The Daily Show: Ears Edition - The Road to Legalizing Cannabis at the Federal Level - Beyond the Scenes

Episode Date: December 18, 2022

The cannabis industry brings in billions of dollars in legal revenue, with Big Cannabis companies leading the charge. However, cannabis offenders remain incarcerated and federal restrictions prevent them from legally benefitting from this thriving industry. BOWL PAC founder, Justin Strekal, and author of Bending the Arc: My Journey From Prison to Politics, Keeda J. Haynes, join host Roy Wood Jr. to discuss the complicated road to federal cannabis legalization. Beyond the Scenes is a podcast from The Daily Show. Check out more episodes wherever you get your podcasts or YouTube.com/TheDailyShowSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to Comedy Central. Hey, it's Roywood Jr. hosted the Daily Show podcast Beyond the Scenes. It's the podcast that explores topics that were originally covered on the show, but deserve a little more time. This week, we're taking a look back at a conversation about cannabis legislation with Bull Pack founder Justin Streckle and author of Bending the Ark, My Journey From Prison to Politics, Keta Jay Haynes. Enjoy. Hey, welcome to Beyond the Scenes, The Daily Show podcast that goes a little deeper into the segments and topics that originally aired on the show.

Like, if the Daily Show is the card, then this podcast is the extra bells and whistles that make it feel fancy. Leather interior. Like, if the Daily Show is the car, then this podcast is the extra bells and whistles that make you feel fancy, leather interior, that screen with the GPS that pops up, heated seats and cool seats so your butt can be toasty or cold. Today we're discussing a topic that Trevor covered on 420 back in 2017. That's right.

We're talking about weed. I don't call it weed. It's cannabis. The Trump administration had a lot of pushback on legalizing cannabis federally, despite the positive outcomes of the legalization. Roll the clip. Support for legalizing pot is at record levels. Partly because Americans have started to realize that unnecessarily incarcerating people for marijuana does more harm than good,

and also because it's the only way to handle all of these hot dog crusted pizzas. But even as most people are moving in that direction, unfortunately there is one very powerful little man who disagrees. Attorney General Jeff Sessions has directed federal prosecutors to re-evaluate marijuana enforcement. In a departure from the Obama administration, more aggressive enforcement may be coming. I reject the idea that we're going to be better place if we have more marijuana and you can just go down to the corner of grocery store and get it. All right, all right. Calm down Jeff Sessions. Think of the upside, man.

More people smoke marijuana. More people buy your cookies. Hmm? Hmm? Think about it. Think about it. And it's not just your cookies. Legalizing marijuana has already created thousands of full-time jobs.

And it's raised hundreds of millions of dollars in tax revenue revenue a lot of which has gone toward public schools. So you see kids drugs are cool. Yeah. Today I'm joined by former cannabis lobbyists and founder of the better organizing to win legalization political action committee better known as Bowl pack. Justin Streckle. Justin how are you doing? I'm doing great Roy victory is on the horizon but we still have a ways to get there. I love it, I love it. Let's keep fighting, Justin, one edible at a time. Do you have any edible, we can talk about that later. I'm also joined by the author of Bending the Ark, my journey from prison to politics. Keita J Haynes. Keta, how are you feeling th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thu how are you thu how are you th th thu th thu thi thi thi thu thu thi to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. the. the. the. the. the. toooooooooooo. thea. thea. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. to politics. Kita Jay Haynes, Kita, how are you feeling today? I'm doing

well, thank you. I'm excited to be here to discuss this important topic. Well thank you all so so much for being here. Let's dive right into it. You know Justin as a former cannabis lobbyist, just for the layman. Break down for me and the listeners real quick, you know what's going on. You know, cannabis is legal in more states than ever, but still not on a federal level. Like, you know what, it feel like, it feel like when your mama say you can do something, but your daddy be like, boy, you better not do that, I better not see you when I'm doing it. And you ain't sure if you're still going to get in trouble or not. So explain to us the state legality versus the federal criminality criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal criminal, the state, the state, the state, the state, the state, the state, the state, the federal, the federal, the federal, the federal, to to to to to to toe, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the the the the the the the the the the the the the, the the the the, the, the, the, the. the. thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, thea, tooo. too. too, to lot of people even who work in Congress do not understand the answer to that question. Basically... Let's start to show on a happy note Justin how about that?

Thank you. Congress is absurd and they don't know what they're doing here. You know this this is one of those things where America, you know the things we choose to care about and how we enforce it. Marijuana is criminalized at the federal level for all 50 states and territories, for all citizens under federal law, but 19 states, which include 45 percent of Americans, have chosen to legalize it. And for all intents and purposes, the federal government isn't taking action against them, but for the cannabis businesses that are around the country,

they're not allowed to take basic federal tax deductions for the banking system. These cannabis businesses are mostly not getting banked because banks are afraid of the SEC. And the laundry list of other states, particularly in the South, that are using the ongoing federal prohibition to justify continue arresting people with state and local police. Is that why you think some states are against the legalization of cannabis because there is a degree of profitability within the prison system? That is one of the the common drivers. I think sadly apathy is the easiest out for politicians right now. If the status quo if the status quo's continuation doesn't threaten their continued

election then they're just going to stick with the status quo and in in all these states not a single state arrests Americans in a racially even way. The ACLU put out a really terrifying but not surprising report that showed black Americans are nearly four times as likely to get arrested than white Americans, despite similar consumption rates. Now, with your lobbying work, you know, has it always been about your relationship with Bolle, or does your advocacy, did it start even before that time? Oh, yeah.

