The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - Local Hour: The NHL vs. The NBA

Episode Date: February 17, 2025

After a weekend full of action at the NBA All-Star Game and the NHL's 4 Nations Face-Off, the crew is full of strong takes. Chris and Mike returned with stories of interactions with Canadian hockey fans amidst a fraught time in the political discourse between the United States and Canada, but they mostly include good banter, TouchTunes, and Hooters. How much credit do the Tkachuk brothers deserve for making this weekend what it was? Is this another opportunity for the show to prove we're not an echo chamber and celebrate Donald Trump after last week's praise of his moves regarding pennies and paper straws? Plus, LeBron James sabotages an already struggling NBA All-Star game, Bob Rock, and a revisiting of Richie Incognito & Jonathan Martin's experiences in "bullygate." Today's cast: Dan, Greg, Chris, Billy, Jeremy, Mike, and Roy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Track your car's value with Carvana Value Tracker today. Shadow show. Shadow show. Shadow show. Shadow show. Shadow show. Shadow show. Shadow show.

Shadowing it. Shadowing it. Chris, as our fearless leader today. Greg, we've started. You need to stop doing that with the microphone. You didn't hear? Okay. We're on, Greg. All right.

What did I do? I touched my microphone. But do you not hear the countdown? Do you not hear five, four? And then after one is when we're starting. Like, do you not hear that? I thought it was a segueing right into the shadow show. Yeah, and Greg's defense shadow shows different

It's just us kind of the concept was we stroll in and it's like cash We're getting ready for the show Greg just getting ready with his to my bag and his laptop Chris as the son of Greg who is in charge of the shenanigans today Do you know where Stu gots is I? of Greg who is in charge of the Shenanigans today. Do you know where Stugatz is? I know that I saw an email last night, which is for him, very early notice, that he would not be here. Because?

I didn't see an answer why. I just saw an updated schedule. No Stugatz today. Billy, as the keeper of the Stugatz, do you know what's happened? Because he almost made it to a full work week at the Super Bowl and then he celebrated it by failing at the end the tires falling off, inconveniencing everybody, canceling a dozen guests and then not showing up for work on time on

Monday. I have no idea where he is. I saw the same email as news to me and then I also saw that he is now working on Thursday which throws off our recordings for later this week. I haven't gotten a heads up, no clue where he is. I also, not to you know put anyone's business out there, also was told that you know we have someone that helps with weekend observations and I was told that person did not get a heads up so that person did weekend observations and did not know that it was for nothing. At least it's done. No let's have Greg do it. Do what? Stugatz's weekend observations. Let's see, you want to audition for the role of Stugatz?

Since you're in the seat, it's a Greg Cody Tuesday. It's always better when it's Greg and Stugatz on a Tuesday. It's possible that that's not entirely complete yet though because this person did get the heads up last night via email, but I think that work was being done earlier in the day just unaware that it was not necessary for today. Billy, I do think that the spirit of Shadow Show should have the sound of you poniendo mantequilla on your toast. I'm trying, yeah.

I'm trying to keep things back to how they were. I think that the Shadow Show should always have you buttering toast in the background as you just prepare for the day. Chris, you were just drinking beer in Canada with Mike Ryan all weekend, right? Some whiskey as well. I wasn't drinking any beer. It was all tequila sodas, all gas, no breaks.

You guys had fun, huh? That's well done. Like that's a... Do you think? There's a little bit of a difference between the exhibitions right now. That's kind of startling. Charlie McAvoy is in the hospital as we speak.

Look, man, I'm stunned at how quickly some of this happened with hockey and basketball, where you've just desecrated one all-star game, you've made a bunch of changes to it, now one of your star players, Kevin Durant, is saying, I don't understand why any of you watch any of this. You all NBA fans seem like they don't like the NBA. He wasn't even talking about exhibitions.

Like, he's talking about in general, he's like, NBA fans exist to just complain about all the things they don't like about the NBA. I thought he made a bunch of great points. He did. His best point was, I think it's more fun to complain than actually watch. Yes, that's right, 100%.

Put it on the poll, please, Juju at LeBotard show. Is it more fun to complain than to watch? He also said the only thing that people are interested in in the NBA is the trade deadline, free agency and player beef. And he's not wrong there either. No, he made a bunch of great points. And the playoffs he said. But you know what? It happened on their watch. Like they are lamenting what they perpetuated.

In fairness, when the players don't care about playing the games, why should the fans care about watching the game? That is correct. That is absolutely happening. But I really do think one of the things getting lost between the link is bubble, pandemic, George Floyd. They didn't feel like playing back then either.

