The Confessionals - RELOADED | 74: The Night Hag and Ouija Board

Episode Date: February 26, 2024

Tonight we bring on Ben to share his experiences with a haunted church he worked at and then later we have Zach share his out of body experiences, night hag experience and the ouija board that started it all.The Confessionals Members App:Apple Store: https://apple.co/3UxhPrhGoogle Play: https://bit.ly/43mk8kZBecome a member for AD FREE listening and EXTRA shows: theconfessionalspodcast.com/joinWatch The Shape of Shadows: https://www.merkel.media/stream-nowWatch Expedition Dogman: https://bit.ly/3CE6Kg0AFFILIATESPrepare with Valley Food Storage: https://alnk.to/2uG55AOGet your Nephilim Blaster 2000: https://alnk.to/9mnHak1Bluecosmo Satellite phones: https://alnk.to/e769EipSee Bigfoot with Sionyx night vision: https://alnk.to/bEhxr3FEmergency medical with My Medic: https://alnk.to/dpr6QM4Black Beard Fire Starters: https://alnk.to/4BFcIbeEcoFlow Power Generators: https://alnk.to/flvpAQwGoDark Faraday Bags: https://alnk.to/5jke3rkEMP Shield: empshield.com Coupon Code: "tony" for $50 off every item you purchase!SPONSORSFACTOR MEALS: factormeals.com/confessionals50SIMPLISAFE TODAY: simplisafe.com/confessionalsHello Fresh: hellofresh.com/confessionalsfree Promo Code: "confessionalsfree" for FREE BREAKFAST FOR LIFE!!!CONNECT WITH USWebsite: www.theconfessionalspodcast.comEmail: [e-mail] to the Newsletter: https://www.theconfessionalspodcast.com/the-newsletterMAILING ADDRESS:Merkel Media257 N. Calderwood St., #301Alcoa, TN 37701SOCIAL MEDIASubscribe to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/2TlREaIReddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/theconfessionals/Discord: https://discord.gg/KDn4D2uw7hShow Instagram: theconfessionalspodcastTony's Instagram: tonymerkelofficialFacebook: www.facebook.com/TheConfessionalsPodcasTwitter: @TConfessionalsTony's Twitter: @tony_merkel

Merkel Media I guess it's time to go back in time Are you telling me you built a time machine Out of a Dolion Time is but a stubborn illusion I have a lot of memories

Of the past People are time traveling within themselves Time travel Is possible This was all circulating around the base that a giant had been killed but no one was supposed to talk about it. fingers reach up underneath the door,

curl up to grab it, and then disappear. When he came over to me, dude, he slithered over to me. And this giant comes out of the cave and they're all frozen. And he starts running and firing at this giant. With a giant move, he's got a spear in one hand, and he's running really fast.

And spears, Dan, holds him up like this. this. Somebody else. Shoot him in the face. Shoot him in the face. They basically decapitated. He got about 15 yards away. I feel something pulling at my leg. And I look over and there are two small gray entity pulling it. And they're literally, I'm getting pulled off the bed. I reached my hand into this bush and I touch air. Couldn't breathe and I couldn't move because I know I'm seeing a monster. Okay, I reloaded. Welcome to the show, everybody. You are listening to The Confessionals. I am your host, Tony Merkel, and thank you for being here.

If you had an encounter or a story you'd like to share on the show, go ahead and shoot me an email. Or you can go to the website, the confessionalspodcast.com, hit the connection section, and you can reach me that way as well. Either way it works for me. Just get a hold of me. Now, this week, we have Zach coming on the show, and Zach has had some really heavy experiences with out-of-body experiences and also some hauntings that came from dealing with a Ouija board. and he's actually encountered a night hag that has left an impression on him that he probably won't forget for the rest of his life. But before we get to Zach, we're going to bring on Ben, who actually has experienced another haunting church.

We've heard several stories like this, but the church that he was being a janitor in was haunted. And he comes on to share what he experienced and what he saw in that church. And we're going to bring on both these guys right after this. Okay, tonight I have a great guest coming on. I have Ben and Ben, we had a technical difficulty and we're back on and I'm really glad we're able to get this bad boy going because I'm really excited to hear about your interview that you have coming tonight. Now, you've had some experiences as a custodian in a church,

some haunting experiences and anything from shadow figures to creepy feelings to possibly seeing a demon. So why don't you walk us into exactly what happened with the whole demon situation? I'm very interested to hear about this. What did you see? how did it unfold? What happened? All right, yeah. So I was doing my normal rides and locked up, locking up the building. And I was upstairs making sure doors are locked. Windows are closed, lights were off, that sort of thing. And upstairs, it's like a big open room with classrooms on the side of the classroom.

And so I was getting back on the elevator to go back downstairs. but I looked straight across from where I was and there was a classroom on that side and they had two duct doors. It's like a door with a crack in the middle and like two doors for the opening. Right. And I was looking across that and I just see like these two hands come out from the side of the door. and then I saw this like dark, dark face looking at me, peer out from behind the door,

and then I just went slowly back behind the door, and then moved his hands with it. And I was just like, yep, that's it. I'm going home. So I didn't even finish, I didn't even finish locking up the door. So. Holy cow. So, all right, so I know you're just talking about the Dutch doors

where it's split, you know, horizontally and the top half open. opens and the bottom half opens, kind of like a barn door. And so a lot of the nurseries have those kind of things in churches. And so when you, like you said you saw hands come out from the room across the door? Yep. It was like, yeah, it was like peering out from behind the door. Now, were these hands kind of like grabbing onto the door like they were going to open it or they kind of grabbing around the side of the wall?

What were the hands doing when you first saw them? because that's got to be one of the most creepiest things before you see the face come forward. You can imagine, like, being behind the door and just, like, peering out and looking at somebody, like you're going to scare them, you know? That's what it was kind of looking like. And, yeah, these hands were pretty creepy looking. Before we get into that, are you meaning that whatever it was was behind the door and the hands kind of came around the door and then the head peered out from behind the door,

or was it behind the wall? it was behind the door. Gotcha. Okay. Well, that's pretty darn creepy. So these hands, how many fingers, how big, how small, could you describe what you saw, man? Yeah. It looked like it had a thumb. It looked like probably four fingers. And it was like, they were like extra long, extra skinny. it was kind of like a green red color and it looked scaly to me when I saw them.

So you said they looked kind of greenish-reddish. I find that interesting because if you combine the colors green and red, I'd imagine you'd probably get kind of like a brownish color. And I just did a live interview today for the patrons with Zach King. We had him on for episode 61. And, you know, he's the ex-Satantic High Wizard.

and he described what a demon looks like. And he said a lot of times they're like a real dark brown or black. And so the greenish red is interesting. Now, when you say that, though, was it like spotted? Like this parts was green, parts was red, or was it kind of like a greenish red tint? I'm just trying to picture this in my mind. Yeah, it kind of was more like a greenish red tint to it.

Like it would move, it moved its hands and it would like turn to greening and then. moved its hands, it would be turned red, you know. It was kind of that sort of thing. Wow. Wow. Wow. So how long was this ordeal? Was it like you saw the hands coming and then immediately after the face came or was this something where you saw the hands or looked at him? And like, what is that? And all of a sudden the face appears. How did this, like, how long was this ordeal? Just a few seconds or a minute? Pretty quick. It was like the hands went out and then the face for, you know, probably two to three seconds after I saw the hands. And then the face just went slowly back behind the door,

and he brought his hands with it. That's stuff made of nightmares. Did you attend this church as somebody who went to church there? I did, yes. I grew up going to that church with my family and everything. Now, did you tell anybody about what you saw? I honestly did not tell that many people after it, because I was just, like, too nervous to tell people because it's a Christian Reformed Church

and not too many people are, like, you know, sensitive about that subject. And it's like, it's, you got to pick who you want to talk to about it, you know. No, I totally get it. Absolutely 100% get it. And it's one of my pet peeves is the fact that, you know, here we are Christians. We say we believe the Bible, but we really don't believe the Bible in its complete nature. Because if you actually believe what the Bible talks about, you would know that demons are real. This is a very real thing.

