The Daily Signal - #387: The Left's Abortion Extremism

Episode Date: January 31, 2019

Well, if you're against murdering infants, you might have been left reeling by recent statements made by Virginia Democrats in connection with a proposed extreme abortion bill. The Heritage Foundation's Melanie Israel, an expert in pro-life matters, joins us to discuss the new radical abortion policies we're seeing in New York and Virginia. Plus: We talk about more proof that LGBT activists aren't tolerant. We also cover these stories:•A bipartisan group of lawmakers is working to reach agreement on government funding, which is set to expire in 2 weeks. But the president sent a clear message to the committee on Wednesday that he wouldn’t sign a bill without border security.•President Trump congratulated the Venezuelan opposition leader Wednesday and vowed to maintain “regular communication” during what he called Venezuela’s fight to regain its democracy.•Jussie Smollett, the actor who stars in the Fox drama series “Empire,” is alleging a hate crime against him that involved assailants shouting “MAGA".The Daily Signal podcast is available on Ricochet, iTunes, SoundCloud, Google Play, or Stitcher. All of our podcasts can be found at DailySignal.com/podcasts. If you like what you hear, please leave a review. You can also leave us a message at 202-608-6205 or write us at [e-mail]. Enjoy the show! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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This is the Daily Signal podcast for Thursday, January 31st. I'm Kate Trinco. And I'm Daniel Davis. Well, just one week after New York legalized abortion up to the point of birth, Democrats in Virginia are pushing for the same policy. We'll talk to Heritage Foundation, Melanie Israel about how this came about and whether it could succeed. Plus, a secular private school decides to shun a Christian school over its views on sexuality.

We'll discuss. But first, we'll cover a few of the top headlines. Well, fresh off the government shutdown, a bipartisan group of lawmakers in Washington is working to reach agreement on government funding, which is said to expire in about two weeks. But the president injected a clear message to the committee on Wednesday, implying he wouldn't sign the bill without wall funding. The president tweeted, quote, if the committee of Republicans and Democrats

now meeting on border security is not discussing or contemplating a wall or physical barrier, they are wasting their time, end quote. The president has also continued to threaten to declare a national emergency on the border if wall funding isn't passed. President Trump appeared

to take issue with a report issued Tuesday by the director of national intelligence, Dan Coates. Trump tweeted Wednesday, the intelligence piece seem to be extremely passive and naive when it comes to the dangers of Iran. They are wrong. When I became president, Iran was making trouble all over the Middle East and beyond. Since ending the terrible Iran nuclear deal, they are much different.

But a source of potential danger and conflict. They are testing rockets last week and more and are coming very close to the edge. Their economy is now crashing, which is the only thing holding them back. Be careful of Iran. Perhaps intelligence should go back to school. Coates told the Senate and testimony Tuesday, we do not believe Iran is currently undertaking the key activities we judge necessary to produce a nuclear device. Last week, the U.S. and a broad coalition of countries, including Latin American countries, rejected Nicholas Maduro, the rogue dictator of Venezuela,

and instead backed Juan Guaido, the 35-year-old opposition leader. President Trump congratulated Guadro, Guaido during a phone call Wednesday and vowed to maintain regular communication during what he called Venezuela's fight to regain its democracy. Guaido is looking to topple Maduro and is organizing massive street protests, though personally he remains in hiding. The U.S. levied sanctions against Venezuela's state-owned oil company on Monday, and on Wednesday, National Security Advisor John Bolton tweeted, quote, my advice to bankers, brokers, traders, facilitators, and other businesses, don't deal in gold, oil, or other Venezuelan commodities being stolen from the Venezuelan people by the Maduro Mafia. We stand ready to continue to take action, end quote.

