The Connect- with Johnny Mitchell - Secrets Of Drug Lord Rayful Edmond: Insider Exposes TRUTH About Washington D.C. Cocaine LEGEND

Episode Date: December 7, 2025

Step inside one of the most legendary — and misunderstood — eras in American crime history. For the first time ever, Whitey Sullivan, the right-hand man to Washington D.C.’s infamous drug lord Rayful Edmond, sits down on camera to finally set the record straight. Whitey was there for all of it — from Rayful becoming a teenage millionaire valedictorian and star basketball player… to building a cocaine pipeline from Los Angeles to D.C.… to overseeing multi-ton shipments every single week. He counted the money, managed the crews, and stood beside Rayful during the DEA’s most dramatic kingpin takedown of the 1980s. His power, influence, and empire continued to shock law enforcement for decades. Today, Whitey is breaking decades of silence to reveal: - How Rayful became the most successful urban drug dealer of his generation - The violence, rules, loyalty — and mythology — of D.C.’s streets - The truth about the federal case, the media, and the betrayals - Rayful’s plan to go legit… and why nobody truly walks away - Never-before-told stories of wealth, danger & survival This is the raw, unfiltered story the streets still whisper about — straight from the only man qualified to tell it. This Episode Is #Sponsored By The Following: Superpower! This holiday, give your loved ones the only gift that keeps on giving — health. Go to https://Superpower.com/gift to get a free $49 gift box with your gifted membership. Rocket Money! Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Go to https://rocketmoney.com/connect today. Join The Patreon For Bonus Content! https://www.patreon.com/theconnectshow 00:00 Intro: Setting the Record Straight 02:25 Rayful Edmond: Origins and Early Hustle 07:57 The Rise: Childhood to Drug Kingpin 18:13 Starting Out Pre-Crack Era 25:21 Transitioning to Cocaine and Expansion 30:57 This Episode Is Sponsored By Superpower 33:36 Running DC: Growing the Empire 41:01 Scaling Up: Bricks, Stash Houses, and Riches 57:41 Life as a Young Insider 1:00:42 This Episode Is Sponsored By Rocket Money 01:02:12 Rayful's Connections and the Colombian Cartel 01:14:48 Organization Structure and DC’s Drug World 01:29:02 The Crack Era: Streets & Violence 01:43:44 The Indictment: Raids and Arrests 01:56:00 Jail, Trials, and Surviving the System 02:14:09 The Second Case: Inside Prison Operations 02:30:09 Sentencing, Appeals, and Release 02:37:13 Coming Home: Release and Final Days 02:44:31 Rayful Edmond's Death and Legacy 02:56:53 Setting the Record Straight: The Real Story Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Rayful was getting at the time, probably 1,500 bricks. He said, man, I just do it for everybody else. And I just look at him like, why don't you just quit? He said, nobody really ever quits. I call him the civilian kingpin. If I had to, he known. I ought to took a bullet for his ass. Shoney was like, the police just got Rayful as soon as you dropped them all.

The whole popping building was surrounded. They threw me in the van. They was like, you're going to tell us where the money is. They knew Ray was moving that money. But we moved the red in their face. Whitey Sullivan was the right-hand man to the late Rayful Edmonds. drug lord from Washington, D.C., who became the most infamous black crime figure of the 1980s. Born and raised in northwest Washington, D.C., Rayful Edmonds became a millionaire from drug dealing while he was still in high school,

where he was also valedictorian and a star basketball player. Then, in 1984, when Crack hit the streets, Rayful took it to another level. Whitey estimates that Rayful Edmonds made $100 million over his career as a cocaine trafficker, making him the most successful urban drug dealer of his generation. Ed Whitey would know. He was probably the closest person in Rayful's life, routinely counting out millions of dollars of his money and overseeing multi-ton shipments of cocaine from Los Angeles to Washington, D.C., on a weekly basis. He was also there when the feds took down the organization in the most highly publicized, dramatic DEA bust of that era. Rathel went on to spend the next 35 years in federal prison and then died suddenly from cardiac failure shortly after his release in 2024. There are many myths surrounding the legend of Raffel Edmonds, most of them exaggerated or flat out untrue. Whitey is here to set the record straight.

This is his first time appearing on camera after all of these years. And after speaking with him, what I can tell you for sure is not a myth was the power that Raffel Edmonds wielded and the scope of his drug empire, even from behind bars, was unprecedented in American criminal history. What you were about to hear is the most fascinating street story that still exists, and we have the only qualified person to tell it, Whitey Sullivan. We tried to fit everything into one episode, but there was just too much to talk about, so if you want to check out the bonus conversation with Whitey, head over to Patreon, patreon.com, slash The Connect Show.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is one for the history books. Sullivan and the ghost of Rayful Edmonds right here on The Connect with Johnny Mitchell. Look, I'm going to show you. I got a video. I was pissed. When Ray got out, we stopped at a 7-11. He wanted a slurpy so bad. But, you know, I'm like, this motherfucker asked for a slurpy.

He's like, Whitey, come on. So it's a homeless white guy just standing by a truck, right? Yeah. So I was like, how you doing? You all right? He was like, yeah, we walk in the store. I come back out. Rayful out there giving him all the shit that he just brought.

Why do you take your jacket off? Hey, give him your shoes. So I'm taking my shit off. I'm like, okay. He said, the store people are like, hey, can you get away from the store? Ray was like, nah, what do you want? Come on, let's go on the store. I think he probably spent like fucking $200 in the 7-Eleven, right?

And he told Rayford, he said, man, who are you? I just got out of jail. So Rayford said, I just got out too. And he said, what's your name? He was like, Ravel, he was like, you must be somebody. Nobody treated me this good. You know what I mean? We got that on video.

Wow. You know, my event started recording. I didn't know. You know, I'm like, he said, Rayful was like, no, let me hug him, man. You're going to be all right. But that's just the type of dude he is, you know what I mean? And I was like, why don't you take your shoes off? He said, you just gave me these new balance.

So I ended up taking my Jordans and shit off to get this to the man. But, you know, I understood it. You know what I mean? Rayful was really special. Like there were a lot of people that hustled in the 80s. There were a lot of people that had bricks in the 80s, but there was a quality about him innately that made him exceptional as a person and as a drug kingpin.

Hell yeah, because like I said, people don't, you know how you could tell him somebody know, Raifle? If they say to cuss or drink, they're a damn lie. Man, didn't even cuss. only words he might have had different was pig Latin you know what I mean he talked that shit like better than anybody and you know what I mean so and he never said harm nobody ever since I've known him I've been known him since I was 10 years old wow so how did you meet him you were a child so I was a child and I don't get it

twisted like people say you can't you know mom I got a job your father and mother and father had good jobs mom worked for Metro and work for the post office It was just the street I lived on at the time The guys ran there in R Street, Northeast D.C. I thought they was getting money. And, you know, it was like a little fascination thing. Like two of them lay next door to me. You know, I used to hang out there with them.

I picked up the game real quick. You know, they were selling water. We call it water, but it's PCP. So you sell a cigarette for $25, right? It's 20 in a pack. You do the math. Sell a bottle of vanilla ashtract. We're selling that for $750.

So I just started saying, damn, I'm going to try to figure this one out. So, you know, dibbling, dabbing, hustle with them. You know, watch the corner. Oh, Whitey lit next door to us. Hey, White, we're going to hide this stuff in your backyard. So all along, I don't got smart. You know, I was smart in school.

Got me some ether. I said, I'm cutting this shit with baby oil. So whatever they give me, I was making double the profit, giving them their money back. So... Killing them. Yeah, so one day, this car used to ride through the street. You know, I'm thinking they had money.

But I used to be like, who the hell is this in this Subaru? This BMW. And the tag said, RE3 on it. So one day he stopped, he was like, man, why are your little ass out here? Ain't you little whitey? I was like, yeah, I was like, who the hell is he? You know, I'm thinking maybe the police, you know, because I don't know him. He was like, man, I'm Ray.

I was like, okay. And then, you know, every day it was like here, stop and hollering. Then one day he was like, come on, you're going to go with me. You're going to watch me play basketball. And I started, you know, doing my homework. They were like, oh, this motherfucking good play. You know, he got Lanzo morning on the side, John Turner, Matambo, a guy named Bootney and Earl, which is probably better than half of the NBA players now.

But they were street guys. And are they hooping, like, outdoors? Outdoors and indoors. So I rode with him to Dumbar High School You know I'm nervous because I'm like, I don't even know this motherfucker And you're 10 years old? 10 years old. And Rayful must be like 17 or 18.

He was 6 years old. Okay, so he's in high school. Yep, he went to Dumbar. All right. So Dumbar used to have this thing called the Urban Collision, meaning NBA players, you know, street legends, you know, that say they should have made it type shit. He's scorched ass.

He had like 40 points. right before third quarter. I didn't know what was going on, but he came back to the side. He said, hey, go to my car and get this bag. I go get a bag, and I don't know what's in it. He was like, I'm calling all bets. So I'm telling me, they bet on like $70,000, $80,000.

Street guys. And I'm like, so where I live at the all street guys, they was at the game. And they was like, who do that dude you with? You know, Ravel? I was like, yeah, I'm lying, though. I was like, I said, Yeah, that's my buddy.

He like family. So the bets end up being something like $85,000. Rayford on them one, he didn't take none of the money. He gave it to all the players, Lanzo. Matambo barely could speak English at the time. Bootney and Earl, he gave them the money and let them split it. And I looked at him like, why would you bet your money and then don't keep none of it? He said, nah, them dudes going to the NBA.

He said, they don't need me. So that's how our relationship, you know, started. This guy's like a Messiah. At 16 years old, he's already got $80,000 in drug money that he's just willing to bet and then give away. And that was him, man. I mean, even in jail, even when I was in jail, I get money orders, and I'd be like,

why the hell is Ray sending me money? You know, I was like, all that's in jail. And then when I got out, it was like, I sent them money, you know, without telling him. I guarantee you two weeks later, something, somebody's bringing me double whatever I sent him. He said, man, stop doing that. Take this money and give it to Keith or Tanya or whoever. They need some shoes. And I used to be saying to myself, man, I'm not doing that.

You're in jail. But, you know, he enforced me. He'd be like, no, they need it. I said, you don't need it. He said, no, I'm all right. But he's always been That's why he was in jail I mean he worried about everybody else

Ray could have been walked away It was like Damn if I walk away What they're gonna do But you know if it was on the other foot People probably would have sent him down the river You know what I mean Do you think he could have made it to the NBA?

Hell yeah Hell and then like Not the jump story But even like that story With John Thompson to my I was there You did not step the race for the way everybody, you know,

portraying on the news, these podcasts. Man, he came to Rayford like a gentleman. You're talking about John Thompson, the coach of Georgetown? He came to him like a gentleman. He was like, I prefer you not that my kids being around you if they're selling drugs. Ray was like, they only play basketball with me.

And then Rayford said, actually, I can go to Georgetown right now if I want to and play ball for you. John Turner was like, no drug dealer will play basketball. for me. And he was like, how you know I'm a drug dealer? The whole conversation was like, and not what they said it was. And then he said, man, I would never jeopardize them kids

education or anything that they're going to do. They're going to be future stars. So he was like, don't let them drive your cars no more. Shit, Lanzummoe used to drive my Z. And I was a kid. Rayford brought me 300 ZX Turbo. Right?

Shit, Lanzo drive my car with his knees up on the sternum with it. You know what I mean? And to this they, I ain't never asked John, none of them for anything. You know what I mean? When I came home, lawns or more than gave me some money, I gave it to my mom.

You know, I was like, I'm going to earn mine. I'm going to get a job. You know. Great problem with, I want everybody else to be okay. Yeah. So at 16 years old,

then he's already known in Northeast D.C. is a big-time drug dealer. Kind of. Yeah, because we were still going hand-to-hand at that time. Okay.

You know. But it's 1980, so this is pre-crack. What is he, is he just selling just PCP? And little powder here and there. So we used to have, they used to call it Fishkill back then. We used to sell like a rock of Fishkill in the bag. So one rock, no powder. So if somebody smashed it, oh, you have to buy it.

That was our motto, you know what I mean? But what people didn't know is right when I wanted to touch the drugs. People always, you know, I got this from even when we got in court. I was like, everybody in line. you're a damn lie I mean most of the people that testify I don't know oh I got it from Whitey

I got it from Whitey the only person lied is the police I navigate that guy anything he was like oh why do you told somebody to give me something I said the police even lied you know what I mean then he said he got something from me and Rayford

I was like this police are crackhead and he's lying I could take a lot of tech the test and prove him wrong but you know so he even at 16 he already had workers. Yeah, so it was like, you know, me, Johnny, Mumford is actually his cousin.

It was a couple of guys around us, Migo, Gans, Ronnie Green. That's all the neighborhood guys. And they ain't that much older than, I mean, they're about my age. Ronnie Green might be about Rayford. Johnny is his age because that was one of my co-defendants. But, yeah, you know, it started off like that.

Rafeo just was a saver, you know what I mean? Even though he gave away a lot, man, new numbers, man. Right. I'm not lying. He'll be like, that guy in the water, we're going to make blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'd be like, how did he get that out of that? But then after you think about it, I got to write it down and be like, damn, he's right. But he was good with math.

So tell us about that, those early days. How did you guys grow the organization, the PCP before the crack came along? And how did your relationship with Rayful grow? So my relationship really grew with him. I still lived on R. Street at the time, which is another part of D.C. and Northeast. He came through. He was like, you got to stop doing what you're doing up here with them.

Huh, you can have this. So I looked in the bag. He was like, I don't like giving you nothing. You don't need to hustle. He always said that, and you better go to school. So I got the bag and I'm gone, going to school. I was like, man, there's a gallon of water. So it was like a month.

I'm beeping, rifle, beeping them, beep. I was like, the hell he at. Then he popped up. He was like, hey, I got a game. I was like, where you was at? He said, I went out of town, you know, my dad, blah, blah, blah. I sold every damn dime in cigarettes. I dipped every damn pack of new ports, and I was selling them $25 a piece.

So I made a lot of money off of it. Wow. And I was like, you know I had that money for you. He said, that's your money. So I'm looking like, no, you really don't know how much money I made off there. I kept every dime. Spring weekends are all about family, sunshine, and evenings on the patio. Before everyone arrives, I stop by my local total wine and more to grab a great bottle to share.

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Yeah, at $25 a cigarette. Listen, man, when I got the almost 40-some thousand, I couldn't find no way to hide it. Because you're just dipping your cigarette, just a little teeny bit. And how old are you? Shit, I'm going on 11 like that twill. Yeah. So when I got the money, I was scared.

I was hiding the water in the backyard. My dad worked the post office. But this motherfucker, I knew he smoked weed in the attic. You know, we lived in a nice house. He was smoking PCP. And the only way I found out is one day I'm coming down the alley from school. And I was like, damn, Rayford won't be coming in a minute. My father in the backyard.

And I could see him like with a dirt and shit at. He wasn't crazy because he trained dogs. He was like, I know this dog ain't dig no hole. He found some of the water. Yeah. He was taking the shit. And then put the dirt back on it. So I was like, how I'm going to say something?

You know, my father, a child abuser. He'll wear your ass out. So long story short, I was like, I'm not hiding that shit there no more. But now you're up. You got 40 Gs. You're in the game. Yeah. Rayford told me keep the money.

I ain't know what to do with it. Buy my friend, scooters and shit. Come on, we ride the scooters to school. Then one day, Rayford was like, huh, take the BMW, go to school. I was like, fuck that. I'm taking this converter one and go. I get to school, parking with the teacher cars out. I come out, everybody in the parking lot,

trying to figure out who BMW that is with BBS on it. I'm talking about the security, the principal. I had to go and beep him and say, man, I'm scared to move your car. They want to know who car it is. I had to go get my mom. And then that's when all hell broke loose. She was like, Rayf was a good kid.

He don't own no BMW. And I was like, this is his damn car. But that's how my mom, she knew he wasn't bad. You know what I mean? She was like, I don't know what he doing. But people really like him. They say he play basketball. All the long, he's hustling like hell.

Yeah. Wow. See, he is such leadership qualities. even as like a young man, as a kid, really, 16, 17 years old. And then he had grown men doing shit. You know, it was people older than us, like even on our case. You know what I mean? So just think back then, you had people that was in their late 30s doing what he'd say, do.

Right. You know what I'm saying? It was just, I call him the civilian kingpin, to be honest with you. Because, like I said, he never said, kill nobody. He never say this. I mean, even some of our enemies, they get killed or something happened. he, up there paying for shit. I'd be like,

why the fuck are you doing that? You know, I'm a kid, but me and I had these conversations. He was like, you gotta remember, you ain't got to let people know you don't like him or deal with him.

He said, but the mom's struggling. I'd just be like, man, there's something without he robbing everybody. Yeah. You know, or he did this, you know. Well, I think that's a big myth because when he,

later on caught the big Fed case, I mean, they painted him like he was this, like, serial killing kingpin. I mean, they brought a helicopter in. They had the jury behind a bulletproof glass. It was way over the top. They painted him like he was like a real murderer.

That was to get us convicted because, so, you know, at the time, I'm a juvenile, and they tried trying to charge me as a dog. So they got them in the cell across from me. I'm in the cell by myself. And they'd take me in first, and then they were like, oh, we're going to charge you. You're getting life in jail. Tell us where, you know, Rayful money is.

But see, what they didn't know is, Ravel wasn't even that type of dude. So even on the second case that he caught in jail, I'm going to get this stuff in sent it to you. I'm going to see you this email straight from the dominions, the prosecutor. Chicky said, give me all of their addresses that owes Ravel before this happened, right? You know what Ravel said? Man, I can't do that.

Chicky is his cellmate, Greg, go home. You know, even the cartel got the direct connect. He's like, man, them people leaving you for dead. all of them owe us. Ray was like, man, I can't do that. That let you know right there. The government telling them, hey, chicky and I'm going to get your ass killed, they're going to hit your mother, whoever, blah, blah, blah.

He was like, I'll take that chance, but I can't let them go kill all the people. And do they deserve it? Hell yeah. Every last one of them do. And I'm cool with all of them. You talk about the people that ratted on him? Where the people that took the supplies from them didn't pay. Right.

At the end, when he got knocked. Again, yeah. And they owed for the keys and shit. Yeah, you know, none of them paid. But, you know, then you had some of them, like, frog in them. They didn't pay and then got back in touch. And their thing was, we're going to rob whoever bring the keys this time. Not knowing is the police.

That's how dumb they are. If I owe you $300,000, do I'm going to believe Johnny saying, hey, bring me what you got, even if it's $10,000. And I'm going to give you another 100 keys. Duh. That shit don't even make sense. Some of y'all came with guns. I was just like, and when that was going on, like I said, he told me.

