The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - Local Hour: David and Pablo's Awkward Moment

Episode Date: February 5, 2025

Pablo Torre, David Samson, and (eventually) Amin Elhassan are today's substitute teachers, and they're off to a roaring start with one goal: have more fun than the group in New Orleans for the Super Bowl. Pablo kicks things off by taking us through the details of what it was like dining with David at Joe's Stone Crabs. Then, the NBA trade rumors are still circling around Jimmy Butler and, now, Kevin Durant as we inch closer to tomorrow's Trade Deadline, but none of it compares to the Luka Doncic trade made by the Dallas Mavericks earlier this week. As interested as Pablo and David are in the transaction, they have questions around how ownership impacted the decision. That leads us directly to a Facebook conspiracy theory surrounding the Mavericks, Luka, Las Vegas, and Texas legislature. Plus, we witness one of the most awkward almost-high-fives in the history of this program. Today's cast: Pablo, David, Amin, Chris, Jessica, and Jeremy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Stream on Stack TV. This is the Dan Leventor Show with the Stoogats Podcast. There's a lot going on today. There's too much going on, I would argue. David hates when I say this, to start any show, there is, I would say, it's an unprecedented degree of substitute teacher vibes going on in the studio today. Chris Cody's dancing.

Feels good, man. Does it feel good? It feels good to have you guys here. It does feel like substitute teacher vibes, but a good substitute teacher. Not one of those ones that just puts on a film. Someone that makes me think. And I leave that day saying,

that person deserves their own, that should be a full-time teacher. That should not be a substitute teacher. I've never had that thought about a sub. I don't know why I'm doing this. I'm with Chris. I woke up in a good mood today. I was excited to come into work.

Yeah. That probably doesn't speak well to how I wake up other mornings. Jess and I saw each other in the parking lot and we literally skipped in together. It's one of those things where like, everybody feels like they're on, they're like at Six Flags.

Everybody's in New Orleans for the Super Bowl. They seem to be, I'm watching, I'm watching Stu Gott's post pictures of Mina at like a sandwich shop somewhere getting were getting a po' boy together. And our task here, David, is to have more fun than them. That is our challenge. That's gonna be an easy hurdle. That's sort of like the hurdle when you start a PTFO,

right on the ground. I just wanna get right over the bar on the ground. That is what I said. I'm already over that. I'm not jealous. I'm happy to be here in Florida with you and Jeremy and Jessica and Chris. What do you guys think about maybe tomorrow

we get like a New Orleans style band to just be out there? Yes. So that we feel like we're, you know, what we're missing we get, all right. When Amin shows, by the way, Amin isn't here. Amin's supposed to be here. Amin is coming. He was on the list. He's coming in from the airport.

Amin has the craziest life, I think, of anybody who does this show. He commutes across the country all of the time. Thank you, Amin, we appreciate it. Thank you, Amin. Just hard work here. We appreciate it. I don't think you can cut it that close.

Well, he has beyond cut it. He is not here. That's true, it's not cutting close. He's late. And so I wanna get into the NBA stuff because last night I was at dinner with David. We were wearing bibs at Joe's Stone Crab. Which if you've never seen David Samson get bibbed,

it is a sight to see. He walks in, I mean, Joe's, can I just, Chris, you've been to Joe's Stone Crab. Do we need to explain what Joe's Stone Crab is to people? It's pretty self-explanatory title-wise, I think. A Stone Crab place owned by Joe? Yeah, right. It's not exactly that, but it's a good is to people. It's pretty self-explanatory title wise, I think. A Stone Crab place owned by Joe? Yeah, right. It's not exactly that, but it's a good place to start.

It kind of is. I think it's the most profitable restaurant in America, one of them. It's the sort of place where you're walking with David Sampson and they immediately come up and say, Mr. Sampson, it's so good to have you back. He is greeted, you were greeted by everybody we saw. I'm not exaggerating.

You must hate that. How many hands did you shake? Did you sanitize right after? There were a few hugs. There were. There were actual full body hugs. Are these fist bumps and handshakes happening while eating the crab?

No, you can't do anything while. Once the stone crabs come, that's it. That's actually. Do you crack your own claws because you don't want them to touch your crab claws? No, they come pre-cracked. I know, but- Pay extra for that.