And it's like precipitated like it's gotten as the things in america have gotten worse and the conversation around that league is ah they were so woke in the uniforms with social justice like they didn't want to play then to entertain us when america was falling apart either and they don't want to do it now and then america turns on them like of course because you want joy with your games why wouldn't you want that it's you want simply that the athletes have a contagious feeling about caring about what they're doing as much as we do. It sounds like you're trying to make the players victims

here. I'm not a little bit. I'm not. I'm just telling you why it's happened. I'm not. I think they're wrong. You got to care about your sport. Like I don't defend it. I am absolutely not defending it. Their job as performers is to entertain, but they don't defend it. I am absolutely not defending it their job as performers is to entertain But they don't like it so much right now Like and they've got so much power that they can tell the commissioner bleep off on national television LeBron doesn't even bother put on the uniform Did we start the show did we let's do it This is the Don LeBattor show with the StuGuts podcast with the Stugarts Podcast. Greg Cody doesn't think he needs any prep.

Greg Cody is always ready. He was born ready. He stays ready. And when you came in today, did you see who is on our guest list today? It says guest for Dan's story. I have no idea what that means. Well that's not what it said on the board. When I walked in and on the board I'm looking at guest list, all it said is 11 a.m. racist

guest. That's what it said. Racist guest. And I think we need to get Greg Cody up to speed because that has some danger in it if he's not aware of what we're doing at 11 a.m. and there's been a scramble here today because Stugats has failed to show up. Awol. We will talk about the things from the weekend in a moment. A lot of people that you love in sports are taking this week off. Taking this week off the way that the basketball all-stars took the weekend off because they are tired

of that particular exhibition and it is super interesting to watch them take for granted their audience caring. I don't know if you guys have seen how low the Miami Heat's ratings are locally, down 56% year over year as I've been telling you what the Panthers did in taking this town and what hockey now does by caring about its exhibitions going to the hospital. Kachuk is flying all over the place. Giant hits in a game that's not supposed to matter until you wrap it in patriotism. That's where Mike Ryan and Chris were drinking tequila and drinking some whiskey.

Can we celebrate the NHL and its players first and foremost, before we get into all the negative? I know that that's the place that everybody wants to go, but where the NBA and its players are failing is where exactly the NHL and their players are succeeding. They out of thin air put together a TV property in four nations that now has value. They are going to share in the rewards of this. Be it, there may never be another Four Nations, but with the World Cup of Hockey, given the numbers that this pulled, 4.4 million,

the most watched non-Stanley Cup final game since 2019, this now is a lucrative television property. There is big money now in international best-on-best hockey and the players deserve all the credit for making that happen from the conceptualizing to the actual execution because they care so much it's evident. If I can take you back I'm not kidding to the last time I cared enough to summon any kind of criticism or indignance for an All-Star exhibition or friendly of any kind it would have legitimately been back when I cared about All-Star Games, which is when there were three channels, this week in baseball existed

because there were no highlights anywhere, and they just gave you this week in baseball, and you caught up on everything that was happening, and then all the stars gathered in one place, and it was before streaming, and a million years ago, obviously ancient times but that is when i started caring about that

and about when i stopped as i entered adulthood and then all of the exhibitions were a silly thing but when you wrap it in patriotism greg and when you have in basketball the joylessness of it doesn't seem like they care very much because they don't they're giving voice to it dream on green is killing his product saying that it's boring and oscar robertson is coming back in and saying it's more than what you play it all

you're doing is right around passing a staff well see doing out there but like they're doing something to their product to see both of them try and fill the space after football and to do it that differently? Yeah, it was amazing to watch this past weekend because hockey kicked basketball's ass. And it was amazing that basketball tried to rejigger its whole All-Star weekend and failed miserably. These three games now, separated by time the players hated

first of forty forty points it's a nightmare you you have a g league guy who's always winning the dunk contest could nobody wants to be in the duck contest the three-point contest is is now superfluous can you stop for a second though because i want to take i i want to get all your thoughts on basketball we columnist can get to the negative very fast you're rolling you're rolling your yeah and you are going to stop i do want to get all your thoughts on basketball. We columnists can get to the negative very fast. You were rolling. You were rolling. Yeah, and you weren't gonna stop.

I do want to celebrate hockey for a second because when you're talking about changes to a sport, I can tell you right now that if you make basketball an all-star game that involves the nations, it'll feel different than what it is that you got this weekend. Also two fights at the tip would help. That helps. That helps as well. I'm surprised no one fought Shane Gillis at the beginning of that you got this weekend. Also two fights at the tip would help. That helps. That helps as well.