He called all the cold offense. I was just like, he was like, please call Murphy, which is a childhood friend of ours, right? I tried. He said, call him, tell him don't go. Now, Rayford already made an agreement with the government, right? But he's still trying to save somebody that he knows is not that type of person, even though he fucked them totally. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Wow. Really like a forgiving kind, kind of Christian man. Oh, he was a God. Listen, definitely bleeding God, like even back then. Like I said, everything came out of his mouth. It was never in attention to hurt nobody. Yeah, we were selling drugs.

But I can tell you what, if Johnny Mother was on drugs, Rayford wouldn't sell it. He said, y'all, I better not sell her shit. You know, he said, I'm telling y'all. I'm going to cut you all off. I mean, he couldn't save everybody. No. You know, if people are going to be on drugs, they're going to be on drugs.

And they certainly were. So you're 11 whipping a teenage Kingpins beamer to school when you're fifth-sixth grade. Wow. Police actually broke my thumb driving that car. They pulled me over. I got out, locked the doors, went in the building. Came back two hours later. They did something to the car.

They took the plug, spark plug. It was a convertible. So I get in the car, they pulled me out. They break my thumb. Oh, a rifle coming to get you in this car. All along, my mom came with Rayful and his sister. They gave a car back, but they said, oh, he fell and broke his thumb. My mom was like, oh, shit.

When was you driving? I was like, oh, shit. My mother was going off, and I was just like, God damn, cat out the bag now. So then did you keep going to school? that now the hell yeah so ravel didn't play that shit to be honest with you if you check his school records Vali Victorian best dress

most popular Was he really a valedictorian of his high school? Hell yeah Did he have offers? Did he have D1 offers? He was gonna go to Joe's town Okay then what happened with that? Selling drugs

He was gonna go So did he lose the scholarship or did he Did the drug money just got so huge The drug money just got so big and I mean everywhere you went with him, it was almost like, they could rape him. Sometimes that shit was ignoring, you know what I mean? Because people don't even know him and be, you know,

running up. I'd be like, what the hell? But how did the drug business progress? And when did you start to see the cocaine start to become bigger than the water than the PCP? So that water went, Rayford was trying to get away from that shit because back then we had water where shit,

shit, we had a young lady to actually put her baby in the microwave, you know, launching off PCP. Yeah. He was like, we got to get away from that shit. Yeah. You know, he really, he was right, though, because people would come up and trying to bite you all type of. The shit we had was good.

Right. Women taking their clothes off, walking down the street. What was the plug? Where do you get wholesale PCP from? So we was getting from California. Okay, explain that a little bit. So it was a guy named Waterhead Bow. They call them Flood.

or whatever, Clint. At the time, I don't know how the hell of Rayful meant him. But a couple of California dudes coming back and forth. We go to Atlantic City. We go to Vegas. And he was getting gallons and gallons of that shit straight from California. And I used to be like, damn. So he was like, we're going to start selling, you know, bricks.

He was like, it's a little bit more safer. Ray ain't believing that heroin. You know what I mean? Like our neighborhood was a street. dope strips. Right. Heroin was huge in D.C. Yeah, it was huge, but it was slow money, but it was guaranteed money.

Right. I can tell you that much. That opioid addiction. His father was in the game or his mother? His father. See, people always talk trash. His dad, he hung in New Jersey, Philly, that type of area, D.C. Well known in that Italian type of setting.

You know what I mean? Like, you go to Atlantic City? Shit, I was a kid. I remember. Shit, I'm standing at the table. they gambling. And Rachel Farber was like, no, he with us. And then, you know, they was like, oh, he got to go upstairs, though.

He said after this roll, they're shooting dice. And I'm like, that's how I got into the gambling shit, because I was like, damn, Rayful just won almost 200,000. Wow. Shooting dice. So they would bring you, he would bring you to Vegas to meet the Connects or wherever, Atlantic City? Wherever we went, like I said, I damn near every instance I was with him when he went out of town.

But not just me, it was a lot of us. You know what I mean? And you can go back and check the records, 10, 12 of us. You know what I mean? I remember when we went to California, when we started getting bricks and stuff, Melvin Butler, our co-defendant, he was like, y'all come on up.

So we get off the plane. He was like, y'all got to take that shit off. And we was like, take what all? All of us had on Gucci sweatsuits with red in it. And I was like, I'm not changing my clothes. You know, it's red and green. He was like, you can't wear that shit where we're going. We're going to Hoover.

He was naming the sunstrip, strip and all this stuff. I was like, and no bullshit. We got to where they ride on a strip, and some goddamn crips came and was like, Melvin, what the fuck is this? And they was talking to me and me go. They was like, who the fuck is these bums? And we like, and Ray was like, hold on, time out.

You know, how did he smooth that shit off? I do not know. But them L.A. kids loved them out of that day. And the reason was Melvin had control of, like, gangbangers, but he wasn't taking care of him. You know what I mean? Yeah, there's no money in gang banging.

Nah, but when you got to do, like Rayford said, come on, we're going to all the shops, the Gucci shop and stuff. And you're giving gangbangers $5,000 and $10,000 for no reason. And I was like, he said, don't worry. He said, they're going to be on our side no matter what. Right. And I swear to God, that's exactly what happened.

I mean, they was like, we'd come to D.C. if y'all need us to. And that happened before. Yeah. Oh, to put in some work? Hell yeah. They came down here. And we was like, hey, people really don't fight down here because they'll fight at that time. But then when they got down here, I said, y'all don't need guns because these motherfuckers are shooting down here.

Is this like, okay, so this is like 1982, 83? Right, 83. So I'm just trying to picture like 10 or 12, 13-year-olds and a few 18-year-old black kids How do you even get on an airplane when you're that age? Raver used to book that. Oh, shit, man.

I don't even know how... The man was smart. I'm just... I'm not even joking. He was like, tell your mom, you're going with me out of town, tell him we're going to the... See, back then, Sugar Ray Leonard fight, stuff like that.

So you would go to the fights in Vegas. Hell yeah, we went to the fight. That... The fight... I think that was like the most thing that triggered me, made me be like, damn, he's making a lot of money. So he will buy you guys? Front row.

We'd be in front row seats. I could tell you the time Eddie Murphy was pissed. You know what I mean? I never knew who the hell Eddie Murphy was. You know, I knew Richard Pryor from my dad, wrecked, shit like that. So one time we went to the Sugar Ray Leonard fight, Rayford May, let's go sit down.

Me, Frank, Skeeter. We're the youngest ones. We in the same age bracket. So, motherfucker come walking with bodyguards, some girls, and it's a guy in a red, level suit. And he was like, these my seats. And we was like, Frank was like, that's the comedian guy. I was like, these ain't the seats. We got the stubs right here.

Man, they went and got security. Security came. Raffel came back around. Tony Lewis came. And the Usher said, nah, these not your seats. You sitting on the other side. He was like, I always sit on the wrong. right side. And then Rayford was like, you can give my seats. He was like, who the fuck are you?

And Ray was like, look, you can have a seat if you wanted. I can tell my crew to move over there. He was like, nah, but I want to know who you are. And they had a conversation. And then Rayford was like, you know, you're the comedian guy. We don't go see him tonight, you know, at the comedy show. And shit, like Clark, where we went there free, we had front row seats. And I was like, this guy, funny is here. And then 48 hours was coming out in all. that. I was like, man, we met this bastard. You know what I mean? So Ray just, he just carried himself with the charisma that got people's respect instantly. Yeah, and there wasn't no tough guy stuff. No. You know what I mean? And that's what, like, like now when you hear people, he got my uncle

killed, my mother on drugs, I'd be like, you're only 22 years old. You don't even know what you're talking about. You know what I mean? Like now, you know, it's people telling me stories. I got people on my job, talk about rifle, me. And I'd be sitting there like, do I say something? You know, I just let him talk. Yeah. He'd be like, yeah, he told him my uncle, I was on that case. And I'm like, it was 31 of us. I don't know you. But I can't say nothing. Yeah. You know, I mean, I don't lost a job because of there shit. Okay. So it's, it's about 83. He's now starting to pick up bricks of cocaine from L.A. Yeah, L.A. He doesn't have the, the cartel plug yet. Not yet.

It sounds like, right? He's just picking it up from... So the same guy, Waterhead Bow and him. Waterhead Bow. And then, you know, Melvin started getting more in the picture. He started traveling back down to D.C., you know, to see what Ray was doing. Like, Melvin didn't have the money, but he had the connects. And then the gangbanger shit, you know, that helped you because, you know, they protected whoever, but not getting paid.

Bo Bennett was a good dude. When you seen him, you didn't think he had money. I mean, no flashy shit. He used to look at Rayford and be like, God damn, your earring's cost, don't they? And Ray would be like, oh, yeah, I probably pay 50 for this one stud. He was like, you're crazy. You know, Rolex, $100,000.

Bowes would be like, man, I'm not to see how much money you're making. You make it more than me. And we used to laugh because I'd be like, but Rayful getting the shit through them. And then he got more people loving him than that they love him. You know what I mean? So then how were you getting the birds originally back to D.C.? And then how would you guys sell it out?

Shit, Raffa was getting at the time, probably 1,500 bricks at the time. 1,500? We started off big. Just getting middle-maned? Yep, middle-man. Wow. And his brother, which is my brother, Melvo, his name Melville, he would never think in a million years that he was involved in anything.

He had dried that shit back in the RV. just drive it back, get him a girl, and drive that shit all the way back. We used to be laughing when he'd get back. He used to be like, man, I'm so tired. We'd be like, where are you going? He said, I'm going to work. And then he go to his job. Yeah. You guys, one of the things that I've tried to focus on most this year is improving my health, but I don't have insurance. I just won't pay for it. It's a rip-off. A lot of people can afford insurance, but you know that you don't have it because you rarely go to the doctor. But when you do need to go, it's hundreds of dollars. just to get your blood drawn to get you started on the process of being healthy.

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the best health while getting around the insurance companies. This is the wave of the future. Go check them out, superpower.com slash gift. So you got 1,500 bricks. What was the ticket on that when he was getting middle-manned? Shit, Ray was paying like 12 for him at the time. 12 G's. 12.

So back down at home, we was getting 30, 45. Oh, my God. So I was selling ounces on my own. I was charging 1,100 ounce. You got 36 ounces in the key. You know what I mean? And I used to kill them. And Ray was like, oh, what you're doing that?

But I maintained doing it because we didn't want to sell ounces on none of the strips. and I sold straight powder. It wasn't no cookup at the time. Rayf was like, how the fuck you be selling it that fast? I'm like, this is the word of the mouth. And they know it's not stepped on. And like I said, he'd give me the price of that. He'd be like, well, you only owe me to 12.

But you know me, I'd be like, look, this is all the money. We're going to do this, you know. But Rayford was just the type, like, no, man, save your money. I ain't had no bank account. What I was going to do with this shit? I used to hire money out back. You still living with your parents? Still with my mom and dad.

But I stay at Rayful House, Rayful Mother House. Rayful Mom and my mom is like sisters at the time. His ass better be at school in the morning. Rayford would be like, bye, take the car. Or then I had little dirt bikes and shit at the time, motorcycles. He was like, man, drive the car. And I used to park the car far from school.

Because I was like, everybody was going to say, who cars this? Who cars that? I mean, you know, he had the range rovers, the old ones. The old blazer. I think I didn't drove very damn thing he had the 928s he had red, white and black

the Mercedes gold trimming I think I didn't drove very down near one of them cars to school and you know people should be like Rafeo little son somebody gonna kidnap him you know all that type of shit

and I was like people ain't gonna fuck with me because they know what's gonna happen you know not because of rifle it was the guys with us you know what I mean they was not going to let Even if Rafer would say let it go, they'd be like,

Rayford will be mad because they're going to go do something. And then he's going to light him up. You know, he'll be saying, man, I told y'all. He owed me, don't worry about it. We just won't give him nothing else. And that's just the type of dude he was. Oh, wow. Okay, so how did you guys, was he also starting to wholesale?

We're out of town or starting to come to D.C. to pick up work from him? Or were you guys keeping it all for yourselves? So, Ravel started branching out. You know, so he still played basketball. I'm talking about he still had his seven people that play with him. Yeah. They beat anybody as in the city. Wow.

And if they would have went to New York and played, they would have beat whoever they're in there. I guarantee you. Uh-huh. So, you know, doing the basketball thing, you could see everybody coming, up-and-coming drug dealers or whoever he's fronting. Like, we might be giving Johnny a hundred bricks.

He'd given him to Steve. but Steve don't know they came from Rayful and be talking, you know, shit, be like, yeah, my man, I don't got to get nothing from Rayful. We used to be like, this dummy. Like a lot of the people they name now from the city, like big names, I'm telling you, they weren't their shit.

Came from Ray. I'm telling you a game from him. They can say whatever they want to say. We know this, and Rafe didn't mind. He'd be like, oh, you said you got that from Mike. you got it for me you know but people like now they don't know the story

you know like me if I got something I wouldn't say I got it from Raven but everybody knew that but you know everybody got their own story about him the man was a good good good guy so he's like what like 20 years old now

19 20 years old millionaire oh he was a million been millionaire he was a millionaire because I mean I knew it I mean I knew it when we started going to our main strip, what kingpin, you know, still going to go to the neighborhoods, like where we grew up and be out there on a Friday. He'd be like, we're going to go count this money.

So I go with them, probably two or three of us. I hate it going because my fucking hands hurt. I ain't want to count no money. And ones, fives, and tens, he didn't keep. We put all that shit in trash bags. The ones, the fives, or tens. And I used to be like, man, I'm going to keep the best. bag with all the tens in it.

He'd be like, White, you can't keep everything. We're going around the neighborhood, and he'd get that shit away. He'd dump it out in the middle of street. See, the courts, nobody wants to say that part. You know, I'm talking about, like, dump it out, and that's a lot of money every Friday. You understand? And then... I mean, the fiends are just going to give it right back to him, but...

Yeah, but it wasn't even like, Feen. It was like, the homeowners. You know, everybody come out there. You had people fighting for that shit, and he'd be like, we're not doing that. So, you know, every Friday, it was like... payroll. Everybody was on the clock. We go out there to pay him. And usually, you know, he don't be involved with the money in the bags. He would bust the bags and be like, huh? And just start dumping it out. You know what I mean? Even in court, the prosecutor was just like, well,

we don't want to talk about that. And then, you know, the witness was like, well, you asked me to tell the truth. Do I think he did more, huh? No. And you know, they don't want a witness to say that. How much were you guys counting up every Friday that you would, you would, Keep. Shit. It was over a million, just that one strip. It was bringing in a million. One strip every week.

And I was mostly powder. We weren't even, and we didn't get to the rock part yet. Yeah, we're going to get to that. How many strips did you guys have? Shit. Every stream of D.C. was rifles, but them two in our area, Orleans and Morton, that was the money strips. Everybody knew you can't go around there trying to sell nothing. You better not.

You're going to get killed or something. You know, they knew the guys that I called my uncle, my coat. defendants. Jerry and Antonio, they weren't going for that shit. You know what I mean? It was just an unwritten rule. Don't sell nothing around there in a two, three-mile radius. Oh, you're going to have a problem. Mm-hmm. So you guys had about, I think you told me he had about 30 strips at one point. 30 strips through the whole city. I mean, then you had, so he's doing about 20, I don't know, 20, 30 million a week. Ray was killing them. And that's wholesale.

Wholesale. So when we got to that wholesale, part. It was a thing, we went to California, and there was some stuff called comeback. And they was doing that all in LA. And we was like, and then New York, because we went to New York, and they was like, oh, we got this comeback to make it hard. And Ray was like, I'd rather just cook it straight up, you know. And then people's like, you're losing. When you do that, he didn't care. So what he did was, we're going to take these thousand bricks, all that's cooked straight up. Take them thousand and we're going to cut them with the comeback

because all it did is swell it up a little bit. It was better than bacon soda. All that shit sold wholesale. Believe it or not, the wholesale shit was gone before the regular shit because, you know, you had people that said, damn, I got $2,000. I'm going to buy all this shit. I'm going to make me $10,000

and $12,000. And it was good. But, you know, sometimes the shit melt. You know what I mean? So comeback isn't rock. Yeah. Rock. It's rock. But comeback is a, it was an air freshen that you cooked the Coke with. All right. Where did it disappear? I have the slightest idea.

I remember we brought like cases and cases of that shit from California. It was air freshener. Wow. And I was like, I learned how to cook Coke so good and easy. I mean, it was just like, well, I'm going to put that on there and I know how to cook it raw and I can sell it faster. But when you put that comeback on it, it was still good. Yeah. It was like, you know, you couldn't really. tell the difference.

How did you cook up a thousand keys? It sounds like it would take forever. It didn't. I ain't want to even joke to you. Because sometimes if you didn't, you might sell $5,100 quick.

You know what I mean? Somebody buying something front of them, some. That shit was an all-week process. I'm not bullshit. One time I was in there and I was fucking high. You know, where I'd have touched it somewhere.

I was like, God damn, I'm dizzy. And Ray was like, I don't want you doing that shit no more. You know what I was like, Fuck, I like doing it. You know? It takes a long time, but it dries so quick. So people don't understand that.

The hard part is bagging that shit up. We would cook it up and then give it some of yours and let them bag it. Why he trusted people? I don't know. But it was always right, though. He'd be like, no, I know how many 50s we're supposed to have. I know how many much money you got to pick up? And I was like, how he'd do this math without no calculator?

But he was good at that shit. So you guys would have thousands of keys of crap. A thousand keys of crap. And you had stash houses, different stash houses throughout D.C.? Hardshows everywhere, yeah. And it'd be so funny. One time it was stash house right in Georgetown. Nice neighborhood.

Yeah. Politicians living there. You would never think that. We shop in Georgetown. And then one day I was like, where are we going? He was like, come on, we're taking the walk. I didn't even know the shit. And then he was like, come on.

A white lady opened the door. And I'm like, I said, Ray must be hump at her. but he wasn't. He was like, come on, we go on the basement. I was like, God damn, you pull this one off. You know what I mean? This lady looked like she ain't going to do no type of crime in the world.

And to this day, she wasn't bringing our case at all. I heard that the shops, the high-end shops, they would close down just so you guys and Ray could go shopping, right? Hell yeah, so you had at the time, you had a store called racket and jog, which was like an athletic store. Don't know that's play fucking tennis.

But, you know, back then, you know, girls were tennis skirts, the guys wore the little filar stuff. They shut the whole store there. If somebody in it, they put them out. The linen and boutique store that was in Georgetown Plaza. All they sold was resashi, Gucci, stuff like that. And when I tell you, a shirt cost fucking $8,000, I was like, Rayford on the Lord's his damn mind back there.

