The Dan Bongino Show - Are The Democrats Planning a Post Election Coup? (Ep 1365)

Episode Date: October 8, 2020

In this episode, I discuss Mike Pence’s destruction of the hapless Kamala Harris at the Vice Presidential debate last night. I also address the troubling evidence that influential Democrats are planning a post elections coup if Donald Trump wins.  News Picks: Are the Democrats planning a coup in the event of a Trump election win? President Trump rejects the ridiculous proposal for a virtual debate. Kamala Harris doesn’t want to talk about her extreme agenda. Kamala Harris still refuses to answer a question about packing the Supreme Court. NJ postal worker arrested for throwing out mail in ballots. George Soros is back! An update on my procedure yesterday.  Copyright Bongino Inc All Rights Reserved.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

get ready to hear the truth about america on a show that's not immune to the facts with your host dan bongino a total complete evisceration last night in the debate totally um anybody trying to spin to you any uh nonsense that kamala harris looked confident last night in that debate is simply lying to you listen i'm a non uh I'm not trying to be some kind of objective guy. I think you all know I'm a strong, devout conservative. But Mike Pence absolutely annihilated and destroyed Kamala Harris last night. I got the evidence today. I'm going to show you the highlights of Mike Pence's total destruction of Kamala Harris.

There are four specific things that stuck out to me last night. I'm going to give you in a nutshell. I've also got the interview, the long anticipated interview in today's show with Michael Anton, the author of The Coming Coup, a topic that has the Democrats and the media so freaked out that I'm not kidding, a New York Times reporter keeps reaching out to me desperate to get my take on what they think the Democrats' coming coup is because they're so terrified we're exposing them. I'm not kidding. You're not going to want to miss that. Today's show brought to you by ExpressVPN. Surf the web in peace. Keep your online activity free from prying eyeballs. Get a VPN. Go to expressvpn.com slash Bongino today. Welcome to the Dan Bongino show. Day after my

surgery, some of you can see the, if you want to watch the video, uh, move the microphone a bit. There's the quite a long scar on my neck there. Uh, so, uh, you might be wondering why the hell we're doing a show a day later. Um, because I want to, and, uh, I want to thank you all. Uh, we got so many well wishes and we got flowers at the hotel and people were just overwhelming and they're outpouring of support. Twitter, Facebook, Parler, email, everything. And it means the world to us. I mean that it's made this experience a lot easier to get through. I got a call yesterday, too, just to show you what kind of a guy he really is, despite the media nonsense about the president. The president called before I went into surgery. I'm not kidding. That's the kind of guy he is to check in on me and see how he's doing. He's just a wonderful guy. He really

is. And it's a shame it gets lost in all the media hysteria about him. Just an amazing guy. He has, he's sick himself or was, and he's concerned about me and the, you know, didn't he, he didn't even rush me off the phone. Just an amazing guy right before I went in for surgery. One quick thing. I, they took out a massive tumor from my neck. I have a picture. I was going to show it to you today. Paula strongly objects to this.

So I'll leave it up to you. We can, we can do like a five second countdown in tomorrow's show. I'll be home tomorrow, Friday. So we'll have a show from my regular studio. So if you want to see it on Rumble, rumble.com slash Bongino, that's the video version of our show, all free, of course. Let us know. We could do a countdown and warn you. It's a big tumor, though.

It looks like something out of Alien or maybe Prometheus, like the original Alien prequel. But it was big. Hey, listen, I got to make light of it. So Paula is adamantly against it. All, listen, I got to make light of it. So Paula is adamantly against it. All right, let's get to the content of tonight's debate and then the interview with Michael Henton, which I promise you you're going to love. Today's show brought to you by our good friends at Omaha Steaks. What we do without Omaha Steaks in my house, we'd be lost because they have the best darn food out there. We live off Omaha Steaks. Whenever we

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to miss out. Their steaks are unbelievable too. The only disappointing thing, you'll never want to eat another steak again outside of Omaha. Thank you, Omaha, for being here. All right, folks, let's get to it. I'll give myself the bell ding ding because we don't have Joe here to do it, but we will be back in studio tomorrow, so don't you worry. No days off here. That's it. It will be back in studio tomorrow. So don't you worry.

No days off here. That's it. It's too important of a time. So let's get to the debate last night. What a total mess for Kamala Harris. Again, I don't care what your partisan stripes are, your partisan affiliation. It was a disaster.

She got crushed. She looked like a child on stage with the adult in the room. And Mike Pence broke every single piece of her ridiculous, extreme, far-left agenda down right in front of her eyes for all of America to see. Even some of the leftist hacks had to acknowledge it wasn't the Biden campaign's best night. Let's go to piece number one.

This is Mike Pence finally, finally calling out the both kind of the moderator here and Kamala Harris and Joe Biden about their obvious, obvious lies about fracking. Listen, ladies and gentlemen, I'm not here to tell you what to think. You're all smart people. You can figure it out on your own. A lot of you are a lot smarter than me. I read your emails. You're brilliant. But I do a lot of homework and politics is what I do for a living. I'm a political commentator. I'm not telling you how to think or who to vote for. You'll figure that out on your own. You're very smart. I'm just telling you, if you are in the hydrofracking business, fracking, natural gas in Pennsylvania, the Marcellus play over in Ohio, if you are anywhere involved in fracking in Texas, in West Texas, anywhere, that Joe Biden and his campaign and Kamala Harris have already committed

to stopping fracking. The fact that they've seemingly changed their mind because they think you won't notice is irrelevant. When they ran, they ran on banning fracking, and I'm absolutely convinced they will ban fracking because the radical left owns Joe Biden. Here was Mike Pence finally calling her out last night on her lies. They already said they're going to ban fracking. I'll show you the proof after this cut. Play this first. Senator Harris, you're entitled to your own opinion, but you're not entitled to your own facts. You yourself said on multiple occasions when you were running for president that you would ban fracking. Joe Biden looked at a supporter in the eye and pointed and said, I guarantee, I guarantee that we will abolish fossil fuels. They have a $2 trillion version of the Green New Deal, Susan, that your newspaper,

USA Today, said really wasn't that very different from the original Green New Deal. More taxes, more regulation, banning fracking, abolishing fossil fuel, crushing American energy, and economic surrender to China is a prescription for economic decline. President Trump and I will keep America growing. The V-shaped recovery that's underway right now will continue with four more years of President Donald Trump. Listen, don't take my word for it. You don't even have to take Pence's word for it. I'm going to play a video in a second of Kamala Harris telling you she absolutely wants to ban fracking. Listen, if you're in the fracking business and you don't like your job, then yeah, vote for Harrison. Bye. Is that a good way to frame it? Paula's right next to me.

We're moving around. You can see the hotel. We moved around and we needed to change the scenery. Now she's to the left of me. But if you don't like, right, you don't like your job. If you're in fracking, it's not a good way to put it, right? She's nodding in approval. Like she said, you're a little confused about what I'm, how you feeling? Well, she doesn't want, she doesn't like when I randomly call out or in the middle of the show, it's hilarious. She doesn't want me turning my head. That's why, because of the surgery. I know I'm not supposed to,

but I know I'm terrible with doctor's instructions. I should do better. Folks, if you don't like your job and you want to be fired, you want your business to go under, yes, vote for Harris Biden, who've already committed to it. You don't believe me?

I've already played video. I'm not going to play it again of Joe Biden pledging to banning fracking, getting rid of fracking, saying he absolutely means it. Here's his running mate, Kamala Harris on tape again, swearing to a potential voter that she's going to ban fracking, too. Again, don't take my word for it. Take Kamala Harris's word for it. Here you go. There's no question I'm in favor of banning fracking. So, yeah. And starting and starting with what we can do on day one around public lands. Right. And and then there has to be legislation. But yes. And this is something I've taken on in California. I have a history of working on this issue. And to your point, you know, that we have to just acknowledge that the residual impact of fracking is enormous in terms of the impact on the health and safety of communities. Yeah. All right. I mean, I don't know what else to tell you, ladies and gentlemen. I mean, she's just, she said it. It's not just once. She said it repeatedly. They will, they will commit because they're hostage to the radical left to getting rid of fracking or phasing it out.

Again, their words, don't take my word for it. Just listen to them. If you don't like fracking, you don't like cheap gasoline, you don't like cheap fossil fuels, and you want to pay more for energy, then listen, I'm just being candid. That's your candidate. Then yes, vote for Harrison Biden. If you're in the fracking business, again, you hate your job, you hate your career, and you hate your life, then yes, vote for Harris Biden. He'll get rid of your job for you. You don't even have to quit. But please don't tell me, you know, the media people today that, oh, you know, Pence has taken her comments out of context. There is no out of context. She's crystal clear.

She wants to get rid of fracking, period, full stop, end of story. Thank you very much. All right, moving on. Another one of the highlights from last night's debate. Again, Pence just did a phenomenal job. Did we not say, right, didn't we cover this on the show the other day when you and i addressed at the beginning uh she doesn't want me to stop chance to turn on my neck they're really i gotta stop that's just instinct for me but i said to you don't sleep on mike pence the wall street covered that wall street journal story

where everybody down oh shucks mike pence midwestern guy you know kamala harris's big city san francisco prosecutor she's gonna eat pence alive i told you i told you the wall street Pence, Midwestern guy, Kamala Harris is big city San Francisco prosecutor. She's going to eat Pence alive. I told you. I told you. The Wall Street Journal nailed it. We discussed it yesterday on yesterday's show. Do not sleep on Mike Pence.

Pence is a skilled, skilled debater, a brilliant guy, a principled guy who has been through the back and forth before. He destroyed Kamala Harris last night. Any objective observer saw it. Let's not play games. Here's highlight number two of last night's debate. Folks, one of the things that's really bothered me, and I feel open to say it now. I don't know if I'm supposed to or not, but I will anyway. I was invited up early to hear the vice president's plan and the president's plan about the coronavirus when it first came onto our shores. I was invited up to the White House. I heard from the vice president direct in a small room.

