The Current - What it’s like to be stuck on a cruise ship with a deadly virus

Episode Date: May 6, 2026

As passengers aboard the MV Hondius deal with the spread of a rare strain of hantavirus, we look at what it’s like to be stuck on a cruise ship and what can be done to prevent the spread of hantavirus in Canada.

This week on two blocks from the White House, we're talking about a Supreme Court decision that could have a big impact on American elections. The decision narrows, some argue guts the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and it's expected to lead to a major redrawing of electoral maps. Join me, Paul Hunter, and my fellow Washington correspondence, Katie Simpson and Willie Lowry, as we break down U.S. politics from a Canadian perspective. Find and follow two blocks from the White House, wherever you get your podcasts, and watch us on YouTube. This is a CBC podcast. Hello, I'm Matt Galloway, and this is the current podcast. I am currently on board that I'm the hobbyist, and what's happening right now is very real for all of us here.

There's a lot of uncertainty, and that's the hardest part. All we want right now is to feel safe, to have clarity, and to get home. American travel influencer, Jake Rosemary, is one of nearly 150 people, including four Canadians still on board the MV Hondias. That is the ship where the World Health Organization says eight cases of Hanta virus have been identified and may be spreading from human to human, which is rare for an infection usually caught from rodents. Three passengers on the ship have died. That ship has been moored off of the coast of the timely island nation of Cape Verde,

which is off the coast of West Africa, but soon it will be on its way to the Canary Islands, where Spain has agreed to receive it, but that island. President opposes the plan to have the ship dock there. We will speak with an expert on Hantavirus and about how to deal with outbreaks on cruise ships in just a moment. But first, we're joined by Craig Lee, who knows a little bit of what it's like to be stuck on a cruise ship during an infectious disease outbreak. He was on board the Diamond Princess off the coast of Japan in February of 2020 when a growing number of passengers were diagnosed with COVID. And Craig Lee is with me now in our Toronto studio. Good morning. Good morning, Matt.

You and I spoke at that time, and it's good to have you here with us. in studio, you can hear the emotion in that passenger's voice in terms of being stuck on the ship and what he's going through. What's it like listening to him? It brings back a lot of memories that we had. I was an interior cabin actually in the Diamond Princess with my friend Larry. We were told that we had to stay put in our cabins. We were allowed to go on deck one hour a day. We had to use the N-95 masks. We couldn't talk to anybody. We answered the door with their masks on. They had the garb completely covered their bodies and their hands. At one point, we were told that it was by touch that we were going to get the COVID. However, they found out

that it was the air that was giving us the virus. My friend Larry never got COVID. We were supposed to come home on the Friday after two weeks, and every arrangements had been made with the Canadian government to get us off the ship. However, the day before, There was a knock on the door, and they said, Mr. Lee, I said, yes. You have COVID. You cannot leave the ship. How were people feeling on board when they were told that all of those restrictions were in place, that you couldn't move around? It was a bit scary. The day before we went to the shutdown, we had what's called a sea day. So we had complete use of the ship.

We could go to the dining rooms, the fitness. We could eat anywhere. We could exercise and everything else. And then we were told in the morning of the first day of, quarantine, you have to stay put. You cannot leave your cabin. It's like being in prison, I guess. Is that what it felt like? I mean, being stuck on a ship like that, not able to move around, not able to go anywhere, not knowing when you're going to be able to get out of the ship, that it felt like being in prison? It did, but the scariest thing is we were afraid that

we didn't know what was going to happen, just as this lady said. And as you said, people were dying. This is the early days of COVID when you were there. And so no, Nobody really knew what was happening. No one knew anything about it. And we've got all sorts of different stories. And luckily, the captain was our savior. He came on every day and tried to give us reinsurance. This is going to be done.

