The Daily - What Happened to Kamala Harris?

Episode Date: November 20, 2019

When Senator Kamala Harris started her presidential campaign 10 months ago, she drew a crowd of 20,000 to her kickoff rally — the biggest of any candidate’s. She was talked about as a potential heir to the political coalition that carried Barack Obama to the White House. We followed her campaign to South Carolina to explore why, after such fanfare, she’s now polling in the single digits. Guest: Astead W. Herndon, a national political reporter for The New York Times, and Monika Evstatieva, a producer on “The Daily.” For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. Background reading:Ms. Harris said she wanted relevant policy, not “a beautiful sonnet.” Here are the signature issues of her campaign.We asked 21 candidates the same 18 questions. Hear Kamala Harris’s answers.

Hi, my name is Monika Vstatieva and I'm a producer for The Daily and I am here with Astead. Astead, introduce yourself. Hi, I'm Astead Herndon. I'm a politics reporter covering the election and I'm driving on a very long highway. We're driving on a very long highway in South Carolina because we came here to try to answer an interesting question. What is that question? What happened to Kamala Harris's presidential campaign that took her from top tier front runner status to the middle of the pack? Okay, let's try to figure this out. Okay, let's try to figure this out.

From The New York Times, I'm Michael Barbaro. This is The Daily. When Senator Kamala Harris launched her presidential campaign 10 months ago, she drew a crowd of 20,000 to her kickoff rally, the biggest of any candidate, and was talked about as a potential heir to the political coalition that carried Barack Obama to the White House twice. Today, she's polling in the single digits. My colleagues, Astead Herndon and Monica Efstatieva, went to South Carolina with the Harris campaign. It's Wednesday, November 20th.

Astead and I are in the car. We're driving from the capital, Colombia, to Greenwood. And Greenwood is a small town. Folks are in suits. You know this is South Carolina. And why is South Carolina essential to her campaign? So she's in South Carolina because, frankly, that's where their campaign is putting their chips. They've had to, after falling on hard times, fire most of their New Hampshire team and really focus their resources on the first state, Iowa, it proves viability, it proves electability, and that the Black voters who like you but are scared you can't win will eventually come around if you prove yourself in the early states. And South Carolina, the electorate's more than 65%

Black, and she thinks that she shares a real kinship there. And while she's been to South Carolina many times before, this is her first time in this community. Her campaign understands these things aren't going well and needs to reach out to people they haven't talked to before. Okay, we're actually walking now. Let's see what's happening. We get to the building. It's a very small building.

And it's Veterans Day. So describe this room now. And it's Veterans Day. It's like a veterans hall. There are rows of people kind of set up in a half circle around what will be a panel. Some people are half on. They're veterans, kind of regalia. We've got flags behind them. Pretty much a standard, intimate, political event. Okay, let's go talk to some people.

Sir, do you have a minute to just talk with us? I don't do interviews. When you talk to voters, you try to get a sense of why they decided to come. Why are you here today? Well, I'm here to support Kamala Harris. I'm here to be enlightened about her policies. Have they decided on a particular candidate? I really haven't picked no candidate yet, you know.

I haven't made up my mind. I'm still shopping, looking at all the options. Today you'll be listening to what she has to say and if she can basically win you over? Possible. It's possible, yes. A lot of people actually don't know a lot about her. Some people don't know anything about her. Well, I really hadn't heard of Senator Harris before until Wednesday. I think that's something people forget about voters.

Not everyone is tuned in all the time. I really haven't been watching the news. I don't even think I watched the debate. As a matter of fact, I know I didn't. I didn't watch the debate. They know the field is large, and they know kind of generally who's up and who's down. And in every conversation we have with these voters,

This is still the South. race keeps coming up. You have to remember the context for these largely older African-American voters. And good Lord willing and the creek don't rise come March of next year I'll be 70 years old.

