The Daily Show: Ears Edition - Jim Sciutto On Talking With Russia and China | Byron Tau Chats Tech & Government Surveillance

Episode Date: March 31, 2024

Jordan Klepper sits with CNN anchor, chief national security analyst, and bestselling author, Jim Sciutto, to discuss his new book "The Return of Great Powers: Russia, China, and the Next World War." Plus, NOTUS Investigative reporter, Byron Tau, joins Jordan to talk about his new book, "Means of Control." They chat about how technology companies house our data and Tau offers tips that anyone can use to limit the amount personal information we give to these companies.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey everybody, John Stewart here. I am here to tell you about my new podcast, The Weekly Show, coming out every Thursday. We're going to be talking about the election, earnings calls. What are they talking about on these earnings calls? We're going to be talking about ingredient to bread ratio on sandwiches. I know you have a lot of options as far as podcasts go, but how many of them come out on Thursday. Listen to the weekly show with John Stewart, wherever you get your podcast. You're listening to Comedy Central. My guest tonight is a CNN anchor, Chief National Security Analyst and Best Selling Author

whose latest book is called The Return of Great Powers, Russia, China, and the Next World War. Please welcome Jim Chudo. We have it here. Return of the Great Powers, Russia, China, and the next, the next world war. What are we talking? Is this going to be a cold war, a hot war? It's an uplifting story, you know, something that's on the Sunday afternoon. It's a lovely read that I read to my kid, just to scare him to do better in school, to be honest. It's a warning, right? And I've spent a lot of years in these places, tracking these things, which I think we have to be concerned about. So it's meant to be a warning and I think it's a serious one, but I also think

going into it, we, that is the people who want a world not run by autocrats, right? Which is about half of us maybe even more, maybe even more, we have some advantages, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, we have, th, th, th, th. th. to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to be, to be, to be a to be a to, to be a to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to to, to to, to, to, to into it right so so I Direct over time to ways that we could find a way forward right avoid the next world war But also come out on top with the things that we hold valuable It provides in some ways a blueprint to to get past that but also looks back as how we've gotten where we are right now you're focusing a lot about where we are in this moment with Ukraine, talk about where we are with China. You call this a post-post-Cold War moment. How do you draw that line from the Cold War to the post-Post-Cold War? So, you know, for my generation, and you're younger than me, but still. 20s, Max.

We remember that fall of the wall, 1989, followed the Berlin Wall, collapse of the Soviet Union. This was, we thought, bringing about a period of peace, and it did for a time, right? I mean, the Cold War was over, and for a very brief moment in time, the US and Russia, if not friends, found a way to go forward. And with China, even as it was growing more powerful. We thought that Russia and China, that we could work with them all the time.

And there's still ways we could work with them, but we thought that they wanted what we wanted, right? We were mirroring to some extent. And the truth is, they don't really want what we want to a large degree, because they see it, and to be fair, they're seeing this from a different perspective. They see our world as th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. the. the. the. theee. thea. theea. theeea. thee. thoooooooooooooooooooooo. theirs. So they see it as in their interests to make America weaker and to undermine that system. Now that'd be clear when I talk to folks, you know, in Europe, in Asia, here in the US, they don't believe that China and Russia want to go to war with us, right? They're you know, they're smart enough people to know that would be a horrible war to be a hot one. That said, they're willing to push the limits pretty far. I mean, one that we saw just the last few years, right, is the largest invasion, the largest land war in Europe in 80 years, right? I mean, that's a pretty big deal. And that shows how of these pathways.

Well, listen, post 9-11, that was a period when the U.S. and Russia actually worked together on terror. They were sharing information and so on. And it showed that there are times that you have shared interests, and that's a good thing. And there are other things too. The U.S. and times, at times, work toguuuu. thogu. thogu. th. th. thi. th. thi. thi. that's thi. that was a thi. thi. Ti. Thes. Thes. Thes. Thea. Tha. Tha. Tha. Tha. Tha. that was a that was a thi. thi. that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a tho that was a thi. Tha thi. That was a thi. That was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a that was a th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. th. th. things that we don't work together on or like at log our heads on. That period with Russia has certainly ended to the point where the reporting is that the US actually warned Russia that an attack like this was in the offing and Putin basically ignored that warning. That's partly a lack of trust, which is important. It's partly a lack of communication that those channels of one of the dangerous trends here is that we don't talk in ways that we used to.