Ladies and gentlemen, anyone telling you, anyone, that the president and the vice president weren't on top of this early and didn't realize the severity of the situation, I don't care who it is that's lying to you. I was up there early. I heard it from his mouth, straight from the vice president himself. I was probably three feet away from him at the time. Don't tell me they didn't take it seriously. They laid out the plan, what they were going to do, and they implemented it. They were following overseas in detail, transmission rates. They were implementing a logistics chain for PPE. covered and I think you're only going to hear it here, but you need to hear it. The former administrations, both Obama, Bush, Clinton, otherwise, they had a different model of testing in the United States for potential pandemics. Please understand what I'm about to

tell you. And the vice president, when we spoke to him, it wasn't just me, it was others. He laid out that the problem with the testing earlier was the infrastructure was set up wrong. Prior presidents and prior administrations had the CDC and others set up for a surveillance type system. In other words, they weren't set up for mass testing. Do you see the difference? Paul, I won't turn my head, but if I don't explain this well, give me like a head nod or throw something at me or something. You'll see like a paper come in the side of the screen. or throw something at me or something.

You'll see like a paper coming to the side of the screen. The system the United States was set up before was surveillance. Meaning if say there was, God forbid, an Ebola outbreak, there would be one or two tests in a region that would go to the CDC and elsewhere that would set off bells and whistles. They would know there was an outbreak and they would implement some type of local quarantine.

They weren't set up to test everybody all the time. That predated President Trump, ladies and gentlemen. Anybody who has any experience in this arena knows what I'm telling you is true. We were not set up to test every American all the time. Trump was left with a surveillance system. When the American public, due to the severity of this virus, pushed for a mass testing system, which candidly, I'm not sure was the right approach, but the president understood the fear and anxiety. They, in literally months, switched from a surveillance system to a mass testing system and changed the entire model. Does that make sense? Okay, good. Paul has given me a head nod.

Folks, I heard this months ago. I've been trying to explain this on Fox and elsewhere on my show. It wasn't the president's fault. And when he figured out that we were just a surveillance testing model and not a model for hundreds of millions of tests, in just three to four months, they switched the whole model over and changed it to a mass testing system because that's what the public wanted. You can deny that all you want. You just don't know what you're talking about. Because that's what the public wanted. You can deny that all you want. You just don't know what you're talking about.

Now, Joe Biden claims to have a coronavirus plan. This is another thing that's bothered me. If you actually read Joe Biden's coronavirus plan, it sounds awfully like Donald Trump's plan. He says things in there that Donald Trump has already done, and he acts like he made it up. We need a military person in charge of logistics to distribute vaccines and PPE. That's already happening. President Trump already appointed a military officer to do all this. We need more PPE. We already have that. There's no shortage of PPE.

We need a rapid vaccine. Did he miss Operation Warp Speed? Everything Joe Biden is saying he's going to do, President Trump has already done. Ladies and gentlemen, just read the paperwork on Biden's plan. Trump has already done it. Finally, finally, Vice President Mike Pence called Kamala Harris out on this. And this was, I think, the most devastating moment of the night. Check this out. The reality is when you look at the Biden plan, it reads an awful lot like what President Trump and I and our task force have been doing every step of the way. And quite frankly, when I look at their plan that talks about advancing testing, creating new PPE, developing a vaccine, it looks a little bit like plagiarism, which is something Joe Biden knows a little bit about.

Oh, that one stung. Someone got a bandaid for that. That one may require dissolvable stitches. Believe me, I'm at a place to talk about dissolvable stitches right now. That was brutal. It is Trump's plan. So you're going to elect a guy who's running on a plan you already have in place now with the guy currently in office and he's supposed to be some kind of change agent, the guy you're supposed he's already running on Trump's plan. Did you read it? Again, I'm not telling you who to vote for. Do what you want. If you're locked in for Biden, Harris, do what you want. I'm not here to you're all smart people. You'll figure it out. But please stop lying. There are things you can disagree with Trump about, and there are substantive differences between Biden and Trump. That's obvious. This is not one of them. Biden literally plagiarized Trump's plan, put it on his page and acted like he made it up. And I'm glad Pence finally fought

back last night. I gave you some inside baseball there. Again, I'm pretty sure now it's okay to talk about it, but I heard this early. Please stop saying the president and the vice president weren't on top of this from day one. I heard it. I was there. You're just lying and making that up. And it's really cheap and disgusting. All right. Here was the, I think the, although the plagiarism line was probably the highlight of the night for a zinger. On pure substance, I just want to say, you ever been to a Baptist church? Can I get an amen? Can I get an amen on this one? How long on this show have I been asking you, the listeners, Paula, Drew, Joe, and everyone?

I've been saying it over and over. When is someone finally going to call out Biden-Harris? When are they going to call them out on their tax hiking plan? Just to be crystal clear on this, Joe Biden has pledged multiple times, as is Kamala Harris, to repeal the Trump tax cuts. The Trump tax cuts were tax cuts for every income bracket, meaning if you were in the middle class, that's an income bracket for liberals listening, you got a tax cut. Do you want to know the rates? I'll give you the rates. If you were in the 25% bracket, that's like the upper middle class, your rate was cut to 22%. Your rate was 25% of your income. It went down to 22%. For the liberals

listening, that's a three percentage point cut. That means thousands of dollars a year were cut in your taxes. That's just a fact. I'm not interested in your opinion on it. If you want dopey time, do it on your own time, not on my show. You can look it up on the internet yourself. Just go and put in a search engine, Trump tax cuts and new rates, okay? If you're too stupid to do that, that's your problem. The lower middle class, your tax rate was 15% of your income. Trump cut it to 12%. That's another three percentage point cut. Biden has pledged over and over to get rid of those tax cuts. Meaning if you are the middle class, the lower middle class, the mid middle class,

or the upper middle class, your income taxes are going up by three percentage points of your income, which means likely thousands of dollars. I'm really sorry. That's a fact that facts bother you. If they bother you, I'm just giving you the truth. If the truth hurts, then really go read fiction novels. I'm sure there's some Stephen King book out there you'd like, but this is the hard reality. Finally, Mike Pence, I've been begging everyone associated with the Trump

campaign to finally call them out on this. Amen. Last night, Mike Pence just annihilated Kamala Harris on this very question. And she looks absolutely clueless. You want to talk about getting wrecked? Check this out. Thank you, Vice President. Biggest economic year in the history of this country. Thank you, Vice President Pence. Senator Harris. Well, I mean, we saw enough of it in last week's debate, but I think this is supposed to be a debate based on fact and truth. And the truth and the fact is Joe Biden has been very clear. He will not raise taxes on anybody who makes less than $400,000 a year.

He said he's going to repeal the Trump tax cuts. Mr. Vice President, I'm speaking. I'm speaking. It would be important if you said the truth. Joe Biden said twice in the debate last week that he's going to repeal the Trump tax cuts. That was tax cuts that gave the average working family $2,000 in a tax break every single year. Senator, that's the math. That is absolutely not true.

Is he only going to repeal part of the Trump tax cuts? If you don't mind letting me finish, we can then have a conversation. Okay? Please. Okay. Joe Biden will not raise taxes on anyone who makes less than $400,000. She's lying. She's lying.

I mean, she's lying. She knows she's lying. And here's a little trick I need you to know about Kamala Harris. Whenever she gets caught lying, she says, let's have a conversation about it. She does it all the time. Put in a search engine, Kamala Harris, let's have a conversation. Anytime she's caught in a lie, she says, let's have a conversation. So again, I'm going to leave it with this because you're all very smart people.

I mean that. Even the liberals that listen, some of you get it. I've had some good back and forth with you all on social media and on email to the decent ones. The losers, your hard pass on you. Unfortunately, there are a lot of those, but that's a part of being a liberal. The loser thing is just you embrace it, hug it. Folks, if you want your taxes to go up and you are a middle-class earner in the United States, then Biden-Harris is your ticket. If you don't want your taxes to go up, then Trump and Pence are your ticket. It's really that simple. Your taxes are going up if Biden's... I don't care what income bracket you're in. The Trump tax cuts will be repealed, which means your taxes are going up. It's a matter of simple

mathematical certainty. Your taxes are going up at minimum of three percentage points, meaning if you make $50,000 a year, you're going to be paying over $1,000 more in taxes a year. It's just a fact. If that's what you want, then yes, vote for Biden-Harris. All right. That's my debate coverage from last night. I thought those were the highlights. I wanted to make sure I got back to you. Just a couple of things before we get to the interview. Michael Anton, don't go anywhere, folks. You're going to love this. This is the guy, so you know, who wrote the article, The Coming Coup. We talk about the Democrats' plans post-election day for a street fight, not a legal one. The interview is stunning. Paula's not a huge fan of the interview shows. Paula loved this one. She was listening again and she's like, this is your best interview ever. So that's coming up.

You're not going to want to miss that with Michael Anton, but just a few notes before we get to that. Thank you all for picking up my book. Despite me, no publicity at all. I'll be doing it next week because of the surgical procedure I had done this week. I didn't get to do any PR on the book. The book went up to number 20 on Amazon. It's called Follow the Money. And I just want to read

to you quickly here just a line from one of the first reviews that came in. There's a chapter on Barack Obama's fixer, Catherine Rumler, his fixer. And like I told you, if you don't know the story of Catherine Rumler, Obama's fixer, then you don't know the Spygate story. She's involved in all of this. She was in the White House during the IRS scandal, the Benghazi scandal, the Secret Service scandal. She was there for Spygate. She then left.

