The Confessionals - RELOADED | 552: The Blood Of The Innocent

Episode Date: March 2, 2026

In Episode 552: The Blood Of The Innocent, we're bringing back the incredible Dr. Engle, from Episode 530: Surviving MK-Ultra, who escaped the clutches of the MK-Ultra program and went on to become a highly sought-after medical doctor. But that's not all! Dr. Engle has a jaw-dropping story to share about her mission to rebuild Russia's medical system, which led her to uncover a shocking human trafficking ring that spanned across Europe and the United States. Tune in as Dr. Engle reveals how she and a team of others exposed this heinous crime against humanity.Please pray for Tony's wife, Lindsay, as she battles breast cancer. Your prayers make a difference!If you’re able, consider helping the Merkel family with medical expenses by donating to Lindsay’s GoFundMe: https://gofund.me/b8f76890Become a member for ad-free listening, extra shows, and exclusive access to our social media app: theconfessionalspodcast.com/joinThe Confessionals Social Network App:Apple Store: https://apple.co/3UxhPrhGoogle Play: https://bit.ly/43mk8kZThe Counter Series Available NOW:The Counter (YouTube): WATCH HEREThe Counter (Full Episode): WATCH HERETony's Recommended Reads: slingshotlibrary.comIf you want to learn about Jesus and what it means to be saved: Click HereBigfoot: The Journey To Belief: Stream HereThe Meadow Project: Stream HereMerkel Media Apparel: merkmerch.comMy New YouTube ChannelMerkel IRL: @merkelIRLMy First Sermon: Unseen BattlesSPONSORSSIMPLISAFE TODAY: simplisafe.com/confessionalsGHOSTBED: GhostBed.com/tonyQUINCE: quince.com/tonyCONNECT WITH USWebsite: www.theconfessionalspodcast.comEmail: [e-mail] ADDRESS:Merkel Media257 N. Calderwood St., #301Alcoa, TN 37701SOCIAL MEDIASubscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/2TlREaIReddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/theconfessionals/Discord: https://discord.gg/KDn4D2uw7hShow Instagram: theconfessionalspodcastTony's Instagram: tonymerkelofficialFacebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcasTwitter: @TConfessionalsTony's Twitter: @tony_merkelProduced by: @jack_theproducerOUTRO MUSICJoel Thomas - Jekyll IslandYouTube | Apple Music | Spotify

I guess it's time to go back in time. Are you telling me that you built a time machine? Out of a Dolion? Time is but a stubborn illusion. I have a lot of memories of the past. People are time traveling within themselves. Time travel is possible. Merkel.

Media. This was all circulating around the base. that a giant had been killed, but no one was supposed to talk about it. Each up underneath the door, curl up to grab it, and then disappear. When he came over to me, dude, he slithered over to me. And this giant comes out of the cave, and they're all frozen. And he starts running and firing up this giant. With a giant moves, he's got a spear in one hand, and he's running really fast.

It spears, Dan, holds him up like this. somebody else shoot him in the face shoot him in the face they basically decapitated I feel something pulling at my leg and I look over and there are two small gray entities pulling it and they're literally I'm getting pulled off the bed I reached my hand into this bush and I touch air couldn't breathe and I couldn't move because I know I'm seeing a monster okay I reload it Welcome to the show, everybody. You're listening to The Confessionals.

I'm your host, Tony Merkel. Thanks for being here. If you were a crazy, wild experience, you want to share with me on the show, go ahead and shoot me an email. Or go to the website, the confessionalspodcast.com, hit the contact section, and you can reach you that way as well. Other way it works for me. Just get a hold of me.

If you want more shows on a weekly basis, go to the Confessionalspodcast. com, hit the join button, become a member. You're going to get access to the Thursday shows, which are members exclusive at free listening and also overtime episodes when they're available, all exclusively available on the website. the newly minted app. So if you want to go ahead and check it out, go ahead, check it out. We have the app. All you got to do is download it off the Apple App Store and off Google Play. It doesn't matter to me. It all matters on what kind of phone you have. So hopefully you guys

are enjoying it that are members. It is a member's exclusive app. But if you're not a member, you can't download the app. You just can't log in. So there's that. Now, today we have Dr. Angle. We brought her back on today because the first time we talked to, we talked all about MK Ultra. But after she was an adult and a doctor, she actually went to Russia to help rebuild the medical institution in Russia after the USSR failed. Well, she comes on to talk about how she uncovered and found a large human trafficking ring that was multiple nations, including the United States, and she comes on to talk about her journey with that and her book called Angels over Moscow. You can go ahead and check it out. It's in the description of this episode, and you can purchase

it off Amazon. It's a fantastic book. It details her story. She comes on to talk about these things today. Also, how this experience with the human trafficking ties directly into MK Ultra Programming, obviously, and she went through that as well. So she was uniquely qualified to connect some dots there. And we also go down some other routes as well, such as the normalization of pedophilia. She broke some news to me on the show. I left my jaw on the desk. And it's because I have been speaking out about the normalization of pedophilia before I even had a podcast. I talked about this stuff of people. They said I was crazy and here we are and it's actually happening. And she said some things to me that kind of triggered me. It went on a little bit of a ramp.

But I think if we're talking about human trafficking on the show, you can kind of expect I'm going to rant at some point because it just ticks me off. We also talk about Starfort. She's looking into Star forts, brought that up. And I was like, I think I recognize this. And then I remember talking about it on a previous episode. But we talk a little bit about StarFords. And I'm going to bring on some people in the future talking more about the Star Fort situation. But it was a good overall conversation I have with Dr. Angle. We talked about a lot of different things, starting out with her human trafficking uncovering in Russia. So let's get to Dr. Angle right now. Okay, today we have returning guest, Dr. Juliet Angle. How are you, ma'am?

I'm very good. Thank you. I'm glad you're here. We were just chatting a little bit about your last appearance and stuff. And it sounds like people have been reaching out to you and you've been getting a good response on that last interview. Yeah, lots of, you've got great people in your chat room and lots of good questions and some good discussions going and there'll be some more interviews with some of your, your viewers. So I think you've got a great crowd there. Awesome. Yeah, I was hoping you'd get a good response from people. I thought it was a great interview. And what we're going to get into today is kind of almost like a totally different topic

in a sense. But it's like a life shift for you. But before we get into that, just so that people maybe can have a refresher on who you are in case they didn't hear the first one. They can go back and listen to it. I believe it was episode 530 is the episode we put you out on. And if you could, just let people know what we talked about in that first interview as far as MK Ultra goes in your life. Well, I was put into NK Ultra. I was basically sold into it by my father. And he made sure I watched myself getting paid for when I was six years old. And I come from, although I didn't know it at the time, I come from a long line of intelligence operatives. All my uncles and grandfather were in the OSS. My uncle is one of the original founders of the NSA. And I was sold into there

basically at the age of six and then put into a program called Monarch, which was the secret. Butterfly Program and eventually into a program called Sex Magic because I was pretty smart. I was I was I guess destined to be a whore for the CIA, I guess. And I continued in that program and I encourage you to listen to the episode because it's a very good review of what went on in there, the kind of satanic ritual abuse that they subject children to. The history of MK Ultra, as much as I know about it, is in there because it was exposed in 1976 when Senator Church held hearings in Congress and exposed it. But then it was quickly buried, and a lot of people that testified in that hearing later disappeared or disappeared from sight.

