The Daily Zeitgeist - MJGMB #62: Denver's Dominance vs. Miami's Indomitable Will with T.J. McBride

Episode Date: June 1, 2023

Miles and Jack were pleased to be joined by longtime Denver Nuggets beat writer T.J. McBride on the latest episode. The trio wrapped up the thrilling ECF, discussed the NBA Finals matchups and plenty more!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Keri Champion, and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. Every great player needs a foil. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Listen to the making of a rivalry.

Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. I'm Keri Champion, and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark vs. Angel Reese. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's basketball.

And on this new season, we'll cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio apps, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. Señora Sex Ed is not your mommy's sex talk. This show is la platica like you've never heard it before. Diet Coke. You might recognize us from our first show, Locatora Radio. Listen to Señora Sex Ed on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The NBA finals are here and we finally have the matchup we anticipated prior to recording last week's episode in a very unlikely near comeback. I will say I was sweating a bit.

I did put the pampers underneath my armpits to absorb all of the sweat. And we've got the Nuggets, we've got the Heat, and we'll go into the series expectations and more with Nuggets beat writer TJ McBride. See, that's a little bit of hip-hop for you. On today's episode, I'm

Miles Gray. And I'm Jack O'Brien. And this is Miles and Jack Got'Busties. What's happening? Everyone. Yeah. The heat nuggets joke about like, what is this? Lunchtime got to eat nuggets. What is this instruction for frozen food? Heat nuggets. Oh, what did you hear? Has officially been done done yeah has been done oh you heard my mixtape straight heat nuggets somebody even put in case miami wins this like here's my draft like we did it out like a week before it actually happened so we've all been beat to it uh i was going to come up with that joke on my own in like four days. Okay. Okay. That's cool.

But first let's welcome TJ McBride, our very esteemed guest. So TJ, you're from LA, right? Yes. Originally. Yep.

And then you came up as a Lakers fan. Yes, I did. Born and raised Lakers fan watching Derek Fisher hit point three second shots growing up on Kobe. That was my entire childhood. Kobe around LA. And that was everything that childhood kobe around la and

that was everything that we ever knew was basketball people and it's why i'm here today fantastic and then but but now you now you find yourself covering the denver nuggets for what almost a little over a decade now yeah pretty damn close to a decade now i think it's like nine and a half ten years i think i think july is 10 years so it's been a long time when you say it like that wow so you've seen uh you've seen it all. I was there for York just for a summer league game in Vegas. I've seen the very, very, very start of this all the way through now. Right, right, right. And you saw it coming from the start.

I remember you said when he got drafted during that Taco Bell commercial, you were like, we're going to be framing a screen cap of this. Quezarito will be the second most impactful thing in that screen right there. That's crazy that you go back to that summer league. He was abnormally good. You watched him, and it still didn't make sense the same way it does today. And yet he was still doing these preposterous things on a basketball court. Even back then, that was what, 2012 he was doing that?

So it was absolutely insane to see him come here. But no one thought he would be the MVP back to back. Arguably should have been three times and now in the finals. So it's insane to see where he come from to this point now. Totally. So I've been saying, I've been posing this question to everybody. I talked to you about the NBA that they look heading into the finals,

obviously could change. Like they might be the best NBA team i've witnessed since the kevin durant warriors yeah yeah what do you think i all season long i've been saying that there's been this inevitability feeling with the nuggets no matter what the score or the time is that they're going to find a way and that was very reminiscent to me of that exact warriors team where you would just hit that third quarter and it didn't matter if you were up by 15 or if you were down by six, you were losing that game by 20. And that was, that's how it's felt all season long. And even in the playoffs, it's felt exactly the same way. I mean, this is a Nuggets team that is, what is it? First

in offensive rating, a couple points away from fifth and defensive rating, and is just far and away the best net rating team in basketball. No turnovers, hitting threes from everywhere, best talent on the court, role players coming through. This team has just turned into a monster. And there's so many ways that they can hurt you. I've been saying that they have more optionality than any team in basketball. They can hit more buttons and find more counters than anybody else.

And that's why they've gotten here. They haven't had any moment where it felt like there was an obstacle they couldn't get over, no matter who they played. anybody else. And that's why they've gotten here. They haven't had any moment where it felt like there was an obstacle. They couldn't get over it, no matter who they played. Now on the other side of the versus sign, a team that didn't feel inevitable heading into the playoffs or at any point this season until I would argue heading in, heading into the Eastern conference finals,

like they were, you know, massive underdogs but they just felt like something inevitable like based on how they were playing in the playoffs based on how boston was playing in the playoffs heading into the series i picked the heat in seven just based on the mathematical pattern of boston went to six in round one they had no right losing that series or even not sweeping that series they went to seven in round two had no right going to seven in that series with that philly team uh i think it's gonna keep going folks and and it did even

though i forgot that and thought that the heat were screwed heading into game seven i thought it was done i thought there was no chance. It was like the extremely slow object hitting the extremely flimsy wall. Like, was the Celtics going to collapse mentally or were the Heat going to find a way to drag this out to 7 and make it an ugly, ugly

Eastern Conference Finals win? And that is exactly what played out. Yeah. But I will say I don't have the same feeling of, you know, the people are sleeping on the Heat here heading into the finals that I did heading into the Eastern Conference. That feeling for me would have been at its height because, again, last episode we were on the precipice of them sweeping. And I was like, OK, this shit looks like it's a wrap. It's a Christmas gift.