I'm surprised no one fought Shane Gillis at the beginning of that All-Star game. That would have gotten me and certainly more invested. Yeah, the fights are great, but look hockey players just go about their sport differently. Amin and I had a big on-air conversation about it. These guys care because putting that country's jersey on matters. Even last night in a totally meaningless game in a Round Robin tournament, it still mattered to these guys because they have professional pride and national pride. They've waited 11 years for a best-on-best tournament at the international level,

and they delivered from the very first puck drop. Sweden, Canada on Thursday, it was already the single greatest all-star week I had ever experienced. Well you were there drinking too much Roy what were your thoughts on all things hockey this weekend and where it is. This is a pretty seismic shift you do understand this right like you you understand that it's super weird in one weekend to have these two things next to each other. It's a little bit disoriented. Well there's one man that you can thank for all this. Wayne Gretzky.

No, not Wayne Gretzky. Donald Trump. Exactly. The man who's wasted taxpayer dollars because he wanted to do laps around the Tri-Overn Daytona, that's on him. Because he riled up everybody in Canada, talking about Canada being the 51st state and all the tariffs and everything, that they got Canadians, even in regular season games, leading up to this tournament,

born the national anthem. So politically, this was even bigger, this tournament, Four Nations. Yeah, there was a little extra juice to it. Yeah, a little. I'm not gonna lie, I've never felt more like a Trump supporter being in Canada. Yep.

I was like, you get sucked in. You hear all the boos and you want to like, you're in a corner and it's just like, hey, stop booing us. Next thing I know, I'm being looked at like I support. I mean, you're America. I am. I look at you and I see the bloated excess. Trust me, I look in the mirror.

I see everything happening over there. Everything happening over there. I look at you and I see the map of a bloated America. Yeah. There was a lot of apologizing on the front end and F words on the back end. Like it was just, you know, you get wrapped up in it, especially when you're in a barn where everybody's booing you. And I understand they're not booing me personally.

They're not even booing the guys. It got so aggregated that the fights were about the booing of the national anthem. No, they weren't. Those fights were premeditated weeks in advance. Listen to the words before you post on end wokeness. They had a group text about it. Such a millennial way for like,

doesn't that take away a little bit from it? It's like, oh, this was all predetermined. I thought it was just a fight. If I predetermined an NBA fight for you, you wouldn't eat that up. If at the start of the All-Star game, what do you care whether it's predetermined? Also, like, I don't think you should be telling people out loud your premeditating crimes. Well, it's not a crime if it's on the ice. But unlike, you know, Jimmy Butler and the Denver Nuggets and, you know, the Jokic brothers and all that nonsense, this actually came

to fruition. And it was, we had three fights in the first nine seconds. And it's crazy. Look, the Florida Panthers went about a decade plus without an American of note on their roster. You had one guy in David Booth that was flirting with getting international call-ups every now and then. I know Austin Matthews is a captain and he's the biggest star in American hockey because he plays in Toronto and he's great. But Matthew Kachuk is the

face of this national hockey team. He is the voice, he is the attitude, and he, with every opportunity, he grabs at each and every opportunity to grow the game. This is such a marketable star. He needed to be the guy that set the tone and he did and it was amazing. Roy, it seems strange to me, okay, because I know he was great before he got here and obviously he didn't even have to be as great as some of his teammates for them to win the championship because Kachuk was better the year before than he was the year they won the championship by a good amount. I don't know if I can say this is a coming out party given everything

I just said about who this player is but to go and fight on behalf of your nation take the lead on something That is hockey taking the lead from basketball or no our Exhibition is the one that matters to be the face of that if you're a panther fan that had to feel pretty good I agree in Calgary They couldn't get past Edmonton and obviously for him count playing in Canada now switching over to America now He's the entire face of this league. You're seeing him in Perry Ellis commercials now He's got on his own clothing sponsor. So yeah, like he's now the face of this national team And I'm for one very happy about it.

Some of the best interactions in Canada over the weekend were with Calgary fans, because they just get so sad when they see Panther fans. They're just like, oh, and I'm just like, Huberto. I just say Huberto to them, it's like punching them right in the stomach. He's having a better season. And there were a lot of Panther fans.

That to me was the most astonishing take from the weekend in terms of a single individual fan base that was well represented in Montreal. I saw more Florida Panthers fans outside of Canadians fans. That was the biggest group there. A bunch of people repping their team. You could actually see this sport growing. People traveling on behalf of their Florida Panthers. I know that we have spent too many local hours this regular season talking about what Kevin Durant says is absolutely so. Player beef, disharmony in basketball sells.

