The Daily Zeitgeist - China Loves Luigi, David Lynch's Pocket Full of M&M's 01.17.25

Episode Date: January 17, 2025

In episode 1801, Jack and guest co-host Caitlin Durante are joined by musician, comedian, author of The Advice King Anthology and host of Cold Brew Got Me Like, Chris Crofton, to discuss… R.I.P. David Lynch and more! David Lynch, Auteur Drawn to the Dark and the Dreamlike, Dies at 78 L.A. Wildfire Relief: DONATE: Support the Kaller/Gray Family's Recovery Zeitgang Lightsaber Auction and Fundraiser Displaced Black Families GoFund Me Directory LISTEN: The Sun by Secret Night GangSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

By the way, my dad likes eating pop tarts, but he doesn't know the names of anything, so he called it a jump tart. This happened like last week. When they're when they're in the toaster and they pop up, they jump. He also called a blackberry. I don't know if I he called called a Blackberry a Buckeye. Nope. He has a blackberry and he goes, you know, these things are amazing.

And I was like, yeah, but they're obsolete and I don't know why you're charging it. And he's like, well, I mean, they're still incredible whether or not they're obsolete, look at this thing. I mean, and, and then somehow he said this buck guy. Yeah. He doesn't care. You're talking about the technology. Yeah.

I thought you meant he, I thought you were talking about the plant. Who knows what he called Palm pilot. I wish I had a joke. I should have a punchline for that, but I don't. Joel the holidays are a blast, but the financial hangover, that can be a huge bummer. If you are out there and you're dreading the new statement email that reveals the massive balance that you may have racked up, well, you could use our help.

That's right. I'm Joel. And I am Matt. And we're from the How To Money Podcast. email that reveals the massive balance that you may have racked up, well, you could use our help. That's right. I'm Joel. And I am Matt. And we're from the How to Money Podcast. Our show is all about helping you make sense of your personal finances so you can ditch your pesky credit card debt once and for all, make real progress on other crucial financial goals that you've got, and just feel more in control of your money in general.

You know it. For money advice without the judgment and jargon, listen to How to Money on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. John Stewart is back at The Daily Show and he's bringing his signature wit and insight straight to your ears with The Daily Show Ears Edition podcast. Dive into John's unique take on the biggest topics

in politics, entertainment, sports, and more. Joined by the sharp voices of the show's correspondents and contributors. And with extended interviews and exclusive weekly headline roundups, this podcast gives you content you won't find anywhere else. Ready to laugh and stay informed? Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to Decisions Decisions, the podcast where boundaries are pushed and conversations get candid.

Join your favorite hosts, me, Weezy WTF, and me, Mandy B. As we dive deep into the world of non-traditional relationships and explore the often taboo topics surrounding dating, sex, and love. Every Monday and Wednesday, we both invite you to unlearn the outdated narratives dictated by traditional patriarchal norms. Tune in and join the conversation. Listen to Decisions Decisions on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, you guys. I'm Catherine Legg. app, Apple podcast,

or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. Hello, the internet and welcome to season 371 A production of I Heart Radio. This is a podcast where we take a deep dive into American shared consciousness. We now have a YouTube channel, YouTube slash at daily zeitgeist pod. You can go check it out. I think our episode from this week drops today. So go check it out. It's Friday, January 17th, 2025. My name is Jack O'Brien aka Ham Baby Baby. Ham Baby Baby. My meat buildup is killing me and I must confess the raw ham juice, raw ham juice, unknown meat residues on the line. Give me a sign.

Large ham babies one more time. That's courtesy of you, Kurt, do that on television. You Kurt, do that on television. Thank you so much. Also sorry, Steaming Chuck, author of yesterday's AKA for calling you Steaming Chunk. I'm old. This is gonna be happening more and more folks. We just have to get used to me putting S's on the end of people's names or you know it's gonna be embarrassing. And I appreciate you all being along for the ride. I'm thrilled to be joined once

again in our second seat, our miles seat by a very talented writer, stand-up comedian and co-host of the Bechdel cast, one of the great film podcasts. It's Caitlin Durante! Actually, it's Caitlin's Durantes. You should have put that on the end. Brad Pitt, so my dad calls him. Yeah. Just kidding. It's me. Singular. Caitlin. Singular Durante.

The Caitlin Durante. Mid-Atlantic. You're from the Mid-Atlantic region. Yes. When Justin asked if we were already recording Caitlin said yes. A very distinguished Mid-Atlantic way. But I admire.

It's wonderful to have you. I'm thinking transatlantic, not mid-Atlantic. What's mid-Atlantic? I thought mid-Atlantic, maybe it is transatlantic. Whatever the Hepburn thing is. Oh, ah. Yeah. I don't know which, what's what.

What does that talk like this? Like a real sophisticate. But yeah, I don't know what's what. Talk like this, like a real sophisticated, but yeah, I don't know. Well, it's not from anywhere so much as a time and an idea. So true. So true. Well, he's been waiting patiently in our third seat, a hilarious standup comedian, actor, musician you can listen to on his podcast. Cold Brew got me like anywhere in his book. The advice king anthology is available anywhere.

Fine books are sold. The poetry window is open because it's Chris Motherfucking Crofton. Hey, what's up? Yeah. Are you guys doing? What? Let's see. If I if I could save Chris Crofton in a bottle, the first thing that I'd like to do is save every day till eternity passes so I could spend it with Chris Crofton.

Oh wow. Chris Crofton being saved in the bottle. And I got to do my own AKAs, which is bullshit. Absolute bullshit that I do not have AKAs and I have to do these humiliating classic rock AKAs. Chris was fuming about the lack of AKAs, even though there's tons of them in the Discord, by the way, for you. Don't stop Chris Croftoning. Yes.

Okay. Hold on. by the way, for you, Chris Crofton. Yes. I mean, I can't do it clearly. I'm not even good at it to be leaving me abandoning me to my own AKKs when I'm horrible at it. I thought, I thought you nailed that one. Don't stop. Chris, I'm a friend who heard it from a friend. Is there such a specific you or Chris Crofton. What's that?

