The Daily Beast Podcast - ‘We Won. And I Feel Like Shit’

Episode Date: November 4, 2020

James Carville, like the rest of us, is having some mixed emotions at the moment. After getting all kinds of polling data saying the Democrats were clean up, the truth is … well, kind of the opposite happened. The gap between expectations and reality was so big, even Joe Biden apparently being on the precipice of taking the White House seems just a little unsatisfying. “Look, this is the biggest election in my lifetime, before my lifetime. And I wake up in the morning, we won the popular vote and we're going to win the electoral college. And I feel like fucking shit,” Carville tells Molly Jong-Fast and Rick Wilson on the post-election edition of The New Abnormal. “Yes, we will have competent cabinet secretaries. And yes, we will have competent ambassadors. And the trains will run on time. And that's about it, right? That's something. That's a lot more than we've got now. But it's not anything close to what we all were hopeful for.” Buck up, Rick tells Carville (and the rest of us). “Donald Trump is about to ride into the sunset—and by sunset, I mean prison—in the immediate future. People need to be of good cheer. This is a stunning victory,” Rick says, anticipating that the absentee votes in places like Pennsylvania and Michigan will break Biden’s way. “It says something about our political pessimism in the era of Trump that everyone's depressed about this outcome. Get the fuck outta here. We just beat Donald fucking Trump.” Maybe so, Molly replies. But she’s still pissed—like, beyond pissed—at the pollsters who gave so many false hope. “Fuck those fuckers,” she says, before a whole bunch of stuff we had to bleep out. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi folks, it's Rick Wilson, and welcome to The Daily Beast's The New Abnormal. Hi, I'm Molly Jongfast, a left-wing pundit, and editor-at-large at the Daily Beast. I'm also an editor at The Daily Beast, a former Republican political strategist, best-selling author, and full-time troublemaker. We're here to have fun, sharp conversations with some of the smartest people in media, politics, business, and science that help make what's happening in the country and the world clearer. I'll try to keep Rick to the minimum number of F-bombs and try to keep our kids, pets, and other wildlife sounds from invading our respective bunkers.

Rick Wilson. Good morning, Molly, John Fath. Good morning in your undisclosed location. Where are you? Don't even tell us. What's going on? I'm in Park City, Utah. By now, it doesn't matter if people know because it's been leaked, but it's very

beautiful here, and it's a cool, crisp, clear morning with which to welcome the the eminent announcement of President-elect Joseph Robinette Biden. and Donald Trump being fucked into the annals of history as the low-life scumbag, one-term shitbird that he is. Talk to us about the Senate. What the fuck are we going to do here? We're going to go win the Georgia race against Kelly Law first. What we're going to do here?

You know, Mitch McConnell dumped $220 million of lobbyist money into these races. There were still some races out there that got close, that were in the ballpark. But I'm going to say this with all love and affection, candidates, quality, matters. Great candidates matter. Some places, even a great candidate can't get up over the hump. I mean, look, we worked very hard to help Jamie Harrison. Very, very hard. He was a great candidate who raised a lot of money. He was a great candidate. What about Cal Cunningham? Well, I mean, maybe not having an affair while you're having a campaign is a smart idea. I think that, I think that was probably, and having it leak. I think that was, that's one of those externalities. He would have had that race in the bag. Right.

but he couldn't keep his dick in the bag. And what about Saraginian? There's still 30% of the vote out in Maine. We'll see where that goes. And look, you've got to also remember, outside of Portland, Maine is Alabama with a different accent. Yeah. And I will tell you, here we go, I will tell you, outside of Portland, things like gun control are issues by which they say, you're not from around here. All right.

I mean, guys, the Senate is a letdown. I get it. Part of what happened with the Senate was that it was tightly constrained in some ways by the presidential campaign sucking up all the oxygen. Right. And in a lot of these states, it became a proxy fight. And in some of the places that Democrats invested a lot of money for good and heartfelt reasons, they poured $10 or $12 million into M.J. Hager in the end, in a race, that as much as John Cornyn is like watching a bowl of vanilla ice cream melt. Right. He was still running well ahead of Trump in Texas.

Could Beto have won that seat? You know, it's an interesting counterfactual, and I don't know the answer to that, Molly. Maybe. He certainly has more name ID than MJ Hager did, and he certainly has a fundraising machine that could have gone to work on it. And he's done a lot of work at the grassroots in terms of organizing. So I would say he probably could have. Yeah. But with candidates and candidates wanting to run, you know, unless they want to run,

You can't make them run. Trust me on this way. I have been to this particular painful fucking rodeo too many times. You're the perfect candidate. You have all the money in the world. You can do this. You can do that. You've got a great reputation.