And you shouldn't be scared to talk about it. You should be very open and accepting of somebody who says they've seen something like this because it talks about it in the Bible. And so it's something that's very frustrating for me because, you know, there's people out there like you. There's lots of people out there like you that experience these kinds of things, but you don't know where to go with it because who are you going to talk to? You can't talk to, you know, half the people at your church because they're going to think you're crazy. And that's a shame, you know? I had a guy on my show who had some haunting experiences in his house. And he was down in his basement.

He has these experiences. And then he's telling me, you know, I don't know what to do with this because I'm a Christian. I'm not supposed to believe in this stuff, but this actually happened. And I said, no, you're wrong. I said, dude, this stuff actually does happen. And it's okay to believe this happens because it's very real. You know, so I feel bad for you, man. I really do.

I wish you would have been able to talk to something. at the church about it. Did you tell anybody or did you never really talk about it? I ended up telling the children's pastor about it, and he believed me right away, you know, and he was like, yeah, we got to tell somebody about that so we can do something. And we got around somehow to like youth group, and they ended up actually praying these things out of the upstairs of the building so I can be comfortable doing my job. did it work? Did you feel more comfortable?

Oh yeah, it definitely worked. Like, there was this part in the upstairs, like these back classrooms that I just hated going back there. And after the youth to pray these things out, it was all better, you know? So it definitely worked. I know what you mean, man. Like, there's churches can be creepy. They really can. Like, it's weird to say that.

But, you know, churches really can be. a creepy place. And I've had creeped out in churches and stuff myself. You know, the church I grew up in. Speaking of those kind of doors that you saw this thing at, there's a nursery that had that kind of door. But you would go into the nursery and then you'd go and there's like a back room behind the nursery. And it was like, it was just kind of like a really out in the middle of nowhere kind of room to be put. And for some reason when I was a kid growing up, that room always bothered me. Always. And so, you know, I totally get it. I've had, and I've shared the show before some of my, um, things that I've felt about,

you know, like I had a dream. For me, I had a really, a crazy dream. And I've talked about it on the show before, but, you know, it's like sometimes you just don't know what to make of it, you know? And, uh, yeah. So I don't want to, I don't want to rehash that, though. But, um, so that, that's a very interesting thing, man. you saw these hands, you see this face. Now, did you see the whole face, like the outline? Like,

like if you were looking at me, you would see my head and all that. Is that how clear you saw this thing, or was it more like a figure where you saw like almost like a shadow figure peering out with, you know, eyes and stuff like that? So just the shadow of it. Like, I couldn't see any features of it. It looked like it was part of the body, but yeah, it was just completely dark. it was darker than what the room was. Gotcha. Yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about. Like, it's a dark room, but whatever it was, was darker than a room, so you could see

a little bit of it, but you couldn't see the whole thing. And I totally get it. Totally get it. So with this whole experience that you had, when you look back at that, do you think if, for instance, I know you would never have done this, I wouldn't have done it. But if you would have saw that thing and ran into the room to find it and it didn't disappear in front of you, but you saw it, do you think you would have done it? saw something very physical or did it seem something that was more um obviously it's supernatural

but do you think it was more ghostly like or was it a very physical looking thing to you uh to me it looked very very physical and yeah i think i'm sure i would have seen something if i ran through and checked it out um yeah those those hands were just solid and i was just like yeah that's that's real you know yeah no i get it man i definitely wouldn't have chased it myself i i think most people would have just turned around around like you did uh because that's just crazy stuff i mean you know bigfoot's one thing but when you're looking at a demon it's a totally different thing so uh i totally get it brother so you had that experience you share it with the youth pastor he believes you the kids pray over you know the church and you're feeling more comfortable but i

know that's not the only experience you had at the church. You've had, you know, experiences where you felt uneasy. You think you might have seen shadow people. Can you tell us about that at all? Yeah, this all happened, you know, way before I saw the demon. The demon was just like the top of the top of what I saw. But, yeah, with the shadow people, I was upstairs in those back classrooms. And I was checking to see how one of our volunteers was doing. She was just cleaning one of the classrooms up there. And I was talking to her and all of a sudden I'm, I, she has her back towards me or she's looking at me.

And I look behind her and I just see this shadow person standing behind her. It looked like her shadow, but it wasn't. And all of a sudden I just see it move quickly out of the room that it was in. And it was like it went straight through the wall and disappeared. And that's when you know you saw something unusual. Yep. So how old were you when this happened? This was only probably three, four years ago.

So that was 24, 25. Okay. And you said the demon incident happened after this. Yep. Gotcha. So this is a church that you grew up in, but you didn't experience things your entire life there. This is more of a recent thing that's,

started happening. Yeah, yeah. I never really experienced anything before I started working at the church. Gotcha. Okay. Well, it would make sense if you're working at the church, you're there more often, you're there by yourself, things like that. Now, you see this thing, and how tall was it? Like, was it really tall? Was it shorter? What was it like? Um, it probably was around, I want to say, like, six, five, six, six. And it was pretty, it was like a skinny shadow. Okay. So was it like a, have you ever heard the rake now? That's not what I'm thinking of. I can't remember. I can't remember what it is. But I forget what it's called. So when you say, when you say it's, it was skinny. I mean, was it like really skinny or was it just like almost like

a skinny person? It was pretty skinny. Yeah. It was like, they look like a six foot six tall, really skinny person. Okay. Now, did it have a hat? I can't. I don't think it did. Okay. Just making sure we're not dealing with a hat man. Okay.

Yeah, because a lot of people talk about this hat man, and it's a completely dark shadow figure, and a lot of times it has a Victorian hat or a Federo, and my wife has actually seen it. And so she, on episode 3, she talks about her experience with the hat man and then her and I kind of run through paranormal things that happened to her mostly her throughout her entire life so very good episode I highly encourage people to check it out but when you saw this how long

how long of a period was this when you first laid eyes on it to the time it walked through the wall how long were you looking at this thing I had to be looking at it probably a good 10 seconds because I think it was trying to make me think that it was part of the girl's shadow that I was talking to. And as soon as I realized that it wasn't, you know, and then it just took off. Gotcha. Okay. So you're saying that there was actually somebody else there, though?

Yep. And, yeah, I had to stop. We were just, I wasn't seeing how she was doing with everything. And I actually had to stop the conversation to go check out the other room that I saw the shadow in. And she was asking you, like, what do you see? What do you see? And I was like, oh, I think I just saw a shadow person.

What was her reaction? She was like, really? Like, I think I've been seeing stuff around this place too. So I was just like, oh, okay. Now, see, now we're getting somewhere because now you have somebody else who thinks they've been seeing stuff, you've been seeing stuff,

and all of a sudden, you probably didn't feel so alone with that. Yep, exactly. Well, how many times have you seen, like, a shadow person? I mean, was that your first, second, third time? I feel like I probably saw that thing maybe two, three times in the building. Okay. Was it all the same place or was it throughout the entire building?

