The Connect- with Johnny Mitchell - How Drug Lord Peter Shue Became Cocaine KING Of New York City, Worked For Cali Cartel, Dated Madonna

Episode Date: June 15, 2025

In this raw and unfiltered episode, we sit down with Peter Shue, one of the biggest drug kingpins that has ever lived in New York City, as he shares his powerful life story—growing up in the notorious Hunts Point neighborhood of the Bronx. From a childhood surrounded by drug dealers, violence, and poverty, to a youth torn between basketball dreams and the fast money of the streets, Peter opens up about the pivotal choices that led to him selling insane amounts of smack and blow, dealing with Colombian cartels, becoming a fixture in NYC's celebrity party scene, and ultimately incarceration- spending over 2 decades in federal prison. Go Support Peter! Book: https://www.amazon.com/Peter-Shue-Story-Life-Party/dp/0988515008 Business IG: https://www.instagram.com/ogpetershue/ Personal IG: https://www.instagram.com/therealpetershue/?hl=en This Episode Is #Sponsored By The Following: CASH APP! Download Cash App Today And Use Code: CONNECT #CashAppPod *Referral Reward Disclaimer: As a Cash App partner, I may earn a commission when you sign up for a Cash App account. HIMS! Start your free online visit or your personalized ED treatment options today at https://www.hims.com/connect BAY SMOKES! To get your free sample just head to https://baysmokes.com/pages/free-thca-flower-gram-sample/theconnect Join The Patreon For Bonus Content! https://www.patreon.com/theconnectshow Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Nailed the speech and maxed out your credit card in the name of friendship. Now you've got one hangover, four pastel dresses, and zero reasons to wear them again. Sell them on Deepop. Just snap a few photos and we'll take care of the rest. And you at least get some of your dignity money back. Someone on Deepop wants what you've got. Start selling now. Deepop where taste recognizes taste. If you lob me, if you got the gun on, me, I'm gonna come get you if I find you.

I was never afraid of death. Hunts Point had drug dealers, stick up kids, hit men, prostitutes. If you ain't got a hundred thousand in your stash, you broke. He said, yo, you have a potential to be a king out here. And I told him, I don't want to be a king. I want to be a prince on my life. My guest today is one of the most famous dealers in New York City history, the one and only Peter's shoe.

In the late 80s and early 90s, Peter was making millions of dollars a month dealing out of his headquarters in the South Bronx. This guy was the real deal, and nobody did it better than Peter. He did his prison time, never cooperated, and to this day, Peter remains one of the most respected gangsters of his era. Make sure to go get his book, The Life of the Party, the Peter's shoe story, available right now on Amazon. And for a bonus episode where he gives crazy details about his time in the feds and his days partying with stars and celebrities, hit that Patreon. Patreon.com slash The Connect Show. This interview was a long time in the making, but it was well worth.

the weight. A street legend like nobody I've ever met, Peter Shoe, right here on the Connect with Johnny Mitchell. At that time, I had 357 mag. I put that on him. You're going to empty everything in your pocket and get me now. All your money you got in your pocket. When you give it and get out, that's when you either get killed or you go to jail. I thought these people were selling drugs, but they were federal agents. When you're in jail, you got to be on point. You got to know what's going on. You got to be ready for anything. How did your father end up in the Bronx? Why didn't he move to Chinatown? Well, he did work down there.

But what it was, he met my mother in the bar. My mom's owned a bar in the Bronx. And that's how he got where. So she invited him for dinner. This nigga came over with his suitcases. That's how they got together. So your mom is African-American. She's black.

Yeah. Your father is from China. Yeah. Where? Canton. Cantonese. Yeah. All right.

Is that the minority? Chinese in New York or is it is Mandarin in the minority? I don't know. I have no idea. But see, my mother was, my mother was brought in Virginia, Richmond, Virginia. You know, so. And then, but she moved to the Bronx. Everybody was in the Bronx.

My whole family was in the Bronx. My brothers, my grandmother, they was in the Bronx. Now, his grandmother, his mother, my father's was in Boston. Okay. So. Now, do you think a Chinese, man in the 50s who gets a black woman to fall in love with them and let him move in. That takes some swag.

Like, do you think that your swag and your hustle, like, did that come that audacity, the audacity of a Chinese guy to hit on a beautiful African-American woman? Do you think you get that from your father? Or where does this hustle come from? I mean, I think, you know, the guys are now family, even my son's down to, you know, we're not shy. If we want something, we go get it. So I guess that came to all of us, you know.

So if it came from my father or his father or whoever, you know, because I never got to meet his father. I met his mother, but not his father. So that just came from us the way we are, you know. What do your parents do when you were a little kid? And my father, my father worked for OTB. That was off-track betting back in the day. Right.

My mother had the bar and then she became a nurse. So when she became R&, she stopped doing the bar. Okay, so they were both had stable jobs, like a nurse. That's a pretty good job. Yeah, she sold the bar and went to nursing school because that's what she, that was her desire. She wanted to be a nurse, so that's what she ended up doing. Okay, so you guys aren't poor. You're in a two-parent family.

I'm poor now. Shit. You're dead now. So, but you grew up in the South Bronx surrounded by broken homes and junkies and and single parent families, but your parents, like you have stability. There's food on the table. Yeah. You know, we, we know,

and then my grandmother lived with us too. So she had her income coming in. So, you know, and as my two sisters got older, they went, they started working. And I was just the youngest. So I was just out there, play a ball and hanging out. Yeah.

You know. Were you teased being Chinese in a Puerto Rican in a black neighborhood? Were you picked on? Yes. So I had many fights. You know, I had to defend myself. But, you know, I was small when I was when I was young, you know. Even though I lost weight now, I was bigger, you know, and more stockier recently.

But I was young and small and guys were so big. Even when I had to go out there and fight the guys that, you know, mess with my sisters, bother them, you know, they was two years old to me, three years old or four years old to me. So I took a lot of else. So, and that's how you learn. You know, a loss is a lesson. Right. So, you know, I'll come home and there's one time this guy, I had to fight over my sister.

I came home and I told my father, you know, what happened. So he said, so, you know, my father was real, like, strict. He wanted you, he wanted you to man up. So he said, what happened? And I said, well, the guy had a good left. You know, well, he said, well, go out and do this, you know. So the next day, I go out there, fight the dude again, and he whipped me again. So I came home, you know, I'm bruised up.

He said, what happened? I said, the guy's too big, he's straw. So he said, well, you told me what to do, you know, he had told me kick him in the nuts and do it. So I went back. out there for them again. And he beat me again. So I came home. And he said, so my father's like,

so what happened this time? I said, what do you think happened? I just lost it. I said, what the, if you think happened? He hit me with everything but the kitchen sink. You know what I'm saying? So my mother was like, you know, he was like, he'd never see me go off like this.

So he's like, shock. My mother was like, look, he's, he said, go to your room. So she said, go to your room. Let me talk to him. She's like, yo, what do you do? Sending our son out there like that every day.

The guys are too old for him and too big. How could, you know, but it was, you know, that's how he is. I could be fighting, right? And he's coming down the block. Today I'm fighting somebody. And a kid will run up on him and say, yo, your son's fighting. You know what he would say?

Now, anybody else's father might say, what, and go and try to break it up or whatever. You know what he would say? Is he winning? Wow. My father's crazy. He's a tough guy. Yeah, he's, you know, he's a gangster too.

So he's down to Chinatown. So he's part of that stuff. Really? And so we, you know, we was brought up tough. So I had to be tough, you know, especially in the neighborhood where we grew up at, Hunts Point. But Hunts Point had everything there. Hunts Point had drug dealers, stick of kids, hit men, prostitutes. I tell everybody about the wild.

dogs that be chasing you and trying to bite you. Right. Yeah. I mean, they used to chase my mother, but my grandma wake me up. I had to go out there with the baseball bat. I have this swing. Get the dogs off my brother because they got it all ended up in the corner. Hunt's point was crazy.

I mean, Hunt's point in the Bronx is still crazy to this day. But in the 60s, I mean, just picture the lapidated buildings, fires just in the barrels in the middle of the street. Yeah. Like just a slum. neighborhood. Why did your parents choose to live there if they had, you know, stable incomes? Because at that time

they was popping babies and, you know, so my aunt had the house. So it was a three family house. So they took the second floor. And, you know, it's a sweet deal for them because it was my aunt's house. Because where we lived that

is mostly private houses. It wasn't tenement buildings and nothing. There's all private houses. Actually, it's all private houses. Actually, spot for you fouse was right up the street i don't know if you're familiar with spot for you house that's where they put all the juveniles and that's the young guys when they when they do do things so i've been there before so yeah wow okay so in the do you recall when you started

learning about what like a junkie was or a drug addict like how old were you you know 68 is when a lot of the vietnam vets start coming back from vietnam and and start using heroin did you kind of remember that taking off in the Bronx? I mean, learning a sin because it's two different things. Like, you know, I used to see that in the 70s, 80s, and, you know, you see all that stuff. And, you know, it's a part of life. I mean, because after the have-on and they were shooting that up, then it came to crackheads. So, but it was similar stuff.

You see the same thing. It's just that crackheads was more violent, and they don't care about robbing their families and doing all kind of crazy stuff that they do. But the hairmard, the people shooting dope, they petty thieves and stuff, but they basically just be sitting with the nodding and all that. So you see them. But, you know, I mean, my family, our block was knitted,

family knitted, so we all stuck together. So there was no dophines on our block. We, you know, our family, you know, elders were to tell them to get off the block. So they wasn't on our block. Okay. They would hang out in the park. and stuff basically. I see.

And when did you realize like that was a whole economy? Like, do you remember what age you learned like, wow, there's guys that make millions of dollars selling this poison to these dope fiends?

Well, we don't... I don't think you would look at that worn up. You know, they make millions of dollars. You just don't know. You'll see guys because of what they wear and stuff that they get in paper.

So, you know, just like the pimps, you see that they get in paper. You see the prostitutes, you see the pimps, you know who's bawling. So they get money and you know, sometimes they used to come to the park while we play in ball and come and bless us with cookouts, here's some new sneakers or here's, you know, some of them was doing that. So I knew all the big drug dealers back in them days. So it was like I was up-becoming.

They always said that I had the potential to be a leader. So even when I went to Vikings Island the first time, they was like, you know, the old guy told me, he said, I watched you grow up your whole life, man. He said, yo, you have a potential to be a king out here. And I told him, I said, Mr. Thomas, I don't want to be a king. I want to be a prince on my life. I went like that.

He's not happening. So that's how it was. But, you know. Well, when you were a kid, like a teenager, you didn't have ambitions to be this street prince, right? You wanted a ball, or when did that change? Well, like, you know, at that time, basketball was my first love. So I wanted to be, you know, NBA player because, you know,

Walt Frazier was my idol at that time. So as the average go by, Walt Frazier was my first idol. And Magic Johnson became my next idol when he came to the Lakers. And then my third idol, I mean, they're not really. Idos would, I'd like to. pad in my game, but I don't play no more with Steph Curry. So my thing is, you know, basketball was always on my mind in them days. And then, you know, my father used to try to get me into the Chinese culture,

so he'll send me to places downtown the Canal Street. He'll go with me. And then he had me taking martial arts and stuff. But, you know, my temper, my temper is too short for stuff like that. So if I'm taking martial arts and somebody hit me too, too, hard. I'm waiting after, you know, the session, come outside with a baseball bat, the buster

was there. So I had to stop that, you know. So I always had a bad temper when I was growing up. So what they, my father did, he left that alone and just let's let me do me. But when I really got into the, to answer you a question, how I got into the life of crime is when

my father and mother separated. So when he wasn't around, most of the time, I became the man of the family. And, you know, What age was that? I like to say about 15, 16. So what happened was, you know, I stole his 38 long. That was my first gun.

Well, actually, my mother found it, and she tried to throw it in the garbage, and I went in the garbage together. And that was my first gun. Because every time him and her used to argue, and, you know, her brothers is big, like you, 6'6, wait. and she'll be like, I'm going to call my brothers. And he'll go right in the room, get the gun. They say, go ahead, call me.

So I'll put in the slugs in the thing. So she'll hang up the phone because she didn't want to have that type of problem with them. But, you know, my father and her brothers, you know, they was cool with each other. But when he left, you know, it was like a lack of weight on me because I became the man in the house. So now I had to take care of everybody and myself too. So once I got that 38 long, then I had a little stick of crew we put together, and we just started, we just saw Robin everything.

So that's where my life of crime started. Wow. And that's when you kind of gave up the hoop dreams? No, I still was playing ball. I gave up the hoop dreams when I was sniffing coke back in the day because, you know, Coke back in the day was a casual high like weed is now, smoking weed. that. So you go to, you go anywhere. It was cocaine ass, straight cocaine. So you see all the

celebrities. I go to parties and all the celebrities are there, everybody's sniffing. So, you know, they got their little straws or whatever. So I started sniffing too. So, but you were, you were doing stickups and then still going to high school and playing basketball for the team and. Well, I couldn't play basketball for the teams because I was never eligible because my grades, I always was missing class. I cut class every day. So, because I want to go. So, because I want to go. go hang out. Oh, you know, my mother tried everything. She tried to put me in Catholic school and the Catholic school. They, they was acting crazy. So I ended up coming back and had, they had their candy cell and I had my little stick of Kru, go rob all of them for their candy money

that they was bringing in because they was treating me bad, you know. I'm, I don't care about no on person, nationality stuff. I get along with everybody. But these people had some racist people in there. And, you know, they had 14 blacks in the whole school, right? I was going to St. Raymond's. I had 14 blacks in the whole school and we all ate together lunch. And then everything else was the white people, which I was cool with some of them.

But then you have the ones that's racist. So they will come and grab people's food off their place and everything. So you're paying for this. This is Catholic school. So they'll take their chicken off the plate and stuff like that. So I was like, oh, these dudes is crazy. So one time, one guy tried me. And he went in my plate.

So I just got up. Went and brought another plate. Everything seemed like, you know, his eye. I went and threw the whole plate on them, you know, the mass potatoes and everything into gravy so that we start fighting in there. So they tell her my mother. that I'm that Catholic school material in public school. I was like, I'm not doing none of this stuff.

I'm not, you know, I'm not starting. Then, you know, then they was the, whatever the guy that runs the place, he was like, oh, he doesn't come with his shirt and tie. Everybody was putting their tie on when they got to the school in the lockers. So why are you, you know, you're singing out me? So my mother was like, I don't know what to do with you, maybe we should send you military school the army. I was like, I'm not going to none of that.

