The Current - Size matters. Meet the owners of some of Canada's micro restaurants and bars

Episode Date: January 9, 2026

A cocktail bar with what must be the world's smallest dance floor. A locavore restaurant inside the proprietors' farmhouse. An experimental Chinese dining room tucked inside another restaurant. Their owners have embraced tiny because it brings them and their customers joy.

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Sometimes you want to go with your name. I can see. Troubles are all the same. Everybody knows. I mean, the theme song doesn't lie. At a place called Standing Room Only in Guelph, Ontario, they might not shout out greetings when you walk through the door, like at the TV bar, cheers. But by the end of the evening, you will likely have had a few laughs with other patrons

because you don't have much of a choice. It is, apparently, the small. bar in Canada. It could squeeze in 22 people, max, and it's one of a number of micro-establishments popping up across this country, where you might be one of only a dozen or so diners in a tiny room, and where the chef gets to experiment and serve you something you never quite expected. Doug Todd is the mind behind standing room only in Guelph, Ontario. Joel Gray is co-owner and chef at down-home restaurant in Markdale, Ontario, northwest of Toronto. And Eva Chin is the chef and co-founder of Yan Dining Room in Toronto.

Good morning, everyone. Good morning. Good morning. Doug, is this actually the smallest bar in Canada? It is. It is. You had mentioned apparently. No, it is officially Canada's smallest bar.

It's 138.88.88 square feet. How big is 138.88.88 square feet. I mean, describe that to me. Smaller than a typical bedroom. And so if you open the door to this tiny, little place. What do you see? Oh, wow. I try to explain that. You walk into, you're walking into another time. It is, it is designed to be a speakeasy from the 30s, 40s. It's got a tribute to build more hats. So all the hat, all the lighting in there are hats that come down. It's very

copper, very little rascals. I guess that's the way you could put it. You have to see it. There's a dance floor in there, too? We have the world's smallest dance floor. It's less than four square feet, but Guinness Book World Records wants like $16,000 to recognize it. So I get better things I can spend $16,000. We'll say it's the world's smallest dance floor. When your bar is full to the brim, at capacity, what is it like?

I don't want to say chaos. It's definitely fun. you have no choice but to get to know the other people that are there. Your drink doesn't come quick, but you're entertained watching that other person's drink getting made. It's just the design of the place. And so last question before we speak with some of our other guests on this. Just as, I mean, why? Why would you make a bar that small?

Oh, man, you know something? It was a joke. The space came available. A buddy and mine bought the building. It was actually being set up for a couple of barbers. and last minute the barbers backed out. It was a friend walking by that saw me in there and basically popped in and saying,

we don't know what to do with the space. And he made a comment that made a cool little bar. And then it all kind of fell together. It's like, I'll take the least. I got an idea here. We broke a lot of rules putting it together. It's in a residential area. It's just in a spot where you would not expect a bar.

And it works. It really works. It's become a destination. place. People are coming in from all over just to see it and experience it. I love it. Eva, tell me a little bit about Yan dining room. This is a tiny little place as well. What, 26 patrons a night? Yes, 26 to 28. We are, I guess, what we call a micro-restraught located within a private dining room of a legacy Chinatown restaurant that's been open for 28 years. So it's a restaurant inside a restaurant? Exactly.

Tell me a little about What does it look like? We heard a little bit about what this tiny bar Looks like. Describe what your mini restaurant looks like. So, I guess you walk through the front doors of Hongxing Chinese restaurant, which is a 28-year-old Chinatown

mom-and-pop family restaurant. And as you walk through the front doors, you know, usually patrons to let the hostess know that they're here for either Honging or for Yan dining room. And if it's for Yan dining room, They get pointed towards the inside, past the bar. They walk through the takeout station, and they're guided into this central private dining room.