So it's continued on, and at that time there were thousands of Americans who had been inducted into the program, meaning forced, including at least hundreds of children, including myself. But I was aware of the hearings, but at that time, I was in my 30s and completely forgotten. Ever having been in the program, in fact, after I escaped from MK. Alter at the age of 17, I didn't remember anything about my childhood. I went off to college. I started a new life and could remember nothing. and so go listen to that.

It was a really good interview, I think, a very good, Tony asked great questions and we really got into it. But I was in my 30s. I was going beginning into psychoanalysis so I could start to recover some memories from my childhood. But I really didn't have anything because everything that would come up was so insanely violent and terrible. But I was a successful physician. I was practicing in Bellevue, Washington. I was part of the Seattle high-tech startup crowd with Bill Gates and the founders of Adobe.

And it was the age of the entrepreneur in Seattle. So before it all went dark when it was kind of fun. And I was invited. I was at the hospital doing my radiology practice and received an invitation to go to the former Soviet Union. It was the Soviet Union at that time. this was 1990 and be the first doctor into their birthing houses and look at their system of childbirth and maternity care because they had probably the highest one of the highest rates of maternal and infant mortality in any industrialized nation so they started invited me later I learned why they picked me

but in the beginning it just seemed like a random incidence out of the blue so I I went to Russia. We also covered that in the previous interview, so I won't go in depth. But I began working in the birth houses and orphanages in Russia and discovering that children were disappearing. And so I want to know what was happening. And it took quite a lot, including working with investigative reporters in Russia and the head of a magazine called Women's Life in Russia, to start digging out what was happening to these children. and they were going into orphanages and we're disappearing.

But 800,000 of them were living at that time in a system of orphanages that were all up and down the rivers of Russia because that's how you got. That's where the towns were, the little towns. So it wasn't like they were kept in Moscow. They were exported to other places. And they would, as time went by in the orphanages, they would, be taken away or disappeared or by the time they graduated, they were picked up outside the orphanages and taken to other countries. So it was right there in my face that this was trafficking of children,

the children were being kidnapped. And this is really what triggered my own deep dive into my own past because I knew there was something there. but I couldn't remember it. So I followed these kids. I had a case or an instance where I brought, I was working with a group, founded a group that supplied orphanages during difficult times. In 1998, during the financial crisis, Russia was falling apart.

And the first thing that budget item that got cut just like is happening here were children's services. So the orphanages were dire straits. So I was delivering coats in the middle of the winter and discovered that all the coats I'd bought, brought for teenage girls. And these are girls that I'd just seen the summer before. They all had the names and they had little gifts in the pocket. So people in Seattle were just wonderful about contributing and helping. And they're just lovely people. But the girls were gone.

And when I tried to find out why all the teenage girls were gone, I got the story from the kids that a bus came and took them to Finland. And they thought this was a really wonderful thing. These kids were going off to a better life. And they couldn't wait themselves to get on the bus when they got old enough. And it was just the driver from my own past. I couldn't leave it at that. So I followed the kids up to Murmansk, up to the Kola Peninsula,

where there were women's groups who were already addressing the problem. international child trafficking, and I met with them, and they told me that the kids were on buses. The buses were used as mobile brothels. The brothels were, as they drove for Finland and Sweden and Norway, which is a totally lawless zone. I mean, you don't think of Sweden as the Wild West, but they have a whole central portion, which is so lawless that law enforcement doesn't even go there. So it's like this central band where smuggling human, smuggling, cigarette smuggling, drugs, smoking, it all goes right through the middle of

the Scandinavian countries and ends up in Norway, at least in this case, ended up in Norway. So I followed them all the way up to Murmansk, and there's a border crossing there that goes to Kirkinis, Norway. And I got on the bus in, there's a, twice a week, there's a bus from

Murmansk, which is the northernmost seaport of Russia, into Kyrgynese, Norway. And I got on that bus, and I was on the bus with probably 12 Sami people who came up to hear on me. And were smuggling cigarettes. So it was an interesting group. They, because they're indigenous people, they can travel freely from Norway, Finland, Sweden, Lapland. What was considered Lapland?

They have a nation up there. And they're free to smuggling as their business or Lisa's group. Anyways, this aside. But I went to Kirkannis. I found that I went to the police, walked in, told them the problem. And they showed me a drawer full of pictures. These are Polaroid photographs of children. And they said, yes, Russian children are showing up here all the time.

So they showed me this drawer of pictures. but they were all the faces of dead children. So they said, see if you can find your kids in here. And I was so rattled and shocked. And it sort of sent me on a flashback. It was the dead faces. And I couldn't do it. So I left, got myself together.

It came back the next day. And then they denied that the photographs existed. But they did tell me that they did find the bodies of children, and they buried them all in a mass grave that was called Natasha. So they called them all Natasha. They didn't know who they were. They didn't know what their names were. If they were matched to any search by Interpol or anything, they would respond.

But no one ever did. So they weren't even sure what nationality these children were. And they said if they were found one alive, of course they helped. But he said, generally they fight. them dead. And that sent me on a personal spiral and a total drive because these kids were helpless. They were never represented, never protected, never sheltered, not in their own society, although the people in the orphanage that I knew tended to be very kind people, but they had no no destiny, no attachment.

And at that time, it was still very early, so they weren't church schools. And there wasn't a response from the Orthodox Church yet. So these kids were just left to the mercies of the state. The state ignored them, neglected them, and sort of threw them out. And the human traffickers took them, abused them, sold them, and then discarded them. And I just, that was too much for me. So I went back to Seattle and it was an emotional roller coaster. When you say it's the two parts of my life are separate, they aren't really because if I hadn't had this in my own background, the fact that I'd been traffic, the fact that I had been sold, the fact that I had been sexually and ritually abused and been about to be tossed out at the age of 17, if I hadn't escaped and gotten myself.

off to university with a lot of, I had help. I would have been in the same situation. So here I was, I was not helpless. I'm an MD. I had a practice. I had money. I had freedom. And I was going to help.

And about this time, the U.S. had just started the trafficking in-person's program. So they just had opened, the State Department had opened an office called the tip office, which is the office to monitor and, I'll forget, it's got this long name, but basically it's to monitor and prevent human trafficking. And so that's what I thought it was. And that's what the people that worked there thought it was. And so I got one of the very first grants,

which was $300,000 to go create a civic response in Russia to human trafficking. So to start informing people, reforming, informing institutions, developing programs for mass media. And it did all that. We did, as soon as I had a group together of really incredible devoted Russian patriots,

they carried out the first civic actions. The first civic actions, not just the first civic actions on trafficking, but the first time citizens have sponsored parades on a social issue that wasn't state sponsored. So we kicked off information campaigns in 21 cities all around Russia, coordinated it, had a huge response, began gathering information on how enormous the problem was.

