The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - Local Hour: I Believe That We Will Lose

Episode Date: July 2, 2024

Today's cast: Amin, Mike, Chris, Billy, Jeremy, JuJu, and Tony. Get ready for a Local Hour full of fury. Donovan Mitchell signed an extension with the Cleveland Cavaliers mere minutes before we began today's show, and the move has left Miami Heat fans asking "what's next?" in terms of potential acquisitions. Amin and Mike lead the conversation on Mitchell, the Cavs, the Heat, and the rest of the NBA fallout (of course AFTER asking Jeremy for the "Heat spin.") Plus, the USMNT was the first ever Copa America host to be eliminated in the group stage. Mike is indignant over Gregg Berhalter still being the coach of the team, and he, Amin, and the rest of the crew discuss the future of the program. Should Gregg Resiggn? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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SAB the CV, copyright 2024. Proximo. Jersey City, New Jersey. Please drink responsibly. This is the Don LeBattor Show with the StuGuts Podcast. Today's episode is sponsored by DraftKings. Stay tuned because you'll hear more about DraftKings and all it has to offer throughout the show. DraftKings, the crown is yours'll hear more about DraftKings and all it has to offer throughout the show. DraftKings, the crown is yours. Ameen, I really wanted to start today's show crushing Greg Berl.

Oh, we got to crush the entire U.S. Men's National Team program. We have to. I want to. I wanted to send a message and come out the gates with it, but then something happened as we were getting into position here. I got a mobile alert and it was a woge bomb and it was that Donovan Mitchell has extended with the Cleveland Cavaliers, leaving Jeremy Tashay so little time to come up with spin. So Jeremy, I hate to do this to you.

I know you're not a fan of these positions, but people are coming right now to drink your tears. This nukes the plan right now. Pat's got to come up with something unforeseen because Donovan Mitchell has extended. He has decided to stay with the Cleveland Cavaliers and the talent pool is drying up once again for Miami. We spoke about it yesterday that Pat Riley and the Heat do feel confident about the team that they have.

I'm just telling you what the Heat think. I saw those reports yesterday and I was like, wow, we're already succumbing. Yeah, I mean look, those have been the reports all off-season long. They were the reports at the end of the season where it was Miami looking at their team, looking at their health throughout the year, looking at what the Eastern Conference standings looked like, and believing they could improve on the youth that they have in not to overpay to go get another star. So they're running it back.

I don't know. There's still plenty of time in this off season to make other moves. All of the flurry of moves that happened yesterday, those are often with the teams that have cap space to move into, you often see trades happen later on. But the reality is, is yeah, it looks like this team is going to be similar to the roster construction

you saw last year, at least at the given moment, unless somebody else becomes unhappy and wants to be either down here or somewhere else, Miami's in a position now where they look at their young core and they say, okay, this is what we have to support BAM and his extension. You have Jimmy Butler now in what is a contract year and you operate from there.

I mean, I'm intrigued to know what you think about the position that Miami is in because I'm sort of, I'm not necessarily saying what my views on this are as much as what I know that he believes about the team. I came to you for Heat Spin, you gave me the Heat Spin, and they had already started laying that foundation with some riders that had covered, I guess maybe they had started getting an inkling

that Donovan Mitchell was gonna be extending, and that's where the momentum was heading, by the way, with Mitchell extending, and there were a lot of Heat fans that just didn't want to believe it. I mean it seems as though we can if we were to hand out a grade for the Miami Heat's offseason to this point I mean they got a top 15 draft pick okay he's got some and they really like him for what it's worth I'm waiting for the team to come out and say like, you know what? This guy kinda sucks.

It's more of a, three days later we fucked up. I think in that all I'm trying to say is he was a guy who was on their board from the beginning and they didn't take Connect despite the fact that he fell to them. Incomplete for the Heat, but I wanna talk about the Donovan Mitchell extension, because words have power. Words have power, right?

So you hear the story, Donovan Mitchell signs an extension. Like, oh God, he's gone forever now. He's locked in, how long of an extension? Three years, oh, he had two years left and he signed a three year extension? Uh-uh, because he has 24, 25 coming up, right? And then 25, 26 was a player option. So what they did was they tore up that player option

and they said, we start the extension there. So 24, 25 was already there, 25, 26, you're one of the extension, 26, 27, you're two of the extension, 27, 28, you're three player option. So in essence, he's just there an extra two years from where we thought he would be. It's what Jimmy was asking for.

Okay, but I understand for Donovan Mitchell, this is not as long term a commitment as it would seem, even though Cavs fans have every right to be excited because they talked to Superstar into actually saying, and it does shift Miami's timeline because when you were thinking about the talent acquisition front, Tonovan Mitchell was at the top of the list. He was. He was the guy because he and Bam are friends.

You look at a guy who seemingly was unhappy. Heard this for three years now. And a whole bunch of Superstars want to play with Bam because they know the deal. They can come right in here and be the guy why do the heat always feel like they're on year two of a five-year plan Billy I am welcome of your perspective I'm just curious like These teams are rebuilding in like two years every team has activity except they get bad and then get good most of the time No, and but would you rather get bad and then good or be a good the whole time?

