The Daily Beast Podcast - I Know Secrets of Trump's Hold Over These Cowards

Episode Date: March 12, 2026

Go to https://zbiotics.com/DAILYBEAST and use DAILYBEAST at checkout for 15% off any first time orders of ZBiotics probiotics. Joanna Coles sits down with The View co-host Ana Navarro for a blisteringly candid conversation about the chaos surrounding Donald Trump’s presidency—from a war abroad and a Pentagon obsessed with flattering photos of Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth, to the growing power of what Navarro calls a party of “cowardly Republicans” unwilling to challenge a deranged Trump. Navarro pulls back the curtain on how figures like Marco Rubio and Lindsey Graham transformed from fierce critics to loyal allies, explaining the political fear, ambition, and seduction of power driving the GOP’s dramatic shift. The conversation also dives into the fallout from Kristi Noem’s scandals, the lingering failures around the Epstein case across multiple administrations, and the uncomfortable questions about Trump’s health and America’s democratic guardrails. It’s an unfiltered, behind-the-scenes look at the personalities, betrayals, and power plays shaping Washington right now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I have seen person after person who I personally knew and admired and thought were different to complete 180s. I have known Marco Rubio since he was very young. I have known Pam Bondi for decades. She and I were friends with Kiki, we'd, we know together, we'd gossip, we'd drink together. So many people in Congress, so many people that are serving in this administration, so many people that I see on TV defending the industry, the indefensible and the unjustifiable because it means they have access to power. But the question is, are you willing to compromise every principle you supposedly stood for,

every conviction you supposedly had, every belief you supposedly held in order to stay in that circle of power? I'm Joanna Coles. This is The Daily Beast podcast. And today we're going to be talking to someone who is steeped in Florida politics, a new Marco Rubio and Pam Bondi before any of the the Trump madness sucked them into his orbit. I'm talking about Anna Navarro, the Republican operator who is just bewildered by what has happened to the Republican Party under Trump. And she has opinions on everything. You should hear her opinion on Kristine Ome and Corey Lewandowski. And she doesn't care that the two of them fucked. What she cares about is what else Christyneum has fucked. Stay tuned for that. She's got literally eye rolls on almost everything that's going on

right now. But having grown up in Nicaragua and a dictatorship, she also has real concerns about the Republic of the United States. She's not only the co-host of ABC's The View, but she's the mom of Chacha, and she's just started her own podcast, which I highly recommend, to call bleep because, well, frankly, she needs to be bleeped a lot. Let's get into it. Right. So, I'm so excited to have prized you out of the studio of the view and your own studio for bleep, your new podcast, to talk about everything, because I know you have an opinion on everything. And I definitely want to talk about what an earth is going on in Florida and Marco Rubio and DeSantis and all that. But first, we are 12 days into a war. And Pete Higgseth,

the secretary of defense slash war as he would have it has issued a decree that photographers who don't take flattering photos of him are no longer welcome at the Pentagon. We wrote a very good story on it at The Daily Beast and the headline was mirror mirror and about this vanity move of his. But what do you think of that? Twelve days into a war. Well, remember also what he did last year, which was to ban some of the longstanding Pentagon correspondence, media correspondence from the Pentagon, and replace them with basically MAGA bloggers or whatever it was. Right.

And he banned the AP, right? Yeah. I mean, and so the attacks on the press by this administration, whether it's Trump himself or cabinet members, have been endless. it's been from the beginning. And I think as we are in the middle of a war, and I'm glad we're calling it what it is, because I saw that Trump was calling it an excursion. I wonder if he knows what that word means, because for me, an excursion is like a field trip, right? I think he meant incursion, but either or it's not an incursion and it's not an excursion. It's a fucking war. So let's call it

what it is. And here we are. know, this guy threw us into war after saying that this is precisely what he wasn't going to do. And this tells you how tragic it is that in this second term, he has surrounded himself by all of these yes, men, and women who are not only unqualified when it comes to experience and knowledge, but also have no moral compass, are vain, and know that their only qualification that they have to keep up is cowtowing and brown-nosing to Donald Trump. So what a difference it would make to have a John Kelly at DHS or in the White House. What a difference it would make to have Mattis, Mad Dog Mattis, running Department of Defense

