The Daily Zeitgeist - Icons #4: Arnold Schwarzenegger w/ Jon Gabrus

Episode Date: December 8, 2025

Hello, The Internet!™, and welcome to this spinoff episode of The Daily Zeitgeist we’re calling The Iconograph: a show about icons. In this episode, Miles and Jack are joined by comedian/podcaster Jon Gabrus to talk about the cybernetic organism (correction: body builder) sent from the future (correction: Austria) to take the world by storm: Arnold Schwarzenegger! They'll explore his rise to stardom, his STAGGERING horniness and why he snapped Barbara Bush's leg like a toothpick!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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hello the internet and welcome to this iconograph episode of durnaley zeitgeist oh yeah he's horny to that also the noise you make when you're horny uh instead of instead of looking at the zeit guys through current events once a week we're looking at the zeit guys through the lens of the powerful pop cultural horrockses that are our icons, Einstein, Erkel, Miss Piggy so far. We use these characters and celebrities to create meaning to build identity to create the greatest soundboard in the history of mankind. Stop whining!

I'm a cop, you idiot. I hope you leave enough room for my face because I'm going to ram it in your stomach. To learn what a normal male human body is supposed to look like was an early lesson I took from our subject today. But most importantly, we learned that sometimes a Polish-American small-town sheriff named Mark Kaminsky has a thick Austrian accent, and you don't need to worry about why. That's just how it is. That's right. Episode four, we're talking to Arnold Schwarzenegger, the Austrian oak, a man who took over the film industry and pop culture for two decades became the governor of the largest state in the United States.

And in the process, snapped Barbara Bush's leg like a twig, something I've learned. the course of researching this episode. A shout out to J.M. McNabb, who provided the research dossier on this one. Speaking of the research dossier, stick around for the end of the episode for my no, no, no, no, notebook dump where I give you my final thoughts and little information nuggets I didn't get to in this conversation. I'm thrilled to be joined as always by my co-host, Mr. Miles Gray. Oh, man.

It's just me, man. This is me. Nothing else. Nothing to see here. In our third seat, one of the greatest. comedians, improvisers and podcasters

in the business. He co-hosts one of my favorite podcast, Action Boys on Patreon, which makes him one of our

foremost Schwarzenegger scholars. It's John Gabras! When I am on the daily zeitgeist

is like I am coming all day. Like I'm coming. When you're saying my name, I am coming. When I'm doing my plugs, I am coming.

Can you believe how much I'm in heaven? Lou, did you hear? I'm on Daily Zite. guys see with you them coming um i went to high school of luferigno junior whoa and we would always say that to him yeah was it when when you were with him were you sometimes you know i i'd imagine it wasn't too hard for you to give him the wrong advices yeah that's one of my favorite underrated quotes shout out to my friend sean uh who would always talk about the part where he's like uh yeah

sometimes i on workout day i give him advice and it's not too wrong to give him the wrong advice and he says it's so like he's so fucking clever but he's saying advices I do just want to acknowledge up top because with all these icons they're like such a part of our brains they're burned in there we kind of just take it for granted that they've always been there

but just with Arnold I want to acknowledge he entered a late 70s movie landscape that was coming off of like the autore movement and was ruled by actors like Robert De Niro, Al Pacino, Dustin Hoffman, who are like these normal sized to tiny men who were method actors and like disappear into their roles. And he came along and just like does the complete opposite. His roles

disappear into him. He's the only actor I can remember who used the same catchphrase in multiple movies. That's actually something Gabris I wanted to ask like is was did any of the other action heroes like keep bringing back like he said I'll be back in so many different and then they get to a point Arnold understands where his bread is buttered like he'll just go on late night talk shows and say like I'll be back and like you're terminated he'll say like what he knows what to do he's not precious about what he says and you got to imagine if you're like the writer or director of these other movies and he's like taking your iconic line

you're like I guess it belongs to Arnold now and he's just saying whatever the fuck he wants yeah yeah the brand was strong with him I also think it has to do with who like obviously it's who he was he's like this outsized charismatic

cartoon of masculinity but also like where America was at the time one of my favorite details of his movies that you guys underline a lot in action boys is that he always made the most sense in a mall, which was like the most American location of the

era. But like he fights in malls in like raw deal, commando a terminator to jingle all the way is like nonstop. That kindergarten cop opens in a mall true lies has a horse chase through them all. Into the Bonaventure Hotel. Yes. You know, he is such a

weird, unique figure, but also like as I was researching this, I kept being reminded of the Volubowski quote, like sometimes there's a man. you know who's the man for his time and like he really was he was so foreign and then became like landed in America he was so foreign in the way he looked

and the way he sounded and even like his hobbies and perspective and then he fucking got America on board with him yeah 100 you know like he there's no fucking way you would still have an accent in year 50 in America if you actually tried, you wouldn't need it. But no, he kept it.

We adapted for Arnold. We changed movies so that Arnold had a place in them. We were like, yeah, Arnold can't play Serpico, but he can fucking play Conan. You know what I mean? Like, he changed culture to make, like, to set it up. Or we changed culture because we were like, we love this fucking save us, Ross Ubermensch.

You know, like, yeah, I do. there are definitely some like fascist vibes that uh people people have pointed out throughout his career um and it's coming along at a time in america where like jimmy carter had made the like american malays speech and everyone's like fuck that that's boring and then ronald regan was the answer to that so his career like kind of starts to make sense in that context but just on the subject of fascism uh something i hadn't realized is that his dad was a Nazi soldier during World War II was like part of the invasion of Leningrad which he made it out

yeah and for for Miles's first time playing the role of Arnold I just I put a quote in the oh wow in the chat that I just want to have you read this is Arnold describing his father's

status as a Nazi soldier when my father arrived in Leningrad he was all pumped up on the lies of his government he was being a Nazi as being pumped up he still gets to jam his brand in there yeah

he's like I'm talking about the dark history in which I come from I will say like you know me I'm going to always apologize for Nazis but yeah that's the other reason we wanted to have you on here other perspective

But I really like Arnold talks about it. He says like and he was he was wrong and it was awful and like all this shit. And like it is that crazy thing where you're like, what can we hold the sins of the father to the child? And it's like he got the fuck out of there and he, you know, and he talks about it. He brings it up and he talks about in his book and in like recent posts during as the world is falling apart. he's talked about like what the people were like before and after joining up with the movement and they're like people are fucked up from having been part of you know what I mean it's right right right he's like guys everyone out here who's like yes let's fucking you know kick Somalians out of Minnesota it's gonna be bad for you eventually yeah right like this is like this that you this doesn't bode well for anybody it's not like yeah it's not like saying I used to be the construction worker in the village people right like I mean, sure. Thanks. So stick around psychologically a little bit more. So what one thing, like, yes, he has spoken on that. There were a lot of allegations of Nazism throughout his career. Dino de Laurentis didn't want to hire him for Conan telling director John Milius. I don't like Schwarzenegger. He's a Nazi. And then U.S. News of the World Tabloid once claimed he was secretly pro-Nazi. The writer of that article then admitted the source was Sylvester Staliener.

alone, which we're going to get into how he did and, like, childish that rivalry was. Holy shit. The one thing is that he did say in an old interview that he admired Hitler, but then he did the thing that all people who say that did. He said, I didn't admire him for what he did with it. I admired his public speaking, which these Republican guys, like, can't help but at my, like, I look back and I see a raiding. I can probably rip out of like

10 or 12 good public speakers before I have to get to like, the leader of the Nazi movement. The architect of the Holocaust, I could probably find a couple of people before that, that before I look back and I see a raving lunatic and they're always like, I mean, you can't deny the guys, the fucking star.

Right. I don't, I don't think so. I think you act to the fucking gills with the absolute worst POV and people are like, you know, you say, but, you know, but you gotta admit he was good i'm like i think i would i would name miss teen south carolina from 2007

as a better public speaker before i said hitler i'm about fucking johnny carson like you know like there's gotta be it's got to be a less harmful guy to look to for public speaking although there is uh like these really crazy behind the scene photos of hitler like hitting his poses hitting his angles and like

he was a studied like poser essentially like and so maybe that's that's what arnold uh saw in him at that early age i will just say oh you're right arnold also an elite level poser like he literally made his uh he was a champion poser yeah we're about to get into that but i will just say in terms of like the fascist iconography like he is like a marble statue come to life and like he like we've talked before about how like one of the aesthetic like detail of fascism is like admiring the human form with like the sex removed like in Starship Troopers and like I do feel like that's kind of like they had to edit out like sex scenes and stuff like that from a lot of his movies because like he just doesn't that's not what people

were there for I guess yeah well it is that weird like bodybuilder thing where it's like it's it's four guys in a way you know what I mean more than it is but I always found it really funny in all his movies when women are like, oh my God, and he's so sexy, but he looks like an insane freak. He's got an insane body, and if that's the thing you like, but when women are like,

oh, dear God, it's like he has de cups that are rock hard. I don't know how you're into that. Where is he had in his cycle? But it is weird because, yeah, there is like that in like that fascist, like, it's like he's powerful, his output is tremendous and no, no

connotations of sex, but hit Arnold himself legendary horny freak. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like problematically. Yes, yes, very problematic. The Brazil video is the most any human has ever inhabited the role of Lenny from of mice and men. Like, it's just like, Jesus, get that guy.

