The Daily Show: Ears Edition - Broadway Stars Discuss Their Journeys to the Tony Awards

Episode Date: June 9, 2023

Award-winning actor, dancer, and singer, Ariana DeBose, discusses her role as Anita in “West Side Story,” the many ways she relates to the character, and what it was like working with Steven Spielberg and Rita Moreno, the first Latina to win an Oscar for the original film. Former “The Late Late Show” host, James Corden, admits Mariah Carey changed musicians’ perspective of “Carpool Karaoke” and talks about what makes hosting the 2019 Tony Awards so special. And, Tony-award winning playwright Michael R. Jackson discusses his journey to writing “A Strange Loop,” why he loves connecting with the audience afterwards, and how the show promotes a spirit of inclusion.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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We're talking, what are you talking about? Yeah, but welcome. It's really good to have you here, especially now. You know, some people, if they're broad. You've been, I think you've been grinding at this thing in Broadway, 10 years, right? Where you've done everything, every different type of production, you're a consummate performer, singer, dancer, actress, everything, all in one.

But it feels like this is your moment. You know where the overnight success comes together after 10 years? It feels like that's that moment. Does it feel the same thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. I theeeeea. I's thea. I's theea. I's theeea. I's theeea. I's theeeeea. I's thea. thea. thea. thea. together after 10 years? It feels like that's that moment. Does it feel the same way for you? I hesitate to say it, but yes. Why do you hesitate? Because I'm really enjoying it. Like I'm having fun. I don't want it to go away.

You know, moments, they're fleeting. No, no, no, no, no, not at all. Like, COVID is a moment, and look how long it's going for. You know what, you're not wrong. Yes. So, I'm just, whatever it is, however anyone interprets it, I'm just enjoying whatever this is while it lasts. Because it's been really fun. I mean, it's not every day you get to make a movie to make a movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie movie to make to make to make to make to make a movie movie movie movie movie movie to make a movie to make a movie to make a movie to make a movie to make to make to make to make to make to make to make to make to make to make day you get to make a movie with Stephen Spielberg, and what you're asked to execute is actually something that you do. I was like, oh, I have to do other kinds of homework, but the bones of what this job is,

I got that. This is great. I love that. I mean, you know, it's also unique to be in a position where you're having fun, the audience is having fun, and the the the the their their their their their, thuuiiiiiiiuiuiuiuiolome, thui, thu, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, I'm, thi, thi, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I's, I's, I's, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I to to, I to, I'm, I'm, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho. tho. tho. thoo. tho. tho. th. th. thooooo. th. th. thi, I'm thi, having fun, watching you have fun, and then the critics are having fun as well. Like that's the perfect combination of what you'd like in art, you know, because Screen Actors Guild nomination, right? Yeah. Golden Globe winner, congratulations. Thank you. Thank you very much. It just feels like you're in this world, NWACP Award as well I should mention. Yes, that's also another nomination. I was really honored by, I'm honored by it all.

I'm very grateful for the opportunities to be seen, especially for artists of color. Like it feels like we're all starting to have a different kind of moment right now. And most of our work is not only being seen, but considered and valued in different ways. And that's really the heart of why I'm, to thiiii. th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, the, th, th, th, thi, the, th, thi, the, thi, the, the, the, the, I'm, I'm, I'm, I, I'm, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, th, th, th, th, th.. th. thi, thin, thin, to, to to, to, too.. too.e. too, toe. too. toe. toe. toe. toe. I'm, I'm, I'm, I the heart of why I'm so excited. I think it's an honor for anyone who gets to talk to you because of what you're doing in all of the mediums you're doing it in. Like, Triple Threat gets thrown around a lot of a lot of a lot of thrown around a lot.

