The Daily Beast Podcast - Blame Fox News For the Rise of QAnon

Episode Date: August 14, 2020

It’s the “secret sauce” of Fox News: “tell people who feel socially inferior that you're really the smart one. You're really informed, you know the real secrets about what's really going on,�� explains Rick Wilson on the latest episode of The New Abnormal. For 20 years, Fox has been force-feeding this sauce to its listeners, saying “that your life would be perfect if it wasn't for that George Soros, your life would be perfect if it wasn't for ANTIFA. They prep these people's minds to reject empirical truth all the time.” And finally, you have them believing in lizard people. In satanic pedophile rings. In QAnon. But maybe, Molly Jong-Fast offers, the QAnon takeover of the Republican party isn’t so bad. Marjorie Taylor Greene, the conspiratorial congressional nominee? Maybe “she and Devin Nunes could someday be on a reality show where they've run away from their spouses. And they're living in a bunker in South Dakota. It's called ‘My Dumb Congressmen.’” Then! Rep. Lauren Underwood, a public health nurse and the youngest Black woman in Congress, talks about her experience doing pandemic preparation in the Obama administration—and whether we can do anything now to reverse Team Trump’s missteps. And! Hank Gilbert, who’s running against Congressman COVID Louie Gohmert, talks about staring down pistol-toting Trump minions for daring to question Dear Leader. Plus! Molly breaks down Kamala Harris’ generational strengths. America’s worst governor compares reopening schools to killing bin Laden. And the ghouls running the late Herman Cain’s twitter account attack Want more? Become a Beast Inside member to enjoy a limited-run series of bonus interviews from The New Abnormal. Guests include Cory Booker, Jim Acosta, and more. Head to newabnormal.thedailybeast.com to join now. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi folks, it's Rick Wilson, and welcome to The Daily Beast's The New Abnormal. Hi, I'm Molly John Fast, a left-wing pundit, an editor at large at The Daily Beast. I'm also an editor at The Daily Beast, a former Republican political strategist, best-selling author, and full-time troublemaker. We're here to have fun, sharp conversations with some of the smartest people in media, politics, business, and science that help make what's happening in the country and the world clearer. I'll try to keep Rick to the minimum number of F-bombs and try to keep our... kids, pets, and other wildlife sounds from invading our respective bunkers. Rick Wilson? Hello, Molly drunk fast.

What's that sound? That sound? It sounds like the spirit of a dearly departed, a love for a Republican figure, who has returned from the great beyond. You mean the head of Black Voices for Trump? You mean... That figure? Mr. 999 himself, Herman Kane?

That was the one. My goodness. You know, unless Molly and I be accused of being cruel assholes, which we are cool after. Don't make any mistake about that. I know it's going to say. I'm accused. And don't confuse object and subject. Herman Kane was the chair of Black Voices for Trump.

He was in his, he was 74 years old. He attended Trump's Tulsa rally where he did not wear a mask because he does not believe in masks. And then soon after, two days later, he was diagnosed with coronavirus. He fought the virus, but ultimately succumbed. Somehow from beyond the grave, he is still tweeting about Kamala Harris. It's like a William Gibson story where a piece of software keeps running and running and running in an abandoned warehouse in an empty room. And everyone's forgotten about its purpose, but it keeps grinding on and on. Is dead Herman Kane better at Twitter than live Herman Kane?

I don't know, because zombie Herman Kane is a fantastic name for Aguar cover band. The whole zombie Herman Kane thing is really scary. And also, I know that this is asking too much of Trump world. But why are these people died of coronavirus? Okay. Yeah. And nobody is acknowledging that. So Herman Kane died of coronavirus. And the guy who funded Turning Point USA, the guy who discovered, I'm not sure he needed to be discovered because he's such a train wreck, but the guy who discovered. Charlie Kirk also died of coronavirus, and yet the Republican Party refuses to take coronavirus seriously. And in fact, today your governor, the worst governor, probably in America, said that sending kids back to school was a heroic act like killing bin Laden. You know, I'm just going to say on the scale of heroic acts, killing bin Laden was pretty well done, pretty well executed, sending a bunch of kids to school to get COVID and spread it amongst themselves, their families, their family's friends, their relatives, their associates, the business associates of the family members, and every other fucking person in America is not bravery. It is weapons grade shit stupidity.

I'm just curious because I feel like the idea, who would be Bin Laden in that case? Would the kids be Bin Laden? Would the teachers be bin Laden? You know, hey, Molly, speaking of zombies. Yeah. Did you see my piece in The Daily Beast today? Well, in addition to zombie Herman Kane, stalking the digital byways and highways, we now have some QAnon zombies entering Congress, including, and I wrote about this this morning, including a person, I predict that we're going to be hearing a lot from in the next couple of years. A woman named Marjorie Taylor Green, who combines Q&ONN conspiracy bat shittery with good old fashion racism and Islamophobia. She is a winner all the way around.