Yeah, it was pretty much all over the place. Like, it wasn't really contained in one area. So this shadow person that you see, and then I'm saying, I think you said the most recent thing that happened was the demon encounter, right? Yeah, that was like the last thing that happened there. do you think it's the same thing or do you think it's two different things i honestly think they were different because the shadow person doesn't seem as scary as the demon then as well okay yeah i mean a lot of times people think that you know it's the same thing uh that all all supernatural

ghosts entities like that uh are demons and uh i don't i don't necessarily agree with that at one time in my life I did. But the older I get, the more I think about these things, the more I think that there are other things happening here that aren't as easy to explain. But when you read in the Bible that King Saul went to a witch to summon the Spirit of Samuel and he actually talked to the Spirit of Samuel, all of a sudden, that wasn't a ghost. That wasn't a demon. That was Samuel talking to Saul. And if that's possible in the Bible, then clearly, clearly, clearly, that's possible today. And what else is possible today? You know, so I definitely think that there's a lot of things going on that we can't even begin to understand or explain. But those are some crazy experiences, man, for real.

I know you said that you were always feeling like creeped out and stuff. Was that just like when you were by yourself or was there ever a situation where you're around a bunch of people and you just got this creeped out feeling. Well, we actually had this one experience I had together with one of my coworkers. We were cleaning up after an event. It was like late at night. It was after a graduation ceremony that we had there. And we were cleaning up in the sanctuary.

And all of a sudden, we started hearing two women talking to each other out of the blue. It was so, it was so random. We had no idea what was going on. So we ran out to the turning for us to see if there are people out there and there was nobody out there. And, yeah, it was just two women talking queer as they. Do you remember what they were saying? No, I can't remember. But, yeah, they were talking to each other, definitely.

Wow. Yeah, see, that kind of stuff's got to be creepy, man. That's just, it's just shivers down my spine, just thinking about going through that, especially at church. It's just something about the fact. that I don't know. Like, I mean, you're at a church and you're already creeped out and then you had these experiences and stuff.

I would have a hard time going back to that church, man. You still attend that church? I don't anymore since I don't work there anymore. So in my family, those are different church now, too. Okay, got you. Well, I mean, I don't know. I think I probably would have left the church after that experience anyways. I'm out.

I'll see you later. Yeah, it wasn't too bad. But, you know, it was just, it was a job. And I had to stick with it. Yeah, I totally get that, man. Well, Ben, I really appreciate you coming on talking about this stuff. I mean, this is a very interesting thing. Have you ever heard the episode that I did?

I actually did two different episodes with Haunted Churches. Have you heard those shows yet? I don't think I have. I'll send them to you. I'll forward them to you in an email. You should check them out because similar situations, very similar. And I think, yeah. I mean, not completely. They're not identical at all, but it's definitely, obviously, it's similar.

Both of them happened in the church just like yours, but, you know, the one guy came on, he's from Canada. He's an English guy in Canada, so it's kind of, it's funny. He's actually turned into a pretty good friend of mine. I razz him about it. But so he comes on and he talks about how his parents were working with their pastor, and they were going through some things and some just a lot of weird demonic stuff going on and their lives and things like that. And it turns out, long story short, there was a painting that was given to the pastor

or a drawing or something that he put up on the wall. It was Jesus on the cross and the two people on the cross next to him on each side. And the pastor one day started having this vibe or feeling that this word in his head, Baphimack, kept coming into his head. And so he asked this guy's father, you know, what a Baphmet was. And he's like, and he told him what a Baphimit was.

And Baphimit's, you know, a goat-like entity, like demonic entity that is worshipped by Satanus. And he said, I keep hearing this word Baphomet. And so he's looking through his church to see if there's anything that resembles that. And that picture that was given to him by this lady when he first took over the church, he turned it upside down and in Jesus's beard was drawn a Baphomet. And so like there was like this whole like apparently there's a satanic coven that was trying to attack their church. And it was just a very interesting story. And then then another couple comes on and shares their experience at their church.

So I'll send them to you and you can check them out and stuff like that. But Ben, I really appreciate coming on and sharing these stories, man. Yeah, you're welcome. Thanks for having me. Absolutely. brother. If you ever have anything else, let me know. All right. Sounds good. Thank you. Okay, well, that was Ben, and hopefully you enjoyed that short little interview there.

He definitely had some crazy experiences inside that church. And, you know, it's a common theme throughout this show now. We definitely get a lot of people contacting us and sharing stories of haunted churches that they either attended, worked in, or knew of. So that said, let's bring on Zach and have him start sharing his experiences of outer body experiences, the night hag, Ouija boards, and all that. We're going to bring on Zach right after this. Okay, tonight I have a great guest coming on.

I have Zach. Zach, how you doing, man? Dude, how are you? I'm doing well, doing well. Thanks for bearing with me. I was running late coming home from work today, and it's been a long day. So I'm glad we're here talking to you. So, you know, you kind of emailed me a few months back and stuff talking about your

paranormal experiences with more out-of-body things, but I know that you had some other stuff happen early in life. So, you know, why don't you just kind of start us in the beginning and kind of walk us through how things developed for you throughout your life here? Okay. Sounds great. So my paranormal experiences started when I was around six years old. My family and I actually were out shopping one evening and we were driving home and we passed an ambulance coming across the railroad tracks. And when we arrived home, back in that day, we still had answering machines. So we got home and my parents saw that they had a few messages on the answering machine. So they checked them and it was my aunts and my grandma all calling hysterical, telling us that my grandpa had had a heart attack and that he was in the hospital and they didn't think he was going to make it.

And then by the time my dad had called them back, they let us know that my grandpa had died. So I took it really hard. We were actually really close. So when I'll say probably two or three nights later, I was laying in bed, trying to go to sleep. And I had a little fishbowl. It wasn't a fish tank.

There were no kind of anything that would create any kind of bubbles or anything. and it was just a little goldfish with a little inside of a little fish bowl. And I heard a voice that sounded exactly like my grandpa's voice saying, Zach, help me, Zach, help me. And it was definitely, it was an experience. It was a frightening experience, that's for sure. And that's kind of what started my paranormal experiences. From then on out, I had just a little experience.

experiences like where I'd see something or a door would lock with me inside it or just little things. Nothing really big happened again until I was about 15 or 16. And we had a completely finished basement. And I had on one side, my brother's bed was on one wall and then my bed was across the way on the other wall. And my brother, he didn't like to, he didn't like to sleep downstairs for some reason in the bed. So he'd always go upstairs in the living room. He'd always sleep in a sleeping bag.

So one night I was, I was laying in bed. I was asleep and I woke up. I don't know why I woke up. I felt like something was watching me. And so I woke up and I saw a figure sitting over on my brother's bed. And it was kind of, kind of blue, like a light blue. I can't remember if it was glowing or not. But, I mean, it was, it was obviously in the pitch black.

I could see it. So it had some kind of glow. But it was, I could tell it had long hair. It was kind of stringy, long hair. But it had his head down, kind of like with his hands together, it almost looked like it was like in a praying posture. And so I closed my eyes and just kind of gave it a second. open, then it was going to go away, open my eyes again, and now I was standing up in front of my brother's bed.

And I could tell that it was a woman. It was an older woman, probably, I would say she looked like she was in her 80s. And she just stood there. She kept standing there. And so I closed my eyes again, kind of just hoping it would go away, opened my eyes again. And she was a little closer. She was in the center of the room now. and closed my eyes again, opened them again.

Now she was standing right in front of me in my bed. And so I closed my eyes again. And I was just praying, hoping she would go away and open my eyes again. She was gone. And that was the last time that I had seen her. And then the next experience that was pretty big was actually in base. training when I was down in San Antonio, Texas, we had what we called Beast Week. So that was basically when we went out in the field and kind of just did a mock scenario of how it would be for a week out in the field if we were deployed, not being able to take showers, having to eat MREs, that kind of thing.