You know, so I went back. at the public school. Memorial Day weekend is almost here, and it's time to kick off summer right. When I'm getting ready for the first big weekend of summer, Total Wine and More is my go-to, especially when I'm firing up the grill with family. I'll grab refreshing beers,

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Savings of up to $1 per gallon redeemable with $20 rewards dollars in your loyalty account. At participating locations, terms and conditions apply. So you were just a bad motherfucker. Yeah, I was, I mean, you had, because a lot of people come from the mud. Their father's not there. Their mom's on dope. Dad's in prison. Uncle's are in prison.

You had none of that. You were just a gangster. They called me They used to call me a ghetto superstar But the whole thing is My father did this Because he made me so rough and tough You know

I mean If you rob me If you got the gun on me I'm You know Anybody else from Pat You know Oh I hear

Oh I got his $14 Here you can have it You know But I'm gonna come get you If I find you You know I was never afraid of death And

People would tell you people be shooting, and I'd be like outside the disco fever sniffing the Coke for like, the bullets better not hit me. And I got my 38 long on me and my people jumping into the car windows and stuff like that because it's hot outside, but the bullets is flying. And I'd be sniffing and I had the gun on me like, the bullets better not hit me. And they're shooting around us.

And my people was like, yo, you're crazy. What's wrong with you? I said, yo, I'm high. So did you have a coke problem? Did it get away from you at a certain point? No, I stopped. You know, that's another thing. I was able to stop anything on my own.

I didn't need no rehabs. I didn't need nobody talking to me. But people around me, you know, they had problems stopping. I don't know what it is. I have a friend now still sniffs. I said, damn, man, you still ain't stop sniffing? He's like, Peter, he said, I'll die before I stop sniffing. I said, well, you definitely going to die.

Because, you know, it's but so much your heart I could take. But I started them. So I couldn't understand how they could never stop. And, you know, some of them stop, but most of them, you know, still dip in dad. And they didn't smoke crack or nothing. They just like the feeling the sniffing. So you're a teenager now. You got your own crew.

You got your 38 long that you took from your dad. What is that? How does that evolve into becoming a heavier criminal? all. Well, you know, we got to have money to get the coat. So you got to stop robbing people. So we was robbing drug dealers. We was robbing businesses like down in downtown. I went to jail for that too. So we was robbing on electronic stores and stuff like that. And that gunpoint? Like running in there? Yeah. Doing sticks. Yeah. That's how I got and how I got caught with the with the, with the, um, vomiting in the spots.

We had to do, now he set this up. He said, yo, this guy's going to do the bank drop. He's like, yo, Peter, you want to get him? Because he owed me some money. I said, how much he's going to bank drop? He said, 9,000.

So I said, yeah, I get him. So I go to 149th Street, 3rd Avenue. I'm outside and broad daylight. Everybody thought it was a movie. Because people walk in, if you see $149 for 3rd Avenue, at them times, everybody, you know, people walking back and forth, they thought it was a movie. But at that time, I had 357 mag. So I put, I put that on him, made him get back in the car,

and got the money from him. So I took the car keys, I said, listen, I'll leave the keys up the hill. And he was, that one, they'd give it up at first. And I said, well, you don't give it, give me the keys. I'm going to shoot your little brothers. Little brothers in the car. So he gave me the keys. So I went up to here, put it on top of the mailbox.

But the guy that set the whole thing up, he took the keys and threw him. And we was in his BMW. So somebody got the license plate. So they got him. And he ended up telling on me. So his sister called me, his sister calls me, she's like, Peter,

my brother says, they know who you are, you know, so you better break out. I say, yeah, they know who I am. This is your brother told him. You know, he's dead now, so that was good. But the whole thing is they came to my house looking for me. And I told my mother, they're going to be coming, looking for me, right? So she changed all the pictures.

My mother was a swirled. She changed all the pictures and put a black dude in the pictures. So when they came to the house, they was like looking for Peter's shoe, but a black dude. So when they look, they said, where's your son at? She said, oh, he's not here. He's away. So they said, is this your son right here? And she said, yeah.

So they showed her all the pictures. She showed him on the pictures. Yeah, this is him. This is him. So they leave. So I'm thinking the coast is clear. I come back like a month later. I come back.

So I'm thinking I'm good. And my man, Camelo, he was like, yo, let's go play some balls. So I said, I'm gonna come, I'm gonna get my bag. I had a big pony bag. And I always took my gun wherever I went in case somebody mess with me. So I had the 357 in there and I had the basketball.

So when we came out and I came down the block, you know, I'm jimmed the ball and he tried to steal it. I spun, I spun. They cuffed me. The guy cuffed me. I said, what's this? He said, you're in the rest. You thought you got away?

And then they charged me with the barber bees. And first time I went to Bronx County. I got a $5,000 a bail. I came out on that bell. And right when I was coming out to hug my mother and them, they cuffed me again. So yeah, you want him? He'd be in Vikings Island.

We got some more stuff for them. So they hit me with some more on Bobby. So I beat some of the trials. And then I lost one. And I ended up doing four years. It was two and the third to seven. But, you know, I got into an incident and I had to stab somebody. And then I ended up doing 18 months in a hole.

So I ended up doing four years. in the state. Okay. And you were on Rikers. That's where you stab somebody. That's where you started. No, when I went to the other gym. Okay.

But how was that? I mean, it sounds like you had to stab somebody. But tell us about state prison. Like, did that form you into being this leader that you're, you know, that old school cat said that you were going to be? No, you know what it was. I mean, even when we were sticking up, people just picked me. Like, instead of my cousin, and he started this, but they picked me as being the leader.

I don't know what it is. I don't know why people all my life they cling to me as the leader. And I can't explain it. I guess it's the order. But, you know, when I got arrested, shoot, when I went to Vikings Island, I was like, oh, my God.

You know, I got on a nice leather jacket, sneakers. So the dude, you know, I already knew what to say because the dude was like, who was on line. He said, yo, my man, What size are your sneakers? I said your size. You know?

He said, what? I said, your size. You know? So he just kept looking at me, right? So I'm going into the messhole, but in my mind, because there was one dude that I got cool with in the bullpen. We know, I was like, this dude's going to try me. I know it.

You know what I'm saying? So he's like, I, well, you don't have no weapon or nothing. You just got to see what you could do. I said, he said, we'll jump him if you want. So I said, I said, let's see what happens. So, you know, I didn't see nobody I know or something like that. So when we went to Chow,

then I managed to the brother that used to, you know, he was from by my way, older guy, and he cussed hair. So he said, man, what you're doing here? He said, shit, what you doing here? I said, he said, what, you at? I said, they're sending me to one upper. So he said, I'm coming up there. So when he came up there, he's like, you know,

he brought this guy named Bear. He was from the Bronx. Big dude had the big bear on his arm. So he came up there. He said, yo, Bear said, because I didn't know him, I just met him. He said, listen, this is my family. Anybody mess with him?

I'm going to come up here and tear y'all out the frame. That's what I needed. They ain't ever bawling me, so I ain't have to worry about my sneakers and nothing. So, you know. But then they switched me to the quads. Now, I was different. The quads is like the sales.

They locked in. about you to sell, so I didn't have been around me. So one day I go to the yard, I come back. My sneakers is missing. So I was like, damn, so I was like, Drago, he said, what? I said, yo, somebody took my sneakers. So we walking through the, you know, to see who's in their cell because the cell doors is locked if you didn't go out.

So I see this big, this big dude hell got my sneakers. in his cell. Now, this niggas is like six, eight, what's your core? And my sneakers don't fit him. He's like maybe 15, 16. My sneakers is like eight at the time. So I was like, who's there he got? My sneakers? So he's like, oh, man, he said, you got to have to do something with him. I said, what? I'm like, I'm a hundred and maybe 30 pounds. What I'm doing with this dude? So I'm trying to figure out. So that whole time, do account time and stuff. I'm trying to, you know, what I'm going to do with this dude? So I'm in my cell.

Drago's in the other cell. We talk and through the wars. He said, we got to try to get you a knife. So I said, it ain't no time for that. So when, um, chow opened, when they called for chow, and after the four o'clock count, I just went and snuck him, wow, which did nothing. You know what I said? So, and then I grabbed them, we got, we holding each other.

and he got me on the front. He said, I'm gonna beat the shell. You ever beat the shit out of you? And I'm holding looking for the police. Where the fuck? He'll take it so long to get in? You know what I'm looking for him to break this shit up? So I'm holding him so he can't swing on me.

So they came and broke it up. So they put him in the cell. And then they put me in the cell, you know. But so we secluded. So all night, I'm gonna kill you tomorrow. I'm gonna kill you, you know. You know, all night. I'm here, this thing.

I said, damn, this nigga don't go to sleep. Because he keeps saying he going to get me, right? So I'm talking about my man Draygo again. I said, yo, I got to get out of here. This thing is after me. He said, what are you going to do? I said, I don't even know. I got to think about it.

So when the cell opened on our side to go eat breakfast, when I went to the desk, I flipped the whole thing over, just doing it over. So that's the reason they got to get you, they put you in the shoe then. So because we didn't go to shoot for the, what you call it because it was overcrowding. It has to be emergency to get you in the shoe.

shoot, Vikings was overcrowding. So when I flipped the food over, they cuffed me and took me out. And he ain't to get to get me. So I seen that chump later on when I came home, but he was in the wheelchair. He was, like, unparalyzed. So they'd do nothing to him. But somebody had shot him. But the whole thing

is, that's how I'll tell you, you, that's what you have to do. You got to think when you're in jail. You just can't be be relash. Everything has to be, you got to be on point. I know what's going on. You got to be ready for anything and deal with it. And so when you go upstate, where were you when this stabbing incident happened? What facility? And Durandek.

Okay. I haven't even heard of that place. So it's like near going towards Canada. Okay. Way upstate. Yeah. So, you know, we was playing ball. Mm-hmm.

You know, we was playing ball. And the dude was losing. You know, the dude lost to us. So, you know, he said the vests were cheating. So he said, oh, y'all can suck my dick. So that's a violation. So I said, yo, who are you talking to? So I'm talking to all y'all.

So I said, all right. So when he went in the shower, when I came back, I got a knife out, man, up in there. And I was like, hitting him up. Suck your dick. Suck your dick. And then, he's screaming like, you know, like a girl. So I man out.

I got blood on. I got invited to the police, man. You know what I'm saying? Because he was coming to see what happened. I mean, because I was going to try to hide the knife. But he probably would have told him anyway. But yeah, that's how I had to do extra time in the shoe. But you didn't catch another case over it, though.

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Price varies based on product and subscription plan. So when you came home from the state prison, what was your plan? Because now you're a man, you're in your early 20s. Did you set out to be this drug kingpin that you later became? No, you know, I wasn't thinking about none of that stuff. You know, I had stopped getting high before I went to jail.

And then, you know, the rob, to be surviving stuff got, you know, I'm like, I get bored quickly. So the, you know, the robbing stuff got, get boring to me. I stopped wanting to do that. And, but my team waiting for me. So when I get home, you know, allowing them quitting their jobs and everything. You know, like, you know, who do you think I am? A lot or something?

I'm going to be able to do. Man, your buddy can get them jobs? And it was like, so you ain't got no plan? I know you got a plan for us. I was like, listen, man. I was like, listen, I'm trying to do everything in the right way, which I was trying to do. I had to hook up in the phone company,

but they found out that I checked the application on where it says ever been convicted. I put no. So this supervisor that was jealous of me, he's in another section. He was, his mom. because I was being lazy talking to my parole officer on the phones where I work at.

Because I was a telephone representative, but I'm on my break. Instead of me going to the break room, I'm talking on the phone. And he was ear dropping. So that's how they came and gapped me with the security guards and all security guards. And I'm like, damn, I wonder who they're coming to get.

They was coming to get me. So they brought me in this room with a bunch of people that, do you know why you hear it? I said, no, enlighten me. He's like, well, you lied in your applications. I said, oh, well, if I was said, I wasn't convicted when I got the job. I mean, now you probably would get a job, but back then.

Back then. So then they called my supervisor and she's like, well, he's excellent what he does. He can fix the computers and everything. Can we do something for him? And they said, no, we don't like lies. So they was like, you know, so that was a low point of my life because I was trying to do right.

So then they walked me out the building to my, you know, you had to have it. I was working on a 375 Pearl Street, so you had to have a special ID to get in. You know, it was like 300 people on every floor that was working because you represent this is all you do is answer calls. Actually, when, I don't know, you remember, I was one of the first people to give out to Pits to sell, so customs calling services. like call waiting, three-way calling, you know, stuff like that.

So I used to have to sell that over the phone. After I heard you complaining about your phones. You were selling. You were a salesperson. Yeah. So I was doing all that. But friends I had that stayed there, they became supervisors and everything. So I would probably have been a supervisor.

And plus, you know, I was on top of everything I was doing. So they walked me out the building. You know, I got into my Cherokee Limited at the time, on 1980, Cherry Key Limited. And I was driving on the highway coming up, and I was feeling so, you know, gloomy. I was like, man, I should just drive my Jeep off the bridge, you know, because I tried to do the right there.

I tried not to be in that life. So then what happened, when I got home, How's where it travels for fares. My mother was already crying. So I said, what are you crying for? She said, I heard what happened? I heard what happened. I said, listen, listen, it's okay.

Well, remember, I tried it your way. I'm never going to work again in my life. That's what I told it. And the person that I called her was the lady that got me the job because she had found out right away. And she's like, told him. And then my PO called me.

He's like, well, you know, you're so smart. You get another job easy. I said, listen. her name was Smallwood. She was my parole office. I said, listen, no disrespect, Ms. Smallwood. If you want me coming every day, I'll come in. I'll come in, but I'm never working again.

And that started me on my life required. Wow. So now was that, like, seminal moment that set you off on this path? That's amazing. So what came next? Did you tell your crew, like, it's on? Well, my partner, my partner, yeah, that too, but my partner gave, I thought he gave me a welcome home gift,

And I thought it was a gun, you know, because it was wrapped up. And I had to open it because I said, you know, they keep trying to get me back in this life. I'm not trying to get in there. So I never, I just put it in my closet. But it was a weird smell coming out of there. So when I, when I, after I was going through all this, I opened it up. It was a key of Coke. So he put a key of Coke in there for me, like a well-go-ho.