And guess who retweeted her? A hearty. A hearty tweet of enthusiastic praise. That would be President Donald John Trump. So I have a question for you. JFK Jr.'s best friend. The NRCC is filled with some of the worst people in the world. Some of the shittiest people on the internet, I think that's fair to say.

And they, even they, refused to endorse Marjorie Taylor. JFK is a live green. But you know who did? The president of the United States of America, in that tweet just endorsed everything about her. And it was a signal that the Q people quickly and clearly understood. They were absolutely losing their minds over it during the course of yesterday. And it is a sign of the Republican Party's transformation from the GOP to the GQP.

And the GQP... The Grand QAnon Party? Yes. The president of the GQP, his campaign spokesman, when a old-school Republican, Young congressman named Adam Kinsinger, tweeted about that Qaeda basically was horseshit and stopped talking about it. The president's campaign attacked him. So this is a party that has collapsed.

It is over. It is done. They have sunk into this bizarre world of a lurid conspiracy theory which believes that the world is being secretly run by a satanic cabal, a child molesting, devil-worshipping, blah, blah, blah, blah. Hey, you're in it, man. If I'm in it, you're in it. Oh, you and I are clearly like the king and queen of the underworld at this point in their minds.

I mean, I think we're still like low-level figures, but I would hope. I don't think I've reached like Epstein level. Or as they always call him, Hussein, in the Q-Anon world. Barack Hussein Obama. Remember, just a reminder to everyone once again of dear listeners, there is no such thing as Q. It is a fantasy made up to entrap Facebook-addicted boomer rube's. and to convince them that there is a coherence to the chaos of Donald Trump, to portray him as a hero in the drama of the White House,

and to excuse his multivarius fuck-ups by saying he's just too busy saving the children. He and JFK Jr. are saving the children from Hillary Clinton's satanic pizza restaurant. But I do have to say, the fact that it's taken off with such that there are really a lot of people who believe this shows that we're really doomed. Oh, yeah. We as a country are now fucked. And I'll tell you why this is happening in part. I wrote about this in the article today. On the Republican and conservative side of the fence, the sense of social inferior that has been so dominant and that Roger Ailes so brilliantly exploited, okay? That's the secret sauce of Fox. It tells people who feel socially inferior that you're really the smart one. You're really the knowledgeable one. You're really informed. You know the real secrets. You know what's really going on. that 20 plus years of conditioning of that message, telling those people over and over and over and over again, that your life would be perfect if it wasn't for that George Soros. Your life would be perfect if it wasn't for Antifa. You know, all these things, they prep these people's minds to reject empirical truth all the time. And what happened when they got so into rejecting empirical truth all the time is that when the addiction to that sense of being inside of the esoteric, you know,

circle. I really know what's actually going on. Well, even Fox can't make up shit like lizard people when Queen Elizabeth is a heroin dealer running the universe. But QAnon can. And so when Facebook was weaponized to get to these people, these people that are around the Q&on world kept pushing and pushing further and further. And it started out as some sort of prank. And then Trump's people discovered it's the one place on the fucking internet where he is seen as an absolute hero where there's no blinking, there's no winking and nodding, there's no, but I like the judges. It's just Trump is heroic. He's Superman, saving the children from Barack Hussein Obama and Hillary Grotam-Clinton. So basically, it's a John...

It's like a Ben Garrison cartoon. Ben Garrison, right. It's Trump as a Ben Garrison cartoon, right? Right. And the idea that Q and on is now going to have people in Congress, and that the NRCC is so full of these dipshits that they didn't put a pillow over her head early in the process and end her campaign. And frankly, look, if Kevin McCarthy had any kind of political testicular fortitude, he would have come out months ago and said... Against Trump. Well, that too, but Kevin's not bright enough to do that. But he would have come out and said, this woman believes in things that are antithetical to our party, our philosophy, our principles, our values, and reality and basic fucking... sanity, and she will not hold any committee position in Congress. She will receive no line items for

appropriations while she is in Congress. She'll be allowed to vote on the floor as she'll be allowed to vote on the floor as is her right as an elected member, but absolutely no other role will she play in our party. But you know what? I fucking promise you she's going to go to Congress because the district is like 97 gazillion percent Republican. I promise you she's going to go to Congress and say, I need to be on the Intelligence Committee. Oh, I want her on intelligence. I need to be on foreign affairs. I need to be on armed services. Because now these people will have a touchstone in Congress, an elected official who can do things like ask the government for information, who can do things like cause trouble for people's appropriations. And these idiots did not kill her off politically

early enough in the process. And now they're stuck with her. And she's not the only one. There are more and more coming all the time. Here's how it's going to go. There will be some people who will say, No, I don't really believe in Q, but it does pose some serious questions. I'm excited for her and Devin Nunes to run off together. You could see that happening. I think she and Devin could someday be on a reality show where they've run away from their spouses, and they're living in a bunker in South Dakota. And it's called My Dumb Congressman, or Dumbest Congressman, something to that effect.

