie, who he was very close to, that was what he considered his surrogate mother. He used to say that that's my real mom, not my real mom, Aunt Annie. Well, interesting thing about Aunt Annie, she was a part of what they called the Primrose League. And the best way to explain the Primrose League, they were like a Protestant secret society. So they would operate within the Protestant church and work through politics. Wow.

So Annie was a part of that. But also, who was a part of that was Lord Salisbury, Robert Gascon Cecil. Now, he's very important because he was a three-time prime minister of the UK. and he also helped run British intelligence. So how did Crowley get into Cambridge? Well, that's because of Jonathan Crowley and Aunt Annie helped him get into Cambridge. She is part of the Primrose League with Lord Salisbury. Salisbury is recruiting guys out of Cambridge to be part of British intelligence.

So all this ties in together because Crowley has got the connections because of family. but he's also really smart and he's questioning going into becoming a diplomat for British government. He already had in his mind he wanted to work for British government. People don't know that. People thought he was just an anarchist out of the gate. No, he was never that way.

He always respected the British. He, to this, till the day he died, respected bringing British. Wow. Wow. So do you feel like this, his whole life, the way his whole life went. Like you referenced it earlier about the idea of the entities and everything. Do you feel like everything that he did throughout his life was the perfect storm?

Or do you think the storm was engineered by darker entities that just saw him as the useful idiot? I used the word idiot very loosely. He was not an idiot. But like the useful person to funnel this agenda through. Does it make sense? Like, was he? I've questioned that a lot myself. I would probably lean more towards that it was manufactured by entities.

Okay. And probably in conjunction with governments, he had the name value, right? He had the connections, kind of out the gate. That's kind of how he got into Trinity College in Cambridge was because of the connections. He was really smart, so he belonged there. But... I believe that the way his father died, the way that turned him into feeling the way he did about Christianity, because he wasn't into the occult until he ended up in Trinity College.

So this wasn't like he was doing all these occult things as a child all the way up until he went to college. No, he wasn't doing any of that at the time. Oh, so she didn't start calling him the beast until later. No, she called him that when he was a kid because he was just so unruly. Wow. Okay. Wow. Had nothing to do with the occult.

She just called him that because she couldn't stand it. Jeez. Pick different words, mom. Jeez. My gosh. Let this be a lesson to all your mom's out there. Don't call your kid the beast, okay? Unless he's a beast on the basketball court or something like that.

Right. Geez. Wow. She just set his life up like that. Man. I mean, every man's decisions are his own. Right. Like, there are things.

that contribute to us becoming who we are in life. And see, when you said that, I thought that you were saying that mom called the beast because of his dabblings, she called him the beast, and then he leaned into dabblings later. So he was just struggling with this concept of this church that he blamed for his dad's death. Yeah. And his mom's utmost devote loyalty to it even after dad's death. And there's probably a real internal struggle.

Right. And then because he's unruly, she's calling him the beast because of that, not ever considering the fact that I'm creating something that will be embraced as the beast. Well, you got to think he went to church, even up until the point he went to go live with his uncle and his aunt. I mean, they were deep into the church. Wow. So he was still going to church up until he went to college. It's just when he went to college, he had more freedom to really, like, study the things that he found interesting.

And it's funny because Trinity College talks about him and they say that he was brilliant. And for three years, he was sporadically showed signs of crazy intelligence, but he was generally unmotivated. And going back on it, they said more like he was unchallenged. That's just how smart he was. He just didn't really vibe with a lot of this stuff going on at school.

I mean, he did well enough, but that really wasn't why I think he was, and I mean, he's cultivated there. I think that you've got Lord Salisbury there who's looking for guys who can work for British Intelligence. They're looking for guys who are amoral, who have no qualms in doing whatever to anybody. And the other thing, we're talking about doing whatever to anybody, proly developed a high interest in sex while he was in college. Now, the interesting thing about that is Crowley found interest in both sexes.

He was completely bisexual. We knew that throughout his entire career. And think about that. How good of a double agent, triple agent could you be if you can integrate in with anybody, anything, anywhere? Yeah. And coupled with the fact that he gets. so deep into the occult and understands it to now it's like, oh, wait a minute, we can take this guy, put him in secret societies to keep tabs on guys who we want to see what they're doing when

it comes to government operations. Because I'm going to talk about here in a minute, the Golden Dawn, and what, from the inside, what he disrupted for British intelligence, because they would send him into these secret societies. knowing that some of these guys had goals that were against their government, well, let's just send our guy in. He knows everything they know. He can operate just like them, and he can just move it to the side or feed us information,

and then we can either stop whatever we need to stop, or we can change the course of it. It was the perfect storm, plus I think it was all a manufactured storm. Jeez. So I knew about the college years and the sexual escapades because I don't reference it a lot, but I have referenced it before about the idea that he didn't view sex as for pleasure. At all. Like it was like, it was a documentary.

I think I forwarded to you as well. I found it really interesting. The guy said that it's like he disdained people who had sex just to have sex. It was like there had to be a darker, deeper reason for it. And that mindset,

is that what led him, I say led him loosely into like, I don't care what I'm having sex with. It's just, in the, moment the sex is for a purpose. It's a sexual, sex magic. Or was it that he entered into this lifestyle situation with those sexual proclivities? I think he experimented and explored in college,

but I think as he, naturally. Naturally. But I think as he got into the occult, I think it changed. And I think by the time he got out of Trinity College when he started joining these secret societies, like the Golden Dawn and Freemasonry, which oddly enough, Freemasonry, he had an on again, off again, love-hate relationship with, depending on where he was at. He really butted heads with the Freemasons in the United States

because they wouldn't push him to the 33rd. Talk about that. Because he went to Mexico, right? So he goes to Mexico and actually becomes a 33rd there when he's down in Mexico. But when he's in the United States, he ends up button heads with guys specifically in Detroit. who don't want to move him into the 303rd.

So that's when he is trying to bring the Ordo Templi Orientis over to the U.S. for the first time. And he's trying to set the OTO up in Detroit. So he looks at that as the answer to not only Freemasonry, but Theosophy, which at the time he despised because it was nothing like Helena Bovotsky had set up from the beginning when she first created it, which he totally respected that version of Theosophy. He just thought it was a more watered down version by the time he got to the same. States. So he's trying to set up this OTO in Detroit as the answer to all of that. So basically, when he gives these rituals out, the Freemasons are so mad because they're like, well, this is a lot like what we do. You can't be doing these rituals like we do. So Crowley gets super mad and his spiritual son, C.S. Jones, who is kind of his proxy in Detroit. And not that Crowley wasn't moving in

and out of Detroit, too, but like C.S. Jones was living there. And so basically he really, he rewrite some of the rituals to then bring some of those Freemasons over to build this OTO, which ends up falling apart. And Parsons ends up picking up later when Crowley's still alive, but going his way out, right? So that was the beef that he had specifically with the United States version of Freemasonry. But he always kind of looked at Freemasonry as what I've always said it is. It's kind of the gateway drug. It's not really the version of secret societies that everybody's looking to get to.