So I called him up and I said, yo. what is this man he said that's where the money's at now crack he says so you know cook it up put it out there you know and see what you could do and just start flipping and this is the first time you've sold drugs first time i sold well no we sold drugs when we was robbing people for the drugs but wholesale like we'll sell it to somebody like you might be on the streets we got 700 grams of this a a year we'll sell we'll sell it to somebody like you might be on the streets we got 700 grams of this a with 70 y'all like that. Right.

But this is me as being a drug dealer. Right. So I, he's trying to tell me on the phone how to cook this thing, and I'm cooking it. And I messed the old shit. We barely got what it costs back. Right. I didn't know where I did.

So I had to hire me an expert cook. Right. You know, a chef that knows how to do that. Then I started blowing up. But when I did that, that's when I got with my team. And I was like, listen, you know, we're back in the game. I agree this is what we're going to do and I told him, you know, we're going to start

here, but I saw him, listen, at first I was putting the crack out there, you know, but after a while I've seen things happen, you know, what really turned me off about the crack and I just started selling a Coke because it turned me off about the crack in my building where I was living at on the second floor,

this guy that was cool, you know, he was cool, you know, I met him when I came back home, I was living with my mom's. And he's smoking crack. His sister told me he's smoking crack. So I was like, wow. So he gets somebody to go into his mother's building, his mother apartment. Now, mind you, the daughter, the sister, God bless her, she wasn't there. But they went in the apartment to rob his own mother's house.

But the mother was there. They end up killing the mother. stabbing over, killing her. So I was like, man, I don't want that to happen in my family. So first of all, I stopped drugs from being on the blocks. They can't be on our blocks. You've got to be farther down. And then I didn't want to sell back no more.

So I just saw selling cold. Okay, so tell us, who is your team? The veins of people? No, no, the guys you had working for you, working with you. Were these your childhood friends? Yeah, how many of them were? Most of them in my childhood friends. And these are black dudes or Puerto Rican dudes?

Both. Okay. So we had a, you know, I had, they was a strong crew and they, they don't tell. Nobody in my crew never tell. Mm-hmm. You know, people told on me out of the crews. It's never, nobody never told me that associated with me. It's always somebody that's jealous and they tell on this.

They'll get caught doing something and they'll tell on me. So the guys that we had, the guys that we had coming up, we had an oath. and we'll go to jail or go to our death before we tell on anybody. And that goes for even if you kidnap one of us. You're looking for one of us. They will have to cut my head, my legs, everything off, and I still wouldn't tell him where he was.

Where's Johnny? You're not getting that from me. That's the way he's brought up. How many of you guys were there? How deep was the crew? Probably 12 at first. Then it got big and bigger because I started hustling and different.

places and you know we're talking about blocks the burvels then um i was town the states so you know so how everybody had coke back then uh this is what like 1985 86 or something no 88 89 okay so everybody had crack now this is crack's been around for like four years why were you different what were you able why were you able to expand so quickly well in anything you do you have to out, out, um, do the competition. So like,

I, say, and say if I'm in Baltimore, because you say, you're going to go to Baltimore soon. Say I'm in Baltimore. And they have, um,

say they have 27 vowels. I will make it minus 29. If they come 29, make mine 30. So we outdo everybody. And we wasn't cutting the Coke. We just putting the Coke in there as, as is.

So after you, you run it through the, and when they're running into the little plastic valves, that's what they're getting. And they cook their own stuff. So, and then I was selling the keys too, you know. Actually, that's how I blew up first. I was selling the hair-on when I first came home.

Because we was talking about that earlier, but the Africans, my little man came to me and he said, yo, I got a connection with the have-on. He said, because they don't know how to move it. So I said, who? He said, these African guys. And I said, so what they want back, every key, they wanted 50,000. So I was selling the keys for 107,000.

I would give them 7,000 to the muse, and I'd keep you 50,000 for myself. So that's how I blew up first. So what I would do, I would just, people that's coming that had the big labels on the hairmark would come to me and get that. Now when the Africans was going dry and stuff, then I got to connect with the Chinese people. So I go down Canal Street and get the have on from them. And see, this is, this, you know, there's a lot of people that lie about being big time hustlers and stuff.

So I play the game with them. So even when everybody's a superstar in the fairs. So when you go to the jail, when you go to jail and the guys be like, yeah, yo, shoot, what's up? And, you know, I heard about you. Yeah, I was big time out there too. was selling crazy, you know, wait. I said, oh, yeah. I said, so you're getting

the China white? They said, yeah, man, I was getting the China white with the seal and everything. I was like, oh, what? How many grams was you getting? Say, 1,000 grams. I'm playing stupid. A thousand grams. Chinese don't sell that. See, Chinese don't sell 1,000 grams. Chinese grams was like,

and you speak to the guy tomorrow, he'll probably tell you that, too. It's like 700 to 750 grams in between there. So, that's how you know these guys is lying. So they don't even sell full kilos. No, their keys is that weight. So you get two slabs. A kilo is a thousand grams, though.

So they, just mathematically. And somebody else's word. But in the Chinese word, it wasn't. So you get two slabs. You know, it's like two slabs lapped up. And that costs you $50,000? Well, there's what's different. That's, there's was different.

We talking about the Africans. Right. The Africans was giving me the eggs. And the eggs was costing me $50,000. Now, we're talking about Chinese dope. It's more potent because it holds more. See, whatever, you know, back of the day, you see people talking about like in the 60s and whatever that, you know,

because we wasn't in there ever, but them guys was getting dope that could take a 40, you know, because I got people that was in them. It was older guys would tell me, man, we had dope that could take a 40. That means for just quick review. A 40 cut. Yeah, cut it 40 times. How do you do that?

Unbelievable. I couldn't. You know, you get probably dope out here. You'd be lucky if you could cut it a half, you know, a spoon. I don't know what they do. I don't sell jokes no more. But even when I was selling Hamon, you know, the Africa's joy only probably take a one at the most.

But the Chinese, the Chinese dope was probably taking. You could probably put a two, maybe a three on it and have powerful dope. So, that was different. But already the heroin has become significantly, even in the late 80s, significantly less strong than it was in the early 70s. Of course it was, because they started cutting it up

or whatever they do. You know, that's above my grade pay. I don't know what they was doing. But I know that, you know, the have on, just like the Coke, in my time, they was making like keys of Coke. They were making one,

be compressing them and making one key into four and stuff like that. so the potency don't be the same. But as long as you could bring it back to where you cook it or whatever they do it, it's all that matter. This next sponsor is for all you out there that love getting hit off with that pack, that Zaza, that trippy, itpy, sticky wiki, Bay Smokes, America's number one online dispensary.

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africans what was the the difference in price from the chinese and how much could you sell resell that for it's been so long ago but i believe it was over 100,000 they would charge me 120 something like that it's so long ago seven 150 grams. Yeah. That's insane. And if you sell a key, you sell probably 150 and just quick turnovers. But the hairmonds fantastic.

So you have quick turnovers in and you get your money, you know, back quicker than the African money. You know, the African money, because the dope is better. Yeah. So you could just get a kilo, well, a fake kilo, 750 gram kilo for 120,000 and then just wholesale. pass it off and make 30 grand. Yeah, real quick, but it goes like hours.

They'll come back to get another one because they got blocks pumping like that because you had blocks, especially like in, you know, I can only talk about the Bronx, because I'm from the Bronx, but Hunts Point, Cortland, Watson, 138 Street. And what's that? What's that every year? Where the Linsmore was the Puerto Rican Linsmore.

They was down there. All in them places, $100,000 a day. You know, so... Unbelievable. They was making crazy money. But I couldn't get that because I was selling wholesale again. I was selling because I couldn't get the bike mix. See, the Puerto Vickers had the mix

and they wasn't giving it up to the blacks. Right. So their mix was, whatever they was using at that time. Because, you know, I talked a few of them, using different type of mixes, but like I had a friend, a close friend, and they was using elephant tranquilizing. So they caught a big case behind that, and I don't want to say no names, because I don't know they want their names out there, but they home now.

But they caught a case, and the mayor told them, take this, because it was killing people, take this off the street, and we'll let you all go. Wow. We won't prosecute you all. But I guess they was getting so much money just said, at that. And they got locked up. Wow. But, you know, it's a whole-

You just didn't have the recipe. I didn't have the recipe for that. But, I mean, that's a good deal to just be able to supply the streets, supply the blocks. How many people were you giving heroin material to? In New York? Yeah. Probably five big labels. Right.

But, you know, you have, I was a Coke man. So we, you know, anywhere from, you know, We went up there in keys, you know, because it was a bunch of us. And I got to connect to give me a bunch of keys at one time. Like they started me up with $250. Then I went to $500. Then I went to $1,000. But it was so many of us that I could push the keys to the movement.

So we was moving them. Me and my partners, we was moving them crazy. Well, if the heroin is so much more profitable, why did you ever switch to Coke? Because I had the mix. See what I'm saying? The hair on was profitable. but Coke, you have the mix. And my blocks, my blocks off a key, off a key out of town, right, off a key or Coke,

you're getting $80,000 a key off your, off, off, off, off, off, off, off, bagging up a straight up key. So I couldn't lose with that. And if you, you know, we's doing like six to eight keys in one, one particular area, like in different, different states. So if you're doing six to eight keys, that's good money. How many people did you have out of town at one time? Well, first, when you get somebody out of town,

first you got to find somebody that has relatives out there. That's the first thing you do. You don't just go out there and say, I'm from New York and try to get on because what happens is, A, they might call the police on you because you're selling drugs in that area. B, they might have you set up to get robbed and killed. So, you know, you got to find.

somebody that's cool in that state. So you might meet a guy named John Wayne. And you'd be like, you know, through your cousin, he's your cousin. And you're like, yo, you get money out here? Yeah, I got a few blocks. We could, you know, boom, boom. And be like, well, suppose we could supply you more. Will you be able to say, yeah, you know, and then you looped them in?

Then you send some of your lieutenants out there to hold them down. And he has his little security and you're booming. You gave, you didn't have a problem giving out assignment. Like you would just drop work on people and let them pay you when they finished. Yeah, we had guys, you know, now the, we, our keys was out there already to bag up and everything. So that's, that's, you get your table crew and everything. That's the work. Even with the hair mall, same thing.

But we had, I had guys that would take keys for me and go to other states and then bring me my money back. And, you know, if they don't bring me my money back then, they know. know what time it is. But nobody never, nobody never did that. They always brought our money back, you know, because we had a, we had a good, strong, you know, grew. And we was from all over. We wasn't just from the Bronx. It was, you know, Queens, Brooklyn, Matt, and. And then how many people out of state? What were some of the most lucrative spots out of town? Watermore's lovely. Philly's good. You know, you know, all up the East Coast, was good. Detroit's good. Chicago's good. You know, West Coast, going up that way, it's too far.

Even, you know, I tried to get stuff out there, you know, but not on a heavy, heavy volume because it's too far. But when you, you got the places two hours away, three hours away, you know, that's good to, you know. My man went to Houston. He had something in Houston for us. Atlanta. You go to Atlanta, you know. Well, you're connect on the Coke side. Somebody's just giving you 250 keys. That's a lot of responsibility. Who was laying material on you like that?

You was Johnny. I wish. What happened, right? I was in, you know, I used to go hang out a lot. So I go to South Beach, you know, and we, we're bawling. We might be in Vegas at the fights, then fly to South South Beach after that. You know, we take a private jets and everything. Before people was taking private jets

and going on this stuff. You know, I was taking private jets. I was taking private jets from McDonald, too. So we taking private jets and going back and forth. So I'm in South Beach and Miami. And I meet this good. And she was fantastic, you know.

And she was Colombian. And we hit it off and I started dating her. And I didn't know. family was into this. So, her brother, their family was kind of

didn't want me with us, you know, their sister and stuff like that because they're Colombian, I'm black and Chinese. So, you know, I could feel the tension when I, when I used to go to the,

you know, they had a nice joint too. You know, it's like a mansion type thing. So I just go to their place. And, um, I said tell her, I don't feel comfortable here. You know, I just don't feel comfortable.

You know, the parents and stuff wasn't even talking English, but he talked English, but he was a connect. So, you know. And he was like her sister, her brother? Yeah, he was a brother. So one time they, he had, he had some guys jump me, you know. And when they jumped me, now, you know, I was just getting established and stop me.

I didn't know these people like that, but then when they jumped me, I was trying to find out who there was, and then his name came up. And when his name came up, I wanted to see him. Because before I went to do something to him, I want to know why? Why did you do this?

You know, we're supposed to be, like family, I'm dating your sister. You know what I'm saying? And I, he was trying to, he was trying to deny it, but I was like, listen, man, your name came up like two times already. So I'm kind of getting the feeling that I'm going to have to, you know, go to war where you're going to, you know, we're going to have an altercation.

And he said, listen, I give you an offer. He said, but you got to leave my sister. You can't date my sister no more. I don't want to date outside of nationality. So I was like, so what is your offer? I'm like, you know, he's like, I give you Coke. And now, meanwhile, I didn't know he was, he was this type of dude. He was this big.

But he's like, I got, I got a large amount of Coke that I distribute. He said, I give you Coke. I heard you can move Coke because she told him that. And had you been moving Coke at the time, or this is still the Harron's winning? No, we was moving everything. Okay. So, but we didn't have no connect. You didn't have the Columbian plug.

That's a connect. Yeah. So he was like, yeah, this was my first connection. So I had others after that. You know, I dealt with Italians. I dealt with Russians. I dealt, you know, you deal with different people as you get a spimmies and people recognize your name.

And I had a good name. They know I, if it's a dime missing, I'm putting that dime back. There's nobody, you know, everything's my fault. I don't, I take the weight. I always have. Even when we get arrested, it could be all of us in this room arrested. I say, all the drugs is mine. And there's a videotape now.

where I caught a case of 219. I said, whatever you find in the house is mine. Anything, I always say, to wait, why? Because I know I can do the time, you know, and I ain't going to tell them nobody. A lot of these guys on the outside, they look like they're gangsters, then they can handle stuff. And when they get under them lights, man.

And you be thinking, not him, that big, this guy, that this big guy, you know, oh, he's a killer. They can't do time. So this cat, he gave me the 250 grams and I had to leave his sister. $2.50 grams? I mean, keys. And I had to leave his sister alone. So I said, well, listen, I don't have no way to transport this from Miami now.