And yeah, when I was like, even if they went to six games i think i would have still felt good the fact that it went to seven i'm like oh yeah they they they're capable of you know getting touched and and then um and obviously being on the receiving end of the battering of being a lakers fan i was like oh yeah no no y'all ain't got nothing for this because what i what happened out there i don't want to again. Although it was a fantastic series just to watch. Again, just to be like, oh, this is the best team in the league. And this is what it takes. This is the level you need to be at if you want to say,

we're going to the finals or we are the champion. And it's not just being elite. There's no mistakes made from Denver. I mean, you watched that in the Lakers series. They have the lowest turnover percentage in all of basketball in the playoffs right now. They just continually machine through you surgically, and there's just nothing you can do about it. Yeah. Buzzsaw is the machine that I've heard them compared to the most.

But let's talk about. So, I mean, Boston did make it extremely interesting. The second half of game four was, you know, that, that was, I, I texted Jabari in the third quarter and said, first three Oh comeback because they just, that, that's the feeling that Boston gives you when they're playing their best.

I think Charles Barkley said it at one point that like, if Miami plays their best and Boston plays their best, Boston's going to win every time. And it seemed like they had just kind of put it together for a while. And then things slowed down in game six, but game six was epic. Yeah. Yeah.

The game winner from Derek white almost, I almost ruined a family trip. I was so devastated when I was like, I was like, Oh no, that's that. No, the buzzer went off. No, that's late. And then the second when I was like, I was like, Oh no, that's that. No, the buzzer went off.

No, that's late. And then the second he slowed it down, I'm like, no, Oh my gosh. And more so to be like, I can't at that point,

it really felt like, Oh, is the universe about to like shine its light on the Boston Celtics right now? Because that, that was getting a little bit wobbly there for sure. that I was getting a little bit wobbly there for sure. White will inbound. It's off the smoke for the 7th guy.

The move had tipped in, but the buzzer sounded. The white was on. It'll be reviewed. Have to protect the offensive rebounder. Oh, he got rid of it. He sure did. That's a Celtic win and we're going to game seven. And that game six game winner was, of course, after Jimmy Butler did what Jimmy Butler does

and stormed back and just forced his will on the Celtics and the laws of physics. I still just feel like I'm seeing something that is unlike anything i've seen before on a basketball court like when he just gets it going because he's like trying really hard to get it going if it was a cheesy anime world where he's like finding the power of plot armor and just like developing more from nothing yeah it's incredible and it didn't like it's at the point now that you can't quantify it like is it going to be enough to beat denver damn well could be like who's going to pick against butler doing this like they are not

going to win this series unless he is at that level of godly basketball player but at the same time it's gonna take seven games of that to be able to do so but he is in a world that you just don't see people reach as a basketball player but that ankle looks bad like he had no pop in game seven at all and i'm worried about seeing butler try and turn corners going into this after seven game series in altitude against denver in game one of the finals two days later so altitude is unbelievable i i think the altitude is being underrated a little bit i talked about it a lot in the Laker series because as somebody who experienced altitude climbing a volcano a couple of years ago,

and I was doing it with a bunch of like 20 somethings. And I was like, Oh, this is like hangovers. Like this is one of those things that just gets way worse with age. So I felt for LeBron heading into that. I was like, Oh,

this, this could be bad and then jimmy always looks gassed like he he'll do an amazing thing and then will look like he just did an amazing thing and that required like all of the life force in his body or he'll get hurt and roll an ankle and suddenly find his jump shot like the guy plays right i've never i've never seen anybody like yeah he's like maximus and gladiator yeah you know what i mean like i don't know this guy i mean he's kind of out of kind of a we'll see what happens you're like what the altitude thing is so interesting though because i've talked to so many people

about it after covering a decade of hoops in denver and every single one says a different thing like some say oh, you just have a quick first wall you hit of altitude and the second you push through it, then you're usually fine on your second wind. And that takes five, six minutes in the first quarter. Other people say it destroys them. Some say they don't feel it at all. The Nuggets love

to steer into it. It even says 50-80 on the free throw line. They love steering into it. But I don't know if this is as much of a real scientific impact as people want to make it out to be considering. These are the best athletes and some of the best condition athletes that are on Earth. So are you implying that when I climbed the volcano, I was not one of the best condition athletes on Earth? Absolutely not a Jimmy Butler athlete. No, nothing but respect. But that's a different level. And they tend to push through.

