The Daily - Trump Picks His Running Mate — and Political Heir

Episode Date: July 16, 2024

On the first day of the Republican National Convention, Donald J. Trump chose his running mate: Senator J.D. Vance of Ohio.We watched the process unfold in real time in Milwaukee.Michael C. Bender, who covers Mr. Trump and his movement for The Times, takes us through the day.Guest: Michael C. Bender, a political correspondent covering Donald J. Trump and his Make America Great Again movement for The New York Times.Background reading: What to know about J.D. Vance, Mr. Trump’s running mate.Mr. Trump’s decision to pick Mr. Vance signals concern for the future of his MAGA movement.For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. Transcripts of each episode will be made available by the next workday. 

From The New York Times, I'm Michael Barbaro. This is The Daily. Today, on the first day of the Republican National Convention, Donald Trump makes his choice of a running mate. We watched it unfold in real time from Milwaukee. It's Tuesday, July 16th. You okay? I'm getting phone interference.

Oh no, maybe that's from your phone. There's like 16 phones in this car. I'm smarter. Okay. It is 9.35 a.m. on Monday morning, and we are driving into downtown Milwaukee to the headquarters of the Republican National Convention. And it's day one, the opening hours of what will be the Republican Party's crowning of their nominee, former President Donald Trump. And the singular event that hangs over this entire convention is the one that none of us expected, which is the attempted assassination of the presumptive Republican nominee.

And the news is just flying at us this morning. We just got word that he's going to be announcing his running mate today, his choice of a VP. So this is a pretty extraordinary day already, before 10 a.m., and we're going to try to make sense of a VP. So this is a pretty extraordinary day already, before 10 a.m., and we're going to try to make sense of it all. We just went through the first round of Secret Service asking to see our badges. We are now stopped at a giant metal pop-up wall and in front of us

cars are being slowly and very thoroughly inspected by bomb sniffing dogs and security teams. Hi! Hi, you guys are good. You just have to get the screen through the checkpoint. Okay, thank you. Secret service. Can. Open the trunk. Get the engine off. Pop the hood for me please. Oh, the front hood? How do I do that?

Wearing a rental car? Here we go. She's got it. Look at her. She's a pro. And also, don't run into my barricade. People keep doing that even though it says stop on it. You know?

Keep your eyes open. Alrighty? Be safe everybody. Thank you so much. So we're headed in for deeper security. Can you back up for me real quick? Yep. Thank you so much. So we're headed in for deeper security. Can you back up for me real quick?

Michael? Yeah. Good. Good to go. Carlos? Good to go. And Rachel? Yes.

Good to go. Thank you. There wasn't a single package inside that bag that they didn't search. Hi. Checking over here. Thank you guys for coming. I can take whoever's next. Hi. Checking over here. Thank you guys for coming. I can take whoever's next. Bye.

Once we made it through all that security, we walked into the first official event of the day, a briefing for reporters from the Trump campaign about what this first day of the convention would look like. So we're inside a very big ballroom that has a podium and two flags set up next to it. Wisconsin, United States. There's about, I don't know, 200 journalists in here filling a quarter of the room.

And a lot of red-shirted RNC staffers and volunteers who are kind of corralling us. And we're going to wait and see what they have to say. But just as this briefing was about to begin, we were told that it was for planning purposes only and that we couldn't use any of the audio from it. I just want to summarize what we heard in this news conference. Essentially what senior advisors to the Trump campaign just told us is that this day is going to be very action-packed. It is going to begin

in the early afternoon with the official technical nomination by delegates of Trump as the Republican nominee. And then in the early afternoon, around three o'clock or so, the nomination of a vice presidential candidate will occur. What that means is that sometime between now, 10.30 a.m. or so and 3 p.m., we will know the identity of who Trump's running mate will be. And finally, we are going to lay eyes on Donald Trump himself at around 9 p.m. in the evening. And the crowd is going to go wild because it's the first time many of them, many of us will have seen him since the assassination attempt. So it's a really packed schedule filled with a giant piece of news in the middle, which is who Trump picked as his running mate. Mike Bender. Hello. To get inside Trump's decision making, we turn to our colleague Mike Bender, a politics reporter at The Times who's been on the VP beat for the past few months.