We had a coast-to-coast chat room in Russia, so we did 11 time zones over the course of 11 hours. one of the most exhausting things I've ever done because it was impression on top of everything else. And gathered enough information. We had a group in Seattle called the Forum Foundation, and they had developed this complex questionnaire, opinionaire, to send out to all the groups who were gathering to participate in this chat room. We had no idea what kind of response would get back or how big it would be,

We got thousands of people filling out these complex questionnaires. And what emerged was a pattern of human trafficking, which was unbelievable. It spread all the way from Mongolia. They participated to Kalinagrad. And we started getting Eastern Europe responding. And they had copied the questionnaire and sent it around. And they had to get it back to us. So it took a couple of months to get all the questionnaires.

back in trains, watermelon trucks. It came in an amazing ways. And they sent back, we had sent out number two pencils because they didn't have pencils to fill it in. They sent back every single pencil. Really? Yeah, they could have kept the pencils. We kept getting these mountains of dirty, grimy questionnaires and the pencils.

So we had over a million people. of data from this incredibly complex questionnaire and were able to map out the progress of human trafficking across Eastern Russia into Central Asia, parts of China, and then all the way through the Middle East. Iran, people from Iran participated and it was actually enough for the groups to take this information to the Russian Duma, which is their Congress, and demand that there be anti-trafficking legislation. And they wrote it, they developed it, and eventually the Duma did pass it. And they did pass quite good legislation.

But strangely, the American embassy opposed it. So what also came out of this mountain of data that we collected was the fact that there were two major destination countries for human trafficking from Russia. And that includes the trafficking coming through Russia. So all the Central Asian Republics came through Russia and then went overseas. And the two main countries were Germany and the United States. And from that data, we could tell that the main points of trafficking were going to New York. They were going to this place called Brighton Beach, where they were going to work, and to Virginia Beach in Virginia.

And so I thought, this is really something. We had the data on the groups that were in the areas where this trafficking comes from, so we could get the information on even like what flights these girls were being booked on because they'd be provided with tickets and it'd have to have a new passport and documents and all this. So the families knew where their daughters, we were looking primarily at young women at that time, where the daughters were going, the orphans we couldn't track. That had to come later. But just ordinary people were being trafficked, being offered jobs and not just it would be nanny jobs, nursing jobs, and accounting jobs. There was a huge number of accountants. that were traffic. And because it was a very popular education program for young women,

so they would recruit from accounting schools. And then they would disappear. And the only way to follow them would be to follow them to the United States. So by that time, I'd had like several years of grants. We built the Angel Coalition, which is a coalition of Russian and former Soviet country organization. who were doing an incredible job, not just with preventing trafficking in their areas, working with their local governments.

In many cases, working with mafia groups who were opposed to human trafficking, and that's a whole story under itself. I believe it. And so I gathered up all this information, took a group of them, went to Washington, D.C., and presented this to the State Department, to Congress, to the tip office,

to international law enforcement. Nobody wanted to hear it. In fact, the State Department had this technique where you can lay out your data, your everything, make your presentation. They don't hear it. They look away.

They won't look at things. They don't touch anything. So I would even like wave it in their face, you know, the kind of posters that were used. and nothing, nothing at all. No response from law enforcement. Never any follow-up would send them through INL, which is international narcotics and law enforcement,

which is our, that's how the FBI works in embassies. They're called INL, and that covers all the law enforcement agencies. So you never know who you're actually talking to. But no response. I even had their personal numbers in the United States. because I knew several of them. I'd call them and say, there's somebody coming. I'd never hear back.

So it was a really bizarre response. And then the tip office every year puts out a report called the tip report. And of course, the number one country for prevention, and there's no trafficking here, and we've got the best system. That's the United States. it's set forward as the paragon of human trafficking. And there we were saying, wait a minute, it's not as good as you think. And also in my own past, which came to me later, I know I sound like a crazy person

because my life was part. And I was programmed to forget. But I'd lived on the Mexican border. And I'd seen the human trafficking. I'd actually been used as a drug meal on the Mexican border when I was a kid. I didn't remember any of this, but it started coming back to me that children were being brought over the Mexican border and then used for prostitution, rituals, all kinds of awful things, including snuff films that I was forced to participate in as a child. So it was, I was sort of in a unique position to begin putting this together that there was maybe the possibility of state-sponsored human trafficking and child trafficking going on in my own country. And now I'm absolutely positive that there is.

and but it did it did at the time this would be in the mid 2000s that we got full on attacked by the American embassy in Moscow and um and not just us but other programs around the country that were really doing good counter-trafficking work it's like everybody was was we were a little tiny grantee and we were we were audited. We were, they would send derogatory letters. They would send missions. I was speaking at Russian Parliament and the, about human trafficking, not about the United States, just about the conditions of children and the Angel Coalition. And the head of INL was sitting in the front row.

This is from the U.S. Embassy. They were represented there. And he very loudly says to the person next to him, don't worry. Angel Coalition will be gone in a month of two. And so I had Russian, the Russian Duma, everybody could hear this. They were coming up to me afterwards and apologizing to me for the behavior of my own country. And what do you do? I mean, I'm an American.

You know, I was just, they constantly provided me with help. And the embassy, but that changed. William Burns then became the ambassador. He's now the director of the CIA. He became the ambassador of Russia. And he was, he was, the whole attitude of the embassy changed. And I was there many times. And he seemed extremely helpful.

And he was also a Russian speaker and very knowledgeable. But now he's head of the CIA. I don't know what any of that means. But I was impressed with him. And then eventually we lost our funding and we were placed under the aegis of the International Organization of Migration, which is another whole topic for you. You wonder who's funding all these migrants that are about to invade the United States, who's lined up, who's paying for all that? It's the UN agency, the International Organization of Migration, so we're paying for our own invasion, which is about to happen. And it was my first experience of being involved with money laundering

because it's clearly what they do through like the IOM, the International Organization of Migration. We were given a grant, our organization, and from the tip office at the State Department, who then bragged about how big it was, but we were never told how much we got. But we were put under all these restrictions under this umbrella organization of IOM.

And we would get reports on our 15 employees. We had one employee. We had maybe one and a half because they love paying for half a person, which makes impossible for you to operate. And they would restrict everything we did, and eventually they took every cent we had, but it was still credited to us.

So when they were discredited in any way, we were discredited, it's so obvious. And we're not the only ones that's happened to. So it's how they basically killed small NGOs and how they basically, you know, destroyed any civic action. Because groups like us would go in. We would find that the people who wanted to do something positive for their country and their people, they would become more public and more visible, and then the organizations like IOM would just shut them down. And that's where we are today.

I mean, they've been using good intention people in really terrible ways. And the situation with human trafficking has gotten much, much worse. IOM is bringing God knows who to the southern border of the United States. and to England. I mean, there's, I just saw a picture this morning of this cargo ship that's going to bring 500

young men, immigrants to the coast of England. And of course, IOM is sponsoring that. So who are they? So here comes your invading army. And, this is where we're at.

It's, and the UN has just made a statement that pedophilia should be legalized and that children children should be allowed to have adult sexual partners, and there's nothing wrong with it. We can't accept that. That cannot happen.

When did the UN make that announcement? Yesterday. Wow. Yes, the head of the UN. Who is it? Guideres. Yes, he just announced it. Wow.

