The Connect- with Johnny Mitchell - Is Trump Covering Up Melania’s Connection To Jeffrey Epstein?

Episode Date: September 9, 2026

Donald Trump once appeared unusually willing to confront the Jeffrey Epstein story. According to Julian Dorey, Trump reportedly cooperated with an attorney representing Epstein victims, publicly urged people to investigate Epstein and his powerful connections, and later campaigned alongside calls for greater transparency. So what changed? In this episode, Julian Dorey joins for a deep dive into Trump’s history with Epstein, the fight over the unreleased files, Elon Musk’s explosive claim that Trump appears in them, and reports suggesting Trump and Epstein were closer than casual acquaintances. They also examine why millions of pages have allegedly remained unreleased or heavily redacted, reports of senior administration officials discussing the Epstein fallout in the Situation Room, Thomas Massie publicly naming figures connected to the case, and Dorey’s belief that major Epstein developments have repeatedly landed during low-attention news cycles. The conversation eventually turns to Dorey’s most controversial theory about what Trump could be trying to protect—a theory he repeatedly emphasizes is speculation, not proven fact. If Trump was once willing to help expose Epstein, why does Dorey believe his behavior changed? This episode follows the timeline, the contradictions, the powerful names, and the unanswered questions surrounding one of the most controversial stories in American politics. Go Support Julian! YouTube: @JulianDorey Clips Page: @juliandoreyclips Podcast: @JulianDoreyDaily IG: https://www.instagram.com/julianddorey X: https://x.com/juliandorey Join The Patreon For Bonus Content! https://www.patreon.com/theconnectshow 0:00 Intro – What Is Trump Hiding in the Epstein Files? 5:30 Why Julian Dorey Became Obsessed With Epstein 11:45 Epstein’s Role as a Powerful “Fixer” 17:23 Epstein, Gaza, Evil & Christianity 23:05 Trump’s History With Jeffrey Epstein 30:04 Trump Accusations & the Melania Theory 35:06 Allegations About Melania’s Past 40:19 Was Trump Distancing Himself From Epstein? 45:24 Why Are 3 Million Pages Still Unreleased? 50:24 Pam Bondi, Todd Blanche & the Situation Room 56:41 The Game of Thrones Comparison to Trump 1:03:42 Epstein Stories & Suspicious News Cycles 1:10:24 Trump’s Collapse as a Master Marketer 1:17:20 The Biggest Names Connected to Epstein 1:24:53 Epstein, Intelligence Agencies & Mossad 1:30:00 The David Rockefeller Story 1:34:44 Blackmail, Politicians & the Epstein Network 1:39:00 Why Aren’t Epstein’s Victims Being Heard? 1:45:40 Could Congress Force the Files to Be Released? 1:50:28 Escaping the Republican vs. Democrat Divide 1:56:21 Julian Dorey’s Final Thoughts & Outro Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Spotify advertising connects you with an audience that's engaged and ready to discover your brand. Launch a campaign with Spotify Ads Manager. This is the most insane thing that I have ever personally come across. It was a case that had me taken from the jump. When it comes to Trump, is this how an innocent man talks? They don't go out of their way to suddenly claim something's a Democratic hoax after they made a big deal out of it, where he said, you need to look into that Epstein guy. You look into that island, that island's a big problem.

He has mentioned extensively in the files. We have it on the record. He had a relationship with Epstein dating back to at least 1992. I think it has to do with Melania. So what are you guilty up? It's been nearly two years since Donald Trump retook the White House, promising to fully release the unredacted Epstein files. Obviously, that hasn't happened.

Most of the files that have been released are heavily redacted, and there's 3 million more pages that acting Attorney General Todd Blanche flat out refuses to release, despite a law that was passed in Congress earlier this summer. And the million dollar question is, why? What is Trump hiding? My guest, Julian Dory, is obsessed with the Epstein Files. He's done deep dives about it on his podcast for years. And he believes the answer might be simpler than we think.

Ladies and gentlemen, prepare to be blown away. It's the great Julian Dory right here on The Connect with Johnny Mitchell. Julian it's great to see you buddy Johnny Mitchell great to see you my friend don't you dare show up to my

podcast with sleeves on don't you dare don't you dare don't you dare show a little bit of respect yeah it's true it's true listen I'm pretty consistent

across the board that's fair man it's like you're you're showing no respect for this art form Listen, I think what made podcast magical, not to get like a little gay right here out of the gate, but like what made it really magic at the beginning that built the whole thing was that it was such a laid back kind of people not trying in the sense of like trying to have a bunch of people around in headsets and be the whole mainstream medium machine. It was just like two dudes talking on the porch, that kind of thing.

And for me, that's always how I've kept it since day one. And, you know, sometimes I do with fashion too, but, you know, I don't think of personally. No, you're right. Like, that's, that was the Rogan effect where there's no editing. It's raw. Yeah. They're taking breaks. They're going off into non-sequiters.

And then now you have, like, diary of a CEO that looks like a CNN newsroom, you know, and he's having, it's, the powers that be are now, using podcasters to run cover, to run propaganda, right? Yeah, I've always said this. I think especially when you're covering any real stories, no matter who you are, whether you're you're you, you're me, you're Stephen Bartlett, Chris Williamson, go down the list. There's a scale, and it's called the Useful Idiot Scale. We are all on it.

At some point, we are all used as Useful Idiot, hopefully without us knowing it before we actually do it and fuck up, right? And it's just a matter of trying to be lower on that scale. And, you know, it's different strokes, different folks. People do it in different styles. I think I think that's cool. I'm fine with that. But like for me, what worked was like I walk in here and it's the same as when I was outside this room. And if I don't do it like that, it's not good. So that's just what I do. Yeah. For sure. So, I mean, there's so much going on. The regime. is throwing so much at us to confuse us and and overwhelm us, right, that the Epstein files have basically kind of taken a backseat in a lot of people's minds, right? Including myself. Right. You know,

after the Iran War started, which is probably connected to the stonewalling of the release of the Epstein files, to the economy, to the treasury market, right, which is, the bond market, which is starting to flash red. All of these things, right? Everything that Trump says, I think most people now who voted for him, most reasonable people are like, yeah, I got got. I bought the, you know, I bought the course. I bought the course and it turns out he was selling snake oil, you know, myself included, right? Like I rolled the dice on voting for him and it was pretty obvious from the beginning that I crapped out. You know, the minute that I saw that he had assigned Marco Rubio to be Secretary of State,

I was like, okay, same old soup, right? Same old neocon, Warhawks. But speaking of useful idiots, I mean, there are certainly some people that watch my show, you know, like I saw somebody commented, they called me a Democrat. I was like, oh, sir, a Democrat. There's nothing you could tell a guy like that. You know what I'm saying? There's nothing.

But we're going to try because there are still some people. There are still some people defending everything that this guy does. And I think the Epstein files, the work that you've done on your show, I mean, you've covered it basically from the beginning of last year all the way up till now. It's like somebody, it's. And why is that? Like, do you, are you specifically taken? Like, is there something, yeah, like, what is your, it's almost like a passion project of yours?

Like, you're doing independent research, you're bringing in journalists that have done deep dives into the files and the, you know, the scandals surrounding it. You've had experts in. Like, what is this? What about the files that keeps you motivated to keep putting it out there? So a few things. Number one, I've always covered it intermittently throughout the life period in my podcast. The difference is until the file started coming out and there was so much noise on it last year, I'd say.

You couldn't even put the word Epstein in your title or forget demonetized. No one's ever going to see the video. So we were never able to title stuff or really thumbnail stuff until sometime in 2025 with that. But I would, you know, I'd do these three hour episodes. So we'd sneak a half hour in here and there. And it was a case that had me taken from the jump because I was like, this is the most insane thing that I have ever personally come across. I do view it as the biggest scandal in modern world history.

I think if you start to go biggest scandal in world history, we could probably look at some other things that have happened over the last thousand, two thousand years that were pretty crazy and maybe comparable. But it is dark. It is awful. it is way deeper than even all like the horrible sex trafficking and rape and pedophilia and all that, which we could all agree, that's the worst thing ever right there. But like this is a guy who was doing international arms deals.

He was funneling money. He was a money hunter for, you know, secret families and these bases around the world of people that we're not supposed to know about or talk about. He was a guy who was negotiating deals with governments. He was a dude who was above, who was above the diplomat class for sure. and above the political class in general. And I've said this a bunch of times now, and I don't think I'll stop saying it

because it's just so perfect. But when Tucker Carlson came out with that idea of once he looked at the files that came out in January and was like, this is a supra government. I never knew it was like this. The way he defined it was, we thought the top level was like the main world leaders. They're powerful.

They still have power. But like, they're the third layer. And there's two layers above them. The top layer are these people that you never hear about who are in total control, all the different types of families, whether it be the Rockefellers, the fucking Rothschilds, banking families you've never heard of that apparently span all kinds of countries from China to Western Europe. You know, all these people that are just quietly in the background that have wealth that is not even on paper for us to evaluate anywhere. They're really the top class. But in between them, there's a fixer class. and those are the people who go out and, you know,

crack some eggs to make an omelet when you need it done. And they're also very wealthy and powerful people as well, but they report to the top class while talking to the class below that. And that would be where Epstein is. And so what I likened it to, I took it a step farther. And I said, holy shit, Jeffrey Epstein's Mike Ermintrault. If you ever watch Breaking Bad, right, Walt thought he was in charge. He thought he was God.

He thought he was him. And he was important because Walt could make the product. He was this brilliant chemist and obviously was printing money for the cartel, if you will. And Mike Ermentrout was the dude who rolled in in a Lincoln Town car. And while Walt complained to him and bitched and moan for half hour, he'd sit there and take it. And then when he finally got sick of it, he'd bitch slap him and remind him who daddy was. And then he'd go home to his daddy, which was John Carlo Esposito's character and be like, hey, here's what we got.

And that's really the guy in charge. It's behind the Pollo Loco or General Pollo's chicken, whatever the hell. called. And I think that's the way the world is really set up just from a 30,000 foot view. The exact details of that and how that works and what the fucking meetings look like. I couldn't tell you. I wish I could. But maybe we'll start to find that out because the facade has now been taken away. And people around the world, or at least even if people are moving on from stuff and we can talk about that because I have a lot of thoughts on that too, you know, people have at least woken up to like, you know, this whole system isn't really what they told us it was. And that's,

that's at least a positive start. I will say that. Yeah. And I think that's what angers people so much is really not just the sex trafficking, which is awful, of course, but it's the fact that their whole reality of how they thought the world was set up in an orderly, basically law-abiding fashion was just shattered. Right. It was just shattered by the reality that we're, essentially, the world is moved like a chess game by a cabal of bankers who are not, who are not accountable to anybody, obviously, right? Right. And a lot of people who have covered, a lot of financial guys who have covered things from, you know, the Iran War to to what's going on in Israel, have been.

basically argue what you're arguing is that it's actually, it's not nation states, but bankers who are the top class of rulers, if you will, the financial industrial complex. And that moves the military industrial complex when they wanted to be moved. It, of course, moves the lobbies that pay off the politicians. So, yeah, that makes sense. So Jeffrey Epstein is a fixer in this game. and he's the class of fixers. Can you talk about any other fixers?