reporter at The Times who's been on the VP beat for the past few months. Okay, we just want to bug you for a minute about what is the status of the VP choice. Last time we talked to you, you told us that there were three top contenders, Doug Burgum, Governor of North Dakota, Florida Senator Marco Rubio, and Ohio Senator J.D. Vance. So like, where do things sit here at 11 at noon on Monday? Just hours before he's actually supposed to make the announcement and nominate the running mate. I mean, I literally ran into a couple of sources who are with other VP contenders who are telling me that they haven't received word one way or the other yet. I don't think he's told the person yet. I mean, we're three hours from a nomination. I seriously do not think that Trump has actually made the formal offer yet.

We have to like, I think we have to just like explain that to people. We're three hours from the necessary public disclosure of this information. And it's not clear that the decision has been made. Yeah, no, it's amazing. I mean, Trump is known to vacillate over big decisions. He did almost the same thing back in 2016 when he picked Mike Pence. He decided to pick Mike Pence and then spent the night before their first news conference together complaining to aides that he had made the wrong choice, wondering if he could pick someone differently. My reporting over the last week has been that he's been going through similar

iterations on this decision. So we're going to lightly stalk you until we get the news. And hopefully when we get the news, you can break it to us or it will be broken over our heads and then we'll talk about it. It will make sense. Yeah, definitely. I am also hoping to be the first to know. And if I'm the first to know, you guys will be the second to know. Okay, thank you, Michael. Yeah. Just as we finished talking to Mike, he made a phone call.

Hey, you don't think, why don't you think it's Marco? He called? Like, just now? Okay. I just saw some folks outside who, for another another contender who haven't heard anything yet. So, I mean, and that was 30 minutes ago, so I'm wondering if it's, like, happening now. No, I didn't see that. Okay. Okay. Okay. Thanks. Bye.

So can you just tell us about that phone call you had? Yeah, yeah, definitely. This was someone who is very close with one of the VP contenders, one of the final three. This contender just received a call from Trump's team saying he's not the pick. Soon enough, Mike confirmed that Marco Rubio had been crossed off the VP list and that Rubio wasn't the only VP contender to receive that call. and that Rubio wasn't the only VP contender to receive that call. So it's 1.30 p.m., and this is a little unorthodox, but I'm peeking over the shoulder of my colleague Mike Bender, and I can see that he's writing the following.

Both Doug Burgum and Marco Rubio have been told that they are not Trump's VP choice. So in real time, assuming that this is right, we're left thinking that the choice is either J.D. Vance or some wildcard person who we haven't even thought of. Ladies and gentlemen, we are about to begin a very important part of our program. I would like to ask that the aisles be cleared and the delegates please take their seats. Thank you. In the meantime, the official business of this convention began. The nomination of Trump as the Republican nominee.

Michael, tell me what's happening. Okay. So at this point, 2 p.m., the roll call of delegates is underway on the floor of the convention hall. West Virginia, 32 delegates. So what's happening right now is that the delegates from each state are publicly pledging their support to Donald Trump. And the delegates from each state represent the outcome of the primary vote that happened many, many months ago.

So like right now, West Virginia's, you know, a designated speaker with a red hard hat on is saying, from the great state of West Virginia. And to cast those 32 votes for our former and future president, Donald J. Trump. We are pledging our 32 delegates to Donald Trump. And on and on and on it will go. And so this is a formality, adding up all the delegates from all the states, but it's actually a technically required component of Donald Trump becoming and accepting his party's nomination. And Trump will become the official nominee

when 1,215 delegates in this room have pledged their support to him, which will probably be in about, like, 30 minutes. I stand before you today on behalf of the great state of New Hampshire. And after Trump is nominated, this entire exercise happens all over again for his running mate, whose identity we still don't know. So that's where a lot of the suspense of this moment is, not in the obvious fact that Donald Trump's about to be nominated, but that everyone in this room is about to nominate a running mate that they don't know

the identity of, that we don't know the identity of, that we don't know the identity of. And we have to know the identity of it before it happens. And all of a sudden, after not knowing how or when we would learn Trump's choice, we finally do. And it's delivered in classic Trump fashion. So I've just seen on True Social that Trump has announced his VP pick and it is J.D. Vance of Ohio. Okay. Daily editor Rachel Quester

breaking the news that it's Vance, which we kind of thought it would be. But now we know. After the break, Vance's nomination and why Trump picked him. We'll be right back. Okay, so we're walking to the convention hall. It's a bit of a trek.

