The Daily Show: Ears Edition - Ronny Chieng's Chinatown Report & The Wave of Anti-Asian Racism - Beyond the Scenes

Episode Date: November 24, 2021

Ronny Chieng talks to Roy Wood Jr. about his viral response to a 2016 Fox News segment filled with racist Asian stereotypes and the rise in anti-Asian violence since then. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to Comedy Central. All right, so you know I like when you get a salad, right? You get a salad and then you get the dressing on the side so you can feel healthy when the truth is just you just going to put the dressing on a little bit by bite by bite and then the end of your salad. You get a salad and then you get the dressing on the side so you can feel healthy. When the truth is that you just you the th. You're th. You're th. You're the th. You're th. You're th. You're th. You're the th. You're th. You're the thi thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're the thi. You're the. You're the. You're the the thi. You're the the the the the the the the the the. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're the. You're th. You're th. You're the. You're the. You're the. You're the. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thi. You're thin. You're the. You're thin. You're the. You're the. You're thin. You're the. You're the the the the. You're when the truth is that you just going to put the dressing on a little bit bite by bite and then by the end of your salad you've already used all the dressing that was on the side. That's what this podcast is. This is the dressing on the side of the daily show. I'm Roywood Jr. This is beyond the topics and the discussions that we have on the daily show. thl. tho. tho. tho. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. the. the. the. the. the. the. thi. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the the the the. the the. the discussions that we have on the Daily Show. I sit down with correspondents, producers, writers, anybody that had anything to do with the piece happening, we talk to them on this show and you enjoy it and it is as delicious

as the Daily Show because it's on the side. It feels healthier, baby. Right now, you're getting a couple extra calories just listening to me What the hell am I talking about you don't care The piece we're going to go beyond on this week Is the O'Reilly factor getting racist in Chinatown? This is when Ronnie Chang responded to some racist-ass shit? That was on Fox News? If you didn't see the original segment, Jesse Waters from Fox News. This is during the 2016 election and Trump was talking China this, China that, and he went down to Chinatown to do what was supposed to be, quote-unquote, journalism and having a real discussion with Asian people, but really what he was doing

was exploiting people who did not speak English and then going around town partaking in all of then going around town, partaking in all of the different stuff that basically just highlighted a bunch of Asian stereotypes. He got a foot massage. He played with some nunchucks. He played Kung Fu fighting. And my man, Ronnie Chain caught wind of this shit, and he clapped back in a major way. Am I supposed to bow to say hello?

I like these watches. I like these watches. Are they hot? GCPenney, 398. Who are you going to vote for? Clinton wife? Clinton's wife has a name. What is it? Oh man, I forget it. Snap out of it. Do you know karate? Yeah, I know. Hit my hand. Oh, that's the spot. Is it the year of the dragon?

Rabbit? No, it's actually the year of the dragon? Rabbit? No, it's actually the year of Go F. Feek yourself. What the hell was that? How was that on the news? In fact, how is that even on TV?

Where the fuck did this come from? I mean, everyone's been wondering who would be the target of 2016's worst racism. I didn't even know Asians were in the running. Okay, so we're going to discuss the rise of anti-Asian hate in this country, where it came from, what we can do to stop it. And a little later on the program, we're going to be joined by Norman Chin, the CEO and co-founder of leading Asian Americans unite for change. But first, it is my pleasure to go beyond the scenes

with my office mate. He is my friend. He is, you're my day one, man. You're my day one for my first day at the daily show. You were right there. I think I beat you to the building by five minutes. Which makes me the senior correspondent. Because I beat you to the building by

five minutes on our first day. Ronnie you did this piece this is Ronnie Chang by the way Daily Show correspondent extraordinaire Ronnie Chang. Yeah thanks for talking about this man and you're my day one too. You and our good friends and we talk a lot in our office like we actually discussed at one one moment doing a podcast together of just us rambling and shit, just our rambles, but I think we both decided that we talk about a lot of stuff that should remain off the record. Yeah, I think you even say we should talk about it. You said you wanted to

install cameras and just keep it on record and then cut clips about what was, I was like, I don't want to do that. Yeah I want it to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the to the to the the the to the the to to to to the to to the to their. their their. their. tho. tho. th. to to th. to to to to their to to their to to their their their their their their their their their their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their their thr. thr. thr. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. tra. Yeah, I don't want to do that. Yeah, I wanted to big brother our office. Just a live stream of Roy and Ronnie just solving every problem, which speaking of solving problems, Ronnie, it's going to be a lot of you eating subway sandwich. That's what's going to be. Hey, we will discuss subway tuna. Okay, they said it's tuna. They just don't know which kind of tuna later, okay? They said it's tuna, they just don't know which kind of tuna. That's good, we're getting off sub- Ronnie, in 2016, why did you fail to solve Asian racism? Anti-Asian sentiment. Why did you fail? It was a bait and switch. I thought we solved it. I thought racism was over after that video and then, you know, they did a pump fake and then they went the other way and it came back.