Can you give an example of another fixer in this kind of class? That's the trillion dollar question. Here's what I like in Epstein, too. You ever seen those videos on social media where like, you know, it's two dudes out in a village like pulling on a weed on a side of a dam? And like they keep pulling and it's really deeply rooted and they're pulling in, they're pulling,

and there's a trickle of water. coming out and as they keep pulling the trickles just a little bigger and then eventually they go like and the water goes like out like that. Jeffrey Epstein's that weed because he's one of many. Now, and this is pure spec right here, I don't know, was he the most flamboyant and out in the open with these types of things as people in that class were and that's really what led to his undoing? Maybe, sure. But like the idea that there aren't a whole class of people, including some people, like Kaiser Soze who are maybe right in your face that you see and you just don't realize

and I don't realize at all. Don't even suspect it that like they're doing these things. Of course that has to exist. It's just it's the law of averages. I mean, just look at the emails and the millions of them and the people this guy was connected to. You think he's like the only one? You know, that that's crazy to me.

I'll bet there were some who were way better at the most important job, which was staying out of the fucking headlines. And the best spies are the ones that you never knew were a spy. And, you know, I remember, it's interesting to look back on it now because, like, you know, Andrew Bustamante, I've said forever, like, nice guy, definitely still in the CIA. And I bust his balls about that. But, you know, he'll deny it, but that's definitely true. That said, I will say off camera over the years, off camera. He said some interesting things.

And one thing that he did say that wasn't, you know, like an off-the-record conversation or something like that was I was filming something for Discovery Channel with him the morning the Iran War broke out. And we got in there. We were out on the West Coast. So it was like pretty early. And I was like, dude, what the fuck? And he's like, I know, man. It's fucking crazy. He was like very resigned to it.

It's just like it's bad move. It's fucking crazy. And I forget how it came up. we were talking about the files and in some context. And he said, yeah, there's two extremely important days at CIA. The day you figure out how the world really works, and then the day you figure out, they teach you how you need to therefore operate inside of it. And he goes, that first day is a really hard day.

And I said, why specifically? And he's like, well, because it works how you think it works. Like, there's very powerful families and they got a lot of money. And, you know, it just kind of trickles down from there. You do the math. And if I may say, I think it was a very honest moment from him. But he specifically used the word like Rockefellers because that's what it was. I brought up that in context of something John Kyriaku, who does not see eye to eye band at all brought up.

And he was like, no, no, like that's, he's like, John's cook in there. That's, yeah, he's on to something. You know, and so you hear this on the scale of like boostamante to Kyriaku, like kind of the opposite scales there. And you're like, hmm, maybe there. is a little pattern there for sure. Well, I think Bustamante is just accepts it, right? This is how the world is. And Kirooku's like, we shouldn't accept this. We have to fight back. And that's how most people feel. Like for myself personally, I can't, I can't accept a world like that. Even if that is the world, I have to talk about it as a way to resist or even being conscious of it

to me is resistance, you know? Yes. I can't or else, you know, I might as well just go, you know, go to a field somewhere and lay down and die. Like, I don't want to be a slave. And, you know, I think most people just kind of resign themselves to consuming slop, whether it be through social media or through entertainment, the food they consume. and yeah, they just kind of walk around

in the banal of their day-to-day lives. And so what the files has done is basically like you either, it's the matrix, dude, you either fucking take the blue pill or the red pill and then you, like it's a burden to walk around knowing all of this stuff, but I prefer it. I prefer it to walking around like a cow and a field chewing on some grass.

Something, and I hear you on all that. those points and there's a lot that I could say I operate kind of the same way as you do. There is just something about this one that offended my spirit so much from the jump because it involves kids and using them as pawns. That's the really sick part. Like they got off on it because they're sick people obviously. But like they use them as a means of entry. And I just, I mean, I guess I'm really great.

grateful for this, but that does not even process to me. Like that, I don't know how you get there. I don't know how you become that. I'm really glad I don't know how. But the fact that there are really powerful people who not only do, but they take great joy in that, yeah, I think that's a problem. We should all not let go for sure. Yeah. Well, it's led me back to Christianity. Actually, to be honest, it's what's gone on in Palestine and in Gaza has actually led me back to Christianity because the only way I can look at like the slaughter, the rejoicing of the slaughter of children. Tens and tens of thousands of innocent children. The only way that I can conceptualize that in my mind is, oh, there's real evil that's battling the good, which is God. You know what I mean?

This is, if you go back biblically, the Pharisees are the ones who turned in Jesus to the Romans to be crucified, right? And that, that dark energy that Satan persists to this day. So perhaps, you know, like that was my Epstein. That was my Epstein files is what's gone on in Gaza, but I'm just too lazy to look at it to the Epstein files. That's why I chose Gaza because it is thick, it's dense. There's so many moving parts. So basically what I want to do today, because we don't have time in one interview to unravel all of the different connections, right?

What I want to do basically is have you walk us through the Trump administration, which one of the key running points during his campaign in 24 was we're going to release the files, right? I basically want to walk through his personal involvement in it. talking about in the files, what we know where we are today with the release of them and why and how they've been able to simply ignore court orders and not release the files, right? So just in real, you know, kind of just in real like general terms or real, I guess, like, you know, low level from what we know in the news, like what the, what the, what?

what the fuck is happening, how 19 months later do we still not know, you know, only a fraction of what is actually in those files? Okay, let's start with the third part, which is why they have illegally not released the remaining files, which is estimated to be around 3 million that we're never going to see. And also, they've redacted things in the first release that they legally were not supposed to react. The fact that that is not the number one story on the news, and it's not like these giant calls for like impeachment or whatever kind of tells you all you need to know

which is that it's a systemic problem because if this were 2018 and it were some other issue and Trump term one he would have been impeached fucking before any of this even happened I mean they would have the whole mainstream media machine would have turned on him and it's the mainstream media machine

still hates him but like it's a quiet apathetic hate that's what it's been for this administration it's not this active visceral hate to be clear I don't think either is correct. I think you got to report the news and you shouldn't hate or love anyone when you're in that position. It's supposed to be the fourth estate, stay the fuck away, call it on balls and strikes. They don't do that. But like, that's kind of interesting. And maybe it's interesting because there's

a lot to hide across a lot of different people, regardless of their political affiliations. Yeah, I would say that's pretty important. And there's a lot of different ties we can make to that, including some of these quiet families that fund everything all the way down, trickled down, many layers below to what includes the mainstream media as well. And one thing I would say, just to go back for one second, when you were saying banking families around the world, yes. But there's also like a lot of aristocracy type families, too. Like the Rockefellers technically aren't a banking family. They're just an unbelievable, powerful business powerhouse family. You know what I mean? Like those families are real as well. It's just titans of the elite class of money, you know, and don't ignore some of the oil guys in the Middle East either. I mean, God knows what the fuck allegiance is they even have. what they claim publicly and what they do privately are two very, very different things. So I don't know. But when it comes to Trump, so a couple things, a bunch of things here.

Like, I have a whole odyssey with this. First of all, if you got any honest defense attorney, any honest defense attorney to talk with you on record or let's say off record and say you just played them tape of Donald Trump talking about the Epstein files since he got into all. office and say, is this how an innocent man talks? No one's going to say yes. They're all going to say no. Innocent men don't talk like that. They don't go out of their way to suddenly claim something's a Democratic hoax after they made a big deal out of it, including their son was tweeting about it every fucking day until one day he kind of stopped. You know what I mean? Like literally every day.

Literally every day. J.D. Vance too. J.D. Vance was like on every podcast in his hokey little fucking way Yeah. Yep. Yep. So that kind of turn was nuts. And like I said at the beginning, I don't know if we were on air yet, but like you were here that Friday, like June 5th or June 6, 2025, when that tweet from Elon came out, when the breakup happened and he goes, Donald Trump is in the Epstein follows, do with that what you will or whatever. We just all looked at each other. Like, what the fuck? You know, like, so there's a there there.

Now, in all the years I looked at this case, Donald Trump, this is where it started for a long time. This is pre-Eptstein file release. So we're going to go full timeline here so that you get the context of where my head was. Donald Trump was one of the very few guys from a powerful position who actually had good green check marks on their record with Epstein if they knew him. Right. So it's already bad if you know him and you're like, what the fuck? But whenever you saw someone that knew him, there were always really, like, the list started with really cringy things or things that go, that looks like something could be there. Whereas Trump was one of those guys that it was reported they had a falling out years ago in like 2004.

Now, it was reported as Epstein came on to a towel hand who was underage at Mara Lago and Trump banned him for life. Later, Brad Edwards, I believe, the attorney for the victim said on Tara Palmeri's podcast, if I'm remembering this correctly. he said that it was actually because of a real estate deal that went bad and they're both kind of narcissists and Trump got it. Epstein didn't and they had a falling out over that. So it's a little foggy what that was. But nonetheless, Brad Edwards said when he contacted back in 06, 07 when that initial case was going on and he was representing the victims and there were many of them obviously coming out of the woodwork, he contacted all the powerful people. Anyone close to Epstein. He contacted friends of his who weren't even powerful.

No one would talk to him. The only guy who talked to him was Donald Trump. Donald Trump, like, invited him over. He talked about it. They sat around a pool. I can't remember where it was. It was somewhere in Palm Beach. I don't know if it was Mar-a-Lago.

And Trump told him, oh, yeah. He's like, look, you know, it's one thing to like women. It's a whole other thing to like underage women. And Jeffrey Epstein definitely did that. And, you know, I don't like him. And I think that's where he told him it was a real estate deal. So that was coming from Trump, if I remember correctly, check with Tara on that one.

But, like, you know, that's, what made it go bad and that this is really bad and he should be investigated. And Brad Edwards was like, wow, you know, no one else did that. So that's a green checkmark. And then I remember that summer 2015 when Trump was first running and was like a hurricane on the scene and just doing media every day. And it was so entertaining, you know, because it's like this crazy fucking New York Celebrity Real Estate guy is actually running for president. And no one at that point was like, you know, thinking he was actually going to go. go all the way and win. I actually did pretty early. I was like, I can see why this would work.