She went and represented one of Mueller's key witnesses in the Spygate scandal, who set up a meeting. She represented Susan Rice. She represented the Clintons. She represented the DNons. She represented the DNC in their defense against the dossier. Ladies and gentlemen, how does Obama's fixer keep coming up in this case? If you haven't seen this chapter, I promise you it's going to blow your mind. One of the reviews, a guy said, I'm still shaking my head over the details. Here's another one,

just quick, from Amazon this morning. He says, the chapter on Obama's fixer was the most interesting and rather scary. The woman, Kathy Rumler, ran interference on Obama's fixer was the most interesting and rather scary. The woman, Kathy Rumler, ran interference for Obama, not just from possible negative outside sources, but also from inside the White House. Read the book. You'll see what that chapter is. And it reads like a police file, kind of like my original book, Spygate. You don't have to read it in order. They're individual chapters that act as individual stories about all these players like the Obama fixer. I promise you're not going to know the whole Spygate story until you see this. I'm very proud of the book and I appreciate you all bumping it up to 20 on Amazon. I was hoping to crack the top 10, but it's been a rough week. Maybe next week we can get a little

bit more publicity. And finally, before we go, I just want to thank the doctors and the staff yesterday at Sloan Kettering thank you so much you were all total professionals and Dr. Singh who removed the tumor managed to get the whole thing out so the prognosis is good really good either way I'm optimistic I feel great I don't want you to think I'm just doing this because you know I had nothing to do I'm doing it because I want to be here I feel good if. If I didn't, I wouldn't do a show. You don't deserve that. But I feel great. Dr. Singh is an amazing guy. And I want to thank Dr. Steve as well. You know who you are for helping get this all together. I mean, think about it, folks. It was just, what, two weeks ago, right, that I found out I had a

tumor in my neck and it's already been removed. So I really appreciate people helping me out. It was a really troubling moment in my life and you all made it easy. So thank you so much. And to all the doctors, the staff, the nurses as well. And to Jean, the nurse, you probably don't watch my show, but you were so nice. I appreciate you taking care of us yesterday as well.

All right, folks, don't go anywhere. I got this interview with Michael Anton. It's going to blow your mind. It may scare you a little bit. I'm sorry, but you need to be warned. All right, stay tuned. Coming up next. So folks, I've been getting a lot of requests to have this gentleman on my show, Mr. Michael Anton. Why? Because I did a show called The Coming Coup about the

Democrats' plans post-election if Donald Trump wins. It's frightening, very frightening. And I'm not trying to scare you, but I've said repeatedly I'm trying to warn you information is power ignorance is not bliss Michael Anton exposed the left in his article the coming coup that show went viral the article went viral afterwards and I've had a clamoring from people asking me to get Mr. Michael Anton on the show to talk about his article the coming coup and what the Democrats devastating, destructive, unnerving plans are after the election, the event Donald Trump wins.

It is scary stuff, but we need to know today. So I brought you by express VPN, ladies and gentlemen, protect your online activity from prying eyeballs today. Get a VPN. Don't wait, go to expressvpn.com slash Bongino coming up.

So, you know, I do these intros by the way, always, I know probably annoys you. I say do these intros, by the way, always. I know probably annoys you. I say it so much, but after the interview, because I like to give you kind of a heads up of what the interviewee is going to say. He says some stuff about our military, what's going on with our military, the perversion of the upper ranks of our military by politicians,

not them trying to influence military leaders. That's really scary in this interview, and we need to all pay attention to. Don't miss a word of it. All right, we have a few sponsors. Appreciate your patience. Today's show brought to you by our friends at Teeter. I can't say enough about Teeter. They have an inversion table that's the best in the business. I use it twice a day. What does it do? It uses gravity in your own body weight to invert you and decompress your spine and relieve pressure on your discs, surrounding nerves, and for me, importantly, my shoulders and other joints as well, which have taken a beating. I use it twice a day.

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tables have thousands of reviews on Amazon and are rated at an astonishing 4.9 stars. And with this deal, you'll get $150 off when you go to teeter.com slash Dan. You also get free shipping, free returns, a 60-day money-back guarantee, so there's no risk to try it out. Remember, you can only get the new Teeter Fit Spine Inversion Table plus the free inversion program app by going to teeter.com slash Dan. That's T-E-E-T-E-R.com slash Dan. Love this thing. Check it out. All right. Now on to my interview with Mr. Michael Anton, author of the piece, the famous piece now, The Coming Coup.

All right. Extremely pleased to welcome to the show one of the most popular guests on this show ever, whether he knows it or not, because I already covered his now famous article, I might add. Famous for all the wrong reasons. That may be a fair assessment, but famous. Michael Anton, lecturer at Hillsdale College, author of The Coming Coup, an article I covered on my show, which Michael went nuclear, DEFCON 700 and 422,622. People freaked out.

So thanks for coming to the show. We appreciate it. Thank you. Appreciate it. I'm glad to be here. I also want to add folks before we get into it with Michael about the coming coup. And again, we're not trying to scare you. I'm just trying to warn you. Michael has a book out. It's a must read the stakes. Chapter seven is particularly good. If you want to be aware of what's ahead,

we'll get into this a little bit later. There it is. Check it out. The stakes, Michael Anton, go pick it up. This guy knows what he's talking about. So Michael, let's get right into it. I've met you somewhere before. I don't know where I know you from, but I definitely know you. I've seen you on television, on Fox and elsewhere. Someone sent me this article and then another person and another person. And I'm sitting there preparing for my show about two weeks ago. The article is in the American Mind. We'll put it in the show notes, folks. It's called The Coming Coup by Michael here. And the article is frightening. And I started getting some traffic from other sources of mine that this stuff you're writing about here is real and it's something to be concerned about.

Give me the gist of it. And if you could, if you could start with this meeting with these Democrat bigwigs, where they came out of this with these war game scenarios and hit on that, I think my audience would really appreciate it. That was when the bell rang in my head. So before that, there were these pieces out in public that, you know, I started to hear and I would dismiss as crazy talk or just loose talk. So when Joe Biden two or three times said, you know, Trump, if he tries to stay in office, the military, they'll drag him out of there. And I thought it was extraordinary when the president considered invoking the Insurrection Act and the Secretary of Defense and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs both publicly said that they

opposed it. Now, it's one thing to oppose your boss, the commander in chief. Everybody has the right to do that. But the right way to do it is you do it in private, you give the president your advice privately, and then you follow his order, whatever it is, or if you can't follow his order, you resign. What you don't do is publicly essentially blackmail the president by saying, don't give that order because I won't follow it. I thought that's strange. I mean, that doesn't happen in our constitutional system, or it's not supposed to. And it all came together when this so-called transition integrity project leaked their report to the media. And the idea was about 100 of these Democratic grandees, senior Democratic politicians and appointed officials and a lot of never Trump, former Republicans, former conservatives. So a whole an anti-Trump group, all of them anti-Trump, even though some of them represent themselves as Republicans and conservatives. They got together and they

played a so-called war game about the outcome of the election with a bunch of scenarios. And the one that really stuck out was one of the scenarios was President Trump wins the electoral college clearly, but loses the popular vote. Same thing that happened in 2016. According to the U.S. Constitution, if you win the electoral college, you are the president. End of story. The person playing Biden in that scenario was John Podesta, former Clinton White House chief of staff and Hillary Clinton campaign chair from 2016. And he refused to concede the election. And his reasoning as Biden was, I don't think my voters will accept a concession. So I'm going to hang in there and I'm going to get on the phone to every democratic governor in the country that's

that in a state Trump won and say, don't certify Trump electors to the electoral college. You got to send Biden people to make sure we win this. And otherwise there's going to be a stalemate and we'll throw it into the house. You know, there was fanciful scenarios about California and some West other West coast States, maybe seceding from the union over this. So as soon as I saw that, my first question to myself was, why would they talk about this in public, right? If you're doing a conspiracy, first rule of conspiracy, as I know you've said on the show, is you don't talk about it. My audience loves this, right? Go ahead.

First rule of the conspiracy, right? If you're talking about it, you've got a reason to talk about it. And I thought, well, of course, the reason must be get the public ready for it. They're trying to say in advance, hey, American public, you are going to see potentially Trump seeming to win the election because the electoral college map will be over 270 for him and yet not be president on January 20th and even perhaps be forcibly removed from the White House. One of the most chilling examples of coup talk that I saw was two former army officers, senior army officers. They're retired now and they're

active in the democratic progressive think tank world, wrote an open letter to the chairman of the joint chiefs saying, dear Mr. Chairman, get ready to use the 82nd airborne division to drag Trump out if he refuses to leave. And I thought, I mean, that's that's really that's crazy talk. That's seditious talk. That is mutiny. That is a violation of the military oath. But this is how far these guys have gone. And I speculate that they're saying all this in public to get the American people ready for a scene on the TV cameras where the president's literally being let out after he seemingly won the election. And they want to be able to say to the American public, don't worry about it. You're not seeing a coup on our part. You're seeing us prevent an attempted coup on his part.

And this is really his fault. So get ready. This is his fault. And all I did in writing that article was quote their own words back at them, including Hillary Clinton's infamous statement that Joe Biden should not concede under any circumstances. And for this, this article came out about a month ago, a little bit less than a month ago. I think it came out September 4th, the Friday before Labor Day. For weeks, nobody talked about, well, the left didn't talk about it. They didn't stand up and go, this is crazy. We're not doing this. We disavow it. And then it got, I gather it got enough traction in the last week or so that they really started to freak out and say, okay, it's time to launch a counteroffensive in which they, you know,

they're doubling down and saying, Trump is trying to steal the election. Trump is going to try to stay even if he loses. And this is all going to be his fault. America, get ready. He's dangerous to our democracy. I just scratched my head and and say you guys are the ones talking about removing him even if he wins the electoral college um but this is how brazen they've gotten it's amazing this isn't even a 180 this is like a 360 where you wind up back where you were and then you find out that you exposed the conspiracy they're blaming now on you as you're standing i mean i find this bizarre i you know. I, you know, when I mentioned your rules of the conspiracy, I said, well, you know, rule number one of the conspiracy is, well, don't talk about the conspiracy. So you're right. Why are they talking about it? I agree. That's to soften us up with body blows. But rule number

two, I said, if I'm, if I'm characterizing this wrong, please let me know. Once you're exposed, just blame it on your opponent, which shockingly is what they're trying to do now. Michael, my face was on the article about your article. They took a screenshot of my show where I talked about your article, these lefty lunatics. And they were like, look at these crazy Republicans talking about a coup. We're not talking about a coup. We're talking about your coup. I'll leave the expletives out. This is insane.

