The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - Hour 2: We're a Country of Haters

Episode Date: April 28, 2025

A look at the most lopsided playoff series in Greg Cote's memory and, of course, The Country Bear Jamboree. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Game four of the Stanley Cup Playoffs. First round the Florida Panthers lead the series against the Tampa Bay Lightning 2-1. The Panthers have a 7 game winning streak at home following a loss. However, between these two teams, Florida and Tampa, the underdogs have covered the puck line in 11 of their last 12 games in Sunrise. Because of that, I think the Panthers are going gonna win, but they are going to win by one, so. What? Yes, go with the Tampa Bay Lightning

at a underdog of a goal and a half against the spread. But the Panthers are gonna win. Billy. Dan, I'm gonna stay on the ice and I'm gonna take the Florida Panthers minus one and a half against the Tampa Bay Lightning. I don't know what's going around these parts here. What's this? I don't know what's going around these parts here. What's this?

I don't know what's going around these parts where everybody all of a sudden is afraid of this Lightning team. And I was told, I don't remember, because honestly I blacked out, because when I see red, I see black also at the same point in time. So last week I was seeing red and I was seeing black

and I was told over the weekend that I proclaimed in the Panthers and Lightning series that I wanted to get hit by Lightning and that's how unafraid of the Lightning that I was. the Panthers and Lightning series that I wanted to get hit by lightning and that's how unafraid of the lightning that I was. And I don't remember saying that, but I believe that in my heart and soul. This lightning team is so soft that if they struck me, I wouldn't even feel it.

It'd be like a zap, a little zap. So I know what you're saying. So far in this series, the Road Team has won every game, Billy. Panthers won two at Tampa. Tampa Tampa came back returned the favor seemed like a very lopsided game 5-1 don't pay attention to that score open netter in there when there's an open netter you toss the records out you know I mean that game hmm hmm a little blip on the radar Panthers are gonna come back and they're gonna show

everyone why this is in Sunrise, Florida, the home ice that everyone is afraid to play on. It is so hot that the ice can melt because of the energy that all the Panthers fan bring into the arena when they see red. And Dan, you know, because you've hit that drum, you know that when that drum is beat, it is a totally different animal.

He just said the road team is winning all the games that was his information I said it too and I'm telling you that ends today right the Panthers and ride them hard Florida Panthers minus one and a half but in a contract year you guys are doing such a good job with not doing that in a way that impresses anybody. You both just picked it. You just, all you guys do is make homer picks. Like you guys just picked the home team to always. No, no. I told you guys all year long, my NHL picks have been on fire this year. I've been telling you guys, ducks fly together all

year long. Now unfortunately, the ducks aren't in the playoffs right now, so I can't take the Ducks. But tonight, we're on the Pan Wagon, baby. Woo! Woo, woo, woo! Roy, don't try and defend your pick by saying, I only have the Panthers winning by a single goal. Like, you're trying to prove to me what a homer you're not by always picking the Panthers to win. Listen, they're not gonna cover it tonight, Dan.

I'm sorry. Hell yeah they are. All right, but Billy said they are,. You guys got different picks. Anyone want to pick Tampa? Anyone? How dare you. No? Okay. Roy picked Tampa technically. No, he didn't. I think Tony has a game. He did not pick Tampa technically. He picked Florida technically. To win, he said flatly he thought Florida would win. But not to cover. Yeah, it's a one and a half goal spread. So he took, yeah, the spread. If this is the money line, it would be different.

Okay. Do you have to explain gambling to you, Dan? Thank you guys for all your help, yes. Yes, you guys are such great gamblers that I want all of your advice because we get it and it's so clearly all important information. I have one over at the Association if you want. No, I don't want, yeah, okay.

So the Heat have lost seven straight home playoff games. Tyler Hero didn't touch the ball very much in the last game and Cleveland did that to him and that's what the Heat look like when he's your number one option. They're gonna be a team that loses more than it wins. Darius Garland did not play for the Cavs like when he's your number one option. They're gonna be a team that loses more than it wins. Darius Garland did not play for the Cavs

after saying that they targeted Tyler Hero. And in his place, Sam Merrill went 0 for 3, no points. And it didn't matter. They still handed the Heat their worst playoff loss ever. 0 for 3, but still a very funny guy. 0 for 3, so Garland is out, Sam Merrill plays the 19 minutes, doesn't do anything the entirety of the game, and the Heat lose by more points than they ever have in a playoff game. But then he did a full set of the Haul.