No, it's called Happily Ever Quaffter with a Q. Jesus. No, I agree. And I think this is the beginning of the end of the Republican Party. These people are a meaningful fraction now of the party. I texted somebody, a pollster friend of mine this morning, and I said, what's it feel like to have all these Q people coming in? And this person texted back that he was in a focus group a couple months ago. And a Q person was in the room and started doing this. And the, quote, normal Republicans around the table didn't say, you're out of your fucking mind. They were like, yeah, well, you make a good point. I guess maybe there is a lizard overlord conspiracy to eat children in pizza restaurant.

I guess you're right. I mean, my God. You don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes when Soros is involved. Okay, so speaking of conspiracies, Trump is trying to kill the post office. He said it outright, okay? He completely set it outright. And in the time we've been on the recording this show, we've also learned that the Postal Service is now shutting off mail sorting machines that sort ballot mail in a number of post offices. I know it's too late. I know it's not going to happen. Wait, it's too late? Why is it too late? No, for something else. I know it's too late. I know it's not going to happen. But Nancy Pelosi needs to let the oversight committee drag these motherfuckers up there and start asking questions. And I know no one wants to do it, and they've all got there. He's like, the election's only 80 days.

These people need to be held to account. And I've got to tell you, there's a growing amount of chatter out there in the world. And I've been a part of some of it today that an emergency injunction needs to be brought against these folks as quickly as possible. Because this conspiracy, and that is the word for it, this conspiracy is growing rapidly, and it needs to be addressed both in the courts and Congress as soon as possible. Yeah, I think it's completely not. And again, I think that, and maybe you can explain this to me, I don't understand why Nancy Pelosi won't impeach Bill Barr. You know, this is one of those things that I just, I'm stunned by. Bill Barr has engaged in the most egregious behavior and he has engaged in lawlessness, like the

Interior Minister of Krap Lakhistan. Yes, Krap Lakhistan. They have delicious takeout. They really do. And the Krap Lakhustani folk dances are charming. Yeah, exactly. It's a country I want to visit. But this is a guy who has engaged in some absolutely horrific illegality and lawlessness and

corruption. And I am fucking stunned that they won't do anything about it. Don't you think that if they impeached him, even if it didn't work, even if it took forever, even if it was just starting it, wouldn't it slow down the crime? You know, it might slow down the criming. It might, for a five-minute window, put the brakes on the cringing a little bit. I mean, right now, they're in court getting their ass spanked by the circuit in D.C. over the Flynn exoneration. Oh, really? Wait, so Flynn is not being exonerated? I'm shocked. Tell me more.

The judge was, shall we say, not taking it lightly. What? I know, right? It's remarkable how when it's not being litigated on Fox News that Trump loses all the time. I was told that crime wasn't really crime when Republicans did it. It's only not crime when Trump officials are doing it. Okay, just checking. I wrote a piece on Camel Harris today. I know. You're You did. And then I wrote another piece. And then I'm writing a third piece on it. What's cool about Camilla Harris is that she is, they can't message against her.

They absolutely can't message against her because she is like, and I think that the thing that we're going to see about Camel Harris, which you're going to see and it will be fascinating, she's like about a generation and a half younger than Hillary Clinton. And that generation is much tougher. So she doesn't feel the need. Like, Hillary was still a little bit apologetic about her power. But Camo doesn't have that. She's just a tough and extremely smart litigator.

She's low on the fuckgiving scale. Yeah. And I think, you know, what you saw, the initial three or four different forays they've made against her, none of them have really worked so far. None of them have really shaken her at this point. Part of their thing is, oh, she's too tough as a prosecutor. And she's too mean because she's too mean. was an attorney general and a prosecutor who was mean to criminals, said the people who

wanted to deploy the cops to beat the living ship and are running on law and order. They're not the smartest of people. Well, and then they're like, Kamala is a radical leftist, Marxist, communist. Right, who was too mean to Kavanaugh? She was nasty to him. You can already hear their ads coming. Right. With the Biden Harris ticket, Marxism is coming.

That's right. They'll seize the means of production. The gulags will open. Harris will wear a dashing uniform and a beret while rounding up freedom-loving Trump supporters. Order your Trumpy bear today. Yeah, you've forayed into the Qaeda non-Trumpie bear. I did foray into the Qaeda Trumpy bear because... That has captured your imagination.