As a matter of fact... Well, not everybody. Right. Well, and the thing is, with Freemasonry, to really be in the know, you've got to be in that, like, 0.0s or 1% of Freemason. You've got to really be at that upper echelon version of that. But sometimes it's just getting into freemasonry to get into one of these other houses or get access to another version of a secret society. And at the time when he joined the Golden Dawn, which we'll talk. about in a minute. That's kind of the deal. The governments were looking for him to infiltrate

these other more exclusive secret societies as opposed to Freemasonry because Freemasonry just wasn't cutting it. It was more of a social club at that point. Now, when he went to Mexico, it was very important that he joined Freemasonry there because of who was involved there. And we'll talk about that in a minute. Who was a part of Freemasonry there? And that helped broker. deals for the British back in the UK. Okay. So where do we go from here then? So he's in college and one of his first missions, which from all accounts we can tell is

kind of his first mission. It was what we assume Lord Salisbury had sent him out just to see if he could pull something off, right? So he is a expert mountain climber, by the way. He used to climb the Alps all the time. So Crowley is just a, dude, I'm telling you, Crowley is... What a weird man. Like, super weird.

But I also lend the fact... Jack of all. Right. But I also lend the fact that his infatuation with the mountains would also lend to the occult, too, because you go to these high places to meet what? Yeah. Meat beans in these high places. So in 1897, he decides that he's not going to go scaling the Alps. And this out of nowhere, he ends up in St. Petersburg, Russia.

and he says it's to improve his Russian. And he, at the time, this is when he said he was going to be a part of the diplomatic service of the British. So it makes sense. Oh, he's just going to learn Russian, you know, he's going to be a diplomat, right? So he goes there when Zarr Nicholas II is in power. And he says some interesting things about when he went there, which keys us off in the fact that maybe he was there for an intelligence gathering or he was trying to gather. intelligence from whatever was going on with the Russians at the time. We don't know what information he was gathering. But he said when he went there, and he's talking specifically about

going there to learn Russian, and one thing about Crowley, you have to know, everything he writes is layered. It's got layers upon layers upon layers. And even the gibberish that you think that you're reading, where some people say, oh, it's just the ravings of a madman. When you dig through it, it's not meant for you or me to understand. It's meant for the initiate. It's meant for the initiate of the mystery schools to understand what that is. And I would go a step further. Some of it's not even meant for them. It was meant for intelligence agencies to understand what he was trying to tell them. So Crowley spoke in riddles all the time. One of his most famous book, the Book of Lies, is literally a book of lies. That's the point of it. It's just a bunch of lies, but the truths are hidden within the lies. Wow. Wow. I didn't realize it. How big is that book? How complex? complex is that book? Is it, like, is it a book that he wrote for that purpose to, to relay messages to different groups and organizations to understand? And within that book, he's speaking to several different groups and they all have the, basically, the code to be able to decipher. Is that kind of like how it worked? So back in my day of following the occult,

going down those roads. Get out. Get out. So that, was my very first Crowley book I ever bought. Okay. Because before I even read the book of the law, which is the most famous book, was the book of lies. And I remember I went to the bookstore, I ordered it, and I brought it home. I read it. I had no clue what this guy was talking about. I think I remember, like, a couple things where I said, I think I know what he's saying there,

but I have no idea, because it just felt like gibberish. It just didn't feel very, you know, it didn't connect with me. But then as I got older, and I'm going back and I'm reading through it, And I'm also looking at commentary that people are talking about it. Oh, he's talking to a lot of different people. He's talking specifically to people in the mystery schools because he's telling them what they need to do, what kind of drugs they should take to connect with these entities. He's talking about the sex magic, the type you should be using to get in contact with said entities. And that was something that he did throughout.

And in the levers that he wrote, a lot of them had hidden verbiage, hidden language within it too. So this all lends back to his early days in becoming a part of British intelligence. And like I said, he's over here in Russia. And one of the things he said was the subtlety of intrigue has always fascinated me. Now, what does that have to do about learning Russian during that time? What is he doing over there? And that was one of the lines that a lot of the historians have said that that was Crowley doing his classic flex that he did. He's just letting me know, like, yeah, I'm over here doing something.

You'll never know what I exactly mean by this. But that was really his first foray into a secret mission for British intelligence. And I believe that was more of a test run, right? Let's see how you do. You know, you say you want to be a diplomat cool. He's probably talking to Lord Salisbury behind the scenes. Salisbury's like, listen, we're going to send this guy out and just see if he can pull this off. Well, clearly, it went pretty well because when he comes back, he actually decides

that he's not going to be a diplomat anymore. And he just wants to follow the occult. It's like, wow, like, that's a big switch from, I want to work for the government to, I don't really care about the government anymore. Okay, so up to that point, was he pursuing occultic things at all? Dabbling, but he hadn't even really got that hardcore

until after that particular mission. So something happened on that mission that pushed him over the edge with it. Do we know what that was? Oh, no. And that's the thing, man. Coley's got so many gaps in his life that we just, it's like a puzzle that you'll never be able to put the full thing together. Even his diaries, like his main diary that the book, The Confessions is built off his diaries. What's it called? Confessions. Really? Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that when I named the show, guys. Just relax. So there will be massive gaps where it would be like three months missing here. And all of a sudden, he just picks up and starts talking about something. Like, oh, I'm over here doing this. What? What happened here? What's going on? Or even in, and you have to take this in account, too. Being a secret agent, if you're writing in a diary, you're going to have in your mind who else might pick this up. You're going to write that in layers too, because if the wrong people pick that up, you don't want them to know exactly what you're doing. Sure. Possibly the reason why he left a lot of gaps in there. Possibly the reason why some of it sounds like really.

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Some exclusions apply. See site for details. So when he gets back from that trip, he really starts going down this trail of occultism. And one of the big books was the book of Black Magic and Pax by Arthur Edward Waite that he picked up. He actually is so infassinated with that he reaches out to wait. And Waite responds to him and tells him to take a look at the cloud, which was written by Carl von Eckerthausen. And Eckerthausen studied at the Jesuit University of Adam White. And Adam Weisop is the guy who started the Bavarian Illuminati, the Illuminati, the First Illuminae. So the question is, how much of that did Crowley know?