I saw it come through my feed this morning, that children should be allowed to choose adult. This is the thing. adult sexual partners. So this is all a continuum that started, I think, long before I was in an MKLTRA program, but certainly, you know, I've had this continuous thread in my life. And it's why I'm so adamant about protecting children and stopping this pedophilia. It's the end of us. You know, I want you to continue the direction you're going here.

with telling your story. But I want to comment on this news that you're breaking here on the show to me because I did not know this. And I, this is something that I've been very passionate about my entire life, adult life, I should say, well before I was a podcaster. And this is, I would say, probably 2014, 2015, maybe even earlier than that. It definitely was actually. It's probably 2012, 2013. I was saying on my personal Facebook page just to the people that I actually knew at the time because I was nobody then, I would say that the way society is going is they're gearing up to legalize pedophilia. And everybody told me I was freaking crazy. They told me I was nuts. And here we are in 2023. Let's just say 10 years later. And when you get parents

to the point where they're allowing their children to make adult decisions with their sexuality, the idea of allowing children to make adult decisions as to who they want to have sexual intercourse with and encounters with is not a far-fetched stretch. That's the next step in this. And so this is what I predicted 10 years ago. And here we are, and I didn't know that.

And that's why I'm taking an aside here because it's sick. It's setting me off. And this is the kind of stuff that you just got to pick what side you're going to be on here. There is no middle ground. There is no fence sitting on this. Either you're for or against child abuse. And that's what this is. It's legalized child abuse. And if the UN is coming out and saying that stuff, guarantee you all the nations within the UN will start coming out and pushing these things as well. It's just it's just, it's just, it's just, just the domino effect. And so it just my blood started boiling when you said that. And so I apologize. I mean, we're sitting down here to talk about human trafficking. So at some point, I'm sure the audience understood that I was going to be due for some kind of a rant. Well, that was the mini one that kind of set me off because it's so current. One of my questions to you was going to be, and it still is, but like at the time frame, and we're going to do the whole timeline. thing here down as we talk, but the fact that we have global leadership encouraging this kind of behavior is, it's just the state of where we're at today. And it needs to be stopped.

At all costs, needs to be stopped. And so that's just my PSA of the day. So I know you're looking for the article, but I'll hand it over to you to say whatever you'd like to say. Yeah. The article is, there have been a number. They've been, as they do, they've been leading up this. But I just heard the head of the UN whose name I'm blanking on and come out and say that sex with minors is consensual. And back in April was the International Commission on Juris from the Office of United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights in recommending March 8th principles for a human rights-based approach to criminal law, prescribing conduct associated with sex, reproduction, drug use, homelessness.

It states that children have both the capacity and the legal right to make sexual decisions. And then he built on that. So, I mean, if you follow this along, according to the United Nations, children make consent to sex with adults. This has been their plan all along. the report does not offer a suggested age of sexual consent and in the statement this morning he said there isn't one you know children of all age consent

to sex this has been in the planning and I can tell from the more I remember about my own MK Ultra training is that their children are used for sex And because of their purity. So they're used for sex. They are sacrificed because of their purity. Their body parts are utilized in rituals.

And that this is happening. And at the same time that the United Nations has got its troops together to invade Europe, invade England, invade us from the southern border. Who are these people? Why is the UN sponsoring migrant camps filled with thousands of young men sitting on the Mexican border ready to invade us? Why do all the U.S. agencies have ammo, guns? Why is the IRS to have over a million rounds of ammo? It's not for the IRS. It's for the invaders coming over the border. So it's pretty clear to me that this is what's happening.

Yeah. So with what you just said, I just want to kind of maybe piggyback, but just point to obvious things that are going through people's heads right now because people listening, I'm sure there's people listening. They're like, well, that's conjecture. That's conjecture. You're just assuming that that's what that's for. And then the guns are for that and stuff. I just, I need to say no more than Fast and Furious. That was a real operation. I know people who were involved with Fast and Furious. I've talked to them, obviously not on air, but I've talked. Like, I know people who've been involved. and handing over guns are guns to terrorists. Like, this is, this is real, that this kind of stuff happening. So say you want to say it's conjecture or not, it's whatever, that's, that's your prerogative. But the fact is, just all you have to do is look at history. We have been known to do these kind of things. So it's not, it's not out of the question. Yeah, it's, it's my conjecture that, that, I mean, I'm watching all these agencies that have no right to have

weapons at all. Like the park service doesn't need massive, like grenade launchers and this kind of thing. They don't need it. And why is that happening? And then you have to put that together. Why are all these military-aged men gathering on our border and we're ignoring it? I mean, it's, I think we're in serious trouble and that I'm willing to come. out and talk about it because I think there's very little time left. Yeah. And what to do about it is, is wake up, wake up and be aware of it and don't give up your guns. I think, first of all, we're going in a different direction I thought, and we'll steer it back, but, but I will say, okay, I'll say this, we may not know what the exact answer is for all this stuff, but we have to

trust and believe, and this is what I believe, I think the answer will be apparent and show itself to you at the proper time. And I'm just going to leave it at that. I got to trust that we have brains and when the time comes for the appropriate answer in response to things, we'll know. We'll know. I think it's more it's more than brains. I think brains get us into trouble a lot of the time. It's our souls. It's people have to have faith in their souls. So it's awakening of souls.

And I think the people that are running around promoting all these things are people that have lost their souls. They've given them up voluntarily. They've been, you know, thousands and thousands of kids went through MK Ultra programs. And their goal was to take your soul. And once they've got your soul, then you become their tool. And their tool, you get all the rewards, you wear the gold, you get the big cars, you get all the money. But you are their tool and you don't have a moral compass anymore. So all the good people in the world that have kept their souls, it's your soul that's going to tell you what to do and respond.

So you have to, it's every person's responsibility to work on their connection with the divine and awaken their own soul and listen. But Jesus said, be still and listen. And maybe that wasn't Jesus. I'm sorry. I grew up in the church of Satan. Excuses. Excuses she has. Yeah, excuses.

No, it really, I have a photographic memory, and I can not. not get the Bible. It drives me nuts. I've listened to Psalms, the entire thing, all four hours, over and over, at least 100 times. And I still can't quote Psalms. Anything else I could probably, you know, recite it like a book. So there's a block that was put in very, very early. But I can listen. I can't read it. I can listen. So sorry about my quotes. No, it's fine. But be still and listen. Maybe that's Ecclesiastes.

Paul is vanity. Be still and listen. I would say I was not raised in the church of Satan, and I still have a hard time memorizing scripture, so it is what it is. How many, let me ask you this. This might be a good way to steer things in a new direction, in a sense. But how many politicians do you estimate,

I'm sure you've thought of it, But how many politicians in just America do you think went through MK Ultra programming? Is it a lot or a little? I think you can pick them out. Yeah, a lot of them. I would say anyone that's supporting the current policies, anyone that's taking this, an anti-human stance. What kind of human being is going to take an anti-human stance?

Yeah. A seriously damaged one. You know, it's like they've lost contact with the reality that we have to survive as a society and a species. And if you are against that and you think you're being rewarded in some way, in some wonderful way, then you've lost your soul. You've lost your moral compass. You've lost your way. Everybody skips the first four chapters of Revelation and goes into the,

a crazy part. But if you read the first four chapters, it's the predictions, it's Jesus's predictions of what will happen to the seven churches of Asia if they don't correct their ways. And within these, this was, these were the glowing jewels. These were the New York City at its best of the world at that time. And most beautiful, the wealthiest, the, the art, the culture, the music was all the top of the world. And within a few hundred years, there were nothing. They were leveled. They were dust.