People are like, you're a singer, you're a dancer. But you really I thank you. I had a lot of fun on that show. You looked like you did. You did so well that like I've seen people crush it on S&L. I have seen very few people crush it to the point where people are like where's her S&L? Where's her show? No, people were saying. People would say, I would like. W. That's cool. I'm actually not so shy about the fact that I really want to bring the like variety show back. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th th. th. th. th th th. th. th. th th th th th. th th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the.that I really want to bring the like variety show back, like I really want to do it. So if anybody wants to hit me up on that, cool, cool. It seems like to me you are soon becoming the puzzle piece that everyone is going to have to figure out how to fit around. That's cool. I've never been, I've never had that. I genuinely feel like that is what you are very quickly becoming. I mean, West Side Story is, few films get remade with as much pressure as this one has had. You are playing a role that is arguably one of the most important roles in not just film, not

just film history, but then like in the history of so many Latina actresses where they go like, this was it, this was the Rita Marino moment that changed film for a lot of people. It had an influence in your life. Yes, it did. I saw it when I was, gosh, I guess it felt like six or seven, you know, and I didn't understand who she was, but I understood, she sort of looked like me,

and I wanted to dance just like her. And th, and I to dance, and I to dance, and I to dance, and I to dance, and I to dance, and I to dance just like her. And then not until my adulthood, did I really understand the full spectrum of what West Side Story did for her, what and what she came to mean to our community. But then also, the struggles that she faced after winning an Oscar, you know? It's like, she became the first Latino to win an Oscar and then all of a sudden there was no work. Right. So she had to find other ways to expand her career and I, as it makes me very sad that that

was her experience but also when you look at her breadth of work, she showed you that Latina's are not. We don't just do this, we do this. That's really cool. I mean, I think, I think I think I think I think I think I think I think I think I think I th. I thi I th. I thi. I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I tho, I'm th. tho, I'm tho, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th th th th th th th th. th. that, thi. thi. thi. thi. the. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the. the. I mean, I think specifically related to Westside Story, my being Afro Latina, that makes me especially proud of what I've been able to accomplish because we really are not represented on screen. And I don't think that any film is a perfect film, but I do think the fact that we, that my inclusion in this film

we're the beginnings of getting it right. I like that. And if Stephen can do it, one of the greatest directors of all time, because he is, then I think everybody else can. He's one of the greatest directors of all time, but you said no to him when he asked you to read lines in the audition. Well, I did. But that was simply because I had found out about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about about aboutto read lines in the audition. I did. But that was simply because I had found out about this audition very, very last minute. I was on Broadway at the time.

I was playing Donna Summer, which was a very challenging role for me and leading a company. It takes a lot out of you. And I don't make a habit of going into a room with any one in it, and being unprepared. Do you? Do you like being unprepared? But if I, like, that's a difference. If I walked into a room and Stephen Spielberg was in the room, let's say I walked into the elevator in this building, and then it was Stephen Spielberg,

and then he said, and then he said, Trevor, I need you to read these lines. I just read the lines. You said no. I said no, because I wanted, I was like, this is, I'm not prepared to show you a viable interpretation of this character. And I would rather do that than, I'd rather give you something that's usable, than give you something that's like, oh my god, thank you so much for coming in and next. Like, I want to, if I was going to do it, it already took a lot of guts for me to walk into the room because I didn't actually believe that I'd ever be considered for the job, let alone get the job, then I was going to do it and do

it well. In a way, I feel like you saying no to doing it incorrectly and wanting to do it your way and the best way possible is part of your character. Like that's who it is. That is who she is sort of is in West Side Story. It is, that is who she is at her heart. And I think a lot of my characters, like, there are different bits of me within them, and that is the part of me that is Anita.

