The Connect- with Johnny Mitchell - Corrupt Rikers Island Jail Guard Reveals How Became The KINGPIN Of Rikers | The Connect

Episode Date: November 18, 2023

Gary Heyward started as a normal jail guard fresh out of the marines. But after financial struggles and exposure to corruption from other corrections officers he soon began running a smuggling ring bringing in tobacco, drugs, and women to the inmates. This behavior eventually landed him in the role of inmate, completely changing his life. Go Support Gary! Book: https://a.co/d/bd09oab  YouTube Channel: @garyheyward   This Episode Is Sponsored by PrizePicks!  Visit https://www.prizepicks.com/connect for a first deposit match up to $100! Need some boost to your mental clarity? Try Magic Mind! https://magicmind.com/  For bonus content sign up for the Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/theconnectshow   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It sounds kind of crazy. I didn't dive really into the criminal aspect of Southern drugs, so I became a law enforcement officer. Hey, guys, today's guest is Gary Hayward. He is an author and former corrections officer on Rikers Island. Gary served on Rikers for 10 years back of the late 90s and early 2000s. He ended up running a smuggling ring inside of Rikers Island. He would bring in tobacco, drugs, even women for the inmates.

And he eventually took a fall, did a couple of years in prison, He wrote several bestselling books about his experience. He's got a great YouTube channel. You should go check out. And he's here to tell us everything about that time. And we've got amazing content. We can't even show you on YouTube. Go over to patreon.com slash the Connect show for a bonus episode with Gary.

Without further ado, I give you Gary Hayward right here on The Connect with Johnny Mitchell. I had a boy running the newsstand. He called me like 2 o'clock in the morning. motherfucker. I'm like, what happened? Like, I'm thinking something happened. He said, you are on the front page of the Daily News.

That's when I see lights behind me, start to flash. And I didn't even think, I just hit it. I was driving like my life depended on. And then I parked the car, popped out, closed the door, and I started running. And he pulls out a burner, shank. It's like six inches. And then he passes it to me. And he goes, here, that's yours.

Don't ever leave the cell block without this. He was the reason I made it out of a place alive. Well, it's good to have you, man. Hey, good to be here, man. I have known nothing about your story. I've got a blurb. I'm so excited because, you know, we have a lot of different stripes of former criminals on this show. We always talk about Rikers.

Rikers, just the name instills a kind of attitude, right? It's a brand. I grew up a white kid in Portland, Oregon. I knew what Rikers was since I'm fifth grade. Yeah. Hearing it in rap songs. You know what I mean? Yep.

You know, it's a culture, and you were part of that culture. Yes, I was. So start at the beginning, though. Where are you from Harlem? From Harlem, New York City. Born and raised. That's right. One of the best places in the world.

Yes. You know, it was comfortable. It was a lifestyle. He was running around. You know, I was happy. Where'd you grow up? What part of Harlem? Polarground projects

Yeah, I've been there You know, back in the day It was the baseball field, the Polarounds, baseball field and they turned it into a housing development Yeah 1967 when I was born And my mom and, you know, we moved in We was the first one on our floor

Wow! Yeah, so yeah That's wild Yes That's a part of history. Are they still there? Your family? No, your family.

Yeah, my mom still there. Okay. I don't, you know. Yeah, you got out. Yes. Yeah. Trying to get out, but she's, you know, stuck. Yeah.

They don't want to move. Yeah. So you came up in that era. You're a 70s, 80s baby. So it's obviously, you know, it's a crack infested, wild ass neighborhood. You have Bradhurst where, you know, they would dump the bodies in the buildings. That's it. We've had some Harlem cats on here, you know?

Okay. Yeah. So were you involved in that? No, I was kind of young when all that was going on. I was a young man. You know, guilt by association, going to school, your best friend joined the gang at the time. It wasn't the Bloods and the Crips at the time.

It was Zulu Nation. I'm not even going to call it a gang, but it was... An organization. Yeah. A clique. You know, stuff like that. That was one of the things that was swamped, you know, going through high school and everything.

they had gangs like the Decepticon, Zoonation, and stuff like that. Yeah, so as far as the drug gang back then and there, very minute part. Like, I was, I think I had to be like 15 years old before I even dabbled in selling drugs

and stuff like that. And that didn't work for me. Really? Really. So when crack hit, you tried your hand at it? Oh, yeah. Yeah. It was like, okay, this is the way it is. You and not. hang together all the time. See, you're pretty tall.

Say you're a basketball player, but I don't play basketball. But I'm with you every. I'm your best friend, this, that, so eventually good by association, we need one more. So then, yeah, so now I'm playing basketball.

So now, as far as the law goes, if anybody was selling drugs and you're hanging with them, you're buddy, you might not have nothing to do with it. But if every day you're with them, and when they go shopping, they buy you sneakers, they buy you clothing, and they go to the club,

and you drinking and enjoying his, criminal acts, then guilt by association, you knew, you didn't run to the cops, you ain't telling the stop, you was enjoying that. It's just like if you do it out your mom's house, when they come raid their homes,

I've seen people with their mother handcuffed with their face, her face to the ground because you were out there selling drugs. So that's me, I dabbled in it, you know, a little bit. But, you know, with me, the crackheads was coming out to me saying,

listen, stop, go back to school. Really? Wow. That's love. Listen, it sounds kind of crazy. I didn't dive really into the criminal aspect of Southern drugs, so I became a law enforcement officer. Wow. Well, save that.

Save that. So, you know, I mean, speaking of corrupt law enforcement, you know, in the 80s, I mean, cops, every precinct had a number. Yes. And, you know. 30. That's right. And if you, you know, got hemmed up, we talked to a lot of dope dealers on this show.

Okay. You know, they would say like if their man got caught with a pistol, 10 grand, 15 grand to get them out of this precinct. You go talk to this cop. I mean, dirty money was, it touched every part of New York back then. Did you, were you aware of that as like a teenager? Did you know the cops that could be paid off? I knew of cops. I don't know if I can say their names.

No, no, don't say names, but just... I knew cops that had crack houses that you knew he was, that was his, that was his work. Really? Yes. Wow. You know, and they were vicious in defending their territory.

Right. It's kind of like they couldn't be too territorial because you were law enforcement. Right, right. But, you know, if you really look at it, if they wanted to busts, they knew who would the bus. They, everybody, it was, It was no secret.

Right. Right. But they had their own crack house and was running their own drugs. And back then, if I knew that you were a cop and that's your crack house, I knew other people knew that just didn't. Right. Right. Right. No, because.

Now, were they working with the cops or were the cops just jacking, you know, raiding other dealers and then taking their work and selling it off? Flaws, I knew what I heard because I said hanging the spot. called a gambling spot where everybody shoot C-Lo and shoot dice. So you hear everything, you see, oh, that's such and such. You know, you learn as a kid and, you know, growing up, they would do raids and stuff

in another barrel. Right. Maybe shoot over to Queens and hit a house. And then... And then take it back up top. I'll tell you one time. One thing, he never ran out of product. He was never dry.

Yeah. Yeah, he never ran out of product. But, yeah, I knew about that. What is the relationship between, well, then, in the 80s, early 90s, what was the relationship between, like, good cops, right? Or clean cops? And people of Harlem, black people.

I'm going to tell you what I would call a good cop. A good, you could be shooting dice. Or you might be on the corner selling weed. He'll come and say, get up this corner. Instead of just the normal take you in, or the handcuffs on you, this and that. Some, I've seen the cop give somebody that's spanking. Like, I know your mother.

You know, get up that. That is what you call a good cop. Right. You know, then there's, we, of course, we all know the dirty cops. So. Well, what's the cop in between? The cop that isn't on the take, but he's brutal. Like he's, he's, you know, he's Sean Penn from colors, right?

Yes. Comes up and puts the knee on your neck immediately and throws you up against the wall. Like, where does he fit in? Were there any of those guys? Yes, I ran into a couple, a couple of me and my friends. Because back then, they didn't differentiate as in, these are the bad guys. These are the bad color guys. And these are the color guys that go to school.

Because we all play basketball. We all ran the same neighborhood until the sun went down and people started doing their thing. So I ran into a couple of cops that would harass us. And it wasn't even to arrest you. It was just to put that. on your back and kind of like sent a message that I'm I'm walking this beat. Right. And because you know in the neighborhood, you know, they getting some, they got some

woman in the projects and that they- Smashing? Yeah. Yeah. You know. So you kind of know, but it's really not a big deal. It's like, oh, look, oh, look what we know over here. It's like, okay, that's such, such, such over there.

And he's messing with such such. So we know when he goes in the building, we know that it's all right because he's going be a deal while. Oh, interesting. Now, okay, years later, when you were a corrections officer, did you feel like, like maybe you hated that cop back then, that tough-ass cop who was mean,

who put his hands on you, but did you feel when you became the law, the police, did you feel where you like, oh, I get it. You got to make sure these motherfuckers know who's in charge. I had a moment, right? And

I'm a brand new CEO, fresh out the military, you know, I was a Marine, so, you know, I came, I'm pretty fit. And, you know, I was a big guy. So they have an intake area where all the inmates, when you get arrested, you come to Rikers Island, you come to the intake. So here it is, me, fresh out the academy, wanting to be the best of the best. And I'm like, excuse me, gentlemen, steal me, sir, can you simmer down? Can you be quiet? Sir, can I get a moment?

Because I'm trying to get them to quiet to give them the welcome to Rikers Island speech. and nobody's giving me paying any attention. Right. So all I hear is if you, can you curse on this? Yeah. If you motherfuckers, I have, I need to hear a pin fart and die of that bit you fuck out. Fuck one of you motherfuckers up. So I'm turning around and it's this little female older CEO that's giving them the business.

Yeah. And I'm sitting here like this, like I'm the big guy. And guess what? They shut up. They stop talking. And right then and then, I knew that I had to set the tone. Right. You know what I'm saying?

And it went from that, from me being, hey, gentlemen, you guys to, that was him. Y'all next. Right. And that's, and I hate to say it was because we had paperwork to do. We had worked, I ain't got time to be sitting here talking to all you, so I already know. Smack one of them up. The rest of y'all are going to fall in line. because now you're here and it's not a game.

So smacking an inmate just to keep order was normal. I saw somebody do it first. Right. Yeah. So yeah. Wow. So it's a routine for officers to put their hands on inmates. I'm going to say like this.

At the time you do what you need to do to make your point. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And of course right now, mothers of America are different advocate groups. you can't just be going around even in the jail right now and just putting your hands

and doing what you want to do. You got to be much more careful now. You could get in trouble. You lose your job. Everybody's wearing body cameras. Yes, and there's cameras everywhere. You know, and it's so bad on Rikers Island right now that it's like the inmates got more rights.

Right. Like they can, you know, like, I remember a time where inmates squirted feces in my face and everything. And I'm like, let me take this badge off. Yeah. And it's, but the camera was there. Oh, I wouldn't care if the camera was there.

And I had a partner that, uh, got fecese squirt in his face. He took his shield off, went to the camera. Johnny Black, shield number seven to this, this, that hung it on the camera. And, oh, it went in there and just put it in work. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Come on.

Come on. No, every, you're just human. Yeah. So, so let me get back, though, to your teenage years. Okay. Um, what, how do people from Harlem feel, or, uh, we'll call them the black community in general, right? How do, how do people feel, you know, about people from the hood growing up and becoming cops? Okay.

When I was growing up, uh, poor, but holy sneakers playing basketball and stuff like that. We really didn't know we were poor because everybody was like that. Right. Until you start getting outside the. circle to see that, yo, we really was poor. So one of the things in the neighborhood is get yourself a city or state job. Right. Do your 25 years, get your pension.

While you're doing it, get your home, move out the neighborhood. You understand what I'm saying? And like a city or state job was, quote, for a better life. Everybody was a good rapper. Everybody didn't have a jump shot. Right, right. Like Biggie said in this song, you know, so you get a rock or jump shot. So, you know, you get yourself a city of state job.

And if you, you know, law-abiding citizen, things will work out for you. Right. Maybe we'll get a house in Jersey or out to Queens or something. Right. And that's, that's what. Yeah. That's what it was. So it was respected.

Like even the dope dealers, right? Obviously their enemy is the cops or certain cops. But if you are from the hood, grew up. up with these cats that are now out hustling, and you said, hey, I'm going to go to the Marines and then become a cop. They don't look at you like a traitor. Some people did. Like, you got to understand, cops got a bad rap, right?

Only because it's cameras now. Because cops have been being in cops for a long time. For sure. You know, but what I'm trying to say is I didn't know that I was going to join the Marines right off the back, and then I definitely didn't know I was going to be. a correction officer because it's like when you're growing up what do you want to be fire doctor lawyer fireman police no nobody says I want to be a correction officer so when I went to the military and then came home to become a correction officer

it was a job people look at it like you gotta get it you know you got to get a job to survive now the people who have had bad running with cops and just hate police yeah like me and you cool. I used to play basketball. We was in the same third grade. Oh, but now you're a pig. Now you're that. And I don't like that. So that means that in your psychic, in your mind, you, you picked up that shield knowing what your coworkers do. So now, some of them have this thing for you. Right. Because when I got, when I got arrested, people who I thought I was, was all right with. Yeah. Was like, hmm. Right. I hope he, you know, he's done. I hope he gets Wow.