It's very hot outside and blazingly bright. And we are now entering the media doorway. How are you? Thank you. Where are you trying to get? To the floor. Okay, just right out there, and then somebody on the direct. Okay. Around 3.30 or so, we walked out onto the convention floor just as Vance was being nominated as Trump's running mate.

USA! USA! USA! All right, time for a little convention business here. The question is on the motion that Senator J.D. Vance be nominated by acclamation. This room is about to complete the nomination of Vance as VP. All those opposed, signify by saying no. In the opinion of the chair, the ayes have it, and the motion is adopted. Without objection, the motion to reconsider is laid upon the table. And just to give you a little bit of a sense of the feel of the room,

J.D. Vance is smiling really widely. He's leaning back. He's laughing. Crowd is chanting, J.D., J.D. And he seems a little in awe of the moment. I am proud to announce that Senator J.D. Vance has the overwhelming support of this convention to be the next vice president of the United States.

And that's that. J.D. Vance, vice presidential nominee. We got to get out of here. When that was over, we headed back to where Mike Bender was working to talk to him about Trump's choice. So welcome to the Daily Studio here in Milwaukee. Okay. Awesome.

Can we close this door? You can shut that, yeah. Mike, you ready? Yep. So if you believe that Donald Trump made this decision, as we think he did, kind of at the last minute, even if you've been thinking about it for a long time, what's your understanding of why he chose J.D. Vance? I think Trump is making this pick on who he he thinks Vance can help him win in Pennsylvania, in Michigan, Wisconsin. These are essential states for victory in November, both for Trump and President Biden.

Trump won them in 2016, but lost to Biden in those same states in 2020. He's very openly saying, I have made a strategic choice. What's interesting about that, Mike, is that in our conversation a couple weeks ago when we talked about who Trump was looking at closely, you had said that he wasn't thinking about these traditional questions of, does my VP win me, X state, Y state?

You know, he was engaging in questions of personal rapport, and he got along really well with Doug Burgum. So clearly the strategic question became front of mind for Trump. And I just want to understand, was there something in the race that changed that made him suddenly think about this or what? Well, well, well, look at the Daily fact checking its reporters here on air. Well, you're not wrong either, Michael. There has been a shift in the last few weeks with Trump. He's gone from talking about finding a running mate who could help him govern to finding a running mate who can help him govern and someone who can help him win. And when he ran the analysis here,

when he looked at the different set of candidates he has, his ultimate decision was that J.D. Vance is the one who can do that. Vance will take him deeper into the states where he needs to win in the Midwest and appeal directly to the working class, blue-collar voters he needs to capture these battlegrounds. Explain exactly why he thinks J.D. Vance helps him win those three or so key states. What is it about Vance's story that maps onto that strategy? The answer is both biographical and rooted in policy. Vance is a child of Appalachia. He grew up in a poor working class neighborhood in Ohio. He served in the military.

And when he decided to run for his first elected office in 2022, he was very far right on a lot of issues. He is one of the most staunch anti-abortion voices in the Senate right now. He's an economic populist, a sort of anti-trade isolationist. He was one of the first voices urging the Senate to vote against aid for Ukraine at a time where his party leaders were supporting that. So for Trump, when it comes to selling the idea of Trumpism and MAGAism, J.D. Vance is a very effective communicator for him, particularly in a crucial area of the country, that if Trump issue like abortion, and from and of the place in the country that Trump needs to win, the Midwest, Appalachia, and that combination means, for Trump, Vance. Yeah, exactly. I think it's also helpful to kind of put this in the context of the other contenders. Right.