Get all of those people out of there. But in terms of like the fascist element of his iconography and like how he appeared two people at the time, the other main. besides action boys that I've dug into for this was the book The Last Action Heroes And they pointed out that the opening to Commando with him like chopping down trees

And carrying an entire tree trunk on his shoulders Like that whole sequence was Consciously pulling images From Lenny Riefenstahl's like Nazi propaganda films They were just like you know what would work really well with this guy Oh man Just size this guy up really yeah yeah I don't think that was his idea.

They were just like, that, that makes sense. And that is what America, like America has, inside America, it's much less appreciated, like how much right-wing American culture has in common with a lot of, like, you know, fascist imagery and ideology. Yeah. For some reason. That's something where I'll tell you, one of my theories is somehow, we talk about this lot on Action Boys.

I was raised pretty much exclusively on movies that are spout like extrajudicial killings the government powerful people are the answer to everything Send one guy into this Yeah you want a cop is the best job You do internal affairs or pieces of shit Send one guy with a gun into a country full of minorities and fix it

You know like yeah To be a 15 year old kid with an opinion on internal affairs Just means like I'm watching the wrong fucking movies Yeah I managed to escape with a perspective that you know cares about my fellow man but i'm assuming all these people in power all grew up on the same bullshit as me but didn't find it as entertainment and found it as like inspo and we're like actually we do need a john matrix yeah to go to valverde and clean it up with a fucking

bazooka with a four quad bazook um so the way he initially appeared on the world stage uh was by winning 19 bodybuilding competitions including mr europe mr universe and then mr olympia Mr. Olympia being essentially the Jeopardy Tournament of Champions for Mr. Universe winners. But he did and like openly admits that he built his body with the aid of steroids. He says I have no regrets about it because at the time it was

something new that came on the market. He wasn't the only guy at these bodybuilding shows doing it. Yeah, exactly. It was legal. Like everybody was doing it openly. It was like cocaine. You know, in the 70s everyone was like, this is kind of like coffee. This is like our new coffee.

We should bring this on to more movie sets. But this one also makes me go to the bathroom a lot, too. Same deal, yeah. He did veto, like when he was governor, there were people who were not thrilled that he was pretty lax on the performance enhancing stuff and called the supplement safe. And I have to, like, I don't know, so I once heard from someone that, like, they worked with him in the 90s and swore, like, at the time he was like bright yellow.

and on dialysis, like, when he was with them and, like, that they were just like, yeah, that's how you got through the, like, intense steroid cycles. There's no known reporting on that. And the guy also later told me that he thought his girlfriend at the time may have slept with Arnold, uh, behind his back. So he might be motivated to shit off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But he has had like multiple open heart surgeries, which he always goes out of his way to be like,

it's a congenital condition. but I don't know that steroids are not and yes he has done them but if you remove steroids from it carrying around that much extra mass even if it is pure muscle is difficult on the human body

like maintaining that caloric input he's putting a lot of miles on his body I mean I knew like big guys don't live that long but when I saw Dave Batista be like dude I have to stop and like really be like I'm done and watching him shrink and being like,

no, it's so I can live. Like being fucking jacked is, it's a fucking very, very short timeline you have living like that forever. I mean, it is interesting, just like talking about the thing that like earlier we were saying that like he comes along with this Ubermensch physicality

at a time that America is like, maybe fascism is kind of what we do in the 80s. And then like once we got back to that point, like in the past eight to 10 years, all of a sudden, actors started looking like John Sina and the Rock and Dave Bautista again. So everyone started. Oh, yeah.

I could go off for hours about this, but like, why, why, why does fucking Superman even have to be jacked? He's an alien. Like, like, there's like, Hulk has super strength. He could have a belly. Like, Thor, some of the people, like, their superpowers aren't even involved, like, with physicality and they're still shredded. It's like, man doesn't need to be diced.

Yeah. maybe the best example of that which we'll get to in a moment is the Terminator who went in the script was supposed to be

a normal sized normal shape of person supposed to blend into yeah the idea it's like yeah to your point like the modern equivalent

is that movie the gray man that nobody saw but it costs like 250 million dollars so they had to pretend like everyone saw it but it's like

these are guys who just the literal title is you have these spies who are gray men who the whole point is like they blend in wherever they go and it's played by like Chris Evans and Ryan Gosling and they're both like shredded beautiful people who like would stop traffic and when you see pictures of real fucking the crazy spies and assassins like that are CIA and Jay Sock like elite level guys they all look like chemists they're all like five eight 165 with like glasses and like weird teeth. And you're like, who the fuck is this guy?

He's like, 650 confirmed kills. Yeah. What the fuck? I'm a Delta operator. Like, no airline? No. One other quick Arnold anecdote. And if you guys have any, but somebody I know was golfing with him a couple

years ago. And as they were teeing off, he kept telling the guy he looked like two tents and too uptight. And then after the guy hit the shot, he Arnold got up to the tea and was like when was the last time you had a blow job and the guy was like I don't know like answered and

Arnold teed off and said that's fantastic and then as he like crushed his drive with a big stogie in his mouth and like watched his ball he said how did it taste so awesome got his ass I do think the posing

like you were saying the hitting the angles like that is something that he studied all along and I think that definitely like played into his being a movie. His subtle performances. Yeah. He's like knowing how to appear on film was something that like he was always good at. Like in Conan you see it a lot because it's like

it's like pre-verbal for him and the movie is like written to that strength. But then he also trained with a sword master for that movie too and because he's an athlete and like a guy who's got like that kind of folk that kind of focus that requires eating white rice, chicken, and broccoli and steroids exclusively.

He fucking looks awesome when he's swinging the sword, when he's carrying the wheel of pain. He fucking, and it's like, he knows. I referred to this once on the blank check podcast, but my pet theory is, we've heard of the male gaze and, you know, people talk about the female gaze. There's something about Arnold that is the

child gaze. Like, you look at him and you're like in awe and you're like a little kid, you're like, that's what grownups are, you know? And then all these action movies, they'll copy it. They'll all be these poses where you're looking up

at these imposing figures and their figure than ever. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's exactly right. Like I have, yeah,

I have written in here somewhere that he looks like he was designed by a seven year old to be like, this is what a action hero should look like. Yeah. This is what I want to look like when I grow up, like when you used to draw. Like I would remember being a kid drawing myself as like a grownup

and like I would always have like a headband and a machine gun. I was like, movies broke my brain. I'm going to I'm going to definitely grow up and be a special forces, probably. Yeah. I'm going to drive a bulletproof Chevy Suburban. So he broke into the world of film with Hercules in New York

where he had to be totally dubbed by another actor for obvious reasons. They changed his name to Arnold Strong. But the only reason he got that role in the first place was Joe Weeter, the co-founder of the International Federation of Bodybuilders, told the producers

that Schwarzenegger had been a Shakespeare Experian actor in Vienna. And they're like, all right, like, sure. And then he showed up. And again, it's like, you know, you need to tell that lie to get him in the door. But then he shows up and everyone's like, this guy actually like really fucking works on film. I don't know what it is. The movie is not great.

His dub is weird. But he, you're watching him and you're like, this dude's a fucking star. There's not a time where you don't say that early on in his career. It's like undeniable. Like, you can't take your eyes off him. and he is really charismatic in sort of like the annoying jock way but like he's got it

like he's got it all taste yeah exactly you know he's got it all figured out yeah he also appears in like I didn't realize that I was watching the long goodbye Robert Altman yes the long goodbye he shows how he's like a Jack Trenchman in that he's in a movie called Stay Hungry

that was like an Oscar Buzzy movie that earned him a Golden Globe for Best Acting debut even though it wasn't really his debut but it was like the first time that awards people had noticed it or he spoke maybe yeah it was the first time he had actually spoken on film um he also at this time worked with a very serious acting coach who in the book the last action heroes talks about how he was like eventually very impressed with his work um he did like all the stanislavski and shit like this is the second invocation of the stanislavski method with erkel yeah no with miss piggy actually like how uh guys came up with her backstory was like just writing freehand dark backstory dark backstory yeah super dark backstory for miss piggy um you got to i believe it i got to imagine based on how how powerful she's become dude came from a lot she came from a hard it's like her mom had so many pigs

what was it like her mom like her mother had so many peglets that she never developed her mind was one of the things and then she had so many pigs she'd never developed her mind and her dad was like fucking around and then like the only way for her to like survive was like winning beauty contests um and she was like i'll never go back there i think there was like a mass killing too in there but i don't remember um but uh he said the guy the acting coach specifically like called out two impressive moments in the workshop that i thought were funny one is where he inhabits the body of a child opening a present on christmas morning and he said he made the other people in the acting class cry.

