The Daily Signal - Getting Put on the SPLC's 'Hate Map' Is Just One More Cancel Culture Attack for Focus on the Family | Jim Daly

Episode Date: June 29, 2025

When the Southern Poverty Law Center put Focus on the Family on its "hate map," listing the conservative Christian nonprofit alongside chapters of the Ku Klux Klan, it made life a bit tougher, but the Christian group had already faced so many "cancel culture" attacks, it was ready for the blowback. "We are Christians, we're commanded to love people that don't think the way we think, we're commanded to endure evil patiently, which I feel that this is one of these exercises," Focus on the Family President Jim Daly told The Daily Signal.  The SPLC, which gained its reputation for suing Klan groups into bankruptcy in the 1980s but now puts mainstream conservative and Christian groups on the "hate map" with Klan chapters, branded Focus on the Family an "anti-LGBTQ+ hate group" last month. As I noted in my book, "Making Hate Pay: The Corruption of the Southern Poverty Law Center," the SPLC claims America is more hateful than it actually is, partly to raise money and partly to silence its political opponents.  Subscribe to The Tony Kinnett Cast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-tony-kinnett-cast/id1714879044⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Keep Up With The Daily Signal Sign up for our email newsletters:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.dailysignal.com/email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠     Subscribe to our other shows:  Problematic Women:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.dailysignal.com/problematic-women⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  Victor Davis Hanson: https://megaphone.link/THEDAILYSIGNAL9809784327   Follow The Daily Signal:  X:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://x.com/intent/user?screen_name=DailySignal Instagram:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.instagram.com/thedailysignal/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  Facebook:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.facebook.com/TheDailySignalNews/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  Truth Social:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://truthsocial.com/@DailySignal⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  YouTube:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.youtube.com/dailysignal?sub_confirmation=1    Thanks for making The Daily Signal Podcast your trusted source for the day’s top news. Subscribe on your favorite podcast platform and never miss an episode. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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We'd love to talk. Business. You know, I have probably interviewed now five D-transitioners, including Chloe Cole, who's only 19 or 20. Her story is so horrifying because she was 12, 13 when she felt like she was in the wrong body. Now, research shows that about 90 percent, did you get this? 90 percent of preteen and teen gender dysphoric children self-correct to their biological gender by 19 years old. And I'm feeling like this is repeating itself over and over in schools today. And it's a tragedy that adults don't know how to protect children rather than harm them.

Well, this is Tyler O'Neill, a senior editor at The Daily Signal. I'm honored to be joined by Jim Daly, who is president of Focus on the Family. It's a great pleasure to have you with us. Tyler, it's good to be with you. Thanks for bringing up this topic. Yeah, yeah. So I, you know, was reading through the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate map. And lo and behold, I saw that focus on the family was there for the very first time.

And that kind of shocked me because for a long time, SPLC had claimed when you called them anti-Christian, they said, no, we're not because we don't put focus on the hate map. So what do you think of this and, you know, what does it reveal about the SPLC? Well, I think the SPLC, you know, I'll give them credit. They started, I think, in the 1950s, if I remember correctly, and they were helping to fight in the 70s. Yeah, they were late. To help fight, you know, discrimination, racial discrimination, and they were funding attorneys to be able to push back on discrimination. And that was a good thing. But I think for whatever reason, they kind of now have trained their guns on the Christian community.

and I think they're net in trying to collect or at least to besmirch Christian organizations that believe in the Bible. They've just decided we're going to cast a wide net and call them hate groups. I have pointed out it's kind of interesting to me that a group that creates a hate list in and of itself is kind of spewing hate, right? Yeah, well, and it actually inspired a terrorist attack against the Family Research Council back in 2012. So, you know, I think you might be on to something there. Well, let's talk about that for a minute because I think people forget that. In 2012, FRC, which at one time was a part of focus on the family, a shooter who went in with, I think, 15 or 20 Chick-fil-A sandwiches and a gun, ended up shooting the guard. And the way the FRC building is, you enter into a lobby with only the guard at that level.

