The Daily Zeitgeist - America’s Hidden Damage, World’s Most Solved Unsolved Mystery 2.2.21

Episode Date: February 2, 2021

In episode 803, Jack and Miles are joined by New York public defender Eliza Orlins, who is running for Manhattan district attorney, to discuss the mental health crisis, America's broadband problem, the Dyatlov Pass incident, and more!FOOTNOTES: Eliza Orlins for Manhattan District Attorney Anti-Vaxxers Won’t Stop Harassing Nurse They’re Convinced Is Dead Shape-Shifting Virus Threatens Cycles of Illness, Lockdowns Chilling trend: A longer, deadlier pandemic The Problem With Mental Health Awareness Social media damages teenagers' mental health, report says Why rural Americans are having a hard time working from home Race and the digital divide: Why broadband access is more than an urban vs rural issue America’s Terrible Internet Is Making Quarantine Worse President Obama Details Plan to Win the Future through Expanded Wireless Access How Biden’s FCC could fix America’s internet Wired to fail Trump Made A Mess Of Tech Policy. Here's What Biden Is Inheriting Affordable broadband is finally within reach US relief package provides $7 billion for broadband Has science solved one of history’s greatest adventure mysteries? WATCH: Ta-ku - Remember Me Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi, everyone. It's me, Katie Couric. You know, if you've been following me on social media, you know I love to cook or at least try, especially alongside some of my favorite chefs and foodies like Benny Blanco, Jake Cohen, Lighty Hoyk, Alison Roman, and Ina Garten. So I started a free newsletter called Good Taste to share recipes, tips, and kitchen must-haves. Just sign up at katiecouric.com slash goodtaste. That's K-A-T-I-E-C-O-U-R-I-C dot com slash goodtaste. I promise your taste buds will be happy you did. There's so much beauty in Mexican culture, like mariachis, delicious cuisine, and even lucha libre. Join us for the new podcast, Lucha Libre Behind the Mask, a 12-episode podcast in both English and Spanish

about the history and cultural richness of lucha libre. And I'm your host, Santos Escobar, emperor of lucha libre and a WWE superstar. Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you stream podcasts. What happens when a professional football player's career ends and the applause fades and the screaming fans move on? I am going to share my journey of how I went from Christianity to now a Hebrew Israelite.

For some former NFL players, a new faith provides answers. You mix homesteading with guns and church. Voila! You got straight away. They try to save everybody. Listen to Spiraled on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In California during the summer of 1975, within the span of 17 days and less than 90 miles, two women did something no other woman had done before, try to assassinate the president of the United States.

One was the protege of Charles Manson. 26-year-old Lynette Fromm, nicknamed Squeaky. The other, a middle-aged housewife working undercover for the FBI. Identified by police as Sarah Jean Moore. The story of one strange and violent summer, this season on the new podcast, Rip Current. Hear episodes of Rip Current early and completely ad-free and receive exclusive bonus content by subscribing to iHeart True Crime Plus, only on Apple Podcasts. Hello, the internet, and welcome to Season 170, Episode 2 of Dread Daily Zeitgeist, a production of iHeart Radio. This is a podcast where we

take a deep dive into America's shared consciousness. It is Tuesday, February 2nd, 2021. My name is Jack O'Brien, aka, cause we gon' Baja Blast, we gon' drink it right, we

gon' do the duke, because it's Daily Zeit. that is courtesy of samboni zamboni and i'm thrilled to be joined as always by my co-host mr miles gray look at his weird hairline that boy is balding balding uh i just came up with that on the spot. I was just thinking about BBD. BBD? New edition. The whole era of boy super groups. East Coast family.

Oh, you mean the East Coast family? Yes. Never skipped a beat. No. Yeah, that's just from me. I didn't even hit the Discord up. That was kind of presumptuous of them to call themselves the East Coast family since, knowing as I do, everybody on the call themselves the East Coast family since knowing as I do, everybody

on the West Coast has East Coast family that they refer to as such. And also there are all the Mafia families. They're like, nah. East Coast family. I mean, that's something they'll have to reckon with in their own time. Miles,

it's especially funny that we're having such a dumb conversation here at the top of the show because we are being joined by one of the most impressive guests we've ever had, if not the most impressive. She is running for DA of New York and formerly a contestant on Survivor and the brilliant and talented Eliza Orland.

We're not worthy. We're not worthy. Welcome, welcome. Thank you so much. Any thoughts on BBD? Thank you. It's great to be here. I'm so sorry I didn't prepare a theme song for myself to the tune of pop music.

I should have been better prepared. Now, I'm not going to speculate what that will do for your bid for DA in Manhattan, but I think it'll be safe. Can't be good, Miles. Can't be good. Yes, I think me singing anywhere would just deter people from voting for me.

And you are joining us from Manhattan. Yep. Yep. We're in the midst of a blizzard. Snowy Manhattan. Exactly. It's a blizzard right now? Yeah.

They said we're in like a state of emergency. We shouldn't leave our homes. They're like stopping transit service at 2 p.m. Oh, wow. Okay. That sounds real. Yeah. So I'm sure a lot of our listeners,

the first who are just now becoming acquainted with you have the uh first question that a lot of people i'm sure have is like how do you go from survivor to running for da of new york how does that uh path happen are they just do they just happen to both be things that you've done or are they connected in any way? Your brilliant strategic mind? So they both are things, well, you know, I didn't necessarily see myself running for DA, but I always knew I was going to be a public defender. You know, that was the only job I ever wanted. It was the reason I went to law school. So by the time I went on Survivor the first time at 21, I already knew that I was going to go to law school, that I was going to become a

public defender. So it was kind of this, you know, thing that I did, but it wasn't anything like I didn't anticipate it kind of changing the trajectory of my life in any way. And then went to law school, became a public defender, you know, spent over a decade representing thousands of people fighting against our cruel, unjust criminal legal system and realized that I needed to do more and we couldn't change the system unless we changed the DA. And so that's kind of what led to my run. Damn. That's pretty awesome. Just years of being a public defender, were your clients or the people that you defended familiar with you from Survivor? Was that ever a conversation that happened? That's funny.