And so we did that. and when we came back, they switched up our whole living arrangements and we had to, we had to go into new dorms. And so during that period of time, that's when I was in basic training, that's when that first H1N1, the bird flu, that first strain of it had come out. And all those people were getting really sick from it and dying. and we actually had a few people from, we were team three, and then team eight, they were some of the newer recruits that had came in.

They had, I think, three or four different recruits actually died from bird flu during that time. And so when we returned back to our base in San Antonio to get ready for graduation week, I had got placed in a room by myself. And so I got in there. First night went okay.

And then the second night, I started hearing rumors about the fact that I was actually in one of the rooms that one of the recruits had died in. And so I started kind of feeling a little uneasy about it, thought it was kind of weird. And so there was a girl that I was talking to. Just like a little internet kind of Facebook thing when it first started. And so we were talking on the phone that night. And while we were talking, I was laying in bed, had the lights off.

And all of a sudden I felt kind of like something was like pushing up from underneath my bed. Like kind of like when you're messing with your brothers or your siblings, you're on the bottom bunk and you're kind of kicking up on that top bunk. it kind of felt like that. And so I kind of thought it was weird, but I didn't think anything of it. I thought maybe the springs are popping or something. And so we kept talking, and all of a sudden, I started hearing what I sounded like boot, like footsteps and boots, kind of coming from around the corner where the bathroom was and coming towards my bedroom, towards the bed where I was.

And so I'm like, hey, I hear footsteps. And I was telling her, and she was kind of freaking out. And I was kind of starting to get uneasy about it. And as I was talking to her about it, I kind of felt, I heard the footsteps get closer and closer and closer. And then I heard they almost like stomp, like right at the end of the bed. And as they stopped at the end of the bed, I heard that stomping sound, all of a sudden the bed from underneath just started shaking violently, like somebody was just kicking it as hard as they could from underneath.

And yeah, it was definitely, definitely creepy. And so I told her, I'm like, I was freaking out. I was like, I jumped out of bed and I was like, I got to get out of this room. But when you're in basic training like that, like you're on a lockdown. So I couldn't go out into the hallways. I couldn't do anything because I didn't want to get in trouble. I was a week away from being able to see my family. family. So I didn't want to, I didn't want to do anything that was going to get me in any kind of

trouble. So I just kind of had to suck it up. And so I, I stayed in there. I turned the lamp on beside my bed and I just kind of had to stay in there all night. I was terrified. And, uh, I kept urine footsteps throughout the night. The toilet flushed itself. It was just a bunch of weird things like that, but fast forward into, I actually probably a year later, deployed to Kuwait, and we were over in KCAIA doing refueling and just doing security up there. And so I was in barracks with more like a dorm room kind of thing. and it was me and two other guys. And so we built inside our rooms.

We kind of, it was like we had three bunk beds, but there's only three of us. So we kind of each took like a part of the room. And we took like blankets and sheets and everything, kind of like made our own little, own little hideouts, like our own little section of the room. That way we kind of just could stay to ourselves and have our privacy. And so one night I,

I woke up because somebody was like a deep male voice was screaming my name like Zach like Zach. And so I woke up and I was like, what in the world? And so I just like gave it a little bit and I didn't hear anything else. And I'm like, okay, you know, maybe one of the guys that's just messing with me. And so I went back to sleep and I woke up and it was an even deeper like growling like scream like Zach. And so I woke up and I kind of pulled the sheets off of the, away from the bed and kind of went out to look and see if one of the guys was messing with me. And so I looked and they were both completely fast to sleep. And so at this time, this kind of, the days leading up after that kind of started my out-of-body experiences to where I think it's when they were starting.

I don't think I was actually having them yet, but I was starting to have the sensations that actually went along with them to where I would fall asleep and it would almost feel like my body was being drained of all this energy while I was sleeping. And I'll wake up and I'd have like this pressure in my head. And it would just feel like, I don't know, it's so hard to explain. I don't know. Like, it's kind of how you would think. If you had a stroke or something, I don't, I don't know how else to explain it. It's just, that's a weird thing to try to explain. But, so they, those, the sensations began, begin starting when I was trying to sleep at night while it deployed.

And after I had heard those voices, and one night we had a girl that was deployed with us named Sashi. And so you're the rules why you're deployed, you know, males only in the room. Females can't be a male's room. Males can't be a female room. So one night I was asleep and I had like a little TV stand with a TV inside my little space that I had. And so I was asleep and I woke up. I felt like something was watching me. And so when I woke up, I looked and in front of me I could just kind of.

to tell like there was a figure kind of like sitting on the floor and so I like I was kind of rubbing my eyes just trying to get my eyes to kind of get used to the dark and as my eyes started getting used to the dark I saw that it was a female figure and she was sitting Indian style kind of right beside that um that nightstand and I kept looking and looking I'm like that's Sashi and I was like, Sashi, what are you doing in my room? I'm like, you know, you can't be in here. And it just kept looking at me. It was staring right through me, but it wouldn't say anything.

And I'm like, Sashi, you got to get out of here. You're going to get us in trouble. And she wouldn't say anything. And I'm like, Sashi. And I kind of reached out to like, kind of touch her shoulder to be like, hey, what are you doing? And when I went to touch her shoulder, she just disappeared. Wow. And, yeah, it was very weird.

So then after we had left Kuwait, we went back to our home station, which was Northern Hall, England is where I was stationed at from my first duty station. And so we went back. We kind of had a dorm set up there as well. It was almost like apartments, like a three-story apartment. So I was on the third floor. And I was dating a girl back in Ohio at that point. and every couple months she would fly out to England, stay with me for a little bit,

and then every couple months I'd fly back up to, back up home to Ohio, I wouldn't stay with her, take some leave. So she had actually, she had come out for Christmas that year. And so I had her saying, I went out, bought a Christmas tree, did everything I could to kind of make it feel as homey and Christmas as I could for. So while she was staying there for that week, we just, we kept having random little things. We had like a Coke can was sitting on a nightstand kind of off the wall from my bed. And we were laying there in bed one night, watching TV.

And the Coke can, we kind of, you can kind of hear like, you know, the sound that a Coke can make, like if you kind of slide it. we heard that and so I like I paused I paused moving like do you hear that she's like yeah I was like what was that and so we're looking around I think it was that cocaine I think it moved and she's like no I didn't move I'm like I think it did and so we started we resumed the movie I started watching it again next thing we knew that cocaine slid completely off the table and it was on the ground and so I picked it up and I was like she's like what's going on I'm like I don't know I was like, I told you I'm haunted.

I told you something's going on. And she's like, that's not even funny. Don't say that. And so we were laying there again the next couple nights. And the toilet was flushing itself. I had no roommates. So there's no reason for that toilet to be flushing. And then the faucet, the sink faucet, it would turn itself off and on, off and on.

and so it was just little things like that and the final night that she was staying there we were laying in bed and I had the closet was basically on the other side of the wall from where our heads would lay on the bed and I had like a bunch of shelving up in there because I was, I collected a bunch of like DVDs and I had like all my PlayStation games and everything in there

kind of just like lined up threw out there in like two different shelves. And so we were laying there in bed and just heard this massive crash come from the closet. And I'm like, oh, man. I was like, I think my shelves just broke. I think all my movies are probably down on the ground. And so we got up out of bed to look and nothing. Nothing was on the ground.

Everything was the same way it was many other time. nothing had fallen off the walls, off the shelves, anything. And so she had gone home back to Ohio, and it was a few days after Christmas. I still had the Christmas tree up, and I had an angel topper on top of the Christmas tree. And so I was laying in bed one night, and I was starting to have those feelings again where I was having in Kuwait, where I was just felt like I was being drained while I was sleeping. And so this night, I woke up to this huge crashing sound again. And so I woke up and I turned the light on.

