The Current - Why students are missing more school

Episode Date: February 18, 2025

The number of kids missing school has grown since the pandemic, causing alarm bells at school boards across Canada. We look at the complicated web of reasons that students can fall into chronic absenteeism, and what parents and teachers can do to help. 

1942, Europe. Soldiers find a boy surviving alone in the woods. They make him a member of Hitler's army. But what no one would know for decades, he was Jewish. Could a story so unbelievable be true? I'm Dan Goldberg. I'm from CBC's personally, Toy Soldier. Available now wherever you get your podcasts. This is a CBC podcast. Hello, it's Matt here. Thanks for listening to The Current wherever you're getting this podcast.

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Appreciate it. And on to today's show. Wakey wakey. The difficulty of convincing kids to get up and get to school is a tale as old as time. But since the pandemic, school boards and provinces across this country say attendance has been reaching alarming lows. A CBC investigation last year found that chronic absenteeism rates reached 50% in several school boards across this country during the 2022-2023 school year. But getting national, provincial,

or even regional data on this issue is difficult. Maria Rogers is a child psychologist, Canada research chair in child and youth wellbeing at Carleton university in Ottawa. She's also the co-founder of the Canadian school attendance partnership, which is a group of experts looking into chronic

absenteeism in children's and teens and its connection to mental health. Maria, good morning. Good morning, Matt. Thanks for having me. Thank you for being here. What do we know about how big of a problem student absenteeism is across this country? Well, in my opinion, we are dealing with a crisis

of chronic absenteeism in Canada. We seem to have more kids missing school than ever before. We have hundreds of thousands of kids across Canada that miss school on a consistent basis. And we know from research from other countries that regular and persistent absences, whether it's for illness, anxiety, sports tournaments, if the absences are chronic, then they tend to be linked with poor outcomes as children develop. We've used, you and I both have used this phrase, chronic absenteeism.

What does this mean? Because it's not just skipping a day here and there, right? That's right. So chronic absenteeism typically refers to missing 10% or more of the school year. So here in Canada, that would equate to about two full days per month or about 20 days of being absent over the course of a typical school year. So here in Canada, that would equate to about two full days per month or about 20 days of being absent over the course of a typical school year. And this 10% threshold emerged

from research that showed that even moderate amounts of absenteeism can significantly impact a child's academic performance and their well being over time. And we see we see from research from other countries, not in Canada, that students who miss 10% or more of school days across the year show notable declines in their academic achievement. They're more likely to struggle socially.

And here's a really important piece. They're far more likely to drop out of high school when they reach the secondary level. There are other terms that are used in your work that I think we should define. One is school refusal behavior. The other is school avoidance. What do those mean and what do we know about

what's driving that behavior? So school, there's a lot of different terms used in this field. School refusal tends to refer to emotionally based school avoidance. So this is when kids don't go to school because of anxiety primarily. There are a lot of other terms used in the field as well. So we hear the word truancy. So this tends to be when kids are skipping school. But at the end of the day, we know that regardless of the reason, whether it is an emotionally based reason,

whether it's due to mental health, that chronic absenteeism can have a detrimental impact on kids over time. I'm old enough to remember when the truancy officer would rap on your door or perhaps give you a call if you were not in school. At what point is the school obliged to get involved and say, listen, your child is not coming to school.

What's going on here? Well, so that varies tremendously across the country. In my experience, schools are generally very attentive to attendance issues. Educators are quick to notice and act when a child starts missing school regularly. But the real challenge that schools face is that chronic absenteeism is a very multi-pronged problem. So there's not one reason why

kids miss school. There's not even a couple of reasons. We see that kids are chronically absent for many, many different reasons. And so it's a complex problem. And so it requires complex and very individualized responses from the school. But if the child is not there, I mean, attendance is taken. And if the child is not there, not one or two days over the course of perhaps a month, but for days at a time,

is it not incumbent on the school to reach out and perhaps a month, but for days at a time, is it not a comment on the school to reach out and say, listen, what's going on? Yeah, absolutely. Schools do take attendance every day and that's great. I know I will get a call promptly if one of my kids is not at school. The problem is that attendance data is not being used in a systematic way across school district, across provinces. So we have no way to fully understand the scope of the problem in Canada.

So you mentioned anxiety, and that could be one of the reasons why a student may not want to go to school, may not feel like they can go to school. I wanna bring a couple of people into this conversation who can speak to that. Brian White is the dad of Seamus White. Seamus is 17, he's in grade 12.

He has been struggling with his attendance since he started high school, and they both join us now. Good morning to you both. Morning. Good morning. Seamus, do me a favor and just describe what a regular morning for you is like when it comes to school. Just walk me through what your mornings are like.

Well, often I kind of just seem to look for any excuse to not go if I've got maybe an itch in my throat or a little bit of an upset stomach. That becomes a lot bigger than it should be and I kind of just refuse to even start my morning. What is it about school that gives you that feeling? You said that in some ways it feels like a chore. It's almost like boring to me.

