The Daily - The End of Andrew Cuomo?

Episode Date: August 5, 2021

This episode contains descriptions of sexual harassment.After accusations of sexual harassment against Gov. Andrew Cuomo of New York surfaced early this year, an independent investigation was begun.And while people around the governor — and his critics — expected the ensuing report to be bad, what came out this week was worse.There have been widespread calls for Mr. Cuomo to resign, but will he go?Guest: Shane Goldmacher, a national political reporter for The New York Times.Sign up here to get The Daily in your inbox each morning. And for an exclusive look at how the biggest stories on our show come together, subscribe to our newsletter. Background reading: Investigators into sexual harassment by Mr. Cuomo said they had corroborated the claims of 11 women who accused the governor of inappropriate behavior, including suggestive comments and instances of groping.A new account of sexual harassment by Mr. Cuomo from a state trooper bolsters a meticulous new report on his misdeeds — and how his inner circle allowed such conduct to fester.In the wake of the report, the New York governor has been met with consequential defections from core constituencies, including labor, white suburban lawmakers and Black political leaders.For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. Transcripts of each episode will be made available by the next workday. 

From The New York Times, I'm Michael Barbaro. This is The Daily. Today. From the White House to the state legislature, Democratic leaders are demanding that New York Governor Andrew Cuomo resign or be removed from office for sexually harassing 11 women. I spoke with my colleague, Shane Goldbacher, about the explosive report that could end Cuomo's career

and what happens next. It's Thursday, August 5th. Shane, the last time we talked to you back in March, you told us the story of Andrew Cuomo's political rise and what started to look like the beginning, potentially, of his political fall. Can you briefly remind us of the outlines of that story? Yeah, Andrew Cuomo is a three-term governor of New York, the son of a three-term governor of New York. And last year, he built a big national profile seen as effective and decisive during the pandemic, emerged kind of as an anti-Trump for the Democratic Party. But as 2020 turned to 2021, he started to face two twin crises. One was about the nursing home deaths that occurred during the pandemic in New York,

both the number of them and whether his administration had intentionally covered up just how many people had died. And the second was a growing number of accusations from women who had worked with him that he had sexually harassed them. And as these women came out one by one, there were growing calls for investigations and a number of top Democrats saying it was time for him to resign because of them. Right. And at the time, Shane, you told us that Governor Cuomo was banking on the support of New York's voters, not lawmakers, and that he believed, to quote you, that voters weren't ready to say goodbye to him and that they believed in him and what he had gotten done as governor.

So his wager was that if he could hold on to the support of regular New Yorkers, he could hold on to his governorship. He bought himself time. So in the spring, an independent investigation began from the state attorney general's office, and Cuomo set out to rebuild his relationship with New Yorkers while this investigation was happening, making numerous public appearances about the vaccine, appearing with key constituency groups while the investigation was happening. But that all seemed to change this week when the report actually came out. Good morning. I'm joined here today by Ann Clark and June Kim, the two lead attorneys who were

designated as special deputies, to announce the findings of their investigation into allegations of sexual harassment made against Governor Andrew Cuomo. And so what is in this report? Well, first of all, I think that people around Cuomo and his critics expected the report to be bad, but it was worse.

The independent investigation has concluded that Governor Andrew Cuomo sexually harassed multiple women and in doing so violated federal and state law. And I would break it down into three buckets of new information. The first is new details from his accusers that we knew. The second is new evidence corroborating those allegations. And the third is new accusers we had not previously heard from. So in that first category, the details are frankly hard to read. One current employee who we identify as executive assistant number one endured repeated physical violations. You had one executive assistant

who has accused him of groping her. On November 16th, 2020, in the executive mansion, the governor hugged executive assistant number one and reached under her blouse to grab her breast. Also saying that she would get so nervous in his presence that she would get hives on the back of her neck. There were also several occasions on which the governor grabbed her butt. That same assistant said that he once requested a selfie photograph with her and that when they took it that she was shaking so much That same assistant said that he once requested a selfie photograph with her, and that when they took it, that she was shaking so much because he was rubbing her butt at the time,

that the image ended up blurry. Executive assistant number one had vowed that she was going to take these violations, as she put it, to the grave. She was terrified that if she spoke out, she would lose her job. Then you have people like Charlotte Bennett who had worked for the governor last year and who went public with her allegations and really, I think, helped turn the tide toward opening an investigation because she had actually gone to the governor's office

to complain about his behavior in real time. When she confided in the governor that she'd been sexually assaulted in college, he asked her for the details of her assault. We knew in advance the kind of conversations that the governor had had with her. He speculated on how her history as a sexual assault survivor might affect her romantic life. Asking about her sex life. He asked her whether she had ever been with older men. He told her that he was lonely and wanted to be touched. Questioned if she was monogamous in her relationships. He suggested that she get a tattoo she was contemplating on her butt.