Count Colorado's Senate is among the Electoral College haters. The state Senate passed legislation that would give Colorado's nine electoral votes to whatever candidate won the national popular vote, regardless of how the people in Colorado voted, if enough other states joined a movement known as the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact. Currently, per the Associated Press, 11 states in D.C. are in this. The compact wouldn't be live until enough states, totaling 270 electoral votes, signed up for it. Meanwhile, Colorado's House would also have to vote on this legislation and the governor to sign it for it to go into effect. Jesse Smollett, the actor who stars in the Fox Drama Series Empire, is alleging a hate crime against him that involved assailants shouting Maga, MAGA being the acronym for Make America Great Again.

Smollett, who is African American, was walking through the streets of Chicago around 2 a.m. Tuesday when two young men wearing red MAGA hats allegedly assailed him, beat him up, and poured a chemical substance on his neck, according to an official police statement to People magazine. Smollett also said they spoke racial and anti-gay slurs and left a rope around his neck before fleeing the scene. Smollett is currently recovering in the hospital.

A group of House Democrats are advising all female lawmakers to wear white to President Trump's State of the Union speech next week. Wearing suffrage at white is a respectful message of solidarity with women across the country in a declaration that we will not go back on our hard-earned rights, said Representative Lois Frankel, a Democrat from Florida and chair of the House Democratic Women's Working Group. Hillary Clinton, of course, were white at the Democratic Convention back in 16, and Representative, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez chose to wear white when she was sworn in. So you're going to be wearing white as well, Kate? Absolutely. It's not like I spill coffee every time I wear white. It's not like you have a choice. You're not an independent person.

No. I mean, I want our hard-earned rights. I mean, whatever. I feel like this is harmless. I don't really care. Well, up next, we're going to talk to Melanie Israel about a horrifying abortion bill in Virginia. Want to get up to speed about the Supreme Court? Then subscribe to Scotus 101. a podcast about everything that's happening at the Supreme Court and what the justices are up to. So how late in the third trimester would you be able to do that? You know, it's very unfortunate that our physicians, witnesses were not able to attend today to speak specifically. No, I'm talking about your bill.

How late in the third trimester could a physician perform an abortion if he indicated it would impair the mental health of the woman? Or physical health. Okay. Okay. I'm talking about the mental health. So, I mean, through the third trimester, the third trimester goes all the way up to 40 weeks. Okay. But to the end of the third trimester?

Yep. I don't think we have a limit in the bill. So where it's obvious that a woman is about to give birth, she has physical signs that she is about to give a birth, would that still be a point at which she could request an abortion if she was so certified? She's dilating. Mr. Chairman, that would be a, you know, a decision that the doctor, the physician and the woman would make at that point. I'm asking you if your bill allows that. My bill would allow that, yes. That was Virginia delegate, Kathy Tran, a Democrat, answering questions from House Majority Leader Todd Gilbert, a Republican, about her abortion bill.

And Tran wasn't the only Virginia Democrat talking in extremes. On Wednesday, Virginia Governor Ralph Northam said this in a radio interview with WTOP. There are no exception. There was a very contentious committee hearing yesterday when Fairfax County delegate Kathy Tran made her case for lifting restrictions on third trimester abortions as well as other restrictions now in place. And she was pressed by a Republican delegate about whether her bill would permit an abortion, even as a woman is essentially dilating ready to give birth. And she answered that it would permit an abortion at that stage of labor. Do you support her measure and explain her answer? Yeah, and I'm, you know, I wasn't there, Julie, and I certainly can't speak for Delegate Tran, but I would tell you, one,

first thing I would say, this is why decisions such as this should be made by providers, physicians, and the mothers and fathers that are involved. There are, you know, when we talk about third trimester abortions, these are done with the consent of obviously the mother, with the consent of. of the physicians, more than one physician, by the way. And it's done in cases where there may be severe deformities, there may be a fetus that's non-viable. So in this particular example, if a mother is in labor,

I can tell you exactly what would happen. The infant would be delivered. The infant would be kept comfortable. The infant would be resuscitated if that's what the mother and the family desired. And then a discussion would ensue between the physicians and the mothers. And of course, all this comes on top of New York eliminating its late-term abortion restrictions

earlier this month. Thankfully, it looks like the Virginia bill is dead, but it's still extremely troubling. Joining us to discuss is Melanie Israel, a researcher at the Heritage Foundation who focuses on pro-life issues. Melanie, what did you think about this Virginia bill? You know what? Everything that we have been seeing here in the last couple days about this bill is horrifying. It's just utterly horrifying and ghoulish.

