The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - South Beach Sessions - Guenther Steiner

Episode Date: April 12, 2024

Max Verstappen, Lewis Hamilton, and Charles Leclerc may be the ones on the podium, but Guenther Steiner is THE breakout star of Drive to Survive, the hit Netflix series chronicling Formula 1 racing… and, no, he swears he hasn’t seen it. Now an ambassador for this year’s Miami Grand Prix, Guenther opens up about his nearly four decade career in motorsports and how he led teams by tapping into the cultures of All-American NASCAR and the world of Formula 1. Guenther bluntly shares how things ended for him with Team Haas, why he was more than ready to move on and happiest when taking on the next challenge. While the biggest party in the world will be happening at Miami Grand Prix May 3 - 5th, Guenther can’t help but giddily ask Dan Le Batard about the craziness of Miami in the 80s. Get your tickets to an unforgettable experience, the Formula 1 Crypto.com Miami Grand Prix 2024 at F1MiamiGP.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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SAB, the CV. Copyright 2024. Proximo. Jersey City, New Jersey. Please drink responsibly. Welcome to South Beach Sessions. We've got nearly four decades of motorsports in the room with us. I'm excited about this one because a lot of people say this man has a lot of similarities to me, so I'm eager to find out what they are.

I assume that he's got some workaholic tendencies. Gunther Steiner is more than a decade now Haas F1 team principal for more than a decade. And now you're the ambassador for the Formula One Crypto.com Miami Grand Prix. I can't believe how big this thing has gotten. I can't believe that Miami is such a big part of what it is that you're doing and I just want to talk to you about your origin story, how it is that you came to be involved with any of this and how it dominates your life a little bit. So thank you for being with us. Thanks for

having me. Looking forward to it Dan. Can you tell us a little bit just early years because in reading about you I found very little about what your entrance point was to this sport, what the roots were of you getting into speed and the construction of what has become a giant sport internationally. I wanted to keep that for me so I can make a book in 10 or 20 years when I have no income anymore anymore so at least I can keep on making a living. The secrets? Yeah, the secrets, yes. But they, no, without joking. I mean my career was, I always loved cars as a kid, you know, when I was a boy, I loved cars and where I come from is in the mountains of Northern Italy, you know,

there is no car racing, there is skiing, ice hockey, whatever you want, but no car racing. So I always begged my father, there was one race, a climber, and begged him every year to go to that one and just had that passion, watched F1 racing on TV, you know, on black and white TV, and just was always interested in. And you know, I like cars, so I did an apprenticeship as a mechanic when I was young, but always loved racing cars. No idea where, family, no history, nothing. And I had to do my national service at the time you had to in Italy. And after that one, I just saw in a Motorsport magazine a posting for a job as a mechanic in Belgium, which was about a thousand miles away from my hometown, you know Belgium.

And at the time, times were different. That was in the mid-80s. And I got the job. I don't know why they took me. And there where it started. And I just worked my way through, I would say, not even up. I just worked it through. And from one opportunity, the next one came along. And somehow I ended up to live in the United States 18 years ago. No, no, hold on a second. Let me slow you down. How do you become a mechanic in Belgium? Like, explain to me. It's not just, so you're watching black and white television. You're fascinated by fast cars because your life seems far away from whatever it is that's happening inside your television set. Correct. Yeah, absolutely. And you're, how old are you?

I started about 12 years old, 11, 12 years old. And so you're deciding you're gonna become a mechanic in Belgium a thousand miles away? That was when I was 20. I decided to become involved in cars by being a car mechanic. Because you like to fix things? Yeah, I like to fix things. I like cars, mainly because I like cars. Because? Where did that start? I don't know. That was in me, in the jeans. Not in the jeans, because my family didn't have this liking. It just, I was born like this.

Did they understand it? Did your family understand your fascination, the desire to make a career out of this, the decision to move away, to become someone who did this in Belgium? No, I think they supported because by then, when I moved to Belgium, my father passed away already. He died early, unfortunately.

No, but it was never... You know, in these days, people have a career plan, planning, what do I want to do when I'm growing up? I never had this, I just always did what I like to do It's very weird to say you know and I like to work with cars and work with cars the opportunity came up I applied to a post on a magazine to be a race car mechanic I got the job you know and that is what I did, but I didn't start at 11 I want to get there.

My life was, what do I do tomorrow? What I like to do, because I don't want to do something I don't like to do, and I still don't. Well, where did that come from? Because I know with me, it came from watching my father come home every night complaining about work, complaining about his boss, and when my mother would ask me at the dinner table,

what do you want to do for a living? I didn't have a direct answer. I just said, I don't want to complain about my work. I want to like what it is that I do. I want to make sure that I'm happy when I do it. And my father responded through a laugh. Good luck with that. Good luck. It's out, but it's one of the keys to happiness is finding something that you're spending that much time doing that you enjoy doing it. The majority of the life you spend working, you know, and if you don't enjoy it, you know, it's, it's, you know, it's, it's not, it's not enjoyable.

I mean, obviously, you know, no, I don't think it came from there because my, my parents, they had a bunch of shop together, you know, that their own business. So they seem to be a pretty happy in what they were. And maybe I saw it there. They were happy to have their own business. And I just wanted to do something what made me happy. Not butcher shop though. No, no, that was not my dream.

No, that was not my dream. You looked at butcher shop and you said that is... That's not my future. No, that's not my future. I want to do something different. And my parents were very good with me. I could do not what I wanted. I would like to have done what I wanted,

but then maybe I wouldn't be here anymore. But you know how that works out, you know, when you're young. No, but they always supported me and they said, you need to do what you like to do. And you are almost always happy doing what you do? The reason I ask the question is because I've heard you interviewed saying that a lot of your job is delivering bad news and a lot of your job is getting people convincing people to say yes and I would think that

most people don't understand the bad parts of your job the responsibilities that you have had that have made the job difficult even though you love what you do but I still love to do because in the end, what you love is getting the result out of it, to do something, to move forward, to move something forward, not just getting by. But when you move something, when you want to move something forward,

you have to deliver bad news. You cannot always agree to everything because then you don't move because then you make everybody happy, but maybe you have no result because everybody happy doesn't mean that you have a fantastic result you know as a leader you need to lead and part of it is to have good news bad news you know and normally it's bad news but as long as you give them the way forward they become good news. What have you learned

about leading like how did you become how does one go from a mechanic to a leader? I had various jobs in my career and it didn't start that I had to run companies to three, five hundred people. I started off, you know, you go away. When I did rallying, that was my first job in motorsport. You know, in the good old days, you were given a rally car, You know, in the good old days, you were given a rally car, some money, some cash money, because there was no credit card, no telephone or nothing, and said, you go and track him, because the track in rallying was like the driver went around and took the base notes, you know, how he has to go with the co-driver. But you were on your own.