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So there's a tribalism between the criminals and the cops. Yes. Yeah. And even though you're cool one day, yeah. Because it's like once you put this shield on. Yeah.

Like, let me just say this. I didn't walk into records out and say, you know what? Let me, let me, my master's scheme is I'm going to go through the academy, become a CEO so I can sell drugs. That's not what it was. You know, when you're doing this job, I don't care how cool you is because I've had instances where I beat up my best friend

for the sake of the job. So now you're in this, you're here. Now, you don't know everybody. So the brainwashing is you're a law enforcement now, everybody else is an inmate. He's an inmate, scum of the earth, and they want you to have dad. That mentality.

Yeah, they want you to dehumanize them. Yes. So you can forget that they were once your friend. Exactly. And you can beat them up. Yeah. You know, some people do what the culture expects them to do. Like in Rikers Island, they teach you an academy.

I really don't like you. You really don't like me. But we're both correction officers. So we already out number. So I might not like you, but I'm not going to let no inmate with your behind. So you could be having an argument

with an inmate in the hallway. And I'm like, here, this fucker, I really don't vibe with him. But one of the things I'm supposed to do as an officer is staying there just to show support to let that inmate know that me and you are together and you run your mouth, you try to do something.

We're going to pound you out. We're going to stomp you out. Yeah. That's just what it was. Yeah. I mean, that's, it's, I get why maybe it's necessary, but it's, that's a scary proposition. It is. Because you're a big dude. And they got dudes in there that all they do is lift weights all day and wait for the alarm to come so they can go whip some ass.

They got gloves with metal inserts in them. Yes. Wait, corrections officers? Yes. Wow, bro. Okay, so save this because this is wild. So when do you think Those cats that grew up in the neighborhood

The hood that grew up to become cops Wouldn't like Wouldn't they want to like join forces With the cats hustling? You know what I mean? Like wouldn't you see that as an asset? Like you know like he's maybe even if you're not You know directly taking money

Maybe you come up to your boy who's moving weight And say hey there's you know They're lining up to like raid. You should fall back. Some people did that, but see, correction officers didn't, where it wasn't privy to police officers. Yeah.

Information. Right, of course. You know, um... Well, what I'm saying is like, is there, do people that grow up in places like Harlem, alongside criminals who choose to become law enforcement officers, do they,

when they come in contact with their old gang, right? Now, you know, they're adults. He's a criminal. He's a law-abiding citizen. Do they, do the cops tend to look the other way? Or do they collab with them? Or, you know, like, what do you think?

It could go both ways, right? Self-preservation. We're all in the hood. We're all trying to get out. You got a wicked jump shot. You went off to school. I still know your mom, your sister, and anything, but you're over there in Kentucky.

You're over there, wherever playing ball. me, I'm not so lucky. So now I got the city of state job, my way out. Yeah. Being an officer, my way out. And self-preservation, I'm really trying to get my family out. So by every means necessary, and you're in my way. You're doing criminal activity.

I'm going to uphold this oath, this badge. Yeah. Not because I want to be super correctional officer. Right. Because this is my job and this is my way out of the ghetto. Now, if me and you are super, Super, super, super tight. Super tight.

Of course. Of course, you know, I'm going to business with you. You know, so you know how it departed? You know how the story of the Boston mob? They actually groomed one of their, you know, one of the young Irish boys from the neighborhood. Okay. Helped him get into the academy. Okay.

Helped him become a high-ranking officer in the state police, I think, just so they could use him to feed them information. You don't think black people do that, do you? Do they do crack dealers, like raise young cats to become cops to then, you know, work with them? Let me tell you something. There's been CEOs who been on a job a long time and they raid their house and find kilos of cocaine in their wall. Right. You still read about that. I read about that in the New York Post.

Right. You know. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So there's close parallels between, you know, especially CEOs and the street. Yeah, definitely. A lot of correctional officers.

I don't know about any other town, but a lot of correctionals come straight from the same neighborhoods as the criminals. Yeah. And that's why, like I wrote in my book, one of the things that you spoke to, your teacher in the academy is you're not supposed to be associated

with known felons and be partying and being around them. And it's like, okay, I'm from polo grounds. I'm from Harlem or somebody might be from Brooklyn or whatever. And a 50-round radius, come on. You're lucky right now if you're walking in New York City with no felony or no police contact so much as a loitering ticket or a desk appearance ticket. So you're a millionaire if you don't have no contact with no police.

It's impossible. Yes. Yeah. So you decided, why did you decide to go to the Marines? Memorial Day weekend is almost here and it's time to kick off Summer Right. When I'm getting ready for the first big weekend of summer, Total Wine and More is my go-toe, especially when I'm firing up the grill with family. I'll grab refreshing beers, easy drinking wines, and some hard seltzers for the cooler.

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This is when I was trying my hand at being a crack dealer. Okay. You know. Yeah, why were you not a crack dealer? Why could the crackheads tell that that wasn't really your bag? Because, you know,

coming up, I was a clean cut kid, went to school, played basketball. You know, now, I still hung with people, older guys who were drug dealers. But everybody knew me. Yeah. They knew that. You never saw me stand on the corner,

pitching, selling them, nothing like that. So when my girlfriend at the time got pregnant and I dropped out of high school, I had to do something. So I tried it. Because, like I said, back then and then, I don't know how the law was,

but the younger you were, the less time you were going to, to get. So they would use us at the time younger people to pitch and be out there and take, kind of like take all the risks. Yeah. So the only, it lasted, I think my drug kingpin run at that time lasted about two, three months because my girlfriend was pregnant with my son and I had to get money.

I was so ignorant about the game was I worked for like a month. I think I gave this guy like about 60 grand. So I'm thinking if this dude gave me $1,500. I could get the crib, I could get the sneakers. I mean, I get, you know, set my kid up at the time. And I did that. And he came and gave me a hot $100. For moving $60,000 worth of work?

What is that, like a brick? Yeah. And I was in the crack house, no, new, brand new at it. Really like, I was, I took it serious. Like, I was working on an assembly line. Like, it was really nine and five legit job, not knowing I'm making this guy rich. And I'm just thinking, like, in hindsight,

I should have got at least 10 grand or something. Of course. And I'm shooting for $1,500. Yeah. So that tells you how much knowledge I had about. And when he gave me $100, that's how I was like, no. And then other crackheads that was out there, no, looked at me, Leary.

Right. Come on, I know your mom. Ah. This is not you at all. to be standing out here on the street. So right after I decided not to do that, I started getting other odd jobs. Then my brother came home from the military.

Of course, mom said, he's out there in the street. So he took me down to the Marine recruiter. And I was reluctant. But, you know, at the time, they was persistent coming to take you to lunch and all and something. So I took the little military asswrap test, June 3rd. June 6, I was on that plane. I had nothing that was going for me.

Where did they send you? Paras Island. Where? Paras Island, South Carolina. Okay. To boot camp. Right. So you did boot camp, and then you served how long?

I served six years. Wow, that's a long time. Yeah, and then I was stationed in California. I'm definitely a decorated war veteran. Yeah. So I served. Did you go to a desert storm? Yes.

Okay. Yes. I was in Desert Storm, Desert Shield. I fought in the whole war and everything. Made it home in one piece. And came home to be a security. security guard job until I took the test to be a correction officer. Was that kind of a natural next step since you'd been in the military to go into some kind of law enforcement?

Yeah, it wasn't. At the time coming from the military, it wasn't that many jobs out there. Right. You know, security guard, you're a big guy, you fit. Yeah. You know, so, and then like I said, the thought process was still the same. Now you're back in the hood. Get yourself down, but you got the military.

behind you. Right. Law enforcement, a lot of military people go straight in the law enforcement. Why not? Right. And I took the test to be a police officer and had a combined test, and I ended up, correction to court me first. Like, I'm just looking for a job. Right. It wasn't like, I want to be a cop. Right. I'm just looking for a job. Corrects to call me first. That's where I'm going. What year is this? 1997. Okay. And that's, and you started immediately at Rikers? Yes. They threw you. And throw you right into the zoo. You get like about two days at the academy. And then they said, I guess it's like, okay,

we really want to see if you go to stick. We could tell you all the scary stories. Right. But we want to see if you, you know, you need to decide if you're going to be made for this. Right. And like the second day there, we went to a ride.

It's just as a tour. Yeah. And it was, I went to a place called HDM. And that's the closest thing that looked like Alcatraz. I'm talking about the tears. and inmates hanging off the tears. And I saw this is like,

I saw how inventive inmates can be like a three-liter soda bottle. It can take some heat when they're trying to cook. I'm like, that's plastic. But it doesn't melt. That water will boil before that plastic will melt. Wow. You know, and I'm sitting there and I was terrified. Yeah.

I'm not going to lie. I was terrified. But I was more scared of being broke and not having anything. And then I'm seeing females walk around there, correction officers, and I'm thinking, you're in here with these dudes,

these rapists, these killers, this, that aren't you as a female? Like, if I'm, no, in my hindsight,

if I'm in here doing double life, I'm about to go up to do double life, taking some kucci from a female, what, how much more time are you going to give me? Right. You know, and I thought about that.

But if they could do it, I said, then it has to be a way. Right. What was the pay back then, starting pay to be a CEO on Rikers? I remember it was $27,000, right. So even in 97 in New York City, you know, you're not living in the projects, but it's not great. Yeah.

I was still living in the projects. You were, okay. You know, and see, the thing is, with all these city and state jobs, it's not the base pay. It's the overtime that makes it what it is. It's worth it, right. So I started in like June or July. And, no, I started in June. By the time, December came, because I was a rookie,

and I kept on having to do overtime, overtime, overtime, I made like 50 grand. Just in overtime. You know, because I never could go home. Yeah, yeah. You know, and I was hungry. I was thirsty, so it was like I hated the overtime. Yeah. And that's what made it.

So I never really just saw it $27,000. Right, right. You know. Okay. So it's a good, you know, working class wage. Yes. Today's episode is sponsored by prize picks. Prize picks is the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America.

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when you went from like nice guy Gary, which you are? I can too, to having to, you know, go to the dark side? Yeah. Well, okay, there's two different dark sides. Is dark side like, okay, now I'm really going to be a seal. and I'm really going to put foot to ass and be that guy then there's the dark side

when I said I'm going to start selling drugs Yeah tell me about the tough guy CEO first When you have to pound somebody out? Yes and the first time I pound somebody out Was my best friend I was a guy who lived in me and his mother Not me and my mother And his mother went to church together every Sunday

Wow And from the polo ground Yes And it was weird because I'm just going to say that Rikers Island is notoriously known for all the vile, crazy stuff that go on there. But if you're in there, sometimes it's far and few between. There's non-jails on Rikers Island.

So something could pop off in jail number one. You work in jail number six. Right. Nothing didn't pop off in jail number six in about six months. Yeah. But the news and the media and the people hear Rikers Island, something happened all the time. So I'm sitting here being a big guy. And it's called the alarm.

You're sitting there in the lounge, eating your food, alarm sounds. Everybody that's eating the food are the ones that got to be the Orange Crush, the ESU team to go down to save the correction officer that's in trouble. Oh, right. So the first time the alarm went off, right? the very first alarm, you know, by the time I got down there, it really was nothing. My drilling was running. It really was nothing.

So I really didn't see no action. I really didn't see no action. And people who are war heroes. Now, I'm not going to say war heroes, but veterans who used to whipping inmates' asses and all this stuff. They would make jokes about people, you know, you ain't pop your cherry. You ain't, you know. Right. So now, the first time I got to do something, like to try to prove myself.

it was because another friend of mine came to jail. What was he in there for? He's a, what is it called? Residivitiv when they keep coming back and forth. He had a parole violation or something? Okay. He was a drug dealer? No, he was just like petty theft.

He had jailed down to a pack where in the wintertime, he'll commit a crime, go here for the winter, and come out in the summertime. Oh, damn. So he was like a junkie probably. Yes. So, but, you know, me being from the hood, his sister had a fat ass. So I was smashing the sister. So he asked me to bring him a pack of cigarettes, which at the time I didn't think it was nothing wrong because Cs are smoking and they sold cigarettes in commissary.

But he was just a bum. He didn't have no money to go to a conversation. So I got the cigarettes for his sister, gave it to him. Come to find out, she had it laced with weed. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And you plate me. Yeah.

So I'm never going to get played again. Now I'm full-fledged seal mode. Yep. So now the alarm goes off. So I'm going down there, huffing and puffing and puffing and puffing. So as I get down there, like even inmates have this male bravado thing about females. Meaning if you jump up and beat up a female officer as a man, you still low a piece of shit. Exactly.

Right? So as we're running down to the area, we see a female wrestling with a woman. an inmate and she got his hoodie pulled over his head. So you know, oh, no, I know he's not fighting a female. So we get down there, I get down there first and we give him, we pounded him and I'm doing, you know, I'm getting my hits in and people are seeing me, you know, in action for once. You give him a stomp? Yes.