This is going to being done. Every crew member and every passenger was given a thermometer to take the temperatures to monitor. One third of the crew and passengers had prescription medicines, and we were running out. So the Japanese health gave us all. these prescriptions without any problem at all and no cost at all. Did you understand the fear that other people had? We were saying that the president of the Canary Islands is it isn't want this ship,

the one that has the passengers on it now that we're talking about, some of whom apparently have this hantavars, that it doesn't want that ship to come to their port. Do you understand the concern that people had, based on what you had gone through? Oh, yeah. It's amazing. When we went for our walks, the hour, we would look outside,

and we'd see all of these medias there as well as these ambulances and they would have passages from the ship covered with blue plastic and the ambulances would come and take these people away and then there were buses coming as well. So it was the unknown. We didn't know what was going to happen. And then you were, as I said,

you tested positive for COVID as well. That must have been terrifying. It was, but I had no symptoms. And I said, I'm quite well. I can go home. They said, no, you won't be allowed on the plane. In fact, we're going to have to put you in a hospital. So you had to go through that passageway?

Yes, and when I went on this bus, and it was filled every other seat, and I was sitting at the back, and all the curtains in the bus were closed, and I was in my winter jacket with the mask on and with my flight bag, and I sat at the very back of the bus, and I started getting claustophobia. If you had a word for those people who, are trapped on this cruise ship right now? What would you say to them based on what you've gone through? Trust the authorities know what they're doing.

Keep your hands clean. Keep sanitized. Keep away from people. Follow what the rules are. And just try to relax. Things will work out all right. Would you ever go back on a cruise ship again? Oh, I've been on three cruises since.

No problem. You answered that before I even finish the course. So you had no hesitation, no concerns about that going back on? No, because we were given good care. Diamond Princess, the Princess cruise ship was very supportive of all of us. They paid for a hotel once we got released from the hospital, as well as our flight home to Toronto. And I've even gone in an interior cabin again,

but I prefer the balconies, but it's money. If you're going to be stuck, you might as well be able to see the sea, I suppose. One nice thing about going to the hospital is I had a window. And I saw birds and I saw storms coming and everything else. It was such a change after being in the interior cabin. We wanted to speak with you again in part because there aren't many people who could understand the experience that those who are on board this ship have had. It's good to have you here and nice to meet you in person. Thank you very much.

You're quite welcome, Matt. Craig Lee was aboard the Diamond Princess in February of 2020 off the coast of Japan just in the early days of COVID-19. I had sepsis, my kidneys were failing, my lungs were full of fluid, and my heart stopped for 11 minutes. Got me to Vancouver Journal Hospital and got my heart going again. I spent two weeks in the hospital, and then I went home. But it took a year and a half to rebuild my body. I lost all my muscle mass, all my strengths. I was weak and fragile.

DGH call me the miracle man, because most people wouldn't survive that. Lauren Warburton of Pemberton, British Columbia, got sick with Hanta virus three years ago, even though the infection is very rare in Canada. David Safferanitz is chief of special pathogens at the National Microbiology Lab in Winnipeg, a leading researcher on this virus. David, good morning to you. Good morning. Thank you for having me. Thanks for being here. What is Hanta virus? Well, Hanna virus is a large group of viruses, actually. They have a global distribution. They do cause two different disease types than humans. The one that we're most focused. on right now with the cruise ship and the situation in North and South America is the ones that cause Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome. This is what people are calling the Andes strain. Is that right? Correct. Andes is the predominant strain circulating in South America. It's causing most of the cases down

there. It's important to note we do not have Ande's virus here in Canada. Unfortunately, for the situation currently, it is the one, however, that's been associated with human and human transmission. How rare is that? That's what the WHO, the World Health Organization, is suspecting. How rare is it for antivirus to spread from human to human? Well, in North America, it's extremely rare. In fact, it's never been documented in North America, because as I mentioned, we don't have that specific strain of antivirus. In South America, it remains rare, but I don't know that we have a true understanding of exactly how rare. It's difficult to determine in individual housing settings or just community-based events, whether people are actually being infected

directly from rodents or from previously infected or currently infected, I should say currently infected symptomatic patients in those communities. But overall, our understanding is that it's quite rare even in South America. And again, there are a lot of questions still about this, but what is your sense even from a distance as to how this may have ended up on this cruise ship? Yeah, I mean, there's multiple possibilities, right? There's the idea that perhaps there was some infected mice on the ship. I think that's unlikely. The contaminated food source that was a common source of meals for some of the passengers, it's a possibility, but also seems less likely than what the WHO is pointed to now, which is that some of the passengers were out doing