This is something I talk about in my book, and I gave it a name that maybe we'll catch on and maybe we'll not. But I called it the celebration parallax, a little fancy term. And parallax is something that it's the same fact pattern. You look at it from this angle, it looks like one thing. If you look at it from that angle, it looks like something else. So when they say, we're going to use the military to drag Trump out of office, everybody says, bravo, you're protecting our democracy. When you or I say, holy cow, they're going to use the military to drive Trump out of office, they say, you guys are crazy conspiracy theorists from the fever swamps making things up. Same fact

pattern. I'm quoting their words back to them. When I say it, I'm a lunatic and it isn't happening. When they say it, it's a glorious defense of American democracy. Just to be clear. And again, Michael's book, folks, is called The Stakes. Highly recommended. Please pick it up today. Amazon, Barnes & Noble, bookstores everywhere. Worth your time. Believe me, juicy material in here. Just to be clear with the audience, we're not talking about a scenario where I'm a Trump supporter. I don't hide that. I'm not a journalist. I'm an opinion guy. we're not talking about a scenario where i'm a trump supporter i don't hide that i'm not a journalist i'm an opinion guy we're not talking about a scenario where donald trump uh loses the election of course he has to leave end the story we're talking about a scenario where donald trump clearly wins the electoral vote i just want to be clear everybody understands

that this is the scenario still if there's a popular vote loss which there is no popular vote presidency that this is the scenario where the Democrats are talking about, you know, dragging Donald Trump out of an office. He legitimately won. I just want to be clear. We're talking about this, correct? That's certainly what the tip report, that report outlined. That was the scenario. An electoral college win, victory, which means a win and a popular vote loss, which as you say, is symbolic, but meaningless, right? You win constitutionally, you win the presidency in the Electoral College, period, end of story.

Democrats have long hated the Electoral College and want to get rid of it because of big blue cities on the blue coasts. They know that they have a popular vote advantage over middle America and rural America, and even those parts of blue states that have a lot of red voters in them. But they love to have it just be a popular vote. And think about it. If you're a Democrat, then if the popular vote is the game, all you got to do is campaign in LA, San Francisco, Chicago, New York, and a handful of other places. You don't have to go anywhere else, pay attention to anywhere else, right? That's their dream for them, but they haven't managed to do that legally. And so what they're trying to do is delegitimize the electoral college and say, well, the popular

vote really does express the will of the people. So even if we go around the electoral college or we game the electoral college or we, you know, what's called faithless electors. In other words, let's say the president wins, I'll pick a state, Wisconsin. But the Democratic governor says, I'm not certifying any Trump electors from Wisconsin. I'm going to send a bunch of my people to vote for Biden. That's a violation of the essentially of the way the electoral college is supposed to work. But that's what they're thinking about doing. That's what they're openly talking about doing. I'm just quoting their own words back. That's all. Yeah, I know. And I appreciate you doing it. Like I said, your article caught my eye immediately. You know, Michael, I see your article here again, folks.

I'm reading it right now, in case you're wondering what I'm not scrolling my phone, reading people's texts. I'm michael's article right because i'll have to scroll through it it's quicker than paper um it's in the american mind it's called the coming coup went viral almost instantly for all the right reasons i i see your story here uh as a media story as well and what what i mean by that is you and i both know we've been around this game for a long time that if this was a story where Barack Obama was running for reelection and a bunch of Republican luminaries, whoever they may be, Karl Rove, a bunch of former old Reagan advisors, Ed Rollins and others were around

war gaming in a project funded by the Koch brothers, and one of the conclusions they came to was secession and the 82nd Airborne, we'd be activating the guillotine tomorrow. There'd be calls for treason charges. The media would be openly humiliating them. Karl Rove and others would be kicked off TV. Of course, none of them have anything to do with any of this. But these guys you're talking about

in this transition integrity project, and if you could describe in your answer a little bit of who they are and who's funding them as well, these are not small timers talking about this. They're not. And the media stories about how we're crazy for covering these Democrat luminaries discussing this crap. No, these are very famous senior people.

Like I said, John Podesta was one of the ones there. And a lot of these former Republicans who are there. So who's funding them? It's kind of murky. I got attacked for pointing out that George Soros is one of the funders. Nobody said you're wrong. In fact, one of the people attacking me said, well, yeah, actually, you're right. He is one of the funders. But it's just not right. You can't talk about George Soros anymore. Again, the celebration parallax. If you're on the left and you say, George Soros is a champion of democracy and liberalism because of all the money he gives, that's great. Somebody on the right says, why is George Soros giving money to district attorneys around the country who let rioters go without bail? Then you're a bad person for talking about it. That's when I talk about it again, by the way. When they tell me not to talk about something, I talk about it four more times just to rub

it in. But you see also this media angle on this, how if this were Republicans, you would never Tell me not to talk about something. I talk about it four more times just to rub it in. But you see also this media angle on this, how if this were Republicans, you would never be welcomed in polite company again. You'd probably be under investigation. Well, the media is part of it. In fact, some members of the media were part of the tip. I got attacked also by a guy I never even heard of. He claims he knows me, but I don't know him.

Named Edward Luce from the Financial Times who wrote a pretty nasty piece about me in the Financial Times. And he admitted, well, he was at the war game for the tip. He was a participant playing the media. So you're invested in this. It's all hand in glove. The media is not covering the story. They're part of the story. And their role in the last week has been very clear. It's to publish piece after piece saying, ringing the alarm saying, oh no, Trump and his Republican allies are getting ready to steal the election. So you saw, there are many pieces, but I'll point out one big, long article. I forgot the author, in the Atlantic Monthly. This is the same Atlantic Monthly, by the way, that posted the completely fake Skrla story a couple of weeks ago saying that Trump, the president disparaged

Marines when he was in France for the 100th anniversary of World War I. I wasn't there, but I don't believe it for a second. Anyway, the same magazine publishes this. He's getting ready to steal the election. Everybody, when it's exactly what they're doing, whatever, as Tucker Carlson likes to say, and I can't stop repeating, whatever they accuse you of doing, they're doing. Whatever they are up to, they project that out and say, no, all my enemies are doing the following one. That's exactly what they're doing. Yeah, I mean, we already saw this with the whole collusion hoax where we now know for the record that it was, in fact, this Democrat infrastructure with weaponized assets and intel and the FBI at the upper level who are colluding with someone the FBI themselves deemed a national security threat from Russia. Not my words. It's the FBI's own words. Whether he was a Russian

agent or not, I was not in the FBI investigating. I'm just telling you, the FBI was investigating a guy working with their team, which is bizarre. How seriously do you take this threat? I mean, is this, now you write at some points where I was scrolling through here about how this was leaked to the media. I happen to agree with your implication. This way, this was probably leaked somewhat intentionally again to soften the body blow there. But how seriously do you take them? I mean, say it is a close election. It all hinges on Wisconsin or even Minnesota, which appears to be in play. And it's 269, 269. Say it comes down to Maine, Maine, Maine too. You know, they divvy it up by congressional district. I mean, how serious

do you take this threat? Do you think they would actually do that? You know, before the COVID and before the riots and everything, if you remember back to February of this year, when the world seemed calm and the economy was great and it looked like the president was cruising to a pretty easy reelection, I had a dinner and a colleague of mine said that he could not see the left under any circumstances accepting another Trump win. They would have to stop it somehow, fill the streets, tie it up in the courts, something. And as soon as he said that, I thought, wow, that's so obvious. And yet, why didn't I think of it? It's so insightful. There's a bell rang. So I think I take this very seriously. I think he's right. They can't accept another Trump win. Now, I think they would prefer to do it. First of all, they prefer to have him just lose. Now, Biden win legitimately and then they don't have to worry about it. do that, I think they would prefer to game the system in closed states, either through mail-in ballots or, you know, what always happens in a closed state with a Democratic governor and a

Democratic secretary of state. Oh, the election's down to a handful of ballots. Oh, look, we found a box of ballots over here. Let's count these. Well, magically, it puts Biden ahead. Let's certify the count right now and give those 20 electoral votes to Biden, right? I think they'd prefer to make it look like a legitimate win. If they can't do that, if either electorally or otherwise the margin is so large, then I think they go to this plan C, if they can pull it off. Now, it's an open question if they can pull it off. So after both Biden and these military officers and others started talking about using the military, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs had to come out and to his credit said the military will play, quote, no role, unquote, in the upcoming election. I note that President Trump's former national security

advisor, H.R. McMaster, who retired as a three-star general in 2018, has been making the rounds on his book and has been asked this, including in MSNBC, CNN type places where that are very hostile to Trump. And he has said the military has got to maintain its complete neutrality, be apolitical and not get involved in any way. I myself, to what extent I have influence with the military via current officers or former officers I know, I have urged all my military friends to play no role and also to tell their friends in active duty, look, you need to protect the reputation and the integrity of the U.S. military. You need to make sure that all your fellow officers do not get involved if they're given a dumb order or

urged to do something that they know violates their oath and is unconstitutional. They need to just stand down. I mean, the U.S. Army is a cherished institution. The U.S. Army literally predates the revolution. It's older than the United States itself formally. To tarnish its reputation in this way, I think, is terrible. And the people talking like this, two former Army officers, I think they're doing a horrible disservice to an institution that they presumably serve loyally and love. You know, Michael, it's really hard to believe that you and I, two reasonably educated men, are having this conversation. It's troubling. It really is. Like I, this is never a conversation. It gives me no joy. I'm not in this for the clicks or the downloads. I told my audience, I'm not trying to scare you. I just would have never in, in, in,

in, in, in, in, I mean, in any length of time, a millennia. I would have never thought I was having a conversation either about a presidency and a campaign for the presidency being spied on by our own domestic spy agencies either. We're talking to Michael Anton again. The stakes, go pick it up today. Amazon, Barnes & Noble, bookstores everywhere. You'd believe in a country as great, as wealthy and prosperous, and with such fidelity to institutions like the United States of America, that a conversation about using our military to remove a duly elected president would be

absurd. But as we said in the last segment, these are higher ups in the upper echelons of the Democrat party actually having these discussions. And one of the things that worried me about your piece, the coming coup, about what the Democrats are planning, is me being a former Secret Service agent, the institutions we had there I know are stable. I know the people. I know the men. Who's ever elected president, they're going to secure. End of story.