Kick him and all that? Right. And then she finally let his hoodie off. And I looked at her, her nose is bleeding. Yeah. So you know he's going to the hospital. Mandatory. You have to send him.

to the hospital, send a message to the other inmates, you put your hands on, first you put your hands on an officer. Yeah. But if you put your hands on a female, you definitely go and get it. Okay. So you look at each other and you say, all right, now it's time to like really put in work. We're sending this guy out on a gurney.

Well, once you see the female fighting, that's it. Like other inmates know, basically that people are spit in your face. You better chuck it up. So you pound. You would pound guys out until you had to carry him out on a stretcher. It wasn't just me per se.

No, but that happens. They beat people down until they have to go to the hospital. I've seen inmates hog-tied and stuff because they hit COs. Because you got to realize, I still want to live, inmate or not. I just can't sit there and let you beat me up. you know, and some people's, their state of mind is, listen, bro, you put your pants on just like I put my pants on.

Badge or no badge, I'm not going to just let you do what you want to do with me. So I'll take the ass whipping, you know. And so when you see certain things, some things is not taught in the academy, but it's an unwritten rule. Some officers had it where if you fight in the housing area, everybody getting their ass beat. Wow. Yes.

Who's beating their ass, though? There's so many of them and only a few of you. See, I never knew how, because at the same time, as a correction officer, I had to watch 100 inmates. Right. And you were walking in there with on A side and B side, 50 inmates here, 50 inmates here, so they can beat your ass any time. And here's the thing.

Me and you boys, I'm your partner. You're called the A officer, which you man, you open the cells, you fill out all the law books. I'm the bee officer. I'm the one walking in the air, looking in the cells, making so nobody's getting raped, making so nobody's hanging himself up, and making sure order is going on.

But the thing about you, me and you super cool, you got my back. If something pop off, I got to hold my own. You might want to have my back, but you can't come in there and help me. You have to watch me get my ass me. Why? Because you have the key.

Okay, right. And if you're running in, now they got B&U because guess why it's still 100 M8, it's still 50 M8s. And now it's a hostage situation. They got the keys. They got the keys and now they can get out. Yeah, right. Did you ever see that happen? Yes.

Did you have to watch a partner get beat down or somebody else's partner get beat down? I'm going to be honest with you. I did dumb shit. I ran in there with the keys because you got a certain, like, you know who's really going to pop up. because you got some inmates like, listen, I ain't got nothing to do with that. You know what I'm saying? Let me just do my time, day while in, I'm over here.

Yeah. So, officers break that law all the time and running there with the keys. Yeah. No, okay, but you didn't tell us what happened with your best friend, beating your best friend down. Okay, what happened was she was wrestling with him.

So while we got there, we pounded him out, he still got the hoodie pull over his head. So I get my blows in, so I'm tired. And the rest of the people coming and they still finish in, And stuff like that. So does everybody take, like, all the officers get to put in work if they want? Sometimes it would be so many that everybody can't get in there.

Right. No, but you have to at least let them know that I'm willing to stand with you, brother officer. Wow. You know, against the inmates because we're outnumbered. Yeah, but it's like a gang. Like, hey, you better get in here. Give at least a few kicks. Guess what?

If you don't, they'll ostracize you. Wow. That pressure is there. Wow. That pressure is there. So next time when you really need them, they might not have your back. You know what? I've never seen them really just let our officer get his ass beat.

Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I've seen some people think about it, you know, because it was a lot of, I really don't like you because you're having sex with the female officer that I want. Yeah. So we're really enemies, but at the same time, when it came to going against the inmates, it's like we had to stand together what I like you or not because guess what? I may need you.

They may be whipping my behind, and I really don't need you to be in your feelings about some chick gum banging and not help you or not call for backup or something like that. So now the hoodie comes off and I see him. And I'm like, I'm stuck.

It's my best friend, and he's trying to defend himself and cover himself, and then he sees me. And when he sees me, he just stop fighting. And he's looking at me. And they're pounding him, and he's looking right at me. Like, our eyes locked, and he never stopped looking at me.

Oh, my God. And they're going in, and they, once they saw that he wasn't resisting no more, they put him into flex cups and everything, and he never stopped looking at me until they took him away. Wow. And I'm sitting here like, what the freak? Shocked. Shocked.

You know, people pat me on my back. yeah, you know, at a boy, you put in that work, you broke your cherry. You're really one of us now. And I'm like, if we're getting back to the hood that I did this to him, you know, I don't know, I don't know how. Because I still was living in the hood. I've yet to go get my own place. So you were going back to the polo grabs every night after work. Wow.

Wow. Holy shit. One time, just like clockwork, I'm going in the building I live in, and I'm going to check the mail, and his mom come up behind me and give me a hug. And I'm like, how are you doing? I'm just going to say, Miss Jones. And she's like, yeah, your best friend, he's back over there. And I'm sending him commentary. If you see him, you know, I know you'll take care of him and blah, blah, blah.

And I'm sitting here, like, he is on his way. He's in the hospital. Oh, shit. Yes. And that was, see, that's one of the things in the academy, they tell you, coming from your neighborhood, you're going to see people. Right.

You're going to see people that you know. Like, oh, shit, that's where you're at. What was he in there for? Like I said. Oh, like, oh, petty, petty, larceny and stuff like that. He was on drugs. Yeah. But growing up with him, you grow up to a certain,

certain age. Yeah. Like I remember he saved my behind. I had bought a, when Nike's first came out, I bought a brand new pair of Nike's. That was getting jumped by a gang called the Ball Buses. It was a Hispanic gang up on Broadway. And he was trying to take my sneakers. And he came and helped me fight him off.

Right. And we ran, but they didn't get my sneakers because he came and helped me. And because you had those new sneakers on. Run fast. And so that's why I knew what he felt. Right. That's why I knew what he felt. So did you feel some kind of way then?

I felt fucked up. I felt fucked up, but at the same time, had I not, like, even if I saw him and knew it was him, it was like obligated to still put the beats on him. And see, that's what, that's a battle with a lot of officers coming from the same neighborhood that the criminals come from. Now, are you obligated technically to go tell the administration if you know somebody in there? Definitely. Now, did you do that with him? Well, he never came back for a while after that.

Right, he was in the hospital. He had spent the winter in ICU. But me and him had beef for a long time. Over that? He tried to kill me a couple of times. Over that? Yes. And he tried to kill you.

He shot at me. I shot at him. This went on for a while. Okay. You know. So you would see him on the street and you bussed at him? No. This is what we're having.

I'm minding my business. And all of a sudden, ping, ping, no, rounds will be hitting the wall in the car. And then I'm, because I have a gun because I'm a correction officer. Right. And I shoot in a direction that is coming from. And the only time I found out it was him because he was a bomb. I'm not going to see he was a bum, but he wore the same hoodie all the time. And I saw the hoodie, him running away.

and I knew it was him. So it was on. Wow. It was on. Wow. And that was over that incident. Of course, yes. Okay.

Yes. How often did you see people that you knew from the neighborhood? At Rikers. Every day. And they're going to let you know. They got to know. And was it ever love?

Did you ever like to get excited to see people? They teach you in the academy. There's the hood rules and it's the academy. Because you know black folk love to fuck it. Yes. But it's like this. If me and you're super cool. Yeah.

And I know you're doing this. This is your job. Yeah. I should date your sister. Yeah. You know, stuff like that. Certain people would know not to... Not to make it obvious.

Yes. And then those are ones that would really get treated good. And if I was going to bring something in for you because you didn't blow it up. Right. Then there are certain people who are, and survival mode in jail and going to let all of his other cronies know,

I know Bob and his dad, he ain't all that and nigh, and call you by your middle name or your street name and this, that, just to get props from the other inmates. Right, and to kind of embarrass you, too. Definitely. You know? So that's when you got to make an example out of it. Wow.

Did you have to do that? I did it a few times. Did you have to tell mother, yes. In front of everybody, listen, in here, I'm officer, hey, but, you know. Like I said, I didn't walk into the jail just criminal-minded. Like, I'm just going to do all this stuff. My job was my number one priority when I first got on the job.

I was going to be a correction officer. I was happy. I'm going to be able to get my own place. You know, be a grown man and take care of my kids and stuff. So anything that got aware of that, I did my job. Yeah. So it's 1997. You're growing into the gig.

I just kind of want to paint a picture for people that don't know Rikers. What was it like? Now, Rikers Island is a city jail, and it houses how many inmates, roughly, at any given time? Some jails got like 2,500 inmates in one jail, and you got nine jails. That's cool. So you had maybe 15,000, 20,000 inmates? Yes. Wow.

Easy. And how many corrections officers? Well, I'm put it to this way. You, in some dorm areas, like I said, you got 100 inmates. You got two corrections notices. It's wild. That watch. Right.

A hundred inmates. Yeah. And people are in there. Are they serving? A lot of people are in there awaiting trial. Yeah, most of them are. You got one building called CIFM, C-76. Those were people who got a year and under.

Right. And those are people serving what we call county bits, right? So under a year. They're not going upstate. They're not getting penitentiary bills. No. Right. So did you find that those were the wilder places?

Because people that are fighting their cases, if I got a murder beef, I got real problems. I don't have time to be gang banging and slashing. So is that correct? Yes. I started in what they called the community center. And those are for people who got a year and under. Okay. So, but let's not put nothing past.

because the first four months on the job, an inmate pulled a gun out in the jail and shot another inmate in that community center. Yes. I've been doing this podcast a long time. Yes. And this is the first time that my mouth is agape. I'm speechless.

What did you just, an inmate had a gun? Yes. That's some third world shit. You see that in prisons in like Ecuador. No, I'm gonna tell you this story. Like I said, I'm, I'm C.O. Haywood. Doing my job. And, of course, inmates try to prove themselves to other inmates, and they talk stuff.

But we all know, you're in the community center. You know, you're not, okay, jail is jail, but you're not really doing no real time. You're doing by six, eight months. Come on, tough Tony. Yeah, you're not hard rock. I get into it with a guy and I tell them, listen, I'm going to lunch.

When I come back, I'm going to take this badge off. Me and you're going to go in the bathroom. I'm going to fuck you up. Right? Yeah. Right? And I had every intention. Yeah.

Because he was talking cash shit. So I go to lunch and while I'm sitting there and I'm telling my boy when I get back, so my boy's like, bet I'll come with you. The alarm goes off. So I was like, fuck. So we got to put on the protective gear. and everything and go to where the alarm is.

Right, right. Well, the alarm is in the housing area I'm working. I just left this area. Right. So when we get there, you ever seen the cartoon where everybody's running down there and the first guy stopped and everybody bumps into it? Right, yeah.

So we get to the housing area and the female officer opens the door and she says, she started, she said, gunshots. I heard it was a gunshot. And the other inmates were on the bars, wanting to get out of the area because they heard the gun, right? Now, those vests

are stab-proof vests. They're not bulletproof vests. So we're like, listen, I'm not going in here. You're going in there? So the captain's like, we got to go in there. Right? So I'm like, maybe there's just something loud,

she heard. It couldn't be no gunshot. So basically, one by one, We let the inmates out, pat him down. Yeah, yeah. Damn there strip search them. Put them on the floor, handcuffed them. Yeah.

One by one. We got all of them out. So then now, none of these guys got a gun on them. So we go inside now. And we see an inmate laying on a bed with a gunshot wound to his thigh. And he said, somebody shot me. And right then there, I think I had like four, maybe five months on the job.

Right there and there, I'm like, I know I'm not seeing what I'm seeing. And yeah, he's there. Medical team come. Really, not a stab wound, not a self-inflicted. It was a gun shot. So now...

Where's the gun? Everybody's there. Taring the whole ceiling, wall and everything. So we move a locker and there's a small P380 gun. Wow. And are those the ones that only hold,

about six bullets or maybe something like four at the time. And I'm like a gun. Yeah. Like I wrote this in a book. That was the first shocker. Because you know when you come from the academy, you really academy trained that everybody's upholding the law. Nobody's going to be doing that.

But see, in the academy now in hindsight, when I look back, the instructor was like, listen, they kept, you said, don't, if you give them a stick of bubble gum, you'll bring them in a gun. If you give them a cigarette, you'll do this and that. So they kept on beating you down in your head. And I was like, well, why did they keep on?

Like, who would do that? You're thinking, who would bring in contraband? Yeah. But the instructors know, they've probably been there. It happens. We know it happens. So we try to, y'all don't know what happens. We know it happens all the time.

So they get this guy out of there. Yeah. The medical team gets this guy out of there. Yeah. And then we search and we find the gun. Now, I'm going to tell you the insight, because we found the gun. of course

is inmates' fingerprints on it and when they do the big investigation what it is is okay we know somebody smuggled the gun

what it was these inmates would trustees that would go outside like Rikers Island has a parking lot for visitors

and you go and you try to sign to come go visit who you're going to visit and then there's a bridge that goes over

these trustees order one to clean the parking lot out there So if you're a trustee, somebody dropped on that gun and an officer dropped the ball and didn't search them because they've probably been there for so long. Right. Yeah, they've earned some trust.