This started in 2015, I was a legislative aid in the Virginia State Senate, and I helped write the first decriminalization bill for my boss, along with the NWACP, the ACLU, and Normal. And then a year later, Normal recruited me to be their federal lobbyist, and I joined the organization in October of 2016 when I thought my job was going to be very different than what was unveiled to me the second week of November. I thought my job at the Daily Show was going to be very different than what was unveiled to me the second week of November. I thought my job at the Daily Show was going to be very different than what was unveiled to me. I can't only

imagine, yeah. Now normal, that's the national organization for the reform of marijuana laws. And they've been around for 50 years. Kita, we're going to talk about your book in a little bit, but I first want to get your opinion, you know, before we've been talking about the criminalization of cannabis and why it was criminalized in the first place, let's talk about the portrayal of smoker, like even at the top of the show, like I've had to be reminded by my cannabis smoking friends that even the word weed itself was a propaganda-ish word? Like, talk to us a little bit about just the portrayal of weedheads versus, say, like, a stoner.

Yeah, I mean, I think it really, you know, goes along with what Justin said, you know, with a report that the ACOU released, you know, just talking about the number of African-Americans that are arrested for marijuana possession versus the number of white people that are arrested for marijuana possession. So, you know, as with anything, you know, we see that, you know, black people are criminalized, right? And so we're always going to find a reason to criminalize black people. And, you know, not only with marijuana, but with all of, you know, I'm saying, the drugs that they're out there. And, you know, I, the, the, you, you, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th., the, the, they, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th. thrown, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, the, they, as, they, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as, as know, I mean, we know, you know, when we talk about, you know, crack and powder cocaine, you know, the difference with that, you know,

the way that black people are treated and the way that white people are treated. But again, it is white people that is using it at a rate that, and so, and th, and, and, and, and, and, they, they, they, they, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you know, into the cannabis business and stuff like that. But when we were prosecuting black people for it, it was exactly what you said. It was weed, right? You know, because that was, right, exactly, you know, and it was the gateway drug,

and it led to, you know, more, you know, people using different drugs and being involved in thi. thi tho, tho it tho it tho it tho it tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, tho, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th.. th.......... It, th.................. It, tha, thi, tha, tha, tha, it, it, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, to, to, to, it's to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, that that's that's tha. tha. tha. tha. tha. tha. th all of those types of things now. But now that we see that white people are involved in this and it is cannabis and white people are profiting off of this as well. Whereas the black people cannot profit off of it, right? And so, you know, so there are so many different racial components when it comes, you know, to the criminalization of marijuana and again, and again, the legalization of marijuana because even in the states where it is legal, like I said, black people are not really the ones that are able to benefit

from it because when you look at the state of, you know what I'm saying, when you look at Chicago, right, recreational use is there, but you can still be prosecuted for it if you're in public housing. Well, we know who lives in public housing in Chicago, right? So it's all of those little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little little, the little, the little, the the the the th.... th. the th. th. the the the the the the to, to, the, to, to, the, the, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I, I. I, I. I, I, I... I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I. I, I. I. I, I, I. I, I. I, I, I, I'm, I'm, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, tte. the, the, the, the, the, the, the, thethen I think that, you know, there was even some talk about the fact that you could not be involved in the cannabis business if you had, you know, felonies on your record. Well, I mean, you know, we all know who have felonies on their records and, you know, we can have a whole conversation today about why you know black people have felonies on that record right so again you know even as we're talking about the legalization of marijuana there's still this whole racial inequality there that black people are still experiencing. How then why was it even criminalized in the first place and this is you know

you know for either of you you know like if weed is this holistic thing it helps and yeah, man, and everything's cool, man, why was it criminalized to begin with? Different people can have different opinions about it, but again, but I think as, when we look at anything, when we look at anything that is criminalized, I think it all stems back to making sure that black people are going to have convictions on the record. It's all about stripping power from black th anything, th anything, th anything, then, th and th, th and th, th, th, th, th, and th, th, and th, and th, and th, and th, and th, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, thi, thi, thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and thi, and, and thi, and, and, and thi, and, and, and thi, and, and, and thi, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, thi, thi, th. th. th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi, thi, to making sure that black people are going to have convictions on their record. It's all about stripping power from black people from black communities. And again, and we can have a whole conversation about this because once we have criminalized

something and then we have associated with black people and we have associated with blackness, then there's a whole other issue. We're all coming up on midterm elections, right. We know that if you have a felony their a felony their a felony thiiiiiiiol-a, th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. And, th. And, th. And,that if you have a felony on your record, then you can't vote. And right now, you know what I'm saying, across this country, the number of people that, you know, that are disenfranchised because of a felony conviction on that record is just astounding, right? And here in my state in Tennessee alone, we have 450,000 people who can't vote because of that were disenfranchising, right? So it's bigger than just, oh, well, you know, we're going to criminalize this.

It's really and truly, when you start looking at it and looking at the intersectionality of all these issues, it is literally about stripping the power away from the black community. And if I can't add to ition, was trying to find himself a new job and he was running around the country building up support for marijuana prohibition. And he would say things like, you know, Reefer makes the negroes think they're as good as the white man, or Reefer makes Negroes look at a white woman twice, and then he became the first director of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics. That was it. That's, th. That's, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, their, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th. And, th. And, th, th, th, th, th, th. th, th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thri. thi. thri. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. the first director of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics.

That was it. That was on his residence. I'm telling you, man, I've done the research. And when they smoked his weed, they look at white women. They go, you're hired. Yeah. What about even calling it marijuana? I've heard that even that, that connotation, in and of itself had racist roots.

Marijuana is simply the Spanish word for cannabis. And when I think about it, you know, my job isn't here to tell you what to call it. My job is to change the law. And the Controlled Substances Act says marijuana and it's actually spelled with an H. You know, it was all the inflection that was put on it when during this racist campaign to stir up animosity against Mexican, particularly Mexicans and Black Americans. So I don't care if you call it marijuana, weed, cannabis, pot, whatever. I just want to call it legal.