So mostly not, but there were a couple times. Oh shit, it's Eliza. There are probably a couple times where someone after I was representing them looked back googled me or something and then found out that i was on survivor and they were like oh man that's my lawyer like you know and uh so there was that but but mostly no i don't think it's

as popular in new york city as it is in some other places across the country. And New York, I feel like one of your big issues is about decriminalizing sex work. And I feel like New York has kind of been sort of put in as a focal point since that story that had come out about the paramedic who was like fired. out about the paramedic who was like fired. And like, I feel like in culture now we're constantly having moments where people are either learning about sex work and why it's not a thing that needs to be criminalized or what, how we look at sex work. Um, and yeah, just how it's like, even on your website, it's like the first thing that one of your first noted policies that you're really passionate about, how has that, you know, obviously your experience as a public defender, I'd imagine shaped your policies

like this, but is there something specifically that you really feel, is it New York specific or what is it about your passion about decriminalizing sex work and the work that the DA does that intersects for you? Aside from the obvious part. Well, yes. that intersects for you? Aside from the obvious part. Well, yes.

So, you know, I think that there is, there's so much that needs to change in terms of the way we think about sex work. And I'm so grateful to, you know, be able to be bringing this conversation to a national stage and for people to be receptive to it. Because the first time I was talking about this issue in, you issue in 2010,

shortly after I'd become a public defender, and I started representing people who were charged with engaging in consensual sex work. And I saw the way that criminalization impacted their lives. I saw how it put them in jeopardy. It put them in danger. It forced interactions with the police that sometimes became violent. You know, they were marginalized. They weren't able to seek police help when they were abused or brutalized. They, you know, and it criminalized their jobs. And, you know, it made them fear prosecution. If anything, you know, you can't even report if you're afraid that you

yourself are going to be arrested and jailed if you come forward and say, oh, somebody robbed me, somebody assaulted me, somebody raped me. And so it was something that I felt very strongly about from very early on in my career. But needless to say, in 2010, it was not a very popular opinion to take. And I'm so glad that over the last decade plus, it's something that really has come to the national stage. And yes, when the woman who was an EMT in New York, who was using OnlyFans to supplement her living because she wasn't being paid enough, but was doing it of her own accord and her own volition, and all of a sudden was shamed by the New York Post,

was ostracized, was kind of stigmatized, has kind of made more people aware of those who are engaging in sex work and saying, hey, why do we need to be criminalizing this? This isn't making us safe. This isn't doing anything for people. And so I'm so thrilled that at the reception that my policy on decriminalizing sex work has gotten. Awesome. Well, we have a couple subjects we're talking about today that are kind of broadly systemic things that I'm very interested to hear your thoughts on the sort of, I don't know, it feels I'm hearing from people, I'm feeling it. Like there's the mental health crisis is, you know, a lot of people are dealing with feelings of like this shit is never going to end.

And then we're seeing statistics that indicate that there is a mental health crisis that's getting worse. So we'll talk about that broadly. We'll also talk about the systemic problem of America's broadband inequality, access to broadband and just general that being a shitty system. We will talk about the Dyatlov Pass incident, which I'm probably mispronouncing, but it is this unsolved mystery that has recently been solved. I won't talk about why we solved it.

I solved it 11 years ago. I solved it 11 years ago. So no big deal. But before we get to any of that, Eliza, we'd like to ask our guest, what is something from your search history that's revealing about who you are? Oh, gosh, revealing about who I am. Or not. I mean, the things I've recently searched include the weather, because I want to figure out like how soon it's like what the snow situation is, whether I can walk my dog, you know, when so he doesn't get buried under 20 feet, 20 inches of snow.

And and then, you know, really, really, I'm constantly looking up things related to criminal justice issues. So, like, recently I was just Googling to confirm because a friend asked, and I was sure I did know the answer, but I wanted to confirm, which is the cost to incarcerate someone at Rikers Island for one night. Oh, wow. Which is over $900 a night. So it's over $ hundred thousand dollars a year to put someone in jail for a year you think about like how much we could be investing in people i mean we're about to talk about mental health issues but anyhow that's something that's relevant yes it's so odd like when you put those figures in front of people like there's still some people

who are like ah i'm still not convinced about a more humane way to solve our issues versus throwing away $900, like $900 a night is really. It's been putting someone in a dangerous place that is damaging to their mental health. that could have imagined what $300,000 would have done at any point for someone who is looking, you know, at a year of being incarcerated at any point in their life, whether that would have come in the form of services, whether education, social services, whatever, until we get to that point. But it's all about, you know, profiting off of the dysfunction. And that's a perfect example of like, well, we don't take care of it then then we can make there's more money to be spent or made on the other side of it which is really cool uh what is something you think is underrated eliza um underrated would be uh nerd ropes

oh hell yeah i i ordered a huge box of them and I've been eating them and I'm like, damn, like these are so good. And they're really underrated. I feel like people don't appreciate how delicious nerd ropes are. Yeah, I love nerds. And I remember the first time I had seen a nerd rope, it had just it seemed like a bridge too far for me. I was just used to eating the shards of sugar that were nerds but i think it wasn't until i like i'd on a whim at a movie theater and i basically like by the end of it was just turning into like a ball that i would just

eat because it was so good i feel like nerd ropes are good for regulating the uh the pace at which you're uh eating the nerds the pace at which you're eating the nerds because like i have a i have a habit of like when you get the little box of nerds those are done in a single mouthful uh but even the king size box of nerds yeah even the king so i don't know why i specified the small one i will i will take i will take the king size down in like two mouthfuls uh and then it becomes a unpleasant experience uh for those around me uh as i like go through various sugar rushes and crashes and you know start crying uh but the nerd ropes i feel like are yeah they they are... They allow you to take it in, experience the

tannins, the subtle flavor hints that are there in each bite of Nerds. Tannin's probably not appropriate. I think that is specific to wine. But filled with flavor. Delicious. Yes, filled with flavor.