And once you enter the room, it's like you entered into a different oasis. The decor, the lighting, the music, everything is different. And once the door closed, you're kind of enclosed to that experience for the next two and a half hours. Why did you want to make something like this? So the concept actually existed a long time ago. It's called Sifon Choy, which is in straight translation of domestic kitchen. And this concept started in the late 80s in Hong Kong when retired chefs from more larger scale banquet Chinese restaurants were bored. And they wanted to cook for friends and family or industry folks.

and so they often would hit up their friends who own these restaurants and who have these private dining rooms who'd be able to lend the kitchen for the chef to play with, I guess. And I was inspired by that concept and I wanted to introduce that back. I was dying out and also it doesn't even exist in North America yet. And I just wanted to bring that concept in. It really freed up my creativity for cooking. This is something that you grew up with, right? Yeah, up to this day, it is a flourishing concept in China and Hong Kong.

And you would go, tell me a little bit about how you were introduced to that concept. It was my family who introduced it to me. My father, my father's a big fan of Cantonese cuisine, and oftentimes the chefs that he really enjoyed after the retired, it was hard to trace them. And so he would keep an eye out for these supper clubs. these underground micro restaurants. And I have fond memories of visiting them as a young child with him.

Joel, your dining room is even smaller than the one that Eva is talking about. This is, it's in the house, in the farmhouse that you live in, right? It is, yeah. Yeah, up here in the heart of Gray County, we seat roughly about 16 people three nights a week. So Thursday, Friday, Saturdays. Why would you make a restaurant in your home? Oh, man, for so many different reasons. I mean, we really wanted to show people a very intimate and personal space.

That was the true representation of both my partner, Hannah, and myself. And, yeah, we moved to the middle of Gray County because that's where all the farms that we were buying everything from previously before was. So we wanted to do like definitely a destination restaurant where we could really focus on each individual guest and share the stories and the passions of our local farmers as well as learn to grow some food ourselves. So doing that on a small scale just seemed like it had so much purpose. It seemed like we were able to connect. And then one of our, you know, one of the best ways to do that was like especially if you're trying to run a farm and a restaurant at the same time is you can. you kind of have to be there all the time.

So we moved to this little farmhouse, and we started working on the idea of opening the restaurant here. And we just slowly started growing that, elaborating on it, cooking with fire outside, but still really focused on that small, intimate seating, and connecting with people. What do you get out of that, that intimacy, because it's so different,

and we can talk about this with our other guests with Doug and Eva as well. But in your farmhouse, the way that it's set up, I mean, it's so different than a large-scale restaurant because you're right there with people. What do you get out of that? Yeah, I think, like, a lot of times, like, people cooking in restaurants, it's like, it's a huge focus on the food, which is definitely very important. But I've always loved connecting with people, storytelling, like, getting to know people intimately and working in big restaurants, you kind of lose that, like working in the back kitchen,

whether it be a closed kitchen. So cooking is almost like a vessel for me to connect with people, like build relationships, connections, really get to know them. And then you're able to kind of share that story about the things that you love and get that point across very easily. It just feels so personal. And I think now, like, especially with the way

the restaurants are shifting, as we're talking about like micro restaurants, people are really seeking out something that feels authentic and has a sense of purpose in real meaning. And that's something that I felt like we found as soon as we moved out here. We're like, we're exactly where we need to be. it just feels it feels right and do you do you hear that from your diners as well that they are looking

for something that is that is more intimately connected with the people who are not just cooking the food but you mentioned i mean you're you're a couple hours northwest of toronto you have a local menu that they want to be connected with the people who are producing that food as well i think so i think um you know i mean it can come from many ways but i like to think that like if people are willing to drive, you know, from Toronto or whatever, all the way out to Markdale, to have dinner, that they're going to be interested in some different way. It's not just going to be for food. They're going to be wanting that sense of connection, something that's a little bit different,

something that's exciting, like a real destination. So I think, yeah, that kind of fits, I think. You know, some people just come because they want to have a great meal. And there's a lot of people that we get to feed that are just around the corner from us or locals, you know, whether it be a small thing. town around us. And sometimes that, you know, our storytelling about the farms and stuff like that, that hits almost a lot better with those people because then they get to know kind of what's around them. So it's just all really personal connection, which is amazing.