I find it grimly fascinating. Yes, very. But I would say she's a really exciting candidate, and for me, I am very excited. I can't believe how excited. I wasn't even that excited about her in the prime. but for some reason she just has really, it's hitting me on all they feel. Well, I think one of the things that's exciting about her is that Joe Biden recognized as a political professional that she could land a punch because he took one from her. That was a debate moment

that she couldn't replicate against him, but she only needs to go in against Mike Flynn. Mike Flynn? Mike Flynn? Wow. Mike, Mike Pence. Excuse me. I had Mike Flynn on the brain. Actually, can you imagine if they... Have you ever seen Mike Penn? and Mike Flynn in the same place at the same time. No, you haven't. No, but she needs to go in against Mike Pence one time and knock his dick in the dirt. And she needs to do it in a way that shows her as a strong, equal partner to Joe Biden and as someone who's ready to be president, as opposed to Mike Pence, who, if Trump comes to an abrupt halt, Mike is going to, like, impact his spleen. He's got his head so far up Trump's ass. And I think she should go at him. You're a silent, you're a toadie.

you're a collaborator, you believe in nothing. She could almost go at Mike Pence in a weird way from the right about integrity and personal character, and personal character. Because that used to be his brand. That used to be his definitional thing. Oh, we've got to have character back again in American life and faith and blah, blah, blah, blah. And yeah. It's true.

Pink Gilbert is a Democratic congressional candidate running in Texas First District against the dumbest man in Congress, Louis Gomerd. And as you will hear in the interview, you, he will be a great replacement for Congressman COVID. So tell us a little bit about your congressional race. Well, it's a race to turn East Texas back into the blue column. You know, this district has been historically a Democratic district since its inception until Tom DeLay re-jerrymandered all the districts and helped get Louis Gomer elected.

So he's the first Republican to serve in this district. I don't know if you know this, but I'm obsessed with Louis Gomer as the dumbest and worst. congressman in the entire Congress. And that is why I'm so particularly obsessed with your race, Hank Gilbert. So I would love for you to talk about what does it look like there? I know that Louis actually didn't win by that many votes, right? Well, right. In his initial race in 2004 against Max Sandlin, no, he barely won that out. And had not he had the help of Tom Belay and others, Louis's not near smart enough to him, pulled that off on his own. But ever since then, you know, he hadn't really had much of an opponent that surely wasn't much to speak of, was she?

Well, I mean, nice lady, she just didn't really campaign and she didn't raise a lot of money. And I think the families had a history. Didn't she run like four times or something? Four times, yeah. But, yeah, I think their family had a history and she wasn't going to get down in the weeds with Louis. And, of course, he didn't have to with her because he didn't really have to spend any money. So when people look at this race on paper, they say, well, hell, this is an R plus 25 district.

How the hell's a Democrat going to win? Well, I grew up here. This is not an R20 plus 25 district. A lot of these people, and they tell me this every day, that have been voting for Louis, are really longtime fiscal conservative Democrats. They just haven't had anybody else to vote for. And they're tickled to death that one is finally running against Louis. But, you know, we've done two polls. PPP's done, we've had them do two polls so far in the race. The first poll, Louis was polling just north of 45 percent. On this last poll, he was polling well, south of 45%. So it's a winnable race. Just like any other race, it just takes a lot of people and a lot of money to get your message out because so much of this district is rural. Well, I have to say, you know, one thing I've noticed just talking to you for a couple minutes here is you sound like one of those northeastern elitists. I mean, obviously... I can tell you, if you'd been with me for the last couple hours and you saw the bottom of my boots, you'd know that me and nobody from the northeast have anything in common.

I'm a small business owner and a cattle ranch. And then my wife and I had started a charity about 10 years ago. She passed away almost three years ago. And so when I'm not fooling with cows or on the phone trying to raise money or directed my sons what work to do that day since they're not in school yet, then I'm up here working on her charity. What's her charity? We help furnish homes for the women and children that move out of the local crisis center here. It's for abused women and kids. And we help to furnish those women's homes once they find a place to live and can afford a place to live and move out of the center.

Oh, terrific. To date, we've done almost 650 homes in and around the Tyler area. That's fantastic. So have you had a chance to debate, Louis, or is he hiding in the bunker like a lot of other Republicans are doing this cycle? No, he won't debate. Hell, he won't even hold a town hall. He's held one town hall in 16 years, and that was in his first session in Congress. and it got so rowdy he never held another one.

Tells the press and everybody else that he fears for his safety. But, you know, I held five before coronavirus hit, and I had 60 of them playing throughout the district. So we're doing a lot of virtually now. But, you know, I had a rally up here on the city square and Tyler a couple of weekends ago. And by the time I got through, I was surrounded within two feet of me,

about three or four deep of guys screaming and hollering. and calling me every cuss word in the book, and they all had long guns and pistol strapped to them. And, you know, that didn't scare me a bit. It just, it more just motivated me to get my message out. So I could imagine Louis had been stood there and how many times he'd have pissed down his leg before he were ever to get away from him.