instead of this guy who seems to relish and take glee and dropping drones off the coast of Venezuela and showing us video game type footage of dropping drones on missiles, on ships laying mines, in the straight-of-hom moves. It's, you know, and his braggadocious self, I guess I'm so disgusted by Pete Hegeseth that the idea that he's banning people because they take on flattering pictures of him is like one of the lesser evils

when I start to think about all the things, the fact that this Department of Defense, or aptly called Department of War, has taken illegal military action. Every military expert has said dropping those drones on civilians off the coast of Venezuela and now in the Pacific was an illegal act. And they keep doing it with impunity. And this Congress, which has completely, the Republicans have ceded their duty of oversight, their duty of providing military approval of operations, they seem to have no issue with.

We've now killed 156 people with these drones on these ships in Latin America. All indications are the U.S. killed over 150 schoolgirls in Iran. And it bothers me greatly that Donald Trump and Pete Hexeth are trying to gaslight the American people and, you know, continue saying, oh, we're conducting an investigation. We're conducting an investigation. instead of acknowledging it as a, you know, tragic, horrible mistake and apologizing for it, something needs to distinguish us, you know, as the good guys from the bad guys. Someone told me that the school, which was next to a sort of depot for the Iranian Revolutionary Guard,

the assumption was because they'd looked at this through Western eyes that the school would be closed because it was a Saturday when they started. So they knew there was a school there, but because they were just looking at this through American eyes with no understanding of the culture on the ground when the school was open because it was a Saturday and kids in Iran go to school on a Saturday, they didn't realize it would be open.

And you think they got rid of... Well, they should say that, right? Well, they should say that. And they got rid of all the experts at the Pentagon who know about Iran. And now we've got Pete Heggseth, who doesn't want an unflattering photo of himself. That's his priority.

And also we found out today about the things he's been spending millions and millions of taxpayers on. Right. Two million dollars on snow crab legs? Right. Because he loves snow crab legs. Who doesn't? But I pay for my own. Right. Right. No, that's absolutely shocking that the expenses that they run up at the end of the year to make sure that they can get the equivalent budget for the following year. He spent on the most frivolous things, not least steak and crab claws. But it's just, you know, it's just so appalling at a time

when Americans can't afford health care, when Americans are being kicked off SNAP, the SNAP program, that you have Donald Trump spending hundreds of millions on a ballroom that nobody needed, talking about an arch, building the arch to Trump in Washington, D.C., making himself so wealthy. I mean, there's just so many things that I think just shocked the conscience. And I'm glad that we continue to talk about them. I'm glad you'll bring them up because one of my greatest fears is that we all get numb to this because it's just such a daily barrage of ignominious things. that it's hard to keep up with this hamster wheel of absurdity.

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drink responsibly, and you'll feel like yourself the next day. March is packed with social plans, so don't wait at now. Go to zbiotics.com forward slash daily beast and use code a Daily Beast at checkout for 15% off your first order. And if you're not satisfied, they offer a 100% money back guarantee. So you were a Republican. You work for Jeb Bush. You live in Florida, which is still sort of, you know, the bubbling cauldron of republicanism in a way. How do you square what has happened to the Republican Party, the hijacking of it by Donald Trump? And does it survive after Donald Trump leaves? Listen, I don't square away.

I have seen person after person who I personally knew and admired and thought were different due complete 180s. I have known Marco Rubio since he was very young. We're the same age. We grew up in Republican politics in South Florida. I have known Pam Bondi for decades since she was Attorney General of the State of Florida. and I were friends with Kiki, we'd, you know, together, we'd gossip, we'd drink together. I've, uh, Lindsay Graham, I knew him when he was John McCain's wingman, not Donald Trump's.

He's a completely different person than he is today. So many people in Congress, so many people that are serving in this administration, so many people that I see on TV defending the indefensible and the unjustifiable because it means they have access to power. And, you know, let's be clear, the trappings of power are very attractive. It's great to be invited to the White House. It's great to be able to go to the Christmas parties. It's great to be able to ride on Air Force One and be able to call up the White House and talk to whomever you want.