And they still are dust and have no influence in the world. And if you read the first four chapters, it's predicted that if they don't change the way they do things. And one of the things that John wrote about in Revelation, and condemned the most was tolerance of evil. You know, if you are willing to tolerate evil for the sake of art or music or culture, which in the Stannic Bible, those are the seven mountains of culture, those are where the human being is the most corruptible,

and that's where our institutions exist. And if you tolerate evil, those institutions will fall, and you'll be nothing, it'll be dust. And that's what happened. And that's what we're doing. I mean, you read them. He condemns Pergamon for following the teachings of the Nikolaitans. The Nikolaitans did the greenery at Christmas,

because Christmas is not the birth of Christ. Christmas is the birth of Nimrod, who is a demon. And the Saturnalia is, the celebration of his birth, and that's December 25th. And they do that with greenery and scent and child sacrifice and child abuse and ritual abuse, which I wrote about that in my book, Sparky, Surviving Sex Magic. So that's 2,000 years ago. We're making the same mistakes now, but you're never going to get people to change

Christmas. And this year I was watching observing, you know, through the holiday season, there was barely any mention of the birth of Christ. It was all Santa Claus and presents and lights and greenery and feasting and pinging out and drinking too much. You know, so they're celebrating the Saturnalia. And then, of course, there's a massive child sacrifice on December 25th. So what's what's the child sacrifice on December 25th? Well that's the Saturnalia. Saturnalia was the high holiday of the

Nicolaiden's and the high holiday of the celebrating the birth of Nimrod. And I thought you were referring to something that happened this past December 25th. Well, it happens. It happens every year. It happened. I was as a child. I was taken off to a Saturnalia. Christmas. And it happens at Disneyland, or it did at the time that I was a child. That was

Disneyland in California. It opened in 56, 55, 56. But I was going there. They were taking me there and having Saturnalia's there. So I don't know. I'm just one, I'm just one little person. and all this. But it's my feeling that we're right on the edge. And so speaking out is what I can do, is what I can, I can share my experiences. I can share my opinions. I can share what I see. You know, it's talking about scripture, not you know, I'll remember it, but it's the scripture where it talks about what does it benefit you to gain the whole world but lose your soul, right? So it's really a very similar situation where it sounds like you're kind of sitting in a similar spot as me where it's like I could sit here and worry about, you know, like whatever, 20, 30 minutes ago. I went on my little rant there. I go sit here and worry about the probably few people that I offended with that. Or I could take a stance because there's, I believe, a few amount of people being louder than everybody else. I think, most sane people would agree with me on what I had to say. But at the end of the day, I literally would

rather lose everything than to lose my consciousness on some of these matters. And that's why I always tease my wife. I say, one day, I might do or say something that just doesn't bode well with everybody, and we lose everything. And we're living in a trailer down by the river. And she's like, I don't think it's going to happen. But if it does happen, I'll ride with you, baby. So like, you know, I'm fine with Because I'd rather have my consciousness and know that I believe I'm on the side of God than cower in the shadows trying to blend in with evil, you know? Absolutely, yes, yes. And you have to stop caring about all the material things in the world,

and you have to stop tolerating evil. You have to speak out against it. And, yeah, work on your soul. That's our chance as human being. to save humanity is the power that's in our own soul. That's why I'm alive right now is, is, I kept my soul. I've lost everything. I have the money that's in my wallet. I mean, that's the extent of what I have, but I have my soul. And so by having your soul, you're at peace and you have peace as well. Let me ask you some things here. So you said early on,

in this conversation that you went to Moscow or to Russia for this whole thing. But you referenced something real quickly, you said, but I was picked for that. And what did you mean by that? How were you picked for? Was it that God picked you for this whole thing or what? Very likely, although at the time I wasn't particularly a Christian. Actually, I found out later that the head of the department of Glovne Rustvo Vadito

Le Uprolena, which is TRU, which is Russian military intelligence, knew my uncle, the one who had founded the CIA. He told me years later, he was, he became, I met him that first trip over there

and he became sort of a supporter of what we did. So he provided protection while I was working on children's issue. And I was not political. I was not military. I was not anything but focused on improving the welfare of Russian children

and then preventing the trafficking of Russian women and children. And then eventually protecting children in orphanages and creating programs so that they could come out of an orphanage and not be trafficked. They could come out and go to a job and a group home and to have a life. But he knew my uncle. So I think that in that way, they sort of picked me and probably knew I'd been in an MK Ultra program.

Never talked about it because I didn't realize it. I also didn't realize that I am a large percentage Russian and found that out later. So had this, whole experience or is it ongoing with with Russia itself that were you able to see a large transformation in the country with the human trafficking once you guys started fighting it and you were getting funding and all that well i did yes and and not just trafficking but in child care maternal life and health care the birthing practices encouraging families rather

than they would actually pay women to get abortions. So doctors made money off of abortion. It's the same sickness that's here now. Doctors are making, we're making money by killing children. It was what they did, which I thought was absolutely abhorrent and helped fight against, and now it's illegal. So then I come back here, and it's like it just moved. So again, it's a question of the moral compass.

I'm sorry. I forgot your question. No, that's fine. I asked you, did you happen to see a positive transformation in Russia from your efforts with the Angel Coalition? Oh, yes. Yes, very positive. Although globally, with the advent of the Internet, human trafficking just got worse and worse and worse. It got too easy.

And I'd been holding up the United States. It's like this paragon of virtue. I mean, I went to like over 50 villages and did lectures on the correct way of preventing human trafficking. And my examples were United Nations and the United States. But as that has crumbled, it's, it's, they've lost, we've lost. our luster, let's say that with the Russians. And in the course of this terrible Ukrainian military action, which is a disaster for everyone, and will have long-term implications for us, because Russia has now has the most powerful

army in the world, the best armed, and has gone from absolutely loving the United States to hating us. I mean, the pressure from the population to just destroy us is gotten to the point where I can't talk to my Russian friends. Even Russian friends who had here, you know, no people here are in favor of obliterating us. And it's the Russian army is now so well-honed and so united. and so well trained, and they have infinite capacity for producing weapons and ammunition, and they have it. Plus, they now have China helping them. So what's to stop that army from just going right through Poland and into Europe?

There's a lot of pressure from inside Russia, from the population, to do just that. And you've got Putin is in power now, and he's very moderate. It's a group who doesn't want war. It's a group that, I mean, they had to invade eastern Ukraine to protect the Russian population in the breakaway republics who had already voted, who had actually voted to be part of Russia, but were stuck in Ukraine by an administrative decision by Yeltsin, who was Ukrainian. This juggernaut is plus a large, there's 40,000 death row, except they don't have the death penalty anymore, but capital crime lifers who were recruited into the Russian army under this Wagner private military group,

40,000 of the worst killers, these are serial killers. I mean, these are all murderers, but they signed an agreement with the Wagner group that if they survive the war, they're going to get all kinds of rewards. And of course, the Russian people do not want these people back in their society. And they've been armed, trained with arms. They're vicious fighters.