They've lost three games by 76 points combined. I don't know whether quantifiably this is the most lopsided playoff series ever but in my mind It is not in my memory. It is it is not I think there's Oklahoma City Memphis this year All this out of the bracket. Yes, the other the other series Well, I know that is well Greg. They want to get my 53 Greg first game. What? Okay, you're gonna hang on Alright, they're up. Do. Hold on. All right, dog with a bone. Continue your show and I'm gonna look something up.

Let's continue. San Marill could have a big night tonight. You can look it up and you will find out that Oklahoma City has a bigger margin. We will, well, you will see. I'm telling you and the rest of us are telling you that we know it to be so because the first game was decided by 50 plus four.

But this series isn't over yet. If the Heat lose by 100 tonight, then this one obviously more lopsided Miami's average Losing margin is greater than the Grizzlies was That's quantifiable. I'm looking up. I'm looking at the numbers right here. Hang on just a second But you said a total number was 70 something look he's doing the math of the eight I'm right four divided by 78 is less than three divided by 76 Quantifiable most lopsided playoff series in Greg Cody's memory

Thank you, I appreciate you petering out there the way that you did. I did the math. You did the math. You did it by average and then you did four games instead of three. That's why average is worth. They've only played three. What are you supposed to do? Right. And in Greg's defense, he said in his memory, he didn't remember the other series. Yeah.

That's true. Well, I remembered that the Grizzlies lost 4-0 by less than a margin than the Heat is currently losing That's what I remembered. Was I right? Hell, yes. Yes, I was You are you are not right that this is the most lopsided series ever played. You are also not you're also not You are you are also not right on the idea that somebody hasn't been outscored by more than 70 whatever points you have said. On average, three? Through three games, Memphis had been outscored by OKC by more than the Cavs have outscored the Heat.

Yeah, but not in total. If I may, if I may, Greg, let me stand up for you here. Thank you. The playoffs are all about adjustments, right? What happened there is Greg said 76 points that's the biggest like margin over, you know the course of a series in his memory and Then we called him on it and then he figured out it wasn't but it was when you do the average

What Greg just did there then is a playoff adjustment. He adjusted. It's the chest move now. It's your turn What are you gonna do? What were your thoughts this weekend when you guys saw the room that Texas quarterback Quinn Ewers was sitting in while he was drafted? I thought that Quinn Ewers would go higher. Did you see the room that we're talking about? Look at the screen right there.

Oh my God. An avid hunter with a lot of dead animals around him. He'd be much better off if he had gone back to college for another year, although I guess Arch Manning would, or ARC as Ellie says, I assume that Arch Manning will be starting there next year, even if Quinn Uers had returned. Well he wasn't gonna return, he was made offers

by a number of schools and there's reports of like up to eight million dollars in NIL money to get Quinn Ubers to go be your quarterback for a year. He opted, very questionable decision, to go to the NFL when everyone kind of knew he wasn't gonna be drafted very high and now I believe he's gonna be on the Dolphins and he's gonna make like $800,000 a year. So he's getting 10% of what he could've gotten

had he stayed in college last year. I guess he's really be on the Dolphins and he's gonna make like eight hundred thousand dollars a year So he's getting 10% of what he could have gotten had he stayed in college last year I guess he's really gambling on himself. The room is wild and I think and I could be wrong here I think had the coaches and the GM's seen that room earlier. He probably would have gotten drafted higher I think that part of the reason why he didn't get drafted earlier is because they didn't see that room cuz that room reads NFL coaches know this guy. Killer, killer instinct. Hunter, yeah, absolutely. Guys, I think I've discovered my new assignment for publicory finds out because I'm going to, yes,

I'm going to find out. I don't think he killed all those animals. No. That's not, that's, he's right now that's stolen Valor. That's not him. Wow. Somebody else did the hunting and he just sat on the couch. I need Ron McGill's commentary on that photo, by the way.

All right, we will get that tomorrow. He's not here today. Waste of antlers. So how many animals is that that is in the room? And is that a bear over there on the left? Is that a tiny bear? Like what's happening? There seems to be a tiny bear

wearing a hat over there on the left. I don't know what the thank you Absolutely not something what is that that's a taxidermist that got a hold of a baby bear What did that's just a stuffed animal guys something that was killed That's what I'm saying Like I think if we do a little deep dive into a lot of these animals in the background, we're going to find out a lot of this is just all fictitious. It's fugazi.