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It's easy as Arndor Trois. Learn French, have fun, repeat. Download the free Morial app now. But you've talked about that as well. And the piece that you wrote in McLean's magazine about your micro restaurant, you said the bigger the restaurant gets, the greater the distance between you and the food. What did you mean by that? Well, you know, when it's a large-scale restaurant, it becomes so transactional, I think, I mean, for the most part, I think restaurants have become very transactional for diners. And it's almost as if they feel like they come in and they pay for getting her.

and they own, they own everything above that restaurant for the two hours that they're dining there. And I feel like when there's such an unbalanced relationship, it takes away the joy and the meaning of the art that's being processed. And at least with my micro restaurant, there is a lot of rules to abide. And I'm okay with that. I'm okay making my diners work to understand that it's not just a, transaction to enjoy the food and the art that me and my team create. And it's not just about the food too. It's the experience that my entire team front and back put forward to creating the experience by having a micro restaurant that has allowed me to personalize

every single part of the experience of someone coming in from greeting them to seeding them, to explaining the dishes, to being able to say goodbye to them at the end of meal and sharing a short conversation. To me, these are all little aspects that humanize experience, that large restaurants are not able to translate in that moment. Doug, that would sound like it's automatic in a bar that's the size of a phone booth, right?

I mean, you have no option but to have that intimate relationship with the people who are there drinking in your spot. It's funny because it's so precise to what goes on at standing room. Yes, you're there to enjoy an experience, but you are part of the experience. You have no choice, but like we were saying earlier, meet the other people that are there. And somebody who you would never speak to, you know, anywhere else, all of a sudden you're tossed into it. It's funny, the networking that ends up happening at these little places. But yeah, you're in standing room, yes, you're there to experience something special,

but yeah, you are part of the action. You become part of it. You leave wanting to come back to your next experience. Can you tell me a bit more about what happens in those small spaces? We live now at a time where it's easy to not have contact with other people, right? You can be on your phone. AI can do the thing for you. You're crammed into this little spot.

You have to talk to strangers, right? you have to, like, actually rub up against somebody else. What happens in those in those moments, do you think, Doug? I find people will make fun of other people who pull out their phone, unless they're going to film something that's unique that's happening in the bar, but it's, it's, I let them kind of govern themselves. Hey, put that away. Watch this.

And I see it. I see it regularly. It's very different than where you used to work, right? You worked at medieval times, is this correct? Yeah. This is like the giant, like, jousting the nights and you eat chicken with your hands. This was a long time ago, yes, yes. Yeah, I've been involved in the entertainment industry at one point or another.

So it's, I guess it runs in my blood. So I'm not afraid to open a conversation and steer people in a direction that's going to make the evening fun. That's for sure. When you told people that you were opening this tiny little place, what was their reaction? A lot of people told me I was a fool. I've had numerous people. We've got this gentleman in Guelph who calls himself a heroineur. He's been to the city numerous times about standing room and caused some issues for us.

What is his issue with this? Because it's in a residential neighborhood? It could be. It could be. But he just outright told the city. and told the newspaper that I'm a fool. And, you know, I'm going to go bankrupt in no time. And standing room only is holding its own strong.

It's become kind of a staple in Guelph. And it's definitely become a permanent fixture. People come. It's become a destination place. I heard that mentioned earlier. You know, you make your way out this way. You've got to experience this. Well, what we're noticing is we're getting people coming in from all over.

People are coming into Toronto to visit family, friends. they've got to do Niagara Falls. You got to go to Wonderland and get sick on a coaster. And now you've got to go to standing room only and experience a cocktail. So, yeah, it's just interesting. I'm just watching it organically grow out. Joel, your place is a destination as well. I just wonder, we often hear that places need to be bigger to survive,

that bigger is better and that you need to have scale to be able to make a goal of it, particularly in something as precarious as the hospitality industry. Do you worry about the viability of a project like this? Oh, definitely all the time. I think, like, you know, fear is definitely a great driving factor to always keep pushing you forward, you know, more than I think you could rely on ego or things like that. I think it's more the fear of always wanting to succeed. But I think there's like, you know, the beautiful thing about, like, us having a restaurant in our house is we're able to, like, manage costs a lot. We're able to be more efficient with certain things, as well as, like, the beautiful thing about, like, us having a restaurant in our house is we're able to, like, we're able to be more efficient with certain things.

as well as like, you know, the restaurant might be small, but the space that we're on is very large. So there's a lot of opportunity to diversify our business. Like the restaurant is like one part of our business where it's like, you know, growing the farm aspect, learning to grow food, opening a farm store this year or two as well. So we can keep pushing that narrative of supporting local, small scale, but in a different way. So there's a lot of opportunity for growth that just doesn't put you in just necessarily a small box. of a restaurant that can help, you know, support that restaurant too as well. And you have more control, it seems like, than if you worked for somebody else or you were part of a larger organization. I mean, you can, and Eva was talking a little bit about this.

