The Daily Signal - INTERVIEW | Timothy Goeglein on Why So Few Americans Can Pass US Citizenship Test

Episode Date: January 24, 2023

Americans' lack of historical knowledge is crippling the nation, says Timothy Goeglein, a senior official with the Christian group Focus on the Family.  In his new book “Toward a More Perfect Union: The Moral and Cultural Case for Teaching the Great American Story," Goeglein discusses a survey conducted among public high school students that revealed that only 3% could pass a U.S. citizenship test. Those students surveyed are adults today, Goeglein explains, adding, this means many Americans today “are woefully ignorant of not only our history and culture, but our system of government.” Goeglein, who formerly served as a special assistant to President George W. Bush, tracks the lack of knowledge of American history back to the late radical historian Howard Zinn’s influence on American history curriculums. Zinn’s “goal was not to teach facts, but opinions,” he says.  Goeglein joins “The Daily Signal Podcast” to discuss why teaching American history is so closely linked to the formation of a flourishing society, and what can be done to restore accuracy and integrity to history classrooms across the country.  Enjoy the show! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Cancel culture, erasure culture, wokeism, has had a devastating impact on our country. This is the Daily Signal podcast for Tuesday, January 24th. I'm Virginia Allen. And that was Timothy Gagline, author of the new book, Toward a More Perfect Union. Gageline argues in the book that America's lack of historical knowledge is crippling the nation. In fact, he traces. is much of the failure to teach sound American history to Howard Zinn. Because Gagline says Zin's goal was not to teach facts, but opinions. Fortunately, Gagline says that there are solutions for how we can improve history being taught in the classrooms today. And he joins me on the show to explain what some of those solutions are and how we can further our society through teaching proper history. Stay tuned for our conversation. after this.

As conservatives, sometimes it feels like we're constantly on defense against bad ideas. Bad philosophy, revisionist history, junk science, and divisive politics. But here's something I've come to understand. When faced with bad ideas, it's not enough to just defend. If we want to save this country, then it's time to go on offense. Conservative principles are ideas that work. Individual responsibility, strong local communities, and belief in the American dream. As a former college professor and current president of the Heritage Foundation,

my life's mission is to learn, educate, and take action. My podcast, The Kevin Roberts Show, is my opportunity to share that journey with you. I'll be diving into the critical issues that plague our nation, having deep conversations with high-profile guests, some of whom may surprise you. And I want to ensure freedom for the next generation. Find the Kevin Roberts Show wherever you get your podcast. It is my pleasure today to welcome to the show, Vice President of External and Government Relations for Focus on the Family and author Timothy Gagline to discuss his latest book toward a more perfect union.

Mr. Gageline also formerly served as a special assistant to Vice President George W. Bush. Thank you so much for being here today. Virginia, it's a real pleasure to be with you. Thank you. Now, your latest book is toward a more perfect union, the moral and cultural case for for teaching the great American story. And my goodness, what an appropriate time to be talking about this. Education is a hot button issue right now, and it's one that has to be addressed. Why did you personally decide that you wanted to enter the conversation on this subject

and write a book specifically talking about our American story and the need to teach that in the classroom? Well, I love that question, and here's a very brief answer. There are two reasons. The first is, as one of the vice presidents that focus on the family, I travel about a third of the time. And over the course of the last two years, literally, everywhere I have gone, east to west, north to south, I meet hundreds of people who say I have never been more concerned about my country than I am now. Secondly, if they have children or grandchildren, they will say, I'm particularly concerned about, you know, the state and fate of our country and culture. And the third thing they say is, what can I do?

You know, what, what is the problem? But what can I do? So I decided to jump into, you know, an endless amount of research and to find out what is the seedbed of our historic illiteracy. Where is the seedbed of the cultural problem in America? And I share in the book a story that I first learned from the historian David McCullough a number of years ago when I was working in the White House. And he shared with me that he had insomnia, genuine insomnia, because he was so concerned about the rising generation of young Americans who overwhelmingly were superb people

but they knew nothing about our founding and our history. And he didn't want to indict anybody, but he said, what are we going to do? So toward a more perfect union, which is this new book, my third book, is my way of adding to the conversation and offering a tool in the toolbox for people who want to address not only our historic insomnia, but to actually do something about it. And that's the purpose of toward a more perfect union. Well, I was so fascinated in the book that you do address how we got to this place. And the fact that this isn't really a new problem that schools have been failing to teach history well for a long time.

