The Daily Signal - The How-To of Homeschooling: Practical Advice From an Expert

Episode Date: March 25, 2020

Choosing to homeschool your child is a big decision, but many Americans just had the choice made for them. Schools all over the country are closing their doors due to the coronavirus pandemic - with some states like Virginia already announcing that schools will remain closed through the end of the academic year.  Leigh Bortins is the founder of Classical Conversations, a homeschool curriculum focused on classical education. Bortins joins The Daily Signal podcast to offer practical advice and resources to parents who suddenly find themselves overseeing their child’s education. We also discuss: President Trump wants to ‘reopen’ the economy by Easter despite rapid coronavirus spread. Vice President Pence says the White House is not considering a nationwide coronavirus lockdown. The International Olympic Committee and Japan have both agreed to postpone the 2020 Tokyo Olympics. Enjoy the show! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is the Daily Signal podcast for Wednesday, March 25th. I'm Rachel Dahl Judis. And I'm Kate Trinco. For today's interview, our colleague Virginia Allen speaks to Lee Bordons of classical conversations about homeschooling and what her advice is to parents who suddenly find themselves now educating their kids because the schools are closed. Don't forget, if you're enjoying this podcast, please be sure to leave a review or a five-star rating on Apple Podcasts and encourage others to subscribe. Now on to our top news. President Donald Trump said he would like to have the U.S. economy open and the U.S. workforce getting back to work by Easter, which is on April 12th, less than three weeks away. Here's what he had to say about his hopes for Easter via Fox News during a virtual town hall with Fox News on Tuesday. You know, the allotted two weeks, but we'll stay a little bit longer than that, but we want to get open very soon. I think that was a big reason it's gone up.

I also think that the fact that the Senate and the House, we seem to be getting along as much as you can get along. We seem to be getting along now on a bill. I think that maybe had even less of an impact than the fact that we're opening up this incredible country. Because we have to do that. I'd love to have it open by Easter. Okay? I would love to have it open by Easter. I will tell you that right now.

I would love to have that at such an important day for other reasons. I'll make it an important day for this, too. I would love to have the country opened up and just raring to go by Easter. Vice President Mike Pence quashed the idea that there would be a national lockdown over the coronavirus pandemic and remarks Tuesday. I can tell you that at no point has the White House Coronavirus Task Force discussed what some people call a nationwide lockdown. Pence said during the Fox News virtual town hall. He added, per the Fox News website, what we've done is published the president's coronavirus guidelines, the 15 days to slow the spread. This is what we believe every American should be doing because we think we have the chance to significantly

reduce the spread of the coronavirus. New York Governor Andrew Cuomo isn't keen on calls to get the economy and the workforce up and going. Here's what he had to say via CBS. Yeah, my mother is not expendable and your mother is not expendable. And our brothers and sisters are not expendable. And we're not going to accept a premise that human life is disposable. And we're not going to put a dollar figure on human life. The first order of business is save lives, period, whatever it costs. He also had harsh words for FEMA saying that it was sending 400 ventilators when 30,000 ventilators are needed, also via CBS.

FEMA says, we're sending 400 ventilators. Really? What am I going to do with 400 ventilators? When I need 30,000, you pick the 26,000 people who are going to do. die because you only sent 400 ventilators. During Fox News's virtual town hall, Vice President Mike Pence announced that FEMA is sending more ventilators to New York, acknowledging that we have a ways to go yet. I just received word. I know we started our conversation this hour on the subject of ventilators

and the challenges that the state of New York faces. And I was so pleased to confirm that earlier today, FEMA from the national stockpile, shipped 2,000 ventilators to the state of New York, and tomorrow there will be another 2,000 ventilators shipped from the national stockpile. We have a ways to go yet. It's the reason why we're marshalling all the resources, not just from the national stockpile, but from our existing supply and hospitals and that equipment that can be converted. Britain is on lockdown. Prime Minister Boris Johnson says people can only leave for essential errands, such as one workout a day, medical treatment, or if they have an essential job. This also includes things like making runs to the grocery store.

Via Johnson's Twitter account, here's what he had to say. To put it simply, if too many people become seriously unwell at one time, the NHS will be unable to handle it, meaning more people are likely to die, not just from coronavirus, but from other illnesses as well. So it's vital to slow the spread of the disease, because that is the way we reduce the number of people needing hospital treatment at any one time, so we can protect the NHS's ability to cope and save more lives. And that's why we've been asking people to stay at home during this pandemic. India, meanwhile, announced a three-week lockdown that could go longer depending on conditions. Prime Minister Narenda Modi said, per CNN, according to health experts, a minimum of 21 days is most crucial to break the cycle of infection.