And even though I may enjoy some of the topics, the style in which it's taught is just dry, and there's not a lot of time for maybe like one-on-one between teachers and students. And so how often would that happen when you would wake up and you would, as you said, kind of, you know, the tickle in your throat becomes something else,

and it ends up that you don't go to school? How many days a week would that happen, do you think? At my worst, it was. How many days a week would that happen, do you think? At my worst, it was happening almost three days a week. Brian, does that sound right to you in terms of how you see that playing out? Sure, there's definitely a higher number on the worst side of things, depending on the week,

depending on the month, depending on the semester. So we might have weeks where we counted a victory though, that we got him to school once in a week and a half or twice in two weeks. We've had stretches where he just has simply not gotten up for a week at a time. So the struggle in the morning realistically looks a lot like what Shane has described

in that there's no real start to it. We will attempt to wake him up and shy of just standing over his bed and continually making noise or talking to him, we'll walk away and he will roll over and fall back to sleep. It's certainly a lot of frustration when we look at the clock and realize that we have to just keep on going ourselves. You mentioned frustration. I mean, I think any of us who are parents have had that experience. If we have teenagers, it's time to get up for school, you go upstairs and nothing's happened,

you go upstairs again and nothing's happened, and the clock can be ticking. How do you understand what's going on with Seamus that would lead him not to want to go to school? We've got a long history of doing counseling and different therapies. We understand the diagnoses that we've been handed. So when it comes to being frustrated, it now looks more like respecting that health is

as much a part of what's going on inside your mind as it is your physical self. I'm also aware that there's not a whole lot of negative wording that is going to change that. So in effect I have to default to respecting his overall well-being. That could be tricky though, right? I mean you're very cautious in saying negative wording, but you can imagine eventually that frustration could boil over. Oh and it does. Absolutely it does. We're certainly not perfect and we're going to say things that we regret later or we're going to say things that we truly feel in the moment. Sometimes it's an attempt to motivate by a different means and sometimes it's just simply

an actual outburst of frustration. Either way, we've been through it all and it doesn't work. We've tried cracking the whip and being very assertive and verbally aggressive in different ways. In other instances, we've been very soft and coddling and all the things that we could be accused of. And quite frankly, none of the above is effective. Kids have been through a lot over the last few years. How much of a role do you think the pandemic played in this? of is effective. Kids have been through a lot over the last few years. How much of a role do you think the pandemic played in this?

I mean, particularly in trying to make that move from elementary school to high school for Seamus. With Seamus, it seemed to exacerbate the anti-social behavior. Seamus chose to do his final year of elementary school online, which I think only furthered that space between him and the other kids that he would be spending time with

in developing social skills with in person. And by the time he got to high school, it just made it a lot easier for him to wanna withdraw from spaces where there was high stimulation and people and that type of a learning environment. Seamus, what was that transition like for you going into high school? It was quite difficult, I'd say, especially my grade nine year still wasn't fully back to the way it is now, just not allowing students to get used to the structure. Were you excited about going into high school?

I'd say I definitely was. I was excited about being able to choose my classes, especially. I was excited to get to know some new people, kind of a fresh start. What have you heard from your teachers about what you're going through? How do they react when you're only there at school,

maybe a couple of times a week? Honestly, they are kind of indifferent mostly. Maybe the odd side comment like, hey, you really should be getting to class, but no genuine concern about anything. Do you think if they were more concerned, if they said, listen, I mean, this is gonna have an impact on your grades, this could have an impact on what happens after high school,

that that would motivate you in a different way? Would that help at all? I think it would probably be helpful, yes. Brian, what are you worried about? When you think about what this might mean, what do you think about? Or are you concerned? Oh, I'm definitely concerned.

I think there are patterns of behavior that have entrenched in shamists that indicate the potential to lack the ability to lack the ability to self-start. And what concerns me more is the seeming lack of support and helping to develop those skills. So to Seamus' comment about the indifference, it does become demotivating.

I can see it in my son because he wants to be successful. What would you say to people who are listening who would say, listen, I mean, part of life is hard, but part of life is doing things that you don't wanna do. And maybe that's going to school, maybe that's going to work. And that if you don't do those things, how can you expect other people to want to extend the hand to help you? What would you say to those people who are listening who might think that? No, and I understand that because I've said all of those things to my son. And the truth

of the matter is there are systems in this society that function in a way that exclude a number of people in the way that their minds work, in the way that they think. Seamus, what do you want people to know about and to understand about why you can't go to school some days? Well, I think it's a good thing to start with. I was classified as a gifted student. I did used to quite enjoy school. I was good at it. I still am good at it when I can actually try.

It took me two and a half years to get an IEP. An independent education plan. That's the plan that would be tailored kind of just for you. Yes. And even once I got my so-called IEP, it was not individually suited to me at all. Can I just ask you about that just finally? What do you like about school?