And the guard was able, even being shot, was able to subdue this guy. But when he was interrogated, he said the reason he was motivated to shoot these people at family research council was because they had been placed on the SPLC's hate list. There's direct connection with the responsibility or lack thereof of doing something like this. And I think that's the big concern I have. People can have a different opinion. We do have the First Amendment in this country. You can call me a hater. That's your right to do that.

one though I'd love to see more evidence what is the concoction for you that you put into your secret black box and spit out a list of hate groups I read their allegations basically they're saying yeah focus on the family is a Christian biblically based group that thinks marriage should be between a man and a woman that's what our hate is and I know being here at focus I don't know anybody here that hates anybody. We are Christians. We're commanded to love people that don't think the way we think. We're commanded to endure evil patiently, which I feel this is one of those exercises, because I think what they're trying to do is quite evil and quite horrible to the Christian community, particularly, but also to the United States in general. What, 97, 98 percent of marriages are going to be

created in a one male, one female environment. They're talking about that percent, that small percent on their end of that definition that they feel they need to attack those that don't agree. And, you know, I just feel, I remember having a meeting, Tyler, in Washington, D.C. It was five LGBT leaders and five Christian leaders. Tim Keller was there. I was there, Gabe Lyons. But I remember at the end, one of the participants said, can we have permission to share

with each other advice to the other side? I thought, wow, okay, this will be interesting. Tim Keller was brilliant as he typically is or was. He said, you know, New York City is probably the most cosmopolitan city in the world. But Muslims don't go out of their way to stick their finger in the eye of Jews and Christians and vice versa. The reason New York City works is because we respect one another. And his advice, he said, was learn to respect people that don't think the way you think. and don't stick your finger in the other guy's eye.

And specifically, we're talking about cases like Jack Phillips, the baker, of course, the grandmother, the florist who was sued. And, you know, the beat goes on in court, etc., where these people are trying to make an example out of Christians that don't believe they can, with a Christ-mindedness, be able to supply those services because it is a infringement upon their religious beliefs. You can disagree with that, but can't you find another baker?

I think Jack Phillips gave them a number of another baker that would bake him a cake. Why are you picking on me? He's now had five or six filings against him because he's a Christian, and that is just not the country that we want to have. Well, and that, you know, his lawyers, his organization that was representing him in court, the ADF, they're on the SPLC hate map. But, you know, I think it was interesting. You mentioned marriage between a man and a woman.

There's also this little matter of being made male and female and then not being able to change your, you know, change your sex between the two of them and the SPLC faulted focus for standing, you know, on the side of sanity on the transgender issue as well. You know, I have probably interviewed now five D transatlantic. including Chloe Cole, who's only 19 or 20, who has a lawsuit against, I think it's Blue Cross in California. Her story is so horrifying because she was 12, 13 when she felt like she was in the wrong body. She was trapped in the wrong body. Now, research shows that about 90 percent, did you get this? 90 percent of preteen and teen gender dysphoric children self-correct to their

biological gender by 19 years old. So the immorality that we speak about in this case is how this apparatus is now capturing these children through schools, school counselors, teachers, administrators to say, hey, little Johnny, we do think you're merry. You need to be merry. And that's what they do. They recruit now in public schools to affirm these children's dysphoria. And it is so immoral to trap these kids. So in Chloe Cole's case, she had double mastectomy, hysterectomy. She wanted everything female to be removed from her physical body. And they said to her parents, you know, you're either going to have a dead daughter or a trans son. What do you want? And they felt forced to sign the agreement, the medical treatment agreement. So she starts. She gets the double mastectomy.

She gets the hormone treatment. And then she sees a woman breastfeeding for the first time when she was like 15 and she realized I will never be able to do that because of what I've done to my body. And that was the trigger I believe God used to get her help and healthy to the point now she's back. She is female. She knows her birth gender. And I'm feeling like this is repeating itself over and over in schools today. And it's a tragedy that adults don't know how to protect children rather than that.

harm them? Well, so it was a very interesting, there was an interview shortly after Focus was put on the hate map, where R.G. Cravens, who's at the SPLC, said that it was both false and harmful. If you say that you can't be Christian if you identify as LGBTQ, whatever their expanded universe is now. And I wanted to see if you would respond to that claim, because I thought, that was, you know, he's saying is doing harm to families by saying that you can't affirm somebody's identity. There's so much in this that, you know, first and foremost, we're made in God's image. Christians, Jews believe this. We're made in God's image. And God makes us for a very specific reason. I would say one of the things I had a woman on Elizabeth Wanning who was a former lesbian.