You know, you were responsible for a car, another mechanic, and to make this a successful event, you know, and that is where you learn to think on your own, to stand on your own feet, and just to get by any situation which comes along. And the message normally was, don't call me up, because if you call me up, you've got a problem. I don't want to hear about problems. You are there. You are paid to solve problems, you know. And, you know, I think I'm pretty good in solving problems or walk through them, not sorting, and walk through them. And I think that's where I learned to manage people, to manage situations, to manage problems. Was it more enjoyable, smaller? I wouldn't say so. I mean, you know, at some stage you say it's enjoyable but you need

to scale it up. You need to try to do more and better to have ambition, you know, and you always want to grow. And you know, I started at a pretty good level in motorsports. It was a world championship already, you know, so I worked through that one and when the opportunity came up to go to Formula One, I took it. When you say growth, you want the opportunity for growth. You are of an age approaching 60. Now, are you talking about personal growth or when you're talking about ambition, you're talking about professional growth. I want to continue to grow, conquer, win, go faster, be and be more professionally?

Or are you also talking about personally there? No, I think it's a mix of the two. One cannot go without the other. If you professionally grow, you need to grow as a person as well, in my opinion. Oh, I just mean that sometimes to be as successful as you've been, it comes at the cost of life balance, of being at home, of being with your family or growing introspectively as a man who might want other things from life and spirituality in something more than racing

or conquering business success or some of the things that feed the male ego, feed the ego in general. Feed the ego, yeah, I understand now what you mean. You know, I think for me it's like, I try to keep a balance. I don't have outside of my work and my family, I haven't got a lot, I don't mean materialistic. I don't have a lot of hobbies. I don't be, I'm not a big socialite because my socializing happens in my work environment because again, I go back because I like what I do. I would think that if you're like me all of your friends are from work all of

them. Absolutely or at some stage they were from work you know because I don't know any you don't know you know very little other because you're spending so much time in it because it's it's it's like a hobby which has become a job. Oh but you can't be as good as you are without having been totally consumed by it. There are too many people trying to take it from you. Yeah, but I mean, you keep... If somebody wants to take it, have at it, you know?

I mean, that's my, I'm not finding it. I'm just saying the world you're working in is so competitive. Yeah, yeah. And to stay on top of it requires, you can't half-ass it. No, no, no, no, and I never do. And one of my thing is like, I do always my best. I try to do my best.

I always give my best. Even here, I try to give my best. I don't know if it is good enough or not, but at least I can look in the mirror and say, I tried my best. There is not more in it, you know, because I think everybody has got a limit in talent and knowledge and

intelligence and but as long as you are happy with yourself, I tried my best, it was good enough, it takes you further. If that is your limit, there you will stay, but it's fine, you know, no regret. I mean, that's why I said I never had this ambition to be a team principal in F1. I didn't start up off at 15 years, I want to be a team principal. It happened. I do the job I do today, a scooter said they're done the job yesterday and a scooter said going to do the job tomorrow.

What comes out we will see. But that is not the, I don't have the end goal. I want to be this, that and the other. You never have? You never have? There's never been a path, on your path your choices have presented themselves and then you've either said yes or no. You've never dreamt of what it is that it was gonna be No Absolutely. I mean I always said if it if it works fine if it doesn't work fine as well I will find you know, this is the old story one door closed. No one opens

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Your family has What relationship with how consuming the job is, how often the job takes you away. Has your family known anything else other than a job that takes you away? No, and that is actually because when I got married in 1994, I was already that guy which was traveling a lot. And I think that that is a good thing now for me because they don't know any different. So my wife, I'm still with my wife which I married in 94. We have got 30 years anniversary this year.

And it's actually, you say it's a long time but I think if I would have started doing what I did or what I'm doing in the last 10 years, it's very difficult to last because it's like you're away a lot. My daughter is 15, she turned 15 last week. She now is very happy that I'm home a little bit more because obviously I was away 14 years of her life almost and she knew about, and she could deal with it, but she is happy in the moment that I'm at home, because I told her yesterday morning,

I took her to school, and I said, I'm going away tonight, and I said, oh, you're going away again, and I said, yeah, but it's only for two nights, you know, and back on Friday, she said, yeah, but I'm now used having you at home. Well, did you struggle at all? Did this have anything to do with you leaving Haas? Or are you deciding some of the things, some of the choices that you made as

it related to her teenage years? Do you want to be home a little bit more because you only get one chance at these particular years? Now, when you're working in a team principal job in F1, you're consumed by it. You are not seeing anything outside. You have got tunnel vision. You just see end of the tunnel, nothing else, and you take all this away. Now that I'm out, I realized that it was a good thing that I can spend more time with her, for her and for me, you know, because you get better bond.

Because before I sometimes was away two, sometimes even three weeks consecutive, which is a long time. But when you're in the job, you know, you're so focused on the job that you forget about that. This is what I'm telling you though, when I ask you about personal growth, when I ask you about the nature of how consuming competitive sports have to be expensive, especially something this expensive, this pressurized and, and how you have to be obsessive compulsive in a way that even when you are

home, you might not be able to be thinking that I'm home because you're always, always revving, never stopping your mind and it would get in the way of personal growth. I would imagine it would get in the way of becoming anyone other than the person who's a conqueror at work. Yeah I think you could be right but when you are in it you don't, I didn't realize it you know you don't realize it and obviously and that is what I say now because people said how you feel not being in

this. I said first of all I'm still around in Formula One because I do different jobs but I can see now my field of vision has got a lot bigger. I see things which before I didn't see while I was in it because as you said, you were focused so much and you have got so much on your plate every day, every hour, every minute, that you don't really think about and if you think about it, you take them aside.

You don't want to deal with them. It's okay, it's okay, you know. How do you handle stress? How were you not being overwhelmed by just the amount of responsibilities that kept piling up on you? I've got one fortune. I sleep very well, you know. And even under stress situations, I can still sleep. So and that helps you a lot because then when you have slept and when you're ready again you've got the energy back you can sort situations which put you under stress.

