The Daily Beast Podcast - Mitch McConnell Is Already Trying to Train Wreck the Biden Admin

Episode Date: January 20, 2021

It is said that before Barack Obama’s inauguration in 2009, a group of Republicans got together and vowed to oppose everything that he would do, or rather, try to do. Did the Trump loyalists on the hill and Mitch McConnell’s Republicans huddle together last night and make a similar vow, this time for President-Elect Joe Biden? It’s a possibility, says Michael Tomasky, special guest on today’s members-only episode of The New Abnormal, which happened LIVE on Zoom. Even if they didn’t, Tomasky, and co-hosts Rick Wilson and Molly Jong-Fast, know that Mitch’s sneakiness isn’t ending with the Trump administration. Take the impeachment for example, says Rick: “They’ll pretend they’re doing to convict him,” but they, mainly Mitch, won’t. “If he meant it, they would have done it. I think he’s leaning slightly more toward it, only because the ‘22 [race] map is staring at him a little bit.” They’re all still tied to the race, so Mitch’s games will continue. In fact, he’s already trying to trainwreck Biden. “If Mitch McConnell wants Josh Hawley to wear a Spongebob outfit, he will do that. He is letting Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz play their game,” says Rick. Speaking of the Biden administration, the crew shares what 46 should say in his inauguration address, and the question almost leaves them stumped. “There needs to be an acknowledgment of the precarious place we’re in. He needs to explain to the American people what a perilous place we’re in and what we can do to come back,” says Tomasky. Rick agrees (“You can’t have a car crash like this and not talk about it. There needs to be some sternness to it, too.”) and Molly goes even further. One word: accountability. Plus! Rick, Molly and Tomasky surmise what Trump could have possibly said to Biden in the letter he left for him (a mention of a gorilla channel??), how the Bannon pardon was a “fuck you moment,” the DNC’s next moves and, of course, the Trump administration’s very last Fuck That Guy, to which Rick and Molly bring the heat. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to another edition of the New Abnormal Live. I am New Abnormal producer Jesse Cannon. And the only sadness I have in my heart today is that Zoom has a strict copyright enforcement so I cannot play David Bowie and Mick Jagger's classic dancing in the streets to celebrate. And because Donald J. Trump is the worst president we ever had and botched the coronavirus. We have to do this from our homes instead of reenactoring the video to that song. If you have not joined us... Which I would gladly do.

I want to see those moves, Rick. If you have enjoyed us for these live zoos before, you could ask us questions on the tab that says Q&A. And even if you don't have questions, please upload the ones you like because we want to know which ones I should ask everybody here. But without further ado, I'd like you guys to give a warm welcome to new abnormal hosts, the Queen of Dunking on Trump children, Molly Jong Fast,

and the king of brutal political ads and the mastermind of so many great ones, Rick Wilson, as well as our guest, Daily Beast Special Editor, and the editor of Democracy or Journal of Ideas, Michael Tumaski. How are you guys doing? Great, man. Thanks for having us. Yeah.

Well, we're actually having you. Yeah. I suppose that's true. Right. Thanks for continuing to keep us off the street. Thanks for putting up with our shit. I think I'm supposed to say, thanks for having me. Yes, yes.

Tamasky also edits both of us. So we are big Tamasky fans. Yes. Team Tamaski, if you will. You know, it's a big love fest here. We're all happy today. So I'd like to kick things off with a poll, which is going to pop up on your screen. If everybody can answer, are you going to be watching the inauguration?

And we'll post the results to that. But before we get going... Wait, we can't vote? No, we can't vote. We have special privileges, and there's different rules for different people. just like Trump's pardoning policy. Clearly. Why don't we start off by talking about that?

What do we think of pardoned Palozo? Well, look, I'm just thinking that the most important thing we've discovered in healing our nation is that Lil Wayne got a pardon. So, I mean. What was that? My favorite part about Kodak Black was like his pardon was also supported by Lil Yati. Why do you think he pardoned? Like, what do you think the unifying principle there was besides people who gave him money? Like, there were a few people, but he thinks of his being on the fame planet with him, right?

And I think those were like, that's why the rap stars. And there's one athlete on there. And I can just some cat and dog stuff. there's a lot excuse me my cat has decided that she's going to interfere with the stand on the iPad so I'm going to be bouncing a little bit here

but I think a lot of it also came down to you know some of that's clearly the pay for play stuff right but you know Kellyanne had one on there for a Russiagate guy and the abandoned one was just to fuck

you to everybody the band and it was deliberate trolling it was just like fuck you America I got away with with it. Ha, ha, ha. And now I'm going to let the worst human being that was ever in my circle get away with it. I wonder if there's a self-interest angle to the Bannon part.

Right. That's what I was wondering. There might be. There might be. Like Roger Stone. Yeah. It's like Bannon knows stuff, you know. Right.

He knows stuff. But, I mean, at this point, he's been out of the circle for so long. I don't think it's as, you know. I don't think there was any like pendant risk from Bannon, other than Bannon just, you know. And I also think that at the end of this, I have a theory of this case. It's a little weird. When they said Bannon was coming back around with Trump before the pardon, it was right after the insurgency on the sixth. And I thought, maybe Trump saw that and thought, if only they were better organized and had a sort of field marshal behind them,

and had an organizing propaganda effort behind them. Maybe they would have been affected. I couldn't help but think that. So you think that that's what's coming? No, I think that maybe what Trump is thinking about is if he's going to form a new party and a new movement, he wants a Leninist organizer like Bannon to do that nationalist populist stuff. And remember, the one person in Trump's world who never fell from grace was Stephen Miller. Yeah.