All of those things are heady things. I know, I've done them. But the question is, are you willing to compromise every principle you supposedly stood for, conviction you supposedly had, every belief you supposedly held in order to stay in that circle of power. I mean, the Marco Rubio I see now, and Marco is one of the... Yeah, tell me about Marco. How did he do that 180? I mean, we saw him standing next to Trump in the debates, arguing against him. How did he become his Secretary of State doing exactly what Trump appears to want? They all did it, right? I mean, think about the 26th.

campaign, Ted Cruz, Lindsay Graham, Marco Rubio, all of them harpooning Trump and calling Trump for what he was, a con man and a grifter. And they've all turned around because they're ambitious for their own. I mean, basically there's two ways to exist in the Republican Party right now. Either you are a Trumper and you approve and say and defend everything he says and does. and that benefits your political career, or you're not, and you're probably going to lose your primary, or you're not, you know, or you're going to retire, or you're just not going to be part of the look. Think about Mitt Romney. Where is Mitt Romney? Right. Nowhere. Think about

Jeff Bush. Where is Jeff Bush? No way to be heard from. And so the only way to continue being in elected office or an appointed office in this Republican Party is if you come along and become a Trump acolyte, which all of them have been willing to do. And those who have not been willing to do so are no longer relevant or in politics. What's the conversation like when Trump's not in the room, when they're all together? Because they know they've all done this, right? Marco Rubio understands his journey, doesn't he? Doesn't Lindsay Graham understand that he went from calling Trump, you know, fruit loops to now he's encouraging him to go into Cuba? That's his latest thing. Do they have this conversation with each other when when the press isn't in the room are they saying oh my god

he's lost his mind he's crazy how can we how can we contain him i don't think so i i think i think the only way that marco can look at himself in the mirror uh is by convincing himself that he believes this by convincing himself that by him um doing the things you know completely changing his convictions the way he has regarding Trump, that by him doing that, selling his soul, basically, he's been able to achieve some good things, which I think he believes getting rid of Maduro is a good thing. I think he believes an dead Ayatollah is a good thing. I think he believes that the possibility of regime change in Cuba is a good thing. And that has, the fact that he has sold his soul, has enabled him to be in the

room doing things that I think are genuinely important to Marco and that he does believe. I think he's also, listen, he's, you know, he's a poor kid from West Miami. And I think for him, the idea of having his own plane and being at state dinners and being at Mara Lago and being there in the center of things is just very appealing. But remember who Marco Rubio is. Marco Rubio is a elected official who basically owed his career, a great part of it. He was the first speaker of the Cuban-American speaker of the Florida House of Representatives legislature.

He owed everything to Jeb Bush. Marco is very talented, very eloquent, very smart, very hardworking. Out of that sorry bunch that surrounds Trump, he is by first. far the most qualified, which I understand is not a high bar, but he is the most qualified. Right. But this is the guy who owed everything to Jeb Bush, had said he'd never run against Jeff Bush, and then ran against Jeb Bush for president. So it's quite consistent with Marco to do what's best for Marco. And whether it's getting reelected to the Senate, if he had state in the Senate or getting appointed as a secretary of state in order to do either of those

things he would have had to kiss Trump's ass. Because if Trump doesn't endorse you in a Republican primary and endorses somebody running against you, you'll probably lose. Ask Dan Crenshaw. Right. So I hear from people that go to Mar-a-Lago that Trump spends a lot of time going around Mara Lago when he's talking to people at the tables and they're having dinner saying, what do you think of Marco? Marco's doing great, isn't it? What do you think of Marco? Is Marco at the moment the most likely person to take over from Donald Trump, do you think? Or do you think J.D. Vance stands a chance? I definitely think the Republican base, the MAGA base, likes J.D. Vance. I think that is their

guy. I think J.D. Vance intends to run. He's given every indication. You see what he's doing with people like, you know, trying to take up the mantle after Charlie Kirk, you know, really become close and supportive of the widow, Erica Kirk, and, you know, it's mutual. And Marco has said that he wouldn't run against J.D. Vance. But I'm old enough to remember when he said he wouldn't run against Jeff Bush. So don't hold your breath. Right. Do you think between the two of them, who do you think would be most likely to get the nomination? Listen, I think J.D. Vans is lining everything up behind him. But at the end of the day, whatever Donald Trump decides is going to, I think, determine this.