You get under stress if four different situations which come and you need to work on and that is how I do it. You work from a place of inspiration? Sure, there is some inspiration as well, yeah, absolutely. The thing I'm asking you, right, when you say you wake up refreshed, you go into work on the most fulfilling days feeling what? Happy for the challenges? Because you, the way that you describe what you do for a living it's almost an endless source of happiness even if there are challenges that would make someone else unhappy. Most of the time yes last year I start

to struggle a little bit with that one to be positive about because for me any challenge is an opportunity you know you get up in the morning you've got obviously you have got problems to sort but okay I'm gonna sort them. That is what I want to do today. I want to get rid of Of what? The challenge is you know Sometimes maybe last year I got the situations I couldn't get out of it because I didn't have the solution because it it it was above me

It wasn't me the problem, you know, I couldn't sort it, you know, so that frustrates but you still, I still didn't, don't give up. I still push and try to do my best. How hard was it to leave Haas? How hard was it to leave? It was absolutely not hard for me in the end when Gene Haas told me not to extend my contract, I was okay and as I said it before now, I should have left a year before, because it was for me, in my opinion, the way to nowhere. Because there was not the backing of the owner of the finances to go and challenge the better teams. I could have worked another five years to run seven, eight, nine in the championship.

I didn't want to do that anymore. I have done that, got the D-shirt, want to move on. I want to be better. I want to compete with people out there, you know. But if you have got one arm behind your back, you cannot do it. Can you explain to us, explain to the people who might not know in layman's terms, the general expense involved in this sport and what you're talking about when you say one arm tied behind your back because I don't think people understand quite how expensive a sport this is? Yes, it's multi-hundred million dollar business, a team to run a team, and big teams, they've got 800 people on staff. We had 200.

The money, there is a budget cut in Formula One now, but it's not that people look at the budget cut and say, everyone's got the same. Yeah, you've got the same operation, what you can spend over the year, but you can make investments to make your cost base lower you know and I couldn't do that so you're not fighting with the same weapon you know you're going with the knife to gunfight you know basically what we did and it's it's it's a big sport that you just need to keep up with your neighbors and all the teams all the other nine teams they invested heavily and we didn't, you know.

But explain to me, without any indictment of anyone, what, what spend heavily means, what the care for a car, when you say the difference between 800 employees and 200 employees, that's one thing, but just simply getting a car to run the way that you wish for it to run competitively. All of these things cost enormous amounts of money. Yeah, there is budgets between, I call it between 180 million and 300 million for the foreign F1 team. And when you're running and governing the finances of that and you're making the daily decisions on how to correctly do that, what prepares you to do that correctly?

What prepares you to lead 200 people correctly? Even if it's just 200 people and they're outmanned because you're like, they have 800 people over there. Experience. It's down to have it done before, you know, that what it is. It's one of these things that there is no school you can go because there is ten team principals in the world, ten F1 teams, you know. It's just experience and you have done it before.

Sometimes you've got the opportunity to get in there and do it and prove that you can do it. It's just that one. Do you have one of the jobs along the path that you remember as the happiest of the times that you were in your life doing what it is that you're doing, even though you're telling us that you always choose things that you like to do, because some of them had to turn out to look differently than you thought that they did when you were choosing them. Yeah, the happiest.

As I said before, I was pretty happy all the time. So it's not like that I say it was... In racing, happiest you are when you win. That makes you happy. I mean, that was why you do it. Even if the other situations are bad, but if you have winning and having success, achieving the results you want to achieve, then you are happy. Even at Hasa, I was very happy. Because in the beginning, when we started, our aim was to finish in the points as a new team because

nobody else has done it and we achieved all them goal posts, you know, so we have done that. I was happy we won in WRC, we won World Championship races, you know, it was happy times. But in general I was always, you know, you've got always the unhappiness, but that, as I said before, it's a challenge, but it's an opportunity. You make the best out of it and you get happy again. It's in your own hands and in your own brain to make you happy if you have got the opportunity. But you had to figure that out at some point along the path, right? You have to figure out at some point

very clearly with clarity what it is you want and then after that when you say that happiness is a choice, once you've chosen it, you've just resigned yourself to no matter what comes, I'm going to be grateful for what I've chosen and I'm going to make it work because at my heart I start as a mechanic. I'm going to fix things. Yeah, absolutely and that is what I always did. For example, I have my own company with a business partner in North Carolina, a composite company with over 200 people employed.

I started in 2009. It was a difficult time because the crisis, the economic crisis was here and I started the company knowing that it will be difficult but we made it a success, not me. I cannot do anything alone. I always have people around me, you know, which help me to do things. But it's again, there is a vision and you make it possible and you try the best to get there. And that is the same like in racing. I mean, because I started with a business plan written up on my kitchen table, call it like this, you

know, and went around to find an investor because I don't have the money to start an F1 team, obviously, and found an investor which invested in it. But there was a business plan and I think I made it successful in the beginning when it was done like the business plan was written, you know, and the success was not winning races because you need to be realistic. You cannot go to Formula One as a newbie and beat Ferrari or Mercedes. It's just not going to happen. You're dreaming. And you need to be realistic with your goals and also the people which work for you, you need to give them realistic goals otherwise they're not motivated. If

you tell them you need to do something unrealistic, they give up after six months because they say, this guy is a clown, you know. But that's what I did. We were very good in the first three years. We finished fifth in the world championship in the third year. That didn't ever happen before. When did you get good, how did you get good at getting people to say yes?

How are you convincing an investor that something you drew up in your kitchen that may or may not work is worth however much the investment required? I think first of all sometimes you need to get a little bit luck as well, you know, but you know you make your own luck. You go to people which you think can have the passion to do this and at the time going into F1 was not a good business decision. Now it is, you know, because it turned around because of the United States, the popularity of F1. And it is like, I don't know, but when you get good, that people say, yes, I don't think you never get good. You just need to keep on trying. And I think you can also,

oh, I'm good in convincing people. I think I wouldn't call me that one. That would be, in my opinion, almost arrogant. Okay. It could be arrogant, but clearly you know something about motivating people. Clearly you know some things about how to convince people that whether it's through your passion or your vision that you're worth following. So you might not want to appear arrogant, but it appears to be a skill you have. You didn't happen your way. Yes, you're telling me, well, I just keep trying. I keep trying and some people say no, but I will get some yeses in a kitchen. What were you asking for in that kitchen?

What was the business plan? What was the investment you were asking for? I think it was 50 million or something like this, you know? And you went around and you got one person to say yes. You're saying, so that's the lucky part, but a lot of people said no before the one person said yes? Yeah a few people said no but also I was not under pressure to make this happen. I was having a day job running my own company you know and just did this one on the side. But I think

when you're trying to come or not convinced to say yes, go back to your yes, I think the yes bar comes when you can explain something because you know it. If people ask you, and I think the investor said yes, because I could explain how I'm gonna do it. You know, if you just go and sell something and you don't know what you're talking about, I wouldn't even go there, because I know it's a non-starter.

You need to be, what you said, the passion, the knowledge, and explain how you're going to do it. That's what it comes to. And then you get the SS. If you just say, I'm going to do this, and you cannot explain it, how you're going to do it, good luck with that one. All right. Well, good luck with this one.