Are you okay with that? Yeah, I wouldn't be able to. You'd get too many cuts on your hands. I'm surprised you don't ask for the cracker yourself. That's a good question by Jeff. Joe's Stone Crab is the perfect place to avoid these kind of interactions because you can always just have the doctor hands

of like, I got crab hands, man. Can't fist bump, can't do anything. We'll talk later. There was a lot of that, a lot of the hands up, a lot of extra napkins, a lot of me clearing the table so there's room for all of the stuff. While Pablo just sort of sits there oblivious, eating dinner with Pablo is an interesting thing

in that your level of oblivion, other than focusing on your social media, is quite interesting. Other than focusing on my social media, what does that mean? It means you're setting up pictures and you're posting and you're doing things while we're supposed to be focused and getting work done and you're focused on what your next post is.

I went to dinner and David went to work. That's a you problem, buddy. Do we have a picture of David in this bib? Oh yeah, yeah, you can pull it off of my, speaking of which, at PSToria on Instagram. It's currently on my Stereotis. I blacked out, I put a bar over the waiter's eyes for privacy reasons, but you could see what the vibe is.

Because you think he wouldn't wanna be in a photo with me? I just can't be sure. You didn't get permission? I did not get permission, But look at the glee. It's a happy place. You didn't blur out the people in the background. I think it's fine. They are not on social media.

They're right there. We ate at 5 PM, and none of those people are scrolling through my Instagram feed. I've never been happier that someone's wearing a bib. Good God, that shirt. It's a great shirt. Don't you yuck on a Robert Graham Yum. That would be inappropriate.

Can you guys Google Robert Graham for me and explain who this person is? Cause I've never heard that name before in my life. Thank you. I enjoyed going to dinner. I enjoy being in Miami. I don't feel like we're the substitutes. I know you always try to say that.

And I'm like, dude, we're rolling out the AV cart. This is what we do. I'm not. Embrace it. I've got 20 things that I think that would be interesting to discuss and that Dan would be proud that we're discussing and you want to focus on your social media.

Well. And not being upset with the mean. I do want to bring us into what I was doing at dinner because what I was doing while on my cell phone was actually doing a bit of reporting. That's what I do, I find stuff out. There's supposed to be a Kevin Durant trade happening and it hasn't happened yet.

And I'm not alone in saying this, Jeremy, the internet has been ablaze. Basically everybody who's even tangentially involved with the NBA has been hinting without reporting, Kevin Durant's about to be traded and they're supposed to be, in my understanding, to be even more irresponsible, like a three-team deal involving some major franchises. So what is the latest, what is the internet telling everybody? Yeah, some of the latest reporting is insinuating that

there could be a three-team deal between the Heat, the Warriors, and the Suns that lands Jimmy Butler in Phoenix and Kevin Durant back with the Golden State Warriors. I'm intrigued to see how and why the Suns would make that move given the circumstances. To me, the only logical explanation for moving Durant and bringing in Butler is if Booker genuinely wants to stick around for the long term and you're trying to extend a window

with another competitive veteran wing, but you're a bad team right now if you're Phoenix. So acquiring Jimmy to then extend him, given the timelines, it might not make sense. They might even be welcoming him in with the idea of clearing out cap space in the off season and tearing the whole thing down. Jeremy, there's one thing that you're missing

in this analysis is that what Pablo was really saying is he was at the restaurant reading his phone, getting what he thought was inside information that we may have to leave dinner at any time, mid-claw, that this trade was imminent, definitely happening, and that he had somehow this connection, my guy's never that he had somehow this connection. My guy's never wrong.

I have a guy. He has a guy. I have a guy. He wakes up this morning, and it turns out the guy is not the guy, he's just a guy. Yeah, Jeremy has the same guy, it turns out. Apparently that guy is waiting till 3 p.m. tomorrow,

just like every other guy, and you were offended to be so normal and out of the loop. Can I clarify with Jeremy though, who are the heat supposed to get in this? I believe the heat would be landing a combination of Andrew Wiggins and picks and other salad and filler. That's what I had heard from my guy.