Wow. This guy right here, he's playing the part. You know what? I wouldn't draft him because I don't believe he did all this stuff. What if they're animatronic and it's really like Country Bear Jamboree when he walks into that room and he starts singing? I like it. Is the Country Bear Jamboree still a thing at Disney?

Oh, it's been repurposed. Yeah, Country Bear Musical Jambore, so I went not too long ago, and I'll tell you what then they close it about I want to say a year ago, and they refurbished it You know what if you like Disney tunes now the Bears it sounds corny now. They're singing some of the hits They're singing Aladdin Is that a t-rex? Come on now come on man., this guy's a time trap. This dude's a fraud, man.

What do you mean a fraud? That's absolutely some, he would've gotten drafted higher if anyone had seen that that was a T-Rex in the corner of the room. Can I ask you, since he's a dolphin, so there's kind of a connection here, when we got to day three, were you thinking, Dan, what I was thinking? Sh Shador's better than Zach Wilson. Shador to the

Dolphins could make a little bit of sense here now the problem is, circle of trust here, problem is we know two is probably gonna get hurt in one form or fashion again right at some point in time and then when Shador comes out if he lights things up then you really have a quarterback controversy on your hands, which I feel like is why you get Quinn Ubers because I don't think there's a person on earth that is gonna be chanting for Quinn Ubers to come into the game, or Zach Wilson.

But that's why you don't get Shador, right? Because you don't want the controversy when Tua, when, if Tua gets hurt again. But he's better than Zach Wilson. But Billy, wouldn't you rather have like two good quarterbacks than one? Yes, I do because I've seen what happens when Tua gets hurt every year

that they don't have a competent backup plan and now the backup plan is Zach Wilson who is, I guess, better than the options that they've had in the past but we know that he's not gonna be. But why would you say that Quinn Uers is better than him when one of them has a skillset that gets drafted top five in the sport

and the other one in a draft that's weak on quarterback goes late in the draft. No, no, no, I'm saying Shadour is better than Quinn Ubers and Zach Wilson, that's why I would have taken him. But are they better than Zach Wilson given that Zach Wilson's measurables were he's a top five first round pick? Well, I mean, we know what Zach Wilson is

where I guess in the unknown, we don't know what Shadour is in the NFL, right? Like we know what Zach Wilson is, where I guess in the unknown we don't know what Shador is in the NFL, right? Like we've seen Zach Wilson in so many stops that like I would rather gamble and have Shador be my backup quarterback than have Zach Wilson, who we kind of know what exactly he's gonna be. Confession, when Dan said when one guy has a skill set

that we know to be valued at top five in the NFL draft, I thought you meant Quinn Ures hunting down the T-Rex. I was like, that is a pretty good skill. I mean, if he does have it, a time machine. By the way, Zach Wilson's top five days are, it seemed like a thousand years ago, he's proved himself for what he is. That's why the Dolphins got him on a one year deal

for the NFL equivalent of about $5,000. How old, just for the record, how old is Zach Wilson? Because while I understand that we've seen him play in the pros and not play well in the pros, his measurables in a good quarterback draft got him drafted very high. You guys are talking about people who are in a weak quarterback draft who went very low. Yeah, but they went low in Chedur, he fell historically. Like, I.

But even if he'd been taken highest, even if he'd been taken the highest that anyone had taken him in any of the drafts, ninth from the Saints, he still would have had a skillset less good where the measurables are than Zach Wilson. But the measurables can be deceiving, right? Like Mel Kuiper famously said that if Jimmy Claussen

didn't work out, he would retire. And he didn't retire, he's still doing this. So like, you can only really go by the measurables for so long. Zach, we've seen, it just hasn't really worked out for him. It didn't work out for him at the Jets once, it didn't work out for him at the Jets a second time. Then he goes to Denver, it doesn't work out there.