He said, oh, I got a place in New York for you. Sure. And he had a place, he had a place for New York. So I told my partners, I said, yeah, I just got 250 grams, 250 keys to move. Hank joined BJ's wholesale club the day he became a father of 30. I coach football. Now coach Hank saves up to 25% off grocery store prices. 30 pounds of pasta, three cases of protein bars, 75 sports drinks.

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Wow. And what were you, what was that price? What was the price to you per key? At that time, he loaded it, lowered it, but at the beginning he was charging me 14. Then he loaded it to 10. So, you know, because he's seen us moving so quickly. Right. But so I took the 250 keys and I gave him out. Okay. And I say, yo. And what were you charging on those keys? We, we partners. My partners, you know, whatever they settle for, we split the profit. Okay, I see. So if we get in for 14, they sell it for 20, 21 or whatever at the time. And then if it's a drought, it could go up.

The prices goes back and forth because, you know, right now I don't know what they do because I'm not in that game. But we was getting, you know, seven, when we started out, 7,000, 8,000 of each one. Okay. All right. So it sounds like you're, you had a bunch of dudes, partners. and you split whatever they could wholesale the keys that you gave them for. So if you made $4,000 wholesaling a key, you split it.

That's my partners. I sold keys too. Okay. I sold keys to people. You have your own customers. Yeah. So if I sold keys of $27,000, then that's my profit. Nobody gets that.

That's all my part. I see. So I would give out 20 keys, $25, whatever they want, and then I'll keep the bulk and I sell. So then when we started getting a whole bunch, he started, you know, I brought him back his money back in like four or five days, you know. He said, what's this?

I said, we finished. He said, you finished? He said, get out of here. I said, yeah. Now, meanwhile, you know, I told him I can't come to the house no more because she was crying and everything. And I really cared for her too.

Because I told her I can't mess with her no more and stuff like that. Did you explain to her the deal you made with her brother? I didn't tell her that. I told her I got somebody pregnant and, you know, and she's like, she was real upset. And I told her brother, I said, listen, you know, but he said, listen, you made a deal.

That's it. I said, well, what about her, you know, her status mentally wise going through this? He said, I'll deal with it. I said, I. So we started meeting up different places and I give him his money and stuff like that. But then he started, me and him got cool.

was hanging out going to dinner and going to the clubs. And, you know, he said, can you handle more? I said, well, let's go up and look at a time and we find out. So I said, I'm going to give you a 500 next time. So I said, I better fly back to New York than to get everybody ready. So I told him he's going to give us 500 this time. And we start, you know, doing what we do. At 10,000 a piece?

No. He didn't start it. 10,000, but I think it was about two months then he started, he loaded to 10,000. So that's $5 million that you have to return to him. Are you still,

and he's laying those on you, you don't give him any money, they just lay it on you and say, bring it back when you're done. You don't, you don't pay that money. You got beef. Right. Now, are you worried about laying work on

your dealers and your customers when it was already getting laid on you, being that you owe money to the connect. I was never lay, I wasn't laying it to the customers. They had to come with their cash. So they had to come COD. Now, my people, they know, they know they had it. If anything go wrong.

But see, I, you know, I'm a business man. I study business. So if we get in them at 10, say when it got down to 10, and we sell them for 20-something,000 or whatever, whatever, It might have went up drought, you might go a little high. But anyway, if somebody get arrested or whatever or the drugs get confiscated, we prepare ourselves for that. So we know if that happens, we got to make that up.

Okay. So I always save things for a rainy day. Right. So we always was prepared for things like that. But what I did do, I was like, you know, we got to come up with a different. because one of the guys got busted or I think he had like 19 keys on them or whatever, whatever. And that's before we started really doing the stash cars. So we started getting the stash cars and-

Hang on. Before you get into that, how do you warehouse 500 keys? I mean, that's a lot of responsibility. Oh, I'm sorry, go ahead. Let's get to that. My boss, my back. We had the keys in one place. That's why I said, I thought about it.

I said, man, they ever hit this spot? How are we going to pay that back? You know what I'm saying? Can we just starting? I said, we got to come up with a better deal. So, you know, I went to dinner with my people and we all talk because we're all bosses. And, you know, I don't deal with, none of my crew was workers. We're all bosses.

So we talked and I said, somebody got to come up with a better idea for us with this. So we, you know, they would say, well, suppose we'd put a certain amount of number in every places, you know. So they might say put 50 here, put 50 here, put 60 there, 70, whatever, 100. You know, just to divide it up. So if something go wrong, you can still have money to stuff to make up the loss and stuff. So we start breaking it down like that. And then, you know, we expand it more so with, you know, but where are you stashing the keys?

You still didn't tell me. where'd he just have 60 bricks that's a lot of coke that takes up the whole table you put it he put it in an apartment yeah you put in an apartment you have the apartment that you have even it could be the apartment that you was doing a tablework for the dope of the coke but you got to have a department and you got to have security in there now to tell you what happened one time to me before i got starting this this big load one of my lieutenants you know he we had to have had like money, guns, and probably about five keys in there in the house. And he got suckered.

Hey man, my other little man, they got suckered because they knocked on the door. Who is it? She said, how's inspected. So it was a girl. And the girl looked good. So they opened and cracked the door with it. The chain was still on the door. said, but they kicked in the door.

Guys was on the side. They kicked in the door. Died them up, you know, whatever, whatever, and took the money and the drugs and the guns. But see, they were so upset, like, you know, because they slipped. But I was like, listen, I'm that mad at your. I want to find that girl because that girl, I would have got.

Because for her to have the balls to do that, to get involved and stuff like that, and she said, my people are? I said, no, we we had to find them. I never found it. But that kind of, that was a whole business being a wolf, being a robber, robbing drug dealers. So like, would you just have crews of people? Like, how do they get the drop on you?

Are they just watching in, are they cruising around the neighborhood, like looking for who has money? Are you known as a kingpin in the South Bronx? And therefore, you have people that are trying to stock you and see where you go. Like, how do they get that intelligence? Which one you want me to answer? I know it's a lot of, how do you find, how do you know? Johnny, they see you. Like, you played basketball before.

Yeah. So you say, people come to the basketball course, they watch you play. They say, oh, he's good. Let's be crude. Same thing in the drug game. They see, you know, they see you upgrading. You went from a Honda accord to a BMW, then a Benz, then, you know, a Mayback or whatever. So you, they see the jury.

They see, so people talk. So, you know, you got the stick of kids is all over the place. You know, so. You would have moved out of the neighborhood. I moved out, but I still came in my neighborhoods. So, you know, but when I come somewhere, my security would be out there. See, I'm always, everybody always said I was paranoid, but I always come like that. So if I'm coming to meet you to exchange some money or whatever we're going to do or some drugs, I'm coming.

I'm coming with my security. So what happens is they're there when I come out. They get out my car, they're there. They're upstairs. In the apartment, whatever, everything's got to be on. And, you know, we call each other. Peter just pulled up, Peter, you know. When I used to go out to parties and stuff, you know,

we have about 50 people with us. We have 25 people outside. that don't hang out. They just smoke weed and they had their guns on them and then we had the 25 people that are going with us. And, you know, the owners never,

even if they were searching, they never searched me. Like the tunnel, they never searched me because, you know, we had that agreement. So I might come in with six guns on me and then when we get in, I pass them back out to some of my people. But the whole thing is,

you know, when you become a name, they start watching. you and they they they they talking and you are plotting i just i was a stick up kids i know you plotting oh johnny got johnny got some some money coming in you know find out where he live at find out and and that's what they do so you know you got to expect that it's part of the game yeah everything's part of the game you in the hustle game you can you can evolve kill or go to jail point blank so you guys would keep cash kind of as like an insurance policy on the side in case some keys did get stolen,

you could then make that up and make your connect whole. So you never came short to the connect. No, never. Cash was always, always put it away. Right. You know. Okay. What were you turning around? Say it's a load of 500 bricks.

What do you think your take off of that? Your profit? Personal take? Yeah. You said 500 keys? Yeah. I mean, I always see, with me, it was a little different because my partners, a lot of them was greedy.

So my workers, the ones that work for me, they might get like a thousand dollars, $1,000 a week, $1,000 every couple days. Where my partners would probably pay theirs, people are 500 a week like a real job. So I was just, I just was brought up a different way where I believe if I have a car, they got to have a car.

If I got a nice place, they got a nice place. So even when we went out to eat, when I always went out to eat, my partners, some of my partners were rather at the end of the, when the check come,

they go in their pocket and pay for it. So now, you got to think about this. I'm always looking at everything. So these guys that got their girls with them, you know, their girls, probably, I need to get with him.

See, I did it different, so we all go in our pockets to pay. So you can't, you can't, like, get the jealousy, the animosity and stuff in there. Because one time, like, you know, we had this thing called, for watching, not the little, Sash Mahoney in them back in the day. What they, the Bowie boys, you ever heard of them? but they said they used to have it used to call Voutine 3

so say we all got say it's all five of us right now and you like a girl okay and I'm the boss I'm talking about my people around me not my partners

I'm the boss and my lieutenants you know is there and say my lieutenant likes somebody so the girl the girl would be like you know looking looking around

but she might be looking to me because she think I'm the boss but my lieutenant like her so I call out Routine 3 so routine 3 is when we act like you the boss so everything we do that whole night like you the boss so we're like

Johnny um how much champagne should we buy Johnny how much this you know so now the girl they're thinking you the boss now so now all that P.D.S.U. stuff go out the window so you get with her so now and it happens that's true. And one

one time and one time you know, one of my lieutenants he got with the girls, so they start seeing each other. They boom, boom, boom. So I like to take my people to shows and stuff. So we were going to see a R&B show. And we all came with our girls, you know,

because you can't come out with me with a girl that you're not going to continuously come out with. I don't want those, you go out with them, you know, your side checks by yourself or whatever, you know. But when you come out with me, you got to be your main girl. So we, when we out going to the show, because I don't want my girl,

that they, that I'm doing that. So she's got to see you. If your girl's name is Angie, she's got to see you with Angie all the time. So, so they, they, um, we went out. We, we had, at the place before the show. We ended, in the, in the, um,

downstairs before you go up to the auditorium stuff. So I tell my lieutenant, I say, yo, go make sure. so-and-so, make this call, and make-so-so-son-and-s. Now, the girl is good. That's the same girl that I pull routine three on.

She's looking like, this nigga tell you what to do, you know, and I can see it in her face. So he don't pay it no mind. He's just going to do what he has to do. So I walked over to us and listen. Okay, now you know I'm the boss.

But I make this much more money than they own me. So that much. So. Okay. You like them, you slept with him. Yeah. I'm fascinated by, I still don't understand how your organization was structured. There's something you're not telling me. You were exceptional by how you organized this, this monster moving 500 bricks. Explain the difference between your partners and the lieutenants and how that worked. Were you just taking a point off the kilos that you gave to your partners? who then gave it to distributors lower on the chain? Well, it depends on who it is. It'll enlighten us, please. Some of my partners is like my, is with that close.

So a point. A point means a thousand bucks people. I know we're talking about. Yeah, I'm telling them. I'm telling the viewer at home. And then, you know, someone that would take me shopping. You know, stuff like that. Lieutenant's is the ones that's under you, your personal format.

So, lieutenants is under you. That's your street team. My partner's got their own street team. Okay. So your street guys, are they New York guys? Are they taking work out of town? They're New York and out of town. But the ones that stay near me is the ones from New York because I'm from New York.

The ones I've run out of town and see, you know, it's because I pop up. because I might not go there at that because if I got a lieutenant's or captains or whatever control and everything I don't have to be out there but when then if something's not right the money coming in slow I need to know why

so you know that's when we'll shoot out there and see what's going on and all once it's a true story and this is in Boston I go out there and it's freezing outside but I wonder why

you know, money's funny that's coming up to New York. So I go out and I see there was this worker that I never liked and I was waiting for him and messed up because I would have killed him.

But he's out there busting his ass and he's drinking the blackberry brandy or whatever he's drinking. But I said, where are everybody at? Where are the lie lie lie lieutenants and everything? We're the captain. He's like, they're in the bar. So you out here, buy your stuff.

self. He said, yeah, me and a homie. So I went in the bar and they don't know I'm there. I'm in Boston. So I went to the bar. I wanted him. He up there bugging with the, you know, and the other ones is drinking it. I said, yeah,

when they see me, they was like, oh shit. What do you do with it? I was like, now I know why money's funny. You know, it is. I said, so you know, this is what we're going to do. you're going to empty everything in your pocket and give me now and all your money you got in your pocket you know and they dudes are going in their pocket you know man but you come on now

you know you're dead wrong you got homie on the street by himself you're not out there watching this back you're not controlling the situation we ain't got no we don't have you know because this spot was doing good so it went down to um only a kid maybe a half a week where it was doing more than that. So I was like, no, no, no, no, no. Give me your money. Give me all your money.

And I got one of my partners with me. I said, yeah, here, hold this, man. So we took the money and we went back to the cribs because I had, you know, I always get them cribs to live in. I said, listen, man, you don't want to go back home? You know, you don't. So my captain was like, because I got on them hard. He said, so he was like, he think he, because he got game.

So he's like, I told you I ain't ready for this. you, I told you. I said, listen, listen. So you want to go back to the blocks and stay on the corners and do that grimy stuff where you just make peanuts or you got your own established to me now here. What you want to do? So he's like, I just want, you know, you know the thing is, and this is real talk, and I put my hand on the Bible. Maybe I have to be with me and make less money than to be out getting, partnership, getting more money. I couldn't understand that. They want to hang out with me. You know, they missed the thrill. That's how I had to start. throwing parties because they missed the thrill so much.

I said, I'm going to throw a party. They said, you know, don't want for your birthday. Don't want for your birthday. So we could, you know, we're all flying. I said, but if I have a birthday party and you're not finished your work, then you're not coming. So they, oh, so they bust that, all the, or every day so. So they come in.