So I've seen a lot. And basically I still see the world as being one great big plantation. These are folks who have grown up in the shadow of Confederacy their whole lives. They have lived under the brunt of Jim Crow, some of them. And that informs how they are making pragmatic political decisions moving forward. Within South Carolina, within the African-American community,

Within South Carolina, within the African-American community, we don't want to take a chance on someone that doesn't have a chance of beating Trump. So things like 2008 and Barack Obama defied their wildest dreams. It was an anomaly to them. And so there's still a fear, a risk that a lot of them associate with a person of color leading the ticket. I hope she's electable, but we have to change the minds of the people. Fear that maybe in this time where Black voters are very worried about the Trump presidency, that a Black candidate or a woman of color was too risky. Do you think that black men will have problems supporting a black woman candidate?

Yes. Why do you think so? The men have been the head. Many people we speak to mention as an alternative... Joe Biden, you know, I think that he's a good candidate. Joe Biden. I like Joe. How is Joe Biden?

I've looked at Joe Biden. Why? There's a lot of reasons why Joe Biden looms over South Carolina. One is name recognition. Because he has been vice president, I don't think we need, you know, someone now that's the only job training. He has a track record because he was there in the administration before. They know who he is. He's a known quantity. And he is someone who has longstanding relationships in those communities.

He has the debate experience, and I feel like he can go after them also. Another reason is he has pitched himself as the candidate who is most likely to beat Trump. Something kind of explicit. Like, when you say that he can beat Trump, do you think that's because white people are more likely to vote for Joe Biden than they are to vote for Kamala Harris? Yes. Yes.

And so this is one of the big challenges Harris has to overcome. Even Black voters, who sometimes like her instinctively, think that her identity as a Black woman might be a liability for the election. And so they see Joe Biden, a white man with experience in the White House, and even this community thinks that maybe he is better suited to beat Trump. And ultimately, that's what they care about the most. So again, we thank each one of you for taking time out of your busy schedule coming out today. And without further ado, it gives me great pleasure... Then the event actually kicks off. There are several introductions. The U.S. Senator from that great state of California, the Honorable Kamala Harris.

And after some time, it's her time to speak. And she needs to convince the people in this room that she is uniquely positioned to represent them best. Thank you, Senator Nicholson. Hi, Mama. What are some of the key points she makes in this speech? Please have a seat. So I will tell you, my background is I am a daughter of parents who met when they were active in the civil rights movement in the 1960s in Berkeley and Oakland, California. She introduces herself to the audience, her personal narrative. I grew up surrounded by a bunch of adults who spent full time marching and shouting

for justice. And then she turns very quickly to an issue she has gotten a lot of criticism for, her position on health care. So I'm running for president to put in place a Medicare for All plan, which means everyone will be covered, including people with pre-existing conditions. And for her, health care looks like what she calls a Medicare for All plan that still preserves a role for the private insurance industry. And this is confusing, right? It can be. She's had different positions on health care.

She started the race as a co-sponsor in Bernie Sanders' Medicare for All bill, which is a single-payer system that eliminates private insurance. But she kind of hemmed and hawed about the specifics of that bill and then eventually offers her own plan. I'm not trying to get rid of private insurance. So I heard from too many folks who said, Kamala, don't take away our choice. Which preserves a role for private insurance. So I heard from too many folks who said, Kamala, don't take away our choice. Which preserves a role for private insurance. And so this is another one of the issues people cite around Kamala Harris's campaign, is that when you look at key policies, if you look at

health care, the number one issue for Democrats in this race, She has not always stood for a singular position. She's tried to have her cake and eat it too, some voters say. Even now, as she's in between the progressive and moderate approaches, she's still borrowing language from that progressive lane. We want the choice between a private plan or a public plan. Well, my plan will give you the choice that you deserve. And this is why I was a little bit confused when I hear her say that. You're not the only one. But we need reasonable gun safety laws, including universal background checks. So she goes through some other issues that are important to the Democratic voters,

like gun safety, the challenges facing veterans. And putting them out of business safety, the challenges facing veterans. Putting them out of business when they were targeting our veterans. But then... And I'm just going to share with you one last thing, and then I would love to start our conversation. She turns to the issue of her electability. What does she say? Senator Harris has added this in the last couple months.