And the report includes text messages that she sent contemporaneously. Text messages that she sent contemporaneously. Miss Bennett texted to a friend on the day where many of these comments were made that she was upset and confused and that she was shaking. Telling her friends that it was, quote, the most explicit it could be of his behavior. She described it as feeling like she was being groomed. So this is real-time corroborating evidence that what she had originally said was true because she had documented it more or less as it was happening. Writing in messages to her friends. And the report is filled with these,

with texts, with emails, with notes taken by the people that Charlotte Bennett reported his behavior to. Our investigation revealed that these were not isolated incidents. They were part of a pattern. Shane, you mentioned new accusers. Can you tell us about them? There are several.

The governor's pattern of sexually harassing behavior was not limited to members of his own staff, but extended to other state employees. But the one that really stood out, both for me and who seemed to resonate politically, is a state trooper who served as part of his security detail and who described a series of interactions with Cuomo that left her very uncomfortable. In an elevator, while standing behind the trooper, he ran his finger from her neck down her spine and said, hey you. Another time, she was standing holding the door open for the governor. As he passed, he took his open hand and ran it across her stomach from her belly button to the hip where she keeps her gun.

She told us that she felt completely violated to have the governor touch her, as she put it, between her chest and her privates. Another time, when the governor found out that the trooper was engaged, he asked her why she'd want to get married because, among other things actions left her feeling completely violated. Wow. And this is a member of his own security team. This was a woman working for him, charged with keeping him safe. And she seemed to feel unsafe herself. charged with keeping him safe, and she seemed to feel unsafe herself. The coexistence in the executive chamber's culture of fear and flirtation, intimidation and intimacy, abuse and affection, created a work environment ripe for harassment. And the report didn't just cover Andrew Cuomo's behavior. It covered the culture

at the senior levels of his administration. It was a culture where you could not say no to the governor. And if you upset him or his senior staff, you'll be written off, cast aside, or worse. It described a culture of fear and intimidation and the normalization of behavior that amounted to sexual harassment. The witnesses described a culture that normalized and overlooked everyday flirtations, physical intimacy, and inappropriate comments by the governor. One senior staffer testified that at a work event, she sat on the governor's lap. Another staffer said she recalled kissing the governor on the lips. So this very damning report corroborates a lot of the original accusations, uncovers very serious new allegations and corroborates those,

and casts real doubt on Cuomo's previous denials. The attorney general's office found these women all to be credible and the governor not to be. We should believe women and that what we have an obligation and a duty to do is to protect women in their workplace. And what this investigation revealed was a disturbing pattern of conduct by the governor of the great state of New York. In fact, they write, the governor's blanket denials and lack of recollection as to specific incidents stood in stark contrast to the strength, specificity, and corroboration of the complainant's recollections. They basically said, add up all the evidence. I believe women. And we believe the women.

And I believe these 11 women. And not the governor. I thank you all for being here this morning. Thank you. Okay, so what happens next? After this report, this bombshell report, is released. So less than two hours after the report is released. Over the past several months, you have heard a number of complaints brought against me. Cuomo puts out a response. First, I want you to know directly from me that I never touched anyone

inappropriately or made inappropriate sexual advances. It is a pre-taped video of him describing the events. There is one complaint made by a young woman, Charlotte Bennett. From his vantage point. And I did ask questions to try to see if she had positive support of dating relationships. And while he admits some behavior that he says might have been misconstrued for generational or cultural reasons. Cuomo's response amounts to mostly one line.

They heard things that I just didn't say. They heard things that I just didn't say. And to me, that felt like such a specific phrase, a way not to say the women themselves were lying, but that they had misinterpreted, perhaps, his behavior. I do kiss people on the forehead. I do kiss people on the cheek. I do kiss people on the hand. And at the same time, this video was splicing together images of him hugging. I do embrace people.

I do hug people, men and women. And he goes through and he says young and old and straight and LGBT. Powerful people. And powerful people. All these images of him hugging. Strangers, powerful people, all these images of him hugging. Friends, strangers, people who I meet on the street. And I think that overall, this video didn't seem to come across particularly well, both among his supporters and his critics, who saw it as blamecasting the women for how they felt from their interactions with him. Mm-hmm. Right. They misinterpreted what he had intended to be non-sexual.