And I'm not necessarily talking about happy talk, right? But we don't have hotlines open that we used to, which are important to keep small things from becoming bigger things. And those hotlines developed because in the last cold war, we got really damn close, right? And you think the Cuban missile crisis, right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right, and I that's, and I, and I, and I, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I's, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and th. And, and th. And, and th. And, and th. And, and th. And, and th. And, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, theean, thean, thean, thean, thean, thean, thean, thean, thean, that was very, and I talk about this in the book, because it's about learning lessons from history as well, but that came close to it to a global nuclear war. And after that, folks like Kennedy even Khrushchev said, we got to find ways that doesn't have, we don't get that close. Let's have to have hot lines of thea. the the. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to be. toehea. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. the. thea. thea. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. to way, we're not going this way. I mean it's interesting you do talk a lot about that. You have to keep these lines of communication open and you also have a chapter or you look at this madman theory. Donald Trump brags about

the relationship that he has with Vladimir Putin. He brags about what he did with Kim Jong-un. And I think on one hand you can see through what that means and what he wants from that. On the other hand, he's talking about legitimate connections. You actually even talk about some of the successes Trump had with his relationship with Kim John Oon. And this madman theory in some sense of being so big, so braggadocio, that tactically, that sometimes can be beneficial in ways that other tactics can't. True. Listen, Opening channels is not a bad thing, or, thi. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. their, their. their, their, their, their, tru and, the their, their tru. tru. tru. tre, tre, tru. tru. their some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some some. So, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the thi. So, tip. So, thea. thau. toda. tru. tru. trueu. trueu. tru. And, tru. And, tapeooooooom. And, thau. And, thea. Ande. And, thea. Listen, opening channels is not a bad thing, right? You know, sitting down with Kim Jong-un is not a bad thing or with Putin or she. We have to be talking. That's better than not talking because when you don't talk, I mean, that's true relationships as well, right? when you don't talk. Jim, stay focused. the small things. Jim, we got to talk. Talking is not bad, but you also have to have realistic expectations. So Trump had three face-to-face meeting with Kim Jong-un went nowhere, right? There were no agreements, but sheer force of personality is not going to change their long-term interest. The worrisome thing, right, is that for Russia and China, these are strategic decisions to undermine the U.S. and the system as it stands today, again, because they, because, because, they, they, they, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, thiiiiii, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, thr-a, thi, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thr, thr, thr, thr, thr, thr. thrue, thr. th. th. We, th. We, th. We's, thi. We's, to to to to to toe. We's, toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toeeeeea. toei. toei. toei. toei. toei. toeeea. toea. thr. thr. We again, because they look at it as aligned against them, kind of skewed against them.

So the strongest personality in the world is not going to change long-term strategic interests, right? And if Trump imagines, as he does, and by the way, don't trust me, I talked to folks who advised him at the most senior levels in his last administration, if tru- personality alone, he's going to fundamentally change that dynamic. It just doesn't line up with reality, right? Doesn't mean talking is a bad idea, but you have to know who you're dealing with here and you have to know what they're seeking to do and you have to be clear to say I'm not going to let that happen. Yeah, you talked to a lot of out of NATO. And I think you kind of walk through how close that was to becoming a reality. And when I find compelling, like, that's a big issue right now.