Good they've been good. I mean it's insane to say that they weren't good last year. This build hasn't been good They were bad. They were bad last year. They were bad last year. A miracle run the year before where they were playing team again Feels like a good year though, right? That's a good year Any year you beat the Boston Celtics in the playoffs is a good year. So we'll take that, but oh, this is a team that has had a few breaks and found good form

in the playoffs. Look, if they lose in the first round last year, everyone is saying, what are we doing here? You gotta blow up the entire team. Pat Riley should resign. But they didn't. They made it to the finals. And that's just another chip on the, that's another chip when you're playing poker and you're trying to get talent to come here to Miami. You got the rings, you got the heat culture thing. And that was just another thing to put under that Heat Culture banner, but I, I,

the Heat fans are getting pretty restless. And from what I, I'm shocked that they haven't done something major. Now that's not to say they're, they're not working on major things, but the impression that I got from talking to people in and around that franchise was that they got a solid sampling of Humble Pie and they knew that things had to change. And for the spin cycle to already be turning about running this thing back and practicing patience, that is not aligned with what I was hearing over the last few weeks. Here's the flip side of that. It's July 2nd. Right. And the pieces and the bodies that have moved

were all are the free agents, which you were never going to factor into. Like Donovan Mitchell is the first like, oh, that was a guy we wanted. He's off the board. That's the first one that's happened. Yeah. So there's still...

We don't have a superstar malcontent right now. Brandon Ingram is going to be on the... Is he a superstar? Maybe have a superstar malcontent right now. Brandon Ingram is gonna be on is he a superstar Maybe not a superstar like that's the name you wanted to hear right off the bat Mike Kevin Durant Exactly I'm not saying Brandon Ingram wouldn't help and I'm not saying he's not a good player in his own right Where it's just quite the the. Is it? I think so. Is it? Yeah, from what?

Depending on the package. What hopes and expectations were, is Brandon Ingram? Donovan Mitchell versus Brandon Ingram is quite the fall? Yeah, man. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not. I gotta talk myself into Brandon Ingram. Like, for, to be trudging through this,

these last few seasons, and for the reward at the end of it to be Brandon Ingram is just like, ah. But Brandon Ingram can give you what you need every single night. The most. He can be the go-to guy of the night, he can let Jimmy cook, he could be a facilitator. Bro, I think you might need to watch more Pelicans games

because Brandon Ingram is that guy. I don't want to watch more Pelicans games. That's on you, you wanna watch? I'm familiar with Brandon Ingram. I don't want to watch more Pelicans games. That's showing you, you wanna watch? I'm familiar with Brandon Ingram. I don't think you are. I know who Brandon Ingram is. I know you know who he is. I don't think you're familiar with him.

I've watched his game, yeah, he's a nice little player. Yeah, is he a superstar to help win the title? That too is so condescending to little. He's not a nice little player, bro, he's good. Okay, he's a lanky player. And he's also one of the highest people I've ever seen play the sport. I'm out. He's good. Okay, he's a lanky player. And he's also one of the highest people I've ever seen play the sport.

I'm out. So, the last two years, right, including this is the finals run year, the Heat have been bottom third in offense in the league and in the half court, bottom five two years ago, bottom nine last year. This is a team that is suffocating from its lack of offense.

The people around it, if you look around the heat in that range of like. You need buckets, Brandon Ingram gets buckets. Orlando, we're talking about Orlando as a neighbor down there. Think about how bad Orlando was offensively. That's where Miami is. Except Orlando, as bad as it is,

still has the Palo Verde Carriages go get me one. At absolute worst, right? Miami, Jimmy Butler, you could look through his career, he's not a 25, 28 point per game scorer. He's a timely scorer, but he's not a guy that said, hey man, just carry me for this whole game. No, Brandon Ingram would walk in as the go-to scorer, but he's not a guy that says, hey man, just carry me for this whole game. No, Brandon Ingram would walk in as like the go-to scorer. And it's just not, it's just such a,

such a harsh recalibration of expectation. What, but like, when you say that, you act like it was, okay, are we gonna get Paul George? Are we gonna get, you know, like, Michael Jordan? Are we gonna get Anthony Edwards? No, I was thinking Donovan Mitchell. I was thinking, I was already,

I was talking myself into Paul George. I still have the pie in the sky scenario of Phoenix realizing that this isn't the path to go down. And you can get someone like Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant excites me more, even at this stage in his career, than a Brandon Ingram. He just does because I think that with important games

on the line, I know what I can get from Kevin Durant, and I just trust him. I have a hard time trusting Brandon Ingram. But he's not, so you can say, oh, Kevin Durant, he's not available. When he becomes available, then we can have that conversation. But you can't be like, you guys promised me,

Kevin Durant level. No, I understand. And so when you say, so really realistically, your Miami Heat offseason has been ruined, air quotes, by one thing, the thing that just happened today, Donovan Mitchell. And I'm here to tell you, Donovan Mitchell's a very good player.

He's a superstar, he's charismatic, he sells tickets, he sells shoes, he sells all that stuff. But the gap between Donovan Mitchell and Brandon Ingram is not like this chasm. It's not great. It's also, to consider Brandon Ingram with the leadership of the Heat culture. That's the part.

He's had the Lakers, Circus. He's had New Orleans where he had to be the guy despite Zion's absence. So imagine him in Sposter's locker room. I feel like that would make Brandon Ingram so much better and he's already good. It's a great point. It's just here in Brandon Ingram,

when once again, everyone outside of, let's just put the Celtics aside because they're just running back at championship side. But everyone else. Are they? Yeah, aren't they? Like running back as in bringing back the same guys. Yeah, they're bringing back the same guys

and it seems the news yesterday, they're locking in all their guys and letting some other ownership group worry about the tab. That's genius. I love that. That is a Jeffrey Loria school of ownership right there. Minus the success. Yeah.