Thank you. Wait, wait eliza you're saying you're you'll house a king-size box of nerds i don't know if i can do the whole king size well not like once but but i get i think most of us know we have those flashbacks to childhood where the nerd boxes were smaller than like the raisin boxes used to get yeah right the ones that like you get for halloween that come in the like variety packs that are just the tiny ones and then you've got the ones that have the two different sides like the two different colors oh yeah and so that's like a you know like a little bit bigger and then the and then there's the like king size yeah roll box um it's hard to yeah but the nerd

ropes are like a really great way of keeping yourself... I can eat that much and it's delicious. And I love the gooey rope part too. Yeah, the gooey rope part is great. They really nailed it in terms of that. What's something you think is overrated? Overrated, I would say, is copaganda. Like TV shows that portray police officers because these shows are basically marketing for police departments and they glorify and normalize the systemic violence and injustices that are handed out by the police and instead make them heroes.

And so overrated. heroes and so overrated what is there a piece of copaganda you'd had you've had to have a reckoning with over time as you're like i realize this is this is just straight nonsense but but i loved it as a tv show or film um i most of the time watch that stuff in it like i i'm no fun to watch legal shows with i scream at the tv i'm like that that's not true that would never happen oh i love you know i'm like really unfun so this is why i just like you know i just instead watch like reality television there you go yeah because like what do we know about the k1 visa process on 90 day fiance but watch a procedural with you you're like oh that is not oh my god the chain of

custody on that is absolutely bizarre right that makes sense i watched den of thieves over the weekend i had not seen that that's the gerard butler uh 2018 uh movie that it like the protagonists are the la sheriff's department um who and like it's there are like vague implications that they're the ones who like have those tattoos and like uh basically kill people and like have white supremacist ties uh but they but they cut all that out. They make the team a little bit more diverse but it's like you're supposed to be rooting for the LA Sheriff's Department

in 2018. Still having trouble. Just like that Denzel movie that came out where people were like, this is also copaganda. I don't care if it's Denzel and we're taking a like rosy lens to look at 1993 policing but uh yeah it's everywhere yeah choppo trap house was like had recommended that they were like that movie's great it's like about a dirt bag and

it's like huh that's the one with o'shea jackson jr right yeah and it's yeah that one takes a weird turn and i'm like whatever it's just like yeah it's just like testosterone fest it's really there's not much else in it absolutely i haven't seen it but i'm not going to yeah good no no watch uh watch bling empire instead about the real crazy rich asians of la which i was watching over the weekend. Oh yeah? How was that? It's wild.

You know, it's funny when you see like the, you know, just obscene wealth where like people are giving each other gifts and like, yeah, the towel has real gold in it. You're like, you gave someone a towel that had gold in it? And you're like, that's, it's so obscene. And it's just like a whole other dimension of reality that we're not used to. Eliza, I'm curious as running for D.A. and saying things like copaganda.

Right. You know, a lot of people, as we've seen over the years, like to walk this weird line of being like, well, I don't want to make the police mad, but also wanting to also seek justice in terms of, and I don't, I don't, you don't need to cast dispersions on the other people running, but it seems like there are what eight, how many people are running at the moment? Eight people. Is that,

has that been a tone right now for P for the other candidates? Cause I feel like only one is not really about any kind of real reform or seemingly doesn't seem like very forward thinking but in terms of the race um as it is right now how how many people are sort of have this sort of progressive viewpoint on how things need to change within new york well so you know what's so interesting and i was kind of touching on this a little bit when i say that now all of a sudden it's become popular to say things like sex work is work. And I'm so thrilled that people are coming around to the progressive views that we should decriminalize sex work. We should decriminalize drug possession.

We should end mass incarceration and stop using jail as the default and punitive prison sentences for low-level offenses. But the problem is even people who are now espousing progressive talking points because they're popular are not necessarily people who truly believe these things. And I think some of the evaluations that have come out recently about the candidates really do kind of delve into these nuanced views of what kinds of changes you would make. And in those, like I come out, you know, head and shoulders above everyone else. Like I'm the only real progressive in the race who has the authentic commitment from my career, from my experience as being a public defender and fighting against this system of injustice. And it's not like all of a sudden one day I woke up and was like, oh, you know what? I think it'd be popular to say we should end mass incarceration. So that's the pivot I'm going to take. And yeah, I'm going to hold

police accountable. And it's like people who've been working in conjunction with the police to lock people up for their entire careers all of a sudden are saying they're going to hold police accountable. Well, I've spent every day of my career cross-examining police officers and questioning the veracity of the things that they say. And so I think that prioritizing this kind of accountability for the police and these real reforms is incredibly important, but making sure that we're not just listening to someone's memorized talking points, but looking into their record, looking into their history, making sure that this is an authentic commitment to bringing about real change. Right. And I can tell by the New York Post treatment of you, you probably are walking the walk

because they're painting you as someone who's like, this headline, most Manhattan DA candidates care most for protecting criminals? Wow. And just like such a disingenuous look on reform, which is like these people just want it's like it's going to look like a Batman movie where they just open up the asylums and the jails. And it's it's it's, you know, the people are going to be running wild when it's really about we have such an inhumane of treating people and we're not actually we're not addressing the root causes of anything. So rather than it. So, you know, credit to you because all the the new york post is absolute trash listen if the new york post is criticizing me i'm obviously doing something right yeah exactly i feel yeah i feel great about it

our pick for manhattan da then it'd be like uh do you do you aspire to one day have like a real shitty New York Post like pun headline about you I feel like that would be the ultimate honor is like some they're gonna come after me undoubtedly like it'll be a daily occurrence of them just hating on me right I'm looking forward to it yeah hell yeah alright let's take a quick break and we'll come right back. When you think of Mexican culture, you think of avocado, mariachi, delicious cuisine, and of course, lucha libre.

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Hello, everyone. I am Lacey Lamar. And I'm Amber Ruffin, a better Lacey Lamar. Boo. Okay, everybody, we have exciting news to share. We're back with season two of the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. You thought you had fun last season? Well, you were right.