They have nothing to lose. And what's to stop them, $40,000 to just keep on going? It's going to be a mess. And as sooner it stops, the better for us. Yeah. No, I agree. I agree. I mean, I'm very, I'm very much mind my own business, stay within my borders and leave people alone kind of guy. So I wish we should be doing that. I wish everybody was doing that. Let me redirect again here. I wanted to ask you about, because you mentioned about the American embassy opposing it at first.

and then just kind of sparked in my head because I think you said I read maybe this but I don't know if you said it or not but it was like 1990 you went to Russia initially for all this I don't know what the timeline

looks like from there to getting deeply involved with fighting this stuff but is there an Epstein connection that you know of when it comes to maybe the embassy opposing it or anything like

bad. Like, obviously, Epstein, you know, happened like he supposedly killed himself a few years back, but he's been operating for quite some time. And I believe since the 80s, he's been kind of involved in this stuff. So have you ever kind of, I don't want to say cross paths, but have you ever had any, like, huh, I'm pretty sure Epstein was connected with this case that I was working on? Well, in the 1980s, Epstein offered me a job. Oh, my goodness. Yeah, this would be in like 1987, 88. I was at a book party up in San Juan Islands. I was invited by a friend of mine who's quite a famous author to this book party.

So we were up in this gorgeous house overlooking the islands. All glass, absolutely beautiful. And all these planes started flying. It was just her, me, and the guys. that owned the house. And I'd expected a party. But instead, all these, not in Caltra, Iran-Contra guys who were all over Seattle were flying in and landing their seaplanes in his little bay that he had. And they were coming and having a party. And I, Jeffrey Epstein and his brother Mark were there. And they were talking to me, mostly Mark, was talking to me. about they were going to buy an island in the Caribbean, and they were going to make it a high-class resort for world leaders. And what they were asking me, because I was a radiologist

and doing a lot of papers at a medical technical development company, is it possible to hide data? This is right when analog was going digital, so it was sort of cutting-edge technology there. was it possible to hide messages in medical data? So would it be easy to take a bunch of blips and hide all kinds of information there? I said, yeah, certainly it would be. So then they offered me the house that we were meeting in,

but I'd have to live there. So this conversation continued on for a few days, and then I decided I wanted nothing to do with it. And, but yeah, that happens. That's the only time I've met him. I mean, I've never met anybody who met Epstein. So it's not like, you know, it's not like there's a whole lot of people out there that can say that. But.

Well, he did, he did hire doctors and he hired scientists and to like be in his centers of whatever the hell he was doing. Sure. I mean, like, I mean, we know that Epstein and Gates, uh, were connected. And I know you kind of ran in those circles in the early days as well. So I mean, you were there in those, the rotation of that crowd. Uh, it is, but if you were to have accepted that, obviously, probably not knowing the full extent of what is going to happen and get, be involved in. Um, it sounds like they were pretty much recruiting you to do nefarious things as a doctor for them. Is that the vibe that you got when you were talking with them? Yeah, and I had serious reservations about putting secret data about world leaders inside reports. They clearly knew it was illegal, and I knew it was illegal, and I had no interest in it. I talked to them for a while. In retrospect, they probably knew I was from an M.K. Ultra program that I was vulnerable, that I was vulnerable because I still hadn't figured it out yet. but no, I didn't want to do it

and it would have meant moving up there and it would have meant complications with my family and no, I didn't take it into it. This is really interesting. So it's such an obvious connection, but it's just something that I find really interesting in this moment. And I'm sure they do this often.

They probably at some point recruit people who've been through the programming to head up and lead things. just like the politicians and why not have not just politicians, not just somebody who is, you know, like a Galeigh Maxwell, but also doctors, lawyers, people who in every facet of civilization is there to serve their purposes. They, they put a lot of money into training you for these purposes. Yeah. Wow. And I also think, in retrospect, that the Russians knew, because of my uncle, who was the one who'd put me in the program,

that I was a graduate of the program, and they wondered if they could use me. So are we ever truly free? I think we are. We keep our soul and, you know, listen for the Holy Spirit, which I got to see grow in Russia. I mean, that was the, that was the most powerful experience I had there out of many, many powerful experiences.

But they went from being an atheist nation. I'm talking about Russia, but it's true of all the former republics. They had been forbidden to even speak about God. I mean, you couldn't talk about anything. They talked about your soul. That was okay. So everybody was talking about the status of their soul, inquiring about your soul. And that's the way people talked about religion.

But as soon as the Russian Constitution was signed and the religion and spirituality were no longer illegal, the entire country began to transform. And the first sign of that was bells started appearing everywhere. Beautiful, huge old bells were like rising up. out of the ground. And it's because the people had buried the bells when the KGB was going around destroying the monasteries and the people took the bells, buried them. And through the generations, kept track of where they were. They knew where the bells were. So they just started rising up. And I was working at a hospital in southern Moscow, in Novo Gaijavo. And in front of the, in the middle of the hospital parking lot.

One day they're out there, digging, digging, dingy. And pretty soon this bell comes up. And it's this beautiful, like four foot high, gorgeous bell with church Slavonic riding on it. And it had been buried. It was the Galitin bell. And it was part of an old church that wasn't there anymore that had been buried all those years ago. So then as soon as they could get the bells up on any kind of a structure, they started ringing.

And in the bells, there's frequencies that are very spiritual and extremely nourishing to the soul. And you hear the deep bonging bells and then you hear the little tickling bells, which are the Holy Spirit. And you know what? I really miss them. So I recently decided that I'm going to start collecting. I'm not much of a collector. I've never been much of a collector. but recently because I do enjoy the idea of treasure hunting, history,

landmarks, things like that, I'm going to, I want to find one of these bells that was buried and then brought out of ground. I would like to see if I can get my hands on one of those to collect because I think that story is so fascinating and it's so deep on a spiritual level. I'm going to look into that. I've never heard this before. This is fascinating. There have to be a lot of lost spells because not every family was able to survive and keep track of where they were. So if you go to a site where there had been a church and do some ground penetrating radar, you'll probably start finding all kinds of things. I'll check eBay first. I'll go to Corralia and we'll start digging.

Yeah, you'll find them. Wow, wow. But they're amazing. Yeah, well, I have a couple friends who are treasure hunters. My friend Christian does it down in Texas. And then there's this other podcast, Appalachia Intelligence guys. They're actively doing a treasure hunt right now. And it's just something that I've always been fascinated by the whole idea of treasure hunting.

And there's a couple of sites that I'm personally working on right now. Unfortunately, one's on private property. And I got to get the permission of the owner to even do it. excavation, and the other one is on highly secured government property, which I don't think is an accident. So the government knows what's there. Sometime we need to have a conversation about Starforts. Talk to me.

You're going to dig for treasure. Talk to me now. Star forts. Talk to me now. Well, Star forts are huge structures, obviously built by civilizations much more technically. advanced than ours. And at least two floods ago, because when you start looking at them and excavating, barely any excavation has been done, but start looking at them, there's at least a

couple of mud floods that have buried these things. So it's older than the flood. They're all over the world. They're everywhere in the United States. where I'm living now is right in the middle of one. Wow. The Pentagon is built on top of one. Statue of the Liberty is built on top of one.

Most military bases are built in the middle of them. That's where they got the name forts. It's nothing to do with forts. Nobody knows what they actually are. St. Louis, Chicago, New York, Brooklyn, are all built on top of the Star forts. So they had water that came out of them that seemed to be generated by the rocks. So the rocks of the star fort generate water.

