The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - South Beach Sessions - Jim Rome

Episode Date: December 5, 2024

There's only one Jim Rome... and he's never cared if you love him or hate him because he knows if you have a take and don't suck, he “can still go hard.” Things are bound to get wild when The Jungle meets South Beach Sessions. Dan and Jim get together in Los Angeles to reflect on Jim's career as a pioneering game changer in a way he hasn't talked publicly about before. Jim gets personal, talking about what it was like growing up as a try-hard sports nerd and getting his start in radio, then realizing he wouldn’t ever want to do anything else. He also opens up about keeping true to his blunt and honest voice from the very beginning, the cost and regrets of being in the brutal business for decades (and the people he's pissed off along the way), and why his longtime audience is as loyal as they come. Watch Jim Rome's "The Jungle" LIVE daily on X from 9AM to 1PM PT / 12PM - 4PM ET and look for his FAST channel across streaming platforms including Amazon FreeVee, Plex, and Samsung TV Plus. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Get a credit card annual fee waiver and earn C plus points faster with the Scotiabank Ultimate package and bank more entertainment Learn more at scotiabank.com slash banking packages conditions apply Scotiabank you're richer than you think Welcome to South Beach Sessions. I'm excited about this one because this isn't in South Beach. This is on this man's turf. This man has run LA, a conqueror, for a long time and I admire him for a number of reasons and I moved that he would make the time in this setting for a couple of reasons. One, he braved two hours worth of traffic at the end of a bad and difficult work week. But more importantly, I've never seen you do much of this. I read the research notes and

I'm like, Jim Rome has been in front of me for 30 years and nobody knows shit about the actual real Jim Rome. Like they know the radio character, which is probably your real character turned up a few notches, but I'm not sure anyone knows you. So thank you because you know I like to interview and I'm imagining that you know I'm a pretty good interviewer.

So you're allowing yourself to be seen. Yeah, no, I appreciate this. I think you're right. Now I'm not pretty good interviewer, so you're allowing yourself to be seen. Yeah, no, I appreciate this. I think you're right. Now, I'm not an LA guy technically. I'm an LA native, grew up in Los Angeles, got the big break in San Diego, and then came back to LA. I've lived in Orange County for about 25 years now,

so that's why I had to brave the element. But you know what, for this opportunity, for this place, happy to do it, happy for the invite, and I appreciate you dude Appreciate you. Thank you Why is it that people might be able to argue they don't really know you after listening to you for four hours a day Every day for 30 years. I think that they do know me listen. Here's the thing I think that there was this misnomer that on the way up. Well, first of all, if we backtrack

I've done this a very long time. So on the way up there was this notion of all, if we backtrack, I've done this a very long time. So on the way up, there was this notion of man, that's a bad guy, that's a bad guy. He's that, he's this, he's the other. And I can remember when I first got into it, and keep in mind, this was way back before there was the internet, there was social media, and my family and friends would see this.

And they would see people either really love me or really wanna fight me. And they would take great offense. I'm like, hey, listen, this is what we signed up for. This is the way this is going to go. This is a show. This is the way I really am for better or for worse. However, I understand that I need to give them a show.

It's got to be authentic. It's got to be real. I'm not talking out my ass, but I'll tell you what I don't do. I don't come home and talk smack to my wife I'm not on 24 and 7. I Understand the job. So do they really know me? I think if you listen to me every single day in the car for 30 years and radio is such a one-on-one Median, of course, they think they know me. But do you really really know me? Do you really really know what's going on in here? What makes me tick and probably not

I'd like to find out a little bit about that because to pioneer for as long as you have, and I associate you with all of California and associate discovering you with, oh, I haven't heard anything like this before. And then what I grew to admire, do people really understand how hard as a solo voice it is to develop an audience?

And I don't mean an audience, yes, you can gather a crowd. I mean an audience that would ride with him anywhere because they connect in this space, which is different than all the other spaces. Yeah, no, I think you understand that. It's what you do, and I admire that a lot, what you do is different than what I do. I've always been, like I'm the last of the Mohicans

in the sense that I'm still a single voice. I'm still a single host driven program. And not because I have some kind of ego or because I need, hey believe me, I would love to get away from me. I kind of get sick of me. I would love to get away from me. But this is kind of the way I've always done it.