So let me ask you this. What's been driving the district so far? I mean, I've seen this in a lot of congressional races right now where the economic downturn because of Trump and COVID is really biting people in the ass. And it seems like that's a big motivator right now. now from what I'm here. Is that the same thing you're seeing there? It is, Rick. But, but, you know, we have a lot of people here that don't follow the national

norm, I guess. Like I said, this is a fairly rural area with the exception of three or four cities in the district. And we've got people that will not wear masks. We've got people that will not abide by the norm. The governor, of course, you know, has been kissing Trump's ass, you know, pretty regular. And Trump blows him up whenever he gets a chance. So we were the shortest state as far a shutdown and then opened back up and now we're leading the country in number of cases and number of deaths. But he actually had to come back and do an executive order requiring face coverings. And now I bet, I mean, people are lining up to run against him in 2022 in his own party. Our local sheriff, our local county judge here, and in almost every county in the district

came out that very day and said, we're not enforcing a mask order nor will we enforce the penalty. You know, a lot of the people just do not adhere to it. And that's why our cases keep continuing to rise. But getting back to the economic issues, yes, it's hitting people hard in their pocketbook. But so many things are, Rick. I mean, Texas leads the nation and the most uninsured people during this administration, out of roughly 20 rural hospitals in the state, 25% of them in this district, I mean, out of 20, we've had four closed in this district. So rural health care is a big issue. Health cost in general is a big issue, and along with prescription drug costs, and the fact that so many of our people are uninsured, that even if they wanted to get attention,

they couldn't afford to get one. What would be the solution for rural hospitals? Because I know that a lot of what's happening there is your hospitals are not funded and then you don't have the beds and then you have the COVID. Sure. The number one driver to the closure of rural hospitals is the high number of people who lack insurance. And, you know, the hospitals are required to treat people, whether they can afford to pay or not. So they have to do the bare minimum to at least get them healthy enough to get back on their feet and walk out the door. And by doing so, since Texas was one of those states that turned down the money, the Medicaid money from the Affordable Care Act, our Medicaid funds are very limited. And so a lot of these, the two main hospital conglomerates in this district, one recently

sold because they were about to go bankrupt for that very thing, for having to write off millions of dollars a year in uncollectable debt due to people not have an insurance. And that is the very reason. The number one reason all those rural hospitals closed. But I mean, there are ways to get passed through funding for those institutions, but Louis Gomerick refuses to do so because he just don't care. So, Hank, what happened with all those folks that showed up at your event? No, they were. I mean, I planned to just hastily planned a rally because I didn't like seeing pseudo troops being deployed to our cities. You know, that's how authoritarian rule begins is when a leader starts sending unmarked people into cities and telling law enforcement, get the hell out of our way, we're taking over. And then they just beat and harass

innocent people rather than trying to go after the people who are actually causing destruction and everything else. And for this president to do that just shows how desperate and how much he wants to be like Putin and Chavez and all these other dictatorial leaders and take over this country. But that's what I was protesting, the fact that these people were being deployed into our cities and our local law enforcement was being told to get the hell out of our way, we're going to do this on our own. So we threw this thing together. And of course, the Tyler PD, they were all excited in the city supposedly all excited. The day before the event, I checked in with them and they said, hey, we're monitoring a lot of chatter. We're going to have a heavy police presence there.

Well, we get there about an hour before the event on Sunday afternoon. There's about 75 armed militia people, you know, walking around with guns, swinging Confederate flags. I talked to some of them briefly beforehand, and they were pretty civil to a point, and I just asked them to, you know, we had the spot reserve, but I wasn't going to run them off, just respect us and we'd respect them. Well, that heavy police presence turned out to be at the most that I saw at any one time was three officers, two of them were riding around in vehicles, talking to the anti-protesters and waving at them, and one was actually standing in the back with a bunch of them. The thing got very confrontational. They ended up with probably 150, 200 of these people there. Most of the 400 people that had RSVP to me kept going when they drove by the square and saw all the guns. But the more we tried to talk, I had a couple of other speakers. They just drowned us out with bullhorns and air horns.

And there was one guy who's an elected official of a small town south of here in Rusk, who was carrying a rifle. And then he was up there in a log truck, pure East Texan. And he was riding around the square, blowing his horn and flipping everybody off. And, you know, the language there would have embarrassed the sailor. But nevertheless, we kept on with our message. And like I said, when I finished, I was completely. surrounded. And while I'm rolling the equipment up, a fight broke out. So that's when I called the

cops for the fourth time and says, okay, I guess you were waiting on a fight. Well, it's happening so you can get your ass up here. And they came up there with two officers who stayed about two minutes and told everybody, hey, if anybody needs to file a report and come down to the station, they left. But one of my campaign guys got the crap beat out of him, got his brand new iPhone stolen, his wallet stolen. And another man whose picture you probably saw, because this thing made all the papers practically in the country about this older man getting choked by this rabid-eyed guy with overalls and a trunk cap on who is actually a small businessman in Tyler. And the police are not going to press charges on that guy. And they tried to talk my guy out of pressing charges.

They even were bargaining for the guy that stole his phone saying, hey, the guy says he'll pay for a phone if you don't charge him. So, I mean, it's, you know, they made a movie about this town and this county years ago called Smith County Justice. And I know how things work here. Somebody was definitely the money person behind getting those people there. we've identified eight different neo-Nazis and skinheads from the still photos we had taken. A militia group called the 3% militia. There were members of the Bandito's biker gang here. Just a lot of different outside groups, a lot of paid protesters, because some of these people had told me they were at a protest the day before in weather for Texas doing the same thing.