He's a smart guy. I'm sure that he tracked that back to what that was. And he's very, at this point, fascinated, fascinated with secret societies. So at this point, he's done with college. He's out of college, and he's decided, from all intents and purposes, I'm going to chase mystery schools, the occult. I'm going to climb mountains. I've got this money still for my family, and I'm just going to live life. It's pretty much what he does. Of course, he's writing, he's doing all these things. What his first plunge really into secret societies is the golden

dawn. And how he gets in the golden don is really interesting. And on the surface level, it sounds normal. I met said person, said person I get to talking. And said person says something about secret society, and I ask him about it. We talked for a while. He introduces me, and then I go through a series of initiations, and I end up getting in, right? That's typical. But you have to look deeper into how he got into this. So he ends up on a climbing expedition.

He goes to Switzerland. And one evening, he's at a lodge. And he starts talking real loud, talking about alchemy, real loud. And Julian Baker, who is a chemist, and he's a practicing alchemist, a side note, most of Crowley's friends, even within secret societies or just close friends he kept around, were chemists or pharmacists. There's a reason for that that he kept chemists and pharmacists on deck all the time because he had access to hallucinogenics like peyote and extracts that he was able to use

because he liked to use those things as a catalyst to connect to these entities. because it would tear down these walls and open himself up to being able to connect to these entities. You'll find that as a common theme. I encourage anybody that just wants to read about Crowley, anybody he's connected to, go and track and see what they did for a living.

Probably a chemist. Probably a pharmacist. So Julian Baker is no different. And he overhears Crowley talking loudly about alchemy. And he's like, hey, I'm an alchemist. And as a matter of fact,

as Crowley starts talking to him, way better alchemist than Crowley ever was. So he takes Crowley to the side. He starts instructing him, starts working with him. And he ends up telling Crowley that he's part of the hermetic order of the Golden Dawn. Now, the Golden Dawn was a secret society. And it was started by Samuel Liddell Mathers, Mathers, Robert Woodman. But Samuel Liddell Mathers is the most important because that's the one that he was the most connected to, and that's the one he wants to get to. And eventually, because of him getting tight with Baker, Baker introduces him to Samuel Liddell Mathers. And Mathers is important because he wrote a book called Book of Abramel and the Mage. Now, Abramelon the Mage is an important book

because of the Abramela, sorry, the Abramelan workings that he was trying to achieve what he called the 30 athers. Now the 30 athers are the Anokian athers from John D. and Edward Kelly that they performed. He wants to be able to perform these 30 athers. If he can complete the 30 athers, then he has achieved this level of what he called samadhi, which he would take various drugs to get into samadhi, but like this would take him to that next level. It would define him as a secret chief. Now, the secret chiefs are just what the hermetic order of the Golden Dawn would refer to as what theosophy called the Mahatmas, what some people call the Great White Brotherhood, what you and I might call grace, what you and I might call these ascended masters, ties right into what people are talking about now with Christ's consciousness, that if you can level up enough, you can become a Christ. It's narcissism at its root core. that we don't need a savior. We can save ourselves.

We are in this matrix. And if we can achieve enough selflessness by killing the ego enough, then we can get past the demiurge, which is guarding the pleroma, which would be best way to say is like heaven, actual heaven, right? Get past the demiurge.

and move into this next level where we meet the Divine Feminine and we meet the monad, which is the real God, because the fake god's actually Yahweh and he's the demiurge. He's trying to block us out. Nazicism has got so many different avenues,

but it's all tied into this. You know, Crowley had what he called the Gnostic Mass East reform. All these guys are highly, highly connected to narcissism. And that's why that I speak so much in my show about narcissism because it's such a corruption of what Christianity is supposed to be,

and they sell it as real Christianity. They sell it as the suppressed version of Christianity that Roman Catholicism tried to snuff out. They're not wrong to a point, because the Roman Catholics did fight with a lot of these Gnostic groups, like the Cathars, the Manichaeans, all these different groups, but in reality, when you really dig

the Gnostic puppet masters behind the scenes, these occultists were playing both of them. them. They were playing the Roman Catholics, and they were playing this side, and they were trying to make it look like that the Gnostics had the real knowledge by having them wiped out. But the best part is these guys that were puppeteering on the Roman Catholic side were Gnostics, too. They were just integrated within the church. You got groups like Priory of Sion, and you've got groups like the Templars, and all of these different groups that were over here that were actually working with these guys over here behind the scenes. So it's like, I try to put this in terms that

people can understand now because we look at history, we don't think about it like history is now when it actually operates the same way. Back then, there were religious wars, and it was built on religion. The wars were. Now it's built geopolitically differently, right? We don't look at it. It's like, well, we're fighting over this religion. We're fighting this other country over this religion. But it operates the same way. We've still got the same puppet masters behind the scenes, playing both sides, garnering money because of these wars. Well, the same thing was happening back then. The catalyst was just religion.

So it's just different launching pads? Different launching pads. But the problem is people get highly invested in religion now. So they will look at specifically the Cathars and the Aboriginesian Wars as the Cathars getting wiped out because they had the real truth. and the Roman Catholic Church had the fake truth. Not wrong on some points because the guys running the Roman Catholic the church at the time weren't good, but real Christianity at the core started before all of that.

That was back with Judaic Christianity and Pauline Christianity. This is back when Paul, Peter, and James were working together. Now, the Gnostics will have you believe that James was actually a part of this group called the Essines and they were protecting the actual bloodlines of Jesus, and this is where you get all these Marevincian bloodlines and all that, whole different rabbit hole. But that's just how Gnosticism is at the root core.

But Gnosticism is tied into all of these groups, and Crowley being one of the top ones. And they totally adhere to a lot of these Gnostic ideas because it is to them about killing the ego. But the funny thing is about all these guys that scream killing the ego, they're not actually killing the ego. Their pride is making them believe that they can become a God,

the more do they kill the ego. So really, they're not killing the ego. They're enhancing their ego by believing that they can actually become a God. Yeah. It's basically, it's like a vicious circle. It's a cycle. Vicious cycle. The idea of killing the ego to become a God to feed your ego.

And it's crazy to think about because, it's sold, especially now, when you're looking at all the New Age movement that's going on with the Starseed movement. Everybody's got a piece of alien DNA in them, right? You've got people that believe that they have these special powers because of that. You have people that believe they have R.H. negative blood. That means they either have Nepheline blood or the bloodline of Jesus in them. That's why they have these powers. And I'm not saying there aren't weird things that surround things.

like the R.H. negative blood type. But at the end of the day, it's one thing to look into it, but it's another thing to use that as a catalyst of why I'm special. Because of social media now, everybody tries to find a reason why they're specifically special. When in actuality, we're all special. Especially when we follow Christ, we're made new. We're all special in his eyes. None of this stuff matters when it comes down to that at the root core. And it's such a simple concept, but everybody tries to oversimplify it so much, Tony. It's crazy. Yeah.