And he got the gun in there. What I found out later on, okay, what was found out was the inmates smuggled the gun in and shot the inmate. It was all planned to get a major lawsuit from the city. Like how you let me because the correctional secrecy. is care, custody, and control. Right. How did you let,

how did a gun get inside Ryker's Island? Yeah. A gun. So me and all my new Jack buddies is like, we shot,

but the senior officers because they seen stuff before. Right. So all, now, now my gears is grinding. Like, yo. What's happening?

Like, who can I trust? And guess what? And guess who was the inmate? who shot him. The inmate, I said, I'm going to come back and bust your ass. I'm sitting there. He had a gun on him, and I'm talking about taking you in the bathroom and putting the beats on you.

He had the gun. Imagine that. And he popped him. Wow. Now, where I found out on the back end was, now, I'm not saying she did anything, but I found out there was a certain female that he was her baby daddy. Own it all. Pay off your home, travel for life, drive a Ferrari.

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No, that was underground. She was a CO-to. Okay, gotcha. You know. Well, so, look, it turns out that a CO didn't smuggle on a gun, but as we know, I'm going to talk about that now, stabbing's, shankings, slashings, are normal on Rikers. They call it a buck-50. Yes. Tell us what a buck-50 is.

A buck-fifty is when an inmate takes out of razor bay, preferably spit it out his mouth. and he cuts another inmate on the side of his face. And, you know, it goes from his chin all the way to his ear. And, you know, I've seen instances where you could see an inmate's teeth. And the way is how fine, according to how fine the blade is, they don't immediately open up. Yeah. You know, it's a slow split.

Yes. And then especially if you get to talking. Yeah. That's why sometimes they come and if you get to the, the clinic sooner up there, try to put, forget a Band-Aid, they probably try to put some tape on there to keep it together. Right. You know, but eventually it spreads and then that's when you get that kilo, you know, that.

Yeah. And they call it a buck 50, because they say it's like 150 stitches. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You get to sew that thing up. Is there a protocol when somebody gets stabbed? Well, first of all, tell me how a razor like that. I know, obviously, you know, inmates make shanks with, you know, whittled down toothbrushes. You know, you can make a shank with a piece of paper.

There's many, many ways. Yes. But how does somebody get in, you know, a razor like that? Is that – are knives brought in by CEOs? A lot of stuff is bringing by CEOs. You can be candid. Listen, of course it is. You know.

So what is – but what is the incentive for a CEO to bring in a razor for somebody? Now, I'm going to tell you like this. Once I was in full-blown drug dealer mode as a CEO, is my mentality is just like the streets. If I own a block, if I'm running drugs on a block, I don't want nobody getting shot or anything fighting because you bring the cops, you stop my money. It gets hot, yeah.

So I never brought in no weapons. Now, that don't mean that they didn't get, jump people in fist or cups. So I don't know why, just like, well, why would a seal bring somebody a gun in? And I learned after I went to prison, and this is why I be saying the stuff that I'm saying now, I bring a gun in it. Like I said, I'm telling this guy, I'm going to fuck you up. He got a gun.

Whoever brung him that gun, forget the inmate. Let me really have just popped them and started beating his ass. That could have been me. Right? So some females, when they're in love, I'm not going to blame it on all female correction officers, but I don't know why a seal would bring in a weapon scaffold What is that?

A scaffold like a surgeon. I'm sorry. Yeah, you get the New York access. You got the Hall of Access. You got the Hall of Access. Yeah. Scalple.

Okay. Yeah. You know. And is it like is it gang beef? Definitely. Do people pay? Would you like I pay a guard maybe if I was like the leader of, you know, whatever, the Trinitarios?

You could pay. You could pay. to get a guard to bring it. That's not new news. Yeah, yeah. You know. Yeah. But I'm especially curious, like, you know, who is, what, what I guess would be the most,

what's the unit or the jail on Rikers that tends to have the most slashings and stabbings? And what is that over generally? Is it gang beef or is it just because people are criminals? A lot of times is gang beef, right? But at the same time, it could be just survival. I'm not going to let you take my sneakers. I'm not going to let you take my stuff. Or over the telephone.

Oh, yes. Tell us about this. Over the telephone. The telephone, you got to realize, mail, visits, and the telephone is my eyes to what I'm not seeing. If I got slot time and you come in and you want to get on the phone or you on the phone over the time allowed it, I need to get my shit off.

I need to talk to my woman. I need to talk to my homey to know what's going on out there. Right. And that becomes a part of my life. Right. My time is 8 o'clock. What are you doing? Yeah.

And to take that away from a person causes somebody to get incredibly angry. Yes. Right. That phone can get you killed in Ragged Island. Like I said, one of the most dominant things that a person can do is come in a housing area. Take the phone. off the receiver, put it in his back pocket, throw a blade or a homemade shank in the middle of the floor

and tell everybody in there I'm in cell number 18. That means that if nobody comes to challenge me, that phone is mine. Wow. Now, whoever use that phone, got to pay me to use the phone, got to get my permission to use the phone, got to give me commissary to use the phone, or we fight.

Holy shit. With razors. With razors. With razors. Or whatever. And sometimes, some people pick up that blade because if I got to talk to my wife, if I got to talk to my kid, if I got to talk to my son, listen, my two-year bid would turn into 20 over that phone.

Wow. So what would yeah, I'm curious about that. What does a bid become when you see people that get re-arrested? Say I'm in there for, I got a dope case, right? Mm-hmm. And I go in there and I got to defend myself with an ox and I stab somebody.

It's just like going to trial, was it self-defense? Right. Did he try to rape you? Right. You know, then first, how did you get the weapon? We don't care about you. Right. So now you was harboring a weapon first charge.

Right. Then they change your ID to a red ID because you're a predicate cutter. like you're known now So if you get caught slashing somebody Yes You got a red ID So that means that now We know okay

Because You ever heard that saying Everybody got a gun Ain't shooting it Like some people just bluff you a lot Yeah The red ID means that he will Open your face up

He will pick up a weapon And he has assaulted an officer Right So he's one of them like I don't give a shit about none of this shit So did you remember officers getting slashed? Yes.

Did that ever happen? Yes. Oof. Officers got slashed, going to hospital, face cuts, you know, and stuff like that.

I imagine they must, if you slash an officer, you're getting pounded out. Oh, you're getting pounded out. You get an extra time. Yeah. On your bid and stuff like that. Yeah.

It's certain things that you're going to the hospital. That's mandatory day. They didn't say it in the academy, but you have to set precedence. Just like I told you. intake. I'm sitting there, gentlemen, could you be quiet? And then a CEO comes smack on, pow, everybody's quiet.

Now I got your attention. Am I supposed to put my hands on you? No. Do I got your attention? Yes. So now you assault a female? Go to the hospital. You've got to send a message. Some officers want peace and quiet in their dorm or the area that they're working, so they're known for putting the beach

on people who don't have nothing to do with the altercation. They over there fighting over a pack of noodles, right? The squad comes in, everybody getting smacked, stomped, and beating this, this, that, because we know we don't want no fighting in here. So guess what's going to happen? The next time somebody squabbling over a pack of noodles, I really don't feel like being locked in. I got to get on the phone to talk to my wife.

So we go to handle it internally. Take a fucking pack of noodles. Or I'm going to fuck you up. If you motherfuckers get to fight. fighting. Right. And I get locked in. Ah, that makes sense. You know what I'm saying? So that's the, not, when would they send? So tell us about the squad, like the goon squad with the riot gear.

Okay. When is that deployed? That deploys every time a correction officer, they got a body alarm. The body alarm, okay. And if I'm in distress, I got a problem. I'm getting assaulted. They tell you're in the academy, you better do the cockroach and be on your back and be fighting, but press that alarm. Like, you always got to have that body alarm on you. That's your lifesaver. Right.

So you always got to have that body alarm on you. You press that and it's in, you know, it rings the alarm. And any available officer. Yeah. Sometimes you have nothing but females. Oh, God. Can you imagine that? You're like, oh, Jesus, what do I deserve this?

You know, and so that's the method of isolation. Don't run on the floor to save me. Yeah. Because who's going to let the squad in? Right. To really save us if me and you both are getting our ass beat. Right, right. So is the riot squad or the squad, are they a separate just arm of the COs?

So, okay, you have something called ESU, emergency service unit. Those are officers that train every day, tactical, do all kind of, whatever. And their job is to come to the jails that are out of control, rioting, blah, blah, blah, and maintain order. So they're specifically trained. Now, in the immediate event that we need people to come right now immediately, those are just officers in the jail that's available. It could be me.

I don't have, I'm in party all night, and I'm drunk sitting there trying to sleep, and now you need me to come help you fight somebody from getting, beating your ass. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, but would they, those tactical teams, would there ever be like raids on cells planned out? Yes. When I was in full swing of being, you know, being who I was. Yeah.

I would get calls from people in security. Listen, they're coming to you. It's called a TSO. Tactical search operation. And they come, they say, okay, in this jail, we've been finding drugs a lot, or we've been finding a lot of weapons, or they've been fighting a lot. over here, or we got a stabbing or a cutting. Yeah.

So when that happens, then they get officers from all the jails. Like, you're in jail number one, two through nine, we gather officers to come, and then we search the whole jail and beat up, smack up inmates and tear up their cells and all kinds of stuff, trying to find weapons and all. So just sending a message through. Now, if they hear a particular housing area, this is how I know I was going to get caught. Because. Okay.

But save it, though, because this is a big climax. Okay, so they will come to your house near, not the frontway, but the back way. Because you're used to coming through the frontway. You're the only one got the key. You buzz them in, you let them in, boom, they come in. They're search the inmates. Yeah. So I will get a call that, you know, they're coming to your area.

And not so much they're calling me to notify me, hide your drugs and stuff. Like, don't be sleeping. and don't be doing something that you're not going to be doing. So be on point. Right, right. You know, because they're coming to search here. I'll tell my officer, listen, they're coming, they're coming. Right.

Like that, to my officer, not the inmate, and then he'll be on point like he's really doing his job. And then they'll come in there and they'll search. Exactly. You don't want to get in trouble for slacking off. Yes. Me, I took it as, let me take my drugs and hide it in the ceiling in the officer station. Right.

Okay. So when you were there late 90s, what kind of drugs? I know now fentanyl, dude, like every week somebody at Rikers is ODing on fentanyl. What were the drugs back then in the late 90s? The most common ones on Rikers. It was for, it wasn't weed because weed has a distinctive smell. Right. It was crack.

It was Coke. It was, uh, heron. Yeah. They were, uh, mail somebody a letter, put Heron in the stamp. Uh-huh. Yep. You know, and they'll get high off of that. Yeah.

How do you smoke crack in jail? They make their own pipes. They're ingenious. They'll make their pipes and they'll get their shit off. Yeah. You know, and they'll be high as a kite and you, like me being from the hood, I know what crack smells like. Right. Walking in the exit, walking in the bill, walking in the lobby.

And you'll smell it. And then you go down there. And now, because it's like, okay, I know I'm going to get busted, but I'm going to get fucking high before they catch me. And what if you catch a crackhead smoking? What's, you just... It's really nothing you could do, you know, especially giving more charges. Right, no. And then if he smoked it all, what evidence do you have, but I just know you're high.

Right. You know, so it was throw the motherfucker in his cell, right? Right. Were there any ODs back then? Like on heroin? A couple of them. No. And see, all this, like after the gun,

gun shot in there that I knew it was on. Somebody's doing something. Right. So, Harron, this, that. Some of it comes through the visit floor. But it's like you start to learn how to read the jail. Monday and Tuesday on Rikers Island wasn't no visits. Right.

So how is it this? You still got shit. Motherfucker. Somebody blessing you. You just ain't holing all your stuff that was smuggled in from the visit. Right. So these are the things that I learned. Right.

Exactly. To watch out for. So here we go. You are, you know, now seeing the realities of what it is, what this jail is, what the job is, what the life is. How did you get, well, before we get into your story. Okay. Did you see any corrupt guards, your coworkers?

before you got into it? Did you see anybody get arrested before you got into it? But what was your introduction to it? First of all, in the academy, don't bring nothing in. Don't give them a stick of bubble gum.

Don't talk to them too long because they're just picking your brain, right? So I had seen, what was called senior officers, that means officers that have been in the jail years, 10 years, and all this stuff, they will have special image. and I will see them in a morning, a breakfast sandwich,

slice a pizza, accidentally throw it in the garbage that you know the inmate is cleaning. And I see the inmate go get it and like you take out of the garbage and listen, I saw it, but at the time, that's what you want to do, hey, that's what you. So that was my first sign that I saw somebody do something like that. Yeah. Getting friendly.

Yes. Getting friendly. Now, Mayor Julian. I think stopped cigarettes in all city buildings. What year was that? Like late 90s, 2000, maybe? Yes. Yes.

Something like 2001. What it was is he did that in, for the city itself. You could be a secretary in a city building. You can't smoke. You can't smoke. Jail is a city-owned establishment. So no more cigarettes in the commissary.

Oh. So when there's no more cigarettes in the commissary, It's a hot commodity. That's right. Now, I can't go to jail because cigarettes aren't a drug in the street. Officers are still smoking cigarettes. Yeah. So, like I said, my buddy, I bought him a thing of cigarettes.