Whoa. Just trying to picture Arnold, like doing that. This is 100% alive, but it's fucking, that's odd. I'm picturing it now and trying, so I'm like, tear up laughing. I know. I'm even trying to imagine what would that performance look like where I'm so touched, like, without even it being Arnold, with an adult doing this. Yeah.

Like, what would they be doing? This guy who's just been, like, presumably, like, hitting on every woman nonstop. And this guy is suddenly. spaghetti string racerback tank top on with like his nipples and trap showing and he's got like cut off Gold's Jim super shorts on barefoot just going like

I don't want the booster I want terrible man You got me another empty bottle of wine He gets it something he would do in like twins And like some of those movies where he like plays an innocent You know He's just kind of like Yeah I don't know like new to the world

And then the other that he said was like really impressive was where he, like, did this non-linguistic growl and utterant, like, you invoke an animalistic, non-linguistic growl and utterance and screams, which sounds like it's like the, when I think of Arnold, I just think of, uh, uh, yeah, you know, like all those like noises that he made. Yeah, and that's so funny that he crushed that part of the acting. Yeah, like, damn, this guy can. And he also really did great.

them. In the max bench press portion of the He smoked at 700 pounds. But he does also kind of become a Christmas icon and it's interesting to note that like the only movie he ever directed he directed an episode of the Tales from the Crypt

and then also a made for TV like Hallmark Christmas remake of Christmas in Connecticut. So he's there's something with Christmas there that we'll probably never get to explore. I feel like Germany, Europe, Poland, Eastern Europe, Vienna, like, that's Austria. It's very, like, Christmas. Yeah, it's like everyone says like the Christmas markets in Austria specifically

are like everyone models like whenever you see like a Christmas market. They're all referencing like Austrian, German Christmas markets. And some of your most precious white female friends will tell you that I just want to go to Vienna for Christmas. I'm like, really? Like, I don't know anything about it. I want to go to Mexico. Dude, it's wild because my cousin just married someone who's from Austria, and he'd been, he's like, dude, Austria is fucking sick. And everyone I know who's been there's like, dude, Vienn is fucking sick. Yeah, it's got to be.

Well, yeah, I think it's because like the buildings are so old. How bad did it be? Shout out twins real quick. That was the, I heard in an interview on Nerdist where he was back in the day. That's the most amount of money he's ever made on a movie. Yeah, that like set him up financially for, because of the syndication. decades. No, because they didn't want to make it because

Arnold can't carry a comedy. So Arnold, Danny DeVito, and I think it's Reitman, they all worked for scale with huge amount of points. And then the movie was an absolute massive hit. Massive hit. And they all made

insane money on it, which makes me so happy. Also, Arnold was already doing very well for himself because when he arrived in America, him and Franco Colombo, bodybuilder. They were doing masonry work and doing all this like labor, but he invested his bodybuilding winnings in like an apartment complex first, like somewhere on the west side of L.A. So American. He was a so American. Someone told like an American businessman, maybe someone in his

team or something like that said, this is what you got to do. And then he like owned a bunch of properties for a while. Like buying that in 1970s, L.A., you know, if you held onto it until now, you're fucking like robber baron. That makes sense. You know that like there's a clip from a couple years ago where he tried to make a joke about making a million dollars that fell so flat like on a radio show. And now it makes sense to me because he was he was making some landlord-ass money like to start up. I don't know if you've seen this clip, but he's like, well that. Easiest way to make money.

The first, the most important thing is, you know, everyone tells you that the first million is the hardest to make. So start with the second million. right uh-huh wow hello wake up wake up

I thought we have a breakfast show here you need to get pumped up anytime the joke falls well get pumped up off the lies of your government wow okay anyway that's because that's such rich guy humor too

when you're like it's not an awful joke I would say if you're hosting Arnold on your show you got to laugh at his jokes I think the job. I bet you Arnold never does that show again. I think they probably just couldn't connect

like his delivery. They're like, oh, humor joke. Yes, thank you. Miles didn't pause that in the middle. That silence was him just looking at them waiting for them. And you're like, oh, it must the video must be over. Then he goes, hello? And you're like, oh, my God.

Well, this is a breakfast show. You guys wake up. If a Lenovo gaming computer is on your holiday list, don't shop around. Just go directly to the source, Lenovo.com. It's your last chance to score exclusive deals on the gaming PCs you want, like the Lenovo Legion Tower 5 Gen 10 gaming desktop and Lenovo Lock Gaming Laptop. So avoid all that shopping, chaos, and price comparing, and just go directly to the source, Lenovo.com, where PCs are up to 35% off.

That's Lenovo.com. I'm Stefan Curry, and this is Gentleman's Cut. I think what makes Gentleman's Cut different is me being a part of developing the profile of this beautiful finished product. With every sip, you get a little something different. Visit Gentleman's Cut Bourbon.com or your nearest Total Wines or Bevmo. This message is intended for audiences 21 and older. Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, Boone County, Kentucky. For more on Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, please visit Gentleman's Cut Bourbon.

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But just overall, like the thing about him investing the money smartly, like, according to everyone, he is a sponge who's like, constantly focused on learning like McTiernan in Predator like cast Carl Weathers because he's like that's the best action movie actor that I've seen and he's like I'm going to put him in Arnold's way and Arnold will just like drink up and learn from him and so he is essentially like the he is a Terminator he's just this like super processing computer yeah fuck you asshole um Dylan you son of a bitch what they got to put your pencils down there in the CIA and thank you for teaching me how to act.

All of that, all of the early work, though, from Hercules in New York and his background work, was overshadowed by the massive success of a weightlifting documentary called Pumping Iron. God damn. It's easy to see why those movies weren't quite as successful because at no point in those movies does he get to say that weightlifting is like coming.

And then Miles would like to... read uh what do you have you oh wow it's a satisfying to me is coming is you know as having sex with a woman then coming i love that he follows up the first sentence by clarifying what he's not even i refuse to say it's jerking off yeah yeah i don't it's gay to jerk off i'm like human woman and you coming and so can you believe how much i'm in heaven i am like getting the feeling of coming in the gym i'm getting the feeling of coming at home i'm getting the feeling of coming of coming backstage when I pump up when I pose in front of 5,000

people I get the same feeling so I'm coming day and night I mean it's terrific right so you know I'm in heaven so awesome and he will later retract that and say like I was joking I knew I and I will

I think he maybe actually believes this or believed it at the time but he also does know how to get sound bites and how to fucking when you watch pumping iron it's a rosetta stone to like why anyone like why he's you just see he's so and he didn't play a villain a lot in his career but he is fucking nearly evil in pumping iron like he's

like mustache twirling bad guy in a way like manipulating the people around him who are like his best friend like lifelong best friends who are going to continue working and like being his friend for the rest of his career and he's like yeah kind of fucked with his head yeah into being worse than me. Right. There's the famous, if it bleeds, the making of Predator. It's like an hour-long featurette.

You can find it on YouTube. He had some crazy ongoing prank or a competition with Jesse the body, Ventura, who could have bigger biceps. And he had the wardrobe department keep taking in the biceps on the sleeves on Ventura's shirt. So he thought he was getting pumped up.

But he wasn't. Oh, to make him complacent, basically? Yes. And then they were doing, they were doing a thing where, They were competing so much and who could work out more and earlier that eventually, like, they were, like, secretly opening the gym that they had shipped to South America to film, like, or in Mexico, wherever they, I forget where they filmed. And they're, like, fucking, like, going in at 3.30 in the morning, 3 in the morning, 2.30, like, racing to see who when you go to the gym, who's already there working out. It's like, that's so fucking funny.

That's, like, childish behavior over, like, and these are all people who are, like, making millions. It's so awesome. Right. that's so funny yeah that that set and i mean that movie is both like when i first saw it this did not hit me but it is like a satire of masculinity and like they're you know shooting at this alien and like completely you know unloading clips into the jungle and like just impotently you know yeah and they're all like they're all like dry shaving their face uh taking their shirts off knives

their limp-dict f slurs before and then like you know like everything everything about

that movie and also arguably like sort of anti American interventionism too right

it's like who we arrive there they end up like they're like hunting with an alien but they the CIA does get

them to like blow up a fucking full base full of locals like there's no explanation as to like

what the local dynamics are or whatever and it's like it's such a it's a more there's so much more going on in that movie than you think like and then the idea that like this is the second team that they send in and the first team just got fucking murked and none of them know about that it's like the most fucking disposable american soldier shit ever yeah yeah it is almost like they were they're making a commentary that going in and intervening in a jungle could go badly for america yeah i don't know where they were i don't know where they were pulling that from all right so his first truly iconic role is conan like he's the titular role in conan I love this fucking movie so much came about thanks to pumping iron

the director John Milius says that Arnold said treat me like a trained dog which again going back to it he's just like I don't give a phone just tell me anything and I'll do it he would like get cut and like there would be like he'd be bleeding

and he'd be like does it look good how am I posing and then they would just like keep rolling with it moving along with the like fascist stuff. It's about an alpha male who battles hippies essentially. The script was by Oliver Stone, but then it was like whittled way down and directed by Millius. Who calls himself a Zen fascist?

