The Daily Signal - Ep. 302: Mr. Trump's Wild Ride

Episode Date: September 22, 2018

On today’s show, we feature an interview with CBS News’ Chief White House Correspondent Major Garrett on his new book, “Mr. Trump’s Wild Ride: The Thrills, Chills, Screams, and Occasional Blackouts of an Extraordinary Presidency.” Garrett has covered the White House for three different news outlets during the last four administrations. Find out more about his personal interactions with President Donald Trump and what he thinks the future holds for his administration.Also on today’s show:• We share an interview from SCOTUS 101’s podcast host and Heritage legal fellow Elizabeth Slattery, who spoke with the Judicial Crisis Network’s Carrie Severino about Judge Brett Kavanaugh.• Our favorite letters from you. Don’t forget, your letter could be featured next week; write us at [e-mail] or call 202-608-6205.• And this week’s good news story from Fox News host and former White House press secretary Dana Perino, who was recently featured on Politico’s Women Rule podcast.The Daily Signal podcast is available on Ricochet, iTunes, SoundCloud, Stitcher, or your favorite podcast app. All of our podcasts can be found at DailySignal.com/podcasts.If you like what you hear, please leave a review or give us feedback. Enjoy the show! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's Canadian Tire's Black Friday sale! With the lowest prices of the year. Hello, can we go? Limbo again. Shop the Black Friday sale at Canadian Tire and save up to 60%. November 27th to December 7th. Conditions apply, details online. This is the Daily Signal podcast from Monday, September 24th.

I'm Rob Blewey, editor-in-chief. And I'm Jenny Maltebano, contributor to the Daily Signal. On today's show, we'll discuss Judge Brett Kavanaugh's confirmation. Elizabeth Slattery, co-host of the Heritage Foundation podcast. podcast, SCOTUS 101, spoke with Carrie Severino of the Judicial Crisis Network. We'll share clips from their interview. We also spoke with CBS News's chief White House correspondent, Major Garrett, about his new book, Mr. Trump's Wild Ride. We'll also share your letters and an uplifting story from one of our favorite people. Fox News host, Dana Perino. Brett Kavanaugh's

confirmation took a series of unexpected twists and turns last week when a woman named Christine Blazy Ford accused him of sexual assault 36 years ago when they were in high school. The accusation has put Washington, D.C. on edge. You can follow the latest developments at DailySignal.com. On today's show, we're featuring an interview that Heritage Foundation Legal Fellow Elizabeth Slattery conducted with Carrie Severino of the Judicial Crisis Network. You can listen to the full show on the SCOTUS 101 podcast. Here is Severino talking about Kavanaugh's character. This is someone who's been in the public eye for 25 years, not just those background checks, but lots of people, you know, who have interacted with him, who have worked with him. Even before this came out, we had had women who had worked with him and known him from high school, college, law school, you know, when he was working with Ken Starr, when he was working in the White House, when he had all of these different phases who say, I know him, I have worked with him.

I just can't stop talking about what a great, upstanding, respectful, even-handed, you know, person he is. then after the allegations became public, dozens more women who specifically knew him during high school got a letter together and said, we knew him at the time. This doesn't jive with the Brett Kavanaugh. We all knew. Some of them had dated him and one of them even during the time of these allegations. So she says he was always a perfect gentleman. This doesn't compute with the Brett Kavanaugh that I knew. So I think you have to take all of all of the surrounding evidence that we have and look at it.

And then, you know, the Senate is going to have to move forward on this at some point. Whether that happens with the hearing on Monday, you know, hopefully or without, I think we need to stop the delay tactics because that's something that is really harmful to this process. Before this even came out, last week, Justice Ginsburg was giving an interview and said how disappointed she is. in the process. The way it is now is not right. The way it was before. And she reminisced about when Justice Scalia was confirmed unanimously, when she was confirmed virtually unanimously. If Brett Kavanaugh had been nominated, you know, in that era, there's no doubt in my mind. I don't think anyone can really doubt. He would have been confirmed unanimously. It's a shame to see what is the circus that this process has turned into. Well, Ginny, it certainly is a circus in Washington. And one of the reasons

we're in this situation today is because of Senator Diane Feinstein's handling of the when she first received it nearly two months ago. Here's what Severino had to say about it. If she thought it was serious or credible or relevant to this confirmation process, she should have disclosed it to her fellow members in the Judiciary Committee, found a way to protect the confidentiality of Ms. Blasey Ford and also protect Judge Kavanaugh's reputation. These things should be, because she's also having a lot of backlash after coming, well, not really coming out, having this leaked, right?