Whether I like it or not, the truth is Donald Trump makes or breaks Republican primaries right now. And there is no indication in the next two or three years that's going to change. I think the reason he likes Marco is because Marco is effective. and efficient and knows his stuff. And so, you know, here's Trump surrounded by a bunch of Lincoln poops, right, by Pam Bondi. I mean, listen, I like Pam Bondi. Like I said to you, we were, you know, we were very friendly when she was in Florida. But I wouldn't hire Pam Bondi to defend me from a traffic ticket, you know.

What do you think of how she's handled the Epstein vows? I think it's disgusting. I mean, I don't know how Pam can live with herself. By the way, I don't know how Merrick Garland can live with himself either. That's one of the things we have to remember and be fair about, and that really just kills me. These Epstein survivors, these women were failed, not by the Trump administration, but by four different administrations.

It was under George W. Bush that Alex Acosta was used. U.S. Attorney of South Florida and brokered that sweetest of the sweetheart deals with Epstein that allowed him to then 13 months later, despite being registered as a sex offender, continue molesting girls, raping girls, and living his life like if he was some sort of elite VIP surrounded by powerful people. And, you know, Obama was then precedent. And then it was, I mean, And we have had four different administrations, Trump, Biden. Yes, I fault Merrick Garland. How different would it have been had Merrick Garland released all of these files instead of it

being Pam Bonding? Why did it take so long for it to become ahead of steam that the Department of Justice felt pushed into releasing them? Two things I would say to you. On the Merrick Garland of it all, I think Merrick Garland was extremely. preoccupied with Merrick Garland's reputation. I think he didn't want to be seen as being politicized. I think that's the reason that he prosecuted Hunter Biden. I think that's the reason that he appointed a special counsel to investigate Joe Biden over the classified issues. And I think that's the reason

he wasn't more proactive and quick regarding Epstein because of the fear that there would be something regarding Donald Trump or other Republicans there and that he would be seen as political. Pam Bondi, what's the steam? Frankly, let's give credit to what credit is due. It's been MAGA. It's been the Marjorie Taylor Greens and the Lauren Bowbirds and the MAGA blogosphere and podcasters who never let it go. It was MAGA who made this into a campaign issue in 2024. It was MAGA who never let go of it. It was MAGA Republican women, Nancy Mays, Lauren Bowbert, Lauren, Marjorie Taylor Green, who defied Donald Trump and voted to require the release of these files. Let's remember Lauren Bober, who was voted with Trump, practically 100% of the time,

was taken into the situation room and bullied to change her vote. That is how much Trump did not want this released. And so I'm disgusted with all of them. I'm discussing. I'm discussing. I'm disgusted with Pam Bondi, I'm disgusted with Mary Garland, I'm disgusted with Alex Acosta, who I knew from Miami as well. He was, I mean, at one point, Alex Acosta, after the Epstein thing, after being U.S. attorney, he was the dean of the Florida International University Law School. Alex Acosta served in Trump's first administration, a secretary of labor, as we all remember, and he was barely questioned about the Epstein. deal. It was like a nothing, it was a nothing burger. Ironically enough, in my view, it wasn't

until Trump gets elected. And then as a reaction to that, there is a Me Too movement. And at times up, which we saw in the files, Epstein was obsessed with and wanting to thwart. Well, I'm constantly trying to sort of create little groups of men where they all got together and just dissed it, right? Because they all thought it was ridiculous and they all knew they were guilty. But it wasn't until that happened. So Trump gets elected, there's a Me Too movement that I think the Epstein survivors, you know, had the ability, the thought that they could be believed and that they had a voice and that they, you know, lost the fear. And then it's the Julie K. Brown Expoise and the Miami Herald. To me, all of those things are elected.

connected. The Trump election, the Me Too movement, the expose in the Miami Herald where the survivors spoke so many of them, and then where we are. Right, because we had Conchita Sarnoff in The Daily Beast writing about the Epstein situation way before Julie K. Browned. It just didn't get any momentum. It didn't pick up. And there were people who tried to write about it and those stories were stopped. Right, right. I mean, there were stories that were stopped. I think people were a friend. of very powerful men. And what they can do to you, they can sue you, they can do this, they can, you know,

they can put all sorts of, they had all the, all the, he had all the luxuries that come with power. And I think we have learned through the Epstein case, you know, here in America, we love to tell ourselves, everybody's equal under the eyes of the law. Bullshit, bullshit. Jeffrey Epstein was not,