And I will say when I go out and I talk to people at MAGA events, you know, there's an isolationist attitude, to say the least. But I do think a lot of people don't, when you bring up something like NATO, the idea of pulling out of NATO is a no-brainer. We want to be to ourselves, it doesn't serve us any, it doesn't do us any good. And I will also say as a younger generation, as somebody who's 24 as you pointed out, like the conversation my school about the Cold War was short. Our understanding of NATO, we don't have, we are so disconnected from the realities of what that was created for, that I think like the discussions we're having right now about the importance of NATO are falling on deaf ears on one party and one candidate, but

also on deaf ears on, I think, an electorate that isn't educated in history in a way to understand what NATO is supposed to do. Is this also a crisis of education? 100%. I mean, you know as well as me that the baseball bat doesn't work, right, when you're trying to convince people of the importance of these things or how it's served our interests over time. We have just remind people and make an argument as to what we have. I think when you look at a lot of time there. They're lovely people, right? They don't want much more than what we have, which is to be able to choose your own leaders,

travel where you want to go, and not get dumped off of building balconies, right, if you write a critical piece about the person charged the country. I might be speaking about how Russia, don't want to live under that. So you have, you know, you have a sympathetic case as to why to help these people or why to help the Taiwanese people defend themselves from China. But then you have a self-interested case, which is that, you know, NATO has stood by the US. The only time NATO has invoked its mutual defense agreement was post 9-11 and they went to war with us in, that, but also a peaceful Europe that is free from Russian domination is in our interest.

It's a vibrant Europe, it's an economically healthy Europe. We sell a lot of stuff there, we could go do business there, we could send our kids to semesters abroad there, that kind of thing, things we buy or cheaper here because it's peaceful there. And you can say the same thing about Asia. Half the stuff in our homes comes through shipping lanes in Asia, which the U.S. helps keep open. So you have both a sympathetic case to make for this kind of thing and a values case, but you also have a self-interested case because we benefited that from that for years. And not just since the last cold war, but even going back to like 80 years ago, post-World War II, that NATO and other treaties help keep the peace pretty much. It's not perfect, but they did prevent so far, right,

you know, the next world war. That's important, we benefit from that. You talked about this not just being a donor. There is a blueprint for some optimism there. Where do you see that? So a couple things. One, we don't want to lookthe Ukraine invasion, you probably heard this too, a lot of folks were like, Putin's way too smart to do that.

He's playing three-dimensional chess with the West, all that kind stuff. He would never do it. Lo, behold, he invades. I also think nobody knows how chess works. Exactly. People use that. Stay focused, Jim. Stay focused. So, you know, they make mistakes too. And he got himself in a horrible war, which, you know, he's effectively losing, right?

And China makes mistakes as well, and its economy is, right? You know, it's definitely flattening out. This idea that China is going to be growing. They've got weaknesses as well. So you want to start with, we have advantages. The U.S. economy economy is is is growing US economy is growing. You know, we have an open society. People buy and want to buy American stuff, right? They don't want to buy Russian cell phones, right? We, we, we, um, there's a reason for that, right? I haven't tried one. I might blow up. They might blow up.

They might blow up. So we have advantages in that sense. of friends and allies. One thing when you look at Russia and China, they don't have allies. I mean, Russia's biggest allies right now are China, North Korea and Iran. I mean, we have all of Europe, in effect, on our side, we're shared values. So we have advantages going in. And then in terms of how to find a path so that we don't go to war. I mean, people ask me this, we came on I've got a 13 year old and 15 year old boy they're like a minute away from draft age and I'm sure folks in the audience who have kids think the same thing you don't you don't want them on a US aircraft carrier in the

Taiwan straight if the US and China were to go to war I don't want that I don't want that either but we can learn from history here th. th. th. their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. the reason why Kennedy and Khrushchev were like, we got really close. I gotta have a phone on my desk. You gotta have a phone on your desk so this doesn't happen again. Those things have faded over time. And with China in a lot of respects we haven't had them, they've come and gone when relationships have gone up and down. So communication matters.

Treaties matter. We negotiated those nuclear arms treaties again to keep the US and Russia from going to war and kind of like just beating each other to death in a nuclear arms race. A lot of those treaties have gone away in the last several years and there are Americans. They're Americans that are like, we don't need those treaties. Well, actually, they kind of help, right? And we have no treaties regarding weapons in space. I mean, Russia just, you know, probably saw our story a few weeks ago, talked about putting a nuke in space to knock out satellites, which, by the way, just so you know, if you think about this war being a million miles away from us, you know, with cyber attacks or with attacks in space, we lose all the technology we depend on every day. Gps and GPS and communications and internet and the financial financial market market market market market market. the financial. the financial. the financial. the financial. thapapapapapapapapapapapapapapape. So. their. the th. their. their. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. their. their. th. their. their. their. their their th. th. th. their th. th. th. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. te. te. We are. te. We're te. We're te. te. te. We're. their. their. te. too. too. too. to. the financial market stops. So, you know, this stuff affects us at home.