But it was because of how openly transparent, even when it was not in the brightest way either, that he would be. It was like, you took the best and took the worst. And people were like, you know what, fucking. At least I know where he stands. And so that ended up turning out. But like, I remember it was these guys, Mark Halperin and John Heilman, before they even had that documentary like live series called The Circus where they went around and tracked the campaigns, which I think they did in the 2016 and I want to say 2020 cycle. You know, they always had the show on Bloomberg that was talking about like politics. And so they had done an interview with him with Trump at like a conference. And after the interview was over, Trump, I guess, was still

miced up and he came around like the staircase and leaned into the set like on air. And they were like, this is just fucking insane. And he was like, you know, need to look into that Epstein guy, Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton got a lot of problems with that island. You look into that island, that island's a big problem. You got it. No one's talking about. So like, again, this is like mass projection, if that's the case, because I'm like, this guy's really on that. Then Epstein dies when Trump's president and it's in his custody, but he's the one at least talking about it. And we knew about the Clinton's involvement and everything and the Democrats were real quiet about that. But he's at least

talking about. It's all weird and obviously the guy didn't commit suicide and that is worth another look and, you know, we could go around the rabbit hole of Donald Barr and all that. But like, you know, there were at least things that you could be like, okay. And then when the files came out, there's these claims about Trump. And I've looked through the ones that I've seen. Now, if people out there have some that I haven't seen them, of course, I want to look at that. But any claims that were made about Trump were one of two things. They were either a quick claim that was made and it was paid out after Epstein's death by the estate that just wanted the fucking fire sale handle everything and Donald Trump

has no say in it. And I don't know the legality of how that all works, but like that's how it was reported. Or it will end, it was a claim that emanated after Epstein was dead. And it would be revealed through FBI agent emails to each other or actual FBI reports and stuff like that. And there was one thing that Nancy May said right when the files came out, and she was someone that to her credit, at least on this issue, she was very firm in trying to get it released, which actually ended up costing her politically big time. And she was true and through about that as far as I can tell throughout the process. So I do appreciate that.

But she did say right when they came out, she's like, all right, everyone, start looking through them. One thing to note is that claims made especially after 2019, after he was dead. about anybody, whether it's someone you like or someone you don't, do need to be taken with a grain of salt because the story got incredibly mainstreamed and we know how this stuff works and it's unfortunate. Like, you remember when the Me Too movement happened in 2017, of course there were women that came out who had been afraid to who had been assaulted and had been raped and that was horrible and it was great that something could start that could bring that about.

The problem is it started a dogpiling effect. where fucking anyone and everyone was like, oh shit, quick payday. And then they'd make accusations about people that weren't true and ruin it for the real victims. Okay. So the same with the Epstein files. Anything after Epstein is dead might be controlled, what do you call it? Not controlled opposition. It might be, could be a plant, somebody that wants to destroy Donald Trump.

Yeah, not even a plant. Just someone crazy or looking for a payday. And by the way, that does not mean that none of the claims made after 2019, that all of them are not real. That's what sucks about this. Some of them statistically are going to be real. It's just some of them get to such crazy levels where it's like, I read through it and I go the probabilities of like Jeffrey Epstein. I'm making one up right now. Jeffrey Epstein, fucking Oprah Winfrey and Alex Trebek being in a room, you know, doing a satanic rich.

on 34th Street while the Knicks played next door and Donald Trump zoomed in. It's like, all right, this probably, even for them, that probably didn't work out, you know? Oh, it's so creative, though. Whoever made that up, it's so creative. It's like an SNL sketch, dude. Hey, I know you have an email too. And I know you get some interesting emails. So I've seen them.

I've seen them. So why? So pre-19 claims. I just heard about one the other day. It was alleged that an underage boy stuck, I think it was a golf club or some big rod inside Trump's ass. Is that not, does that not have any veracity? I really hope that's true. Did you hear about this?

I'm trying not to laugh at that. No, it's hilarious. It's objectively, I don't want to say objectively funny, but it is subjectively funny. Yeah, I don't know. I'd have to go look at it. I don't know anything about that one. I also, I've never found any evidence that Trump's into members of his own sex. That is one thing about it. I've never seen that. I mean, I'm open to anything. But like, here's where it gets interesting, though, John. And this is why I take a huge issue with Trump now. his behavior has been very guilty. So what are you guilty up? And I'm open to anything. I really hope. I genuinely do that he's not one of them.

And like the sitting president isn't a petto. Obviously we've probably had that before. But like there's just something about that that would just be like, God damn. Like the fucking meme where the guy's taking his headphones off, just check me out of here. But what I actually think, if you held a gun to my head and said, hey, you got to take a stab at this. is it? I think it has to do with Melania. And there's a few things right here. So we saw Melania come out and give that press conference in April out of nowhere. And allegedly, Trump didn't even know she was going to give it. And she gets up there for six minutes and she goes,

the victims need to be heard. And the Congress needs to help the Epstein. And people are like, what the fuck? And then you realize that earlier that week, Amanda Ungaro, Zamoli's ex and the mother of his child who he had ice arrest and then she was later deported more on her in a minute i had a chance to talk to her for an hour but like she was coming out and saying i know where some bodies are buried milania you fucking bitch like all this stuff and one of her bones to pick with milania is that when she got in a jam after palo pulled a big move on her she called milania and milani didn't do anything about it and she was like this bitch let me tell you something about amanda that is not a woman of

I would want to piss off. All right, this is a tough, tough lady, like, down to it, 100%. But, you know, those two things were, the word definitely is strong, but the likelihood of the correlation there of Amanda going public and then Melania giving that statement is very high. And when I talked to Amanda, and I talked about this on a show, I got her permission afterwards to report back the thing she said. When I talked to her, one thing that was very credible about her is that there were times where she had every incentive to make a claim and she didn't make the claim, meaning like she would say, I would say, do you know exactly who introduced Melania to Donald Trump? And she's like, no, I have suspicions, but I don't know for sure. And she told a story about how one of the

first times with Trump, she's standing there with Trump and Palo back in like, oh, and Paolo goes, Donald, Donald, tell Amanda who introduced you to Melania. And he goes, oh, I was Paolo. And she's like, I was not buying it. But like, she wouldn't say Epstein introduced him to Melania, right? If it came out, even if it were innocent, and there's not a lot of innocent stuff around Epstein, but let's just play this out for a second. If it ever came out that Jeffrey Epstein, maybe in just a regular, you know, not rape, involved New York socialite setting, happened to introduce the current president to his current

wife back in the day. The truth wouldn't even matter. It's the biggest scandal in modern history. It's over. And so I have always thought, I shouldn't say always, this year I have really honed in on, I think it has something to do with Melania. And now I just had Andrew Lowney in here that the British journalist who's done a lot of great work on this and many things over the years. And that episode's going to come out in a couple weeks. But he was, for what it's worth, he talked about this on air, so I could say this. He was in, when he was over here in America visiting, he went out to the Hamptons, had some really interesting happen out there, really interesting things happened out there.

One of them was he was talking with a high-level United States diplomat who said, oh yeah, it's a known fact. And again, this is pure speculation, Your Honor. If you're watching this, I'm just reporting what was said in a conversation. I don't know if this is true. I have no proof to say this, but that is what it is. Anyway, he said that it was a known fact around Washington, D.C., that Melania Trump had been a lady of the night in Milan prior to coming to America.

And so this hit a little red alarm in my head because when I spoke with Amanda, And that was a couple weeks before I talked to Andrew. One of the things he said to me, or she said to me, was that one odd thing about Melania when she came to America as a model is that, and she went like this, she had money. And she's like, listen, when a model comes here, you know, it's not like we're destitute, in most cases, at least. A lot of times they're trafficked here and stuff like that. That's a whole other issue right there. But like they come here and, you know, they have an apartment to stay at. Bologna had nice shit.

Had a nice apartment. And what Amanda then said after doing this was that I don't know. I know nothing about where that came from. You know, maybe she had someone back in her. And she was referring to like a man, like a sugar daddy kind of thing, which also could be innocent. It's possible. But when you hear like someone very openly tell a journalist who works on this case, and this is a high-level diplomat.

in Hamptons, just telling him that it's a known fact around Washington, D.C., that she was a high-end hooker, allegedly Pierce Beck, in Milan prior to coming to America, and then you kind of tie those two things together with what Amanda said, starting to click. So again, I say to you, if it were revealed in anywhere in the Epstein files that the sitting first lady of the United States had at any point been involved in sex work, biggest scandal of modern history. So is that what it is? I don't know. Is that the biggest scandal that she was a hooker, though? I think everybody, like, I know that. I don't pay close attention to stuff, but I know that she, yes, she's from a, you know, Eastern European country.

Many of them become prostitutes and the world of modeling is rubbed right up against the world of high-end escorting. How is that the biggest scandal if she was a prostitute and if Jeffrey Epstein introduced her to Trump? What does she have to do with Jeffrey Epstein? It's optics, dude. We live in a world, and I wish it weren't this way, John. And I say this all the time.

I hate it, but I can't change the rules. We live in a world where how things look matters a lot more than how things actually are. You have to figure out the how things look part, looks part, before you figure out getting across what things are to people. And people couldn't handle that. You and I can sit here and speculate about it, but if we don't have a smoking gun on either of those things, it's just kind of two assholes talking on the internet and saying, he said, she said, which is exactly what we're. doing. But like, if it came out and there were proof that either of those things were true and those things were black and white proven in the Epstein files, yeah, that could explain why he's covering it up, which doesn't excuse it at all, by the way. Also, since he ran on

releasing this stuff. So you think, like, yes, like people. Totally. So you think it could be that simple. He is literally probably, maybe even went to war with Iran. all the way to shouting down journalists who ask him about it, to, you know, all of the things he's doing to not let these files be released could simply be because they contain proof that his wife was a prostitute? I think it's very possible. And I think the second layer to it is I think there could be proof in there that perhaps somehow the relationship was consummated through an introduction from Jeffrey Epstein. That would be the bigger story of the two. They're both huge stories, but they do, they're on brand.

They're on brand because Donald Trump's number one fatal flaws is pride. He can't stand the idea of looking weak in any way to anyone at any time. And the ultimate sign of weakness, like as a man, I can't think of something a lot worse than the most notorious sex trafficker ever known to man. introduce me to my wife who also happened to be a hooker. And that were proven. You think Donald Trump wants to walk through his golf club and, you know, talk to the members about that? Right.

No. No. And it takes away, I mean, you want to talk about losing aura points. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So I think it could be that. Your wife was a fucking work was a, was a pro.

Okay. So do you think that all of everything that the Trump said in the years leading up to the world discovering who Epstein was and his death in 2019, right? Going on camera saying, they need to look into Epstein and his connection with the Clintons and all the way back to 06 where he told that journalist, hey, look into this dude. He's no good. it involves kids, you think that wasn't like the way that the CIA and the Mossad intelligence agencies will say it's basically misinformation, purposeful misinformation to get people like I'm actually involved. I'm in the files, but I'm going to say look into this guy and yeah, I knew him as a way to put me above suspicion.