It's like a hijacking of sorts for sure. Oh, and it is. And to get to why I brought the Golden Dawn, right? This is the interesting part. You know when I talked about how British intelligence would send Crowley in to disrupt certain things. Well, Crowley goes into... the Golden Dawn, and he realizes that some of these guys are part of this group called the Jacobites. And what they're trying to restore is the House of Stewart to the Thrones of England, Scotland, and Ireland.

Now, the House of Stewart's interesting. I've been doing tons of research on the supposed bloodlines of Jesus, and the House of Stewart's a huge part of that because they are protecting these bloodlines. So to put them back on these thrones is very important to these people. So the Jacobites are part of that. And quite a few of these Jacobites were in the Golden Dawn. So they are part of this group that's trying to, because of these secret chiefs, these entities that are telling them, because the thing about the Golden Dawn is that's their real leaders or the secret chiefs. Now, like Samuel Del Mathers and some of them would refer to themselves as secret chiefs, but they weren't the actual secret chiefs.

They weren't these Mahatmas. They weren't these entities, these what we would say, great. or aliens or whatever, right? They weren't the entities really guiding the force here. These are these secret chiefs. So they're guiding the Golden Dawn to do all these things, but also politically, because ultimately they want to get these bloodlines in the thrones in certain places. Now, another part of that would be these Carlists, and the Carlists were connected to the Jacobites because they wanted to, in Spain, make sure they had a Don Carlos

on the throne. So at the time, there was a Don Carlos II, but he wasn't on the throne, and they wanted to create a coup and put him on the throne. So it gets crazy. So you've got Samuel O'Dell Mathers and all of these other guys in the Golden Dawn,

and they're funneling guns. They're funneling all this weaponry to Spain secretly on these ships to fund this coup. For Don calls the second to take over, again, it's all about the bloodlines. It's all about putting people with bloodlines in power because that's the occult nature of it at the core, right? What the entities want, what these secret chiefs want.

We have to get to these. And I would suggest Nephylene bloodlines, something that's not of this world, obviously, but obviously something that's not good. So we're going to have to probably go down that rabbit hole of these nephylene bloodlines, something negative. So as a part of this, and this will let you know how crazy trained that Krolo's. was because you don't think about Crowley this way when you see him. But one of the things he wrote was how that he obtained a commission to work a machine gun. He took pains to make himself a first class rifle shot study drill tactics and strategy. This dude's a legit secret agent. He could take you down. So this dude's literally like, hey, I will infiltrate any way possible.

I'll have sex with you to get where I need to get to. I'll just kill you. if I need to. I'll act like I'm this. I'm one of the best actors on the planet. And he's connected to these entities all at once. And that's the fascinating thing with Crowley. He's so multifaceted. Like when he walked in a room, that's why he was so engaging. He just took up the space because he could just piss you off and then attract you at the same time. He was good for it. And that's why he was chosen. I think at an early age, long before he got to Trinity College to play this role as the secret agent. So we were talking about those guns getting funneled. I just broke up right that little piece about him being trained. He talks about being trained during this

period of time. So the personal yacht of Ashburnham and he was one of the other guys that's part of connected to the Golden Don. He's not really part of it. But he works with these government entities who are trying to get these Carlos on the throne, right? Don Carlos is second trying to put him on the throne. So he's got this personal. yacht called the Firefly, and this is, he's sending guns down through his personal yacht. So on the last leg of the third gun running trip, it runs into trouble at this French port. It's picked up. It gets nailed.

The whole operation's D.O.A. at this point, done, right? So Crowley comes out and says, after that, the conspiracy was disclosed. He just says that, I somehow, like the info got out. I don't know how. Well, if you look at the list of the crew members, there was a C. Alexander on the crew members. It's one of Crowley's aliases, one of his secret agent aliases. So he's funneling the info to the British the whole time telling what they're doing.

He infiltrated to literally disrupt the Carlist and the House of Stewart at the same time because he's working for the British government all the while playing the guys that are in the Golden Dawn. and during this time, even afterward, they still don't know he did it. Wow. Wow. So with all the double agent moves that this guy made, did he ever, because it seems like he's very loyal to England, to the UK. Did he ever waver off those commitments and do things that could hurt them out of selfish ambitions? Not that we know of.

Now, the British played that they were angry about the German situation when he was working with, the Germans. Yeah. That was just a ruse. They never indicted him. He never got in trouble. And there were plenty of other secret agents that were playing double agents at the time that did get in trouble, at least on face value with the British government. But wasn't when he was messing with the Germans, that was to get the United States in the war, right?

Oh, yeah, but they were allies with the UK. And the UK didn't want the United States in the war? No, he did. They did. So the goal was to put Crowley in with the Germans. So why would they get mad at them about it, though? You know? On face value, they had to act like they were mad.

Oh, I got you. Okay. So you're saying, why is he over there doing that? But in reality, they weren't. Right. Yeah, I got you now. That's why he never got in trouble. Yeah.

Wow. Okay, so, I mean, he was loyal to the crown, essentially. Very loyal to the crowd even until the end. Gotcha. And that's one thing that always, I love. laugh about when people look at Crowley is this big anarchist. You look at musicians,

celebrities, many of them will quote Crowley. I remember back in the day when Jay-Z had that shirt do without will, and that was a big deal, because that was in that big Illuminati craze, and he busted that shirt out, and you're like, yeah, of course he did. But that's why

they looked to him. Even the Beatles had him on their cover. And it's wild because he's looked at as anarchist, but a whole time, he's straight up England through and through, and he's all about the government, at least to get his own ends. And I do think the one piece that nobody's really put together that I've been putting together over the past three years is, yeah, you've got all these people talking about him being a secret agent, you got all these people talking about him being

a part of the cult. You got all of these missions that he went on. But the one thing that I keep going to is if the government that we know of now and we know of them talking about UFOs, you know about them talking about interdimensional beings now that are calling them, we have tons of undocumented stories, you know, from people saying that they're in contact with entities, what was Crowley's role in that? Because if Crowley's ultimate goal, which was always to get in contact with these praet or humans, and essentially try to join them to get this power. You don't think the government was pushing him to do that?

Think about it. Why wouldn't they be? So they at the root were involved in the same things. Yeah. I absolutely think so. And the more I've dug, the more I keep uncovering all of these weird trails about his connection with entities. and the government operations being right there. That's interesting.