Every site in the Bible that's named where the tribes of Israel migrated to is a star fort. Because they're raised, they're up to 300 feet off the ground. And nobody could really, really knew what these things were until drones. and Google Earth. But, and they exist on old maps. So you get a map from the 1500s of the United States when Sir Walter Rale and John White were mapping out the new world and the colonies.

It's got Starforts on the maps. They later covered them up because of this, some kind of edict. I don't know. I'm researching this, but. Wow. There was an edict of discovery by the Vatican saying that if there was no advanced civilization on a piece of land, you could take it. So they had to cover these up because obviously they were evidence of advanced civilization and they wanted the land.

But they're still there. So we're talking about ancient technology kind of stuff. I feel like I've had... Way beyond. Yeah, I feel like I've heard this mention before now that you're talking about it. you said you're researching it we should have you back on to talk that for for a focus on this sometime if you if you be up for something like that because um star forts man like i think i think i you just give me another rabbit hole to start looking down into it's it's it's it's a key

to something absolutely major and and when you start seeing them you can't stop seeing them they're absolutely everywhere they're all over the united states they're all over russia all over Asia. They're everywhere in the world, and they are these distinct shapes. They look like they were almost created by sound frequencies. And someone in California had a, maybe Washington State,

had a pendulum during an earthquake. And the vibrations of the earthquake actually drew a star fort from the pendulum. Wow. It drew this multi-leaved thing, and then something looked like the eye of horace. So all these things don't come from nowhere. Oh, my gosh.

You know, it's so funny. You just said something that's the star shape is what you, we're talking about star forts. I'm not even thinking about shapes here. So the idea, so there's a fort in Philadelphia. It's called Fort Mifflin. And it is,

it's in this shape of a star. And I, because I've done, I've done digging in, because I've talked to, the fort about doing an excavation there and they laughed at me essentially when I told them I was just a local treasure hunter. They're like, then absolutely not. You were not coming here to stay away. But that's interesting. That's really interesting. I've never really even thought about that.

Well, the military puts forts in the middle of all these structures. They're getting some kind of energy or water. Also, Google data centers are in the middle of these things. The one in St. Louis is huge. It's absolutely huge. And I'll send you some links so you can start looking. But when the settlers came, there was an enormous water tower in St. Louis before there was anything else with a Corinthian looking column on top. It's enormous thing. And it was the source of water for the city. I think it's still there. But they've remodeled it or something. But it's at the head of an enormous. Marma Starfort, which then connects to the Manhattan Project in the east and continues to the north and connects to Cahokia, which are the, are they, they're supposed to be Native American mounds, but they're actually one of the points of the star fort probably have much, much older, including, you know, they found giants there, which then were taken away. but you know what I find so I find interest we don't know nothing no what I find interesting about you is

I was just sitting here listening to talking it just kind of clicked on my brain like you're one of the rare people that uh serves a bridge between this crazy stuff that people talk about like me to this other side of the of people where it's like respected you know educated people uh you know I'm a former truck that's now a podcaster. I don't hold a degree. But you're not just a medical doctor. You were a highly respected medical doctor. I mean, top of your class, all that. I mean, and the fact that you're sitting here talking about this stuff and you were first on the show talking about your personal experience in MK Ultra, like you're like this unique bridge between these two different realities that we don't normally get with people. And I find it fascinating that

one, you look into this stuff, you're willing to talk about it. But also, you have to the backing of your medical degree. And for people like me, like I don't really, I don't really care about degrees. But like the fact is, there's a lot of people out there that, that I think will give you much more credence than maybe another guest saying the exact same thing, just because you do have a medical degree and your history with that. I just, I find it really fascinating. I just do. And this random comment there, but there you go. An interesting guess for you would be to talk to Michael Janich. He's got the site Dutch sense.

And he's the one that is pulling together. He's been studying radar since he was like five. And his father worked for McDonald, Douglas, and Boeing. And he does, now he does a worldwide earthquake prediction report. and forecast and it's incredibly accurate. And if you follow his channel, he's proved that the Earth does not have a solid core just by studying earthquakes. And he's also, because he spent so much time on Google Earth, has been documenting these star forts. And he said that Antarctica is a giant star fort.

And that the antipode to Antarctica is the focus of most of the deep Earth. earthquakes in the world. So he'd be a fascinating, fascinating guest to get on. And he always says the same thing. I'm just a carpenter. You know, I don't have informal education. And he's the most brilliant mind that I've ever listened to. His powers of observation.

And then courage, because he's always being trapped, followed. He discovered a star fort in New York City, apparently. It's a big housing project was built on top of it, actually by the Rockefellers. And within a week of him reporting on it, the park that was there was set on fire. So it was burned and destroyed. And another one where he discovered another Star Fort connected to the St. Louis complex of Starforts called Fort Belferre or Bell River, whatever that was in French. but and the park service has now closed the park and is digging it up so he's on to something the park service that's armed probably oh yeah so he's uh he'd be a he'd be a great wonderful guest

yeah i i think i'm going to be looking him up to and again i'm on which reminds me uh when i interviewed you and put put out that first episode i did it an interview with Dr. Sanger a while back, and she heard the interview with you, and she said she'd be very interested in talking with you. So I think I'd like to have you and her on some time together, because she talks about a lot of different things, and I think you two would get along very well. This is, like, I'm not trying to, I'm not posing somebody that would be, this isn't like a debate. This is somebody who I think would have a great conversation with you, because she talks with a lot of people as well in the realm of what you do and things like that.

So I just think it would be really cool. Dr. Sanger and you coming on together and talking would be a really fun episode, I think. And as long as I think that, then that's what happens because I'm in control of everything here. So that's how I operate, you know? Sure. Sure. I'm looking back in my notes here as to the things that I jotted down here. One thing I wanted to ask you, and this is more along lines of MK Ultra, but I think this was a question that came up a couple of times. And maybe it's because I didn't ask the proper question to get the response out of you. But you did reference the idea a couple of times now at 17 escaping MK Ultra. And I think you meant, I think you even said off the university and you had help. I think in the, and I may not, might be misremembering, but I think in the first interview, I think I didn't do a good job on an ad. asking you, how did you escape MK Ultra programming at 17, if you even remember something,

how that happened? Sure. I was, at that point as a teenager, I was being used as like, they called us party favors. And part of a group that they called the Freaks. And we were skinny, sexy girls with a hair was longer than my skirt. And my skirt was very short. and we were kept for record executive parties. That was my thing.

So they have be big parties in the Laurel Canyon and different canyons. There's like seven of them around Los Angeles. And we burst into the parties and hand out LSD and dance and get everybody high and then get them in compromising positions so they could be photographed and black males. So I was at Esselin. It's now called Esselin, but back then it was called Murphy Hot Springs outside of Monterey. And they had a compound there, and they were bringing in record executives. And we were prisoners there.

There was barbed wire all around. There was no power at that time, so everything was dark. And we were in the middle of a cornfield. There was a hot spring there somewhere, but we weren't able to use it. And they flew in record execs to preview bands. So they always had us girls in the back with tambourines and things, dancing around. And then it was just a few weeks before university was supposed to start.

And I was 17 and I hadn't finished high school. But my high school teachers who knew that, there was something terribly wrong in my life. Help me. They helped me apply to the University of Washington. And we were living in California at the time. And so they helped me apply, help me with letters and support as, you know, really getting behind me as a bright kid.