What's that Chris Cross song? Is there something there? Yeah, yeah. Warm it up, Chris. I'm Crofton. Warm it up, Chris. I'm a Crofton. I'm thinking of a different generation.

I was like, oh, Christopher Cross. Yeah. Oh. Crofton, take me away to where I'm going. This is the episode today folks. So, uh, wait, do I have, does, does anyone write AKs for me or am I? That's a good question. That's what I feel like.

I should have left there. It's not fair. There's Jack over there all smug with AKs like probably for days. Probably like AK is for AK days. No one calls my legs plumpers, no one does shit for me. I don't think that's true. I think there's like, I'm sure there are probably at least five AKAs for each of you. Wow.

In the Discord. I mean, a lot of people do anagrams for me. Yes. And then of course there's that. Yeah. Chris, I don't know if you knew this, but Caitlin has the most anagrammable name in the English language. Is that true?

It's up there. I mean, it's, it's very true. You know that. Warranty Titanic, Nine Tit Dracula, Latin Dancer UTI. Oh my goodness. These are all good band names. Nine Tit Dracula is a great name for a noise band or something. It fucking rules.

I'll start one. Yeah, there's dozens of others and many of them have the word tit, taint, cunt, nut. It's a lot of dirty words too. Wow. I'm going to stay away from those then. I can't say those anagrams. I can't, how are people telling you these things without being so, you can't say that kind of stuff to anybody, even if it is an anagram, Hey, guess what your

anagram is, cunt tit, you can't say that shit to people. Yeah. Cunt tit Dracula. Hey, that might be say that shit to people. Yeah, cunt, tit, Dracula. Hey, that might be true, but I'm also calling the police. Yeah. All right. Chris, we're going to get to know you a little bit better in a moment. First, we're going to tell the listeners a couple of the stories we're talking about

later on. If we get to them, we are going to say RIP to David Lynch, who passed away yesterday. We might check in with Drake, suing his own record label and why the Village people will be playing at Trump's inauguration, even though they said they were not going to be. All of that, plenty more. But before we get to it, Chris, we do like to ask our guests, what is something from your search history? Well, you're not going to believe this one.

Uh-oh. Um, it's not going to be something silly. If you've been listening to my cold brew, got me like podcast, which is really, it's been just nothing but good morning. Got me likes for three days a week. I do a podcast in the morning. Um, and just talk a little bit about my state of mind and read a poem and then play a song, a little bit of a song to recommend a song. But

if you've heard the last couple, I've been talking about the ketamine treatments I've been getting. Oh yeah. Which, you know, I didn't feel like, I wasn't sure whether to, like, you know how the podcast microphone could be like a truth serum. Like when I first started doing podcasts, I was like, what am I saying? I can't, why am I telling these people this stuff? Right. You know, like I, you know, and I, I felt like maybe I shouldn't mention this ketamine stuff in case people think it's like, oh, he's insane, you know, but my depression has been a lifelong.

Problem. And I, I take Zoloft I've taken Zoloft for 20 years. I've tried various other SSRIs. I do not, they all make me basically nervous or have sexual side effects or both. And with Zoloft, it doesn't make me nervous, but I still have sexual side effects that suck, you know, especially it's just, it's't make me nervous, but I still have sexual side effects that suck, you know, especially it's just, it's just things that you put up with because I'm like, well, I'm, I'm like, I don't want to sleep all day because that's like sort of my, my way of dealing with depression is I just can sleep, you know, for like insane amounts of time and like really

surreal amounts of time. And I, and that's like, whenever you're thinking like depression's like fake, which I think a lot of people will have depression think it is, you know, because. There's so many things going on in the world that could make you depressed. Now it's like, if you have clinical depression as well, you start to say, well, I don't know, you know, maybe I'm just like, I'm just a big complainer. Like everyone else is sad too. You know what I mean? So there's a lot of ways to like sort of gaslight yourself about depression. Into thinking it's just a thing to get over on your own. Yeah. I mean, in my life, I've slept like 35 hours in a row, like actually slept, like not, not gotten, you know, get up. Yes.

To like go to the bathroom or whatever, but you know, like really be asleep for that long, like that's not something, yes, to like go to the bathroom or whatever, but you know, like really be asleep for that long. Like that's not something you're supposed to be able to do. I mean, that's like the species wouldn't survive if everybody was sleeping 35 hours. You know, I think there is somewhere in the middle, like maybe 10 hours, like I don't think you have to sleep three hours and keep diet cokes and a gun on your dresser like Elon Musk. You know, I think there's a happy medium, you know?

So the thing about this drugs bravado is I, my, my new. Psychologists that I have because I'm so poor that I have heavily subsidized insurance that's actually kind of deluxe right now, but I do have right now $900 a month insurance for $14 a month. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that.

I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that.

I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that. I'm not sure if I'm going to be this can't happen. There's not winter here. You can get depressed anywhere, it turns out, in any, in any weather,

especially if it's the time of year that's quote unquote winter, even if it's sunny out and warm. Right. But so I just tried to take it seriously. And so she recommended, she said, well, you tried this, I tried a new drug over the summer and it didn't agree with me, usual anxiety and, um, I went in and I, I saw, I said, she said, we can try this bravado. You're technically depression. Your depression is a treatment resistant.

If you've tried like five antidepressants and they all, you don't agree with you, which is certainly true. Sure. I've tried more than that over the years. People always recommend well, buterin, you know, how I found out while buterin wasn't working for me when I tried to switch to it in like 2016? I was like, cause it makes me kind of manic. Yeah. Well butrin,

so the first- That's the one that's got a little bit of a up to it. So the first two weeks, I'm like, I think I'm having a breakthrough. Yeah. I feel kind of wild. Maybe this is my natural setting. That's how it should be, you know?