We need treaties for that stuff. We were heading to the good news and you just mentioned. You mentioned a nuclear weapon in space. This is why my kids love talking to their dad's school about. But the final thing is that you can, with those treaties, they can help, they can help this going down a bad path. And the final thing is that communicating what you want stand won't stand for matters, right? I mean, if you look, I speak a lot to the Estonian prime minister here. Estonia is like right on the front lines of this, expecting that he'll be its last meal. The thing is, the parallels between a Hitler and a Putin is that if you give a little ground, he tends to take more.

You know, he took a piece of Georgia in 2008, and he took a Ukraine in 2014, then invaded again. The clear communication, and we learn this from Hitler, you know, if you are soft and don't tell them what's too far for you, they might then take advantage and move forward. So the US, I think, and its allies can be confident and say, we're not going to allow you to invade countries because borders matter to us and they're our friends. And we're going to stand on the way and the costs are going to be high for you. That doesn't necessarily mean we're going to go to go to go go to go. means, but that we defend our friends and we're going to be strong. And those messages matter over time.

And if you look back, sometimes clear messaging can prevent miscalculation and can prevent the guy on the other side thinking he could take advantage of you. Well, it's a great read. The return of great powers available now. Be sure to check out CNN Newsroom on Max, Jim Schuett. Thanks so much. Thank you guys. Jim Shootout. Thanks so much. Take a quick break, everybody. We're back right after this. Hey everybody, John Stewart here.

I am here to tell you about my new podcast, the weekly show coming out every Thursday. We're going to be talking about the election, earnings calls. What are they talking about on these earnings calls? We're going to be talking about ingredient to bread ratio on sandwiches. I know you have a lot of options as far as podcasts go, but how many of them come out on Thursday. Listen to the weekly show with John Stewart wherever you get your podcast. My guest tonight is an investigative reporter at notice whose new book is called Means of Control, How the Hidden Alliance of Tech and Government is creating a new American

surveillance state. Please welcome Byron Tau. Byron. By run. By run. By the way. This book scared me. This book scared me, okay?

I gotta be real honest. It's scared me, it's fascinating. I don't want to scare people away, but there was a lot of revelatory things in here. Now, I have some skepticism and I understand that technology, a lot of times, these tech world, these tech apps, they're tracking me. They have a lot of data. I understand the government. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe not always, maybe not always above board, but you found a way to put these two together, like a ham

and cheese sandwich of paranoia. And tell me, I feel like a lot of this starts, what started to surprise me, starts here at these digital advertising exchanges, right? Start, start with me there. What do I need to understand about a digital advertising, thapapapapapap that you see every time you load an app or a website, that's tracking you in more ways than one. Every time you load something like that and you see a little display ad, you're actually passing a ton of information back to these technology companies that are vacuuming it, they're trying to build profiles of profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles the profiles th profiles th profiles th profiles th profiles tho profiles tho tho thous profiles thous profiles thous thous thous thoustechnology companies that are vacuuming it up, they're collecting it,

they're trying to build profiles of you, and there are thousands of them that are all getting this data every time you load an app. And some of those entities are actually saving that data, they're brokering it, it's become a big business model, so they're selling it to other entities. So whenever you give a weather app permission to know your location, your location is actually being passed back to this mind-numbingly complex system of digital advertising. And there are thousands of parties there that can collect it, even if they're not the one that serves to the ad.