Right. Projection. Right. projection so you think you think actually he might be innocent of of some of the major accusations in a petto yeah being a peto it's possible but I'm open to him being guilty of that as well because he knew the guy very well I'll give you another example this was actually one one thing I talked about for years that was one red X mark not a green check mark for him which is that Maria Farmer she and her sister I believe her name was Annie

were both victims of Epstein they were both some of the early public ones to talk. If you remember the James Patterson Netflix documentary in 2020, the woman who drew the big picture of like the reptilians, that was Maria Farmer. For years, she would say supporters would always listen to every word she said and they'd be like, oh my God, you're cooking and I'm so sorry this happened to you. Great job exposing it, yada, yada. But then there was one thing she would say and a subset of her supporters suddenly wouldn't be such big supporters. And that was she talked about how she worked the front desk when she was like 19, 20, 21 at Jeffrey Epstein's office in Midtown Manhattan.

And she said this on record, and I can't find the videos of her saying it anymore because it's like off the internet. If someone can find it, please pass that along. But she said on record that Donald Trump would be in there multiple times a week. And there's one specific story she tells where he walked in there, like maybe for the first time or whatever and kind of looked at her and she was of age at the time if we're being fair

but like you know she was young and like kind of looked her up and down and Epstein walked in and said no she's not for you and so you know if you're in there multiple tons a week at the guy's office like you're good friends with him it's like Leon Black when he's like no

we're just business associates bitch you were fucking over his house getting breakfast all the time you know what I mean Like, it just doesn't, you got to call on balls and strikes across the board, regardless of what it is. And I'll call it in both directions. When I see things that are like, well, that's a good sign. Okay, great. When I see things like, well, that's a bad sign, okay, we got to talk about that.

And so I'm open to like it also being the worst thing. I, as an American, I selfishly hope we don't have a president that was involved with that. But I still have not seen the smoking gun on that side of things, whereas I have seen some smoke coming out of a room. and I'm just peering in there trying to find a gun when it comes to his wife. I've seen some serious smoke on that. So the smoke, not the smoking gum, but the smoke certainly has to do with the fact that he's in there. Isn't he mentioned in the files, like more than Jesus.

Jesus is mentioned in the Bible, right? I don't know. I don't know about that, but like he's mentioned, yeah. But haven't people, but isn't it like tens of thousands of times? I don't know the number off the top of my head, but he has mentioned extensively in the files, yes. Okay. Now, some of them are also after he became president, so he's being talked about a lot. But there are a lot of mentions that occur prior to 2015, prior to 2016, before he's ever president.

And again, we have it on the record. He had a relationship with Epstein dating back to at least 1992, at least. Well, yeah, that's back in the early 90s. that's when the famous video footage of them, I think at Mara Lago, right, talking about the, you know, pointing at the group of women and, yeah, kind of being scumbags. The allegation, I think it was a 13-year-old girl. She was, I think, raped and then murdered. She was, she, it was alleged that Trump raped her and then had her killed.

Did you hear about this? I have heard about this one. I believe, if I remember correctly, because there's a bunch of these that are like this. That was another one that was made, if I'm thinking of the right one, that was from an FBI report in like 2021. Okay. So post-19. And that doesn't mean it's not true, to be clear. I'm just saying like you have to, you do have to grade it a little bit after that, which sucks.

It's like the worst thing ever to have to be like, well, who's telling the truth and who's not? talking about victims like the worst shit ever that we know happened like overall we know this stuff happened so it's just like who's the most believable about it and i fucking hate that part of the job and ever having to do it and you know right right okay so uh so let's let's let's work through this really really logically let's let's hang on the milania theory that because that seems to be i don't have the most meat to it, right? That she was a high-end hooker, possibly introduced to her husband,

the now president by Jeffrey Epstein, right? So if that's the case, you've got three million pages of files that were ordered, like they passed a law, pushed through by Massey and Roe Kana of California, right? Thomas Massey, Senator of Kentucky, Rokane, Senator, or representative of California.

They got, they basically passed a law, a special order mandating that the files be released. First of all, tell us what's going on with those. And of those 3 million unreleased, not just redacted, but unreleased pages, why could Bologna, I mean, how deep in those pages could Melania be involved in? Why not just redact those, right?

If you're Trump and all you have to hide is that your wife was a hooker introduced by Epstein, why not just release those other three million pages but have that part about Melania blacked out, redacted? You know what I'm saying? That's also, that also is far from the only thing. I do know what you're saying, but that's the other thing here.

And this is the second layer we should talk about. Yeah, I think, Trump's main driver, pure spec could be that that part would be revealed in there. Like that could be his selfish kind of like self-preservation driver. But there are a lot of other things in there that either would reveal truths that they don't want the public to know. They mean in a whole big machine here, from the bureaucracy all the way up to the people to pay them. Or also even, if I'm going to be fair, could include things that would very easily lead

people to think things that maybe actually aren't true, but of course, we'd all think it's true because we don't trust any of those people as far as we can throw them. So it would be a mix of both, I'm guessing. But the part that is mind-blowing to me is that when they did, and I believe it was what fucking, what was the number? I can't remember the number on the files, but when they did analysis of the 3 million that were released and then the missing parts of that. A ridiculous number of files was specifically missing from 1999 through 2001, which is when a lot of things happen. That's when Melania Trump, that's when Melania Trump came to America. That's when the dot-com boom went bust. That's when 9-11 happened. It's when Clinton was. That's what

flipped over to Bush. It's when Nellie, it's when artist Nelly released country grammar. That's correct. That was really, really important. That was in the, that was in the ashes of losing Biggie and Pock and Rapp was trying to find its way, and Nellie rescued all of us. But there was a lot going on during those times. And one would say that that's a pretty interesting time period to be missing a lot of files

from. So all I can do is speculate and say something's going on there. I don't know what. Could be a lot of things. Could be all. I mean, the possibilities are endless. And so the government, the regime, right? The Trump regime and the cohorts know what's in there.

And they think it's so damning, like causing a revolution damning, whether that had something to do. Epstein had something to do with 9-11 and the, you know, the Israeli Assad and the CIA. connected to something that has to do with them, and they say, we just can't. We just can't. That's right. We cannot allow the people to know about this,

because it's such a huge betrayal. It's literally proof that the American government not only knew about it, but actually had their own citizens murdered in the worst attack in American history so that they could, do X, Y, Z, right? Could make war in the Middle East or whatever.

Could very well be. Could be something like that, for sure. I mean, we, again, we know the kinds of things that happen in those years. And when you see them going out of their way to violate federal law to not release those things, one has to connect the two dots and say there's a there there. And you saw that video of Pam Bondi. So Pam Bondi was the original AG, the one who, on paper, you know, what do you mean on paper?

Well, because I think it's pretty clear from the New York Times report that was based on the situation room tapes getting leaked to them, which that would be like the biggest scandal in modern history if we weren't so inundated in scandals. No one's talking about that. But the New York Times, we have every reason to believe got access to rooms from, got access to the literal tapes from the most sacred room of like situational planning that we know of publicly that exists in this country. where they were all talking in a room about how to deal with a rape scandal, by the way. But that's near the hearing of there. But, you know, it's very clear from those meetings that Todd Blanche is in charge of this stuff. And Pam Bondi was an after. I mean, listen, she was not the brightest bulb. Fucking everybody knew that. I'm of course they knew that back there.

Obviously. But she was just, she was just to me, I think there's tremendous evidence to support the fact that she was just kind of the fall lady, you know. Okay. So even before she stepped down. Even before she stepped down, you think Todd Blanche, who's now the one with the spotlight on him, you think he was the one that was actually the AG. I think it's very clear. I think it's very clear on this case, which was the most important from a PR perspective as well, case for them that he was in charge on it. Like, I just read that New York Times report.

Right. And tell me that that's not the case. and then go play any tape of this lady open in her mouth at any point and tell me that they would have had her be in charge of that. And I just don't see it. Well, I was alluding to that video of her at like a bar or a restaurant with talking to somebody a colleague. And she's like, if they found out what was in these files,

it would cause a revolution. Yeah, yeah. So, but real quick, because what is that New York Times leaked audio? I didn't even have, I didn't even know about this. So this was back in May or early June. Something like that. The New York Times put out this long report where they described the meetings that occurred in the situation room. And I want to say it was June, July, August of 2025.

And these meetings, and they described exactly who was in the room. down to the last name and directly quoted things set in there down to crazy details about these meetings were specifically about dealing with the Epstein fallout. So just start there. All the most important people in the executive branch of the government outside of Donald Trump, who was not in there, but J.D. Vance was, all the heavy hitters were, chief of staff, all of it. They're all gathered in the most important geopolitical, military planning room that we publicly know of that we have to discuss a giant

fucking rape ring and the fallout of it. I mean, already like the optics are like, are you fucking kidding me? Then you get to what's said in there and how they're talking about it. And listen, I wasn't born yesterday. I know everything. It's not just politics. It's corporations. It's all of it.

It's about risk mitigation, damage control. control PR and optics and they're not very good at the optics these days or the PR I might say or any of them. But like that's how they talk. That's what they do. I get it. But like the callousness and complete, I don't know, like ambivalence and almost apathy so many of these people in the room clearly have about this. They are only looking at it as a political obstacle that they need to find a way around or to get the attention off it. and they're not thinking about the gravity of what this means and who this guy was and who he was attached to and who might even be in the room is not working for the right interest right here because they're a descendant of this. I don't know. That's spec. But I'm just saying like it's a meaning of life kind of story where you're like,

wait a minute. Everything I thought might not be what it is. And to them it was just another like, all right, yeah, this is a tough one on the front. page um this is really bullshit all these fucking all these retards talking about this i don't know all the people that fucking voted for them that's how they're talking about these people you know like it was just so oh it was gross like when who was who was do we know who these people were yeah jd vance okay susy wiles uh todd blanche uh the deputy like it's it's like a who's who's who's who of everyone. I don't have it in front of me. I don't want to fuck up some names, but like, the heavy hitters, we're all in there. But that's important that I want, really listen to that point for, you know, the, really the,

I'm talking to now a very small percentage of, you know, boomers and, and people that are so blinded by MAGA. The point you just made is, ugh, these fucking retards talking about it, Middle America, MAGA people, they hate you. They see you. They see you. as an obstacle to, they see democracy and you as an obstacle to their goals. They hate you. Actually, they probably want you dead. That's why they're importing 700,000 tons of poison beef from Argentina. That's why they're ramming through vaccines. That's why they're allowing all of these chemicals, even MAHA, make America healthy again. They just like, you know, they're allowing like these incredibly toxic poisons to be used in fertilizer,

they want you dead. So that's a great point that you just made, like bringing this up is this is how they truly feel. So anyways. I think when you look, there's a lot of comparisons you can make to this. But like if you ever watch Game of Thrones, right? Kaleesi starts off as the innocent to an extent,

you know, from a high class, but a former high class girl who's sold to a husband where her brother's going to try to reclaim the power that they lost. And then very quickly it replaces to she's going to try to reclaim it. And she starts with the smallest horse tribe and spoiler alert here. It ends up all the way through the series to where she gets all the way to like the throne. The thing about her is almost from the beginning, especially once her brother was out of the picture, even in getting him out of the picture. Her one, weakness was that she did want power. She wanted it bad. She was driven by that. In doing so, though, she at least maybe actually was, but worst case scenario pretended to care about the common

man. She was the breaker of change, the person that said no more slavery. She wanted to appeal to the common man and everything because she saw them as human in a way that the elites of all the societies did not. And then she became the very person that she hated by killing. all them at the end. And it is really hard for me to not look at the timeline of Donald Trump from 2015 to now and not see the same fucking thing. Totally. It's the story of man in many ways, the corruptibility of man. You got the Godfather. You got Vito on your wall. The Godfather 1 is about Michael starting out saying, that's my family, Kay. That's not me. to his arc is he is the evil one at the end of Godfather too, right?