Yeah, but my wife wants to go on vacation next year. I'm not even kidding you when I tell you that is an absolutely true fucking story. I remember a story of you sitting on a certain man's porch and begging him to run. I do. Yes, yes, that did happen. That did happen. You can't make them do it. Right.

Can we put to bed people who run for Congress and then lose and then run for the fucking Senate? Like, can we say if you lose a congressional race, M.J. Hager, John Ossoff, you should not then immediately qualify for a Senate race. Look, winning matters. And there are a lot of people who get a sort of buzz on the, from the media in terms of being a campaign. and a hot property as a national figure, they think, okay, well, yeah, I didn't make the fourth congressional district race, but why not I can scale to a U.S. Senate race. The Senate, right. You know, I was thinking about this a little while ago.

I just, a donor just asked me, what did we do wrong with our Senate recruiting? I said, I'm going to give you a more complete answer later. And then he responded. He goes, what should we be doing for 2022? I said, the Democrats should be recruiting every male military veteran they can find to run for office. And I mean that without any sexist overlay, but in Texas and Kentucky, if MJ Hagar had been Michael Hagar, the military record would have been different in the minds of those voters in Texas who are not, you know, again, not woke, not sophisticated people in a lot of, in that regard.

It is just, there's a degree in the Democratic Party that, you know, we don't, we don't want more white men. But if you're running in West Virginia or Texas or Kentucky or Alabama, go with the white dude. I mean, I mean that with just pure political calculus, nothing else. But if John Ossoff is a white guy and he sucks. But he's not the right white guy. I'm sorry. John Ossoff looks like a guy from the AV club. Right.

You're the guy who looks like he's from the first infantry division. Can we just agree that Democrats fucking owe a big time John McCain's widow? Yes. They owe Cindy McCain, a great debt of gratitude in Arizona. But Mark Kelly also ran a great campaign. And again, what is his main characteristic? Military service, astronaut, Navy pilot, all that thing. All that stuff mattered to those kind of voters that you want to swap over.

As we're going to talk about with Carville a little bit, you know, there's a cultural disconnect in this country. Democrats started to get it and Biden got a lot of it, but he could have had a sweeping victory if the party had been more willing to address some of that sooner. I hear from a lot of Democrats this morning and they're disappointed about the Senate races, but have I mentioned that they won the fucking White House? He's going to have a bigger popular vote victory than Hillary Clinton. And he's going to have, yeah, and he's going to have. Not bigger than Obama 2008.

No. Right. But he's going to have an electoral college lock here shortly where he cannot, where no amount of Trump fuckery is going to undo it. Okay. Donald Trump is about to ride into the fucking sunset and by sunset, I mean prison, in the immediate future. People need to be of good cheer. This is a stunning victory. It says something about our political pessimism in the era of Trump that everyone's depressed about this outcome. Get the fuck out of here. We just beat Donald fucking Trump. It's going to roll up. Look, this may be some misery for the next couple of weeks with lawsuits and back and forth.

And I'm probably going to spend a lot of time on the phone trying to make sure that nobody breaks and gives up. Look, I said from the beginning, this will be a tight race. Yeah. And I said from the beginning, Trump would declare victory when he had not won. And I said from the beginning that it was going to grind out. And there would be a gigantic, Titanic legal battle with this fucking guy. My prophecy has all come to pass. I am Zoltah. I am the mystic future.

Yeah, you don't need sleep. You're good. You just stay up. We've got James Carval, who is, like, the greatest person in the entire world and is going to tell us how to feel. James Carval, tell me how to feel. If you were to said, you're going to have the biggest election in your lifetime. And when you're an old man, and I'll tell you two things even better.

You're going to win the popular vote and you're going to win the electoral college vote. But the deal is you're going to feel like shit. And I mean, that's just where I am now. I think in a country that desperately needs change, I mean, you name whatever it is, we need action. Yes, we will have competent cabinet secretaries. And yes, we'll have competent ambassadors. the White House will, the trains will run on time. And that's about it.