So this was all made up for my benefit of all the BLM protests we had had for weeks prior to that. And since then, no anti-protesters at all and strong police present, but not at this one. Unbelievable. Somebody associated with Louis, I'm guaranteed, had something to do with this, and we're investigating it very heavily, and when we find out, we're going to make it public. Well, I think you ought to, Hank, and you've got to keep swinging, keep up the fight there. Hope you have a good hard race against the dumbest man in Congress. Well, I hope we beat the shit out of him, Rick, and plan on it. What do I need? I need every one of y'all's 2 million-plus followers to go to my website, Hankfortexas.com.

It's also the same on Twitter and Facebook. Like us on Facebook and Twitter. We'd have everything that we need to send this sucker back home. The only bad thing is we're sending him back here. I'm kind of hoping that on November 3rd, when Marine 1 takes this narcissistic president and his show wife to the airport, and they get on Air Force 1 along with the whole family to head to Russia, that maybe Louis has a seat on that plane and don't test positive again.

Change needs to happen, HankforTexis.com. I want all your supporters to jump in there and we're going to kick this piece of crap back down here and get up there and try to straighten that mess out. The new abnormal is going to release a limited run series of bonus interviews over the next few weeks.

Starting in August, we'll release a new one each Sunday. But listen carefully. Only Beast inside members will have access to these. So head over to New Abnormal. Dot the Dailybeast.com to join now. Your Beast Inside Membership helps support the great reporting at The Beast and podcasts like the new abnormal. Thanks. Lauren Underwood is the Democratic Congresswoman from Illinois's 14th District. She's the youngest black woman to serve in Congress, and she's going to talk to us today about COVID,

as well as Camel Harris. You have this incredible healthcare background. I bet you never thought you would be putting it to work in the way that you are. Oh, sure. So I am a registered nurse and I'm what's called a public health nurse. And so I spent my career working to improve health and well-being for communities and populations. And so I worked on the Affordable Care Act at the federal level, working on private insurance reform, healthcare quality and Medicare preventive services, those free screenings and vaccines and contraceptive coverage and then joined the Obama administration where I worked on public health emergencies and disasters. So we actually did Ebola, Zika, the mosquito illness, and the water crisis in Flint. We worked

with device manufacturers, pharmaceutical manufacturers on new vaccines and treatments and diagnostic tools for, you know, emerging infectious diseases or bioterror threats like smallpox and anthrax and will purchase those items in bulk and transfer them to the strategic national stockpile. And so really learned a lot in working with communities who are facing really significant, either natural disasters, like wildfires, hurricanes, tornadoes, or these kinds of health care threats, public health threats, and helping them prepare, respond, and recover. So, you know, we will transfer those products to the strategic national stockpile. So when I think about this moment that we're in, I do feel uniquely prepared and suited to help, you know, not only lead

my community through COVID-19, but help lead our country forward. So were the cupboards bare? Remember Trump is always saying the cupboards were bare? So your background in public health and your background understanding the sort of big picture infrastructure things that are required to manage something like this. The lessons that you guys drew, and both George W. Bush and Barack Obama, both took pandemic crisis management and crisis health care seriously. Both administrations, you could barely see the difference in their policies on that. Have you heard from anyone inside government about what the changeover looked like or how they were under-resourced or how the, or was it just the management at the top that caused this to be such a disaster? Well, I think what we've

seen coming from the administration is a real deflection on their responsibility. I mean, from the very beginning, they're not to be a nationally coordinated response. The shift from Health and Human Services to FEMA and FEMA claiming that they only had operational responsibility, which was logistics, which, you know, manifested in states competing with one another for critical protective equipment and testing supplies and them championing that as success. Just speaks to the complete break down of a system that had been tested over many years. Like when we talked about pandemic preparedness, everyone had a role to play. It was a very hierarchical plan, which said that the White House, the National Security Council, had clear roles. States and emergency managers had clear roles.

Our health care system had clear roles. And none of those plans were followed in this COVID-19 response. And so as a result, we've seen a real fracturing in how communities have felt the impact of both this health care crisis and an economic crisis, right? Some governors who respect science and value the endpoint of their health advisors and have invested in public health and local public health infrastructure. So Ron DeSantis? Well, no, I'm just kidding. No, but I think that my governor, J.B. Pritzker, is, you know, a great example of taking early decisive action to protect residents across Illinois. But we've seen that even in the best circumstances, right, We're still struggling to have rapid test turnaround times.