Miserable. Miserable and in complete power and control and completely sinful and everything that he didn't want to be. Remember that Dave Chappelle, that's a perfect example. Remember that Dave Chappelle Saturday Night Live opening remarks in November 2022, where he talked about the visual. And this is a guy who even at the time, he was never like a fan of Trump. But he's like, you have to understand why this guy happened. And he talked about the visual of Donald Trump walking out of the room and looking down off the porch at all of us who don't have access to that room and saying, oh, yeah, I've been in that room.

I know how they talk about you. It's fucked up. He was so brazen to admit that he had been in that room, but he at least came out and said, I know it's fucked up. so I'm here to help you. The thing is, he's now walked right back in the room and slammed the door in your face. That's, that's, that's just it. I mean, it's not political. I liken it to this. You know, the Biden administration for four years was a disaster on every front. The guy was dead and not even in charge. I mean, he literally wasn't a lot. You know, God knows who was running the country. It was corruption to a T. Four years of the Biden administration was like someone turning on the water and leaving their house for three years. the four years of what this Trump administration is like someone fucking busting the pipes and leaving the house for three weeks. They're both bad. It's a different kind of bad.

One's passive, one's aggressive. That's what it is. To be honest with you, that is part of the reason that I voted for him. Part of the reason was that I heard Jimmy Dors say this. It was specifically about the genocide in Gaza. He's like, I can't reward the Biden administration that the Democrats. in general, I cannot reward them with my vote, because that is my red line, is funding and running political cover for an extermination of a people. That was part of the reason, but also is because

I know this country, deep down, has to pay for its sins. It's gone too far, and you see that with the debt. It's really, economists will all talk about, and you know, I believe in Bitcoin, and I believe in getting rid of the fiat-based system, but the spending of money and the debt is what brought down the Romans, it's what brought down the British, it's what is bringing us down. And I knew Trump would accelerate that.

I knew his chaos, like, we got to just get to it. The country has to fall to its knees before it can rebuild itself. And so part of me was like, I know this guy is going to be chaos, and it will bring us closer to, our reckoning, our rock bottom. The rapture. It does

sound, it does kind of sound Armageddon in many ways. You'll be in Vancouver though. It's cool. Yeah, I'll be in Vancouver, BC. So I'm out of the blast radius, dude. Okay, so if we go off the supposition that, just, just to take the only real smoking gun that we may have, which is that Trump is, doesn't want it leaked,

that his wife was a hooker and had ties to Jeffrey Epstein, maybe was funneling some of these underage girls to Epstein. Do you think that's a possibility that she was connected to him in the way that Galane Maxwell was? Oh, that's interesting. I have never thought about that before. I've never seen any proof of that. I've never seen a claim of that.

But that's an interesting. Well, think about it. She's from Eastern. She's from Eastern Europe. she's involved in the modeling world. She's already older by the time that these allegations come out. So she's now the, she was maybe trafficked herself, and now she is a trafficker. As many, in sex rings, we know that happens.

Like the one girl who survives, who sold into prostitution, into, you know, sexual slavery, becomes now, you know, working for the people that got her into this position. So maybe, maybe there's a. connection there. So just going off that supposition is from everything that you've read and all the people you've talked to, do you think the war in Iran had a part to play? Do you think the Epstein Files had a part to play in starting the war with Iran? Or was that all, you know, Israel seeing the writing on the wall? that they'd lost the American public, right?

And that Trump is their last chance to expand the Greater Israel Project while they've got him, you know, he's the last American politician that they fully got by the balls. You know what I'm saying? Like, what do you think, what do you think had a greater part to play? The correct answer there is, I don't know. but I like you cannot rule out that it's a distraction campaign. One of the things I have always talked about on this case since the beginning, and I've talked about this in the case that's just gotten built better over the years,

is the way they've used news cycles with Epstein. So let's start at the beginning. Jeffrey Epstein is found dead in his cell in the wee hours of an early Saturday morning in August. What is the deadest news month of the year? August. August. What is the deadest news time of the cycle of the week? And I'll give you a hint.

It's about a 12 to 18 hour period. Friday. Friday at about 3, 4, 5 p.m. through early Saturday morning is the deadest time of the week. So you got the deadest time of the week prime in the deadest month of the year. Good. That's the first data point. Then you have Gieland Maxwell's trial. It happens November, December, 2021. And if you remember, this is like peak COVID. It's in New York. So all the jurors messed up and all that. And they go to deliberations around Christmas time. And that week after Christmas, which is the deadest news cycle time of the year, that particular week, the week between Christmas. and New Year's Eve, New Year's Day. The jury came back and they wanted to take time off for their family because it's the fucking holidays and the judge said, no, bitch, get back in there and make a decision.

They come to a decision, I believe, on Wednesday, December 29th, which this is a year where that sandwiched, the 30th was like a Thursday, then the 31st is a Friday, New Year's day is a Saturday. That's the deadest time of the week is literally New Year's and the New Year's Day, two days after this shit. It's already in the past. By Monday, it's January 3rd. People don't even know that happened. And by the way, the judge ordered

all the files related to the case or a subset of them sealed forever and no one can ever see it. And the woman was convicted of sex trafficking children to nobody. Very interesting. Then, then, President's Day weekend in the United States. It's not President's Day

weekend in other places. But to be clear, President's Day weekend in the United States, it's 2022. In the wee hours of that Saturday morning, John Luke Brunel is found dead in his jail cell in Paris, and they say that it is in France, and they say that it is a suicide, right? By Tuesday.

By the way, John Luke Brunel, sorry, John Luke Brunel, just for people who don't know. Explain who he was. He was a major modeling executive in Europe, an extremely close friend to Jeffrey Epstein's, and someone who's viewed as one of the lead traffickers in his organization within Europe. as well. And he had been sitting in prison related to the Epstein case, and he's found dead. And so that's

President's Day weekend. So it's a really long weekend. So a Saturday morning's prime by Tuesday. A lot of people didn't even know who the guy was by Tuesday. Nobody's talking about it. Then you get for, I'll even skip some stuff, but you get forward to 2025. John, when did that email, when did that, you know, like whole thing come out with, with Epstein, obviously it was when you were here. But that caused like a month-long kind of struggle where people are like, wait a minute, is Trump like in the files? Is you going to try to cover this stuff up?

And if you remember, the FBI came out with a with like a report saying that, you know, nothing to see here, whatever I want to say it was like July 2nd. People check me on that. 2025, which is smack dab in front of July 4th, also like maybe the second deadest news week of the year outside of that week after Christmas. And it's just like shove it under the rug, shove it under the rug. And then they're fighting it throughout the rest of that summer. That's where that New York Times story comes in where they're talking about this. Like, how do we handle this or whatever? They don't want it released. Some people in Congress are starting to say, no, we want to get the files legally

release, get these bill forward. Trump's like, fuck you. They delay, they delay, they delay. And by the time it gets to December, when they're going to release, when did they release the first fucking files? They released it on Friday, December 19th, I want to say it was, 2025, which is the Friday before Christmas, which I believe fell on a Wednesday or Thursday. The whole next week's dead.

and they were supposed to release it that morning, and they delayed it all day. And Massey was tweeting about it, and Connor were tweeting about it, like, where are these files? They were legally supposed to release. They released it like three or four or five o'clock. And then by the time you got to the next week,

the day after Christmas, they astro-turf that Somali fraud video to Mars. So that becomes the whole story. A week after that, they invade Venezuela. We're in the New Year. No one's talking about it. Then three weeks later, later. They released the next Epstein files on what?

Fucking Friday. So that's what they do. Put it out on a Friday and this one they couldn't keep in the box. They could not keep this one out of the news. And that leads us to this point of like them fighting news cycles. That's why my head has to consider the possibility. Like I said at the beginning of this, my answer to your question of did they invade a Ron to cover up the Epstein files? The answer is I don't know. And furthermore, well, I would fucking hope not, but I can't rule that out. I can't rule that out as at least a part of the calculus because they could not get rid of that story. Once that's second trons, once that second trance dropped on Friday, January 30th or whatever that was, they could not fucking get

rid of this man. And suddenly, you know, then they're invading Iran and that story takes over because it's bigger, you know? Wow. That makes total sense. Yeah. So, so, so. maybe these are things that Trump has already cooking, right? The kidnapping of Maduro, invasion of Venezuela, the invasion of Iran, right? People, you know, his lobbyists and his masters, the people who own him, you know, they have this in his ear. And whenever something leaks about the Epstein story, he says, okay, now is the time.

Now is the time to go in and invade. Maybe. I mean, he doesn't want people talking about it. He's literally said it. Like, for a guy who's such a brilliant marketer, and I'll never take that from him, he, in the past has been, for a lot of his life, was just an unbelievable marketer. He has mismarketed his entire presidency, particularly this issue in ways that are biblically unimaginable. I mean, it's like watching, I've described Donald Trump like Roy Halliday. Do you remember Roy Halliday, the pitcher?

Yes. Okay, so Roy Halliday, rest in peace, he actually tragically died a few years after he retired. Roy Halliday, for whatever it was, you know, 12, 13 straight years at one point was like the best pitcher in baseball. The guy could paint every corner, he could muscle you on the inside. He had a fastball that was just fucking insane and he could give you a complete game on command. And he was playing for the Phillies at the end of his career, which is my team. So I loved watching him play. And I forget which year, if it was 2011 into 2012 or 2012 into 2013.

whatever it was, one year, he's the best pitcher in baseball still. And the next year he showed up and his body just stopped. Like he didn't lose a step. He lost fucking 40 steps. And he went from being the best pitcher in baseball to what felt like overnight being one of the worst pitchers in baseball. And he quickly realized, shit, my body can't do it anymore. And he retired.