If we are not able to manage this pandemic in the next 21 days, the country and your family will be set back by 21 years. If we are not able to manage the next 21 days, then many families will be destroyed forever. The International Olympic Committee and Japan have both agreed to postpone the Tokyo Games that were set to commence in late July due to coronavirus concerns. In its stead, the summer games will happen at some point in 2021. A change that will likely wreak havoc with sports schedules, but should bring great relief to the athletes, organizers and health officials. officials who pressed for a delay and complained that the IOC was not moving quickly enough to adjust to the coronavirus pandemic, per the New York Times. Next up, we'll have Virginia Allen's interview with a homeschooling expert with tips for those

who are new to homeschooling. The Daily Signal is doing all we can to provide you and your family with the information you need on how to stay healthy through the coronavirus pandemic. Social distancing is one of the best, proven ways you can protect yourself and your loved ones. Dr. Birx, Dr. Fauci, and U.S. Surgeon General Adams explain why. Take a listen. Social distancing is what we refer to when we ask people to say at least six feet apart.

Staying away from people whom you might get coronavirus from or who are at high risk and whom you might spread coronavirus too. You can socially distance yourself from people in social settings by not going to bars, not going to restaurants, not going to things. it is where there are a lot of people. It all just means physical separation so that you have a space between you and others who might actually be infected or infect you. I am joined by Lee Borton's founder of the homeschool curriculum, classical conversations. Lee, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. It's very nice to get to speak with you, Virginia. Yes, we're all

speaking from a distance right now, maintaining that social distancing. But right now, because of social and the coronavirus, so many parents are finding themselves homeschooling their children, and they're looking for support, they're looking for resources. So I want to pick your brain a little bit and find out what some of those resources are. But first, let's just talk a little bit about why you chose to homeschool. I chose to homeschool. Well, I don't know how much time do we have. You want the whole story or the short version? I guess the shorter version, maybe, for the sake of time. So my husband and I, my husband is 10 years older than I am.

And when we got married and then I got pregnant with my firstborn, I saw a TV show about homeschooling. And those folks struck me as quite weird. And I knew I wanted to join them. And we didn't have the TV. I was walking through the mall and saw it on TV at the Phil Donahue show. If anybody remembers that. And then when I got home, I told my husband about it. And him being 10 years older, he had been very discouraged by our.

my students in our college program. We're at the University of Michigan getting our aerospace engineering degrees. And he just like said, I'm so happy to hear there's this way to do this because there's no way our kids were going to go to school if they're going to be as unintelligent as your freshmen seem to be to me. So he was just relieved for the academic side of it. And then eventually we both became Christians. And of course, we stopped wanting to emphasize having our children in college and instead said,

let's make sure that they're in Christ. And so now I would say we homeschool for the best of reasons so that we can constantly model our love for the Lord and hope that our children will do the same. Yeah, I love that. That's beautiful. But, you know, it's one thing to say, I want to homeschool my child. It's an entirely different thing to decide that you're going to create a homeschool curriculum. So tell me a little bit about the reasoning behind classical conversations and what really drove you to create it. So when our eldest, Robert, who's now the CEO of classical conversations, was in middle school, I did like so many other homeschooling parents. I thought, oh, no, can I do high school? And so I started reading more books on higher level academics and looking around for programs, speaking with our friends, and a lot of them were very nervous also about it. And just after doing a lot of research,

and again, working with my husband, we really came to the conclusion that we were still the best solution for our children. But one thing we really wanted to have was a classical education for them, which very much requires a community. And so my husband and I decided that we would once a week have people into the house, adults and children. And we would work together on rigorous academics that were kind of hard to do on your own, not just because they were rigorous, but sometimes, you know, you wanted the people to do a Shakespeare play with or discuss a chemistry lab or you need debate partners. And so we came up with a curriculum where the families could do the majority of their work at home and then just get together once a week and kind of polish it off and finish in community. It's kind of like a weekly PTA meeting for the parents, a weekly training for them to do better in class school Christian education. And of course the socialization, which has nothing to do with the children, it's the mothers who all want to have friends.