She answered it so beautifully. She said, this is thousands of years old. This is. This is. is Gnosticism where you separate your physical body from your spirit and that the spirit is the only thing that matters and that's what counts with God with the universe, etc. That is a faulty way of thinking about it because God creates us very specifically and in the area of gender he creates us male and female for lots of reasons. I know those communities that don't emotionally, psychologically line up with that. They fight that. But they're actually fighting God's nature. And we understand that there will be a small percentage of those teens, for example, that are feeling gender dysphoric. But again, 90% will self-correct. So that 10% we need to have

compassion for. We need to have a heart for the mental issues that they are suffering from. And here's how I'd respond to this person. The DSM-4, for example, which is the diagnostic tool, the diagnostic guide that psychologists and psychiatrists use. The DSM4 noted that gender dysphoria was a mental issue, as a mental condition. They also included all of the LGBT alphabet as something that needed counseling and intervention to help correct. Now, does that work every time?

Of course not. But the idea that without evidence, without scientific evidence, somewhere between the DSM3 and 4, and now the DSM-5, those disciplines just erase that. And they decided because, in my opinion, of political pressure, we are no longer going to call that a mental disorder. It would be good if they could provide the science for this. And so far, at least for me, the science has been flimsy. So he can make all those accusations.

He can say everything. I know people personally who have come out of the LGBT alphabet and are now strong believers, and they're saying to me, people's identity needs to be rooted in Christ. If they can find that place, everything else will line up. And they will affirm to me that, no, you cannot be gay and be Christian. Those are incompatible. It would be like me saying, I'm an adulterer, but I'm a Christian, I'm good. That doesn't go.

It doesn't fly scripturally. I've got to bend my behavior, my understanding to scriptural. not been scripture to me and my behavior. And it's that simple. We're not the authors of the book. We're not editors of the book. We are followers of the book. And we, even with our imperfections as Christians, need to live it as perfectly as we can so a world can see a life that feels God's shalom, that knows God's peace, rather than this world's chaos. So it's been about a month. since the SPLC put you on this map. Have you received any pushback, any attacks,

any threats, or any deplatforming since then? Yeah, Focus was already experiencing the deplatforming. We've, you know, again, we've worked with Congress to talk about this, but we have had definite problems in insurance technology and banking. And we've experienced that directly. We had an insurance company that happened to be from the UK, but they sent me a letter and just said, now this is an insurance company that

we use for certain lines of our insurance for 48 years. We've never had a claim, ever. All they've done is taken money from us. We've never had a claim. And they wrote me a letter and said, because of your position, Mr. Daly, on the definition of marriage, we can no longer underwrite you. I thought, you know what? I can't wait to your actuary guys have a chit-chat with you. Because we're like the A-1 customer you want in your pocket of insured because we're the ones paying the bills for the rest of the people that are blowing it. And, you know, to me it's just evidence, again, of a culture that's upside down. So that is evidence of the debanking technology. We've had seven contracts when technology companies have signed an agreement to do work for us midway through.

They've said, oh, now that we know you don't support gay marriage, we can't work for you. We haven't sued them like Jack Phillips was sued by the LGBT commission. I mean, we chose to just, okay, we'll find another technology company that will work with us. We're in it already. And for the Christian community that doesn't know this, time to pull our heads out of the sand. It's okay. Life's been easy. But now it's time.

We've got to be aware of what's going on in the culture. As far as the SPLC in their list and the day after they announced us being on the list, we had about 15 protesters on the property, not on the sidewalk, outside the door of Focus's entrance on our north side, kind of harassing our staff as they came into work. That again needs to be owned by the SPLC, and God forbid that somebody should ever think of harming somebody. I think that directly is at the lap or the feet of the SPLC. And have you received any threats or, you know, hate mail or anything of that nature? I think those instances are up slightly. We tend to always receive those things because of what we believe, those, you know, amazing things that we believe marriage is a man and a woman. We believe in the nuclear family.

We believe the West did not create the nuclear family. we think that's pretty well stated in scripture, which is three to four thousand years old. But for all those things, trying to be people that are doing good in the community, in the country, in the world, we do get a certain threat level. And it has heightened a bit. So when the SPLC started going after conservative Christian groups, this was in 2010, they made pains to distinguish between. the Family Research Council, which, as you noted, used to be part of focus and focus on the family. They specifically said, you know, after James Dobson stepped down, that you had sort of moderated focus, I find it very interesting, you know, to go back and see that because you were moderating

focus and now they've decided that focus is too hateful. And that that moderating force, if ever there was such a thing, you know, somewhat either didn't work or something. But how would you respond to that change and that particular claim? I think at that time and even today, I mean, I still reach out to the LGBT leadership. I'm trying to say leadership before the alphabet. And that had some good effect. You know, I tried to let them know that we care about you. We're not against you.

we just don't agree on the definition of marriage. And, you know, there were some good relationships established with several of the attorneys in the movement, so to speak, that were pushing for O'Burgerfell. And I get that. I mean, I said to one particular gentleman, I said, you know, the interesting thing for me is you're getting to the table.