Now that doesn't mean it's the way I'm always going to do it, but this is the way I came up. To your point about the audience, you know like your show for instance, you have an ensemble, you have lots of people around you. My ensemble is actually the audience. I have this culture,

and I have this ride and die audience with me. Not everybody loves me, but they listen. But I'm telling you, one of the most gratifying things of all is, dude, I've got guys that have been with me 30 years. I mean, 30 years. I can document this.

When I first started in local radio in San Diego, they started to call and they're still calling. Now, on the one hand, from a business standpoint, you don't wanna age out that way. I need to find a younger audience, which is part of the reason why I made the move into streaming and fast channels and things like that. But it's, how do you maintain an audience like that?

I have a lot of pride in the fact that you have to earn their trust and get them to come back every single day. And man, they're rabid. They're rabid. Well, but you have to be an unusual kind of conqueror to still be thinking that you have to win every day now to get a young audience. You don't have to do any of that.

You could very easily, could have stopped doing any of it ten years ago and or you couldn't, not really. Well, not the way you're built. Both, yeah exactly, exactly. I don't want to stop doing it because here's my thing, I'm not one of those guys who's like that athlete that man they're gonna rip that jersey off my back. I'm like they're gonna have to rip that jersey off my back. If you were the guy, if you were the Grim Reaper and you came to me today and said, hey, yo, Rome, you've had a pretty good run,

but we pretty much don't give a damn what you have to say about anything anymore. I'd be like, hey, Dan, it's been a hell of a run. Believe me, I did way better than I would have ever thought that I would have ever done. If I walked off, if I walked out of here today and never ever appeared on any show ever again, I won. I did better than I would

thought. So to answer your question, well then why are you still doing it? Because it's hard. It's hard. I like it. I want to see where I still fit in. I want to see how do I still win. I want to see how can I solve this particular puzzle. Yeah, you were the guy. You were one of the first ones in. You got really lucky with timing, but now it's hard, man. Now everybody who's got this has got a show. Now I'm competing with everybody in the world. Back in the day when you first heard about me, there weren't very many of us doing it.

I had a pretty captive audience. Now I'm in a firefight to be seen and heard, and how do I do that without compromising who I am and how do I reinvent and evolve? It's still really interesting to me, and I still love the grind. And you know what, frankly, I still wanna, I love it. There are people that rely on me that work for me,

and I still wanna set an example for my kids, and I want them to be proud of me, and I want my friends to be proud of me too. And I wanna be proud of me, and I have something to prove to myself. I wanna talk to you about that, I want to talk to you about that. And I want to talk to you about it being hard. But before I do that, this need to compete at this level

on the hard things that has been inside of you from guessing 40 years longer, where does it come from? That's a good question. I've thought about this a lot. I don't know. I always had, I just knew, man. I had something, I had a chip on my shoulder from a very early age. So where did that come from? I don't know. I've never really sat in therapy, but probably not one of the cool kids in school. Maybe

didn't get the girl. Maybe, I don't know. I don't know. Like my father, and I know you're really good on family, my father was a Boston guy who had a small business, worked very hard, and he and I would talk and not always connect, loved him, but didn't always connect, but he would say to me, man, you should really relax. I don't know how to tell you how to relax, but this drive, like, I don't really get it. And he worked hard, so I don't even know

why he would say things like that, but he would say, I don't get it, but you didn really get it. And he worked hard, so I don't even know why he would say things like that. But he would say, I don't get it, but you didn't get it from me. So I don't know what it was, I just knew that I was kind of neurotic and kind of psychotic and knew exactly what it was that I wanted and was paranoid that I wasn't going to get it.

So I was willing to pay a price. I negotiated with myself early on that I was willing going to get it, so I was willing to pay a price. I negotiated with myself early on that I was willing to do whatever it took to get it without being immoral or unethical, but I would go the extra mile and it didn't seem like work. It was more painful for me not to do it than to actually do it. In other words, I went to UC Santa Barbara,

I would do internships, where I'd get up at four o'clock in the morning, everybody else is just, can we curse on this one? Yes. Shit can, you know, like it was a party school and I got mine, but it was a party school, but I had no qualms about getting up at four o'clock to work for free before morning classes.