What do you love about school? I love my teachers. I've participated in wrestling. I've done volleyball, street hockey. I definitely enjoy the social aspects of it, though sometimes it can be a little overstimulating. Pete Slauson Brian, when you hear that, before I let you go, what goes through your mind? You said something earlier that in some ways you see a victory in getting him to school

maybe one day a week. When you hear what he likes about school, what goes through your mind? Pete I get sad when I hear that he's extremely happy to participate in things because when he's not doing that, I also see how sad he is and I see how defeated he looks and I can only understand how left out he feels and that just shatters my heart and it speaks to something that's far deeper than he just doesn't want to get up for school. Brian, I'm really glad to talk to you about this. Thank you for being here. Thank you so much for having this conversation with us. I do think it's important. And Seamus, thank you very much. Thank you.

It's Brian White and his 17-year-old son Seamus White. They're in Sarnia, Ontario. I'm Sarah Trelevin, and for over a year, I've been working on one of the most complex stories I've ever covered. There was somebody out there who was faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake.

No pregnancy. And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's baby. It's a long story. Settle in.

Available now. Maria Rogers is still with us. She's an associate professor at Carleton University and the co-founder of a group that studies national student absenteeism rates. Maria, from what you've seen, how familiar is Seamus' story? Yeah, Matt, sadly Seamus' situation

is very familiar to me. As a clinical psychologist, I work with children and teens like Seamus, who, like his dad said, he wants to be successful, but struggles to attend school regularly. And we see the impacts of this can be very far reaching. Not only do we see it impacting a child's mental health and emotional development,

but we also see the impact on families. So as we heard from Brian, so he said it shatters his heart. And so it's not just the kids that are impacted, it places an incredible strain on families. And many parents tell me that they are utterly exhausted by the effort that it is required to try to get their children to school.

So it's very stressful for families. They both talked about the fact that things changed during the pandemic. What do you think the pandemic did to young people? Oh, you know, Matt, I was at a conference recently and I heard somebody say that if COVID-19 was the earthquake, then chronic absenteeism is the tsunami. And, you know, that really resonated with me

as someone who works both clinically and as a researcher in this field. We have a mental health crisis among youth, children and youth in our country. Um, mental health supports have not kept up with the demand. So only actually less than a third of kids who need mental health supports in Canada receive them. Um, so a lot has happened in the lives of our children since, uh, since 2020.

What would you say to parents or people who are listening who may not be entirely sympathetic to what they're hearing? I mean, as I said, to some people, life is difficult and there are things that you have to do that you don't want to do. And part of school is going to school and you need to get up and you need to go to school and parents need to, you could imagine people saying parents need to set expectations in some ways. What would you say to the people who would be repeating that back to what they're hearing on the radio right now?

Yeah, I mean, I certainly can appreciate that perspective, but we have to remember that children are not adults. They're still developing in terms of their social and emotional health, in terms of their academic skills. And so it's not just stress and mental health. I would encourage people to really think about all of the many different reasons why children may be missing school. Sometimes kids are facing social issues at school, like bullying. There's school bus shortages in many areas of the country, There's school bus shortages in many areas of the country, newcomers to Canada, those who are new to the Canadian education system often struggle to engage with school regularly

and those families need a lot of support. So there's really quite a range of issues. This is a complex issue and it involves not just the child and the school, but it involves the family. And in some ways it's reflective of some of the broader shortcomings of our society right now. So just in the last couple of minutes that we have, what do we do about it? If, as we said, there are long-term ramifications from this,

from not being in school, just in terms of grades, but also a behavior that can become ingrained, what do we do? Yeah, I mean, but also a behaviour that can become ingrained. What do we do? Yeah, I mean, that's a difficult question. And I think there's a few shifts that need to happen if we're going to move towards becoming a country where most of our kids are attending school on a regular basis. I think the first one, and you mentioned this off the top, Matt, is that we need better data. We need better data collection in this country. This needs to be done in partnership with school districts and researchers.

One of the challenges that we have in Canada is that unlike many other countries, education is provincially mandated. So that means that each province and territories, ministry of education operates independently more or less. And because of that, the development of any attendance data collection, any attendance policies are managed only

at the provincial level. So we need to be looking at more of a national scale. And then I think, you know, what really came up in Seamus and Brian's story is that we really need to bring a stronger focus into nurturing a child's relational health at school. So really fostering social connections with peers and adults, even between parents and teachers so that children and families feel a sense of belonging and that they want to go to school and that it feels like a place that is sense of belonging and that they want to go to school

and that it feels like a place that is welcome and a place that they feel connected to. You said this is a crisis. Yeah, I think it is a crisis and there's no easy solutions here. This is not a one size fits all problem. Maria, I'm glad to talk to you about it. Thank you very much. Thanks for having me. Maria Rogers is an associate professor and Canada Research Chair in Child and Youth

Wellbeing at Carleton University, co-founder of the Canadian School Attendance Partnership. Any thoughts on this that you have? We would love to hear from you. If you're a teacher, an educator, a parent, or a student, email us at thecurrent at cbc.ca.