So is your movement going to be able to transfer now from a more aggressive, I would say in some ways, more militant attitude to get to the table, to now you're at the table. And it's not going to be good for you to elbow people away from the table that doesn't show very much tolerance for a different opinion. And I get it. These are deeply held convictions on both sides. But if we're going to live back to the Tim Keller thing, if we're going to live in a country of pluralism, I'll recognize that you have fought for those rights. I just don't agree with them. And if you want to criminalize me before that. I guess that's the moment we're in in this country that, you know, some people,

if you look at the UK and Canada, people are going to jail for saying we believe in family or marriage defined as one man, one woman. That's a dangerous place to be. Well, it seemed to me as though if there had been a change in this time period, it was a change on the left where more and more these things are demanded, almost as a still-definery. orthodoxy and you have to embrace everything or you're the devil. But I was wondering if that's your experience as well. Yeah, I think I would say, and again, human beings, we all have bias. And so you've got to try to think objectively as you can. I don't think our positions have changed. Maybe tone. You know, I care about people. As a Christian, I care about people, all people. I think when I read in

the scripture that we're created in our mother's womb, that the Lord creates us in his image, male and female, he creates us. I take that to heart. And that's something I have to express to everybody as a believer in Christ. My first and foremost thing is I want you to know the Lord because he's your creator. And that compels me as a Christian to talk to you. That requires building a relationship. And most relationships don't start effectively if you're saying, I hate you, I don't like you.

I often say to Christian audiences I'm talking to, who has a testimony in here that goes like this? Those Christians hated me so poorly that I decided to become one of them. It's just never, I've never had a hand go up. The point is in Romans 2.4, the Lord says, Paul says on behalf of the Lord, don't you know it's God's kindness that leads one to repentance? I take that to heart as a believer in Christ. So I want to be kind. mean, I can agree with you on your definition of things. You have a worldly perspective, not a Christian perspective. So I get it. And so I want to say, hey, the best thing for us as Christians is to

pray for the SPLC, for them to have an awakening, for the scales to fall from their eyes that they're fighting against the very God of nature and the universe and of our souls. How about that for a revelation? That would be awesome. But in the meantime, we're going to to stand firm in the river of culture. We're not going to be moved by intimidation. We're not going to be moved by the herd or cancel culture mentality. We know the scripture. We know you don't like it. God himself said, you're not going to like it. And for us to be firm. And we're just going to stand there. I think we're going to come out on the better end of this when we're in front of our creator saying, well, Lord, we love them. They spit on us. They called us haters. I'm sorry,

I didn't represent you well. And I think he's going to say, thank you for standing with me. Well, what is next big that focuses focusing on right now? You know, the biggest thing we've got is something called Hope Restored for Marriage. It's got an 80% post-two-year success rate. We go back to every couple. About half the couples that come have divorce papers drafted or ready to sign. And to have an 80% success rate with that pool of,

I would say marriages and crisis is incredible. And all we do is we pull open the wounds, reintroduce them to scriptural truth about how we get along better. And it's just worked fabulously. So we're expanding that. We have a new facility in Cave Creek, Arizona, just north of Scottsdale coming up. We have five locations doing those four-day intensives. I think that's the hottest thing going at Focus on the Family right now. Because if we can reduce divorce rate from, say, you know, 30%, 25% within the Christian community to 15%.

I think that'll be a great accomplishment for focus on the family within the Christian community. Yeah, those numbers are just horrifying. I mean, even in the Christian community, especially when, you know, you believe that marriage is instituted by God. And Jesus says, therefore, a man will leave his father and mother and cleave to his wife and the two become one flesh. Like over and over says divorce was allowed in the old law because of the hardness of your hearts, but I would rather you never do this. I mean, it's heartbreaking to see what's happened not just when it comes to the threats

from defining marriage from the LGBT side, but also what's happening in straight marriage itself. I mean, where do you think that, you know, why are divorce rates so high and what is the the gospel response. Yeah, I think I've had many discussions with the experts. That's what I do as an interviewer. I think Gary Thomas is really strong in this area. Tim Keller's book on marriage was really good.