We have a black tie affair. That was my first party for my birthday with, um, key sweat and touch. performing. So, okay, so it sounds like you still have an answer to how much money you made. Because I can't calculate because I spend so much money too. You know, if I make a few million I spend it, it goes in a girls get it, the casinos get it. You know, you can't calculate what you make because it goes. And, you know, your money doesn't come by in one shot. No. So it's hard. I mean, I'd be a lie. I could be like these pretenders that come in and tell you some

some crazy stuff or I made $10 million a day. You can't say that. So it sounds like you're you were giving work wholesale to your closest friends and partners, people that you consider peers. And then you would take guys from New York and set them up out of town where you would then give material to them and they would break it down to be distributed locally, correct? They had they had they hooked up with somebody that out there that we can trust to right to put it. the same the game. Right. Because if you go on somebody's hooded and you not know, and nobody's representing you from that town to you and you're going to have problems. So, you know, D.C.'s known for that. They, they back in the day, and I have some great D.C.

friend, so shout out to all you know. But they know for that. They'll, they'll trick you in. That's why they could never have me come out there with Coke. They have to come to me and buy it. Right. Because they'll have you come. You'd be like, they'd be like, uh, Johnny, bring me two keys. you bring him two keys. Johnny, bring me four keys. He made me four keys. Johnny, bring me six keys. I'll never see you again, Johnny.

You'd be missing the next to you. Right. Then I got many of you took the keys, took the money. You know, so DC was like that back of the day. So, you know. So it was, and the reason I asked about the structure is because this is really set up almost like a mafia-like structure. You have captains, the lieutenants,

and then they have workers. Did the, we're going to get to it, but did the, were the feds able to put a RICO case on you like that? Or? No, because I never test nothing by money. Okay. So, and none of my people never told on me. Right. See, you got these other organizations.

They get, they get people they can't trust. Just like, you know, these young brothers are getting into the gangs and stuff. Now, you recruit people you don't even know. But my people came from the ground up with me. Right. So I'm not going to tell on nobody. So if anything go wrong, we got to stop one time in the cab and the gun was in the, I took the gun. It's mine.

Three of us in the car. And they will all tell you that. I don't never let nobody else take it. My partners be like, yo, what is what is wrong with you? You're the boss. Let one of them take it. I said, how we know they're going to hold up. I know I'm going to hold up.

Everyone doesn't break down and they start turning on everything and it's going to go ease your way. to y'all too. Right. You know? Because one of my partners' people got out of court, bust knocked off

and stuff like that. And he's a midget. And he ended up telling on me saying they was getting the drugs from me since 1980. I was already in jail during my time. He said he's at the trial.

He said, we was getting the Coke from Peter Shoeb since 1980. That's how much he's telling. He's making shit up. This was in 2001, 2002. So I came to court and defuse some of that stuff. I said, no, he's lying.

Never happened like that. And he's always been a liar. And, you know, he was bullied because he was a midget. And, you know, he said he was going to get them back. And this is what he's doing. And he was like, well, you know, my partner. And this is how a lawyer I am. And my partner would tell you that.

He said, I said, my partner never killed nobody. I was the bad guy. I was the one with the temper. but they had to keep me out of trouble. I said, you know, he was nothing like that. You know, he's a small-time drug dealer, but I'm lying. You know, I'm just lying. Because all they could give me is five years for a lying, perjury in court.

But I was trying to save them from getting life, you know, which I did. But, you know, people always save me. Now, even to this day, if something goes half, if they catch, you on something and I was hanging out with you at the ballgame last week oh we know Peter Shue gave you the matures we know that's why I stay in the house I don't go nowhere because I know my name is still on their minds right and like even when when back in the day when I don't know if you knew Wolf and the Wolf was

body girl for a puppy one time so Wolf came home from the feds went back in the day and 80-something, whatever. He told me, he said, yo, shoot, they're showing your picture of everybody in the face. I said, why? He said, yo, somebody's telling you crazy. So Dave was actually showing my picture to guys, can you give any information on this guy? And but I never touched drugs. I only touched money.

And I thought at the time, because I only touched money, I'd be right. And I never knew nothing about conspiracy. And that's what got caught up with me because I didn't know you could get a conspiracy charge. Now, what was the height of your guys is, did you guys have a name for your organization? No. Oh, that's smart. That's kidd stuff. That's kidding stuff, right?

That's when watching movies. Right. Well, no, a lot of stupid, a lot of stupid crews have names, sex, money, murder, you know, all that shit. That's a gang. We wasn't a gang. We was organized. What's a good. Right.

Because, um, um, uh, pistol Pete, the black, Mr. Pete, the real one. Yeah. That's my family. That's my people. I love him. You know, so he's like a younger brother than me. And he was playing basketball when I started in my... Right.

So, you know, he might have caught some of the traits I did, you know. But he was just doing him. But when you get a name and you start naming your people, that's when you start getting in trouble with the law. Right. Just like tattoos, having tattoos on you. That's some form of identification. I don't do none of that.

Well, the Supreme Team, they were the most flagrant with their... their branding. You know, they had jackets, for God's sake. Supreme, Supreme Team, we was all in the same circle. So Supreme is cool. Prince, I just went to Prince's welcome home party. You know, I love Prince of Death. And the rest of the Supreme Team, shout out to Shannon, Tucker, and Shannon, Tucker and Teddy.

And the rest of them that I didn't really meet, that might still be away. But there's so many of them. but they was from Queens. They good people. So after you started blowing up and you guys have this massive Coke connect, the Colombians, did you ever go back to heroin?

I had some office from another connect, right? Because he used to laugh and tell, you know, he had a joke with me because he used to tell people, you know, like when I called him. come to his house. He said, here you take these two keys to have one, because you know, I don't want to touch. I don't want to mess with it.

And he's like, he'll tell his friends, look, he said, Peter's scared of hairball, you know, and they used to be laughing. But I couldn't get the mix. The mix was the mix, listen, have-on money, way more than Coke money. Anybody could tell you that. But if you don't have the right mix,

you know, then it's a problem. Yeah, but if you can just give it to somebody wholesale and make $50,000. $30,000 just by passing it off, maybe he has the mix. But the hair mom became garbage out there. I seen it. It was like, you know, the texture of it was garbage. And like I said, it was only holding a half.

Maybe, you know, there's some guys that was, I'll say one person, one group, because it was close to me, pure energy. Now, pure energy was doing crazy numbers. and pure energy, you know, the boss told me, his boss, you know, the boss and them said, yo, shoot, I can only put like a half on this at the most. I said, why? He said, fast turnover and the hair-in-law's not holding like that. I said, damn, this shit was holding for like 40, 40 years before you take him 40.

Back of the day, it's not like that. So there's only so much, since it can only be stepped on a little bit, there's only so much you can sell it for, right? Especially with the competition. Right. That makes sense. Now, the days of Frank, you know, we're talking about Frank Mantis, early, Frank Matthews, Nikki Barnes, and Frank Lucas or whoever else was out there at that time,

you know, they could, they could hit it with a 40. Totally different times. You know, you'd probably make it so much money, crazy money. I wish I was, I guess I was there that time, because anything could have happened. But I would have liked to have that opportunity when I was hustling to hit it with a 40 and see what would happen, you know.

Okay, so you never really went back to Heron once the Coke started just blowing up. No, I didn't. That makes sense. I get some, I get some Havard, and I try to get somebody to mix it and see if I could put it out, because if I could have found the mix,

then I would have grabbed some. So I would mix it, be in the house, mixing it just playing them out with morphine and Bernita and whatever else they put in it, we put in there. And I take it to the streets and, and, um, the, um, the dofean be like, man, this is good. This is good. I said, what is it?

Zero to ten. Man, it's a ten. So then I go back in the house and mix up some more and take it back out. No, this ain't the same, be. This ain't the same. I want to bust him in this head because I know they're playing games now because it's free. So I was like, man, this is the same thing. I just mixed it the same way.

He said, nah, no, no. So, but I couldn't get the mix. Because, you know, and I got to respect that. The, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, close friends of mine, they wasn't giving up that mix. That's fascinating. So I always wondered why the Puerto Ricans had the hair-on game in New York on such a lock. And did you say it's because they had the recipe and they weren't giving it out?

I mean, if, if, doesn't it connect help to, like having the right supplier? And that helps because if, if, if you get it for a good price and it's, and you get it. abundance, but still in all, the dophine got to feel it. So the dophine is now feeling that mix, then, you know, what are you going to do? And the dolphins out there, they get hooked on the mix. So if you come back with something, it could be better than they've been having. But they're so, they'll be looking for this, this label. Right.

Oh, I want this. I want that. I want this. I don't want that. And that's just how it is. So, you know, I just, anything that's a headache to me, I don't like to deal with Coke. Coke wasn't a headache. Coke is not a headache.

No. So, you know, I'm talking about moving wise. So, all you could bottle this up, put it out. How long would it take you to move 500 keys? We would try to do it. We would try to do it in a month. Yeah. Okay.

You know, it depends. You know, it depends because some people I know will come and want to buy straight up 40 keys at one time. So, boom, that's a sell, you know, and you don't make crazy profit on that. So if you save, if you sold it for 20-something and the key was going for 10, you paid off some of the keys you got left over. You see what I'm saying? And that's how I used to do.

I never spent that money. If I had, if the, if the bill, like going to buy a car, if your bills 500,000, say your bill's 500,000, but you, but you say, but you're selling extra prices on everything. So when you get to 500,000, you know, it clears your bill. So now everything else is profit. So all your keys you got left over, you push that out there. That's all yours.

So if anything going wrong, you ain't got to worry about nothing. But you got to get that bill money first. And did you work with the same Colombian suppliers the whole time, or did you actually make other connects? I had no other connects too. I got some people in Bahamas. You know, it's different. I dealt with some Italians.

It depends on, you know, who's going to come with you with the right price. You know, now the main connector had, he said he'll never have a drought. He'll never be empty. And he was empty. And that's how I got, I caught this case when I got the 25 years. Because I had to gamble. And I thought these people would sell drugs, but they was federal agents. So what happened was

And this was Madonna's friend Arlene Brickman that set me up But Madonna was involved in that whole thing So I get the I'm thinking I'm getting the keys And they're giving me And I'm so stupid You know

And I see When you can admit your stupidness Then you're a real person You got people in denial I was real stupid Because how can I be getting These good prices in this to drought So I'm

You know when I went in And I started doing this 20 some years I was like I need to kick myself in the And I used to tell my friends while we're talking and, you know, and I was like, yeah, you should have never failed for that. But they was giving me a good price. And it was no, it was never no drugs because it's the feds.

Right. So I showed up with my money because I said, well, let me test this out because I don't know, you know, I never dealt with you all before. So I'm bringing $120,000 to you. And I brought them $120,000. Now, who are these people supposed to be? John deers. Right.

Who were they, though? Were they supposed to be guys from New York? Were they Colombians? Were they... Italians. They were Italians. Supposed to be. Got it.

So that's how the story. You want to hear the story how I got... Sure, sure. But let's... Since that's kind of how you took your fall, I guess let's talk about the parties because that's... When you guys were at your height in the early 90s, right?

Yeah. 89 we started. Yeah. And how long did it take you to build up to this? like multi-million dollar organization. You got there pretty quick. That's easy. With the parties or with the?

No, with the drugs. Oh, the drugs was that first year. Overnight, right? That first year, we was rolling. And so parties became a way for you got, one of the ways for you guys to wash some of your money. Yes. So tell us about you throw your first birthday party for you.

You just plan it on being a one-off, right? And then it was a smash. So you kept going. So yeah, tell us about this is like party-threat. party-promoting business. Well, I didn't do it as a business. I just want to let my people enjoy this stuff because they're working hard and they,

you know, you're from New York. Your family's in New York. Now you're in Kabooka-Booka-Booka-Swer where seven drugs you don't get to see your family that much and your kids. So, you know, I said, but listen, is either that or you don't get no money. Now now you get money, you're getting $7,000, $8,000, and you can just send home money every week

and your families, you know, went from bags of riches, you know? So what you do is on you. So they, you know, like, again, allowing them want to stay with me than to go and get this crazy money. And I was like, your dues is crazy, man. Because I said, listen, I got a new, I got a new state. I said, one of y'all can take it. I'll split 50-50 with you.

Nobody raised it here. And nobody wondered it. I was like, yo, what this wrong with you? I was it? I would have, uh. Where was it? What state? Um, Baltimore.

I said, yo, I'll, I'll, I, this is the beginning. I said, I'll, um, I would have been like, I'm out. You know what I'm saying? So you've had to stay here to get $5,000 or $7 a week where you could get 50% cut on everything we're doing because that you control in that state. I couldn't believe that. But these dudes want to hang out with me so much, man, you know. And I appreciate the love because that just shows you that they really love me as a public.

But, okay, you should have wanted to check there when I did the 25 years. So you're going to be with me. Yeah, right. You should have just committed to cry. I used to joke with them about that. You should have just did the crime just to come in there with me. So she didn't want to hang out with me all the time. But, you know, so I start, I do that one party.

And then, hey, you know, it's always a wise guy. let's do it once a month Oh yeah really I said that's what you're trying to do now Yeah because everybody else's birthday's coming up And you know We'll we'll You know we

We know you want us to finish everything Before a party So if we finish everything Would you let us have the party Throw the parties So I start laughing I said alright we're gonna do it So because we had such a good time

At that first party It's like it was a black tie affair What do you guys have But Omni Hotel. Okay. It's on 50th Street, I think, and 7th Avenue, if I remember. But we were talking years ago. But it was so, I had parties everywhere.

But what made this party so? It was the first one. Everybody was, I gave out money for the best dressed female, the best dressed couple, the best legs, you know. BBLs was available out there then. And so it was natural bodies, but girls still had crazy nice legs. So we give out, we have a lay contest and stuff like that. So, you know, I was just giving out free money to all this stuff. And we had the best DJs.

We had, everybody just looks so good. And, you know, that was my goal. If I was going to throw a party, I wanted to go back to them TV shows. Saturday Night Fever. No. The TV shows. not the movies, Dynasty. That's what I meant, yeah.

Dynasty, Nost-Lanning, and Dallas. You know what I remember when they have parties? They be dressed up. I wanted to show that we could do that. Right. So my parties used to be based to have people come looking good. So you see people looking so, you know, I got a couple of videotapes somewhere,

but the fairs took most of our videotapes from the parties when they broke it to them. My apartments, I had different apartments all over the place. They took Rolexes, Minks, everything, you know. So they was never there. Okay, so how did the parties become more of, like, go from just being one-offs to actually, like, money laundering schemes? Were you charging people to get in?

Yeah. Okay, gotcha. So please go into that. We charge people to get in and we charge, you know, but basically I didn't care about the money coming in. I just wanted to have fun and wash out money. And like... So did you have holding companies?

Like when you were getting back those checks, you know, if you charge, obviously when you're washing money, you're going to lose some. That's the tax that all drug dealers pay. I was getting ready to incorporate myself and everything when I got locked out. I'm getting to quit the game. Yeah. I was going to do with that. And that's what they say.