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and we're back and uh let's talk about mental health because i just feel like i'm hearing this more and more i'm feeling this more and more felt like there might be light at the end of the tunnel because the vaccines were rolling out, and then we just had our worst COVID month ever in January in the United States. The vaccine rollout is a bit of a mess. I definitely don't think we should feel hopeless. The ingredients of the solution seem to be somewhat close at hand. We're only 10 days into the new administration, but in terms of getting to a place where they're combining those ingredients is a solution that requires widespread responsible behavior from the U.S. population, and we've just seen nonstop evidence that a large portion of the U.S. population is actively hostile to the suggestion that they behave responsibly. the suggestion that they behave responsibly is, I don't know. It's got me feeling kind of shitty and like we're taking a couple steps backwards. Yeah.

I mean, especially with like in LA, the disruption that happened at Dodger Stadium with all these like anti-vaxxer, masker, COVID, hoax, pandemic people, like interrupting the process of vaccinations. Like it's one thing to just have your awful take and just be there with it. The name, their cause is shop mask free. They want to go to grocery stores and shop without a mask. That is their cause. Right.

We see them. They've been everywhere. They've come through parts of the Valley. They were the century city mall being like we don't need masks and i don't know if this is like of some kind of troll from the chamber of commerce because it's it sounds like just the weirdest like thing to be like we gotta shop mask free y'all or we gotta do this it nothing is really making sense but i think that's adding to like the chaos of this entire pandemic, like on top of us not having or regaining any sense of normalcy, quote unquote. We have other people who are completely taking this in some bizarre direction where it's now like there's opposition to act to treating people with dignity or or treating each other responsibly. act to treating people with dignity or or treating each other responsibly um so yeah it only feels like it's sort of uh compounding there was a nurse in chattanooga who got the vaccine on tv and

fainted because you know like temporarily like went to her knees then was helped up and explained immediately to the press that was in attendance that she has an overactive vagal response, which causes any pain, causes you to pass out, 20% of the population have it. And the anti-vaxxer and COVID hoaxer conspiracy theorists seized on this to make the case that she had died and they had replaced her with a clone, I guess,

or maybe not. Maybe they think that she's just... But they had to do a proof of life video from the hospital to be like, hey, here she is. These are her coworkers. They can vouch for the fact that she's alive and well and still working to save you guys' lives.

And the people were like, yeah, nice try. Nice try, therefore therefore what our cloning technology is that good yet we're failing to give people like organ transplants yep like i mean it's like just think of the the ramifications right if we have clones couldn't we be doing all kinds of other cool stuff with it rather than being like that nurse let's cover up the vaccination process so get a clone in here yeah it's so it's but i get it like you know like when people are powerless they're at their most susceptible to getting swept up into some explanation as to why they are powerless because sometimes the truth is just so hard to fathom you wouldn't be like yeah it's

just the billion they've been setting up the game to be like, yeah, it's just the billion. They've been setting up the game to be like this because of X, Y, and Z. And it's really just unfortunate to see because, and I feel bad for this nurse who passed out and immediately knew like, oh my gosh, people are gonna take that the wrong way. I need to immediately be like, that's just me.

Don't worry, it has nothing to do with the efficacy of this vaccine or whether or not you should take it. And that other level of dread that even healthcare practitioners are having to experience. Yeah. There's also facts that lead us, like non-human causes for the bad news. There's a new variant of the coronavirus that will likely become the dominant strain within the US. It's a British variant, or at least that's what they're describing it as, more contagious. And researchers think it may be 30% more deadly.

So there's a lot of ways that this story is breaking in the wrong direction. So combining that with just the general sense I've had reading on social media from other people, from studies that this is like having a negative impact on our mental health. There's a new study in the Journal of Sports Medicine that is not about how we're doing in the pandemic. It's about just like our baseline heading into this. And it found that 17% of men, 17.8% of men, 27.6% of women, and these are like young people, they're student athletes, they're, you know, academy um freshmen were tested and found to have uh basically they were trying to find a baseline for concussion symptoms they were like so we want to just test people who haven't had any concuss like concussive activity like no head uh injuries just to see like

what they are like how they compare to people who have. And they found that that portion, 17% of men, 27.6% of women, basically had symptoms of concussions just from general mental health deterioration. They tested the same as people who have had head trauma just like from like a general fog of health problems uh mental health problems and just a lot of like these small kind of background problems that i think are hitting america uh and that don't really get covered all that much. Or when they do, it's like, you know, teens are being made depressed by social media, but it's not like covering it as like a holistic problem.

And I mean, to Eliza, the points that you were making, like there's an article in The Nation that's about the way that America has been approaching this with awareness campaigns, like trying to destigmatize mental health, which is like, you know, there's nothing negative about that, but it's also a cheap fix to a problem that is staying unfixed. A lot of the research finds that it's basically caused by inequality and just all the different ways that endemic, inequality, internalized racism, all of these different things are causing people to be less and less mentally healthy the longer that we go forward in this version of reality where we don't have communities or our communities are dissolving and we don't have the protection of like any sort of social institutions. It's just we're at the whim of kind of corporations and for sure. But I think that it's also exactly I think it's also like something that really is kind of exacerbated by the way in which we handle people who are in the throes of mental health crises.

So far too many times I've represented people who've been dealing with a mental health issue. And because we don't have these structures, these social structures to deal with these issues, people call the police. And so the police show up. They have no training, no ability, no way to handle someone in the throes of a mental health crisis.

And so the situation usually escalates because showing up armed and in a situation where you're going to be untrained to deal with someone in the throes of a mental health crisis means that oftentimes it results in, you know, some pretty serious violence. And we've even seen it result in the deaths of people who have been, you know, killed by the police

because they were dealing with a mental health crisis and the police showed up. And then, of course, there's the fact that, you know, the number one mental health provider in New York City is the Department of Corrections. So more people are getting mental health treatment in our jails than anywhere else in New York City. I mean, that's just wrong. That's absolutely wrong. Like that just shouldn't be how we're dealing with these things. And as you say, mental health issues are on the rise. And so we have to have people, especially in our local offices who don't want to just address these things by locking people up, which like honestly just exacerbates and deteriorates people's mental health condition