They came back hard. Racism came back and went hard to the rim. You know what I mean? Racism like, it like broke the bad boy. It was down O2 like the Milwaukee Bucks. Yeah. And it came back hard. They came back so hard, yeah. We joke a lot in the show, but this was a piece that, you know, it was what we call in the Daily Show office is a quick turn.

This is where the news breaks. And rather than go through a formal booking, like, no. Ronnie was like, the camera, tha, tha, tha, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. I'm going to Chinatown. Just for the people who don't know who've missed a piece, give me the backstory on what lit this fire so fast. From the time this piece aired on Fox News, I think our response aired maybe 36 hours later, if that. Yeah, it was, yeah, yeah. So once things hit the Z-Gyce in American News, then it starts to enter the building a bit.

And this, the underlying story, which was the Fox News story, was actually causing so much grief in America that it hit the pop culture at Z-Gyze, and then that entered the building which, I mean, to be fair, it already entered the building the day before, but it started building overnight to the point where the Daily Show had had to address it to address it to address it to address it to address it to address it to address it to address it to address it the the the the the the the the the the the the, it already entered the building the day before, but it started building overnight to the point where the Daily Show had to address it. We decided to go to Chinatown to get the response of people from that neighborhood who were interviewed, the same neighborhood that was interviewed in the Fox News segment. And we went down and I was worried that, because in Singapore and Malaysia people get really apathetic about politics and they're very hesitant to be on screen and they're

very hesitant to be on screen talking about politics. So I didn't know if that would be the same thing we would face in New York City Chinatown. But what we found, the entire Daily Show team found, was that it was the exact opposite. Because as soon as we got to New York City, Chinatown, people, literally as soon as we got out of the car and I was dressed in the suit, and they, as soon as they saw me, they're like, hey, are you here to talk about that thing

that happened yesterday? And I was like, yeah, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, and they, they, they, they're, they're, they're, they're like, they're, they're, they're, they're, th an.... they're, they're, they're, th.. th. th. tho, tho, tho, tho, told..... told, told, told, told, told, told, told....... told.. told. told. told. told. told. told. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thr. thr. told. told. told. told, told, to. told, told, to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. over here. And then they brought us to the place in Chinatown. And people lined up around the block to talk to us. They lined up. So it was like, I didn't need to. Yeah, people don't normally line up to talk to us. So I literally, I was just standing there as people came one after the other to come and bitch about what happened yesterday. What are your thoughts on the Jesse Waters video on Fox News?

The chicken s-shunder who came down here and thought he was big shit because he talked to people who couldn't speak English? Yeah, that dushbag piece of shit. The one with no testicles, the one who came down here who said, let me talk to some old people and let me put them on camera without asking them and sort of put them on national television and made fun of them in the worst possible way, that asshole. Okay, I think we're talking about the same guy. Right, all right. What was the question again? I can't remember.

The whole idea, theymeathea's, the the the the the the thrown the thrown the thrown the thrown the thrown the thrown the thrown the thrown the they don't have sophisticated thoughts on politics and the way the country should be run. So that was the idea we were doing in Chinatown which was trying to get their opinions and in many cases we kind of asked them to speak Chinese or Cantonese just to make the point that you can have sophisticated thought in languages other than English and so yeah yeah, the response was, you know, it required almost no effort on that part. The streets, the streets did the talking on that one. You're more Zen dude than me. But the thing that I found most interesting about this piece for you was the lack of

anger from you as a correspondent. That's the thing I'm always suppressing. Like, like, when That's the thing I'm always suppressing. Like dude, when I'm about... Like when we did the Republican National Convention 2016 and we did the piece, when was America great? And I'm having to look at people, look me in my black ass eyes and tell me America was great during slavery and I'm trying not to re-ah. So when you went down to Chinatown on a piece as an Asian, was this personal? Was this a more personal piece for you? Yeah, yeah, I mean, it felt like a direct personal attack.

By the same time, you know, at the daily show, you know the drill man. It's like, we're like in the emergency room. It's like we see so much crap every day that you, in order to operate professionally, you become kind of desensitized and you're just here to treat the patients. And so we just keep seeing car crashes every single day. Eventually you're like, oh yeah. Like you have an objective view of it. And also, I was pretty pissed going back to the studio.

And I remember we brought the footage back, and this is again speaks to the team at the daily show is that we, we went out, we went th, we went th, we went th........ And, the team at the Daily Show is that we we went out to shoot went back edited wherever we shot wrote the the desk piece and on the same night right and we recorded it the same night like you and you know field pieces are usually separate to desk pieces but this was like the perfect merging of chat with Trevor and a desk piece and a and a field element and man on the street all in one day. I mean that's the you know for me and that was this is early on in my daily show I was maybe one year in and I was like man this is the daily show is best you know everything everyone's operating and firing in all cylinders in a very short time frame and sorry to answer your question about not being

pissed off I mean part of it is part of it is the job. And part of it is, I always feel like, because I'm a first generation immigrant to America, so I'm in America because by choice. Like, I want to be there. And so when I see shit go down, I see like, I also see, in this particular instance, yeah, you can say blatant racism, but the silver lining to this whole story was that, everyone, I, I, I, I, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, th..., th., th., tho, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, you can say blatant racism, but the silver lining to this whole story was that everyone got angry by this Fox New Peace, not just Asian people, not just Chinatown, New York City people.