Which is funny. Look, I wanna talk about ownership though, because we just referenced just now the Phoenix Suns and their owner, Matt Ishby. Like what is he doing? I was hoping Amin would be here for this but we can pick it up when he's also around. I think that the media in general, the way we talk about the Luka Dantic thing, is very backwards. I think it's remarkable how much we've missed the forest and the

trees. This is a story about ownership. Nico Harrison has gone from a guy, I've never seen, speaking of guys, I've never seen a guy go from zero to one million in terms of nobody knows who he is to everybody has a developed opinion. And we have talked so much about the strategy and the architecture of the trade, Nico Harrison and Rob Palenka. Rob Palenka saying that Nico Harrison was basically in private conversations with him. They've known each other for years through Nike and they've had to keep this secret and they made it happen.

David, this is a decision that must originate with the people who own the Dallas Mavericks. A hundred percent. I don't think people even know largely that Mark Cuban no longer owns the Dallas Mavericks And it infuriates me because I did an episode about who does own them the Dallas Mavericks Obviously Miriam Adelson and her son-in-law Patrick where can we find that episode? Public Tori finds out it's available on YouTube. We have

99.2 99,000 200 subscribers come be our 100th thousand What do you get for that? You get a plaque, you literally get a plaque. Are you gonna give someone a plaque? I mean, for being the 100th? No, no, no, I'm gonna get a plaque.

Oh, so you just want people to join that show? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll send them a photo of the plaque. Such a Pablo thing, isn't it? I digress. The point is, this is an ownership story and it's less so a GM story, as much as the GM story is colorful and funny and amazing, but I just think you must follow the money here

and the money is a very clear, yeah, it's the plot, not the subplot. So the money with the trade, I don't think, I don't agree, I think you have to focus on the truth that Nico was not alone. There is a report this morning that JJ Redick knew about the trade during the Knicks game, before the Knicks game, and that he was super excited

and he was in a great mood and all happy, which would track that the coaches would know while Jason Kidd sat there pretending I had no idea looking like someone stole his lunch money. That's my favorite part of this whole thing, just how awkward he looked during that press conference. Wasn't that amazing? Do we have a photo of Jason Kidd?

Is there anything worse than being forced to go to a press conference and having to be the, what's the word for when you're not in the know? I was joking yesterday that, do you think he tried to get out of that press conference? Do you think he was just like, you got this, right, Niko? 100%. I got a call and he's just like,

no, I think we should be aligned on this, come on up and he's just like, oh got this, right, Nico? Like, I got a call, and he's just like, no, I think we should be aligned on this. Come on up, and he's just like, oh, all right, I'll go up there. We staff press conferences in advance. You say who's gonna be up there, and if someone makes a big issue, if a player makes a big issue or the GM, you can get the AGM,

but you need someone from the baseball front office to take the heat off you as having made the decision, and I don't know why Nico would bring him up there just to say that he's been neutered. It made no sense to me. Well, it's- I'm not buying it. Look at that face.

It's the feeder of all of it, right? Look, and again, do I buy that LeBron didn't know about this? Do I buy that, yeah, Clutch was not involved when they represent LeBron and Anthony Davis in this, and they wouldn't have shared information. I don't buy any of that, obviously. But the owner story, this is a multi-billion dollar franchise at the center of which is this kid,

is this 25 year old. And Nico Harrison does not have the power unilaterally to be like, I have an idea. This has to come from the people who own and bought the team. You know, the idea can come from the GM, but it has to get approved by the owner. But my point is, the idea can't go anywhere Without the owner.

Unless the person who pays the bills is like, yes. And so to your point, I wanna acknowledge the best case scenario for this story in terms of what were the Adelsons sort of aware of? It's that they didn't care. The question of how mad should you be as a Mavs fan at the owners of your team, the most generous interpretation of the order of events here is that they didn't care when Nico Harrison

was like, I have an idea. They said, whatever, go do it. Like, we're not gonna spend a ton of time thinking about this. That's the most generous interpretation. That's awesome, that's no meddling. Isn't that what you guys want from your owners, letting the basketball and baseball people

make the decision? You always complain about that. The owners are too involved. I mean, I think you just want whoever doesn't suck at it to do it make good decisions I don't really so you can meddle if you're good. No, I don't metal David I think we've drawn the line. It's the Mendoza line exists in baseball This is the Luka Doncic line if your GM comes to you and says I'm gonna trade Luka Doncic right now I just want the owner to say that's an insanely stupid idea