That's something that that's a lot more than we've got now, but it's not anything close to what we all were hopeful for. Yeah. I mean, can we squarely put the blame here on the pollsters? Yeah. Because I feel like they told us last night we were going into a blue tsunami in which Democrats would win Georgia. North Carolina. And I would like to remind everyone that, like, this week, Dave Wasserman and I were, you know, he tweeted, Texas is in play? And I said, is Texas really in play? And he was like, it's been in play for a while. And I was like watching the election returns. And I was like, that doesn't fucking look like in play to me.

Well, no, look, we're no worse than 50-50 in Georgia. Yeah, that's true. So, and I mean, what happened is that these, you know, I suspect that we'll be doing deep dives into everything. But the percentage of non-college whites must have been astronomical. And they were all, you know, modeling to reflect that. And I actually thought incorrectly that they would overshoot. Yeah, me too. You know, just because human nature. You've got to straddle the artillery south that the post of the overshoot. The truth of the matter is they undershot again.

And, you know, at the end of the day, the country is really changing. I mean, it's changing. Right. It's changing. Culturally. and people are just resisting that change. Right? They feel like they're left out.

They're not part of the culture. And somehow another, to a lot of these people, you know, it's just a way to tell people who think, you know, just to fuck off, okay? I don't like your hypnotist. I don't like your diversity. I don't like your culture. You know, there wasn't enough of them.

But, you know, and let's not forget, I mean, we actually won. Right. We've got to keep that in the back of our mind. But it's a victory, but it doesn't, right now, it doesn't seem like one. Yeah. I'm sure when Biden gets inaugurated, you know, I don't know what he's going to be able to do. The other thing is that Kamala Harris is going to have a hard time being a front run in 2024.

The thing that I think is interesting is, so a lot of this polling, people have said, well, there are these shy Trump voters. These are shy Trump voters. But actually, what we're. seeing is like shy, you know, Susan Collins voters. So clearly in the Senate, pollsters were more wrong about the Senate than they were about the presidency. Yeah, I think so. And I've just talked to, I got an update from a guy in Pennsylvania and talked to people all more than wrong. They're very confident Biden is going to win Pennsylvania, but a lot of down ballot, they voted Republican, particularly in the suburbs. And I think there was a divided government, 2% instinct here. Can you talk

about that? Well, there were people who had been Republicans most of their lives, and they couldn't stomach Trump. So they said, okay, I'm going to vote for Trump. I mean, I'm voting against Trump, but I can't go into Democrats. I don't much like them. I've never been one. So a down ballot, and we didn't do as well as we hoped in congressional races at all not a Senate. And I think when we unearth these, somebody state legislative races and stuff, we're going to find that Republicans ran ahead of Trump a little bit in some of these places, particularly. in these kind of suburban places. That's what I think.

I don't have the hard evidence is yet to come in, but that'd be one of the first places I'd look. I mean, it sure seems like that when you look at the Senate races, right? I mean, we were told, right, Teresa Greenfield was going to, that looks like a Pipe Dream or Jamie Harrison.

I'm especially angry about the Senate. I find that in raging. Well, yeah, I guess angry. I mean, I'm profoundly disappointed. I mean, I know the guys. and, you know, like, had friends in a lot of these races. You know, and to somebody like me, it's a, there's a human toll. Yeah.

And we take a Morgan Jackson in North Carolina, you know, David Keith in Alaska. You know, when you lose one of these things, just miserable, you know, Steve Bullock. I mean, what you could, what we got to do is dust off because we're probably going to have two runoffs in Georgia. Yeah. It's difficult, but I mean, it's hard to brush yourself off, you know, but you can, but you You got to get back in the game yesterday. I said, I just can't go another day. I'm so glad this is coming.

I'm fucking fried. I don't know what to do, but you don't have the ability to be fried. You just have to get up and shake it off and go back in. That's what we're going to do because we don't have anything. We're having another choice. Yeah. But I'm no other choice. And God, you're just going to be the gridlock.

And, of course, he's old. It's going to take a lot of skill. He's got a lot of stuff to navigate. I just hope that he can do it. I do think that if you're going to have a divided government, he has a lot of experience with getting along with the Republicans. And he'll get along with them. But it's pretty simple that they're sent there not to give along by it. They're sent there and the people are going to be mad when Trump is going to stir people up to no end. They're going to, you know, they're going to make this thing as ugly as they can.