You think that if that had been some poor Latino in Hia, Florida, or some poor black guy or some poor white guy, you think he wouldn't have served his entire life in jail for sexually assaulting and raping, he had over a thousand victims. Would somebody else have been able to get away with that? And, you know, and I was telling you, I think we have given a pass to so many, particularly men, powerful men, people that we admired, or I can tell you, I admired, you know, I admired Bill Clinton. I admired Bill Gates. Why do you think Bill Gates was hanging out with Jeffrey Epstein? Bill Gates, at one point, the second richest man in the world. What on earth would Bill Gates need from Jeffrey Epstein that he couldn't get from someone else?

Well, first, I think we shouldn't underestimate Epstein's ability to weave a web of power and influence and just, you know, give himself that aura of that normalized what he was doing. But Bill Gates was hanging out with all these other billion ass. Can I tell you something? Always be careful with the nerds. Because all of those nerds, they never fucked the cheerleader. Right. They never had, they never went. they were never the popular guy at the prom.

They were never, they never had. And so I think, you know, I think some of these, I think that's why Epstein hung around and so many tech conferences and science conferences and longevity stuff. Because all of those scientists and technical nerds and, you know, not only was he getting information for investments in things, but he was also always weaving this web of, okay, If I surround myself by these powerful people, then these other powerful people will want to be around me and think that it's okay despite what I've done. And I also think, I also think that until Me Too happened, most people just kind of shrugged. It was all you got was a shrug when you heard of a older guy, a powerful older guy, messing around with a young girl.

I think, you know. It was just the sort of natural law of things. The Lolita. Oh, you know, it's the Lolita syndrome. It's okay. You know, I think a lot of people thought that any post-pubescent girl, once they were post-pubescent, they were fair gay. Right. So let me ask you about another.

Don't you? Yeah, I do think that. I do think that. And I think through the lens of Me Too, people have realized, I think women have understood their position differently. But let me ask you about another sexual transaction that's been going on in plain sight that's finally caught up with Christy Noem and Corey Lewandowski. This was an open secret in Washington, big open secret in the Republican Party. What do you think of their relationship?

The transformation of Christine Noem is an interesting thing. Joanna, the fact that she may have been fucking Corey Lewandowski as the least. of my issues with Christy Noem. It's the fact that she fucked the Constitution, that she fucked the Latino and immigrant community, that she fucked the country that I worry about. It's the fact that she was the leader of DHS as they killed and shot US citizens.

It is the fact that she had, that she led that department when there were almost, what, 4,000 children detained that at the same time that the government was shut down and TSA agents weren't getting paid, she was spending hundreds of millions of dollars on an ad campaign. I mean, there's so many. Which some of her colleagues got money from too, right? Let's not forget that this was not just her spending the money on the ad campaign. There was commission coming off the job.

First, the ad campaign itself is so ridiculous. And I want people to go look at the ads, right? because she's on a horse, all made up. I don't know anybody who goes on a horse looking like that. But, okay, that day she was in a cowboy Barbie costume. God she loves a costume. Yep. But she's doing this big ad costing hundreds of millions of dollars

where she's on a horse in Mount Rushmore in telling immigrants not to come to the United States. I'm pretty sure that the people in El Salvador and Guatemala and Mexico and Nicaragua and Venezuela and Afghanistan and God knows where else that she was talking to don't speak English and are not watching this ad. So this was nothing but a vanity project. This was, you know, this was not an ad where she, who was this ad intended for? Really?

Potential undocumented immigrants coming into this country? that is the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. So who is it aimed at? Is this about her run for 2028? Yeah. I think she saw herself as a potential contender. And I think she is a vain woman who love to cosplay different characters. And she just loved the entire thing about the lashes and the extensions and the makeup and being on TV and the, you know,

know, all of that. And the plane, the luxury jet that she flew around with, with Corey Lowndowski, and we should point out they're both denied they've had enough. If she had, you know, if she had produced her own version of Lady Macbeth and gone off Broadway somewhere, she could have gotten all sorts of costumes, period costumes then. It's astonishing to me that she spent a quarter of a billion dollars on that ad campaign. It's just crazy. and it took one of the Republican senators in John Kennedy

to ask her the killer question, did Donald Trump know about this? And her clearly obfuscating and going, yes, yes, he knew. And then... Do you think John Kennedy asked that question in coordination with Trump in the White House? Yeah, of course.