The kids will naturally. So it just came out of a lot of different needs. Within doing it, in the first three years, we had 300 people on the waiting list to get into the program. So my husband quit his job and we work with some of our friends and that's kind of how the story all began. And so 20 years later, we're in 20 some countries. And in the United States alone, we have over 120,000 children enrolled in our curriculum. And the greatest joy I have is to see how many homeschooling parents just dig in and really want to learn and are so glad for weekly support as well as recommendations and curating

of the actual academics. And obviously right now you all aren't able to kind of get together and do those larger group meetings. So is a lot of that taking place online or how are you continuing to maintain that connection that you mentioned being so vitally important? Right. So a couple of ways. There are some of our communities are online temporarily for this, you know, end of year. But because we always homeschool within the parameters of safety, it's not a big issue for us because we have a less than 12 to one student to, I mean, tutor to family ratio or to student ratio. And so we're in small groups anyways most of the time. Now, we do have programs that are in churches and much larger. And so those have disbanded personal homes.

And if they can't do that, then they do it online right now. So we're making due, as all homeschoolers do all the time. We just get the resources the Lord gives you, and you just gratefully move forward. And so that's how we're doing it. Yeah, yeah. All right, well, let's get practical and talk about what were some of those challenges that you had when you first started homeschooling and how did you overcome them? I would say the one that we all have is, I have never had this day before with the children I have at the age of. they are before. His mercies are new every morning for a reason because you don't know what the day is

going to ever hold for you. And so you can react in fear or you can react in wonder. And so during those middle school years where I was talking about where we were trying to explore, you know, what would we do with our high school students? We continued through when fear and trembling with the confidence of Lord would help us day by day. And of course, after getting through your first child and then your second and then your third and so on, you end up realizing that there really was nothing to be afraid of. Most people, I think, quit homeschooling in the high school years because a lack of confident, not lack of ability. Because remember, there's still children and there's so many good resources out there. Parents are quite capable of homeschooling through the high school years.

And so we just had to learn that because being the first generation of homeschoolers, I didn't get to see that. So it's hard to believe what you don't see, but then, of course, as Christians, that's what we're called to do, is walk in faith. And so our faith was strengthened through that. So practically, it really is trusting the Lord, even though that might sound like a platitude at this point. Yeah, well, let's talk a little bit more about that because I know so many of our parents out there listening, they do have kids in homeschool that are now at home or even in middle school and they're looking at, you know, the math assignments that they're supposed to do it or the science assignments and they're thinking, I do not remember this. So practically, how can they be helping

their kids right now in subjects that they honestly don't even remember how to do? Well, so you have a couple of different ways. If somebody's homeschooling right now because of a short-term reason with the virus, and, you know, most homeschoolers actually only homeschoolers for a short amount of time, they do it because they're military or job loss or they moved or a child sick for the year or something, sets the majority of folks who homeschool. So if people are listening to this thinking that all of us have this lifetime commitment like I do, that would not be true. Most homeschoolers are going to do it to get through, you know, a bad situation or maybe a really delightful, great situation. They've been traveling or dad's home for the year, working from home and they want more time with

them. A lot of people homeschool not because of academic reasons, but just because of family reasons. And here we are one more time, having a lot of different family issues to deal with. So there's two groups. There's the folks that are trying to get through this temporary situation, and they tend to rely a lot on resources like we have at classical conversations. A lot of new people will begin with classical conversations also. And as people get more confident in what they're doing, they start to be able to branch out and figure out, you know, a myriad of resources that are included or available, I mean, for homeschoolers. So for those that are just kind of jumping in, a resource I would turn you to for now to finish off this school year is one that we've put together called homeschoolers. schooling journey.com. And it's a site where people can download what we call our survival kit and find all kinds

of resources from our partners and more. We put together a lot of things that are commercially viable that are now free for a short amount of time or highly discounted, as well as YouTube videos. And then we have games and we have some of our own products that are for free. We have one thing that a lot of people don't know about is this service called Right Now Media. It's like the Netflix for Christians. and that's free on our website, homeschoolingjourney.com, as well as science activities, and there's even a fitness program.

