The Current - Will the Gordie Howe bridge deliver on its promise?

Episode Date: July 27, 2026

A multi-billion dollar bridge between Canada and the U.S. was supposed to strengthen North American supply chains and ease bottlenecks on the nearby Ambassador Bridge and Detroit-Windsor tunnel. We hear from mayors on both sides of the Detroit River about whether tariffs are putting that investment at risk.

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Hello, I'm Matt Galloway, and this is the current podcast. After decades of planning, construction, legal wrangling, and a last-minute dispute over the terms, the Gordy Howe Bridge between Canada and the U.S. finally opens today to vehicle traffic. The bridge spans the Detroit River and is named for a hockey legend who was born in Saskatchewan, led the Detroit Red Wings, and was known for a style of hard-skirts. Scrabble play that earned him the nickname, Mr. Elbows. The bridge was supposed to be a symbol of international friendship in a way to smooth the flow of people in trade across the border.

But with a new deal over toll revenue with less favorable terms for Canada and a new round of tariff threats from U.S. President Donald Trump, will the bridge deliver on its promise? Joining me now are two mayors from opposite sides of the bridge and the border. Drew Dilkins is the mayor of Windsor on Tire, and Brian Barnett, is mayor of Rochester Hills, Michigan in the Detroit metro area. Good morning to you both. Good morning.

Mayor Dilkins, I'll start with you. You know, the opening of the Gordy Howe Bridge was supposed to be a really big affair with high-ranking dignitaries from both sides of the border, celebrating our friendship, and it was really a scaled-back version with a ribbon cutting on the Canadian side only on Friday. What was the mood actually like? Well, the mood on Friday was spectacular, you know, where there were probably three to 400 people on site, celebrating what has taken us the better part of 25 years to deliver for the United States and for Canada, a beautiful bridge connecting our two wonderful cities and our two nations. And, you know, it would have been a little disingenuous, I would submit that if we had folks in from the U.S. in the middle

celebrating in the same week that President Trump launched two sets of tariffs against our country and continues to say he's going to, to make us the 51st state. It just would have been a little disingenuous on our part. But I will tell you, and quite sincerely, I say, I hope that there is a day in the future that we can close the Gordyhow bridge for an hour or two. And actually, when the time is right, get the right people on the bridge from the United States, the right people back from Canada, the leaders there to celebrate, cut the ribbon and do a proper ceremony, a proper celebration worthy of both the bridge construction, but the man after who it's named as well. A do-over you'd like. Well, just round two. We've done round one. Round two would be great as well.

And what do you think? Do you think the bridge is actually going to open now? I mean, I know we talked about the infrastructure minister literally crossing his fingers. It was a bit of a joke. And yet, you know, there it was for everyone to see. What do you think of that? Well, I'll believe it fully when I see the first car cross. And I know the Howe family is lined up to be that first car at noon. And I suspect President Trump won't want to stop, you know, the Howe family from crossing the bridge. He's in Michigan today himself.

So the bigger question today is, will the president make an appearance at the Gordy Howe Bridge? And that's what everyone's waiting to see. But I suspect we've got an agreement. Both sides are a go. I can tell this weekend there were some big backups at the border, which likely meant the U.S., going into the U.S., which likely meant the U.S. was moving personnel over to the Gordy Howe just to do last-minute training. And I suspect that we should have a smooth opening at around noon today.

Okay. Mayor Barnett, what do you think? Will it open today? I do. I mean, I'm excited. We are thrilled about this. This is great news for both sides. And the opening of the Gordy Haugh will certainly improve the economic situation on both sides. And it's unfortunate that, you know, we spent the first five minutes or three minutes of this interview talking about the challenges. But excited to think about, you know, the investment of certainly of Canada and the teamwork, which hopefully will lead this discussion moving forward because it is a major improvement. for both the, you know, the Michigan and the Ontario sides. And I'm hoping that will become more of the story moving forward. Yeah, I'm afraid we are going to talk a little bit more about the challenges. I mean, there have been many. Curious, you know, the, the big ceremony was canceled and just the Canada side had that big celebration. What does that say to you about U.S. Canada relations,

that that's how it all played out? Well, you know, Mayor Duncan's and I are good friends, and we've been on a few of these calls. And unfortunately, I guess I'd say this certainly feels like the parents are fighting because the kids get along really well. You know, our businesses, our local governments get along famously. And unfortunately, it's been, it's sort of been the parents that have been, and unfortunately, largely our parent that has been creating some of the challenges. I mean, I'm not a fan of tariffs. I don't think they have worked well in curbing economic behavior. We've talked about the challenges they've had for businesses in my community. And so, So I hope that we use the next few weeks, both the president and the prime minister and the leaders on both sides to negotiate quickly to something that doesn't end up looking like it has in the past.

