The Daily Beast Podcast - Why World Leaders Think Trump's an Idiot: Rothkopf

Episode Date: January 22, 2026

David Rothkopf, The Daily Beast’s unmissable columnist, joins Joanna Coles to unpack Donald Trump’s disastrous return to Davos and why it may mark a genuine rupture in the world order. What was once a gathering fueled by prestige and pretense becomes, this year, a summit driven by fear—of Trump’s bullying, his ignorance, his threats on trade, NATO, Greenland, and allies who once trusted the United States. Rothkopf explains why European leaders walked out, why markets rattled, why the EU froze trade talks, and why figures like Mark Carney are now openly warning that this is not a transition but a break. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

And then Trump showed up today in Davos, and he gave a speech, was so offensive to the crowd. Europe does not trust us anymore. Europe does not trust the U.S. and NATO. Americans need to remember. Europe's the same size as us as an economy. But also, Europe has the ability to focus on China, to focus on others in the world in a way that really changes the equation for the United States. So it was a fiasco. It was a mess.

embarrassing. Trump was offensive. Trump was a boor. Trump was an idiot. I'm Joanna Coles. This is the Daily Beast podcast and what on earth is happening amid the boiling vats of fondue in that tiny little town in Switzerland where I have never been. The president descended somewhat gingerly from Air Force One and delivered a humdinger of a speech where he was basically equal opportunity. insulting everybody he could think of. Who knows if anybody wrote that speech or if it was just one of his weaves. But we have David Rothkoff here to dissect it and debrief on it for us.

Who better. David was the editor of Foreign Policy magazine. He worked for the Commerce Department. So let's get into it. David Rothkopf, what are we doing here in the States? We should be in Davos eating bubbling, cold. of fondue. Okay, first of all, fondue sucks.

And I used to host a fondue dinner in Davos every year. You did? And every year. And there's this one little shop there that's a restaurant that's the big Davos restaurant, the big, you know, place to go. And I would get the back room and I would host this dinner there. And every year I thought, fondue's terrible. I love fondue.

Before we get into the meat and potatoes of Trump's speech, and then, of course, the Gavin Newsom of it all and the new campaigning ground, I want you to set a little bit of the scene for us of Davos, because I know you were the ultimate Davos man at one point. You were there for the State Department. I'm assuming you were there for when you were the editor of Foreign Policy magazine. And I've never been.

I would be terrified of slipping and breaking something on the snow. But I need more details about what it's actually like. Well, first of all, I never worked for the State Department. I worked for the Commerce Department. I always get that wrong. I always get that wrong. Why do I do that? No, no, I feel like a promotion.

But, you know, I was there when I was managing the director of Kistinger Associates. I was there with foreign policy. I was there for many, many, many years. And, you know, the way it was described, you know, is the sort of mountain retreat where people would get together and hobed, and do deals is a little misleading. In fact, I remember once talking to Eric Schmidt,

who was, you know, the founding CEO of Google, and he said, you know, every time I come to Davos, I'm pretty sure that somewhere in some hotels, some big deal is being done, but it's never where I am. So FOMO, full of FOMO. It's full of FOMO, but, you know, it's a lot of strutting your stuff. I remember going down the stairs at Davos and watching people look at,

look at your badge to see whether you were important enough. And I turned to somebody who happened to be next to me, who was a finance minister from another country. I said, now I know what Dolly Parton feels like. Because nobody looks me in the eye. Everybody looks you in the chest. Well, and I think, isn't it full of high-price escorts? I mean, someone once told me that all the escorts from Europe

just hone in on daos for that week. There was a lot of kind of Russian and East European escorts there, but that was, you know, that was a demi-Mond on a demi-Mond. Let's focus that, you know, this, this, all these people, you know, are there in the hopes of doing a deal, being seen, wanting to be perceived as being somebody who's in on the action. But the reality is there was never really that much action going on there. and it's had a couple of bad years. Now, there was a story in the Wall Street Journal this week, which said Davos is back because

Trump is back. And I don't know who planted that story, Stephen Chung or one of these. Well, good for them. But the reality is people showed up at Davos this year because they are terrified of Trump. They are terrified what he's doing to markets, to their businesses, to the transatlantic relationship. You know, as it turned out, they had every reason to be terrified. But my final point about Davos is this.

It's cold and unpleasant. You are absolutely right. They don't shovel the sidewalks because people who live in Davos go with their skis or their sleds and they like to pull them along on the sidewalk. So everything is covered with ice and snow. And on a regular basis, you see bankers and government minimums, fly up into the air and land on the pavement flopping around like seals about to be clubbed. Because it's just a really unpleasant place to be.