It's stretching between five and seven days now, where earlier several months ago, folks could reliably get test results back in three to four days. I mean, if you're not able to get timely testing done, then how are you really able to have adequate disease surveillance in a community? Why do you think the testing has gotten worse? Because we've seen that there's not been an investment made in increasing manufacturing.

capacity domestically. And that could have been changed if the president had used the federal, the defense production act. Yeah, right. Yeah, but it also can be changed right now. Right. This is a change that could turn on now and yield major impacts this fall when we are in the throws of flu season, right? Like, this is not, you know, a zero-sum game. We are looking for leadership and that leadership can emerge and make a tremendous impact now. I mean, in some, In some ways, I think what I hear you're saying is this isn't as much a money problem as it is a management and leadership problem. It seems like that there are a lot of people out there of goodwill and good faith who would be doing the work properly if the leadership from the top

down was sending the right signals. From our very first coronavirus response bills, right? And in March, we passed three. We have continued to put millions and millions and millions and millions, like hundreds of millions and dollars in investing and building up our testing infrastructure, right, to develop novel coronavirus treatment. And obviously you've been hearing a lot in the news about the vaccine work, right? The money is there. But guess what? If the president isn't willing to step up and, you know, invest in domestic manufacturing capability,

then the United States is just going to continue to have to fall in line behind other nations in the world when we are continuing to try to source products from foreign manufacturers. Right. Aren't we like the worst in the world for this? Well, our case rates are certainly very high. Our death rates are certainly very high. Throughout our country, we still have a lot of, like, a very high census in our hospital beds, meaning our hospital beds are full.

Our ICU beds are full. And it's been this way for months after months after months. And so there was a lot of talk about, like, flattening the curve in the spring. Like, you don't hear that as much right now. There's just been the steady state of high-level disease and death in our communities. You know, that's really a good point. You just don't hear the phrase flatten the curve anymore. We just sort of rolled over and gave up on him trying to flatten the curve before the disease started to flatten 166,000 Americans as of today. The temptation here is to keep you and just talk to you about COVID because you're so knowledgeable.

But I want to pivot if it's possible to talk to you because besides being a public health official and a nurse and also having all of this insight into that, you also are the youngest African. American woman ever to serve in Congress. That's right. And so you have, I think, a unique insight into what is happening right now with Camel Harris. Yeah. When Kamala Harris was, Senator Kamala Harris was selected as Vice President Biden's choice as a running mate, joy just filled out of my soul. I felt seen. I felt that we had reached a new moment in representation in this country.

and without a doubt, I know that she is prepared to lead our country forward out of this very, very, very challenging moment that we're in as a nation. She is a fearless leader, a fighter. She is tough. She is smart. She's been my partner as we work to save moms lives with our Black Maternal Health Caucus in the Congress. She and I introduced together a comprehensive set of legislation, nine bills that we call the Mommy Bus to end the Black. Black maternal health crisis that we face in the country where black women are three to four times to die as a result of childbirth in this country. And I think that we continue to see black women step up and lead our country forward. We step in in our communities to solve problems. We are reliable, reliable voters. But guess what? We're also electable. And she's going to do a great job. It is interesting to me that I have written about this and thought about this a lot because

African-American women have been the backbone of the Democratic Party and organizing. And so do you feel there's more scrutiny on you, too? Well, listen, it's hard being the first, right? So I'm the first woman. I'm the first person of color. I'm the first young adult to represent my community in Congress. Of course, there's scrutiny on me, right? Senator Harris is only the second black woman to ever, ever, ever serve in the Senate.

The first was Senator Carol Mosley Broad, which, and she was, represented me in Illinois, and that was in the 90s. And so, of course, there's extra scrutiny. But guess what? As a high-achieving black woman, I'm used to having to be better than others in order to get ahead in life. That is just part of the, I would say, American experience as a black person. And so she knows that. Barack Obama talked about it a lot, this idea of having to be exceptional in order to get recognition and achievement. But the electoral policy, component is something that hasn't really caught up to where our country has been, meaning that the powers that be, the gatekeepers, the folks sitting in these dark rooms

that are used to anointing and appointing people, have a certain vision of what a leader looks like, has a certain vision of what it means to be electable. But what we found in 2018 with my election and Colin Allred and Lucy McBath and Johanna Hayes and Joan Goose and Ilhan Omar and those of us who represent communities that are not majority black communities, is that we are electable and can lead and can be very effective, very effective from the communities that we come from. It doesn't have to have this 80% black district to elect a black representative kind of thing. And I think that Kamala Harris is going to just bust that class ceiling for us as well. I love that. I'm very scared of getting it, the virus. How do you guys,

members of Congress, you're supposed to be back and forth. You're. You're supposed to be back and forth. have a pre-existing condition. I barely leave the house. How do you guys manage that? And Louis Gohmert is wandering around with COVID. Yeah. So plague Louis. Because of my pre-existing conditions, you know, I know that if I got COVID, I would likely be symptomatic. It probably wouldn't be mild. And it would be tough. And so I've been very, very cautious, still showing up to do my job across the district, you know, still flying to Washington to vote, but making sure to continue to have the hand hygiene always, always, always wearing my mask. And I get tested because I also have parents who are in a high risk category.