And what was proven is the Republicans that try to break from Trump, they get punished. and they're not going to be that interested in helping Biden. Yeah. I know you do stuff by, and the courts are not going to be friendly at all to him. No. I mean, he's going to have a federal judiciary that is stacked against him. He's going to have a U.S. Senate that stacked against him. I mean, he's got some really formidable challenges here.

To say the obvious, the virus is not going anywhere. When do you get the excess hospital capacity? And these guys think it's a hoax. He's, you know, he's not going to be able to implement. do anything about a mask mandate. Yeah. I mean, you know, the Michigan militia is not going anywhere. And police are not going to stop shooting people.

Too much interaction. Something goes wrong. I mean, I hope the guy, you know, I think that the people around him, he'll appoint really competent people. Then the party is, you know, the argument is going to be, see, James, we don't know with a corporatist Democrat and you hang out with all these Republicans. You know what happens? The Latinos don't show up.

Our base doesn't show up because. They're just tired of TweetyD and Tweetyly Dump. If we're going to live with that ship forever, the never-Trumpers, Republicans are going to try to, you know, ruin everybody's career. Right. And you people, you know, were disloyal and the lefties are going to, like, come after. And if Kamala Harris is going to have a tough time being the frontrunner. And because of what happened in the House, the House Democratic caucus is going to be more liberal than was before

because we lost a bunch of these suburban seats we picked up, like Joe Kahneman. Huntingham and people like that, Kendra Horn. So, you know, if I told you that I wasn't feeling very good, I wouldn't be like to. Okay? It doesn't do any good to bullshit anybody. Yeah. No, I agree. You know, that's not a winning hand.

You know, what we've got to do, Molly, is, you know, we've got to remind ourselves, this is a work in progress. We thought that this would, you know, that this would be open. And somehow another, you know, we get to take a few days off and, you know, do Zoom calls and be giddy. And that's not the case. I don't want to be annoying here, but it does seem like there's a case for optimism in the movement of Texas. Yeah, but, you know, remember, it moved really hard in 2018, and it kind of moved back a little bit. Yeah. All right?

But it is. I mean, Georgia is a real case. for optimism. And North Carolina. North Carolina, was closer than it was before. The obvious, the big problem, you know, is South Florida. Yeah. What do you think happened there?

I don't know. He only did pretty good in South Florida. She came out of mind with like $30,000 vote margin. And Biden only comes out with $100,000. He had some trouble with the socialism stuff, I think, really dug in with them. Yeah. Look, James is absolutely right. The socialism

attack in South Florida is so deadly and so persistently powerful with 50 plus Cubans that, you know, Trump invested a massive amount of resources into it. And that split off that 100 plus thousand votes in a way that just we couldn't offset it. We spent a lot of money in Seminole trying to rev up Puerto Rican voters and we successfully took a red county and flipped it. But there just weren't enough Puerto Rican votes to offset the Cuban votes in that space. What percent did we get in Seminole, Rick? Because I thought if we won Seminole, we won DeVal.

We did win Duval. We also won Osceola. Right. I mean, we lost the fucking thing in Miami Day. We did. No, no, James, 100%. We just didn't get the numbers off the top we needed in Miami Day. We got 50.7 to 47.9 in Seminole.

I'd have said that's enough to win. Like I said, we were pounding the Puerto Rican message in the Orlando media market the whole time. We got Osceola by good numbers. And orange, of course, we took easily. But we just didn't get the numbers we needed in Miami-Dade. And we thought we'd have a little better numbers than Pinellas, but we just didn't get there either. I mean, we won Pinellas, but it just wasn't enough.

Molly and I were talking and I said, look, this is the biggest election. Shit, my lifetime, before my lifetime. And I wake up in the morning, we won the popular vote, and we're going to win the electoral college, and I feel like fucking shit. You know? I feel like hit. By the question. And we won.

Right. We won. We won. But, you know, it's, I'm talking to all my, my, my, my, my brother in this morning. And it's like, we know we're going to grind this thing out. We're going to get Wisconsin. We're going to get Michigan. We're going to lawyer it out in Pennsylvania.

And we're going to win Pennsylvania. And that'll be that. It'll be a very, a very fine, clean, electoral college win. But it is still like a, it is still like, you feel dirty after having to campaign. It's like wrestling pigs. You don't like being in the mud with you. Yes. It's always like.

wrestling pigs, isn't it? Often an example I use. There's a lot of pig wrestling going on around here. Rick Wilson, how much sleep did you get last night? None. None. Wow. I slept four hours.