So I wonder if the altitude is as big of a deal as people like to make. Well, I mean, cause on some level, right? Like a lot of elite athletes, they train at high altitude for the reason that it's a benefit to your endurance.

So I think like on some level, right? It's like passively they're already training at an elite level by the altitude, but it's, it is hard for me to say, and that's all it is because that's not true you know it takes 12 hours of being in denver to begin acclimating and then you just have

to push through that first layer of oh wow i'm feeling my first you know struggles a little bit earlier than i normally would in a regular game so it's not gonna like derail series that's kind of right it got to it got to the point where i was i was in my conspiracy theory bag during our series with the i was like i in my conspiracy theory bag during our series with the i was like i don't know man because jack you were like look it's not lebron being 38 and mortal it's the altitude i'm like yeah that's what it is he looked more gasped than he did for sure but i think that's probably a confluence of things but so like in but i started googling i was like okay what how these

other denver teams doing i'm like what's like how the white caps doing you know what i mean or the rapids i'm sorry the rapids doing because i'm like yeah that's that's vancouver i was like their mls team because i was thinking like that's another cardiovascular intensive sport and i'm like that must come out there must be proof in the pudding there. Their record is not that great. Denver's record for most of the franchise history is not great. I think in a seven-game series, against a team

where the whole heart of the team is a 38-year-old, I think... There's nothing wrong with being 38. Stop saying it like it's a bad thing. For someone who's 38 years old, I'm tired of hearing this. The man might as well be a fossil for NBA age, though. Let's be real.

I can't believe he's still standing at this point with what his knees have taken. Oh, yeah. But it's just so funny to me, continuously, when that number is like, just parroted and been like, 38. And I'm like, I'm, you know, I have a little bit of it band pain but that's i can discuss that even legal to have a elderly person like that playing in the league what if his dentures get knocked out uh all right let's take a quick break we'll come back and we will preview the series that we're all facing down i'm carrie champion and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports,

where we live at the intersection of sports and culture. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry, Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Every great player needs a foil. I ain't really near them boys.

I just come here to play basketball every single day, and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black. I love her. What exactly ignited this fire? Why has it been so good for the game?

And can the fanfare surrounding these two supernovas be sustained? This game is only going to get better because the talent is getting better. This new season will cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. It was December 2019 when the story blew up. In Green Bay, Wisconsin, former Packers star Kabir Bajabiamila caught up in a bizarre situation.

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And, all right. So, I mean, one thing we didn't really touch on on our recap, Game 7, incredible performances all around. Caleb Martin in particular. Is Caleb Martin having the best playoffs by someone who averaged under 10 in the regular season?

Like, I don't remember another one like this. I mean, you might want to go the Andre Iguodala route simply because he didn't play in the regular season and then decides to play in the playoffs. But I haven't seen a player who was put so low. If you would have ranked the NBA players, like he was not a starter on his own team.

He was the sixth or seventh guy on the Heat, let alone one of the best scorers efficiency-wise in the playoffs right now. I've never seen someone become this much more of themselves in this kind of a setting. Yeah, it was Caleb Mart-Him for sure. Because I was the same. I was like, who? I was ignorant.

I was a little bit like, huh? You got to put some respect on the Martin twins' names. Even going back to Nevada, those two were dogs. Every single step of the way, they've been fighting. I got a lot of respect for them. Yeah, see, and again, I've shown my ignorance and it has come back in my face because I was like, oh no, no, no, no.

This is something. But yeah, that sort of turnaround is kind of unheard of because I think the other examples that we could think of were people who we knew were a little more established, so it wasn't too much of a surprise, whereas Caleb Martin is out. It's also the most heat thing ever. Yeah, yeah.

Right. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, seeing Max Struess and Caleb Martin and Gabe Vincent and dusted off Duncan Robinson just off the shelf doing all this is the most heat thing I can imagine. Yeah, but all right. So the series, the finals. and just off the shelf doing all this is the most heat thing i can imagine yeah but all right so the series the finals um first of all we are going to have a historic underdog winning

the title this year we know this because the biggest underdogs to win the nba championship at start of playoffs since 1992 1993 the heat odds were plus 12 500 the implied probability there is less than one percent that's the lowest odds uh the 2011 mavericks were had an implied probability of 5.3 percent 1995 rockets implied probability of 5.3 percent the fourth longest odds would be the Denver Nuggets this year. 9.1%. Which, yeah, for people paying attention, it has felt a little inevitable,

but it just seemed like it got missed by the mainstream sports media or the betting public just because they're a small market, I guess. I mean, they're a flyover city. And this is why Michael Malone's been yelling so much. Like, you have an unorthodox star player. You have a city in the middle of the country that no one

wants to go to because the airport is so far from downtown. And you have just a group of people who are playing team basketball with no hero ball whatsoever, trying to make it work in an old school, let's build it ourselves chemistry sense like that doesn't work it doesn't appeal to people there's no theatrics it's not drama filled like they just go to work and they handle business i think this is why people like chris manix and all these conversations about the nuggets being boring or not compelling is it's wrong but i can understand how they get there in a lazy sense like you look at them on paper and you're like, what is there to get really excited about? But you get into the weeds and you see what they've come through.