In the 80s. Yeah, I was like, that ugly, you know, I used to be like, that ugly shit. Right. You know, dress shoes. Why do you have to stop wearing tennis shoes? The gaiters cost $3,000. I was like, that shit hurt your feet.

I mean, I got old pictures of that, you know. They shut that whole shit down. And, you know, people would be coming like, who the fuck in the store? You know, one time, EZE, you might remember back then, he came, he was going to the White House or trying to go to a dinner.

Easy E's E. He couldn't get into the Linnat Petit. And he had a fucking fit. And he was like, I know this dude. You know, we come out. And he was like, you Melvin Butler guy. Ray was like, yeah, what's up? You know, they're talking.

So easy. It was like a thing to me. I was like, man, I'm wearing Raider shit and all that. I was like, let me just be calm. And then I was like, he acting like that. The Rayful, like I'm going to act to him. Yeah, he was acting like a fan when he met Ray. And listen, they opened the store up and let Easy in all the customers in.

After Rayful left out. Yeah. He was like, that guy just spent almost 100,000. He was like, what the fuck? You know, so that was the type of dude he was. How would you describe the structure of the organization? Like, was it basically just little dudes like you that were family to Ray, running the, you know, guarding the work, making sure that the people you fronted came back with the money?

Like, how would you describe it compared to, like, you know, a cartel today for people to understand? See, like that cartel shit, I think, is a little different. Rayful Damny had his whole family involved, except one of his sisters and his mom. They was totally not involved in our case, but they went to jail. His cousin Johnny was his man. You know, they was real close. You know, they grew up together.

But Ray, if he trusts you, it was something different. Everybody had a problem because he trusted me being a younger kid. I don't know what it was. I looked up to him like my dad, to be honest. You know what I mean? Even though my dad was in the house, he was a damn child abusing. You know what I mean? Ray had his structure real good.

So one of our main strips, his brother, well, Manji's dead now, his name, he Mangostood. That was my guy. I mean, he was one of Rayful, bro, but he was so old school thorough. I mean, he ran the strips at the time. Tony on jury everybody was scared of their ass Maryland, D.C., Virginia, Florida, New York, whatever the case was,

they knew them two motherfuckers are a bangy. So, and were they related to Ray or just friends? They weren't related. Me and those two wasn't related at all. And they were the killers? They'd kill your ass. Yes. Do you recall them having to go

see anybody from out of town that ran off with the work? or... Well, we ain't having none of that, really. Like, we had something that fucked up money. Guess what? They came back with the person and the money. And Rachel told them, don't worry about it.

So that's how them two guys was. Tonyo was a little bit more vocal. He's home now, too. He was vocal where I'm going to kill your ass. Jerry was the one you had to be like, fuck, this mother, I'm going to say shit. I think he's going to kill me. Yeah, that's my heart right there.

We are extremely close. So where did this violence come from? Because everybody knows, like, D.C. was known as, like, the murder capital back in this era. So if Ray's not doing the killing, where do you think all of this bloodshed is coming from? See, so they give us the beef, but really all that killing didn't really start kicking off until we was being indicted. So the news media and people don't tell you that shit, you know what I mean? the pissy-ass judge, he dead now, Charles Ritchie. He had a nerd to tell me that, oh, you're the cause of my son dying.

His son died from crack, right? And we're looking at him like, if your son was a crackhead, that's your problem because we're in jail and crack ain't even been around that long. But the murders really start happening when we started being investigated. We knew we was under indictment. You know, the police was following us every damn way. Rafe thought it was like comedy. He'd walk up to the police cars and be like,

hey, y'all ran through that light back there. He said, but we're going to go in Houston's. If y'all want to eat, come on in. So, you know, I'm looking like, man, why are you playing with these people? You know what I'm saying? We went in Neiman Marcus. Rafeo birthday was going to be that weekend, I believe.

So he don't know all of us got money, and we're trying to surprise him. It was a fur coat and a hat to go with it. You know, we can't afford that shit. shit like he was doing, shoes 4,000, and Nema Marcus. We in Wisconsin Avenue up at the top of Northwest. So we went in there, and we was like, damn, the police didn't follow us up, you know, to the store. So when we went in there, you know, me and Little Frankis, which is his cousin, we was the youngest.

I said, that lady looked familiar. But, you know, we let it go. So we picked out a fur coat. Everybody was like, all right, here's my 5,000, he could have your old. So we're going to pay cash for this coat and some shit Ray for spending, he's picking up shit That's probably going to be like 40,000 But you know back then

Stores was taking that money Yeah They weren't caring about no 9,999 No, they were taking cash Fuck yeah So the lady was like Well, I want to, y'all are paying cash We need you to come right into this little back room

So we can count the money But I already got mine in thousands I said something wrong Ain't no customers in this bitch, you know. And then Ray was like, yeah, something up. The DEA and the feds came in the store. They took all our money. They called my mom, Frank Mom, because we're juveniles.

And they was like, we're taking all this money. And Ray was like, you're going to give me a receipt. He was like, give you a receipt. He said, you're going to get a receipt. He said, no worry, I'll be back to buy this shit to mom. But they kept me and Frank, and our moms had to come and get us. I was mad at his head. I was like, my mother going to kill me.

Mother whooped my ass, Rayful out there, seven district laughing. He was like, we ain't do nothing. They just took the money from us. I don't know what's going on. But we knew he was,

you know, he said the police that gave him the word that they on us. It's hot. Why would your mother whoop your ass if she knows what you're doing with Ray?

She never knew. You know, people think she knew. But I never, my mother never said I was selling drugs or anything. You know, I'm just hanging with them. But my mom was like,

they keep saying he a big drug dealer where'd get these cars from I said playing basketball mom his mom and dad got money there's no way they believe that nah she didn't at the end you know she was just like

they told me somebody was shooting you know at the go go and it was you and somebody I'd just be like they want me ma'am you know my father didn't believe that shit

I don't want him hanging around him you know so that's what me and him stopped bumping heads and I'm like mom's staying at Boozy house she said, As long as you go to school, you know, Rayful mother and my mom was close.

So she was like, he better go to school. So his mother didn't play that shit. If I'm there, go to school. But you know it started getting hard because I'm in class, beeper going off.

I'm like, fuck. I said, I got to wait people in school. Man, they got money. Why are he driving that Porsche to school? You were driving a Porsche to high school. I remember when Scarface movie came out.

And I don't think you were 16 yet. Nope. I could tell your story about that, too. That's all in our court papers. Sure, let's hear it. So it was a Thursday. I think it was around my birthday, too. Ray was like, I need you. Somebody going to give you a ride. You need to go out Alexandria to the Porsche dealer. I said, okay, what I'm doing? He said, you're going to pick up my car. He's like, bring the car back and park it and I'm going to read his house.

He said, because you're going on me out of town. So he gave me the money. I was like, who I'm giving this to? He said, just going in and ask for the city. He knows you coming. So I got like $75,000 in my possession. I get there, this Italian-looking guy come out. He's like, you white? And the guy whooped me is older, and he was like, oh, you white.

And the dude was like, that's white. And he was like, come on, let's go to the office. He said, the car already. So I was like, okay. And I'm looking at this red portion. I was like, I noticed I ain't rightful car on the floor. And God damn it. He said, you're not a drive?

I said, yeah. I said, I learned. Rayford told me how to drive. And he was like, you sure. He said, this money, we're going to count it. So he was like, it's $100 short. I said, bullshit. I know it ain't.

So it was like 120s, right? He said, well, this is short here. I said, no, it's not. It's 50s, that's $1,000. You got 120s right there. And I said, that's all hundreds. The guy was running game, you know, trying to be fun. money. He gave me the keys. Everybody in the porch dealer was like, that little guy, I said,

y'all going to take it out because I don't want to hit the doors, you know, going out. They took it out. When I tell you, I rode it all through D.C. with that car, I ain't listened to Rafa at all. I rode through D.C. I was like, everybody was like, man, that's the Scarface Porsche. But I ain't know the movie, you know what I mean? Oh, my goodness. I mean, this is out of control. So tell us about how much. How do you? How do you? how he found when he really gets connected with the Colombians. So when he really got connected with the Cummins, we was at a fight.

It was in the Vegas fight again. Sometimes we went to the fight, and I didn't even watch this shit. You know, I was just fantasizing about all the people there. You know, I'm like, damn, we can walk around. Look at these stars, you know, athletes. Melvin and Ray walked off. He said, I got to connect. And we was just like, you already got money.

You know what I mean? He said, it's going to be some shit that's going to come, and we got to see what it was. When we got home, it was a hundred bricks and they had like little scorpions on top of it. I remember that shit, and that shit was potent. I mean, it was taped and everything. But I'm telling you, when you got in the house, you can smell it. And he was like, hey, y'all got to get a mask. He said, I'm going to let y'all deal with this shit.

And we bust that shit open? He was like, why don't want you in here? he was like, we're going to get money, money now. But he was like, I don't want to do this shit no more. That's what Ray said? Yeah, he said, he said, man, I just do it for everybody else. He said, he said, I don't want to do this shit no more. And I just look at him like, why don't you just quit?

You know, he said, nobody really ever quits. He said, you know, it's one way you're going. You're going to jail. You're going to die. He said, but I'm going to make it out of this one. and I used to be like, why he talk like that? You know what I mean? He's seen a good picture and everything.

He was like, I'm a good dude. He said, I'm going to beat dogs. Wow. So he did have a plan to get out? He wanted to get out. But like I told you, it was always family members, friends, somebody was in the need or something. Like, people don't tell the stories. Raveo brought a bicycle shop.

Shit, who will make money off a bicycle shop? In D.C. Northeast? Nobody. He had that. The police didn't even know that. You know, people cleaners, Chinese lady running it. You know what I mean? And I didn't even know that.

I was like, how the fuck he got keys to this Chinese lady cleaners? So he was trying to go legit by washing his money? Well, he was like looking out for somebody else. They wanted his name, you know. It's still people already had houses that he paid for. Right. Cars. You know, did they do anything for him when he was in jail?

Hell no. Yeah, and mostly it's just back then you could, if somebody was down bad, you just give him a couple of keys and you change their life. So he had a lot of drug dealers depending on him, too. Let's be honest. A lot of them, man. A lot of them. Like even you think back now, if you hear some DC stories, people, they throw up names. Michael Frey.

He was getting shit from Ray. He ain't ever take nothing from Ray. I'm going on the record of saying that. And everybody on my case can back it up. the ones that's still alive. Tony or Jerry, they can back it up. You know what I mean?

But if you listen to stories, you know, people would be like, oh, Michael Frey was, he ran D.C. He didn't run nothing with us. So we hear that like from, you know, movies like Payton Full and, you know, a lot of New York cats

that we've had on, like, D.C. was the place that out of towners would go because the price was higher. But how does that make sense if Ray had the best price Right, because to be a kingpin on this level, you have the most merchandise, the best quality, and the ticket is the lowest. So talk about that. So that shit didn't happen until we was going in.

You understand? So you already got locked up. Yeah, we locked up. So people tell all them stories. Alpo. I know him personally. Right. He wasn't no bitch.

So I'm going to go on a record and saying that shit. And he told or whatever they want to say. But guess what? Nobody wants to step into him. you know what I mean Was he taking work from Ray? No, when Ray, nah, he didn't come around until when we was going in.

Okay. You know what I mean? So he wasn't even making no money like people were saying. Right. Until after we was gone. You know what I'm saying? You had another kid named L.A. Roy. If you do your homework,

he was more popular than Alpo, more thorough and everything. I mean, he even escaped from the feds before. So if you looked that up, now he was coming down once when we was great to go in. But nobody can beat Ray prices, man. I'm telling you, we was getting 30, 38 a brick.

People weren't getting that. And Ray was paying 12 for that shit. And I think before we went in, he probably was paying nine. Oh, my God. So, you know, you got to do the math. And Ray be like, why are you trying to sell it for 30? Shit. He was like, just selling for $25.

I was like, no. You know, and I was a kid. You know, he was like, don't even stress yourself. You know, I'd be like, Ray, I'm going to take $10. 10 of these, 20 these. I know I'm going to do something with it. And he's always telling me no, why are you hustling? I mean, Ray will take care of me if I needed it.

He was like, you just want your hands in something and trying to get your own money. And I'd be like, I was around him, but I wasn't a handout, you know what I mean? I really love a dude like my dad, you know what I'm saying? So you guys kept, once you had the Colombian plug, by the way, do you know how Ray met them, how Ray got in touch with them?

and Waterhead Bowen. Why would they give him the plug? Well, they ain't have a choice because once Ray started going back and forth to California and they finally found out who he was, they was like, okay, these cats are right here ain't doing what they said they was doing. Oh, so they just went around the L.A. dudes, the Colombians.

So it was at the point where, like, Waterhead Bow, he wasn't offended because he was like, shit, he's moving more shit than I can possibly ever move. Right. You know, and then when I really figured out, like, how he was doing, we started going to Detroit and shit like that, Florida. I was like, all the shit coming in and through Florida, why is he giving somebody some shit down there?

You know what I mean? That's when you knew it was just like people really fuck with him because I know some prices had to be cheaper in Florida. But they was like the product that he has, that shit is good. Right. It was almost like Heron. You know, you could put a three on it.

Wow. You know, and like I told you, it was potent, man. I'm telling you, like bleeding through the bag type shit. And L.A. was the spot. Great love, L.A. That was the pickup spot. Yeah, L.A. Well, one time, no, it was closer.

I mean, even one time in Detroit, why I don't know. But we went to Detroit, and I was like, this is a broke-down-ass town with pimps and, you know, whores. Yeah. That was the money down there in Huron, you know what I mean? Right. And I used to say, well, we don't sell heroin. And then I figured it out. He was like, oh, no, I just had somebody to drop something here.

Yeah. But I knew why, because he was supplying people that didn't even know they was getting it from. You know what I mean? You guys, I've been using Rocket Money for over a year, and it's helped me save hundreds of dollars on unwanted subscriptions. I'm just like you. Everything in my life is a subscription. And half of the things I forgot that I even subscribed to, most of them I don't even need. Rocket Money is an app, a tool that helps you track all of your online payments and all of your automatic subscriptions.

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It's just like, okay, he said he'll go to money or, you know, whoever was going to meet us there had the money. And I'd just be a, you know, yeah, Johnny made it. You know, and that's it. What was the typical re-up? How many bricks? Shit, it was 2,500 or more every time, every time. What was that like being 16 years old

looking at two tons of cocaine, two and a half tons of cocaine? It was like, at the first time I, you know, it was like, the fuck is all this shit. You know, but after that, it just got kind of normal. You know what I'm saying? And I knew that shit was going to be gone before we even get home. We know who getting it, where it's going, how much going to the strips. Yeah.

Okay, out of 2,500 bricks, give us an example roughly. Like, how much would stay in D.C. on the strips to be sold retail, how much was getting... 500 was definitely going to our strips. Right. And it was being bagged up. You got to think, dime bags, 20 bags, 50 bags. Oh, my God. So you're getting every damn bitter all your money out of it.

Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you say the average person paying, so Ray paying 12. Over brick, you know how much he's making off if he sell dimes? That's a lot of shit. Insane. Yeah, and even if you lose the money and we didn't take no shorts. So, you know, all these stories, you have people saying, oh, I got $5 worth of change. Nobody never came to our strip with quarters and shit or short because the shit was good.

And they knew Tony and the jury was going to be like, or imagine, oh, we don't take shorts. you know they might go five miles somewhere else and get something from somebody else and pay $8. Yeah. But it wasn't worth it though. Yeah. Go get two more dollars. Yeah, that's how it was. They wouldn't take, you wouldn't even get in that line.

And where were the people that were picking up wholesale, where from out of town were they coming from? Shit, everywhere. It was people sometime. I'm going to tell you the story when one time, so around 4th and M. That's where Ray Aunt lived. That was just like a spot. Sometimes we just pull up. and be out there or at the house, 4-7M Street.

I remember one time a guy pulled up in a Porsche. So, you know, we know everybody. I'm standing outside kids older than me, some my age. And the dude was like, hey, why are he? And I'm not answering this motherfucker. I got Virginia tags. I said, nobody in this city got a 928. And it's an older one.

I said, nobody but Ravel and Tony Lewis. He was like, oh, I wonder how. call at you, young guy. So at this time, I don't know who he is. I'm just thinking there's some, so one of my friends was like, I'm going to see what he want. He went to the car, and then I said, who is it? He said, I don't know, but I'm about to give him all baking soda and sheetrock.

I think he's the police. So I was like, go ahead. I said, what do you tell him? He said, he wanted a quarter key. He told the guy to pull down the street, not like shit. He went and sold it to him. right, got like $6,500. He said, but when he was looking in the mirror,

he said he seen the dude right in that his tag number. He was driving a citation, my buddy. One of them old little citations. Troy, our cold offender too, so he got locked up with us. He was like, man, I think that nigga, the police. And I was like, I said, told you. Nobody

in the city got a post. I said, and he looked too young to even have that shit. So when our case came about, they tried to give me a conspiracy on that also saying I told him to go sell them sheetrock and bacon soda. So I said to my lawyer, I said, how are they going to charge me for that? You took government funds.

Troy got five years for that shit. Just for selling not drugs. Not drugs. That's five years. And he's one of our co-definners that actually went on the run, like when they was coming to get us, him and Antonio Jones. They went on the run. Tonyo was on sit, Merckis Most Wanted.

So, you know, I was pissed. And then the dude walked in And he said, yeah, Whitey told him to give it to me So this guy was 19 years old, just turned 19 Metropon, the police sent him to the DEA And said he can be, you know, stop working and getting But he didn't do nothing I said, I didn't give it to him

And I didn't tell nobody to give it to him But I said, I knew it wasn't right. You know what I mean? You sniffed it out. But it was baking soda and sheet rock. Yeah, it's like a Scarface. It's like a ghetto boy song. Yeah, and then the bullshit, they said government funds.

I was like, that is crazy. Accept it. You can't accept government funds? What the fuck is that, dude? That shit is, it's goddamn law, too. I mean, they're just so dirty. It boggles the mind. And then that same guy, he actually tried to, like, come back again.

And we was like, Troy sold him, bacon sold his sheet rock. Right. A real. So everybody was like, one of our friends pulled a pistol. was like, get your ass from around here. He never came back. So, but, you know, we found out later he was working with the DEA and the FBI. He wasn't good at that shit.

Yeah. Because I was like, you let Troy see you right down the tag number. Right. So who are your, so, but then you had real big time drug crews from, from all over the Northeast coming in and picking up hundreds at a time? Only certain people was not even getting a hundred. They might get 50, 20. You had a couple of guys that was putting their money together.