excursions in Argentina inadvertently became infected while doing so and boarded the ship infected, but perfectly healthy. And then at some point during the cruise, they started to show symptoms, classic indicators of HPS, the disease progressed to the point where the virus could transmit from human to human. Again, the close quarters of cruise ships probably aid in the efficiency of the transmission of the virus. And then I think that's where you get what we're seeing today, where there's multiple cases in this small confined space. And if you contract this, what happens? Sorry, I didn't catch that question. If you contract antivirus, if you are infected with hantavirus, what happens? Right. Well, I mean, initially not much.

the incubation period is quite long. So you'll be infected and not even really know it for two, even three weeks, possibly longer. Generally, symptom onset is quite gradual. It's what we call nondescript, so it's not really associated specifically with antiviruses. You might think you have a common cold or just general fatigue. But at some point with hantavirus pulmonary syndrome, you're going to start to have a respiratory manifestation. So the virus targets the lungs. You start with some coughing, some general difficulties breathing.

that can progress quite quickly into this severe respiratory distress, which ultimately requires medical intervention. Unfortunately, there's no specific medical therapy or antiviral that can be given to a patient to reverse the symptoms or reverse the course of the disease. So really getting appropriate and rapid medical attention to assist with breathing and to help you get through the infection. That's critical here. Do you understand why, for example, the president of the Canary Islands would say, I can't allow this boat to enter the waters of that nation because of the concerns that people have that this could spread, but also that there isn't really effective treatment. I do understand it from the standpoint that this is largely an unknown virus for many people.

I mean, we've been studying it since the early 90s when it was first discovered. A lot remains to be discovered with the virus. So, you know, and in the general public, it's not one that you hear about. very often. So local health authorities probably have, you know, their concerns are warranted. There's no doubt. But I think the important message is listen to the public health officials. The WHO has experience with these and other more contagious outbreaks. I think with proper guidance, these people can be properly taken off of the ship, you know, perhaps a brief quarantine period if needed, with some self-monitoring afterwards to ensure that they're not a risk to themselves

or to the communities should they actually have the virus. Just finally, and this is something that people have been talking about, understanding that it's a different strain. But there are a lot of Canadians at this point in the year. Could be going up to a cottage and cleaning out a cottage or a cabin or what have you. Maybe they work at a barn and there's mice or rats in the barn. And they come into contact with rodents and they worry about this virus. And again, a different strain of the virus, but this virus being present.

What would you say to them? Well, I think it's a great point. I really appreciate you bringing it up. Because now is the time of the year where we do start to see antivirus cases in Canada. We usually have a few cases in the spring and possibly a few cases in the fall. I would remind them that overall it's a very rare infection across Canada. We might have five or so cases a year. Ten cases in a single year would be an extraordinarily high number for Canada.

If you do suspect rodent infestation or if you have seen rodents, take the appropriate precautions, wear a mask to prevent yourself from inhaling virus-contaminated particles perhaps if you're sweeping or cleaning, those are risk activities, particularly after you're opening buildings that have been closed up over winter. So I think with appropriate cautions, people can really reduce the risk of contracting

anti-birus in Canada and in fact everywhere. But it's just something that they need to be aware of. If they do notice and they are concerned that they've inadvertently breathed in some of these particles or other ways of contracting the disease, take note, make note of the day. And if you do start to experience respiratory mass, manifestations down the road.

You know, when you do see your physician mention that you did see, or you may have had a rodent exposure, that will typically lead the physician to down the direction of the possibility of a hantavirus exposure. And if warranted, testing can be done. David, this is really helpful. Appreciate you being here this morning. Thank you.