that should have all of that didn't have to happen if they had followed the proper process. You know, as someone who is a mother of both sons and daughters, I think everyone deserves respect. And so we have to be careful that we are absolutely respecting women who have had a sexual assault. And so we have to be of respect also to women who are claiming to have. We don't know the outcome of what we're going to find in this yet. But we also have to respect, you know, men as well. And so everyone, both sides deserve to be heard. We thank Elizabeth Slattery and SCOTUS 101 for that interview.

You can read Elizabeth's commentary on why she stands with Brett Kavanaugh at daily signal.com. And just click on the Kavanaugh tab at the top of the page for our full coverage. Even better, subscribe to the Daily Signal's Morning Bell email newsletter and you'll get the latest news delivered to your inbox each morning. We created the morning bell to be your one-stop source for credible news reporting and insightful commentary. on the issues that are shaping the agenda. Sign up now at daily signal.com. Just click on the connect button at the top of the page, and you'll get it tomorrow. Up next, our interview with CBS's Chief White House correspondent, Major Garrett.

We'll be right back. Liberals have pretty much cornered the market on 101-style podcasts that break down tough policy issues in the news. Until now, did you know that every week, Heritage Explains, intermingles personal stories, news clips, and facts from heritage experts to help explain some of today's hardest issues from a conservative perspective. Look for Heritage Explains on iTunes, Stitcher, Google Play, or wherever you get your podcasts. Major Garrett is CBS News's chief White House correspondent and the author of the brand new book,

Mr. Trump's Wild Ride. He's covered the White House for three different news outlets during the last four administrations. If you've ever watched a White House news conference or press briefing, chances are you've seen Major in the front row. Major, it's great to have you on the Daily Signal podcast. Thank you for having me. Thank you very much. Now, you recount in the book the first words that Donald Trump ever spoke to you and why you should have taken them more seriously. I want to take our listeners back to that moment in August 2015

when Donald Trump, for many conservatives, was somebody who, you know, they didn't necessarily expect to end up in the White House. Can you tell us that story? Sure. So we're in Burtrun, Michigan. This was just a few days after the first Republican presidential debate in Cleveland, Ohio, where Donald Trump made a very big splash. And he drew a very large crowd to this part of Michigan. It wasn't even for a Trump rally or a Trump event. I still have my press pass from that event. It was for the two local Republican county. offices. So I think one of them was Genesee County. I can't remember any other county, but it was a fundraiser for those two Republican counties. So the Trump campaign didn't even have its own press badges. It didn't even have an apparatus. And he were charged, I think, $25 to get in, $75 if you went to front row

seat, and there were thousands of people there. Before the event, Donald Trump had a press conference. First time I'd ever seen him in person, my entire life. And he goes through a couple of questions on one side, and he looks over to the right side where the press corps is sitting. I'm on the far seat on the first row. So not very close to him. But he notices me. He says, major. Fantastic. And what he meant by that was, you're here. And because you're a network correspondent, I know who you work for. I know you by reputation. my campaign must be getting more important. Therefore, I must get more important.

And then he says, I saw you answer or ask a question of President Obama. He didn't like that. I'll probably be happier. Go ahead. Something for that effect. It's all in the book. And what I say is I should have owned a lot of things about that. First of all, the sense of self and the sense of media presence

providing verification to Trump that he's becoming more important and how much he monitors that. That was a very early clue. The fact that he watches and consumes a lot of news television do all a great deal about this question that I asked President Obama about the Iran nuclear deal where the President really went after me. And then he also

had no sense of time. He said it was two weeks ago and a month ago. And then there's also the sense of the President wasn't happy, but I'm sure I'll be more happy, meaning whatever the scenario, whatever the situation, I believe I will have the upper hand. The point of all this is to