It was laced with weed and shit like that. Yeah. So when I saw it do with the pizza and stuff like that, And then there's certain inmates that have certain personas about him. And it was a certain inmate. I remember his name. His name was divine. I'm not going to call another man Divine.

So he had, literally, in his cell, silk cheeks in his cell. He walked around with gator shoes on. Because you got to remember, in Rikers Island, you don't, you're going to see if you go to jail. You're going back and forth to court. So you're wearing regular clothes. They don't make you wear like the... That's only if you're doing the year and under, then you'll wear...

The county bit, the county stuff. Yes. Yeah, county blues. Otherwise, in that, you're wearing your regular stuff. That's why people get their sneakers took and all kind of stuff. That's crazy. That's spoiled. Yeah, whatever you got arrested in,

that's what you're wearing into your family's sending you a track suit. Dog, I had to fight in sandals. In plastic sandals they gave me. What? Yes. That's wild. So you got your, and if you had. So you could have, so you could be flying there.

Yes. You could be walking around fly for a year. And the fly you are, the more higher archie and the gang, because how is you walking around with gold chains on and gold teeth and Jordans? Right. And nobody's trying you. Right. You know. Right.

So this guy named Devine had this, all this stuff in the cell, always had commissary, always was smooth and quiet. and a female CO will always come get him and take him on strolls through the jail, you know, and bring him back. And nobody said, what are you doing? Who's that? And it was like, no, but I'm the new guy just watching, keeping my mouth shut because it's odd to me,

but I know I'm from the street. I know you've got to be somebody if the officers, it's not even like she's rissing her job because it seemed like other officers, hey, Devon, hey, how you doing? Wow, so this cat had the juice. Yes, yes. He was a pimp.

Sounds like it. He dressed like a pimp. But that was my first signs of, like when you're really getting a noted job to know what's corrupt and what's allowed and what's not allowed, come on, you're giving them pizza, they're getting cigarettes,

and this guy's getting carb-launch being walked through the whole thing, and then his cell, stay open, nobody goes in there to steal nothing. Yeah. Okay. No. Right.

Fascinating. Who knows what was going on with that, huh? But now that cigarettes are illegal, do you start to see your coworkers making money bringing it in? Did you see the trade develop? I saw one guy. He was a dumb ass. I'm not going to call him.

He's cool. I saw one guy get in trouble. I just called him a dumb ass because the way he did it. Now, in hindsight of how me becoming who I became, I did my dirt by myself, right? I didn't want to accl nobody. I didn't trust nobody. It's not like, yo, you're going to get in on this with me?

It was just never like that, right? So he did some dumb, like take some cigarettes, throw him in a garbage can. like the guy with the pizza but you did it with officers who like wasn't with it like why would he come

why would you come in my area and throw something in the garbage can and then a dumb inmate was wilding going crazy trying to get out of his cell to get to that garbage can so he blew up the whole situation where the officer's like well what

what's in the garbage can then when they go and they see cigarettes and they remember the dumb guy yeah so he'd get in trouble for that? Yeah, she lost a job. Okay, so that's what would happen if you got caught bringing in cigarettes, you'd lose your job. Yes. But they wouldn't charge you. I'm not. Okay, because I know in the feds, they do, I mean, it's real small time, but they do, are, they're charging CEOs down. Now, because at the time,

it happened, but it wasn't rampant. Right. So, so how did you, you know, how did you get into doing what you did? Um, what happened with me was, I was going through a divorce. Mm-hmm. How many years on the job now are you? I think I had like two years. Okay. So you stayed clean for about two years? Yes. Okay.

For the most part. Okay. So I was going to divorce and I got hit with child support. My check was shredded. Mm-hmm. Right? I was losing everything. Car getting reposed.

At the time I had got me a place, had to move back with mom. Mm-hmm. You know, of course, whoever goes to child support, they already know how these jobs. judges can be at that time about child support. So I was desperate. Now, mind you, I've been propositioned already. Yeah, yo, Haywood, yo, come on, this, that.

And, you know, me being upstanding. Yeah. I'm not jeopardizing my job. Yeah, yeah. You know. And when Mayor Giuliani stopped cigarettes from being in the jail, it opened up a whole market. Like, tops tobacco at the time was $2 for a pouch.

Yeah. I would charge an inmate $300 for a pouch. Now, you might think that's kind of extensive, but nobody's smoking. So if you take one little roly that you made from top of tobacco and sell it for like $20, you're eating in commissary like forever with $20. And a person who got that nicotine, he's smoking.

He's going to take a couple of puffs and put that out. Take a couple of puffs and put that out. So that's life. That's everything. That's right. So they're beg borrowing still to get you that money, have their wives, their family member, put money in your commissary for one of those rollies.

Right. So me, I'm not going to sell no roly. I'm getting a quick flip. Of course. Give me $2. Ouch. You give me $300. Who was the first guy, who were the first groups of guys or guy you were working with?

It was one guy I was working with because I knew his family. like listen it's not like you're going to get resumes and say you know choose so I was somebody I knew from the street from the neighborhood from neighborhood

and he had short time yeah right but his family wasn't looking out for so I was desperate because of child support right I was nervous

I was afraid I didn't want to lose my job but I had to do something and he's desperate too Yes. So the first thing I did was bringing, like, two, three packs of tobacco. Gave it to him, that was $900. $900 just like that.

Right? Cost you six. I'm nervous. I'm afraid because let me explain something. Before I really went to the dark side, I still really wanted to do good. But at the same time, survival, self-preservation, and opportunities, they've been near. I just never took them up on it.

And when I did it the first time, sweaty palms, dripping sweat, because guess what? People knew I didn't smoke. So even seeing me with some cigarettes, hmm. Right? So I had it in my vest.

And when I made the trade-off, I'm sweating. I'm sitting there nervous all day. Hang on, let me stop you. They don't search guards going into work. Okay. It's that brotherhood. and blue, why would I ever think that you would be doing something like that?

Even though gang intel and the Inspector General, we found pouches, we found this, we found drugs, and so we know it's going on. It's just, I don't know you're doing it, and you don't know I'm doing it. And it's very awkward. If I got to work with you every day and we're cool, now I've got to be like, oh, Gary, I've got to search you. That's weird. So now, they never search you, like patch you down. Right, right.

But you got to run your bag through the magnometer. Right, right. You got to step through something. Yeah. Now, me, once I learned the craft of what I was doing, I wouldn't come in regular clothes. Because, you know, some officers come in regular clothes. You got to check your gun in the armory. Yeah.

And you got to go put your bag through there and went through there. If you beat, if the officer's really a gunhole, you got to clear it and take your pillow off and all kind of stuff. But if you came fully in your uniform, With your belt on, your badge, ready to work. Bebe, beep, beep, blah. I got it. Right, right, of course. So you had the tobacco.

You were already in uniform. With the tobacco and my, and they made it mandatory that you had to wear the staff blue vest. So. Even easier. Yeah. No, and I was a big guy. Right. And so you met, and were there the same amount of cameras back in like 99?

No. They're less cameras. So it's easier to hand it off. Where do you meet the guy? Well, in the housing area. Yeah. Well, we're working. I'm the one because in the morning, I'm there by myself,

and I'm not supposed to let the inmates out until my other officer come. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. So in the morning, I got trustees. Yeah. That's my guy. A crack and cell, he goes like he's mopping and stuff.

Inmates have never sleep, so we would go off to the side where I know they can't see, make the transaction. Yeah. And once you know there's no cameras. You know the blind spots, yeah. It wasn't no cameras. So, and then how to. Does he get the money? Does he have to sell it first?

Or does he have somebody on the outside? Listen, why are you the money? I don't deliver nothing until I get paid first. So you already had the money? I already had the money. Of course. I was better than UPS. Great, great.

Like, I would meet their sister, whoever, this and that, blah, blah, blah. And I'll have a crackhead. I would have this family member, Western Union, at the time it was Western Union. What's in this cash app? Now it's been mine. Yeah.

So I'll have Western Union money to a crackhead. I get a cracker at $10, use your ID, get it, get my $300 or whatever I'm getting, and then the next day I'll just walking there and get my pouch. And then however he get it off, if you got caught with it, that's that. That's you. Right. And come on, they'll break it down to something called fingers and gloves and the jail network. And genius.

Yeah. So, and how often then did you start $900 is love? How often were you starting to do that? Well, And how did that turn into drugs? Okay, at first, I only did it when I really needed to pay a bill, when I really needed.

Right. So when that first time went over and nobody jumped out and the rest of me, nobody said, aha, I didn't get caught. And the nervousness started going away. And I mastered the art of how to get. get it in. I was making pretty

decent money because, let me say something. I was a drunk, meaning I was drunk, and then I partied with officers who were at top pay. Right. You know, because I wasn't at top pay yet, either. So, you know,

I started buying the mincote. Okay, how much money were you making that? We break down numbers on this show. Okay. I never knew, I'll be honest, never knew how much money because guess what? I could be dead broke. I had a

gambling problem. I could go in the gambling spot with like $5 to $10,000. Lose that. Lose that. Go to jail the next day. I got about four or five brand even coming from somewhere and you'd be amazed

because one time, one guy kind of like he didn't get me in trouble but however he got his girl to smuggle smuggled on him in $1,500, and you know an inmate's not supposed to have cash on him. He's going around flashing freaking cash. Unbelievable.

Like, you see, this is why I do what I do right now, because officers ain't learned. It's still going on. And I'm trying to tell you, right then in that moment, the money is good. Okay, so you're making, like, mid-level crack dealer money from bringing in tobacco to inmates. Yes. That's wild, dude. That is so crazy. So when you actually, when I go to the drugs,

is because one of my workers. Okay, and you call them workers. This is interesting. So how many trustees or workers did you have picking up tobacco from you? Okay, so here's the thing. Only one guy picked up from me. Allegedly nobody else knew I was the guy, the connect. Oh, but you were just giving it.

He was the kingpin. And he was breaking off everybody else. But I knew who he had, going what? Working in the law library, working in the kitchen on the pink detail. So I knew, right? That's why I mentioned Monday and Tuesday I didn't bring nothing. Right. Because the jail was dry.

Right. On visiting. Wednesday is a visit. That's when all the drugs, that's when whoever could get their girlfriend to be crazy enough to bring something. Right. So that's when I hit my mark. Right, right. So I had a couple of housing areas of guys.

I had money coming from all over Western Union. People's inmates, girlfriends, mothers doing sexual favors for me to bring stuff to them. So I was a real piece of shit. Yeah, and you were kind of an addict too. Yes, I was a drunk and I was addicted to gambling. Right. I love to gamble since I was a real piece of shit. like that's when I first started

because I told you I hung out the gambling spot since I was like 15 and 16 and I went in there one time with $5 and I won't $700, you couldn't tell me gambling was in the way to the world. You know, right. You think you're going to win every time. So that high. Yeah, yeah. So like one time, I mean, I'm curious

I'm sorry just to cut you off. What kind of gambling spots? Tell us about a gambling spot back then in New York City. A gambling spot is like there's Chinese gambling spots, but would you go to the black gambling? Black gambling spots. Okay, this is fascinating.

Tell us about an old school Harlem gambling spot. You walk into, okay, sometimes it'll be a barbershop. Yeah. People in there getting the haircut. And the back room, only privy people that's known can go in the back room. Now, you sit there busy getting their haircut and people with traffic coming back from this room all day. Yeah. People coming in with meat coats and selling stuff.

Got gold ropes on. What is he doing? And they're selling the ass back there? So when I was privyed to be hanging with somebody who was allowed to go back there, that's how I got my card to go back there. So going in there was quit somebody. And then they smoke a weed. Yeah.

They're playing music. It's like a little social. It's a social club. Yeah, yeah. So it could be anywhere. Wow. It could be anywhere. I've seen a Chinese restaurant have a gambling spot in the back.

What's the wildest gambling spot you remember? Like with the most money, the most like castic outlaws. Oh, please. I was a kid and at the time it was a notorious drug kingpin named Alpo. Yeah, of course. He got, no. Everybody knows Alba. He was the guy.

I was a kid when I couldn't gamble because the stakes was high. I mean, anybody who was anybody who gamble, like $10,000 a bet. Right. You know, so I was in there like the store runner. Yeah. Go get us this. I wouldn't even order to buy beer, but at the time they gave some. So, and I seen like $300,000.

Yeah. And cash laid out on the floor. And are they playing Seelow? CELO. That's the three dice. Yes, three dice and four, five, six. Yeah. You know, and they had these wise.

bets going on like I'm going to throw a head crack on this roll this one time and they be winning so so if I came in if I how do you win 700 on five dollars okay the these games start sometimes they can start from a quarter yeah betting 25 I got the bank you bet in 15 cent 20 and then I put five dollars in there and you bet in a dollar and this and that and it goes to 20 dollars so I'm so now I got a hundred dollars in there now we bet in ten out now the game don't grow. Yeah. Right?

Yeah. So when I first came there, it was like a bunch of us. It was like seven of us kids. We all had pocket change and we'll put it together to make three or four dollars to make a bet. Yeah. So that's how we started doing it. So one day I was there. My mom had gave me like an allowance, like about $15.