But what does worry me a little bit and gives me some pause is during this coronavirus threat we've had, and obviously we've had a lot of death from it as well, things I thought would never happen, happened too. People going to jail, being tased for not putting a mask on in public. I mean, business owners being shut down. Does it give you a little bit of pause? This is not meant to be any knock on our institutions, but it does give me a bit of pause here that this happened in the United States of America. Does that make you worry a little bit more? Yeah. I think our institutions are more fragile, a little more wobbly than they've been in a long time, if not ever. I think that in particular, the military brass isn't quite as apolitical as it used to be in part eight years of Obama. I've been asked this in interviews and people say, well,

Obama, he purged the officer corps. Not exactly. It's more subtle than that. As you know, the military promotion system is up or out, meaning if you don't get the next promotion, you need to retire. And they can then carefully select who's with the program, who's on our side and who isn't. And let's make sure we get rid of the people who aren't with the program and only promote up the ranks people who are. And so the current military brass, especially at the general and admiral level, is much more favorable to, you know, what I call in the book ruling class interests, coastal interests, banking interests, tech, finance, the big blue cities, the people who run the big blue cities. They're much more in that vein. We just saw, for instance, today, General Stanley McChrystal, who was fired in 2010 by Obama for pretty, I don't know if it was viciously, but harshly criticizing the Obama

administration and the vice president, like came out and endorsed Joe Biden today. You know, so the old days, you know, H.R. McMaster, when I worked for him, i remember his first speech to the nsc he said i'm an apolitical guy i don't even vote i've never voted since he got into the army that's obviously pretty long gone um i do think though or at least i hope at least i hope that first of all if there's something um fishy going on in the period between the election and january 20th donald trump is still the president, according to the Constitution. And the only person who can give an order to the military is the commander in chief.

And he's not going to give them an order saying, please remove me from office. OK, that's point one. Point two, I'd like to think that if an order or if an urging comes from outside the chain of command to remove the president and the military thinks he won or thinks, look, it's an open question right now because we still have three states haven't certified and we don't know who won the electoral college. They'll just say, I'm not following it. I'm not going to do that. I know what my oath says. I know what the constitution says. I know what is in the best interest of my institution. So for this to work, for what some of these Democrats have talked about to work, they've got to get the military to salute and follow that order. And I'm not convinced that that will happen. And let me just say one other thing. I think

it's important that I haven't really, I've only said this to a couple of people, but I need to write it up. The fact of the matter is what the left says they fear, which is Donald Trump saying to the military, okay, I lost, but I'm giving you an order now to keep me in power. Use force to keep me in power is an impossibility on two levels. One is, I know the man, he's never going to give that order. If he really loses, he's going to leave office. Second thing though is Donald Trump for, and I don't mean this as a knock on him, but what have we seen in the last four years? He's the president of the United States. His control over his own executive branch bureaucracy is very tenuous at best because there's a huge resistance inside of it that

doesn't like him and that doesn't want to implement his program. There is no way in hell that Donald Trump could give an order to the military saying, use force to keep me in president, even though I lost the election, and they will follow it and enforce that. There is no way. They will all mutiny if he gives them such an illegal order. Well, Michael, you almost made that point yourself in the first segment where Donald Trump, who is the duly elected president, didn't even give an order, but mentioned invoking a perfectly constitutional insurrection act. And the defense secretary is already opening his mouth in public, suggesting to the commander

in chief that it's not a good idea because he's, I mean, I don't know, confused about the chain of command. I'm not sure he didn't even invoke the Insurrection Act. So I think you make your own point that, of course, they're not going to let the president lose his stay. You know, that's just an absurdity. You know, but this goes back to the paradox of the left. They go back and forth weekly, sometimes daily. The president's a fascist. He's a monarch in waiting.

He's running an oligarchy with his little crew. They do it. And then the next day, they paint him as entirely incompetent, a buffoon, like the book, the Bob Woodward book. He either goes back and forth from being a moron in the press to being the most calculating like Lex Luthor genius ever. And I think that's more a reflection of the media's own stupidity than it is anything Trump is doing. You know, it reminds me, I was a kid in the 80s. So I, you know, I witnessed Ronald Reagan's

presidency from grade school through high school. and he got essentially the same criticism, bumbling, dimwit actor who's a figurehead for aides who actually run the country and, you know, evil genius, fascist tyrant. You know, I try to have it both ways. But in addition to the secretary of defense, remember General Milley, who accompanied the president the day that they cleaned out Lafayette Square when these huge protests had taken over, essentially right in front of the White House. And General Milley later had to apologize. I shouldn't have been there. I violated the, you know, the apolitical nature of the military.

So can you imagine General Milley taking an order from Donald Trump, Donald Trump calling him up and saying, OK, I lost, but I decided I want to be president for four more years. It's time to use the military to crack down. And General Milley saying, yeah, I'll do that. It's impossible. All the former, all the retired four stars out there, Mattis, McChrystal, many others have announced their opposition to Trump and they have enormous influence within the military. They're going to be on the phone immediately telling everybody they know still in the service, don't do this, but they don't even need to do that. Nobody's going to follow an order like that. It's just it's I don't even actually I don't know. Does the left actually believe this is a possibility or do they put it out there for propaganda purposes?

Maybe it's a combination of both. But anyone serious shouldn't believe that Trump has even a 1% chance of staying in power illegally on the backs of the military. staying in power illegally on the backs of the military. Yeah, we're talking to Michael Anton, author of the book, The Stakes, and the terrific article, The Coming Coup, which if you haven't read yet and you listen to my show, you've made a huge mistake. You must read it. Listen, I can't give homework. I'm not the school teacher. I'm just suggesting you all need to read this. So, Michael, in your article, you talk about this transition integrity project. Don't you love the names, by the way? This should be called the Transition Chaos Project and the Promote Misinformation Project. But it's always some name like the We Love America Project as they destroy America and teach critical race theory and

all this other anti-American stuff. My suggestion for its name should be Ensure Biden Becomes President by Any Means Necessary. Very good. I like that. I'm changing that. So the transition integrity, air quotes project. You were one of the first people I saw put out that they discussed in their manifesto, whatever it may be, having a potentially a street fight, not a legal one after the election. Now I put that comma slash not a legal one because that's important because, oh, listen, a lot of people use the term street fight in all types of different ways. You know, this courtroom is going to be a street fight. I don't really mean a street fight.

They really mean a street fight. It says a street fight, not a legal one. What exactly do you think their plans are? The Antifa BLM type riots to create enough chaos where people are just like, I've had enough Joe Biden's president no matter what? I think their plans is to track. One is there definitely will be a legal fight. I mean, we've read stories about they've assembled a huge team of lawyers. I think 600 at last count.

It may be more than that now to be suing in individual states that are close and to be suing in the federal courts to ensure a favorable victory for Joe Biden. But I think the other thing they're going to want to do, and the left is good at this, and unfortunately, much better at this than the right is, is fill the streets with protesters. Now, my own view is that it's in their interests if all those protests are peaceful. But you know, the powerful visual of a packed National Mall or a packed, you know, Times Square or something like that, with a camera from above showing just a sea of people carrying signs saying, you know, Trump Trump must go, oust the dictator or whatever, to put massive pressure on public opinion and on our institutions until... And then the message

will be to the president, look, this is untenable. Who cares if you won or if you think you won? The country's ungovernable to you now. No one will follow your orders and the people won't accept you. You're seen as illegitimate. So for the good of the nation, you just need to step down. I think that's what they mean by street fight. Although the events of 2020 have shown when the left fills the streets, things don't always stay peaceful. I'm not sure the left leftist leaders can control their own shock troops when they decide they want to break windows and burn things and loot. So anything can happen once the, once, once the protesters are out there. Taking notes as you're talking. Cause I had questions. I haven't got to ask my questions because you so much stuff you say is interesting. I'm taking notes on new questions. All right, let me take a quick break here. Michael Anton, again,

author of the new great book, the stakes and author of the terrific piece, the American mind, the coming coup frightening stuff, folks, we've got to be on top of it. We'll be right back with Michael Anton. Stay tuned. Folks, we have another sponsor today. Always appreciate your patience. Great companies want to be here and talk to you. This company's Allform. What's Allform? Well, you've heard me talk about my Helix mattress. It's like sleeping on a cloud. We love it. I have great news. Helix has gone beyond the bedroom and started making sofas. They've launched a new company called Allform. They're making premium customizable sofas and chairs shipped right to your door. You know what makes them really cool? For starters, it's the easiest way

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Anton. All right, welcoming back Michael Anton, again, the author of The Great Peace in the American Mind, The Coming Coup About the Democrats' Plan for Chaos Post-Election. You know, Michael, you mentioned something about the Democrats' shock troops. I did an interview with Dinesh D'Souza on my show twice. As a matter of fact, Dinesh is just a fascinating guy. I know you know who he is. And he's always talked about this too, how the Democrats and socialists and communists have always had their shock troops, always.