And in fact was terrified that if I didn't do it, somebody else would. And then when I did do it, man, it was like a drug. I'm like, wow, I'm getting ahead. I'm winning, I'm feeding that thing. And I just had that chip and I just wanted it. I just wanted it. I've got more questions here

because I want to explore this with you. When you came in, you and I don't know each other. And I simply know based on what it is that we do, this person must be a maniac like there's simply no way that his show remains as good as he is when he is doing the same show for four hours by himself doing the same thing the same sledgehammer that that that because he wants to win there's no way that this person can be a sane person who is not a bit lopsided because he's been working in solitary confinement, crushing everybody for 30 years

and it's him, his computer, his talent, and four hours is a long time, dude. Like, by yourself, I couldn't do it. I did it for a little while at the beginning of my career and I got stamina for this stuff. And three hours by myself? No thank you. Okay, to be fair, to be fair, it's not by myself. I mean, I'm on there by myself, but I've always been extremely well-produced. I have a good staff.

I don't have any enormous staff, but I've always had kind of like elite fighting warriors. Like, there's a culture to it. There's a culture to it. And there's a whole side conversation about how the world has changed, you know what I mean? But I've always, we go hard, we go hard. So it's not, it's four hours now,

but when I first started, it was five hours. It was 7 p.m. to 12 midnight, and you can't even imagine the tweakers and the kooks and the nuts that would call me at night, man. That was wild. But that was my first big break. So I was on for five hours and you don't rate at night because you get preempted by games

and nobody's listening at night. And this was on a radio station in San Diego. And then the first ratings book came back and whenever, and there was no, nobody rated it at night. And I had like this huge number, huge number that wiped out everybody. And everybody was like, holy crap, what's going on here? So they quickly moved me to a day part,

four hours from five to four hours. And then everybody said, never work during the day, man. That guy, what he does at night will never work during the day. And it worked during the day. And then I just started building the thing out. So I went five hours to four hours to three hours. I'm like, man, I got this thing wired.

I'm gonna get down to two hours then get down to this thing wired. I'm gonna get down to two hours, then get down to one hour, then I'm gonna get down to like Paul Harvey 15 minutes, and then the Rome minute. But when I get down to the Rome minute, I wanna be paid the same amount of money that I'm getting for the three hours, but I stalled out at three,

and now I'm back up to four. So that's a long answer to, I haven't always done four, but I did three for a long time, but I've always been well produced and had a good crew around me, and I work hard. I'm talking about the maniac part of it. So yes, you're not alone on air

because there are a lot of people behind the scenes, but on air you're alone and well produced or not. I'm telling you that as someone who does some of this with an ensemble, I've worked in construction, I've done physical labor things, there is nothing as tiring as those four hours that I've ever done on any stamina level. There's not anything I've done that makes you as tired as what that is. Have you never had a cup of coffee? Do you, I mean, we have some help,

and I do it legitimately. Listen, like you did construction, right? So you understand, we understand how lucky we are to do this. See, that's the other thing, man. People, okay, here's what people don't get about me. Maybe now I've kinda, my whole thing's funny, right? I was the jerk.

I'll never forget, like there was an article written about me in LA Magazine years and years ago. I was kind of naive and this guy pitched it like, yeah, I just want to hang out with Rome. I want to follow Rome around. And this was when I was on my way up and things were happening fast, spinning fast. And I'm with this guy and I'm hanging out with this guy

and we do this whole interview and I let him follow me around for three days. And I'm like, that went pretty well. And then I opened up the article and the headline just screams, the jerk. You know, and then it was pretty clear that not everybody likes me very much. The funny thing is now that I'm at this point in my life,

now I'm just kind of the OG. And now I'm not that guy that everybody hates because they've moved on to other things. So. And where you push the edge, people are now, like not that it wasn't plenty edgy the way that it was But you don't get in trouble. You're not a shock jock. You're not nor nor are you doing takes to get aggregated? So it's not like you're right. There's only so far you can keep pushing the edge. Yeah, you're right. Well, exactly

Well, okay, but like just as you probably pivoted I'll get back I'll get back to the construction angle in a minute But just as you pivoted probably at some point, I could do that, I could go there. Like, I'm pretty cognizant of the landscape, which is why I went off of linear cable and tried to take this shot, and I'm not, I love this, now that I'm on the other side of this,