say he left me a lot of clues about who he was and what his approach to politics was going to be over and over and over again. My own criticism is I didn't pay nearly enough attention to that. There were clues right there, right in front of me, but I didn't take them seriously. I didn't analyze them closely enough. And if I had, I despaired myself months and months and months of bewilderment about who Donald Trump was and what he was actually trying to do if I just paid closer attention to that very first sentence he ever spoke to me. Well, Major, you mentioned President Trump's sense of self, and something else that you write about in your book is the president's reliance on his gut. How big of a strength would you say

was that during his campaign, and do you think it has served him well in his presidency so far? Well, it was the most important component of his campaign. I can't tell you how many Republicans, especially those who ran against him and lost. could to this day are day in and day out amazed about how this particular political figure

in American life Donald Trump, now our president, now the nation's president, relies on this sort of instinct he has and will not turn away from it. And in fact, when criticism comes cascading down

and when he senses people around him, even his closest allies begin to get wobbly, begin to get weak need, he increases, not decreases, whatever it is that he's just done to create the cascade of criticism or the sense of anxiety among his advisors. That is a unique approach to politics. I'm not saying it's the best approach to politics. I'm not saying it always works to his advantage, but it is singularly different. And for the time in which he was running, and it may not be worthwhile than any other time, but for the time in which he was running, it sent a powerful

and reassuring signal to his supporters who wanted someone to speak the way Donald Trump did and once criticized wouldn't back down. That reinforced their sense of confidence in him, their reliance upon him, and their willingness to turn out for him. So I don't see how you can take any of those things I just said and separate them from his eventual victory. I believe they are absolutely reinforcing. Now, has that always served him well as president? No, it hasn't. But it has also served him well at times when he's pushed the envelope and then backed away. I have an entire chapter in the book about this president's, and there's only one way to describe it, unique approach to North Korea.

Incredibly hard, intense, aggressive belligerent by one turn and then diplomatic and backing away in the next. He created that space for him with very unconventional methods, methods that left the foreign policy class right and left. you willed it. So this sense of gut instinct and going on his own and looking around the room and saying, well, just because we haven't done it before, why can't I do it? It's a question he routinely asks, often answering it himself. Well, I'm going to do it this way. Everyone fall in line. That sense of gut instinct, whether it always serves him in the best way or the worst way, it is his most reliable instrument as a politician. his reliance on it is nearly perpetual.

Well, Major, you've had the opportunity to cover four different presidencies, and that's certainly one of the distinctions about this president is that gut instinct. How have you changed, or how have you been forced and other reporters been forced to perhaps take a different perspective based on the other presidents you've covered because of Trump's unique style? It's a great question. how we I've always reluctant

to describe how other reporters have changed because I'm so focused on what I do and how I try to do it and how we try to do the story within the confines of CBS News. I would just say

there were, in the previous presidencies I covered, a general rhythm. There was a general rhythm and there were rhythms. Most presidents, every president I cover, would sort of look at a week, at a month, and have a strategy, have a set of goals. Some were short-term, some were medium-term, some were long-term.

Other events would intervene, of course, but they would try to create a sense of internal and external pace and some dimension of predictability. This president just doesn't do that. He doesn't think that way. He doesn't operate that way. And even when some things are put on a somewhat predictability, past meeting, there's a decision that has to be made and several agencies are involved

and they need to check off on it and needs to get to a place where it can be presented to the president. And that process has a somewhat traditional dimension to it. The president himself, and I write about this in the book, will sometimes look up and say, nope, I've changed my mind, or I'm taking the opposite position just because I don't think everyone in this room has thought about it as much as I have or is trying to be as creative as I have or I'm just changing my mind. I'm just flat changing my mind. and that creates its own disruption. That's an internal disruption that sometimes filters out to us.