Wait to see. Hey, they're tied in championships. Celtics ownership group and Jeffrey Loria. One title each. Two. This Celtics ownership group won. 08. Oh, this was around in 08?

Yes. Because I knew that they took on like those Vegas guys like around that time. Paliuka and Grausbeck, they came in. Because they have a larger group. Yeah, but those two guys, those are the two main guys. I sing corrected. So actually that's quite a bit of success

for that ownership. Yeah, suck it Sampson. Since 08. 2-1. But here's my frustration and why I just came at you to do so with Brandon Ingram. Two one, which is one off of the three one Panama score yesterday, continue.

We'll get there. But we will definitely get there, trust me. I've been waiting for this moment for all my life to get at the US Soccer Federation and Greg Berhalter. And I think you and I were enjoying that game the same amount. And you know you and I were enjoying that game the same amount. And you know that I love my U.S. Men's National Program.

But again, we'll get to it. Here's why Brandon Ingram just slices me in half. It's because when you consider all the names over the last 10 years, and this is like attempt three on Donovan Mitchell that you haven't seriously been in the game on. But there is just superstar after superstar after superstar that you get excited for and to be left with surveying the land and at this point in time the superstar malcontent

that you have to trade all these young players for that you've developed is Brandon Ingram and at that point I understand the spin of like, f it, let's just run it back and see what's available in the mid season. It's a second straight year of everyone in the East seemingly getting better and you're standing Pat. I find it really hard to get excited about bringing them back and talking about the huge chances because as of right now Forget playing this doesn't look like a playoff team This does not look like a team that can compete inside its own division right now It's got a lot of ground to make up and I understand the point if they're healthy if they're healthy

They're probably the second seed. Okay, and then the seventh seed is going to take them out Because they're gonna be resting their guys and they're going to be more talented come playoff time. I don't see a path here. You can project all you want that if all those guys played, they're a two seed. They're a fraud of a two seed. And you also have to take into account that they're a year older. This is as bad a position as a Miami Heat have been since the Waiters and James Johnson era, since the Hassan Whiteside era,

where their hands were totally tied behind their back because they dished out bad contracts that were very difficult to move. At least they have pieces on their roster that they can move. Now I'm not saying change things just for the sake of changing them because you're desperate, but you gotta be-

Sounds like it, that's exactly what you're talking about. You gotta be insane to say running it back is what we should do. You need to have Jimmy Butler in the playoff run and they still gotta win in Boston. This team is gritty. Bro, I don't see what you see. I see the Miami team still as one of the scariest teams

in the league as long as they're healthy, especially if you add a player like B.I., come on. I understand the perspective, especially from a Boston supporter because that's the boogie man. Oh, I'm not a Boston supporter, I'm a, I love the NBA, brother. Like, I'm not just a Boston supporter scared of no damn body. I'm saying this as a person who watches every single game,

WNBA and NBA, I'm saying that Brandon Ingram brings something that you guys could 100% benefit from. I think the other thing, Mike, that you guys could 100% benefit from. I think the other thing, Mike, that you have to keep in mind is this isn't like, well boys, back up the cement truck, this is us for life, life, life, life. That's not what's happening here.

Like, July 2nd. A lot can happen just in the next couple of days. Damien Willard got traded a day before training camp. Yep. Like things, shit happens. Although we were, like a year ago, like I got all those social media memories, like we were already on the Lillard path here.

Yes, yes, but like my point is, shit happens continuously from now up until February whatever. Shit happens continuously. People get upset, people get disenchanted, people run out of patience. Hey, and LeBron's still out there. People get upset. People get disenchanted. People run out of patience. Hey, and LeBron's still out there. And Bronnie. LeBron, I guess, is my pivot, my irrational pivot.

The trade packages always end up mattering too, right? So you would have been giving up, likely, your whole young core and your bevy of picks, whatever you have left to go get Donovan Mitchell and building around Mitchell, Bam, and Jimmy Butler and hoping that Jimmy Butler didn't then walk in the off season. You're still in that position with Jimmy.

The question becomes. We're hoping that he doesn't? If you were to be in, if you were to make a move for Brandon Ingram, for example, what does that trade package look like? For that matter, a guy who's been floated out there, and this is certainly not the name that you wanna hear if you're going from Donovan Mitchell,

but Zach Levine, they're talking about attaching a pick to him, so then it puts you in a position of hey, if you can acquire an asset on top of a guy who can go get his own bucket, then you're back in position to either at the deadline or in the following off season, make the type of moves that you're looking for. Look, this is a negative, no matter what.

Look, today's a sad, like, today, Heat fans are allowed to be upset about Donovan Mitchell not being here, but it doesn't have to be the end of the world. It is the beginning of the summer. Jeremy, I wanna ask Mike a question. Other than 2010, what was your franchise? You act like every year y'all got the best of it. Talent acquisition.

Name names. Shaquille O'Neal, Brian Grant before him. Brian Grant. Alonzo Mourning before him. Brian Grant. Tim Hardaway. Tim Hardaway. Tim Hardaway had no knees.

Tim Hardaway had no knees. Tim Hardaway. Tim Hardaway is rich. Okay, hold on, here we go. Watch this, watch this. Tim Hardaway had no knees and everyone thought his career was over when they got him. Alonzo morning cool

All right, so this your counter to me rattling off like 17 examples He's always talent every name you just named because you act like every summer They walked in with the best free agent guys look who I'm with now, but that's not what they do No, no, what they do is the best trade available. They're always in that conversation That's not what they do. No, no, no. What they do is the best trade available. They're always in that conversation. Count them.