Yeah. And then Rayford said, whatever you buy, we front you. Wow. He fronted a lot of people, man. And like I said, to this day, people don't try to speak on that shit. I know firsthand. Yeah. You understand?

And the issue with me is a lot of people didn't like me because of Rayful. I'm going to get money from a grown-up, and they feel insorted, you know. Right. They'd be like, I'm giving this little nigger $100,000. So I'm the one that's. going to go count it. And if it's short, I'm going to come back and say, hey, it's short. You know, I don't have people shorting $50.

Man, that's a petty shit. I was like, no, you can't count. Rayful, no, I'm going to count it. And I'm going to count it right. And I'm not going to take from them. I'm not going to steal from him. And people would be like, hey, man, that little nigger can't count. Ray was like, shit, he can count.

He counted it twice. But, you know, Rayful will get everybody to benefit of the doubt. How fast do you get rid of 2,500 keys? I told you. That shit would be gone. except what's going to the strips because we had to keep the strip cranking you know what I mean

you had to keep it where I'm just telling you the line can be a half a mile long oh my God no listen I mean like it's a grocery store and you know eventually

that shit gonna get hot we had a college which is a deaf college called Gallaudet college um right there on the corner in our neighborhood I mean you even had some deaf kids

like in the line buying fucking powder and crack, you know what I mean? He used to get to the point where the police pull up in ice cream trucks. Like they're selling ice cream. Motherfuckers walk up the ice cream truck and the FBI, DA jump out of it. Fucking taxi cabs.

Shit, we used to pay people $1,500 a week to watch the corner to hollered when the police come. You know, that was some good-ass money if you think about it. Oh, shit. All you doing is hauling 50 police, or they say order raid, which is a pig Latin word.

But I don't watch people get their ass whoop for doing that shit. Like the police turn that corner? Man, they'll beat you to death if they can't catch nobody else. Alley's was real mean, though. Tony on jury. And he one of them was in the military,

but you would think that shit. If you run down the alley, we know the duck, jump, slide. They had barbed wire. I remember one time, we ran there, everybody just gambling. You know, just a regular weekend. police come, people pick up some of the money run,

but you probably got like 10,000, 15,000 on the ground, like a crap game. We've run down the alley, but we look back, and you can see police falling, neck getting cut, because they don't know it's so dark, and then we at the end of the alley laughing like him, and then Rayford would be like, fuck that, let's play with them today.

I'd be like, you're a millionaire. Why are we doing this shit? Somebody go to the storm by all the eggs. That's the type of guy who was. I mean, you wouldn't even think that shit. We go on the store. Hey, I want all the eggs. Where he was like, they still around there, watching the corner, you know, making it where we can't hustle.

Throwing eggs at the police. I used to be like, but they won't do nothing to him. But if they catch one of us, they fucking us up. Those must have been some legendary dice games. Fuck you. The crack era. Tell us about how much money would be in a crack era, D.C. dice game. So, you know, we had crapp houses, too.

Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, we still got some now. Like, people really don't talk. about it because, you know, these youngers are running in and try to rob it. But shit, I mean, man, crap, I was ready for walking in? See, everybody think it was payday, sweet.

He'd be like, who's shooting the dice? They'd be like, you got him. Ray was like, all right, what's the bet? Bet you can't throw a full, under a full. Put all your money on the table, whoever betting it. Like, you got people that just throwing shit on the table. He don't know what it is. He was like, bet, bet, bet, bet, bet. This motherfucker, throw that shit. We're talking about one shot rolls.

You know what I mean? Count that shit. He got 80,000, 100,000. Fuck, dude. And then you got people like, he was like, you want some money back? Because, you know, back in them days, people would be like, you win. You give a person a little bit back. Of course.

Ray would be like, what you want back, but you owe me. They shoot it again and owe again. I'd be like, you're fucking crazy. Because you can't beat long money. Or one of us younger guys, he would be like, no, I'm going to let Whitey shoot the dice. And I'd be like, I don't know. I don't want to be involved. It is shit.

Because if I win, everybody mad at me. Yeah. You know what I mean? If I lose, Rafer don't care. Bet it back. You know? Man, he didn't clean houses.

I mean, $150, $200,000. I mean, just like that. Yeah, you get a house man a couple of dollars because it's his house. Yeah. And you're shooting on a pool table. So, you know, he'd be like, I mean, like, why you bet that much?

He was like, no, we win or we lose. And I just be like, he always win. I mean, always. If he lost, how much money got on you, Johnny, hurry, whitey? Give me that. He said, bet this. Don't know what we gave him. I could say that I gave him 10,000 and wasn't.

He went. He was never worried. He was never concerned. He never, he didn't seem even, like, he even cared about money, really. He didn't, man. It just came to him, but it's almost because it's like that law of the universe, like you just attract it, but you don't, you don't, you don't, hold onto it. Like he almost had like, this is going to sound crazy to say, he almost had like this like Eastern like Buddhist philosophy. He's like, we're just here for a time. I don't

own any of it. I'm just here passing through this life. Yeah. And his thing was, what a fascinating man. And he was just like, everything was positive that like came out of him. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Even when I know I'm shit depressed, you know, ain't nothing Ravel can say to me. But somehow I sit back and think and be like, he said it's going to get better. And bullshit you not something happened and get better. I'd be like, what the fuck? This man in jail, you know, we fighting to get him out. People didn't

know that. You know, his sister, lover, all my heart. Rachel Edmund, Millerton. She used to be like, I don't know if it's going to work. But Rayful and you keep saying and getting out, every time I go visit him, he'd be like, I'm going to be home soon. And I always be like, I'm praying.

I don't think that's the much praying ever did in my life, not even for myself. I was like, he deserved it. I even was at the point where, man, I wish I could trade places with you. You get out and I go in and do your time. And he used to be like, stop saying that. You're going to be out there with me, you know? And I just be like, man, when you get out, I'm going to be so relaxed.

You know what I mean? God damn it. He can make any situation feel like it's going to be positive no matter what. Real born leader. Yeah, I remember. It's a real born leader. I mean, like even in D.C., who you know like a drug dealer, murder, anything,

they have a councilman meetings saying they want people to come and say why he shouldn't get out of jail. They had like five of that shit. I showed up for the first one. So everybody was like, why don't go? I was like, I'm not going to let them bash him like this. We're trying to get this paperwork in this,

so they get, because they owe them good time, never gave it to them. See, people don't realize, Raifle cooperated. He didn't get no time off. People don't know that. Rafe got his own time off. He filed motion after motion.

His sister filed motion. Vince helped file paperwork. We got lawyers. He didn't get no time off for telling him. Only thing he got off was mom getting out. Wow. So people were telling a story. Oh, he got out.

No, the law changed, dummy. You know what I mean? They don't know before he died. Biden was about to partner him. with the dude Southwest T and all of them we got the paperwork he was about to be parted

and he was already out on the leg monitor which he shouldn't have been on but what they didn't realize he didn't tell so I went to this first meeting when I tell you people got up there

on the mic in front of the news media yeah my sister was killed because of him and they was like how old are you she was like 19 my sister was 30

I was like Rachel been in jail over 30 years Long than you've been alive. So you lie. You know, but the news media ain't questioning her, you know what I mean? I had a lady that was sitting beside me the whole time. I don't want his ass out.

He was having people killed and all that. So they was about to close up, right? So one of the prosecutors, he was like, I know you to me. I went hiding. I was sitting like the second row. I waited. They said, we're going to close this up because it looked like the majority of y'all don't want them out. But it was so many older white people, Chinese, that said, he deserved to be out.

He was only locked up for drugs. The people that, they said murders, nobody got found guilty but one person for one murder. I said, I got something to say. They was like, who are you? I was like, my name Harry Sullivan. I was a juvenile on the case. Rafer was like my dad. The lady that was talking shit, she jumped up and hauled ass out of there. The old guy that said something left. I said, every story I heard up here was a lot. They was like, can you tell us? I said, well, I was on the case. I said, so I'm telling you firsthand. The young lady right there can't be telling the truth because she said her sister was 30. He'd been in jail longer than that. So how did he get her killed, you know, or whatever the case might be? And they was like,

and you can see the news guy saying, yeah, his name Whitey, but I didn't say that. I just said, hurry. And I lit their ass up for like 15 minutes. And the news outside trying to follow me to my car. Can we talk to you? I said, I don't have nothing else to say. I said, but y'all holding a meeting about a man ready to go up for a re-sentencing. He didn't tell and get time off.

Tell that part, you know. Man, that shit was all over the news. My mom was like, why did you do that? You know, my job went crazy. I was like, God, damn it. But they did ask me, did he get you to sell drugs? I said, I did it on my own. He didn't make me do anything.

I said he got a life sentence because I was a juvenile selling drugs. That was one of the points he got. You know, giving a juvenile drugs and then by a school. And you know, that shit haunted me, you know what I mean? Because I was like, he didn't make me sell drugs. Do you feel, it does sound like

from the outside looking in, just not knowing you, that this story sounds like what were they were called grooming. He was grooming you from 10 years, years old when he said, saw this little man out there selling dip cigarettes, like, I could train this guy and make him love me so he can, he can sell drugs for me. Yeah, I know people looking at it, but like all our co-defendants and the people that's close to us,

they know, me and share the bond like fucking father and son. Like, he had a son that's younger than me, you know, real young. I even just change his diapers and shit. Well, if he went with us out of town or Vegas or Atlantic City, I'm the goddamn baby. You know what I mean? And I hated that shit. Even though I was young, you know, I couldn't go and go gamble nothing at the time and stuff.

We had like a serious bond. Like that was, my day wasn't right if I ain't get a letter from him and I'm in jail, he in jail. I'm sending him a letter. You know, I'm just talking about everyday shit. Or he's saying, hey, I heard you acting up in the FCI, you know. I'd be like, I'm not acting up, but, you know,

I'm not letting these gay booty band We call our homies get me involved in some dumb shit. You know, and then they say you ain't sticking with the homies. Nah, I don't believe in that shit. And then, you know, I was light skin. Good hair, cat eyes.

Shit, I was baited, you know what I mean? But the thing was, I just won no sucker. I ain't saying I was no gangster or any of that. Anything I got in, or Dave was like, oh, I ain't fucking with him. You know what I mean? I was just steed with it. You know what I mean?

If you were stronger than me, Oh, I know what they do. I got to figure out another way. You know what I mean? So I want to talk about how this all culminated in, like, one of the biggest cases of the crack era. How long after Ray met the Columbian plug? How long was he working with them before the case came down? All the way up until it.

So for a couple of years at least? Yeah, almost like two years. We were going to say coming around. Yeah, about two years and something. But he was buying this shit. See, people didn't know that. It wasn't like a front thing. Ray was like, I'm going to buy my shit, you know.

And then we used to be like, well, he just don't, they're going to give you a credit. I mean, take it. Because Simon. He was like, nah, we'd do that if we need it. They never needed it. So he was COD. Yeah, Ray buying that shit.

So take it to buy 2,500 bricks at, I don't know, say, so it says at least 2.5 million. Hell yeah. I could tell you, I could tell you even, so one time, where he went against us, his name Royal Brooks, one of Rayful childhood friends, Rayford sent him to college. Wow. Right. We went to go count some money.

I was like, how much money we count? He said, got to count four million. We got to make sure it's four million. So I was like, okay, this is going to be all goddamn night. You know, we go count the money, rubber band it up. We get the suitcases. We go meet Royal. Rafe was talking to him.

I don't know what he's saying, but I know he's going to California. This dummy, get on the plane, somebody cut into him, you know, on the flight. Greed got to him. The guy was like, hey, yeah, you know, it's a basketball game, blah, blah, blah. He said, where are you going? You know, cut into him. Royal opened up so much to this guy, which ended up being a DEA agent. he was like yeah I'm trying to get something

for 2.5 million remember now he had four million dollars and the dude was like no I think I can work that out you know we can get it you know the whole time it's a DEA agent they don't even know Royal got money with him the money is going to get there when he get there

Roya go to the hotel call the guy and the fares just come and then he said oh I got to call a rifle you know he called a house which is Rayful Aunt's house at the time. All of us there, except Rayful. And they was like, Roy, you on the phone.

And then everybody was like, Roy, you on the phone? I had a hard ass outside. I said, I got to go find Rayful. We're outside somewhere. He's like, what's up? He said, I'm getting this number saying 911 on the pageer. Somebody calling me a car phone. Roy your ass was busted.

He didn't gave you the fees the $4 million. Oh, my God. So, Rayful, everybody, you know, Tony, O'Jerry, Rayful, everybody, Johnny, all that's talking. I don't got really no say-so, but I'm right there. He's like, come on, whitey-all. I'm going to count four more men. And I was like,

where the fuck you don't get four more million this quick? We ain't got four more million, and he got the shit that he wanted. Wow. So hold on. And did that later become evidence in the indictment, that four million the DEACs? Four million dollars.

Yep. So, okay. How would they get the, how would you get $4 million in re-up money from D.C. to L.A.? All right. He was sending that shit on the airplane. So you'd have a courier. He had somebody to put it on the plane and everything.

Girls. Some of the baddies girls back then they had jobs, you wouldn't even think that they had the way of doing that. Roya was like a, that's a bad taste that I'm all, because Rayford loved that mom. Even after he told, you know what Rayful said? He said, man, I respect that from him. He was on the street guy.

Yeah. And we used to be like, we wouldn't even be in this predicament. You know. Clearly not. They changed his name. He couldn't tell nothing but the money. He couldn't tell nothing else. They said, who you get the money from?

Rifle. Out of his hand? Yes. Not like shit. You didn't get the money from a rifle. But he ended up changing his name. So $4 million gets you 4,000 keys. Holy shit.

He was killing. That is. And this is why we under investigation. Yeah. Okay. So how would you guys get 4,000 joints across the country? Whoever this, the Columbia was, they had that shit set and then Melboe go pick it up. His brother go get it.

Oh, so you guys didn't even have to drive it. They didn't even have to drive it. They delivered it to you. Oh, they delivered close. Baltimore, Delaware. It got easier, you know what I mean? Melbourne ain't had to drive for him. But Melbourne got balls better than anybody I know, man.

We joke about this shit every other day now. I said, you weren't scared? He was like, hell no. I'm just driving. Wow. You know. How, but 4,000 kilos, how, what vehicle are you taking that in? You got to break that.

They don't have everything. They don't have a big-ass 26-foot box truck. You thinking this goddamn beans and potatoes. Shit, stash spot, the RV. The whole bottom of the RV is fucking bricks. You know, it got so easy then. Then, you know, everybody started having these stash spots. You know what I mean?

And then where do you warehouse 4,000 keys as they're being passed out? Oh, he's sitting everywhere. No, we already knew Keith coming to get 500, somebody coming to get 100, the strip getting these, this person getting that, and then we had shit that we just knew it's going to sell later.

You know what I mean? But Ray had it planned out. Right. So everything would be out of his hand don't mean it was paid for yet, but it'd be all out of it. It'd be all gone. And when the money comes back, you know, say like 4,000 keys, you guys sell them for an average of 25,000,

let's just say 20,000 the low end. 25 probably was the lowest back then we was giving it to somebody. Okay, yeah. So say it's, say it's like 12, 15 million that comes back off of $4 million

investment. Where would that 12 million, like, did he have, did he have different, I mean, where was he keeping that kind of cash? Different places,

different houses. Shit, we could be in a different part of town and Ray can say, oh, and I got to make a stop, go get 100, 200,000, you'd be like, who the fuck house is this?

You know what I mean? Some stuff he did, to itself. Yeah. But me riding with him, I just observe and pay attention. You know what I mean? Shit, he ain't never keep nothing from me. That's why I said, if I had to, he'd know.

I ought to took a bullet for his ass. So he had, when you talk about people that were either helping him directly or indirectly, even if it was just stashing money, he had hundreds of people that were cooperating with him. Cooperating with him. And to this day, it's some people that have never been mentioned. You know what I mean? Yeah.

To this day. I seen a lot of them when he first got out because he was using me and Vince phone to call people I was pissed because some of the people I can't stand ass

you know Why? Because they was out here Rayful hot you know or talking with people that's talking about Raifle instead of checking them

being like hey I don't want to be indulved in this conversation and Rayful FaceTiming him he'd be like why did he go with your car I'd be like man that man was talking shit

with somebody and Ray was like like, man, I forgive everybody. I forgive him. He's Jesus. He's the drug kingpin Jesus, dude. And then some of the people that, like, they say, he turned state on, right? They was fucking calling our phone.

He phaximed him. You know what one guy said? Man, I'm sorry. He said, Rayford, I'm sorry. I put you in that predicament. He said, I fucked that money up. And I'm looking at the dude. Like, you said, you know what?

He was like, yeah, I know what? I was like, what's up? And I said, at least he kept it real. He ain't saying that hot motherfucker or this and that. You know, D.C., everybody jump on the bad wagon. It's a thousand million hot people, right?

Rief was just the only one that's known, like not only from D.C. So if you talk about him or say something bad, you get a little, you get a little publicity or somebody going to say you said it. You said the wrong person. You might get your ass punching him off

or something else, you know what I mean? Because there's still a lot of people that be like, I don't play with y'all like that. That man dead. leave it alone. He forgave everybody, man. Okay, so what year, I mean, do you remember how it all ended? Do you remember the day you got arrested and what happened?

So before the 15th of April, it was around April to 9th or something. What year? That was 89. Okay. Oh, so this went on for years. Yeah, so like 1989, they got us April the 15th, right? So around the ninth, it was a restaurant called Houston's restaurant in Georgetown. When I tell you, Rayford walking that bitch, his table waiting, they already know what we eating.

I mean, it was an expensive restaurant. So these white shirt police came in there, D.C. police also. We sitting there, and his name was Lieutenant McGuire, pure asshole. He was like, I need to have a conversation with you. Ray was like, you hungry, sit down. He was like, you want to tell the little man to leave? He said, nah, he's all right. The dude, sit down.

The other police stood there. They both white shirts. He said, I just want to give you a warning. They ready indict y'all. They're ready to come and get y'all the 14th. Raver said, tell me something. I don't know. You sure it's the 14th?

And he's like, well, I'm just warning you. I'm just trying to give you some, and let you know. So it was kind of like he wanted some money for it or something. Right. Rayford was like, okay, see you later. You want something to eat? And he told the lady, hey, get you. them with steak mill and stuff.

Put it on my bill. So they went to the door. So I was like, what you're saying, Ray? He said, he said, they're probably coming full. He said, we know that. He said, but we're going to beat this shit. I got the best lawyer in the world. Y'all ain't got to worry about nothing.

Did he have police paid off? No, they're aware of. Dick riders. Yeah. Listen, Ray ain't, Ray ain't believing that. Like, it was like they liked the conversation with him. Because he was such a celebrity. That's what it was.

