The Daily Beast Podcast - Wolff: What I’m Going to Ask Melania Under Oath

Episode Date: October 24, 2025

Michael Wolff joins Joanna Coles to tackle his startling new announcement: a billion-dollar countersuit against Melania Trump. The two dissect Jeffrey Epstein’s well-documented friendship with Donald Trump and connect the dots to Trump’s East Wing demolition, showcasing the president’s strategy for destruction. Wolff and Coles also unpack Stephen Miller’s hardline crusades, exposing the strange psychology that drives one of Trump’s most maniacal members of his inner circle. As the legal walls close in, one question lingers: how much of Trump’s chaos is calculation, and how much is pure compulsion? Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The other night, night before last, my lawyers went into court and sued the first lady. So it is now Michael Wolfe versus Melania Trump. I think the first is just to subpoena whoever might seem to be able to shed light on the relationship of Donald Trump and Melania Trump to Jeffrey Epstein. And I think we'll be looking to subpoena various Epstein documents. And that is another backdoor to begin to see materials from the so-called Epstein files. Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein were the closest of friends for nearly 15 years. Many of the conversations I had with Jeffrey and Epstein were precisely about this, of Epstein talking about the real closeness, the intimacy of their relationship involved,

in every aspect of each other's lives, social lives, sexual lives, business lives. His Epstein said, we were the same person. I know the secrets. And again, to remind everyone, the first thing Steve Bannon said, putting out his hand and shaking Jeffrey Epstein's hand, was you were the only person I was afraid of during the campaign, the 2016 campaign. Jeffrey Epstein knows the secrets. I think this lawsuit is an opportunity to reconstruct their lives together.

Donald Trump, Jeffrey Epstein, and then later Melania, Trump would come along. This is precisely what Donald Trump wants covered up. So bring it on. So Michael, you had some big news this week, which you announced on, your Instagram, Michael Wolf, NYC, standing on the porch of your lovely 17th century Hamptons home with the Stars and Stripes. 1829. 1829.

All right. With Stars and Stripes flapping behind you, can you tell people who aren't following you on Michaelwulf, NYC.com, and they certainly should be, what you were actually announcing. And just, so just let me say before that, We're flying the flag because we can and we should. But also just to reclaim it, Trump has set out to take that flag away and he can't. Well, I think he's set out to take it away from half of America, right?

He has taken it for his own use. It has become his own stage prop. And he can't do that. So it's our flag. Is the American flag flapping inside Trump's head? I think the stage set is inside Trump's head. And I've actually seen him walk on to the stage. And he's very conscious of how many flags.

And how many flags is not enough and how many flags is too much. I mean, it is all stagecraft, which he is very good at, in which the American flag turns out to be a very useful supporting player. So we fly it on our porch too. Okay, you're now making me think I should get an American flag for my deck. We should all, everybody listening to this should reclaim the stars and stripes. It's a beautiful flag. And you're going to start selling a lot of flags, Michael.

You might. I'm surprised that Trump hasn't got a special Trump flag, actually, which has got a gold. There's got to be some gold in there. Maybe one of the stars becomes gold, or maybe he adds an extra star, a gold star for Trump. I'm horrified to say that from your mouth to Trump's ears, that might well be the case. Michael. Joanna. We had promised people that we would talk about Stephen Miller today and devote our entire episode to it.

In fact, we have been superseded by events. We are going to talk about Stephen Miller towards the end of today's podcast, and then we're going to devote all being well, events permitting our podcast on Saturday to more Stephen Miller, because I know how many of you are interested in him and he's such an intriguing, weird character. But Michael, why don't you tell us what you've been doing? I suppose we're in lieu of talking about Stephen Miller, we're going to have to talk about me. which I have mixed feelings about. You've become the story.

I'm not the only one who has faced these kinds of lawsuits. This has just become their trick in the book. We don't want this discussion to go on. How do we stop it? We threaten people with lawsuits for billions of dollars. So instead of wilting, instead of acquiescing, the other night, night before last, my lawyers went into court and sued the first lady. So it is now Michael Wolfe versus Melania Trump.