Now, there's a story in the paper today saying it's also too small, traffic jams, too much security. And so they're thinking of moving it. And they listed two places. Dubai, which I kind of understand, that almost makes some sense. or Detroit, which makes no sense. Well, also cold, also cold and much easier for the Americans. Well, easier for the Americans, but Davos was never about the Americans. Davos originally was about the Europeans.

It started in the 70s as primarily a European thing. And then it was about multinationals. And people should never mistake big U.S. corporations. as being American. They're multinational. They are there dealing with their community at Davos. And people have more in common with other multinationals than they do with their home countries.

And so that's why you get, you know, you get a lot of policies that may not have been in the U.S. interests being promoted because ultimately they were in the interests of these big companies who were the agenda centers and who are the agenda centers. Okay, so you must be missing being there then and being at the center of everything

and people staring at you. Now, tell me, you told me once a very funny anecdote at the time that was happening around Black Lives Matter. Can you just remember what it was? I want you to share it with people because it was so good. When I was the CEO and editor of Foreign Policy Magazine, we would do host a lunch with the ones. Washington Post, which was part of the same group, and it would have all these sort of big shots

together. And I remember at one, and I can tell you when, it was 2017. And I was hosting one table, and Marty Banner and the editor of Washington Post was hosting another. And I think Lally Waymouth, who was affiliated with the family that owned it, was hosting another. And like in my table, or the right next to me, because everybody was jammed in, was Jamie Diamond. the CEO of J.P. Morgan, and then right next to him at the next table was David Rubenstein, the billionaire from Carlisle Group. And somebody started talking about Black Lives Matter.

And I think David Rubenstein was the one who leaned forward to Jamie Diamond. And at that point, said, what about us? billionaire lives matter too. So good. So good. This is the stuff that occupies Davos. People think is happening at Davos. And it was actually happening at Davos. What a great anecdote. Billionaires' Lives Matter, too. Don't let's tell Zora and Mam Darnie that. All right. So let's get into the Ville and the dauphin noir's of Trump's speech. And my favorite line was, I've been very, very smart, very smart. That's not how he speaks, but it's me trying to differentiate. And actually, several commentators on YouTube wrote in and said,

I've got to stop doing Donald Trump with an English accent when I quote him because it makes him sound too intelligent. So I'm going to try and do it in a very bad American accent. I show up for these podcasts every week or so because of your impression. All right. So tell me, what was he talking about? What was going on there? Well, I mean, again, let's set the stage.

The U.S. decided this was going to be a big deal. He was going to be a big deal. They took over what I think was a former little church along the street, turned it into USA House. We're having events there. Scott Bessent was speaking there. The cabinet was out in force. And last night, so, you know, today's Wednesday. So Tuesday night.

Tuesday night in Davos. Howard Lutnik was giving a speech that was hosted by Larry Fink of BlackRock. And Lutnik was, you know, Lutnik is a loose canon to begin with. He'd totally out of his depth in this job. And he's kind of thuggish and he's ridiculously loyal to Trump. And he started getting up and insulting the Europeans' Trump style, but without the finesse. And I use the term,

Finesse lightly. Well, he doesn't have any of Trump's child. We need to go back to coal and we need to. And people, Europeans, started booing him at this dinner. And people like Christine Lagarde, who's the head of the European Central Bank, who is the most poised, experienced international statesperson I know, walked out. They just walked out.

So things were going badly. And then Trump showed up today. And he gave a speech in which he thought the big headline was going. going to be that he kind of sort of renounced the use of force to take Greenland. But the rest of the speech was so offensive to the crowd. You know, you're to a bunch of Europeans. You'd all be speaking German if it wasn't for us. And then, you know, we gave Greenland back to the Danes and that was stupid of us.

and Greenland is just a piece of ice, and it's all my ask, and we're going to get it. And if we don't get it, you know, or else, and there is this big implied economic or else tariffs and other kinds of things would be imposed upon them. And he was a racist, and he was talking about how Somalis are a low IQ people. And he was making up complete nonsense about the U.S. economy, and he was talking about Venezuela as though it were something to be proud of.