But then one day I was driving down like the highway, freeway, you know, and I was listening to the final cut by Pink Floyd, really loud and drinking a vanilla latte. Neither of which I do. So just change your whole personality. You're like, fucking Pink Floyd, huh? So I was like, this is, no, I'm not, this is not, this is not going well.

So I got off of it. But anyway, I've had two treatments. Of the ketamine. And the collision of Western and Eastern medicine is the funniest, most idiotic thing I've ever seen. Tripping in a strip mall, I would compare it to. Right. Yeah.

It's like a psychedelic, like some ketamine treatment is like a psychedelic approach. Tripping in a regular doctor's office with regular Tennessee, mind you. Tennessee, like not nurses, just like medical assistance, which is like. Kind of sitting with you and talking you through it. Your shaman is the, is the same as like, I don't know how the vibe would be like, uh, you know, it's like, it's like being talked through a trip by like two people who work at Jiffy Lube. Yeah.

That happened to me on Monday. Right. I mean, if we're going to approach this at like a broad level, there's going to be a lot of, yeah, it's going to be like industrial trip sitters, you know? It's like, it was insane. They were so nice and they were just like, but they were just like, you're going to be okay, you know, but they look scared, you know, I was like, I am like, why are you scared?

And they're like, I don't know. I just started doing this. I just started doing this. That's cause they're also like enemy. I'm going to tell you the truth. Okay. So this one of the two women, okay. Who one was like, this is my job.

Right. And I was like, well, yeah, what's your degree? She's like, I'm a medical assistant. I went to school for a year. I'm like, hmm, well, you sound like an asshole in this anecdote, by the way. You're like, oh yeah, what's your degree? Listen, I just said, I know you're not, but the only reason I'm able to know because I'm like, I'm scared. I flipped. I flipped on Monday.

I don't do drugs. I'm sober. Yeah, I don't. Yeah. I'm sober. Yeah, I don't I I stopped doing psychedelics in 1992 because I lost because I very good. I was yeah I was dying and ruined everybody's trip and everything. Yeah, you know what I mean? There's nothing worse than tripping with the you know, the anxiety guy sure we're done. We've been we've been this lace this lace Oh, I was the worst. I was a like hurricane level nightmare blunt rotation. I was the worst person to smoke weed with. Me too, by the end.

The anxiety guy, man. For a while I was pretty good at it, but then the weed got better. And then I fell apart. But anyway, it was just, I'm excited about it because the second treatment I had yesterday, I was able to, well, this is the thing I asked, all I asked was like, is there a doctor? Like, can I see a doctor? Like I didn't see a doctor through the whole thing.

So I just saw these two people who gave me this drug. They said I was going to be okay. And then, but they just kept saying, you're going to be okay. But then they also did get kind of scared in the middle. They were like, your blood pressure is a little high. They said that's me while I'm on the drug. That's what I mean. So it's like, that's, I don't care if I don't have a degree in it. I have a degree in art history and I got like a C plus. So I'm not, I just want to know that I'm not going to die.

And if you're asking people who are kind of like, I just did that. One of the people who was in there being my trip guide was the front desk person who I had seen the other day when they said that the medicine didn't come in. The person who told me. Right. So I was just like, I was, I, and I was being sensitive while I was tripping. Cause I was like, I'm not trying to be a jerk, but do you have any kind of medical accreditation to be in here?

Cause you're at the front desk. Yeah. She goes, and while I'm tripping, she's like, yeah, they have me bouncing around. Wow. Wow. Wow. But I did get the head of the whole organization, which I of course won't mention, but she got on the FaceTime or FaceTime with me or whatever the hell it is. Yeah.

That's what old people always say about stuff like that. Yeah. Or whatever the hell it is. On the video phone. Yeah. Whatever the hell it is. And about stuff like that. Yeah. Or whatever the hell it is. A video phone. Yeah. Whatever the hell it is. And she told me that it's an anesthetic. So when you feel like you can't breathe, it's just because you have been, basically

your whole body numbs out. So you can't, you can't feel your breathing, but I needed to know that ahead of time. That was the thing. Yeah. That would have been helpful. It really, those, cause I kind of knew it was the anesthetic, but they didn't really get into specifics. So I ended up talking to these two people, like in a intimate way, I've lost my

mind. I thought I was dying. So I was like, I was, I was talking to these people like, that I met 15 minutes ago about, I mean, it's like tripping, having a meltdown like that. You kind of want to, it's pretty uncomfortable. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Like I was telling them that I felt like that, you kind of want to, it's pretty uncomfortable. Yeah. You know, like I was telling them that I felt like a tongue depressor made of static and stuff like that.

Wow. You know, and they're like, well, pretty cool. They're like, well, your, your blood pressure is a little high. Yeah, that's not told your blood pressure is. No, if you think it's not, you know think Good Morning Got Me Like is boring, you got to start tuning in because I'm doing reports on this stuff. I did have a great experience yesterday. I just was a little bit more ready for it.

Anyway, I'm optimistic, but I'm also not that optimistic. I don't know that there's a drug that can cure the modern know, the modern malaise we have with, you know, tech bros in the white house combined with clinical depression. I doubt there's like some, you know, poor Yeah, tech bros are giving like some of the psychedelic therapy a bad name, but I do think there's value to it for a lot of people, for a lot of conditions. If it's like being, you know, if it's being done in a therapeutic setting with like good doctors.

I got better answers yesterday because, because I just texted them and I said, um, you know, I just was wondering if I'd go down on the dose. Yeah. And I said, I just wondered also if there could be a doctor that maybe came in at the end and said like that went well or didn't go well and they were like, well, we can't get a hold of you or not. Your doctor's in a probably won't be able to call you back. But then one of the got on the text and said, we talked to some

doctor I've never heard of or met. We talked to somebody, somebody, and we're going to stay at the same dose. And then she wrote, we got you exclamation point, exclamation point. I love it. So I love the confidence. What kind of medical system is that? 2025 baby, this is how it is. I mean, all of it is because they're on a bare bones budget.