even further. And then, you know, they're released back into the community because most people aren't getting locked up for life and they're worse off than when they went in. Yeah. There's this quote from this guy, Rudolf Virchow, who is often called the father of modern pathology as a study, not as the cause of all these pathologies. But he said, politics is nothing else but medicine on a large scale. politics is nothing else but medicine on a large scale um and i think that's just yeah a very valid point that probably doesn't is isn't super intuitive to a lot of americans but the the idea that you know these issues that are happening internally in people's uh minds are a result a direct reflection of systemic issues that they're seeing but we're a little bit too close to it sometimes you know there's the this is water kind of problem where we don't don't look around us and see what you know just our natural conditions because we're too

close to them yeah and yeah the policy issue is so funny because people who are at the levers to create the legislation to help people still act confused or try and point to other things when it's like you actually have the power to change things. But it's really whether or not you're able to rock the boat and make the wealthiest people a little bit more uncomfortable than maybe they're used to you know when you think of like just as policy as medicine a lot of the countries were able to get their lockdowns or whatever in order because they knew we have to subsidize people's lost wages that's how we get that's how we can get compliance because we understand if we say world too scary and dangerous to work therefore we will subsidize that lost

income so we don't create you know just screw up the economy even more than it has yet no one's actually willing to look at that as an actual treatment to like this entire pandemic it's most like well how quickly can we get these vaccines and it's like what who's where whatever it's like but you're you're you're also there there's this like really uh intentional blind spot um to really kind of throw up your hands and be like well my powers work to a point and at that point then it's it's not worth it to some politicians, unfortunately. both the people who have less and also the top 1%. It's bad for everybody. So,

you know, they, I think that they probably think that keeping things the way they are is better overall for them because they've been, again, it's the, like, this is water thing where they're,

they came up and their DNA is like American like haves versus have nots. But they don't know that there's another way that it can be, which would allow them to be happier in a more just and equal world. A 2020 study that this article talks about looked at suicide rate and minimum wage between 1990 and 2015 and found that for every dollar, the minimum wage is raised. The suicide rate decreased by three point five to six percent. Wow. Yeah. If that's not an argument for raising the minimum wage. Fuck.

It's like. Right. And then we're still talking about a figure that we were debating like 10 years ago like 15 was like that one set sail like we should really be like 28 30 you know uh if we're really trying to make things equitable because a lot of the times too when people like make these other examples like well you can work at mcdonald's in scandinavia like den well, you can work at McDonald's in Scandinavia, like Denmark, and you got all this stuff and people are like, well, how does it work? And it's like, well, for starters, their minimum wage is a lot higher because at the very least legislators and the government is willing to actually do the analysis and say, as a policy, as a nation, we think like

you should only have to have one job to at least have your needs met rather than like how many jobs can you cram in for the bare minimum which is where we're at now um well and don't you love when people are like well teachers if we pay people minimum wage of 22 an hour teachers don't even make that much and instead of saying so let's keep the minimum wage down, it's like, let's pay teachers. Let's pay teachers more. Everyone, everyone more money except billionaires and multimillionaires. Can we get on that page at least, y'all? And it's funny. Yeah, like you say, there's these weird arguments that always are reflexive a lot of American people have, which is like, well, where are you going to get that?

Or where does that money come from? Or if we we pay x group then we got to pay x group or if we give these people kindness then what about the rest of us that have suffered it's like well unfortunately some of us had to go through some shit but hope that's to create a you know a plurality of people who can actually see the possibilities of a kinder future rather than getting hung up on well i didn't get that i didn't get humane treatment so no one should and if i didn't get it then what what what's next a teacher's going to be paid their worth for educating our children oh like yeah it's like well i had to have polio why should anyone get the polio vaccine right right really it's We really have this like weird like FOMO,

except it's like fear of humane treatment or something after the fact. Yeah. The study that found that it's bad for top to bottom mental health in terms of like earning power. The theory that they afforded is that it's just uh anytime you are tying your own self-worth to an interaction with another person and it's like a zero-sum situation that adds stress to your life that adds stress to your daily uh experience of the world and i i think by extension uh living in a world where if you you know the worst case scenario is uh losing your job and your life being seen as meaningless like socially uh just like in terms of the external cues that you're getting

uh losing your job and the health care system being like sorry you're fucked like that uh that in that imprints something about uh two people about like our own self-worth and like about what, you know, that, that is, we're not stupid. We can read these clues and see that the society around us is telling us our lives are meaningless,

uh, unless we are providing some sort of like value to capital basically. Um, and you, and it's apparently radical to say more than can you can you create something can you create some value then you can't play the game versus oh hi you came into this earth a human being welcome to earth where at you know because we have these we've evolved over time from you know, cave people and to tribal people, to countries, to governments, that we can still have this basic sentiment, which is you are alive, you are valued. And you can get a bare minimum.

Like we're doing well enough. We figured out this earth enough that we can offer everyone just the basics. Like you don't worry about your food or staying alive or getting medical care or having shelter. You know, that's, that's just, we're all going to say that's what we're all owed as human beings, but it's still like, well, hold up. Can you put in a 40 hour shift? Okay. Well then we can, now we can talk because you said yes. Versus our, you know know can we just redefine what

it takes to be to owe to dignity um in this culture especially like america because we're so self-reliant over here all right let's take one more break and then we'll come back and talk about another big systemic thing. on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. You thought you had fun last season? Well, you were right. And you should tune in today for new fun segments like Sister Court and listening to Lacey's steamy DMs. We've got new and exciting guests like Michael Beach. That's my husband. Daphne Spring, Daniel Thrasher, Peppermint,

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And we're back. And just kind of branching off of the previous conversation we were having um you know we we've been uh talking to our writer jm and just amongst ourselves a little bit about like what we want to kind of keep an eye on any background uh infrastructural damage that has been done by uh the trump administration and one of the things we called out was uh you know broadband and just generally america's had a broadband problem in terms of equality for many years but um you know having a small-time criminal organization fronted by a grifter for the past four years in charge of the country and an opposition party that at times seems to be fighting

for the status quo seems like it's not going to help that. So I wanted to talk about inequality of internet access in america since that's always been a problem but especially now that it's we're not totally sure when the um pandemic is going to end uh is going to be more and more important yeah that it's a it's such a non-stop issue i've for starters eliza, in Manhattan, how many companies are you beholden to to even have broadband? Is it like two at most? Pretty much. I think it's like two, maybe three.