It's a heck of a lot more exciting. Jamal Murray has probably returned from an ACL injury as best as anybody has. I've never seen anyone come back from an ACL tear in their first season back, be able to put together a run like this and play this long without their knee failing them. Nikola Jokic is one of one. We've never seen anything like him before. So the idea that this isn't interesting to me is crazy. And the fact that people missed it was just ignorance.

Like this is something that people just didn't take the time to watch the Nuggets because frankly, they weren't as interesting as the Lakers failing. People would rather watch the Lakers go through the chaos they did when Russ was there and get excited about the hype of Malik Beasley, who did not even play against his former team in the Western Conference semis. I don't know why we feel

that way, but the entire grand narrative of the NBA is always going to be transactional. It's always going to be about trades and rumors and who is doing what. It's not as much about basketball. We haven't trained casual fans as media well enough for them to even know what a horn's action is.

Like you can sit back and watch a cover three get played out by an NFL analyst in every single football game, but nobody knows what it is to put a horn set out there or to have a C corner play or what a flare screen is. So I feel like a lot of this has to do with that last one was one of them, but that's the problem. I mean, we, it's hard to enjoy basketball for basketball when the fans watching it aren't necessarily watching. Right. I remember like in the warrior series where LeBron clocked

like that hammer play on the inbounds, people were like, Oh, he's a genius. Like people were like, that's a play. Yeah. That is like in every single playbook in existence, from eighth grade basketball through. Like this is not an unbelievably inventive way of playing the game. And we've talked about this, Jack, that there is this like sort of outsized emphasis sometimes on like who messed up. Yeah.

Who's more fun? Who's more fun? Punchdown. Yeah, exactly. Who's Don Beebe this this time yeah yeah all the coverage is boston's collapse and the bucks the milwaukee bucks collapse and it's like i don't know are you sure that's what we're watching you sure yeah that's what you're not really good it could just be that the nuggets are phenomenal used to wanting to click on that they're only going to click on

stuff like that and they're never going to read anything actual analysis-based. I can say this, again, watching even as such a partisan fan as a Laker fan, I knew going, I was like, oh no, this team is so good. It's difficult to watch because I'm rooting for the team that

has no chance of winning, but part of me loves basketball enough to go, they're so good. Yeah. They can't. Matt Moore made a great point. Works for the action network. He's on NBA Twitter,

like crazy. Everyone probably knows who he is, but he made a point that it's not the national journal journalism media that don't know. It's the TV people. It's the ones that sit down, have a game to cover, get a one sheet of information,

and they talk about the game in front of them. Most national reporters, Howard Beck, Mirren Fader, all these different people who write long feature stories, they all know what the Nuggets have been doing. This isn't surprising. It's the ones who are usually television-based, who don't have a need to be able to know everything and are only going to use very base-level and surface-level analysis anyway, who haven't taken the time to learn. It's like Lisa Salter saying she hadn't watched Jokic since he played in the bubble. That was three years ago. How did he not watch the back-to-back MVP in either of his two seasons? So I wonder if a lot of this is the talking heads that we always see are the ones that we're hearing

from the most about not knowing. And the actual national media who is writing and on a day-to-day basis traveling to learn about these teams do know they're just not the ones on TV yelling. I saw everything I needed in the bubble. I think, I think I got this guy figured out. There's no more clear indicator of who a player is in the bubble. That makes total sense.

Right. Oh yeah. Look, Jamal Murray, I saw him in the bubble. No, thanks. It's like,

wait, what? You saw him. These are that same Jamal Murray a couple of weeks ago too. So you definitely aren't feeling that anymore. No, no. I was like, Oh no, please. I mean, to that, like, you know, where, where, how did you like, where did you predict the nuggets would be? Did you, are you saying they were going to be in the finals this year? I was very much so on the nuggets going to the finals this year. I just knew what they needed and they needed a perimeter defense and dogs. You can actually fight and keep guys in front of them.