And we've actually been seeing revisionist history in academia for a very long time, correct? We have indeed. And in fact, Virginia, I document. in toward a more perfect union, this breakdown in history and civic education. And I tie it directly to many of the ills that we face as a nation. Incivility, bad leaders, cultural decay, cancel culture. I actually quote former president to Eisenhower. He said, a people that values its privileges above its.

principles soon loses both. And I thought, wow, that has never been more timely or topical or relevant. And so to your point, Virginia, it's my sense, and I write about this in the book, that we have forgotten our principles while exulting our privileges. But it seems to me that without principles to serve as a foundation that we will eventually lose our privileges. And that is what we are seeing playing out in our culture every single day. And it's why I wrote toward a more perfect union. It's not a book that says, here are all the problems. It's a book, as you know, from reading it that offers many of the problems, but it addresses those with solutions or ways to actually address the challenges that we are that we are living through and seeing. Which we so need. I think it's very

easy to focus on the problem and just get very discouraged and stop there. But I love that you are presenting solutions, which we're going to talk about in just a moment. But I would be curious to hear from you, from the research that you have done for the book, from your own personal experience, what is the view that most high schoolers, most college students have of America and have of our history right now. Well, let me just start out by saying that if there are two overused words in our great country, it might be shocking and stunned, those two words. But the more that I got into the empirical data, I was shocked and stunned. And I could use a lot of examples. I do a site, many of them, in toward a more perfect union. But just for our wonderful conversation, let me

share some startling statistics. There was a survey done of public high school students, which was drawn from the U.S. citizenship test that all immigrants must take before they become legal citizens. And remember, this is public high school students in the United States. Are you ready for this? I'm ready. Okay. Only one in front of the United States. Okay. Only one in could name George Washington as the first president of the United States. Barely 10% knew that there are nine justices on the United States Supreme Court.

Less than 30% knew that the president heads the executive branch of our government, and only 3% Virginia were able to answer six out of the 10 questions, which is, you know, the passing score for the U.S. citizenship test. So I think in summation, it's fair to say that these students would now be in their early to mid-30s casting votes, you know, rallying, running and holding political offices. And yet, and I say this even as a limitless optimist, but, you know, they are woefully ignorant of not only our, history and culture, but our system of government. And, you know, I'd like to say that there are particular large empirical data sets where you say, my gosh, that's a dramatic improvement,

or that's a incremental improvement. But it's not. And when you summarize these important national studies, you find that only in the main, that only, that only, only about half are able to earn what you and I would say is a passing grade in U.S. history and civics on the most basic questions. So what's the result of that then in society and in culture when you have individuals that are graduating that can't pass a U.S. citizenship test? I think that we have to say that cancel culture, erasure culture, wokeism, has had a devastating impact on our country.

And we have to agree, ultimately, with our founders who believe very strongly that if you want to have a constitutional republic that is robust in freedom and liberty, that you have to pay a lot of attention to virtue. You have to pay a lot of attention to character, and you have to form citizens. who can bear the weight of a free society. And I think that the result of cancel culture is now measurable. And I think we have to realize that some of the most important, I mean, objectively, the most important figures in American history have been canceled. And what is the net result of a large portion of the next generation of citizens and leaders who are living in

areas where George Washington has been erased. Thomas Jefferson's been erased. Abraham Lincoln's been erased. And it's not just American figures, by the way, toward a more perfect union, which, by the way, the title of my book is taken from the preamble to the Constitution. You know, figures like Winston Churchill, you know, have been, you know, have really been frontally assaulted in this regard. So I think these are a very concerning data set and they have real implications for the future of our country. We're talking with Timothy Gagline, author of Torto More Perfect Union. And I was interested that you write in the book about Howard Zinn and how we can really look back and point back to him as some of the root of really how we've gotten to where we are today

and why American history is being in many ways rewritten this arisal of wokeism and cancel culture. Why is Howard Zinn's influence over America so lasting? You know, Virginia, I devote in toward a more perfect union an entire chapter to Howard Zinn. He is essentially the architect of much of this diff's information. And he wrote and published, and it was very widely used. His textbook on American history has gone through dozens of printings, and the malevolence of his so-called history has had a withering and terrible effect on generations of Americans. By the way, not only in public schools, but in private and parochial schools.

And I thought it was very important that people became much more aware of Howard Zinn, his books, and the terrible impact that he has had. His goal, by the way, and I document this in the book, His goal was not to teach facts, but opinions. And he wanted, he said, to transform American history. And his goal, of course, was to denounce Western civilization and to convince students to reject it. And by the way, he said and wrote that it was marred by the religion of popes, the government of kings, the frenzy of money. You know, this passes as history. And it's easy for all of us just to discount someone like this and to say, well, of course, that's not something or someone that we would embrace.

But in fact, Howard Zen is the most widely embraced historian of American history being taught in our schools. And I thought it was very important that among other things that we became much better, you know, and much more familiar with him and with his history. You know, he states that America became involved in World War II, for instance, to protect, and by the way, I'm quoting him, to protect the imperial interests of the United States. I mean, Virginia, his version of history is now the dominant one being taught in our education system. And I think it's very important that we are, that we're manifestly aware of the malevolence of his so-called history of America. You write in Toward a More Perfect Union that in order to solve this problem, it's going to require a proactive approach rather than a reactive one.