If you need to, you know, you can't get outside, which it is spring. I would think you'd go outside, but if you want to stay inside and get your kids moving, we even have a fitness program on there. So there's a lot of things that we're doing, and I know other homeschooling resources are doing the same, just trying to pull together things people can do to help their children and stay active for the next three to eight weeks. maybe even finish off the school year. And of course, what we're hoping for is people will see those resources and maybe consider homeschooling permanently or for at least another year. And then, of

course, we would ask them to look at classicalconversations.com. That's so great. That's such a practical resource to have that kind of emergency kit package that parents can literally go to right now and start utilizing. Yeah. So, I mean, because we're not the only one, right? A lot of people don't know that. There's thousands of homeschoolers who have curriculum and materials that for people, you know, that can use it any time. And of course, there's, you know, YouTube. They've had a lot of ads lately about how you can go on YouTube and learn anything. So people aren't without resources. But all these I'm talking about right now are online resources. They really are our weakest resources because when you're working with children, your best resource is a pat on the back

and a smile and a word of encouragement and a, you know, looking them in the eye and helping them consider why they're struggling or what they're interested in or what kind of math, I mean, not math, and what kind of homework they help they might need. And so we really believe that the idea of social distancing is probably not the best word to describe what's going on now. We are all social creatures who need a hug. So in this time when we're trying to not hug our names,

neighbor because we're worried about passing on various viruses, really a better word is physical distancing because you and I right now are being social together, aren't we? Correct. Yeah, absolutely. Yes, so one of the things that we just love about homeschooling is how we can, five or six of us can flop on the couch and just read a book together. And in fact, we have a new series called New World Echoes, and it's a collection of stories that are very short read-alouds that are appropriate for the entire family, whether you have a 17-year-old or a 7-year-old, to just lay on the couch or flop on the floor and read together. And if you're able to throw a blanket outside and

have a picnic, it would be appropriate to bring them to because there's small books you can hold in your hand. I really would encourage parents to use as little online resources as possible right now and to just spend time with their children talking face-to-face and getting to know them in a different way than they had before. But what about the parents who are listening and thinking, oh, I would love to do that? But I have a full-time job that I'm trying to do, you know, online right now. About how much time should parents who do have full-time jobs and are working online be building into their schedules in order to keep educating their children and making sure that they're still continuing to learn and get the attention that they need? Yeah. I know.

one time a grandfather told me he wished his daughter would homeschool, but since she had four children and there's six subjects, she didn't see how he didn't see how she could homeschool 24 hours a day. And I just kind of looked at him and said, nobody does that. In general, I think homeschoolers through about eighth grade might spend three hours, five days a week at the most where it's kind of a sit-down academic situation. And then when your children in high school, if you include those three hours, plus they have, of course, a much more extensive reading time, which a lot of times they'll do before they get out of bed in the morning and as they're going to sleep at night. I mean, it's really rare to have a six-hour day of academics no matter how many children you have. One thing homeschooling teaches you to do is to be efficient and picking the best things to do and not being robbed by somebody else's lists,

but being able to look at your children and say these are the things that we want to do together. and make them your priority. And so when it comes to time, just is a quick schedule just to give someone who maybe has to work and still has the kids at home, get up in the morning and do your reading or a Bible study and devotion together and have breakfast and then go off to do what you need to do for the day.

At lunchtime, break and do a math or science lesson. Go outside and look at the plants and maybe do a little bit of journaling and writing. And then when you go to bed in the evening, I suggest that you, again, you have like with these to call it was the children's hour. And just spend an hour playing board games and doing read-alouds. And if you won't watch a movie from, you know, something that's for the whole family. But break it up into segments that fit into your day.

And don't feel like it's something where you just sit down and work for three hours straight. Or six hours straight, whatever you think, you know, you would need to do. I can't say that I've ever been in a room doing more than probably two hours. hours straight of academics with my four children. But that doesn't mean that in their high school years, there weren't days where we did spend five or six hours, but it wasn't every day by any means. So one of the things that we've become accustomed to with public school system and institutional schools is just having, you know, 50 minutes with five or six different people each day. And that's just not how homeschooling works. Mom or dad, whoever's doing the educating

just spends time with the whole family. And studies have shown that the average child only gets about 30 minutes of academic instruction in a classroom situation that's personal. So you really can do it. And I suggest that everyone find a friend who homeschools and just learn more about what it's really like rather than probably what you imagine it's like. There's no reason to bring school home. You actually can just have a family life together.