I'm not wedging in my pitch like people do to you and I when they talk to us, but this is why I made this decision to go to X and to go to the Fast Channel because people are now consuming their content in very different ways and I had to be real. I was not changing with the landscape. I was busting my ass doing that show, that horror thing you were talking about,

but I was not changing and recognizing that the world had changed. I had kids that didn't even watch TV. They never watched TV. I mean, that was their TV. So we did that. And yeah, I ultimately made that thing. But the point about I'm not saying things to say things,

I'm not aggregating, no, you're right. I'm not doing that. No, I could, I could. But the thing is, I wanna sleep well at night. I wanna look in the mirror. I wanna respect myself. My thing always was, have a take, don't to sleep well at night, I want to look in the mirror, I want to respect myself. My thing always was, habit, take, don't suck. Habit, take, don't suck.

My thing was never, hey, you know what? Say something that you don't really believe that you know will get you viral reaction and clicks and people will talk about you and you will provoke and you will incite. I just wanted to say things that were on my mind that I meant that I could defend and that I could back up and elevate a conversation. So I still do what I've always done, but I recognize what's going on out there. And by the way, I'm not judging. That works for people. That works for people. That's just not the

way I do it. And really quickly, back to construction. You're grateful for this job we get to do. Yes, thank you. This is why, one of the reasons I go hard and have always gone hard, I did get out of the business for a minute and it went badly, badly. I went in, I had a bad experience my senior year

in high school or in college where I worked for a radio station for nine months for free, happy to do it. And then the news director says to me, I got good news for you son, we got you a paying job. And I'm like, man, not only am I on a commercial radio station, not the college station, but a commercial station paid.

Hell yes, my time. He goes, all you have to do is cut a demo tape, play it for the owner. He signs off and we are gold, baby. I'm like, you got it. I knock out this tape, I give it to the owner and the owner goes back to the news director, my boss, and goes, I hate this kid, I hate him.

He's not on my station. And I'm like, I already am on your station for free once a week. And I'm like, that's a bad experience. I can't control my destiny. I don't like that because I have a family business to fall back on. So I go to my same father.

I'm like, hey, dad, I'm going to come to work for you. And he looks at me and he says, hey, son, the hell you are. I'm like, what? He's like, you're not working here. I'm like, what father doesn't want their son to be a legacy and follow in their footsteps? He said, me. You never once expressed any interest in this business. You cannot work here.

I'm like, wow. Because I was young and dumb. I just, I'm like, big house, nice car, president. That's what I want, that's what I want, and that's never what I wanted. So I wore him down, I got into it, he fired me. I went into sales, I couldn't sell anything. Dude, I was miserable.

Cold calling, terrible products, terrible territories. And finally one boss said to me, she's like, man, you are terrible at sales. All you ever talk about is radio. If I were you, I'd go back and do that. So it was that thing that you might've done construction. I tried to go into sales. I was terrible at that.

I have had an immense gratitude for all of this ever since. You're like me too, probably can't do much of anything else. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hey, who knows that I can even do this, but yes. But you've been sculpting this thing like a maniac for 40 years like so it's been in the business, but you were dreaming of this before then, right? Like you and you were a of this before then, right? And you were a lunatic in high school and college. Pretty much, I was always a tryhard. I was never exceptional at anything except effort.

Except effort. The only advantage I had, here's my advantage. I knew that I had no advantages. And don't get me wrong, I was an upper middle class kid, suburban kid from the Valley in Los Angeles, from a family that owned a small business. So I, I did not come up through the mud. Let's be real. But what I did understand was that there was nothing significant about me. I knew

no nobody in the business, really, I knew one person, I knew nobody in the business, I did not play the game beyond tennis in high school. I never not play the game beyond tennis in high school, I never thought that I had a good voice or a good look, I didn't think that I was really physically imposing. Nothing special about you. Nothing. Nothing.

You don't think anything as an entertainer, a broadcasting talent, there is nothing special about you. Nothing, nothing, nothing, but I was alert, so I got to school and I went to the radio station and I started to work and compete and I would see my peers I'm like, holy crap. That dude is way better than me. That guy is way better than me That gal is way sharper than me. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. This is your obsession But if you can't beat the people in your own room, I did the math. I wasn't even a J school I went to a UC school, which is just theory. Like there was no TV station there.