Because if you can do that, Jokic is no longer your defensive liability. And if they can shoot threes and handle the ball, like KCP and Bruce Brown can, that just gives you more optionality. You can attack in different ways, and you have the defense to back it up now. Denver might be eighth in the postseason with defensive rating, but they are.6

points away from being fit. So this is not just like some mid-level defense. This is a team that has been putting together exactly the process that they want to play with, can play multiple different styles, and they've stopped Kevin Durant, Devin Booker, LeBron James, Anthony Davis, Anthony Edwards, all the way down the list. So this is a defense that can really defend now, and that's been one of the biggest differences. But to be fair, you picked the Nuggets to win the title the last six seasons right i did not i did not i know i didn't grow up a nuggets fan so i don't i don't have a whole lot of hope and i honestly didn't think they were

ready until this year so yeah so i mean one thing i have to ask is somebody who watched anthony davis try his best to try and guard yokich and. And at the time I was like, man, AD's defense is something else. What, I mean, from your perspective as you know, like I hate to sound like a courtside pundit, but what did the Heat have to do to handle the Nikola Jokic question? Is it the Kevin Garnett thing? I saw him say, he's like, yo, I'm coming after him. Boom, nonstop, make him run, try and gas him out.

Is it like, or are you saying there you cannot defeat dr manhattan you can there are ways to make yokich uncomfortable the heat don't have the ability to do those things you need to put layers of big bodies in front of him and that's why you saw the lakers put ruey on him and put ad on gordon and just put bodies after bodies between him and the rim you can't do that as the Heat. We can do put Caleb Martin on him, pull Kevin Love off the bench. Like Hayward Highsmith isn't going to check Jokic one-on-one and be able to box out. So you can't do that as the Heat.

Even if I do like some of those guys. And I think Bam Adebayo is a top three defender in this league, pretty much inarguably. I am one of the biggest Bam fans, but I put some clips on Twitter. It doesn't matter. Like Bam Adebayo can do everything he wants. It does not matter. He's lacking an inch of height and about 30 pounds of weight and a whole

lot of leverage that Jokic has that he does not, and he's been able to go right through them one-on-one. So, I don't know what you do at that point. Right. It's to the point where I'm thinking AD, you know how Michael Jordan started working out after that Pistons defeat? AD needs to go work with horses or something to serve

you. Solace like Jokic does at the horse track. Get on that program or whatever because it's working. Do we think we're going to see a lot of NBA players start adopting what Jokic does like chilling with horses

during the offseason just to try and... The Nuggets have been doing this. I was asked on a radio show I did earlier, who's the player who's benefited the most from Nikola Jokic? And I said Aaron Gordon, because Aaron Gordon has spent his entire time in Denver learning to see basketball through Nikola Jokic's eyes. He went and just traveled the world during the offseason, met Jokic and I believe the Czech Republic to watch the Serbian team play international basketball, and just like, sent some love, continued

to watch film, and came back with the intention of seeing the game through Jokic's eyes. And we've seen who the player he's become. He's no longer trying to pretend he's LeBron. Like, this is a guy who can help any team in basketball and be a third or fourth guy on a championship team. So, it's, Jokic impacts people and the way people see the game on a championship team so it's yokich impacts people

and the way people see the game in a way that you just don't see yeah so that helped his three-point shooting yeah well he's not having to take jack up shots off the dribble with the guy in his face he can sit in the corner now yeah i will say people are still somehow sleeping on Denver. So in this series, Miami were plus 400 heading into the Celtics series, which made them one of the biggest underdogs in the conference finals in years. By the way, heading into the playoffs, they were plus 6,000 to make the finals but yeah now they are plus 300 against the Nuggets and I guess that's probably because

you know people just saw them beat Boston and everyone thought Boston was but like I that doesn't track to me at all that you would be a bigger underdog versus Boston than Denver when we've seen what Denver just did to the West like that feels silly to me. It feels a lot like there's a lot of sharps who are out there trying to get

value by picking Miami early and have moved the line. That's what that feels like to me, because the nuggets have been substantially more favored than the heat for a lot of the books throughout. But as we've gotten closer and closer to the series, it seems like people are starting to overweigh the Heat because I think there's some big bets going on the Heat. So I wonder if that's part of it. And also, I think like more of, you know, the betting markets are determined by bettors and who's putting money where and the Boston Miami series was very high profile

and went to seven. And a lot of people were watching that more recently. Yeah, Denver's had nine days chilling at home. Yo, could you come back to Serbia and come back from this home? Yeah. This is our first gambling advice. I would say Denver is undervalued a little bit.

Yes. This is not financial advice though. Don't take me for financial advice. I chose journalism for a career. Do not take financial advice from me. take me for financial advice I chose journalism for a career do not take financial advice from me or us we're podcasters so what do you think

I mean it sounds like we've got your pick it's probably like heat in six or seven despite that is there anything Miami can do at this point you think it's going to be point? You think it's going to be a sweep? You think it's going to be five, six games? I have too much respect

for Jimmy Butler and Eric Spolstra to call sweep. I think this is going to most likely be a six-game series. I'm leaning closer to five, but I'm going to give Spolstra and Jimmy Butler a game or two without a doubt. Probably two. But when you start looking at the battlegrounds, the turnover battle is going to be huge.