That's all I want them to do. They don't have to do more than that. Which is probably what Mark Cuban would have done. So the Mark Cuban part of this is funny. That's my favorite part of this whole story is the Mark Cuban part. So refresh our memory, David, because you were out ahead on this, truly,

when it came to Mark Cuban. Getting crushed. Selling to Miriam Adelson and Patrick Dumont. And all of you in there in that room crushing me when I told you that Mark Cuban, when he sold the team was done and Mark Cuban was coming out and saying, oh, I'm still the head of basketball. I'm still maintaining my power. And I said, of course not.

He sold the team. He has, he's not the governor. He's not the alternate governor. He's nobody, he's nothing. He sold, but Mark Cuban made us all believe that he's involved until the Luca deal. And then he said, oh, I better let people know I got nothing to involved until the Luca deal. And then he said,

oy, I better let people know I got nothing to do with this. So he basically changed his story. You also said AJ Brown would never play for the Eagles again. I can't, I didn't say I got everything right. Didn't you say you'd trade Mike Evans too? I just want to be clear, Jessica, and I'm happy to go at this right now at 914. I don't remember crushing you for Mark Cuban takes. Are you right in everything you say every time you say it?

I just want to establish that. So that's a stupid threshold to even talk about. But the fact about Mark Cuban is simple to me. The Samson Line. It's the Samson Line is we're all going to be wrong if you're willing to take a position. Even you Pablo. I disagree. Well that's exactly, that's you being you. But you're not right all the time. For Mark Cuban. I'm trying to set David up for a victory lap and you're somehow turning it into a parade of defeats. I don't wanna take a victory lap. I want to explain the way it works when you sell a team is you don't get power and Mark Cuban trying to mislead

all of you bothered me greatly. And now the fact that he needed to separate himself from the Luca deal is hilarious. Like he's been waiting, it's not been a month since he sold the team. This is a story about the theater of power who actually has it, who pretends like they have it, who performs it.

Nico Harrison is the greatest gift to Maryam Adelson. Not because he got Luca Doncecch out of there, because everybody is simply talking about his incompetence. It's a thing with Roger Goodell. Roger Goodell's great value to NFL ownership is that he is the meat shield. You criticize him and his weird press conferences, and you do so less so now, obviously, by the way,

a separate story. But the whole point is look over there at the guy we put on camera at the presser next to Jason Kidd. Don't look at the people who actually had the power to make this deal happen. It's an incredible gift we've given to a person, by the way, Mary Madelson, just for the record here,

was Trump's biggest donor in 2020. These are just facts, right? I'm not gonna present them with any sort of editorializing. Just facts about who she is. You can, you can say that that's bad. I just wanna point out that she was Trump's biggest donor in 2020. She is a super donor to the Republican party

in its most mutated state. Mutated also feels objective at this point. And she is the architect quietly of Trump's whole policy in the Middle East. Which, by the way, happens to be relevant certainly right now and yesterday. She has been all over the biggest story in sports and the biggest story in politics at the same time,

and nobody is really talking about her. And that is an amazing bit of theater for us to miss. I didn't wanna miss it. I wanted to talk about it with all of you because it is true and this happened. Her husband really started this with her and when he passed away, she took the mantle. Why is this more of an owner trade than any trade?

Because by your lot, like isn't every trade go through to the owner's desk? And it's like, I don't know what's the difference here between every trade. It's a great question. To me, David, so the reason I what's the difference here between every trade. It's a great question. To me, David, you would, so the reason I love that David is here, by the way, great question, Chris, it's because.

Thank you everyone. It's so rare. That's so rare. When it comes to meat shields and when it comes to people, executives running a team who must be trotted out there to be deeply unpopular in front of the press to cover for the owner of the team, I present to you David Samson.

It was my job for 18 years. Why'd you sign Heath Bell? I mean, it's those were questions that were asked of me that you all blamed me for doing. And that was my job. It is Nico Harrison's job. Have you ever noticed you don't see owners at the firing press conferences? You see owners at the firing press conferences?