Then there's this normal disruption that he likes to create and generate. He loves to churn. He loves to churn the sense that he can always redirect the conversation, or if not redirect it entirely, shove it in different and unpredictable directions. Because his Twitter fee means a presidential statement fee. We have to measure in a way everything that appears there against the totality of everything else that's going on because the most important thing that may have happened at any given day, Saturday, Sunday, 1 a.m., 4 a.m., it doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter. It could be a tweet. And that sense that you always have to be on guard and always sifting that aspect of this presidency is without a doubt completely different. Well, and of course that speaks right to the title of your book, Mr. Trump's Wild Ride, which I love, as somebody who's been on Mr. Toad's Wild Ride at Disneyland before. So certainly something that all of us in Washington have come to try to adapt. And I definitely hear what you're saying about past presidents. And I think it's probably made not only journalists and the news media put them in a unique position,

but the amount of interest there seems to be from both Republicans, Democrats, liberals, conservatives about President Trump is just off the charts. I mean, you see it day in and day out. So it's certainly something. It's an endlessly fascinating saga. It's an exhausting saga. It creates anxiety. It creates a great sense of adoration. One thing I write about the book is you can't get away from the fact that this presidency,

in all of its, one phrase I use, cyclonic spasms creates tremendous and your constant reactions. Some of them deeply emotional, some of them psychological, some of them ideological, some of them just pure amazement. And all of that is the totality of our American experience with what is clearly an American experiment. Donald Trump is the first president of his kind, never to lead a military successfully into a large battle or to have been previously elected and tested in prior political office. He checked neither of those boxes. Every single president before him had.

As I read in the book, that tells us something that is changing about our American. sense of expectation of what a president either needs to be or should be. So as this experiment continues, we're all watching, and the point of the book for me is to step back and say, whatever your reactions, do you love this or hate this experiment, things are happening. And five to ten, 20 years from now, we're going to look back and say, wow, those things that happened are still with us, for good or for ill. And so I try to get myself away from a bit of the noise and find a protective space where I could try to make sense and assess what's already happened on the substantive side of the Trump presidency as opposed to

the noisier side of it. Well, Major, it is certainly a unique presidency. Something we discussed a little bit was President Trump's love of TV. How do you think that television news shapes his thinking and his decision making? Well, it certainly informs his sense of the world. and because his television doing habits tend to, according to his own Twitter feed, which gives us pretty regular and near constant signals about what he's watching and what's making an impression upon him, his TV viewing habits are not only large, meaning he watches a lot of television.

There's no debate about that. And that is one of the ways he is informed about the world, and that's one of the ways he then interacts with the rest of the time. country. So it does inform not only what he prioritizes and what messages he drives on his Twitter feed, but for example, and I recount this in some detail in the book, when he saw the original global television coverage of the chemical weapons attack in Syria in 2017, then he got intelligence briefings and other video that reinforced it. He said, I have to do something. I have to do something that suggests that the world is not going to take this,

and there's going to be a reaction, and I'm not going to do it the way President Obama did it. And then I sort of go through what was described to me by many who participated in it, very methodical and gradual process to make a decision, methodical and gradual in ways that even surprised those who were expecting that they'd never seen President Trump operate under this kind of pressure before. They're expecting to act maybe a little bit more rationally or maybe more rapidly, either one. But he didn't. And I sort of explained the process in the book.

So that, and I'm not saying it's an absolute conclusion, but it offers some suggestive evidence that in that case, when the pressure was on and there was something he was reacting to emotionally and otherwise by television, he took his time. Took a lot of meetings, listened to a lot of different voices, then made a decision. and then stuck with it and moved on. So television does inform a lot of what he does, what he thinks, and what he reacts to. And that's also something that White House aides have told me makes him unpredictable internally because they're not sure one days that he's a watching and what it is that's going to click in his head and then suddenly come to their desk as a new high priority item. Right. Well, something else I was hoping you could give us some insight into.

Are your personal interactions with President Trump? I know specifically there's one instance in the book where you asked him if he was scared to let people to let his supporters down. Could you elaborate on that a little bit? Yeah, we were in South Carolina, Myrtle Beach, and it's a very, very hot day. And we, and my producer and I got to the rally about two hours earlier. We knew that we were going to have an interview with then Canada Trump. The crowd had been forming long, long before that, maybe six, seven hours. And that was consistent with so many Trump.

rallies that I covered, and I covered more than 75 Trump rallies during the 2016 campaign. And so I said to him, do you ever worry that all the promises that you make, and he by then had long since embraced this idea, you're going to get so tired of winning, we're going to win everything, it's all going to be great. He said, you know, you're building up tremendous expectations. Do you ever worry that you're not going to be able to meet them? And he said, and I I quote him directly, I quote him directly in the book. I don't want to let these people down. It is pressure.