So. Before I let you go, I'd love to talk about one of the most, just like amazing moments in film. And that is when a character who has created a moment in history. tha. thia. thia. thia., thi. that, that, that, that, thi. that, that, that, that, that, thi, that, thi, thi, that, thi, thi, that, that, that's, that's, that, that, thi, that's, that's, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, th. th. that, th. th. that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, thi. that's, thi. that's, that is when a character who has created a moment in history comes back to the film. Obviously I'm speaking about Rita Marino who comes back in Westside Story playing a different role but comes back as an executive producer and then you're in a scene with her. I wonder if that was a lot of pressure for you. Was there any moment that you shared with her where you were like, okay, this is my thing that I've sort of inherited from her

and I have the opportunity to turn it into what I want? I read, we spoke briefly at the beginning of the process, but she was very supportive. Thank God. She made me feel very comfortable and just encouraged me to bring everything that made me unique to the character and just let me, gave me permission in her own the the the their their their their their their their their their toe, toe, their, their, their, to, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, their, the, toe, toe, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, the the the, the the thin, the the the the te, the the the the tean, the the tean, the tean, tean, teanuuo, toe, to the character and just let me, gave me permission in her own energetic way to fly. And now the scene you're talking about is it's deep heavy subject matter. So I sort of shifted into just focusing on who the characters were and playing the truth of the characters because if I had actually thought about all right now you're going to yell at Ritom

I don't think anybody that hadn't have been me. I don't th think the think think think the think the think think the thi the thi th right, now you're going to yell at Ritomorino. I don't think anybody, if it hadn't been me, I don't think anybody would have been comfortable doing that. Well, you know what, you did it? You looked more than comfortable. I mean, you're just sailing and congratulations on the award. Congratulations on the award. Thank you for joining me on the show. Thanks for having me. Finding great candidates to hire can be like trying to find a needle in a haystack. You might get a lot of resumes, but not enough candidates with the right skills or experience.

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Listen on the IHeart Radio App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. James Corden! Finally! Finally! I'm so happy to be here. So I am beyond excited to have you here. Because like, you have come in and genuinely changed in many ways the people perceive not just late night but television. Because I remember when you started on the show, everyone was like, oh who's this guy? He's starting at like 1237 at night and what's this thing going to be?

And overnight, you took what was once considered a fringe time slot and turned it into the biggest explosion thanks to your ideas including Carpool Karaoke. Have like, like, like, yeah, like, Has that changed the way you see the medium as a whole? Uh, I don't think so. I think we always thought that's what we were going to do. Oh, really? We were going to try to. You know, we didn't know that it would, it would happen.

We had no idea that it would or could happen as it did. But our, I mean, essentially, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that that that it would, that that would would would would would would would would would, that it would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that it would, that would, that would, that would that would that would that would that would that would that would would that would that would that would that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, that would, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to that would, that would, that would, that would ego won't allow me to recognize that I'm making a show that airs at 1237 at night. If I think about that too long, I'll just really get depressed. So we were like, well there's nothing we can do about that, so we can, hang on, wait the internet, we'll use that. And so we only really think of our show as not really being in a time stop. We th as as as as as as as as well, we th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th as on, wait the internet, we'll use that. And so we only really think of our show as not really being in a time stop. We think of it as well, it launches at that time and people can find it whenever they want to,

whether that's years down the line or days or the next morning on their journey to work, lunch break, whenever. It's the kind of wonderful thing about makingthis right now in this particular time. Definitely, definitely. And here's the thing, it's not just about time. I think it's also about place. You know, your show was one of the first that really blew up on an international level the same way. Everywhere you went, people were talking about carpool karaoke. They had the sense of what, you know, a rap battle was,

the thii. A lot of people don't know this. You guys struggle to get people on that show. Oh, we couldn't get anybody. Yeah, we couldn't get, I mean, honestly. Because now everyone's like, James, when am I coming on your show? Yeah, it's kind of lovely. But we couldn't, I mean, honestly, I really always believed in the idea. I always thought, oh, I could. game actually you can play with the audience. If everybody in the audience, if everybody now, just in your own mind, don't say it out loud, just and you do it Trevor, just think of a, think of a recording artist, a living recording

artist. Has everybody got one? They said no. And it's not a lie, it's the true, absolute truth. And so then we, we, and it was just a chance meeting with Mariah Carey's publicist and she was about to put some new dates on in Vegas and I showed her a clip of me doing it in a sketch with George Michael that I'd done at home for a comic relief. And, um, and she loved George Michael and I was like, if it's good enough for George, it's good enough for me. And that was it. And nobody thought that it would ever become the thing that it's kind of become, but it's kind of, it's crazy.