Donald Trump as a marketer is Roy Halliday. He went from a guy that could market his way out of saying, grab him by the pussy and win a fucking election as president to a guy that couldn't fucking talk his way out of a parking ticket. And that's where we're at with how he how he has behaved and commented publicly, not just on Epstein. Look at how he talks about the Iran war. I mean, like, no, I don't think about it at all, referring to people's bank accounts

here or gas prices and stuff. Like, Malacca, what did you run on? Right. Are you fucking kidding? Data centers. Data centers. Yeah. If you don't want data centers.

you want to be backward and poor, shut up. So that's so, so because of that, because of his buffoonery and his, his, uh, ostentatious, uh, ostentatious marketing and, and, and his, uh, his bombasticness, right? We talk, you talked to, we talked to the beginning of the episode. There's basically three levels of this,

these, we'll call them the masters of mankind, right? At the top level, you have, uh, essentially families, elite, aristocratic, can't even call them elite. They're really like, how would you describe them? Like the ruling

families from the Rothschilds to the Rockefellers to the fixers, which are Jeffrey Epstein and such, down to the bureaucratic level, right? Which is basically, they're the marketers.

They are the people marketing how their masters want the world to be. right the people who run governments who they convince the public that no you actually have a say you do live in a democracy you do your vote does matter right because trump trump would be at that level correct uh yeah effectively he wouldn't be at like a fixer level no he would be in the he would be in the third layer just to make sure i'm following you right there layer one at the families layer two is the fixer layer three is you know like the world leader types to head a corporal

When it gets to like some of the corporate titans, it gets really weird because they're either one or they're three. And it's hard for me to say which is which. You know, is Sam Altman a one? Is he a three? Is Bill Gates a one? Is he a three? I'm not really sure. But like the one thing I do want to get across is like it's not like the people in the third layer are powerless.

It's just you thought they were the top dog. You thought they were LeBron. they're not LeBron. And, you know, there's a guy in between them and LeBron. They're the third fiddle right there. They got a lot of power. But, you know, you're Dennis Rodman. You're not Jordan.

Yeah. Yeah. And it's because a guy like Trump couldn't, it's because he's too out in the public that he probably couldn't ascend the levels, right? They would never, he would never do what a guy like Epstein would do because he couldn't, he just can't keep a secret.

Yeah, you can't hold mud. And also Donald Trump, like if you've, if you'd followed him over the years and listen to people talk about him and try to cut through the noise, a common thread that was talked about with him, not just from people that wanted to rip him or tear him down, just like it's a pattern that you've heard from so many different people discussing his career that I actually think is true,

which is, you know, he was this son of a guy from Queens. he wasn't and you know he was this kind of like epstein kind of had the new york accent and this rowdy gaudy ostentatious outsider who desperately from day one wanted to be in the in crowd in new york city and he wasn't allowed in it so he would constantly try to fucking mark it and buy his way into it to amass power and he was never fully accepted by that class i think epstein to speculate here, I think Epstein knew how to get accepted by a lot of those people because some of the highest level people

who still look down on him definitely and said, well, he's just a useful fixer tool like a David Rockefeller, because they gave the thumbs up on him and he was their guy, everyone else, and I'm just guessing here, looked at him like, oh, yeah, he's a part of the crew. Even with the coni-isle accent, like, yeah, he's in this world.

in New York. Because I don't know that Trump ever got that. Because from the beginning, you know, from 20 years old, Epstein or 22 years old, he was harvested and put in that position. Yeah, you know, he became, he was like a mediocre student, but he became the head dean at the Wharton School of Business. And the person who gave him that job was Barr, whose son ended up being the head of the CIA, William Barr. No, no, no, no, no. He was, I don't know anything about the Wharton School of Business, but he was given a job. as a college dropout as the teacher at the Dalton school, which is the premier. I'm just getting it wrong. Yeah. The premier high school for like, you know, elites in New York City. And yes, it was Bill Barr's father, Donald Barr, who was the principal at the time,

who gave him that job. Of course, nothing to see there. You know, it's like, again, if some of these things are coincidences, then God damn, they're really unfortunate coincidences because holy shit. You know some of them are not. Right. So, okay. So let's talk then about what, what you know, because you know more than about this than anybody else in this space doing this podcasting shit. Who are the most guilty?

From what we do know, what names some of the most guilty people yesterday. We're recording this on a Wednesday or Tuesday. Yesterday, Thomas Massey came out in front of Congress. He had a minute and he read off a list of 14 names. People who perpetrators in the Epstein files go through some of them and explain where they are on the levels of the elites. Are they first class, second class or third class? Okay, Jess Staley. Jess Staley is one of the guys he named. He was a high level executive at Barclays. I don't think Jess is any of those classes. I think he's just like he's like kind of the fourth class, people that donate to the third class and, you know, want to be in the club, but he was a high-level banker who, I mean, that's a whole, he went to the island with Epstein.

He clearly insinuates to take in part and, you know, sex parties and stuff with him and is clearly very guilty. Leon Black is another guy that was mentioned. I don't really see a scenario where Leon Black is not guilty of participating in things with Jeff. Jeffrey Epstein, he's a prolific liar. This is one of the most powerful people in the history of private equity founded Apollo. I would say Leon Black, Leon Black's in that third class, I think. Like you see him whenever he's around Trump, that's not a guy who's honored to be in Trump's presence. He's one of those guys that said, Malaga, we're on the same level. You know what I mean? So that's why I say that. Les Wexner is another guy.

he talked about less, Lex, less could very well be in that second layer. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there's an interesting thread there that I've talked about before where, and again, this gets to total speculation here. Because I can't show you bank transactions.

I cannot have to say that. I can't say hard evidence, but something, a thread that's never been pulled on, as far as I can tell by people who could forensically maybe get some of this. But when Tara Palmerry did one of her two podcasts that she did on this, she did two series back in 2020 that are excellent. One of them is basically called Maxwell's. The other one is called Epstein. And in this series, she went around with Virginia Robber

Schuphrey, who's now deceased, who was a whistleblower here and a victim. And she would go try to approach people that Virginia had known from that world to get them to talk. And some people would say, oh, sorry, not talking. And then other people said yes. So I believe the guy's name was Juan Alessi, but Jeffrey Epstein's house manager, Juan Alessi, who's an immigrant or then worked for him for him for a lot of years. He lived in a gated community. They went and approached him. And he said, oh my God, Virginia, yes, come in. And not only did he let them in, he agreed to go on mic and have the conversation recorded. It's a really difficult thing to listen to because you can feel how, you know, just like human nature in the room with like you, you listen to this guy and

you're like, I don't think this is a bad guy. But then you realize the cognitive dissonance or the active looking the other way that he did. And you're like, that's a bad thing. To hit credit, he was emotionally honest about this stuff, which is more than I can say for a lot of people. So I will give him that. And one of the things he explained. is he said, you know, he was working with Jeffrey Epstein a little bit in like the late 80s. He said, and then 1992 saw him happen. He's like, he got rich, rich. Like, it went from, you know, yeah, he did a nice place on the Upper East Side to like now he's working his way to eventually he was going to get that mansion.

Like the townhouse in New York on the 71st Street, he gets the plane. He starts balling around the world. He was like, it went from zero to a hundred. And he also maintained in this conversation that he didn't really know. what Jeffrey Epstein did, like work-wise. You know, the guy's life was, to quote his email account, like a vacation. He just was going places and whatever. And then we talked on the phone with people, but he never knew what he was doing.

It's like the Will Ferrell line. I never knew what she's doing in there. You know, like he just, he couldn't figure it out. And so he said it was just really interesting because he got a lot of money. And so I put the timeline together and I go, okay, Les Wexner ends up giving him that house. I don't care how good friends you are with someone. You don't give someone that house.

Sorry. That's just not feasible. That place on the Upper East Side by the park? Yeah, effectively gives it to him. Signs over his, you know, money watching to Jeffrey Epstein, apparently because Ellie de Rothschild vouch for him. That's what Les Wexner said, at least. Wow. And it's just interesting because November 1991,

Robert Maxwell drowned off his boat. off the Canary Islands in the Atlantic Ocean and was quite, you know, very quickly buried on the Mount of Olives five days later. And somehow this, he was an awful guy, total narcissist, all these things, but he was a prolific spy. And, you know, for all his bluster and all his flaws, of which he had many, the fact that somehow conveniently when he died, he left his family destitute and he allegedly had like a $400, $450 million pension scam on the books at the Daily Mirror, made no sense. This guy had a lot of different businesses.

Like I know business guys over lever sometimes, but like the idea that all, like he had nothing is insane. And so much so that his sons were later tried for his crimes in the UK. and found not guilty. Now, when have you ever seen Sions in a corruption case where regular people were defrauded, not found guilty?

That doesn't happen very much. But that same amount of money is roughly a similar amount to the type of net worth that Jeffrey Epstein suddenly had injected. And I always wonder if Les Wexner is a little bit of a fountain where the money flows from one to the other.

Like I said, Robert Maxwell. In order to hide money, in order to hide money or laundering money. And fund operations. Like I said, Robert Maxwell was buried on the Mount of Olives. We know that he was a spy for Russia, the UK, and Israel. He was buried in Israel. Do with that what you will. Les Wexner, when George Bush put together like the Israel Commission or whatever in 2008,

Les Wexner was on it and traveling with him over there. You know, and like you see stuff like this and you wonder, what else is there. And Epstein, to be clear, was involved with a lot of different things. I mean, I've studied this many times, but Dave Smith had a great tweet that isn't necessarily true either. I don't know that he's right, but it's an amazing tweet when the Epstein files, when the second tranche came out, he put out a tweet a few days later where he said, I used to think Jeffrey Epstein worked for Mossad. I now wonder if Mossad worked for him because it's just so much higher level. And another thing I've had to really like adjust opinions on looking at this is the extent of my

government's involvement with him, which is more than I thought it was. More than I'd always chalked it up to be. So, like, he worked with a lot of different people, but of course, he also worked with, I won't even say Massad, let's keep it really simple just to make sure we hit the point here. He worked with Israeli intelligence. There's several different groups. It's all the same shit.

Totally. Right? So, Mossad's the easiest way to put it because that's the most famous one that people know. But, like, you know, you have to wonder what that connection is. and no one's ever been able to satisfy me with an answer there. I'm happy to be like, okay, yeah, he really did have a pension scam. He really did cost all those people all that money. And it really didn't get funneled somewhere else, perhaps,

to Jeffrey Epstein to fund his lifestyle where he was now going to be the guy. But you wonder that. You certainly wonder that. But why? Like here's, okay, I see what you're saying. And I think it's more high level than that, too. And I've had to adjust my mindset when I look at, because there's a huge frenzy around. blaming the government of Israel for everything that's going on in the world.

Right. And I actually look at at a higher level now, I think it's actually global financial capital that is running the world. And Israel is just one node. Started to look at different nodes. It's a node in the military industrial complex. It's for selling weapons and funneling weapons and causing being the jump-off point for forever wars in the Middle East that have gone on for the last 25, 30 years.