So we have talked a lot about Jimmy Butler and the Heat when it's a nowhere season that is, like I said before, a 56% drop off in ratings year over year is something that tells you there's a profound indifference around the Miami Heat for the first time in a very long time and to have the Panthers step into the breach and feel very much like it's Tampa. It's what grew at the beginning in Tampa in Florida where you get such strong allegiances because these are the moments that you remember

for a lifetime, the snapshots. When I talk to you in general, for all the howling you hear about the All-Star game, go ahead and mention all the moments you remember all time from all of the All-Star games. Like your entire data bank of memory of amazing All-Star moments. Mine are all in baseball.

They're not, you know, I've got a couple in basketball. Sean Taylor killing Brian Mormon. Yes, yes, Sean Taylor, I hit on a punter in a Pro Bowl game, but like the moments are the things that make for the stickiness that as a lifelong allegiance of I saw this with my mom, I saw this with my dad, I remember what the place smelled like, I remember how good that felt to be a part of that,

to be a Panther of that, to be a Panther fan in Canada in the middle of that and to watch your guy, not the best guy on your team, but kind of the most important one, kind of the star. Not necessarily the best guy. Like I could have said it two years ago. The face, the attitude, the culture changer is Matthew Kachuk. The best player, two ways, Alexander Barkov. And it was great to see a bunch of Panther fans out there cheering for him. But the guy that is the face and attitude of this team, and now nation when it comes to hockey, is Matthew Kachuk.

But we have aired, and this is our fault. It's our fault as a show, and it exposes a casual interest that Stugats and I have in the Panthers. We have three Panthers fans, like die diehard three Panther fans in the room and they're still at the top of the conference and I guess Roy likes it too yeah they're still a covered it they're still exceptional okay folks did you know that sleep is one of the most important parts of recovery whether you're a pro athlete or just looking to crush your day, getting the right kind of rest is key.

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He's the one who's got to like worry about what the future is. And Mike Ryan bet on DraftKings because Mike Ryan bet on us. This is the bet you're afraid of doubling down on putting up a billboard in Edmonton. Stugats. I care more about Matthew Kachuk than I do my daughter. This is the Don Lebatard show with? Stugats! I care more about Matthew Kachuck than I do my daughter. This is the Don Lebatar Show with the Stugats! Roy, you have been compromised. You are the most biased of all of the Panther people that we have around here. Impartial reporter.

Unprofessional. You have a press credential, but you guys have to feel like you're at the beginning of what was happening in Tampa. Do you not? You slay Tampa, you win the championship, you take out McDavid. McDavid's not as good this year as your team is, when I thought McDavid and they would have that vengeance jump that the spurs grow into when they beat the Miami Heat after losing to the Miami Heat, but your team is still better

and some would argue, more expert than I, that your team is tougher. Yeah. Yeah, Connor is still McOverrated, by the way. It's a fine man. A great man once said that. I can't remember who. The great thing about the Panthers is that this is You can remember who. This is sustainable. They've been really really good for three

years now. Kachuk, one of the great trades in South Florida sports history, Kachuk just turned 27. He's absolutely in his prime. Well hold on a second. It's not only one of the great trades in South Florida sports history. That's one of the greatest trades ever made to lock up that guy for eight years, win a championship immediately. Like that's all of sports. That's both countries. That's not just South Florida.

That trade changed the Panthers from being a team that never won in the playoffs to this conversation we're having right now. That's nuts. Can I bring it back to Saturday night? The most united I felt with Canada all weekend was walking away from my away from my Seat into the concourse after that first period because it really was one of those holy shit. What did we just watch moments?

You're literally high-fiving high-fiving Canada fans of just no I'm telling you it was it was a just mutual Okay, we're at war right now, but holy shit, that period was one of the coolest sporting events I've ever seen. I know I'm being hyperbolic, top 10 easy. I'm not gonna go top five because everyone's gonna get mad at me. A top 10 sports moment, that first period, those fights, the hockey after,

the crowd when McDavid scores, one of the loudest things I've ever heard, just that first period. Billy is skeptical. You'd be terrible at war, honestly. Like horrible at war. You're going, you're high-fiving your enemies in the concourse It was just like after one of the battles after one You don't think ever in war after a battle where they kind of decided that we're done here like hey good one though

That was good like come on at the end of the day. They're Canadian. You know it's like everyone's like I got warned by Sid Cicero is like man. I feel bad for you going in there I'm like relax I dry hump the gator outside of the swamp and I put a collective hat on him. We're good. It's fine. As a group, they would boo, but face to face, nice. You're not even Canadian, they're French Canadian.