You can dictate what it is that you're serving. You can be very specific and precise about the food that you are presenting and the atmosphere that you want to create for other people. Exactly. Exactly the way that Eva was just kind of explaining that. just really focused on that experience from the moment that guest walks through the door, you know, especially the way like we curate a menu, you know, everything is precisely organized, brought in. We know all the details of our diners that are coming in ahead of time. So it can almost be like anti-restraintrants sometimes.

It's like we're trying to eliminate all the stress so that diner can come in and have like the best experience they can. And also all of our staff that's working here or Hannah myself can also have that best experience and set ourselves up for success, I think. Yeah, most of the time anyway. Eva, you've worked at large places. Can you ever imagine going back to a larger restaurant now that you have your own beautiful little space? Oh, I mean, never say never. Where the world is a scary place. You don't know what's going to happen. But for my own restaurants, I don't think I'm looking to open any place more than 60 seats.

to be honest, for the foreseeable future. Doug, I mean, you've been successful with this little spot. I could imagine that other people would say, you should open a bigger bar. Think of what you could do with a larger space. Would you ever be tempted? No, thank you. I'm loving the way it works.

Listen, everything about it works. The landlord put in a patio for all three businesses to use. It was something he kind of planned for, I guess, guaranteeing that his rent gets paid. but he put in a patio and I do license it so in the summer you can you know you can go outside and have have a drink it's it's funny how I created an outdoor menu basically ready to drink in a can and nobody wants them everybody wants the fancy cocktails that we make inside they'll come in they'll watch the drink get made and then they'll take the cocktail outside and enjoy it outside and make room for

others but it's I wouldn't change it if anything I would I would entertain the idea of putting up a location, but it would be small. Everything about it would be small. It works. One person operates the whole bar. The neat thing about these stories is that they are kind of proof of concept, that you come up with an idea and you can actually make it happen. What would you say, finally, Joel, to somebody, it's the beginning of the year. And people are looking for inspiration to do something maybe that they've always thought about doing. And they think, well, I have to do something big. I can't do something small. What would you say, Joel, to somebody who's thinking, I could do this and I could do something at a small scale?

Yeah, I mean, I hope, I mean, this is like one of the things where the concept that we have here up in Gray County, it just shouldn't be us. You know what I mean? I'm like, this concept can exist. Anywhere else that exists around the world, like a small business, especially this focus, farm board. Like, I hope we can be an inspiration to show that others can do this. You know, it can be, you know, more local, more driven. And it doesn't have to be the biggest thing. It can be very intimate and curated in a very special life.

fanciest, nicest things, you know, the flashest restaurants. And we started very humble, very small. And we just slowly started elaborating on that and growing as a business and like really curating that experience for people. So yeah, there's a lot of opportunity for people to just kind of think outside the box. And I think that should be expressed in many different ways, you know, within culinary school, you know, in business. Like it doesn't have to be the largest, the largest of things.

It's like maybe it's a little bit more humble. It's a little bit more controlled and small. I don't know. It's just we found the sense of purpose that makes us feel good and we're doing what we're supposed to be doing, which helps drive our business forward. And I think people feel that. And I think that as Eva was kind of chatting about that, like, I just want to see others do that too, you know? That's excellent. I'm glad for all of your successes in smaller places.

Bigger isn't necessarily better. And I can't wait to come and check out all of your drinking the tiny little bar and eating in the restaurant in the restaurant and eat in your own home as well. Joel and Doug and Doug and Doug Doug Todd runs the bar standing room only in Guelph, Ontario. Joel Gray co-owns downhome restaurant in Markdale, Ontario. And Eva Chin runs Yan dining room in Toronto. You've been listening to the current podcast. My name is Matt Galloway. Thanks for listening. I'll talk to you soon. For more CBC Podcasts, go to cBC.ca slash podcasts.