A street celebrity. Man, they used to take a lot. of money from a lot of us, especially me. They would just jack you and keep the money, right? I could be on the strip, so you know, you might have four or five thousand dollars in your pocket. I mean, just change. Yeah.

They want to take that shit. I got to the point where I come out of dollars with no money. I'd be like, they keep taking that money for me. And they say, come down to precinct and prove it's yours. Yeah. It didn't even make it to the precinct. No. So.

Anyways. So we was, Rayford said, I'm going to Virginia Beach after that day. He took Troy. and a couple other guys took Tony O's, he just brought Tony O' white, brand new station wagon, Mercedes. That shit just came out. He's like, we're going there to the bitches.

Why do you don't want to go? I was like, I don't want to go. Because I wanted to go to the go-go that night, you know, see Chuck Brown or whatever. Rayfordham went, Troy's calling. He's beeping from the car calling. He said, a helicopter just pulled us over. They got us on the highway.

And we're like, I called Tony on them. I was like, hey, they got, If you're rifle in your car, they're taking the seats out of the car, they've taken the bag out of the back. They're thinking there's drugs in the car. Rayful ain't going to have no damn drugs. It's a brand new car. So look, Troy talking to us, the police slam him on the ground.

You can hit him disconnect the phone, you know, the little brick phones. So when they get back up to D.C. to us from Virginia Beach, he said, yeah, they're coming. So if Rayford was like, come on, why does ride? You're going to take me to Pam House like the next day. I was a girl that was pregnant by him. No soon as we dropped them off, the police wasn't following me no more because, you know, they was following us everywhere.

I was like, looking in the mirror, like, I ain't even got no license. These motherfuckers, it's not behind me no more. So I said, I'm going to go park the car like he said. I'm going to my girl house, which was older to me. Man, we get 911-1-1-page. My shit, 911, 911, 911. I go to my girlfriend, mother-room.

They use the house phone. Johnny was like, the police just got rifle as soon as you dropped them off. I was like, what? My mom, City on the Cedes is in front of my house. That was the news at the time.

You know, everywhere they, like, kicking doors. They used to have their cameraman, fall and all that. So they had my mother apartment building. I'm calling Johnny. Johnny was like, don't come around Northeast. They just kicked my mother doing. So I knew shit was hitting the fan. I took my girlfriend, Mother Louis Chivette.

I'm riding down the hill in southeast. All these black vans coming up the street. I'm riding right past him like, I said, what the fuck? And the FBI, DA, I'm just riding right past them. I get to my mom apartment, the city on the seas ain't there. I go around back, take Rayful Rolex all, took my chain off, gave it to my mother. She said, what the fuck did y'all do?

Man, I'm telling you the whole apartment building was surrounded. I look out the window. I said, let me go down there because I don't want them to raise your house. I go to the door, they running past me. I opened the door, then they grabbed me and slam me, start whooping me. And then I could hear one of the news people saying, he's a juvenile, you know, y'all can't video them. But you weren't a juvenile at this point. At 89, you would have been 19.

Mm-mm. Am I getting my math wrong here? Yeah, I'm going to be 19. I'm still a juvenile. I was about to be. How old were you? I was about to be 17 going on to the, I'm one of the adult yet. They was charging me.

She was like 17. Yeah. Okay. When I got a birthday in October. Okay. My mom crying because they were whipping me. And they was like, lock her ass up too. I was like, my mom ain't do shit.

But they were locking her up because she's hitting the police. So they took me in the van. I can't see out the van. They put the bag over my head. And I'm like. They put a bag over your head? Yeah. He was like, bag his ass.

They was like, you're going to tell us where the money. yet. You're going to tell us now. And they was punching me in my stomach and shit. The one stepping on my shoes. I was like, the fuck. He was like, where's the watch and chain you had on earlier? I don't even know how they know that. But I gave it to my mom.

You know, Rayford Watch was probably like $85,000 I had on. And I was like, my mother ain't giving them that shit. So they take us down to the, it used to be called Moist's the FISD. So it was the FBI, DEA, regular police all in one building by the FBI building. So when I get down there, I see Rayful, and they got him like, he ain't even locked up. You know, they're talking to him. He said, what happened to you? I said, this bitch right here, he busts my mouth, you know, and they grabbed me and dragged me in the room.

You know, their whole thing was, you're going to tell. Where's the money? They ain't care about nothing else. They were like, where's all that goddamn money? And I was like, I don't know what you're talking about. I just kept saying that. They're like, your mother going to jail. We're going to take your mother's bank account.

We're going to do this. I was like, my mother ain't got none of my money in the bank account. As we get with, everybody's being brung in. I'm saying people getting dragged in there. And I was like, God damn, he don't even be with us. Like one guy named Greg and Ronnie, I was like, they don't hang with us. But they got thrown in the mix, two girls. I was like, Dee Dee and Trina, they don't do nothing with us.

Did they arrest Rayful's mom that day, too? Hell yeah. So they hit all the houses. They couldn't find Tonyo. Tony is the one that went on the run? Yeah, Tonyo and Troy. Tonyo, they were scared of. The only reason they got Jerry

because he ain't leaving Rayful's sister, he's married to Rayful sister. He was like, don't lock my wife up. She ain't got nothing to do with this. They locked her up too, and she was pregnant. So he was like, she didn't do anything. They really hated you guys. I think it's because he was so rich.

And they had to lock everybody up. So he wasn't had nobody on the outside. That's what it was all about. Right. They couldn't find big rifle. You know, he wasn't going to be on our case, but they was going to get him. He was actually out of town. Did they find any work the day of the raid?

No. The only thing they found was some money. Wow. That's it. Any work that they showed later was shit. You know, they caught somebody with a couple ounces, 3,020s, 20 bags. And, you know, they piled it up. The $4 million, they had.

that on the table. But they said it was three point something, whatever. It wasn't what they're supposed to be. But we already knew that. We were just like, that's the money Royal had. Yeah. So they skimmed a little before they turned it. Yeah, they took some of that money.

The guns and shit they had, it was like shit they found in alleys, you know, fully automatics. Well, I got caught with a fully automatic before that. Me and Troy, my other co-defendant. It was a gun outside. It was mine. But Troy took the beef. You know what I mean?

Because he was like, Rayford won't be mad. can't let you go to jail. He actually a good motherfucker. He's murdered my wife, the little sister. You know what I mean? He was like, I'm the one always in trouble. He took the beef, the one that solda, bacon soda, and she brought. How many people got arrested that day?

And then how many stuck to the actual indictment? Like how many people were in there when you guys went to court? All of us, nobody on the case turned. It was people outside of the, that you had a crackhead saying, and Rayful was gay on the stand. They was like, how you know he's gay? One day I had on a coat with nothing underneath it, and he wouldn't even look at me.

We was like, where the fuck they're getting these people from? Right, they took Ray kindness for a weakness. You know what I mean? Like back then, gay was like a unspeaking rule, but there was some women, some men that was women back then. People ain't know. They was getting 10 and 20 bricks from us. You understand?

You were giving that much work to trans people. That motherfucker's had money. Yeah. One of them still around named Ann. He had a full sex change now. But back then, that's progressive. Look better than any female I know,

even to this day. And Anne got to be about 65. Wow. Okay. How many people were on the indictment? 80? No, 31. 31 people.

31 of us. So how long are you in... Do they send you to the Metropolitan Correctional? like the federal lockup, or are you in county jail? How does it work in D.C. when you're waiting to go to federal court? So while we're being, when we first all got us, they got us there and we're going to federal court, and Rayford was laughing. He was like, yeah, we made the big time.

It ain't Superior Court. So I always thought Superior Court was the court. They take us to this fucking building and drive the vans and the cars onto a big-ass elevator. And the shit going to ground. So we, I'm like, I'm a junior. I'm like, what the fuck is they taking us? As soon as I got downstairs, they was like, take his little ass upstairs.

All the J.B. Stevens and all these people wanted to talk to me. I mean, I didn't know who they was at the time, but, you know, they was the big attorneys and, you know, for the government. Look, if you tell us where the money is, we're going to let you go now. We're going to relocate your mother,

your twin sisters, your brother. We're going to relocate your whole family. I was like, what money are you talking about? Yeah. They whooped me in there. He had the marshal who actually beat me up in there. And then they was like, go get him a soda. Go get him some candy.

I ate that shit. I drunk the soda because the dude was like, you better eat it. They went and got the little warm-up cheeseburger in the microwave. I was like, I really don't eat me. I ate it. He said, now you're going to tell us what? I was like, hell no. But when my mother get here, I'm going to tell her you hit me.

I mean, man, he whooped me some more. And then they brought my mom. What money did they, what were they talking about? It's like you didn't know where all raised money was. No, so what it was when we was being indicted, you know, they knew Ray was moving that money. But we moved the red in their face. One time, one time we moved probably seven army duffel bags, all hundreds.

Gave it to his father. We put it all in the back of the Range Rover. And the fares was right there, but they just couldn't see the back of that vehicle. and his father drove right off with it. Wow. So, you know, that was over millions at all. Of course. You know, so they was like, got to be money

because they hit all these houses and didn't get no money. They got, you know, probably like 20,000. So they got, they seized no real money from this case. They took a lot of his jury, but it wasn't all his jury. Right. They took the cause.

Because this is over a five-year period, at least doing this kind of, these kind of numbers, plus like all the water. And I mean, this guy made a, hundred million dollars. Ray made it easy. I mean, if you think back to it now, I was like, damn, we made a lot of money back

in that time. You know what I mean? It's unfathomable. So this is, because this is, there's a lot of misconceptions about, like, the evidence that they had. Because, again, like, when you look at the footage, it was such a spectacular. It was, like, what they would have done for, like, John Gotti. Like, they painted him as this, like, black mafia head.

And it looked like you guys had a ton of bodies on you, but it just doesn't sound like they had that that was true. So, like, when we got locked up, they was like, we got you out for 30 murders, right? All of us are looking like, I mean, if it's a murder, we know what the count is. You know, one of our co-defendants is peanut. He killed somebody in front of every goddamn body. You know, that was one of them situations. So, I mean, we was like, what the fuck are they talking about?

I had got locked up for murder before we got indicted. But I didn't do it. I was fighting the guy, but somebody else that was with me at the time, he's dead now. Nobody knew what happened. People was like, he got shot. He got, all along, the glass cut him. We fell through the window. You know what I mean?

So they kicked my mother door in before the indictment. Oh, you killed this guy. The rifle was pissed with me because we just come from Vegas, told me not to go to the go-go. Me and my friend Anthony Jones, we ride to the go-go. And, you know, at that time, we had little street beefs going on. And, you know, this little guy ain't no hustler, no nothing, but, you know, a van tager. And, you know, I wasn't scared of him because I grew up with him.

Shit, man, was tussling like him. But when him and Anthony started fighting, nobody's seen that part. All of us fell through the window. So the glass cut the main artery and he died. So they was like, oh, he got shot. He got stabbed. Be honest, that glass killed his ass. Did they try to put that murder in the indictment?

Or that non-murder? Yeah, they brought it up saying, well, why are we going to recharge you with murder? And I was like, nobody killed when there? Y'all stupid, you know what I mean? And I was like, what witness? Because it wasn't nobody but me, him and the guy, and the guy that take the money at the door.

And he told him that it wasn't no knife, you know, no gun, no nothing. So. What about Peanut? Those murders. Peanut got found guilty on where he gave him 15 years for the murder. But he had to kill him. You know what I mean? What was that about?

So we was at a club. So you know back in D.C. at the time, you ain't had had no ID to go in these clubs. Yeah, or drive a car, evidently. No, hell no. I was going in a club that sell liquor. It was called the Chapter 3. So we always used to go there. So at the time, peanut had a little beef with a guy named Brandon.

His brother, later you will hear about his brother name was Big Ed Gary that was with the outpost shit and all that. they beefing really over a girl you know nut getting money hanging with Rayful on us now and he will bust your ass you know he he'd pull that pistol and shoot your ass Rayful had him calm down

we all at the club some words was exchanged with him and nut so the guy Brandon walked up on all of us with a pistol Rayford was like man you ain't gonna use that pistol

so we need to you need to stop doing that right now he didn't know nut don't went to get the pistol when you pull a gun out and rifle around all hell breaking loose man nut emptied in his ass in front of everybody I'm talking about stood over him and everything

inside of the club right in front of the club oh wow so all of us left and then you know the word was rifle got nut to kill Brandon that wasn't even the case they was all and beefing over a girl you know and Brandon was more so

a vanish taker you know I mean And that murder was, they put that in the indictment too? Oh, yeah. Yeah. That was the only one. So it was two other murders with Greg and Ronald. They was killed and they swore Tony and Jerry did it because it was a broad daylight type of killing.

And when I mean they got killed, they got Ronald got killed just for being at the car with the guy. Greg, that's something different. They had to kill his ass, whoever did it. I had to help them, my two co-defendants out because I was out there. I was like, they didn't do it. What happened? Why were they murdered?

Well, Greg was one of them light-skinned dudes that you would think was a punk, but he wasn't. And he wanted to prove it to everybody. And Tony on jury was thorough, you know. Rafa grew up with Greg. So, you know, Gray had no problem with Rafael, but he was mad that he don't get him involved in the activities on the strip. He had to work for Tony on Jerry. Jerry not going for that shit. And, you know, Tony O was more vocal.

Greg would try him, right? Which was the wrong thing to do. So one day they down at the car, I'm out there, Greg pulled a gun on me. He put the gun in my face. He said, I should bust your little ass. But I know Rayful will be mad at me. He said, but Tony on Jerry love your little ass. I should bust you.

So I'm like, I ain't do nothing to you. I mean, he got the 357 right in my face at all. He said, I was going to truck. So I started backing up. He said, go tell him I'm down here. I did go up the street. Jerry won there, and I was like, Gray just pulled a gun on me.

He was like, what? Man, y'all get y'all asses from around here. I'm still around there, hard-headed. I walked back down the street because I was like, I ain't do nothing to Greg. You know, now I don't win got a pistol. I was like, Greg, don't know. He'd do that shit.

I'm going to shoot his ass, and then I know I'm going to get a good rep because he goes so hard, but, but Rayford gonna be mad. Fuck, I walked down to the corner. I swear to God, all you heard was like 30, 40 shots. And I see a fat dude, which wasn't Jerry. Jerry was kind of thick. And I see a tall dude that's real tall.

And I knew who that was. It wasn't Tonya. I was like, oh, fuck. Everybody was like, Tony and Jerry killed Greg and Ronald. I said, no, they didn't. You know, and all the way to court. The prosecutor was so mad. I said, Rafe was like, I need you to, when we go to court,

you got to be a witness for Tony and Jerry. They're trying to smoke their boots with that murder that they didn't do. So the guy who did the shooting Donnell, he got killed once we went in. Somebody had killed him. They said he was doing, he had a beef with Greg, you know, something we didn't know nothing about. So they killed him while he was with his mom. The other dude, I never knew who he was. I seen his face.

And I was like, I was there. It wasn't Tonya or Jerry. So none of these murders, this is all like ghetto street shit. It had nothing to do with a furtherance of drug trafficking. Nothing. They just blamed it on Rafeel, man. Of course. They even put Rafer with Murray & Berry.

Rayleigh ain't had no fucking relationship with Murray and Barry. For people that are a little younger, they don't know who Marion Barry is. He was the mayor, the disgraced mayor of Washington, D.C., who got caught smoking crack in a hotel room, and then he got reelected. Hell yeah. Good for him. Okay. How long? Okay, but they, they tried, of course, to lump all of these murders inside of a larger RICO indictment to make it look like, you know, again, a mafia style, a mafia style operation. So you have 31 people on the indictment. We don't have to go into like the super nuts and bolts of it, but essentially Ray is being charged with the Kingpin Act. I assume. Yeah, 848, running criminal enterprise. It was two trials. So, you know, Rafe and all of us was on the first trial.

But me being a juvenile, I was on the first, but they kept taking me in there because they didn't want the public in there. What were you charged with? And what were the other people? Conspiracy. Everybody was charged with conspiracy. And the judge wanted to take my mouth when we first went in because, you know, my lawyer telling me conspiracy is, he hearsay she say right whatever and I was like that don't make sense you know I was I'm thinking he you know they tell me some bullshit so I'm like where's the jury they was like y'all got anonymous

jury the first time ever in history anonymous jury how crazy is that yeah so my lawyer was like they can't do this so you know he was fighting that yeah fighting it's unconstitutional it's unconstitutional yeah so at this time they took all of them over DC jail They took me to O'Kill, which is a juvenile place, maximum security. So me being the dumb ass, I got down there, got in some shit about the guy that got killed. You know, they're saying that I killed. Some guys that just don't know what they're talking about we whoop the shit out of, men, you know, people that just got with me, you know what I mean?

And I tried to skate, you know, trying to run their vehicle through the fence. the fucking worst mistake I ever made. They took my ass over D.C. jail and put me, I was one of the first juveniles to get over in that jail. And they blocked the whole cell off, you know, a whole tear. It had me in the...

So, you know, my whole thing changed now because I was like, oh, this shit got real. Raffel was hauling and sending notes. They just brought white in here. What the fuck? So the police let Raffo come up and talk to me. Wow. He was like, what the fuck?

He wanted to beat me up for trying to run. And I was like, Rayford, I couldn't stay there in there. They was locking me in that room. He said, you're going to be in here in your room now. 24-hour, 23-hour lockdown. You come out Monday, Wednesday, Friday. I was like, bullshit. He wasn't lying.

Yeah, of course. It was called administration surrogation. So my first two days at D.C. jail, I flooded the toilet. I flooded the whole. tear because they was fucking with us. You know, they was like, oh, they said, make you sweat. You're going to end up telling, you know. And I'm hauling, like, I said, I'm going to flood this fucking tear.

And when I get some matches, I'm going to set this shit on fire. What were they trying? Were they coming to you with deals? Oh, no, they was trying to make the police, like, make it bad for me. Don't give me the food. Right, right. Were they coming to, were they coming to other people in the indictment, though, trying to get them to flip on Ray?

Everybody, but none of them could say nothing. And the only one going to say something, it's Tony O'Jerry, right? Really, one of the rifle of her sisters. Everybody else is like, they can't say no major shit. And they love Rayford so much. That's why nobody flipped. You brought some girls and said money laundering because they did, one time they went to the stores and brought some clothes or some shit. And we was like, what?

They gave them two years, three years. Wow. You know what I mean? Did anybody a bail opportunity? I mean, clearly after you tried to escape, you didn't. But they wouldn't even let me go to my mom. You know, I still was a juvenile trying to be charged as a duck. My mom was like, y'all, they made her, y'all going to let them out.