The entire country was like, yo, this sucks. And that's why it entered the Z-G guys, right? Because if most people thought it was okay, it would never have blown up to the point where, you know, at that time, people were pretty upset, you know, everyone, white people were upset. Every race was pretty upset about this. So if you ask me why I'm not more upset, it's because, oh, it was a cause that everyone already,

you know, most people were upset by the issue already. And we were just giving them a platform to express it, you know? Who was the target audience for this? Was it, or I guess who were you aiming this piece towards in a way? Like, was it, was it at the reporter that went out and did it? You know, his name is Jesse Waters. I personally think we should bleep his name. Just bleep his name. Is it at the reporter who went out and said this ignorant shit, even though he kind of sort of apologized after the fact.

Is it the right-wingy Fox News type media outlets that pushed this narrative? Or was it at the people that actually thought that what he did was real journalism and informative? Yeah, I mean, it was, I think honestly, it, man, it was for whoever wanted to listen to it. But also, I think Asian people in America, they never had a way to critique the media like that. I think the history of Asian American storytelling in America, there's been no one in the media to critique media portrayals of them on a big enough platform. So honestly, it was almost to put a flag in the sand and be like, oh, you know, this

kind of stuff isn't acceptable anymore. And it was a sentiment I felt there was already in America. And yeah, I kind of symbolically put the flag in like this is the moment, but, and I was lucky to be happened to be in a position to do it, right? Because we wanted to show that criticizes news and media. That's what I'll show essentially is, right? And so I happen to be on the perfect platform to do it. But like, like I like I like I like I th like I th like I th th th th th. th th. th. th. th. th. th. thi thi thi thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I that, I that, I that, I that, I thi, I that, I that, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I th. th. th. th. th. thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thr. thr. thi. thr. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. to be on the perfect platform to do it. But like I said, I think most people in America didn't think it was okay even at the time. No, not in the least. The thing that's so interesting about this country, though, is that every minority group is dealing with their own racism too. So then when you find out about the new racism, it's like,

oh, okay, well I'll be right there in a second. I'm currently getting beaten the head by a cop. I'll be right there as soon as I finish dealing with my own traumas. And it's very difficult, and I think it's very dope that so many people were willing to speak out, which brings me to 2020 as a matter of fact. Now, you already know the role that Trump played and stirring the pot from 2016 up until COVID. But at COVID, I feel like that's when the pot went from medium to hot.

For, well, from hot to hotter for anti-Asian American sentiment. You know, there was a 150% spike in anti-Asian crime in 2020. And then also, you know, everything that started with COVID and it's starting in China. And then Trump driving the narrative of, oh, it's the, you know what he said about it. I'm not going to even repeat what they called the coronavirus at the time or whatever. But the China virus, that one I can say. I'm not the, you th, I'm th, I'm th, I'm not th, I'm not th, I'm not th say I'm not going to even repeat what they called the coronavirus at the time or whatever, but the China virus is that one I can say I'm not going to say the other one but it really you can say it I'm not going to say it I'm not going to say the case. It's so weird that we have to tipto around quoting the president in case we say a slur we can't directly quote the ex president. It's just just that we that we that we that we that we that we that we that we that we th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. that that that that that that that that th. that we thi thi. that we thi. that we that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that we say that we say that we say that we say that we say that we say that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. That's th. thi. That's thi. That's thi. thi. that. that. that. that's that. that's that one that one that's that one that's that one that's that one that that that's quote the ex-president. Yeah, it's just you insert

slur here just whatever you think he said he said it. Do you think like how much of that contributed to the uptick in violence in 2028? The bigger question, the bigger question, do you think that like, do you think that like, do you think that like Fox News and Trump were following their base? Were they just giving to people what they want when it turned in terms of stirring up racism? Or were they leading them to this and then creating racism? Yeah, I mean, I think it's one of their go-to moves in the playbook is to blame people who look different to them, right?

That's more the go-to fascist moves, I guess. So I think that was the easy, you know, when bad stuff happens anywhere, I mean, let's say in America, then people look for someone to blame, right? And so I think putting it on a whole race of people is a way to direct their anger. I think it's also weird in America that they, like, people, I think Asian people are kind of under the radar a bit until this thing happened and then now it became, it kind of gave people an excuse to like go after Asian people if you're having trouble.