Zen fascist. Arnold said he's so far to the right that he wasn't even a Republican a.k. ahead of his time, I guess. So this becomes like one of his first roles that's so iconic that people just start calling him that. Like when you read about when Cameron's trying to cast him in Terminator, people are like

you're going to cast Conan in Terminator. And then like after Terminator, people are like, you can't put Terminator in the you know, but like he's choosing his roles pretty wisely. If you zoom out, yeah, if you zoom out and see that this guy who is

this physical specimen but is not quite there English-wise or acting-wise, you cast him as a nearly silent tribal warrior who fucking kills a bunch of people with swords

and then you're like okay what else can he do he's like how about a robot robot yeah fucking great like just the idea of like

what a way to like fucking make your way into the huge movies that were huge because of him too and but he gets to just they're like okay and this

like that'd be like all right in this you're playing a fat New York podcaster Gabor is this your first job like I hope you can pull it off you're like fuck yeah you're from long island

okay I think I can do this which exit off the LIE though 25 south perfect all right I love it it's actually two away from mine so we're gonna need to rewrite but so Cameron didn't originally have Arnold at mine for the Terminator as we were saying he wanted Lance Henriksen for the role uh who played Bishop which is like it's such a profoundly different movie but like it makes more sense on paper because yeah why would the robot need to be shredded and have an Austrian accent if it'd be enormous and like he would

not blend at all he can all and like it makes no sense yeah but it fucking works I know I was gonna say like it that version probably works because James Cameron like knows what he's doing but there's no arguing that it would have worked as well as it does with Arnold no and he got his

Lance Hendrickson type with the T-1000 right guy Robert Patrick Robert Patrick and Lance Harrison are constantly being confused in my head so it's like it's good casting right like think but also just like going back to the initial point like think about if uh brand that it was putting out like think about if the t-1-thousand was yoke like again like another like a liquid bodybuilder which is right because that juxtaposition made the t-1 thousand more terrifying yeah right i mean i love uh in interviews it's going around

again when cameron said the reason he made a t-1-000 a cop was because they kill indiscriminately don't give a fuck about humans and like all this stuff. And he's like, what better disguise for a person to be able to do whatever they want to whoever they want and be awful. You know, like, hell yeah, can't be good. Yeah, yeah. So that's what like he, in Terminator 1, he was like, he, it's kind of good that he's foreign seeming because everybody's afraid of Russia.

And Russia is like always the one that starts the nuclear war in both movies. They're just like, yeah, fucking Russia. But he didn't want to even meet with Schwarzenegger. They made him, he was like, I'm going to, like, pick a fight with him, I guess, during lunch. And before he left, he told his friend, if it doesn't go well, you can have the chair and the stereo, which I think is just a funny window into how big a deal stereos were for that generation. Yeah, it's like the highest or the most expensive thing in anyone's house. Wait, I can take your Macintosh amplifier?

Yeah. But Linda Hamilton was like, I'm a trained to Juilliard actor and this guy is Conan. well like this this is a bad idea like this will just be a blip on my career and then she went and they weren't on camera a lot together and so she went and like watched one of the scenes where Arnold was like doing his thing in a parking garage and she was just like oh shit like he just like he knows how to like his physicality and like how he moves in that movie she was like this is actually going to work really well yeah and like his like lack of mobility he moves very well in Conan

like he's he's wheel you know he's leaping around wheel and stuff but he's a little stiff because he's a giant he's the Austrian oak oak chest and Terminator it totally benefits him quick aside about Terminator something we learned

figured out on Action Boys or noticed on Action Boys is that the entire premise of the Terminator movies require Linda Hamilton to let a time traveling dirtbag raw dogger like she has to Michael Bean

fuck her wrong Kyle Reese has to finish in her in order for the Terminator movies to happen and that's such a crazy thank God

this guy who I think is a homeless lunatic I'm gonna let him fucking finish it for the world ends yeah a cream pie

saves the world Sarah this guy Kyle kind of stinks no he's from the future and I got to bang him to save the world he said does she even know that

at the part where they have like is she on board at that point no I don't She's on board with, like, maybe the reality of it, but she doesn't know, like, it's like they're about to make John Connor, which is such a funny specific because John Connor sent him back. Did John Connor say, like, hey, this is my mom. You have to be my dad.

Yeah, you have to go fuck my mom. Yeah. Right. It's the opposite of Back to the Future. You have to go back and fuck my mom. I mean, it's a romantic scene. They're making pipe bombs. He's like, I feel in love with you the second I.

saw that shitty photo of you from our son from the future and then they have sex that's fucking wild but yeah Cameron has said that for Terminator 2 you know obviously Arnold's character suddenly becomes the hero but he was initially

meeting with Cameron to play the Michael Bean role which does make more sense because like if it's a human they have to be strong to like that's the human you would send back you would send back a human that looks like Arnold to fight a Terminator that looks like Michael Bean.

But I think Arnold just inherently understood, like, this is what I would be good at. And then at a deep animalistic level, my name will be the name of the movie. I'll be playing the titular character. And I'll get to kill a lot of people, which we're about to get into, was important to him. I feel like there's like some part of his brain that is, like, the same part of the, like, people's brains that were like, when you take a picture of someone, you capture their soul. like when photography like he really like placed a lot of weight on like how many people he got to kill

in movies and you know can't beat that with regards of the Terminator but yeah Cameron has come out and said like the reason a cop is a cop is a bad guy in T2 is cops think all non-cops are less than they are stupid weak and evil they dehumanize the people they are sworn to protect

and desensitize themselves in order to do that job which fucking rules okay so Schwarzenegger came away from reading the script for Terminator 2 with like a worried look on his face and Cameron was like, well, what? This is fucking perfect.

And he was like, I just like, don't get to kill anyone in the script. That was his, he was like bummed that he didn't get to kill anyone. Oh man. Like this is, this was a big deal to him because I, like, it was one of the pieces, like one of the

pieces of data that was like kept track of in his rivalry with Stallone. Back at Cracked, we like once made a video counting all the kills in Commando and that was by design, you know the scene where he's just like going into the Valverde, yeah, Valverde and just like mowing people

them. Yeah, but then like there are parts where it's just like five seconds of just like him shooting like waves and waves of like indiscriminate bad guys. They do the ultimate cut, the ultimate like 80s action movie cut where you see Arnold spray in M60 like 50 times. Then it cuts to

50 guys just leaping out of different cover like oh we all got hit in that one. It's awesome. They added that scene because I think it's one or the other. He had just seen Rambo 2 and I think that's what it was. He had seen Rambo 2 and was like he got like a lot of, he killed

a lot of people in that movie. And so they like added scene. They were literally taking extras who had just been shot and like spirit gumming a mustache onto their face to like differentiate them from there. And then just being like get back out there to be killed again. Oh, that's so awesome.

Oh man. For all the hating. So Stallone should taking the role of Terminator, because wasn't he offered the role? Like, didn't Stallone turn down the Terminator role? Yeah. So, the Stallone episode is going to be crazy. Like, they're, their rivalry. So let's get into their rivalry.

Are you guys doing a Stallone episode? Allow me to say, I'll be back. Hey, don't I got rights? Hey, Elizabeth, don't I got rights. So, hell, good. Hey, I'll be back. Three seashells. Three cockpock shows. I assume that, like, the rivalry between the two of them was, like, made up in my child.

mind you know because they were like the two big strong guys um but it was not uh i want to i want i guess just tell the stop or my mom will shoot uh yes we're you're all yeah yes um but this is a quote from arnold uh miles that just went appeared in the yeah yeah yeah this is this is from arnold yes we were movie rivals but we took the competitiveness to the extreme we tried to have the best body We had to kill more people in our films and we had to have the biggest guns. Yeah. Wow.

They were counting. And like, literal dick measuring guns. Truly. They were just keeping tabs on how many people they killed. And like Stallone was on Letterman's then. After a while, I started to like competition,

this one-upsmanship, he'd get a bigger gun. I'd shoot more people. He'd shoot more people. And so I think probably definitively, and Gaboris, I want to get your official, scholar's opinion on this, but I feel like

Schwarzenegger won, right? Like his movies did better than Stallone's and it's all, there's just the Rocky won an Oscar. That's true. So there's like this one thing that that Schwarzenegger doesn't have that

Rocky had, that Stallone had. Schwarzenegger probably doesn't give a shit about that. Right, doesn't matter to him because he was like governor like, you know what I mean? Like he won like a million times over. Yeah. And I think history will be kinder to Schwarzenegger. than Stallone too. Stallone has maybe more duds in his

but Stallone has always been a little bit more of an artist than Arnold too. Stallone wants to be Robert De Niro. Right. Arnold wants to be Superman, not the actor. The character. Literally be superman.