I'm like, what is that? What is that? And so when I turned the light on, I noticed that some of the bulbs from the tree, they were laying like all over the all over the room and just different spots like they had been thrown off the tree and i was like wow well that's really weird that's creepy and so i looked on the top of the tree and the angel topper was missing oh no no no no no and so i'm looking all over and in that sink area so like the front door if you look directly across that was kind of like the vanity area where the sink was.

And back there in that vanity area was the angel and the angel's head was busted off. And at that point, that's when I knew, I felt like, hey, this has got to be something dark that's messing with me. And so a few nights later, you know, I, one of my, one of the girls that lived, I think she was about two or three doors. down from me. She was a self-reclaimed Wiccan. And she, uh, she knocked on the door and saw I answer and I was like, hey, what's up? And she said, hey, do you happen to have a can opener that I could borrow? And I was like, yeah, I think so. I was like, hey, go ahead. You can come in. And so she came in. She was standing there. And as soon as she kind of got in more into the the dorm room, she was like, what's in here?

And I was like, what do you mean? What are you talking about? And she said, she said, there's something really dark in here. And I was like, do you feel it too? And she was like, yeah, I feel it. She's like, it's a female spirit. And I was like, okay, well, that's weird. And so I thought it was weird that she felt it too.

And she's like, you mind if I bring some stones over and, you know, and kind of do a little blessing thing and stick them on top of the doorways. And I was like, it can't hurt anything. I was like, sure. And so she did it. She brought it in. And I mean, it helped for the most part. But nothing, nothing, I guess I can say nothing else happened big.

But the out-of-body experiences started after that night. completely on put. So I had the same feelings of where something was like draining me of all my energy again. But now at this point, I could, I was standing at the end of my bed and I could see myself sleeping. And so it, but I couldn't move. I couldn't go any further. All I could do was just kind of stand there and watch myself sleeping. And then I end up back in my box.

body. And I'd wake up and I'd have that pressure in my head and completely drained of all my energy. And this went on for nights and nights and nights. And then it seemed like each night, I could move just a little more until I could finally get to where I could open a door. And then I could get into my kitchen. And then when I get in my kitchen, I could open some covers. And then this lasted for about 30 nights, about a month. And the 30th night, I came back, but when I came back into my body, I had those feelings again, but it was, it was different. Like, this time I couldn't breathe.

I couldn't move. I couldn't talk. I couldn't do anything. And my room was pitch black. completely dark. Like normally, you know, I could see something,

some kind of light was coming out from outside, but I couldn't see anything this time. It was just completely dark like I was blind. And so now to the darkness, all of a sudden, I saw a figure floating above me, and it was, she was completely black.

And I could tell that she had like a black veil kind of over her face. and she was, I don't even want to say illuminating, but I could start to see her out of the complete pitch black. And the only thing, so when I was looking at her, like she was forcing me to stare into her face, and her face was pasty white, and her eye sockets, like there was just big black eye socket. She had no eyes.

It was just big black eye sockets, no nose. And the only thing that I can think of to describe what she looked like was, if anybody's seen the newer Sleepy Hollow with Johnny Depp, when he goes into this little cave area to look for that witch, and she pulls up that black veil and she had what she looks like, those no eye sockets and kind of just like a cracky, like white, look in face with like the little cracks in and everything that's that's the only way i can describe visually for people to think of what she looked like is that's what it looked like um

and i actually had forgotten uh about a wigi board experience that i think started all of this stuff um yeah when when i was 18 uh uh I went back home to Ohio before because I knew I was about to join the military. And so one of my buddies that I had actually met at MEPs through the military, the whole enrolling process, he was like, hey, we should do something of fun before we leave. And I was like, yeah, I'm like, hey, you want to go up to Ohio? He's like, yeah, definitely. And so we went up to Ohio and we're just kind of hanging out with all my old friends and everything.

and we had one of my friends, Katie, we were like, hey, you know, you want to go hang out with us tonight? We're going to go over to my grandparents had went to visit one of my uncles over in California. And so my other uncle was watching their house for them. And he's like, hey, you guys come over, we can hang out and just chill. And I'm like, yeah. So we invited her over. and she was like, yeah, let's go. So we all went over and we were hanging out and my uncle's like, hey, you guys,

I ever played a Ouija board? And I'm like, I don't want to touch with that stuff, man. I don't want to do that. And he's like, we should do it, we should do it. And I was like, I don't know, I don't know. And he's like, there's a, in that house, like, there's a foyer. It's a really old house. And there's a, the foyer area.

When you come through the front door, it's always, we've all, all. the whole family, we've always felt just like a darkness, like a presence in that area. And so he's like, let's just go. Let's go in the foyer. You know, it's creepy in there. It'll be fun. And I'm like, okay, whatever. So we went up, we went upstairs in the upstairs area above the foyer.

And so we sat on the floor and we put candles around us. We started playing with a Ouija board. And so we started asking it questions and we weren't really getting anything at first. And so we kept asking, asking if anybody's there. And finally, it started, yes. It said yes. Somebody's here. And so we asked if it was good spirit or bad spirit.

And it said good. And we're like, okay. And so we kept asking a few more questions. And then it just kind of started acting like it was freaking out. And so we're like, is this still the good spirit? And it said no. And we're like, well, who is it now? And it spelled out Bippin.

And we're like, okay, well, that's kind of a weird name. And we're like, what are you here for? And it's spelled out to kill. And we said, to kill who? And I already had this feeling in my stomach. I'm like, I know it's going to spell out of that. I know it. And so next thing you know, it goes to the Z.

And so I take my hand off my chin. And I'm like, no, I'm not, I'm not messing with this anymore, guys. I'm like, I know exactly what it's going to spell. It's going to spell Zach. And so they're like, just come on, just come on. And so I put my hand back on. And then it went to the A and then a C and then H spelled out my name. And so I was freaking out.

And I'm like, what, what? And they're like, why do you want to kill Zach? And so it just spout because. We're like, how are you going to kill Zach? And it spelled out nice. And we said, we said, where? And it spelled out basement. And so I'm like, I'm done, I'm done.

I'm going. I'm leaving. I'm not messing with those anymore guys. And so my uncle was like, hey, don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. We're just messing. We were just playing with you. It's all fake.

It's all fake. Yeah, it was us. We were moving it? And I was like, were you guys moving it? And they're like, no, we weren't moving it. And my uncle was like, yes, you were, yes, you were. And I'm like, okay. And I was like, well, there's only one way to figure out, you know, if you guys are

mess with me or not. I'm like, I guess I'll go to the basement. So I walked down the stairs and I started walking through the floor, you're back in the living room. And I was walking towards the basement door. And Uncle stopped me and he's like, dude, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it. And I was like, why, it's just fake? You said, you're moving it.

And he's like, no, I wasn't moving it. And I was like, okay. So it was that was a little freaky, but fast forward. So after England, I went to Mississippi, Columbus, Mississippi for my last duty station. And so I had, when I got onto flight, I started meeting some new people. And so I met this guy, Michael. And so he's like, hey, man, you want to? You want to come over. We're having a party this weekend. Do you want to come over with, you know, with some of the guys and, you know, you can meet my wife and we're all just going to hang out and just chill? I'm like, yeah, that's cool. And so we go there that weekend. We're all just kind of hanging out, chilling, talking, having a few drinks. And him and his wife and I, we started kind of,

kind of hit my home, you know how to say, like hitting it off, kind of just like, hey, you know, hey, we like the same kind of music. We're both into horror films with all the stuff. And, hey, we both, we both seen a lot of weird things and heard a lot of weird things since we were a little kid. And so she told me that she, she was a sensitive and that she felt, she kind of felt something around me, but she couldn't tell what it was. And I was like, oh, that's weird. You know, I've kind of heard something a little bit like that. before and she was like yeah and so um we all started kind of hanging out more all of us started hanging out and uh we'd have a party over there almost every weekend and one night she told me that she's like i think it's i think i feel like it's a female spirit like that's around you and i was like

yeah you know that's that's what i've been told before i've i've heard that a female spirit's kind of around me and that it's dark and that it doesn't like other women around me. And so she had told me that, and I thought it was kind of freaky because it kind of brought a lot to light, thinking back to the very first thing that I had saw when I was 16 with the woman across the room that started coming towards me, and then the other female spirit I thought was Sashi, and then the whole spirit floating over me out of my Audubon experience.