And so a lot of data is saved and resold. And so what you're telling me here is, well, some of that I assume, right? I open up that weather app, oh, it knows it's cold here, it's going to sell me a parka, right? It also knows that I'm cheap, so it's going to have to be a cheap parka, right? These are what these phones do. You talk about, the government has decided, well, we can't, we can't, we can't, we can't, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, we can, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi, that, th. th. th. th. th. th. tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, th. I, th. I, th. I, th. I, th. I, th. I, th. I, th. I, th, th, th, th. I, th. I, th. Oh, th. It, th. It, th. It, th. It, th. It's, th. It's, th. tho, tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. thoo. thooo. thoo. tho me these shoes for my gout-riddled feet. Perhaps I share too much, they already know. But how is the government getting in on this action?

Sure, so there's a lot of ways government gets data from things like digital advertisers. So sometimes they just buy it from these data brokers that sit there and they slurp it all up. Sometimes government contractors set up things like things that look like marketing companies and they get access to these ad networks and they provide the data to the government. Sometimes governments hack into these systems. So there's lots and lots of ways for governments to get data off of these networks and

often they just simply need to open their wallets and buy it. Is this legal? This is by and large considered legal because when the government acts as a buyer in a consumer market lawyers have tended to take the position that you've lost the reasonable expectation of privacy that's core to your Fourth Amendment rights, right? Like you've already told something like a digital advertiser or a bank or some other company something about yourself or the information that you're generating, so what privacy interests do you have in it? And if it's available for sale and the government's buying it just like any other buyer, most lawyers have

blessed these kind of programs. You go into the apps like Grinder and and initially as... I, in the book, that's no judgment. No judgment. No judgment, no judgment. In the book you talk about apps like Grindr, right? And how that data was suddenly being used for nefarious purposes. And you even talk about a Catholic blog essentially that purges

information on a bishop and then publishes that and outs that bishop and gets that bishop fire, right? Is that some of the, like what are some of the examples of these nefar-these, this information being used for nefarious purposes? Yeah, so with that grinder is out there selling its users data. It's that Grinder wants to serve ads to its users like many other apps, but when you serve ads you are exposing all of your users to these thousands of advertisers, these entities that can collect this information, and again some of them sell it, and some of them sell it to people that they don't look very closely at. And so in this instance, there were th th the the the th th the the the the the the the the the the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, their their their their their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the, thr--i.. thri. thri. thrownean. thri. thri. thean. thean. thean. thean. thean. the. the. And so in this instance, there were a bunch of Catholic journalists who had received tips from people who had acquired this data through purchasing it, and they were going around and

they were saying something like, you know, we have a lead on some priests that might be using Grindr and violating their vows. And one of those journalists bid on it and published a story about this and this Catholic official had to resign. And this is true of not just Grinder, but basically any app where we share our location and it wants to service banner advertising, we're sharing a ton of data with them and whoever's out there and is, you know, has access to it, can buy it. Now, you mentioned something here at the end of the book talking about the recent Dobbs decision, right, and right th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th. and th. And th. And th. And th. And th. And th. And thi. And thi. thi. thi. thi. thiol-upi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi, thi, thi, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, thi. thi. thi. toeea. toea. toea. toea. toea. thea. thea. thea. thea. the. the. the. the end of the book talking about the the recent Dobbs decision, right? And right now access to abortion services Is limited in some states people are crossing the state lines to get that is this the type of thing that you see as a harbinger for a A tactic or a tool for states to to purchase through advertisers ways in which to track people potentially?

they as a crime? Yeah, it's certainly possible that state governments who have decided that they want to make abortion unlawful and want to even take the step of potentially, you know, seeing what residents travel out of state. The sheer amount of data that's sloshing around about all of us all the time is a target for states like that. And it's entirely possible that states could either purchase data or, you know, you, you, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if they they they're, if they're, if they're, if they're, they're, they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they they they they they they they they they they they're they they they they, they they, they they they're they, they're they, they're they're they, they, they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're going their the, the, thateateateate, thateat, that, thateateat, that, their thateate, their their their their their they're the like that. And it's entirely possible that states could either purchase data or, you know, if they're going to go down the root of criminalizing traveling on a state for abortion,