And he's been talking to people about. or risen too, Grace. But he's been talking to people about, you know, keeping the nationalist movement alive, keeping Trump nationalism going. So that may be, and he's, and Bannon's still close to, Miller and Bannon are still in that same circle. So basically the two worst people in the administration. Well, yeah, for sure.

And, I mean, look, it amused me today that one of the few people standing there on the Oval as they were leaving, or on the South Law as they were leaving was Dr. Sebastian Gorka. The dragon of Budapet. But what about the pardons like the congressman who wrote down

the menu of bribes on his congressional stationery? Yeah, no, look, that stuff is just obscene. And between the pardons and the final, final fuck you to America was the executive order that said, Oh, yeah, I said my people could never go in lobby and do influence peddling after I'm out of office.

But, nah, never mind. I mean, it was such a douche move. But Tamaskie, do you think that they were, I mean, do they have any lobbying power? Most of them probably don't, but some will. Sure, some will. And I mean, even if they don't have any lobbying power to persuade the Biden administration. or the Congress to do anything, they'll still make $2.5 million a year failing, you know.

Sure. Sure. Washington is famous for taking the deputy assistant undersecretary of toilet seat maintenance, and the guy suddenly goes to a lobbying firm, and he's a senior governmental advisor. Yeah, right. But who can those people lobby? Lobby Republicans in Congress.

you know, they'll lobby. They can lobby the MAGA. They can lobby the MAGA Congress. And if they, we'll see what happens with Trump. You know, this whole Patriot Party thing may just be, may him just be just him masturbating, right? It could just be him shit talking. But if it starts to emerge, people will have, there will be a certain desire to bribe Trump to keep him on the Republican reservation. And there'll be a lobbying world that will start telling people, I can help keep him calm.

I can help I can help regulate the the crazy etc. Yeah. Do you guys think though since he doesn't have Twitter? I mean, he's been so quiet. How would he get his voice back? Well, karaoke. What do you think is karaoke song is? I guess it's Gloria.

I think it's my way. It's rat in a cage. My dear friend Sam Goldman said, though, if it's my way, it's the Sid-Vicious version. Yeah, right. I believe it's rat in the cage. Spot on my rage. I'm still just a trump in a cage. So we have a very popular question.

Did I buy a copyright? I think you sang it off-key enough that it's not going to get registered. Okay, good. Because it's always going to be off-key with me singing, as you know. Same, same, same. So, Mauree Dottily has a great question, as a great comment that says, not a question, but a huge statement of gratitude for all you have done for the nation. But I want to get to Nathaniel Watson's question, which is a really fun one. What do you think Trump left in his letter to Biden?

Tamasky, you go first because you're like the serious person here. I am. Sorry. You know, he didn't leave a letter, obviously. No, but he did. Maggie said he did. He really did. Yeah.

Well, you know, I'm sure it was something completely self-serving about how, you know, we've left you the country in the greatest shape that it's ever been in and, you know, don't fuck it up. Actually, I think it's probably a note that says, I still can't find the guerrilla channel. Help me, Joe. I think it's, I mean, I think it, I can't even imagine what it is. It's got to be, it's in Sharpie, right? It's. Yeah.

In Sharpie. I mean. It's probably, it's probably, you know, it is, I think, Tamask is right. It's probably some self-aggrandizing bullshit. I'm the greatest. And you, you're going to skate on my legacy. Keep American great, Joe. So we have a question.

from Sandy Murphy, which I thought was really interesting, but I'd like to turn it a little bit different, which is I'd like all three of you to answer us, but it says in interviews, I've heard Rick say he can get the DNC to work well again. If you were running it, what would you change? I'd love to first hear from Rick and then hear from the rest of you about what we think we can change. Well, first off, we'd rearrange the office into a sort of a bullpen thing with a large, semi-naked man wearing nothing but a breech cloth, beating a drum every day, and yelling stroke, stroke, stroke. is why you will never be in charge of the DNC. Thank God. No, look, it is, it is, all political parties go through cycles of effectiveness and ineffectiveness. The DNC has had a lot of uniquely ineffective moving parts.

I'm sorry, the cat is really here, hold on, America. You're going to get your dose of cat. Oh, manless the kitty. Hello. Oh, look, she looks very like her portrait. Wow, that really is a good portrait. You just sank a claw to my collarbone.

But look, I think what they've got to focus on is the fact that they picked a lot of low-hanging fruit in 2018. They had a great year because Trump was helpful. They also had a great year in 2018 because they picked a lot of candidates who were exactly right for the districts that they ran out. They were good local and regional and political and ideological fits for the districts they ran. They weren't all perfect, you know, they weren't all AOC, Ilhan Omar, perfect progressive A-plus scorecard types, but they were right for their districts. Now, some of those got knocked out with, by not responding promptly this year to some dumb, stupid lies like defund the police. You know, that, and I've talked to a number of Democrats who told me very directly like, yeah, that wasn't killing us. Once that got in the dialogue, it started knocking their numbers down.