That's interesting. So it wasn't like he was a solo act on his own, just doing his own thing. There was, he was probably, probably even receiving instruction on next moves. Absolutely. And think about he lived the high life,

most of his life. There were times where he would complain about being broke, but then you get a giant shack. And then he's running around doing something else. That was his sign of saying, broke, better feed the beast or else the beast is going to turn.

And after this whole Golden Don fiasco, he's still playing it up like he's part of them. Now he's playing it. Well, I'm going to go to the U.S. I'm going to see what I can set up there. That's kind of his game

that he's playing with the Golden Don. Again, Golden Don has no really idea. Outside of the fact, he's got friction with plenty of the guys in the group over the years and it kept getting worse and worse, because Crowley's Crowley, man. He's just, he's got no allegiance to anybody at all. That's it.

You know, he had certain people who was close to for good periods of time, and then they would fall out at some point. And he basically not alone, you know, at the end of the day. It wasn't like he had all of these people. You know, it's the classic story of chasing the image of being this icon, right? And at the end, just, that's, crazy to me. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure there was plenty of people that fit that bill. Yeah. You know, I mean, he came across so many people and certainly it wasn't all people that that were of the same mind.

I mean, there was plenty of Christians that came across his path that might have just took a step back and let him pass by. That, and I do think that there is a certain level of initial, reactionary moment where if you know that somebody's involved in something that's demonic and especially if they're being super loud and anti what you believe that there's an opportunity for you to react in that the wrong way to become angry you're attacking my lord you're attacking Christ, which I don't think that part's wrong to feel protective of who we look to as our Savior. But I also look at the way that Jesus reacted to those who came against him and how he was

the complete opposite of that and how that he always extended with love and compassion to people. And I think that that's something that I'm trying to. to do more of. And maybe this is just more of me venting and how that I'm also continually working on myself to be able to connect to people even deeper who aren't necessarily Christian, who hopefully I can help with my story and things I've been through and things that I talk about because I think that we all should look for those pockets, those areas that we can to help whoever we can around us.

Yeah. I agree. I mean, you, well, everybody has their own missions field, I suppose, is the word, best way to put it. Like, everybody has their own life stories and directions that make them a qualified candidate to speak to somebody else's life, you know? We don't need to rehash your life story, but, like, you have a very specific life story that does qualify you to speak to people coming out of this kind of stuff. maybe they're in it now, you know? And you also have a unique background where it's like, yeah, you come out of that, but you're also the son of a pastor.

So like you've walked both sides of the line, you know. And I've seen the shift in your life since I've met you. And so it's like if there's, if there's not a whole lot of people I think that fit your bill when it comes to being able to have that life. experience to speak to people, you know, because it's like, oh, you know, shouldn't be a Satanist. That's bad. It's like, okay, why should I listen to you? Right. You know? Especially when you're talking about some of these occult groups, they're going to laugh at you. I'm not a Satanist. I hate that stuff. I don't believe in Satan. Yeah. That's exactly what they're going to say.

Yeah. Because their entire structure, hierarchy of belief system, has nothing to do with the Bible on either side. Mm-hmm. Completely different. Yeah. So when you look at it that way, I think there needs to be people that are qualified to talk to people like that who understand those areas of the occult and be able to speak to it intelligently. And I'm going to say everybody's called to do that. No. By any stretch. No. But I do think the cautionary tale is, as Christians, is to understand when you don't know everything about that and not be reaction.

in a way that would cause that person to not want to come to Christ because you're just flying off the handle. And again, man, I'm not saying this because I'm some holier than how a person that's figured it out. I'm just as easily as anybody else to get angry if I see something that I feel like is against Christianity, where I feel like is just absolutely tearing it down from the inside for sure. But I think I'm getting better at noticing that emotion and being able to, okay, God, what do you want me to do with this? Measured responses, right? So it's like, what you always talk about? Yeah. I mean, it's really just stepping outside of the moment and counting the cost of everything. You know, it's just like, eh, would I be justified in

whatever I want to say, yes, but at the end of day, is it going to change anything? No, especially in the spirit that I'm in right now. There's a lot of self-reflective honesty that people need to have with themselves as well on just like where you're at in the moment. And I've never done it perfectly and stuff. But like, for instance, a great example. I had a, I did a, we'll get back to Crowley in a second. But I had a post on Instagram a few weeks ago and some guy hopped in there. I don't remember what he said. He said something about, like, the Bible,

if I was fake or something like that. And I forget what he said, about my guest. And I spent way too much time writing reply to him. And I wasn't mean or anything. Well, a little bit. A little bit at the end. I wasn't, I wasn't, I wasn't writing it in, like,

an angry spirit or anything. I was just like, hey, if you're going to be a jerk, I can be a jerk, too. And I just kind of broke down the, the fallacy of his thought process. And I guess I did it, I did it without worrying about his feelings. You know, I was just like, no, you're wrong. And this is why. And then he replied back with, you know, my credibility has been shot or whatever, whatever. It's like, whatever, I don't care. And I, and I, and I, at first, I thought, like, I'm not going to reply to this because I, I,

I'm in the habit of just like, whatever, you can have the last word, you know? Right. And then I don't know what happened, but I started writing a response. And then I was like, you know what? I'm not doing this. And I was reminded of Spurgeon said, I think he said, it was something like the word of God doesn't need you to defend him. He just let him out of the cage and he'll defend himself. He said, God is like a lion.

You know, he doesn't need you to defend him. Just let him out of the cage and he'll defend himself. And that's why I was like, okay, my response is Galatians 110. And that's what I did. I dropped that there. And it was just like, and I can't quote it verbatim, but the idea behind 110 is, Galatians 110 is saying, you know, do I strive to please man or God? And if I'm striving to please man, am I really a follower of Christ?

Right. Like, I'm trying to please one. And it's not the person in the comment section that I don't know. And so I try to, I try to refrain from those back and forth, though. Right. They're all time-consuming. But that's really, at the end of day, through all the stuff that we do with podcasting, documentaries, your music.

It's like, you know, who are we striving to please? And it's that I think it was really popular back in the early 2000s, but that phrase, audience of one, the idea of like, I just need the audience of one. God, that's all I'm trying to please. That's all. that's the only cheering that I need to hear from is him to say, well done, my good and faithful servant. That's it.

Like, I'm not really, I say, I, we can't be worried about, you know, what Joey from Nebraska thinks of episode 57 that was put out like seven years ago, you know? It's just like, who cares? It's just, I mean, you create stuff and you, you, you, I mean, you want people to enjoy their time spent with you, but in a day you put stuff out, and it's never going to be something that everybody likes. And so when you come to that realization that you will never make anything that everybody that hits play will enjoy,

you stop trying to please complete strangers knowing that no matter what you do, somebody's not going to like it and just do what you want to do. You just do what you think. And if people haven't noticed, that's kind of what I do these days. And I think that's the formula. You're right. And I didn't mean to get this whole thing sidetrack. Yeah, no, I know.