they could simply subpoena it or go to court for it. And so it really does make it hard to move around the world anonymously these days, just because of all the data that we all generate every day. You talk about the privilege of disappearing. And you also talk, I mean, I guess I hear this, and I understand it, and it scares me. But I also, on the other hand, think, like, can we avoid this? Is this sort of the world we are in right now? And as a journalist, as an investigative journalist,

there's an element of secret. at least assumed with some of the conversations you have or what have you. In the book you talk about, you even went to go purchase a car and somebody who's researching a book about the ways in which people can weaponize data on you, purchasing a car that you already see ways in which that ties you to location. How do you go about a process of purchasing that and be an investigative journalist who cares about secrecy? Well, the poor Hyundai dealership that I walked in th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thed, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, their, thi, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, and, and, and, and their, their, and their, their, their, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi.ed, thi.ed, thi.ed, thii.ed thii.ed thi.ed thi.ed thi.ed their thi. thi. thi. Well, the poor Hyundai dealership that I walked into had no idea what they were getting into. Oh, great. Another investigative journalist on data brokerage. God damn it!

They didn't even know how to answer the questions I was asking. So, you know, I eventually made them go get a car from like two states over that didn, essentially, like the Bluetooth that's in the car, and also in the tires, right? So one thing people don't realize, but your tire is actually are broadcasting a little radio signal constantly. And it's there to tell the car essential computer that your tire pressure is to thehea......... I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. the. the. their. thehehehehehe. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. thea. tire. thea. thea. tire. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. their. their the the the the the the thea. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. tie. tie. the. the. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. t. ti. ti. ti. ti. tire. tire. tire. ti. tie. ti. ti. ti. ti. tire is a proxy for a car. That tire is screaming a unique identifier all the time. If we put a little sensor here, a little sensor there, a little sensor under a bridge,

a little sensor in a tunnel, we can track cars around based on their car tires. And car companies don't seem to realize that this is a vector for tracking and have never done anything to, you know, make these vehicles or make these systems work better for privacy. And they can sell that information to insurance companies? Yeah, so a lot, there's a big controversy now about selling car data to insurance companies. So car companies like GM were doing that, and they recently said they were stopping it to data brokers that were selling it it to insurance companies for public safety purposes it seems like governments are putting up these little sensors that might be able to track either your license plate

reader or your car tires or both or all sorts of other things that I don't even know about yes but yes this is entirely possible. So you have to take extra steps as an investigative journalist to keep this anonymity. Yeah and there are things that ordinary people th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the th. the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. the. the. to to to to to to to. to. to. to. to. the. the. the the. the the. the the. the. the to keep this anonymity. Yeah, and there are things that ordinary people can do, right? You can be a little bit more careful with the permissions on your phone. You know, not every game needs access to your 24-7 location, your photo roll and all this data about you, right? It'll work just fine without it. Every time you open the Uber app, you don't need to let it have your geolocation.

to to to type to type to type the to type the to type the address to type the address to type to type their their to type their to type their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're a aae their.shueue w w.shue w.s. the Uber app, you don't need to let it have your geolocation. You need to type the address that you're at. So you can do small things to reclaim privacy and make sure that parties that don't need your data don't get it. Now, as I read this, I thought about this, about secrecy, about ways in which you can take small steps. And then I saw your acknowledgments. And in your acknowledgments, you were very grateful to people who helped you write this book. And you said, the first words of this book were written on an Amtrak train between D.C. and New York.

A full chapter outline was completed at a rented farmhouse in Rizarstown, Maryland in January 22. The final few weeks of writing this first draft were spent in New York City at the work heights on Franklin Avenue. This is remarkably specific for someone who's worried about location. Nobody's perfect. Nobody's perfect. Well, it's a good read. It scared the bejesus out of me. I appreciate it.

Means of control is available now by Rintow. Explore more shows from the Daily Show Podcast Universe by searching the Daily Show, wherever you get your podcasts. Watch the Daily Show weeknights at 11, 10 Central on Comedy Central and stream full episodes anytime on Fairmount Plus. This has been a Comedy Central Podcast. Hey everybody, John Stewart here. I am here to tell you about my new podcast, The Weekly Show, coming out every Thursday.

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