It really is amazing. I mean, it's gone from just being musicians to politicians. I mean, Michelle Obama has done it. You know, you've had Tom Hanks on the show. You've had, everyone, it's become this thing that is larger than life. The next step you do realize is you and the Pope in the Pope Mobile. Oh man. And you just can, you can only sing the one song. I would love that.

I would absolutely love it. I would love it. If he's watching the Tony's, I's, I's, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, th, not watching this, he'll be watching the Tony's on Sunday. So we'll talk, we'll really get, I would love nothing more than to do it with the Pope. That's something that I've loved about your show is that it really is an expression of all of your talents, right? So a lot of people were surprised. I remember the first, this James Cornyn guy can almost sing. And it's like, no, no, he can really sing. Which is shocked people, because there's some artists who've come in and been like, I'm gonna sing with this funny guy, and they're like, wait, wait, he's hitting the notes.

You sing better than some people, and then you have to dial it down. I won't say who, who, but you do. to do. to do, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, to. to. to. to. to. to. to, to, to, to, to. to, to, to. to, to, to. to, to. to, to, to say, to say, to to, to, to to to, to, to, to, to to to to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, their, their, their, their, their, their, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their, the the they. And, they. too, too, too, too, and, too, too, too, and, too, too, too, too, and, you're an actor, you're a performer and you've loved theater your whole life. Yeah, I mean I'd never really hosted, I used to host a show back in the UK which you came on actually but that was my only real time hosting anything but really what I'd ever do is be in plays or I would write you know sitcoms and things in the thi thii. I'm thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. I'm thi. I'm thi. I'm thi. I've thi. I'm their thi. I've tho-I've their their their their their their their their their their their their their I've their their their I've their I've their I've their I've their I've their I've their I I I I I I I I've their I I I've I've thi. I've I've I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm thi. I'm thi. I've thoo-I tho-I've toda' today today tho-I've tho-I've tho-I've never never never never never tho-I've tho-I've tho-I thes in the UK, I never thought that I would, it never even entered my brain in the same way that I don't think it entered yours in any way, that you think, Oh, I would host a daily show in America. It feels too far away. It feels too far. It's out of reach somehow, you know, and I think we both had that feeling when, because we essentially got announced at basically the same time, right, right, right, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, because, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I... And, I. And, I was, I. And, I was, the, the, the, the, the. Oh, the. Oh, the. Oh, the. Oh, the. Oh, the. Oh, no, no, no, the. Oh, no, no, the. Oh, the. Oh, oh, the. Oh, the, I was, I'm. the same time, right? And it was both who the hell are these guys. Yes, I remember this. And we both had to really deal with that in that own way. Yes, definitely.

But yeah, I would love to go back and act at some point and go and do a play again. Every time I come here to New York and I try and go to the theater as much as I can, I'm going to go tonight and I miss it, I miss it hugely, but at the same time I feel in no place where I want to stop this kind of glorious journey that I'm on at the minute. I love it. I don't know what I've done to sort of deserve such memories, do you know what mean? That's how it feels every day really. That's beautiful, ma'am. But the Tony's is like an expression of a world that you've adored for a long time. This is your second time hosting. What's impressive is that you're doing the Tony's and you've done the Grammys. It feels like you have more fun at the Tonies.

The Grammys are fun, but it feels like you have more fun at the Tony's. What makes them special? That's the first real big difference between the Grammys and the Tony's, is everybody wants to be there and they're thrilled that they're all doing this. No one's going, I didn't fucking win, what, you know? So it's a very, very supportive community. That entire community of Broadway, they are, these are a load of people who are squeezed into 12 blocks. Back-to-back theaters and they know each other and they're friends.