It wasn't an allowance because I didn't get it all the time. So, and I had $5 and I was bet $2 and $3 in. I built that up to $15. And I built it up to like I had $35 from $5 and they kept growing until I was gambling and I didn't know How much I had and didn't they said you know the cops come. It was it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a it was a It was a day on the door so you get to stop everybody got water in there right and when I ran out when I got home and I took all the the crypt Crick put up money and sat on my bed. It was like like like like six 85 Wow and I'm like you can't tell me that I'm not going to be gambling.

Can't tell me shit. You know, and then I started going back and I would win, I would lose and this and that. And, you know, over a period of time, you're going to lose more than you win. Of course, of course. That's the disease, right? And it's like, it's like, crack.

You're chasing that high that you got. Right. When you came in there, because sometimes I come with $200 and then I want $8,000. It's like you got to catch the nights. And then you started learning, oh, Johnny's hair or Peter's here. Yeah. And they'll call your phone. Your Mac is in the end of the day.

And then you come because, you know, these are the guys who got money. Right. And so they can match your bets. And they're the degenerates. Yes. Wow. Does that still, do they, I think they still have some gambling spots in New York. Nah, they do.

They do have some. You know, because that's a way to get shot too. You know, that's because I, when I used to roll dice with like, you know, semi-dangerous people, like, I realized, I'm like, oh, I'm up $300. I just took from this guy. And he wants, he's like, go, let's go. Let's go it again. He's trying to win it back.

I could just say I quit. and that's where it gets dangerous. And that's where it gets dangerous. Yes. So now you're making fucking cake. Yes. Tens of thousands of dollars a month off your cigarette hustle. And so you could just go blow five Gs in a hand.

And come back in and get three or four grand. Easy. I'm sorry, I took us down that road. Real quick. Real quick. Because now we're going to get into the big crescendo. This is a fascinating episode, man. I'm so glad you hit me up.

I just, man, we got a little send a shout. Shout out to Magic Mind. I'm exhausted. I came in from L.A. I've been running for the last three days. I'm fried. Okay. I've been doing comedy shows and podcast nonstop.

So I take one of these back. It's like it's got neutropics. It's got like 55 milligrams of caffeine. So it's like drinking half a cup of coffee. And I just toss it back and I'm like laser focus. Like I'll be back good to work for hours after this. So if you like it, like if you need this, go check them out, magic mine.

They're a cool little company out of L.A. Hang on. I can't recommend it enough. Caffeine is my, that's my drug, bro. Anyway, so you've got your worker, your kingpin bringing in the tobacco. How does that elevate to drugs? Because, okay, competition.

We still, like, I'm not the only guy in, no. Bringing shit in. Yeah. Did you know who the other cats were? know. Okay. I didn't know at first. Right. But then one of my workers is like, like, you know, kind of made a comment like you small fry. Like, like, you know, kind of like, I'm going to go work for somebody else. And I'm like, because I'm like, motherfucker, I'm the one that fucking feed you motherfuckers. So me and the guy will tell you, say, yo, you say,

yo, you need to step your shit up. Is that, was he like dropping the price? the other CEO? Yeah, no. Why would I pay for tobacco when I can get high high? Yeah, yeah. Right? So then my thing is, at the time,

once I got winded at, now, because I'm going to be honest with you, I was a criminal for bringing in cigarettes. You still bring in contraband. Yeah. But I really didn't feel that I was in jeopardy. Like, what the fuck are they going to do? It's still cigarettes.

The most I'm going to lose my job. Yeah. Right? Now you go to jail, but I'm thinking the most of I'll do my job because it's not a drug. A narcotic. Yeah, it's not illegal. But at the same time, if I'm making this money with cigarettes, how much money I can make if I bring in Coke or something else. Now, here's the thing.

You got to be careful because you really don't want people getting high. Like, you do? You really don't want people doing things that's noticeable. Right. Right. Because in full swing, I was bringing in Hennessy for somebody's birthday. Yeah. A small thing, a lipton iced tea.

You know. What do you charge for a bottle of Hennessy? $500.00. Easy. And I would get the airport nip. Yeah. You didn't even bring him a full bottle. I'm not doing that.

Not VSOP. Okay, I had to learn. Like, once you dive into that element, I had to learn the craft. And when I say learn the craft, it's like, is, like, is. Like, it's a hustle. Yeah. So if I'm going to bring in Hennessy, people who senses smell and hearing and all that. It's times 10.

Right. Like, so. Because you're so deprived in there. Yeah, you could smell Hennessy from. They can smell what female officers coming by her perfume. Oh, that's Officer Jasmine. Yeah. Right.

So if I brought somebody Hennessy in there, you know you're locking in yourself for the whole day. Right. Enjoy your fucking birthday. Right. But you ain't coming out, reeking of nothing. You know, and you better be washing your mouth out with tooth facing this. No. Do you run that down to them?

Yes. Yes, they knew. And if they stepped out, you find a reason to put the pound it on. Yes. Come on. This is a business now. Yeah. You know, so with Coke, everybody can't afford Coke.

Right. You know, only a select few can get the money up for Coke. Okay. about the Coke economy in Rikers. What does, how is it sold? Like, say, I bring in a balloon, you bring in a balloon of five grams. How does that break down?

How do they break that down? It's just in a little hits? Yes, it. Just one snorbers. I don't know how much they charging. Yeah. I'm charging to these. The minimum I'm charging is $500 to, like, $1,500.

For a gram? Maybe a half ounce of Coke. I'm trying. Oh, 14 grams. Oh, okay. That's a lot cheaper than I thought you were going to say. Yeah, yeah,

because everybody couldn't afford it. But me getting two or three people to get me $1,500 in one wok, then now I ain't got to go around the fucking city to your people house for $500. Right, right. You know, and that wasn't that often because by choice,

I didn't want you skied up because a lot of times people get to fighting. When you get to fighting, Alarms get the pull. People come taking you out the area. Blood, no, drug testing you and stuff like, and then it's like, how did he get Coke? How do you get this high?

And it's just like the phenomenon that's going on right now. Can I stop you really quick, though? Sure. Just as a former drug dealer, fascinated with the numbers. Why is it more worth it to bring in 14 grams of Coke that only a select few people can afford for $1,500 when you could bring in a pack of, you know, a pack of tobacco? for 300, but that's going, that's selling out instantly. Because after trying to almost getting caught a couple of times

and trying to stash my stuff in the ceiling. One time my dumbass had like 20 pouches on me and the search was in my area. Right? What's a search? Search is when they randomly pick areas to search for drugs and weapons. To bring the dog. And they brought the dog in.

And I was so happy that all I had was tobacco at the time. Right. So I did the Coke thing. Whoever could afford it, I made it affordable because it was quicker. Right. For me. Right. You know what I'm saying?

And then at the same time, I wasn't getting out there. I could have got more if I stood out in the street. Yeah. And so I'm not doing that. No, of course. I'm in here. I'm an officer. You don't suspect me.

Right. So you went back to, you went to Coke because it was. It was way less bulky. Yes. And you could just, it was more, a lot more subtle. Yeah. That's it. Okay.

And I was making more money with the tobacco because everybody couldn't afford the Coke. But the tobacco got too hot. So did you stop the tobacco when you started bringing in the Coke? I didn't stop anything. Okay. Great. So you're, okay. You didn't tell me that.

You're just adding different products. Okay. Well, it was a feel, right? Now, I already had my tobacco connect. I know he's going to get it. And, and, And the way I had it was I gave it to him. And he got it out my house because I got so tired of the goddamn search coming to my area and me being nervous and all that.

So the thing was, as soon as I get it to you, you get it out the area. How would he get it out of the area? Because he was a trustee. Right. Right. And he, you know, a lot of drugs go on throughout the jail due to lazy officers. Right. Because if we did everything we're supposed to do, right?

You'll catch a lot more of you. You're not going to catch everything. No. Like, for instance, me and you work in the housing area, there's only two of us. There's a hundred inmates. Oh, dead. The rule says every time inmates leave the housing area or come in the housing area, you search him. Bro.

Hang in to search a hundred people. I've been partying all night. I'm tired. I'm slump. I'm drunk. I'm not certain. And guess what? if I did, the captain,

because you got certain hours of the feeding, right? Certain hours of what? It's called the feeding is the breakfast, lunch and dinner. They call it the feeding, meaning it's a process with all the inmates come down to the mess hall to feed. Everybody got to take turns bringing their houses down to the mess hall. Right.

That feeding would go on for hours if the officers searched every inmate, 100 inmate. coming out the housing area to make sure you're not bringing no weapons, drugs, anything out there, I got to search. Right. So that's 100 on the coming out.

It's not feasible. And then they got to pass this metal detector in the hallway to make sure nobody passed weapons in the hallway. Then going into the mess hall, you search him. Everybody.

So you get searched leaving and then search going in plus passing through a metal detector. Yes. And then so... And they still get stuff in. To make sure that you ain't meet your boy in a mess hall.

on the way out the mess hall, everybody gets searched. It's impossible. It's literally impossible. And if one guy does it, if one guy's all gung-ho, that means the rest of the CEO's got to do it, and they don't want to do the extra work. And the supervisors itself, like, I'm not going to be for freaking five hours.

You'll never get to the fucking lunch. Right. Right, I see. Or whatever. So they're like, run the house out. And we'll run them in there. And the officer's safety, not in the rules,

the less inmates that are passing in the corridor, the safer the officers are. Right. You know what I'm saying? So the quicker we get you in there to eat your food, the quicker we get you back in the house, the less cuttings and stabs and stuff go on. Okay.

Man, that makes sense. Okay, so the trustees get it out, how they get it out. Did they ever get caught with... All the time they got caught. Right. And they didn't rat on you. Wow. Okay.

And that's just like a trip to the hole or something? Depending on what they get caught with. Yeah. If there's tobacco, because they mean... take gloves, they put the tobacco in there. I've never seen nobody get caught with coke, but they got caught with tobacco, got caught

being drunk, and got caught with, like, real money from in the street. Yeah. Like, what are you doing with that? Yeah, stupid. You know, so... So, okay, so tell us then tell us about how the Coke... So now you got tobacco and Coke.

How did that... Did you grow that? Like I said, everybody couldn't afford Coke. Right. So, I would bring in Coke at least maybe two, three times a month. Okay. But that was enough. That's a nice 4Gs. Yes.

Yeah. Plus my paycheck. Yeah. You know. And the tobacco. Yeah. So listen, you think that's something. Did you buy a house?

Did you get back on your feet? Oh, yeah. Did you get, you got a spot? Yes. I had a couple of spots. I had two, three spots. Nice. You know, a couple of cars.

Yeah. You know, I learned from some of the older drug dealers. Not to be too flashy. So I would buy stuff like minivans and MPVs and stuff like that. You know what I'm saying? And I will drive the same car to work. Of course. Don't show up in your new flashy joint.

Not my Tuesday, Mercedes and my Wednesday. Right. So I learned from my older cats. Like even when I had the beef with my best friend and he was trying to kill me and we was going at it, the older cats would tell me, listen, when you go up to you, your floor, don't just get off the elevator. Let the door open and sit there. Yeah, yeah. And at the last minute, jump out.

Right. Don't go on the two floors below or two floors that. Come out at a different exit. Right. So I learned all this stuff. Of course. Not that I was a super duper gangster, but like if you and you're in that life. Smart, though. Yeah, you have to be smart. Because that's what. There's inmates that know your whole family,

know where you went to school, know where you lay your head at and everything and we'll get at you. Right. Now, when your best friend, who you had to beat up, when he shot at you, when he got out and then he came by shot at you, were you already crooked and selling dope by then? Okay, gotcha. That's why you had the pistol on it. Yes. No, but as an officer, you had a legal gun. Pistols on you all the time.

But you know not to shoot it because if you shoot it, you're in trouble. Yeah. Especially if you're really not defending yourself. Right. Okay. So then did you bring in anything? Like, how did this all, what happened after that? You're bringing in coke, tobacco.

I'm bringing in Coke, tobacco. You're bringing hair on? No. Okay. No. But they was getting it. That's how I knew competition was getting stiff. Uh-huh.

You know, I was bringing Coke, tobacco, cell phone service. Okay. Yes. Now it's the era of the cell phone. Yes. Tell us about this. I will buy that because at the time, when cell phones was in all these iPhones and all that, They had little flip phones like this that an inmate can boof and is behind. Yeah, yeah. And hide it.

At the time, you had cards that you could buy minutes. Right. So I would put 10 minutes on a phone. Yeah. $500, you get 10 minutes to say whatever you want to say. Wow. And then you bring that phone back to me. Wow.

Wow. And people would pay that. Yes. Wow. Not to be on the Rikers Island phone. Right. Right. You know, and that was, that was very lucrative.

Lucrative. That was lucrative. How often could you set that up? I was doing that at least two or three times a week. Oh my God. Yes. That's wild. Yes.

I had money coming from all over. That's why I couldn't, I can't really tell you, like, on an average day. I made this and that. Because a lot of people couldn't afford it, but the ones who I knew, once I got somebody who I can trust that I was, rocking with, you know, that's how I got caught, but, you know, that I was rocking with, it was like a cash cow. Right, right.