But I think you're right. I think the competition, I also think we're talking about two guys who come across is really dumb but are probably a little more savvy than they And I think they understand K-Fabe and a rivalry between two big guys will benefit both of them. You know what I mean? And so then they get to make the escape plan and we all go.

And it's like it's like heat. It's like dumb heat. You know what you're like 15 years too late. I do like the dream cashing in my mind and I don't know if I would want to change a perfect film. But it does seem like if they had been able to get over the rivalry and. make Schwarzenegger Ivan Drago like that it would have broken

the world like that that movie already did incredibly well for a movie that is like I think 40% montage yeah right but you know like that that would have

fucking destroyed people's brains yeah Arnold's like and you see it with some of the big actors now where their ego gets in their way of like interesting choices like where it's just like I can't have sly beat me up and it's like but right

okay would have been cool. Yeah. Literally everyone in the world would have seen it. But yeah. And you would have gotten one more kill than him in that movie. Yeah, you would have got to kill your boy fucking Carl Weathers.

That's right. It just wasn't properly pitched to him. Do you think there's any backstory to like, I feel like the movie posters for Cobra and Terminator are very similar? You know, like where Terminator's like he's got like a gun like this. Cobra Stallone is also doing it with like a red background. He's got a bigger gun though. He doesn't have a pistol.

still. He has like a little MP5. Yeah. Exactly. And I'm like, hold on, bro, are you really going for the exact same composition of a movie poster, Anne Cullen? It's like, no. It also has those weird, like, techno vibe. Like, the, aren't there, like, those

music video shoots in there that kind of look like a poor man's version of? Christine Nielsen is like shooting music videos with robots. Right. So I wanted to talk about Brigitte Nielsen in a second because she started out working with Arnold and

I feel like this is a good kind of summation of who they were. So Arnold and Brigitte Nielsen co-starred in one of the Conan films and like her quote on it is like the set lights wouldn't be out and we'd be off fucking each other. We like

the way we did every single thing to each other's bodies that like reads like a romance novel. Yeah. And then Stallone goes on to marry her and like tightly control her career and like she couldn't be in anything that he wasn't involved with and then when she was finally in Beverly Hills cop two he called Eddie Murphy

and accused him of sleeping with her like it just seemed like he's like fueled by insecurity and Arnold is just this like bounding confident puppy fucking yeah he's like a giant golden retriever with his lipstick out yeah yeah oh that's actually Arnold and Brigitte hit it off in Red Sonia which is not a Conan movie Red Sonia is Red Sonia is Red Sonia and then Arnold plays exactly a character like Conan, but named like a name's something different. Yeah, and it's just like, yes, we can't legally call him Conan, but he's a barbarian who fucks a chick with a sword in this movie.

Yes, and he also, they, he said that they shot him from like three different angles in every shot that he was on so, like, they could just like stretch the footage as much as possible. He was just like, I don't really want to do this. They're like, yeah, no, you're just here for a couple days. And then they're like, he's actually the star of the movie. But yeah, so the one thing that Arnold always had the ability to do, which is weird because he doesn't seem like that funny of a person necessarily, but he could always do comedy and that drove Stallone crazy. And so in 1992, he decided to fuck with Stallone and tell him that

the movie Stopper. My mom will shoot that script was going around. And he said that he read the script. It was a piece of shit. Let's be honest. I say to myself, I'm not going to do this movie. Then they went to Sly and Sly called me. Have they ever talked to you about doing this movie? And here I'm going to give you the quote Miles so you can read it. And I said

yes, I was thinking about doing it. This is a really brilliant idea of the movie. When he heard that because he was in the competition he said, whatever it takes, I'll do the movie. And of course the movie went major into the toilet. Went major into the toilet.

Major into the toilet. So awesome. That movie is fucking bad and weird. You don't just cover the good ones on action boys. We haven't done Oscar yet, which is Sly's other attempt at comedy that fucking failed hard. Yeah, Arnold just has a better sense of humor, even about himself, which I think is like the thing that makes him better. The Rock doesn't have that. Like none of our modern, maybe Sina does, but none of our modern people have that about themselves.

like everyone's too self-serious or like worried that you know like that 90s toxic masculinity mentality of like well if I make fun of myself then everyone knows I'm a bitch yeah okay then I might become gay or something yeah someone will think I'm gay if Kevin Hart mocks me in a movie no I should rip Kevin Hart in half in this movie um Predator I think arguably his best movie I don't know T2 is probably my favorite of his movies, but it's a really great movie. His muscles are used for comedy. And like that also gets to the question of like, how much is he aware of it and how much is he just willing to let himself be used

by directors in the way that, like, he like kind of finds the right people to work with and then lets him do their job. Whereas that seems to be the exact opposite of Sylvester Stallone gets like guys that he can bully and be in charge of and stuff like that. He fires the initial director and then gets

like some guy who he can just like push around. more or less yeah Arnold's strong suit is like a trust in directors and like a ability to go like I don't fully understand what I'm saying in this scene but you just tell me how to say

phonetically and I'll get it out and then you watch sly movies and realize like English was Sylvester Sloan's first language I mean he sounds like that he sounds like that and English is the only language they spoke in his life

the only other detail I learned about Predator in this from JM is that they had a problem with their water filtration system the cast got sick and as far as I know this is the only Arnold Schwarzenegger movie

in which he shit his pants during the filming and I bring that up only because I have a loose theory because that's also true of Harrison Ford and Raiders of the Lost Ark

all the desert films are filmed while he's like running off to shit his brains out because he was like incredibly sick also true of the most iconic moment of Michael Jordan's career I'm just saying like when you have to when you have to like focus

your mind on not shitting your pants on keeping your butt hole tight and not weekend yeah yeah you do some pretty iconic work we don't know like it's not it's also not something that like Einstein would have said like you know when I came up with the equals MC squared I was

shitting my shiting my back out of my button up pants. It wasn't just a loose theory is a loose stool that led to it all. It's a really, yeah,

I mean, that's inspired me, Jack. I think next week I'm going to do, we'll do the diarrhea episodes to see if that changes my performance here on the pod. Theory of diureativity.

Yeah. Sorry. Rialitivity. Kindergarten cop gave us the soundboard, which I do think is like one of the most iconic things about his career.

I think it reinvigorated him in a weird way. Yeah. And it really made him in like crystallized like a joke version of Arnold that then he got to like push against by becoming a politician. Like it was like there's like this weird thing where this is like he's a household joke with the fucking soundboard, which we were all obsessed with. Shout out Ebaum's world for giving me like fucking six years of fucking joy. And Howard Stern is where I first heard it too. But then he survives becoming like that much of a fucking joke.

somehow, which is just crazy. That's impossible. This soundboard still exists. Who is your daddy and what does he do? Who is your daddy? I want to ask you a bunch of questions. Uh-huh. You have them answered immediately.

Who is your daddy and what does he do? For people who don't know what this is, our yoga listeners, like it was just, it's like a pool string toy, but like, you know, you can like hit everything and it, like, gives you all these different lines from Schwarzenegger, and it was used for a great like prank call effect on many a radio show and um but i i also think like something uh i think it was rogers set on action boys that i thought was really smart is that both as a movie star and like just how we thought of him he's just an action figure that you like dress up in different things and like make do different things and like that's why i think

the soundboard works so well is because it's basically the pool string toy for like pre-internet shit posters where you can just like use Arnold quotes to just like do whatever like use them as many times as you want and there's no scene where he's a child opening up a package making the audience

cry watching the movie like everything he says is like weirdly ah ah you know and it's like right right right dude my favorite one was he called the Gator Lodge was one where he confuses this old woman. Those are the best videos, or I guess they were just, you know, audio clips at the time.

But I think like to your point, it really was sonically Arnold Schwarzenegger's just in your subconscious on this in this way that you also got excited at the idea that someone was just laughing in your face playing blatantly Arnold Schwarzenegger's talent bites. And they're like, who is this? And they're like, Detective John Kimball, you fucking idiot. It's Detective John Kimball, you idiot. you idiot you idiot you idiot okay hey Bennett let off some steam

yeah remember when I told you I'd kill you last I lied my friend is dead tired commando commando is the most full of those like if you're like Commando and kindergarten cop

Yeah Kindergarten cop is the one that like has so many of my favorite Kindergarten cop like weirdly is one of the ones that kind of looms the largest in my memory other than Terminator 2. Like Terminator 2 is the most

burnt on my brain movie of my life. But kindergarten cop just really like every review when you go back and look is like this really shouldn't work. Why does this work? But it like really fucking does. The bad guy is like too scary for like

a movie that also features children and Arnold like it's like also it's like our first time we see Arnold and a beard, right? Like, and I'm a big fan of Arnold with facial hair and he has a fake beard in the beginning of that movie and those weird little like fucking shooter glasses. It's like very, it's, that is, that was,

Jack, I kind of get what you're saying because we were young when we saw it. Exactly. It was kind of like, you know, the other movies were like grown up movies, but this felt like a movie that we were like allowed to see. And so then, and then all of a sudden you feel like, wow, imagine if your fucking teacher, like had a gun.

like it's hard not to think about it would be sick. My dad, he's a gynecologist and he looks at vaginas all day. It was a time before that was actually a political talking point that all teachers should have guns. Right, right.