Where do you all think the role of cannabis in media and entertainment fits in terms of the portrayal of it or fueling the war. Like, you know, Dr. Dre had an album called The Chronic, and we all know when Snoop and the whole West Coast rap scene, Cypress Hill, if we're even going to go back even further than Defrault Records, where it was a lot of, we smoke weed, this is what we do, it's fun, we're having a good time. How much did that play into some some some some some some some some some some, that play, that play, that play, that play, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, thiia, that, that, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, the the, thi, th, th, th, they, they, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, they, they, they, time, how much did that play into some of the negative stereotypes? And even with the films, you know, if we talk about, say, Friday or Pineapple Express or Herald and Kumar, how much do you feel like those movies and music based on weed culture influence the portrayal of cannabis, be it positively or negatively?

I think it definitely influenced it, you know, specifically like you said, you know, when you're talking about, you know, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, the, the, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, definitely influenced it, you know, specifically like you said, you know, when you're talking about, you know, like Dr. Dre and, you know, and we see, you know, Snoop Dog, when you look at the lyrics of what they were singing about, you know, it's like, again, this is the criminalization of black people, the criminalization of black bodies, right? And so that, and so that, and so that, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, and so, th, and, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, the, the, thi, thi, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, thr, thr, thr, thr, thr, thr.... thr. thr. thr. thr. thr. thr. thr. the, the, the, the,? And so that is what it was associated with. And so when you associate something negative with it, then you can treat it negatively.

And I mean, and I think, you know, we're talking about cannabis, but also too, like, let's look at, you know, the portrayal of crack cocaine with new jacked, you know, like what to what were crackheads, you know, and all of these things, right? And, you know, when it comes to marijuana, they were weed heads and, you know, and they set around and they were either involved, you know, I'm saying, in violent, you know, you know, activities in their neighborhood, or they did absolutely nothing. And so, I mean, it's just really this whole narrative that's associated, you can look at just over the history that the narrative that has been associated, you know, with black people, whether it's black men or whether it's black women, you know,

like, we can talk about welfare, right? Like, and how that, you know, had a negative connotation when it was associated with black women. But when we look at, you know, the history of welfare and where it all came, it was whitethose things. You know, if we want to criminalize something, then we will associate black people with it. Building upon Keta's comments, I will say, you know, just culturally, the acknowledgment of marijuana use, be it through rap, hip hop, or going back to the Cheech and Chong movies, and then later, the explosion of the internet

and people being able to communicate and share memes and little clipped videos really helped give the public the opportunity to review this substance through a lens that wasn't just the government-funded propaganda that was, you know, like Refer Madness, which now we just use as a colloquialism about how absurd it was, but that was a government-taxpayer-funded movie to scare white people to not use marijuana and to stoke racial division. These high school boys and girls are having a hop at the local soda fountain. Innocently they dance. Innocent of a new and deadly menace lurking behind closed doors.

Marijuana, the burning weed with its roots in hell. That was the only lens that people had largely, from, you know, 1930, the beginning of criminalization, through Ronald Reagan, until we really started getting to be able to access different aspects of the culture. And I think even though some of that propaganda has, you know, subsided, I still think the ideology is still there, you know, to what Qaeda said, you know, if you want to criminalize it, attach black and brown to it, you know, like the state of Texas is a great example where I think the

population of black people's like, oh, you only find, you only finding us? We're the only ones you catching with the marijuana officer. Nobody else has marijuana. And so, you know, that creates opportunities for people to separate, you know, families based on drug charges. And, you know, the thing that's also very, very messy when you talk about drug charges is that, you know, you started talking about asset seizures and forfeitures and then you're also able to charge anybody else. This is, you know what I really love about drug laws? Is that it's group possession if they want it to be. If I'm with you and you got the

drugs, somehow we got the drugs. I'm like, no, they got the drugs. And I think that's also how they're able to catch up, you know, family members and loved ones. And, you know, that's just a whole another layer to it, which, Keed, I would love to talk to you a little bit more about, you know, after the break, about your journey and how women in prison, you know, and girlfriends, and wi and wa, and wa, and wa, and wa, and wa, and wa, and women, and women, and wa, th, caught up in this drag net over a drug that should have been legal the whole time in the first place. We'll do that after the break. This is beyond the scenes. Now, Keita, I want to dive more into the story that inspired your book because, you know, we spoke with Justin, you know,

earlier just about his work on the activism and the lobbying side of things to get these laws changed to keep things from happening that happened to people like yourself. Now, if you could for the people who don't know and what inspired your book, how did you end up serving time for a cannabis charge? So I end up serving almost four years in federal prison for, and the charge was actually aiding and abetting a conspiracy to distribute 100 to 400 kilograms of marijuana. I actually had seven charges, and part of those charges were the conspiracy charges, which is what you alluded to earlier.

And it basically says that if one person or a couple of people had marijuana, and if you're associated with them, then you can be charged with that. And conspiracy can be attached to be to be to be to be to be a a a to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to, to be a conspiracy, toy, toy, to be a conspiracy to distributey conspiracy, to to to to to to to to a conspiracy to conspiracy to conspiracy to conspiracy to conspiracy to conspiracy to to to to to distribute, to distribute, to distribute, to distribute, to distribute, to distribute, to distribute, to distribute to distribute to distribute, to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to be a conspiracy, to, to, to, to, to be a conspiracy, to, toe, toe, toe, toe, toe, toea, toea, toea, toea, toea, toa conspiracy, toea, toa, toa, if you're associated with them, then you can be charged with that. And conspiracy can be attached to pretty much any of the offenses in the federal system. So myself, along with 28 other people were indicted in the middle district of Tennessee on various different marijuana charges. Everyone chose to put guilty except for me. I chose to go to trial, chose to hold the government to its burden and was to, and was, and was, and was, and was, and was, and was, to, the, to, to, and, and, the, the, and, to, and, to, and, the, and, to, to, to, the, to, to, to, to, to, toe, toe, to, their, and, to, to, to, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, a, a.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a for me. I chose to go to trial, chose to hold the government to its burden and was acquitted of those charges and was found guilty of aiding and abetting. But what a lot of people don't understand is that aiding and abetting still ties back to the underlying offense, which was a conspiracy.