Mayor Dilkins, remind us why this new bridge was needed. There is, of course, the Ambassador Bridge. There's the Detroit Windsor Tunnel over in Sarnia. There's another bridge. So tell us a little bit about why this one was needed. Yeah, so Windsor, Detroit is the home to the busiest commercial border crossing between our two countries. and the Ambassador Bridge today handles about 25% of all the trade that travels back and forth between the United States and Canada.

That bridge was built in 1929. And sort of after 9-11, when everyone started doing a deeper dive on security checks, sensible people said, well, what would happen to trade between our two countries if something happened to the Ambassador Bridge? And that added, along with a forward-looking view of our trade agreements and the suspected increase in trade and the need for additional road capacity. Those two things really added ahead of steam to a government conversation to say, how can we start planning for a new border crossing? And it was actually September of 2002, September 2002,

that Jean-Cretchen, then Prime Minister Crecheon, and then Premier Ernie Eves announced $300 million towards construction of a new border crossing. And then everything started moving forward. And so it's literally been 25 years of announcements, and discussions and planning and lots of community battles to make sure that we got a good solution here for residents and neighborhoods as a new route was created to this new bridge. And you know what, I would submit that when I look back at 25 years of all of that effort, we really landed well.

I mean, I think the community one, I think our nation one. I think it's great for the United States, for Detroit, for Michigan, for Ontario, of course. And, you know, with respect to us, some of the issues that we're dealing with, I just look at this and say, it's taken us 25 years to build this bridge, and it will stand for more than 100. And so the disruptions that we're feeling today, it's easy to get wrapped up in the sort of tweet of the day. Let's play the long game here and recognize that what we've created together will stand to the benefit of families on both sides of the border, businesses on both sides of the border for many generations to come. Mayor Barnett, you know, this was in the works for decades, 25 years or so, but, you know, the genesis of it came at a time when it was a different time. And so now we are actually seeing that trade is down 7.6 percent trade across these two nearby bridges, the ambassador and the Blue Water Bridge near Sarnia, because of the trade war, we're seeing this decline. And so there's concern, you know, the threats of a new set of 50 percent tariffs from the Trump administration. What could that mean for the benefits that this bridge people are hoping?

to see and does that diminish it somehow? I don't think it diminishes it because I think people understand, as Mayor Dukin said, the long game here is what's important. And I think that's true in the trade discussions as well. I mean, Michigan is so dependent on trade with Ontario and particularly trade with Canada as well that it just, it's too important. I mean, the auto industry is, you know, mother's milk for both Mayor Dukins and myself. And, you know, I think you'll see.

obviously, you know, this is a couple clicks above our pay grade, but, you know, there's a lot of discussions happening, but people understand Michigan is an important state to the president, it's important state to the U.S. economy. The industries here are critical nationally. So, you know, I think there's this time that's being used to negotiate a little bit harder on both sides. It's unfortunate. But these industries are just too valuable, these regions just too valuable to let anything substantial happen to them. So I think things will look different here very shortly. Hi, Steve Patterson here, host of the debaters, and while I love a funny fight, there's one thing that's not up for debate. The Stratford Festival is world-class theater right here in Canada. Whether you're a fan of Shakespeare, musicals, or classics like Death of a Salesman or Waiting for Godot, there's no better time to experience Canadian talent and no better place to see it than the Stratford Festival. So get your tickets now at Stratfordfestable.ca and experience world-class performance the whole family can enjoy. You know, we even take the debaters there once, so I guess we're world class now. Personally, from CBC Podcasts, allows you to get lost in someone else's life.

From a mysterious childhood spent on the run to a courageous escape from domestic violence, each season of personally invites you to explore the human experience in all its complexity, one story or season at a time. This is what it sounds like to be human. Find personally wherever you get your podcasts. You know, the New York Times and Bloomberg have been reporting that the Trump administration got involved after lobbying the Morroon family that owns the Ambassador Bridge. Mayor Dilkinson, who are they and what has it been like dealing with them as the Gordy Howe Bridge Project progressed? Well, the current setup really speaks to the fragility of having an international crossing in private hands.