Yeah, so, oh yeah, them. But I will say in America, I think what's interesting about being Asian and America is that you're kind of always, you know, the idea of being a perpetual foreigner in America. Like, Asian Americans aren't usually, like, like, they're, like, like, they are, like, they are, like, like, they are, like, like, they are, like, they are, like, like, they are, like, they're, like, they're, like, they're, like, like, like, they're, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, they're, like, like, like, like, like, like, their, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, they are, they are, they are, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're their, like,, you know, the idea of being a perpetual foreigner in America. Like, Asian Americans aren't usually, like they're always seen as having to like answer for stuff that happened in Asia or, you know, like, everyone's always putting stuff

that happened to Asia on Asian Americans, when they're very separate cultures. Like, a lot of, Asian Americans haven't left America before. They were like, they're like, they're their their their their their their thian, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. they're they're they're they're they're they're they're thi. they're thi. they're that. that. Like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're, like, they're, like, like, like a lot of Asian Americans haven't left America before. They were like born and raised and they never left, you know? And so it's almost like, quite frankly, like African Americans being asked about stuff that happens in Africa, or like Anglo-Americans being asked about stuff in the UK. You know, like what happened in, what's going on with Brexit, you know, like,

most people don't know what's happening. A lot of these Asian Americans are just Asian American culture. But I guess my point is that that's the way I kind of describe the perpetual foreigner thing. Is that you're always being asked about stuff over there and it's like you got nothing to do with the stuff over there, you know. The thing for me with 2020 when, when the uptickickickickickick the up the up thicicicicicicicicicicicicicicicicic thic thic th up thi th up thi th, you th, you th, you are th, you are thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, are just are just are just are just are just are just are just are just are just are thi, are thi, are thi, are thi, are thi, are just are just are just are thi, are thi, are thi, are thi. are thi, are thi. I are thi. I are thi, are thi, are thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. they are just they are with the stuff over there, you know. The thing for me with 2020 when the uptick happened, when the 150% jump and anti-Asian sentiment and the crime started happening, especially in the New York area, you know, it was people of all racist perpetuating these crimes, but there was also a lot of videos where sometimes it was a black person attacking an Asian person and so as a black person out and walking around I'm like okay how do I carry

myself to make sure that the Asians know that I'm safe and that I'm not here to punch I will and it I'm being silly but there is this idea and it's no different than at night when you you live in a city you're you're the city you're there's a the city you but there is this idea and it's no different than at night when you're, you live in a city, you're, there's a woman five, six steps ahead of you on the sidewalk, right? I'm not trying to creep you out, I know I'm a big dude. So to keep us both comfortable, I'm gonna slow down my step a little bit, give you 10 feet. So that you know what I mean? Like just being conscious of making sure that everybody has a little bit of space and that everybody's comfortable.

That was problem one. Problem two was, for me, because there were two door men that got fired in New York City for not helping an Asian woman who was being attacked on a sidewalk. And my thought was, wow, okay, if that happened, what would I do, me, Roy, and in my head, I'm like, okay, I'm going to help. I have to break that up. But then there was also a piece of me in my head going, okay, when the police come, what are you going to do to make it look like you're not the one attacking the Asian. And I'm like, fuck. Wow. I've got to call the police on myself and let them know that I'm cool. Set my phone up, set up the IG live screen, then go hit.

Like, being a little fanatical on that side, but there were all of these levels in my head of how could I help but also remain safe for police and people that are pulling up with even less information than I have, you know, when I circled the corner. But that's, that's an interesting thing. We could probably exploit. Matter of fact, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pose that question to our guess. After the break, we're gonna be joined by the wonderful, wonderful Norman Chin. He is the CEO and co-founder of leading Asian American Unite for Change. We'll have him on in a second. This is beyond the scenes.

Are you enjoying going beyond the scenes with me, Ronnie? I'm loving it. It's the best. It's too late. It took you too long to answer. No, no, that was the lag. That was the zoom leg. It's too late. It's too too too too too too too the commercial it's the commercials. It's too too too too the commercials. It's too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too too to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to be too. to to to be too. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the to the the the the the too. the the the the the the the the the too.a.a. the too. the too. too. too. too. too. to to was the lag. That was the zoom lag. It's too late. It's too late. The commercials are started. We're joined now by someone who I trust more than Ronnie Chang. You know, I'm not saying that Ronnie Chang hasn't done the work, but last I checked, Ronnie Chang wasn't the CEO and co-founder of launch, Rani Chang? No, I, unfortunately I was written out the story. tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the thi thi the story, the thi the the the thi the the the the the the the the the the the co-like, the the co-in, the co-in, the co-in, the commercial, the co-in, is the co-in, is the the the co-in, is the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the co-in, the co-in, the co-in, the co-in, and co-founder of Launch, Ronnie Chang? No, unfortunately, I was written out of the story, like hidden figures. Launch is leading Asian American Unite for Change. His name is Norman Chin. Norman, thank you for joining us on Beyond the Scenes.

Great to be here. Thanks for having me. So let's jump right back into this discussion. We've talked about Ronnie's piece and everything that went down in Chinatown with Fox News, but I wanted to have you on to talk a little bit more about where we are today with regards to anti-Asian sentiment. I wanted to talk to you for a second about the status index and ways that we are able to quantify what's going on. Because the thing that we deal with, no matter what minority group you are, you're told that whatever it is you're dealing with, ain't real. It's not real. Well, everybody, of course robberies up. It's a pandemic. Everybody's unimplicated.