It was as though the United States seizing the oil assets of another country and putting them into a secret bank account in Qatar, which only Trump controlled was something to be proud of. And, you know, he said all the big oil companies are going in there. But we know Exxon, Exxon said when Trump got them together, this is an uninvestable country. And, you know, he's having a meeting. tomorrow there about

the peace board for Gaza, which he mentioned. But meanwhile, he invited Putin on the peace board, and then the big news, breaking news today was he invited Bibi Netanyahu to be on this peace

board, you know, the butcher of Gaza. Like, hey, you come and join it. The peace board is now starting to look a little bit. Like, I don't know if you remember, the scene and the James Bond movie Spector where all the heads of Spector get together in this opera house

and I think it was in Germany. But it's starting to look like a bunch of Bond villains and Trump's charging them each a billion dollars and where's the billion going to go and is it going to go to a Jared Kushner casino project

on the Gaza coast and what'll happen to the Gazans? Who cares? So like from beginning to end, the speech was offensive. It was a fiasco. Markets responded badly. Immediately after the speech, the European Union announced

because Trump was threatening tariffs if the Europeans don't go along with giving Greenland to the U.S. The European Union pulled out of the trade deal that they negotiated with the United States, said that's unhold because if you're going to change the terms

every time something comes up, then we don't really have a deal. You know, markets are skittish, stock markets up a little bit, but other markets are highly skittish here. And, you know, I think finally, and most importantly, as big a fiasco as it is politically, as as embarrassing as Trump was for his ignorance and is slurring his words and his low energy and all of that, this is really a historical watershed. For 100 years, the U.S. has made building transatlantic relationship the foundation of peace and prosperity for us and for many, many people in the world. And it's over. Europe does not trust us anymore. Europe does not trust the U.S. in NATO.

No one thinks they can count on NATO. The trade agreements, the cooperation is in trouble and there are threats of retaliations and, economic bazookas, and I think Americans need to remember. Europe's the same size as us as an economy. Europe not only is big and important and leading in a lot of key technologies, but also Europe has the ability to focus on China, to focus on others in the world in a way that really changes the equation for the United States. So it was a fiasco.

It was a mess. Trump was embarrassing. Trump was offensive. Trump was a bore. Trump was an idiot. But this is also a bright red line in history. And the world is not the world that it was when you woke up this morning. And it only promises to get worse and worse. And I just think all of us listening need to go, holy shit. Yeah, listen, I mean, I grew up in Europe. I have lots of European friends and family still. And they're all saying we cannot believe that Europe. biggest ally has now turning into an adversary, both militarily, potentially, which obviously brings around the end of NATO and also economically. But what we're seeing out of this are new world leaders, right? So we have Mark Carney's speech about middle powers, which I want

you to talk about too. We have the grey-crested crane of Gavin Newsom strutting around sensing opportunity. He's now pecking at opportunity. opportunities there. And then we also had, and I want you to talk about this too, Donald Trump picking on certain European leaders, Macron being one that he, you know, taunted, because Macron's refused to write the one billion dollar check for his peace board, and also the Prime Minister of Switzerland, who he said rubbed him the wrong way. So can we dissect each of those? And it feels like Mark Carney is emerging as the, the same. leader of the West? Well, look, Mark Carney has the advantage that he's located directly next to the United States. Stand next to Trump. Anybody will look sane. But the reality is Mark Carney is an incredibly gifted guy, was the head of the Bank of England

before he ran the Central Bank in Canada, before he became the Prime Minister of Canada, a really brilliant guy. And he's quite low-key. and his oratorical style is not great. But what he said in the speech was not, he said, this is not a transition. This is a rupture. Right, in the world order.

A rupture in the world order. It was really important because a lot of people have said, you know, and this has been the way a lot of people in the press have been writing, well, we're sliding in this way. And we've crossed the line. And that's what Mark Carney is saying. And why? Because the U.S.

a threat. Canada's biggest friend is now a threat. There were stories in the paper yesterday of the Canadians are now planning for what they would do if they were invaded by the U.S. and saying that they would try to figure out how to conduct guerrilla resistance like the U.S. faced in Afghanistan and have people out there with improvised explosive devices and so. This This is crazy, but Canada is taken seriously because Trump's not backing down. He did go into Venezuela. He is threatening huge economic pressure to go into Greenland. He changes his mind on force, but he could change it back on force.

It's crazy. So Trump insults him and says, well, the Canadians, they're not grateful. You know, we're going to build this golden dome and they'll benefit. Well, you know, I've said this on here before. Golden Dome is a fantasy. If you talk to anybody who's a nuclear arms specialist, they will tell you it can't be done. You can't build that kind of shield for the United States, at least not with the current technologies that we have. But more importantly, Trump, you know, Trump liked to be a bullion.