And what we are suing for, there's, in New York State, there are a set of laws. They're called anti-SLAPP laws, because this is what's called a hers is the threat of a slap lawsuit. suing me for defamation in a situation where there is patently no defamation, but suing so that I will shut up. So instead, in a turning of the tables, a jujitsu move about what someone in the White House said to me this morning, well, no one saw that coming, we have sued the First Lady and we will, and the importance of that is that it gives me subpoena power. I can subpoena the first lady, the president of the, her husband, the president,

and anyone else who might shed light on the relationship of Donald Trump and Melania Trump to Jeffrey Epstein. In other words, this might be a way. to actually get to the bottom of this story, to open the curtain, the dark curtain. And we'll see how they feel about that. Epstein, Epstein. So, Michael, what has the reaction been? I know this is the first time.

I think a first lady has ever faced herself with being sued. Well, there's a series of first here, which I think it's important to, acknowledge. This is also the first time that a first lady or a president has actually reached out to sue people in the press for defamation. That's never happened before, not least of all, because according to the law, a president and a first lady really cannot be defamed. They're just their public figures. They've put themselves out there. in the land of free speech, we ought to be able to say literally anything about them. So that's new and that's effective.

On their part, it's been incredibly effective. They sue the media and the media goes quiet. So this is, again, apparently deeply unexpected to them this turn of events, me suing them. And the response has been, I think, nothing less than, then incredible. An outpouring of support on my, I made a short Instagram video about this, constant incoming now.

So I, and I think people suddenly say, you know, oh my God, you know, this, this, somebody's got to do it. In a sense, I would have preferred it would be someone else other than me, but. Of course, because it's, this is expensive and it's time consuming. Comes the moment, comes the man who's surprised by the moment, which would be me. And I'm going to refer people to your Instagram, Michael Wolfe, NYC, where there is all sorts of conversation about what happens next. In theory, how fast can you start deposing the First Lady and the President? This is all new territory for me, so I'm not certain.

and they will obviously put up roadblocks. So this is going to have to be, this is a needle to be thread. And let me just say also, this is going to be an expensive needle, and I'm going to have to reach out and we're starting to go fund me and all that in looking for support here.

And the support is partly, partly for me and what I'm going to have, have to shell out on this. But it is also, it is also to provide the wherewithal to hold these people into court. They can't do this. This is, dare I say, America. Well, it was, it was America. And, you know, one's only got to look at the remarkable speed with which the East Wing is being demolished to see that this is not the America we knew. Donald Trump has put his own people in over what would normally be the commission that would slow any process like this down, make sure they were hitting every historical mark, so nothing of import was destroyed. He said the building was

going to be adjacent to the East Wing. He said at one point in July, nothing was going to be destroyed and in fact they've taken bulldozers and jack hammers to the east wing and now they've hastily erected a fence so nobody can see what's actually going on but it seems such a metaphor and in fact several people have commented on youtube this morning and said in fact k l ratham says i wonder if no king's day would have been much larger if this demolition had been more visible before this latest march what do you think i just want to say one thing that that that Trump in the White House says all the time to people whenever whenever people say well that's going to be a problem and maybe we shouldn't go that far and um you know

maybe we can't really do that what he always says is we have the power we should use it um which is a kind of a terrifying thing if you think about that um you know and it turns out, yes, if you're the president of the United States, you do have the power and you can use it, but you're not supposed to. So this idea that you're not supposed to do this is kind of, you know, a tenon of American democracy. And that has been falling. You're not supposed to tear down the White House. I mean, can it be more obvious? than that, you're not supposed to do it. The People's House. Right, the People's House and also Congress is supposed to stop you doing this or at least put the brakes on until every eye has been dotted and every T has been crossed. And we're in a remarkable time where it seems the only people that are working are the demolition people on the West Wing. And meanwhile, we're still in a shutdown. I think it's day 23 we're recording this. There is that.

But I think that the broader point here is that Trump is looking for ways to marshal this power that he has, which, again, that we might have, we might have been aware that the presidency has enormous powers, but that there was a built-in mechanism not only for other branches of government, government in other agencies and other people of conscience to restrain this power. But we're in this totally unexpected moment in which the President of the United States is not only intent on using it, but willing in ways that no one ever imagined. again, to tear down the White House. And let's be very, very clear about that. And I think one of the things that people are responding to is the pictures of that.