And I'm so glad that this bill failed the other day because it's so drastic and out of death with what good policy should be. And beyond the disturbing discussion that they had about an abortion happening during labor and having the option to do, in nigh care to a baby who is born alive. The bill is extreme in other ways, too. It's called the Repeal Act because it removes all restrictions on abortion in the state of Virginia. So in addition to late-term abortion, for any reason, it also eliminates informed consent requirements.

It eliminates clinic safety requirements. It allows these late-term abortions to be performed in outpatient clinics, so outside of even a hospital setting. It removes ultrasound requirements. It does away with the 24-hour waiting period. It's the repeal Act because it repeals all restrictions on abortion. And it's just so radical and so extreme, and it's unfortunate that there are policymakers who are trying to push this.

You know, Melanie, it's interesting that this is coming just a week after the New York bill passed that liberalized abortion up to the point of birth. You know, I can remember the partial birth abortion ban act passing under Bush, and this is kind of coming right up to that, which kind of, you know, makes a farce out of it. Why do you think this is happening right now? We had the March for Life less than two weeks ago. We had the 46th anniversary of Roe v. Wade, and suddenly this big push to expand abortion even more. Right. Well, you know, and one of the things that I think hasn't received as much coverage about the bill in New York, which of course is extreme as well, it's not only permitting abortion on demand, but it also eliminates the legal obligation to assist an unborn child if that child survives an abortion procedure. And it also does away with the state of New York's fetal homicide provision. Prior to last week, there were 38 states where,

a homicide statute could apply before birth. Now there's only 37 because New York did away with theirs. And so these laws are so extreme, and it's because groups on the left that promote, quote, unquote, reproductive rights have seen that over the last decade, there's been this wave of pro-life laws passing at the state level. Groups like Americans United for Life, national right to life, they have mob. of legislation and they work with members of the state legislatures to get those pro-life laws pass. And they've been very effective at it. There have been hundreds and hundreds of these laws in the last decade. And so unfortunately, some of the groups on the other side have started seeing that they have opportunities in some of these states like New York to do the exact opposite.

So let's talk a little bit about fetal development. Of course, you know, the argument we're always hearing from the left is it's just a clump of cells. But, you know, I think we've seen enough ultrasound pictures on Instagram and Facebook to know that once we talk about third trimester, it certainly doesn't look anything like a mere clump of cells. How developed is a baby in the third trimester? You know, by the third trimester, we know because we've seen those preemies in the NICU who were born as early as 26, 25, 25, 20, four weeks, they're fully developed. They still need to be in the NICU because they need some extra help to keep things going,

but they're fully developed. Everything is there, all the fingers, the toes, the internal organs, and yes, they need help to survive. But this is absolutely not just a clump of cells. When I remember going in to see my own 20-week ultrasound last year, that was at 20 weeks. You could see playing as day on that ultrasound screen. That's a baby. It's not a clump of cells. It's a baby.

Sometimes you can make out whose nose the baby might have. Sometimes the baby might be giving a thumbs up with their hand or sucking on their thumb. And again, with these laws, they're doing away with those ultrasound requirements that allow women to be inside their own body and see their child before they make this life-altering decision. You know, in that interview that we just listened to, something that Governor Northam said was that these decisions are always made with the consent of women and the, you know, the doctor and the husband, if he's involved, But is that actually the case? Are doctors really giving women all of their options? No. You know, one of the things that is so heartbreaking,

particularly in the cases where there is a very, very difficult diagnosis to the baby in the womb, where a doctor is telling a woman, your child is not going to survive. So you should have an abortion now rather than, hold off the inevitable. And unfortunately, there are just so many personal anecdotes from women who have been speaking out in response to these laws saying they weren't given any other options besides abortion.