And so I started kind of just in what that Wiccan girl had said. So it all just kind of started coming back. And I'm like, wow, this was starting to creep me out. And so she, one night, we were all over there. And they're all like, hey, you guys can stay the night if you want to. You guys can just sleep down here. So me and a few of the guys, we stay. over and we just slept down the living room and they had right off the living room that had stairs that went straight up and then

into their bedroom and so one night we were down there we were sleeping and um I woke up and I heard Amanda she was up at the top of the stairs and she's like she was like trying to go she's like Zach, Zach. And I was like, what's up? She's like, there's a woman standing there right in front of you. Like she doesn't want me to come down the stairs because she wanted to go come down the stairs to get a drink of water in the kitchen. And she said there's a woman. She's in a blue dress. And she's standing there like in front of the stairs, like in front of you. Like she doesn't want me to come down there. She will not let me come down there anywhere near you. like and i was like be serious and she's like yeah she said i see a woman and so i just thought thought that was really creepy and so um a few weeks later i i met this girl nicky and so we started

kind of hanging out a lot and uh one night she was like hey have you ever messed with the Ouija board and i'm like yeah i did it when i was 18 i was like It's not really something I'm uncomfortable with. I don't want to do it. And she's like, she's like, let's go to Toys R Us and let's grab one. Let's just grab a Ouija board and hang out. And I was like, whatever, you know, I did it before. And I guess it's not that big of a deal.

I didn't know if it was real. So we had, we went to, went to Toys R Us, grab the Ouija board. And we came back to my. dorm room and we set it up put some candles around us and we started playing and so this girl like I said we we just hung out we didn't she didn't know I didn't tell her any of my life story she didn't know anything about me um and so we were playing and we said no is anybody here with us and I said yes and we said what's your name and it spelled out Bippen they exact same person or spirit that I that we made contact with the very first time that I played

with my uncle and my friends in Ohio and I was like no way and so I told her I'm like hey you know I ran into the spirit like four or five years ago and she's like oh my goodness that's creepy and so we kind of started talking to him and all of a sudden same thing as last time the board just kind of started freaking out, uh, randomly. And it was just going all over the place. It wasn't making any sense. And it started kind of like throwing out obscenities. Um, and so we're like, Fippner, you still there? And it's, it said no. And we said, who are you? And, uh, I don't, I don't, I don't even like to say this thing's name. Um, it starts with the V. And, and yeah so I'm not even I'm not even to go into it but because I think it it messed me up a lot but uh so

it's spelled out its name and it it's just started every time she would ask a question it would throw out obscenities at her like it just it hated her it would not it was just I don't know it was so hate hate hate hate hateful torture And so when I would ask questions, it would answer me back just normally. And so I said, you know, what do you want? And it said, friends. And I said, do you want to be friends with me? And it said, yes.

And I said, why would I want to be friends with you? And it said, are. And I'm like, are like, we are friends? And I said, yes, we're friends. And I was like, I don't think so. And it said, it spelled out Butch, which was my grandpa's name. And I said, how do you know my grandpa? And it said, friends.

And I said, you're friends with my grandpa? And it said, we. And I said, we're friends with my grandpa. And it said, yes, we're all friends. And I said, how are we all friends? And it spelled out past the life. and I said, okay, so me, you, and my grandpa were all friends in a past life, and it said, yes. And I said, okay, I said, how did we die?

It said fire. And I said, okay. And then it got to where, and then she would try to ask another question. It started cussing her out again. And then I tried to ask a question, and all of a sudden it wouldn't talk to me. It would not answer me at all. and so I said I kept that I'm like

why wouldn't you talk to me anymore why don't you answer me anymore and it said scared and I said why are you scared and it said you and I said you're scared of me now and it said yes

and I said why are you scared of me and it said devil and I said I said who's who's the devil and it said you and that's that's basically where it ended um and so i i don't know what any of that meant

but i mean after we after we played that and we said goodbye to that spirit um i just felt like i started getting like i i've had severe anxiety disorder ever since that moment for the I think it's been almost seven or eight years now. So I feel like, and it's just something that I'm just now starting to break free of. So that's one of the big reasons why I don't like to say its name, but it definitely was something that messed me up. But I feel like that's, that's probably the end of the big things. I've had little things happen since then,

but those are some of the biggest experiences I've had in my life. Do you think that these experiences are done or do you think this is going to be ongoing from this point on? I think they're going to continue to be ongoing. Like I said, I've had little things. I've had, I've had a part,

like I had an apartment where I had an apartment where I saw like a white, a white figure kind of like peek its head around the around the wall sorry my little guys

that's okay just ran out it peaked its head around the wall and kind of just looked at me and I've had just different I've had different electronics kind of just freak out on me

I've heard. I woke up with voices screaming my name again. I had one night I kind of fell asleep on the couch and I had like this woman's voice. It was like a whisper, but a very loud whisper kind of whispered in my ear very loudly. The end is coming. So I've had, I just had a bunch of weird experiences still. but nothing that I think is huge, as big as those other experiences as they are.

They're still ongoing. With all these experiences that you've had, if you had the option for it all to stop, would you take that option, or is this something that you're kind of intrigued by? As much as I want to say that I would want it to stop, I don't think I would want it to stop. I think it's something that I've always been intrigued by.

and that I'll continue to be intrigued by. And I think that's, I think losing my grandpa when I was six kind of started all that. I mean, hearing that, that voice in that fishbow, I think kind of started it all for me. And it just kind of wondering, hey, you know, was that my grandpa? You know, did he go to hell? Was that why he was asking for help? You know, like, what, what was that? So I think ever since then, it's sparked an interest in me.

And until I get some kind of answers, I don't think I'm going to want it to stop. Okay. Now, you described that black figure in your room. And at one point you said, she made you look at her. How did she make you look at her? Was this something that she took control of your body? Or did she reach out and touch you? How did that whole thing work?

it was just that it was that like how I described just like I couldn't move like I couldn't move I couldn't breathe and I mean it was as to where she was like it was almost like she was controlling my eyes like I couldn't even move my eyes to the corner like to the corners like I could not look away like she was forcing me to just look her straight in those empty eye so I she wouldn't let me look away okay so When you're doing this out-of-body experiences you were having, and you said over time you started working your way further away kind of thing, I think you said you kind of went into the kitchen and would open doors and, you know, like drawers and stuff. How did that work? Now, is that something that you're, like, you're having an out-of-body experience and you're actually able to physically open a drawer? Were you able to actually feel the drawer physically, or was this something that, like, I don't know. It's almost like I feel like I'm asking you, you know, when you were a ghost, what was it like? You know, because, like, I mean, how did that whole thing operate? Like, I mean, when you're trying to touch something, could you physically feel like you do when you're, when you're at work and you open up something?

That's that funny thing that you would explain it that way because that's almost what it's like. it's like you're a ghost. Like it's not like you're real. Like when I would open those drawers, I couldn't feel it. It was just like, like feeling like you're like you're just so lightheaded. Like when you're,

that's why I to describe it. Like when you're completely exhausted. Like you haven't slept for over a day. And you start getting that feeling where like, it's almost like you're walking on clouds. Like you can't even feel yourself walking kind of thing. It's kind of like that. That's how you feel.