And the jury was asked to determine the amount of marijuana that I was responsible for and they checked the entire amount of the conspiracy. And so in the federal system, the amount of time that you get is based upon the amount of marijuana that you have. And so the amount that they checked automatically carried a five year mandatory minimum. So regardless, you know, me being someone who had never had any exposure with a criminal legal system, I was already looking at five years in federal prison regardless just because of the amount of marijuana that they checked. And you never seen saw touch the weed? No. No. No. The guy that I was dating, he told me that him and his family that they had some businesses in Memphis, which is about three hours here in Nashville, and that they had a beepers plus shop and that no one was going to be delivering the pagers and cell phones their their their their their their their their their their their their their theirseurseseseses theirseursomeomeososomeosomeosomeosomeos. their s. I I their s. I their s. I was their s. I was their s. I was their s. I was their s. I was their their. I was their. I was their. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I I I I was. I I I I I I I I was. I I I I I I I I I I I was. I I I I I I I I I I was. I I I I was. I I I I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I was. I'm. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. A. And. And. And. And. And. And. And. And th. And th. Anders Plus shop and that no one was going to be at the store when

FedEx was going to be delivering. The Pagers themselves owned and asked if I would sign my name and his cousins would come and pick it up. So all I ever did was sign my name on packages. Never opened up the packages, never even saw any marijuana when they brought it into court for the jury to see it was the first time that I saw anything that was ever alleged to have been in those packages. And that alone is enough for a conspiracy charge and there are people like that that still sit in prison to this day on similar circumstances? Yes, that was enough. There was also this part of the whole trial because I was convicted on the fact that I should have known that there was a marijuana in the back in those boxes. Not that I actually knew but that I should have known. How you spoke, th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th that th that that was that was that was that was that was that was that was that was that was that was that was that was tho tho that was that was that was that was tho. tho. thoo. tho. tho. tho. thi thi thi thi thi thi th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. that's thee. that's thi. thi. thi. thi. thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi ththose boxes, not that I actually knew, but that I should have known. How are you spoke? Okay. That's, you know, that's another part of the whole criminal legal process.

And I hope that, you know, when people read the book, that they see that and understand that, because, you know, we can be convicted on the fact that wethere were enough things that happened within this conspiracy where I should have known that there was marijuana that was in these packages and and there are people that are serving life sentences in prison in federal prison right now over marijuana. Yeah and worse it could have been cocaine and we wouldn't be talking today if we're really gonna be honest about it. Right. You know you mentioned also in the book that you studied criminal justice in college and you know and th, you th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, the thi thi, the thi, the thi, the thi, the thi, the thi, and, their, thi, thi, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and their their their their their their, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, their their their their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their their, their their their their their their their their their they, their their their their their their their their their their tho, th in college and you know and that you had a heavy interest in law and like you even worked as a correctional officer at a point

How did your interest in the legal system help and hurt you in your case? Yes, so how it hurt was that I remember during the trial? The the government had subpoenaed like all of my school records because I was in school major and in criminal justice during the trial, the government had subpoenaed all of my school records because I was in school majoring in criminal justice and psychology at the time. And I was on the dean's list. And so I had all A's and B's and so they tried to equate to the fact that I did so well in school

in these criminal justice classes, again that I should have known. As if- Great, detriment? Yes. Yeah. And in my particular situation, it actually was. So it was, I think that they tried to use that to really hurt me. I think it helped because I didn't really walk into it as blind as most people are, right? The federal system is an animal all within itself. And most people don't really know people

who have had contact with the federal system because it's not the same as the state system. Like you don't see people that's getting probation and coming home and stuff. In the federal system, people are going away for years and years and years. And so the fact that I had was studying criminal justice and particularly had really done a lot of research on the disparities between the powder cocaine and the crack cocaine at that time, you know, I kind of had an idea of what the federal system was, but even still, even

with having a basic knowledge, it still does not prepare you for all of the things that happen within the criminal legal system. Because on the one hand, you want th you you you you you to to to th you th you th you to th you th you th th you th the th th thi thi thi the thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi, thi, thi, thi, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. thi. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. thi. thiiiiiiauuuiauia. teauuuia. thia. thi. thi. the criminal legal system. Because on the one hand you want to appear intelligent and competent so that they believe you but then on the other hand if you're too smart then old Lord Jesus, that's going to hurt. And then also probably didn't help that you was a black woman. No, it actually it did not help that I was a black woman. And it's interesting because my judge was a white female who was a Clinton appointee and she you know parades herself as being progressive and white women and that label progressive is another conversation another day as far as I'm concerned but you know she

told me that any person of my intelligence should have known that I was dealing with something highly illegal and that I was lucky to have been acquitted of all of the other charges. And so, you know, she talked to me in a manner as if, you know, I was this black person and I had these advantages that black people normally don't have and how dare I end up in front of her courtroom because, you know, talk about this in a book, there was a white female who was addicted to drugs, she robbed a bank and she got less time than I did. Now you definitely know when you robbing a bank. Oh absolutely. That one you were extremely aware of. Now Justin, I know that you would also, in your past,

when you were younger, got arrested for smoking cannabis, walk me through your journey through the federal correction system. It wasn't a federal charge. It was a local charge. Okay, how long you go to jail? I did not. I got arrested with my best friend. We were out camping, and they got us with underage alcohol. And we watched sitting handcuff for 45 minutes

as they searched the campsite for cannabis. We saw these rangers on their hands and knees with flashlights in the middle of the night searching for pot. And when we went to the judge, same charge, you know, they didn't find any marijuana we had thrown it into the fire. I got 40 hours of community service and court costs, and my friend got a $500 fine, a year of probation, a year of drug testing that he had to pay for.