I'm like, if everybody else around the nation has the same dream on their various campuses and everybody in the workplace, they're not giving back their jobs, the hell are you gonna make it? Why you, why you? So when- Are you even thinking that you're particularly creative

at this point or not that either? I think at this point I'm sort of creative because I'm starting to formulate in my mind, hey, here's my thing, I figured this out. How are you gonna get a job? How are you gonna get a show? How, why you, why you, why you? And initially I could not answer that,

but at the same time I was formulating content ideas. Like, well, what if you did get a show? What would you do? What would that show be? So, I had to figure out the first thing. It was kind of like a three-prong thing. I was working on my mindset because I knew it was a brutal, brutal business

with a lot of rejection. I thought that was the only edge I could get if I was like, if I had more grind, if I wanted it worse. I worked on my mind, I worked on the answer of how are you gonna get a show, and then I worked on what would the show be. And I was already tracking all these things from the second I walked into the dormitory

my freshman year of college. That much I knew, because dude, you know what I wanted to be? I wanted to be a pro athlete. And incredibly enough, I figured that out in little league. For not long thereafter, that was never gonna happen. So how do you stay in sports? I'm like're not long thereafter, that was never gonna happen. So how do you stay in sports? I'm like you, like dude, we were obsessed with sports.

I never fit in in high school. I was just trying not to stand out in any particular way. And a teacher told me I was good at writing. I don't know if this is true for you or not, but were you standing out being a bit of a loud mouth or being a bit, were you yappy or a lot of bravado or were you standing out being a bit of a loud mouth or being a bit, were you yappy or a lot of bravado or were you? Not the bravado, maybe a bit of a mouth,

but definitely a nerd who wore it on his chest. Like I was the guy that went to high school. It was kind of a weird thing. Growing up in LA, I had three heroes, three sports heroes as an LA sports kid. And I got my love of sports from my Boston father. My first idol in the world, I'm dating myself now. I'm old enough to be your pop almost.

Gail Goodrich of the LA Lakers was my idol, my first idol. My second idol, almost simultaneously, was Terry Bradshaw because that was the Steelers run, 75, 76. My first real recollection of a sporting event where I just got hooked was the Immaculate Reception, 1972. So I'm a Laker fan, I'm a Steeler fan, and I'm an LA Dodger fan. So I was obsessed.

So I was the guy that would wear the Steeler gear on Fridays and everybody at school would be like, hey, Rome suck you suck And I'd catch a lot of heat on Mondays when they lost like weird stuff like I mean sounds so lame now But I didn't want to go to school because I knew the abuse I was gonna take but I wore it on the sleeve So kind of a nerd but kind of a mouth not one of the cool kids, but man. I didn't try to hide it I was obsessed with sports bullied at, bullied for being sports dork who knows everything.

You're standing out by this thing that you care about because I've not met a lot of people like you, but this tracks according to some of my successful friends and where it is they got a lot of their identity early on after struggling with whatever the formative years are, but you know you want this one thing and If you focus on this one thing and you knock everyone else out of the way when you don't think you're special You'll go grab all the things you want

I don't know if happiness is among them because being this maniacal also has a chase in it that I could see a lot of joy Falling by the wayside or or at least some empty making an appearance because you're so obsessed with this one thing and you're never gonna Fill all the holes with just this. Okay, a little wistful, and I'll explain that to you in a minute. If your whole thing is like, hey man, I know your deal, Rome. I know why you want it so badly.

You were bullied your whole life. Not true. I will tell you a really interesting story though. I saw a kid and it was years after when I'd kind of made it. I don't remember exactly what it was, after when I'd kind of made it. I don't remember exactly what it was, but we were on the tennis team together. He's like, man, it is good to see you, bro. I'm so proud of you.

And he was a good kid. He's like, I'm so proud of you. I'm so proud of you. He's like, man, I wonder what all those other guys would think now. I'm like, what guys? He's like, you know, all the guys that talked a lot of shit to you and were taking advantage of you.

I'm like, and I mean this truly, truly. I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. He's like, he looked at me kind of sideways. I'm like, no, really, I don't know what you're talking about. I would own it if I did. So I don't have that story about man, that dork got worked, that dork got bullied. Now I will own this, not the cool kid for sure.