And they was like, fuck, no. The prosecutor said, we need birth certificate. We need where it was born. Because they was acting like I was older than what I was, and I wasn't. They froze my mother bank account. She probably had like fucking $5,000 in it back then. my dad they went and got him he had a nice penny in the bank

they froze his shit so you know he hated my ass and he hated rifle yeah he was like I didn't know he was a fucking drug dealer I'm looking at my father like you was high you don't even know anyway even though he went to work every day right

so long story short get over to jail fucking I'm getting fucking piece of hut Kentucky coming to myself my girlfriend at the time I called home for Collette She said, Rayful just got somebody to bring me something. I'll tell you when I get there.

She come and visit me, you know, it's a glass. She said, I just gave the police 10 bottles, 10 baby oil bottles full of Don Perillon and gin. I just gave them three pounds of weed. That's for Tony and Jerry to smoke while they're in there and Manjee. And I gave the police $4,000. Rafer said, just give it to him. And I was like, who pronged it to you?

She was like, some white lady. And I was like, so we really ate and did anything we wanted this. Ray set everything up. Everything. My cell, they moved me so I can watch TV through my cell. Wow. Drinking in there? I didn't drink, but when the shit came to me, I had to give it to them.

You know, the baby oil ballers looked like fucking baby oil, but it was gin. Only thing I asked for was roach spray. Fucking D.C. gin, the road just eat your ass up. So the police was like, why are you in roach spray? I was like, man, you turn the lights off, the roaches, you turn the light off, turn it on, roaches everywhere. I don't know how the people survive at DCJ. DCJ was fucked up. Yeah.

That's like the South. You know, like it's, that's a real South shit. Yeah. So. How long are you in there fighting before you guys go to your first trial? Shit. It was like every day we was going to court. And then they,

then one day they came and raided the jail. So they was like, they raiding the jail, the FBI, you know, some people would see outside. And we're like,

what the fuck? It was all for us. Y'all ass going to Quantico. They took me to Richmond. I don't know why. They took me and Tonya went to Richmond first. And it was about some guns.

Because remember, I said I got caught with a fully. But Troy took the beef, but then, guns were stolen from a major gun place. So they was hitting us with all type of stuff. We need to get this gun with the hundred round clip. And I'm like, the fuck.

You know what I mean? So we get the rifle and they take them to Quantico. Tonyo gets shipped back to Quantico. Then they take me to Quantico but keeping me separated. So they took me to a fucking sale. And it's a white guy beside him, but he's in shape. I'm talking about nice shape I mean his hair cut neat

you wouldn't even you think he'll police so I'm thinking man this is a police they try and play like he locked up turned out to be Oliver North wow you know and and when he told me his name I was like I'm not talking I don't even know who the fuck Oliver North is

so one day the army come in the Marines they bringing in Norway Yeager and he was on your cell block all that's that whole cell block is these people. So they was like, everybody's staying away from the sales, you know, military people that's locked up.

And they was like, oh, he's the big drug dealer. You know, he's the, he ran a country. President of Panama. Yeah. So we like, you know, I don't know. I was like, I ain't never heard of this damn person. Oliver one day he said, you got to chill out. He said, if it's something you want to tell him, you should do it because they're going to try

give you a lot of time. So one day, they bring his uniform. And I was like, this is my mom. I forgot all these medals. I told my mom and lawyer the name, they was like, y'all don't watch the news when you're in jail? I was like, over here we ain't got no TV.

It was his ass. And he was like, you won't see me prior again. That motherfucker never came back to that cell. Yeah. Oh, you didn't do much time. No. And he said it, but he told me, you should tell them what they want to know

so they can relocate you. I said, I'm not doing that. But. Wow. He said he wasn't coming back after that second court appearance, I didn't see him no more. Yeah, he took the time for Reagan

and the whole administration, basically. They treated him like royalty, man. Yeah, yeah. He had regular soap in there from the streets, cologne, his shoes were shined in front of the cell. And when they burned that uniform, I was like, damn, he got every medal there is.

God, that's wild. Just a kid from D.C. and you're locked up with the most scandalous figures of the entire history of the drug war. And then, So how long are you in there? Yeah. When do you actually go to trial?

So we started going to trial. The day that they say we're going, we can hit a helicopter's coming, but I can't see a rifle in them. Nutt is semi supposed to be paralyzed. They sent me and him to Lorton now, right? They said we're going to Lorton when the court date was starting. We was like, why are we going to Lorton? That's a state prison, but you know, you know, you know the stories of Lorton.

And I don't visit it, Lorton. It's a really bad place. This shit was fucked up. I mean, it ain't no way to put it. You didn't go visit nobody unless you knew somebody that's going to protect you or something because you can get your ass killed going to visit somebody. So the helicopter getting Ray for them. The news out there.

They would transport Ray to the court and a helicopter. That's fucking crazy. So Nutt is paralyzed, the one that got locked up for murder. Right before we went in, he got shot in the barbershop with me, Rayful. and all us. And he wasn't paralyzed like everybody thought. So when they locked us up, we was like,

just keep playing like you pearlized. So he in the chair, but he can walk the whole time. They put him in a car. They put me in a car. They flying them and they're driving us up. And they was like, your little ass getting in a helicopter

next time talking to me. And I was like, I don't care. I was like, at this point, what I'm going to do? I can't say no. They got with their nut can walk. That's what happened.

It was like, my lawyer was like, can Columbus walk? I said, no. I ain't going to tell my lawyer the truth because I was just like, I ain't going to say nothing. Rayford was, that's the first time I seen him kind of worry. But when we was getting on the helicopter that last time, he's like, I'll be back. I look at the Rayford was like, man, we're on the helicopter. They're about to convict our ass. You know, he was like, they can't convict us.

None of us got caught with nothing. And that's the shit he stuck with the whole trial. He still didn't get it. Did they offer him any kind of plea deal that you know about? Yeah, they asked Ray to... So at the time, they wanted to know who that Columbia and collect was. And people don't realize Pablo Escobar's sister, Rayford was cool and close with her.

Wow. That came out later. You know, Rayford was going to keep most of that shit to herself. So it was the Medellin cartel that he was working with? Wow. And to this day, she used to... to say, I'm gonna get his ass killed. You know what I mean?

But he didn't tell on her. So, you know, we don't know what, why was that the problem? Right. He didn't tell on it. He didn't tell him with chicky and him. People don't know that. Chicky still talked to Rayford when he got out until he got killed. Remind us who Chicky is?

Chicky is the Colombian connect that was in jail with him. Right. And, you know, we're talking 500 to 1,000 to 1,000 bricks. And you're selling that shit from jail. Oh, that's right. He was the connect in jail. He was his roommate. So, right, right.

Okay, so he didn't, just focusing on the first trial, Ray didn't flip until he got caught for the second case in when he was already locked up. Already locked up. So what happened with the first case? How did that adjudicate? So it adjudicated bad. They left Rayful come and talk to me with my lawyer. And like I said, Tony on jury was getting blamed for two murders that one is.

He's like, you got going there and tell him, you know, I knew that. Donnell did it, but Donnell was dead. But, you know, that street code shit was still don't say nothing. We were like, he's dead. We didn't tell him to do that shit. We don't know what that was about. I said, all right, no problem. So, you know, they called me as a witness.

But they was tricky because they wanted to, well, where's all the money at? You know, it jumped all the way to something else. I was like, I've never seen no money. So they were trying to say, I'm lying, you know. We all got found guilty. How long did the trial last? shit that shit lasts it longer than i can't even remember weeks months did they have a lot of people testifying yeah but you know what the bad part is

the only true testify is royal brooks with the four million yeah everybody else it was like they went got tom dick and hurry that court of case and norfolk like lose associates that wasn't even our associates though right like one guy to my yeah i brought it from rafel and whitey rafel looked at me i looked at me i looked at him, I was like, I don't know him. His name's Stephen McArthur. I'm gonna remember, I'm letting it be known. It's a court case anyway.

This guy had 12 years, quarter case in Virginia, and told them he used to get stuff from us. Well, can you say, rifle put it in your hand? And he came in there and said that. Nobody in that whole case said that. You see what I was saying? Lying. Yeah, so it was like, they just rigged the whole case. The helicopter made it look worse.

me trying to run from the juvenile place fucked it up. A girl house got fire bombed. They blamed me. They said I had it done. I made a phone call. I was on the phone with this girl, and I did say, that raggedy bitch,

I was like, all this shit that we all done for her, we ain't never done nothing to her because they said she was testifying, which she was, but what she was going to tell? She said, yeah, they used to be on the drug strip, blah, blah, blah, blah. Somebody threw gas through her house. But it wasn't us.

Shit, they pulled me back in court. They pulled me Sunday morning without everybody and took me to court to a totally different courtroom and said they're going to charge me with awesome. And I was like, play the recording, and my lawyer ate that shit up.

You know, they record everything on the jail car. He said, all he said was all the shit they done did for her. You know, she was a grown woman. She later said she lied, but that don't come out. You know, us found guilty.

So when they found all that's guilty, they flooded the news with that shit. Yeah. They told me I was going to button them or Lexington. Hold on. What were the sentences? She, Rayford was two life centers plus like 400 years. Yeah.

Two life centers like 400 years. Everybody, Tony O. Had one counter conspiracy. They gave him life. You know, jury got 33 years. Johnny got 30 years. His mom got like 15 years. You know, it was just trickling down.

His mom got 15 years. Yeah, they was trying to give me 16 years. That shit came out to like 10 and some change. Who else? Troy got 60 months. A lot of people, like, it was just a mixed up of time. You know what I mean? Yeah.

And it didn't make sense because nobody got caught with nothing really. You know, it was like you caught some street shit or you had somebody say they got something from somebody. So it wasn't like, hey, we. caught rifle with a thousand bricks. Yeah. You know. Holy shit. Yeah, that was,

it's a railroading for sure. Yeah, hell yeah. And, you know, they, they were furious probably because they didn't get any money either. That's what it was. You know? Every talk was, even when we got found guilty, my lawyer was like,

you know the DA and they wouldn't like to talk to you if you know where any of the cashed you. Yeah. I tell my lawyer don't come to see me no more. because I was like, I'm found guilty, what the fuck? Yeah. And then they said I'm going to the federal prison soon as, you know, you already turn 18.

Yeah. They sent me to Lewisburg. Lewisburg. But they kept me in the hole, right? Rief was in there, and I didn't know it. So I'm in this room. Man, all I know is when we drove up with the marshals, they drove me in a car.

I was like, Lewisburg, penitentiary. You know, I know all the people who refused to take care of, you know, Lord and dudes. So I ain't allowed to you. My stomach was fucked up. I was like, fuck, I should have stayed in that juvenile place. The first knock on my door, some dude walked up to the door. He was like, hey, little youngish, what's your name?

And I learned, you know, Tony and Jerry was like, don't talk to nobody. He was like, nah, I'm talking to your little ass. He slid a note under the door. I read it. It said, Rayford going to be up at the count. I was like, how the fuck did he know I'm here? But he knew everything, though. Yeah.

Man, they let him come up. They cracked the door. He said, man, I can't. He said, you can give him a handshake. Raffo gave me some clothes, some food. He said, they're not going to keep you here because your security level is high, but you're not built for this. I think my shit was like a 37 or something, 38, and I don't know why.

The enhancements. And I was like, he said, you got caught with that gun, you know, blah, blah, blah. I was glad as shit I was in there 42 days in that hole man I was so glad when they said oh you're about to get on you're going to El Reno

you're going to Herzberg airport that was the worst shit ever man what hole in Louisburg no when I left there I thought that was the worst but when I got to the airport they put a black box on my handcuffs I was like the fuck is this

oh you're a rabbit I was like I ran from a juvenile place The fuck are you talking about? I kept talking. They put a bag on my head on the plane. I was like, and the dude beside me was like, I bet you a little ass to shut up now. They put a bag on his head.

Man, I was laughing. I was like, I don't know where I'm going. Got the fucking this airport and landed. A fucking dust storm. It was an arena. And they took me off first. I was like, why I'm being treated like this? of me.

Got the El Rina. That was fucked up jail. That shit looked like an old movie. Now, I think I want to, in the interest of time, I think I want to

maybe save your, most of the stories about your experience in prison. Maybe we could do that on the Patreon, but I want to talk about what happened with Ray, how he got the second case, and then eventually how he ended up

cooperating because people are going to want to know that. We've got to get that out. What did he, how was he feeling when he had this double life sentence? Like, and what made him go back to moving keys behind bars? Like, it just seems so crazy. Ray took that shit better than everybody. A couple of tears. You know, someone's looking. I'm looking at my mom like, the fuck. You look over to Ray. He's smiling. He's like, we're going to get back. He said they railroad us. Yeah. He was like on appeal.

He told the new lawyer he was getting was Billy Murphy. He used to be a judge in Baltimore. He came to me with notes and telling me, Rayford was like, don't talk to nobody, wherever they take you, don't say shit. People are going to be trying to get in our case to get their time off. Y'all going to be all right. He's smiling. And I'm looking at him.

Man, I was so mad at him. I was like, he said we're going to beat this shit. You know what I mean? Yeah. But they was like he's going to Louisburg. I touched down in the arena. Ray, we writing. Ray said, we're going to be all right.

We just got to do what we got to do to survive. Me not knowing meaning that he's hustling or ready to do something. Right. But what's the odds? You put Rayful Edmond in the cell with chicky. Do they meet at Lewisburg? At Lewisburg. Okay.

And put them in the same cell. I mean, I'm just saying, what's the odds of that shit? That's crazy. All the vacant sales, you put Rayford in the worst block. I want to say it was D block, if I remember right, the worst block. And then you put them in a cell with somebody that got all the connections to any product you want. He just don't got nobody to sell it. To move it.

Okay. So, and Cheeky explained his connections? Was he connected to Pablo Escobar or who was he with? Indirectly. His mother was Giselle Blanker. Oh, really? Hell yeah. So Cheeky was the son of Griselda Blanco?

Yes. Is that a fact? That's what they say. I'm not sure. Can we look that up? I, because I know a lot about Griselda Blanco. She's somewhere. They connect to however the case was.

I don't think maybe not his son, but maybe connected to him. Because all of her sons are dead. Is Chicky dead? Chicky dead. He got killed soon as he got out. Oh, might be. The only one who's not, the only son is. Michael Corleone Blanco is the only surviving son of Roselda.

No, it is his mom because Michael used to write Rayford. Ah, okay. Even when that little TV show came up. Right. We was all like, Chickie got killed just like her, somebody on a motorcycle. Because they deported him back to Columbia, right? Yes. Okay.

And Rayford was still talking to him. Wow. Even after the shit hit the fan and they say, Rayful telling her. Right. Chick, he didn't cut Rayful. So would that tell you? He didn't tell him what chick. Right.

That's what I said. People got this misconstrued. I see. I see. But you put them two in the same sale. Okay, this is wild. So how long, how much time does Cheeky have right now when he meets Ray? Shit, I think he only had like eight years or something left or some shit like that.

Okay. Yeah, you know, they was going to deport his ass. Right. They hit it all from day one. Like, Rayf used to write and be like, oh, no, I got a good sellie, chicky, good dude. He said, if you need anything where you at, he'll make sure. That's not a lie. I was in El Reno, Gene Gaudy, that's John Garty brother.

Never knew who this dude was walking around the yard. I mean, I know I heard of Garty. He was like, they was like, the guy I want to talk to you with the Eddie Bauer coat on. I was like, who the fuck is this with an Eddie Bia coat on in jail? Rolex, plain Rolex. And he was like, oh, my name, Gene. He said, a friend from Lewisburg said, to give you a little survival package. and I'm just like

and L.A. Roy was just like why to take it? Somebody Ray, no. All along it was chicky that did it. Wow. You know? And I'm just like, I don't even know him.

You know what I mean? Right. Never knew what Rayford was doing. You start hearing it through the federal system though. They was like, man, Rayful blessing people. Why, you know,

your homies and shit because they're on the street running their mouth. Right. Okay. So Ray's still got people, wholesalers that didn't get caught

that he could move work to. Yeah, even guys that we never fuck with before. You know what I mean? What's up? Shit, he was Osvaldo. Oh, he was Osvaldo. That was his name.

Okay, so his first name was Osvaldo Blanco. Okay, got it. Yeah, no, I'm sorry I even pushed back on that. Oh, no, it's definitely his mother because I could find some letters and show you writing about him and what him. Wow. That's amazing.

I don't think history, because people know a lot about the Griselda saga and then, know a lot about Ray, but that is, that is fate. That's crazy. People don't even know, like, you know, that story. Melvin Butler got a lot to do with that Giselle Blanker, the dude, the black dude she was messing with.

He was under Melvin Butler and Waterhead Bowen. Right. People don't know that. He cut them off and started fucking with her. And they was wondering where she was getting the shit from, you know, where he was getting it from. Right. Okay.

So he's, obviously, as Volto, Cheeky can, still has Colombian plugs that are bringing it in. Hell, yeah. So he and Ray is getting in contact with his dealers, his distributors. And they was taking it straight to D.C. They didn't even have to go out of the side of Merlin really to get it, you know. And they was paying at first. But, you know, so D.C. got a bad reputation.

So Rayful in jail. So, you know, these guys figure. And these some thorough guys, you know, some killers, some of them. Fuck him. He in jail. They ain't thinking about, okay, we fuck. disconnect, we ain't got nothing else. Or who's giving it to him?

Like, Ray wanted telling people Chicky was giving it to him. But, you know, common sense, you know, like our co-defendants, you know, I get a note, or I get a visit. They'd be like, you need anything? Rayford just gave your mother a couple of dollars. He sent it.

I'm like, he ain't got to do that. You know, my mother had a job. You know what I mean? And I was just like, I don't need nothing. I just want to get out. And when I get out, I'm going to get a job. You know, everybody used to laugh at me. I was like, fuck that.

I ain't doing this shit. more. How was Rayful using his connects on the street? Like how was he getting yeah, how was he managing that?

How was he picking up money and, you know, it's hard from inside. Yeah, so what is amazing with that shit is, people was going to see Rayful

and weren't even on a visiting list. He'd be like, hey, just come to see me. Give him your name. This is a federal jail. How the fuck was he pulling that all? Yeah. He'd go visit him.

He'd say, hey, what can you handle? Some guys, someone wasn't getting no more to 20 at a time. It was that many people. So the seven or eight people that got locked up in that whole conspiracy out of the jail, there's probably 20 of them that got away. Because Rayford ain't saying nothing about them.

The ones that they wanted was them dummies that was running their mouth or they got followed to the jail. And they was like, let's see who the fuck they're going to visit. And it happened to be Rayful. That's how it all blew out of proportion. You did have a guy in there with Rayful named Donnell.