And the shock troops are the frontline chaos agents, which cause enough chaos and threat of fear that the people just need, it almost becomes a, all right, we've had enough. Whatever you say goes at this point, just give us back some semblance of normalcy. Haven't we already seen that, though, with Antifa and BLM, where after the Floyd incident, which was roundly condemned by everyone across every single possible political spectrum, ideology, whatever it may be, they've unleashed the shock troops anyway. And I think, my humble opinion, I think that got out of control too. And it only slowed down when the polls started to change. You know, what I've noticed is graffiti and also protest signs that some of the Antifa,

BLM and other types carry in it. And the wording is, are you tired yet? That sounds like kind of blackmail talk to me. To America, are you tired yet? Yeah, this is exhausting. We've shut down your city. You can't get to work. You can't get back. Your favorite restaurant has been burned to the ground or whole sections.

Look at, you know, I'm in D.C. Whole sections of D.C. for a long time were closed. Many of them are still at least close to vehicle traffic stores, boarded up either because their windows were broken or because the owners didn't want to risk it and just decided to put plywood up. And the city's kind of a ghost town compared to what it used to be. I think that is part of the strategy is to make people get tired and say, all right,

I want some semblance of normal back. So what is it that you want? And what do I need to give you to get you to stop? That's part of it, for sure. I mean, I can see that. I can see that after the election, where you have Antifa in, listen, my town where I live in Martin County, Florida, has a great sheriff and a great police department. Luckily, we haven't had any civil unrest, but I know my neighbors and I can only imagine post-election if this coming coup they're talking about, if the shock troops they have are unleashed here, what, you know, two or three weeks of not being able to buy food, not being able to travel on roads, having people pulled out of cars and literally beaten up, graffiti all over. I can only imagine the effect on the collective psyche in my neighborhood, it would have to be devastating. It would be devastating. And that's one of the most disappointing things about 2020 to me is how varied law enforcement response has been. Now, in some places, law enforcement has really

stood tall and said, we're not going to tolerate this here. And Florida seems to me to be one of the bright spots where you've had a lot of local county sheriffs, but also Miami city cops just saying, we're not putting up with looting and rioting and we're going to enforce the law. There's a lot of other parts of the country, though, where the mayors, the governors, the sheriffs, the DAs, the police chiefs have held back. I think some of that's deliberate and some of it is police chiefs thinking, if my mayor is not going to support me, how can I risk my officers' lives going in to enforce the law? And then officers could get injured, get harmed, or end up being charged with crimes by DAs who are out of control. That's the worst thing about 2020 is people defending themselves, defending their property in a lot of parts of America,

them getting arrested and getting the book thrown at them. I mean, we've seen the McCloskeys, Kyle Rittenhouse. And I can't remember the guy's name, Jake, somebody, I think this was in Louisville, who was attacked in his own business and his father was attacked, defended himself. The local D.A. investigated and said, I'm not going to charge this guy. This is clearly self-defense. So the feds swoop in and charge him. He gets doxed, further attacks and protests. The poor guy ends up committing suicide. The law enforcement really needs to step up here and do its job, which is to promote law and order, not attack people, arrest people, harass people for exercising their lawful, constitutional, and natural right to self-defense. You know, Michael, once your piece, The Coming Coup, went viral, I saw a number of other

people catch on. And some of them have been writing about this. And I think you just kind of nailed the essence of what the Democrats are planning post-election. Maybe that's why your piece got as much attention. It was really well written. I mean, I read it three or four times before I covered it on my show, but I saw a number of people afterwards cite your work. And one of them I saw, I believe, was in Revolver. I'm not really sure.

But it mentioned something I found fascinating, how the tactics being used now by people like in the Transition Integrity Project, in that group, Stanley McChrystal, who you mentioned before, former military officer, he's got a group that he's advising called Defeat Disinfo. But one of the core takeaways from their piece was it's frightening how these military and intel tactics we've used overseas to foment revolutions, color revolutions overseas, resemble quite nicely the same tactics being used here to attack Donald Trump. Get the media on your side, claim the leaders illegitimate, point out incessant character flaws, paint his opponent as a, you know, put him at the top of the totem pole of moral integrity, street violence, street chaos, get the military on your side. I mean, it kind of sounds like what's happening now. It is.

It's very similar. It sounds like when you mentioned Revolver, they've covered this specifically, I think, with greater depth than anybody, how the similarities between this and a color revolution in Eastern Europe and in the former states that used to be part of the Soviet Union have been unfolding. If people have asked me, I think, you know, what's the specific difference between a color revolution and a coup? The best answer I can come up with is a color revolution is when you can get it done, get the leader ousted without recourse to the military. The military either doesn't, you know, just stands down, but it doesn't actively,

it may be on your side, it may be neutral, but it doesn't do anything. And a coup, more strictly is when, you know, force is required and the military as an institution has to get involved. The reason I use the word coup in my piece is because the people talking about it, we're openly talking about using the military, including former military officers themselves were openly talking about using the military. So you want to call me a crazy conspiracy theorist. You know, you guys are the ones talking like this. It isn't me. You know, Michael, having some, you've been at this game longer than I have, but having become a, as my podcast audience guru, you know, you put a target on your back. And that's okay.

I don't like it, but it's okay. It's part of the business. I've got a lot of experience with this. When I had a source early on tell me almost four years ago now in a Dallas hotel room that Spygate was real, I laughed them off. Me being a former federal agent, I thought, sir, that's the dumbest thing I have ever. There are no, it's not possibleest thing I have ever. There were no, it's not possible. There are too many guardrails. I gaffed it off. My wife was there.

I'm having this conversation. I'm talking, I'm like this. I'm looking at her going, pointing a phone, like this guy's telling me some crazy story. But it turns out the guy was right. I wound up, of course, following up with him, became a valued source, wound up writing three books on it. And this is the left's tactic. It's a pernicious, devious little tactic. When people like you and I, when your piece went viral, when the truth gets out there, what they do is they want to put a tinfoil cap on you and make you look like the crazy one. And just so you know, and I know you know this, there's nothing you can do to escape that. You can quote them. You can take videos of them saying it. It will always, the story will always be about you.

I think you're figuring that out now, right? Yeah, no, and their dominance, their overwhelming dominance of the mainstream media, cable news, the nightly news, the newspapers, social media means that the message, I mean, thank God we have venues like you, Fox News and many others to that the message i mean thank god we have venues like you fox news and some and many others to get the message out but we got to admit that these channels are a minority of the bandwidth that's pumping out a message i just mentioned now because why not um i even got a death threat out of this from a guy who from a co-chairman and co-founder of the tip it was a veiled death threat. He compared me to some Nazi who got shot by firing

squad in 1945 for just for having written articles that- Yeah, I covered it on my show. Don't worry, I took care of him. I mean, I just want everybody to know Nils Gilman of the Berggruen Institute, and his tweet is still up there. And he as well, totally fair game. I'm not calling for violence. I just think the guy's a scumbag. And he got all these people to come out. All these blue checkmark big names came out and defended Nils and even said, Anton, you should apologize to him. I find that incredibly brazen. The guy tweets a death threat about me, and I'm supposed to say sorry to him.

I mean, that's. No, no, no. I wasn't going to let that happen. I know you weren't either. You're a pretty tough guy. Paul, remember that show? We found out about this tweet. Someone sent it to us the next day. I savaged that son of a whatever. But no, I wasn't going to let that happen. And again, just my experience, I'm playing fake tough guy. Listen, it stinks to get attacked. I know it. I'm on the receiving end of it all the time, all day, all the time. The only way to fight back is to just fight back viciously. That's it. I mean, see, only if you don't, they just do it again. And I found with me, I've even been told

by some people, oh, maybe dial it down. No, thanks. I'm not doing that. I'm really sorry. You're going to attack me and my character because I exposed you and turned out to be right in the spy gate thing. You exposed possibly one of the most threatening aspects of this upcoming election and warned people about it using their own words, and then they were attacking you. It's absurd. Let me take a quick break. Again, we're talking to Michael Anton, author of the terrific book. Again, got it right here. There's the cover, folks. You can check it out. An American flag burning on the cover there, sadly, right at the front because we're in a lot of trouble. His book, The Stakes, is about literally the stakes of what's coming up in this upcoming election.

We're going to talk a bit about his book after this break. And I want you to check out his article as well. Very important piece. The Coming Coup and the American Mind. We'll be right back. All right, our final sponsor of the day, our good friends at We The People Holsters. Listen, this COVID time has been really rough,

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I have a couple more questions about the coming coup article. But your book, The Stakes, America at the Point of No Return. Tell me about it. What inspired you to write it? What's your warning in it? And what does it say about this upcoming election? In part, what inspired me to write it is being born and raised in California, being on my mother's side, anyway, a fifth generation Californian. So going back all the way to the 19th century, my family's been there and seeing what's happened to it as it's become

a deep blue democratic one party state where the left rules without opposition and can do whatever it wants. And I, you know, the popular image of California is the sparkling coasts and the great, you know, Yosemite Valley and the, you know, the forests and all the wonderful natural beauty and the manmade amenities like the Golden Gate Bridge and Disneyland and the beaches. And that's what people think when Hollywood, Silicon Valley, people think that's California. That is California, but it's a fraction of California. The real California has become a dystopia for the middle class. The infrastructure is crumbling. Home prices are through the roof and wages are low.

So the worst of all possible world and people are fleeing in droves and in fact for the first time since 1850 when california became a state it's almost certain to lose a congressional seat in the next sentence sorry census because the population is finally declining and i was convinced in 2016 that had the president not won had trump not won we would have had blue state politics from coast to coast more or less forever. And I'm more convinced than ever that if we lose in 2020, that will happen. And I'm joined by a lot of people who now endorse this thesis and say, yeah, again, it's one of those things. If you're a Democrat, you go emerging Democratic majority.