Whatever corporation owns this organization is like, you know, why can't we like shift the front desk person to be the shaman? Like, what's the problem? Like, what if we just tell them they have to? They'll do the best they can. It's a great idea in theory, but it's also becoming legal and operational as America is taken over by private equity, whose job is like, what if one person

did the job of 10 people? And yeah. That's the drug we all need. The drug we need is revolution. That's the drug we all need. The drug we need is revolution that dismantles capitalism and all the other oppressive structures. If we all just take that drug, a lot of our problems will be lifted away. Gets me out of bed, Caitlin, I'll meet you on the corner of Pico and La Brea if that's a real corner.

I can't remember if they're like the ones that run parallel or not. Let's not get too early though. Let's meet at like 1130. Oh, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. What a journey. Please go listen to Cold Brew Got Me Live. I feel pretty good. I got to say. Good. I don't. I'm going to keep with it and, and I, uh, because I'm hopeful. I mean, I, I am fed up with SSRIs. I'm fed up with the side effects from them.

And if I can, if there's any way to get out of it, if I, if I have to live on Zola for the rest of my life, I can do it. I've done it for a long time, but I would like to, to, to try, you know, see if I can do better. Yeah. Yeah, of course. Let's, uh, take a quick break. We'll, uh, plan the I can do better. Yeah. Great. Yeah, of course. Let's take a quick break. We'll plan the revolution real quick and we'll be back. 2025 is bound to be a fascinating year.

It's going to be filled with money challenges and opportunities. I'm Joel. Oh, and I am Matt. And we're the hosts of How to Money. We want to be with you every step of the way in your financial journey this year, offering the information and insights you need to thrive financially. Yeah, whether you find yourself up to your eyeballs in student loan debt or you've got a sky-high credit card balance because you went a little overboard with the holiday spending or maybe you're looking to optimize your retirement accounts so you can retire early.

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signing on the dotted line. Listen to the Athletes First Family podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back. What Chris is something you think is underrated? Underrated. I would say, um, I can't remember what my idea was for this. It's, uh, it was going to be, I think it was going to be that it was on. My audio book was underrated again, just so I could promote it.

It's done. The advice King anthology is done. And audio book is done. And yeah, and it took forever. And I don't know how anyone records an audio book except to use AI, because you have to have someone who can donate 50 hours of high quality studio time, which is the equivalent of making like 14 indie rock records. Right. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know how they, you know, like the budget is like, I don't even have the have the budget of an indie rock band for this thing. So anyway, but it's done. Good. And so that's underrated only because it's not even out yet. But also I need people to buy it because it's like 10, it's going to be 10 bucks. It's hilarious. It's like three and a half hours of me doing standup basically. I mean, I can't

read these columns without getting, and my mom does the introduction. So you're sidebaring on it. Yeah. I mean, I'm just, well, I'm just performing the columns like, because they're like, a lot of them are just straight up standup except written. And so I had to, that's why it's going to be fun. It's like a comedy album and it's got some like serious stuff in it about depression and things like that But it's gonna be a lot of fun and my mom does the introduction because Tracy Moore who wrote the introduction She's a journalist out in Los Angeles. She couldn't do it. So it's like all how great I am or whatever You know, it's like a nice it's the introduction to the book like, you know I'm read it who would be good at reading something about me? That's like really positive.

And so I got my mom who's 83 and she was so psyched to be in the studio and everything and she, she, she rehearsed by reading. She's like, I need the book. And I was like, I don't have a copy of it. She's like, I need the book to practice. So she was reading like obituaries out loud out of the newspaper. Yeah. That's how I get ready of the newspaper to practice. Yeah. That's how I get ready for this show every day.

I never, I never practiced anything in my life. So I was just like blown away. What, uh, Chris, what's something you think's overrated? Overrated is this any news media right now that is covering any cable news. Every single bit of it should be, should be thrown out the window. I mean, everybody knows that, but especially now, because I'm so tired of hearing about how these tech guys, Musk and Zuckerberg and, oh, there's a small list. Everybody knows them, I guess, Larry Ellison and, and, and Peter Thiel and all, and, and,

you know, they, they're not, they say, oh, they've accrued as much wealth as during the Gilded Age or like we haven't seen this much wealth, but this accrued as much wealth as during the Gilded Age, or like, we haven't seen as much wealth, but this isn't a matter of wealth. This is a matter of power. And they keep discussing this without mentioning the richest person in the world didn't own the news. Right. The richest person in the world couldn't meddle in government affairs in Myanmar by shutting

off or turning on Facebook. These people have power unparalleled in human history. These people are kings of the whole globe. There wasn't even an interconnected globe until 30 years ago. So the idea that they keep getting discussed, well, it's getting really bad, getting really bad. Talking about this in terms of money misses it. This is power on levels that have never been seen before. And I'm so sick of hearing it being discussed in comparison to the Gilded

Age, when all you could be was like the meanest guy on the block and you could have the biggest tower and stand around in it and be mean to your immediate surroundings. But you couldn't like try and overthrow the government of England with tweets. Yeah. I mean, you just couldn't. You could yell at stable boys. That was what the old. Oh, they were so mean to their stable boys.

Yeah. I mean, sure. I'm not, I'm not, listen, I'm not saying that was okay. Yeah. Biden coming through at the end of not, I'm not, listen, I'm not saying that was okay. Yeah. Biden coming through at the end of his thing and being like, guys, some of these tech oligarchs are bad news. I think I'm glad you brought that up. I can't even, I can't even process that.

After that process that after like a record num, like I think there was one person with $150 million before he started. And now there's like eight of them. Did he even raise the corporate tax rate when he was in office? No, he did nothing. That's what I mean. He's just finding out about this on the way out. That's what I mean.

I mean, how is anyone? And then we're not talking about the fires, you know, but I'm sure you guys have talked about it to death and you're also living through it. And I'm, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. It's so horrible. And on top of all that shit to have a guy saying stuff like that, who's the president of the United States. I mean, how much can people take? That's what I mean. It's like these giant megaphones need to be turned off or we're never going to be okay again. We're not going to ever be okay again, unless we turn these fucking things off. I remember there was a, in a hundred Thompson's fear and loading in Las Vegas.