Three big off seasons. One Alonzo morning. Absolutely. That was the big one. That wasn't an off season. That was mid season. No it wasn't. It was the summertime.

It was? Len Rice for Alonzo morning. Okay. Right? Number two was Shaquille O'Neal. Yeah. Jamal Mashburn was also a pretty aggressive move. Are you high right now?

Jamal Mashburn was an aggressive move. I'm just saying, like this seems like. You say you want anything. You just want anything. Just do something. Do something guys. Move things around. Oh, now I feel better.

We did something. I now realize like how annoying it is when someone just gets louder when you're trying to have like a conversation. You are irrational. Let me finish my point. I'm being rational. The Miami Heat's identity is always being in on the talent, is always being in on the

talent and succeeding and now they're failing at much. Alonzo Mourning, Shaquille O'Neal, Chris Boshan and LeBron James. Other than that, and I guess Jimmy Butler. That's a lot of examples. That's four in 40 years. To his point, you didn't want Jimmy Butler, right? And you didn't want Jimmy Butler. You didn't want him the same way.

I had to talk y'all *** into him. Hold on. Yes. I had to talk y'all into him. 40 years! Yeah, but that- To his point, you didn't want Jimmy Butler, right? And you didn't want Jimmy Butler. You didn't want him the same way. I had to talk y'all **** into him. Hold on, yes. I had to talk y'all into him. I wasn't the biggest Jimmy Butler fan, but getting Jimmy Butler with Zero Cap Room is an example of what this franchise used to be.

Aggressive, all-in moves to get superstars. Whether I rated Jimmy Butler as much as his superstar tag allowed for, that doesn't really matter. He was a superstar. He was an all-star for, that doesn't really matter. He was a superstar, he was an all-star player. He wasn't a superstar when he came. So he wasn't, they fought against. He became a superstar here. So but Juju, or Tony, finish the line for me.

So you got four times, two of them were good, one of them was eh, and the other was Jimmy Butler. Over 10 years, what's that? 10 year one. That's a one hot Butler over 10 years. What's that? 10 year one. That's a one hot thing over 10 year average. Right. Stop acting like you guys are doing this thing every damn year.

You sound like a Laker fan. We're like, everybody wants to play for the Lakers. Like yeah, in like 1987. But the reality is the history of this franchise, the history of this franchise is not wheeling and dealing all the time. It's just they've had high profile ones that have gotten brainwashed into thinking,

we've got the whale hunter, we've got Captain Ahab out here on the, ah, she blows, a hump like a snowmobile. It is superstar Nick. Why would I think that when after every season, Pat Riley gets in front of a microphone to once again ramp up expectations. He didn't do that this year. Joe Biden got in front of a microphone to once again ramp up expectations.

Joe Biden got in front of a microphone, doesn't matter. What I'm saying is, at the end of the day, these teams, y'all's mantra is the toughest, I don't know the toughest, roughest one, that doesn't stand for superstars. That means we work hard, and I feel like he's a hard, Brandon Ingram is a hard worker that could benefit y'all, is all I'm saying.

Okay. And Brandon Ingram, by the way, Show me, because if he is all I'm saying. And Brandon Ingram by the way, right? Show me, because if he- Jimmy Butler shows you and you didn't like Kyle Lowry, but he went to the finals with Kyle Lowry and he benefited and he contributed. So whatever we feel doesn't matter. I think they went to the finals in spite of Kyle Lowry.

Look, by the way, Lowry is, when they got Lowry, he was at a higher position than Tim Hardaway when he was acquired. Like at that point in their careers- Where do at a higher position than Tim Hardaway when he was acquired. Like at that point in their careers. What do you season on the Tim Hardaway thing? Like the Zo was a move. I'll season on, you know why? Cause season on Jamal Mashburn doesn't do numbers.

Okay. That's why. No, no, no, but Jamal Mashburn was one of the top names available in the mid-season trade deadline. Ryan Gronk. They got him. Go ahead. Lamar Odom, you can have your opinions on Lamar Odom. It changed the trajectory of the franchise. Lauren Dragich was the biggest name available at that trade deadline. You hated him too. You thought Tyler Johnson

was better. We celebrated when we got Dragich. Yeah, I had a very popular vine. Lamar Odom and Brandon Ingram are, you can't say Lamar Odom is a bigger draw than Brandon Ingram. Hey Juju, you're a basketball fishing outter. How many times an All-Star has Lamar Odom is a bigger draw than Brandon Ingram. Hey Juju, you're a basketball-fishing out. How many times an All-Star has Lamar Odom been? I don't, I can't. Zero, zero. Yeah, okay.

Right, how many times had Gordon Draghi's been an All-Star at that point? Well Lamar Odom changed the trajectory of where they were going and it was an aggressive splashy move. So, and he then ended up being a key piece in the Shaquille O'Neal acquisition. Dude, I don't know what to tell you.

If you don't think that the Miami Heat's whole DNA is built as much on superstar acquisition as it is on the culture BS, then I don't know what to tell you. This has always been a team that has been aggressive in the trade market. And let me tell you something. Well, I keep hearing about how Darrell Morey, how does he have draft capital? He's in the conversation every goddamn year and he finds a way to make it happen. He found a way to make it happen again with Paul George. He keeps stealing your lunch money, Darryl Morey. Darryl Morey is what people think and wish and hope Pat Riley can be today.

Darryl Morey won conference finals appearance in his career. Yep. In his career. Houston and Philadelphia. Okay, he's had. No, congratulations. That's the guy. Ooh yes, save me, save me Taro Mori. Take me to the promised land of the second goddamn round.