Like, no, man, I'm telling you. They're attacking us. So how were you all able to assess attitudes and stereotypes towards Asians over there with the status report? Thanks, Roy. No, exactly to your point, these stereotypes and perceptions have been prevalent in American society for decades, and actually are at the root cause of hate crimes.

If you find, you look at research about hate crimes, they stemmed, just was saying, from stereotypes initially that then lead to scapegoating and then lead to violence during difficult times. In crisis, this is like COVID, our once in a lifetime hopefully. So we're seeing a repetition of the cycle of stereotypes leading to scapegoating, leading to violence. So as a new nonprofit last year, we were formed in 2020.

We were looking for existing research on stereotypes of Asian Americans. And shockingly, the last study that had been done comprehensively was 20 years ago, when there are half as many Asian Americans in the country. And so we thought that's just a glaring need, there's a glaring need to do more research about stereotypes. And so the theeee, and so the statuse, and so the, and so we we we we we we the, and so we the status, and so we the, and so we thia, and thia, and thia, and thi, and tho, and to be to be to be to be to be toe, toe, to be to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, to, and, and, and, to, and, and, to, to, to, and thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thea, thea, theananananananananan, theaugh, toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toea, toea, toe. need. There's a glaring need to do more research about stereotypes. And so we commissioned the status index study, which is really checking on how Americans now

perceive Asian Americans. And unlike most other Asian American research that's out there, we interviewed all Americans, so not just Asian Americans about their experience, but also other racial groups. So it was quite groundbreaking this year. How safe, or how unsafe how unsafe rather would you say Asians feel in America right now? And Ronnie, I'll throw this to you first. Just in general during this time from 2020 till now, is your head on a swivel more than it was, say in 2015? I think God depends on the state.

I think in Hawaii it was, it was like, such a great answer. I mean, that's like a lot of America, right? It depends on the state, right? Yeah. I will say when I went back to New York City at the peak of the pandemic and all the crimes were happening. I definitely was, you know, it's, you know, that's and that's the thing right, the internet versus real life. Real life definitely felt different to my Instagram feed in terms of the amount of violence that was happening on my Instagram feed. So real life felt way, way safer than compared to Instagram. But because of Instagram, man, my head was definitely on a swivel.

The entire time in New York City, you know, I'm looking behind my back, I'm not walking down streets, I don't know, I'm sprinting. Are you making sure the black guy behind you is at least 10 feet and not six feet? No, I don't racially profile. I go, I do my comedy shows. I run from show to show, make sure if someone's attacking me is because of my jokes, not because of my race. And I have my phone by my side. So basically it's like living in New York City, but more.

It's what we should have been doing over the last five years. But this just kind of made me more aware. And not just for myself, but for other people as well well if I see like an old Asian person on the street I'm always like okay well you know it's my job to to is my job to make sure she's okay for the length of time which she's in my field of vision and then I pass her off to the next Asian bystanders who's walking in a separate direction so yeah it, it's what looking for other people too, you know. When we see these videos, by the way, Norm, I don't know what you feel, and Roy, I mean, I don't know how you feel. When we see these videos happening to elderly Asian people,

when I'm not even worried about, I'm not thinking about, I'm not thinking what that happens to me. I'm thinking, what that happens that happens that happens that happens that happens that happens that happens, that happens, that happens, that happens, that that happens, that that that happens, that that happens, that happens, that happens, that happens, that that that happens, that that that that that that happens, I that that that happens, I'm that happens, that that tho, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I tho, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know my relative. That looks my grandma, like my aunts, my grand aunt. Like I'm worried about them more than worried about me. For sure. You know, when I see these videos, it's not like, I don't start fearing for my life. I'm like, man, what, what, what if there's another? Because the, the people being attacked aren't the videos we're seeing, you know, we're seeing the people who can't really defend themselves. To that point, when we talk about stereotypes, Norman, just in general,

and we know how much pop culture delves in that and baves in that, you know, for a number of minorities, but it seems like it's even more unique and even worse in a way for Asians, because, like, some of the stereotypes will also, they'll even th even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even even th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, thooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooes, the, the.. the, th also, they'll even take something positive and just, oh, you do your homework. Oh, you're good at math. Like, shouldn't we all be good at math? Like, even when you take Ronnie's film,

crazy rich Asians, which did, I would assume, amazing things for helping to debunk some stereotypes, people will turn around and see three well-dressed Asians walking down the street and just go, look at them rich-ass Asians. Norman, how much does pop culture play a role in that and have you seen any improvements in any regard that would help you believe that the tide is turning and how Asians are at least portrayed in entertainment? You know, Ron, that was one one of the key areas of our research is about how Asians are perceived in the media and TV and movies. Because that's a key source of information for many communities about Asian Americans.

A lot of the communities don't have Asian-American friends, so they looked to movies. And the question that you may have heard of that got a lot of press was we asked people to name a single prominent Asian American. And the number two and three answers they gave were all martial artists. Number two was Jackie Chan, who we love but who is actually not American. He's from Hong Kong. And number three was Bruce Lee, who's also, you know, a martial artist, but has been dead for 50 years.