It's just like, how do we get back to Cruelly about that? Hard left. Yeah. And I think ultimately, I'm, the moral of all that was I'm really learning how to look at people differently and look past the monster. Yeah. And understanding that there's a human there, no matter how hard it is to see. right, there's still a human there. And if there's a human there, they can be reached.

Yeah, I mean, they can be redeemed. Right. And I think that that to me is always where I try to bring everything back to on my podcast, if I'm on any other podcast, is that redemption piece. Even if it's about somebody that, from all indications, was never redeemed like Crowley, it can still be a cautionary tale. It can still be a cautionary tale for us Christians and how that we should extend our hand to someone who

we don't particularly like at all what they do. And it rubs us completely the wrong way. Well, maybe that's what God wants you to do, is talk to that person. And maybe not beating them over the head with the Bible is how you do it. Maybe it's creating some sort of relationship in whatever way.

if it's a work relationship, whatever, to where you just show them kindness. You show them something that nobody else is showing them. And I know it sounds super simple, but sometimes it is that simple. And I'm finding that more and more in my life and how that I'm extending out to people. You know, sometimes I get slapped in the face for it. You're going to get told no, and sometimes people will get angry with you, but if God's telling you to do it, maybe that's a seed you planted and it sprouts later. Yeah. And you never see the sprouting.

Right. Get back to Crowley, though. Sure. So after this golden dime fiasco, he decides he wants to go to the States. Now, this is the first time he goes to the States. People don't talk about this very much because everybody talks about the 1914 and 1919,

because that's when he did that long stretch. But he actually goes to the States before that in 1900. So he goes to the States in 1900. He goes to New York. It's very interesting when he, right before he first lands, there is a giant explosion in fire at this shipyard, Haboken Shipyard, right before he gets there. And I only bring that up because that's the first time he goes to the States. Well, the second time he dips back into the States, there's a huge earthquake in San Francisco. So it's kind of weird.

He's jumping into the States twice, and there's this crazy disasters that happen before he gets there. So it's like omens. Little, kind of. Yeah. So he ends up in New York. He's only here for like three days. He tells the guys back at the Golden Donnie, talks to Mathers,

and he tells him that he meets two guys and they're members of the order. And he said they just got back from Mather's. Mexico. So he's telling Mathers, hey, I'm going to go to Mexico and I'm going to see what I can set up down to Mexico. Now, that's just the way he's telling Mathers, right? As we dig deeper, he had a whole other reason for going to Mexico. All along he was going to Mexico. This wasn't a, I'm going to New York and, oh, I just met some people and now I'm going down to Mexico. He, his whole idea was to get to Mexico. Now, he gets there. He gets to Mexico City. He loves it. He's like, this is the kind of Christianity I love. This is exactly what he says. He said he loves this

version of the Catholic faith. He's like, because they gamble, they have sex. They're going crazy down here. This is all in Crowley's words. I'm not here to like bashing by it's a Catholic or anything like that. But according to Crowley, when he gets to Mexico City, this is what those Catholics were doing. They were partying it up. And Crowley's all about partying. Now, he loves the president at the time. He specifically says this in his diaries. Periphero Diaz is the president, and this is important because we're going to get to why that Periphero Diaz is important to this part of the story of him being in Mexico and him being a secret agent. So while he's down there, he starts working on the magical workings of Auburnel. We were just talking about that. It's the book that Mathers wrote. And he's

starting to explore these 30-Athers, the 30-Athers of John D. and Aber Kelly. And he's, and he's trying to tap into the interplane territories ruled by angelic figures is his whole goal. So now we're starting to see the maturation of Crowley moving more into, oh, now he's starting to do more magic. He's on his own now. So now he's down there on his own. He's got the 16th century manuscripts from John D. and Ever, Kelly, with him. So he's down there with these manuscripts, and he's going to start working this. magic to connect to these entities. And he starts doing what he calls a ritual of self-initiation.

So he's self-initiating himself into where he thinks he's going to be after he completes the 30-a-thers. Now, just to preface it, he doesn't complete the 30-a-thers, right he's down there. He can't. He's not even at a magical point to where he can do that. He completes two of the 30. He ends up completing the other 28 with Victor Newberg in 1909. And this is when he ends up out in the desert. And this is where Victor Newberg, who was his assistant at the time, they go out there to complete these working. They actually do, but to complete the working, Hurley has to take it from Newberg. And this lends back into that idea that, again, sex.

is not a pleasurable thing for Crowley in this sense of just pure pleasure. It's always got an endgame goal. And the thing is, when Newburgh does that to Crowley, Crowley passes into this city of the pyramids where he completes this ritual called the Knight of Pan while he's there. Okay, so when he's passing the city of pyramids, are we talking like a different realm? Different realm, absolutely. He goes into an astral realm called the city, called the city of the pyramids. He completes this night of Pan. Part of the night of Pan is a Gnostic ritual to kill the ego. Once you kill the ego, you come back out and now you're a new person. And essentially, Newberg, the same thing happens to him because he's completing the ritual too. When they come out

of this city of the pyramids and they move into the next phase of life, this is when Crowley really explodes right after 1909. Like he's going crazy. Then that's when he gets to the state's 1914. He's completing ritual after ritual after ritual. He meets all these different entities. after that. Abaldives. He meets Amalantra. He meets Lamb. All these different entities that are giving him different information that he's helping build, which I think he's funneling back to the government as well during that time. So I don't think it's just for the sole fact that he's trying to reach this level for just himself, but I also think that the government is a part of this. And we're looking at it right now. He's down in Mexico. And this is, again, long before 1909, and he completes the rituals, but he's completed two of them.

Now, he befriends this guy down there called Don Jesus de Medina. Nobody knows who this guy is. He's only talked about in Crowley's writings. So Crowley talks about Don Jesus de Medina. He's a fellow occultist. He's actually a leading figure in Scottish right Freemasonry in Mexico. And he actually awards Crowley with the coveted 33rd degree while Crowley's down there. But here's the interesting part.

we were talking about peripheral Diaz, the president of Mexico. He's also part of Scottish Fright, Freemasonry. So now we've got politics intertwined. Okay. So now Crowley is down there. He hooks up with Down Jesus, Davidina, to the fact that he and Don Jesus create their own secret society called the Order of the Lamp of the Invisible Light while they're down there.

and part of this part of this group that they create is to help finish the sacred magic of Abermill and the Magee like we talked about and part of that is he starts tapping into these four princes of the demons Lucifer Leviathan Satan

and Belial and then he taps into eight sub-princes Astoroth Magat Asmodi Bielzebub Orions, Paman, Eraton, and Amion, and they're all subject to the will of the Lord of the Universe. So he and Don Jesus de Medina with this new secret society they created while they're trying to tap into the sacred magic of Abermell and the Mage, they tap into all these entities while they're down there. Also, at the same time, he's been inducted into this Freemasonry, 33rd degree, Scottish Right, with the president of America. Mexico peripheral Diaz as well. So this gets this political side and this weird occult entity side all working together. Also, while he's doing that, he figures out how to make

himself invisible. So this is one of his new learned tools that he does. So when he first starts doing it, he creates a flickering state so he can flicker in and out of reality. For real? Yes. So this is what he's talked about. And this is multiple writers that have written biographies about him. This is a very important part about him going to Mexico because this is a very big part of what he says that he's learned. Now, obviously, some of the writers are skeptics.