He had a funny passage. I never forgot where he was saying there was a machine on the Vegas strip where for $5 they could, they would project you like a hundred feet tall on the side of a building and you could yell anything you wanted at Las Vegas. And he was saying this, he was saying how insane that was. Yeah. How scared he was of like taking drugs and then seeing like some random person screaming from- You can't let random people scream at a whole city.

Well, you know what I mean? We have, you know- That has been the tech innovation of the past 50 years. Yeah. That's just, that's what's overrated is talking about things in content in, in ways that are not only, I don't know if they're obfuscating, if they are, these people are too in the system to even understand, Oh, it is either just as wealthy as the, as the Gilded age. I mean, they can have as many carriages as they want.

I mean, they can have, you know, like that's not what's happening. Anyway, that's, that's all just occurred to me. I just found out about this Joe Biden mentioned it today. Yeah. It's just, it's not comparable to any Gilded age. That's not, and they're richer than anybody in the golden age. Gilded. A lot.

Yeah. Exactly. And I, they keep saying that. So I'm like, oh, and they're like, yeah, that's not that much different than we bounce back from that. You know, we'll be fine. And that's the message that you're supposed to calm the fuck down. Yeah. Really? Ultimately. And I it's making everybody insane.

It has been just interested. Like that is the thing from red note that I keep seeing people, you know, so red note is interesting to me like the this new social media app where people are like going as an act of rebellion because of the cancellation of TikTok. And they're like, oh shit, we actually can like talk and speak to Chinese people who've been like cut off for us, from us for decades. Like what are they like? What are they into? And they're all just like Luigi Mangione fucking rules is, is what is like the,

the number one most popular, uh, meme on social media. It's just like, I don't know. It's. Wait, that's, that's the most popular meme on, on, on red note, like on Chinese social media, they like love Luigi Mangione. That is weird. Yeah. But I don't know. No, like on Chinese social media, they like love Luigi Mangione. That is weird. Yeah.

But I don't know. Like it, it just seems like there is this whole thing that's being massively missed to your point by CNN and he's a multicultural phenomenon. Like that guy's like universally considered hot. Yeah, he is universally considered. I mean, that is like one of the explanations by someone was like, that's just because he looks good. Like the expert on red note is like, it's just cause he's hot, but yeah, I don't know, like there, miles had put the story in of like, it's a sound clip from Sean

Hannity's radio show where he's like talking about how rich billionaires like he's just shaming people for being fans of Luigi Mangione and for anyone talking like getting on board with taxing the wealthy. And I just I think there's going to be this massive fucking uprising of like people at least like their sentiment being like, this is a fucking disaster. Like what are you guys talking about? And I don't, I don't know what it's going to look like necessarily, but it just

seems like the disconnect is so profound. And like, yeah, the Luigi Mangione stuff is like, you know, gotten tamped down. So, you know, because there's not not new news coming out because he just made two appearances over the course of the past three months. And every time he does, social media is like, yeah, fuck yeah. I can't wait until he's on Dancing with the Stars. I know, right? Oh, Masked Singer, yeah. There's that moment over break where like,

Colin just mentioned his name and the crowd like started cheering and he was like, you guys are cheering for justice, right? Like you're cheering because he got caught and like he was joking, but like, I, I don't know, there's just such a weird thing happening with like the, the complete disconnect. There's a tipping point. And, and, and I think the fires in Los Angeles, even though first and foremost, they're just a tragedy. Yeah.

But they, they affected it. I don't know. It's going to be hard for the wealthy who were affected, say the palisades, a lot of the wealth, very uber wealthy in the palisades to feel like they don't need social services. If a lot of those palisades people, sadly, well, all rich people everywhere voted for Trump because they don't want to pay taxes. But then when you're starting to question where the water was and where the helicopters are and those sorts of questions, you start to understand, wow, we just voted for a guy who has vowed to cut more, cut the helicopter, get less helicopters.

Yeah. To get less firemen, fire people, you know, that is, we're really, I think the collision of those two things is like, I mean, the Pacific Palisades is like not a place people you can really, I've been there. It's beautiful. It feels like otherworldly. It feels untouchable.

Right. And, and, and, and it's, you know, it's like these narratives that we believe in, like that somehow life is this thing to win. And, you know, it's like, but the, but the point is that I think even rich people are starting to smell a rat. Yeah. Or they're like making up like the, the articles I'm seeing covering like rich people's responses, like this guy hunkered down with like a gun and a fire hose. And he's protecting his house himself. And yeah, he blames Gavin Newsom.

Like that's kind of how they've figured out their way to like justify what they previously believed and also blame it on unhoused people that they claim are lighting the fires, which yeah, it's I, I, I've been, uh, I've come out of the fires and like the misinformation shit storm, like kind of let less hopeful or I don't know, more, more certain that like something needs to be done about fucking social media, but feels like the wrong time for that sentiment. I do just want to read this quote from Sean Hannity because it's like kind of a good example

of the type of shit you're talking about. He said, I even heard some Trump supporters say they want to soak the rich. You sound like Bernie Sanders. You want to soak the rich. When I didn't have any money, I was a contractor. I never got hired by a poor person. In my 10 years in the restaurant business, I never got a tip from a poor person, which absolute fucking bullshit.

That's wrong. Yeah. No, I want a thriving economy where Americans have high paying career jobs and you got to focus on the basics. But yeah, so complete definitely did not work as a tip based employee in the service industry Because then he would know that rich people are the fucking worst tippers in the world I've waited on billionaires before I think it's funny because they actually The two that I waited on tip 20% exactly and they acted like they were so like they were we're not monsters

I am a job creator. God. You tip less than poor people. I mean, just like, Oh, 20% buddy. You should be giving me a million dollars if you're a billionaire. And they won't even miss it. They won't even know. I mean, it's so funny.