Explain to me how you go from mechanic in Belgium to $50 million. That was a side business. It was something, it was a little thing on the side. Take me through the journey, the path of how it is that that happens. I'm going to do something on the side. I'm going to go in my kitchen and I'm going to see if on the side, I ask someone for $50 million. How do you go there?

I think it's just like it's life. I mean I went to life in motorsport. I got to know a lot of people, a lot of very good people, you know, very knowledgeable people. I tried to learn from them. I tried because some people you cannot get as good as them. I'm fully aware of that one, you know, but I try to get always to learn of any situation in life I do. And then all of a sudden you get there. But you're competing against people

who have whole legacies in this sport whose families have passed all of this down, who have a giant advantage over somebody who's just appearing and learning the sport. I don't know then how it happened. Okay. Okay, all right. Because I. I'm lucky then, good dog. You lived it, well no, but that's not, come on.

That's not, you can be falsely modest and you can. I try to be modest, but I think I just work my way through it. I mean, it's like, I always did, as I said before, I always try to do my best and maybe I'm good in doing some things and that for my success, you know, I must have been good at something. Otherwise I wouldn't be sitting here with you. What people wanna follow you, do they not?

Like you have noticed this, at some point, you don't think that that's a skill. To lead people is a skill, it is a learned skill to get people to follow, to get people to believe in the things that you believe, to build teams. Like this is all, all of these things, these are not lucky things. No, no, you need to be at the right place at the right time

and you need to have skills, obviously, but I said to you, I worked my way through over decades of doing racing cars, you know, so I learned a lot of skill and we need also to go back, Formula One, or racing cars 40 years ago was not what it is now, it was a very basic industry. So I was lucky enough to get in at the right time and while the industry grew, I grew with it. You know, so it's easier to learn about it than when you get into something which is fully developed. You know, that's my opinion

anyway about how it works. You know, if you're on the bandwagon in the beginning, you go with it, you learn it, you know, you get to know the people which will be the future leaders, you know, you know them, you have got relationships with them, you are part of them, you know, and you just move up with there and you always be honest about things, you behave professionally, honestly, and people will respect that, and then people will give you opportunities, and when the opportunities come, I never hesitated to take it,

knowing that I take a risk, but I'm not afraid taking a risk. Always, like you're somebody who doesn't do a lot of fear with risk, is that something you've always been, or you pride yourself on that? Yeah, I always was happy to take risk, you know. Knowing that there could be, you know, at the other end,

something bad happening, but it's like, okay, I was always confident about that I would get it done, you know, that's why I took the risk. Oh, but I think a lot of people don't do things out of fear all the time, because risk and consequences are something that make people not move. I'm not afraid of consequences. I deal with them.

You know, that is how I see it. You know, obviously I know there is risk and if risk, but you know, there's also opportunity. If you want to move forward, you need to take risk. Are you for free? Are you just generally a positive person? Right? just generally a positive person, right? Like if, if where you see, if you look at challenge and can turn it into opportunity at every turn, you're doing something philosophically,

I don't know if it's spiritual or not, but philosophically you are doing something to make your life positive as you experience. Every challenge is, well, this is an opportunity. Not everyone can. I'm very much like this, you know, for me, every challenge is, well, this is an opportunity. Not everyone can... I'm very much like this, you know. For me, I would charge an opportunity. You know, there is like, I will get this okay,

and otherwise I will just do something, do it differently. But I would say, work business-wise, I'm pretty, you know, positive about how to move forward. Drive to Survive portrayed you as not necessarily looking happy, right? Yeah, but that's in the heat of the moment where it portrays me. In general, I'm a pretty happy person. I'm sometimes, as much as I'm extrovert here, I can be very introvert when I'm on my own, you know,

and just thinking through things. I take my time to think through things, because obviously when you see on my own, you know, and just thinking through things. I take my time to think through things, because obviously when you see it on TV, they just give you the moments when you've got action going on. But I can sit back and think things through, and I sometimes just take thinking time, you know, because there is things I need to, problems I need to solve, decisions to make,

and sometimes you just need time, just sit down, think them through and then come to the conclusion. And that's what I do. Pete Slauson What did you think watching yourself on Drive to Survive? What did you think was happening with how you were being presented to the world in a huge growth opportunity for you in the sport and next thing you know you're taking pictures in airports and people have your picture your face on their t-shirts and all of a sudden you're a bit of a celebrity in ways that you probably didn't expect. I didn't watch myself on Netflix. Is that right? Yeah that's right I didn't watch it and I didn't watch it. When it came out, there was a screening in London

and the day after there was a F1 Commission meeting where the team principals, the FIA president, the CEO of F1 meeting together four times a year and I didn't go to the screening. I walked into this meeting and everybody was like, what is going on here? You know, all the president had something to say, you know, and you know, it was like, and I, I was like, almost bumped out because I didn't know what they showed,

you know, I had no idea because I didn't see it. And then obviously by talking, they showed, and they showed us a small trailer, 20 seconds of it. And partly was me, you know, and I said, at that moment I decided I'm not gonna watch it, because I was not afraid, I didn't want to see myself, you know, because they were just talking about this,

and I just, guys, I've had enough of this, I mean. And also I didn't, or I don't watch it, and didn't watch it, I don't want to see myself and maybe thinking I should be different, and then trying to be an actor actor because I'm not an actor. I'm not working in Hollywood. I'm doing a job. If I watch myself, I know myself, then all of a sudden maybe I wouldn't change as a person

but when I see a camera, I maybe try to change. Then what you do, you spend energy trying to be somebody who you are not. Then it gets very inconsistent who you are. So I said, I do not watch it, you know. And actually was, when I went home, my wife obviously watched it. And what I hear, I was swearing quite a bit, apparently. So I was like, I go home now.

I will get the opinion of my wife, which will not be great, you know. So she didn't say anything. I didn't ask anything and we left it at that. Get out of here. It's still undiscussed. You don't know what her appraisal is of your cursing. I believe this is a world record for you for amount of public time spent without cursing.

I believe you. No, I'm very, I'm very, I'm very well behaved. Every time a microphone, I've got the switch on off. There's nothing in between. It's either on off, off you know because you could not it's the same like when you're acting or being you there's nothing in between okay well I've got a number of follow-up questions first of all take me into the mental space that you're in when you're this person who was who resonated with

American audiences who's living up he's living in the red in those moments that are so pressurized where it's, everything's coming down on you. We have to be faster than everybody. I'm a maniac. I have to be a bit of a competitive maniac here. Yeah, no. And when I go racing or something like this, I can

get very upset very quick. You know, I take a lot in, but, uh, and that is, I think the competitive spirit in me, that is what drives me as well. You know, but I'm not always like this. I start on a normal day. I, I, I. It's there. It's no, it's, you couldn't be always like this. You would, you wouldn't have the energy to be, you can only visit this space.