But, you know, Gary says it this way. When you look at the institution of marriage, you know, typically there's a bit of humor in this, but opposites tend to attract. We look for a mate that has qualities that we don't possess. So extrovert is drawn to an introvert. They probably can't even say why. It's just in us to complicate. ourselves. We get along with people that aren't exactly like us. And that's the irony,

because those very things that attract us sometimes can begin to irritate us. And I think we just don't have, as Gary would say, the perspective on marriage. God created this institution for us to become more Christ-like. What is that characteristic like Christ? Selflessness. And we're born selfish. Human beings are selfish. I'm sorry to say, you're in D.C. see you see a lot of selfishness in that city and every other city so it's part of our core sin nature to be self-ish and marriage is an institution i think god created to allow us to become more like him which is laying your life down for your wife for your mate um to understand the dynamic between male and female how do we get along well how do we love each other well and i would say all the research

Brad Wilcox at University of Virginia, other research, it's all indicating that the best marriages in the United States across the board are Christian devoted Christian marriages where they're living the truth. And I can just add to that, we've done our own research, those marriages that are actually living it well, meaning they're reading the word together, they're going to church together regularly, not every Sunday, don't panic, but they're also praying. together. You add all those things together. You have an incredibly strong marriage and a highly satisfied marriage, the highest in the country. And so, you know, research speaks for itself. Well, I think there's also a theological aspect when it comes to trying to redefine marriage

or weakening marriage, when you think about what marriage means for a Christian, is there something, you know, marriage is the image of Christ in the church? How does that play into, you know, why focus has to be such a bedrock institution on this? Well, I'll give you a story from a Catholic priest. I had dinner in Washington, D.C. at the Hay Adams. And this priest was at the same table I was at. And he said, can I share with you what we believe? I said, of course, in the area of marriage.

He said, you know, Lucifer, which in the Christian community, that is Satan, the evil one, when he wanted God to put his image into the angels. And Lucifer fought for that. And God said, I'll put my image into human beings. I'll create them male and female. And the two shall become one flesh. You know, we think of marriage spats and divorce as pretty ordinary things. I'm asking you to think a little more deeply now.

So the two become one flesh. And he said every day, every marriage on this earth, Christian, non-Christian is a stench in the nostrils of Satan because it reminds him that God's image is walking this earth. That'll change how you view your spouse, how you should love her, love him, lay your life down for one another, be there for each other, be selfless, assume the good before you assume the bad. If we can just get back to those practices, if we could three times a day, compliment our spouse for something we admire in them. You'd have virtually zero divorce in the

Christian community. Well, thank you so much, Jim Daly. I wonder, you know, how people can follow you. If there's anything else that you'd like to address on the SPLC, on how you're standing in the culture, you know, I'd like to see if you have more to say. No, I appreciate that. I think we covered a lot of it. I would say for Christians first and foremost to pray for them. Because the word says, pray for your enemies. And what is it if you do good to those who do good to you? You know, the non-believers do that. But the Lord specifically, in Luke 6th is pointing that out, be different.

When they confront you, when they are going after you, when they're attacking, you pray for them. And so that is something we should sincerely do and to ask God to have mercy on them, to show himself to them. because he made them as well. These are POWs in the spiritual battle, people that have been taken prisoner. So I get it. You can come after us. The only other thing I will say is that we're not moving. The Christian community is going to be an irritation to you because we can't.

We didn't write the book. We're following the book. Thanks again so much. Where can people follow? Focus on the family. Just focus on the family.com. That's the best. to go, especially if you need help in your family. This place, it's a treasure trove of help to you.

Well, and I wanted to ask also briefly, while I've got you, I was a big fan of Adventures in Odyssey when I was growing up. And I don't know, I mean, it seems as though there's been a hiatus for a while, but is there any idea about bringing that back? Oh, it's happening. We still produce the radio drama of Adventures and Odyssey. But I'm excited to announce for the first time here, on Tyler's show that we will be releasing a animation movie coming out either in May or in the fall of 26. And we're excited about it. It will also lead into a 13-episode animation for streaming. And we're looking forward to it.

It'll be the prequel for those Odyssey fans out there. It'll be the prequel to the current Odyssey going back in Witt's younger days. So, yeah, it's going to be fun. We're putting about 25 million into this. I think kids are going to love it. Awesome. So great to hear, especially for those of us who grew up with it and now have kids of our own, that'll be exciting to see. Thank you so much, Jim Daly, for joining us.

Take care, Tyler.