He was like, well, you know, Canada, you know, you better you better tell your leader the next time he gives a speech like that to watch out because we're coming for him. And he did the same thing going after Macron. He made fun of Macraugh for giving a speech with sunglasses on, which Macron did because he has an eye infection. He did look cool, though. Only a French president could have pulled that off, is all I'm saying. Well, they had this kind of blue tint to them. Yes, he looked fabulous.

And also he's got that tremendous accent. I'm being facetious, obviously, before people write in and say, I'm trivializing, which is what is clearly a very serious moment. But his picking on Macron was just seemed like the worst kind of bullying, playground bullying. David, hold on one second. We're just going to take a word from our sponsors. And I'm back with David Rothkopf, dissecting where else, Davos. Well, he did.

But, you know, he did the same thing with the Danes. We did a lot for the Danes. The Danes did nothing for us. The Danes were the first people to respond after 9-11. You know, the only time Article 5 has ever been invoked in the history of NATO, they're like, okay, we're here for you. Send our troops. They lost lives of Danish troops protecting the U.S., responding to 9-11. The Danes were critical in a whole host of intelligence cooperation with the U.S.

We're leading the way in a lot of those things. Trump is an ignoramus and he's a bully and he went after the suite. Swiss and he went after other Europeans. He, you know, he said, well, you know, I talk to my friends about Europe and it's just, it's not the same. I know, because he's stuck in 1965. Well, he's stuck. Yeah, I mean, he doesn't, I mean, I don't know, you know, what he is referring to.

He's never liked Europe. He's always, he's always been a little, you know, fond of Eastern Europe. We could talk about that if you want, but he's never liked Western Europe that much. and you know he was he was going after them here and it's it's very clear you know this guy has done more he's wanted to damage NATO and blow it up since the last term right he mentioned it you know he told mark espart the secretary of defense to pull troops out of Germany espers said no you know they found ways around all of this they moved the troops from Germany into Poland so we didn't lose the leverage that we had but he doesn't have anybody like that around him, no. They all snap to attention. Whenever he says something twice, they do it. So, David, David, one of the things that people are beginning to say, which you have said for many years at this point, which is that Europe may not be the same, but Trump is not the same either, that Trump is, you know, cognitively slipping, we can see it in plain sight. He's been in

the public eye long enough for us to have comparisons with his first administration with 10 years ago with 20 years ago. He's definitely not the same. Even Tom Friedman in the New York Times today said, is he a mad king? He is a mad king. Do you think there is, I mean, there's a rupture in the world order. There may have been a rupture in Trump's brain. But do you think there is also now an understanding and a panic among the ruling class, perhaps, I should say, that Trump is, there's something wrong with him, that it's time. I believe that everybody who is looking at this objectively thinks there's something wrong with Trump, whether he's had a neurological incident or he's had a series of neurological

incidents or he's entering into a phase of dementia like his father did, who had Alzheimer's, and we know that that's genetically passed on within families, or whether it's just aging or whether it's too many cheeseburger. I don't know what it is. But Trump is certainly not the Trump he was a year ago, and he's not the Trump he was 10 years ago. And, you know, he wasn't so great to start out with, right? I mean, he was a big fat guy who never took care of himself even back then.

but he is declining. The notion that, you know, he is now a mad king or that he is now a threat, I find that I personally have a little bit of trouble with it. And I don't want to pat myself in the back. There's nothing that bugs me more than the social media culture of, I told you so. But there were a lot of us 10 years ago who said, this is where it's going to go if you elect this idiot.

And, you know, when I say a lot of us, I mean, everybody who lived in New York City, anybody who read the village voice and the articles by Wayne Barrett in the 1980s, anybody who watched this guy go bankrupt over and over again. Six times. Anybody who listened to Barbara Walters interviewed with him when he talked about being president in the early 1990s, everybody knew it. I wrote an editorial in 2016 saying the biggest threat the United States faces is candidate Trump. And when I was the editor of foreign policy, which we had never written an editorial like that, but we felt compelled to do it. I wrote an editorial in the Washington Post in 2017 saying the biggest threat the United States faces is Donald Trump. The problem was everybody else in a lot of the mainstream media and a lot of the mainstream media and a lot of lot of big businesses were like, well, if we say that, he'll be offended, let's go along with it,