So they've got to focus on great candidates. They've got to focus on quicker and more agile messaging and response to the kind of adjutprot bullshit that's going to come at them. Because believe me, the 22 cycle is already shaping up very much in the minds of the Republican establishment, of the Republican consultant. establishment to be about socialism, also socialism, as well as socialism and socialism, and also why has Joe Biden failed so badly on COVID? How do we lose half a million people? Right. What do you think, Tamaskie? Well, picking up on what Rick was saying, so, yeah, there are about 10 districts,

House districts where Democrats lost this time that they had won in 2018. that are kind of really Republican districts. They just had a really good year in 2018, like New Mexico, too, the Zocetil Torres Small. That's really kind of a Republican district. She picked it off by 4,000 or 5,000 votes. It's possible to pick off those 10 districts again, but it has to be a really good year.

And the first midterm is usually, obviously, not a good year for the incumbent party. The average loss 26, 27 seats in the post-war era. So Jamie Harrison's job is going to be to try to undo that history. And, of course, Biden has a lot to do with that, too, and his administration and the House and the Senate and what they managed to accomplish. But, but, you know, I think Harrison's job, aside from, you know, raising gazillions of dollars, which is always the DNC chair's first job, is spreading that around and getting it into maybe not all 50 states, maybe not quite the Howard Dean strategy. because, like, you don't really need much of an democratic infrastructure. It saddens me to say in my home state of West Virginia, which, you know, is not going to send a Democrat to the House of Representatives.

And where, incidentally. I was shocked by that news, Mike. As I call it the Northwest Frontier Province of Pakistan. Can I get you know, the Howard Deed strategy seemed to work really well? Why do we think this shouldn't be pursued? Oh, I think it should, but it should be like a 35 state strategy. You know, I mean, I think you should throw some money even at the West Virginia's and the Idaho's. Or Mississippi.

Yeah, just, you know, Mississippi for sure. You can win some local races in Mississippi and state legislative races and so forth. One other thing I would encourage them to do is to drill down a little bit. Yeah. Look, everybody who is a college fraternity or student body president becomes a DA, becomes, you know, ambitious, wants to be in the U.S. Senate the next day. The Democrats could do a really valuable thing in some of these suburban areas where the Republican brand right now is poisonous. By electing a bunch of county commissioners and sheriffs and dog catchers,

and those people form a food chain that builds up. up and gives you candidates and gives you a field to run from in the future. Instead of hoping, you know, there's been a lot of stunt casting in the Democratic Party the last few years where they thought X or Y is the is the stunt candidate that'll appeal to this or that. Some of this is just nuts and bolts, grassroots, hard work, you know, go out, do the organizing, do the, do the shitty campaign stuff. Once we can knock on doors again, go knock on doors again. Yeah.

Voter registration. Yeah. Guys, but I do think, I do think there's, they've got a lot of hope in the suburbs right now. If I was doing a strategy, I would call it the 50 county strategy and pick out 50 suburban counties around the country and watch where this wing has happened. Look, that's how we were successful in Lincoln Project. We went, we picked out suburban counties and we ID the voters there and just scoched a few thousand here and a few thousand there. But I also think the Senate map for 2022 is really good for Democrats. It is. It's much better for Democrats.

It's going to. But they need to find people who are popular in those areas and not those people who've lost congressional races. Yeah. It's too bad. It's his turn stuff. You can't do that anymore. You've got to pick winners. Guys, can I interrupt for one second?

I just wanted to let you know. I've been sent a poll from the largest Q&on telegram channel. The results are this. 20% believe Biden will be arrested before he can be sworn in or during his swearing-in. Makes sense. 6% believes Biden will admit to the world on stage he cheated cannot be potus. Riots will begin. Yes.

19% believe something happens that will delay the swearing-in ceremony. Riots will begin. 34% believe Biden has sworn in his potis. The military and Trump have a plan coming in the near future. Oh, that means. Yeah, right. And 21% believe nothing happens. Biden is Potus.

What about... 36,000 QAn honors voted in that poll. Wow. Hilarious and also terrifying. Terrifying. And the rest thing that ended up shooting himself. Do we think there's a...

I mean, the riot stuff is a little scary. No, I got to tell you, But this weekend, I think the fact that the FBI swiftly started arresting these assholes who broke in the Capitol and wanted to kill Nancy Pelosi and hang Mike Pence and who killed a cop. The fact, the FBI sort of rolling them up. And I mean, they move with some dispatch folks. A hundred plus people arrested within 36 hours of this thing. That's the stuff, right? I think the fact that this weekend, the alleged gigantic protests around the country,

and Washington were deterred. And you broke the back of some of that immediate idea of, you know, we're going to, we're going to seize the capital, the airfield, the radio station, and like a, you know, coup in Sierra Leone in 1964. So. Yeah, I want to go back real fast to what we were talking about before. And I think because I think this is an important point. And Rick was kind of making it. But like at this point, I think, you know, organizing Trump's ideology in Senate races to a large. extent. I think Warnoff's, Warnock's victory proves that more than anything.

Ossoff's too. I mean, you know, the Democratic Party of 12, 15 years ago would have sought, and indeed sought, you know, like Sam Nunn's literal daughter, you know, to try and to try and hold that seat. And what this year proved is that, you know, you can nominate, even in Georgia, fairly liberal people. Right. And, you know, if you just organize, out-organize the other side, you can eke out a narrow victory. And so, you know, organizing Trump's ideology now in a country with so few swing voters and so on. But I also think that they were charismatic candidates. I mean, Warnock more than Asoff.

Not Aung-A-Saw. God bless it. But the pushback on. I don't say A-Sop. Ossop did up his game a couple times. He had a couple of, like, for a guy who was consistently batting like 200. Yeah. At the end of this thing, he came out and just hammered a few of these, like, moments with the press.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. He threw a couple of punches. Against Purdue that were just like, you know, Grand Slam home run stuff. It's great. But I do. But Warnock was the kind of candidate you need to run in Georgia. I agree.