And these are people who eight times a week. Like, look, you think you work hard. I think I work hard. But like, when you're doing a play or a musical, eight times a week with one day off, that is absolute graft. And the reason I want to really really really really really really really really really really really really really really try try try to really to really try to really to really try the to really to really to really to really to really the to really try try to really to really try try to really try to to thi thi the the the thi-a thi-a thi-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-s, the the the the the the the the the the the the thoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo'-seeee..-seo-s. thoooooooooo'-s.. the reason I want to really try and make it the best show I can is I believe that per square meter there is no room on earth That it holds as many talented people as that that room does and it's a show where and I think you're just want to celebrate

These people who are so gifted they are so talented they are so talented that they put on a show on a the show on a the show on a the show on a th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. tho. tho. tho. their?? tho. thi. their? thi. tho. their. tho. tho. their. their. their. their. to to??? to to?? to? to? to? to their. to their. their. their. their. their. their. their. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their. their. their. their. their. too. too. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. te. t. And in a world where we are living increasingly on our phones and tablets, iPads, all those things, we are all searching for a live collective experience and experience to be together. And these are the people that provide that. So we're really going to try and make the best and biggest show we can. I've had real moments this week. I thought I should have just the the th have just th have just th have just th have just th have just th have just th th th th th th th th th th th just th just tho tho tho tho that that that th best and biggest show we can. I mean it's terrifying. I've had real moments this week where I thought, oh I should have just left it at the one I did with Hamilton and that was a real success. You know, I should have just gone out there, but I really hope we're going to do it, we're certainly going to stop at nothing to make it a celebration of a group of people that I think at the absolute minimum deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve deserve, at a the to be, at a the the the to, at, at, at, I, at, at, at, I, their, thi, I, I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, thi, thi, their, thi, thi, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, to, to thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, their, their, their, their, the absolute minimum deserve to be celebrated on television at least once a year. I'll tell you this, I've never seen James Quarden not do something at 110%

so it's going to rock man. We'll see it at the show. I hope so. Thanks. Thank you for bringing the show. Finding great candidates to hire can be like trying to find a needle in a haystack. You might get a lot of resumes, but not enough candidates with try it for free at Zip Recruiter. dot com slash Zip Recruiters smart technology identifies top talent for your roles quickly. Immediately after you post your job, Zip Recruiters powerful matching technology starts showing you qualified people for it, and you can use Zip Recruiter's pre-written invite to apply message to personally reach out to your favorite candidates and encourage them to apply sooner.

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I'm Tim Harford, host of the Cautionary Tales podcast, and I'm exploring that very question. Join me for my new miniseries on the Art of Fairness. We'll travel from New York to Tahiti to India on a quest to learn how to succeed without being a jerk. We'll examine stories of villains undone by their villainy and monstrous self-devaring egos, and we'll delve into their villainy, and monstrous, self-deviring egos, and will delve into the extraordinary power of decency. We'll face mutiny on the vast Pacific Ocean, blaze a trail with a pioneering skyscraper, and dare to confront a formidable empire. The art of fairness on cautionary tales.

Listen on the I-Heart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. My guest tonight is Pulitzer Prize winning playwrights Michael R. Jackson. He's here to talk about his smash hit new musical, A Strange Loop, which is currently nominated for 11 Tony Awards. Please welcome Michael R. Jackson. Thank you for having me. Before we get into the show that you have created that is getting everybody buzzing, let's talk about the name.