When you give it and get out, that's when you either get killed or you go to jail. For sure. And that's what happens. They always say that it's like a jinx. But I'm getting all this money. And I'm putting it back. You know, I don't never take credit for things because this is my personal relationship with God. Like sponsoring for the homeless, Thanksgiving meals, clothes, everything.

I sponsored a lot of that. People don't even know to this day. And I don't take credit for that because, again, you got people out here doing that. Yeah, I did this. That's not for the society. That's for God. Your relationship with God, or Allah, who you believe in, that's your relationship with them, with him.

And you're supposed to get your rewards when you get to heaven. So my thing, I never, that's the way I was brought up. So I never brag, I never, you know, you would never know to this day if I got a dollar or I have a million dollars. You would never know. I'm the same person all the time. I never change my personality.

It's always the same. Where a lot of people, they start getting money. I don't want to name names because a lot of them was young. But, and I'm talking about celebrities, too, where they never got money before. So it messed them up. Because you never had when you get, you know, it's like, oh, my God. But if you had before, it's like, it goes up and down. You know, you have, you might be $100 million a day and have nothing the next day.

So you have to be able to adjust with life. I adjust with anything. that's going on. If I'm with a bunch of broke people, I can fit right there. I'll cry broke too. We broke, you know. You know, when are we going to get somebody to eat at?

But if I'm rich, I'll fit them with them too. So the parties, you know, I just wanted to see how people reacted at the parties. Can they upgrade themselves and make themselves fit what I used to see on the TV shows? And they did. They get the head and nails done. You know, the brothers have the secrets jackets

to hook up the time. You know, they're showing their Rolexes, their Cuban bracelets and everything, with the diamonds in it. So, you know, it was, it was, that was so, so fascinating to me. And I used to just sit in the party and just watch everybody.

And I used to get, I used to outdo everybody else's party. That's why they couldn't, nobody could throw a better party to me at the time because if you go to get a comedian, hire a comedian, I'm going to get a comedian, and an artist.

If you get an artist, I'm going to get two artists. I'm going to get, until your money, your money can't hold it. So you can't afford, your overhead is going to be messed up. So I didn't care about that. How much would you spend on artists at these parties? It depends on who's hot, the hottest ones. Who would you have? Like Keith's sweat.

Yeah. They might cost $5,000. At that time, Keith costs about $40,000 now. You know, Dave Chappelle, he when he first got to New York he started comedy at like 14 in the mid-80s some of the ways that he survived as like a broke comedian

is drug dealers from Brooklyn would pay him to go perform and he'd be coming back on the subway this skinny kid from Maryland with 20 20 G's in his backpack you know and he deserves it he's funny yeah he's funny guys like you paying these cats yeah but I used to pay

I used to just outdo everybody and then you know if I if I get three headliners, right? The lowest one would get less money. The one that comes on last, that's going to get the most money. Of course. So in touch, in touch was a group that made a song

called Too Hype. Put on my best. Can't believe that she said yes. So that was the hit at that time. But they was just coming out. So I had them perform. I had Keith performing. I had a comedian perform.

So, you know, through the course of these parties, you start to become more known by mainstream New York high society, right? You step out from just being this street celebrity in the ghetto to now being this kind of Manhattan socialite in a way. That's what people say. And that's what the movie people say. That's why my story is different from everybody else's because I crossed over. So I got to a point where I didn't know I was a drug. dealer, a celebrity, a movie star or something, you know, because this one time, this is a true story on my mother's grave.

This guy came over to me. He said, he said, Mr. Shue, can I have your autograph? And I was like, so I'm looking around like, am I getting punked? You know what I'm saying? Even though punk wasn't out there. Well, I was trying to see him about French punk and me. So he's like, no, for real, man. My daughter's seeing you on a music video box with Ralph Medellion show.

I said, she, she's in love with you. I said, how was your daughter? She said, six years old. I said, oh, man, I said, so he gave me a shit, and I signed it and took a picture of him to give to her. But that's the type of things I was going through. And, you know, even now, one time when I came home, I'm getting on the Metro North because, you know,

I'm just home. This is like, in October, I, probably November. December of 2015. So I'm on the train platform. So it's like these young dudes, they look like high school kids. They're looking at me, right? And I'm like, oh, man, don't tell me these niggas going to want to try me, you know, try to varm me or something like that.

So I'm like, you know, I'm paranoid because, you know, I just got out. So I'm looking at these dudes trying to play it off. So they start easing over to me. So I said, oh, man, so I'm thinking, you know, in my mind. So which one should I try to take down first? you know, in my mind. So when they get on me, the dude says,

hey, aren't you, Peter Shoe? Now, I'm on the defensive. Like, yeah, yeah, I'm Peter Shoe. Like, yeah, right. He said, nah, no, no. Yo, my mother, my, you know, my father, whatever, they talk about you all the time. They love you, blah, bo, blah, blah.

I said, oh, man. So I saw a laugh. They said, can we, can we take a picture with you? Can we take a picture? Can we take a picture? You know, and then one time, the dude was seven, CDs. I'm with my girl. He said, CDs outside walking by with the city. He got the CDs in the sand.

He said, yo, buy a CD for me, buy a CD. I said, listen, man, I don't, I don't, I don't, you know, one about, you know, CDs today, you know, I'm telling you. This is downtown near, down here. Yeah, can now. So, yeah, so he's like, he says, if I told you, I know who you was, he was. I said, what are you talking about? These are young dudes. So I said, who am I? He said, you that guy. I said, who? He said, he said, he says, shoe. He said it like that.

I said, oh, man. So my girl said, well, you got to buy a CD? I said, yeah, I got to buy it. But, you know, it's good to be known for the good things. It's bad to be known if people, I don't want people follow my footsteps on the bad things I did. No, I know that, but this is kind of part of the story, you meeting celebrities. Like, did you start having people like, Madonna because famously you knew Madonna.

She had a crush on you. Was she coming to these parties? No. I met her. You want to know this? How would we met? I'll tell you how we met. Sure.

There was a party around the corner at the crane club for Chas. Chas passed away. He was, he has the movie coming too about a beg robbing because that's what they did back in the day. But he's, his, that was like my brother, from Black Hair Productions. And people would tell you he's got a good name if you ask people about him. So he was having a birthday party over there.

So they was at the Crane Club, and Chas and Wilson is around the corner. And that was the groupie spot on Sundays. So he's over here, you know, and I was over there first, but it's too crowded. It's too packed. The Crane Club couldn't hold on them people. So it was too crowded. So I broke out and went over to Chaz and Wilson's. for a little while.

So Chazza Wilson is like, let me give you a scenario. It's a blonde bar. All the groupie girls are standing there and trying to come up, you know, with the celebrities. And then the celebrities got the tables in the back.

And you'll see, Robert De Nivell, Winnie Harrison, Andre Havel, you know, all them type basketball players because me and Oakley used to go there all the time. So I had an eight-seater.

They gave me an eight-seater every time I came in. Oakley had a booth. But my eight-seater was AP booth. It was boot 46-6. So I used to mess with him about that. So I come to the Chazzy Wilson's and I'm chilling at the bar

with the two of these groupie guys that I might try to score on. So I'm talking to them. And my man came over with me. He was like, yo, Madonna want to meet you, right? So I said, Madonna, he said, yeah, she says, she likes your eyes.

I said, well, I said, tell Madonna, you know, I like my, my women black, like my coffee. Because I got that off of, I got that off an airplane. Remember that movie, Airplane? So I love that line. He said, that little kid said to the girl. And she, he said, can I sit down? He said, I, I like, I love.

my men, black like my coffee. And this was a little kid, so I laugh every time I see that. And so I won't, he went back and he told it. And, you know, I'm still talking to the, the girls that somebody tapped me on my shoulder. And it was her.

So I turned around, I said, oh, shoot, she said, that was the racist, you know, comment. And I was like, I was just joking. I was just joking now. I said, she said, hi, my name's Madonna. I said, I know you are. I'm Peter. for my mom.

So she said, will you come to my table for a little while and talk to me? I said, sure. So now, because homie had left, so I went to the table, I was talking to her,

we're kicking it. Are you star-struck at all? Like, do you care? I never would stars talk about. Just like, you know, you know these people be groupies and run them out, take it jumping and take pictures with guys.

I know all these guys. So isn't that nothing? I'm the star in my eyes. So they should be wanting to take a picture with me. So I don't, I don't chase no, no, no, no, no, no, lime light.

Yeah. So I go, I go, sit down where we took kicking it, boom, boom. And then she's like, well, can I keep in touch with you? I said, yeah. So I give her my beeper number. She gets my, you know, I get her stuff. And she gives me a kiss on the cheek. She breaks out.

Was she hot? Did you like that kind of, I mean, of course, early Madonna was beautiful as far. You know what I liked about her? Her legs. Her legs. Her legs is fabulous. legs. Yeah, legs.

She ain't had no butt at the time. I was going to say, though, she's skinny. She got a butt now. She's got that BBA. Sure, yeah. She doesn't have a butt then. So I go to the, um, I go back to the party. Now, you know, I tell you it was too crowded.

So somebody shoots up in the air because it was, it was getting crazy in there. So everybody left and they arguing outside and, you know, Chaz was drinking, so he's happy and everybody else was drinking. And I was. like, you know, some of my Brooklyn people was there and stuff. So somebody said, no, we all from Queens. I was like, listen, listen, everybody here from Queens, niggins from different brothers.

So y'all just go home and chill because I didn't want thing to escalate. So my beeper went off, and it was a two-one-two beeper call. So I called the phone back. Oh, I was supposed to take this other girl off. And she was, I always wanted her to. I never got it. was, because she broke out because of the shoot. I wanted her, that was my day.

That's why I came to that party. I wanted her, I didn't get it. Well, anyway, so I answered the phone. She said, she said, I said, who this? She said, this is Madonna. What's you doing? I said, nothing now because the party over. She said, why don't you come down to my place?

So I said, where are you live at? She said, 64th Street, Central Park West. So I'm on 79th Street. skip and jump. So I went down there and she had the loft. So I went up in the elevator. And she came to the door with the negligence. She threw negligee on.

So, I mean, you know the rest. So you smashed? Is that what you're trying to say? As the kids say? Now, did she know you were a drug dealer? Did these celebrities who come? I didn't know. She knew in the beginning, but she did know

because the one that was setting me up, He set me up through her, and he knew. He told her. Okay. Before we get into that, did these celebrities who came to your parties, these actors, musicians, et cetera, did they know? Did the greater public who knew Peter Shoe from the parties know your backstory? They probably did. No where all the money came from?

I mean, nobody never came to me and said, hey, don't you sell drugs? They never came to me. But I have to believe, you know, they knew because where did I just come from? Yeah. You know, like you just put water in the plant and I just grew. I mean, they knew and stuff, you know. And I was still conducting businesses at parties. Like, we had this club we should go to all the time called Bentley's.

So if you came from out of town and you wanted 20, 30 keys or whatever, whatever, and I'll have you meet me at the club. We're hanging out. We partying. And I had my lieutenant. Take your lieutenant. And we had the. We had the big van or whatever we had in the parking lot down the block.

And that's where the Coke was. And you'll give us the suitcase of money, whatever, the duffel bag, and he has changed it. And I never had the counter because they know not to play with my money. So we did it like that. So we was making exchanges like that. And, you know, it's, it's, it's, I was trying to kill two bears of one stone. Because I might want to hang out, but I know you coming in to get something. So I got to make things happen.

So, all right, let's me see. Now, Johnny's coming in at 10. Okay, so I'm going to get these keys down here. We're going to hang out tonight at Bentley's because you're like that because the girls and the champagne and whatever. So you get your, you get to kill two birds and one stone. So you're good. And you get your drugs and the next day you're going. And then you're calling me, and when you get back to your state and tell me, yeah, you know,

everything land. it and we're good. Thank you. And, you know. What year did you meet Madonna? Early 90s. Okay. And you didn't catch your case until 95. So you suspect, or maybe you know, you're about to tell us, through somebody that she knew, that person led the DEA to you. Can you explain that?

Well, I don't have it on paper. That's why I don't say the person's name. Okay. But you don't have to say the name. If I knew his name, I mean, if I knew he did it, that I won't have no problem saying the name. But it's something, you know, fishy. And the thing is, because I could wonder, why would she do that, you know?

Well, how long had you guys been dating, I should say? Over a year. But she was like, yo, listen, she was trying to have my baby. She was trying to get pregnant. I mean, I go to house and smash. and she would lift her legs up. I come back from the bathroom,

she got her legs up, because she's trying to get the spin and drop down. I'm like, yo, what you doing? So, you know, so she scared me with that because I was like, oh, man. So, you know, at the time,

I had a nice, pretty good. She was black and white. Was Madonna your side check? Yeah. That's so dope. Basically, so Teresa, Teresa was my girl. So I was like,

so I went, you know, then I'm taking the places, you know, I'm taking Madonna places, and I got the place for her to do the video for this song called The Secret. And if you look at the video, you'll see as an Oriented dude, I was supposed to be in that video. That was supposed to be me. But I got caught because my girl found out about Madonna because her friends, you know, were always telling them somebody.

So they, they was like, Peter was singing Madonna at the Rockets. seen as I was the first one ever took Madonna to the Ruckett because she's never been up there. You took her to Rocker Park? Yeah. On 125th? No, 155th. 155th. I'm sorry.

Yeah. So when we went up, you know, everybody was starstruck when she came up there and stuff like that. But so we chill and then I, we was driving through Harlem and stuff. And my, my, my beep was going off and it's my girl. So I pulled it. And she, I heard the room was, so I pulled it over. I said, hold on. let me go take this call, so I went and got the call.

She said, yo, you're cheating? She's going on. She's just kidding. You know, crying. I said, listen, it's not what you think. You know, no, no, no. I said, I'm just trying to do the, get the video thing for it because I get paid $150,000. I'm going to give that to you.

I don't want the money. I don't want the money. So she's going crazy, right? So that made me back up for Madonna because I very care for Homegirl. So I went. when I'm back, I went back to, um, when I went home, that's why I missed the video shooting. I went, I went to me and Teresa's crib, you know, every time I'm, I make love to it. Because I took her away, we went to Aruba and St. Martin's back to back, but I took her away.