how bad could it be, there will be guardrails, people will, well, the guardrails are gone. The Republican establishment has abandoned ship. They're on their knees before their king, saying, yes, sir, how high, sir. And the business establishment, many of them are going along with him. If I were going to say there is one little silver lining that I have seen in the past 24 hours in Davos, it's that the Europeans who have really had a hard time since there, you know, was the idea first posed of the United Europe in coming together on anything, are finally recognizing that you've got to stand up to Trump. And, and, you know, that you've got to be tough, and the head of the EU and the foreign ministry people from the EU,

and the head of the European Central Bank, and the head of a lot of these countries, and, you know, are saying, no, we're not going along with it. The Germans are saying, no, we won't be on the peace board. The French are saying, no, we won't be on the peace board. They're pulling out of these trade. This is the, the U.S. guardrails have given out. So. Fortunately, there's some in the world that are emerging. So was Gavin Newsom right to go?

I mean, he's obviously planting his flag for 2020. Gavin Newsom, I got to tell you, you know, I'll take one step back from it, because, you know, I know your background and you have been a trendsetter, and you understand what's cool in the world. And the core definition of cool is not caring about it, right? You're not cool, if you're not cool, if you're not cool, if you're. if you're trying to be cool. And the core with becoming a presidential candidate

is not looking like you're trying so hard. And Gavin Newsom is trying so hard. He is trying every angle. I'm going to go and attack Trump, for which we applaud. He's been very tough on that. I'm going to go and play to the Joe Rogan crowd, which is gross and disgusting in the Ben Shapiro's and the others.

But he's like, I'll do whatever it takes. and so he goes off to Davos and you know God love him you know for speaking out against Trump but you know you say he what kind of bird did you say it was a grey crested crane which has a sort of plume of hair

like Governor Newsom which I know shouldn't matter but Donald Trump's hair oddly matters he understood even though it looks like a sort of candy floss is settled or what are those things that blow down Texas roads that there's nothing else on tumbleweed, that a tumbleweed has somehow blown and settled itself on his head.

He understands that it's recognition and that nothing matters more than recognition as a candidate. If I were asked to nominate a bird, I would say Gavin Newsom is a preening peacock. And he wants attention. And, you know, frankly, we need all the voices we can to speak out against Trump. So God bless and keep it up, but spare us this guy as the Democratic nominee. Do you think that Gretchen Whitmer and J.B. Pritzker and Wes Moore in Maryland and Josh Shapiro in Pennsylvania are sitting thinking, damn, why didn't my team say you should be in Davos? This is going to be a moment. You need to be there. No, I don't think they are because Davos is followed by a narrow group of people.

and there's some people reading a story about it in the Washington Post, and nobody, nobody is reading a story about it. No, but you say that, but David. But David, a daily bugle. I mean, it's just not. But David, as the founder of Deep State Radio,

you know that this is all about opportunistic clips on YouTube and Instagram, and Gavin Newsome is everywhere there now. It looks like he's offering an alternative. He is for a moment. David, we're just going to have a quick stop for an ad break. And David Rothkopf and I are talking about what else Donald Trump's insane speech to Davos. The reality is this, and I really think people need to keep this in mind.

Four, three out of the last four Democratic presidential winners, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Barack Obama were nowhere as candidates two years before they were elected. Joe Biden won, but frankly, everybody thought he. was nowhere. We are way too early to know. Because for all the reasons you just talked about in YouTube and Instagram and

and various other social media channels, the reality is that the zeitgeist changes all the time. And so the candidate who's going to win is going to be the

one who comes out and gets the zeitgeist right a lot closer to election day. And so, you know, my, my sense is, you know, people are going to do horse races throughout this year. It might be one of those people, but it could just as easily be somebody who the Democrats win in the House and they hold hearings and all of a sudden somebody becomes a star. Or Trump sends troops into some city and some mayor or some governor stands in front of a statehouse building or turns away ice or gets arrested and then writes a letter from some jail someplace. And that person will emerge as a hero.

And I would just keep an eye out for the person, you know, for whom lightning strikes in the social media world closer to election day. Okay. Well, from your lips to YouTube's ears, it's a really remarkable moment. It's a remarkable moment. And also the thing I found very strange was Lindsay Graham, who, you know, a ridiculous figure at this point, who's gone from calling Trump sort of tuti-frutty Trump to now being, he couldn't be more obsequious, saying that NATO hasn't worked at the last 80 years. of peace organized, you know, from World War II onwards, hasn't worked.