Very small group of friends, didn't get the girl, but I would love to give you a really clear answer. I think it was just kind of a combination of things that all added up to I had something to prove and I was gonna get mine and I wanted to be proud of me and like, yo man, I'm all right, things worked out pretty well, how you like me now? But I can't point to that one thing.

That one childhood trauma I cannot point to. The reason I'm asking you for the roots, it doesn't even have to be trauma because I don't know how one gets impacted by that kind of relationship with their father, for example. But you have an uncommon need to compete and win. You would not have competed and won the way you did if you were not greedy and gluttonous

about the amount of desire you have for this thing still that makes you want, no, I still want to be better than everyone else. And so I'm asking you to explore where that comes from. I disagree with that. I do not still wanna be better than everyone else. And so I'm asking you to explore where that comes from. I disagree with that. I do not wanna be better than everybody else. I wanna be better than this last version of me. I wanna prove that I can be better than I've been.

I wanna prove that my best work is in front of me and not behind me. I wanna prove that I still got it, that I still have that fire in my gut. It really is about me, and then it's about business. Let's be pragmatic, I need an audience, I need sponsors, I need partners, but I'm not trying to beat you,

I'm not trying to beat him or her, I'm trying to win, I'm trying to prove me right, and those, I'm not out against the haters, you know what I mean, they're gonna do it hey he was gonna hate I'm trying to prove to myself that I can still do this honestly I'm not trying to dominate anything but my process and show that him and I can still go hard I can still go hard folks it's the holidays Christmas is around the corner. No better time to get with family, get with friends, and enjoy an ice cold Miller Lite. It's what we do. Me and my dad, we pop

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like Miller Time. Celebrate responsibly Miller Brewing Company, Milwaukee, Wisconsin 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. Fewer calories and carbs than premium regular beer. An important correction that you made there so I will ask this, did you come about this attitude because I don't believe that's what 20 year old Jim Rome would have said to me about winning and I don't know if 30 year old Jim Rome says it, maybe it is, I'm going to get better every day I'm going to learn or grow. The bravado I saw from that man on television full of himself because he was getting a lot

of acclaim in an age where it would have been difficult for anybody to have that much success, I saw someone on television as a young man who's puffed up. I still think the reason that I'm here before you right now is not, it's not that. And I'll tell you why. If it were that, it would have got away from me and I would have been about that and not my process and not the standard. I do the same things that I've always done.

I wasn't puffed up, but I was hungry and I had a real chip on my shoulder, a real chip. And I wanted to win. And, but it was not out of ego, it was just out of pride and craft and performance. And I can do this and I earn this. And then you have to understand, there were certain points where the thing changed

a little bit, right? Like I came up fast. No, okay, I didn't. It took me a while. I was in Santa Barbara for three and a half years trying to get out. Resumes, phone calls, everything. Trying desperately to bust out of a small market.

It was scary. I thought maybe it might not happen. But finally I got the call and then things happened quickly when I got to San Diego. Got on the air, got the call from ESPN2, got on the TV show on Talk2, booking A-list guests. It was all great.

How old are you? 1994, so 30, 29, 30. So tracking pretty well. But ready for this, feeling like you're ready for this. Deserve earned, I'm this good at this. It seemed, I was still green, but again, I was doing stuff that had not been done before and I had a belief in myself and my process.

And an audience. And an audience. And I was, look, ESPN found me. They found me in California. I was making enough noise in California. And again, they did wanna set up a studio in California. Presses in California. But you were one of the only ones.

You were representing California. I don't know in the history of sports media if anyone has represented Southern California the way you have coast to coast, hundreds of radio stations for many years. Certainly on the way up. Certainly on the way up. But I think your thing about, hey man, I watched you when you were young. You were different. I was not looking to conquer the world,

but I was looking to win. And I was looking to, I was trying to do the best I possibly could, honestly. I really was day to day, do the best show. Here's the thing. I learned this at the dinner table growing up in a family that owned a small business. I heard this every single night.

Take care of the business, the business will take care of you. Take care of the business, the business will take care of you. Take care of the business, the business will take care of you. And I told the staff, take care of that show. Take care of that show and the show will take care of you.

And to your thing, last thing about me being puffed up and having this bravado, here is my thing. I did convince myself of this. I was still looking for separation. I was still trying to ask myself, how are you different?