But yeah, you're stuck. If you want to have broadband access, you're stuck. And there's so many, especially now with remote learning and kids having to go to online school. It's like kids who are systemically disadvantaged are just further disadvantaged because of their lack of broadband access. Right. Yeah. And like the whole process. I mean, because it's funny you're talking about like, you know, obviously a JITPi at the FCC did a heck of a lot to make things not very good in terms of making treating broadband as like a right. But even then, like it's been this thing we can never get right because it's so like, you know, like Eliza is talking about or anyone in most cities. No, it's like, I don't know.

It's because we're at the will of like two or three companies. Yeah. And then if you think about the other ways in which it exacerbates inequality, like, for example, in New York, with the vaccine rollout, you know, they expanded the categories of people and they just released the demographics of the people who are actually getting vaccinated of the eligible people. And again, it's like people of color being left out. Now, why is that? Well, because you have to navigate complicated web, you know, you have to have Internet access. You have to be able to navigate these sites that are not well designed to sign up for an appointment. You know, there's no language access, there's no accessibility, like it makes it

extremely difficult for people who lack access. Yeah, the disparity of internet access is distinctly racialized communities of color trail behind their white counterparts in terms of internet access when you're controlling for all other factors like we talk a lot on the show about internalized white supremacy and it's just everywhere including here in medical care but i mean yeah when you have a top to bottom in all these different industries that are then not beholden to an overarching like governmental influence or you know regulatory body as America has increasingly kind of been pro deregulation more and more it it ends with these sorts of things bleeding through and causing just immense problems. Yeah.

So much. There's systemic racism, yeah, across the board and white supremacy and all of it. And it's built into every one of our systems. Yeah. And it's funny because we always hear about rural broadband. I know. We need rural broadband access.

But a lot of the times, people are like, the analysis know we need rural broadband access but a lot of the times like people like the analysis of who is lacking bribes completely like fucked up for lack of a better word because if these these maps that indicate where there are lapses in coverage are made by the telecoms companies so they're giving a very weird take on who needs the access and just the cost that goes. It's just it. That was the biggest thing for me. I'm just reading what James writing is like. Understanding, obviously, because there are these racial disparities, but the version that's touted to most people is like rural.

It's the people in these rural areas. It's like, no, it's not because how many people know how many of us we've i've even been in a situation even when you're you you're younger you don't have money because look let's be real do you have a hundred dollars a month for broadband or sometimes you know around that 80 60 whatever it is most of the time you're like going in on it with other people be like hey let me get your router information so i can hop on your wi-fi to your neighbor or something like that and so like when you really factor that in it's like the the problem is much larger than these areas where you're saying the wires aren't connecting in the heartland right and spike way of contrast in other countries like south korea and sweden the

governments build the broadband infrastructure uh just the way that the government builds highways here uh and then they allow internet providers to use them um so it's like but but in in america it's all based on these corporations you know uh trusting the free market because the argument is like well if we have to build take fiber optic cables out there to the farm rural areas that's too costly and therefore there's no roi on it there's no return on investment so then because we always talk about this constantly on the show if shareholder value has this whole country held hostage yeah because if they spend too much money providing wife like broadband then they it's it's not as cost effective and their profits look smaller. That affects the share price.

And now we're like, oh, don't do that because we got to keep this thing up to make sure that the shares are being traded without functionally improving anyone's lives because that's just the whole rub of it. the whole rub of it and yeah like it's it's it seems like this really ongoing problem where where as much as we think that we can regulate our way out of it we're not ever actually gonna when are they gonna do the thing where they look at the utility companies and go this is like a this is like antitrust town and y'all are the mayor and we need to figure out how to break this up because we can't keep trusting these companies to do the right thing. They only do the right thing for the ledgers. Right. Comcast just recently extended its fees despite receiving hundreds of millions of dollars of public subsidies and new tax breaks. And, you know, even though Biden says he's on this problem, 17 Comcast executives maxed out

their donations to Biden and their top lobbyist hosted his kickoff fundraiser in 2019 so this is one so we will definitely have their gooses cooked this is just sort of this is the problem this is exactly why so i will say in the primary i was a big supporter of elizabeth warren who i thought had the best plans for real big structural change. And she introduced a plan related to broadband, you know, expanding broadband access, where basically she thought we should, you know, offer grants like in the amount of I think she said, like, 80 something billion dollars to nonprofits and municipalities to bring access to get internet to underserved areas. And that's like, she was all about, you know, like break up big tech and make sure that broadband is universally available. And I think that that was like, you know, she basically said we should break up big

tech under antitrust laws. And like, I think that Joe Biden for, you know, he's certainly better than the previous occupant of the White House is not going to be a champion in that regard. I don't know, Eliza, just because he's all booed up with Comcast. I can't imagine. I've never seen that in American politics before. Yeah. I mean, that's the whole, I mean, that's like why everything is so perverted because it's just like NASCAR. You know what I mean? Like you just, you, you sponsor a Congress person to go do your bidding in there to make sure your company's protected. They should have to wear those jackets.

No, they really, and I've been saying that like flippantly, but you should know when you go to a floor vote, you wear all those companies on your back. So we know because that would, that would help people be like, Oh,

you're voting against this broadband thing. Oh. And it's not like, you know, your biggest sponsor, like how on a NASCAR, whoever got the hood is the biggest sponsor. And you walk in there with Comcast, AT&T. Oh, right. This makes sense. And it's funny because there's so many representatives who are right on all these other things. And then you're like, I don't understand why they're so wrong on this thing.

And then you look and you're like, oh, right, because their state is where this company's headquartered and you can't enter office unless you have their blessing. Well, Eliza, I know you have to run. I'm shocked at how much of your valuable time you let us take up. It's been such a pleasure having you.