I would be so upset with myself if I let them down. They show up early. They wait in line for hours. I want to stay on them. What are you doing? Why are you here? Well, it's because of me, and I feel the weight of it. I'm totally freezing there.

But it was a moment where I think he was, at least momentarily reflective about the expectations he was setting. And then I mentioned him in the course of the interview, you know, when Harry Truman left the office, he said, you know, Dwight Eisenhower is going to come into this place and it's going to mark orders like he did when he was the Supreme Allied commander. And back then, all the orders were immediately carried out. He's going to come here as president. He's going to say, do this, do that, and nothing's going to happen. Poor Ike.

Let's look at the puzzle. You know other presidents have been frustrated with, even though they won an election and they were setting an agenda, it takes a long time to get things done. He acknowledged that ever so briefly, but said, no, I'll get it done. I'll take care of all these things. And I quote him directly of all the things that he, at that moment, in that part of the conversation before the South Carolina Republican primary, had prioritized. And then I sort of say, well, some of them have been carried out. Many of them remain undone, which exemplifies this gap that every president encounters between what their intentions are, what their promises are, and what they're actually able to get done. Well, Major, I applaud you for making all those trips to those rallies, getting outside of Washington and telling those great stories that they come from all across America.

You know, one of the things that we've seen here in Washington is a lot of comings and goings from this White House in the time President Trump has been there. Who, based on your own reporting, still has his trust, whether it's somebody in the cabinet or whether it's an aide who still remains loyal to him? Who does he trust? I fundamentally believe he trusts his chief of staff, John Kelly. But does he trust him every hour of every day? No, that's not really the way that Donald Trump operates. I don't think outside of his family there is anyone he trusts 100% of the time day in and day out. I just don't think he operates that way.

Now, I don't say that the only other. option for Donald Trump is mistrust. There is a gray area in between, a testing place. I mentioned the book a couple of times that it's my experience, both dealing with him and talking to people who walk with him on a regular basis, that he's always sort of placing people on a continuum of high performance, high trust, not so high performance, maybe mistrust. And that evaluation process, unlike most political figures I've covered, never ends. Well, most political figures, I've covered once you've sort of proven yourself you're in and you're trusted until you provide evidence otherwise. For Trump, even if you don't provide that evidence otherwise,

still wonders and tests and reevaluates. That's one of the things I think makes it difficult to work for Trump. And while you've seen people who had good jobs, leave, and I read about this in the book, people who come into the administration, they send an egg timer. They're like, I'm going to be here a year. Maybe not even that. And usually, when that time expires, they're out. Because it's tough. It's a tough and exacting and sometimes emotionally difficult, sometimes traumatizing, but a lot of times difficult system of standards that Trump sets.

So I think Kelly has his trust. I think he is strongly behind his Treasury Secretary, Steve Mnuchin. I talk about how Mnuchin was one of those early, identified key people in the Trump world outside of his family, starting with the day after the election. I talk about that in some detail in the book. But I think the circle is small. Even his family members have recently said the circle of trust is smaller. They would like it larger. But I think even for those who are not family members who have his trust, it's never permanent. And just because I think that's the way Trump looks at life. You can never be sure. So you're

always asking and you're always testing. But one thing you mentioned about the Trump rise, I want to get this across. One of the things I tried to do in the book is not just say I went to the following, but introduce people who are reading the book to people I met and the voices I heard during the campaign because they're relevant to some of the policies the President Trump is pursued. And I wanted those voices in the book so it wouldn't be just a Washington, D.C. book about a presidency. Not only that, my colleague at CBS Dean Reynolds is based in Chicago on a monthly basis that sort of these Trump supporter check-in stories. All this is going on in Washington, world with Trump supporters in some part of the country, what are they saying? I've placed those