Great. Thanks for having me. David Saffernett is Chief of Special Pathogens at the National Microbiology Lab in Winnipeg and a leading researcher on hanta virus. This week on two blocks from the White House, we're talking about a Supreme Court decision that could have a big impact on American elections. The decision narrows, some argue guts the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and it's expected to lead to a major redrawing of electoral maps. Join me, Paul Hunter, and my fellow Washington correspondents, Katie Simpson and Willie Lowry as we break down U.S. politics from a Canadian perspective. Find and follow two blocks from the White House, wherever you get your podcasts.

and watch us on YouTube. Dr. Vikram Nurenjan is an epidemiologist and professor of public health at the University of Limerick. He is in Limerick, Ireland. Dr. Nureanjong, good morning to you. Good morning. This sounds obvious in some ways, but given the close quarters of a cruise ship, what is it that allows for outbreaks of infectious diseases to happen easily in that sort of setting? I suppose the cruise ships bring together a large number of people in conflict.

find environment for several days. You know, there'll be sharing dining, sharing the cabins, entertainment areas, and kind of closely managed water and air system. So that means that this kind of place, even at home or the hospital, it becomes kind of infection can be easily introduced over there. And there are many opportunities for it to spray it from person to person through food, water, or via contaminated surface. So I suppose on a cruise ship, the place from the public health perspective will look at the outbreaks

or this is spread from time, place, person and microorganism. So on the ship, the place is kind of closed or semi-closed pressing person could be any older person or people with any illness or reduced immunity. And the time will be the immunic incubation period before the symptoms appear. and the microorganisms could be any contagious one. It could be norovirus. It could be COVID-19. And in this case, we have a hunter virus.

And so in a situation like this where you have the ship anchored off the coast of Cape Verde, maybe on its way to the Canary Islands, although there's dispute about that, is keeping the passengers on the ship right now the right thing to do from a public health perspective? And people are concerned about this spreading. I suppose the WHO is following the international health regulation. and according to those guidance, the response is kind of managed between the international health regulation and the laws of the receiving kind of country where it might be kind of boarded over there. That means the port authorities, the public health officials and the ships team,

they have all the roles to kind of play over there. Like over there, they will carry out following the international health regulation, carry out the public health risk assessment, environmental risk assessment, and patient safety assessment. It's important for us to know that the disease, it's important to contain the disease. It should not be spread because we are going into unknown territory. We have seen the previous outbreaks where the cases would have been kind of transferred

from one place to another. We have seen the pandemic during the COVID time. So we don't want the infection to be transferred from one person to another, like early isolation, quarantine, testing, and movement control. These are the things that we usually follow in terms of the outbreak management. That is the first thing. Because the less number of the people infected, it will be better to manage them and contain this is outbreak, I suppose. We just have a couple of minutes left.

I want to ask you just in part because there are many Canadians who love to go out on cruise ships, even if these sorts of outbreaks, particularly this kind of outbreak, is very, very rare, you can imagine that this will create concern for a lot of people. And so what would you say to people about how they would go about staying safe? I suppose there is no need to be kind of much concern. As Craig Lee mentioned, he has been to the cruise so often, and it's on my bucket list as well to go on a cruise ship. I suppose what people can do is that they can get a, if they have certain decisions,

with them like cardiovascular disease, heart disease or diabetes, you know, their immunity will be reduced. So it's better to kind of check with their general practitioners or doctors to see what kind of precautions they can do. They can see where they are going and what sort of diseases might be common. And if they need to kind of get the vaccine, they should get those vaccines. And I think after the pandemic that has kind of, the pandemic has gone, people have become complacent that they are not carrying the mask with them. So I suppose it's very handy to carry the mask because we don't know when and where we might get the infection. There is always an uncertainty and always kind of manage the basic things, washing your hands frequently and seeing what's kind of going on in the surrounding and follow the advice, whatever is given to you when you are on the cruise.

Because over there, the people are kind of following the advice as to keep everyone safe. and you are part of that team who can keep yourself safe and the other people as well. I hope you get to check that item off your bucket list. It's good to speak with you, doctor. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. My pleasure. Dr. Vikram Naranjan is an epidemiologist and professor of public health at the University of Limerick.

He was in Limerick, Ireland. You've been listening to the current podcast. My name is Matt Galloway. Thanks for listening. I'll talk to you soon. For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.