You know, and I would just offer my services. And then, not to mention, when I recruited a female correction officer that was offering up her services. Okay, so tell us about this. Yeah. Actually, that's my second book. It's called Copstitute. Okay.

What would you do to feed your kids? So, listen, I don't care. you work in a hospital, police department, fire department, whatever. I'm not talking shit about anybody's occupations. Sex is going to be around.

So officers are fucking. Like, that's no-brainer. That's why there's a high rate of child support and all kind of crazy. I learned that when I first got in there that officers are fucking. And it's because they spend so much time on a job.

It's high stress. Yeah. You know, you spend more time with me, then you do your husband. Yeah, right. So eventually something going to happen. Sure. You know, so you will have inmates that would come down on new charges.

Right? And be on Rikers Island. Now, they're already bitten. Now they come down to go to court on other charges. And they got money. Oh, you mean there's already, there are inmates in serving time in the penitentiary who get caught new cases up there and they send them back to Rikers.

No, no. No, they're up in during the penitentiary. doing a bid, and they got evidence that you had something to do with something else here. So you come back down to Rikers. Right. And you fight in another case while you already... From the street. Yes.

Oh, I see. Gotcha. Wow. So, I learned all this after the fact that is no fucking secret. There's no trust nobody. It's a status thing for M.A. to have an officer in his pocket, right? So female officer came to me on time because I'm dealing with anybody. First of all, I'm, me being a big guy, they put me in the high classification area in GMDC. Seven upper, eight upper high classifications. Those are all the drug king pens, all the murderers.

So you were some high-minded criminals. Yes. Everybody was in the paper came to my area. Right. Do you remember any like real like high-profile guys that stand out that you guard it? on Rikers? I got it the guy at the time when AIDS first came out,

I got this guy who was all in the paper for spreading AIDS to a bunch of people. It was who was that guy? He had killed, like shot, I'm going to say killed. Like about eight people.

And he would show his paperwork about where he left this body here and this body here. It was a, bunch of them who came through like drug dealers and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah. Well, anyway, sorry. It's okay. So you're in this high, high class unit

and so these cats got money. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So she was tired of getting beat. When I said getting beat, she was giving ass to inmates who didn't have money. Oh, my God. And it was stiffer. Like, oh, my people won't come,

this and that, and we never. So she was amateur. Oh, man. I didn't bring nothing until I got the money, right. Right. So, sex in one of these dudes, they run in my mouth,

I don't know how you pillow talk in jail, but they told her about me. So she came to me, kept her mouth shut, and offered me a proposition. I ain't wanted no ass. I'm getting all the coochie. Yeah.

But so, so they had something called a pyramid scheme. Right? A whole bunch of officers was in there, even higher, deputies and all that and she was sexing them getting money from them. Wow.

The captains and all that. So we and her came to a agreement that I would let her know the dudes that really got money that that's really going to pay her. She would rock out with them. How much would she charge

like a king to fuck? She would charge $1,500 a pop because she figured these motherfuckers ain't going to last for so long anyway. Right. I was getting $500 off deck from showing her who. Yeah. Right.

And she made pretty decent money. There's been times where not only them, I would see it out in the street, take a deputy. She will have me sit in my car, follow her, get out her car, get in his car, follow him, go to the hotel as kind of like proof if he ever fucking. Ratted. Yeah. There's eyes on you. Yes. Yeah.

Wow. Wow. It goes so deep, dude. That is crazy. When I sit back and I look at myself the craziness and at that time, it wasn't crazy at all. Right.

Because you're in it. And then she started the inmates that I would let know that now I'm selling ass. I'm gonna tell you the funny story. You're pimping. You're selling dope. You're pimping.

Damn, you went from a square Marine. If those crackheads from Harlem could see you now, boy, you're running it. Yeah. And I'm going to tell you a funny story. Now, I did my time on working again. The Daily News calls me. They want to,

we want to do feature your book in the Daily News. So I'm thinking they're going to put this little article about my book. So she said, where are you? I'm at work. I said, I'll come out for lunch. I'm working for New York City House. I come down, a photographer takes like 100 pictures of me and about the leave.

I said, so where's the reporter? she gonna call you later. Never get the call. Right? I had a boy running the newsstand. He called me like 2 or 3 o'clock in the morning. Motherfucker.

I'm like, what happened? Like, I'm thinking something happened. He said, you are on the front page of the Daily News. Wow. And it says, I quote, he made money so in Coke,

cigarettes, and coach by having female officers prostitutes themselves. He pimped out female correction officers. Now, I'm gonna be honest with you. I can't say that I pimped him out. She was doing it anyway. Yeah, of course.

You were just an escort service. Yes. Wow. Basically, because pimping is making you, like, bitch, you better go do it, I'm gonna beat your ass. Yeah. Well, how many tricks do you think you helped her turn?

Oh. Quite a few? Once again, everybody had that kind of money. but she did about 4,500 a week plus her thing and would come like it's sometime like listen

but here's my question though where how do you set that up where do you fuck the bathroom remember back then and there's not cameras like that right right right so she had a post where she floated around you know sometimes

sometimes delivering mail sometimes coming to get them from escorting for medication early in the morning. So we always had it mapped out. Yeah. Once we got the money, she'll come with her condoms. Yeah.

Go right in the office's bathroom. Yeah. You know it ain't no camera in there. Right. Wow. Do your business. Yeah. And like she said...

Would you stand guard? Definitely. Yeah, yeah. Because I don't even getting caught in here. Right. Now, I remember one time, our court, this ain't got nothing to do with what I'm. doing, I caught a female officer giving an inmate head.

And then when I quarter, like, let me tell you like, like this, if you ain't yelling, screaming, rape, help me, get them off me. Right. I'm on my business. And later on, I'm a dirty, I was, I was a dirty Negro. Because later on, uh, I, you got some head. Yeah, because you're trying to explain all that was my, my baby daddy. I got a kid by him and blah, blah, blah.

I was just, listen, hey. give me some head no one will ever find out a couple of times I'm playing no but listen that's the nature of the game but guess what they used

what they got yeah yeah and at that time by the way did you ever like you know like you know sexual assault

amongst inmates did that happen on workers I hate asking that question I did it of course because see all right I don't want to say

the wrong thing about the community, I don't want to say the wrong thing because now you got to be correct. Nah, you'll be right. Yeah. Back then, they had what you call homosexual or gay housing. Right. Where if you said that you were gay, they will put you all together.

Right. Reason being because a lot of these gangsters... Yeah, they don't want that. No, they would beat them up, mistreat them, so for their own safety, they'll put them together. Yeah. that don't mean that it wasn't getting taken advantage of in that housing area. Really? Yes.

Wow. And some people being spiteful will put a straight young person talking this in them housing areas. Oh, like COs would mix them. Yes. You're going to the gay unit. Yes. So what would happen if you sent like a hard rock to the gay unit? One time I found a young man.

in there. Like, this one I'm trying to say. People got to understand when I talk, I talk to deter people from going to jail. Because I'm going to let you know. A CEO has your life in their hands, bro.

Right? So you talk shit, tough Tony. I don't care if you kingpin. I'm all kingpin. Knock out 30 people. I can still decide whether you live or die

up in there. Wow. So one time a kid was running his mouth. To a female CEO, ugly bitch, in a town, everybody wants to fuck you, you know, being very disrespectful. So she signed him in to gay housing. And when you go to gay housing, I can't live here, I'm not going there.

Then the squad comes and whip your ass. So you're going in that housing area. Yeah. Right? Wow. That, I found that out later. because at the time, you know, everybody had to work the gay housing.

So I was working there one time. And you got to do account. At least three times a day you got to account, make sure all the inmates accountable, look in the cells, make sure nobody hanging themselves because you never know what somebody got found guilty of. Did you ever see that?

Did they ever have to cut people hanging? I cut somebody down. Oh, my God. It's terrible, dude. Bro, this is. Oh, it's awful. It happens all the time still in Rikers. They teach you an academy that these are possibilities of that,

what you're going to run into. Oh, man. You know, so I'm doing my count, and I'm coming up one short all the time. Yeah. One short. So sometimes, officially you got, you yell at count time, and they all go stand in front of the cell,

and you do the count, you tell you, yeah, we got 30. Good. then they go back to doing what they're doing. Or if it's a smooth day and it ain't no fighting, ain't no, and you tell everybody freeze, count. Stay where you are. I count everybody at the day room. I count all right this and it's that, 30, be good.

Yeah. Kept coming up short, right? So I said, okay, now, listen, everybody goes in front of their cell now. Now we got to do it the right way. Right, right. Still coming up short, so I'm going by this one particular guy, cell, right? and I noticed that he would make sure

that he's standing in front of his window. Right? So I'm counting that I looked in the window and I've seen the trickle of blood on the floor. So I move, right? So I go in there and I follow the blood

and look up his sheet and Diego, the young guy. He's wrapped, head to toe, in a sheet. The only thing that is exposed is his mouth and his butt. And this is the guy that was running his mouth. You guys put it there?

Running his mouth. They was doing him dirty. And we failed them. Yeah. As an officer. Yeah. We, we, we, okay, I'm saying like this. You're not going to catch anything.

You're not going to catch everything. I don't care if you were super gung-ho on your job. The way is designed. There's another reason. why I don't go to jail. The way is the sign. You got to fit the inmates here, 50 emmage here or in the cell area at 30 and 30. I'm controlling all the knobs. Another one's going back and forth. When he goes up to A side, somebody getting fucked, beat up, a robbed on a B side. And then you come, you ask him what happened, or I slipped

in the shower. Because they're afraid to tell you that this dude just made me give him head and took my sneakers and beat me up. Yeah. So I found this kid. Yeah. And in my mind, I'm fucked. I'm, I'm, my partner's fucked. Right?

Because it's a difference. People get raped in prison. I hate to say it like this all the time. Some of them will never make us think about it. Yeah. Some of them go to the clinic and it's found out that they got raped, but they don't want it to be known

around the jail that they got Right So In particular I was terrified There's no answering Like it's no

How are we gonna hide this Right How are we gonna answer for this Right Because we're supposed We're watching all the time Yeah You're not supposed to be on one side

You're supposed to be patrolling Back and forth Right Right Right Yeah Giving them options Opening their cell

Watching them So what'd you guys do I got them from under there Yeah Oh I put the B on the guy who cell he was in.

Oh, of course. But he was the one that did it. Oh, really? It was just his cell. They stashed him in because he was a punk. Wow. Somebody going to get something,

especially if I'm losing my job. Right. Right. Now, if you beat up somebody that was gay in this day and age that did that, even if they were in prison, would you be, like, in trouble? Because it's like it would be looked at

a hate crime or something? But it wasn't a hate crime. It wasn't that back then. Yeah. Obviously, it's not, no, it's not even now, but like, it's not. But would they consider that potentially, you might get a lawsuit by somebody trying to take advantage of you? If I can prove you raped somebody, gay or not, you broke the law. Yeah, of course.

That's why you got your ass. Did you guys ever end up finding who did it? Yeah. Yeah, we found out who did it. Transfer them out. But it's all after the fact, because this is what happened. Like I said, you got to really sign yourself in and say, I'm gay to go into the gay housing.

Right. Right. So once this happened to this dude, and then I didn't know at the time how he got there. I'm just working the house in there. But you always find out everything after the fact. That he cursed out some female officer. They made his ass going there.

And this is what happened to him. So now I get him from under the bed, unwrap him. he crying don't know trying to still have a tough persona but Duke right yeah

um my partner are you worried about HIV me I'd be terrified I at the time bro not even thinking about it my job

yeah let me get this dude from under here right right and see what the story is yeah yeah right I hate to say

you go always spin it and lovers quarrel he was with it They had a fight. I mean, you know, you're thinking about saving your own ass. Oh, right. Right? So me and my partner trying to get the story together.

I'm human. Bro, you want to go to the hospital? He said, no. He said, hey, we just, just get me out of here. Yeah. That's all I want. Wow. I don't want nobody to know.

Yeah. I lucked up. He didn't want nobody to know. Yeah. He just wanted to be out of them. Right. Right. A-Sat Rocky.

Got his card, made a few phone calls, swapped him with a... Yeah. Yeah. And got him... Wow. And I seen him in passing. Yeah. Now, motherfucker's going to talk.

Right, right. You know, but somebody's saying that you got raped versus people actually was there. Right. You can always dispute that. Right. Right. Wow. And he knows.

Never acted up again. Wow. Well, obviously. And he was, I think he did it like a little five-bit bit. Man, I hope you went and got tested, bro. But I'll tell you, I'll tell you this. God damn. Me?

When I ever work that housing there, I was on my job. Forget. For sure. For sure. I was on my job. Yeah, that's wild. You know. Okay.

We got to, man, that is just, that's insane. I mean, that's Rikers, though. Like, and that, and telling these stories, like, that is, that's like the chilling reality of what goes on in an American prison jail in the most the richest city in the in the in the country of in the richest country on earth that this is what happens every day yes so tell tell let's round it out though so you're you're on your hustle mm-hmm how did it all fall apart how'd you get how'd you get knocked getting comfortable uh-huh getting comfortable okay uh I had a friend that I was working with what do you mean

working with it was another guy from a neighborhood now he was from my neighborhood he was a CEO no an emma okay got you

that I was doing business with his sister was from my neighborhood and periodically we would fuck and she said oh you know oh my brother's there so

it became all right like it was like clockwork yeah she gave me the package and I Give him my money. Right. Coke?