And even in some cases, when those women would decide to continue carrying their pregnancy anyway, prepared to have to say goodbye to their child right after birth, their child was okay. We're seeing women post stories of their child who's six years old now, and they were told their child wouldn't survive, and they were told that they should have an abortion. Or the unfortunate cases where their child did indeed pass away right after birth, but parents had the opportunity to spend a couple hours with their child. And that was something that was very important and meaningful to them. And unfortunately in the medical community, we're hearing these stories from women that they're not being given those options. Yeah, and I unfortunately can't remember the names of the authors, but I know I've read a couple of op-eds by women who chose knowing that their child, I believe in both cases, would likely die before they gave birth to continue the pregnancy. And they wrote very powerfully of what that experience meant.

and even though obviously their way of knowing their child was very different than the way anyone would dream of or ideally want, it still mattered to them to have as much time as they could with their kids. And I think that's a perspective that often gets lost. But I wanted to talk a little bit about the international frontier. You know, the United States allows abortion all nine months. How does that put us compared to international norms? Unfortunately, the U.S. is very extreme in the context of international law. We are a very extreme outlier.

There are only six other countries in the entire world that permit elective abortion after 20 weeks of pregnancy. Unfortunately, the United States, we're in the company of countries like China and North Korea. and so it's definitely not the kind of company that we want to be keeping. And we can do so much better, and hopefully this outcry against these extreme bills will prompt policymakers to pursue different options, because we know for a fact that most Americans support limiting abortion to, at most in the first trimester. We know that the American people are not as extreme as what these last. laws would allow. And so hopefully this outcry that we've been seeing is going to emboldened

people to continue standing on the side of life. Yeah, that poll that came out a couple weeks ago from Marist and Knights of Columbus, I believe, 75% of Americans supporting banning abortion after the first trimester. Maybe that may have something to do with the abortion lobby feeling the urgency for its cause at this moment. Melanie, thank you so much for calling in and for explaining this bill for us. Thanks for having me. Are you looking for quick conservative policy solutions to current issues? Sign up for Heritage's weekly newsletter, The Agenda.

Each Tuesday in the Agenda, you will learn what issues Heritage Scholars on Capitol Hill are working on, what position conservatives are taking, and links to our in-depth research. The agenda also provides information on important events happening here at Heritage that you can watch online, as well as media interviews from our experts. Sign up for the agenda on heritage.org today. Well, just weeks ago, much of the media erupted over news that Karen Pence, wife of Vice President Mike Pence, would be teaching an art class at Emmanuel Christian School, a private Christian school in Virginia. Among other things, that school holds to traditional Christian teaching on sexual ethics. Well, the firestorm isn't over for that school. One of its athletic competitor schools, Sheridan School, in D.C.,

is now shunning Immanuel Christian over its views. After learning of the school's policy, Sheridan administrators said they began considering how to respond, whether they should stop playing Emmanuel Christian in sports altogether, or whether they should just release a statement. Here's what the head of the school, Jessica Donovan, wrote in a letter to parents obtained by the American Conservative. Quote, since the majority of students wanted to play,

we were initially planning to go to ICS with the student athletes wearing a statement of support. such as rainbow socks or warm-up jerseys. As we talked more, we understood that some students did not feel safe entering a school that bans LGBTQ parents, students, or even families that support LGBTQ rights. Forcing our children to choose between an environment in which they feel unsafe or staying home was not an option. So we decided that we would invite ICS to play all of the games at Sheridan. since ICS declined our offer to host, we will only play our home games and will not go to ICS to play, end quote. So, Kate, is this a sign of things to come for Christian schools in America?

Probably. I think what I really struck me about this was just this idea that we can't interact with these people. And, you know, I think it would have been different if the school had gone to play a game with Emmanuel Christian school. and something had happened where like if there was a specific incident where someone had used an anti-gastler or something, I would feel very differently about it. But as it stands, there's been no incident. As far as we know, this school has been nothing but welcoming. They apparently were so the opposite of In Your Face about their belief on these things that this other school had no idea that they requested that, you know, parents adhere to a normal Christian and sexual morality.