It's crazy. But yeah, like I haven't really been able to get Arnold much in front of my kids because like I don't want their first experience to be jingle all the way because I don't think that's like a that good of a movie. And so I was going to show them, I was going to show them kindergarten

and cop and then I listened back to the action boys. I was like, there's like a drug overdose in this. Yeah. I'm like, I don't want to give them the wrong idea about drugs, you know? Yeah, I know. If we'll be using them wisely in our house and both of my kids know where the Narcan is. Yeah, that's right.

You got test strips, man. You're not a test for fentanyl? Check your stockings, kids. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Wait, it says we have an appointment. He's going to learn to use those. Yeah, we're going to go get our fentanyl vaccine. today.

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Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. His comedies are like on. Again, all of the shit, like, he doesn't make any sense on paper. Like, Twins is a deeply fucked up eugenics story. Like, it begins in a top secret government lab where scientists are attempting to create a physically, mentally, and spiritually advanced human being. And the narrator has, like, a thick Austrian accent. So it's like, doesn't make it seem like it wasn't about ex-Nazi doctors trying to create

a master race. And then kindergarten cop is, like, gun-toting, policemen. again, goes undercover, the most conspicuous human being on the plant. Like, if that guy was just a cop, he would be famous. Right. How fucking cool he looks. And then junior. Yeah.

Yeah, Twins is like maybe your best bet to show kids, but it's like all adult themed. It's not like, it's not like really fucked up, but it is like too, like I couldn't imagine kids holding their interests. What about last action? If Conan wasn't so scary, that would be the one that makes them. most sense. But it's a touch spooky with like snake worshippers and shit like that. Yeah. I am very

interested to see like if his appeal still holds, you know? I'm sure it does, right? It's still like these movies are good. But then I thought that about Jaws and my son was like, it's almost as good as the Meg too. So oof. Yeah.

Yeah, you know, it's hard. You're like fucking with the modern attention span, which is just like on it, it's like modern consumption is on just a different frequency than we had growing up. Yeah, you know? Yeah, yeah, of course. We kind of had no choice but to be like,

well, Jaws is what's on. I have to like set my brain to be able to sit here for this, which we'd barely ever see a shark. And then you're a kid and you just get baby shark. And then all of a sudden you're like, who cares about Jaws when there's baby shark? Why is the shark singing? Why does Chief Brody not open the video by being like,

hey guys, you know, talking directly to me. We're at the kind of part where his career starts to go way a little bit. It starts to go downhill for the first time. He's like kind of invincible for a long time. Two things that happened in the early 90s. One is playing at Hollywood, which was like a massive deal at the time, but it just, it fell apart pretty quickly. The food sucked. Schwarzenegger pulled out in 2000. He was notoriously bad at pulling out early enough. That's the one time he pulled out. One time he pulled out on time. and then last action hero was like the big the big one it was everybody was like focused on it so

it got like watered down by studio notes it doesn't like totally cohere there's some like really good stuff in it but like it's an insanely good concept that they just fall a little short on and like yeah i remember loving it as a kid and or at least wanting to love it and then rewatching it as a grown up you're like man this could be so much better yeah they also movie to remake. Everyone, all these remakes movies that everyone loves. Remake a movie that kind of sucked. That's right because I can make that way better.

And he was also listening to mini-discs, I think. Like in his stereo and his car stereo had mini-discs. I was like, do some bygone technology. It's like a satire of action movies that like doesn't really get a lot of action movie like tropes. Like there's a cartoon character walking through the police station.

He's like always throwing dynamite around. It's like, what the fuck is that? He keeps calling F. Muriel Abraham Salieri too he's like that's Salieri it's like that's Amadeus what are we talking about now they also made a pretty

confident decision by deciding to release it the same day as Jurassic Park which didn't go well oh wow same day June 93 what a time erected a gigantic inflatable Schwarzenegger in the middle of Times Square but it was like

Kaiju sized and holding a bundle of dynamite and it was three days after the World Trade Center bombing. Oh, Jesus. So they had to immediately move it out. They also put the title of the movie on a NASA Space Shuttle, spent $500,000 to have it on the space shuttle launch, and then it got

delayed till like five months after its release date. And it was like, oh, man, that is a, like, it would almost be at that point, like, terrible luck for the NASA mission to, like, have that movie's name on it. But it was also just, just like in terms of action heroes, this is like diehard has come out,

Batman has come out, like lethal weapon, and you're starting to see people kind of trend towards more normal sized action heroes. It's just like people are like, I don't know, it's kind of weird that that guy's as fucking massive as he is.

Right, because much like the Brad Pitt paradox or, you know, like if Arnold's movies were any more realistic, like every scene would just have people stopping him on the street going like, what the fuck? Or like, holy shit.

Can I take a picture with your arm? What are steroids? The Brad Pitt one is like, dude, you are fucking hot. Like every situation would just be absolutely ruined by like, wait a minute, dude. You're fucking gorgeous. Hold on. You're a carpenter, dude. No, no fucking.

I'm wearing glasses and I have a bucket hat on. So nobody's going to even pay attention to me. But just a quick anecdote from that time, Bruce Willis says that after die hard, he walked into a restaurant and Arnold was already there. and he like called across the dining room do you know why you'll never be an action hero and then he flexed and he goes toothpick arms Jesus Christ

that's awesome true lies I will say is a incredibly Islamophobic but very watchable high point of this late career part of his up there with you don't mess with the Zohan yeah

it's a fun fucking movie but you can't believe it you know they're like wild it's like really kind of Oh, yeah, yeah. It's fucking crazy. I'll do anything for the Jamie Lee Curtis hotel sequence.

Yeah. Do it sexy. Do it slowly. Do it some more. And even there, he's doing, he's kind of using a soundboard. Yeah. Well, yeah. And like in Running Man, when he's picking out his woman,

Sleazy. Like, that's a great running board line too. Sleazy. Sleazy. Sleazy. Athletic. Sleazy. His, his, you know, we can offer all the cultural commentary we won on why we think his movie career faded down the stretch of like the

90s here. His theory is that it was when he fixed the gap in his teeth. He recently told Glenn Powell during like the running man movie run up that he thought it was he should have never fixed the gap in his teeth. He might be right, but that's definitely not what it was. Some people just start making bad choices. Like money and like shit gets in the way and you just start choosing stuff. Like Arnold had like accidentally great taste for what he would pick. You know what I mean? Like it just made like he would, he was in things that were so perfect for him.

And he never like stretched too far. But then he would do like a racer and stuff and you would be like, these are bad versions of stuff he's already done. Yeah. Because when you look at it, if you think like, okay, true lies 94, your hairy tasker are great. next movie is junior yeah you know then eraser then jingle all the way you're like oh yeah it's cresting now right yeah yeah yeah yeah and jiggle all the way would be a fun like career like aside if he kept the other shit going on but jingle all the way became then he was just like oh this is who i am yeah yeah and i think also like

as you lose the heat like no you're no longer working with james camera and now you're working with whoever directed like you know some of these movies and then it's like you you don't have Danny DeVito reteaming with you and jingle all the way as he was supposed to. It's like, although Simbaat's great, but, you know, it's just like he stops having,

it's hard to like sustain a thing like that. And I always remember like Batman and Robin, him coming into that world felt like an admission of like being a failure like he had given up because it's just like, no, this is like the thing where they have to paint on your muscles. Like you don't, you don't have to do that.

You're fucking. It's the guy in a suit, dude. Yeah. The fuck is this. So he's like, all right, my career slowed down. I'm going to become the governor of California. He does. There's like a recall election, a bunch of celebrities.

Gary Coleman runs. He runs. Everybody treats it as a joke at first. He's doing like just Terminator puns the whole time, but then he wins and becomes like an actual politician. And this is where we come to, you know, he was bad. He had like, you know, he fought gay marriage and by saying that, gay marriage should be between a man and a woman, you know, the sorts of malapropisms that,

you know, you can edit out of a movie, but then it becomes like a thing that everybody. Yeah, when you're a lawmaker, it hits a little different. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But there was this moment where, I don't know if you guys remember, Barbara Bush, like, showed up with a cast, and they said that she, like, slid down an icy hill on a saucer sled, and that's how she broke her leg. Arnold recently told the true story, which I'm going to put in the chat for you, Miles. It was snowing up there, and we had this toboggan, and Bush was trying to teach me how to slide that, because I was only used to sledding down with Austrian sleds, which you direct kind of with your feet.