They don't even want to be there. Uberdo and they would just be like, oh, come on. You just say Uberdo. I mean, no, we're lying there. And then by the end of the game, you're chanting 51 at somebody's face. You know what it is. And then they get mad at us and we say, we're lying there, and then by the end of the game, you're chanting 51 at somebody's face. You know what it is, what it is. And then they get mad at us, and we say,

we're just kidding, come on, that's funny. Sorry, sorry. That's good banter. Good banter. We did give people their first ****, and that was literally an olive branch. I guess they don't have them there without all crazy warnings, and they're like,

what are those, pal? We're about to change your life. He's like, I chew it? Nah, buddy. Nah, just dissolves. Get ready for ride. These are sixes. Chris, did you really turn to a Canadian fan

after some rhetoric back and forth and say with a point good banter? There was two guys that really took exception to us. And then the entire row of eight dudes got involved. All right, can you guys get me that video? I want to show the video of Mike Ryan and Chris Cody fighting ten Canadian fans at once. We have that video from earlier in the show.

I don't know what country this is from here, but it's 10 amateur, thank you Billy, 10 amateur fighters against two professional fighters. And this is where the future is headed here. Which way is this gonna end? 10 amateurs against two professionals. Who do you guys have? The 10 amateurs or the two pros? Well, they're weight classes for a reason.

I'm gonna go super heavyweights here. I don't know where this ends. I haven't seen the entirety of this video. This is good banter. That's you too. That's not banter. For the podcast audience, we're watching two guys punch 10 smaller guys.

Two super heavyweights against like 10 smaller guys. It's the two super heavyweights. Yeah, the amateur got a good shot in. That was a sucker punch. They're allegedly amateur fighters, smaller ones and the two guys are Yeah, the two guys the two professional super heavyweights one Those are not amateur fighters those are ten kids who have never fought before Fighting two professionals. What stories did you come back with? How many good stories do you guys have from the weekend?

What stories did you come back with? How many good stories do you guys have from the weekend? So there was a moment before the Saturday nightcap, USA Canada, where my friends were at a bar and we went to Scout to go get food or see if we can get a proper American pregame. We walked down the block and I found a Hooters. I was like, oh, perfect. Do they have a Touch Tunes?

Now Touch Tunes in Canada, owned by a different company, so your app doesn't work, so you have to get cash to put it in. So I saddle up to the bar and I put in 20 Canadian dollars, which might as well, I think the exchange rate is like 3,000 American. And all I do is put American songs. I'm telling you, like Freebirds in there

like two dozen times. There was one point, and this was my mistake, I played After Party in the USA, the Star Spangled Banner. Oh boy. The entire Hooters turned against me. They knew what was happening. How'd they know it was you? I didn't, well.

And the Kachukchers. Well, when I started, yeah, me and the Kachukchers, he'd eat it up with all the other Panthers. It was actually a great unifier. There were two Tampa Bay Lightning fans behind me and they were like, yeah, good on ya. And so like the Canadians in the bar unplugged the touch tunes. The music just stopped.

It's Hooters, come on! Which is a shame because I was about to play Nickelback How You Remind Me to set them up just to hit them with Freebird one more time. Pow! But they had unplugged it and we wore out our welcome so we just met up everybody else at the bar. How's Hooters doing?

Well, that one, not as good as it could have been. But they definitely took all my money. I only got like, dude, I was like a third into my programming. It was incredible. Hooters hasn't gotten bankrupt? Hooters is awesome, man. I love Hooters. I love Hooters.

I'm not complaining. I'm just asking you. I would imagine in this day and age that they might struggle to survive. Why? I just don't see them anywhere. What? I don't see them.

There's Hooters on South Beach. They're everywhere. Just drive around. Hooters is still, thank God, an American institution. Hooters is tame compared to Instagram, to be honest with you. Yeah. There's Twin Peaks, so there's all sorts of competitors now.

At LeVittar's show. Put it on the poll. There's Twin Peaks, so there's all sorts of competitors now. At Levitard Show, put it on the poll. Is Instagram, what was the word you used, Bill? Hooters is tame compared to Instagram. Before you went to Hooters, like, blah, blah, boom. I also got like a- Now you go on Instagram. I had the weirdest response to, can I talk to your manager? I've ever received in my entire life.

All right? And I hope they're not listening. How often do you do this? Was this the other Touchtoons issue we had? No, so this was still at Hooters. I'm like, I know that the manager was feeling it because when I was playing Living in America, I saw him singing along.