And just think about it. If you loved your children and there was no such thing as any school, When you still teach them basic skills and how to read and do math and when you teach them how to serve their community and how to take care of their home, the things that you just do in your average life and then like now helping with homework after school take up about the same amount of time we homeschoolers devote to academics. The better part of our day is spent with our children doing things we just all enjoy doing. So we travel more and we have field trips more and we get together with friends more and we can work at the community centers. and service with seniors and things like that. Because service is a big part of homeschooling with children. And so a lot of people are so worried about the math and science

where there's so much help like we offer and then the YouTube offers when really what we're trying to do is teach our children to be good citizens and have a constant civics lesson of how to behave appropriately in any situation you find yourself in. So there's a lot more to it than I think people think of and it's a lot easier than they think. Yeah. No, that's really interesting to hear.

So, I mean, because I'm sort of thinking like, all right, if you're a parent who has maybe four kids, they're all different ages, you're saying, you know, you don't have to kind of have these individual specific full days worth of work for each child. You maybe have like a little bit of time for each of giving them their own assignments, but then you're able to actually do a lot together and kind of have more group activities, even despite the age differences. If you think about, they said reading and writing and arithmetic forever for really good reasons. You need a child on your lap when you're teaching them phonics.

They need some individual time then. You need your middle schoolers sitting next to you while they're struggling with difficult material, which is the same as taking them through phonics when they were younger. So there's some personal time that's needed. And then there's quiet time that's needed. Each of your children should be able to go off and on their own, whether it's playing Legos or writing an essay. They shouldn't have to have mom or dad next to them all the time.

On the other hand, some of my favorite things to do was write papers with my children or build Lego castles with them. So as a parent, it was just my job to assess their needs and our family's needs. And each day, do my best to work it out. Because, again, his mercies are new every morning. And who knows if the dishwasher is going to leak that day or, you know, someone's going to come down with the flu, whatever it is. you just have to learn to roll with the punches. And for those of us who've been like, you know, regulated our whole lives,

we go to school from daycare through college and then we're at work. And we do what our players say, sometimes it's really difficult to retrench and just say, hey, I'm in charge for a little bit. What is it we want to do as a family? Oh, this is so good. I feel like it's just kind of taking the pressure off. This is great.

But are there maybe some do's and don'ts of homeschooling that you can offer? for us, just things that you've learned over the air through trial and air. I mean, the biggest don't is to not worry that you're not doing enough because here's the thing. None of us are doing enough and all of us are doing too much. And it depends on what field or area you're talking about. Not a one of us is perfect. So we're going to have our strengths and our weaknesses.

So on those days where you just feel like you are so weak in a certain area, just stop. And don't say I failed or I quit or I'm a bad mom. Stop and say, you know what, I might not done this so well, but I did do this other thing really well. And the children are going to get a lot of different experiences for me as an adult. And all of them have some sort of value. And so to not make light of the things that maybe seem unschoolish, they may be where the best teachable moments occur or where your kids are really listening. So the one thing that, you know, I share a little bit about that earlier, was to learn to not be afraid and to just be really joyful and grateful. And then when you just want to kick the kids out of the house or put your husband's face in the mud, you know, whatever that is, you just have to say to yourself, okay, this two shall pass.

And we're going to start over tomorrow and we have a great day. I used to, at the end of the day, when I had all four of them home, if I knew I'd just opened up with a Bible reading with them, did a math lesson, and then read to them at 9. my kids were well educated, that that was enough. Let's go back and talk a little bit more about classical conversations. You all have come a long way since you first started in the early 2000s. What do you think really led to that success? What was kind of that switch that just, you know, people were so hungry and really wanted to learn more and find out more about classical conversations that has allowed it to do so well?

So it surprised me the answer to that question. About six, seven years into it, I realized that a high percentage of our families were military. And that's what was making us grow. Because once the families were bought into homeschooling and classical education and saw how easy and approachable our program was, they, of course, get deployed every three years somewhere else. And then their attitude was like, well, there's not a CC here. So I'll start one. and I'll get together with my military friends there.

And so, of course, that's why we're in bases all across the world. And then, of course, the families who've started at bases across the world have started to find natural citizens in those countries to take over for them. And I don't know the exact numbers, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's a third of our families are in the military. And so think what we do for them. And this is what we do for them, they recognize is important. But people need to remember one third of children move year round.

no matter what situation their families are in. We don't really have community schools anymore because of all the moving that occurs. And so by being in classical conversations, the military families had two things. They had one, they knew exactly what the curriculum was, that they were going to be doing the following week, no matter how far away they moved. And so that was a strain off the parent trying to decide what to do about curriculum. And then the second one was that they instantly had friends for their children when they moved because of our small communities that we meet in.