Now he's over here, and they're paying him a lot. They're paying him $8 million when in the past, like, the Dolph out there, now he's over here, and they're paying him a lot. They're paying him eight million dollars, when in the past, the Dolphins haven't spent on a backup quarterback, which is why they've been in the spot that they're in. I'm just saying, had they gone, I understand why they didn't, because you don't wanna have Shador as your backup,

especially when you have Tua that is your franchise guy, you paid him all of that money last year, but the fan base, honestly, is still very split on if Tua is the guy or not, even though they gave him all the money. So I understand why you wouldn't bring in a guy like Shadour just to add fuel to the fire of hey if Tua is struggling a little bit we have Shadour here who can be better. But on the flip side devil's advocate I would rather take a chance on Shadour Sanders and

on Zach Wilson should something happen to Tua. Well I love the yours pick because it's very late. They spent hardly anything to get him. And Zach Wilson has a one-year contract. So Ewers is on the practice squad. He's learning. He's marinating for a year. And then he's very likely to be the backup.

Zach Wilson turns 26 in August. So he's still young. I find funny always the fact that you've seen someone fail in the pros, you haven't seen the other one fail in the pros, so you believe that the other one you haven't seen is more capable of avoiding failure, even though the way that we measure these things,

empirically, the way that we measure these things, Zach Wilson is more valuable. Not just in the contract he signed but where he was drafted than the two people you guys are talking I mean, but yeah, like if I see Ted Bundy and I see Ted lasso I'm gonna go with Ted lasso because I know Ted Bundy's a serial killer Maybe Ted lasso is capable of killing but I haven't seen him do it yet So I know for sure one of them is a serial killer like Like I know one of them isn't very good in the NFL. You know one of them played for the Jets and no one is good there. Yeah, but he also played for the Broncos.

And the Broncos weren't very good before he was there and they weren't very good immediately after. They were a playoff team last year. With the team. They got Bo Nicks. Yeah, Bo Nicks played. When they got Bo Nicks and a different team the following year, yes they were better but no one played quarterback well for the Broncos the year that Zach Wilson

tried to play quarterback for them. Yeah, but Zach Wilson also went to Sean Payton, quarterback guru and fixer, and he's gone after a year. And they got Zach Wilson out of the bargain bin for a one year deal, which tells you nobody else wanted him. There was nobody competing to sign Zach Wilson who wouldn't have taken a one year deal for peanuts. I'm not going to sit here and argue that Zach Wilson is good.

That's not the argument that I'm making. Seems like it. The quarterbacks in the NFL next year are gonna be wild, right? Like you have Justin Fields who's probably gonna be starting for a team. He's gonna be starting for the Jets. Right now, if there isn't, which there very much appears to be,

some sort of secret deal between the Steelers and Aaron Rodgers because nothing makes sense as to why they didn't really take an actual quarterback. Mason Rudolph is not gonna be starting for the Steelers. So it seems as though there is a handshake, wink, wink agreement that Aaron Rodgers is gonna end up there because he's been secretly talking to Tomlin

because why else would you be rolling out Mason Rudolph as your starter? I'm guessing that Aaron Rodgers is hurting today, watching the Packers in the first three rounds take two wide receivers and a tackle. Not great. Like, oh, now you do it. Do you think there's anything that will ever happen

where Aaron's like, maybe it was me? Put it on the poll at Levitard Show. Do you think there's anything that will ever happen that Aaron Rodgers will say, maybe it was me? Howdy folks, it's Mike Ryan here to remind you that Game Time is the official ticketing partner of the damn Levitard Show with Stu Gotts. As you know, I talk about Game Time plenty on the show because I use it plenty. And the weather is warming up.

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This guy comes in as the next Wayne Gretzky. His nicknames include the Chosen One and McJesus. Okay, he's a great player. He scores a lot of goals. He scores a ton of assists, but it hasn't translated to making Edmonton a powerhouse in the league. They're in the final. Stugats. What's your nickname for him? McOverrated. This is the Don LeVatar Show with the Stugats. getting wrapped up in the local hour, in the first hour, on all Shador Sanders stuff. So I haven't actually gotten to Greg Cody's very valuable Miami Dolphin draft thoughts. The Miami Dolphins do not do sexy things with the drafts.

So it's full backs and defensive linemen, fat guys taken too early. With the added bonus of a snarky Barry Jackson of the Miami Herald who is now officially fed up saying the Dolphins will hold tryouts for cornerbacks at 2 a.m. outside of a Sonic. Sonics. One at Homestead?