That's how I felt when I was doing, when I had those out of body experiences. And I wasn't even trying to have those out of body experiences. It wasn't like I was trying to lose a dream or try to astro project. Nothing like that. It was just, it just kept happening. And it wasn't something that I could control. But it's exactly what it felt like. It was like you were a ghost.

Like you, when you would touch something, you couldn't feel it. it was just that that feeling of like a like the only way i can explain it like you're walking on a cloud like you're like you're just completely lightheaded and you just can't you can't like you can't feel anything like it's just like nothing's real but it's it's it's so hard to explain but that's exactly when when you said that you know it's like you're a ghost and you're trying to that's exactly what it's like well along those lines you know you know you see these ghost shows and stuff and they say that, you know, oh, just turn off the flashlight, but just enough that, you know, if they turn it a little bit, the light will go on, we'll know

they're here. And we have to make it so that it's not on, but it's easy for them to turn because it takes so much energy to turn the light on for ghosts. What do you think about that? Like you're having an out of body experience and you're opening drawers and things like that. Did it feel like you took a lot of energy to do that? Or was it very seamless? Like it was just natural? When I was actually, I don't know if you want to call it the astral plane. When I was there, when I was out of my body, you don't really feel that.

But like I said, when I did get into my body, I felt completely drained of my energy. and I had that pressure in my head, that like that light had in this, like I said, like it felt like I had a stroke or something. Like it was just like I couldn't get my energy back. Like it was just completely drained from me. And I mean, on the ghost, on the ghost realm of that, I actually heard on another podcast I was listening to a story about a woman and her boyfriend. where the boyfriend had actually, his brother had died a week or two before this had happened, but she said she was sleeping one night, and she woke up,

and she felt like somebody was, like, kind of standing in the room with her. And so she went to nudge her boyfriend, and he didn't wake up, but she kept nudging him, and he wasn't going to, he wouldn't wake up, and she looked over, and she could see him standing on his side of the bed over there,

and he was talking to his dead brother. And he, the next, she was so freaked out by it. And she kept nudging and nudge him and wake up and he finally woke up. And he was like, hey, what's wrong? What's wrong? And she said, hey, I swear, I just saw you standing outside of your body. Like you were standing over there, like, but you were still here. You were laying in bed.

And he's like, that's really weird. I was just having a dream that I was talking to my brother, that I was seeing my brother. So it's weird like that. Like maybe you do almost go into this other plane when that happens to where you are a ghost. It's odd. It kind of makes you wonder what ghosts are then. It kind of makes you wonder when people. are experiencing, you know, ghost activity as far as like ghost hunters and, and having interaction,

are they just somebody having out of body experience that they're interacting with? I don't know. It's just, I'm sure it's not like that every time, but it's just, it's an interesting dynamic to think about. That is. You know, and these things that you were experiencing, you know, like the out-of-body experience, that was involuntarily. You weren't pursuing that, right? Right. Yeah, that was involuntary. It's something, like I said, I felt kind of like that on start of it to where my energy was drained and everything when I was deployed in Kuwait, but they never completely began. Like, I was hearing those voices, so I don't know if those voices were something that was trying to draw me into that astral plane to give me to start having out-of-body experiences. I don't know if it was some kind of dark entity that was trying to get me in, but maybe I had enough. energy at that point to keep myself from having them. But maybe once I got back, I don't know,

once I got back into that dorm room in England where that darkness was more prevalent and had more of a hold on that room, maybe it had more of a power over me to where my energy was just completely drained. And then every night that it kept going on, obviously my energy was drained more and more and more. And it just, maybe it just, it took more of a hold on me. to where it could force me to have those experiences more, more prevalently. Yeah, that's really interesting, man. I don't know. I mean, with all the things that you've experienced and stuff, I mean,

I personally wouldn't want to experience these things. And, you know, I've never messed around with the Ouija board. I've heard stories. Obviously, I'm listening to you. And that kind of stuff, just, no, no thanks. No, I'm good. you know, you've, you know, at least in the show so far, you've shared that you've experienced things playing with a Ouija board twice. Have you done it more than twice, though?

I have not. So those, that last one, after I, after I messed with the board with, with that girl in Mississippi, and I came across that spirit, like, I, I just, the darkness that I felt from it and just how I felt that it impacted me. I started Googling. I googled the name and just came up with all these different people that at that same time that were running into the spirit. And then, I mean, more and more and more and like it was becoming like a phenomenon, all these people are running to the spirit. And when they did run into the spirit, some of any bad things were happening to these people. And then all of a sudden they're making a movie. movie about it in Hollywood. Then it's on all these different ghost shows on TV. They're running into

the spirit and it's like it's nothing to mess with. No, it's definitely not. And, you know, I'm not, I'm not a fan of the idea that, of what you just said where, you know, the name of it, you're, you're researching it all of a sudden now that's, you know, they're making a movie about this thing. like to me that's not cool you know and I just think sometimes that Hollywood dabbles and things they shouldn't be dabbling in at least you know on a mass scale like you know they're they're doing something to give to the masses and it's like I don't know if you should be giving that to everybody you know exactly yeah yeah it's one of those things like it was just something that nobody heard of and now everybody knows that spirit's name and everybody's going to be trying to reach out to

that thing and it's not something to mess with. I mean, it's, it's ruined people's lives. Yeah, absolutely. You know, you've had a lot of experiences at night. You know, you wake up and you have a soci, I think it was the name, and then you have the black figure and then the, I think it was a blue figure earlier earlier and these these things are you know happening at night. Is this something that's kind of like kind of pushed you to fear going to sleep at all? I mean, do you have a hard time going to sleep after these experiences have happened to you? Not so much. And that's what's weird.

It's weird. It's, I mean, when I saw when I had that. whatever you want to call old hag the witch like right out of that out of body experience floating over me like that that did terrify me like that the next night i did not sleep i didn't sleep at all but what's weird like when i saw when i saw that that blue figure that woman when i was 16 it was one of those things like and like how i explained i just kept i laid there but i closed my eyes and just hope that it would go away like in your right mind you would just run like you would run off the stairs you would be gone you wouldn't you wouldn't just sit there and just wait for it

they come to you but it's like it's one of those things it's hard to explain it's like you're terrified but you're not you're not scared enough there's almost like a piece about it it's weird to where like you want to run but you don't want to run you're just like okay you know let's just wait it out and see what happens kind of thing when in your right mind you would you would run you would be gone So it's weird how it works that way. Yeah. Now, with the night hag, and I think that's what you called it, a night hag, the very first figure you saw when you're about 15 or 16 years old, you said every time you closed your eyes and opened them, it was closer to you, right? Right.

Okay, so that sounds like a horror movie. Oh, yeah. You know, like, that sounds terrifying. Now, what you were looking at, could you see details? Was there a face? Yes, yeah. She was, like I said, it was, she had, like, it was long, stringy hair, like, just dirty-looking, dirty-looking grayish kind of hair, like, but she had that blue tint to her. And it was just, she had, she looked old.