Now, I'm looking at the Iran War as a way of them wrapping that up. They're saying the Israel's become a toxic asset on the balance sheet, and they're winding them down now. So in the same way that I look at the Epstein files, it's something much high, it's higher level than just intelligence agencies, right? why why why why do the Rothschilds and the families what what do they get out of all of this is it just total control i mean that's what i would guess absolute power like what else can it be but are there everything you have everything in the world it's just more power that's all that's left in in the human in human

greed after you have all the money is total absolute power Yeah, my brain would go to that, and that's what I would think. But are there also things that at that level and that layer you consider that I don't, that don't even occur to me, possibly. But yeah, I would think it's just power dynamics in human nature. You know, a couple things here. One of the things is I've actually, I talked about this recently, but I think when people just call chalk off every evil entity that they don't like

as being demonic and like not human or like lizard, I think it's a huge cop-out. And I'll tell you why. It's because you are denying the possibility of the existence within human nature that evil like that could exist. It's an easy answer. Oh, they're just not from here. They're different.

I think it's bullshit. I think they're people. I think they're evil people. In many cases, people born into a system where they're taught to do that because that's just how it's always works. So you're going to carry on the legacy and that's what you do. And I think it's inherently evil and has to be called out that way as human, as the lowest form of, you know, human existence.

But the other thing is when you talk about these families and why they do it or whatever and using things as a note, I actually am starting to agree with you on that a lot. I do think Israel is used as a note. I also, you know, I hate that they make me have to talk about them every fucking week because we have this war going on and obviously they're taking horrible actions continually still in Gaza

and now a lot in Lebanon as well. and like, yeah, I have to talk about that stuff because it's objectively inhumane and horrible. But like the trap of blaming every fucking thing that's ever happened on Israel is certainly one you don't want to fall down because it distracts you from also other things, entities, places, even countries that are problematic as well.

And so I want to look at all of it. I don't segregate on any of it. I'm like, if it's bad and it's not good for America, let's fucking talk about it. That said, it's not to the actions Israel taken are disgusting and what their government has done is disgusting at every level and that does need to be talked about. But it harkens when you say that, it harkens to a story that John Kirooku told me that really made a lot of sense. And this was the one that was being referenced

when I talked with Bustamante and told you about that conversation earlier. John was in the Middle East. I forget of who it was Boffrain or one of the countries. He was stationed there. And he was told that David Rockefeller, I think it was David, was coming in. And, he was an old man at that point. He was like fucking, I don't know, 85, 90 years old, something like that. And so the reason he was coming in, John was told, is because he was getting some fucking award. Some like, I don't even know what the award was. It was basically like prestige worldwide.

It made no sense. And John's like, the fuck is David Rockefeller flying to the middle of bumble fuck in the Middle East to accept an award? All right, whatever. I guess he's got different priorities than me. So Rockefeller's there. They obviously like prepared to, you know, host him in every. And so he gets the award.

And then John, the one time he was around him, was like, oh, Mr. Rockefeller, great to have you, whatever. Congratulations on the award, by the way. And Rockefeller looked at him and was like, thanks. You know, and like kind of walked away. And the other guys around John were like, you fucking idiot. He's like, what? They're like, he's not here for an award, you fucking moron. that's just a cover, which is a shit cover story, by the way.

We put him on a fucking military jet to Iraq to go meet with Saddam clandestinely last night to warn him that if he doesn't stop this shit, he's going to get a bomb up his ass. And again, when I run that by Andy Bustamante, from John Kyriaku, he ain't disagreeing. Yeah. So, and you know what that reminds me of? these because these are non-state actors. David Rockefeller from the Rockefeller dynasty is a non-state actor.

He doesn't work for the government. He's a private citizen, but he's being ferried on a military transport to Iraq to meet with Saddam Hussein, the leader of a nation state. Who does that remind you of in recent, you know, in the media these days? Jared fucking Kush. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. A non-state actor. Why is he meeting A, with Hakeem Jeffries and members of our Congress in secret? Why is he negotiating for Trump with heads of states overseas? My question is, why is it public, though?

That's what I want to know. Because I've been calling that out like crazy. Sure. But it's like, okay, they're feeding him to the sharks every day. Oh, he met with, oh, he met with Hakeem Jeffries. Oh, we just met with Iran. Oh, here he is on camera doing this meeting. It's like, so who's not on camera?

Sure. So there's somebody higher than there's somebody higher than Jared. Yeah. And he sucks to be very clear. Like he's the worst. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but yeah, like I wonder that because they, you know, it's not like people knew about that David Rockefeller meeting. You know, these aren't things that are ever reported and stuff like that. There are people who are above the reporting. But like you hear that and to dovetail off what you were saying, it's almost like we work for him. Not like equal playing field. He's, says, I'm coming over. Have a plane ready. Does that sound like an employee or an employer? So how? Exactly. So our government that we pay taxes to is working for this shadowy oligarch is one of the elites from the top level of the system of control. How do they manage to do that? I think the answer is pretty obvious, but how do they manage to have control over our government? Is it simply through bribery and possibly violence, you know, with going back to the JFK assassination? What do you think?

You are now above my pay grade. I don't know, but I do know it ain't what we have been told it is by any stretch. And I do know that families like that exist. And I do know that they wield power. And I do know that the extent of it is not nothing, you know. I, you know. And I think why that's, we cracked the Epstein scandal is we use a guy like Epstein to get the decision makers from the third level in compromise.

We use them for blackmail, essentially, right? We get all of these things hanging over your head. And that way we control you far greater than just through bribery. We, we have you on camera with a 12 year old girl. when we own you. We literally own you. You are a slave. You are our goy slave, right?

It is hard to imagine the world existing today where a very uncomfortable portion of it is not exist. It is not based totally on some level of blackmail. And it sucks to say that. but is it everyone statistically no but are there a lot of people that you know can get got and got some something that they don't like to talk about at dinner parties on them and are told hey here's what you got to do feller you know we just saw one of them pass away r-i p lindsaym but, you know, fair to say that guy probably took some actions in his life.

He didn't like the idea of the public knowing. Sure. And I think that explains a lot of positions that he may have taken. Well, I think RFK too. I think it's so crazy. People that don't have anything to do with foreign policy in the government. He's got nothing to do with the Iran war or anything to do. at least in the public with, you know, the state of Israel.

But yet it doesn't make a tweet for like months. And then all of a sudden when something, you know, allegations of genocide come out, he pops up any talk of, any talk of Israel committing genocide is blood liable against Jews. You're like, well, well, well, John, John, I spoke with my friend, Rabbi, you only. And he assured me with complete,

with complete assurance that they did not have anything to do with this war in Iran. And that anti-Semitism is a major scourge. It's like, fuck you, dude. Don't hide behind that shit. I'm so over. I'm with you. I'm so over that. It's got nothing to do with you.

Shut the fuck up. Go get the food dies out of our food. Totally. Which he hasn't done, really. By the way, run the tape on this. I've been saying this for years on my podcast. I can think at least all the way back to episode 197 with Tommy G, which would have been March 2024. One of the things that always was in the back of my head about RFK was the Black Book.

Okay, so if you look at the Epstein Black Book, this is from, you know, like, 03. So at the time, RFK was still married to his former wife who now, you know, he divorced and she later committed suicide. but under his contacts he had like 10 contacts there including and this was just like chef's kiss the maid of honor for his wife who happened to be Andrew Cuomo's wife like direct contacts numbers emails etc and I remember when I was a really little kid before the iPhones they used to have phone books contact books and so I thought to my four grandparents who were all alive at the time and my two parents, all of whom had emails and phones. And I forget what it was.

Maybe there was like across those six people who were the closest six people in my life, there was like 14 contacts or something like that. Jeffrey Epstein had nine or ten contacts, whatever it was, for one guy and his wife who's not a blood relative. That's weird. That's a lot. I know you fucking well. if I do that.

Like there's other guys in that book. Like he had, for example, he was building places all the time. He had every great architect known to man in his book, but he'd have like one number. That's innocent enough to me. Okay, fine. I can ignore that one. But like nine. And then you look at Bill Clinton, who's not listed as Bill Clinton, is listed as Doug

banned. And then in parentheses, Clinton's guy. There's like fucking 47. Yeah. You know? Trump's got a bunch of them too. Right. It's just like how you can't say you don't know the guy,

no pun intended here, intimately, when he's got that many hooks in you. So the victims, I want to talk about this before we get out of here, the victims that are still alive, that I believe they are not being allowed to speak. Like the government, the Trump administration is not hearing them. right and that's and and and they're using it as an excuse well we they use the excuse we we don't

want to release the files because it'll it'll harm the victims right because then they don't care about the victims obviously not right but i'm saying you there's a bunch of victims that want to come forward and talk so clearly they're not worried about harming themselves so why aren't they letting the victims come forward and why don't the victims just release who abused them, right? If the government refuses to release the files illegally, right, why don't the victims just go to the press or sit down with you and say, here it is?

Some of them have. Okay. Some of them have. But you're right. It's an interesting point, like for some others that haven't. And I'm always a little careful when I'm talking about, like how, what I would do if I were a victim of law. like especially of like a Jeffrey Epstein or something like that.

Even now when he's dead, but there's a lot of powerful people attached to him and the fear you might have with that. It's very dangerous for me to say, if I were blank, then I would blank. I don't fucking know how I'd handle that. And thank God I'm not in that position. It's an interesting question, though, on both fronts. Why is the Trump administration not hearing them out when they claim to care about the victims, including, by the way, like we talked about Melania Trump's whole speech was

like, listen to the victims and shit. You know, that's the wife right there saying that. and then also if they're not going to do that, why do at least some of them not come out with exact claims? The first one, you know, as far as the Trump administration not listening, it's because they just botched this whole thing and they're just dug in deep at this point they're trying to make it go away by any means necessary. That's the best answer I can give there.

The second one, I don't know. I don't know. And I don't know how fair it would be for me to fully speculate on that, at least referring to the victims who are the real ones. I'm sure there's some in there that are trying to get a payday, but there's plenty that are legit real victims. We know for a fact these guys had thousands and thousands of victims. Yeah, of course.