You see them at the hiring press conferences. That is a very common thing that owners think people don't notice. They send out the president or the GM when you're making a move or an unpopular trade, but then when it's a huge free agent signing, then the owner comes out. And so I think that it's important to know

that one of the privileges of ownership is that you get to decide when you have your meat shelled out and when you don't. But Adelson, as you know, you keep calling her the owner of the Mavericks. Clarify? You should clarify that it is her son-in-law who is the actual governor, the actual owner of the Mavericks, because she would not be approved by the NBA. Hey folks, it's Mike Ryan and I need to talk to you about something that I use religiously. not be approved by the NBA. amazing foods from all across our great country. They will ship free to your door, anywhere in the US of A. Gold Belly will ship you Philly Cheese Stakes from Jim's or Pat's in Philly. I'm treating my office right now to a cheese steak party from Pat's, courtesy of Gold Belly.

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That's 1-800-Flowers.com-slash-Dan. Dan Lebatard. Go pee-pee. Stugats. Go pee-pee. This is the Dan Lebatard Show with the Stugats. Go peepee. This is the Don Lebathorpe Show with the Stugarts. So this is something that we reported in the

Poblatory Finds Out that the NBA called me to push back on immediately. The concern had been, Mary Madeleine, if you Google her, is so toxic that the NBA said we need a meat shield for her. And that ended up being reportedly, according to our reporting, Patrick Dumont. Well, that's a fact. That's not a report. He is the principal owner.

He's the governor of the Mavericks. But an anonymous guy who is her son-in-law, who is in fact the governor who shows up at the meetings, and it's not Miriam. And all of this, again, is it a distinction without a difference? We can argue about that. Where the money comes from seems to be

the most relevant thing as always. Her. As I've been told many times, the answer to all of your questions is money. We should probably think about that. But to Chris's question specifically, like what's different about this? Why is this an owner thing?

It's because it's Luka Bleeping-Dancic. He's 25 years old. He is all the all the superlatives. We've all been saying five time all NBA five years running made the NBA finals blah blah blah blah. David. If Popovich traded Wemby would Popovich get crushed like this? Yeah I mean. He would? Yes. So Popovich hasn't earned the right? If he traded him for a 32 year old I think everyone would be like what did they just do that if Papa been traded when be at all yes I would say that the immediate reaction would have felt that way about if you traded him for Luca Donchich like that's the air that when B is in at the moment considering his a correct an impact on I also I think we're like the reason why this is also not just an owner thing

It's a GM thing is because of how bad the hall was for Luka Doncic. That's where it's like, even if this is an owner thing, the GM's job is to make those transactions make sense. And it just still doesn't really make a lot of sense. This leads perfectly into my favorite conspiracy theory that I have seen about all of this, which you guys will enjoy because it involves ownership

and manipulating politicians. So, the theory that I believe stemmed from a Facebook post is that, that's where it starts, I'm couching it with that from the beginning. All good theories begin with a Facebook post. Is that the ownership group for the Mavericks wants to have gambling legal in Texas. And in turn, they want to use the threat

of moving the Mavericks to Vegas to influence the state legislature to pass legalized gambling in the state of Texas. And the only way that by 2026, they could logically threaten to move to Vegas is if they get the NBA to approve it. If they're a thriving franchise with a young superstar in Dallas,

the NBA would never approve the Dallas Mavericks moving to Vegas. But if by then this core group has come and gone, and Anthony Davis and Kyrie Irving hasn't worked out, they can sell off the team, hit rock bottom, and potentially threaten to move to Vegas. And this is a perfect time for Amin to arrive. So I want to laugh at this and pick it apart.

And luckily Amin Elhassen has just arrived, the guy who just interviewed, I believe believe the originator of the Facebook post in question that's right that's right do you buy it do you buy the theory well first of all the guy's very clear he's a lawyer he's just a Mavs fan who's a lawyer and he makes it very clear like there's no sourcing on this he's just connecting dots it is true that the adelson family purchased the mavericks

with the intent of getting gambling legalized in texas and having this vast territory the largest population of non gambling people because it's not available to them in the united states upwards of 20 million people in the state of Texas. That's true. They didn't want it to get legalized.