Let's talk about it. How many people do you disappoint when you show up? I mean, like not now, obviously, now it's more of like'm surprised, but like Michael R. Jackson, people just see Michael Jackson. I don't know. I think like I always get people to perk up a little bit when I'm like. Oh, my name precedes me. You just show that Mr. Jackson. Yeah. And then, um, was the R was always there, I'm always always there I'm always. I kind was always always the R always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always always the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I th. I th. I thr thr thr thr thr thr thr thr thr the throooooooooo th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I'm assuming. I kind of dropped it in there to make a distinction. Well that's on Facebook on them I'm the living Michael Jackson. I like that. It's the only other person who I think has is Michael B. Jordan. That's right. Right. Right. He interned all my children when he was like a kid working there. It's really there. There's a connection. Look at it all the famous names. the famous names. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the only only only only only the only the the only only the only only o' the only only only o' the only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only only. the o. the o' the o' the only only. the o' the o' the o' the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous famous names. the famous names. the famous names. the famous famous names. the famous names. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous. the famous famous names. the famous names. the famous. the famous. the famous famous. the famous. the famous. the to create their own famous things and that's exactly what you've done. A Strange Loop. Congratulations, 11 Tony Award nomination. Thank you.

Thank you. I have the pleasure of seeing this production and I can't even explain it to people. But you know what I love about it is it makes me seem cool when I recommend it, you know? No, no, no, no, because you know, in this world, there's not many things you can recommend to people that'll have them leaving, feeling like you're so cool because you told them to go. Everyone I tell to see this goes and sees it, and then they're like, Trevor, oh, thank you. So, that's was going to be the hit that it is? Um, not even close. Like, it was like not on my vision board even a little bit. So it was really exciting. But you took 20 years to write it.

Yeah, almost. Yeah, that's wild. George R.R. Martin would be like, yeah, I know what it's like. It's like a. I would love to know where this, where this idea, where this idea, where this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, this idea, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th. It th. It th. It th, th. It th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th, th. th. th, th, th, th. th. th, th. th, th. th. th. th. th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to toeei. to. to. to. to to to to to to to to the joy of the show is that you won't really know what it's about and you'll just be in a story but what we can tell people is it is a story of a gay black man who is in the world of theater and he's in the world of being black and in the world of being gay but it come into and every gay black fat yes and you talk about that in the show yeah one of the funniest shows I've the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's thi. It's thi. It's thi. It's thi. It's thi. thi. thi. thi. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. th. It's th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's thin. It's thin. It's the. It's a the. to the to the to to the the the the the the the the the theeeee. the the. the. the. th and you talk about that in the show. Yeah. Yeah. One of the funniest shows I've ever seen, one of the most poignant shows I've ever seen, people crying, people laughing. Like, I see why it took 20 years. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it just started off, you know, I was about

23 years old. I'm 41 now. And I had just graduated from undergrad playwriting, the NYU. I didn't know what I was going to do do do do do do do do do do do the the the tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho thin thin thin thin, I was going th. I was going th. I was going th. I was going that I was that I was going that I was going that I was that I was that I was that I was that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I that I see th. I see th. I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see took. I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I see why I was going th. I was going that I was going that I was going to do with the BFA degree. I was living in this old lady's bungalow style house in the middle of nowhere Jamaica Queens, which if you live in New York, that's like all the way to the end of the E or the F train and then you take a bus that's like 10 minutes to get to the house. It was crazy. And I was just like, didn't know what, I was just, I was, I was, I was, I was, I didn't, tho, tho, tho, th. th. th. th. the thin, th. thin, the thi, thi, that, the to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, thr-a, the to, to, to, to, to, to, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, all, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, all, like, like, all, like, all, all, like, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, all, and it was just about, you know, a young black gay man walking around New York wondering my life is so terrible. So, and sort of the show sprang from that sort of primordial soup. I didn't know that it was, it was true that you worked as an usher at the Lion King. Yeah, I worked at, when the Lion King and a year of Mary Poppins and then I did a couple years later a seasonal sin of Aladdin So I ran through the whole Disney pantheon