Both of these teams thrive scoring in transition. Denver has the lowest turnover ratio in the league, so they're not going to turn the ball over very often, which is going to hurt the heat. But the Nuggets do happen to end up getting destroyed in passing lanes. That'll be a big boost for Miami. That was one nice thing that Boston did,

is that they gave them the ball, which is really nice. And like, you know, a sign of character, I think it is, you have to be able to let everybody thrive sometimes. Um, but I also think the three point variance is going to be fascinating because if they just shoot the lights out of the ball and they decide, you know what, we're going to, we're going to guard Jokic one on them with bam. If you want to take twos while we take threes, we're going to live with that because we don't know how else we can score you. And we're gonna we're gonna guard yokich one on one with bam if you want to take twos while we take threes we're gonna live with that because we don't know how else we can score you and we don't know how else we can be able to keep up with nicole yokich if we're gonna send two at them so i think that's gonna be an interesting part of this as well as can they just out shoot them and the tyler hero thing is interesting everybody keeps talking about game

three tyler hero could that make a big difference? And Tyler Hero is going to get cooked. The Nuggets, when they played them in every single game, like I watched the last four years of Heat Nuggets basketball, and every single time Tyler Hero was on the floor, it didn't matter who had the ball, they were attacking Tyler. It was an all-out blitz to attack him. And while he did get some shots up on the other end, you can't have a defensive sieve like that in the finals. You just can't. And especially when it's coming off of injury you cannot do that and when you put kcp and bruce brown on them and say that's your guy glove them it's gonna be very difficult for him to create space and create any kind of impact yeah i i would not try and bring him back if i

agree just based on like what we've seen uh But you know, we're going to end up here and they're going to be like, we don't have ball handling. We don't have shooting. We need somebody else. Get Tyler in here and it's going to go rough probably. I feel like they... Miami Heat probably are one of the teams least likely to make desperation moves. But yeah.

But Spoh also knows that if he doesn't have options, he'll hit nuclear buttons. He'll do whatever it takes. That's who he is and has always been right how uh the zone does not seem like it will work out very well against nikola jokic i got some stats for you on the zone i looked i was wondering yeah right after the heat were officially going to be the finals opponent that's the first thing i looked up the nuggets were the number one offense against the zone in the regular season they scored i have it right here 1.15 points per possession on 56 percent shooting and 45 percent from three

against the zone this year and in the playoffs they've been the best team against the zone as well so that would be a very rough call if you're going to run a lot of zone against them which was what miami did against boston but like boston should have been good against the zone right there they're shooting they just devolved into your turn my turn had no cohesion whatsoever and just took a lot of really contested mid-range twos and three-pointers that they weren't making so i there's this is a real systematic defense that is going to very specifically and intentfully attack this team against the Miami Heat regularly. They're going to know exactly what buttons to press, when to press them entering the series.

It's not going to be like Boston, who's like, we have more talent, let's just sleep through it. Denver will not be entering the series in that same way. So I don't think you can compare the way that Boston played against that zone to the way that Denver is going to. Plus, you got Jokic in the middle of the court. Good luck dealing with that in the zone. If Miami could just be playing Boston

in the finals, I feel like they'd be... That'd be a great matchup for them. I feel like I've seen that somewhere. Just do that for them. Yeah, exactly. Alright, should we take a quick break? Let's take a quick one. Come right back for the fastest segment in podcasting. History

after this. I'm Carrie Champion and this is season four of Naked Sports where we live at the intersection of sports and culture. Up first, I explore the making

of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. I know I'll go down to history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game.

Every great player needs a foil. I ain't really near them. Why is that? I just come here to play basketball every single day, and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black. I love her.

What exactly ignited this fire? Why has it been so good for the game? And can the fanfare surrounding these two supernovas be sustained? This game is only going to get better because the talent is getting better. This new season will cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke.

Señora Sex Ed is not your mommy sex talk. This show is la plática like you've never heard it before. We're breaking the stigma and silence around sex and sexuality in Latinx communities. This podcast is an intergenerational conversation between Latinas from Gen X to Gen Z. We're covering everything from body x to gen z we're covering everything from body image to representation in film and television we even interview iconic latinas like puerto rican actress ana ortiz i felt in control of my own physical body and my own self i was on birth control i had sort of had my first sexual experience.