They actually pull this off. Some believe that maybe he was able to figure out a form of hypnotism to make people. will think that he disappeared. He does talk about at one point that he figured it out so well that he puts on a red robe and a golden crown and walks down the entire street of New Mexico City, nobody sees him. That's when he knew he had mastered the ability to go invisible. So we already know he's tapping into the astral realm. We know that he can, he's pulling these entities out.

They're speaking to him from the astral realm. He's going to the astral realm. So what's to say that with the connection to these entities, he's not able to create some way of phasing in and out of reality. It's possible. Has there ever been any documentation of anybody saying that they've seen him do it? No. All we know is what Crowley said he did.

And again, this goes back to some of the people who are staunch, pushbackers of Crowley. Right. The people who are like, Curley's just full of it. He just wrote a bunch of junk and he just wanted people to believe this, to swindle them, whatever. Maybe. I'm not going to sit here and say that he's telling the truth or not. But the issue is he has been documented throughout history of performing these rituals with other people, going into the astral realm, with other people. So he's had tons of different people corroborate at least that part. So he's down in Mexico and he says, that he's taught himself how to make himself invisible, what better tool for a secret agent than being able to make yourself invisible? And I would say Richard B. Spence talks about that in depth when he talks about Crowley and his biography. And he's kind of a skeptic when it comes to Crowley's occult side. He talks about it.

He mentions it because it's important, but he's very, focused in on the secret agent part, the geopolitical side of what Crowley did. You know, and some in what he says is that the occult stuff was used as a mask to hide some of the different things that he was doing with the governments, which maybe. I'm not going to sit here and say that he didn't have the charlatan side that swindled people and tricked people, but I will say that there's too much evidence that he was connecting with these entities and doing these things with other people who corroborated. for him to just totally be faking it.

And to think that he went down to Mexico and learned how to make himself invisible, it's pretty wild man. When you really think about it. Yeah. Now, you may ask, what's this connection to peripheral Diaz? And how does this tie into him being a secret agent

down there in Mexico? Well, Wheatman Pearson, he's a British director, one of the biggest and most successful construction companies, specifically in Mexico. Crowley leaves Mexico. Pearson arrives with an interest in oil concessions from Perforo Diaz. It goes through seamlessly, which America was trying to get the oil diesel of Mexico. Everyone was fighting over oil deals with Mexico because all of the ships were moving to petroleum-based fuel.

Everybody wanted it. Everybody wanted these deals. Well, Crowley's down there, hobnobbin. He's in a secret society with the president of Mexico. And then all of a sudden, he's just like, that's time for me to go, just kind of out of nowhere. And then Wheatman Pearson shows up, who's brokering it, goes right through, right after Crowley leaves.

So, again, circumstantial. but this isn't the only circumstantial thing with Crowley when it comes to in an area that he'll be in there'll be somebody of great stature there there'll be weird stuff where something's brokered on a boat and you know of this

said person and Crowley just happens to be there too on the logs why is Crowley always in the mix when something's happening with the governments or something's being brokered so I think that yes Crowley is multifaceted as a character. I think that he not only is looking out for himself and his occult interest and for the

governments, but also from just the geopolitical side, he's also working as well. It's another example of him joining a secret society to do what? Do something the government wants him to do. Wow. Wow. Yeah, I mean, it seems like everything he did was focused on that, everything. and yeah i mean do you think that something because i mean if you're a secret agent

the idea is to not be found out we know that he was a secret agent was there something that went wrong or did he just at some point want credit for what he was pulling off was there an ego in play i mean you know what i'm saying like why is it that we know about crowley the secret agent when the whole idea behind the secret agents that they never existed. So we were talking about Richard B. Spence, because I'll go back to him a lot, because he's done

probably the most work alone on this idea of him being a secret agent. And he called all these different modern-day secret agencies. He called MI5, MI6, he called the FBI. He called CIA. This is in conjunction of him doing this research. And I'll have Jack throw this up for people to see. he reaches out to MI5, MI6. They go and look and they say that, oh, yeah, there's this folder with his name on it. There's a slip in there. And I'll show the slip for everyone to see.

It says his name and it's his folder. Nothing in the folder. And Spence is like, well, what's in the folder? I don't know. I don't happen to it. He asked the FBI, CIA. What do you know about Crowley? No comment.

They don't even give them a no. They just give them a no comment. So all of these agencies, they got plenty on Crowley. Plenty. They're just not divulging the information. And even in Mexico, man, he had a moniker that he went by while he was down there. He was writing for one of the papers while he was down there and he was going by Isidore Achille O'Rourke. And everything means something with Crowley, right?

So IAO is actually the Gnostic name for God. So he's actually using his initials to say he was a God. Wow. There's their pride. Always, always with him. And the name O'Work also ties into Jacobite Freemasonry. Everything he does means something. Every name, every initial, everything he did.

And I know today we don't have time to really go into the MK Ultra, the hidden part of him being MK Ultra. And I've done a three-part series on that. It's almost six hours if people want to go check it out. But he would do that in his writings, where the original name for peyote was Annalium Lewinney. And he would put A.L. In all of his writings. And it would seem like it meant something else. But he was telling you the amount of peyote you needed to use to connect to these entities, what we did in this retrovenomian.

what we did in this ritual constantly. He had the interesting thing about that is he had a Lieber called the cactus. Now, if you know anything about peyote, it's from a cactus. And he writes about the writing. So we've never seen the Lieber. He says the Lieber's not actually a Lieber. It was a hundred testings on people. with peyote that he says the British government got from him and he doesn't have him anymore.

So this is where we get the idea that he was the hidden father of M.K. Ultra. There's way more to it than that, way more to it than that. But that's the document that we know that the British government arrived at. And the British that got those documents were connected to the Nazis who pushed the earliest forms of MK Ultra, which those guys through Operation Paperclip ended up over here in the CIA, and then MK. Ultra came out. So he was actually doing the original testing on MK. Ultra and how to manipulate people's minds with peyote and mind-altering drugs. Man, that's wild. He literally had his hand on everything.