And every time I make love to her, she starts, she's crying now. You fuck me, Madonna. I was like, oh, man. So I said, you know what? When we get back, I'm dead. I'm not, I'm not, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, off, so I stopped messing with it. So when I went to the video shoot,

because the day was in the middle of the video shoot, then Madonna going off of me. She's like, no, you know, because I didn't tell her, you know, I was leaving and whatever, whatever. She said, you tell me you want to be out the drug game, you want to do this, you know, and I'm trying to plug you in

and he'll get you, and you just do me like, you know, so I didn't want to hear her mouth feet, so I broke out of her. You broke up with two girls at the same time. That's smart. But do you think, do you think that breaking up with Madonna? Do you think she vengefully,

do you think she then went and told somebody what you were into? And that led them to the DEA? No, because they're informant. Arlene Brittman, she testified about all this stuff. Okay. And she, before I broke up, she was already setting things up. Because I would. Madonna was, or Arlene Brickland.

Okay. Who was Arlene? Who's Arlene Brickman? She's the lady that made a book called Mob, Mob, Mob Girl. She's talking on Italians and everything. Okay. If you look up the book, Mob Girl is... But my son said she passed away.

Who was her, how, what was her relation to you? Like, how did she know about all this? I'm going to tell you. Okay. Madonna was supposed to do a... Madonna was supposed to play her in a movie when they come out with a mob girl. Because the lady was like a slut, and she was... Sleeper with all the Italians, but she was getting knowledge from them,

and she ended up telling them some of them. So, Madonna's, we went to this concert on the beach, right? And, Miami, man, it had to be 100-something thousand people on that beach. And this is the craziest show I ever seen in my life. I forgot the name of the group, but they, you know, that rock, punk, rock joint, eh, la, right? And what they, they're spitting onto the crowd. The crowd's, yeah, ah, they're spitting.

And I'm looking at this shit, me and my man Mark, I was like, yo, this is crazy. Then he, then one dude in the group pissed on the people. They're like, yes, thank you. And I'm like, I came, so for that whole two hours I was out there, my mind was like this. I can't believe this shit. Now, we told him about 100,000 people.

And then you say you're out there with your girl. You might lose your girl. Because they're throwing your gun, flipping her all through the, you know. And she's rolling and she's flying all through the car. You know, she might be in two miles somewhere else now. The joy was just amazing. I'd never seen the show like that in my life. So I was, I was all about that.

I was like, this shit is crazy. They tell him he spit on me, piss on me. I was like, and now that I think about all, Kelly should have been there. Yeah. You had no part of it before I was doing it. But anyway. So when we get back to the crib, you know, we in Star City. She had the crib out in Star City, and Sylvester Stallone live right next to her.

You're talking about Madonna still. Yeah. And there was another place that she was trying to get me to get. That was empty. But when we get back to the place, we, you know, socializing, you know, the group is there. People, so I go in the kitchen. Arlene Bittman's in it. And now, mind you, at that time, Arley Bittman is like 60-something years.

old, she's an older lady. So she's crying, you know? So to this day, I can't figure this shit out because how did she know I was going to go in that kitchen? So I came in the kitchen. This is all scripted. There was some kind of plot with this thing, and I didn't see it.

You know, it just went over my head. So I'm in the kitchen, and I said, what's wrong? Why are you crying? Because I haven't met her. You know, I haven't met her already, you know, And so Madonna said, you know, I'm going to play her in the movie mom girl. So I said, what's wrong?

She said, oh, I have a lot of problems, Peter. You know, just like an old lady, you know, talking. So I said, what's, I said, Tommy, what's going on? She said, oh, a lot of money. I said, owe a lot of money to who? She said, I'm too ashamed to tell you. So, you know, she's, she's, she's, playing games with me. So I'm milking it out of her. And she said, you know, I owe these drug dealers,

like 300 something. I forgot what it was. It's been so long. So she owes a whole bunch of money. So I said, why don't you just ask McDonald for it? You know, she said, because Madonna don't deal with nobody that's dealing with drugs. So I don't want to let her know I was doing, you know, drug deals. I said, okay, sounds reasonable. So she said, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, If I don't have this money a certain period of time, they said they're going to kill my daughter. So I said, who is these people? She said, some Italians.

So I said, all right, so what can you give them to hold them off until we could figure this out? She said, well, I don't know. I just want to give them something. So I came out there with, I think, $75,000. I think it was $75. So I gave her, I had my man go upstairs to get, get the 50,000 out the woman, bring that down. And I gave that to her.

I said, here, she's like, oh, thank you, thank you, you know. But you should talk to Madonna and try to get the rest of that money. But she's like, no, this will help for now. And if I ever could do anything for you, because I could get, I could get, you know, coke and stuff. And I was like, no, I got my own connect. So, like I said, time go by. And then there was a drop. My connect couldn't come through.

Now, I got 15 blocks in New York. And they crying. In the South Bronx. No, all over. So they crying. Yo, we need some work. We ain't got no work. You know, so I'm getting tired of them crying.

And I remember she told me that she got somebody. So I hit up. I said, do you still get somebody with the drugs? She said, yeah. She said, I could put you on the phone with one of them and see what's going on. So I said, I see what's going on. So I get the call and I think, I said, tell you do, so I'm thinking, it's some off you do or whatever.

And I said, he said, hey, Peter, how are you doing? Said, I'm doing good. You said, yeah, I heard you need some things. you got good references, you know. So I said, he said, a lot of people know you. I said, oh, that's good, that's good. So how can you help me? And he told me, I could use so-and-so.

What did you order from him? This is how I know it was, I should have. I was purchasing eight keys. I think it was 15 apiece. Wow, that's not a lot of coke for you. No, I had to test it out. Right. And it's only for the 15.

blocks. Right. And I say, Andy was giving me seven on consignment. Wow. Seven in a drought and here pay me when you're done? Who does that? Ha ha ha ha ha. You know what I'm saying? But when you're, when you're, when you're go that long without coke, without drugs to sell, you get desperate. You know, it costs me 20-something years in my life. Of course. But see, you know, the thing with the thing is that makes it even worse, man. You know, I never felt that I would, I never got into. that where I got thirsty. So I was thirsty, you know, and that's not me.

I ain't got no problem when falling back. We just wait, but these guys kept calling me, Peter, we need what they? I should have killed all of them. But they're the things that are the reasons that I got the time. But they're the ones that actually need money. The boss, he's rich enough to where he can fall back. But they have money.

They have money too. But, you know, having the spending is two different things because I always told, you know, I was, my partner My partner told me this, and I related to them, if you ain't got $100,000 in your stash, you broke. Yeah. So you better, and that's that time.

Right now, that's way higher than that. Right. You know? How much is it now, Portland? How much you got to have your stash? So you got a stash, you got to have that. Yeah. So, you know, I figured, you know, if they had $100,000 or more,

because we used to joke about it, I used to test them. How much you got these stash? Oh, 75. Oh, you broke. You know, play around with them. But they should have enough money to hold them over until the drought was over. You know, forget what I got.

And what were your Colombians telling you, you know, what were they, would they give you a sense of when the new ship? These were the Columbia. This is somebody else. And these people are still active. That's why I'm not going to say that. Okay. But the whole thing is they are,

they was telling me, you know, it's going to come. It's going to come. I said, no, listen, man. You know, you got me out here thinking we'll never be empty, and now we drive. If that's the case, I would have kept some on the side and a spoon fed them.

But I wasn't doing that because I felt we was going to always have it. So he's like, no, Peter, Peter, we're going to get it, you know. The same OBS. But I was dead. Well, life is life. and, you know, you, everything happens for a reason, as you say. So you went to, you agreed to meet with these Italian drug dealers. Yeah.

And did they arrest you on the spot or did they build a bigger case? No, they invests me on the spot because what they did, right, I had the money. So I'm in the car. One of my lieutenants, he passed away. But he, one of my lieutenants is in the car. And he got me an extra five years because. it's five years for a gun. Now, when he's going out there,

you know, he, he wasn't a vehicle person that would go. That's why this, this all sounded like the godfather. You know, like one of the movies where they, where the drama ain't going, and there was a setup and they tried to kid, but he wasn't supposed to go. But the other guy was sick,

so he was going with me. So I said, I said, grab a, bring a, bring a gun, so you make sure we're right. So he comes to get me. He pulled up. And he says, here. He said, here what?

He said, I bought two guns in case of you. You don't know how many people's there. So I felt, you know, I thought about a year. We might need two in cases to set up. So we go all the way to Long Island and a tofu restaurant. Now, meanwhile, we also had a trailer car come after us because they're the ones that going to take that drugs. I'm not taking that with me.

So they'll come and take the jugs and put it in the car. But they parked somewhere else. So that's when we had the stash cars now. You had the stash the James Bond stuff. You know, you can make the James Bond stuff so everything could open up for you. So when I get to the parking lot

of the tofu restaurant, that was naming the restaurant, they sent a Spanish dude. Now, this ain't Italian. So the Spanish dude, he comes up, So he's like, hey, Peter, I said, hold on, hold up. So I'm thinking there's a setup now. Say, where's the guy I'm supposed to see?

He said, no, no. He sent me. I'm a worker. So we get in my car. And he says, just like Scarface, do you got it to the money? You know, that type stuff. I said, do you got to the stuff? So he said, oh, you know, close by, close by.

But he claimed it was in his car. So I said, I got to see the money first. So I opened a bag and showed him the money. He didn't count it. He just looked. So then he got out the car. And when I said, yo, I said, Mike, keep the car money. You know, because it just didn't feel right to me.

He goes back to the car, his car, like he's giving him open the trunk. And I'm watching him. And I'm watching the surroundings. And I see him take his hat off. And that was a signal. And it was like, 30 calls for the, they saw come over everything. And I didn't know who they was at first. I thought it might be somebody trying to bomb me.

So I went to pull my gun out. I had a 45 at that time. And I went to pull it out. And I seen the badges. They had the things on their neck. So I just threw it back and let them. throw me on the ground and they start kicking me. Oh, you're going to try to shoot us?

You know, all that stuff they do. So that's what happened with that. So that's the DEA. Yeah. Okay. How long had they been, and you took them to trial? Because I had two hung juries. Wow.

So, because the conspiracy laws, right, you got to have somebody conspire with. Now, I can't conspire with police or informant. So Arlene Bremens are informed. farming. The DEA's, police, feds, whatever. I can't conspire with them. Mike was never on none of the tapes. He's never on none of the video tape.

I mean, the video, the tape, phone tapes. So it's just me and the watcher call. So I said, listen, if we're, if we're, um, if we're playing charades, then if you take me in for pretending to be a drug dealer because there was never no, there was never no drugs. They didn't bring no drugs. It was a drug conspiracy.

So you're bringing me in to do, I'll take, I'll do time. If you're bringing me to do a drug case with no drugs because you play, you play make-believe. But then they got to go to jail too, the federal agents because they make-believe it. They make-believe they was a drug dealer. So, you know, that didn't work. So that was your argument. So you took them to the box twice. You took them to trial twice.

Three times. Two times I got hung jubbies. So that must have cost a fortune. But see, the whole thing is, the whole thing is, they know the laws. They knew, to this day, they couldn't prove no conspiracy against me. They gave me, I did 20-something years on known and unknown.

Well, who's the known? Did they offer you plea deals? Yeah. What was their best offer they gave you? The first deal was 17. I got a hung juby. The second deal was, like 10, I got a hung jubi.

The third deal was five. I got an undo. Why did you turn down the five? Everybody asks the same question. I could give you a dollar for that. Because if I got another hung jubi, they couldn't take me to trial no more. They would just gave me income tax invasion.

Okay. Was that a year or something? But anyway, so what happened? Because for the $120,000, I showed up with. But what happened was, plus, I came in other cases. If you follow me, I came in other cases. So if I don't get, go to jail,

if I don't go to trial and I take the cop out, they would make me cop out to the gun. And the drugs would still be open. Now, if you know the law, that means if another case comes out, they could retry me on their drug case. I see. Like when the midger was saying,

we got the drugs of shoes since 1980. They could be charged me. And other cases came out, follow me. That's friends of mine that court that was down with my team. We are all down together. They had cases. Four years later, five years, you know. So dudes was running up on me when they see me in jail.

Yo, shoot, you know you're on my case. And they'll show me the transkins and everything. They got your name in here. got you. So if I would have did that and everybody say, you know, Peter, you should have took the five years, but they don't know what was coming after because I would have got life. Because you could have, you would have been re-arrested on other people's cases.

Right. Because one of my partners had, DeRico, he had the bodies, what you call, bodies, drugs and all type of stuff. I would have been on that. Right. Because the midges saying they was getting the drugs on me. So now I'm on that. I would have been on that. Right. indictment. So it's better to keep your separate case and just do your time?

You know, because the judge got mad at the prosecutor. On the future cases, not my case. Because the prosecutor, you know, I told the judge, I told the judge, listen, can I address something to you, to your, so he cleared the jury out. I said, listen, they got me in the shoe. You know what the specializing is. I'm in a shoe.

for no reason. I did not do no crimes. I was minding my business. I thought I came down here on my, on 2255. They got all the snitches, because all the snitches said, if I come to the units, they feel threatened

because they think I would try to do something because they'd tell them to my partner. I said, listen, they got me down, they got me in the shoe for no reason. I'm in here, you know, a shower, maybe three times a week, the food, you know.

So he was told He had told the marshals and stuff That um no he told the warden That the warden that the prosecutor in the AW Don't let the snitches be on the compound The snitches should be in the hole and the dudes That has nothing to do with the case you know that should be on the compound So

He got mad So he was like, where did this come from? I said, oh, I had some more. He said, what? I said, the reason this is going on down there where all the non-vats is in the shoe because her, I pointed out to the posse kid and she's a black lady.

I said, she's having an affair with the AW. And she's a lesbian. So he's like the piano. You knew that? Yeah, people told me in the jail. So I told her up. I said, that, that, that, that. So it was like, so.

He was like, the judge got mad. He was furious. So he said, why did you bring Mr. Shoe down here? So she was so pissed off at me. She was like, she said, well, we thought we were going to try to get him to cooperate on the case. He said, did you go see him? No.

Is he trying to cooperate? No. Okay. So why is he still here? He said, well, we're thinking about putting him on the indictment. And he's looking over the paper and down. He said, I don't see his name. Why is he still here?

So he's getting furious. This is the judge. So she just went blank. She couldn't say nothing. She just looked down. So he said, get the marshals. Call the Martians in here. So he brought the Martians.