If you're in your señora era or know someone who is, then this is the show for you. We're your hosts, Diosa and Mala, and you might recognize us from our flagship podcast, Locatora Radio. We're so excited for you to hear our brand new podcast, Señora Sex Ed. Listen to Señora Sex Ed on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast record, right? And this season, we're taking an even bigger bite out of the most delicious food and its history. Saying that the most popular cocktail is the margarita, followed by the mojito from Cuba,

and the piña colada from Puerto Rico. So all of these... We have, we think, Latin culture. There's a mention of blood sausage in Homer's Odyssey that dates back to the ninth century B.C. B.C.? I didn't realize how old the hot dog was. Listen to Hungry for History as part of the My Cultura podcast network. Available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back. Yes. Evil. DJ McBride. Oh, you poor soul. You've wandered into the fourth quarter rapid fire round of questions. This feels like when Sway does the five circles of doom or whatever. Yeah. I feel like that's what I'm getting stuck in right now. Get ready.

How's your freestyle? They fall for it every time, Miles. They fall for it every time. Brian, play the shook ones instrumental. Classics only. It was something different today. Anyway, so here we go, TJ. This is the fastest segment in sports

podcasting history. I'll say that. I think I can say that quite confidently. We're going to ask you a question. Don't think about it. Just answer just reflexively. Just pass it right back. Got it.

Okay? And if we start dragging on, we are entrusting you with keeping this entire segment moving. So you got to cut us off. Miles and I aren't on the hot seat. Don't give me this too much power. I'm going to wield it. It is way too much fun, too. I can't say the hot seat Don't give me this too much power I'm going to wield it It's way too much fun to I can't say no Well guess what

We're going to have a real tug of You can't put a big red button in front of someone And say don't press it Hey well you got the big red button And I hope you're ready I'm ready Jack we ready I'm ready

Here we go Ryan start the clock You want to go first Why don't you go first Yeah I'm going to go first Someone's got to pick. Let's go. Let's go.

Yeah. Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Hold on. This is my best surprise. Hey, my time. My time. My time. My time.

Hold on. My time. Quick twang. You're getting lost again. Come on back. What is this guy's problem? This is Miles and Jack got mad boosties, not TJ got a spicy mouth. All right.

Start the clock back up. TJ McBride, is there a single NBA player you would take right now over the chance of taking Wemba Yama with the first pick this summer? Wow. That was quick. After we just heard everything that this man has said

about Nikola Jokic. Yes. He's still going to take Wemba Yama. Yes. Just... Now what is it about Wemba Yama? I thought we weren't doing this. I thought this was rapid fire. I came off the chest. I'm asking a follow-up question, which I believe is in the bylaw.

We've never seen anything like this. This is a beyond LeBron level prospect. I mean, you don't see someone miss a three, follow it up, grab their own offensive rebound, and throw it back down. The guy is incredible, and I believe in his body, the way that they're actually working on his plyometrics and they're working on his flexibility. Well, we heard it here first. TJ, we're talking teams we want to cover in the offseason.

Spurs are a shoo-in because of the aforementioned Ohabayama. What's a team you're expecting big things from? We got Spurs, We got OKC. We got the Magic. Who's another team that people might be sleeping on that we're going to? Wake us up.

Wake us up. The Suns. I know it's very low-hanging fruit, but you give an offseason for Kevin Durant and Devin Booker to figure things out and retool around them and get Aiton out of there, that's going to be a scary team no matter what. That team was not ready for the playoffs this year. The Nuggets caught somewhat of a break because they were so fresh together And I think now we're gonna see a much scarier Suns team next year than they were this year

Maybe like we can plan out some like dates or like some things that they can do together Top flight top golf top golf yeah why did i say top flight sad story i lost a golf club into the driving range last time i went to top golf never went back like yeah like hands lost it and it was gone it might have been the sweating from the beard but that's neither here nor there got it got it i get that tj next question jalen Rose's hair? Is that a question? Is the answer no? Yeah, there was a...

I heard a question mark on there. You heard me? Yeah, the answer is just no, and I'm going to leave it there. Wow. No. No. Wow. Okay. And you're going to leave it there. No elaboration. Yeah.

I mean, the question was vague, so I think the answer could be just as vague, in all fairness. Dream in-game commentary team. Who takes over? Does these finals? Sedano sideline. Doris Burke in the booth with Ian Eagle, who does the Nets call. Yeah. Ian Eagle's so good.

So good. So good. I've had enough green. Although it was funny watching Jamal Murray pointed him and scream bang last time he hit him. That was a moment right there. I remember that a little too vividly. I had a friend when we were playing intramural ball who would always shout bang bang

every time the ball left his hand. And he was like a 30% three-point shooter. Bang, bang. Bang, bang. Okay, next one. Since you have LA roots, I gotta ask you,

rank these three LA chains. In-N-Out, Fatburger, Tommy's. Fatburger, In-N-Out, Tommy's. Fatburger is vastly superior to most burger spots. And I will get shakes there anytime. And that's the Johnson owns part of it. And that's the king of LA.

So, right. Okay. Okay. That's fair. That's fair. I like that. Then we in and out next.

Where are we? What are we doing? Yeah. In and out next. Okay. Wait, why? How come Tommy's is low?