voices in the course of the first year and a half of the Trump presidency as well to constantly have a check, not only for the reader, but for anyone here in Washington, introducing and making sure those voices of people who look at this presidency and have a certain point of view on it, that they're not left off or they're not short-changed in trying to evaluate what has and hasn't happened. Well, Major, that's one of the reasons that I know Ginny and I were commenting even before the interview of why we enjoyed the book so much. It's just one of those that's filled with stories and things as closely as we follow these, these comings and goings and happenings in Washington and try to do it all around the country. You've managed to include

some excellent anecdotes and some great details on this book. So I know Ginny has one question looking forward to 2020. Yeah, you know, Major, it's hard to believe that it's been two years since the election. So looking ahead, are there any significant changes you think the Trump team will make for the 2020 campaign? A lot of that's going to be determined by whatever happens to midterm elections. I'm not suggesting there'll be wholesale changes, but there will maybe be some significant reasons. assessments, depending on what happens. As I say, we up along with the book, if Democrats we take control of the House, then there'll be a readjustment. That will suggest a Democratic

sort of backlash or snapback. It will suggest maybe some buyer's remorse against some suburban Republicans and independents who voted for Donald Trump in 2016. There will have to be some measurement about what does that mean and what does it portend for a re-election campaign. But as I also say, the epilogue if Republicans even narrowly retain control of the House and Democrats don't be gaining or take control of the Senate, meaning Republicans basically hold full. I say President Trump's renomination is guaranteed and his reelection is far more likely than anyone would have imagined, even his most ardent supporters on inauguration day 2017. And so the midterms are going to be one of these mile markers.

in the Trump presidency, and we're going to look back on that as either there's this heavy reaction and there looks to be all this activism, but Republicans still by some amazing combination of their loyalty and Trump's unique political skills hold on, or there is going to be this tide, this wave of some dimension. And then they'll have to be a reassessment. There's a suggestion there'll be a rather big, personal shake-up in the White House. If Democrats take control of the House. If they take control the Senate, maybe that will even be deeper and more profound in terms of personnel and how to position the White House. There's a sense that if Democrats take control the House and maybe the Senate, but even if only family the House, the investigatory aspect of Congress

will be much more intrusive, and the White House will need to prepare for that, not just in terms of communications, but lawyers and experts. So there could be some significant changes depending on what happens in the midterms. And the last thing I'll say about the midterm election, because I learned this in 2016. I spent a lot of time covering presidential campaigns before and lots of midterm campaigns. I've been all over the country doing that many times. And I think all the data and all the things we thought we learned before 2016 that told us there were pieces of data we could sift and analyze that would have some predictive value.

I think that's all gone. I think the Trump era introduces a new dimension of unpredictability. saw it first in 2016, I think we'll see it again in the midterm. By that I mean, you can't go back to a previous midterm cycle and say, well, these pieces of evidence told us what was going to happen and these pieces of evidence are going to tell us what's going to happen now. I don't think we know what's going to happen. We know some trend lines, but because the Trump effect, this personality and the way people will react to it is so different. We just have to wait and see. Some great insight. Major, thank you so much for writing the book and for joining us on the Daily

Signal podcast. Once again, it's called Mr. Trump's Wild Ride. Thanks very much. Want to get up to speed about the Supreme Court? Then subscribe to SCOTUS 101, a podcast about everything that's happening at the Supreme Court and what the justices are up to. Thanks for sending us your letters to the editor. Each Monday, we feature some of our favorites, both on this show and in our Morning Bell email newsletter. Ginny, what do we have this week? Well, first up, Marv Langston writes, thanks to Kevin Mooney for the great article covering climate change and the Russia. It's amazing to me that our country and the globe continue to be fooled by the new climate religion. Carbon dioxide follows temperature.

It doesn't cause it. Even more interesting is that if Putin was going to push someone into office, it would have been Hillary, not Trump. And Heidi Greby writes about last week's interview with Fox News Politics Editor Chris Steyerwalt, who just published a new book called Every Man a King. She writes, Thanks so much for your interview. I admire both Steyerwalt and Dana Perino, and I learned a lot about populism.