He had to go to alcoholic and drug addicts classes that he had to pay for. And I'm sure I don't need to tell you the difference between myself and my friend. So that was that was what opened my eyes firsthand but in a front row seat to the racial disparity that that our criminal legal system inflicts on on people who don't look like me. Okay so then to that disparity point then Keita talk a little bit about like the lawyer side of it you you know, because sometimes you're only as lucky as you are your lawyer is competent. Talk a little bit about the role that lawyers sometimes play in the mystery this, because

everyone isn't like yourself where they already had an interest in criminal justice. They already had the ability and the mental capacity to process and understand the law in a way that they can educate themselves while they're incarcerated to work on their retrial, to work on their appeal. So, talk a little bit about the importance of a lawyer and did, and the role that a lawyer played, did a lawyer play a role and everything turning out, I want to say better for you, but not being as bad as it could have been. Right, it definitely was not as bad as it could have been. You know, I was blessed, we were able to actually hire a lawyer,

so I didn't have a federal public defender and so I talk about this in the book where the women felt as if their lawyers didn't do anything for them, that their lawyers just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just just had had had had had had had had had had had just just just had had had had had had had had just just just had had had had had had had had had just just just just just just had their their their their to have just just just just, you had thed, you had to to to thed, you had to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to th............ th.. th.... th.... th.... th. th.... th. th.. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. theeeeeeea. theeea. thea. theeea. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to thea and, you know, and they were pleading to 10, 15, 20 years, right? And just felt as if their lawyers didn't care, their lawyers didn't listen to them. And so I had a completely different experience with my lawyer, which, you know, was one of the reasons why I decided that I wanted to become a public defender because I wanted to be able to provide the same same level the same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same the same the same level the same to to to the same to to to to the same level level the same level of to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to be to be the same the same the same the same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same level of representation that he provided me being a lawyer that we paid, I wanted to provide that same level of representation to people who cannot afford it because I had heard the stories from the women in prison.

And so when I was working as a public defender here in Nashville, you know, I took the, the government to task, right? Like when it came to that, I specifically remember one of the DAs she offered, I had two clients and they both had the same drugs, everything and she offered my white client drug treatment and offered my black client to just plead guilty to this charge and to pay a fine and this stuff and and I said, well wait a minute, I was just like you offered Mr. Such and Such and such and such, you know, to go to to go to the drug treatment and to go to go to go to to to to to to to to to treatreatreatreatreatreatreatreat, you and to their and to to to to their and to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to their their their to to to to to to to to their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their drug, their drug, their drug, their drug, their drug, treat, treat, treat, their, their, their, treat, their, true, true, true, true, true, true, true, true, true, true, their, their white, their their their their their, the drug treatment and to have the opportunity to have this removed from their record if they completed but you offered you know Mr. Such and such here you know to plead to this to have a felony on their record and to just pay this fine I said you know what's the difference and she was just like well I mean does Mr. Such and such the one that she offered the fine to was a black man she was like. to they. She was like. She was like. She was like. She was like. She was like. She was like. She was like. She was like, she was like, she was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She was like, does. She. She was like, does. Does. She was like, does, does, does, does, does, does, does, does, does, does, does, does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. Does. does, does, does. does. does. does. does. does. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He was, to. He was, to. He was, to. He was, just like, so you mean to tell me that you see the value in my white client's life, where you're giving him the opportunity to have this expense off his record so it doesn't

follow him the rest of his life. But you don't see that same value in my black client because you just assume that black people are just, they do and they don't care. Whereas white people are just like, oh, well, you know, it's a problem, you know, and it's the same thing, you know, when we look at, you know, the crack cocaine and the powder cocaine, you know, and opiates, you know, the whole epidemic and we want to get people treatment. But when black people, you know, we're using drugs and we want it is the very very very very very very very very very very very same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same same right it's the very same thing with marijuana is that and and it just just really really boils down to the simple fact that in this system we do not see the humanity and the dignity in the black and brown bodies that are coming in this system in the same manner that we see

the dignity and the redemption in the white people that's coming through the criminal legal system. After the break, let's talk solutions. Let's talk solutions, Justin. And Keita, I want to also find out from you what are some ways that people who are in a similar situation like yourself can help themselves. While people like Justin try to fix the system, what can you do to help yourself within the existing broken system that we're in? This is beyond the scenes. We'll be right back

Beyond the scenes we are back and we are talking Cannabis and just the different ways that the government is figured out of what you got to give it up to the government boy They're some slick ones they know how to make something illegal and then make you pay for it even then turn around and profit from it. We're gonna get to get to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th that that that that that that that that that th. that that the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the. the. the. thean. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the some slick ones. They know how to make something illegal and then make you pay for it even, and then turn around and profit from it. We're going to get to that in a second. But first, Justin, I know that you have been on the right side of this issue and fighting with political action committees to try and get the cannabis laws changed in this country. What is the government doing right now? Have you, our politicians, in your assessment, just, let's just go off the 2022, in your assessment, do you feel like

anybody in Washington has heard your cries, you and Ketus cries, about the need to change some of the cannabis laws? 100% and I am very pleased to report that there has already been a bill that has passed now twice in the House of Representatives called the Marijuana Opportunity Reinvestment and Expungement Act, or the Moore Act, which would, in a comprehensive way, end marijuana prohibition and his criminalization, address federal convictions through an automatic resentencing and and release system. So, you know, those who are still incarcerated as Keto was for a federal crime would get relief as well as fund state level and local level expungement programs and what's known as social equity licensing