It makes all the difference in a story. And in our business, we know this. When there are pictures, you get to literally see this. I mean, there are no pictures of Trump on a daily basis tearing down democracy. but there are now literal pictures of the wrecking ball taken to the White House. Well, the interesting thing is that Donald Trump is obviously an experienced construction person. He's been doing it all his life. And normally the first thing construction crews do is to build a fence around the area that they are deconstructing or demolishing.

so that, you know, people don't see it because it's often very unsightly. Here, they didn't bother to do that. The pictures came out. People were clearly very disturbed by them. And in fact, the fences only went up earlier this week. I'm wondering if that was a deliberate thing that they wanted people to see it to understand that Donald Trump is unafraid to wield power, even in the form of a jackhammer and a bulldozer.

Or if it was just a mistake, I'm told that people who had access to the scene were told they were not allowed to share photographs of it or any kind of video. But do you think he deliberately allowed people to see what was going on to flex his power? Or do you think it was just an oversight? There's another aspect of when you're in the real estate and construction business and you want to demolish something, especially in New York. It is important to you want to demolish before you're allowed to demolish or before the entire approval process is going through. Once you've demolished, it's demolished. You've changed the facts on the ground.

And builders in New York do this all of the time. You do not want to give the opportunity to all. all of the various groups and commissions and citizens who might go to court and try to stop you. So you want the wrecking ball to get in there first. And I have a sneaking suspicion. That's what happened. That's partly what happened here. There's no going back now.

He has demolished it. There's no going back. You can't restore it. He has demolished it. And of course, yet again, a metaphor that this is where Melania Trump, the first lady would normally have her office, except for the most part, she is nowhere to be seen around the White House. So, Michael, you're taking a book out of Trump's advisor, Roy Cohn, by always going on the attack here and suing the first lady. What are the first kind of documents

you're going to be looking for for them to produce? Or what kind of evidence are you expecting to find? I think the first is just to subpoena whoever might seem to be able to shed light on the relationship of Donald Trump and Melania Trump to Jeffrey Epstein. And I think we'll be looking to subpoena various Epstein documents. And that is another backdoor to getting the, to opening, to being able to, to begin to see materials from the so-called Epstein file. But mostly, you know, I think it's going to be interesting. Donald Trump and, you know, I mean, this is an important point, which I think it's I've made before, but to keep making, that Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein were the closest of friends for nearly 15 years.

Many of the conversations I had with Jeffrey and Epstein were precisely about this, of Epstein. talking about the real closeness, the intimacy of their relationship involved in every aspect of each other's lives, social lives, sexual lives, business lives. You know, Epstein would say, I mean, is Epstein who said, we were the same person. I know the secrets. And again, to remind everyone, and I've said this before, when Steve Bannon met Jeffrey Epstein, and I was standing there when this happened, Steve Bannon, the first thing Steve Bannon said, putting out his hand and shaking Jeffrey Epstein's hand, was you were the only

person I was afraid of during the campaign, the 2016 campaign. Jeffrey Epstein knows the secrets. So I think it is, this is, this lawsuit is an opportunity to, reconstruct their lives together. Donald Trump, Jeffrey Epstein, and then later Melania, Trump would come along. This is precisely what Donald Trump wants covered up. So bring it on. And how do you think they will perform under deposition? Is the question, will they tell the truth? Well, you know, they will try to avoid the truth. They will have weeks. in weeks of preparation for deposition, for a deposition, but good lawyers will be able to triangulate

the facts. And they're based on what someone else says. And you're looking to give, when you take a deposition, you're looking to give people no room to maneuver or little room to maneuver. And of course, there are plenty of photographs of them all hanging out together. One thinks that the famous one with Jeffrey Epstein with his arm around Gillen, and then there is Melania, and then there's Donald Trump, and it's a quartet of them, and everybody has used that photo, and it's now an infamous photo. Galane is obviously someone who might shed light on these matters. So do you think it's likely you will be deposing Gillen, Maxwell? I think everybody who was involved in that circle during that

time period will be is someone who will certainly think about calling. I'm thinking also of some of the tapes of Jeffrey Epstein that you had when you were talking to him at his house. He'd invited you in to write his biography. And he talked about how he and Donald Trump used to go to Atlantic City and hunt women together. and also about him talking about how Melania and Donald Trump first slept together on his plane. All of this. This is, I mean, this is kind of, you know, I think that there are many opportunities here, but it's, but one seems to be to bring Jeffrey Epstein back from the dead and let him have a conversation with Donald Trump. this is what he said. Let's see what Donald Trump says to that.