This is great. We'll never lose again. But if I say it, they say, oh, conspiracy theory. This guy's a nut. He believes in the great replacement in all of this stuff, even though they say it. Well, the more immigrants we have, the more democratic a state becomes, and immigration is the key to tipping America blue forever. So I think the president needs to get immigration under control for a lot of reasons, not least of which is national security, raising wages, tightening up the labor market, raising wages, especially in the bottom half of the economic ladder, right? Bankers' wages aren't impacted by immigration, although Silicon Valley wages are by high-end programs like the H-1Bs that undercut wages of coders and programmers in

California and throughout the industry. But so I just think if we lose, if the president loses, we will see. First of all, we already know what the Democrats have been threatening to do. And here's another example of that celebration parallax. They go out and say, we're going to add D.C. and Puerto Rico. We're going to pack the court and we're going to get rid of the filibuster. And when the Republicans say, so you're going to add D.C. and Puerto Rico, pack the court and filibuster, they point at us and go, you crazy right wing conspiracy fear mongers.

Right. I'm just saying you guys told us you're going to do this. All we're doing is quoting your own words back to you. They want to do those things, but they want they don't want to alarm people about it in advance. So when we talk about it, they have to shout at us, whereas when they talk about it, they're just doing it to get their own base fired up. But I think they will at least attempt to do all that. And I think it could mean a USA that looks like New York or California, where the

Republican Party exists, but doesn't matter, can't win elections, can't really exercise power. And so the last break on blue power in the country is gone and they get to implement their program in full. You know, I'm an eternal optimist. I know it doesn't seem, I can be dour at times, but I do. I believe these things come in cycles, both micro and macro. But again, like John Maynard Keynes, who I generally revile, but he did have that expression, which is in the long run, we're all dead. If we're in the middle of a macro and that macro is on a trend, we're down for freedom. You know, it doesn't mean much to you if it turns around after you're dead. And this is what worries me about what you're talking about and what you discuss in your new book here.

Again, the stakes by Michael Anton. If they do pack the Senate with D.C. and Puerto Rico, and by the way, Puerto Rico, it's not really a lock that they'd have two Democrats. Nonetheless, D.C.'s a lock. There's no statistical chance. So let's say you get one Republican senator from Puerto Rico by a long shot. So you still have three more on the Democrat side. And then you pack the court with, let's say, two more, even whatever, four more justices, whatever it may be, that are diehard liberals. The problem then, Michael, is we get this... I heard a story once by a radio host, and I forget

his name. He's talking about the Freedom Train. How Republicans... The Freedom Train left the station a long time ago as we get further and further away from real, good, pure, unadulterated freedom, Republicans only slow the train down. They never reverse it and get it back to the station. So like the Democrats, for instance, we've seen with Obamacare, the Republicans came out all fiery. John Boehner was like crying on the house floor. We're going to get rid of this, rip it out, fruit and branch. Now we have Republicans actually running to protect this thing. So that's what worries me about what you're saying about California is we may be living in a really bad macro where if Trump loses, there is no saving this place for a generation because there's no math to. Right. You quoted Keynes. I'll quote another economist. This is Herbert Stein,

Nixon's chief of the Council on Economic Advisors. And one of his favorite aphorisms was, anything that can't go on forever won't. And my view is woke blue state politics is a thing that can't go on forever. There are too many internal contradictions. And there are too many ways that it's just anti-nature. It's just anti-human nature. Now, the problem is a thing that can't go on forever can still go on a long time. Communism was anti-nature, shot through with internal contradictions. The Soviet Union lasted 70 years. I sure hope blue woke governance tyranny in the United States doesn't last 70 years, but it could last 20, 30, 50. I don't know.

I do think, though, that it is a thing that can't go on forever and so won't. I'd like to see it end and us return to a normal, moderate, sensible politics while I'm still alive. But I have to care about what happens later because I care about my kids and I'm a teacher. I've got now generations of students who are, you know, in their twenties coming up behind me. I have to care about them. So even if we can't save this thing while I'm still around, I'm going to do everything

I can to help, to help them help save it for them, but also help them prepare to save it. Yeah. Yeah. What did he say? The world takes hostages. It's not just about us. And I agree. I mean, I called my second book, The Fight, precisely because of that reason. It's not about us. I'm a Christian. I believe in my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. I don't know your religion, not my business, but I just believe you were put here to fight. You weren't necessarily put here to win. A lot of brave, honorable people didn't win their fights, but their life and their honor and their integrity was marked by what they stood for, even if the ramifications of their decisions didn't happen while they were even around. So I believe that strongly, what you're saying, that these are generational fights.

But what worries me is what you said, that really dumb ideas can persist for a really long time. I mean, you saw it in New York. I grew up in New York with the Ed Koch, David Dinkins era. Michael, I was on the other coast from you. I mean, I can't tell you a major city, one of the world's great cities, decay. It's fast. When you watched it happening in front of you, you couldn't believe it was happening. in front of you. You couldn't believe it was happening. Graffiti, trains, shell game folks everywhere in Times Square, hookers, prostitutes, drugs, car break-ins every night, two or three on a block. The cops wouldn't even take police reports sometimes for car break-ins. It was considered just like, hey, they only stole your car. And I find this stuff can get really, really bad for literally decades, but it only changes when the elites start to see it hit them. Because the elites are the ones that control the messaging, academia, and the media. And once their kid gets mugged, God forbid, their car gets stolen for the fourth or fifth time, they're the ones that get on the news and say, hey, Mayor Dinkins, this city really sucks right now. You better fix

something. I actually, I did grow up in California, but city really sucks right now. You better fix something. I actually, I did grow up in California, but I've been going to New York since I was a little kid and I've lived there twice. I lived there in the last part of the last year of the Dinkins administration in 93, which wasn't New York's worst, but it was still grubby and grimy. I think it's starting to come back. And then I lived there for two years. I worked for Rudy Giuliani when he was mayor. I worked in City Hall. I sort of saw the city at its best when it had recovered. To me, one of the most depressing things about 2020 is, you know, New York started to go bad, I think, in the early to mid 60s and especially under John Lindsay was probably the worst mayor before de Blasio, the city had ever had. And it took 30 years to recover from that. And it recovered almost fully and completely. And it was a spectacular place in so many ways. And I just feel terrible that the city gave back all that progress in two months this year. And I didn't know you worked for Giuliani. This is a surprise on the show live. How long did you

work for him? Two years so so you know as good as anyone what he did and michael i mean listen this is great i didn't intend this to go in this direction but we're going to take it in because this is really terrific um so for those of you who grew up in new york and obviously michael having worked there the city was a a hellhole i mean to describe it as a nightmare is it being generous to nightmares. Rudy Giuliani runs against David Dinkins. He loses the first time, right? Runs the second time, wins by a sliver. Doesn't win by a lot. Slides by, even factoring in the voter fraud, right? And then runs for reelection after he institutes sound anti-crime policies. Finally, some sane economics in New York. And he wins over Ruth Messinger

in a landslide of historic proportions as a Republican, which says to me that when people can bypass the elite cultural machine and see for themselves what a good, solid, liberty-oriented Republican can do to fix a bad area, they'll vote even overwhelming the bad media coverage. But then what happens? Things get good again. The culture takes back over and you go right back to Bill de Blasio. Right, right. Yeah. Rudy was reelected by, I think, with 60% of the vote. I mean, an unbelievable number. Now, hard to imagine that happening again, certainly for a Republican law and order candidate. And then his legacy was effectively preserved by Mike Bloomberg for 12 years and three terms.

In part, certainly the crime law and order legacy was preserved by Mike Bloomberg. And there are other ways Bloomberg was different. But, you know, de Blasio is just a relic from another era. You know, we don't want to. It's like he learned the wrong lesson on everything. You know, one of the lessons from the Giuliani success was you got to prosecute the small crimes. You can't let public order turnstile jumping graffiti, the squeegee guys, all of that stuff. If you let that happen, you let larger disorder grow from it. And so he kept trying to keep a lid on everything. And de Blasio comes in and says, I'm not going to do that anymore.

Very similar stuff is going on on the West Coast. So you mentioned property crime. San Francisco right now is the highest property crime rate in the nation. And I actually had a, I had a, I was there a few years ago. I go a lot because I'm from there and I visit constantly. And I was there and I had a car break in and I called the SFPD and they kind of laughed. They're like, well, we'll take a report, but we're not sending anybody to see you. What do you think? And, uh, you know, they basically said, don't call us again because there will be no followup and you're whatever was stolen. You're not getting back. So you take the report just for insurance purposes. They don't effectively enforce property crime in San Francisco anymore. And to mention George Soros again, just to get

in further trouble with the left, he put a bunch of money behind this hard left-wing terrorist, or I shouldn't say that he's a terrorist. He's the son of two left-wing terrorists who went to jail for killing a police officer and then was handed over to two other left-wing terrorists who bombed one police plaza in the early seventies, the infamous Bernadine Dorn and Bill Ayers, Barack Obama's good buddies who raised him. And now this guy is the district attorney of San Francisco County. And he's just saying, here's a whole list of crimes that I'm not going to prosecute. And San Francisco has become a dystopian hellhole that might actually even be worse than New York in the Dinkins era was with the big exception is there aren't a lot of murders because of the crack

epidemic then isn't raging now, but quality of life in San Francisco, property crime, you know, the kinds of things you see on the streets, the open drug use, open literally feces everywhere on the streets in San Francisco. That is worse than anyone has ever seen it in living memory. who've written some bestselling books about the Rudy Giuliani era, the decrease in crime and the success of generally conservative law enforcement first politics there, or public order first, I should say, politics. And they've tried to attribute it to all kinds of bizarre phenomena. But the hard reality is having been a police officer and worked in the Giuliani era, the solution was rather simple. Giuliani was just the first one to implement it. the solution was rather simple. Giuliani was just the first one to implement it.