This is a space where you visit and you spend. That's the passion which takes me there. That's the passion which takes me there for what I do and what I work for and who I work for as well. It also makes you feel more alive, right, than anything? Like, yeah. You get rid of your frustrations. At least I'm done with it and I'm never afraid if I offend something in my hands,

which happens sometimes, I know that. I'm never afraid to apologize for it, you know, because it happens. It is not meant malicious or to hurt somebody. I don't want to hurt anybody. You know, you don't want to know what your wife thinks about, about how you came off to the world, how the man she loves. And I I'm sure she recognizes the man who is

over there, but at home as well, by the way, I'm not denying that one. So I'm not in denial of that one because otherwise if you got a task, uh, she would say, yeah, he can get query very upset at home as well. You know, if something goes wrong, regardless that your wife would not tell you, cause she, she has an opinion. She has an opinion of how it is that you absolutely. I mean, she has an opinion on everything and it that you absolutely, I mean, she has an opinion on everything and it's a wife, you know, so, but

that you don't know. It is what I'm saying that you don't want to know. I don't need to know. I don't want to know. You understand why I find that funny though. Right here is a combination of things. It's your work.

You care about it very much. It's how your work is being presented to the world. It's the woman who loves you and has a great many friends who are now seeing the man that she sees when he's rabid at home and perhaps the appraisal is a bit of, of lunatic in him. I don't want to know what she thinks. And I think the other people in the family don't tell me because they don't want to get the reaction from me, what't tell me because they don't want to

get the reaction from me what they tell me you know so no your daughter doesn't have any opinions on this oh yeah oh yeah she's got an opinion but it she keeps it as well very you swear a lot on tv that you know but we never discussed it you know we didn't have a family meeting about it you know no everybody stays away from it why you being number one to stay away from it not that you know, no, everybody stays away from it. Why do you? Being number one to stay away from it, not that. You are number one, you don't even wanna know. What? It never happened, it never happened for me, you know, it's something, it isn't there.

Well you don't have very much interest in the fame portions of this, right? It doesn't, it's not anything for you. It's not anything, no, it doesn't do anything for me. I mean, it's obviously, you know, I wrote a book. I mean, but it's not like that I woke up one morning, I want to write a book because I want to be famous. No, I was approached to write a book.

And the meaning I said, no, I'm not gonna write a book because of that reason, I'm not gonna spend any time write a book. So the guy came back to me, let's write a book. I want to write a book. So he sends me another email. The guy was persistent. Speak about this and this guy,

I wrote the book for them, you know, with them, you know. Okay, so one of them is an ex-racing driver which I know very well. It happens two days later I run into the guy, you know, I see the guy five times a year, two days later, hey, did you work with this writer? Yeah, yeah, how is he? He's cool, you will have fun. I said, okay, let's speak with this guy, you know yeah. How is he? Oh, he's cool. You will have fun. I said, okay, let's speak with this guy. At least I speak with him, you know.

Because the guy tried hard, you know, and I respect people. You appreciated the persistence. Exactly, exactly. I speak with the guy, I take a phone, and then we said, what do you want to write? I said, I'm not gonna write a biography. No, no, we write something different, he said. We write your diary next year.

I said, how you know that something happens next year? I mean, how can you, you know, it's like, it could be the most boring year of our life. No, no, it will not be. All right. How do you know? I don't know. He persisted. At some stage, I got on with the guy so well, let's write a book, you know. So we wrote, we wrote the book and it came out very good. I think credit to him because he understands my thinking, how I do things, you know, and that is how it happened. But back to fame, I didn't do it to get famous.

I just did it because I like to do it. It's the same, they said, Gunther, you need to do the audio book yourself. I said, well, I don't want to do an audio book, you know, read your own book or you need to do it. Okay, a lot of people don't do it. Okay, if a lot of people cannot do it, I'm gonna do it, you know, it's a challenge, you know.

Went in there and did that in three days. It was hard work, something I didn't imagine that it was this hard, but again, I keep on challenging myself on things, you know. If some people say, you cannot do it, that doesn't mean I'm gonna do it, you know. So it's all things like this, that is how I do things. What did you think was interesting about the book?

Not the process of it, but what you gave to the people of yourself. What did you yourself find interesting? I find interesting, I gave them... It is a book, it is fun, but it tells a true story. It's all true, you know, it's fun, I think, to read, because I read it when I did the audiobook the first time. And I think it just gives people that they can enjoy themselves. If somebody likes racing cars or Formula One,

you can enjoy themselves. That, I think, is nice. I give them something they like to read. I mean, for sure there's people which don't like the book because it isn't the technical book of Formula One, but do not read it if you don't like it. But what was beyond, you know, giving into the persistence of an author, the reason that you chose to reveal whatever it is that you chose to reveal in terms of leadership principles or stories or what your wisdoms are that aren't

technical wisdoms necessarily, but just your... you wanted to share portions of your life with people and so I'm asking you when you present this book written by somebody else with you and you're proud of this book, what in that book do you think is interesting as someone who lived this life? What's your answer to that question? I think the interesting thing is to show people what you're doing as a team principal. I think you read some of the things in the book, or at least somebody told you what is in there. It just shows you what you have to do.

But nothing in particular that I want to give a message or something, I wanted to create entertainment for people having a good time. I like, you know, if people read the book and have a good time by reading it. And a lot of people, I think, have done it because a lot of people told me that they like the book, you know. And I think that is success for me, you know, not on a personal level, in general, you know, for the people, you know, for the people. If you have... I respect anybody who gives me something where I'm entertained.

Why do you think that you resonated in Drive to Survive? What do you think about you it is that connected with people? And you haven't seen it, so... Right, I was going to... So it might be hard for you to answer that question. Hard because I can just imagine because I was me, but I don't know how the other ones did it. You know, it was not about me to show,

it was about Formula One. So I don't know why people pointed at me more than other people, because I haven't seen it, how other people did it. So you know. I would imagine it's because you're real, I would imagine it's because you're real. I would imagine it's because you're human and, and it's not, no, it's not staged and not edited.

Not, you don't seem to be, you don't seem to be careful with, or care. You don't seem to know you're being watched. No, I don't care about it. I mean, in a positive way, I don't care. You know, it's not, not because I don't care. You can take in a few ways,. No, I don't care about it. I mean, in a positive way, I don't care. You know, it's not, not because I don't care. You can take it a few ways. You know, I don't care.