It really is remarkable how he is able from beyond the grave to change the political narrative here in the States. And of course, this week we've got the publication of Virginia Joufrey's model, Nobody's Girl, which has kicked up a whole new conversation, Prince Andrew in the UK, with whom she was photographed and who we know was a frequent visitor, Jeffrey Epstein's, as was his wife, Sarah Ferguson. They have both been brought low by their association with him, by lying about their association with him. And now it looks as if Prince Andrew may be turfed out of Frogmore, which is his rent-free residency from the royal family as William gets ready to take the throne. So it's all very curious. So it's all very curious.

how one man can have such an impact over all sorts of world leaders. And of course, the hunt is on Virginia Dufray and Nobody's Girl talks about being raped by a prime minister. She doesn't name the Prime Minister. I'm not quite sure why not. And I don't quite know why the, why her ghostwriter Amy Wallace hasn't named him either. But there's now a hunt going on to understand who that was. Do you have any insight into who that might be? I've only ever met one former prime minister at Jeffrey Epstein's house. But having said that now, I'm thinking, were there, I mean, there were so many people at Epstein's house. Was there a, was there, were there any inconsequential prime ministers that I might have met? And are, is there such a thing as an inconsequential prime minister?

might depend on the country, I suppose. But the one prime minister I met there, it was a consequential prime minister. That was Erhard Barak, right? Because you write about him in your book too famous, where he comes swanning in and immediately starts asking for caviar. He's asked what he would like to eat, and he very pointedly says he would love some caviar, and I think a hard-boiled egg. Yes, and I have written about that, and I am just letting rush to say that I have no no knowledge that Ahud Barak has done anything wrong or that he had any relationship with any of the women around Jeffrey Epstein. That is something I don't know. I do know, however, that Ahud Barak and Jeffrey Epstein were the closest of friends. And I know that Jeffrey Epstein and Donald Trump were the

closest of friends. Epstein, Epstein, Epstein. Michael, hold on, we're just going to take some ads. And back with Michael Wolfe talking about all things Trumpian. So Michael, let's, oh, I tell you what I do want to do. I want to let people know about something new that we're doing that we're rather excited about, which is our first live performance, which we are doing at the Museum of the city of New York. We're doing it on November the 5th, which is the day after the New York mayoral elections, which will be very interesting to see how that results. And I'm assuming we will have a result. But the two of us will be appearing live together, taking people's questions, talking about whatever we'll be going on by then. It's three weeks away. So goodness

knows, the world will have shifted. But if you're interested in coming to see us, we'll be talking at from 630 to 8 and it's you can get tickets at mcny.org. That's the museum of the city of New York.org. M.c.n.n.w.org. And we would love to see you. Okay. So Michael, we've been promising to talk about Stephen Miller for some time now. There is enormous interest about him. Where do we begin? And why don't you begin with Trump's description of Stephen Miller? How does he think of Stephen Miller. When you're inside Trump's head, what is he thinking about Stephen Miller? I know this principally from the first administration when Stephen Miller was regarded throughout the White House as an oddster. An oddster. Yes. And Trump used to talk about him that way and roll his

eyes and crazy Stephen and weird Stephen. He used to. to call him. Weird Stephen. And I know, and I had asked to meet Stephen Miller once. I asked Bannon this. I said, you know, you know, I'd like to meet Miller, who already had developed this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, family was already talking about him as as as as a kind of um um uh you know that they had that he had somehow lost lost the plot of his of his upper middle class jewish family in los angeles and um but any rate so um and band said you really want to meet him are you sure um and i said and i said um uh yeah he said okay and this was in the old executive office

office building. So Bannon showed me into the small office that Miller occupied. And we spent a little time together. And then when I came out and went back to Bannon, he said, well, do you see what I mean? So everybody has this idea that Stephen Miller is weird. And weird to talk to, weird in a kind of spectrumy way? It's actually physically weird. I mean, in the moment, the way he looks at you is, is, is weird. I mean, he focuses this intense look, kind of unblinking look at you. He doesn't really kind of respond to what you say. He just says what he says. So there's, it's, it's, it's like you're not really in the, you're not really having a conversation with anyone. You don't really exist in his, in his frame of reference.