How many, how many conference finals do you think he gets to? How many do you think he wins if Eric Spolstra is his head coach? Get out of here man. What? Get out of here? No, no, no, no, this is a big piece of it. Yes. Yes. He has a lot more success.

So what I'm saying reward the head coach with aggressive moves as a GM. It's July 2nd. Okay. It is July 2nd. No, in my mind, it's two and a half years, two and a half years of width. In the middle of that, they were in the NBA finals. Got it, got it. Yeah, and that's always gonna be the rebuttal. And the conference finals. It's always gonna be the rebuttal. Two and a half years. And if I say-

Game seven conference finals and the NBA finals. It slaps way harder than me telling you they've been in the play in two consecutive years. It slaps way harder than Jamal Mashburn and Bryan Grant and Tim Hardaway. That's where it slaps harder then. These were aggressive moves. These are aggressive moves that are just aggressive

for the sake of aggression and not because of the actually like things that you take home and put on a fridge. Say, look at what I did today. They got Ray Allen, they got Goran Dragic. I literally rattled off 25 names. And you go to Tim Hardaway's knees. Just unreal. I went through every name.

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use code Dan for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply, again, create an account, redeem code D-A-N for $20 off your first purchase. Download Game Time today, last minute tickets, lowest price guaranteed Don LeBotard Stugats They'll play D and show threes as they chase the Nats for the sixth seed These five words in his head scream are we winning games yet?

This is the Don LeBathard Show with the Stugats All right let's uh let's talk about something that we both agree on I believe that I believe that we will I believe I believe that. I believe that we will. I believe that we will lose. I believe that we will lose. I believe that we got an ass beat. I believe that Panama's better. I believe that this guy's done.

La la la la la la. US sucks. Oh, I thought you were still making fun of Heat fans. US sucks. Ah, ooh, ah, ah, ah. I don't think that's how the chant goes. I think it's how it goes. I think how it goes I think how I look I

Watch the game from the Goodyear blimp ladies and gentlemen Bird's-eye view so I could see all of the little ants running around on the field and let me tell you something about US soccer That has not changed over the 150,000 years. They've been playing. I don't care who the names are I don't care where the bloodlines whatever I don't care, the bloodlines, whatever you want to talk about. It's undeniable that this country plays like a pickup game every damn time. Sometimes they win, sometimes, a lot of times they lose, excuse me, but they play like a pickup game.

What I mean by is so many times, first of all, complete lack of accuracy in the short game. Passes going far, short, out of bounds. Guys making passes that are panic passes. They don't know what the next play is. It's like, oh, let me get this to get rid of it. You pass it to nobody, right? Blinders on in the scoring area, in the scoring third, right?

Last night, Haji Wright, you got a man right here. Like, I gotta shoot the ball because I'm a strike. I think more knockout goals in international competition than Cristiano Ronaldo, Haji Wright. Congratulations. Now take your ass home. World Cup elimination goals than Cristiano Ronaldo. Take your ass home and put that on your than if you're gonna run all the way.

Take your ass home and put that on your plate. What you're saying is not wrong, and I think last night, it doesn't often happen where I'm just like actively rooting against my team, especially when it comes to the national teams. A handful of times I can, there was one USF game against Randy Shannon where I wanted Randy Shannon out in the worst way. I was just cheering for USF at that point. Last night was one of those nights.

I got picked up to be Elsa for actually going for it even though he was suspended putting out there an aggressive starting 11 for Uruguay to show you. This US men's national team program has lost to Panama on home soil twice in the last 12 months And there's been a lot of golden generation talk and there's been a lot of talent talk And I will concede that this is probably when you look at the clubs that these guys are Playing with when you look at the actual talent on the field This is worthy of people saying this is one of the more talented US soccer generations ever

So if you want to take swipes at the talent, that's... Isn't this supposed to be the best team ever? Like, isn't this supposed to be the team that's supposed to win the World Cup that America is hosting? It's been dubbed the Golden Generation, and they've lost to Panama twice in the last 12 months. Everything that glitters ain't gold, Billy. Who could have seen this coming outside of everyone who has followed U.S. soccer passionately over the last five years? I followed very passionately.

Yeah, and you knew one day this day would come. Now I don't know if the Federation's actually gonna do the right thing. I'm so over this Federation and the nepotism that exists within it that I don't expect them to actually do the right thing. So this is an appeal to Greg Berhalter. Resign with 2G G's you step aside

Oh shit, you got brought back and I feel like he got brought back new t-shirt resign U.s. Soccer Federation wanted to avoid a lawsuit a lawsuit by the way a mess that was entirely Constructed by Greg Berhalter because he couldn't shut his trap around reporters. And he made an ugly situation even uglier with Gio Reyna. He couldn't keep that behind the locker room doors. He couldn't do that. That had to play out in the public sphere.

Okay, fine. He's brought back. What do you, what did you think was gonna happen with Greg Berhalter out there? This guy wants to come in and play like Barcelona and boss teams that he's more talented than. Play like what? Boss Panama, you can't boss Panama.

Hold on, play what? Play like Barca football, play possession football. There's no, you just mentioned it, there's no possession here. I don't trust this team if they travel to El Salvador to play them off the pitch. Dude, saying they wanna play like Barcelona is like? Dude, saying they want to play like Barcelona is like saying the Detroit Pistons want to play

like the 2017 Warriors. I understand. Look, take swipes at the talent all you want. I will say for US soccer history, there's plenty of great examples of them showing up with a gritty 11 and playing a defensive style, a counter-attacking style, and getting the results needed. They did it against literally the greatest soccer team

I have ever seen with Spain in the Confederations Cup. I've seen this country, when it adopts that mentality, actually get success, lean on the athleticism, long ball it to the speedster over the top, get a goal. Because in the international game, it's not how you do it, it's doing it. Amen. Okay, okay, that's fair.