It's being careless. I'm not careless, but I don't care. You know, it's not important to you. It's not important. You know who you are. You know where authenticity is important to you. You know who you are in competitive moments. The people who work for you, the people who love

you, the people who respect you know who you are in competitive moments, the people who work for you, the people who love you, the people who respect you, know who you are. And as long as you have their respect and understanding, what difference does it make what somebody out there thinks of what you're doing? I even think if people don't like it, how I behave, I'm okay. I don't do anything to anybody in a good way, you know? If you don't like me, I respect that.

You're entitled not to like what I do. You're fully entitled and I have no problem with that. Have at that, you know? It's like, I'm good with it. I've not done anything bad to you. So I don't feel good. It's a good way to live though. It's a good, if you'd, it's easy to say,

I don't care what others think. But it doesn't sound like you care very much what people who you don't necessarily know and respect think about anything. Exactly, I don't judge, you know, I try not to judge, we all judge a little bit I think, but I don't try not to judge other people. I mean as long as you know sometimes, you know, for me an example is the book. Some people say the book is not good because it's not about Formula One. It's, okay, I'm okay with that. I mean, I don't take any offense, you know?

I'm not gonna get upset about it. You know, I give you a bit of advice, don't read it. Because if I start the book, and after 10 pages I don't like it, I'm not reading it to the end, then to tell the guys an idiot, oh, it's a bad book. No, I close it after 10 pages page and put the site get the next book You know, I mean it's like I'm never doing anything to be negative against somebody but you're unusually confident, correct?

Yeah, I would say I'm I'm I'm confident I'm not overconfident because I mean I you know, I I know where a limit is You know that because if you're overconfident you get arrogant that I don't want to be arrogant and I don't think I didn't call you arrogant I called you confident yeah I would say I'm confident yeah I would think that you would have to be in order to do some of the things that you do I would think I don't know how much doubt you've had in in choosing the things you've chosen with the conviction of I will conquer this challenge,

this is an opportunity. I don't know how much doubt you have had along the path. I don't know what looks for you like the toughest of times or the times where you thought about quitting or doing something different. No, man. I'm just saying, you know, I lost all my confidence when I was told that I going in the studio with you, you know. That's it. You were intimidated by all of this. Yes. I saw you, your hands were shaking a little bit.

Yes. I had to put makeup on because. Yes, I could see it. I know you're well covered that way, but I could see, I could peer into and see where your soul, where it was covered, but you haven't done very much doubt. Like when you start a job, what did the grind

look like for you? What, when you look at the beginning of your career or whatever it is that was difficult, were you so happy day to day surviving every day, trying to do the things that you had already chosen that you didn't do much in the way of doubt. No. And for me always is if this doesn't work, I can do

something different, you know, there is a way forward somewhere else, you know, and I don't know know what it is but it's just that confidence that I say hey if this doesn't work out I will be alright you know I mean as long as I'm healthy I've always was convinced I will be alright you know. Take us through the decision to come to the United States take take us through how easy or hard that was, 17, 18 years ago? I worked at Red Bull F1 and at the time they were setting up a NASCAR team here and they asked me if I want to come to the United States to help to set up the NASCAR team.

And obviously leaving Formula One at the time was not easy, but it was another opportunity in my life. I always had a few dreams. I wanted at some stage having my own business and always come to the United States. It was still the land of the free. I'm more than 65. There was a lot of opportunity in America still. I couldn't come because I didn't have the money or the means and I couldn't get a work

permit or nothing. I didn't have anything. So when that came up, I said to my wife, should we go to the States to do this job? At least we live a few years there and see how we like it. And then we always can come back. Again, I wasn't afraid to come back. If it doesn't work out, I just go back. So we came over here.

My NASCAR stint with Red Bull ended after one and a half, two years. I had offers to go back to Europe to work in motorsport. And I was like, no, I quite like it here. I like the States, you know. Said, okay, if I want to stay here, there is difficulty for me because being from Europe, from motorsport doesn't really fit in here to find just a job I didn't want to do. How about opening a company, which was another dream for me, as I told you before, to have my own business? I found two guys, which I said, hey, I've got this idea to open a composite shop, but I explained why it is a good move to do in the United States. And I got two guys coming on board with me. So we did it in three now.

Only two of us are left. One exited the company after two years and started the company because I wanted to stay in the States. That was the reason why I stayed here. And then obviously, as I said to you before, I came up with this idea to create an F1 team in the States because I thought there is individuals which could be interested in and I got that right,

that somebody bought into the plant. I mean you were instrumental in helping make F1 popular in the States, were you not? I don't know if I was instrumental. I think I helped it, you know, I helped it, you know. How do you do with praise? You seem to, anytime I'm coming close and giving you

something, you're like, I don't wanna be arrogant. I wanna. Yeah, exactly, I don't like to be arrogant. Yeah, yeah, I don't. Okay, but it's not better to say that you, and to say, first of all, you're. I don't believe it, you know? You do believe that you.

I go home and my wife does the opposite, you know? Right, right, she doesn't tell you the opposite that you helped influence F1 in the United States. She may tell you you're not quite as special as perhaps you think you are all the time, but on this one, I don't think that she would argue that you were influential about making this sport popular here.

You've been a leader here, so let's put that to the side for the moment. Where was Red Bull in its existence as a product by the time that you got there? Like what you're, if you're saying you're a risk taker, Red Bull, I associate with risk. I associate as a, as a brand, I associate the, the time that you're talking about as Red Bull

is adventurous. Red Bull is doing stunts. They are doing, Red Bull is doing aggressive United States marketing on this is an interesting brand on pushing the limits of how fast humans are willing to go. Yeah, no, Red Bull at the time when I joined them, they were already at a good place. They were, I think, about 20 years in business. I knew the owner a long time before I joined the company because I run a program in Rallingen.

Red Bull was the sponsor when they were still a relatively small to now company. At the time they were still a good company, but they were nothing like now. But then when I joined them as an employee for Red Bull Racing in F1, it was already a well-established company. There was not a big risk taking. I had a job in German touring cars at the time, and I moved from there to Red Bull to F1, and then came here.

And when they wanted to open the NASCAR team for me, I didn't know nothing about NASCAR at the time. I know it existed, obviously, but I didn't know who was who. And it was a complete, for me, it was something completely, opening a complete new chapter in my life, which I was very happy to do,

because I was hungry to learn something more. And for me, I would say one of the first Europeans which came over to the States to run a NASCAR team, which was pretty cool. I get overwhelmed by what you're describing because it represents so much change, and you're looking at it as Opportunity and learning and I'm looking at it and saying wait a minute Yeah, it's racing but f1 and NASCAR are not the same

So this person is gonna come and he's gonna run a business for these people and he doesn't actually Know what he needs to know here. I would find that overwhelming No, I knew that there was other people. It's not about me. There's other people. I could employ people and I got a good lesson here. Uh, when I came here, you know, you come from F1, you think, you know, at all, because F1 is F1, you know, Beneklov motorsport and all this is, this is, and

then I realized after months, it's not better or worse, NASCAR is just different, but the culture is different in racing in NASCAR than in Formula One. Totally different. Completely. Absolutely. But I learned that. One of them is American South and the other one is the world. Yeah.