And I think, you know, we would never do that again. And so the private interests of the owner of the Ambassador Bridge have played out every step of the way as they look to protect their own business interests, which a lot of folks would do if you own this international crossing as well. And so it's meant more lawsuits, more challenges, more disruption because you haven't had sort of the seamless nature of just government doing what government does. You've had to deal and move around these private sector interests. And so, you know, the Ambassador Bridge is protecting their interest, but I'll tell you, the whole discussion from the very beginning was never about building a border crossing to put the Ambassador Bridge out of business. It was always about making sure that we had redundancy in our border crossings and that there was, in the event something happened, that we had another pathway for traffic to move. And so although trade is down today, I think that is just a blip on the radar screen. in a moment in time, and you will see trade increase as we get to the, hopefully the finish line here on an updated trade agreement that's good for Canada, Mexico, and the United States.

And then you'll see trade increase. And the capacity and the border crossings, yes, patterns will shift. Trucks will move back and forth. They'll find the most expedient way to cross the border at the cheapest price. But the Ambassador Bridge is always going to be an important part of the border crossing ecosystem between Windsor and Detroit. Mayor Barnett, curious, you know, since Donald Trump began this trade war against Canada and the rest of the world, you've really been advocating for his administration to change course. He's already said here today that you don't like the tariffs. So what do you want the administration to understand about how this trade war is affecting your community and how long can you keep telling them and not see any change?

Yeah, I think, you know, I've been blessed to be the mayor of my city for a long time, 20 years. And many times a mayor's job is just to tell the stories of their community. And that's what I've been trying to do. I mean, I sat down with the businesses in our community across many sectors and said, you know, how does this impact you? And resoundingly, the answer was going to really negative, largely the uncertainty. I mean, you know, investment hates uncertainty. And that's what you're looking for as a mayor is, you know, folks putting down roots,

creating jobs, you know, doubling down on your community. And so, you know, just sharing those stories to say, listen, and many of these folks, typically were supporters of the president, you know, business owners and job creators and so forth. And so it's just, you know, it's been hopefully a respectful way, but saying, listen, these were the stories on the ground, police tariffs hurt a city, you know, 15 miles from the Canadian border. And, you know, do with them what you will, but I'm going to keep saying what I'm hearing because that's my job. And I just haven't seen these tariffs be impactful. I mean, the confusion over these, you really have to follow them on a daily basis to know, you know,

what's being tariffed, what's being affected and sued over in court, what's being held over. It is a massively confusing game for the average business owner of a small company with 20 or 30 employees. And that hurts my community. And that's why I'm sharing these stories so fervently. Mayor Barnett, those are all logical arguments, but it doesn't always appear as though the president is interested in logical arguments. So how do you deal with that? Yeah, that's a challenge. I wish there was a short answer for that.

You know, I mean, I know that Michigan is valuable to the president. He, he, you know, if you've been in the U.S. political system, you try to learn the levers that matter to the president and political matters. Political levers do matter. Michigan is important. We do have a very important Senate race in our state, which I believe is why the president is here today. And so, you know, you try to relay and lean into those things that, you know, mean something to him. And those are the ways that you try to, you know, you try to share your stories and have impact. It's not always as straightforward as it has been with other political leaders.

But, you know, I do believe the president understands the importance of some of these major industries. He has brought some of the key auto industry folks over the time of these discussions. So I think he does understand the larger issue, but it isn't always a direct dot connection to get there, unfortunately. Mayor Dilkins, we heard there that the president is in the Detroit area. in Michigan today. Do you know, I understand he's going to be at a GM testing facility for vehicles. Do you have any expectation that he will stop by the Gordy Howe Bridge? Well, everyone on our side is waiting to see whether the Beast actually makes an appearance

on the Gordy Howe Bridge or whether there's a flyby or a drive-by. And so we, you know, I would say anything is possible with Donald Trump. We just don't know what to expect. But he really has until noon before the bridge opens. And so he'd have to make that play, you know, pretty darn. soon if he's going to make it before it opens for traffic at noon. How closely do you follow his truth social account to find out things like that? I actually don't really follow it, except I can't avoid it. Every time I turn the TV on

of the radio on, there's some announcement about what he's said most recently. And so who knows what he's going to do? I mean, I don't get too flustered about Donald Trump and whatever is truth social posters of the day. You know, people have said, well, you know, this is Gordyhow Bridge is a bridge over troubled waters. It is not, these are not troubled waters. There is no light a day between Brian Barnett and Drew Dilkins and between most people in the United States and Canada at this point. What we have is like a, I call it like a backyard pool where everyone went for a nice swim. All the family's there. Everyone's got out and gotten dry. And all of a sudden you have that cousin who jumps in and does a cannonball and splashes some water around. And that's really what we have.