It's not how you do it, it's doing it, but it's also how you do it. Like they don't... Ask Greece if they liked how they did it in 06. No, I get it. Like there's always gonna be an example of someone who just like, Italy is the example most of the time, right?

Like where they just shitted their way to a championship. But my point is this. Like you keep talking about the talent, but the talent doesn't play like it's talented. It plays like it plays hard. I think they play hard. I don't think so. I don't think they play hard enough.

I think they play dumb. They play dumb. Yes. And that's the part where you can have as many players as you want playing in the EPL and in Germany and all these places, but if they come back and they still play dumb, like they're from New Jersey, I'm sorry.

New Jersey catching a straight. New Jersey's one of the great soccer states. Well yeah, exactly. A lot of great talent came out of New Jersey. No, he's right. One of the great soccer what? States, United States. United States of suck, right?

New Jersey is not like Rio. It's not like. I think we're in agreement in terms of how they play. Like you and I can have their disagreements about the level of talent, that's fine. If someone wants to tell me, how can you say they're talented when they're losing to the likes of Panama, I concede, fine.

I think this team does play stupid. And I think it just goes back to the general approach and the ego. What I don't like about Greg Berhalter, what I've told him to his face on Chelsea Mike Dubb, I think this style is really, really dumb to play on the international level. I think you see, I will concede that when you get to the the knockout stages, this team is not going to be as talented as some of their opponents. And I will also concede that that does not matter.

That does not matter, especially when you're hosting a World Cup in 2026. We've seen it time and time again in this sport. You don't have these guys in your camp for a very long time. So while you're trying to institute this really sophisticated attacking scheme with where you have all this possession, you have these guys in your camp for like four days at a time. What are you doing? Just be organized with defense. Get guys that play smart. Get guys that can adopt your mentality as a manager, can carry that message out and not beat themselves. What the U.S. Soccer Federation did, which is I theorize avoid a lawsuit by bringing Greg Burr Halter back, but what they did in doing so is they gave the players exactly what they wanted.

If you look at camp, everybody's so loose, we're having so much fun, everyone loves Greg, kumbaya. There are a lot of championship teams that hated their manager. Carly Lloyd spoke to it. We won titles, we hated our manager. You need a manager that holds people personally responsible because, oh, how can you blame Greg Berhalter for Tim

Weah punching a guy? I can, I can. That comes with a mentality. It all starts with that leader there, and you let a bunch of kids hand pick their guy and look at the results. Now no more making you happy. You don't have a say in this.

You're gonna have a manager that should come in there, run your ragged and make you hate the sport of soccer. That's what you deserve. So you want Jose Mourinho. Oh, you know me. You know me. And Mourinho, like, look, I don't wanna make this a Mourinho thing

because that's a headline grabber and people Something I just I want an adult here. Let me tell you and Jose merino fits his profile, which is why We'll go with Jose merino as the avatar for this. I want an adult that has succeeded at the highest level What is Greg Berhalter done to? To be worthy of five years on the job. What has he done? He's a loser He's a loser. He's a loser. He is a career loser.

Don't talk to me about times that he had in Columbus. Get real. Columbus. I want someone that has had success on the club level, the international level, success at the highest level. Because when he tells your ass to be running laps with a tracker on your back You at least know it's coming from someone that you should respect Greg Berhalter doesn't command a room

I don't respect Greg Berhalter house Tim way is supposed to respect Greg Berhalter I told Greg Berhalter to his face his tactics were wrong my guy's a loser. He's a chump Mike Let me ask you a question man. How much of this is you the soccer Federation's? overconfidence in the MLS as a source of anything? I think what this is, is the Soccer Federation doesn't actually answer to anyone, and we don't exist in a country where they actually feel the heat,

which is why they brought Greg Burrhalter back in the first place, while his brother's there in the Federation, and just totally ignoring the passionate fan base that there is such that it is look I wish that I lived in a country where the lower third is not clay Thompson agrees to three or $50 million big deal where it's plastered from television to television Greg burr halter has to go I don't live in that country I don't think I ever will live in that country. It's a different place.

That's why you fail. Not you, this country. When it comes to this, that's why- You get a coddled federation. You get a subpar product, right? Given the resources that this country has, right? That federation is pulling and dough. The resources, the infrastructure, all that stuff. It staggers me. Like when I watch US games and I see these people in the crowd, I'm like, who are actually,

what, you guys actually think that the result is gonna be something different? Like, it staggers me. When you said yesterday that the 1990-18 was supposed to do things, I'm like, do what? Do what, man? Dude, you see some of their matches against Brazil and Argentina in the lead up to that World Cup.

The lead up. You can talk about exhibition-friendly, man. No, no, no. I'm not talking about exhibitions. I'm talking about gold cups and Copa America. It's like, what are you talking about, dude? It's all right. You don't have to have amazing recall of the 1995 US Men's

Soccer team. It's cool. I'm just going to be there to check you on it. We're not talking about 95, we're talking about 98. But like 95, 96, 97, there are other competitions that exist, if you wanna like, cast those aside and say that they're not, like look at the Brazil roster that that US men's national team hung with

in the mid 90s, look at it, look at the Argentinian roster. I ain't gotta look at it, I'm rocking the shit right now. It's a different game. It's not about, it's not always about talent. Do you need talented players? Yes, but you need cohesion. You need a different approach. Sure, but you also need talent. Like yes, I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying.