I went to bed at 11. I salute you. By way, Rick, my guys tell me that Pennsylvania is more secure than not. Yeah, our folks are telling us that was one of the calls I just was dealing with. the number of mail ballots in the Collar counties around Philadelphia and in Philadelphia proper is way in excess of what we need. Yeah. Somebody.

One reliable person could win by as much as $200,000 votes. Yeah, that's what I'm here. I'm here in a similar range. And I look, and I think the number is coming out of Michigan right now. Yeah, there's a big trench of votes not counted in Wayne County. Right. The upshot is Albert said that Biden's going to win. Yes.

And that's it. If you went not, you bust the number. We're going to go past bust the number, I think. Nevada and Arizona are going to be, they'll finally finish counting. Ralston says Nevada's done. Yeah, yeah. And if Ralston says it, that to me, and Nevada is the voice of God. Right, right. There's a bunch of votes in Milwaukee, some purple and blue areas around Green Bay that are going to come in.

LaCross has another like probably six, seven thousand blue votes that are going to come in. I'm looking forward to to revisiting the people that were in my Twitter feed last night saying Trump 2020 bitch. So if we have so what can you tell us something to be happy about with the Senate? Because it looks like the Senate

is where the fuckery really went down last night. We forced Mitch McConnell to spend 200 million dollars and we're still going to go into Georgia because Kelly Loughler is a vulnerable and broken person. Did she win?

She is a runoff. Yeah, but I mean she won the runoff? She beat Doug Collins. Yeah. So that's great because she's much more, she's easier to defeat than Doug Collins, right? She's more of a Roy Moore. For sure. I mean, look, they're both crazy. I can take either one of them. Right. But Laughler, forget it. Yeah, Laughler is cuckoo. So there are still some votes, I'm told in Fulton, DeKalb, and Cobb. Are those done? No, not at all.

In fact, I've talked to this guy. He is like the best Democratic quant in Georgia. Right. He actually thinks, you know, now you've got to be careful because, you know, it works so hard in this. He actually thinks that Biden could carry Georgia. We'll have a count at noon, a pretty good count by the end of it. That's what I'm hearing is.

And one of the lawyer things I was just communicating with somebody on was, we're watching out for any fuckery from Kemp. But right now, Gwinnett still has a pool of votes that didn't get counted last night due to some software bullshit. It's 86,000 votes. And Fulton, Cobb, and DeKab still have a bunch of votes out. And so... This is 6 o'clock this morning. Right.

Chris, is there any more updates on what's left? Answer. Not really 250K uncounted absentee that we know about 150K in DeK, Fulton, and scattered elsewhere. Yeah. I wouldn't be surprised if it's actually $280K or $290K would a lot extra in the big four, because that doesn't count any ballots that would have been returned on Tuesday. About $30K came back on Monday, and there was some balance outstanding from very reliable voters. 88% of the votes still, it is in from Cobb, but that's a good number.

That's a good pool right there from Cob alone. And again, the Gwinnett thing, we don't know what the, we don't know if that $86,000 is in the pool of or not on the report. So, but if that's the case, it could, it could force Purdue into a runoff if he gets below 50% if that. That would be awesome. Heck, we'd all be living in Georgia. I can throw a rock to Georgia from my house. And Georgia's not terrible, right? I mean, there's this city there, right?

Tell me. No. But if it's two runoffs in Georgia and do we see anything else? So Biden is going to win Maine. one, but not mean two. But not main two. And Senator concerned Susan Collins is going back to the Senate. But look, Mitch McConnell was forced to spend $200 million

dollars defending those seats. The runoffs are going to be, the runoff or runoffs in Georgia are going to be absolutely critical. We're in a spot right now, I think, where the candidate selection and messaging lesson that's going to come back again and again and again. and, you know, the closest of the presidential race ended up affecting the way the Senate race has played out. Yeah. Yesterday we talked, Rick and I, and I said, we're going to win this thing by a lot.

And Rick said it's going to be tight. And this entire time you've said, you thought it was actually going to be really tight. I have. I've said it on the podcast. I've said it in articles. I've said it on my LPTV broadcast. But why? What did you know that Nate Silver didn't know?

Well, here's the thing. A lot of these states that we were going to potentially compete in, like Texas and Georgia, are still quite red states with a couple of blue spots. And as I've written a lot, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin are not woke. A progressive Democrat in Michigan is basically a centrist conservative in California. These are states that are not liberal states. They have good, the working class vote in those states is very dispositive. But culturally, a lot of those people, you know, you can have a lot of guys in, say, Michigan or Pennsylvania that are union, that are blue collar and are culturally more conservative.