And, and when he talks, it's very, in a mona, mona, man, jesus. In a kind of, does he monologue? Yes. Monologizing way. Thank you. and you know speaks in those kind of in those kind of paragraphs of of of of what we're going to do and what we have to do and why why this is in and and then he just kind of drones drones on and and then suddenly you find that you know that the you know that the that the that the Jews are putting being put on trains um but i mean it's really that kind of scary stuff So let's reel back a bit. He's Jewish. He grew up in a wealthy enclave of L.A. in Santa Monica. And he is supposed to be the policymaker behind Trump's immigration policy, right? He's the reason that we now have masked men. Immigration is the thing that has most animated him. That is the thing that has pushed him into the,

this, this, a sort of, a sort of right wing, right, the world of right wing extremes. During the campaign, one of the Trump aides referred to this as, because they, they, they had used him to talk about immigration, to give an interview to the New York Times about immigration. And the AIDS around Trump, if not Trump himself, immediately regretted this because it produced, you know, terrible headlines about what was going to happen to immigrants, which turns out to be what is happening. But at that moment in time, the other people around Trump, the more normal people around Trump, one of them referred to, as he said, Stevens' masturbatory fantasies about immigrants. And why does he feel like this?

I mean, America is, you know, it's a nation of immigrants. Why, where does this come from? Well, you know, America has a long history. I mean, we should note of antipathy to immigrants. I mean, you know, that's an interesting history because antipathy then turns into coexistence then turns into inclusion. But there is always that thread of antipathy.

And that's what, I mean, that's what Trump has exploited. I mean, the Trump campaign, starting in 2015, begins with this idea that we're going to build a wall. So it's a very potent issue. And Trump is, Trump is good at identifying those potent issues and sticking with those potent issues. Repetition, repetition, repetition, part of the Trump, the Trump method. And so Stephen Miller has been a key tool in that. You know, even if Trump considers him crazy or weird, he has been able to, to,

to strictly focus on that narrative, immigrants. Immigrants are bad, immigrants are dangerous, and we're going to get them, and we're going to expel them. And with a language, with an extreme language, I mean, and couched in with enormous rage and anger. Yes, and so it's a totally reasonable question. Where does this come from?

I mean, Stephen Miller has no reason. There's nothing in his life that would suggest that he or his family or anyone he knows has been, has had inexperience in their own lives or communities in which immigrants would have been a threat. Well, far from it, I would think, in the wealthier enclaves of L.A., in fact, half the economy is kept going by by gardeners, by domestic help that are all immigrants. I mean, let alone the farms of California. But it's so hard to understand what triggered him to create such an extreme policy that we now literally see playing out on the streets of our cities with masked men bundling people into the back of unmarked vans. And people at the side, you know, and people at the side, taking videos of it, which we all see on our social media feeds and which are incredibly

disturbing. No, and I've been told that he watches these things. Someone has described to me this sense of pleasure that you get from Stephen Miller as he watches the videos of this. So, I mean, this is, yeah, I mean, this is weird. It's also warped, I think, I think we can say. The level of cruelty that we're seeing, the level of power that is being demonstrated, the level of the level of this lack of, lack of sympathy is, I think must be partly what is, what's, what's motivating him here. This is, he likes it. And also the knowledge that this is not something that's going on in secret, it's going on in public. There were videos this week. of it happening in New York, ice. And this is something that's happening in broad daylight.

And I think passes by or unexpected witnesses find it very difficult to know how to respond other than by taking videos of it and posting it and saying this is what's going on in your neighborhood. You know, there's a thing here and it's central to the second Trump administration of looking at these large cultural movements in modern American history and trying to undo them. Civil rights, feminism, and the facts that immigration, that immigrants have become a dominant presence in this country. And these are brown immigrants. Right. I was going to say it's a very specific kind of immigrant. Yeah, no. And remember, they're now rejigging policies to bring in white immigrants.