Or do you think it was completely out of... No, I think he led her to drink. I think he led her very gently question by question to the point where she had zero wriggle room. and that was the moment where Trump realized this was terrible for Trump. I'm sure he did know about the campaign. Well, the lethal blow is when Senator John Kennedy asks her, did Trump know about this?

Did you talk about this with Trump? And she said, yes, and he was supportive of it, which Trump alleges is a lot. I actually believe him because I don't think he'd be cool with a quarter of a million dollar ad campaign that wasn't about him. But I, you know, Cha-cha. Part of me, most of me thinks that this was planted, this question and the way it was,

was planted by somebody at the White House who realized what a dragon and albatross she is around their neck. We just heard this week that the White House is instructing Republicans running for, election this November to stop talking about mass deportations. Right, right, because they know how bad it's been. Of course, they give her the face saver of she's going to be part of a new group that deals with South America. Do you think she sat there? What have we done in Latin America? Well, to deserve the scour of Christine Nome. But do you think that, though, I think she's going to get such great photo ops. She will. Can you imagine her in British? Of course. She's playing Carmen Miranda with bananas and pineapples on her head. I mean. Right. And she's,

she'll go full explorer in Patagonia. Oh, Dora the Explorer. Dora the Explorer. But do you think, so now you're- Do you think she brings Corey Lewandowski with her? I don't think, well, she won't be useful to Corey anymore. Well, she went, he moved on to someone else. And do you remember when she got her bag stolen? I was going to say, it wasn't a Mexican restaurant. It wasn't a Mexican restaurant. No, it was a burger. It was a burger place. And her Rolex, remember? That's right. And didn't she have a ton of cash, too?

Yeah. You know, the question somebody should be asking and investigating is, since she was awarding all of these multimillion dollar contracts to cronies, what was she getting in exchange, if anything? That to me is a legitimate question because she seemed to be living pretty high on the hog. Yep. Yeah. Yeah, high on the hog.

Although her husband has Brian, spelled with a Y. Horns coming out of his head? Well, his family say that 20 years ago, he realized he had a calling from God that his calling was to support Christy Noem in her pursuit of power. So that's why they're still together, because as you point out, the relationship with Corey has been going on for some time. We are led to believe, though they both deny it. All right.

I have another question for you. Trump's health. What do we think? We think there's obviously something going on there, right? I mean, it's not, you don't need to be a trained doctor, which I'm not, to see the size of his ankles, to see the bruises on his hands, to see the latest thing, that that scab whole thing going on in his neck, to see the obvious deterioration, mental deterioration. and know that there's something going on there, but we're never going to know. They're never going to tell us, right? But if it had been Biden, the Republicans would be screaming holy murder right now. And I do think, I do think that at some point it's not going to be now because we just, this Congress

is incapable of something like that. But there's so many things that where Trump has shown the weaknesses of this system and that if we actually had a Congress with a spy, they would do something about it, whether it's transparency in the candidates and certainly precedents, health and finances, right? Whenever we've still not seen his tax returns. The, you know, tightening the loopholes on the grifting by families. But of course, that would mean that Congress would have to do something about all of the dumb. nephews and children of congressmen and senators who have phantom lobbying jobs or consulting jobs with companies benefiting from access to their fathers or mothers. So that's not going to

happen, but that should happen. So, you know, we have seen the conflict of interest, the grifting, the violation of the Hatch Act. I mean, it's just one thing after another where, again, And this Congress, the Republican leadership in Congress, has ceded their duty to provide oversight and to be a check and a balance on the executive, which is why I hope and think that the American people are going to provide that check and balance by voting them out in November. And it feels like we're already in the run-up to the midterms, doesn't it? So I'm very curious. You are a well-known Republican, I guess, operative is the right word, in Florida.