As electability has become an increasing point of conversation in this race, she's decided to address it directly. So I just want to have a brief conversation about something that's been coming up in connection with the campaign that I call the elephant in the room. But really, it's the donkey in the room. And it's this conversation about electability. this conversation about electability. And the conversation goes something like this. Well, I don't know if America is ready for a woman of color to be president of the United States.

She's addressing the identity question head on. Are Democrats too scared or is it too much of a risk to put a black woman up against Donald Trump in this critical election? I know I'm ready, but I don't know if my neighbors are ready. They'll say, well, maybe it's not your turn. And she says, this is not a new conversation for me. In fact, this is a conversation I have heard in every campaign I have. And now here is the operative word, won. And what she's trying to evoke there is that she has broken barriers before

and that if voters put their trust in her, she will do it again. And so in this short time, she's addressing the two big challenges of her campaign. And she's trying to solve both. She's trying to put forth a clear position on health care and sort of suggest that there was never any lack of clarity to begin with. And then she also tries to present her identity not as a hurdle to her success, but as a rallying point that people can come together and again, just like in the past,

they'll overcome it. Thank you all very much. Thank you, thank you, thank you. We'll be right back. Okay, so we're now headed to the town hall. Then we're back on the road, and we keep following Senator Harris. And the next stop is Greenville. This is a bigger city, over 62,000 people. Yeah, we're headed from Greenwood to Greenville, a more urban community.

A state cannot be bothered with nothing but Beyonce right now. And I actually find out you can sing. So we get to Greenville. When we come in, it's a larger gymnasium. It's probably double or triple the amount of people in terms of crowd size, even though there's some empty seats. And there's also just a more elaborate setup. That's all kind of just the campaign doing more of an operational flexing of muscle for the bigger city. Right. So this is a more diverse place.

It's more highly educated. It's younger. And people are following the election more closely. And so here, many people already know her. So are you also people who have picked a candidate? I know I see the search, but you're all in. Yes, all in. What are some of the things they tell us? They say what you hear from the Kamala Harris diehards,

that she first came on their radar during the Senate committee hearings where she was praised for aggressive questioning of Bill Barr and Jeff Sessions. So I think it was during Sessions' confirmation hearings that I thought, she's going to run for president, and if she is, she's got my vote. Eventually Brett Kavanaugh. Especially during the Kavanaugh hearings when she talked to Dr. Ford and just looked at her in the eyes and said,

I believe you, I believe you. They tell you that they like her debate interaction with Joe Biden in the first debate. She looked tough on the debate stage, and she's the one that they want to see go up against Donald Trump. And you ask them, like, but why is she not polling better? What have you thought about the kind of trajectory of her campaign? I mean, she started up there, but she's since kind of fallen. Why do you think that is? What are some of the things they cite as examples? These folks are following the race closely, and so they know that there's been a change in political standing from where

Senator Harris started the race to where she arrived now. And when you ask her supporters that, why did that happen? They again point to her identity. She's been erased by the media. She's been misrepresented by the media. They blame media for preferring often white candidates over people of color. And they point to a top tier where the four candidates at the top are all white now at the Democratic Party. I mean, she's a Black woman in a race that everyone's looking for a white savior candidate. And so, but I think don't count her out. She's got a strong ground game. The event kicks off with a couple of introductions, including from a high school student. Ladies and gentlemen, I am proud to present to you someone who looks just like me.

Yeah, they've had started having organizers introduce her, particularly women of color, to lean into that representation aspect. Well, good afternoon, Greenville. It is wonderful to be back. And throughout the speech, the thing that gets the most ovation is when she goes after Trump. We will need, as our nominee, someone who can stand on that debate stage and go toe-to-toe with Donald Trump. And Greenville, you're looking at her.