And look, Bill Clinton and Barack Obama managed to get a lot of those votes. Yeah. Well, we spent $80 million in 77 counties in Wisconsin. I believe it. Yeah. And, you know, I don't know how much effect we had, but it's a goddamn good thing we did. I mean, we just constantly, you know, when everybody was going nuts about Arizona and Georgia and North Carolina, you know, we started this project saying if we hold that, we can't lose. Yeah.

How much impact we had, but our strategic inclination certainly was validated. I mean, go back to our donors and say shit, you know. Yeah. And this year, we've spent a lot of time under the radar going. going after to split out in Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Arizona, an awful lot of these softer Republican voters to get over what we call the Bannon line, as he calls it, three, four percent. And by the time this is over, it looks like our model will be validated on that stuff, but it is, you know, it's nerve-wracking as shit. And everybody would have loved to have

a Florida or a Texas or a Georgia on the map last night. Right. Well, we might get Georgia. We still might get Georgia. Yeah. And who knows what's going on with the mail balance that DeJoy is holding off in the Postal Service? Because that story, that's the lawyers I'm dealing with right now is there's going to be a challenge on that front, like I think in the next couple of hours. Well, guys, look, I thought that we would all talk about how much fun it was to work together.

It was so much fun, we're going to get to do it some more. Yay. It was so good. And it was such an exhilarating experience. It seems like we're not going to stop having fun. Before you leave us, pick a fuck that guy for us. Who is the guy? Who do you think really needs to fuck off after this?

Probably the American Association of Public Opinion Research. Something like that. Yeah. You know, Rick is right. The set of cultural dynamic, they're not woke, and they feel like that the entire culture is set against them. The country is being transformed in ways that they're not as important as they used to be. And when that happens, people have a tendency to dig in.

I mean, ultimately, they're going to lose. But, you know, ultimately, I'm 76. They've got to lose now. Before we get into things, We have a fun little treat. There are so many insane things happening in the world right now, and two episodes a week just aren't enough to cover it all. So, the new abnormal is going to release a limited run series of bonus interviews over the next few weeks for Beast Inside members only.

We'll release a new one each Sunday. But listen carefully. Only Beast Inside members will have access to these. So head over to the new abnormal. dot the Daily Beast.com to become a Beast inside member now. That's New Abnormal. Dot the DailyBeast.com. Rick Wilson,

yes. Who's your fuck-that-that-guy? My fuck-that-guy du jour is, of course, perennial favorite, Lewis to Joy. Yeah, that's a good choice. Who on Tuesday flatly defied a court order and said, no, fuck you. I'm not going to go find the absentee vote and vote by mail ballots in the postal system. Fuck you. There are at least 300,000 of them floating around, apparently just for Florida.

Now, that won't change the outcome of the election in Florida, but this idea, that you get to just say to a court order, go fuck yourself, is not one that is extant in Western jurisprudence. This is a high-grade fuckery. I think Lewis DeJoy has well earned that. Yeah. And look, the DeJoy strategy of slowing down the postal service and breaking the mail delivery system very deliberately and very consciously has played out exactly as they wanted it to. So here we are. Yeah. No, I agree. But I'm going to go with. with all pollsters. Fuck those fuckers.

You come at me, Nate Silver. You get the... Oh, wow. Okay. Posters get the... All right. You don't tell me

it's going to be a fucking blue wave. And then I, you know, you don't get to break... Shame on you. Shame on me. You don't get to shame. I'm quoting W here. You don't get to shame again.

Well, let me say this. Two words that never came out of my mouth in this election cycle, except as we're not going to have, were blue and wave. Yeah. And there was always going to be something that was very culturally contingent in this campaign. And that blue wave, any wave, by the way, these days is going to be much, much, much, much harder to achieve because of the siloing and the polarization of the two parties into their particular media bubbles. So, but with that.

But with that. We beat Donald Trump. On that note, we'll wrap up this episode of the new abnormal from The Daily Beast. In future episodes, we'll be talking with smart folks from The Daily Beast and beyond from media, culture, politics, and science who will help us understand what's happening to our country and the world. We hope you'll subscribe to us on your favorite podcast app and share the show on social media. We're just getting started and don't want you to miss an episode.

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