And I'm not even disagreeing with, like I'm a person, I'm an aesthetic snobob I like to see it played right. You actually would like Greg Berhalter's style if you ever actually if they knew how to play it right if they had the talent and the discipline to play it but but if it wasn't soaked in ego to even try to attempt that when you're playing on a choppy pitch with rocks on it in El Salvador. Well I mean you can play that way on a choppy pitch and El Salvador rocks on it if you have players who grew up playing on choppy pitches with rocks on them.

But the problem is, you got guys that came up to these academies with these manicured lawns and everything, oh, there's a $750 fee to enter. No problem, we've got it. Like, that's your talent base. So you can't take them to them weird-ass places. It's not like Brazil or Argentina or many of these other places,

or even France where these kids grew up playing in shitty environments, right? But I digress, what I'm trying to say is this. It's your environment. You're right. You're right in that cohesion matters. You're right in that having a scheme and being able to execute it matters.

You're even right, I'll even allow you that, hey man, sometimes it's just a 30 yard bomb in a cloud of dust and then we fall back. That's this nation's identity. For the men's team, that's how they win. That's when they have their success and great goalkeeping to bail you out. Yes, but there's a cap to that if you don't have talent.

There's a cap, like that's good enough for a round of 32 in the World Cup. That's good enough maybe for a round of 16. In 02, like they got to the quarterfinals in 02, Torsten Frings had a handball. That's the best American team I've ever seen. Well, in terms of results, hard to argue. And they played a style that was conducive

to what they had, talent-wise. Yeah, a giant-killing style. Yes, but. And there are good moments in this national team's program. 1950. There is an identity there. And yes, what you're saying is right. The soccer culture in this country,

you can't expect to have dogs on your team when you're going against guys that have been playing barefoot and favelas, and it's literally their way out. You're not gonna meet that mentality, that intensity, but you can beat them in other ways. Structure, organization, a commitment to a common goal. And it starts from the top.

It starts from that U.S. Soccer Federation. If I ask you, who's the director of the U.S. Soccer Federation? Who's ask you who's a director of the US Soccer Federation? Who's in charge here? People don't know and that allows for this whole attitude of People that don't have to be held accountable for their actions So Greg, I have zero faith in them even though they made a good hire with Emma Hayes. Greg Cody? Greg Berhalter, two G's.

What has he done? I am asking you, dude. You need to realize that this is a sham, an embarrassment, and they in all likelihood brought you back to avoid a lawsuit. So do the right thing, walk away, cause you are not that guy. 2026 is around the corner.

This team doesn't have qualifiers to actually find their form. What are you gonna do that you haven't done in the last five years? We've seen enough, we've seen enough. Red card, Tim Weah, oh, hard luck, you lost to them twice in 12 months, pal. Get outta here, you stink.

You were given a job that you shouldn't have had in the first place, and against all odds, they brought you back in spite of every U.S. soccer fan telling you this was going to happen. They didn't get out of a group with Bolivia and Panama in it. Bielsa was reveling at the opportunity. He was licking his chops as he was suspended to try and attempt to put a nail in your coffin.

Bielsa who the US soccer federation didn't want to hire whatsoever because they know what they're doing. They brought in the sporting director from Southampton everybody, Clear Alain. It's a joke of a federation. And you got 2026 serenade at you like the barrel of a gun. So wake the up and make an aggressive move. There are big names available out there. Mourinho, fine. Klopp, fine. Give me a professional. Brandon Ingram. Give me a professional with something on his resume and a dude that can walk into a room

and command respect because these children out there are not respecting the manager and it's playing out on the field. It's playing out on the field it's playing out on the field you have a golden opportunity you're gonna ruin it u.s. soccer you're standing in your own in your own way and you don't see it you don't see it take this seriously it's happened twice in my adult life a world cup here on the uh... a men's world cup here on u.s. soil

and you piss it away we spent eighteen months with the result knowing the result of the World Cup and the mess that was left in our wake in Qatar. You spent several months in this asinine job search just to bring the guy back and what does he do to reward your faith in him? You lose this to Panama. A huge national embarrassment.

You wanna talk to me about offside? I wish Gommi Ball and Konka Kaif came out with a joint statement and said fine, he was offside. Panama still goes through. Panama scored three goals. You want to talk about the US talent? Panama looked talented. Where is the US talent?

And Christian Pulisic, I love ya. I think you are generally. Pronounce your name right. I think you are genuinely, I meant to say, the most talented attacking player this country has maybe ever seen. I think you're worthy of that praise. I think you're a champions league winner.