You're looking at her. There's a couple lines that any Democrat can say, and they'll get the audience on their feet. A surefire crowd pleaser is to attack the president. And somebody needs to remind Donald Trump that some of his closest relatives are immigrants, too. And especially with the impeachment proceedings going on, Senator Harris's lines of justice being on the ballot or prosecuting prefer Kamala Harris over the rest of the Democratic field, who are also making those same arguments? And that's why I'm running. I thank you all so very much. Thank you. OK, where are we going?

We are in Greer, South Carolina. The following day, bright and early, we join her again. It's next to Greenville, and this time it's raining. At a community center. Okay, Needmore Recreation Community Center, we are here. Where she is speaking to maybe 20, 25 people, all African American, older residents. So you all know and have lived long, wonderful lives, and you'll remember that for a large part of your life...

She spent a lot of her speech on lowering prescription drug costs and her health care plan, but she also mentions more systemic problems. And remember those 0% homes? Nothing down? Predatory practices. The brokers made all kinds of money. Like housing inequality and equitable education, issues that matter to older Black voters. And the father can look at his son and say, son, you don't have to go and get a loan from one of those private companies that are going to charge you these outrageous interest rates. I'll take some of the equity

out of my home to help you pay for tuition. So thank you very much. Thank you. After the speech, we see something that I haven't experienced so far. A pastor starts a prayer for her. So we're going to pray. We're going to pray. We're going to pray for protection. She is literally holding her hands, and the whole room, everyone is standing up.

Kamala, daily pass. When you were in your mother's womb, God already knew about this thing in your life and already knew that you would be in Grand South Carolina at the Needmore Community Center. It wasn't an accident. This is one of the cool things you can see while campaigning, specifically in South Carolina. Because the Democratic electorate is so Black

and because the Black electorate, particularly in these Southern states, is so religious, a lot of the campaigning happens through these religious communities. Pastors in Black communities are not just religious leaders. They're community leaders. They're political leaders.

They're cultural hubs. And particularly with Black candidates, there's like a sense of kinship there. God, for every flight that she will take, I pray that you are the pilot. God, for every car that she journeys in, I ask you to be the driver. And for every thought that she would think,

I ask you to be the host. Kamala Harris is a religious woman, and there is a shared language of faith that happens at these events that you see with other candidates. It's not like they wouldn't pray for a white candidate. But there's something different when it's someone who they know has worshipped in their churches for their whole lives. And so she prays for her, and she mentions that the last presidential candidate she prayed for...

Now, the last person that I laid my hands on and prayed for in the presidential election... Was Barack Obama. Was Barack Hussein Obama. The reverend is Reverend Gadsden, but she goes by Pastor T. So we can be clear, they call me Pastor T. Reverend Telly Lynette Gadsden. That's who I am. And we actually catch up with her after the prayer.

Have you, that was your first time seeing the senator, I imagine, right? First time seeing, but not first time hearing about. And then we ask her about the race. Have you, are you someone who personally has made a decision about who you want to vote for? Are you someone who personally has made a decision about who you want to vote for? I have not. I have not. And that's been because the field is so wide, you know. But where I am, as I've shared, is just a posture of, first of all, praying for our country. You can see how that represents a problem for Kamala Harris. so we have this pastor who says she last laid hands on barack obama but isn't ready to give

her support to kamala harris someone who started this race so strongly by trying to capture the same kind of coalition that obama did we've heard that the challenges to her campaign are her identity and the lack of clarity on policy. But those same things could have been said for Obama. So what's different in 2019? The Barack Obama coalition that he rose to power with combined young people, liberals, and historic turnout from Black people. And there's not one candidate in this race that has yet been able to win those different demographic groups. And that was supposed to be Kamala Harris.