What exactly do you mean by that? Well, I think, if I may say, Virginia, that this is the most important tool in our toolbox when it comes to the way forward. We must stand up to this lack of teaching and propaganda if we are going to preserve America. I actually believe the stakes are that high. You know, the writer Barry Weiss, I quote, because I think what she says is so important. She says, keeping the spirit of liberty alive in an age of creeping illiberalism is nothing less than our moral obligation. and she says everything depends on it. And I couldn't agree more. I think we have to ask ourselves, what do we want? And I think what we want, I think the goal here, and I hope that toward a more

perfect union, this book, I hope that we have helped to plant a seed. I think what we want is we want an informed citizenry that is equipped with the right facts. You know, if I had to summarize the goal of the book, I think that's what it is. You know, I'm a Reaganite. I really admire and love Ronald Reagan. And he sounded the alarm when all of this was really beginning to take place. when he wrote that an informed patriotism is what we want. I think that's right, that we've got to do a better job of getting across that America, the United States of America, this extraordinary country is freedom. It's freedom of speech. It's freedom of religion. It's freedom of enterprise. I mean, our great constitution, the centerpiece of our country, you know, has been, as we have, you know, shown in the book, And as we've shown in this conversation, you know, really put in in the back seat. Freedom is very special and it's very rare. And as Reagan said, it's fragile.

You know, it actually needs protection. And I think the president was right that if we forget what we did, you know, we won't know who we are. And he was warning us of what he called an eradication of the American memory that could result. in the erosion of the American spirit. And it seems to me that that is precisely what the, what, what, what, what the stakes are in this entire national debate and conversation that we are having. And so, so Virginia, it seems to me that we ought to do the old-fashioned thing. We ought to start with the facts. Our, our second president, John Adams, said facts are stubborn things. I love that. I think that that's, I think that's where we're at.

Well, I love that you mention Barry Weiss because she is one of the many voices that you mentioned in the book that's really speaking out on this issue. And we've seen such a wide array of individuals in very different spheres from the academic to the journalist to authors who are all really putting out warning signals and saying we need to wake up, see what is happening in our education system. do you think that we're approaching a tipping point where finally Americans will wake up and we'll see a swing, a solid swing back to teaching American principles, the Constitution, American founding correctly? I am an inveterate optimist, and it seems to me that the best days for our great country are ahead of us. And I think that we are definitively at a hinge point of American history because that the ultimate goal of cancel culture and items such as the 1619 project, which I write about at length in the book, it's really their goal is to destroy America's foundations through ignorance and disinformation and to essentially create an entirely different nation. that no longer embodies the principles of the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution. And so I fully and totally agree that we are at a hinge point. And, you know, great countries, great nations have to decide.

And I think we are now engaged in that decision process. Many of the institutions that served us so well and that were so reliable for so long have become as confetti. And I think that we have to admit that we need strong institutions, that the institutions matter, that the Constitution is central, foundational, that the words are fixed, have a fixed meaning. And so I think we have to go tell a new generation the Great American story. And as I say, in the subtitle of this book, it's not, just a cultural question. That's absolutely the case. But it is also a moral question. Freedom is worth defending. And so, yes, I think we are definitively at a chapter of American history

that is a calling upon our better selves. And we have a lot of work to do. Briefly, before we let you go, what would be your advice to teachers listening or parents listening who are thinking, I want to be a part of the solution. I want to teach my kids, whether they're my own children or the children that I'm teaching American history, truth, but it sounds a little overwhelming. Where do they start? Thank you. And that is a perfect, you know, codicel to this wonderful conversation. Here's what I would say. I would say that the battle for the soul of our nation begins in our homes, which will then hopefully transform our schools, and I suppose restore the proper teaching of American history and civics. And I believe that if we

have a notion that this is going to be effectively addressed by starting in Silicon Valley or in Wall Street, or in some of our most famous places of higher learning, it seems to me that we are seriously wrong in that analysis. I think it has to begin at the local level. I think it has to begin where we live. It has to begin in our homes, in our communities, in our places of worship, and then we have to build from there. And it seems to me that that, that, the place where restoration and regeneration and renewal can happen. And as I say and write in, you know, toward a more perfect union, I'm confident that there are millions of people who are passionate and agree that these first principles are the thing. And I think it's time to

to buckle up and move onward. Timothy Gagline, the author of Toward a More Perfect Union, the moral and cultural case for teaching the great American story. You can pick up your copy today and order it on Amazon. Mr. Gagline, thank you so much for your time today. Virginia, thank you so much. We have good cheer. If you are interested in picking up a copy of Gageline's book, again, you can get it on Amazon. We'll be sure to put that link in today's show notes. But thank you so much for joining us on today's edition of the Daily Signal podcast. If you haven't have a chance to check out our evening show, take a minute to do so every single day at 5 p.m. every weekday, we drop a top news edition to bring you the headlines that you care about.

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