I mean, I always wondered about North Carolina. I mean, you know, you know, I know she lost the primary fair and square, but I thought that African-American woman who was in the state Senate might have made a better candidate than Cal Cunningham. And I guess given what came of Calcutty. Something I'd be curious though for you guys to wait at it, but though, while we could argue that Assoff may not be the most charismatic person, I thought he put a very good template of how to debate a problematic Republican.

I thought his debate performance was amazing. Yeah, no, that's what I said. For a long time, he just didn't quite have the mojo. And that debate and three or four of his press hits, I mean, I seriously had, I saved one of them to put in our in our prep file to show candidates like, this is how you do not take the shit. Yeah.

This is how you don't take a shit question with a shit predicate from a shit, you know, opposition candidate. You go at them, you go right up in their shit, and you, and you pound them in the nose. And he was a, he,

he, look, voters always want to see some fight in the dog, as we say down south. And he had fight. Now, Warnock also did something that was a bridge for the Democrats in a way that is a different coalition than they're used to. It's African-American women, which is a core constituency of their turnout model everywhere,

and rightly so. They're the most engaged, energized part of the Democratic base, okay? But they also bridged over to educated white suburban voters in suburbs that were formerly Republican. They're not Republican anymore because the Republican part. party itself has hived off. So the Democrats have a window of opportunity to convince those voters to stay with them. They may not stay with them. If you had rational candidates on the Republican side running, I know it's a hypothetical. But they're dating. They're not married, is what I'm saying. But I also think, I mean, there were certain Senate losses that seemed sort of beyond explanation like Sarah Gideon. Yes. Well, that's the last state where they split tickets, you know. Yeah. Every poll, and I mean every single private poll that I saw in the last month in Maine, and I went back through my notes, I got seven different polling briefings on Maine in October and the first week of November.

Sarah Gideon was ahead by between four and 11 points in those polls, average 6.4% ahead. The morning of the election, Susan Collins pollsters walked into their morning Zoom and said, we're sorry. We couldn't get you over the line. We're going to lose by seven points tonight. So what happened? We apologize. This is the greatest, weirdest mystery. It is an outlier in every single pollster's numbers this year. Joni Ernst was the same, right? Not quite. Joni Ernst was always a closer equation. And Iowa is a more predictable swingy state. Maine should have, I mean, it just, there was a lot to it. And it's a mystery that I haven't had the time and bandwidth to get the, to get our math nerds,

like strap them to the wall and beat them until they explain it to me. But there's got to be a solution to this polling problem, but I don't know what it is in Maine. It was a baffling, baffling. Wasn't it that sportscaster? Seriously? Wasn't that a big deal? Didn't that move most? It had something to do with it, but I mean, it could we explain with the sports cast?

Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead, Tamasky. You know, I can't remember the guy's name, but he's a revered television sports anchor in the state who is retired now, but, you know, was on everybody's TV for 30 years telling them about sports. And, you know, just one of these trusted figures, avuncular figures, who came out with this folksy, nice endorsement of Collins that didn't seem very political.

and just really kind of worked. Might have. Might have been, but I don't know how much juice was behind that, but. We need to move on. Jesse tells me we need to move. I'm getting a text from Jesse saying we need to move on, which means we need to move on, you guys. Yeah.

When we do the pod, there are times where Jesse's like, no, enough. That's enough. You talk too wrong. Because he's like, please stop talking about this. Please. Okay, we have a great question for member Andrew Baines, which is where does President Biden need to diverge most from President Obama? Ooh. Oh, wow.

Tamasky should go first. I like that you keep up with the hard question on Tamaskin. No, it's fine. As long as I don't know. I'll speak for the broad liberal left and say that, you know, he needs to be more aggressive economically. He needs to be more, more, you know, pro-working class economically and less Wall Streety and all that kind of thing, you know. And he doesn't have, you know, he's put together a very different team that Obama put together. You know, he doesn't have a big Wall Street presence.

And his, you know, his Wall Street person is Janet Yellen, who basically made all but the really left he left really happy that she was his choice. And if you look at his counsel on economic advisors and national economic. Council and Trade Representative and other choices. It indicates somebody who has learned the internal Democratic Party lessons of the last few years, which is that the Center of Gravity and the Party has moved left on economic questions in the sense that, you know, the Democratic Party is determined to do something about income inequality and concentration of wealth and and those kinds of issues. So, you know, that to me is the big thing.

is the biggest change that he needs to make. I think there's other areas. I mean, he needs to have some continuity, too, but like, but that's the main thing, and I think that's the main signal that he's sent. Let me say this. And I have had a growing sense in the last 10 years, and I've written about this a bit, all the free market stuff that my party used to say they believed it was all horseshit. because the money to be made, and I'm guilty of it, is advocating on behalf of major corporations and

industries to get favorable regulatory and tax treatment from the government. A lot of these companies, they're not successful because they've been entrepreneurial or innovative or anything else. They're successful because they hired their best lobbyists and got the regulatory structures designed to protect their company, to protect their equities, their interests. Why do you think Facebook wants to be regulated? They want to be regulated in Washington so that they can set the terms and keep all the other competition out so that only a company at their scale can succeed.