I mean, it was supposed to be a number of people. It could have been Beto O'Rourke. It could have been Cory Booker. It could have been Kirsten Gillibrand. But when we entered this race, the thought, the reason why her candidacy was so feared was because she was thought to be the one who could most quickly tap in to that coalition.

Well, there are differences that we knew would be true from the start, and there's things that we've learned over the last six, eight months. From the start, we knew that as a Black woman running, she would have no historical touchstone, and she would face unique barriers. And I think if you From the start, we knew that as a Black woman running, she would have no historical touchstone and she would face unique barriers. And I think if you asked the campaign, they would say that's true. But it's really about messaging. We knew that this race would be defined by a progressive wing led by figures like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, and a moderate wing led by Joe Biden, and that people like Kamala Harris would have to exist,

threatening both worlds. And that's been difficult. When you talk to voters, the most consistently repeated thing is, well, I don't necessarily know what she stands for. And I think that is borne out of those two wings, the progressive and moderate wings, defining this primary through their fight.

And so Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren can say, if you aren't with single-payer health care, you're not a progressive. If you're not willing to raise taxes on corporations and wealthy individuals, then you don't have big ideas. corporations and wealthy individuals, then you don't have big ideas. And the moderate wing has defined themselves by rejecting that, by defining themselves by saying, well, we can't do that or we won't beat Trump. But if you're trying to do both of those things, if you're trying to thread in between those worlds, we have seen electorates that aren't really willing to give people that benefit of the doubt.

And that's driving a lot of the anxiety right now, particularly among the party's moderates. And that's why we see all these new candidates jump in the race. The anxiety breeds restlessness, right? restlessness, right? And Deval Patrick, who just announced, Mike Bloomberg, who's expected to, are trying to capitalize on that anxiety. Because in the circles that like them, in the circles of elite Democratic moderates, they are a group that expect it to have more options. They're not that surprised at the way Joe Biden's candidacy has turned out. Where the biggest surprise is,

is they thought they would have an alternative figure to Joe Biden who could replicate that Obama lane. Now, remember, these are a group of people who think that Warren and Sanders' progressive policies will lose them the general election. They think that Warren and Sanders, if they are the nominee, will struggle to bring out the type of people that put Democrats over the top. And without that, without someone in the top tier

who is winning Black voters and exciting young voters at the same time, there is fear that you cannot replicate what Obama did. Now, their argument is that that's because of the campaigns, that the individual candidates and individual campaigns haven't done the things necessary to produce that support. But it could be because of a changing electorate and two wings of the party that support. But it could be because of a changing electorate and two wings of the party

that just aren't looking for a merging savior anymore. We'll be right back. Here's what else you need to know today. Colonel Vindman, what was your real-time reaction to hearing that call? Chairman, without hesitation, I knew that I had to report this to the White House counsel. I had concerns, and it was my duty to report my concerns to the proper people in the chain of command. In dramatic testimony on Tuesday, two White House officials who listened in on President Trump's phone call with the president of Ukraine described their alarm over his request for investigations into his political rivals.

And what was your concern? It was inappropriate. It was improper for the president to request and to demand an investigation into a political opponent, especially a foreign power where there's at best dubious belief that this would be a completely impartial investigation. One of them, Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman, said he immediately interpreted Trump's request for the investigations as a demand, given the imbalance of power between the United States and Ukraine and the desire by Ukraine's newly elected president,

Vladimir Zelensky, to secure a visit to the White House. And two federal corrections workers, who were on duty the night that Jeffrey Epstein killed himself in a Manhattan jail, have been indicted. The workers were charged with falsifying records, since they signed documents saying they had checked in on inmates, including Epstein,

when they had not. Instead, according to the charges, the workers sat at their desks and browsed the internet. Epstein was at the jail awaiting trial on multiple charges of sex trafficking in a highly anticipated court case.

That's it for The Daily. I'm Michael Barbaro. See you tomorrow.