structures to assist those who have been impacted by the war on drugs to get into the legal industry. But that's only the house. And I know Roy, you talk a lot about the dysfunction in the Senate, and that applies to marijuana as well. I am truly of the belief that if they held a closed door session, just up or down, do we continue marijuana prohibition, that at least 60 senators in the Senate would say no. But given the, that's not how the Senate works, and given Mitch McConnell's absolute seeming glee at the prospect of young poor people getting arrested for marijuana and his iron-gripped ruling of his Republican caucus, it's very

difficult to see how we get to 60 votes given the legislative filibuster. Okay, so then with that being said, you decide to found the bowl pack, you leave, you leave normal, and then you create a whole new pack and you go all right we got to get this straight at the federal level what inspired that change and how does the bowl pack how do you fight cannabis at the federal level? So one of the things that I've thought about a whole lot in the last few years when I was still at normal Corey Gardner was running for re-election and he was a big champion of the Safe Banking Act, so essentially to legalize the profits of the sale of licensed marijuana

companies, but not the people who consume it. And I'm in favor of the Safe Banking Act as an incremental measure, but he was defeated in his effort to be re-elected by Hickon Looper, Senator Hickin' loop, excuse me. And the Republican narrative in the Senate caucus is, you know, marijuana didn't save Corey. And I think that's entirely disingenuous argument, I think that if Jesus Christ himself came, second came to Colorado and told every voter to vote for Corey Gardner. He still would have lost. It had nothing to do with marijuana.

So my hope is with the bullpack, working with allies to help unseat Republican prohibitionists in the United States Senate. And we're particularly looking at states like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and possibly will expand the map depending on how our resources go. But I think if we can flip that mentality that continuing to support marijuana criminalization can contribute to a Republican electoral defeat, then that will help motivate more Republicans to realize that it's time to, as Senator Wyden, keep saying it, get with the program.

Justin, can I recommend that you all focus on Tennessee so that we can get rid of Marshall Blackburn and that will tremendously? You and I should talk after this offline about what's going on in Tennessee, I'd love to hear. If there is a pathway to do it and I can help absolutely. What are some ways, you know, you spoke in the last break about, it's a public defender, being an advocate for your clients who may not necessarily know all of the different avenues that are available to them because, you know, especially as black people, you know, just take whatever they offer, you just take the deal, don't, don't fight it, blah, da. And then when you get out of jail, you are dealing with the jailed, the jailed, the jailed, the jailed, the jailed, the jailed, the jailed, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the, the, the, th. the, the, the, th. thi, thi, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the the th. th. thi, the, the, the, the.e. thea, thea, the. thea, the, the. the, the, the, the, the the the, don't don't fight it, blah, da da. And then when you get out of jail, you are dealing with you're dealing with a society that treats you like you have a scarlet letter. And you're

dealing with people who will make, who will assume you to be what you were and never see you for what you could possibly be. What are some of the ways that people who've been negatively affected by this war on cannabis? What are ways that they can benefit from the industry today? So, you know, you're exactly right, because when you do leave prison, there is a host of collateral consequences that we deal with simply because of this, right? You know, where it comes to finding jobs, where it comes to housing and those types of things. But I think that it is important that it is is is is is is i is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important it is important to to to to to housing and those types of things. But I think that it is important to have our voices heard when we are talking about any of this cannabis legislation right and what should be done. And so I work at two

different organizations like locally and on a national level and locally is an organization called FreeHarts and it is an organization that is run by directly impacted women. So everyone that is employed there has been directly impacted whether it has been themsel, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, tho, tho, tho, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, their, their, their, th. th. th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th. th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, to, to, to, to, tauui. taui. Weaui. Weaui. thaui. We are, thi. We are, thi, thi, that is employed there has been directly impacted whether it has been themselves or a family member. And so we make sure that our voices are heard when it comes to the various different local legislation and then on the national council, the national council for incarcerated, girls and women, that is one of the main things that we do, is that we make sure that directly impacted women and our voices are heard when it comes to any type of to to to to to to to to the, the, the, to the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th, th, th, th. th. th. th. th. thi, thi, tho,, thi, thi, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th. the, th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thr-in, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, thrown, tham, tham, that directly impacted women and our voices are heard when it comes to any type of legislation that is going to be beneficial for us. And so, you know, that is the thing that I would suggest that people do is that people really

get involved because there are no representatives who have any type of directly experience when it comes to the criminal legal system, which is one of the reasons why I chose to run for Congress, right? Because again, you know, we have people that are making these laws, but they are not impacted by them. And so, you know, we definitely need people who understand the issue, people who have been there, people who can say, no, this may sound good, but when we actually look at this, this is going to negatively be impact to black and brown communities, right? And so even though while we may have some legislation that looks good on the front end, if we start to really peel it back and really look at what it's going to do, is it going to be beneficial for everyone, right? And so I think

it's really important that those of us that have experienced a criminal legal system that we are on the forefront of this, that it is our voices that are heard. And we have the same within our community, those, that those of us that are closest to the problem are furthers from the resources, right? Because it's one thing to draft this legislation, but when you're drafting it and you don't have someone who is directly impacted at the table, to all of the organizations that are involved in any type of legislation, you know, particularly to legalize cannabis, is that if you don't have directly impacted people at the table, then you need to get them. And, and I'm really excited, you know, for years now, we've been working with the Marijuana Justice Coalition, which was convened by the National Council for Formally Incarcerated Women and Girls, as well as just leadership USA, which is another similarly, you know, all led by formerly incarcerated people. And they were a part of that critical coalition that worked with Chairman Jerry Nadler's