How do you, are you just banned from everything now? Does anybody talk to you anymore? What happens when you run across Marco Rubio or Pam Bondi? Do you ever see them? Do you ever come across them? Well, they now, no, I haven't seen them. I think the last time I saw Marco in person was about a year ago when we both attended the funeral of a former Republican congressman, Lincoln Diaz-Balart. his brother is serving in Congress now, Mario Diazbollah, and Lincoln Diazbollard, his other brother is with MSNBC or MSN now, MS now, and now he's a state with NBC, Jose Diazbollah. But Marco was at Lincoln Diazbollard's funeral, and I was at Lincoln Diazbollard's funeral. Lincoln was a Republican who I, but he was like a brother to me.

And what happens, well, I'm in Miami, and a lot of times I run into a lot of times I run into people who were friends of mine, not just elected officials, but just, you know, people who were, you know, who are staunch Republicans, they'll call me a communist, or they'll turn their face at me. I've lost friendships over it, whatever, you know, it's, it's the world we live in now, and if a friendship is defined by political agreements or disagreements, then it's not much of a friendship. I've learned to live with it at this point. And, you know, it is what it is. It's, I mean, there was a time in this country, and you're old enough, you remember this, when people could have vocal, strong, loud disagreements on politics and still be friends.

I remember being on CNN with Donna Brazil during the Obama administration and me being incredibly critical of some of the things Barack Obama was doing and Donna defending them. We were having debates on TV and afterwards we'd go and have oysters and wine at the, you know, local watering hole. Donna Brazil is like the only person. I think I'm the only person who can match Donna, oyster for oyster and drink for drink. That's pretty much a thing of the past these days. Trump made it so that, you know, You can't even be a Republican who disagrees with Trump and be at the same dinner table with Trumpers. It's just become incredibly difficult.

We've become polarized in a way that I never imagined we could be. So final question. You grew up in Nicaragua. You experienced dictatorship from both sides, actually, from Somoza on the right and then Ortega on the left. Do you think America under Donald Trump is actually a dictatorship at this point? I mean, are the things that structurally worry you about the future of democracy in America? Yes. Do I think it's a dictatorship?

No, because we still have mostly independence in the courts. And I think they've, you know, they have been. doing their part in trying to keep democracy alive. I think that our system of checks and balances was not designed when the founding fathers were drawing it up. It was not designed to have somebody that's got the dictatorial tendencies that Donald Trump does. I take the word dictatorship very seriously.

It's not something I throw around lightly because I've lived under Ortega. I was very small. and Somosa was in power. When the revolution happened in Nicaragua, I was eight years old. But I've lived in Miami my entire life surrounded by Venezuelans and Cubans who fled dictatorship and Haitians who have fled dictatorship. So are there things that are dictatorial-like, that are reminiscent?

Yeah, when you see the attacks on the free press, when you see the attacks on institutions like universities, when you see the weaponization of government against political opponents like James Comey, like, yes, when you see the enrichment of the person in power and his family, you know, those are all things that dictators do. When you see Donald Trump trying to lie and change election results and stay in power through violence, which was January 6th. That's what Maduro did in Venezuela. He lost that election to Maria Corina Machado, that poor woman who gave Donald Trump her Nobel Peace Prize. What was she thinking? If I was her, I'd be at the White House knocking down that gate asking for my medal back. Because every time anybody puts a mic in front of him,

he starts talking about how great Delzi Rodriguez, Maduro's vice president, who was part and parcel of every human rights violation that that regime perpetrated on the Venezuelan people. But all Trump can do is talk about how great she is, how wonderful it is to work with her, how wonderful a person she is, how it's a great collaboration. In the meantime, he's got Maria Corrida Machado's Peace Prize medal hanging in the White House somewhere, and he keeps throwing that poor woman under the bus. He doesn't even mention her name. Right. Well, this is why you can't give in to bullies, right? The minute you give in to them or the minute you suck up to them, they just want more.

That part. All right. So let me ask you something. You were a vociferous defender of Jimmy Kimmel when his show was suspended, and you were very powerful on the view. There were stories that Bob Iger, the CEO. of ABC had come to one side and said, hey, you guys have to lay off Trump. You have to be easier.

And he'd in particular taken you off to one side. What was that moment like? Well, I'm not going to talk about private conversations with Bob Eiger or, you know, or any of the executives. I can tell you this much. The view, viewership is incredibly loyal. And I think the reason the show works. And we are now on the 29th season.

and it was created by Barbara Walters, we're turning 30 next year. It's because they expect from the hosts on their authenticity and transparency, and they expect us to take on some very tough hot topics and discuss them honestly. If we don't, they know that. If we change, they know that. The show is right now number one daytime talk show in America.