And I mean, I think this is one of those things where it's just, it's the opposite of tolerance. And it's really trying to ostracize. And it's concerning because, again, it shows rather than have this attitude of live and let live, the left is really trying to make concerns about the LGBT agenda akin to being racist. Yeah, Rod Dreher, who wrote about this, the American conservative, I think made a pretty good point that this concern about safety, quote-unquote, that the head of the school expressed in the email is pretty disingenuous, that it's pretty ridiculous to think that students would feel unsafe

in a school that holds to, you know, Christian sexual teaching. I mean, they never, as you mentioned, they never encountered any kind of problems, you know, playing them in sports in the past. So, you know, kind of hard to under, but we hear a lot about that sort of, I'm feeling unsafe. It's kind of, it's kind of, it's kind of the trigger warning mentality, the safe space mentality, kind of all of a piece. Yeah, and I think, I mean, there's implications for that. I mean, could potentially someone say in a workplace who is gay, lesbian, transgender, bisexual, pansexual, whatever, could someone say that my traditional Christian colleague that I know they go to a church, you know, this, of course, Bezfee did a whole article about how Chipp and Joanna Gaines went to a church that taught traditional sexual morality. so this is not insane.

But anyway, let's say someone says my colleague goes to church that they've never said anything on this issue. I have no idea what their views are. But they've mentioned they go to this church. I know this church teaches this. I feel unsafe around this colleague. I mean, is that going to fly? And I think, you know, that's why I was saying. I think it would be very different if there was a specific instance of, you know, an anti-gay slur or, you know, maybe they wanted some accommodation with dressing rooms that wasn't made.

But, like, as far as we know, nothing. ever happened. They don't cite anything happening. They don't even cite the students discussing this viewpoint. And I mean, this is scary. Yeah, the head of school, yeah, she doesn't actually cite specific, you know, students or quotes or anything. She just says, yeah, here's what they generally thought. Right. It's not like a manual Christian school is like, hey, everyone, get on the field. We're going to read a lot of our tenets of faith before the game. Right. I mean, I hope all of us work with people, play sports with people. I mean, if you're into playing sports, that's not my thing. But, you know, interact with people that we don't agree with on everything. You know, I hold very

strongly held moral beliefs. And I don't, I would hardly say, like, I can't be around someone. I can't work with someone. I can't interact with someone who disagrees with me. Yeah. Well, we'll have to see how, I mean, obviously this is breaking out. It's news now. It's public. And we'll have to see how other schools respond. And if maybe some of them take a better attack. Right. But I think, you know, I think this is a point that our heritage colleague Monica Burke made last week in this podcast. But essentially, you know, same-sex marriage and much of this liberal sexual revolution agenda was sold to the United States as live and let live. And what we are seeing increasingly is that's not what the activists want. They really want it that you, if you hold these beliefs, that you will face ostracization and ghettoization and all sorts of social consequences just for virtue of holdings. them, not even by your actions. And not even if you're in a public school. Like you're literally on your own having a little private school by yourself trying to mind your own business. Right. And even then you can't do that. Right. These are not activist judges. No one is telling the school what to do.

And it's happening. And it's happening in Northern Virginia, which of course, a lot of government officials, a lot of Capitol Hill staffers, a lot of politicians live in this area. Yeah. Well, we'll continue to follow these stories and similar stories. But that's going to do it for today. day. Thanks for listening to the Daily Signal podcast brought to you from the Robert H. Bruce radio studio at the Heritage Foundation. Please be sure to subscribe on iTunes, Google Play or SoundCloud, and please leave us a review or rating at iTunes to give us feedback. And be sure to listen every weekday by adding the Daily Signal podcast as part of your Alexa Flash briefing. We'll see you again tomorrow.

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