But I think if Biden goes and attacks big, he's going to have a pathway that isn't just better economically for the country, but also good politically for him and better for sort the nation itself. Look, we need to go after the fact that there are only basically four big banking concerns in the country now. There are only three or four big health insurance companies in the country now. The tech industry has one search company to speak of, one social media platform of scale to speak up. But from insurance to agriculture to tech, to everything else, there's been a gigantic concentration of equity. in a few small firms, you know, in the Teddy Roosevelt trust-busting tradition, this is something

they should be looking at. They should be looking at how has competition been stifled and cut down? Why are wages so stagnant among everybody else except the very, very top of the scale? Because look, I'm a free market guy, but what we have right now are not free markets. What we have right now is a very rigged table that does not have any free market principles. It just wears a dress and says it's a free market. So crony capitalism. It's crony capitalism. And monopoly

capitalism. I mean, Adam Smith was an anti-monopoulist. Adam Smith attacked the British East India company and wanted it broken up. That's a good line that Democrats could use, actually. And incidentally, I'm interested in this, Rick, and I'm sure you've noticed this too. One key appointment Biden has not made yet

that I've had my eye on from day one. He hasn't named his antitrust person. yet at the Justice Department. And I'm really curious about why that is and who that's going to be. Right. I'm curious about it, too. I think that's going to be a hard, that's going to be a hard sell. And a lot of Republicans are going to come out against it, but it's definitely necessary.

You know, it'll be curious to see how Mitch McConnell deals with that, too. Well, and I think, I think, you know, look, there's a degree to which the coming months are going to be devoted to COVID. okay. They're going to be focused on COVID and rightly so. Because if Joe Biden doesn't get COVID under control, all bets are off. Okay. If we have another half a million people die on top of the 400,000 that are dead now, all bets are off. Yeah. But if he gets COVID under control and shows that we can have a competent, sane, decent government that can do shit, like get people an injection, he's got a chance to go and tackle these bigger questions. It is. is important not to try to boil the ocean in my mind for the administration. They need to pick a few good fights to win. COVID is when they really got to win. And on the economic front, they can wedge some of these reform questions into economic recovery based around COVID.

But it needs to be stuff that's substantive and not just, you know, catchphrasey. It needs to be stuff that's real and not just, you know, you know, 15 talking points on a sheet. paper. But do you think Mitch McConnell, I mean, he's such an obstructionist. Do you think there's a world in which, I mean, remember, it's a 50-50 Senate. It's not a 51-49 Senate. It is. Go ahead. Go ahead. Twelve years ago tonight, 12 years ago tonight at the Capitol Grill on Pennsylvania Avenue, according to reporting that, to my knowledge, has never been refuted, about two dozen Republicans gathered. Paul Ryan, Boehner, McConnell.

I think was there, but some Senate leaders and some insiders like Grover. And they vowed that they were basically going to obstruct everything that Obama did. I wonder if there's such a meeting, albeit virtually, of a similar group of 20 or 24 Republicans tonight. Probably a good chance. Look, McConnell has decided, and his advisors have decided, that two things are scaring the shit out of them right now. Now, the 22 map is not a great map for them. The second thing is that their donations of the corporate level are being choked out with a very deliberate plan, a very deliberate strategy.

It's not the Democrats Party doing it. It's assholes like me doing it. But their corporate donations are being choked out right now. They're getting their ass hint at them. He knows it. So he's going to make some performative moves on the front end to say, Trump was bad. He's probably going to be he may now. Like yesterday.

Yeah, right, exactly. But I look at that purely as performance art. I don't think that's a sincere belief. I think he's like, fuck it. I got to do this. Will corporate dollars, how do you keep corporate dollars from coming back to him? You shame them? Because, you know, look, he will be there.

And he's already, he's already letting Josh Hawley, seditionist, traitor, encourager of mobs. High five, Josh. he's already letting Josh Holly play fuck around with Biden's appointees and nominees. He's already letting him do that. And once again, just to make this point for the 500th time, if Mitch McConnell wants Josh Holly to show up wearing a SpongeBob outfit to the floor, he will make that happen. Mitch McConnell has total control over his caucus. They will do whatever he tells them.

There is no resistance. there's no rebellion. They bark like dogs when he tells them to. He is letting Josh Hawley play this game and letting Ted Cruz play their game because they're going to they're going to card all these nominees and say, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, they're not going to let them get on the floor. They're going to push and push and push. They're trying to train wreck the Biden administration already. They're going to try to do it by with a, they're going to try to play the refs in D.C. at the media class and say, well, you know, Mitch McConnell gave a passionate speech about how bad Trump was about the six. But pay no attention to the fact that we're not letting you name a CDC chair or name a guy for HHS or whatever.

There's going to be a lot of a lot of that DC fuckery of which McConnell is the master. So can Biden go around that? Well, let me actually ask a follow-up question on that because we have a popular question in the chat from member Jonathan Gleinzer, which is right after McConnell's speech on the floor yesterday, have you changed your opinion on whether he, support an impeachment or not? Look, the fact that he's doing, the fact that he's doing an impeachment post hoc, part of that strategy

is that there's some legal question about it, some constitutional question about it. And, you know, if he meant it, they would have done it. Now, there is an argument that McConnell's caucus would have been less amenable to convicting Trump while he was still in office.

Well, guess what? You got an hour and a half, guys. You're going to be okay. So I think he's leaning slightly more toward it. I think that is only because the 22 map is scaring him a little bit. The 22 map is not great. Unless he finds some ways to scooch back those suburban Republicans that we were talking about earlier, it's going to be tough. I think he can, I think he probably feels that he can negotiate that position without having to get to 67 votes. I think he can free some people, Portman and Johnson, if Johnson wants to. I don't know if that's a different question. But some of those ones who are up in 22, he can release them to vote to convict.