And I think it's because of that formula and because that formula hasn't changed. So we continue to do what we do. You know, if you tune in every day, we are talking about the abuses of power and calling them out and giving different perspectives on what's happening. We all see the efforts by the Trump administration to musk, anybody or any institution, any company that is critical of him. They may try, but they haven't muscled the women of the view yet. And, you know, I think we take our responsibility to be accurate, to be truthful, to be engaged very seriously. And, you know, I consider it a privilege

to have that kind of national platform, because a lot of people get their news from the view. A lot of people are not tuning in to CNN or MSN, MS. I keep saying it wrong. What the hell is I called now? MS now. MS now. You know, 24 hours a day are not reading the New York Times.

We've seen that local newspapers have taken such a hit lately. There's less and less local newspaper coverage of national, big national stories because of lack of resources and support. So I take that job very seriously. We all do. And, you know, we continue doing what we've been doing for 29 years. Well, congratulations on reaching your 30th anniversary. That's an extraordinary achievement in television. And it's fantastic to talk to you. I mean, it's so liberating to hear someone just feel free to say what they think. And I love your line about Christina and that you don't care if she fucked. Corey Lowndowski, you care if she fucked the country. Anna Navarro.

Very good line. Very good line. Why I started this new podcast, bleep. Right. Because those things I can't say on TV. Right. Not because somebody's telling me not to say them, but because they're right. an FCC violation at 11 a.m. in the morning. So I have, I actually have gotten bleeped with some,

on network TV with some frequency. And then I tried to curse in Spanish and thought they won't know what I'm saying. Maybe, you know, but they, they've kind of caught on to me. So at this point, if I say anything in Spanish, if I say queso, they will bleep me out just to be on the safe side. And so the, the reason that I named the podcast bleep, is because it's a place where we can be uncensored, unfiltered, unbleeped, and, you know, and just talk truthfully. And I think this new podcast space is so refreshing because it is so free. Well, and what's fun about watching bleep is you're sitting there in your kind of comfy chair. You've sometimes got a glass of something.

You're raising your glass. You've got chacha on there. and you look like you're having fun. You're chatting away. You've got opinions on everything, which is what makes great, great podcasting. You know what I don't have opinions on? I need to find some opinions on.

I need to have an opinion on Timitay-Shalamee. I don't even know how to say his name. You really don't. And the opera and the ballet thing. Do you have an opinion on that? On the what? Do you not know about this?

What's the last bit? Opera and ballet. Oh, yeah, I do know that. And he's sort of right, which is why, you know, nobody goes to see the opera anymore. I don't know. I will tell you this. I was a three-tenors groupie at a point.

I went to see the three-tenors. Pavarotti's dead. Right, but. Jose Carreros, I think, is almost dead. And the other one got me-toed. Right. Placito, unfortunately, who I saw at La Scala and who was fantastic. I also was the three-tenors girl.

And I don't mind going to the opera, but I'm always. struck when I do go to the opera, how old the audience is. So maybe it's something that we all come to later in life. You turn 70, you get a membership to the opera. But I think people are going to be on YouTube watching Bleep instead. I hope so. I hope podcasting is not a dead art. I think it's just beginning. I think, Chacha, you should have your own podcast. You could have a dog podcast. You could interview my dog. Chacha looks strangely. at home in a podcast studio. Chacha is strangely at home anywhere.

She's a very comfortable dog. Yeah, very sweet dog. She lives. In my next life, I want to come back as Chacha. I want to be carried around everywhere. I want somebody to pay for every morsel of food that I eat. I want to be loved and pampered and go everywhere. And she doesn't need extensions.

Anna, thank you so much for coming in, so much fun. How great to have Anna Navarro's opinions. Unbleaped. Unbleeped is what she should have called her podcast. Not filtered by the networks, but just raw Navarroisms, which give us an insight into what she really thinks about the madness that's going on. Anyway, if you have been, thank you for joining us. Leave us a comment on what you think about Anna's opinions. Leave us a comment about Chacha, my latest obsession.

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