And so we went down totally out of control. And of course, we crashed into Barbara Bush, who broke her leg then after that. Jesus. He just trucked. Poor Barbara Bush. And of course we crashed into, and of course we crash. When he says shit like, and of course. And of course we are crashing.

And like, because we talk about it. Like he has like these like rolling dialogue things. And of course we are. And then I am here. I am on the deli site guys. I am talking to Miles and Jack. And I'm here. Right.

I am here with Jack and Miles and we are having fun. And we are talking about the sled. And of course I'm sledding. And I'm sledding and with Miles and Jack. Like he like is kind of, you know, he's like, I am here on the tonight show to talk about collateral and it's collateral is the film I am coming out as collateral yeah yeah it just keeps going yeah that's I think the coolest thing he ever did as a politician was well it's so funny because I remember being I was not very politically minded uh for a long time in my life and I remember being like

oh that's cool Arnold's the governor and then like some people whose opinions I liked as a young kid were like he's like not he's not that like cool like he's got he's got like bad politics and you're like oh okay and now as like a grown up I'm like fuck like imagine Arnold was like what the right was like that be a dream come true and they're just actually are only about taxes somehow and not about like policing every fucking my choice every person makes uh right he's like uh pro choice but no health care yeah I go all right I mean that's kind of the status quo warmer warmer make a progress yeah uh he said On nerdist, Chris Hardwick asked him,

is there any law you would change if you could as a lawmaker? And he said, it's obvious, but I would change the president has to be natural born. Like I was like, of course, he would change the rules so he could run for president. Yeah. That's right.

At the time, you're going like, yeah, right, blood, a celebrity winning president. Like, oh, never mind. I would kill that. That is like one of the reasons we wanted to do this show is like, to like have more fun but also like you know icons are powerful and like they become they take on a life of their own and like Donald Trump was just a cartoon rich guy yeah he you know like we just

I think we have a tendency to like misunderstand what they become icon how people become iconic and also like the power that they have over us and like I feel like he kind of he's been a critic of Trump, but it's hard not to see that his political career is like a template for Trump's rise where he's like a wealthy megastar who was just like presented himself as an outsider underdog who could fix the problems. But for the 20 years before he was a politician with bad politics, you liked him. So like, you know, it's hard to shake that. Like Trump, no one liked Trump, but no one hated him either. He was like this rich douchebag. And then he got like a TV show and he was like kind of weird and kind of funny and gaudy and you were like oh it's fucking crazy and then

you're like he's in my life he's someone i recognize and then when he's like oh i'm running for uh office a lot of us went like well that makes no sense and a lot of us were like i know him yeah they're like oh no i vote for him i know his name he's not actually the terminator yeah he's actually he's very rich so he doesn't he knows how to get rich for everybody so i'm going to be rich i'm quoting like six of my family members in one when i say that right right right exactly. Yeah, I mean, there were lots of scandals in line with his run for governor shortly before the 2003 election. L.A. Times published a story documenting a long history of sexual misconduct with at least 15 women claiming they were groped or harassed by Schwarzenegger.

And then in 2011, his marriage, he married into the Kennedy family, Maria Schreiber. And it was revealed that he had fathered a child with their housekeeper, which came to because the kid no one has ever looked more like Arnold Schwarzenegger before. It's funny because Christopher looks more like him than Patrick does. Patrick has,

Patrick has Kennedy jeans, which of course are beneficial. Christopher is like big square jawed, handsome, like it's very, but I look, it's fucking, you know,

wear a rubber when you have affairs with employees. But it's a lesson that we're taking away. That's amazing to take away. But I would also say like, it's bad.

It's fucked up. But the fact that he's like loves and accepts Christopher is so fucking real. Like it's so cute. Or Joseph. Is that the one? Joseph, Joseph, Joseph, Joseph. Patrick is the one from White Lotus. Joseph is the, yeah, yeah.

He's the one that we bought a Jeep. Yeah. It's just so like it's funny. Like it's, he's just like, yes, I had a fair with a guy, but he's my son. And yeah, I was the governor. Like, he's just like, that's the power he has where we're just like, come on Arnie what's 20 women reporting sexual assault

you're Conan what did I just say he's not even a because he's not a person in a weird way either like an idea yeah like I'm like I don't know I don't think Arnold Schwarzenger's a person to be honest he's like

again he's a fucking G.I. Joe toy that you just fucking pose in different things the allegations were not shocking to anybody who's seen that Brazil video there's a video from early very early in his career where they sent him down to Brazil and it's one of the

wildest things of it's like the most overtly horny anyone's ever been on camera like and yeah I mean he's like grabbing women's asses who are like you can see somba dancing yeah somba dancers who are like pushing his hands

off of it because they're like dancing around him like doing like carnival dancing and he thinks it's a strip club and he's like yeah yeah let's get let me let me grab you by the waist surely and it was yeah it's it's pretty just everything even his interactions like with like that one woman like he's like feeding her carrots and shit these are carrots no no no no it's wild but overall like a very weird a very weird career that just like I I do wonder how much it's gonna fade

over time like do you guys think those movies are going to make sense to people in like even like 30 more years is it going to be like Polly Shore movies, you know, where it's just like, this was a thing that people were obsessed with and, like, studied more sociologically. Some of the movies are just like too good and undeniable. But it does also feel like 30 years from now, people will look back and be like, it's so weird that he's like this giant fucking. Oh, right. Like, is it more of a thing that people under like are like, oh, okay, I get it. Or it's like one of those things. And you're like, what the fuck were people back then? Right. We were anti seat belts? You know, like. Like that shit when you're just like, we smoked on planes? Yeah, right, right. This guy, no one's asking why he's talking like this

in the reality of the film? Right. What the fuck? All right, guys. I mean, if film still exists, I'm sure there'll be a very interesting way to discuss what the trends are and stuff, but who fucking know?

Yeah, that's true. It is funny, Jack. Like, you just casually say something like, in 30 years, how will we look at that? And then my brain just goes to be like, what the fuck is going to be happening in 30 years? I mean, I'm talking to two dads, so I feel I always lessen my nihilism in those moments. Oh, God.

What am I? Jesus Christ, I know. I feel like fighting over a glass of water. Based on your day job here at TDZ, I'm assuming you guys are a little plugged into that one. I'm always envisioning The Road by Cormick McCarthy. Right. That's a beautiful guy when we're doing the road is going to appreciate Arnold Schwarzenegger movies. all we have is this iPad preloaded with Last Action here.

Sorry, I really wish you to have Conan or Terminator on it. You should have seen him. I was a big Bridget Wilson fan. This is a big break in it. Well, John Gabris, such a pleasure. Thank you so much for coming on. Always such a good time talking to you, too. I appreciate you having me on, especially I don't have to deal with today's awful news

stories and we could just talk about how awesome Arnold is. It's like even more of a treat to do TDZ with you guys when it's not about the state of the universe. It's about Mr. Universe instead of the Steel. Yeah, yeah. Where can people find you, follow you, hear you, all that good stuff?

I'm at Gabris on social media. I got the free podcast with Adam Pally called Staying Alive, wherever you get podcasts or YouTube. I got Action Boys, which is a Patreon podcast where if you remotely like what this episode's about, it's unfortunately that for three hours every week. That's at Actionboys.Biz.

We have some free episodes that you can get addicted, you know, we get you hooked and then you come back for more. And then lastly, I made this physical media 30 episodes of the Gino Lombardo show. It's like three, 10 episode seasons. I turned it into a USB drive with like original art that comes in like a cassette form. And you can get that at gino.gabris.com if that's something that appeals to. Amazing. Any comedy bang bang fans out there. Yeah. Yeah. That's where I first first heard you. I still remember sound speeds. I still remember writing Gino Lombardo

and then John Gabris down in my notes app I think it was like his first appearance and I was just like who the fuck is this guy? That was like my second podcast appearance ever.

I didn't even know what podcast were I had moved out here and I did Gino for Scott and I had such a good time and then I didn't know I would be doing exclusively that character

for the next 15 years on his job. One day we'll be doing an icon episode about Gino Lomberto. Yeah. Yeah, sure. Don't worry, his sexual assault scandals are coming in hot. He groped the bagel boss guy.

Hissed him on the back of the neck. All right, that was a fun one. This is the notebook dumb. You may have noticed, first of all, that we didn't hit our standard question. If this person or character existed in the present tense or in our reality, would they have been on the Epstein flight logs. We didn't hit it because this is our first icon who did exist in our moment

and he wasn't on them. Dingin Casino Jackpot Sound Effect. He was not on them. I think we decided Miss Piggy wasn't probably on them also in that alternate reality. And people were pissed. People were like, yes, she definitely would have been.