It's so crazy, the more you dig, and I'm not even through digging. I've just been digging into his connections with being a secret agent. But the more I'm digging in that, then I find these other things where I was doing research on his love for the divine cactus, peyote. Then all of a sudden it's, oh, wait a minute.

He's work with the government over here. Oh, man. So Timothy Leary, who was a big part of the M.K. Ultra here in the U.S., was a fanboy across. And he talks about do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. And he talks about specifically working with the CIA when it comes to MK Ultra programming.

It's wild. It all funnels right back to Crowley. He's such a central figure. And I'm not even going to say in the States, I'm talking the world. He was literally everywhere doing everything. And he's had his hands in shaping what we would consider to be the hidden aspects of the governments around the world. Wow. I feel like that's a rabbit hole. Like never ending.

That we're freeing the rabbit. That's crazy. That's crazy. All right. So we've been going for, I don't know, over two hours. If we, because, I mean, we can't get everything. How would you? If you had a, if you had to put a descriptor on the name, okay? So, Alistair Crowley, someone would call, you know, Satanus, father of McKay Ultra, double agents, triple agent, black magic, magician, I don't know, like, practiser.

How, is there, is there a way that you have ever considered of how would I, if I had to describe the man, like he's been involved in so much, like how would you describe him? Man, that's a good question. You know? Yeah. Is he's like,

it's like he's, I got a joke that I'm not going to drop right now. Drop it after her actually. But it's just like, it just seems like he's got a lot. He had a lot going on. And he actually seems to play a role in why things are the way they are

today to this day. I mean, the rabbit hole of the MK Ultra is like, that's wild. That's wild that he would be so connected to something like that, along with everything else that he's done. But maybe we could just call him the ultimate double agent or something like that. Like he just, I mean, if you, if you were sitting in a government seat saying, All right, we need a James Bond here, which he probably was, the James Bond.

But like, if we need, we need the ultimate double agent. I mean, really, that's what you painted. I mean, this guy was like, you name it, he can do it. And he's done it. Funny story about the James Bond thing. I knew it. I knew it. One of his idols was John D.

John D was the original, 007. He signed everything, 007. That's where Ian Fleming got the idea for, for 007 when he wrote James Bond was from John D because John D worked for the queen. And the 007 stood for the eyes of the queen, the two zeros, and then seven was the magic number seven that he used. And then some people suggest that it stands for two ball. Kane would be the other moniker that would also tie into John D being the first 007, which Crowley was a huge fan boy and studied all of his work. So he was one of the first British secret agents who was tied into the occult.

And now you got Crowley, who came in later. All right. So how many series do you have of Crowley? Currently, I've got five. Five. And I think it's about 11, 12 hours of content right now. It's an ongoing series. So it's not done.

It's going to keep going. I've got plenty of other things. It's funny. I go so deep with research that I find myself still leaving stuff on the table, even though I'm dropping like a three-part series. That's an hour and a half, two hours apiece. And I look back on it. And I'm happy with him.

I'm like, man, I left that. Maybe I'll use that for something else. The MK Ultra series I did with him. Is that separate? Or is that part of the six? It's part of the full, but I just did it in three parts because I wanted to do one episode and I'm like, there's no way. It's just too much.

It was so much. much because I'm going through all of these libers that tie into Annalonium Loenny, which is an old name for peyote. And he integrates that in consistently through all of his writings. And he talks about he uses what you would call blinds. And blinds in writing is basically, I'm saying one thing, but I'm meaning another and possibly another and maybe another. So he used to use that a lot with his writings to throw people off. And again, sometimes it looks like absolute gibberish. It just looks like letters and numbers.

What does that mean? But then when you understand that there are abbreviations for certain things and you realize what those are, oh, it then it starts adding up. And it starts coming together. And that's pretty much what he did with everything. Everything was a riddle to him. And he found a lot of joy in you not knowing what he meant. And if you figured it out, if you knew, well, then you and him might be good friends.

Interesting. Well, people can go check it out. We'll link it in the description of this episode. Hopefully. If I've heard it tell Jack to. But, I mean, you guys know where to find it. Free the Rabbits. It's been around for over a year now.

And every week is a new episode. Mondays. Every Monday. Is there a specific time? If you go to YouTube, you can be part of the premier chats that we do. It's at 12 o'clock in PM every Monday. Eastern time. Yep. And if you're on any of the RSS stuff like Spotify, Apple podcast, whatever else that you just listen to audio, 12 a.m. Okay, I gotcha. So 12 a.m. midnight on audio, noon on YouTube and Rumble. And Rumble. And the reason for the time drop difference is because on audio, it doesn't matter. On YouTube, the algorithm, it matters.

So it's just like, and that's why we do it too. I mean, we do the exact same formula for Tuesdays. It's because when you look at the analytics on the back end of YouTube, you can see your viewer base and what times a day they're on most. And our chunk, last I saw, it was like between noon and 8 o'clock at night. I think it was where the peaks were. And so I said, well, why would we drop? episode at midnight on YouTube when nobody's on. Right.

So we drop it at the beginning of that wave from noon to eight is a whole wave of people being on that follow us. So you drop it at noon so that they have access to it. But if I start dropping the audio at noon, there's a lot of people for 12 hours and be like, where's the show? Right. So we play the game, you know? But Joel, man, I appreciate it coming on and dropping some knowledge on on Crowley.

So it's a rabbit hole that people can go down. I try to keep it as compact as possible. It's so much. It's so dense. Yeah, you can't keep. It's, well, I think with everything that his life encompasses and stuff, I think you did a good job keeping it compact. But if you want the encyclopedia version, they can find that on Free of the Rabbis. Right.

All right, let's wrap it up. friends slept. We're just broken pieces to the gold and no missteps. I'm here to break down all your idols ritualistic. If you don't like it, I don't speak in euphemistic terms. The world is run by Charles Montgomery Burns. They keep in it hooded like CERN. They've done it in thirds before the earth was occurred. And all the friction I'm getting is warranted when your chambers don't echo. The entrance needed for what I be saying don't come from progressive or gecko. And why are you popping prosceco? If you ain't putting in labor, I'm taking shots of espresso. Every second I favor more than the last. We never get a return. Turn on time loss with the divine laws, but people looking to rap it like tacos with lime sauce. Hey, I never cared too much what they say. Matter of fat, what I'm saying, I ain't here to explain it on the levels all they see, but they don't see my creator campaign. And politicians for your souls, no debate. But stop for the next.

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