He caught a case, and he started trying to tell a little shit from inside the penitentiary. Raffir was killing him, though. He wasn't making a lot of money. He made, $1,000 to joint $2,000. But, you know, that's a good money in jail. Yeah. Any other money he made, he was giving to people. Like I told you, he was taking care of people on the street that didn't make no sense, man.

Who was managing his business while on the street? Nobody. He was doing it from jail. he had one dude that was cool and Michael Jackson actually he then gave statements like people who are scared of this guy to this day right

his name Michael Jackson I ain't scared to say his name he's Rayful Age he gave a lot of information but you know how you don't have to always testify you know if Rafe plead guilty who won't testify right

but he did give statements of that shit. And he's one of the guy that was getting 20 and 30 joints at a time. How many bricks was Ray moving? Shit, they was talking about a thousand a week or some shit. Oh, my God. You know what I mean? It ain't over. It ain't, it ain't, they didn't make it drastic or, you know, made it more than what it was. So he could make $100,000, $200,000 a week. And he was giving that shit away. That's the part I didn't understand. You know what I mean?

But, like, how do you move that money? I mean, who collects that profit for him? and puts it on his books? No, they put money on his books. They bring him money to jail. Listen, Reifle had keys in jail. No. Ask some of the dudes that did time with him. I can give you a couple of the dudes' name after we finished.

Yeah. And you could contact him. Oh, my God. No, I believe it. I believe it. So like a major story. One time, Redskins was in the playoff or something. Rafe was a big, big, big Redskins fan.

bullets, wizards, like they're the wizards now or whatever. He loved them. So the warden was going to shut down the jail, the whole thing for the weekend. Rafe would make some deal with the warden, right? He said, if we can come to some agreement, they won't be going on because you shortstaffed. He said, but I guarantee you you can hold my word that ain't nothing going to get out of hand if you let them watch the, you know, stay out for the game and the fight. Raffel told the warden, if I can make this shot from half court,

anybody in Lorton get, I mean, Lorton or Lewisburg will tell you this the truth. If I can make this shot from half court, you'll let them stay out, and they won't give you no problems because you're shorthanded or anything. Rateful made the shot. They stayed out all night, no late midnight count or anything. The warden got in trouble for that shit because people told.

He made the shot. Then the heat started getting on the warden, and then come to find out the little guy down there was telling. So it was Huron in the jail. It was a key of Coke in the jail. See, they don't want to put that out there. They're paying the guards to bring it in? She could have that shit come in and rifle. It had to be the guards.

It can't be nobody else. No, you can't get a key through visiting. Nah, they was bringing that shit straight in. Wow. Some dudes was getting jealous. That wasn't getting paroled and stuff. Yeah. They were sneaking trying to tell.

Shitky was having their ass punished. And wasn't Ravel because he don't want to do that. Right. Ravel had one fight in Lawton, I mean in Lewisburg, his whole time in jail. This shit went through every federal prison in the world. The guy named was Chicken. He's from our neighborhood, Trinity, like a, you know, a thorough neighborhood at the time. Ravel beat the brakes off him.

And everybody was like, I didn't know if Raifle could fight. But all of us know that. You know, he's not a violent person. And he whooped Chickie, where he made him quit, cry, lay down, everything. From that time on, that's what I said. Rafa never changed his name,

even after the fact. Right. How long was he working with Chicky moving keys from behind bars before the second indictment? Shit, almost 18 months. It's almost, you know, not even two years,

but around that time, it was cranking. It wasn't nothing they could do. Right. Like I said, some guys didn't pay. Start not paying. And Chicky, he was, he was adamant about that shit. Give me their addresses.

My people were going to take care of it, Ray. I know it's not you. You know, Ray used to write men, but not talk about it. He'd be like, man, people just don't want to do right. And I knew what it was because everybody was telling me. The girls come and see me, they were like, Rayford told me to tell you, such and such didn't do this. what you think.

I'd be like, he's not even built like that, you know what I mean? So Chicky was having people murdered on the outside? Yeah, your ass killed. If you weren't paying. Okay, so then what were the,

so they re-arrested him? They raided Leavenworth and... They raided Lewisburg. So this will happen. Rafe and all them was out on the yard. They was looking for the kid, Donnell. You know, all the same dudes, we go meet on the yard.

Rafe said he knew something was up because Donnell wasn't out on the yard. You know, they all walked the track together. Rayful jog probably eight, nine miles a day every day, even when he came home. He said he knew something was wrong. He said, next thing he knows, they see, like, police they never seen before.

You know, FBI, DEA stuff, and guards with papers in the hand. So it's time to come in for the four o'clock count. People going in, Ravel said his stomach told him something great happened. They had a picture of Ravel saying, grab him off the yard. He said he went to walk out and they grabbed him and said the warden wants you. They took him straight out of the penitentiary and they took them to a hotel.

And they said, we have X, Y, Z visiting you, talking on the phone about you, coming to visit you, not on a visiting list. We followed them what you want to tell us. And Ray was like, what do you mean? And then, you know, they gave him the story. We let your mother out. Right. Right. Right now. Wow. He didn't say yes, no, right then and there. You know what I mean? He said he wanted to make some phone calls.

And he called all his code offenders, even the ones in jail. You know, they made it where called Tony Lewis. Let's call this person. Let's call that person. You know, by that time, you know, it's like, God, damn, what do you do? You know, anybody else would have been, fucking, you know, told if that was the case. I mean, his mom been in jail all these years and didn't have nothing to do with our case. So he, because he's doing double life, he doesn't know if he's going to win his appeals.

And they told me, they're like, we're not giving you a dime off of your sentence. Right. And he was like, so what is this conversation? We'll let your mom go. Yeah. We know she ain't had nothing to do with it. Right. Now, you got them people saying that when they charge your mom.

That shit is a real road. Yeah. You know what I mean? The conversation me and him had when he called him, I was just like, damn. I said, no, Boosie need to be out. I don't get the fuck who it is. Right. I mean, I was, but I was like, he was like, you're grown now.

He said, man, you know, I should have been tried to do, you know, help my mom. But she was abing in about, fuck no. I'm least something getting out. And then we're going to fight to get you out. You know, Boosie was thorough. Oh, so his mom didn't even want him to tell to get her out. Hell no. Wow.

She said, I'm about to be going home in a couple of years anyway. Boosey was just thorough. I mean, they don't build her like that no more. Whatever jail she was in, she ran that shit. Wow. I could tell you that man, I believe it. Yeah, so it was like, and she was a government worker. Right.

Remember that she worked for the government in almost 28 years. Right. So they weren't involved in drug trafficking, really. Hell no. Just money laundering. Just whatever. Yeah, because they were like, oh, he brought his mom a house. That wasn't even the case.

She actually brought her own goddamn house. You know, but it was a nice house. But so, but right, didn't listen to her. No. Ray didn't listen to her. And he was like, they're going to let Busy out. They got the papers drawn up.

He said, them dudes ain't paid, man. But I don't want them to get killed. You know, I'd rather their ass be locked up than killed. That's just how he was. And, you know, that word travel so fast. The DEA was like, oh, we gave him a fried chicken and he told, you know, making up all these dumb stories. I was like, that ain't even what happened.

He called every co-defendant. That's how respectful he was. He was like, you're going to hear some shit, but I got to get Mama Busy out. She's getting old. She's sick. She's not making it for a couple of more years. Yeah.

When that shit hit the fan, it was just like, God damn. You know everybody. Yeah. I don't believe that shit. You know, nobody believed it. But then you had, you know, these guys started getting locked up. But they dumbed them.

You know what I mean? If I owe you, like I said, 300,000, and I tell you, you say, how much money you got, Whitey? And I say, I got 56,000. All right, just bring me that. I'm going to give you another 50 bricks. Don't you think something wrong with that? Okay, so Ray was cooperating against the people on the outside. It was a number, like seven guys.

Right. They make it bigger than what it was. Right. It was more people than that, though. You understand what I'm saying? but them the guys the police got on because they was hot already on the street they were making too much noise

or in the shit where some shootings done happen and that type of stuff What about Chicky? Chicky was sent back to he ain't telling me chicken Chicky was deported and then remember he ended up getting killed

So that's so crazy to me So they didn't Ray didn't even have to give up the plug They knew it was Chicky too Right You know, they asked about it. Like, can you? He was like, I will not. He had a relationship with chicky, man, like one of his brothers.

Wow. He was like, that man loved me and I love him. He'll tell you that to this day. And the other brother that's still alive? Michael? Yeah, he talked to Ray. Yeah. That's why I said people, you know.

Wow. So he, I mean, it almost seems like they were doing Ray a favor in certain ways because he got to get his mom out and he didn't even have to tell him to connect. No. He's just giving up dudes that already fucked him over anyway. Yeah, so the prosecutors, I could show you later like an email. They, like the prosecutors even put in the thing. Look, Ravel, chicky gonna get the motherfuckers killed.

He was like, I'm not doing that. I'd rather them be locked up. This email's from the prosecutors. Wow. So that's letting you know they ain't give a fuck. They wanted to grab these dudes that was in D.C. They was like in different neighborhoods. So, you know, if we can get one from northeast, southeast, northwest,

we can say we're shutting some shit down. Right. But it wasn't even really like that. It was other people getting money in D.C. Right. They just was connected to Ray for. That's all it was. Did Ray have to go to court to testify?

Yeah. Okay. And he did it. Yeah. And he said, I don't got no animosity to him. I know y'all mad at me. He said that. Look, if you go back to the court transfer, he said it.

He was like, listen, rather y'all been in here than dead. People are going to kill your whole family. Right. You know, all they wanted was an address. He refused to give it up. Are those dudes out? now? Hell yeah.

Okay, so they're already out. Man, I see some of them. We talk. They're not mad at Ray. And you don't hear them on no social media, no Instagram. Yeah. You don't hear not one word. They say that hot, you know, bitch or rat, whatever.

You got all these fake people that never dealt with Ray for saying that shit. Yeah. Well, because they know they were wrong anyways. That's it. Listen, I was sitting beside him when he talked to these guys. Yeah. He talked to him. He was like, why do you guess who this is?

And I mean, you know, me, I don't want to talk to them because I'm like, I don't want to be involved in that shit. They was like, I'm not mad at you, man. I fucked up. That's what they said. Yeah, how do you fuck up something with somebody giving you something? Yeah. You weren't even paying for it. All you had to do was hustling and be quiet.

You was letting everybody know. So. Wow. And again, that's another myth. You know, that's another street myth is like they painted him to be this like, they painted Ray to be this really instrumental. informant, this Sammy the Bull level rat. Yeah, they're talking about 300 people and all this shit. Tell them to show the paperwork.

Yeah. It didn't even come to that. You had some other guys that got locked up. They used to call a murder ink or whatever, and I ear you. I know them guys. You know what I mean? They called Rayford as a witness on their case because at one point of time, one of them used to be around us.

You know what I mean? And he wasn't doing shit around us. But, you know, and Ray was like, yeah, I know him, you know, blah, blah. Ray just had information on everybody on the street from being in jail. And they just took his word. Ray was like, yeah, I mean, they know him for this. That's it. And he got on the stand and said that.

Yeah. And he didn't get a time cut. Fuck, no. And he didn't change his name. So it's almost like, you know, people talk shit about Sammy the Bull or whatever, right? Okay, why ain't nobody do shit to him? Rayful was that type. He was like, God got me.

he said, man, my goodness, I'll weigh the bad. And he always used to say that, but I was like, every time I do something bad, that little shit outweigh the good. But with him, you can find more people to fuck with him than no. I can tell you that now.

Yeah. Okay, so moving forward, how did he beat the life sentence? The double life sentence, plus 400 years. So these fucking laws change. Really, they railroaded us. Actually, you know what I mean?

I ended up coming home and I was getting papers in the mail saying you can go back to court for re-sentencing. I was like, I'm home now. What the fuck are you talking about? So Raver was like, hey, I'm filing this shit. Raver was doing people law work in jail. Nobody tells you that part. He actually helped people get out of jail to this day. Wow.

I mean, even help with the lawyers, money, everything. He said, I'm filing this paper. Make sure I get to the lawyer. You know, I'm going on running shit. His sister running shit. My boy Vince paying for shit. His sister is me. Rachel, she should be a fucking lawyer.

She's not a lawyer, but she can be a lawyer. She's like, they're going to take this time off. They owe him all the good time. They never gave him no good time since he's been in. So he went back for re-sentencing. Can you explain the change in the law specifically? So they enhanced rifle whole crime because I got caught with a gun. They're saying nut used a gun and a felony murder.

But none of the guns was rifle. You know, it wasn't his. So if you look back, they was giving him points, you know, making him super, super criminal. And it was because of something somebody else did. And, you know, and half the time, he wasn't even around. So they violated his rights from that. You're supposed to get 54 days a year good time.

He never got any of that. Even to the day he got out. they still owed them good time. So it was going to be some money involved somewhere where they had to pay them. Right. And they knew that. Rayville had us filing papers and motions. When I tell you, it was two and three motions every month getting thrown back.

Denied. Denied. Oh, you did it wrong. And he was refiling that shit itself. You know, and we was like, Raven, he was like, no, they got to get me on this one. There's a new law coming out. They're ready to take my time back. They got to take this time back.

So he had 30 years on the new charge. They took the life sentence back under these new laws that came out. The 30 years in Pennsylvania, that judge refused a buck on it. But they ran it together. So, you know, it's a difference. They run it while.

That means you got to finish one time and then do the other one. But he had 30 years in Pennsylvania, so they was like, he did this time. Okay, but one second. How do you get a life? sentence reversed. He had two life sentences. Yeah, two life sentences. So the first life sentence, they said his pointing skill was all screwed up. Right. So they actually brought them back to court.

All of us came to court, you know, I made sure I was the first one in. And the judge said, I don't know how this happened, but, I mean, you were going to remain in jail because you still have 30 years in Pennsylvania. But we got to take this time back from you. He's sitting there smiling. Wow. And, you know, we ain't telling nobody because now's a chance. Yeah. I knew it.

I was like, they got to let them out because they great change another law. All these guys talking about it. So they got rid of two life sentences and one shot? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. That has got to feel. And with no cooperating at all.

Right. But then you still have 400 years. Yeah. So all these fines and all this shit they had, they started having to take it away because that Coke law and the crack law, they changed all that shit again. And you was like, damn, they fired. They got us on that shit.

Let's see if they give them some time off. They gave him all of that time off. But Pennsylvania said, the fed said they let them go. But we hold them for that 30. So that's where all this motion came in. And then, you know, the talk was, it's costing us more to hold him.

And we owe him, you know, time. They even try to make him take witness. set. Like, we're giving you some money. We're changing your name. He told me no. I told him, take it. You know, somebody offered you $700,000, $750,000, a new name, send you somewhere else. He was like, I'm not doing that. Wow. So he walked the yard everywhere he went, even after cooperating. He ran the kitchen, God damn, in Arizona. He ran the whole damn kitchen. When the last visit I had with him, the police was crying. They was crying when he was getting released.

At the airport, the police that Brung was crying. Wow. And we was like, the fuck. When I left the guard, was like, we're going to miss him. And we was like, he said, man, he kept shit under control. Everything was positive with him. It's unbelievable. People don't know.

He called in every Sunday at D.C. churches to listen to a goddamn church sermon. every Sunday. Wow. People don't want to tell that story. Trina Stepman is the pastor. She has a church at D.C. Axer. Wow.

Didn't miss a beat. If it's 9 o'clock, 8.30, he's calling in, and they let him stay on that phone for an hour or two to listen to the church. He made an impact. He was just a special, special, special, iconic-class kind of person. Yeah, you ain't, I mean, you ain't going to find that again. I mean, it's impossible.

It's really not in the drug game. Nah, then they don't tell you, beefs in D.C., you calling in to a rec center and making these two neighborhoods stop killing each other. And they did it. Yeah. I didn't think that shit was going to work because I said, Rayford, they differed now.

I said, these younger don't care. They be killing and don't know why they're killing, you know, or they beefing and don't know what's the beef about. There was some shit like four years ago, but, you know, they keep it going. He was like, nah, they're going to listen. Them motherfuckers, listen. I was shocked.

All the times he called in to my little league football team, right? Yeah. They don't know who Rayful is. They just know the stories, you know. And he was like, you know, make sure y'all listen. You don't want to end up where I'm at, you know, play football. You ain't guaranteed to go to the NFL, but you can get a job. You know, he's talking to him like that.

And I was like, y'all good? They'd be like, yeah, we're going to win. You know what I mean? He was, I mean, you ain't going to make him like that no more. He's a good guy. Hell yeah. So he goes in, when did his time start, 89? 89.

And then he got paroled and he came home. Yeah, 2012. Okay, so yeah, 25 years. No, it's longer than that. I'm sorry. 35 years. 35 years and six months. Yeah, I got it written down.

35 years. Wow. And then they fucked them on that. You know, I didn't tell nobody he was getting out. Me, Vince, his sister, Rachel, knew, and Jerry, which is her husband. We kept that shit so, Mom, my wife was like, where the fuck are you going? I was like, I said, this is a good day. I got to be somewhere before tomorrow morning.

Shit, we hard-ass the ursone of me and Vince. We stayed in the airport all night We got first flight flash First class First class flight We in the airport The airport is not even open I was like man

Because we didn't know how they was going to bring them We didn't want the news or anything I had to finally call my wife And I was like I'll tell you something in an hour or two But something wrong Because we don't see them Fuck I get a call

My phone I don't know the number The police basically saying Look y'all got to be at the door right for walking at the door I already went I already went through the metal detector because I'm thinking he already went through Vince was like I don't see him

shit this man's smile was so damn big it was like I said this motherfucker still be smiling I'm crying like a little baby you know what I mean I think that was the best day right there for me oh incredible you hadn't touched him for no 35 years

Yeah, for a long time. Even the people in the airport, it was some police undercover. I don't know who the hell they was. Like, it was a guy standing with us the whole time with a suit on. But, you know, and I'm like, the fuck as this guy. Every time we move, he moved. Rafer coming through, we hugging each other. I didn't know Vince was recording it.

Rafe, he said, I'm free. Thank you, y'all, you know. The whole airport looked like they turned around and was looking at him. And I said, oh, shit, these people don't, they know who the fuck he is. We walk him to the bathroom. I take all that shit off here. We give him some clothes.

You know, I gave my Rolex. Because he said when I get out, I want your watch. I was like, I got you a watch. And he ain't wanted it. He wanted mine. Took him in the bathroom. He started crying. He was like, give me your phone.

He called my wife. And she said, she just started crying. I mean, she was like, that bad ass, it didn't even tell me. I just ain't want to tell nobody, you know what I mean? Because I ain't want to mess it up. That was the best time right there, though. And so he's, now he's got parole. He goes to a halfway house.