I also try to make sure that I'm not going to be a super spreader, right? And there's a real responsibility with that. It's just a real shame that so many people, particularly essential workers, front line workers, who are more likely to be women and people of color, continue to lack the personal protective equipment that they need to show up to their job every day. And I really feel badly and continue to fight so hard to make sure that we can quickly remedy this situation.

Because these folks truly are heroes. It's not some kind of empty platitude, and they deserve better treatment than they're receiving. I'm hoping against hope that this vaccine comes soon and people will take it. Are you concerned just like we've had so much trouble scaling up? Like we couldn't get the swabs made, right? Are we heading towards a disaster with this vaccine, like not being able to get needles made?

I mean, do you foresee the problems that have plagued us at every stage of this also hitting us with the vaccine? Or are you more hopeful about the vaccine? Oh, I'm worried. I'm very worried about a number of things with the vaccine. You mentioned supplies. So everything from syringes, to gloves, to bandages and all these things, right? Those kinds of disposable medical items typically are not made domestically.

And when a vaccine is available, you don't have every American seeking the vaccine. You have everyone around the world seeking the vaccine at the same time. So those global supply chains will be taxed and will create real problems. There's also been over the last several years, really decade, this anti-vax movement that is pervasive. It is, has dominated social media and is highly problematic. But then you also have people who actually do believe in science. People who actually do believe in public health, they vaccinate their kids, they vaccinate themselves. They may not get a flu shot annually, but they are deeply skeptical of what folks are calling the Trump vaccine. And if there were one

that was approved and made available this fall or around the end of the year, they don't want it. And, you know, But that's a challenge too, because that creates a real public health crisis when, you know, the American people start to doubt the safety and efficacy of our rigorous review process that the FDA would lead. And then the third challenge that I'm kind of looking at is equity and distribution. For example, we have the Navajo Nation that has the most cases per capita. And if they were their own state, which they're not. But if they were, they would have more cases than any other state in this country.

We have African Americans and Latinx folks who African Americans are more likely to die of COVID, Latinx folks more likely to be diagnosed with COVID, and still you go into those communities, right, where it's predominantly people of color, can't really get a lot of testing, not a lot of health providers, and it remained shortage areas just day to day in terms of our health care system. And so when I think about the experience of people of color, we need to be planning to get resources there quickly, aggressively, and early if we're going to have a chance to save lives. And I'm not hearing that conversation from the administration leaders. You know, I'm communicating with a CDC source yesterday, and I asked this person about the

alleged Russia vaccine. And this is a person of enormous, like, scientific background, very, very, very smart. And I got back the eye-rolling emoji. Have you heard anything else about the alleged vaccine from the Russians? Not that one in particular, but we do. do know that there are a number of pharmaceutical companies around the world that do have vaccine candidates in advanced trials. And so, again, a lot of the conversation across the country has been dominated by if the U.S. has a vaccine candidate that is effective and safe first. But what if it is another manufacturer from around the world, right? Like the president positioning on matters on foreign policy and global health has really been isolationist and has destroyed

so many of our relationships and partnerships with our friends around the world. And it puts us in at a disadvantage when you have to rely on negotiations and diplomatic relationships in order to even gain access to that. And so that's something else that we really do have to consider. As you know, dear listeners, we have one mandatory formation on this show. One thing that must be here, or Molly and I will be chased through the streets by ravenous mobs of furious listeners. And that is the segment we call Fuck That Guy. My Fuck That Guy today is Louis DeJoy, the current Postmaster General, who has engaged in the shutdown of Postal Service functions in order to advantage Donald Trump's re-election for president. My message to you is to Joe is, first off, cut that shit out.

And second off, when this is done, do you think there's no accountability? Unless Trump wins again. When this is over, you realize you are going to prison, motherfucker. You are going to be wearing an orange jumpsuit and breaking rocks or stamp and license plates or whatever the current modern day equivalent is. I guess it's running a phone call center. So get ready to answer the question. May I help you with this charge on your master card, sir? Because you, Louis de Joy, are going to fucking prison.

Fuck that guy. My fuck that guy is not going to prison. But he is an opinion editor at Newsweek. His name is Josh Hammer. And he recently commissioned a piece of. about birtherism, which by a guy who had said that Ted Cruz could run for president, even though he was born in Canada. But maybe perhaps Kamala Harris couldn't run for president because she was born in Oakland, California.

So my fuck-that guy is Josh Hammer, the opinion editor. Josh Hammer and Luce the Joy, welcome to the hallowed halls of the new abnormals, fuck this guy. On that note, we'll wrap up. this episode of the new abnormal from The Daily Beast. In future episodes, we'll be talking with smart folks from The Daily Beast and beyond from media, culture, politics, and science, who will help us understand what's happening to our country and the world. We hope you'll subscribe to us on your favorite podcast app and share the show on social media. We're just getting started and don't want you to miss an episode. If you'd like to follow us on Twitter,

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