That's true. When they build the new building, the new arena, they want a casino attached to it. They're casino magnates, the Adelsons, right? Macau, the Sands. They're mostly in Asia now. In Asia. I mean, so there's so many things

that Jeremy said are so ridiculous. I don't know what Jeremy said. I'll just tell you No, he's there. We just summarize summarize the Facebook. Okay, so so cuz I like I think I did We get a slow-motion replay of what just happened. I don't want ever Okay, here's another connection remember when Josh Harris owner of the commanders also one of the Sixers went on Monday football and Remember when Josh Harris, owner of the Commanders, also one of the Sixers, went on Monday football

and was there with Troy Aikman and Joe Buck and he thought that something happening was a high five invitation and then he grabbed the hand of I believe Joe Buck. That's just what happened with me and Samson. That was terrible. I was not trying to high five you. I thought you were.

Proceed, I mean. Chris Cradaville is the guy's name, this lawyer's name. So, as I said, that's correct. They do wanna legalize gambling in Texas. They do want the new arena that they're gonna build to have a casino attached. They already have the land.

The land is in Irving, Texas, near the site of the old Cowboy Stadium. So that stuff is all true. The part where it's like, and this deal was to put the, is the stick because the carrot didn't work in legislature, I don't know. He says it's his theory too, like he's not saying, oh I know I got the inside scoop. And I think that's very important to point out as people like to take things and run with it. Yes, yes. Legalizing gambling in Texas is not in any way

correlated to Luca being on the Mavericks or not. It's just, that is, when they are deciding where to legalize gambling, when you're lobbying, whether you're DraftKings or anyone else lobbying for legal gambling, you are not focused on who is actually on the team in the state or city where you are going. But even bigger picture, right,

when it comes to what the NBA's financial interests here, it is interesting to consider that, right? If you're Adam Silver, the question has arrived. Should he veto this deal? Should he have vetoed this deal? And just purely cynically, purely following the money, this is a good deal for Adam Silver to have happen in his league is it not from a pure like Luca go to the Lakers

Lakers have a whole decade of runway of your next all-time player Dallas you'll figure it out like that feels like a cost benefit that Adam Silver can I as heart of hearts would approve of can I be unfun today? I hate this talk someone's gotta do we we started the show by saying we have to be more fun than people in New Orleans And I mean immediately saying I mean like but like we're taking it down. This is what I Gives me headaches right it starts with the question. I'm picturing Dan watching like finally someone's bringing it down What are you doing over there with your hands? That's what Dan's doing. I'm not doing that. Rubbing his nipples. So, yeah, this idea that, oh, silver should veto it like Stern did,

the Chris Paul deal. That's not how this works. Chris Paul deal was vetoed by David Stern, not as commissioner of the NBA because it's unfair it was vetoed because he was the de facto governor of the New Orleans franchise at the time because the guy who owned it ran out of money and he's like I can't run a team anymore who wants it it's like the bank foreclosing on on the team and so Stern was like I'm the governor and they bring him this deal and the deal by the way was to get like Pagasol and a couple other middling players and Stern looked at it and said we're better off being terrible and trying our luck in the lottery. And so he vetoes the deal as the de facto governor.

The deal doesn't go through. They do a different deal that brings them the type of players that will bring their value down. Excuse me, their competitive value down on the floor. They're terrible. Guess what they got? That following lottery, the number one overall pick, who was Anthony Davis? Totally the right move for the Pelicans franchise. But everyone's like, he did it because he's going to help the Lakers. So wait, hold on.

Do people do that? They do that all the time. They do that? They do that. I never do that. With that voice. That's weird. You never say that.

You never say that the league vetoed the deal because it would have been bad for business. Well, the league used to run the Expos. And there were a bunch of deals done by Omar Manai as the GM of the Expos. Remind us why the league, why Major League Baseball was running the Expos. Because we sold the Expos to Major League Baseball

so they could run the Expos and move them to Washington and become the Washington Nationals. And so we could get the Marlins, and so John Henry could sell the Marlins and move to Boston, because the trust that owned the Red Sox wanted to cash out, and baseball wanted to make sure that John Henry got them. It's a three-way deal, basically.