So that's the tricky part right there. They act like he was going to a halfway house that he could come out every day. We already got an apartment in Kentucky, right? His sister doesn't figure out, hey, this shit cheap in Kentucky. Y'all can stay there, blah, blah, nice place. We get there. Rayford was like, this looked like a jail.

And I'm saying the same thing in my head, but I don't want to tell them that. And he was like, he was like, what the fuck? I don't want to go in there. He said it. He was like, I said, they say you come out every day. We're going to stay in a hotel right here on the corner and to the apartment ready or whatever. shit, I couldn't even get out the truck to walk him in there. Vince was like, get out.

He's like, come on, why did he get out? I'm crying. I'm like, fuck, they line to us. You know what I mean? So we walk him in. We go to the hotel around the corner. Ray is calling that damn quick. I was like, how the fuck he calling us?

And he just walked in there, play. He said, oh, no, it's going to be all right, man. They said, I got to wait to this lady get back all vacation. I don't want y'all to fly out and stay we're like, we stand you know, next thing I know Rafe got people calling us from that jail that we don't even know.

Hey, my name, Kevin. Rayford told me to call you, give you this address. He was like, the kids wear size 3T and 4T. I was like, what the fuck is this? Just taking care of people. Some dude that came through the federal system, Rayford got us calling home to send clothes.

to send clothes to his girl that just, you know, got little babies. Like, he ain't even been in there one day. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? It's unbelievable. The world travels so fast, though. We in a hotel.

We get the top flight, the best room they had. Next thing we know, we're seeing, like, news trucks and shit. So I was like, we ain't going outside. Vince was like, yeah, let's not go outside. You know, Rayford calling. He said, man, they told him all they don't know when this lady coming back from vacation, he said,

I'm getting skeptical now. I was pissed. Because my whole thing was, y'all lied, you know. He's supposed to win an end, come out every day, work, you know, have a little job. A couple of days passed,

we said, Ray, we're going to fly home because, you know, we had jobs. Shit, we fly home, not even home a week. Ray, for calling every day. You know, we could see him on a video screen. I think I got a couple of them videos, too. And he's showing a whole,

old dorm, right? Fucker, everybody in there is probably only him and two black guys. Everybody in there, white, right? Everybody in there, love them. They're like, man, they're doing you wrong, you know, on the video. And I'm like, Ray, do you know them? He said, nah, I just meant them. That's Skip, that's Kevin, you know.

He's naming people. He said, I'm going to look off for him. You know, they're doing them wrong. I'm like, Ray, you can't look off of people until you get out. When I tell you, we flew down. we rented a Tesla truck, one of them big trucks, the cyber beasts, and we waiting outside for Rayford.

When I tell you, every police in their jail walked out, women, white women, crying. We got some of the video, right? He won't lead the gate. He told him, man, I'm going to miss y'all. I said, Ray, we got to drive

to Tennessee to get to the airport. He was like, no, man, I got to say bye to them, man. Kevin bought to come out and go to work. work release, I'm going to tell them to stay out of trouble. And we was like, fuck. We was driving.

Remarkable. We driving to Tennessee. We stopped at the Ferrari dealer by the airport because he said they had to use the bathroom. So we was like, he said, I want to get one of them ice creams. You know, one of them, I forgot what that shit called Tropical smoothie or whatever. I said, Ray, you can't eat that shit. If you're going to be using the bathroom, we're getting on a plane. So I said, man, I'm walking next door.

The lady going to my, um, excuse me, um, you got to have an appointment to come in here. I'm like, the fuck out of here. So I walked back outside, looking at the cars outside. Rafe was standing by cars. Man, what is this? I was like a Bentley. That motherfucker walked in the door. I don't know what he said to the lady, but I'm going to show you the pictures in the video.

He went stood by the car. He's my, I'm coming back to get this. it was 826,000 or something. The lady was like, here's my car. Please make sure you come back. I looked at the lady like, bitch, you wouldn't even let me walk in. So Ray took a picture about his blue one.

Wow, bro. He took a picture about his white one. And he was like, I'm buying that car. And I was like, Ray, that car caused him a million dollars. He said, so? Do you think he had money, stashed from those years? Something. Because he was like, we're going to be all right soon as they.

As soon as they let me go, he said, I got a trick for you. And I just, you know, I just was like, I believe everything he said at that point. Because everything he says comes true. He manifests it. That lady wouldn't let me walk in there. The door opened, she stopped me in my tracks. I said, I just want to look at that car right there. She was like, it's appointment only.

And on the door, say that. But we turn around right away inside. We almost missed our fucking flight messing with him. Yeah. Ha. Okay, so guy, he's like Tony Robbins or something. Tony Robbins tries to teach this kind of like charisma, but you can't. He had it, man. It's just part of who he was, so special.

He had it. Where did you go? So, so where did you go from there? Where did he go? We drove to Tennessee to the airport. We didn't know we had that much time. We actually could have took him to Merlin to let him see his mom. We thought about it, right?

But I was like, Vince, I don't want nothing to happen. or somebody's seeing him. So you have to get him to the... Tennessee airport to get to Florida. Because that's where the halfway house is. It wasn't a halfway house. It was his sister house. Oh, okay.

See, people got him mistaken. His family owned the fucking house. Oh, so he didn't, he wasn't on, like, work release or anything. He did, he was, he was just on parole. Well, the Wick, Wicksack still tried to control, like saying, he still got a report to this head, a federal supervised officer. Right. Because they say he was going to be on paper the rest of his life.

And we was like, we're going to fight that shit. For sure. So people always say he died in the headway. I was, man, Rayford died in front of the house that his sister owns in Florida. I still go there now. Okay. I hate going. I just went, you know, me and my wife, my wife and his birthday the same day, November 26th.

What's the odds of that shit? Wow. We just went down there for our anniversary. I swear I ain't want to go. That shit killed me, you know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Everybody got the story mistaken. Oh, he was poison.

He was this. But before we get to that, we drive to Florida. I mean, we get on Tennessee to the airport. We run a car to drive to the house, right? Raven was like a big kid. I'm getting in the swimming pool of the house. He was like, video. And I'm going to show you this video when I find it.

He was like, people thought I was dead. I was counted out. And he's saying that shit. So you know after he passed away, you know how your iPhone throw that memory up? Man, that shit scared this shit out of me because I was like, it's saying,

yeah, they thought I was dead. And I was like, the fuck? That shit ruined me. But his whole thing, I need to call this person. They said there's son ain't got no shoes. I was like, how can people that's in jail and people on the street be asking for all these God damn favors.

Already, yeah. You know what I mean? He just got out. So how long was he out before he passed? I mean, it couldn't have been a year. No, it wasn't a year. It wasn't even a year. Nope, he didn't even.

He made it to his birthday, which was November 26th. He died at 17th of December. Oh, my God. So he was... A couple of months. It was just a few months. I thought he was a healthy guy. He was running...

Six-three, all muscle. Yeah. Never seen a doctor in jail. Right. So, you know, I was skeptical about it too, because I talked to him that morning. I was at a funeral. He said, I know you couldn't fly down the day.

I said, I'd be there tomorrow, right? This is the day he died. So I didn't get it. He said, I got to go see my probation office, the supervisor, which was a dick. So the girl had an Uber to take him to see him. So I usually, I'm out the funeral, and I'm like, right for him, call.

Yeah, what the fuck? So I'm dialing his number. Nobody called. I mean, nobody answered. I said he must be still in there with this dick, because the dude was a dick. I mean, he was just like, I'm going to test you for drugs every day. The Rayfrey never used drugs, idiot. He said, I don't want none of your co-defendants around, but they approve me to be around regardless.

He said he didn't care. It's a violation if I'm there. But we had paperwork saying that I could be there. Vince called me. He was like, where you are? He sounded bad. He's like, I'm on the phone. phone, Rayful not breathing. I'm on the phone with the medics and the lady and the Uber guy.

He dialed your number, then he dialed my number because that's the last people, you know, Rayford called and his girl. And he clicked me in. And I could hear the responding lady saying, I said, it's a camera at the house. That's what I said. I said, call Ray Sheld. Tell her get on the fucking camera. We could see what's going on in front of the garage. And you can see them trying to resuscitate them. The lady did it for like 33 minutes. Wow. And then she was like, I'm going to have to give up. And, man, I think my whole heart dropped.

I was like, don't do that shit. You know what I mean? I'm in my hellcat. I ended up on the curve in D.C. I'm out the car. My wife, you know, how they can locate you on your phone and shit. She was like, what is going on? I said, Rayford not breathing.

Man, I lost my shit. And I was so mad because I didn't go because he said, go ahead to that funeral, and they'd come the next day. Because I would have been there. He wouldn't have been in no Uber. So the Uber was a little Asian guy, probably like not even five feet tall. He couldn't get him out of the car.

We looked at the video, you know what I mean? Rayful's sister showed us, and I'm like, the fuck. And he waited, so he thought he was sleep in the back of the car. Right. He said, all right. He said, thank you, you, rifle. He was like, yeah.

and he said he went to sleep. So he had a heart attack in his sleep. But you know me, me, Vince, one of our other buddies, Jose, he was like, rape security. Shit, we hopped in him in Vince truck and hauled ass down in the rain. The police wouldn't let me see the body.

And then, you know, they was like, what's your name? And I was like, you know, I told him my name. Well, he got you as like a son, you know, on his stuff. but they wouldn't do shit. They was like, we got to declare what happened.

I said, somebody pulls him. You know, everything running through my head and mine. I was like, but Ray ain't going to take nothing for nobody. He only went to the probation officer. You know, even Vincent was like, do you think somebody who touched him or pausing him? I'm like, you know, being who he is, you think about the movie shit.

And you'd be like, did the probation officer give his ass something? Because this bitch never called us, never said, sorry for your laws to his family because he was a dick. I even went to the probation place but they wouldn't let me in.

It's hard to know, man, because even with a guy as strong as Ray doing 35 years under those conditions, it's hard to explain. It just depletes your body. Let me just tell you. And your mind, of course. So I don't had,

I got seven stints. I don't have five heart attacks since. I've been home. Oh, my God. So, you know, the joke with me and was, I was like, I'm going to stay alive until you get home. Yeah.

He was like, boy, you're going to be okay. You know, I even had a heart attack on the phone with him before. Wow. Driving to the hospital and woke up on a helicopter. The second opt-tops, both optosies said Maine, Audrey was clogged. Oh, they was going to show me. I mean, you know, I was like, nah, this shit, it is what it is. I had to sign for his body.

I paid for it to get flown back. That shit was harder than I thought it was because I wasn't legally his son. And we know how family do. His son changed his name or whatever. And now everybody wants to be involved. You know, sometimes people think money is somewhere. And I had to come to a conclusion of him.

I said, well, you know his family. body coming back home. His mom is here. You know, they didn't want to do it, but he had to be convinced. So me and Vince flew back to Florida. I paid for everything. One of my friends gave me a funeral home. They said, why did they got all his belongings? They're going to give it to you when you get to the airport. You want to fly with them. So I couldn't get a flight with that plane. So we fucking hopped on a flight and went back home and waited until it came to BWI. You know what I mean? Reagan. Of course, that leaked out, because whoever one of the assholes was, they tried to sell,

you know, the story. I'm the one picking up Rayful's body. They ain't take no pictures, though, because, boy, they were going to be in trouble. I got to the funeral home, and they, fuck, I felt like I was ready to have a heart attack. Because they were like, come on, they want you to go in and look at the body again, blah, blah, blah. I stayed in for like three hours. like I said I could show you video Vince cutting his head while he did

we dressing him because Vince was just bothering he won't let nobody touch him yeah like I said it should have been me instead of him I still say that because you've been locked up so long yeah well I mean what a epic ending

to a guy with such a remarkable misunderstood life it's almost like it had to be that way you know like it was God he really was touched by something higher you know

so let me uh one more thing so when he passed you know we hauled ass to Florida right it rained all the way to fuck there I mean I'm driving they scared because they were like why you let us drive

I couldn't right I was like I got a kid there I got to get there we turned on that fucking street And this is God is my witness I got the video I was getting out the car The fucking sun came out

I'm talking hot as hell Where you can see the steam Coming off the ground As soon as I pull in front of the garage I'm scared to get out the truck Vincent Jose get out I get out the truck I'm videoing them two

Because I'm like man I ain't never coming here again That's all I said The fucking front door The screen opens and slams, like real hard. You can hear it on the video. It's no wind blowing or no nothing. These two, Jose, went like 300 and something. I mean, big security guy. I mean, they ain't fat.

Vince, Puerto Rican, they look at me. I'm ready to get in the truck and pull off. Vince believe in that spiritual stuff. He was like, Ray opened the door for us. And I was like, I'm not going in there. It took a minute before I can even go on that bitch. And when I showed the video sent it to his sister and everybody, they was like, they weren't no wind blowing. I said, and look, I go to the door. The door hard is held to open,

the screen door to the inside that's, you know, to the house. And my wife was like, you can't explain that shit. You know what I mean? Fucking, um. And that just kind of is a perfect fitting to his life,

which was inexplicable. A lot of it was just could not be explained. And then I didn't, you know, I wasn't there when they took the body and all that, right? I walk out to the swimming pools. I walk back out front. I don't know why I went out there. I look in the trash can. The blankets they covered, they covered them up with, and some of his socks was in the trash can.

I took it out and took it to his sister. I was like, what's the odds of that shit? Because I don't know why I looked in the trash can. Yeah. So I gave it to her. She was like, what's this? I said, look back at the camera. These are the two blankets they laid on top of them into the, you know,

the police and stuff came. People was fucking calling the phones. You know, they was my phone and Vince phone. Can I speak the rival? He's not dead? And we like, that bitch, don't call his phone no more. You know, I mean, up until like four months, people were still calling. I know he ain't dead.

Well, I've seen the death certificate. You showed it to me. Yes, sir. So what is his reputation now? Do you think his legend will live on for many. generations in D.C. I mean, he's a very well-known guy. He's, he's, it's going to keep it. Like I said, it's still going and you'd be like, the man is dead now. I mean, you got the people, you got a lot of people that be like, ain't nobody like him. Yeah. Oh, y'all fake drug dealers. Y'all fake this.

But you got the guys that want, you know, they try to use the podcast, you know, social media. You say rightful name, people going to listen. That's why I ain't never do it. You know what I mean? Reefers tell me all the time. Man, do it. It's your story too. Make some money. Legal money. I used to be like, I wait till you come home. And, you know, he mentioned your podcast more than once. I wanted them on here, man. That would have been.

Oh, hell, yeah. He was going to do it. And like I said, him and Vince, they were like, why do you got to look at these podcasts? I don't look at so much of your stuff. She said, my wife, looking at it now probably. She was talking about her this morning. And she was like, you must like to get her. Yeah, because you'd be saying no to everybody. I'd be like, nah, Rafe would like them? I said, what I'm going to do? Go against him?

You know, and he was even like a little bit of your story. He was saying, you know, like some of the things you've been through. He was like, yeah, his stuff is a little different. You know what I mean? He was like, everybody else want to idolize this bullshit or don't want to say none of the good. Say the good and the bad. And that's what I tell a lot of people,

like some of the people I don't have conversations with. Step to, you know, in other words, I was like, hey, just tell the whole story. Don't be on your little podcast. I'm a rifle of a snitch, Rayful of Rap. Tell how that came about where all the people told on us or all the people that told on him again or bring the police to him. I said, what are you supposed to do? I said, you know it's supposed to be no honor musties, right, or criminals. I said, do your homework.

Rafer wasn't dead. he was a goddamn, I always say the civilian kingpin. Yeah, yeah. He really was like almost like a ghetto saint in certain ways. Hell yeah. You know, it harmed a lot of people with drugs, but he was just a man of his time, you know. We'll never see another era like that, thank God,

uh, in American history, an urban American history. And he is, I think, I mean, when you compare him to other people of his stature, other drug kingpins, black drug kingpins. I don't think anybody had it like him.

Certainly not in the cocaine era. Nobody was making money like that. Yeah, that's what. And then, you know, that's the stuff that, uh, shit, my grandson ain't number nine years old, right? One of them. Yeah. I mean, because he called me dad still. He said, they was talking about rifle in my school.

And I'm like, elementary. And then I got a 17-year-old, right? He'd go to, the only reason he went to Dumbar because Rieffel went there. Him and Rieffel talked every day damn near. I mean, and he was like, you got to let him go to Dumbar. You know, my other kids went to a private school or they went to, you know, a charter school. He went to Rateful school. This is last year playing football and everything.

He called me last, well, two weeks ago. Dad, and FaceTime me. I was like, you're supposed to have your phone to school. On the screen, they show me, Rayful, and all of us. And he's saying all the kids are doing like this. Dominic, ain't that your father? And I was like, why y'all doing that? Some social class that they, you know,

saying how somebody ran a Fortune 500 company, blah, blah, blah. I was like, do they know I'm your father? He was like, my teammates, dude, they mess with me now. And I was like, you know, that's. That ain't what I want to be known as. You know what I'm saying? But shit, the class was like three hours long. And I said they actually used a rifle shit because he went to that school.

Yeah. Vala Victorian, straight-age student. Wow. Most popular, if you look at the old school books. Great Hooper. Play basketball. Yeah. I mean, the best.

Should have stuck with that. But, you know. Hell yeah. And what they say, they're most likely to succeed in the yearbook. Wow. Wow. you know well well we could talk all day maybe we'll talk a little more over on the patreon the bonus but uh whitey i'm so honored i really am i mean i'm honored to meet you too man

i'd rather you have it than anybody else at least we know you know what to do with it you hear that blad yeah definitely him and rife wanted it it ain't like this is nothing that i did this was in of making before he passed. Well, I hope he sees this wherever he is. And, you know, this will be locked in time. And I just wanted to get it on the record because, of course, with these street legends, the truth is always somewhere in the middle.

And it's never what the rumors are. And nobody is ever all good or all bad. But that was really like so many things that I didn't even know about. Yeah, that's why I said people, they talk, but it's what they heard and what they added on, right? Yeah. And then half of that shit is trashed. And I hope this sets the record straight.

I know it does. Nobody can tell this story besides you. And, yeah, like I said, it was just a great honor. And so. Yeah. Finally got it off my chest because, like I said, I never, I ain't sit with nobody. Yeah. We talked about it.

And like I said, he had. you at the top of that list with Vince, you know what I mean? Man, must be doing something right. Well, yeah, definitely. Harry Whitey Sullivan, in the great irony of the street, a black guy named Whitey. Exactly. I, again, can't thank you enough for coming out here.

And then we'll switch over and we'll do a bonus chat because, you know, there's layers of your story that we just didn't get all the way to. And your story is just as fascinating. head over to patreon.com slash the Connect show, sitting down with the DC legend, Whitey Sullivan.

Thanks again, brother. Appreciate it, man. All right, guys. All right.