Yeah. So, hey, can we, when the music stops, I'm like, hey, can we talk to your manager real quick? I wanna find out what happened with the music. I'm like, hey, did you stop the music? He's like, what are you talking about? I love the tracks. I'm like, well, the Touchtoons is off over there.

He's like, all right, let me do that. And I thank the waitress for putting us in contact. I'm like, hey, thank you so much. I'm going to tell them how great you are. She's like, don't do that. I'm suing him. What? Canada's different. Hooters. This is a message from sponsor Intuit Turbo Tax. Taxis was dealing with piles of paperwork and frustrating forms and then waiting and wondering and worrying if you were gonna get any money back. Now, taxes is easily uploading your forms to a TurboTax expert who's matched to your unique tax situation. An expert who's backed by the latest technology which cross-checks millions of data points for 100% accuracy. While they work on your taxes, you get real-time updates on

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were selling to that guy. The guy who wanted to pay me in foreign currency no interest over 36 months? Yeah no. Carvana gave me an offer in minutes picked it up and paid me on the spot. It was so convenient just like that Yeah, no hassle none That is super convenient sell your car to Carvana and swap hassle for convenience pick up fees may apply done libertar It's not my favorite rejoin Context needs to be applied over joke and what the context was applied We, uh, we'd like to rip that out of context. I was going for a thing.

And... You're gonna... I have a family. You're gonna pretend here that you don't love Matthew Kachuk more than you love anybody you've ever loved? I don't love Matthew Kachuk more than my daughter. Stugats! Now it's pretty damn close.

This is the Dan LeVatar Show with the Stugats. ["Stugats!" by Dan LeVatar plays in the background.] Chrisugats. Chris, since we're talking about music, I really didn't think I was going to get many more opportunities ever in my career to play the song that we're about to play. But over the weekend, there was a very long story that opened the door to us to play one of the best and happiest and pepiest songs ever made around here. Who's stomping around the dolphin facility? Topping up everybody he sees. Who's cracking skulls and stealing from rookies? Everyone knows it's Richie.

Who's eating nails and poisonous corals? Intimidating guys on his team Who stole my wife and broke my new glasses? Everyone knows it's Richie And Richie has monstrous thighs Be careful, he'll gouge your eyes Screams racial slurs at black guys But out of love But out of love Did any of you have time to read this story a deep deep dive where Jonathan Martin spends a year with the writer and the only thing that comes from it is the aggregation of he lied about being bullied during bully gate and now a lot

of people are trying to support Richie Incognito in retrospect who was Richie Incognito was one of the worst people in the history of the NFL, but he's taking a victory lap today, because what's getting aggregated is what he feels like is exoneration. Did you guys read this story? The writer spent a year with Jonathan Martin.

I did not read the story. I did not read the story. Billy said under his breath, what a waste of a year. I was kind of done with this story in 2018 when Jonathan Martin made criminal threats on social media. No laughing matter, posting guns, and it was bad, I believed he got charged for it. It was a bad situation.

I don't think there are any heroes here, I think to circle back and claim victory over one thing. I also don't necessarily think, I think maybe embellishments, but look, there's a lot of rotten behavior that we learned about that wasn't just around Jonathan Martin and Richie Incognito. When you think about the Asian victim

that was giving interviews at the time down through what happened several years later, it's just a shitty story. For it to be aggregated as Richie Incognito is like off the hook somehow for all of the truly heinous things he said and did, just because Jonathan Martin wants to reclaim his place within that story,

those two things are non-congruent. You don't have to believe that all of a sudden Richie Incognito is some good guy who we all turned our back on in a moment of need and he wasn't actually a bully just because Jonathan Martin at this point in his life doesn't want to view himself as a victim. Those are two separate things. Martin, when he did the Ted Talk that led the entree into that story, he didn't even mention this. I mean, that's the thing he's most famous or infamous for. Didn't even mention it in the entire Ted Talk. Now, Netflix is trying to do a story on this, a documentary, and Jonathan Martin, I've heard,

is not cooperating. You know the Dolphins would not cooperate, because that was a tremendous national black eye for them back when it happened. So yeah, it's I would I agree with Mike. There's no winners here May the story just go away because that was just a terrible time for all concern. Okay, but When somebody is doing this exhaustive a piece of work that Billy is saying is a giant waste of time of a piece of work that Billy is saying is a giant waste of time. Surely it's not lost on you guys that the white black of this, they get held up as avatars. The story doesn't matter, the names don't matter, the sports don't matter. It's all just arguing on the internet to say, see, there is something I can point to that the black guy did and here