And again, the moms want the friends as much as the children do. So that's why they kept starting everywhere because they wanted to have academic community as well as the military community that they were in and enjoying the travel opportunities they had being military families. So that was really quite a surprise to me. And now I'm super grateful to all of them. Yeah, well, it's just incredible to see the success that you all have had.

And I mean, you've been in this movement for such a long time. How do you think that it's changing as we're hitting a second generation? For instance, you know, there's now homeschool kids. You know, they homeschooled themselves, their parents homeschooled them, and now they're turning around and homeschooling their own children. So how has the movement really changed over the years? Yeah, probably my happiest stories are how many grandmothers, mothers, and their children are in classical conversations.

In other words, I got three generations all working on the material. And so think of the connectivity that we have in the sense of not just laterally with other families, but legacy with the families that stay generation after generation. And so that's been really neat to see happen. For those of you that aren't aware, we've been around for 20-some years now. And so if folks came in, you know, you don't have to start a kindergarten, right? So people might have started at high school and been with us for four years and then got married a few years later. So that's why we're able to do that in a single generation.

So that's just been fun to see. The thing that I would say would be different is it's almost a whole other conversation. My eldest two children who were in their 30s had a more similar education to my grandmother than their two little brothers did. than they did, I mean, compared to their two brothers. So what I mean is this, they didn't have technology. The Internet was not something in our house. We didn't have computers when they were going through school. So they learned pencils and paper and books and then going outside and playing and, you know,

the various things that my grandma and my mom and myself all did. Versus the second two, we have a 10-year gap between our two sets of kids. The second two were very computer literate and expected a lot of things to be done quickly and didn't have necessarily the same level of patience as the older two because things were pretty snappy once you're in the computer age. And so helping them deal with the fact that they don't always get to have electricity and technology and the things they see in front of them, that it's important to be outside and to be playing and to writing your own stories

and reading books with something hard in your hand that's not a lot, Kindle, was a battle for us, just like it is for all parents, you know, trying to get the Nintendo off and determining whether you're going to have a TV in your household or not. So I got sort of both worlds there, one where it was kind of easy to homeschool

because all families were used to playing together and working together to this place where now everybody can be in their own little silo and not even know what their siblings do. So it's something to overcome. Well, we want to make sure that all of our parents listening know how they can find out more about classical conversations and start utilizing those resources today. So where can they go? So go again.

If you're a short-term homeschooler who's just looking into all this, go to homeschoolingjury.com. And that's where we have our survival kit. And if those kind of items interests you, go on to classicalconversations.com. and you'll see the whole universe of what we offer for kindergarten through 12th grade. We sell books and curriculum as well as information on the communities and the philosophy. We are a Christian company, and so you'll see things like what we believe in our statement of faith. And anybody's welcome to participate in our curriculum. So we encourage everyone to look at it.

And I wanted to let you know that we are looking to make a really big announcement on March 28th. We are going to be offering some new services, and I'm not allowed to tell you what they are, but I want our listeners to go to our website on that day. I'm pretty excited. Classful Conversations is about to change the face of homeschooling again, and it's not what any of you would think of. So, please, go look at it. All right. Great. That's Saturday. We'll mark the calendar. Well, Lee, thank you so much for your time. We really appreciate it. Thank you, Virginia. I hope that I was helpful, and I pray blessings on everybody, and that they will just be healthier and wiser than they ever knew possible when we come out the other side of this.

Yes, I agree and I echo that. Thank you. You're so welcome. Goodbye. And that'll do it for today's episode. Thanks for listening to The Daily Signal Podcast. We do appreciate your patience as we record remotely during these weeks. Please be sure to subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, or Spotify. And please leave us a review or a rating on Apple Podcasts to give us your feedback.

Stay healthy and we'll be back with you all tomorrow. The Daily Signal podcast is brought to you by more than half a million members of the Heritage Foundation. It is executive produced by Kate Shrinco and Rachel Del Judas. Sound design by Lauren Evans, Fulia Rampersad, Mark Geinie, and John Pop. For more information, visitdailySignal.com.