Vance is not bringing a new piece of the puzzle to Trumpism. Marco Rubio, the senator from Florida, would have been a Spanish-speaking advocate who may appeal more to Latinos. Governor Doug Burgum from North Dakota could have helped settle down that pro-business Republicans who are nervous about Trump's unpredictability. Trump is sort of signaling here that he's not interested in adding to the party. He doesn't want to make the tent bigger. He's doubling down on this sort of white working class, pro-MAGA piece of the party that he sees not just as a way to win in November, but very clearly the path for the party in the future. Of all the candidates Trump was thinking about for VP, and we've talked about this with you, they went on a journey, right, from Trump skeptic to Trump supporter. But J.D. Vance's journey stood out because he was so unstinting in his criticism of Trump when Trump first entered the political scene back in 2016. I remember interviewing Vance and talking to him about this stuff. I mean, he compared Trump to Hitler. He called Trump the opioid of the masses. He

suggested Trump was a con man. That's a lot to overcome, but he did. But he did. I mean, this is the most stunning 180 degree political flip-flop of our time. To go from saying the sort of things that you just brought up to now being chosen as his most trusted advisor, a running mate, a number two who will serve as president if something should happen to him is extraordinary. I mean, you may have to go back to post-revolutionary times when we used to pick vice presidents by who came in second place to find a vice president who has said such searing criticisms of a president. Fascinating. And ultimately, what's your understanding of why Trump could get past that? Somebody who's not very good at accepting criticism.

No, that's true. But as much as Trump hates criticism for his own actions and deeds, he loves the redemption narrative. And he loves being asked for forgiveness. by going on television, making nice with all of the right-wing websites and media in order to show how much he has changed his mind on Trump. And maybe most effectively, blame the media. That point has been proven by Vance himself, who has explained his new thinking, his evolution on Trump, by saying he was lied to by a media narrative about Trump. And now that he's gotten to know Trump, now that he's seen Trump in action as president, he's changed his mind. Right. And it sounds like he never really needed

to change his mind about some of the fundamental ideas of Trumpism. He had to change his mind about Trump. He seems always to have been fundamentally aligned with the ideas that Trump embraces, economic populism, some pretty far-right social positions. He needed to change his mind on the man, not the message. Yeah, it was very personal, I think, for both Trump and Vance in this instance. Again, Vance is someone who grew up in rural Ohio, whose family is from Appalachia, saw some of the things that Trump has railed against when it comes to manufacturing jobs that are being shipped overseas, you know, these sort of pillars and institutions of society that have failed to uphold their end of the bargain when it comes to working class, blue collar, small town Americans

like Vance's. If you are the Democrats right now, Mike, and you're absorbing this news, where do you see the greatest vulnerabilities are going to lie for Trump now picking Vance? Democrats are definitely going to use Vance's old words against him, this sort of library of video clips and audio interviews of Vance going after Trump. But Democrats will also seize on Vance as an extremist, whether that is ardent abortion view and support for a national ban and his willingness to do what his predecessor, Mike Pence, wouldn't. Vance has been on record already saying that he would have blocked the certification of the 2020 results and that would have helped overturn that election. Right. So you're saying one simple way that the Biden ticket can go after Vance is by saying that you will enable Trump to break the law, overturn the election. We should affect that. Yeah, I think so. I mean, looking back on what happened after 2020, the system worked because there was a lot of people around Trump who maybe they weren't guardrails, but maybe more speed bumps.

Right. And there's no indication that Vance has any willingness to play that role in the next Trump administration. In that vein, it was pretty widely noted that in the hours after the attempted assassination of Donald Trump, we saw J.D. Vance come out with a statement. It was the most strongly worded of anyone seeking to be his VP. And it has some factual problems. Here's what he said. He said, today, the attempted assassination is not just some isolated incident. The central premise of the Biden campaign is that President Donald Trump is an authoritarian fascist who must be stopped at all costs. That rhetoric led directly to President Trump's attempted assassination. We should say there's no evidence that that's true.