Where can people find out more about you, contribute to your campaign, all that good stuff? Yeah, it was so fun chatting with you both. Thanks for having me on today. So to find out more, people can go to ElizaOrlins.com. That's E-L-I-Z-A-O-R-L-I-N-S.com. We are running a fully grassroots campaign. The maximum donation in our race is $35,000 per individual donor. So you think it's a lot that people are maxing out to Biden. In the primary, they could give him $2,800. Our max is more than 10 times that, which is absolutely wild. So there are people in our race who are fully funded by millionaires and billionaires who don't want to be held accountable by the Manhattan district attorney's office. So,

you know, we're doing it on thousands and thousands and thousands of, of grassroots donations. So, you know, if you can chip in a dollar, $5, $25, or if you can chip in 35,000, we will certainly not turn it down. But we really do appreciate it. We have over 7,300 individual contributions, the only ones with that much grassroots support. And so we'd be so grateful for anyone to learn more about us and chip in. Do it, Zeitgang. And we also like to ask our guests if there is a tweet they've been enjoying.

Do you have one of those? I do. So this is from at SupramanTracks, S-U-P-R-A-M-A-N-T-R-A-X. Pandemic day 25. I made bread. Smiley face. Day 95. I sure do miss my friends. Day 310.

The White House appears to be under the control of a shirtless man in a Viking helmet. Day 330, Reddit's coordinated attack on Wall Street is going as planned. There we go. I don't even know. Yeah, they would think we were lying. Couldn't have believed it. Wouldn't have believed it. Wouldn't have believed it. Oh, God.

If only we had access to these tweets like a year ago. Like, nah, come on. What are y'all talking about? Come on. Reddit versus Wall Street? All right. All right, Eliza. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Thank you. Great meeting you. Great meeting you. Take care. Bye. Take care. All right. Like we mentioned, Eliza had a out uh because she is a busy because running

for da also eliza go easy on me if you if i ever come across your courtroom saving the world uh but that that was super dope uh what an amazing person uh now she's out of here let's talk about some dumb bullshit uh so this diet love pass uh story is one that it's it's a staple of the um you know conspiracy theory community uh i first came across it in an article uh like i think over a decade ago on cracked uh that was basically miss like big famous unsolved mysteries that totally have solutions um and so here i'll tell you what the the mystery is since you're not familiar with it yeah yeah um so 10 members of this uh this is a real thing this is a real thing the way you started off it sounded like a weird fucking like riddle so it was a stormy night and so 10 members of like a polytechnic institute like a scientific college

nine students and one sports instructor uh had fought in World War II, headed into the frigid wilderness. This is like 1959. One student with joint pain turned back, and the rest, led by a 23-year-old engineering student, continued on. There's camera film, personal diaries later found on the scene that makes it clear they made camp

on february 1st pitching a large tent on the snowy slopes of a mountain i'm not going to try to pronounce uh probably not one you're uh intimately familiar with but the name can be interpreted as dead mountain in the language of the region's indigenous uh mansi people uh so when a search team arrived a few weeks later because they just nobody ever heard from them again the other guy made it back the other guy made it back and he never heard from them again like none of the planned you know rendez views uh happened uh their tent was found barely sticking out of the snow uh it appeared to be cut open from the inside uh the next day the first of the bodies were found near a cedar tree over the next few months as the snow thawed uh they gradually uncovered just all sorts of creepy

bodies all nine of the team members bodies were scattered around the mountain slope some in a baffling state of undress they were half naked some of their skulls and chests have been smashed open others had eyes and one lacked a tongue others had eyes missing and one lacked a tongue and yeah people were like this doesn't make any sense there was also uh like radiation on one of the bodies uh and so people like the official explanation from the soviet bureaucracy was quote unknown natural force and so that like it's it's impossible not to be into this as like a somebody who's open to conspiracy theories right because it could be anything like yeah it could be anything monsters yetis whatever so back when we wrote about it we pointed out that it made sense as an avalanche uh and just kind of some of the more inexplicable details like the radiation

isn't actually that uncommon for anything that's been laying in a snowy area that gets a lot of sun because snow is a tremendous reflector of the sun's energy. The missing eyes and tongue are pretty common with bodies left in the wilderness for a long time since animals go for the soft parts first. And the various states of undress are pretty common for anybody suffering from hypothermia and you know the theory being that they ran out of their tent when an avalanche they heard an avalanche coming at night

and the tent and all their stuff was buried and so they died of hypothermia people will as they're dying of hypothermia feel hot and like take off some of their clothes um oh shit yeah that's oh because your shit's just so fine you're just delirious yeah oh my god so the but people there there was a lot of like pushback on that theory uh not just that that was like one of the more explanations, and we just pointed out that it made a lot of sense in ways that conspiracy theorists were-

How were people pushing back? My first thing was, yeah, if they're scattered everywhere, too, who knows if even the avalanche took some people. Yeah, so there was no snowfall on the night that the avalanche would have happened and usually you need snowfall to add weight to the snow burden that triggers the collapse most of the blunt force trauma like injuries and some of the soft tissue damage were atypical of things caused by avalanches where usually people mostly asphyxiate and then if an avalanche had occurred uh oh there there's this thing about like a gap of nine hours between when they made camp and when the avalanche happened i think it assumes that they would have caused the avalanche because they're like cutting into the

side of the mountain to make camp and that's usually how those things happen. And yet it happened nine hours later. So this new study basically just takes those down point by point. I think the most interesting way it's taken down is that the idea that there's, did I mention the fact that people say it wasn't a steep enough hill that they were camped on no oh so they're saying it was even too flat for an avalanche it was too flat for an avalanche is okay one of the things they're saying but that's actually a optical illusion that you see have you ever like heard of places where they say like water flows uphill and it's like this mystery of uh like a place where gravity doesn't operate or gravity is weird like you drop a stone and it kind of falls to the side. Oh yeah. Every year at burning man. So all of that, that actually is a thing that happens.

Like basically you're at a place that a chunk of flat ground that is actually on a portion of ground that's embedded with, within a larger slope. So even though all your sort of context clues point to the fact that you're on flat ground, you're actually on a slope. And that's what was happening here. They say that this piece of land, when you go and study it, has at least the 30% grade needed to trigger avalanches uh there wasn't snowfall but

there was massive wind uh but one of the reasons this is like kind of a fun story that i think might actually like become popular enough to put an end to this like like uh clues from the film yeah revealed the truth or so one of the scientists who uh is basically created this paper with the official explanation uh back when frozen came out was like holy shit they have absolutely nailed uh the way snow falls and is blown away and is like actually behaves and so he actually traveled to hollywood and met with the 3d modeling company that created the snow for frozen and like got a better idea of how snow behaves and like used their algorithms that they used on frozen to better inform his algorithms of just like

how snow operates and then they also consulted these old GM studies that they had done with a bunch of cadavers like back when people weren't paying as much attention took a hundred dead bodies and just like

threw heavy shit at them and just studied the way that the bodies were destroyed. What were we, 14-year-olds in charge of that study? I know, right? Yeah, we'd just smash them up and we're like, Oh! Oh! Oh!