That's what he's saying. But at the same time, he's kind of rationalizing behavior he said didn't happen. So it's a little confusing. It is. I think it's both at the same time. Mm-hmm. So you've started to hint at this, but what is the overall reaction,

especially from elected officials, to Cuomo's defense here, to his response to this report? Well, remember, a lot of top New York Democrats had already called for Andrew Cuomo to resign when the allegations first came out. And so after this report was released,

they repeated those demands. The people of New York deserve better leadership in the governor's office. Senators Chuck Schumer. We continue to believe that the governor should resign. The fact that there are 11 women coming forward is deeply, deeply disturbing. And Kirsten Gillibrand.

I think these actions are inappropriate for the governor of New York State. But then... Calls for New York Governor Andrew Cuomo to resign are growing louder. The list of Democratic lawmakers calling on Cuomo to resign seems to grow by the hour. We started to hear from the Democrats who had resisted calls for him to step down. A trio of House Democrats say Cuomo should step down. They previously had not called on Cuomo to resign. There were lawmakers from New York like Hakeem Jeffries, Greg Meeks, and Tom Suozzi. And then came the most prominent Democrat of all. Back in March, you said that if the investigation confirmed the allegations against

Governor Cuomo, then he should resign. So will you now call on him to resign, given the investigator said the 11 women were credible? I stand by that statement. Joe Biden, who also has been close with Andrew Cuomo for years, who came to New York to back Andrew Cuomo's 2018 re-election. And he announced that he too was calling for Andrew Cuomo to resign. Are you now calling on him to resign? Yes. Right. It doesn't get much worse or serious than the sitting president of your own party telling you as a governor that it's time for you to resign.

Yeah, and I think that there are a few politicians in the country who would hear that message and decide that they were sticking it out and staying in office anyway. And Andrew Cuomo is one of them. People around him have said he is not going to resign. And it quickly became clear that if Andrew Cuomo is going to no longer be governor of New York, it's not going to come from public statements issued in Washington. It's going to come from a shove in Albany formally pushing him out of office.

shove in Albany, formally pushing him out of office. We'll be right back. So Shane, you said that for Andrew Cuomo to ever leave office, he would need a shove from Albany. Translate that. What exactly does that mean? Well, look, Joe Biden can put incredible political pressure on Andrew Cuomo. But what he can't do is actually remove him from public office. Andrew Cuomo either has to do that himself by resigning, or the state legislature in Albany can do it for him through an impeachment process. can do it for him through an impeachment process. And in Albany, the impeachment process starts in the state assembly, just as it starts in the House in Washington, D.C. Right. And Shane, in our last conversation,

we talked about the relationship between Governor Cuomo and state legislators in Albany. And my recollection is that it is not very good. Not very good is an understatement. There are few lawmakers with a real and close relationship to Andrew Cuomo. Most have been at the receiving end of his bullying and vindictive behavior, as they have described it. And that even when there are successes, even when he signs their bills, he takes credit for them and leaves them behind. And so on Tuesday afternoon, after this report came out, the assembly got together for an emergency phone call to figure out what to do next.

And on that call, there wasn't a single lawmaker who voiced their support for Andrew Cuomo. According to multiple people I talked to, it just wasn't there. And while he has a bad relationship overall with lawmakers, he does have some pockets of support. And there had been some groups of lawmakers who had said, let's wait until we have the results of an investigation

who hadn't joined the stampede calling for his resignation this spring. But even those lawmakers didn't speak up on his behalf on that phone call. And in the hours since, a number of them have issued statements saying, it's in fact time for him to step aside. And the most important voice among these assembly Democrats is their leader, a lawmaker named Carl Hastie, who'd been among the people given Cuomo time, saying, let's wait until the results of this investigation came in.

And then late on Tuesday, he issued a statement. And he didn't pass his own judgment on Andrew Cuomo. But he said that the governor had lost the confidence of the Assembly Democrats. And that, quote, he can no longer remain in office. And he promised to quickly begin the process of impeachment. of the Assembly Democrats, and that, quote, he can no longer remain in office. And he promised to quickly begin the process of impeachment. Hmm. So the lawmaker who would be in charge of an impeachment process that could result in Andrew Cuomo being removed from office is now putting out a statement saying it's time

for him to leave that office, which would seem to imply a threat. Leave or you'll be impeached. And there's a lot of focus on this statement in even the adverbs that Carl Hastie uses. He says that they will move expeditiously and quickly. And there's a real question of, well, what does that mean? Are we talking days or weeks or months? And the broad sense is that the assembly will still take a few weeks at a minimum to wrap up their investigation into the allegations against Cuomo. So it's increasingly looking like impeachment may happen to Andrew Cuomo. Absolutely. Right. Because I guess the question at this point is, Absolutely.