office to draft the Moore Act. And, you know, it also included the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights and the ACLU, among others. And, you know, it took through the Marijuana-I justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice justice, the marijuana, the marijuana, the marijuana, the marijuana, the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights and the ACLU among others. And you know, it took through the Marijuana Justice Coalition, we brought all these actors together and we, you know, right now we're going through the Cannabis Administration and Opportunity Act which was just introduced by Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer along with Senators, Corey Booker and Ron Wyden to make sure that we're hearing from all the stakeholders before we come out with what kind of the the the the the the the the the th the th of th of th of th of th of th of the the the the the the the the the the the the the thean thean thea thea thea thea thea the. the. We're the. Wea the. Wea the. Wea thu. thu, we're thu, we're thu, we're thu, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, theaughe, thea. Wea. We're theaughe, thea. Wea. We're thea. Wea. Weaugh, the, thea, the, the, Wyden, to make sure that we're hearing from all of the stakeholders before we come out with what kind of technical improvements we're going to be recommending

you know a full-throated endorsement and a full lobbying strategy. You know, we're at this precipice where depending on how pointedly we try to be proactive in reparative justice, it's not just going to matter for the day after the legislation is signed, but it's going to be a sea change compared to where we would be 50 years from now. And there's three critical components in my view of what is often just referred to as a catch-all under social equity. And it needs to be both the criminal legal reform, so how is it that we're going to end the criminalization and make sure that we don't allow those who have been harmed, be it through maintaining those criminal records. Marijuana charges are one of the

leading causes of deportation in this country. To, you know, to, to public benefits to everything, as well as the second bucket is licensing for those who have been impacted or benefiting those who live in communities that have seen the criminalization of marijuana be used as that entry point by law enforcement who is essentially treating a community like an occupied zone. And then the third part is actually, and this is what I fear doesn't get discussed enough, which is actual just direct economic reparations for those who have had their lives impacted or been incarcerated as a result of a marijuana charge. Evanston, Illinois is the first to my knowledge that

implemented a local ordinance and I really hope and I'm inspired that we see that percolating more around the country. What Evanston did and and I may be a little bit off in my characterization of it, but they they made sure that they were going to set up beside a portion of the cannabis revenue that was generated by taxes in the local sales to be specifically earmarked to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho, and tho, and I the the the the the the the the the tho. And I the the. And I the. tho. the tho. tho. th. th. th. th. the th. th. th. th. th. th. And I I I I I I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and, the the, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the cannabis revenue that was generated by taxes and the local sales to be specifically earmarked to go to those who have been arrested in Evans, who live in Evanston to help them buy by homes or to pay off their mortgages or to be rental assistance. So direct support for the impacted individuals in a perpetual forward-thinking, meaningful way. You know, being a person that is impacted, you know, by, you know, this whole cannabis marijuana,

I still have a conviction on my record today. So for all of the people that are able to profit off of marijuana, those that are able to smoke it freely, like, you know, there's this whole thing, you know, it really bothers me, right? You know, to hear people talk about it so freely because, you know, here I am someone who literally experienced all of those things that Justin just said, like all, the host of collateral consequences associated with the marijuana conviction, but yeah, when I go to Denver, Colorado, when I'm sitting outside on a patio eating it, I see why people walking past me smoking it freely, you know, people talking about edibles freely here, but yet here I am with being treated as a second class citizen for something that people are doing freely and legally now. And selling legally, which you also can't do dependent on the state. Exactly. If I could just one, I want to put a fine point on this. When we talk about expungements of records and and and ceilings or whatever it is. the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. th. the th. the the the the the th. th. the th. th. the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the thable thable. thable, thables, thables, thables, thables, thables, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the ta. tea. tea. tea. tea.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a. I tea. want to put a fine point on this.

When we talk about expungements of records and ceilings or whatever it is that the local jurisdiction determines, it absolutely needs to be demanded that it is automatic. Too often we see city councils or state legislatures or even federal representatives trying to equate a new petition-based process as if that's going to make justice rain down like manna from heaven. No, because just asking for permission for some of that. You're still asking for permission and too often people won't even know about that new program or if they do know about it, they're being expected to navigate a very complicated judicial bureaucracy. And that's why, you know, we're really pleased to see in the new the new the new the new the new the new the new new new new new new new new new new new new, in the new, in the new, in the new, in the new, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in about it, they're being expected to navigate a very complicated judicial bureaucracy. And that's why, you know, we're really pleased to see in the new bill by Senate leader Schumer,

that it would be an automatic process and that those who had convictions would be required to have those released and be notified. Being notified is an important thing too, just because you had an expungement, if you don't know it, you're still checking that box. So those things need to work in harmony in order to make sure that people can no longer be harmed going forward. And one final thing, not only that it be automatic, but that it be retroactive. Yes. Because if it goes into effect today and if it passes and it goes into effect, you know, whenever, if it's not retroactive, I don't receive the benefit from it, right? You know, because we're talking about, you know, my conviction that is from, you know,

two thousand and two, right? So not only that it be automatic, but also that it be made retroactive. I feel like, you know, I asked asked th for you presented nine more problems that also need solutions to this issue. And I'm going to ask you about a tenth one. And I hate to ask it, but I got to because we got to, we got to get to the bottom of this. This is like a nine-front war that you all are waging, the two of you. What role do the companies that have already benefited from the legalization of marijuana who are now lobbying to keep it illegal federally so that it doesn't cut into their

profits play in keeping marijuana sales licenses out of the hands of so many people who deserve them. That is a 25 billion dollar question currently. It's going to be a 45 billion dollar question in a couple years. It's projected to by 2026. And it's going to be a multi-trillion conversation in just decades. Unfortunately, marijuana reform is not going to escape the same kind of legislative capture that we see in every other aspect of American-style capitalism. And I know some of the lobbyists from the marijuana industry who are, you know, just beating the drum about how, no, we need to be incremental in this.