You don't like it. I like it. I'm just partial to it. I like the fries at in and out. I like the shakes. I don't know. Hey, look at that. Someone In-N-Out. I'm just partial to it. I like the fries at In-N-Out. I like the shakes at In-N-Out. Hey, look at that. Someone with taste who likes In-N-Out fries like me.

Everyone comes for In-N-Out fries, and I'm like, not me. I don't get it. They're like, what? You don't like natural potatoes? That's the problem here? Yeah. I like them floppy. I love me some In-N-Out fries.

Go to In-N-Out for sloppy fries. Pour water all over them. All right. You can take any former Denver great, put him with this current group with the Nuggets. Which former great are you choosing to make a run in today's

NBA? I'm gonna go with Alex English. I wanted to pick David Thompson, but Alex English would have been a little bit more team-oriented. It would have been a little bit different otherwise, but Alex English would have been a little bit more team oriented. It would have been a little bit different otherwise, but Alex English is a guy who has watched this Nuggets team closely too. He still is a part of this organization in a loose sense. So I very much so would think Alex English, that scoring was out of this world. And you put a wing

like that next to Nikola, he'd be a little bit, he'd be Michael Porter Jr. actualized. Yeah. Okay. Follow-up question. How much does it bother you to see Russell Wilson courtside when he's sitting courtside? Do you think that that could, like that's one of the potential things that's making me believe in the heat is like when Russell Wilson's courtside.

Yeah, so the LA pass of mine is a Raiders, a Los Angeles Raiders pass. So everything Broncos needs to burn. I'm done. I hate it. I may not be a diehard Raiders fan anymore, but I hate everything to do with the Broncos still to this day. So anytime I see any of that, I'm out.

It's the most annoying thing when Peyton Manning on the Jumbo Tron or Russell Wilson on the Jumbo Tron is the loudest that it gets in ball arena. So I'm out on everything Broncos. You could have picked anyone out of a hat and I'm out. What's your favorite ball offering in terms of glass storage jars? Oh, I actually have the Mason jars in my cabinet as my glasses. Cause I do the old school poor thing of finding them at the grocery store for like six bucks. And this is a cup.

So those ball Mason jars are the elite cups. Yes. I got the big one with the screw top one next to me but that i have all the lids and everything it's the way i just added that question too yeah he just added that question and now and he knew that was coming it's like as i'm about to ask this one no where are we going jack or miles what do you mean i don't i don't follow jack oh you seem confident with everything else this is going to be the way we do this because i think that i'm gonna have to go jabari okay wow that's my man no you know what i'm over that answer all right whatever whatever that's my man all right all right taylor jason McBride. It's been real today.

TJ McBride, man. Thank you so much for joining us. Miles and Jack got mad boosties. That was tough. It's been so much fun. Where can people find you, follow you, read you, do all that kind of stuff? Yeah, just at TJ McBride MBA. That's where everything goes through on my Twitter.

You'll see everything I do there. I'll repost this whenever it comes out as well. So you'll see everything that I do from that Twitter feed. Go click on the link to this episode and listen to it a second time. Yes. Exactly. Boost them numbers. Thank you. Boosties. Exactly. Shout out to our Boosties listener of the week, Matt

Chambers, for the recent show review. By the way, review the show. We love reviews. It helps people find it. Matt Chambers said, title review the show. We love reviews. It helps people find it. Matt Chambers said title of the review. Ha ha ha ha ha ha! That's exactly what you guys have been

going for. Body. On the nose. Body. You've avoided them all year in favor of more Embiid segments. But now you have to talk about the Spurs. Jack, Wemby's going to bring the Spurs into another decade-long 50 game streak i think also he was using jack the way that joe biden does like as an old person i don't think he's talking to me hit the road jack it's like that kind of jack

yeah yeah uh anyway make sure you give us a follow on twitter at mad boosties at m-a-d-b-o-o-s-t-i-e-s yeah exactly that's it we did it another one in the book a perfect thanks for doing it thank you so much tj uh and yeah we'll check in with the finals with y'all next week on more miles and jack got mad boosties when we have a new producer because I'm tired of this Jabari. Who is this guy? So-called Jabari winning the Miles and Jack segment. This is crap. I'm Carrie Champion, and this is season four of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry.

Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. Every great player needs a foil. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Listen to the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by

Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. I'm Carrie Champion, and this is season four of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore The Making of a Rivalry, Caitlin Clark versus Angel Reese. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game.

Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's basketball. And on this new season, we'll cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio apps, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. There's so much beauty in Mexican culture, like mariachis, delicious cuisine, and even lucha libre. Join us for the new podcast, Lucha Libre Behind the Mask, a 12-episode podcast in both English and Spanish about the history and cultural richness of lucha libre.

And I'm your host, Santos Escobar, emperor of Lucha Libre and a WWE superstar. Santos! Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you stream podcasts.