I don't know which one. I mean the Sonics is right across from their facility. It's in front of the Walmart. 2 a.m. workouts for cornerbacks because they have not yet traded Jalen Ramsey, right? They are in talks to trade Jalen Ramsey. They do have a defensive back position problem. But what are your thoughts on the Dolphins draft? Anything here interesting to say as the long-time Miami Herald columnist, a person who's been

covering these drafts for about 40 years? It was a weird pick, Kenneth Grant, in the first round. It was a weird position to pick and it was a reach. It was a player who wasn't in many first round mock drafts that I saw. He certainly wasn't in Kuypers. And it's just, he's a nice player, but at that position, that was their third need after cornerback and offensive guard. And they could have hit it harder. There were available players there, need after cornerback and offensive guard and they could have hit it harder there were available players there particularly

at cornerback At 13 and and they bypassed them So I think it's an average draft just just meh because after that I like the the Quinn Ubers pick After that they did target their positions. They did pick a corner back late a guard They ended up picking three defensive tackles, which is probably too too many. But yeah, the problem with the Dolphins right now, they're stuck in no man's land in the middle of the draft. You know, it's the classic, not good enough to have a meaningful low pick and not bad enough to have a meaningful high pick. So they're stuck. Billy, would you do me the favor of telling me the origins of No Man's Land?

Why is it a land with no man? Because I don't know where it is that started. I do wanna re-ask a couple of questions from earlier in the show. As a prank, it's a good prank. I will say again, cruel, wrong, immoral, but pranks kind of are that. I don't know where you guys put the line on pranks,

but sort of that's the point of pranks, to embarrass you and be kind of cruel. He didn't invent that prank though. I mean, that's a cliche prank. No Man's Land, originally the name of the plot of ground lying outside the north wall of the city of London, the site of a place of execution. Oh wow, so when you're sent to No Man's Land,

there are no men living at the end of you visiting. Fuck a lot of them. Yeah. Dan, I got another Mickey Loomis impression for you. Oh wow. Let me get you to try again. It went so well the first time. The first two were great.

It was fun. Let me try this again. We're going to take you with our next pick right here, man. And you know it! That did sound like a general manager. That's great. That's a good imitation. Spot on.

Great mimicry. Mickey Loomis. That's exactly what he sounds like. I've been in his company. I've talked to Mickey. Have you? Yeah, sounds just like a mean. It was a great imitation. I'm so glad we went back to that. Just it was so successful the first time. It's good that we take those things and let them soar

into the sky where they can live freely and just create unity and laughter. Greg, if you were Shadour and you're getting Sanders, do you rather get a call for Mickey Loomis or Mickey Mouse? Eisner! Well you know what if he got a call from Mickey Loomis in the first round that would have made sense because Greg Cody and Mel Kuiper jr. both had him going number nine to the Saints. The other question I wanted to ask you guys because this is something that I felt like happened with Chidor Sanders go ahead and come up for me. This is America's second most popular sport, college football. Let's name all the people we thought were

stars last year. Just star names. I'm not talking about regional stars, I'm talking about national stars. I mean, because maybe Quinn Uers qualifies because he's the quarterback at Texas, but you do understand if you can give me ten names, Shador is one of them. If you can can give me ten names should or is one of them if if you can indeed give me ten names and i don't know that you can give me ten national stars in college football problem with that then as a metric is because it also factors in heavily how much we talk about people regardless of whether they were actually good or not

i could throw out archmanning as one of those names. Yes you could. Because I know that name. Did he play great and does he deserve it? No. But I would take him though. I would say he could be one of the 10. That name would be one of the 10. This sport is, the fame in this sport is hard to come by

if you are not a skill position player because you're wearing a face mask and it takes work to get your name out there because a lot of people are just rooting for laundry or betting on games and the parts are mostly interchangeable. And I know that people listening to this, if you know college football, you might make an argument on behalf of 20 people you think are stars. I'm asking you, give me all the names that you'd put in the class of Shador Sanders as a star.