It was a three, that's all it was. You guys acquired the Marlins, he acquires the Red Sox, and then Washington acquires the Expos. It was a three-way deal, basically. It was a three-way deal. That's all it was. You guys acquired the Marlins, he acquired the Red Sox, and then Washington acquires the Expos. It was a three-way deal. And there were a lot of trades that were done. If you go back and look at Expos transactions after O2, and there was a lot of talk that they should be vetoed by SEALIG,

and he would not veto them. And so the Expos made a bunch of bad trades. What is the verdict that you have of how Major League Baseball was at running the Expos made a bunch of bad trades. What is the verdict that you have of how Major League Baseball was at running the Expos? Great. They put in a guy named Tony Tavares to be the president. They had a GM named Omar Manaya, who some of you may know. Yeah, Mets.

Yes, from his days with the Mets. And they ran it knowing that they were trying to cut expenses, didn't care about revenue, didn't care about attendance, didn't really. Well, now it's sounding worse. No, but that wasn't their job. Well, so this is why I bring it up though. It's because Amin is, I love Amin's retrospective,

his revisiting of how good a GM was David Stern actually. Not a GM, how good of an owner, he was a governor. But I'm saying this because ownership and decision making, when it comes to when the league is taking over teams, kind of hard to disentangle because the incentives for the decisions you make are different now, right? It's different. Sure, but the decision he made was the best decision for the franchise. That wasn't a, because the best decision for the franchise that wasn't a because the best decision for

the league would have been sent chris paul to kobe bryant send them to l.a. get him out of this the thirtieth largest market in the in the league send them to the number two market turn into the marquee for all of the financial incentives were there for them to do that and he did it because that was it was best for the organization the only thing david stern would do was sticky envelopes. I mean, that's really the extent of his involvement. Frozen is what they accused him of. Nobody, sticky envelopes, Pat Ewing?

It was frozen. It's frozen. Why are you making it sticky? David, as always, we are 100% right when we disagree with you specific. I thought it was a sticky envelope. It's a frozen envelope. What is a frozen envelope?

It was cold. They put it in the freezer, it was cold, so when he reaches in to pick the envelope, the cold one is the one he pills. And is that now, did you find out that that's officially what happened? That has been for a long time the dominant theory. But never confirmed.

But what sticky substance do you have on the envelope? I thought that it was stuck to the, and when it, my video surveillance showed that when they twisted the ball with the envelopes, that the Knicks one stayed at the bottom and didn't twist like the others. No, it was a frozen envelope. That was the theory.

By the way, the May 11th, 2022 episode of Basketball Illuminati, we tackled this. Episode 13, we had Patrick Ruby, who did a very exhausting. Yes, for ES very exhaustive, deep dive into all of the the conspiracy theories surrounding that draft. But to that point, right, as somebody who is also the voice on Basketball Illuminati at the beginning, quoting a story that I'd written about why the NBA is the league most riven with conspiracy, it's because of stuff like this. It's because of stuff like this.

It's because there is just enough plausibility for these things to take root. But I want to disentangle, like, what is conspiracy and what is actually just business, David? Having Ewing on the Knicks is just business. They need, and it's funny, you have a league now where the Knicks have not been able to perform in a couple decades.

The NFL is a league where the Cowboys, people laugh. I did this on Nothing Personal today. If the NFL were scripted, the Cowboys would be in the playoffs and in the Super Bowl way more than they are. And the Giants and Jets would not be as bad as they've been for a long time. You wouldn't script it without the Cowboys.

I just, it's all horse hockey. Look, but I'm not trying to relitigate the frozen envelope. What I'm trying to get back to though is this Luca thing, which Anthony Davis, by the way, via the Mean Story, has brought us back to. Full circle, right? So we get to how could this deal happen? Why didn't Adam Silver do anything?

Number one, if there were gonna be a commissioner who would play God, it's not Adam Silver. David Stern, maybe. I agree. Adam Silver is like, well, it seems like they really like the deal and then that's it. I'm just saying. I kinda wish he would play God more.