And he himself might even vote to convict and might encourage about seven or eight Republicans to do so so that they look reasonable. Yeah, and and what is that doing now? Romney, Portman, Murkowski are all, they're already basically out on the question. So there's three in the bag right there. But the difficulties they're going to have, I think, at some point, they're going to start feeling a weird wedge problem. They're going to be pushed on the left side by the demands of a better, having better positioning in the Senate map for 22. On the other side, they're going to be told, you've got to keep the Trump voters. You've got to keep the Trump voters. The Trump voters, the base, the base, the base. Well, that base doesn't like Republicans, and I've told that Republicans is for four goddamn years now. The base hates you too. No matter how conservative you are, the minute you cross Donald Trump or don't do what Trump wants, the base hates you.

So take, if you will, the story of MicroRubio, who did everything he could to try to trim it up the middle with Trump, try to pretend, oh, to normalize, so I could work with the White House on policy questions, pay no attention to the lunacy. Well, now Ivanka's going to move to Florida and primary the guy. How long do you think it's going to be before Donald Trump goes out on makes a speech says, little Marco was never with me.

You can't trust Little Marco. And the Republican Party, which is, and the state Republican parties, by the way, there's not a single state where the governor is a Republican who controls the Republican party anymore. The Republican parties are controlled by the Trumpers. Right. Almost entirely. Joe Gruders runs the Republican Party of Florida.

He is so far up in Trump's ass. I'm surprised his head is impressing Trump's. diaphragm. I mean, he is just like, he's the worst of the worst of the Trumpers. Terrifying anatomical. Zoom doesn't have a beep button, unfortunately. I don't understand. So just, so they'll vote to convict him maybe and what will happen? Nothing. I predict the actual outcome will be they'll pretend they're going to convict him.

they'll say, we don't have the votes, and they pass a central resolution that says, you were very naughty, Donald, don't do that again. But will they bar him from ever running again? Fuck, no, no, no, no, they're chicken shits. No, there's too much risk in doing that in the ways Rick was just describing. They alienate their base terribly if they do that. They themselves get hammered in 22 if they do that. But they can't, but so he could run again?

Sure. Yeah. That seems bad. Listen, I think the primary in 2024, if Trump, I don't think Trump seriously wants to run again. I think he wants to rip off another couple hundred million dollars from people, you know, sending the last five bucks from their disability check. But he will stay in the race. He will pretend. He will, you know, on his death bet, he could be in a, he could be in a breathing machine.

but still say he was going to run. And they will keep pretending that. So it's going to hold and hold and hold and keep back all the people that want to run. Ted Cruz and Josh Holly and Marco and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, all these idiots. But Marco really could lose in two years. So Marco might run for president because he's going to lose the Senate if Avaka gets in a race. That will decide whether Marco runs for president. Yeah.

Right. So I think one of the big things that's pressing today is obviously Joe Biden has what a lot of people are saying is the most important inaugural speech since Lincoln. Anything you guys think he should do that is not the common knowledge. Sorry with the throw hard. No, no. Jesse, it's actually a great, very thoughtful question. It is. And I think that the main thing he has to do, look, Any president who stands on that west front of the Capitol has a duty to history. He must acknowledge what has happened. He must face it. We can't pretend we can't shut the door and everything's good now. We're going to move on.

And I think he will. But I think it's so important that he offers an affirmative call not just to unity, or not just to, you know, friendship, but to duty and to country and to patriotism that is depoliticized and departisanized. This is, and he may actually be the most uniquely positioned person to have, to do that. But he needs to face, I mean, we need to talk about what just happened. You can't have a, you can't have a car crash like this and not talk about it and face it. And you can't, and I also, you know, there's going to be a temptation, and I hope the speech is not too much of, I reach out my hand to the people who just tried to murder my former colleagues.

I think he needs to be, there needs to be some sternness to it, too. That's my feeling. Yeah, I think the exact same thing, that, you know, he needs to, I hope he looked at Lincoln's not famous second inaugural address, but first inaugural address. which he was giving, you know, after several states had seceded and when the country was on a path to war. You know, there needs to be an acknowledgement of the precarious place that we're in. While simultaneously talking about unity and talking about the need to unify and so on, he can do both of these things at the same time. But yeah, there needs to be, he needs to explain to the American people what a perilous place we're in right now and, you know, how we can come back from it. And he needs to put that in grand sort of historical and civic terms and not, you know, not just capital P political terms. And I also think he has to, I mean, the Democratic base, and I think the world needs accountability, too.

So there has to be a question of like, we're not going to, because I think a lot of people think he's just going to give Republicans a pass, which is what Republicans are hoping. And I hope that you won't do that and he'll say, you know, if you've committed crimes, you have to be held responsible even if you really are mad. One of the things, one of the things symbolically that I just saw pop up, Biden and Harris are going to have officer Eugene Goodman. Oh, that's good. Escort them up the steps. Oh, wow. Wow, is that a signal? Wow.

Is that a clear signal? I mean, they're not letting this go, and they shouldn't let it go. Armed insurgents attacked our capital at the behest of Donald Trump. But I also think... Six members of the Senate encourage that attack. Right. Fuck you. And 130 members of the Congress.