They're like, here's your 20%. See? Yeah. There you go. Yeah. But yeah, you thought I was going to be like nothing. It's like, so like with shit like that being put out there from the mainstream media and like the new administration, I'm like, part of me is like, is how are

people going to react because that they're, they're rejecting that sort of bullshit at this point, the sort of like, all right, Bernie Sanders, you want to soak the rich, get on out of here or, you know, Ben Shapiro coming out and being like the radical left is supporting Luigi Mangione and like all of his listeners being like, uh, it's not just the radical left, man. So, yeah, well, I think people look to the problem. The problem we have is that people are so used to looking at the television for, for what, like what the score is. Like, you know, are people starting to wake up, you know, and the

TV will never admit that. So then they're just like, I guess people aren't starting to wake up, you know, but everyone is, but it's just, you just can't get validated. It's kind of like when I was in that room, like freaking out on the ketamine and wanted somebody of authority to come in and say like, this is okay. Right. Like you're right. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like you're right to be freaking out cause this, that, and the other thing, but we will never get that validation because the media is owned by these same people

So we'll never ever and it's really important in a culture that looks to TV for reality. It reminds me of network Caitlin mm-hmm. Do you watch that movie? Yeah, you know, I'm mad as hell I'm not gonna take it one of my favorite movies, you know, and and you know talked about all this stuff in 1974 you know, talked about all this stuff in 1974, you know, and, and, uh, that line where Peter Finch is imploring the audience for his news show, saying, we're the fake ones. You're real. You're the, you think we're the real ones and you're fake. That's how he's like, that's how fucked up this has gotten is that you think we're real. You know, we, you know, it's, and it's just, um, it's

unfortunate that it just keeps, keeps going. I mean, I can't stop looking at screens either. You know, it's not like I know how to stop. Yeah. As addictive as that highly processed food we were talking about yesterday. Yeah. And there is that. Uncrustables as addictive as arustables. And visual mouth feel.

Yeah. That eye feel, you know? Yeah, yeah. How's the eye feel of your apps? The Titanic has great eye feel. Oh, the movie Titanic? Of course. Yeah, I've heard of it.

I know who's here. Wow, thanks. Thanks for reading the room. No problem. Yeah. No, that's the thing. The oligarchs who control the media and who control all of our systems, they won't admit. They don't control Red Note though. Oh, wow.

So true, so true. Yeah. They're never going to admit that people are acknowledging the class divide and uniting on that because they thrive on the right and the left fighting like all this just like arbitrary and not, it's not all arbitrary because like, you know, people on the right want trans people to die and stuff like that. But so there, you know so there's certainly justified disagreements on the political side of the aisle, but we do need to unite from a class point of view. Then that's the revolution I'm talking about.

So I'll see you on what did we say? The corner of Pico and- Pete I'm going to do it again. Corey, there you go. I'll see you on the corner of Highland and Vine. Those run parallel to each other. I'll meet you at Schwab's drugstore. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'll see you there. All right. Let's take one more break and we'll be right back. 2025 is bound to be a fascinating year. It's going to be filled with money challenges and opportunities. I'm Joel. And I am Matt. And we're the hosts of How to Money. We want to be with you every step of the way in your financial journey this year,

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Listen to the Athletes First Family podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back and an RIP to David Lynch who passed away yesterday. He had emphysema was completely isolated in recent years, uh, so that he wouldn't get more sick, but there was still hopes that he might direct a project remotely. That, you know, not sure what he was working on at the end, but very, very sad news. He was a big smoker. Big smoker who I did like respect, you know, his statement about how much he loved smoking when he was like, I'm dying now because of smoking.

But, and then just like wrote a like paragraph long love letter to like smoke. Yeah, he sent us part of the art life. He was pulling smoke into his lungs and feeling it burn there. That lung feel. Yeah, he was like, I miss it. He said it was part of the art life. And I like that. I like that. I like the idea of an art life, you know, and also taking, you know, like, yeah,

like, we're all going to die. Like, you can do something that's bad for you if you enjoy it. Right. Yeah. And he certainly did. And just the story. Just like kids stop eating baby ham babies. Ham babies.

I can't. This is my fifth ham baby today. What's a ham baby? Is that like a ham globule? Is that like a baby that's in the, in the cake in the, in New Orleans? No, it's a ham. So you know how like when you go to the grocery store, if you want to get like ham cold cuts, you, they take a big, they take a big hunk of ham.

Yeah. They call that a ham baby. They call that a large ham baby. Not in my, not around what, no one I know. No, we, we just discovered that on yesterday. That's horrific. No one should call anything a ham baby. that on yesterday. That's horrific. No one should call anything a ham baby. And the boar's head line of like, you know, the conveyor belt of ham babies was getting clogged

because too many defective ham babies were getting like, pulled off the line. You want to know why more people don't listen to my podcast? Because the joke that just crossed my mind is the only thing that should be called a ham baby is when the parents met communicating on ham radio. And that's good stuff. Right. See what I'm saying? And that's why my podcast is only for certain people. Yeah.

The original sexting is, uh, sexual Congress over ham radio. Wearing over tube top. All right. Yeah. So I don't know. There's just like good stories about him also. Like people, I think like, I don't know.

Everybody knows who David Lynch is, right? He made Blue Velvet and Mulholland Drive. We talked about recently because it is the Moana too of great films in that it started as a TV show and then people were like, I don't know, nobody's going to watch this as a TV show. And so they edited it into like what is considered one of the best movies of the 21st century. Mulholland Drive.