The Martians came in. He said, you see what time it is now? He looked up. The Martian looked at the time. He said, listen. if Mr. shoe and the rest of them guys is not out the shoe

by the time this court session closes I'm going to show you he pointed out as the prosecutor I'm going to show you the marshals and I'm going to show you that lesbian AW what the shoe looks like he's told my locker door up

so when I got back down there I was out on the next day smoking they didn't even keep me in the shoe no but they sent me back to my jam I thought that was funny. That was the highlight of my whole tip of time. Well, take the highlight because it didn't do you much good. No.

You're going to have your little good time. Of course. But you're going to never get back. So I still don't understand. I guess we'll just wrap up. But I still don't quite understand. I guess that's a legal question for people can investigate themselves. Why did taking it to trial and losing make it so they couldn't come back and

re-arrest you in the feds on other people's indictment? and other people's trials. You can't, you can't, I wouldn't have never get, I couldn't have been charged for the drugs no more. I couldn't get charged with drugs no more. Because you had already been. Yeah, once you convicted of drugs. Tried and arrested and that's that same ever.

That's the same ever. You can't get, you can't get tried for no drugs. Okay. There's no, no, that's it because then that's double jeopardy. Right. So once you get convicted of the drugs, that's it. I see. So, okay.

That's basically what it is, but. Wow. Wow. that's an odyssey because do you feel lucky that you didn't get a life sentence? Because certainly with all the people that you controlled and commanded, the amount of weight that you moved, I mean, there's guys that'll never come home that move less than that,

you know? But you gotta have your team has to be right. If you, if you notice, yeah, but do you feel lucky? Like, do you feel like that was,

you know, some kind of divine intervention? Like, boy, George didn't sell as much drugs as you. He's never getting out. That's an example. I know, Peter.

but I'm just asking you a question. Do you feel lucky that you're not doing life? That's another crew. That's heaven. And I know all of them, but they so, listen, when you sound, when you, when you, when you, when you doing life, right, offer something, nobody knows what life is until you do it. You can't despair me as, you know, a person doing 20 years don't know how it feels to do life. A person doing 10 years don't know how it feels to do 25 because they never did it.

But to me feeling lucky, no, I don't feel lucky because of this. My mother got sick, she died. I miss my whole kid, my children's childhood. You know? I miss the best years of my life. That 20-something years, that's when you, listen, when you first growing up, right, you're trying to find yourself in life.

That's in your teens. You're supposed to start feeling yourself a little bit getting some kind of, you know, what you want to do in life, what your agendas and stuff in the 20s. Then in your 30s, when you reach your 30s, you're supposed to be stabilized. You're supposed to have stability, job, money, life insurance, you know, businesses, whatever. So if you don't have that, you know, then you're lost.

So I had, I got everything taken away from me, you know. Did you have to forfeit? Did you have to forfeit money? They forfeited the money they took for me that day. They didn't find nothing else. But they didn't get anything else. No, they could never get nothing else. They didn't have any property or anything like that?

No. Well, the property I had was under somebody else's name. The places I had was rent was joint study. Right. Because we had a bunch of places we rest our head. Because I'll be this place, I'll be that place, you know. Right. And, you know, the game is just, like I tell you, it's a dirty game.

And I don't recommend nobody gets in it. And then, you know, a lot of guys can't do time. so you don't want to go to jail. So do something else. And then, you know, a lot of these young brothers out here is getting killed and they're listening to these older guys that stay on the wrong. I don't never tell nobody to do this what I did. I don't never tell nobody there's no glorification in it.

You know, I always been like that type of person where, you know, if it's me, that's my judgment is on me. I don't believe like, yo, Johnny, you need to sell drugs. or Johnny, you need to do this. A Johnny, you... Nah, everything ain't for everybody. Yeah. Many may come, but few are chosen.

So the fact that I got caught up in that life, I never would wish that on nobody else. And even with my kids, I would never want them to do what I did. I'll never want them to go through that because as much as people say, it's nothing to do jail. You could do that.

Man, I'm saying, you know, be whining and crying in jail. See, you know, these dudes is funny because I seen them in jail. You know, I go to the shoe and everybody will tell you, nobody can say that I'm whining and crying there. Only time I cried when my mother told me she was dying, I cried then.

Or if I hear something that they're sick and I can't get to them, that would bother me. But as me being the shoe and we locked down and I'm jumping around, I'm sending magazines everybody sells. I'm cursing out the water. Hey, I slept with your wife last night, you know. And that's why they put it. because they poisoned me, and that's how I almost died twice.

Wow. So you got the other guys in there though. These are, you know, you will know some of them, but you might have videotape interview, so they'd be like, you said, damn, I thought they was tough guys, gangsters. They didn't know, man, I don't wonder how long we're going to be in here. I'd be like, yo, are you serious? Your time ain't stopping.

Yeah. Regardless where you do it, it was breakfast of bed for me. Yeah. I ain't got to get up. I ain't getting up for nothing. Count time. All right, fuck you. I ain't getting up. Here's your food. All right. And now, you know, if you don't get up, though, what they do, they play the kid game. When you go to yard, they come in there, take everything out of your cell that you might have got extra bread, that's a cake. You know, so it was, you know, things like that. But as of me, I did time in the right mind where, you know, it, you know, I'm not saying I'm perfect for me because you get stressed out and stuff but I did a time where I

basically handle it myself. I didn't contact the outside world. People would be mad at me. Why? You didn't call. You don't talk. Because it's my time. I ain't called nobody. Oh, gave me some money. I need money. No. Charles Oakley used to make sure I was good.

He said send money to me. He used to, um, if I need any, anything done because, you know, he tried to come get Michael Jordan come visit me in Atlanta, but Mike said, I ain't going in there. He, um, he, um, um, when I came home, money at the car wash for me. Yeah. When my mother passed, he flew up, gave me money for that for her. So, you know, those are real friends.

Those are true friends. You can't, you can't, that's why I love Charles Oakley. You can't get guys like that. What happened to the rest of your team, the closest guys, Sue you. What was their fate? Once coming home in 2026. Wow. The young one's home. He's chilling. So nobody got life?

No. Wow. Well, he, the one coming home did, but my testimony got it, made him, made him, he beat the body, no, he beat the, he beat the bodies, lost on the drugs. And then the judge tried to enhance him on the bodies. And you can't do that. That's how he, because he got life first. They took the bodies off. them because they said, if you, the law came out, if you're not convicted of that charge,

you cannot get that sentence. And that's what they did to them. They tried to give them that sentence. So that law changed in the federal sentencing guidelines? Yeah. So you couldn't, you couldn't do that. Like, that's what boy George got sentenced on. So he never got caught with any bodies, but they took into consideration when he was convicted for running a drug enterprise. Yeah. They took the bodies surrounding the case into consideration that pinned it, pinned it on him. That's really interesting. They took that away. That's what they do.

It's a good step, though. But you know, because his codiff and ICE is real close to me. I don't know if you ever met my... Ice is a good brother. He's real close to me. I mean, there's some good brothers out there that need to get their stories told him. And maybe I could get them on the show. There's a Spanish Miss Mom.

You said you did the Black Miss Mom already, right? You did Lou Sims. Lou Sims. All right, he's good. I don't know if you did Ferris. But you got... We'll get into it. Look, we're going to jump over to the Patreon now because we've been going.

But tell us what you've been doing. You've been home about 10 years. It'll be 10 years this year, this October. What does Peter Shoe do now? And let's plug the book and, you know, tell them why they can find you, man. Life is not stopped. You're, you're back. I didn't even know it was going to be 10 years.

You just threw that on me. It's going to be, yeah, man. You're going to have another party. Yeah. Me and you go through one. Yeah. I'm down. So.

I'm down. You said, what, what are you been doing? What do you, do you still promote parties? We had one in the 219. Okay. We had one. Me, my friend Vopo Doop that was locked up with me before. And my man Chris was who those parties and moves.

He does concerts. And Kevin Childs from the Don Devin magazine. We had a party. It was, it was sensation. We had like 2,500 people in there at the casino in Queens. Oh, wow. And they haven't had another one since. And it was real nice.

So we did that. And, you know, I'm doing the movie stuff. Yeah. And the book, the book. Tell people where they can get the book. We put it in the intro, but tell people where they can. My cousin handles the book, so I forget. Just download my name and it was so where the book goes.

Peter's Shoes story. Because I forgot, my cousin, Tevi, he handles the book sales. So he was doing that because he put the book together while I was in jail. I just wrote the stuff and he put it together. So I let him handle all with that. So I know it was on Amazon before it was at all these places, but I don't know where they had now. And if they want directly to order a book,

they could call his number, and he'll send the book to them at his number is 917-328-5295, and ask, tell them they want to copy the book. Now, if they want me to sign it, then he asks it, bring the book to me and I sign it, and then he'll send it to them. Because I get those requests sometimes to sign it. But I don't hardly keep, you know, I'll hardly keep books. Just like my son handles all the PR stuff.

He does, you know. Well, they can look you up, you know, the link will be to your Instagram. So you can DM Peter's shoe on Instagram. The link to the Amazon link will be in the description to go buy the book. And yeah, man, exciting. Yeah, OG Peter's shoe is our business is our business on Instagram. And the real Peter's shoe is me. Okay.

So all the business stuff goes to him. Okay. And then we're on Facebook. We are, we are, we on, um, 24-hour call. We, you know, I'm a people's person, so I get to see everybody. And when I go, when I go out and they want to take pictures of, me, whatever, you know. Because I'm going to give a shout out to all the brothers that stay in my corner. And like, and that's guys like Jeter Kiss and, and, um, um, um, um, um, um, nyes and all the rappers,

L.L. Koojee, because L.L. Koojee, in the summer, put my name in this record and his first hit, single, The Force. You hear my name in that. And somebody just put my name in their record, too, and their tracks. But they, you know, they keep me relevant. So they always keep my name rotating on a song or a t-shirt, like, guys make t-shirts, they'll put P. the shoe guy, fish, pistol, pee. You know, and,

you know, I find that, you know, heartwarming. Even I don't want the people to remember me for that. I want the people

remember me for the good things I do. You know, so there's a whole bunch of good things I did and a whole bunch of people that are helped. Well,

let's talk about that on the Patreon. Patreon.com slash the Connect show. I've been trying to do this episode for a long time. We finally made it happen. It was an honor

to sit down with you, man. It really was. I mean, they really don't make cats like you anymore. I know they say that about everybody, but Mr. Shoe, Mr. Peter Shoe, you've come a long way, sir. Hey. I really appreciate it, man.

You know what? I remember a couple years ago when we was trying to put this together, and you told me, he said, you said me, you said, don't worry, I'm going to get you on this. We had to, we had to get some things right on our end. But, yeah, dude, now we're here in New York. And it's, like I said, when my, when, when my son found out

because I couldn't remember it. I had you confused with somebody else and when he said Johnny Mitchell, I said Johnny Mitchell, I know that name, I know that name. He said, Johnny Mitchell, he's like just as big as Vlad TV.

Both of them is like, you know, and we did Blad TV, so I said, and then they turned on me, I said, Johnny, that said, okay, and it came to my brain and I was like, oh, because, you know, I have so many people coming at me. I have some, you know,

people that do. did time with, they'd be like, Peter, you don't remember me? I said, nope. Oh, they'll say, you don't remember Joe? That was in the, that's no. Because so many people I corresponded with over the years. And even now when I'm home, it's like, my son got to remind me who this is because I don't remember a lot of people.

And then, you know, we got the celebrities we got to remember. We got the ballplay, because we go to the big three all the time. Shout out to Ice Cube and them and shout out to Voice White. And shout out to Dime magazine. These are all the people, they support me. All these people support me. So I like to support them to all the rappers, all the DJs, you know, all the people that just got, all the, you know, these people were still my basketball shirts, taking no prisoners, you know,

from the Rutgers that had teams in. They still got them shirts and then send me pictures of the shit. And, you know, it's just. You're a New York legend, man. And I love this city and I love the history of it. I love the history of the game. I do, even though it's, you know, it involves selling drugs and some bad things. But I don't care.

I'm still, I'm still fascinated by it. And you are like the leader of that. So you were chosen. That's what's interesting. You said many will come fewer chosen, but you kind of were chosen. And you've, you've worn this burden to the best of your ability. So to me, to me, any boss. Or anybody that, because people say I'm the greatest of all time and stuff like that.

But anybody that didn't cooperate to me should be on that list. And I'm talking about, you know, that's a lie because a lot of them has passed away. And, you know, you're talking about like Guy Fisher deserves his props. Prince of them deserves this. It's a whole Supreme team. Ronnie Bump. I don't know you heard of Rani Bump. That's another giant.

I mean, you got so many people, boy, George and them, ice and them, Lynch mom, my dispennish, linch mom, those are like my family, they deserve all. You know, there's a lot of people out there, and that's why I tell people, you know, I know people would say, oh, why you ain't do Peter's Shoes movie yet, right? And I'm not going to say that. I don't advocate for myself. My son do, but I don't. You know why?

I say, all right, you don't want to do nothing for Petershue, but you got a lot of dudes out here that deserves a movie. that didn't tell. You're doing all these rap movies, you know, uh, paid them for, uh,

Goodfellas, uh, Sammy the Bull joint, uh, Frank Lucas joint. All these dudes, do a real person. Do somebody that never told.

Do somebody, do somebody that went through the trenches and, and held up. And they, John Fisher did 30-something years. Prince did 30-something years. You got a lot of dudes, George is up there now.

Ice, you know, my 20-something years. That's why I don't, that's why I don't advocate for myself. I want to see my movie out because I crossed over. And there's a lot of things that we didn't even talk about that would be in that movie. We're going to get to it on the Patreon. That's what we're going to do. We're going to talk about that, all that stuff on the bonus that these cats got to pay for. But when do we do that?

We're going to click the cameras off, stretch, and then get into it. Oh, we're doing that today? Yeah, we're doing that today. I got to go, I got to jet out tomorrow. man. So we're doing, I got you here. So you're, you're captive. Peter Shue, check out, go follow him on Instagram, go get the book. And, and just, just stay up with him, man. DM him. And, you know, you're, you're a good man. You're a good man, Peter Shue. And don't forget, not connect. Get on that, get on Johnny, Johnny's joint, Johnny Mitch's joint. Hot is join out here. Uh, thanks, guys. Up his joint from, up his joint for 1.3 to 3, the

100 million. Let's get up to 300 million. So Johnny can call me and give me a check. That's it, man. That's it. All right, you guys, we'll see you over on the Patreon. Mr. Peter Shue. Thanks again, guys.

Take care. Peace.