What was there anything that was anything that you saw where you were like? I don't ever want to see this again the Broadway show so I'm gonna create something differently or was there something you saw that? that made you want to create the show the way you did? Well well? Well? Well? Well? Well, well? of both. It was a strange loop. Ooh. Ooh, I like what you did there. Okay, okay. Yeah, like, you know, you're standing in the back of the theater, you're ringing the bells, you're watching an audience night after night after night, show after show, you get a little

bored. But luckily, you know, I was there with my thoughts and just sort of thinking through the show, we used to have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have have the to the show, I used to, we used to have the stuff to play bills, and sometimes I would write little ideas for, that would go into the show on the back of the inserts for like, today that this understudies in or whatever, and I would collect them and they would be in all my pockets when I got home. But so it was wild, know, I saw so many people in the audience

who were touched for different reasons. You know, if people grew up in a religious family, I saw them connecting with the show in a different way. If people, you know, had issues with their identity growing up, maybe they were bullied, maybe they're struggling trying to get by, you're trying to find friends, love, all of these themes are touched on. And I watched people in the audience feel something. I watched everyone walked out, just making sounds.

That's when you know. No one said anything. Everyone was just like, oh, oh, ah, oh, it was beautiful. But then I wondered what you got by creating. Like for yourself, did it change anything in your world? I mean, I guess for me, the best part of the show has been actually talking to people after, when like when it lets out, because what I've been finding is that for some people, the show is a mirror,

and for other people the show is a window, and that seeing people there together, experiencing the same thing but through those th th th tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, and, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, to, togu, togu..... togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. togu. together experiencing the same thing but through those two different lenses has been creates a really powerful energy that sort of goes up onto the state, goes to the actors on stage and they send it back and it really brings the audience into the loop of the show of the characters mind that we're in as we're watching. You had a great, I forget was the phrase you called it. You said it was like a, it was a big, gay, black and queer ass American Broadway show. I love that. I love that.

I love that. You know what I loved about it? Yeah, it was. It was what you just said. Was what you just said. I've seen some shows where, you know, if an audience is, let they don't enjoy it as much, or if the audience is black, maybe they get it more or less. This was one of those shows where everyone was enjoying it from a different perspective. Yeah, there's a lot of different reference points sort of in it because that's kind of

what it's like to be a person. You're made up of all of your reference points, your history, your different the main character Usher, that's his name, he loves a lot of different things and he hates a lot of different things. And so my sort of hope was by exposing the audience to that everybody can sort of meet Usher and the show, and the show, and the show is sort of promoting a spirit of inclusion for anybody who decides to come in and stick it out. I don't think anybody's sticking it out. I will tell you not, no, and the the their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their, their, their, their, their, their, their, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. their, thi. thi. thi, thi, their, thi. thi. thi, thi. thi, thi. thi. thi, thi, thi. thi. their, their, their, their, their, their thi. their their thi. thi. thi. thi. thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii. thi. thi. stick it out. I don't think anybody sticking it out. I will tell you not, no, genuinely. There's some difficult moments for some people. But you know what, I think that's what made it so amazing is it's not difficult, it's not difficult for the sake

of being difficult, it's difficult in like a life way. It's not, it's not at all. And I've seen shows where audiences go, I'm uncomfortable, I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've th. I've that I've that I've that I've that I've that's th. I've th. I've that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I the the the the the the the the the the the the the their their their their their their their their their their th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I thi. I th. I thi. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I ah, I'm uncomfortable. But here it was people experiencing the discomfort that somebody else may be living through. Yeah, because that's what the character and I am trying to do, is we're trying to get the audience to feel what it's like to walk in the skin that they may not be, either that they don't feel familiar with, or that they feel familiar with, but feel unseen, unheard or misunderstood. It's phenomenal. It's one of the funniest, most intelligent, just everything in this is that you put.

I hope you win every single Tony Award that you're nominated for. Congratulations. Everyone needs to go watch the show. Thank you for being here. Explore more shows from the Daily Show from the Daily Show, weeknights at 11, 10 Central on Comedy, th, th, the comedy, and the comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and comedy, and the your podcasts. Watch the Daily Show weeknights at 11, 10 Central on Comedy Central, and stream full episodes anytime on Fairmount Plus. This has been a Comedy Central podcast.