And you're like, what are you talking about? I mean, they're just, it's a really remarkable moment. If Lindsey Graham got a phone call from Donald Trump or Caroline Levitt or whoever it is that calls Lindsey Graham, and they said, Lindsay, we want you to go on national television and say that the president's balls smell like a field of lavender in the South of France, Lindsay Graham would say it. Well, he would say when can I go? How fast can I get to the studio?

Yeah, but that's his role. You know, his role is to say, oh, yeah. No, idiocy. You know, this is whatever the president says space aliens took over all the brains of the Democrats. I think we should investigate that. I wonder if Marco Rubio and J.D. Vance are talking to each other and going, dear God, how long how much longer do we have to put up with this or if they're uh sharpening their elbows to go after each other i mean it just seems they're sharpening their elbows we saw the first

we saw the first shot fired in the republican presidential um uh campaign to succeed trump this week because usha vans announced she's having her fourth job you know and that this is like you know, this is J.D. Vance saying family values and my wife, who should be deeply offended by the fact that I insult her, country of origin, and everybody like her, and anybody else who is brown, is willing to sleep with me and have another baby. And so we're not getting divorced. You know, here we are making a bigger family. You know, this is him campaigning. and I'm sure Marco Rubio is trying to think of the appropriate counter move as we speak. Well, perhaps he could adopt David Beckham's son.

Well, that kid wants out, man. I mean, I don't know what the Beckams did to Brooklyn Beckham, but he wants out of that family bad. He really, he's doing that thing that a lot of the kids are doing these days where he just goes for total cut off from family, which seems very dramatic. but that's also a fascinating rupture in celebrity culture and a celebrity life that people can't get enough. It may not be quite as consequential as the rupture between the United States and our European allies, but it is another rupture.

It's definitely a rupture, but I'm sure that David Beckham is at home whipping up some delicious potato dish that his wife will not eat because she obviously doesn't eat cards. Well, actually, if he walks to David Beckham documentary, what he's probably doing is he's, He's on his knees and his skivis scrubbing the cooktop because he does seem to have a bit of an OCD thing. Yes, an OCD. Well, and also going around wiping the tops of candles, which was something I didn't know you were supposed to do, but that was quite a helpful hint from that show.

Well, David Rothcopf, it's never dull speaking to you. I'm sorry we're not dipping large carbly slivers of whatever bread is the best for soaking up fondue. Well, come to Washington. and we will host a fondue party for you. Excellent. And all of your Washington admirers. And we'll say, you know, we'll just say it's like. Well, there will be a very small crowd, David.

It'll be a small bunch of us huddled around a pot of bubbling fondue. I am sure that when you look into the comments following this little venture into YouTube, there will be millions of volunteers who want to dip big chunks of bread into bubbling cheese and here you do your Melania. Well, thank you. Well, that's not Malania. I can't channel Melania today. Well, David, always a joy to talk to you.

And, I mean, who knows what happens next? What an extraordinary moment. But I'm very glad that we have you to decode it for us. And the last 25 years of Davos looked like they were just washed away on the sand that the tides have moved in and how it was. happen to a nicer group of people as far as I'm concerned. If Davos disappeared tomorrow, the world would not in any way be diminished. On that note, David, on that note, all right, we will see you very shortly, I hope, and I can't recommend Deep State Radio your entire media

network highly enough. You keep people saying. Go to Deep State Radio on YouTube. Subscribe to Deep State Radio on YouTube. It's the fastest growing part of what we're doing. And you'll get, you know, it won't have the benefit of Joanna, although Joanna you should come on there too. I'd love to come on. You've never invited me. You've never invited. And we invite you all the time. I'm going to follow up. Okay, follow up, please.

In the next week or two, we'll have you grace our stage. And people can then go also to DSR network. If you want to subscribe to podcast the old-fashioned way or go to YouTube and get it there. But David Rothkoff and Deep State Radio, Unafraid, speak truth to power. David, thank you. I love talking to David Rothkopf because he's funny and he's got a sense of perspective,

but he also has a sense of how fucking serious this is right now. This is a rupture. Mark Carney is right. Europe's biggest ally, America for the last 80 years, has become its destabilizing adversary. And it is a real moment in the global order of things. And frankly, Donald Trump does seem to be a government of one, as he's always telling us.

He will decide. It's his morality that will tell him when to stop. Well, for now, the Daily Beast is not paying him $1 billion to join his Peaceboard. We're with Macron, and I want some of Macron's sunglasses. In fact, I'm going to order them right now. If you have been, thank you for joining us. You may too want to add some sunglasses to your repertoire, especially those blue shades. We love having you. we love hearing your comments on YouTube.

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