How are you different? You're really not that different. All right, well, here's how you're gonna be different. You're gonna be bold. You're gonna be aggressive as hell. You're gonna push the envelope and you're gonna do smart interviews, tough interviews, and you're gonna talk some junk, man.

And you're gonna stand your ground and you're gonna be right there. So I think that's kind of where that energy and that vibe and that bravado came from. I thought that I had to be that guy to make it, to make it. If not puffed up then, how does this Jim Roam, who just turned 60, look back at that 30 year old Jim Roam? And in what ways is this Jim Roam different? Yeah, obviously a little more mature.

Obviously would not have called Everett Criss a fifth time, you know? You and I have talked about that in the past, but that was just different. It was a very different time and the format was a little bit different. And we get older and we evolve. I used to make the joke, like I don't know if I told you this last time we talked, but I used to say, I used to think when I was 30, man, believe me, the last thing this world needs is a 50-year-old smack talker. Nobody's listening to that, and yet here I am 60, still talking a little bit of junk,

you know? But, but, but, I am also really cognizant of I don't want to lose MPH. I don't want people to say, yeah, man, you know what? I hadn't heard Rome for a little bit and I checked him out, dude, bad show, lazy, he doesn't look the part, he doesn't sound the part. I don't want to be that guy stumbling around

in the backfield damaging legacy. I don't want to be that guy. But you know you're not. You know you do a good show every day. You care too much. It's when you stop caring about it that way that the show will suffer. And then you'll know. And then you'll know.

I just can't believe that you still care at that same level because the level of stamina that requires, team or not, for 30 years, I'm marveling at it from over here as someone who's got a work ethic and through his 30s was working three full-time jobs. So it's not like I don't understand what it's like to want your thing so badly that you're going to get it no matter what. Okay, okay. All right, so let me say this. I appreciate you saying that.

Here's the one thing that if you were to say, well, what do they not know about you that maybe they should know about you or what do people not know about you that you would like them to know? That I'm not that smart and that it's hard work. And I've always worked this way. Going back to that thing I said about if I'm wistful about anything, all right, that I'm not that smart and that it's hard work. And I've always worked this way. Going back to that thing I said about if I'm wistful about anything, all right, so I'm not lonely.

I'm not, the pursuit of this is not lonely. I'm a little wistful about this. My son, Jake, our older son, once said to me, hey dad, I get that you're not like other dads. It's okay. Which I interpreted to be kind of a drag that you're not like other dads, it's okay. Which I interpreted to be, it's kind of a drag that you're not like other dads. And what he meant by that is, I get up at 4.30,

I go to work, I grind out, I come home, I get my cardio in, we have dinner. Now when the kids played ball, they played high school baseball and travel ball and all that, I never ever missed anything. But, Dan, I'd go into that home office and I'd grind every single night, every single night.

So we weren't, we never went out during the week unless it was business related. And that was not that nine to five life. And I think that, you know, my son, I think would look at other dads and be like, Hey man, how come we can't do stuff like that? Well, dad's got to work. So is that selfish? Is that wrong? And then I would say, yeah, but, but,

look at the house that you're living in. Look at the neighborhood you live in. Look at the schools, the public schools, the best schools in the country that we're sending you to. And then his response was something, because he's such a great kid. I never asked for that big house. I never needed that nice car, you know?

And I don't want to over sell it because we're like this, you know, we have two kids that are amazing and I set a great example and believe me, the kid, the kid's all about the grind. Jake, we talk business, I set a really good example for him, but if I'm a little wistful about anything in this whole thing, is that commitment. That's what it took for me to achieve what I achieved

and still be in the game right now and I'm still working like that. And to be honest, I don't know that everybody around me who works for me understands that even. Like, you know, the world's changed. Like, why? For who? For what?

Because this is what I've always done. And then when I'm done, I'll be done. But you sound like an old veteran from the 1920s talking about how kids today don't understand what work is required here. No, I want to be clear about it. I understand that the world's changed. I'm not that guy.

I'm not like, yo, man, I'm not Gran Torino. I'm like, get the hell off my lawn. I understand the world has changed, but what I do understand, it's not even from the 20s. I go back even a few years. You know, I'll give you an example. I don't wanna give you that example. Um, I, they, they, the rules of engagement have changed.