You showed in Syria odd that it's not a fluke. You're one of the best players in Syria offer AC Milan. You finally show that you can stay healthy. And I think you've got the proper mindset, but this moment right here, where he tries to go and shake the, uh, the, the officials hand, I think he allegedly said, go celebrate with Uruguay okay dude that's fine you got away with acting like such a petulant child on the pitch you should have been given a yellow card the official kind of acted like a child here in this video if you would have seen what

Pulisic did that didn't get carded during the actual run of play where he was just he made contact with the official. He was acting like a child He walked up and he talked he said Shake your hand just say I feel like the official can be the bigger person there and give like a tell with that go take Your losing asshole. That's that's your captain and it's just not gave him a fine That guy was, Christian Pulisic was insulting that official up and down. Was he officiating great last night? No. So what? Yet you have a game for your lives in a Copa America. You didn't,

this is the first time I think since they actually had regular hosts in Copa America that the host didn't get out of the group stage. I believe so. I think they started this format in 1987. Maybe I read that tweet wrong. But they gifted a path to the knockout stages to the US and Greg Berhalter biffed it. Not only that, Jesse Marsh, who's American, who Greg Berhalter openly feuds with because anytime anyone says anything about Greg Burhalter his antennas go up And he feels like he has to address it because that's a mentality we have in that position Jesse Marsh makes it to the knockout stages with Canada in a tougher group

Bad looks all around you could have had Jesse Marsh. He at least has some credentials He at least has done some things over in Europe Yo, but you didn't go Jesse Marsh, you went with Greg Burhalter. You went with now his mortal enemy and Jesse Marsh has dragged, dragged Canada to the knockout stages. It's a joke of a federation. It's not all on Greg Burhalter. Greg Burhalter has been who he has always been.

There is zero surprise with Greg Burhalter laying an egg here. What has he done? You are right Mike that this is the first ever group stage exit for a host in Copa America. He's got AIDS. No! Hmm. I don't know if that's true.

Ha ha ha ha. Mike, let me ask you another question, man. And this one is sincere. I'm not trying to be churlish here, right? When you think about where this is all headed, first of all, we expect him to get let go, right? This is these are the results that I'm begging him to resign because I have so little faith in the U.S. soccer players. They put out a statement saying this morning I read that they're

gonna evaluate what happened in Copa Medica. I don't know why that takes so long to evaluate. I think it's pretty clear what happened in Copa Medica. I don't know why that takes so long to evaluate. I think it's pretty clear what happened in Copa Medica, but they're gonna evaluate what happened and make a decision that's best for the program going forward. Let me ask you a question through that. So do you feel like you represent what a lot of US soccer fans feel?

Yes or no? Or do you think you're an educated minority? I don't know. Okay, the reason why I say that is because watching the broadcast, I usually don't watch the broadcasts in English. What a broadcast, by the way, a sicko's delight. Let's show that camera angle that we started off with.

First of all, yeah, oh my God. Oh, that was amazing. I needed binoculars, right? Dude, that's what you meant earlier with the reference to that. This is, yeah. I was like, were you actually in a- What is this, a game for ants?

Dude, CONCACAF has so many funny moments, especially throughout qualifying. Company Ball is actually hosting this tournament. They are the governing authority. But this is as CONCACAF as I've ever seen a non-CONCACAF region B. This aerial shot here. I'm sorry to interrupt your train of thought.

It starts with obviously that, but then, I don't typically listen to the commentating because I just find it to be sickening most of the time. Yeah, propagandist. But yesterday was like, I was relishing this because I'm like, oh yeah, let me hear it. I need the tears directly into my veins. And I'm listening to them,

and it's like they're in a dream state. They have, isn't, I guess where I'm going with this is, isn't this part of the problem? Is that you have a media that seems to be very, very, roses as opposed to being critical? I mean, Alexi Lallis is still like representing the US on these grand stages, but I will say that, yeah, the media is somewhat to blame.

I think especially with Greg Berhalter, but it's a difficult position because I'm certainly an outlier in just being super negative around Greg Berhalter. You wanna rally around him. And in my defense, come the World Cup, look, let's get to the knockout stages with our one goal on the run of play. Let's do it, whatever. And I actually think he was leaning into some of the things that worked for the US in the past,

and that I have no plan. We're not going to boss these teams off the pitch. Let's just be gritty. But I do think that there is a real issue with media in this country covering US soccer, and the main issue is that they don't allow traditional media to cover it, maybe because many people in traditional media, you're Stephen A. Smiths of the world, Mike Greenbergs of the world, can't actually speak on it with any sort of authority because they're rewarded for only having to follow three sports.

But I do think that there was a massive opportunity here. And if you want to say, what's your pie in the sky scenario to pie in the sky references? Yeah, lots of pie, lots of sky. What's your pie in the sky scenario to pie in the sky references. Yeah, lots of pie. Lots of what's your pie in the sky scenario for for 2026. It was always about hosting the world cup as I, as I grew to love this game and appreciate it in my teams and to where I am now, to where I'll be 40 when the world cup actually rolls around. It was always around that world cup that we're hosting. Can we

compete? Can we make a run to the semis? Can we give this country something to rally around? And yet the talent was lining up. This is as talented as a team as we've seen really and they're wasting a golden opportunity. And I don't think it's too late, especially if they get the right man in charge to manage the team, but they have wasted something that does not come around often. I was a child the last time, I'm gonna be a middle-aged man the next time.

The next time this rolls around. And to not have the progress over the years the mile markers along the way outside of 02 it's really disheartening it's really disheartening because this country has a wide talent base to choose from this country can change its approach and be about the winning you know what I would do if I were head of the Federation I start handing out passports left and right, man. I just go down there to Rio. Like Joel Bede? Joel Bede.

We do. No, I'm aggressively. You don't understand. Clinsman was like our team, half the team didn't speak English. There you go. Like when Clinsman was a manager. There you go.

I just want, I want, I want a real, real manager. I want them to do what they did with the women's team in Emma Hayes. A serial winner, someone that has bravado, someone that has cachet, someone that demands your respect. And I want that for the US Men's National Team. I want Emma Hayes. Bring Emma Hayes. Have her walk across the hall. What happened to the Messi of Medford, New Jersey? Guys, I'm a massive, massive proponent of good sleep.

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