And then I forged all my. parents' signatures on all the documents and forms and all that, I could still forge their signatures. And I didn't know how I was going to get out of Murphy Hot Springs, but during one of the breaks, when everybody was all drunk and high, a red triumph drove through the gate who had a clicker, and it was my handler whose name was Chip. and he would go out in Monterey and sell blotters of LSD made a lot of money basically selling drugs from his car

and sometimes he took me and I drove so he had a sexy chick with lots of hair driving the car while he sold the blotters of LSD so I knew how to drive the car and he drove in passed out, left the gate open and he was in the driver's seat

and he was a big guy. And so I thought, this is my chance. I'll steal a car. I couldn't get him out because he was too big. I did push him over on the other side, so he was sort of half down on the floor. I got into the car, used the clicker to reopen the gate and took off.

I didn't have any shoes, any money, any purse, any anything, but I was getting out of there. And this is where the Lord came in big time. because I got to the point where I was out of gas, still had this guy in the car, passed out, was freezing cold at, you know, just the skimpy little skirt on and no shoes. And I didn't know what the heck I was going to do.

So I was going to go into this truck stop and pick up, we called them daddies, get a daddy to buy me a meal. And it was like, the Lord said, no, no, you're not going to do that anymore. And so I started looking around the car and out with the glove box. And there was his role of cash. He had this huge roll of 20s from all the blotters of LSD been selling. So I had his money. And then I found that the car was absolutely full of green stamps.

I don't know if you're old enough to have heard of green stamps. Yeah, it's not ringing a bell. You used to get them with gas or different things that you'd buy. When you collected enough, you took it into a, a green stamp distribution center and got pretty much anything you wanted. So I bought gas, bought food, eventually got him out of the car with a nasty confrontation, but drove north and then got on a bus and took the bus to Seattle. And with the drug money and the green stamps, took my place at the University of Washington

and showed up the first day looking like every other little co-ed with the, my tidy skirt and knee socks and pink sweater and neat hair, so that this wild head of hair, and started studying and left it all behind, just left it. I mean, just never thought about it. And the past was gone. And it was college, so, you know, nobody cared where you came from or what you did in high school. It was over. For me, it was really over. So that's how I escaped in a red sports car. It wasn't exactly the story I thought I was going to get, actually. But I thought it was going to be more simple.

But with that, though, when you were in MK Ultra before you escaped, you were still living at a home with your parents. You forged their signatures, things like that. Did they just not ever come looking for you? I mean, it shouldn't have been too hard to find you, right? Well, they did. And we interacted less and less over the years. And then when I started to remember, I went to them and wanted to know what the hell had gone on.

And my mother, I never saw her again until just before she died. And my father started saying, you know, what do you want to know? And then he would tell me something. And I'd say, I don't believe that. And you go, well, how about this? And he'd come up with something else. And finally I said, I'm going to see a psychiatrist. And if I don't see a psychiatrist, I'm going to kill myself.

Because either I'm, if I'm crazy, I am not going to inflict this on my children. And I was absolutely convinced they were better off without me if I was going to be like, what I was remembering was my parents. And my father said, well, if you see a psychiatrist, You'll never see us again. And I said, if I don't see his psychiatrist, I'm going to kill myself. And he goes, well, that's your choice. And it's the last thing he said to me. So I didn't see him again for 20 years.

And I never saw my mother again, except just before she died, she called me. But they made a point of letting me know that they'd gone to Mexico. So they'd left the country. What was that phone call like talking to your mom? Did she ever say, you know, you were right? This is what happened or anything like that? No. And my father didn't either.

And I did ask him several times when he was in his 90s. And he always pretended like he didn't remember anything. He just, he was terrified. He was afraid of, of, I don't know, because he never told me. And the same thing was true that my uncle, he would never tell my cousins anything. In fact, I had all these cousins that are about my age. We never met each other. We didn't know each other existed until I started doing ancestry.

And then suddenly I turned up with all these cousins who are also looking for other people. But the families were all involved in this. That's incredible. That's crazy. It's terrible. It's a crazy life that you've lived. It really is. And I really think that, you know, as bad as the things you went through were, you're using those situations for a better purpose now, you know, and sharing your story, raising awareness to from MK Ultra realities to human trafficking realities and how intimately involved us as Americans are when it comes to human trafficking, we don't even realize it because the systems that are in place that take our tax money fund these kind of things. And so I think you raising awareness and speaking out, and you've been doing it for a long time, has really, it's really, I think you found such a great purpose in life

that I just, I applaud you for doing so and having the guts to come out and talk about this stuff and not worrying about reputations and stuff. I mean, obviously, you threw that that worry away a long time ago. And I think it's really cool that you're doing what you do. Well, I think it's really cool you're doing what you do. You really get it out there. And you obviously have very devoted followers who are sort of leading the edge on waking up. Yeah.

So impressive group, really. Well, on that note, I'm going to wind things down. I think that the followers are awesome and they will take this information and they're going to dig and they're going to share and they're going to raise awareness just through their own channels. People have so much more influence than what they realize. I mean, I'm the guy with a microphone and I have a large reach up front at first. But, everybody listening has a bigger reach than me because collectively you guys have access to millions of people. And so it's really, it's just the domino effect. And the more people listen, the more people start digging and prove to themselves in belief. Because I think it's a big thing. You can sit and listen to something and say, oh, I don't know how I feel about that. But if you can prove to yourself that this is true, and I believe this is true, at that point you really don't have much of an option than to be active in some way, whether it's talking to your spouse or your,

your parents about it and raising awareness that way, to taking it to your own podcast if you're listening and you have a podcast or a YouTube channel. I think it's very important. I think as much as they have tried to brush over the Epstein situation that happened in 2019, I think it was, in August 2019 when he died. As much as they tried brushing that over and carry on business as usual is as much we need to apply pressure and say no more. No more child trafficking. No more human trafficking.

No more MK. Ultra. No more child abuse. It's done. That's it. And really, like I said earlier, and I do mean it, knowing how to approach things appropriately when the time comes. We're living in a society of people who have been manipulated

to be perceived as gutless. I think there's a lot of people out there that are brave, but they don't know how to be brave because they've been manipulated enough through mainstream propaganda to not know which way is up. And I think that if we can find our compass morally, we can truly start to really make a difference in this world. and hopefully in the nick of time because things are getting crazy bad.

And if you're somebody like me, and I'm talking to basically the audience because I know you're a Christian, but if you're somebody like me that is fearing the divine power of God, I think we need to get our ducks in a row quickly because his wrath is being held back by a threat at this point. And I think we need to prepare for that as well. So that's my closing statement. No, go ahead.

I was going to say, we don't want to experience the wrath of God. No. We want to get our act together. He's giving us a chance because the wrath of God is a terrible thing. Exactly. It's not going to come down and wrap you in cotton wool. We're going to be dry bones. Well, that's the show, but I really hope you enjoyed it.

If you did enjoy, please share the show with your friends. I don't care where or how you share the show. Just share the show. If you enjoyed it, because that's the best thing you could do to help the show grow. share the show. And until next week, friends, stay safe. Take care and remember the truth of set you free. But first, it'll piss you off.

Bye.