With Arnold, I'll say the internet actually couldn't believe he wasn't on it and made a fake list of names that went viral on Twitter claiming these people were on the flight logs. I mean, it's still early. It's still early, folks. We still don't know every. We still haven't seen every file yet. One thing that's becoming a recurring theme also as we look at these icons for me is the question of, I guess it's like kind of a nature, nurture question more of a was it them or was it us of the icons we've covered so far, like Einstein is one extreme because he's this super singular genius who was going to be famous no matter where and when he existed. And then Erkel's kind of the other side

probably doesn't become an icon in most other moments historically or places in time, but catches something peculiar about the cultural moment. And I'd say Arnold is kind of somewhere in the middle there, kind of an enigma. I feel like he was, is going to be famous no matter what, everyone who meets him, like even the people who go and being like, this guy seems like an idiot. Like James Cameron, for instance, they come away from like a single meal with him being like, this is the face of and titular character of my next movie. But the specifics and the level of his dominance feel very peculiar to the 80s and 90s. like it'll be one of the weirdest sections of the future museum about the late 20th century.

Like people will just be like, why is this guy everywhere and why does he look like that? I also wanted to note that you can kind of see the specificity and the suddenness and massive impact of his influence in movies he never appeared in, like the same way that you can see certain cataclysmic volcanic eruptions in tree rings on like other. continents. Like the example I was thinking about is the Rocky franchise. In the first Rocky movie, Stallone's trying to play by the rules of the 70s. He's a schlubby every man who isn't as ripped as his opponent. That was kind of the point. It's an underdog tail. Like all our movies are generally underdog tails. So it doesn't make sense that he'd be the Superman. But then

Arnold hits. And by Rocky 3, Stallone looks actually like too muscular to make sense as a boxer. But by that time, the point was no longer to make sense. The point was suddenly to always look as conspicuously awesome as possible, no matter the role. And then Arnold's influence fades. And, you know, he and Van Dam are replaced by action heroes with toothpick arms. And Stallone goes back to playing a schlobby guy in Copland. I think Copland came out the year after Eraser, I think, which was the first of Arnold's big swing action movies that like doesn't really exist. It's not like a flop or a bomb like Last Actor Hero.

It's just like people are like, I don't even remember what that movie was about. On the subject of bodybuilding's relationship to acting, there's this mystery at the heart of filmmaking I've always found interesting, which is why do actors like Robert De Niro and like John Turturro who are these great actors You know, they're actors, actors, but then when they direct movies, nobody really, like, they're not great directors.

And then the actors who do make great directors are people like Ben Affleck and Clint Eastwood and Robert Redford who are kind of one-dimensional. I mean, they're movie stars. Like, you'd never want to go see them in a stage play, but they end up making great directors. And I think one of the reasons is that they understand a very simple thing. thing, which is how to look on camera, like how to show up, you know, without the interiority of the acting process to rely on, they focus on everything outside of them, their relationship to the camera, what angles make them look best. If you're not a great actor, you're good at looking awesome on camera, you have to be sort of directing while you act and like sort of

bending the movie around your face, which requires a much broader understanding of how film making works because they don't have the tools inside so they figure out how to work within the machine around them to look awesome. And that sets them up to be better directors than somebody who just shows up and is like, I'm the Jordan of the shit. I don't need to pay attention to these idiots with cameras. Obviously, Arnold didn't become a great director. But I was thinking about that when researching how his bodybuilding led into his acting career. Because from a very early age, he's thinking about how to pose and, like, hit his angles and how to appear to people. He's just, like, pure exteriority.

He's studying how to show up at the right angle to portray the right things, which for him, the right thing is always to just look awesome and strong. And that was the right thing for America in the 80s and 90s. I mentioned how he tried the Stanislavski method. I talked about how his teacher thought it got great results. Arnold disagreed. Arnold eventually was like, I don't want to be that kind of actor.

I want to be an action hero. And he quit the Stanislavski method and committed to weapons training. And he won all sorts of awards from gun nut magazines and shit like that for being the best shooter of guns in movies. I don't know. I don't subscribe to them.

Next up, I think the question, we kind of talked about this, but the question of, like, is Arnold hot is interesting? I'm like, why is he not? You know, Gabris mentioned that the women characters in his movies are often like, oh, hoa, hobo, look at this guy. But he kind of gives off the same vibes as The Rock. He's sort of like too invulnerable to make sense in that way.

He's sort of a marble statue come to life, which I think does tie back into fascism. There's a really good article called Everyone is. beautiful and no one is horny on the website Bloodknife that talks about the sort of sexless, bloodless nature of our movies while everybody has suddenly become completely shredded, like the rock and the Marvel movies. And in that article, uh, the writer R.S. Benedict connects it back to Paul Verhoeven's satire of fascism and American action movie, Starship Troopers, and describes the co-ed shower scene as quote, a room full of beautiful bare bodies and everyone is only horny for war. And I feel like that's a perfect summation of Arnold movies. They had to cut

a sex scene from Commando because the actress and the director were like, this doesn't make sense and like it feels weird. But they were willing to add an extra like 150 people being killed in the final scene. In terms of Arnold's relationship to other action stars, as I was reading that book, The Last Action Heroes. I feel like John Claude Van Dam and Arnold Schwarzenegger are sort of spiritually linked. They're just these unquestioningly confident, like puppies who've never been told no. And then Stallone and Segal are these massively insecure sort of sad boys who refuse to let their guard down. Their careers are like scar tissue that's like grown over their wounded ego and then Schwarzenegger and Van Dam are like these ids that just

sort of shed their super ego like needless shirts and are just running around flexing and waving their dicks in our faces. And finally, I talked in a past episode about this theory I was working on of like icons have to have like a contradiction at their core. Like there's too many famous people. We don't want to learn about another famous person. We're already holding all this shit. We don't want to have to pick up another famous person. But our brains are intrigued by contradiction. And so you have like Einstein is not just a super genius. He's a super genius who can't remember to put his shoes on before walking out the door. Erkel's a dork, but he's a dork who's extremely confident. Miss Piggy, a career motivated diva, primarily driven by a romantic love of

Kermit. And if I had to jam Arnold into the contradiction theory, I'd highlight some of the stuff we touched on. He's an American hero who spoke with a thick Austrian accent. He's constantly going undercover while being the most wildly conspicuous character in any movie. And it's interesting that he thinks that the thing that killed his career was fixing the gap in his teeth.

You know, he's a subscriber to the contradiction theory, apparently. And, you know, Stallone also had an imperfection. with the way he talked and kind of slurred his words because, like, one side of his face was lightly crushed by a four-seps accident when he was being born. But I'm going to shoot you guys straight. I don't think there's a lot of contradiction here. I think Arnold is a pretty straightforward, like, cartoon of a jock. He makes locker room blowjob jokes.

He smokes massive cigars. He's just, like, the toxic masculinity of the 70s pumped up to the extreme. to just like the physical embodiment of what a seven-year-old would design an action hero to look like. Yeah. So I'm not sure where we're at with this contradiction theory. I feel like I might need to replace it with our new theory that people do their most iconic work while shitting their pants. All right. That's going to do it for Arnold.

We're back next Monday with possibly the most famous and recognizable figure on the face of the planet. who, depending on the tradition that you follow, may have done their most iconic work while shitting their pants. I'm talking, of course, about our icon number five, Santa Claus. Talk to you then. Bye. If a Lenovo gaming computer is on your holiday list, don't shop around. Just go directly to the source, Lenovo.com.

It's your last chance to score exclusive deals on the gaming PCs you want, like the Lenovo Legion Tower 5 Gen 10 gaming desktop and Lenovo Locke gaming laptop. So avoid all that shopping chaos and price comparing and just go directly to the source, Lenovo.com, where PCs are up to 35% off. That's Lenovo.com. Lenovo, Lenovo.

I know he has a reputation, but it's going to catch up to him. Gabe Ortiz is a cop. His brother Larry, a mystery Gabe didn't want to solve until it was too late. He was the head of this gang. You're going to push that line for the cause. Took us under his wing and showed us the game, as they call it. When Larry's killed, Game Must Untangle the Dangerous Past,

one that could destroy everything he thought he knew. Listen to the Brothers Ortiz on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Stefan Curry, and this is Gentleman's Cut. I think what makes Gentleman's Cut different is me being a part of developing the profile of this beautiful finished product. With every sip, you get a little something different.

Visit gentlemen's cut bourbon.com or your nearest total wines or bevmo. This message is intended for audiences 21 and older. Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, Boone County, Kentucky. For more on Gentleman's Cut Bourbon, please visit gentlemen's cut bourbon.com. Please enjoy responsibly. I'm Robert Smith, and this is Jacob Goldstein,

and we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast called Business History about the best ideas and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people, horrible ideas and destructive companies in the history of business. First episode, how Southwest Airlines use cheap seats and free whiskey to fight its way into the airline is. The most Texas story ever. Listen to business history on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.