But so this is against brown immigrants. And again, these are, I mean, I'd say that those are three of the most dominant themes in modern American life, civil rights, feminism, and the and the, and the, and the history and the new history of immigrants into this country. And it is all about, so push that back, undo this. Again, return to 1965 before the voting rights act. And isn't one of the things about Stephen Miller, too, that after Donald Trump lost the election in 2020, that Stephen Miller didn't abandon him, other aides abandoned him, his side, in law, Jared Kushner abandoned him, didn't want anything more to do with him, especially after January the 6th. I think he, like everyone else, literally everyone was of the opinion that Trump

lost this election and that was that. Then I think Stephen Miller had had, like quite a number of people in the White House, had nothing to do, had to reconstitute their careers. And And it was hard because I think if when you came out of that White House, especially with January 6th, there were few opportunities. And so the only opportunities that really existed was to fall back on the Trump fold, the Trump universe. And the fact that the Trump universe did not collapse was, I think a surprise to a lot of people. including people in it. And then it became an opportunity, a surprising opportunity. And Stephen Miller started a not-for-profit, started benefiting from the general Trump diaspora, call it.

And then he started an America first legal, I can't remember the quite, but it was attached to the American first. I mean, one of the two main conservative policy organizations, one's the Heritage Foundation, and then the other is America First. It's a 501C3, you know, one of those, one of the kinds of groups that always form in Washington and then serve as kind of policy advisors to vary as to both Democrats or Republicans. and also between administrations usually are the place that you wait out until your guy or your party comes back to the White House. And as it became clearer and clearer that Trump had a good shot of coming back to the White House, these groups became more and more powerful. and Stephen Miller within them became himself more and more powerful so that when Trump was reelected and came back into the White House, Stephen Miller came back as a central policy player, which he had not been in the first White House.

It's just extraordinary his rise. And as you say, the cruelty around it and these videos that people are seeing of people, being shoved in the back of vans. It's most alarming. Michael, quick ad break. And back with Michael Wolf talking about all things Trumpian. Yeah, I don't know anyone in the Trump universe who does not regard Stephen Miller as a wakadoo. And does Trump like him? Does Trump like having him around? Not especially. I mean, he may, I mean, I think Trump is a bit confused by him, by his intensity, by his preoccupation with these issues, which Trump benefits from, but frankly, is not preoccupied by. So, but in that respect, Stephen Miller is a useful tool. Until it becomes something that is too much for Americans and they decide that they've had

enough of it. Yeah. And but, you know, and I would say that that should be happening and that is happening, but at the same time, what we're just seeing is a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, you know, and I would say, true willingness to double down. And, you know, that's part of the, part of this, this moment is in which, you know, Trump is not looking forward to having to be reelected. I mean, to back to this idea, we have the power. We can do anything with it. And we should do anything that we can do with it. Well, you're doing what you can do and all being well, you're going to be able to depose for the first time ever the first lady and her husband, the president, Donald Trump. Let's pick up and talk more about Stephen Miller on Saturday. He's moving out of his house in D.C.

because he and his wife have been doxed and because people are apparently turning up and leaving messages in chalk on the pavement outside, which I'm sure they and their three children and don't appreciate looking at every day. But anyway, their house is up for sale for $3.5 million, if anybody is looking to move to D.C. and would be up for moving into the Miller's house. You might want to sage it first. But Michael, I know you've got lawyers' conversations to have

and things to get back to. I want to do a couple of quick shout-outs to people who've asked us questions. Rick Wallace, 41, wants to know, what does the CIA have to say about Trump's actions, or do they just defer to him? Like all aspects of government, everybody is afraid of Donald Trump. So, you know, the CIA is not different from anybody else at this point. It is, they work for, they work for Donald Trump.

If they forget that, they're going to be fired. I also think we ought to do a special episode or an entire episode on the DOJ, because I do find it extraordinary that it appears to be almost entirely staffed with his former personal lawyers. So we have Pam Bondi as the head of the DOJ. Todd Blanche is the number two. And then Lindsay Halligan now is the US attorney in Virginia overseeing the indictments of James Comey, of John Brennan, of John Bolton. I mean, this is completely unprecedented for the DOJ to become quite so politicized. I want to interrogate you on that.

And I think we use the word unprecedented, and that's not really the case. That's a value-free word. I mean, it's not necessarily terrible that something is happening that has never happened in the past. This is something well beyond that. This is a complete subversion of the very principles of American justice. And Donald Trump, the President of the United States, again, if you have the power, we should use it, has taken upon himself to destroy the idea that justice is blind and now justice is administered only through Donald Trump's eyes. Very scary place indeed. go forth and deal with your lawyers and we will talk again on Saturday.

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