She had wrinkles, like, just old wrinkles, like, you could see. She had eyes. wasn't just like a socket kind of thing like it just looked more like just an old lady like an actual human figure but like an old lady was it was weird it wasn't something it didn't it wasn't like a dark feeling like it did creep me out but it wasn't as dark as what I had seen floating above me when I had that out of body experience okay wow wow that's some that's some crazy stuff man it really is uh do you you do you think that this is something that is possibly going to be handed down to your

children? I mean, is this something that you worry about at all? I don't even know if I can worry about it. I honestly, I think it already has started, unfortunately. My son, so we, I'm married to a, I'm married to a Hispanic girl. And so we speak a little bit of Spanish and English with with the boys. And so the littlest, uh, kukoi means boogeyman, uh, in Spanish. So I mean, there's been several times just to where the, the littleist he'll, he'll just be standing there like, we're sitting there having dinner or whatever and he'll just start like he'll have his face will just turn into like sheer like dread and he'll just start pointing and say kukui kukui kukui like just freaking out

like there's something like standing behind us just like staring at him and he he will freak out like completely and there's been times to where the boys will come running into the room and they'll be like hey hey what do you want and I'm like what are you talking about and they'll be like you just called our name you called our names and I was like no I didn't I've been sitting here like watching TV you're doing whatever and they're like no you just called our names and I'm like no guys I promise I didn't call your guys the names and uh just just the other day I was I was sitting there with my littlest and I was walking him into daycare and he's like he's like daddy um Coit

Tony and I was like who's Tony and he's like my friend and I'm like I'm like okay

and I was like I was like where's Tony at and he's like in my bedroom and I was like the Kokoi hit Tony in your bedroom

he's like yeah he killed him and I was like what? And he's like yeah yeah daddy Kokoi killed Tony

and I was like that's so creepy so yeah unfortunately I think it's already started for the boys. Is Tony an imaginary friend?

Yes, Tony is an imaginary friend. So he's seeing the Kokoi, the boogeyman, and an imaginary friend in his room. You know, I wonder sometimes if imaginary friends aren't so imaginary. My sister, she had lots of imaginary friends as a kid. And I remember seeing, you know, she's five years younger than me. And I'm thinking, you know, imaginary friends, okay, whatever. And the older I got, and the more I look into this stuff, sometimes I'm just

wonder, I mean, I'm not saying my sister was haunted, but I do wonder sometimes if some children that are seeing things aren't just, it's not just imaginary. Maybe they're actually interacting with something. And the fact that he's been seeing the boogeyman and now the boogie man is killing his quote unquote imaginary friend, that's kind of crazy. That's kind of crazy. How old is he? It is. He's just turn three in March. Oh my gosh, man. Yeah, he's a poor kid. I know. He's got a long life of craziness ahead of him if it keeps on. Wow. Wow, man. That's heavy stuff. That's some heavy stuff.

And so even with, even with all that and, you know, the things you've experienced and the things that your son's experiencing and stuff, you still seem, you still in some way. are attracted to the idea of this stuff happening. Yeah, unfortunately. I don't know what it is. It's not so much that I do nothing to invite it in. I mean, I've never messed with another Ouija board. I don't do anything in my power to try to invite it in. I mean, we pray with the boys every night

and try to keep them in. relationship with God and try to just, you know, try to keep evil from from entering. But, I mean, if, if spirits and anything paranormal, if it's, if it's all dark, I mean, I don't, I don't know, I don't know how it just continues to get in when you try, try your hardest to keep it out. Yeah. You know, I've used this on, on the show before as an example, but I wouldn't say, it's hard to it's hard to break down like as far as like a spiritual um theological theological convictions of mind kind of thing goes you know like i'm a christian and you know i try to understand the bible and try to you know look into these things and the bible is you know it does

say not to practice things that would summon spirits um right which you know a Ouija board would be one of those things. But in the Bible, it talks about how King Saul summoned the spirit of the dead prophet Samuel. And during that story, I mean, he's literally talking to Samuel. So Samuel was a prophet. Samuel wasn't evil. But yet Samuel was present when summoned by a medium. And so it's a very, it's just a very tricky thing to navigate through because we really don't know.

You know, you can watch as many go shows as you want and these guys on TV will say, oh, yeah, we got it all, we've got to figure it out. This is what happens here and this is exactly what this is. They don't know. They think they know because they've developed their own theories and ideas on how this all operates. But they really don't know, you know, and none of us do. Exactly. And so it's just, man, dude. But, I mean, what you got going on in your life,

I honestly, I wouldn't say it was probably very positive. No, I mean, you got something. You got something that's saying, hey, come on down to the basement. I'll kill you with a knife. That's scary. I mean, do you ever think about what would have happened if you gone to the basement? I kind of do. I mean, I thought about it a few times.

I'm just wondering, you know, is there really just going to be, I mean, when I think of Bipin in my mind, I'm thinking of just like a little, little dude and like, I don't know, like, and I'm overall just standing there with a knife looking like Chuckie or something. Like, I don't know. It's just like what would this thing it look like? How would I have got stabbed? Like, it is. It's weird to think about. Just how would that have turned out? Let me ask you this question.

Uh, earlier in the show, you kind of were hesitant about saying the name of the one entity, and I asked you not to, but you, you do say that the name of this one. What's the difference? This one, I just, I didn't feel that threateningness about it. I do, I do feel like it was super weird that, that, that, that, that I came in contact with them twice. I mean, obviously, it was something that has it to, on me, but I just didn't feel that, I don't know, I didn't feel that like a danger from him, I guess.

But I've also, I've Googled him just trying to see if, you know, if his name's popped up, but his name, his name doesn't pop up anywhere. It's just something, it's like something that nobody else ever ran into. But then you look at the other one and hits, it's something. form of ancient evil that so many different people have it experienced now. Okay. Well, Zach, listen, man, this was a fascinating life story that you have. And with everything that you've gone through, where do you stand on this stuff? I mean, obviously you believe it's real.

And do you have mixed feelings as to what this is all about? I mean, obviously you think about it all the time, but like, what about all the, your experiences could you conclude, at least for yourself, that, you know, is there another world as an afterlife or is it another dimension? Like, what are your thoughts on everything that you've experienced? Like, do you have any rationale towards it? That's hard to say. I mean, I do. I think there's an afterlife. That's for sure. But at the same time, I mean, if you put it in the perspective of heaven and hell, like, it just, I don't, I don't see none of these, like that old woman and just the smaller things. I just don't, I don't see them, obviously don't see them being sent from heaven.

And I don't see them particularly being, being sent from hell, like, to come and torment me. I mean, because it wasn't, it wasn't that dark of a feeling. It was more of a, yeah, it was scary, but at the same time, it's, there's almost obviously like a, like, a, like, I'm comfortable with it. Because I didn't, I didn't feel like running out, just closing my eyes. It's just kind of like, hey, go away. But I didn't run. I just let it come to me still. So it's one of those things.

It's like, yeah, there's an afterlife. There's a heaven. There's a hell. But like what? It's almost like there's some kind of in between to where these things are. Or maybe it is. Maybe it's an astral plane where people are, it's just people. It's just people having out of body experiences to where they're,

That's their dream. Maybe, maybe some 80-year-old woman was having a dream about being creepy and standing that some, some 16-year-olds, that is, like, watching them sleep. I mean, it's just, it's weird. It's hard to figure out exactly what it is, but, I mean, it's so hard to even comprehend what it might be. yeah no i absolutely agree with you 100% i mean uh to understand it all if you said you understood it all then i'd say zach come on let's be read let's be honest here uh right because it

none of us do and that's why we do these shows to compare notes so uh exactly you know zach i i really appreciate coming on and sharing your experiences and stuff and if you do have any other experiences that you think you'd like to share with me, feel free to get a hold of me, man. Definitely, definitely. I appreciate. I appreciate you having me on. Absolutely, man. Take care. Well, that's the show, everybody. I really hope you enjoyed it. And remember, if you've had an encounter or a story you'd like to share on the show, go ahead and shoot me an email. Or you can go to the website, the confessionalspodcast.com. Hit the connection section,

and you can reach me that way as well. Either way, whereas for me, just get a hold of me. I hope you guys all have a great week. Take care. And remember, the truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off.