So, and you look at the roles people see Asian Americans in, the men are the gangsters, they're the nerds, the technicians, the women are the masseuse workers, they're the, the waitress. The restatrush hour. Exactly. All the steerable roles. So a lot of those stereotypes still persist. Our research was important because no one again had done this research for 20 years.

So we reestablished, we quantified a baseline. This is where things are. It's not good, but at least we know where we are. Hopefully over the next one year, three year, five year, ten years, it won't be 42% of Americans who still can name a freaking prominent Asian American. So we're hoping to track progress over time, but to your point, yes, a lot of these stereotypes still exist. The fact that Ronnie and others were able to show Asians in a positive light, right, as being successful and being, frankly, physically attractive, right? When's the last time we saw an Asian American male take his shirt off in a movie? Well, we had a lot of that crazy rich agents

and a lot of the Asian American men in the country were celebrating that and a lot of Asian American women as well. There are definitely trends and positive signs, and I think a lot more movies and TV shows are coming out, which is really encouraging. But this brings me back, you know, and that makes me think about the overall solution to everything we're talking about, and there is no one thing, you know, I think in America we always want this like,

we want the app that fixes everything, we want the go fund that will end racism. You know, we want that one that one that one that one that one that one that one that one that one one one that one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one one the the the the the the thoomomomomom, thoom, thoom, thoom, thoom, thoom... the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the thoome, thoome, thoomea. thoomorrow. thoomorrow. thooooooo to to to to to to to to to to to to to tho tho tho the go fund me that will end racism. You know, we want that one home run solution and like these are complicated social problems multi-factorial issues you know that require attacking from different places. So yeah, one aspect of the attack is you know Pierre Pong Henry Golden taking their shirt off in his criticisms. That that moves the needle a little bit I won't, you know I it doesn't solve everything but it definitely helps a little bit. And some of it is where the funding is going, or the on the streets actual help. Some of it is legislation, some of it is you know messaging. So like all this stuff plays into it

and that's why having the data helps us understand where we can attack. It also helps prove that there is an issue th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th is an thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi th thi th th th th th th th th the the the the the the the the the the their the the their thi thi thi thi thi thi te te te teeeeeeeat teeeeeeeeeeeeat teee teeeat te te te because it helps us understand where we can attack it also helps prove that there is an issue you know. Yeah no one of the questions we asked our respondents is how would you address these problems about an anti-Asian-American sentiment and stereotypes in the US and the answers were exactly what what you mentioned in terms of awareness in terms of legislation in terms of awareness, in terms of legislation, in terms of solidarity, in terms of more media attention. The other key solution is education, and I wanted to toub on that.

When we grew up, very few of us had the opportunity to learn about Asian American history and classrooms in the US. And now, as you know, recently, Illinois mandated the teaching of Asian American history in public schools, which is a huge milestone. And other states are moving in that direction. And so clearly, more Asian American history and knowledge is important. These are cycles. There were lynchings in 1871 of Asian Americans in LA.

No one knows about that. A lot of people don't even know about the Japanese internment during World War. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And, and their. And, their. And, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the the the the the the the the the the the the the their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their their their their their their their, their, their, their, the. A lot of people don't even know about the Japanese internment during World War II. And so to make this information more accessible to young kids who are really the key to address before they become racist adults, we're working with a group called the Asian American Education Project to provide a graphic novel overview of the highlights of Asian American history. So think about, you're a fourth grade, fifth grade kid, th. th. to to to to to to to to to to to learn, to learn, to learn, to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and to learn, and the highlights of Asian American history. So think about you're a fourth grade, fifth grade kid, you don't want to learn

even about your own history. How do you make Asian American history, how do you make Asian American history, how do you make Asian American history, how do you make Asian American history, so that schools and teachers and students can get this information in a very accessible way. We can share it digitally as well. These are the things we're trying to do to really have an impact to create more education. But to Ronnie's point, it's a it's a movement that needs to happen and we're starting to get organized, starting to have resources, but there's a ton of work to do in many different areas. In many different areas. A the areas. A the areas. A thiiiiii. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. throwns. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. th. th is th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the is the is the is the is theeeeea. thea. thea. thean. thea. theea. thean. theea. thee. th, if there's anything to take away from anything what's saying is, go find the people who are doing things, because there's a ton of people who care and it's

a ton of people who are doing smart things in many different areas. You know, maybe you like being a vigilante on the street. Yo, there's vigilante you like raising money to help small businesses. You know, there's organizations raising money to help the business in Chinatown. There's people trying to put, as Norm just mentioned, educate kids, you know, there's people are doing stuff. Okay, so then let's talk solutions after the break because I have a couple of questions of how I, non-Asian can be a part of this.

This is so dope, Ronnie. I feel like the white women talking to black people. Like, I just want you to know that I see you and I am an ally. Thank you. Thank you, Karen. We're trying to get the Karen's on board, yeah. I'm black. I'm a Keith. Beyond the scenes. We'll be right. I'm black, I'm a Keith, I'm not a kid.