I kinda wish he would play God more. He's just a means thing. But David, it's more about his energy. He doesn't sound like that at all, but the energy is very meek, whatever you guys like. And David Stern would walk in the room and tell you, every one of you go F yourself, I'm in charge. Because-

Because- David Stern was an A-rod. David- Adam Silver is way better liked, but just as powerful. Let me, let me, no, he's not A-rod. He's not A-rod. I meant to say asshole, but I didn't wanna say it. Oh, he could say jackhole, you could said jackhole. That's a good one. Yeah.

Could've said a million other things. Could've just said asshole. Cause then you'd just said asshole. He did. He actually did, yeah. And it's well liked, not better liked. Thank you. That's my EP.

That's my EP. Guys, we're crushing this today. It's been so much fun. It's been informative. Chris Cody having the show of his life so far. Let's watch a movie. Asking good questions. Nipples have been rubbed.

And it's like 930. Nipples. Yeah. What did I say? Nipples. Nipples? That's fine. Put that replay up of the awkward back and forth.

I don't think we need to do that. There's no audio. It's just you guys. Like, what is here? David's going for a high five. Oh, lord. Let's not show that again. Oh, man. I didn't know what to do.

To the listening audience, Pablo was just making the point of like David said, and he holds his hand out. Pablo's like, David's like, ooh, high five. David looked at it as like an opportunity to make connections. I thought there was a connection. I thought we were having a moment. Can you pull the video from the last time David and I were

here where he tried to Dap up Dominique That's in the archives somewhere. Wow, that's on this forget that that's actually my intro to nothing personal It's every day we show it and the audience loves that when I jump into his arms That's part of our 32nd intro. Is there like a playlist of awkward interactions with David Sampson? They're efforting it. I'm told there should should be now. It'll never be Dan with Josh Norman. That's always the gold standard. Have you ever seen that? I have not.

You have not seen this? No, is this awesome? It's security camera footage of the Clevelander bar. And Josh Norman walks in and there is Dan. And somehow, Dan is basically like grinding on the back of Josh Norman. It's an incredible.

What starts as like just kind of a normal embrace, Dan like pulls him and like they like take like three steps back, it was so awkward. And what? Pulls him from behind? Yes. Wait, hold on a second. You're telling me Dan was awkward?

I have to see this. Pablo picked up on this the best. The best part of the video isn't what happens. It's not like shot. There it is. It's shot with grainy security camera. It's like TMZ video. Oh, the Clevelander.

All right, they embrace. Oh, wait, wait, wait. He pulls him. No. Oh. Wait, that didn't seem awkward. See how? What are you talking about?

Play the game, David. By the way, are you talking about? Play the game David. By the way, and look at the guy in the black shirt over there, his awkward, he scratches his head, like oh my God. Yeah look at him, look at him. He pulls him in, look at him. He looks at that and he's like, oh crap. It's the slow dance.

Admittedly in my mind it was even worse. Over time I have reimagined this. It's the step and a half back he takes with him. Like, come on. Arm around his neck and then pulling him. It's the little, it's the slight pull. Wow, that was Jessica. You as disappointed as I am in that video?

Eh, it's pretty awkward. And if you know Dan, you just know why it's awkward. No, but he's called it the most awkward thing ever. Yeah, what you just did with Pablo was more awkward. I agree with that. I agree with that. All right, here we go. Here's David and Dominique. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's see if this is worse. Oh, the dance. What is that dance? Forgot about the euro step. Oh my. Oh my god. OK, you know what?

This takes the cake. I would put this under cringe, not awkward though. Oh my god. It's like, ah. What is this dance? You're just stepping to the basket. I don't remember what we were doing or why we were doing it. We had to do DAP class.

We did DAP class. And I don't think you passed. Amazing when everything is on camera. This little shuffle right here. And recorded. That might be the worst part. The shuffle, the shuffle up to it might be worse. The actual DAP, not terrible.

Everything before and after. It's everything. This is terrible might be worth the actual DAP not terrible about everything before and after it's everything This is terrible and then watch the DAP the DAP itself Not terrible, then you go into his like, I don't know why you put your legs up. Yeah. Yeah, he wants to sports That's a short thing Is it a short thing? Yeah needed up each thing. We need to call Dominique Friends, it's Jerbear and you know that I'm obviously a bit of the romantic type and Valentine's Day is coming up and for me there's only one place that I trust. 1800flowers.com.

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