I can exonerate the white guy. Right, as soon as things started getting aggregated, I kind of telegraphed where this was going, and I had zero interest. I understand that the writer did an exhaustive job that sounds exhaustive, spending a year with Jonathan Martin. There are a lot of exhausted journalism pieces

that I have no interest in reading. Had no interest in this one, kind of put that story to bed almost a decade ago. Okay, so given, I will tell everybody this, because perhaps you've noticed a general lightning of mood around here in terms of how it is that we've been doing the show for the last four months, at least in part, because I have pulled much of the politics

out of it, and temporarily, I just, I need a break from the fight and from feeling like I am losing as I'm being bombarded with a strategy of, yeah, sending people to camps on Guantanamo, that's like the ninth story that people care about today. There are planes turning over and whatever, just a million things happening. So I've tried unsuccessfully, largely, to avoid what's happening over the last six or seven weeks. It's impossible to avoid.

But I saw that the politics shows made their return here. John Oliver's team gets a really nice break. Bill Maher works really hard. And I saw that Kid Rock was on Bill Maher. And I did not know, this is not the most interesting of things here, but I was not aware, were you guys aware, that Kid Rock's name was Bob?

I did not know that Kid Rock's name was Bob. Yeah, we knew that because he was tight with Carson Daly during the TRL era. Okay, I didn't know it was Bob, and there's something about the word Bob that is funnier than Robert. Like if it was Robert, if his his name was Robert it wouldn't seem as Ridiculous to me as someone named Bob wearing the costume of someone named Kid Rock

Yeah, doesn't look like a Bob well his name is Robert is Bob This isn't I know but I go really William Guillermo's yes, I could be Bob art Oh, it could be now check it Robert James Richie Chris I think a Robert James and he has a tattoo that says Bob right here. Don't you too? I do too. So it's one of the things we have in common. Chris, I know that you came back from Canada rejuvenated

and creatively that you were inspired. So can you just make a quick song for me that makes fun of Kid Rock being named Bob. ["Rubber James Richie Richie says I'm Chuggy now Crump"] My name is Kid! Kid Bob! And this is for the Trust Fund boys with the answers The Orange Man and the Alleged Couch Romancer The Wall Street Geeks, Daddy New Car Dealers The Five Anchor Farm, Redneck Cultures Dealers

I'm Robert Rock, but you can call me Bob, the kid who appropriated trailer slobs So mega crackheads, the critics, the cynics, are buying into my political gimmicks For the flag as a puncher with the Super Bowl and my cyber truck is straight fueled with skulls My beer attack is my hate projects, fill my bank account and let me cash some checks And my focus group sent to hate Hollywood I resemble Dr. Phil with a wig and a hood Remember when I had the fake Senate run? I just want Donald Trump to call me son!

Bob call me Bob, my name is Robert James Richie Richie says I'm chugging up top home with a boogie Bob call me Bob, my name is Robert James Richie Richie says I'm chugging a cup, pop the boogie. Little faster next time, Chris. Little better, please. We have less politics now, yeah? We're back. I mean, that's not, that doesn't count.

Huh? It's a parody. It's a song, it's music. No, don't worry, we're doing both sides. We've given Trump credit for pennies, for paper straws, and for making the four nations so contentious because of his attack on Canada. So we're good, we've given him credit for stuff. Yeah.

Label of Trump was right one more time. I know we did that last week, but I think we've- Where Donald Trump was right, part two. I think people are starting to get it. Like, you know, we're doing less. We're sticking more to whatever it is that we stick to. This is not an echo to. It's not necessarily sports. This is not an echo chamber.

Did you guys think, because this was funny to see happen over the weekend as we're complaining about the basketball All-Star game, it is something between a statement and a flex for LeBron not to even put on the uniform for the team photo, right? I'll get in a second to LeBron talking about why it is that he wasn't playing in the game

and sounding like he's fumbling around searching for the excuse, but there aren't a lot of ways to defend that LeBron couldn't put on the uniform for a photo shoot. Are there? Are there people defending this that you can't... I don't know. Like, if Silver's begging these guys to please care, to please care about how any of this looks, just pretend like you care, not wearing the uniform for the team photo I thought it was great it's not caring forever yeah it was wonderful and and it's just exemplary of this event this what the NBA All-Star weekend has become