We don't know the motivations of the shooter. We don't know that he consumed any of that rhetoric or that Vance is even characterizing it correctly. So what should we make of the fact that Trump chose that running mate who made that statement in this moment? I think Vance, in a lot of ways, kind of embodies the id of Trump and that instinct to fight. And even though these sort of manufactured statements from the campaign are calling for unity and calling for peace, what Trump really wants—

Since the attempted assassination, right? That's right. What Trump really wants... Since the attempted assassination, right? That's right. What Trump really wants is someone who is going to keep fighting. Factual or not, I think this shows the passion and the energy Trump was looking at running, valuing that interest in fighting more than... Interest in unity and peace. Yeah, or facts on the ground. Right. I want to end, Mike, with something you hinted at earlier, which is facts on the ground. Right. I want to end, Mike, with something you hinted at earlier, which is when you said that Trump is looking to Vance to set a path for the future of the Republican Party.

What is that path with Vance as number two? Vance is only 39 years old. He's barely old enough to be president. Right. 35 is the requirement. Exactly. So he's obviously going to be viewed very much as the heir apparent for Trumpism. Trump knows this. And the signal it's sending to everyone, not just in the party, but the rest of the country, is that any remnants of a debate about whether this party snaps back to its sort of pro-business establishment culture pre-Trump era is exactly that. It's a pre-Trump era. It's over for Republicans. And when it's not Trump, it's going to be J.D. Vance or someone exactly like him. Right. In other words, Trumpism is here to stay. It is the Republican Party now that I've chosen J.D. Vance. There's no going back anymore, Michael. Thank you, Mike. This is really helpful. I really appreciate it.

Thank you for having me. Are you guys from Michigan? Yeah, I am. We make the daily podcast. Back at the convention hall. We wanted to ask folks from all the big swing states about the selection of J.D. Vance about an hour ago and what you make of that decision and if you think it's going to help Trump win of J.D. Vance about an hour ago and what you make of that decision and if you think it's going to help Trump win this state.

Absolutely. Look, I think the key thing in the platform is that it is dedicated to the forgotten men and women, and that is the blue-collar workers in the flyover states. J.D. Vance gets that. It was clear that Republican delegates saw J.D. Vance as helping Trump win those key Midwestern states that will be essential to Trump winning in November. So if Donald Trump wins Pennsylvania, which we're going to make damn sure he does, we're going to work our ass off. You think that Vance helps him do that? Yes.

And just make sure, I want to understand why. Because J.D. Vance is like the common man. He's like the common guy. — And that like Trump, they do see Vance as the future of Trumpism. — And the other nice thing is, he's young. — Yeah. — He's 39 years old. — Why does that matter?

— It's good to have somebody young with somebody that's old, in case, God forbid, something ever happens. In other words, you already see him as the successor, the inheritor of Trump's message and the party in MAGA. Yeah, he's going to have to carry the mantle. That's probably what's going to end up happening. Trump's only there for four years. You need somebody afterwards for the next eight. You need somebody for the next eight after that. And you're from Wisconsin. You're a delegate from Wisconsin. This is important. Trump mentioned Wisconsin in announcing Vance. Why was Vance your number one choice? I think he brings youth to the field, to the vice president, and I looked at the upcoming years,

in 28, what'll happen, and I think he was the man that can do it in 28 for the Republican Party. You're already looking forward to the next race. Yes, very much so. We'll be right back. Here's what else you need to know today. In a stunning decision, the judge overseeing Trump's classified documents case threw out all the charges against him. In the process, she rejected what was widely seen as the strongest federal charges against the former president. Judge Eileen Cannon, a Trump

appointee, ruled that the special counsel who filed the charges had been given his job in violation of the Constitution. That finding flew in the face of previous court decisions reaching back decades. In response, the Department of Justice said that it plans to appeal Cannon's ruling. Today's episode was produced by Carlos Prieto, Claire Tennesketter, Jessica Chung, Muj Sadie, Eric Krupke, and Ricky Nowetzki. It was edited by Brendan Klinkenberg and Rachel Quester, with help from Paige Cowan. Contains original music by Dan Powell, Corey Schreppel, Alicia Baetube, and Marion Lozano. And was engineered by Alyssa Moxley. Our theme music is by Jim Brunberg and Ben Landsberg of Wonderly.

That's it for The Daily. I'm Michael Barbaro. See you tomorrow.