Is that the one with the Mulholland drive. It's, it's not the one with, um, the, the, Naomi Watts. And it's the one, the dumpster in the back of the diner. Yeah. That's, and it has the street Mulholland drive in it as the title might suggest. What's the, what's the, you don't have to be that insulting. They should have called it the corner of Pico and La Brea. Thank you. Oh, man. So so that what's the movie with Robert,

the guy who may have murdered his wife, Robert Blake, Lost Highway. That one's good, too. Yeah. I love that one. So people see his movies and they're like, this guy must be fucked up. This guy must be like a real dark person. I just want to read this one interview for a reporter who visited the set of Blue Velvet, which was his movie that was really the mainstreaming

of the David Lynch aesthetic and super dark and fucked up. When it came out, a lot of people were like, reacted as if someone had committed a crime. I saw when I was 18, I had no idea what the hell it was. Yeah. I still hard to know exactly what it is, but it's a, you know, a work of art. That's what that is. One thing we can say. And not just because he smoked so many cigarettes making it.

one thing we can say. And not just because he smoked so many cigarettes making it. It's just unmistakably a vision of the country and of one person. So somebody shows up. It's a movie with like fucking like just some brutal, horrible things happening. Ears and dirt, you know, it opens with somebody's like severed ear and the dirt. And anyways, someone comes, they're like, all right, this guy's going to be real fucked up and found him riding around set on bicycles with streamers fluttering from the handlebars, his pockets full of peanut M&Ms. I like that detail. How whimsical.

I, pockets full of peanut M&Ms, like bordering on like, what are you doing? Those are going to melt and be, your hands must be like covered in like different colors, candy coating all the time, unless he just has the least sweaty hands of all time. Also, he's going to make himself sick. Am I right? The reporter said, David is a genuinely happy person. And this is one of the remarkable things about him. I've never met anyone as serene as he is.

Uh, he was also a lifelong devotee to transcendental meditation. Right. So I don't know, Caitlin, you're a film person. What are you? Are you a lynch? I have a master's degree. You are a film master. Are you a Lynch? Well, excuse me. I have a master's degree. You are a film master. I'm sorry. I don't like to mention it.

At the risk of us are film people, you are a film master. I'm kind of a master. Are you a fan of Lynch? I would say I'm not a fan. In fact, I tweeted something to this effect a few years ago and absolutely got destroyed on the internet. But I don't regret it because I stand by what I said. But I mean, I like Twin Peaks.

I haven't seen the more recent season that like, you know, when they kind of revitalized it. But I liked the original series and I enjoyed Elephant Man, because he directed that too, right? That was his one mainstream. I like his more normy stuff and that just speaks to my taste, I guess. Because I don't know what the fuck Mulholland Drive is about. I've seen it many times and I just get frustrated because I'm like, I'm not smart enough for this.

But then I'm also like, well, maybe the filmmaker is not smart enough. Maybe you should tell a fucking story. So I'm dunking on David Lynch even post-Moran. But either stuff of his I liked. I'm sure I didn't finish his Dune, but it seemed wacky and fun. So I might go back and watch it, IDK.

Yeah, I think also I would imagine as a woman would probably be sick of hearing about David Lynch from dudes. Well, that's what my tweet was about. I was like, I'm really, I really resent. It was something like, I resent, um, like all the, I don't know if I like made it gender specific and said like all the men or just like all the people who, uh, spent years trying to convince me that David Lynch was any good. So it was like a really bitchy tweet, I'll admit it.

But- Listen, yeah. But- I'll tell you, this guy happens to men too. Like a certain type of man will confront you and be like, have you seen the latest Lynch? And you're like, ah.

I shall not name names, but there was a man comedian who, who I know who like got furious with me to the point where he was like yelling at me because I was like, yeah, I'm not that big of a David Lynch fan. And he got so like viscerally angry about that. Yeah. And so I'm like, okay, calm down everybody. But I'm sure he was a very nice person. And I love the image of him riding around on a bicycle with streamers from the handlebars and the M&Ms in his pockets.

That's beautiful. Yeah. And his documentary about the documentary about him, where they're showing him like booking, like there's one where he's making phone calls and he gets like, um, some celebrity to be in his movie. and he's like, yes, yes. Like he's like, he's like a star-struck too. Yeah. Like he, he, there was a lot of charming things about him. But yeah, I definitely have been cornered at parties and like grilled about David Lynch by like dudes who were trying to prove they were smart. And it's annoying. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That is annoying. That does happen. I told one guy I watched the new, I remember I was at this party.

It was kind of like a fancier party that I would usually be invited to in Los Angeles. And there was a guy who was a director. Like that's what people were saying he was, but I don't know what he directed. But he, you know, he certainly wasn't like a director I'd ever heard of. But he was like, had a bunch of tattoos, you know, and he was just like, have you seen the new Twin Peaks? And it had just come out. And I was like, yes, I have. And he was like, you saw it?

He's like the whole thing. I was like, he's like the whole thing, because he had seen the whole thing, you know, but he was like, he thought he'd gotten the jump on, I guess, humanity. And I was like, yes. Yeah, humanity. And I was like, yeah, yes. And he just like, didn't want to talk to me anymore because I think he knew I was lying. Right. He should have. Yeah.

I thought it was all right. I did eventually watch that, but I did had not then, and I just did not want to get into what was going to happen. If I said no, I hadn't seen it. Yeah. That's amazing. I just couldn't even imagine what would happen next. Well, Chris, it's wonderful having you as always on the daily zeitgeist.

Where can people find you, follow you, hear you, all that good stuff? Well, I've got a couple of good things to promote. The audio book's not out, but I was just going to say I get, I have a pretty good deal with Vanderbilt University with that thing. So if people buy it, I get kind of a good chunk of it as opposed to the book, which I don't get a good chunk of. But um, the audio book, oh my god, if people knew how much money you make off of a book. Holy God, holy hell. Anyway, I am, I'm gonna be in Chicago this coming week on Wednesday at a studio in. You can look on my it's like a secret show in like someone's music studio.

But they have regular shows there. It's like a 36 seat place. And I'm doing a show with Kristen to me. I'm going to read my book, like probably to stand up and then play a couple of songs. And that's Wednesday in Logan Square area. And you can get the specifics from my Instagram at the Crofton show.

And then Friday, I'm gonna be doing a set at the Lincoln Lodge Friday 8 p.m. show, which is supposed to be a really fantastic show up there. And just to shout out to Kristen Toomey, who is kind of like helping me out with all this. And she's, you guys will, if I mentioned her before, she would be such a great fit for daily zeitgeist, you guys would love her and she's huge. And in Chicago, she's just like, I don't know.