Because the prank hurts more because it happened to a star. The fall hurts more because it happened to a star. The fact that most of these guys don't have a certain humanity to you where you can't even see their faces, but this person, you know his story and you know his dad's story. And it creates a name and a stardom that all of a sudden people are attached the same way they are to the quote unquote polarizing to Atanga Wailoa, who they know as a name because they saw him in college and now they've got a rooting interest in who that person is because there's a human underneath the uniform. But can you guys give me a number on what it is that you think you'd put the over under on

college football stars last year? Names that have national stardom. Let's name them Travis Hunter, right? He's far and away number one. Cam Ward, right? Shadour Sanders. Jeremiah Smith from Ohio State. You have Ash Gentry that everyone was talking about but isn't necessarily a star. It's basically the guys at the Heisman ceremony. Yeah, but what does star power really have to do with the draft? Oh, I'm just saying the reaction to everything that happened. You're seeing something unprecedented happen

because it's a player that's falling, but it's not a random player. It's a player from your second most popular sport, one of the 10 guys that you think of as having a fame. And really, there are only two or three guys that, is there, his teammate is the only guy that I'd put in the same level of stardom, just given who his father is. Dan, I don't think that's stardom. I think that's infamy, right? Because it's not that Shadrach Sanders was popular. It's popular with the brand packaging of super braggadocious, super hey man, I'd do this my

own way. And I'm not making a value judgment on it. I'm just saying it attracts- But infamy is part of stardom. Not always. No, but Jake Paul or whomever, like not always. Not always, but for some people, yes. For some people, yes, when it is the root of your stardom, right?

The root of Jake Paul's stardom is I'm an obnoxious asshole, right? I think what happened to Shadrach Sanders has that because his stardom is rooted not only in his ability, but also in his ability to be polarizing. Polarizing on purpose, not, hey, I just live my life and all of a sudden all these people are upset. But no, like, oh, let me rub it in their faces. Like when you do that, it attracts a certain kind of attention that when this fall happens on draft day,

yeah, because it's not just, oh wow poor starters, how could this happen? It's like, yes finally come up to this guy in a way that, for instance let's just assume Arch Manning had played last year and had played well enough and had a fall on draft day. I think there'd be a lot of questions like, oh, what happened to Arch Manning? But it wouldn't be the celebration of yes, in your face, dude.

I think the point that it means making is we're a country of haters. We love seeing people that are great do bad. Like, that's the entire reason why we're sponsored by the haters. Why? Because when we do well the haters hate it. And when Tom Brady was drafted in the sixth round it wasn't particularly controversial at the time because he wasn't projected to be a high first round pick. We didn't know how good he would be in the NFL. With Sanders he was projected to be a top 10 pick for most of the draft

buildup and then he just systematically went down and down and down and because of who his father is, he's a bigger name than he otherwise would be because he's on the team with the the two-way Heisman Trophy star. There's more spotlight around Shador than there otherwise would have been so that's why he's a big star. Doug, you can almost say like people didn't really know who Tom Brady was, more spotlight around Chidor than there otherwise would have been. So that's why he's a big star. You can almost say like people didn't really know who Tom Brady was, right? Like he was playing two quarterbacks in Michigan. Like he was there half the time and social media was basically zero. There was nothing. So with Chidor Sanders, with the 24 hour media

cycle, with social media, with him making rap songs, with his dad being Dion Sanders, with him flashing a $70,000 watch on the sidelines in full uniform to colorado states or colorado states crowd or arizona states crowd or whoever it was it's like you you the level of notoriety is just so much higher now that This is rife for things to happen and he's also in the nil era He's one of the first big national stars in the nl nil era where all of a sudden of the first big national stars in the NIL era where all of a sudden it's not a scandal if a guy has a Mercedes Benz or a Bentley because they're entitled to now. Really like, LaVar Ball prepared us for all of this. He did.

Like, this is the only difference between the Ball family and the Sanders family is that Deion Sanders is legitimately legitimately was great as a player and is great at his job right now whereas the bar ball was just great at talking right well let's not use derogatory language like that he was he was professional talk he's a professional talker right professional clown entrepreneur promoter but also part of that is that promoter part is that I'm going to oversell my kids I'm going to I'm not gonna sell them I'm gonna over sell them and when you over sell a product then

You put you get to a place where they're going to be people who are loyal to the product and they're gonna be people who can't Stand the product and I think that's the difference between the regular infamy of stardom that you're talking about versus when it is engineered I think one of the differences also with like the balls and the Sanders is between the regular infamy of stardom that you're talking about versus when it is engineered? I think one of the differences also with like the balls and the Sanders is because Dion was Dion there's a lot more credibility behind it right because you just assumed and he was a coach he was his son's coach but he was his coach he was a coach you know he was a star obviously he knows the talent but Lonzo also and I could be misremembering this Lonzo also played it very differently than Chidor did right? Like Lonzo, to my recollection,

wasn't going in and kind of acting the way that Levar was. He wasn't going in meetings. He wasn't kind of blowing things up. He was just, they were trying to get him to the Lakers and they got him to the Lakers and he was more quiet on the two and he was always kind of like an accessory to Levar when Levar was going out doing Levar things.