Yeah. I mean, go on. Do they not get some cover to from, you know, like the new queen of crazy in the long list of Republicans who've gone really mad. Marjorie Taylor Greed is already calling for Biden's impeachment over fictitious things. And I think this gives a lot of cover for them to say, we don't have to call for unity when you're not taking care of the queen of crazy over here and saying, what the fuck, lady? You know, who knows what to say about her? Those people, those people, by the way, in 2022, there will. be more Q&ON candidates running for office rather than fewer. There will be more lunatics running

for office rather than fewer. That that shit is going to eat the Republican Party alive from the inside for a long time. But what about Lauren Boer or whatever? Boebert. And Marjorie Taylor Green. I mean, it seems like there's a lot of evidence to point that Lauren was actually giving tours the day before the... So, I mean, how does that... that stand? That's criming. I mean, how does she get to stay in Congress after that? Well, look, pending an investigation she does. I think she should be investigated. I frankly think that if she did that, and we find out that there's any sort of active conspiracy around it, she should be expelled. But I believe that Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz should be expelled. I believe

that their actions were proximate. Ted Cruz's speech the day before. screaming that we're not going to take it. We're going to storm the battlements. And Josh Hardy out signaling his troops and on the floor that morning, minutes before the attack, continuing to feed their shit with this crazy conspiracy theory about a stolen election. Now, look, are they going to be expelled? No.

As a member told me in the Senate, though, secret vote, it'll be 99 to 1 to expel. Certainly, Cruz. Yeah. Cruz, it would have been before this. But I mean, Holly, that, he is really scary and dangerous, and there's not going to be any accountability there? Look, I seriously doubt you will see any real accountability for Josh Hawley at all. Now, he is taking a beating everywhere. You know, and we're going to chase Josh Hawley like wild dogs for a while, because he is a bad dude.

and he is one of the people that I've talked about for a long time, who is going to try to take Trumpism and nationalist populism and authoritarianism 2.0 and run it through the car wash and slap on a better suit and wave his Ivy League credentials around and say, oh, no, I'm not that kind of fascist. I'm the clean-cut kind of fascist. And run for president. I just happened to be reading yesterday about the history of expulsions

of senators. Ooh. Civil War, seven. Yeah, a lot of them in the Civil War, obviously. You know, they committed treason against the United States. More recently, there have been a lot of proceedings in the course of the 20th century, about a dozen maybe. Most of them were not expelled, but some resigned on the way to what appeared to be expulsion.

Recently, the two most recent ones, Bob Packwood in the 90s, And that was just over sexual misconduct and, you know, abuse of power, I suppose you would say. Yeah. And then resigned before the Senate vote. And then more recently of Nevada, John Ensign, Republican. And that was, that way, he had an extra marital affair and there were some financial improprieties, as I recall. There was some money shenanigans. Yeah, yeah.

But it wasn't anything like what Josh Hawley did, for God's sakes. And Ted Christy had, and he resigned before what appeared to be, if I'm remembering correctly, a vote that seemed likely to expel him. So, you know, I mean, if those two guys had to go, I mean, come on. I knew Bob Packwood a little. And while, you know, while it may have been a creeper and a Me Too guy, the resignation was ultimately in part because he recognized the damage he was doing to the institution. Yeah. Benson. Also, again, not a perfect human being, but a sense of honor let him say, do I want to drag this thing out and humiliate everyone?

including the body. See, here's the difference, though. Yeah, I don't think. Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley are post-2010 candidates

where they believe that anything that would have been shameful before is now a badge of pride that owns the lives. Right. And owning the libs is all that matters to them. And owning the lips takes on many flavors. It's but de media or

big tech, you know, all these things, these excuses they make. they look at this as an opportunity to raise money. They look at this as an opportunity to build their cred with the crazy. Because that's their base now. Yeah.

Well, and we probably need to talk about Fox News' decision. The purge of sane people? Right. Well, they just- Right. They've gone full O-N. And that is pretty interesting and Newsmax. And that's pretty scary.

Yeah. Well, I have a suggestion since our most popular request is for a fuck that guy. And maybe we can lead into this by doing a fuck that guy about Fox News and the way they're turning with the money, honey. Who is the worst? I mean, I have to say that I would think Lachlan and Rupert Murdoch are the worst sort of fuck that guys of Fox News because they are the bosses. But Tucker Carlson is a close second, I think. Look, I think Tucker is the most dangerous one at Fox for two reasons. One, he's a nihilist.

He doesn't believe any of this shit. Everyone who's known Tucker for years and years and years knows he doesn't, and this is all bullshit. This is performative hoax stuff. This guy doesn't believe in shit. But he fakes it like the best of him. Yeah. And he is going to clearly try to leverage this into a presidential campaign or something

at some point. And even though the vast majority of his advertisers have long ago fled the fish-tick hour of thinly veiled racism and not so thinly veiled racism. White power. White power out. Right. Right. The Tucker McNair Swanson fish stick lad, white power hour hour. Those ideas, you know, the idea that he's the smart one is true. But Hannity is a buffoon. He's a, he's a, he's a bellower. He reads a teleprompter. He's, you know, facing the crowd kind of guy. He's an idiot. But what's happening now at Fox,

they replaced their 7 p.m. news hour with another opinion show now with the money, honey. Yeah. Okay? So that's going to be less sane. I mean, what's next? Like Lou Dobbs gets three hours during the day. It's crazy.

But they're going to keep up, they're going to keep up this show as long as their demographics hold up, which is not going to be forever. And as long as, as long as Time Warner and Comcast and other networks, pay them 20 bucks ahead for a carriage fee. That's how tough folks need to understand. Boycotting Fox advertisers doesn't do a goddamn thing. I mean, it's fine.