But there is good things. And I say, it's not better or worse. NASCAR is just different. And I needed to accept, I accepted that not not needed, I accepted that. After a month or two, I said, wait, I need to understand their culture because I need to adapt to their culture because culture, you cannot change it in me. I cannot change culture. I cannot do that. I mean, culture is there a long time and there is good things in this culture. It's a different a different way of racing which I learned a lot in that time for when I came back to F1 with Haas F1 and bringing back to America

I understood when Liberty Media bought a Formula one American company what they were gonna do Because I was in American sports before so I've seen a lot of things done before you know Getting more entertainment into the sport. It's not only about racing a car, it's about entertainment as well. Okay, but there's American sport and then there's NASCAR. When you talk about culture shock of the American South, like I think of F1 having a certain racing elegance to it, and I think of when I think when you're talking to me about NASCAR culture, I'm thinking about I'm thinking about a gritty Southern tradition that comes from dirt roads a long time ago and is embedded in the American South.

So when I think of you coming from a different culture, not just. From another side of the world, but F1, this is not F1. This is a totally different culture shock for you. That's both the culture shock of America and the culture shock of going from the fancy, most sophisticated of racing to a grittier kind of racing. What was the culture like for you? The culture shock like for you?

It was pretty big, but I accepted it after months. I think I understood that it is a difference, and I cannot change it. So it is different, but the technical culture is completely different. As you say, high technology, low technology, which is not all low technology in NASCAR, but it serves a purpose. Why it is like it is, you know,

because you need to run a business, you know. You cannot spend millions in developing a car if you then lose millions because then you don't stay alive. NASCAR is doing, it's got a good business model, in my opinion, and it's an interesting sport. It attracts people. Why does people watch it? Because it gives entertainment.

You know, there's a lot of people watching it, you know. So, as I said, I learned a lot after the first two months where I tried to be the guy you just described, you know. You learned very quickly, no, I'm gonna have to change here, this is not going to change. They are not gonna change for me. And then when you do that, you start to introduce to people, to convince people, this is another way to how to do it and maybe we could do better introducing more engineering and I think I did quite a bit of that in NASCAR when I was there the one and a half year I was there because a lot of teams changed that way you know in the years later was I the first one maybe one of the first to do it you know for the team but everybody a lot of people followed because it had to be done. But it was for me, I learned, I think I learned a lot more than they learned for me.

There's great wisdom in what it is that you just said though. I don't know that a lot of leaders have the eagleness of realizing two months into being put in charge of something, of realizing two months into being put in charge of something. Oh, they don't have to change. I have to change because I've, I'm going to fail if I sit here and try to impress my ways. They make me fail. I mean, because they can make me fail.

But how did you learn that that quickly? Usually there's a stubbornness and a resistance and there's a a there's an ego involved in I'm running this why is it can't why can't I get these people to conform to my will you think about it and you think about it what they're doing you know where you want where you want to take it you know and then you have people around you I people are working for for for me there which were very smart you know but and they did it in the way they did it and I asked I had people working for me there which were very smart, you know, and they did it in the

way they did it. And I asked, I had just asked questions, why you do it like this? Just try to learn. I mean, as I said, I cannot change a culture. I'm aware of that. I'm very conscious of that. If anybody out there can say you can change a culture of a... it's just it's not gonna happen, you know. And I don't know why I realized that. I mean it didn't take me

a lot to realize that, you know. Because in the beginning, as I said, I came in gang ho, you know, this is how we're gonna do it. And then I realized, whoa, if I go hardheaded in here, I'm gonna be the loser because I cannot change the thinking of a hundred people, you know, which in, in, in, in my own team, nevermind the whole series where it's thousands of people. How can I do it? Who I am? Nobody here.

You know, I'm the last. I mean, a year arrived in America, you know, it was your coat, a euro, you know, you know, that, um, how have you noticed that the culture of Miami has embraced what it is that you guys are doing down here? I mean, you see it on the attendance. You see it on the following of people, uh, uh, how, how people is interested in the Grand Prix in, in a race, you know, it's just like, it created a vibe here because it's Miami.

If Miami has got a good show on, everybody want to be at the show. I was told you were the first year. I was dressed very poorly. I'm sure they will. You were kicked out the second year. You didn't get, you didn't get access anymore. I shouldn't have based on the way that I was dressed. It was very hot here the last time that I went.

I was here by the way. You know, I remember it. It's unbearably hot. Because I did, I did it it anyways and it was a big party and Miami does a big party well. They do it good, yeah, they do a big party good, yeah. And you, as the ambassador, what is it that you want people to know

about what it is that you're doing, why you love this, what it is that keeps you around this when you don't have to be doing it anymore. I obviously love motorsport because it gave me a lot in my life, you know, and I think it's very interesting. And what I want also to explain to Miami people, the Miami race is a very good one in the F1 calendar. You never can say the best one, you know, because there is more than one best one, to be honest. But it's very good, and there was a vision by the people here, by Steven Ross and Tom Garfinkel.

When they started this project, it was very similar what I did with Haas F1. They started, we do something a little bit different here. And they brought this race to, obviously, to F1, and said, we want to do this, that and the other. Obviously when it was presented the first time to the teams, it's not gonna happen, you know, what they tried to do is too difficult.