Beyond the scenes, we'll be right back. When asked to name a prominent Asian American, Norman, I have all the statistics here, man, this is very interesting. 42% of Americans couldn't do it, 11% named Jackie Chan, 9% Bruce Lee, 5% Lucy Lou, 2% Kamala Harris. And you brought up, you know, I just want to talk about the- Wait, hang on, what percentage was, did they mention me? Hang on, let me zoom in. It's probably statistically insignificant.

Yeah, trick question, Ronnie, you're not on the list. Next year, Ronnie. Next year will be a big number next year. Let's talk solutions on how I can get on that list. I want to be with the 42%. Now, Norman, you brought up something with regards to one solution that I think makes sense, which is education and the curriculum. You know, I grew up in Alabama, which is, I grew up in Alabama public schools, late 80s, all of the 90s,

and I say this not joking, I am not joking with you. I did not meet my first Asian person until the eighth grade. So, in terms of these areas where a lot of this bigotry is happening, and a lot of that bigotry is believed, it's not a lot of Asians there. And so, I know that there's definitely a role that the school system plays. And, you know, Ronnie, you talked about people being active within their own communities and connecting with the people.

It's crazy because you're basically saying the same thing that black people, the same thing we've been saying to white people. Find someone that's doing the work and show up and show up and show up and get involved in organizations that are doing things. Because like I said, before the break, there's a ton of organizations who are trying to help. And I'm in America by choice. I'm in America by choice because I think there's more good people there than bad people. Way more good people than bad people.

And I think the fact that we are talking about this, the fact that Norm did this study thi thi thi th th thi th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thi, it thi, it thi, it thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I that that that that that that that that that thi, I'm that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that th.... that that that th and I th and I th is th is thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi. the the the the the the the the the theeea thea.oooomea thea thea thia thia th There's, those are kind of more of the grassroots, you know, solutions, but let's talk on the political side, Norman. Did the anti-Asian hate crime bill, the COVID-19 hate crimes act, is that enough from President Biden to help stop the swell of what you've seen happening in your community? No, I mean, I think most people would agree it's the tip of the iceberg or what needs to be done, but it's a positive step in the right direction. So, you know, it helps to create more reporting channels for people to report the hate crimes. That's important. It sets aside information, money for education about racism towards Asian Americans. That's all important. But it's like the drug war.

You've got to start it, fight the war at the source, right? What's causing these hate crimes and what's leading to the stereotypes and the scapegoating and the violence? And so media is very powerful. The news is very powerful, right, in terms of how Asian-American stories are reported. And so there are groups activating to try to get more coverage about Asian-American stories. Education, as we talked about, is extremely important to shape hearts and minds. We were fortunate in

terms of politically to be invited by Congressman Ted Liu to present to the congressional Asian-Pac Pacific American Caucus and where we shared our data so that the legislators and the political leaders can have more information that they can use to fight their battles. And so that's one way we're trying to link with the legislators. You know, getting Asian American history taught in schools,

that requires legislation, right? And so it requires political activity. And so that is a very important channel to get things done as well. All right, so Norman, there are certain crimes in this country that get more attention from the media than others. Crimes of a racial nature. How much does the media play a role? And the example I want to use is the mass shootings at the Asian massage parlors in Atlanta. You have a gentleman who goes from parlour to parlour killing people and I know that there was an element of sexual addiction that was a part of that, but that does not absolve race from also being a piece of the

motive for those crimes. But not only does that not get turned into, well, did he kill him because of sexual shame or did he kill him because they were Asian or was it a little bit of... But they just stopped talking about it all together. So let me amplify your point with a couple additional data points there. Roy, first of all, we did our study in March, April of this year, and one of the regrets we had when we first did the study was, gosh, I wish we had done the study before the Atlanta killings because then even more Americans would be unaware, right? We thought everyone would have know about the anti-Asian American sentiment.

Shockingly, again, 32% of Americans, basically a third of Americans say they're not aware of the increase in hate crimes towards Asian Americans in the past year. So I don't know where they're getting the information from, but clearly it's not sharing it's not representing the hate crimes that are affecting women in Atlanta and other places. That's one data point. The second data point is I just was on at an event in the Bay Area with Dion Lim, who's a local newscaster and really prominent activists in the Asian American community. And she says now that when she goes to her producers and has you know sometimes five or six anti-Asian-American

hate crime stories each day, they're saying you know we're not, the public's not interested in these stories anymore so we need to find something else to report on. So exactly to your point these stories are getting buried. And so how do you solve these problems? These are systemic problems, for sure. One area that a lot of people are focusing on, I think makes sense is representation. How many of their producers or senior people at these media companies are Asian American and care about Asian American stories, right? I think that is critical and I think that's an area where

we have seen significant underrepresentation of Asian Americans and leadership positions. One of the key statistics from our study was that half of Americans think that Asian Americans are actually well represented. They think, hey, model minority, we're smart, hard working, we must be successful, it must be leaders. Well, actually, we're 50% underrepresented in terms of leadership positions in terms of Supreme Court justices of which there are zero Asian Americans in terms of the corporate world in terms of the political world, in terms of owning TV stations and movies movies stations, etc. we are severely under represented yet people are under the illusion that Asian Americans are well represented. So I think representation is a key part of the puzzle.