Broken windows policing, where when you let a car be stolen and say there's a tool left behind, and you don't fingerprint the tool because you say, ah, like this SFPD told you in San Francisco, it's just property crime. You're not getting it back. That same guy who stole the car might've went on later to commit a rape or god forbid a murder uh all kinds of horrible crimes and giuliani said yeah when we get these guys we can prevent the other stuff too one of the things the nypd found i'm sure you were an officer you know i was just a policy guy in the city hall but that they found is okay you catch a guy jumping over a turnstile and transit cop stops him and they run his name turns out he's probably odds where he's got a warrant for something else or he's carrying an illegal weapon.

And, you know, you get a gun off the street that way. You know, they're all kind. These things are connected. They're not they're not harmless because the people who do them are more likely than not to be not harmless. Right. And so broken windows policing, which originates from an article in the, of all things we trashed, I trashed the Atlantic Monthly earlier in talking to you. I'm going to praise it now, but of the Atlantic Monthly of long ago, in 1982, published an article by James Q. Wilson and George Kelling called Broken Windows. That's where the idea comes from. And they laid this out.

And over the course of the 80s, some innovative guys in the NYPD, above all, Jack Maple, a fairly legendary figure. He was the first deputy commissioner. Bow tie wear. Bow tie and the hippie hat and the two-tone shoes. Implemented it along with Bill Bratton. Broken Windows Policing is the single most successful sociological or public policy initiative of the 20th century.

It's worked everywhere it's been tried. It's saved literally thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of lives from coast to coast. And we're giving up on it inexplicably. And it's going to cost lives. It's going to harm property. It's going to do nobody any good. This is a proven theory. This is not even a theory anymore. This is a proven fact. It works. It makes communities better and safer, and we should not abandon it. It's crazy that we're abandoning it. So Michael, I'll wrap here on your book because again, folks, I just want to strongly encourage you to read Michael's article and the book. The article's in the American Mind. It's called The Coming Coup by Michael Anton, A-N-T-O-N. Covered it on my show. You regular viewers have heard about it now four or five times. It really is a, you know, it's a lighthouse in the fog. You need to look, you need to be able

to make your way back to shore to all this fog we're hearing right now. And this article will kind of beam me in on what's going on. But his book here, again, called The Stakes by Michael Anton, it's a warning about what's ahead. Give me kind of your worst case scenario first, and then we'll end on a good note there. Your worst case scenario, let's say, let's game it out. Joe Biden, God forbid, wins this, which would be a disaster. We lose the Senate. Not only we lose, but we lose in states we thought we'd hold. Joni Ernst, Cory Gardner in Colorado. Let's say they get close to even a filibuster proof of job, which I don't think matters because they're going to dump the filibuster anyway. And let's say their

house majority grows, I don't know, 10 more seats. They're kind of peaked out a little bit, but let's say 10 more seats. I mean, what do you see policy-wise as some of the worst things we'll see? Tax hikes, just the, just attacks on police. You know, I don't want to put words in your mouth. What do you see? Yeah, tax hikes, certainly, although that may be the least of our problems. I think they'll go back to this horrible Obama policy called Affirmatively Furthering Fair Housing,

which was trying to eliminate single families. Explain what that is just quickly, because, yeah, because everybody in my show is fascinated. It's basically an attack on the suburbs to say, look, if you're a successful suburban town with single family zoning and high home prices and good schools and stuff like that, you're privileged. And what we need to do is get rid of that zoning and start moving populations around. We want to take people out of the cities and move them into mixed use housing with you. And so, you know, look, I think people should have the right to live where they want to live, but that includes having the right to live in a single family house in a single family neighborhood.

If you want to, they want to make that effectively illegal and do, in a sense, population transfers. The guy to read on this is Stanley Kurtz, who's written the most about it. National Review. Yeah, spectacular. I think they're going to try to push through some kind of reparations bill. That was a fringe idea for a long time. It's now become mainstream in the Democratic Party, even the Brookings Institution, very establishment, supposedly center-left institution. The soul of old Democratic Washington has come out saying, we should do this. That's just a massive wealth

transfer from savings and home equity for people who, let's be honest, there's nobody alive today who ever owned a slave. And there's really not only that, you know, even if you could say, well, we could take it only from people who are the descendants of slave owners. Why are we punishing people for something their great, great, great, great grandparents did? That's just a violation of any semblance of fairness or national justice. Of course. their great great great great grandparents did that's just a violation of any semblance of fairness or national justice of course i think i think they'll go crazy with the woke stuff the critical race theory the anti-patriotic education um and all of that uh and and i just think that they're what they will also try to do is essentially federalize everything right so the

idea that there are states and the states can do, that the states have their jurisdiction and realm and the feds have theirs will be, well, no. States, we the feds, we know what morality is. We know what morality requires. If you don't live up to our standards, we'll either cut federal aid to you or we'll impose other punitive measures because we want to enforce uniformity across the entire country. So they're going to be going after red states and saying, you need to get in line with the progressive cutting edge of California, New York, and Massachusetts. And if you don't, we're going to use punitive measures to make sure that you do. I think we're going to see a lot of that.

Sounds like a real party. Sounds terrific if you're a nut job. Yeah, no, it sounds great. By great, I mean really crappy. Do you think also you're going to see, before I get things, I don't want to leave the audience on a bad note here, but Do you think also you're going to see, before I get things, I don't want to leave the audience on a bad note here, but do you think also we're going to see

a doubling and tripling down on corporations like we've seen with Elizabeth Warren with her emphasis on stakeholders rather than the shareholders, renewed shareholders, a renewed pressure on corporations to get with the woke program? Yeah.

Right now, though, they don't even need to put pressure on corporations. Right, they're doing it anyway. They're feeling where the wind is going and they want to get ahead of the wind so that they're not being pressured. The problem is, at least it seems to me, is when corporations adopt all of this stuff, if there is nature, if there's human nature, if there are laws of economics, as you and I have learned them, this has to hurt the bottom line eventually, and they're going to have to dial it back. And that's when they get the pressure. Well, you said that you'd make your workforce, you know, 50% X, and you know, you would do it

solely on demographics and quotas and diversity, and this kind of thing and meet these, and you haven't done it. And therefore, you need to be punished. And some of these people may say, well, And you haven't done it. And therefore, you need to be punished. And some of these people may say, well, we tried to do it, but it's difficult with all the competition for talent and this and that. And I have to be worried about my bottom line and accountability to shareholders. And we'll see how far they're willing to go in the woke direction at the expense of the bottom line before their businesses start to suffer and or fail and before their shareholders start to punish them. But for now, they clearly feel like they've got some running room. So we can definitely expect more of that. And we can especially expect, I think, the government to work even further, more closely with media and social media to enforce various norms. The government's in a wonderful position. The blue left doesn't like the First Amendment and wants to restrict speech and censor people, de-platform people,

but they don't have the legal power to do it. So they outsource it to Google and Twitter and other technology platforms who are private companies and say, well, you know, First Amendment doesn't apply to a private platform. The government loves that and they work closely in many ways with these companies. And I think you'll see more of that. I think you could see speech severely restricted. I think you will see speech severely restricted in a coming blue. Yeah. Yeah. We're

seeing it now. Yeah. So exit question. So we don't leave the audience depressed on a weekday here. If Donald Trump wins, I am an optimist. If he wins and we have eight years, that's four more years to clean out this mess. I mean, let's be honest. We talked about it in the opening segment of this discussion. For those of you who missed it, you can listen and rewind on the digital podcast version. Michael brought up the fact that clearly I'm a supporter of the president, but there were bad personnel decisions made early. I think there was an effort to do kind of this, you know, Lincoln,

let's bring in our old political enemies, people into this kind of circle of new allies. But that was a different era when men had honor. A lot of these men he brought in simply don't and saw a great book deal and went out and screwed the president over. But now I think the president's kind of gotten hip to that. I know he has. They're very careful now with personnel. I think with four more years, you could get a nice

Roto-Rooter job on the deep state. And I'm not saying we're going to turn this whole freedom train around, but I think the president could do real damage to the cancerous components of our excellent country, but their government, which has some warts on it, we could get rid of. I think even a flawless eight years of Trump was never going to fix all the problems because there are too many and too deep. We definitely need another four. I think you're absolutely right that he can accomplish a lot in another four, both as president, but also what I think he needs to do in his second term is rebuild, build a new consensus within the Republican Party around his platform, around his trade platform, his

immigration platform, his national security platform, his individual liberty law and order platform, so that we really need is not just four more years of Trump, but then a generation or more of Trumpists behind him in Congress and the Senate, in state houses, as governors, and hopefully as future presidents. And that, to me, is the most important thing that we need out of the next four years is to build that kind of nationalist, populist, patriotic, pro-middle class, pro-worker, pro-American economy. Not pro-American economy, pro the numbers, because the old

Republicans would say, well, we're pro-economy. Look, the GDP is up and the stock market's up. Well, all the gains are going to Manhattan and Palo Alto, but hey, the numbers are up, right? No, we need to share the gains widely from coast to coast, all throughout the middle, the north, south, southeast, southwest, everywhere. And if we have a Republican party that's committed to that agenda, then we have a fighting chance over a generation to rebuild what we need to rebuild, which was never going to happen in eight years. Eight years is just necessary to lay the foundation. Which is a perfect ending because that's actually the subject of Michael's book. Again, The Stakes. There it is, folks, right there by Michael Anton. I was honored to get a copy

here. It is a terrific book. So much meat and potatoes in here. A lot to get to pick it up on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, again, bookstores everywhere. Don't forget to read Michael's piece. It is an eye-opener. I'm telling you, if you're stuck out there in the fog and you want to know what's coming, it is a lighthouse of reason and it exposes what we need to see. It's called The Coming Coup and the American Mind. Be warned, read the piece. Michael, thanks so much for your time. This interview was a real pleasure. Hope to have you back sometime. I'd come anytime. Thanks a lot.