We have done always like this before. And they just did that. I wouldn't say they did it different, but in a good way, they raised the bar of Formula One race event as an experience. This I think was the first one where they really was all-around experience for a family or something wanting to go to a race because you can enjoy a lot of things here you know and what happened afterwards a lot of the other F1 races promoters you know the historic ones we call them, where what you get is you

buy a ticket, you watch a race car for two hours, then you watch a race car again for two hours and then you go home. You know, they say, wow, Miami is doing completely different. You go in there at nine o'clock, you go around, look at things, have got a lot of things going on, then you watch race cars, then you do something different with the kids, then you go again, watch different race cars, then you do something different with the kids, then you go again watch different race cars and then you do something different. You go and eat a proper meal, a good meal, then you go and watch. They saw that and they know that they need to change as

well because the world has changed in the last 20 years. It hasn't stood still, you know, and Liberty Media was when they bought Formula One, they brought it to America, I would say, and now Miami helps them to move it even further up Are you yourself an adrenaline person? A lot of drivers like to jump out of airplanes like big Adrenaline things are you about big adrenaline things or you like to be near? People courageous enough to go 200 miles faster in life than you are? I don't like to jump out of airplanes. I always check the exit doors now if they're bolted in, you know. I'm pretty safe on that stuff. But no, I think my adrenaline comes from organizing things,

not doing them myself, because I mean, driving myself. I mean, you know, I haven't got the talent. I'm, you know, honest about it. But what is it that attracts you to speed, to cars, to like, since it, as a little boy, you're sitting there watching on a black and white television. I don't know, I don't know that son of parents who are running a butcher shop, you will tell me how happy they were or weren't every are running a butcher shop, you will tell me how happy they were or weren't every day running a butcher shop. They had their freedom. Maybe they love that. But that boy

who's watching a black and white television and dreaming childhood things that a little boy dreams, he's fascinated by cars in a way he's fascinated by little else, right? He wants to fix cars. He wants to understand the mechanics of how those things work. It's an interesting choice to make as a young boy to decide what your career path essentially would be. If not at 20 when you were 12, you're feeling the calling of it. Not being an owner necessarily, that became a dream later in life to own your own business. The initial appeal is how do these things run how do they run so fast why is it that I like racing so much why do I like watching this on a black and white

television is it transporting me from the life I'm presently living it must be because I never had the temptation to be a driver to be honest I never had that temptation I never had it I just loved never had it. I just love the sport, you know, and I love the speed of the sport, I love, there is technology involved, you know, all that stuff, I just like that stuff. I was interested in, it's, I think the adrenaline for me gets going when I was running a team.

Obviously, when you go qualifying, your adrenaline gets going, because that shows how good of a job you did before, you know, to prepare everything, and how good of a job you did before, to prepare everything and how good you can execute. I get adrenaline things for this, but I'm not the guy which wants to do stupid things on a motorbike or in a car, that's not me.

I don't go, for example, onto race tracks to do fun driving fast. I'm not tempted to it. It's not like that I, I'd rather stay at home with my family, you know. Do you ever question the worth of what it is that you've dedicated your life to? I know you love it, I do it sometimes

even though I love what it is that I do as well, but dedicating your life to, I need to get a tenth of a second faster. I need to get, I need to get just a little, I need to get this technology just a little bit better so that I could go just a little bit faster. You've dedicated now 40 years to that pursuit? I don't regret any minute of it, you know?

I mean, we always have little regrets in our way, but in general, actually I'm very thankful to have had the opportunity to do this because not everybody gets it to live their dream, you know, and it was my dream, you know? So, and I'm still living the dream, you know. It's like, it sounds cheesy, I'm living my dream, but it is what we are doing.

Look, you've got half of the fight figured out to happiness in life if you're doing something every day that you love that much. So I have got a few questions for you. I mean, I'm turning now interviewer. The floor is yours, sir. What kind of questions do you have? I was told you grew up in Miami.

I grew up in Miramar, right near where it is that the stadium is. I grew up about five or six streets from where it is the stadium is. So how was Miami in the 80s, 90s? You would have loved it. Because this morning I answered, not knowing you and not doing your other. I said, what would you have done if you wouldn't have ended up in motor racing? I said, I would have moved to Miami and lived 1890s in Miami and maybe I wouldn't be around anymore.

Well, let's see. I think that you probably were in the eighties, Miami. This was the cocaine capital of the world. Look at you. Your eyebrows went right up there. There were a lot of people having a lot of fun in a lot of different ways. It was, uh, uh, now I, I grew up, my, my family was exiles. My life was very small. My parents kept me away from a great deal of temptation, but this was a, a dangerous, fun or rebellious place. Uh, probably, uh, more vibrant than, than it is now.

And you would have loved it. I see the gleam in your eye at the amount of partying that was being done in Miami because of people enjoying the good times in the 80s. I mean, I know some people which were here. It must have been a fantastic time. I mean, I would think there was bad things as well. They were all good. There were a lot.

No, there were a lot. There were no bad things. There were great, many bad things that, well, you know, our whole city, I don't, I mean, I think people know this, but basically the cocaine economy, all of Florida in some ways is a bunch of different very small spring break type towns, Daytona beaches. Ours is the money. Ours is the one that's covered in the cocaine money. In the, in what was the booming business of Pablo Escobar's cocaine empire, many of these skyscrapers that are built around here, they are built on how much of that drug money was literally

coming through Miami. Look at the giant smile on your face. It must have been a great time. Yes, it was a great, crazy time. Crazy time, not that I'm not trying to say anything. Look, we understand. There was the great many parties over here, and then over there the strip mall shootings that ended with a lot of people who were dead because a woman from Colombia who was running our streets and city was killing people.

So that part of that. I saw that movie as well. Exactly, yeah, there was a lot of them, yeah. But I was just a kid back then. I don't know what it's like. In the 80s, I was a teenager. I was born in 68, so I was something of a teenager. And then in college, I'm going to the University of Miami

in the late 80s. But the gleam in your eye when you asked me that question suggests that you knew what my answer was going to be. You didn't need the answer for me. I'm just confirming for you. But you lived it, I didn't. Yes, yes. I wasn't, I was not here, you know, so I need,

I always speak of people which are from here or lived at that time here how it was and they all said it was, you know, it was like in the movies, you know, like it says portrayed, you know. It is crazy to me as someone who has pride and love for how strange and wonderful a city Miami is having seen it grown into what it is that it's grown into It's crazy to me to see f1 here

It doesn't make any sense to me that something this large a spectacle of this kind of expense It it is one of the many things that makes Miami arrive as an international city in a way that couldn't happen anywhere else in Florida. No, I mean, I think you don't appreciate what Miami means in the world. Miami, it's the cool place, you know? It's a cool place for people from outside of the States.

I mean, in the States, everybody knows Florida, Miami, but outside of the states from Europe, it's a destination Miami, you know, it's always. The other thing that you would love is just how many different cultures are here. Like it is just super diverse. It's not, it's not like anywhere else. I don't think in the United States in terms of just how much different diversity that you have here culturally from region to region. It's just a lot of different people living together.

No, I believe that. And I think that's a cool thing, that creates the buzz, which is as good. It comes from the different cultures, the buzz. It doesn't come on its own. Appreciate your time, sir. Appreciate that you're doing this in Miami. I will tell the people again, crypto.com Miami Grand Prix, May 3rd through the 5th. You can get tickets at F1 Miami, gp.com.

I am struggling to read this without my glasses. Thank you, sir, for being on with us. Appreciate the time. Thank you, thanks for having me. Enjoyed the time. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Enjoy the time. Thank you.