Right, because I guess the question at this point is, what would prevent a New York state Democratic lawmaker from voting to oust Andrew Cuomo? Would it be because of his name, his family's legacy? Would it be because of his reputation for retaliation or what? You know, I wouldn't underestimate the rareness of members of a party ousting a chief executive of their own party. And so the idea that Democrats alone would provide all of the votes to remove a Democratic governor who by only a few months ago was overwhelmingly popular

and who still has millions of dollars in the bank to bankroll his own political future and who has shown a history of vindictiveness, while they may not like him and they might be prepared, it doesn't make it an easy vote to take. Right. It's one thing to threaten it. It's another thing to actually cast that vote to impeach a leader of your own party.

It's one of the most severe votes a lawmaker can ever take. I'm curious, Shane, how these lawmakers and how Cuomo are thinking about the voters. Because I'm remembering our first conversation about Cuomo's belief that the voters were going to be his lifeline. That regular New Yorkers weren't ready for him to leave office. Do you think that these lawmakers are thinking about that? And are they worried that their appetite for impeachment might not be aligned with the views of New Yorkers? Well, I think it's safe to say that Democratic politicians right now in New York

have a greater appetite for Andrew Cuomo's removal than Democratic voters across the entire state. At this point, you're looking at 100% of the congressional delegation supports his removal. But that's the thing about being a political leader, is sometimes you're leading the public in your direction. And at this point, every major Democrat in the country is pulling in the direction of getting Andrew Cuomo out of office. So Andrew Cuomo can hope that public sentiment will stay behind him. But the very first polling that exists, and it's a quick poll taken by Marist, shows building momentum to have Andrew Cuomo removed from office.

Came out, said 59% of New Yorkers say he should resign. And that includes notably 52% of Democrats. And at this point, even as Andrew Cuomo a few weeks ago looked like he planned to try to run for re-election, only 18% of Democrats said they still supported him running for a fourth term in 2022. So in the end, this relationship with New York voters that has allowed Andrew Cuomo to remain in office up to this point, despite these original allegations, it may not end up saving him in the end. It might not let him remain governor.

mostly just fighting for time. He's fighting for time to repair his relationship with lawmakers who could impeach him. He's fighting for time to repair his relationship with the public, who is increasingly unsupportive of him. Mm-hmm. And look, he used time effectively this spring during the investigation.

And after the allegations, he began making appearances across the state with key constituency groups, with clergy leaders, even with some of the lawmakers who said he should resign. But it feels different now. The pace and pressure is intensifying

and the legislature is signaling it's going to be moving fast. And it's just not clear that time is on Andrew Cuomo's side. By my calculations, Shane, Governor Cuomo has about a year left in his term. Governor Cuomo has about a year left in his term. Is there a version of this where perhaps Cuomo does serve out his term and does survive this, despite the extraordinary seriousness of these allegations and the evidence against him? I can tell you what I can't imagine, which is that Andrew Cuomo voluntarily leaves this job.

You have to remember, he came of age in the governor's mansion when his father was governor and he was one of his top aides. He spent his career working toward running for governor. And he's now in his third term. He once said the only way he would leave office in the middle of this term was if God struck him dead. But I don't think he ever even considered the possibility of impeachment. Well, Shane, thank you very much. We appreciate it. Thank you. On Wednesday, three different district attorneys from across New York said they were now investigating Cuomo,

raising the possibility of criminal charges against him. Several labor unions that once backed Cuomo withdrew their support, and the head of the state's Democratic Party called on Cuomo to resign, saying that his removal from office was, quote, inevitable. We'll be right back. Here's what else you need to know today.

Here's what else you need to know today. As of Wednesday, the global tally of known COVID-19 infections has surpassed 200 million, a figure that reflects the world's inability to contain the virus nearly two years into the pandemic. The known death toll from the virus now stands at 4.2 million, but it is believed that the real number is far higher. Meanwhile, while hundreds of millions of people are still waiting for their first dose, some rich countries are moving towards booster doses. The World Health Organization has called for a moratorium on administering COVID-19 booster shots, saying that the vaccine should instead be reserved for poorer countries, where most people have yet to receive a first shot.

We need an urgent reversal from the majority of vaccines going to high-income countries to the majority going to low-income countries. The plea from the WHO comes as several European countries, including Germany, Belgium and Italy, prepare to begin giving booster shots next month. Today's episode was produced by Jessica Chung, Michael Simon-Johnson, Daniel Guimet, Chelsea Daniel, and Aastha Chaturvedi. It was edited by Dave Shaw and Rachel Quester. Original music by Dan Powell and Marian Lozano. And engineered by Chris Wood.

That's it for The Daily. I'm Michael Barbaro. See you tomorrow.