It's fine. It hurts a little bit. But Fox News advertisers are not where their revenue comes from. The revenue comes from cable provider carriage fees. So right now, Comcast is subsidizing the proper. propaganda network of the insurgents. Right. Time Warner is subsidizing the propaganda network of the insurgents.

Disney is subsidizing the propaganda network of the insurgents. Right. That's where to go. But, yeah, I mean, just as there are going to be more Q and on candidates in upcoming House elections, there's just no immediate end to this in the near future. As long as there's, you know, OANN pops up and news. Max pops up, and if they go away, something else will pop up. And it'll be even crazier. Sure. I don't know what we do about this over the next years. What is the regulatory play?

I mean, I know we're not talking about that because it's scary, but is there a world in which Congress could regulate? I mean, even in Europe, they have more of a libel laws that are somewhat better at controlling the fox. Yeah, the problem is all these things are emergent now in the screaming space. And it's really tough. It's really tough to make a First Amendment case against these guys being able to say what they want to say. I think what you have to do is go after the money. Okay. Look, for years and years and years and years and years and years and years and years, people screamed, we've got to get the money out of politics. Okay. So they passed McCain-Feingold, which put more money into politics. So, you know,

So we reverse engineered this problem in the last couple days, the last couple of weeks now, with these Republican members of the treason caucus. And we're going at like corporate board members. So it's okay, Marriott. You know, reach out to all the corporate board members to say, you're supporting a bunch of people who want to overturn the free and fair election and who want to delegitimate tens of millions of African American votes. How do you feel about that? You're giving money to them. America should know, right? And they all almost universe they've said, no.

and they've stopped giving. Market forces like that work. Market forces like that are highly effective at changing political behavior. Regulatory structures they work to a limit, but they're not politics is downstream

of culture and regulation is downstream of politics. Change the cultural thing at the top and all those things ramify out and the problem gets easier, at least. to manage. I think that's a great point.

I do have to say we're getting, speaking of people rising up at Agree, people want the fuck that guy. Oh yeah, everyone has to be there, fuck that guy. Kamaski, you go first, who's your fuck that guy. It's just anybody of anybody who's on my mind? Anybody you choose. He's really hate.

Okay, Mike Lindell, isn't that his name? Oh, yes, yes, yes. The my fascist pillow guy. Yeah, and you know who else? Cheryl Atkinson. because, you know, after Bedbeth and Beyonder, whoever it was, quit carry his shit.

Cheryl Atkinson tweeted that this is just like Nazi Germany. Fuck you too. That's a good one. Well done. That's a good one. Rick, who's your fuck that guy? Guys, there's only one fuck that guy possible today. My fuck that guy is Donald John Trump,

45th and soon to be last of his line ever to hold that office, president of the United States. Donald Trump was the worst, most corrupt, most evil, most egregious, most cruel, most divisive president, most repugnant human being to ever sit in that office. And I'm including Andrew Johnson. Okay. This is not a man who deserves any respect, title, dignity at all. He deserves to be hounded for the rest of his life. He has cost the lives of 400,000 Americans. He has done untold damage to our reputation. in the world. He has divided us along racial and class and educational lines and country like no one else could have. I will never cease in my position that the ultimate all-time reigning champion, his jersey is going to be up so far in the rafters you can't see it will be Donald Trump. So fuck that guy. And mine is the Trump kids who all spend their father's speech weeping,

weeping because they didn't get pardons. They know the gravy train has hit a wall. I don't know, but they spent the... Ivanka is an ugly crier. I have yet to see the video of Ivanka. I saw the lads weeping silently. And Kimberly Gelfoyle has like taped on several layers of mascara running in her way. Well, I noticed the picture of Don Jr., he had his head in a certain position where you could really see even with the beard the Hapsburg chin of the Trump line.

I mean, I will say the one thing that has been interesting is there are no good Trumps, right? We had always sort of secretly held out this hope that Tiffany, who had gotten into Georgetown Law School, would be the good Trump. And she turned out to just be as awful as the rest of them. Guys, I just want you to know in two years when he's emancipated, Baron will be a leader in Antifa. Is that where he was today? He was at the Antifa meeting. He will go by the name Abu Donald.

On that note, I see it's 11 a.m. That was a great joke to have done. I would be remiss to not express how many of these comments were gratitude for you all bringing them laughs. and keeping them sane. And it seems the audience really wants that passed on to you guys. And I will also express my gratitude that this has been one of the only nice things through a horrible time, but that you all did such a great job with this podcast throughout the season. We look forward to continuing it.

Thank you, Timasky, for joining us. Thanks, Michael. Thanks, Jesse. And thank all of you for your attention to the podcast and your support. and for tolerating the various sounds of... And our terrible ad reads. Thank you for tolerating her terrible ad reads. Molly, you're crushing it.

All right. Apparently my pillow wants to sponsor us now. Just to Midian or big fans. Thanks so much to see it. Everybody. Everybody, have a great day. We've got a new president coming up in one hour and one minute from right now. On that note, we'll wrap up this episode of the new abnormal from The Daily Beast.

In future episodes, we'll be talking with smart folks from The Daily Beast and beyond from media, culture, politics, and science. Who will help us understand what's happening to our country and the world. We hope you'll subscribe to us on your favorite podcast app and share the show on social media. We're just getting started and don't want you to miss an episode. If you'd like to follow us on Twitter, I'm Molly John. Fast and he's the Rick Wilson. Thanks so much for listening and we'll see you again on the next episode. Want more great listens?

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