Here you had Dion and you had Shadur kind of, Shadur was acting as though he had the talent and the fame of Dion when Dion was in college and he wasn't at that level. So Lonzo, no, LaMelo though. Like he's got all the same vibes as LaMelo Ball. But LeVar disappeared by the time LaMelo came around. Like LaMelo is better than Lonzo

and LaMelo is more talented, so he was able to make it without LeVar going and having to hype him up. Poor Jello. Put it on the poll please. Are we a country of haters? And the other thing that I wanted to address with you guys as it relates to just this thing,

I don't know if there's a greater crime that an athlete can commit with fans than arrogance that fans feel is unearned because we're kind of okay with arrogance if you've earned it. If you know you're great we kind of like that. If you know you're great there are exceptions right? Barry Bonds was somebody that could be viewed actually it tends to be the arrogant black guy most often that has trouble overcoming his excellence because of the jerkiness. But we tend to like someone who knows he or she is great and carries him or herself with

that greatness. But the unearned arrogance is the part that bothers a lot of people, even though in the case of Chaudhuri, I think it's earned. Like the quarterback who helped turn the worst program in the country into a program everybody was talking about. I believe that he earned whatever it is that he walked into those rooms with, but you've heard me say before that,

this is true of at least the American sports fan, the American sports fan prefers humility, even if it's false, to arrogance, even if it's the truth. But we'll allow it if it's the truth and we know you're excellent. Like we'll be like, man, I wish I was that cool. Joe Burrow, Joe Burrow, we're all like, mm, I wish I was that cool. Or I would, Joe Burrow, Joe Burrow, we're all like, mm, I really like the way that he carries himself.

But also the stat sheet supports it. The idea that everyone wants to knock Shador down before he even gets into the league, when his arrogance is not unearned. No, in fact, the draft just told you, he was more successful than he had any right to be at Colorado because the draft just told you he was more successful than he had any right to be at Colorado because the draft just told you

he's not that physically talented and more sacks than anyone in the sport tells you that offensive line wasn't any good either. But I mean, the draft doesn't actually tell you that because he didn't actually fall to where he was going to be drafted. He took a historic fall. And it's not just like sports fans that don't like it.

Obviously it's the front office, it's the GMs, it's the coaches, because like because they have a lot of insecurities too where they're not gonna want to have someone come in who hasn't played it down in the league when their jobs are on the line coming and dictating the terms, which is part of why he didn't end up getting drafted. If we take the name out of the situation

and see a kid who went from an HBCU to another big school that was terrible and made them relevant and then kind of fell in the draft, you'd be like, nice story, like that's a kid that has worked his way up and has earned a spot in the NFL. Now we put in Shadour Sanders and all the things that come with it and now it's a terrible story.

But Tony, I always say it was the same story but a different name, but keep the part where allegedly has his headphones on or anything, keep the part where allegedly has his entourage there and they're like, ah, you know. It changes things, yes. It's the same, that's what, it's not his name. It's what Dan said earlier.

We thought Deon Sanders' name was gonna help him and it didn't, it didn't save him out of this. But this is something though that, god almighty, the baggage that we consumers bring to all of this, one of the great compliments that I've gotten in my career for something I've written came from Steve Kerr because I was writing about the 2010, 2014 heat and I was saying if we took this story,

pay cuts, sacrifices, everything, wrapped it in the American flag and made it the Olympic team, America would absolutely root for those guys as a symbol for our American arrogance and greatness. But because of all of the baggage that we brought to that discussion, and this one, what ends up happening

is Shador Sanders gets prank called and some people enjoy that he got his comeuppance, as Amin tried to say. And you know it. Folks, listen up. They're here and they're hot. Get ready because Jimmy John's is turning up the heat. After years of perfecting the cold sandwich,

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