Yeah. I got comfortable. I'm thinking he in there for a little skid bit. What's the skid bid? Skid bid. It's a quick one, right? One and a half. That's what, listen, one day in jail is horrific.

Right, right. For somebody who never been to jail. But jailers, people who will be going, you got two years. I'll sleep two years. Right. Right. So I stopped checking. Right.

The packages. I got careless with touching. Because before you put in the bag, I never touched nothing. And then when I give it to you, I dropped out the bag. So they could come raid this with my fingerprints. They don't shit.

Right. So we fucking. We cool. I'm making money. Yeah. You know. Everything's all good. Yes.

Yes. Until, until I'm working. Right. And the inmates, the blacks and Puerto Rican is about to have a little riot in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the, and that was in a whole bunch of other officers trying to defuse the situation. And they rowdy, but as soon as I walk in, everybody simmer down. Everybody simmer down. And, and that was unusual, right? Very, that a female captain observing the whole thing, because they, they was, like, we were about, we were about, we were about, and they were about. about ready to get it in.

Right. And she looked over because, you know, my name is Haywood. Everybody, what's up, Wood? What's up, what? M.H that I didn't even know was like, what's up, Wood? Ah. Right. People running their mouth.

Yeah. So she asked me, who are you? I said, oh, you know, I'm officer Hayward. No, she said, no. Who are you? Whoa. Just like that? like that. And then now I'm

now I'm like somebody talking. Because I've been rocking, once you, rocking, making money, losing money, drunk, drinking, fucking this and that. How long is this run that you've been on? I was I would say the run was about six years. That's a long time.

It was a, but. That's longer the most dope dealers on the streets last. Listen, but you got to remember, I'm on the cover of being a correction officer. I know. Whoever going to suspect me. Of course. Of course. You know. And I'm going to say, for doing for six years because I started after this I started

dabbling in the streets but I had to do that because now I connects and you know So you're moving stuff on the streets a little bit Oh okay no I really What are you talking like wholesale or kibbles and bits? Well you know what I was just connect He had it you go to him

Oh about giving me my cut We're talking bricks? Not bricks like that Not bricks like like like halfs? I'm not going to tell you not bricks Because once I made the introduction and got my cut I don't know what you did after that Oh, gotcha.

But I didn't really want to do that because I'm an officer. Right. I'm killing. I'm killing. Yeah. You just got night. You just got a, you know what you had? Multiple streams of income.

That's it. Very good. That's it. Diversity, man. So when stuff started getting back to me, you know, this is why I would be telling opposites. Like, it's no such thing as everything going to come to an end. Right. Right.

So after that incident, did you fall back or what happened? Okay. I fell back. made a few phone calls from friends of mine and I was quitting. Yeah.

Get me out of here. Transfer me to the tombs. Downtown, yeah. Yeah, right? As soon as I'm working in the tombs, the inmate dies, no way knows why in a holding pin.

This shit does follow me. But, um, so now I'm working in the tombs. trying to become this model officer. Yeah. Again. Right.

And then the call came down and they modified me. What does that mean? That means you're officially under investigation. Wow. And these are the feds? No, these are the IGs. Internal Affairs for corrections. Okay, got you.

So now, when you're under investigation, you're still getting paid. where we're taking that shield we're taking that gun and you get to keep your ID okay this is so interesting why they do that why do they tell you you're under investigation is the idea to catch you it's like the feds

there I got you oh wow you can run you can do whatever we already got when we do that right she they did that they already had everything they needed on me they were just waiting for to get all the paperwork together and connect the dots the other people that was under

investigation doing the same thing as me because when I got arrested, six other people got arrested. But we didn't, it was like we was a gang. Yeah, yeah. Because there was other people with other jails. Right. They just wanted to tie you in in one big bus. That's it. Wow.

To make it big and crazy. Like, this is what we're doing. Right. So when you got, when you got modified. So now what are you thinking? I'm thinking who the fuck, how the fuck, what they got on me? Yeah. Damn, I was reckless.

You're taking all that's reckless. Oh, fuck, I shouldn't know. Was it this one? No, you're sitting there trying to figure it out. That, I was modified for like four months until they knocked on my door. At home? At home. I was living with another female, a female CO.

In the morning, they came, knocked on the door. They buzzed, because sometimes the police does buzzer to get in the building. Yeah. So they buzzed the buzzer and they said, the police. And she's like, why the fuck they always buzzer my, my buzzer to get in the building? Not thinking they're coming to your house.

Right. And they came up, they knocked on the door, and I'm getting dressed. And the ex says, Gary Hayward here. And she said, yeah, so now we book, because now this is not correctional, these are cops.

Yeah. So I'm even, right? And it was like, We need you to come with us. Bye, bye, bye, Turner Affairs and that. So I'm going to be honest with you. At this point in time,

I don't know what the fuck it is. Cocky me, you ain't got shit because I never got caught with no coke. I never got caught with no... Right. With nothing. Yeah. Right?

So they take me down town. I forgot where it was two Lafayette streets, somewhere like that, right? Mm-hmm. And now I'm not in handcuffs. I'm just riding in the back of the car Right?

So they put me in the room. I sit down. They say, wait right here. Right? So they all come in. Right? And it was like, we were getting reports

about contraband and cocaine and blah, blah, blah. So me, I'm taking everything to agree. I don't know what you're talking about. This and that. So they had a TV did it. And they put the video up, right? So it's a,

I just want to show you something. So I look, and it's me. Taking the package. You thought this was your run club era. Turns out, it was more of a thinking about run club era. The good news? Someone's marathon training is about to start. Sell your workout gear on Deepop.

Just snap a few photos, and we'll take care of the rest. They get their race day fit, and you get a payout for trying. Someone on Deepop wants what you. you've got. Start selling now. Deepop, where taste recognizes taste. From this dude's sister. Right? On the streets? On the streets. She met me.

I remember in front of fucking bowling alley. I thought it was odd, but I'm so used to meeting her. They were in a car videotaping me. Oh, shit. Taking it. Wow. Right? Dumb me, not checking, used to. Going business with her.

Yeah. Took it to bring it to the brother. They told me, is that true? I'm like, I'm not going to say yes. Little did I know, I didn't have to say shit. Because I'm busy looking at myself up on the screen. They got another camera behind a mirror looking at my facial expressions that they're going to use against me.

Like, he never said it was him, but you can see his reaction when he saw himself. Right. Wow. Right. So now I'm like, in my mind, I am fuck. Uh-huh.

Right. And I'm like this. I never said, yes, that's me. I was like this. Like, you know, oh, shit. Right?

After I did that, then I stood me up. You got to write the main silent. Handcuffed me. Is that all they had? I didn't know. That was too much for me. And I didn't know what they had.

Right? If you got that, Now I'm like, how reckless was I? If I didn't know about that, what else did they have on me? So now I'm getting booked. I get down to what you call Bronx Criminal Court, right? Do you live in the Bronx? No.

Well, everybody from Rikers Island gets arrested, they go to the Bronx. Oh, right, Bronx County, right. So I'm in Bronx, and then they bring in other officers. And then they bring in the officer, you know, that first, where I first got winning, who was bringing in Coke. So when I saw him and all that, the gig was up. Wow.

Now wondering how much, who they got, whatever. So when everything unfold, they said that the girl and her brother was coming to testify. So they wouldn't get time, testify against me.

Wow. And I'm dead if that's true. Right, right. Right. So I'm sitting there. Now, $30,000 bail. So is that 10%

You just put up three grand? Yeah No, it was $300, so I had to pay $30,000. 30, got to okay In hindsight, I had the money But one thing that happened When they're ranked me now Are you being charged in federal court?

I'm being charged In federal court or state? Oh, interesting, okay The state deals with it Usually it's the feds when it's like cops and shit But I'm gonna be honest with you if I was a real criminal

like I was a criminal but I was in right it was synthetic coke oh the package that she gave you because they can't give you real coke oh interesting the feds could but the state had I had I known that I probably would have fought

a little bit more you know what I'm saying but I'm thinking they got me did you have a good lawyer I was going That's what I was going to do But Half me said

Save your money bro It's already Now it's already front Front page I'm getting arraigned I look back My mom Family there

Yeah It's dead Yeah That was the hardest thing Over this whole bit Yeah Look at my mother Across that visit floor

Table and telling her Don't put up the house don't put up this stuff, don't do all that. Let me just ride this out. Right. Right. Still, I still didn't know how much time.

Right. What I was getting. So then scaring the shit out of my mother. Yeah. Emmy. Oh, he was suspected of all the drugs that I was coming in, building. Yeah.

All this and that. If convicted of all charges, he faces life in prison. The street part of me is like, okay, you caught me for a half ounce of cocaine. Yeah. motherfuckers don't get life relaxed for that if that's all they got you for right

so now I don't know you come on you know how it is in jail they play that game you're sitting there you ain't connected nobody can talk to you I ain't got no code defendants so when it came down to it

I have been in about five months okay so you didn't bail out I didn't bail out because were they keeping you at Rikers no okay I'm going to tell you, the inmates loved me. Yeah.

Right? Bloods, Crips, Latin Kings, so they didn't make a difference because I did business with everybody. Yeah. And when they found out the guy who would sit to me, they had to get him out, the state. They had to get him out. Oh. They were going to riot. Right.

Right. Wow. And they couldn't keep me on Rikers because they was going to write. So they sent me to Nassau County. Yeah. Long Island. Yeah. And, um, will bring me back to forth.

And whatever money I had, I figured I was going to need, because I felt I'm caught. Yeah. When you go to prison, you need that money. Yeah. So when they came and offered your boy, uh, two flat. Two years? Two years. That's a skid bid.

Dumb me. They must ain't got shit. Oh. You see what I'm saying? Because they're trying to deal already. I could probably, I could probably, I could probably get him. But dumb me talking to myself, motherfucker you ain't know about this bowling alley video. Right.

I already been in five months. So out of 24 months, you do 20 months. Right. I ripped the lawyer's shirt getting that pin out of his pocket. Right. To sign that. Yeah. And then I went up north.

And that's one real fun. begin. Okay. Wow. Um, so look, we're, we're out of time. I want to, I want to save the bid, the story of you being up north for the Patreon. If you wouldn't mind, just like an extra half hour, we'll stay and share these stories with the premium members. Okay. Is that cool? Hey. Because I don't want to give away, this has been one of the most fascinating stories. I'm pleasantly surprised. This interview is, I want people to go buy your book and watch YouTube channel. Okay. So let's do that.

I don't want to give everything away. Okay. So go ahead and plug. Plug away. Okay. My book, Corruption Officer, is by Simon & Schuster. Wow. It's on Amazon.

Five-star reviews. My YouTube channel is Gary Haywood. You know, Big G to C-O. Yeah. And check your boy. Walk with me. Yeah. Go subscribe.

Go check it out. I assume you tell these stories, but it, great detail. Yes. Yeah, yeah, go, go rock with it. Yes. Yeah, I'm certainly going to go subscribe. Go check out his book. And yeah, I mean, I guess, yeah, it's just where I think we're out a camera battery. We didn't think we're going to go this long, but this is incredible. Okay. Bring it all back. How long have you been out and what are you doing with your life now? Okay. I mean, obviously, you're doing great things. You're writing. You're on the internet. Yes. Right.

out. I've been out for like about 13 years. Yeah. I got another job with the city. Hilarious. How long did it take you to like get that? I'm going to tell you, I came home in 08, 2009.

Yeah. 08, 2009, I had the city job. Because it was a laborer job. They figured you're not touching money, you're not messing with kids. Yeah. You're not in a prominent position. Right, right. But I worked my way up through the ranks and I'm, I'm,

doing fairly well. I write scripts. I got the opportunity to work with Will Smith's company. They optioned the book. It was supposed to become a series on FX. Still working at Magic. Can they go by the book on Amazon? The book is on Amazon.

Yeah. You know, corruption officer, perpetrated with a badge. Second book coming out next year, Cops or two, what would you do to feed your kids? Wow. Third book is House Gang, the crooks that slipped through the cracks. Let's go.

Are you selling these books? in prison? Well, you better be, dude, because, man. I'm going to say this

too. Female officers show me support and they buy the book and they purposely took it in Rikers Island because it was banned. They banned the book

from Rikers. Oh, that's cool. But up north, you know, you know, they, you know, my book is,

is rocking inside the jail. Wow. You know, it's a great book. I'm going to read that, bro. I got one for you. Okay,

be better. Yes. I want you to sign it. Yes, sir. Gary, incredible, man. I feel like I've known you for 10 years. Yes, this was great. This was great.

So please go check him out and switch over to the Patreon right now. We're going to chop it up a little bit more. Hear a few more stories. Head over to patreon.com slash the Connect show. Gary, we appreciate you again. Gary Haywood, G-A-R-Y-H-E-Y-W-A-R-D. Gary Haywood, go check him out on YouTube and buy his book. All right, guys.

Take care.