I'm totally intimidated. She's going to kick my ass. No, I already told her, she's like, it's not a competition. I'm like, oh yeah, it is. Great. Is there a work of media that you've been enjoying? Oh, I forgot to do that one. Can you guys go first? I always forget to do that one.

That's good. Caitlin, where can people find you? Is there a work of media you've been enjoying? You can find me, follow me on Instagram at Caitlin Durante. You can go to my website. There's information about, um, what's it called? The classes I teach. Sorry, my brain.

Kaitlin University. You're witnessing its collapse in real time. Thank you. Kaitlin University, where you can take my screenwriting classes. Oh, there are live Bechtelcast shows coming up. There was one in LA on January 19th that we have pushed back because of safety concerns, because of the fire and the air quality. So that is rescheduled for March 2nd.

And that is not only a live show in LA at Dynasty Typewriter on March 2nd at 730, but it's also being live streamed. So if you live anywhere in the world, you can still catch it if you buy a live stream ticket. So that's that one. And then our other shows are still happening as planned. One in San Francisco for SketchFest on January 23rd. That's a show on Titanic, of course. Of course. On Titanic by Titanic. Yes.

Yeah, with Titanic for Titanic. Yes, of course. Precisely. I have announced that if that show sells out, I will get naked so that Jamie can draw me like one of her French girls. Hint, it's not very close to selling out, so I really need, well, it's not that I want to get naked on stage, but I will do it just for the laugh

and for the story. But what I really want is for people to... For the drawing. Jamie's a great artist. And then I'll auction it off and, you off and donate the money to a good cause. But what was I going to say? Buy a ticket to the show, please, is the point. And then finally, we have a show in Portland on January 26, and that is a show on Shrek.

I will not be getting naked during the Shrek show. That's cool. That is fair. I got my, I got a work of media just real quick. Please, because I don't have one. It's just somebody from Donald Boat. Donald Boat? At laser boat 999.

Me, the main problem is I think I'm Eric Cartman. Therapist, let's examine this. Me. I mean, I just feel like Eric Cartman in this bitch sometimes. Therapist. I'd like to pry into this for just a moment. Me. Like I walk into rooms and I think, damn, I'm stepping like Eric Cartman.

That's it. That's it. Seems like a real exchange. I love it. Work of social media I've been enjoying is from, there's a clip from Carly Leopard, L-E-C-A-R-L-Y, L-E-P-A-R-D, of somebody just being like a real debonair person in a hot tub I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, found their soulmate and it is this person, but that's right up the street. Pigeon Forge. Yeah. There you go. Like, uh, it's like a place you can buy, like, you know, it's like a tourist.

It's like a Gatlinburg where Dollywood is. But, uh, one, I forgot, I have a show Sunday too, in, uh, in, um, Kirksville, Missouri at a order at a order, which is some kind of performance space and they, a zeit gang people asked me if I wanted to do a show up there. So that's what I'm doing on the white. Amazing. Yeah. Cool. Oh yeah.

Enjoy that. Missouri. I'm excited. Put that in your pipe and smoke it Missouri. I mean, I'm like, don't look at the map before I say yes to things though. It's like seven and a half hours away. Yeah. Yeah.

America's so big. And I have nothing in between, you know, I've no, no, no halfway point show or anything. I'm just like, yeah, I'll do it. How far can Missouri be? I've been enjoying a work of media. I've been enjoying Harrison wine. Reb tweeted, tell me again, how having an entire room dedicated to pissing and shitting is more practical than a diaper.

Wow. True. Okay. Surprisingly good. If you're so, if you're so smart, when you explain that to me, you can find me on Twitter at Jack underscore O'Brien and on bluesky at Jack OB the number one. You can find us on Twitter at Daily Zeitgeist. We're at the Daily Zeitgeist on Instagram. We have a Facebook fan page and a website dailyzeitzeitgeist.com, where we post our episodes

and our footnotes. We also do the footnotes in the episode description of wherever you're listening to this. You can just look at it and you can see the links to the sources. And we also, in that area, we link off to the sources of the information we talked about. We also link off to a song that we think you might enjoy. Miles is out, but Super Producer Justin, really good at this. Is there a song that you think people might enjoy? Yeah.

So there's this group I've really been digging called Secret Night Gang out of Manchester, UK, and they like to mix American R&B, soul, and fuse that with jazz and some gospel elements. And it's just a great composition of things coming together, great musicianship. And this track starts off with smooth and relaxed elements and then builds into this absolute rock jam and then recedes back into smooth jazz again. And it's called The Sun. And you can find this song in the footnotes that again is Secret Night Gang. Secret Night Gang. Cool.

The song is called The Sun. Yeah. A lot of their songs are about the daytime in the sun. And then they actually met during like a music class. And secretly they started like making their recordings at night. Yeah. And they started writing songs about, you know, the daytime and the sun and stuff and it's pretty cool. That's awesome.

All right. Well, we will link off to that in the footnotes. The Daily Zeitgeist production of iHeartRadio for more podcasts from iHeartRadio. Visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. That's going to do it for us this week. We are back on Monday to tell you what is trending, what trended, what happened over the weekend. And we also have an episode that recaps, cuts together some of the highlights from this week that drops tomorrow. So you can check all that stuff out.

We hope you have a great weekend. Thanks again, everybody, for reaching out supporting miles and his family. He I think is going to be back fairly soon. But yeah, appreciate all of the support and love coming from the listeners and we will talk to you all on Monday. Bye so much. Bye. Thanks so much. Bye. Joel, the holidays are a blast, but the financial hangover, that can be a huge bummer.

If you are out there and you're dreading the new statement email that reveals the massive balance that you may have racked up, well, you could use our help. That's right. I'm Joel. And I am Matt. And we're from the How to Money podcast. Our show is all about helping you make sense of your personal Finances so you can ditch your pesky credit card debt once and for all make real progress on other

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