We are good friends. We love our friends in the United States. And I don't want, I don't want to let Donald Trump overshadow what is a monumentous day for us here. This connection of this bridge is really, really important for all of us. However, you know, he's not just the cousin that splashes some water around. He has real power and has shown that already through sectorial tariffs. And we could see this 50% tariff. And so, too, I wonder how frustrating is it, despite your sort of characterization that he's just the cousin that's annoying to not seem to make the headway that you would like to see on these sorts of negotiations? Well, listen, it's incredibly frustrating for everyone involved.

And I think Mayor Barnett properly described the uncertainty that is out there, just trying to keep up with what tariff is in place at this time, which one are you getting a refund on, what's coming next? And oh, it's 30 days from now. Where are we at? Is it going to happen or not happen? And there have been all sorts of fits and stops and starts on this whole journey we've been on for the last year and a half here.

Ultimately, we've always, said that a tariff on Canada is a tax to American consumers. And that is playing out loud and clear. And at a time when there's a war in Iran and gas prices are high and the price of ground beef is super high, I say, you know, how much is it the cost to get in your F-150 in the United States and get to the grocery store to buy expensive ground beef today? And Americans aren't stupid. You know, they see all of this playing out. And they're feeling the pain as well. And I really look forward to watching the results of the midterms this fall to see, you know, how they voice their displeasure but what they're seeing currently. Mayor Barnett, you, I'm curious what you think of the midterms because you are a

Republican and continue to be. So what keeps you in the party despite everything we've just talked about? Yeah, well, yeah, obviously, it's a great question. I mean, I think the principles of the Republican Party are, you know, what brought me to it, not an individual. And, you know, I mean, I think, you know, from a, from a market standpoint and from an economic standpoint, what you're seeing the president do is not always consistent with traditional Republican values. And so I'm very curious what will happen in the midterms. Obviously, you know, control of the House and the Senate are clearly up for grabs. The president's last two years will largely be defined by what happens in the next 90 days.

And so there's a lot of folks watching that. I mean, listen, I'm not rooting, you know, against anybody. I mean, obviously I want our economy to be strong. I was talking to some business owners yesterday in the liquor and alcohol market. And they're desperate for Ontario and largely Canada to get back in the game because sales are down 25%. So these are real folks that and politics don't matter when you're trying to put or don't matter as much when you're trying to keep a business open and keep people employed. And so obviously this president is incredibly difficult to bring it. I think he enjoys the fact that he's wildly unpredictable.

Will he show up in three and a half hours on the bridge? Nobody knows. But there are good people still working hard to make sure businesses and communities are operating. And that's why I said this is largely like the parents are fighting, but the kids are still getting along. We've got about a minute left. But Mayor Dilkins, I am curious, you know, as the Canadian negotiators are going into these negotiations to renegotiate Kuzma, what advice do you have from them, given everything you've learned? learned so far of this Trump administration? Well, I listen, I think Minister LeBlanc is a smart person.

I think all of the folks who are engaged are intelligent. They know that we are dealing with a complex partner on the other side. But fundamentally, I mean, the message has to be we are stronger together. And we have proven that since the 1980s with the free trade agreement that morphed into the North American free trade agreement. And heck, USMCA-C-C-C-C-Kuzma, that was the deal that, Donald Trump negotiated in his first term and called it the best trade deal of all time. So even Donald Trump at some point in his life has recognized that the trade agreement he signed

is a good deal for the United States, for Mexico, and for Canada. And it has to work for all three partners. And where we have disputes, we have mechanisms to figure those things out. And I think ultimately we'll get to a pathway where it's good for all three partners again. Okay. Drew Dilkins, Brian Barnett. Thank you very much for joining us. Thank you. Drew Dilkins is the mayor of Windsor and Brian Barnett is mayor of Rochester Hills, Michigan in the Detroit metro area.

You've been listening to the current podcast. My name is Matt Galloway. Thanks for listening. I'll talk to you soon. For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca.ca slash podcasts.