is complete trash LeBron James is bigger than the NBA the only player who is and for him not to be in uniform for this team photo, quote unquote, it's not even a team, why do they need a team photo, was ridiculous, joyfully ridiculous. I thought it was great. Good for LeBron. Good for LeBron. Yeah. Because? Because he's, he's, it's a middle finger to a ridiculous weekend of non-events. They need to just explode. Take a lesson from the NHL if you need to. They need to just explode their whole All-Star weekend. So this is the first time I've heard this take being given by anybody, where not only does he think it's great, he thinks it's great as a statement to just blow up the

entire game. Are you guys hearing that anywhere? Well, blow up All-Star weekend, okay? And do something like the NHL is doing to to make all-star weekend something that players look forward to Something that fans look forward to right now. It's it's I can't talk ill enough about What the NBA all-star weekend has become and what they've done with these three games now the space in between the games playing to 40 points It's a nightmare. it's a disaster. The NBA deserves every- This is twice you called it a nightmare. Lashing out at LeBron seems odd here.

We have a weird relationship right now with the NBA, and we're just mad at the NBA right now, so we're lashing out at LeBron, who's done more for the NBA than anybody. Be mad at Adam Silver, be mad at whoever. Going after LeBron right here seems odd. If I may, he's perpetuating one of the problems. The guy literally bailed like minutes before the game.

He could have had plenty of advance warning, someone else could have been on that roster. To me, it felt like a response to Adam Silver saying, hey guys, all right, look what happened last night, there's a property that has value, let's try to care a little bit more and then LeBron has the most obvious lie you can tell by his tells here with the shoulder shrug and the um listen to LeBron James as he tries to come up with an excuse on the fly as to why he's not playing in the All-Star game. You won't

see anything for me tonight unfortunately I would not be in uniform tonight still dealing with ankle and foot discomfort, I would not be in uniform tonight. Still dealing with ankle and foot discomfort, so I will not be playing tonight, unfortunately. The bobblehead tell from LeBron gets me every single time. You wanna give him credit for nuking this? I say, I look at him, I'm like, you're part of the problem, pal. But Jeremy has another theory here

that I think might actually change my tune. I've never been more sure that LeBron is retiring after next season. That this was his moment to nuke what this All-Star weekend was. To not give them the opportunity for the photo ops where you see his placement within that photo. People would have been cropping in on him, Steph and KD as their All-Star moment together. He didn't want to give anyone the photo shoot. He didn't want to give anyone the optics. dropping in on him, Steph and KD as their all-star moment together. He didn't want to give anyone the photo shoot. He didn't want to give anyone the optics.

He didn't want to give the all-star weekend any narratives that people could glom onto. Oh, the Olympic guys are back together. This was his moment to tank this one so that next year as he goes on a retirement tour and you see guys like Yanannis on Twitter sort of floating the idea of, oh, maybe I'll do the dunk contest. John Marant saying the same thing. The All-Star Game comes back as LeBron's final quote unquote gift to the NBA even though

he was part of what ultimately tanked the All-Star Game. He gets to be the hero because he tanked this weekend's All-Star game Conspiracy theory I can get behind I can get behind that one that one sounds good Yeah This was an act of defiance that he didn't want the optics of being associated with anything that he knew would be a mess So he would not bother to dress up in any way and be a part of the charade and don't forget It's Steph's weekend. They're hosting in the Bay Area. This is a celebration of Steph. He's running sidecar at the very least He's going to the party politely

He's showing up because he must it's part of his employment contract But he he separated himself that this was a victory for LeBron not being associated with this was a victory, right? I mean, can we not excuse the behavior? Part of why it's become what it is Biggest problem is the stars not playing and you're literally in an all-star game They're they're asking for you to pay for tickets to see all the stars and minutes before LeBron's got a foot ankle Oh, I guess soreness like this is the issue He could have actually had someone who wanted to be there be there

Like that's the part about it. That's kind of like annoying is that like yeah, you don't want to be there No one really wants to be there But like you're taking the level of I don't want to be there to the next level and you're actually costing people who want to Be their opportunity if his ankles really hurt you guys sound like jerks though Okay. Yeah, why would the oldest player in the league, why would he have any body elements with more mileage? Oh, because his body's aging like the rest of everyone else's bodies. This is so disrespectful.

Charlie McEvoy is in the hospital. Okay, so I just want what I want, and Billy's been beaten down by the Stugats experience here over the last couple of weeks, but I would say that Billy, if you say after Mike that LeBron is part of the problem you have to remember and have echoing in your ears that Mike Ryan came in strong after a fiery weekend of drinking the real stuff hockey and he said you're

part of the problem pal he put an extra pal on the end of that and you need to get better at your pal pal