Only when you have leaders who appreciate and understand the Asian American experience and the Hispanic experience do we have real diversity and true accurate coverage of America. And so we're hoping that we'll see some changes in that area in the next few years as well. All right, I'll leave you gentlemen with this question. And I'll let Norman go first, because I know Ronnie and I are going to argue. How do we Norman get other minorities to understand that the Asian fight is also our fight. Because, and I was just, and as a black person, I'm just going to be, you know, very blunt with what some of the sentiment is in other communities

where it's, okay, well, how they get a anti-Asian hate crime bill before us? We've been trying to get it. How do we get other groups? Because everybody is so insular. You know, Ronnie is very right in that regard in America, where everybody's just tend into their own farm. You know, I've got my problems to deal with the Latinos head. We're focusing on our things. And how do we get other minorities to understand that if anybody can break through it's good for everybody? Totally. Yeah, a lot of the issues that we identify apply to other that if anybody can break through, it's good for everybody. Totally. Yeah, a lot of the issues that we identify

apply to other racial groups and people of color. And so one of our goals is much, it's more outreach to other communities of color, to reach out to the African-American black community and Hispanic Latino community. There is much more that we share in common in terms of our experience in white America, then that separates us. So outreach is critical.

We also believe that working closely with these partners on initiatives such as diversity in the media, such as fair representation are really critical. So yeah, I think it's a key part of the solution. And I say the onus is not just on, it's on both sides of the equation, right? In our study, we found that certain communities have less interaction with Asian Americans. And so they don't know Asian American culture.

That's why they see them as others. So we need to build more bridges between these communities so people can appreciate the Asian Americans, whom some people think are as cold and unfriendly and out warm. Well, they've never been to my house or Ronnie's house for a dinner party, right? They've never had time to share that experience more and let people know just how warm and dynamic our culture is.

And also, again, break down these barriers. So I think at the micro level, interaction among different groups is really, really critical. That's how you, just like you, I mean, you didn't, maybe didn't meet an Asian-American, but then once you get to know Asian Americans, then you start to have a more well-rounded understanding of them and hopefully developed good friendships, so. Ronnie, how do you get me to care about your shit? Go. I don't mean Asians. I mean, me is Roy caring about Ronnie's problems. Man, you, uh, get you invested into my life, maybe give you some equity.

I should have listened to you about Bitcoin in 2015, but that's a separate conversation. I mean, we are pretty investing in Jada's lives already. I think the community as a whole, you know, someone put it to me really well once. Look, I don't have the solutions, man. I tell jokes in bars for a living. I don't know how to save the world. What I do know is that, yeah, we, there's more good good people than bad people in America, and that goes for minority groups. There's more good minority group people, goes without saying, obviously, than bad people. And when we join together on issues that we do agree on, it increases our voting strength. It creates a more powerful voting block.

Because Asian people are what? 4% norm? Was it? 4%? 7%? 7%? the tweeean, 7? Right.

And what's the African Americans are? 13? Well, hang on. Ni can't. Well, hang on. Nick Cannon just had four more kids, so African-Americans are what. If you join all together, there's a voting block there. You know, there's a stronger voting bloat, which allows you, if we work together to get legislation passed, it benefits all of us. And nothing against white people too. We need white people to help out. And most white people are on board. But when you're, it's so hard to explain sometimes and that's why only minorities get that

and that's why we should get along in America is because sometimes it's not that anyone is blatantly being evil. It's just that the system itself in a way that you can't even begin to explain the issues you're having. How many times have you gone into a room and been like, no of these people are even gonna get what I'm saying? I'm talking about my Asian grandma on the streets who, you know, they don't understand what, you know, they're not gonna get it. Whereas if you talk to Latino people or black people,

they'll understand it more. And so if we can get more like mind of people in decision making positions, you know, that's where kind of we can stop moving the needle with change and that's why we should be joining together as a voting block. You know, that's my argument to you, Roy, I mean, you can also tell your back of me as you always do and you know, we can America continue on. Don't tell these lies. You know what I view, I view America as a DMV and everybody's in there for their own issue, but the moment one person starts complaining, you need three other people to start complaining.

And then that line of justice will move a little bit faster. Norman Chin from launch, thank you so much. Leading to Asian American, Unite for Change. Visit them online, launch. That's launch, like the space shuttle with two A's launch. Because I know I have a southern drawl and you would think I said lunch and I didn't say lunch I said launch like a rocket two A's dot org Norman thank you so much for coming beyond the scenes with me thank you so much Roy thank you Ronnie and

I'll see you whenever the fuck we're back in the office yeah I'll see you soon man good clean up your side please okay okay all that's it tak th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th that that that that that the the that that that the the the the the the the the th th th th the th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th that that that that that that to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the the. I'll see you soon, man. Good, clean up your side, please. Okay, all right, that's it. Take care, everybody. Listen to the Daily Show Beyond the Scenes on Apple Podcasts, the Iheart Radio App, or wherever you get your podcast.