Oh, if only our kids were taught civics and American history, A? Why can't we learn from history? Yes, that works. No, that doesn't. She did that and got burned. He did this and was such a hero. Well, we're trying to teach our kids ourselves if public school won't do it. Hope to see more interviews from those in the journalism world. Thanks for what you guys and gals do at The Daily Signal.

I look forward to reading it every day. Your letter could be featured on next week's show. Send an email to letters at dailysignal.com or leave a voicemail message at 202-608-6205. Up next, we'll share this week's good news story. Did you know you can now listen to all of our events through SoundCloud or just by visiting our events page on heritage.org? You now have access to hundreds of events and compelling discussions on policy issues from your car, on the train, or the comfort of your own home. Visit heritage.org slash events for more information or search for the Heritage Foundation on SoundCloud. This week's story comes from Fox News host and former White House press secretary, Dana Perino. Ginny, tell us about it.

Well, Perino was featured on Politico's Women Rule podcast. It's a great interview that covers a range of topics, but there's one specifically we wanted to share with you all today. Dana speaks about the hard decision to move to Washington, D.C. early on in her career and how prayer helped her. And I wrestled with it because at the time I thought, if I don't do this television work now, I will never get to do it. I thought that it was door closed on other opportunities. And if you decide to go into to work for government, that's going to be your life. Obviously, and for any young woman listening, that is not true. But that's what I, that's just what I thought.

And I slept on it for three days. And I remember learning that if you pray about a concern that you have or a question you have, you pray right in between. when you're awake and right before you fall asleep, if you pray right in there, that when you wake up, you should have the answer. I learned this in church a long time ago. Did it work?

And it came up to me and I'm telling you, I woke up in the morning and I was like, oh, I'm going to Washington. Ginny, so the interesting thing is I tried this last week and I did exactly as Dana described. I had a big decision to make and it worked. I felt so good the next morning with clarity and purpose about what I was going to do.

I really thank Dana Perino once again for coming through with some great advice. I know she's been a mentor to you personally, and you had the opportunity to meet her recently. I did a couple months ago. I was in New York, and she was so gracious and allowed me to stop in and pick her brain about a variety of topics. And I really appreciated it. I know she's been a mentor to you as well. And this whole podcast I'd recommend people listen to because it was so insightful to how she started her career, her advice to women, men, anyone who wants to get involved in politics or communications, just all around a great podcast.

And you said one thing that stuck with you that I hadn't previously known about was the abuse that Dana was taking on Twitter. And tell us that story because it's really fascinating to hear it from her own perspective about how these weren't even real people. Right. And it's something that caught me by surprise because she didn't really acknowledge it while it was happening. It started in 2016 during the Trump campaign for the presidency. and a bunch of Twitter feedback was horrible today,

and I had a lot of other conservatives, but she was particularly affected. And she talks about how when Twitter went in and purged, all of these Russian bots, the abuse finally stopped. It calmed down. And she was so surprised. And she said, you know, it takes a toll on men, on women, no matter how strong, no matter how confident you are,

that kind of abuse via social media has an effect. These people are real people. They are. And I think, again, speaks to something that we've said on the show before. I mean, it really does matter how you treat others. And that extends to Twitter and Facebook and all of those social media platforms. So we encourage you to check out Dana Perino's podcast with Politico's Women Rule. And hopefully we'll be featuring more stories from her and Chris in the future.

We're going to leave it there for today. The Daily Signal podcast is broadcast from the Robert H. Bruce Radio Studio at the Heritage Foundation. You can find it on the Rikishay Audio Network along with problematic women and the right side of history. All of our shows can be found at dailysignal.com slash podcasts. You can subscribe on iTunes, SoundCloud Stitcher, or your favorite podcast app. And if you like what you hear, please leave us a review or give us feedback. Be sure to follow us on Twitter at DailySignal and Facebook.com slash the DailySignal News. The Daily Signal podcast will be back tomorrow with Kate and Daniel.

Have a great week. You've been listening to The Daily Signal podcast, executive produced by Kate Tranko and Daniel Davis. Sound design by Michael Gooden, Lauren Evans, and Thalia Ramprasad. For more information, visit DailySignal.com.