We need to be incremental in this. We can't go too far, too fast. And they're glossing it up to make it seem like they're earnestly trying to get things done. But for every day that goes by, that we don't see the, the, the, but for every day that goes by that we don't see comprehensive reform, we see the entrenchment of the state-siloed marketplaces because unlike any other consumer good, it is illegal to have interstate commerce on marijuana because of federal prohibition. And in some states, like Pennsylvania or Florida and among others, we see a hyper-limited

number of licenses that are allowed. And $50,000 non-refundable application fee in West Virginia, for example, just for the right to be considered, not to get it, not a pre-approval, just to be considered. And it really is just doubling down on the class war that is inflicted, just infected in so much of American society. So we talked about the role that, you know, the media is played in influencing public perception of cannabis. What can we do to change the political perception of it? When you're talking about politicians who I'm old school and I'm Christian values, I just want to make sure their threaten the the their thi thu thu thu thu thu thi thu thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi. Just just just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in just in thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the the their their their their their their in fact. I their in fact their in their in fact. their in their in their in their in their in their their When you're talking about politicians who are, I'm old school and I'm Christian values, I just want to make sure that we're doing the right. How do you change the minds of those people, Kita?

How do you get elected officials to just be honest, to just be real and just go, it's not that bad? I mean, I have Christian values, right? but, I would say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say say that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that's that that that's that's that's that's that that that that that that that that that that that that that that that, that, that, that, that.... I'm, that, that, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that that that's, that's, that's that's that's that's that's that's that's th. that's the th. thi. that's thi. that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that But, I mean, what does that mean? I would say that what some of these Republicans call Christian values are not Christian values at all, right? And so I think we, you know, we need to start breaking these things down and we need to start calling these things out, but also too, we've got to change the narrative around these things because, again, you know, wetalked earlier in the show about the, you know, who is associated with this marijuana and with cannabis, right? And so I think, you know, we need to start changing the narrative around that and say, you

know, like this is happening to everyday average people, right, like myself, someone who's never been involved in the criminal legal system. And if this can happen to me, this can also happen to you. And so I think that, you know, it all comes down to seeing the humanity in people, right? Because, you know, when we look at, you know, Dr. Drey and Snoop Dog, you know, Mitch McDonnell is going to be like, I ain't got nothing nothing in common with him, right? Mr. Mitchell, you know what I'm saying, who is serving, you know, 15 years in prison, you know, I'm saying, for cannabis, and he's a Republican, right? You know, and then when you start to break those down, then it's just like, oh, well, you know,

what, this really could be me, and then you start to see the humanity, and it's unfortunate that we have to do that for you to, for people to even even even even even even, to even, to even, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, the, the, the, can't you just see the humanity in me just as a person? But we know that that doesn't work. And so that is a lot of the things that we have been doing is that, you know, when we are advocating for legislation, we are bringing in people that look like them and say, hey, you know what, I'm harmed about this too. And then that's when they take a step back back and they say, oh, you know what? Maybe we do need to start changing some things, right? And that's why I say, you know, this change is going to come about from the ground, right? That's a whole movement thing, that's a whole organizing thing, right? And so it's going to come about from the ground up, like, you know, it's not going to come from the top down, it is not going to happen. Change is going to come about by the movement. Like we look at like movements that have taken place all across this country, you know,

I'm saying over the past, you know, 50, 60 years, that changes come from the ground, right? Like the organizing, you know, from everybody all across the country coming to, that is what is going to see this, you know, where people from different backgrounds, people, you know, I'm saying, you know, from different classes, you know, people are coming together around these issues and saying, you know, what, we want change. And then they are pushing their representatives, their legislatures, legislators, you know, for this particular change, and so I just believe, you know, particularly being someone who is part of this movement, that that is where the change is going to come from. Justin, how much is promoting medicinal marijuana helped in your efforts to get people on board, just a little bit, and then get them to look at the broader issue as a whole, or have we

exhausted medicinal marijuana as an entry point into this conversation? Oh, it's certainly a great entry point on the escalator of radicalization, as I like to refer to it, depending on the lawmaker, right? And this is one of the those areas where you have to know your audience. Particularly with, you know, amongst the veterans community, right now a VA doctor would be fired if they are practicing within a state that has a medical marijuana program, of which there are 39, if they fill out that state legal form. And that's because they're a federal employee. So there's an amendment.

It's been championed by representatives Earl Blumenauer and Barbara Lee, who are the co-chairs of the Congressional Cannabis Caucus in the House, to make that small change. And we just got it approved to be as part of the NDAA, just back in July. So it's those kind of things that where we can open hearts and minds to look at it from a different angle that can help just break open the head, if you will. And if I can add one point to Qaeda's last point, which I thought is phenomenal and change comes from the ground up, there's an organization supernova women that is all women of color led.

They started in Oakland, and now they're really spreading around the country, inspiring more people. And they put out a new report at the beginning of this year that showed that for every one dollar invested in their social equity licensing system and small businesses, it yielded a 120% return on investment in the locality just in creating and supporting small businesses. And then when they looked at the numbers from a different lens, for every one dollar of the revenue invested yielded when you include educational support, reentry services, job training, placement, expungement assistance, etc. It yielded 456% return on investment

for every $1 spent. So, you know, right now Supernova Women's trying to make sure everybody's seeing this report, seeing the data, and hopefully Oakland can be a good example for localities around the country on how to do a better job of prioritizing local ownership and diversely reflective ownership in communities everywhere. Well, Justin Streckle from the Bowl Pack, thank you so much. And Keta, the book is bending the arc my journey from prison to politics. I cannot thank you all enough for Bending the Ark, My Journey From Prison to Politics. I cannot thank you all enough for going beyond the scenes with me. Thank you so very much.

Thank you. Listen to the Daily Show Beyond the Scenes on Apple Podcasts. The Eye Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. Watch the Daily Show Weeknights at 11, 10 Central on Comedy Central and stream full episodes anytime on Paramount Plus. This has been a Comedy Central podcast. This has been a Comedy Central podcast.