I'm talking about like the 15 or 20 that have actually sat down with Thomas Massey and Rokane. So super, super credible. Their traffickers or their perpetrators, their abusers, ostensibly are some of these people that Massey just read off in front of Congress yesterday. So I just didn't know if you had any idea about, I mean, maybe they are scared for their lives, right? Or do they have some kind of like, would they have some kind of like legal slander litigation put against them? If one of the victims came out and said, yeah, I was raped by Prince Andrew, a lot of.

with whatever, Donald Trump or somebody connected to Trump intimately. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. And it's a fair question. Especially probably the ones who are already talking with him. Right. And then why wouldn't Massey, if Massey knows all this information, why wouldn't he, if the victims didn't want to come forward and be on camera,

why wouldn't he just read their statements off? Maybe he will after he's out of office. Yeah, I think he did start. I think he's doing it in pieces. I don't know. I'm guessing. I don't know. But starting with naming, I have them in front of me,

Jess Staley, Leon Black, Les Wexner, David Copperfield, L.Con, Tom Pritzker, Glenn Dubin, Frederick Fekai, Eduardo Teor Durrani, John Luke Brunel, Daniel Syed, who's also not recently dead, Amzi, L. Coley, and Prince Andrew. Like, that's a start because it's getting to really specific people. in this case he was referring to the 14 Epstein co-conspirators, which obviously would include people who had their names redacted in that context within the files. So like maybe that will get to specific claims. If we really want to also stick on a tinful hat for a minute and get real uncomfortable with this,

another thing you do have to consider is how many victims, we know a lot of victims were victim face-to-face. And so that makes your question fully fair. What about all the victims who maybe weren't victims face to face? And what I'm getting at there is, you know, hard for me to try to think like these people do. But you see a movie like eyes wide shut, how would you know who was abusing you in that kind of setting? They're all wearing masks and shit. Right.

You know, like I'm sure there were things like that. I shouldn't say I'm sure. I have a high degree of confidence. There were things like that that most likely occurred as well. And that gets really, really fucking bad. And it's just crazy that like, God damn did Kubrick Cook in that movie. I mean, he, he, dude, he told you.

He told you what was happening. And people, you know, none of us listened. Yeah, nobody is that creative to come up with. Not like that. No, nobody's that creative. We all know that, or have heard testimony from people who have been at these ceremonies, right? You know, whether you talk about the not coconut grove.

It's my favorite neighborhood of Miami. Bohemian Grove? Bohemian Grove, yeah. To the worshipping of ball and, you know, these, again, it's the practicing of the dark arts. It's not, these aren't lizard people. These are people that have been infected with evil, which goes back to my, you know, me really, like, it makes me a believer in Christ even more when I look at all of this evil, because I'm like, oh, you predicted this in the Bible.

You wrote in the Bible that this evil, this Satan exists in the world. And so, yeah, these people are infected with the worst of humanity, which is greed, total power, right? And obviously sexual immorality. Just put it in every way. Yeah. And God knows how this will all play out. you know, do you see anything in the midterms if the Democrats sweep the House and the Senate, like Pauley Market just predicted they would yesterday? Is that going to make any one iota of difference?

Can they force Todd Blanche? So this is where we are today. Todd Blanche, the now acting Attorney General, is just like Pam Bondi, he's got a mandate. Literally, he's breaking federal law. I don't know why he's not arrested. but he's refusing to release the other three million unredacted Epstein pages in the Epstein files. Could a fully Democrat Congress force him to do that? What do you think going forward? You would think so. Again, if this were insert another issue here and the year were 2018, of course they would. And they'd probably go way overboard and do things that are.

ridiculous. Like, this is the one issue that it's just like, like, if I were Hakeem Jeffries, who's the minority speaker, I'd start off every single day with a tweet about Jeffrey Epstein. That would have been the last year of my life. Of course. He don't talk about it, though.

You know, so maybe they would. But I think, I think it's just two birds of a feather flock together. said this for a long, long time, long before I had the podcast. I had my black pill moment. I didn't know what was called back then in late 2017. I had been liberal. I had been conservative at different points, like for two or three years apiece, I'd say, in each scenario. And I had my moment where I realized, oh, oh, this isn't real. This is all bullshit. And also, like, my opinions were all very moderate. And then I thought about it. I'm like, oh, so they just create opposites of

the spectrum to create equilibrium through straight up. violence so they could do all the shit behind the scenes that you don't vote on. And it just made so much sense to me. And that's like maybe the only take in my life that over time I just see stronger and stronger evidence for. I never see something that pulls you back from that ledge and is like, well, no, maybe that's not true. It's like the one thing I could really say that about. And, you know, from a 30,000 foot in the air perspective, but yeah, I don't know. I don't, I don't get very involved in domestic politics. I don't really care about it.

I don't cover a lot of that on my show. We do a lot of foreign policy stuff. And then we do the things that are like the socio-cultural kind of things, which is smack dab when you're talking Epstein, when you're talking war, when you're talking surveillance, stuff like that. And by the way, you know, after years of having such division and strife on the left and right, which still exists because people still fight over bullshit, you have three issues. that like the average person below age 55 agrees on this year. We don't like mass rape.

We don't like war and genocide. And we don't like fucking surveillance. That's right. That's right. It's the biggest kumbaya moment ever. My audience, like, and I love it, it's very exciting to me. My audience ranges left to right and is so well distributed. And that gives me a little glimmer of hope because enough people are like,

all right, we can talk about health care later. we can talk about taxes later, we can talk about, you know, government later. How about we just start with like the base? Yeah, let's not have a bunch of fucking retards try to rule our lives. And that's what I'm constantly trying to pound into my own audience's head or anybody who will listen to me, whether it's my parents or just anybody. Get out of the left-right Republican Democrat box. That is all a sci-op designed to distract. you from what the fuck we're just talking about, which is being ruled by a cabal of elites who want

you dead, who want to strip your country of all resources, and then, yes, put you in a mass surveillance open-air prison to make sure you don't get out of line. Get the fuck out of Republican, you stupid sheep. Stop watching the fucking mainstream media, dude. And that's, but, but, you know, part of it is, and that's where Boomer comes from, is that the, only people really still still trapped in in this binary way of thinking are the people that consume MSNBC and Fox News and these motherfuckers just won't die yeah and there's and they're and they've got all the wealth and they're a huge they're 25% of the population so it's like it's frustrating it's frustrating you know when when you have access to more information and there's people

who are just like, yeah, I'm not going to go look at it. It is very frustrating. I think that at the end of the day, the best thing you can do is when people ask about it, answer their questions with as much evidence and as honestly as possible. And where I've fallen short sometimes talking with people, some boomers in my life is I've lost my mind a few times. and I've been way better at that recently, you know, with just like when they ask me, they're going to think what they're going to think, but I'll talk just like this.

I did it the other night with my grandfather talked just like this for like 45 minutes. And he's a smart guy. He wants to learn. It's not, he's not by choice, dumb or anything. He had a whole system where this is how you got your news forever. And now he's 90-something years old. So like, am I going to sit here and blame him for, for, you know, still having that? No. But what I can do is I can say, have you thought about this? Have you seen this? Do you see what's going on in this trend right here? And he's not going to be like, oh, that's bullshit or whatever. Doesn't mean he agrees with everything. But like, he's like, oh, no, that's very interesting. You know, where'd you hear that? How'd you find? And I find that when I do that, you get a lot more people for it to clock on, for sure. Definitely, definitely. Yeah, I'm the worst about that. I admire you because you're younger than me, but like you're just more mature.

than me. You're able to just kind of in a journalistic way say, yeah, you can control your emotions. Basically, everything that's gone on in these recent years has been a test of my emotions. Can I remove that side of me that just

wants to like kill a motherfucker? Like you put one of these fucking IDF guys in front of me. Like don't, don't, like I see these videos of them clashing with people in the street after they come back from Israel, massacring people, right? They go back to Australia and they're getting in somebody's fit. Don't put one of those motherfuckers around me because I'm going to catch a case.

And it's the same way with like being on on Mike and having an audience is like I don't want to, at the end of the day, I don't want to put people down. You know what I mean? Like I don't want to stoop to like my base biology, which is anger and violence. like that that's when you go to the dark side so it's like come to the light every time come back to the light and and and even if people are just unread undereducated fucking process food eating retards don't call them that come at them with love and information yes and like and some humility and i need to practice some humility too you know what i mean yeah it's okay to get emotional

once in a while. I mean, I've had a couple crashouts, but, like, they were pretty well-deserved. Like, one was on Howard Lutnik, right when all this thing broke, and he just wouldn't resign. Perfectly deserved. I don't have, I could have handled that a little calmer, that part, I'll say. But, like, as far as, like, going at him, yeah, I mean, I had the most bulletproof case ever. There was no, they didn't even have to put a glove on the hand. You know what I mean? And in this case, it actually really didn't fit, if you know what I mean? like it like yeah or it really did fit you know he's one of the most egregious examples one of the most egregious examples yes and so i i agree with you you got to you got to find a way to comment

and one thing that's always worked for me over the years because i'm from new jersey like we react emotionally a lot of us you know like that's my first my first impetus is you know emotion is when things are happening i'm constantly working these things out behind the scenes before I have to then go on and do it live in the sense that the same way that I do it here when I'm talking with you or I'm on my own show or whatever where we're just ripping it and how we talk about is how we talk about and we look at it later you know it's going to be that when I get in there so I already need to have my head in the place of where I know how to hash out arguments well so like that's where my daily phone calls with Danny Jones have come in over the years my phone calls

with a lessee from my side come in I talk with Dief about these things every day and I can tell like when I'm getting when I first get really worked up on something even with my dad sometimes I can tell when I'm so right that even with that weakness it's getting through and I'm like wow okay this really is bad and then other times when it's not getting through it's all at all it's like okay maybe I'm less right about this than I think maybe I need to pull this back a little bit take a deep breath and let's look at it fact by fact case by case and I do my best with that and you know I'll keep trying to get better at that but you're right you got to you have to try to look at things as objectively as possible in a world where it's increasingly harder to.

And it's like not everyone is exactly the thing that is the worst about them and not everyone is exactly the thing that is the best about their group of people and stuff like that. But I do always go back to my friend Eric Zooliger's quote from, you know, three years ago when he was on my show over three years ago, he was like, people are not their governments. And, you know, it's so true. I would very much like to think that people around the world would have the great and dignity to not say that I was Dick Cheney. You know what I mean?

Wasn't my choice that he was vice president, but he was and caused a lot of problems. And I understand why people may hate us because of that. I empathize with that tremendously. You know, but like you got to separate those two and we got to find the common grounds between us. And, you know, where there is evil, you do have to call it out. And, you know, sometimes if you do that a little bit emotionally, maybe that's okay. Absolutely, man.

Well, Julian Dory, you're just a young phenom. and I love watching your show. And if you live it under a rock, where can they find you? Julian Dory on YouTube, the main channel. We have the Clips channel as well, Julian Dory Clips and the one hour podcast channel, Julian Dory Daily.

And then I'm at Julian D. D. D.D. on Instagram and at Julian Dore on X. Yeah, dude. Of course, man. And it's just I love how you could talk about the Epstein files one day. And then you're interviewing Peter Schiff about, you know, the coming, financial apocalypse and it's just like it's it's the new improved Joe Rogan and I really mean that

and I'm glad we're friends and thank you so much for coming on and talking about this this subject and and honestly if we could take one thing away I wanted to come on to figure out what they really had on Trump and it would just be wild if it came down to as simple as my wife's a whore and I don't want the world knowing Could be. Pure spec. Could be. But dude, thank you so much for having me. I really, really appreciate it. It's great to be. You got it, guys. You got it. You got it. And thank you guys.

We'll catch you on the flip side. Peace out.