Gnar! All right, yeah. It's bad. It's bad. So looking at that study data they basically found that uh the injuries were pretty consistent with what you would have seen if there was a like suv style chunk of uh hard snow or ice inside of the avalanche which is hitting you right yeah so wow they think the avalanche hit them uh they were camped at a pretty like when you look at

where their beds were they were actually like dug into the snow in a way that they were pretty well supported so when the thing hit them uh they were uh pre-demolished but probably didn't die and then their camp mates like dragged them out to safety and then went downhill yeah all went downhill from there um but it's a wild story uh and i don't know i do think that this is is the explanation i don't think there's been yeah yeti uh alien explanation yeti gang where you at come on rebut this terrible study yeti oh they're going to uh they yeah yeah i am making a lot of enemies as reasonable as this might sound uh i'm gonna be what in big trouble with the community people like a sexier yeti explanation for this that's right come on yeah dude watch

they're gonna be like well if they use frozen we will use the modeling of the child's film abominable uh to then prove our yeti theory it's like well no that's not what they did it wasn't just because there was a movie that that reinforced their argument but go at it yeti gang i'd love to see it yeah they probably will use the fact that oh because frozen okay yeah yeah what did a nice monster do it that elsa had created right that's where it's that's where you realize too like you don't get don't get in arguments with conspiracy theorists yeah because if you're not on the same page then nothing you're saying is real and there will be it's like i don't even know how you reverse engineer common ground at that point we're like all well, where can we agree?

What's snow? Can we agree that that's frozen? Like a water that's very in a solid state. Okay. Okay. Moving on. What's Russia? And then it all falls apart.

Like an experimental ground for the governments of the world to create new bio organisms that are like, just terrorize the earth. Wait, bro. You think Russia exists? Come on, man. Right. And you're like, oh, Jesus. Now who's naive Wait, bro, you think Russia exists? Come on, man. Right, and you're like, oh, Jesus. Now who's naive? Dude, did you say Russia?

Like, what? All right, Miles, it's been a pleasure talking to you today. As always, where can people find you and follow you, and what's a tweet you've been enjoying? Twitter, Instagram, at Miles of Grey. Also, 420 Day Fiance. We're doing a lot more twitchy stuff so go to twitch.tv slash 420 day fiance uh for that kind of that snark i guess all right so i got a couple tweets um actually no just this one from a reductress because it cut me straight in my heart bone uh as somebody who

has been dabbling on tiktok and just seeing what what's going on there and this is from at reductress saying are you ugly or did you just see a 17 year old on tiktok um and yeah it's it's wild like not you know no you know you can kind of keep track of like what the youth them are doing out there in the world because you're out there and you see the kids in their faces and you see what they're up to. But when you don't have that kind of data from, you know, the world being shut down, TikTok is really where I'm seeing it. I'm like, damn, these kids are, like, on some radical shit. And also, like, and they're doing it with swag, too. So look at y'all on that tiktok shit um a tweet i've been enjoying uh somebody brought it to my attention that a tweet i had liked and retweeted

was actually very similar to an earlier tweet i don't necessarily think that that means it was stolen i just you know parallel thinking but i do like to give credit to sjk salisbury uh who tweeted another wooden ball would it kill the makers of avocados to include a different toy like a mood ring or a novelty eraser um and that was uh kellyanne kanye at jerry robledo uh pointed out that that was the earlier tweet so shout out to everyone involved in allowing me to say that I liked that tweet

also your co-host of 420 Day Fiance Sophia Alexandra tweeted herd immunity is when those stampeding wild beasts got off for trampling Mufasa you can find me on twitter at Jack underscore O'Brien you can find us

on twitter at Daily Zeitgeist we're at The Daily Zeitgeist on Instagram we have a Facebook fan page and a website DailyZeitgeist.com where we post our episodes and our footnotes we link off to the information that we talked about in today's episode as well as the song we ride out on Miles what are we riding into this fine tuesday upon this is from taku who's just a

just a lovely beat maker from australia now in australia and this track's called remember me and it's got like a great uh dream vibe. Like, I don't know. It feels like a dream. I'm very articulate. Very articulate. But it's just very, yeah. It's nice. It's got, it's major key tonality, not too minor.

So it's not giving you any tension. And it just feels like you're, you know, if you were coming back from like a hip hop dream back to the real world, waking up. So yeah, Remember Me by Taku. All right. Well, we are going to ride out on that. The Daily Zeitgeist is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. That is going to do it for this morning.

We're back this afternoon to tell you what's trending, and we'll talk to you all then. Bye. Bye. Bye. Hi, everyone. It's me, Katie Couric. You know, if you've been following me on social media, you know I love to cook or at least try, especially alongside some of my favorite chefs and foodies like Benny Blanco, Jake Cohen, Lighty Hoyk, Alison Roman, and Ina Garten. So I started a free newsletter called Good Taste to share recipes, tips, and kitchen must-haves. tips, and kitchen must-haves. Just sign up at katiecouric.com slash goodtaste. That's K-A-T-I-E-C-O-U-R-I-C dot com slash goodtaste. I promise your taste buds will be happy you did.

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Hi, I'm Maite Gomez-Rejon. Our podcast, Hungry for History, is back. And this season, we're taking an even bigger bite out of the most delicious food and its history. Seeing that the most popular cocktail is the margarita, followed by the mojito from Cuba and the piña colada from Puerto Rico. Listen to Hungry for History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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This season, we make new friends, deep dive into my steamy DMs, answer your listener questions, and more. The more is punch each other. Listen to the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Just listen, okay? Or Lacey gets it. Do it.