There are boundaries. I'm willing to pay greater price than maybe some others are. And I am cognizant of this is the way the world is right now. And yeah, I'm the old guy who's still grinding and still loving it. Let me ask you what that felt like. How did that land on you from your son? I understand that you're not like other dads.

Yeah, that was, like I said, it did not land well. Luckily, again, like I said, they're funny, the kids are different. So we have two kids, one's 23. The reason, forgive me, I'm just gonna stop, the only reason I'm gonna stop you is because what I imagine that means, without knowing your family dynamics at all, is that Jim Rome was so singularly obsessed with this while

having a great relationship with his family and his kids and coming to all the games, but because this required so much of him that sometimes he couldn't quite be as present as he needed to be in whatever the places are that he needed to be most present, because this requires 20 hours out of 24 hours in a day content brain. Fair, fair, fair. And yes, that's why I would be wistful. Now, I just don't want to misrepresent,

that's a true story, that happened. I don't want to misrepresent it in the sense that now he has my grind, he's proud of me. Now he, because now he understands. Now that he's in the business, he works for a production company, he's not on the sports side, he's more on the news side,

he wants to be kind of a documentary guy, but now he works those days. Now the conversation is, yo, Pop, I work as hard as you. I'm like, yo, Junior, first of all, super proud of you. Super proud of you. You don't work quite as hard as me, and you sure as bleep haven't done it for 40 years,

but yes, you learned your grind from your old man, and I really appreciate it. But to your point, yes, because I went to that office at home every bleeping night, and stayed up late, and got got up early and did it again because that was my only separation from people like you and everybody else. This is the point, this is what they don't get.

Rome, Rome is, Rome's a smart ass man. He shows up, he cracks open the mic, he talks some shit, he does a pretty good interview, then he goes home. Man, I wish, I wish, I wish that's how that was, but that's never been how that's been. So that's the only thing, and dude, I'm not being a martyr. I get it, man, I am so lucky.

Part of me's like, wait a minute, I've done, I've lived a whole life talking sports and interviewing athletes, they pay me to do this? That's a joke, man. I hope they never find out. But I was gonna make sure they never found out by paying that price and doing the work. It seems to me a bit insane

that you would almost take as insult the idea that the reason you conquered this world is because you're talented. I think. Like you want this more to represent like, no, this wasn't about I'm going to out-talent you. I'm going to outwork all of you. I think that I am not, I'm not a hack.

I'm not a hack. I'm not without talent. I'm not, I had a plan. I had a plan and I had a vision. But I got real lucky with timing, of course. I know that. I was born at the right time. You know, a lot of these athletes that we talk to,

guys that are like my age are like, damn man, look at the money. I'm like, you can't help when you were born. I got in at the right time. However, I had a plan and I had been thinking about that plan and it was a bold plan and I was not afraid to execute the plan when I got the opportunity for the plan.

So I am not without talent, but I was strategic. And I know there were people more talented than me that abandoned the fight before I did. I figured out it was a war of attrition. And if I can outlast them, I can stay in the game. And if I get my shot, I can win. So I'm just saying to you, yes, I have some talent. I'm not a hack, but believe me,

I came up with people in local markets that had far more talent than Abandon the Fight. What advice? And I know they were looking at me like, I know I'm better than that guy. I know I'm smarter than that guy, to which I would say, you're right, except you Abandon the fight and I stayed in.

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to the reason for your success is? Great question. I think at least on the way up, at least on the way up, again, the self-awareness, but what I recognized, and I think you'll understand this, I was gonna do it differently, and not do it differently just to be different. I just recognized something.

On the way up, there was only WFAN and there were some major markets that had some major shows, but there was almost no content. So I grew up in LA and I'm listening to like Dodger Talk. It would just be post-game talk and it would be something along the lines of, hey, when do these gonna happen in the next home stand? Great show, I'll take your answer off the air.

And I'm like, man, that's whack, that's boring. What kind of show is that? Not very interesting. So I- That's the same thing I did. You're gonna outsource the work to Hector on a mobile and you're not even gonna do the job for yourself? You're just gonna take a call?

No, it would just be some, exactly. Well, and it'd just be some dude flexing his knowledge of the pitching staff with a giant voice. I'm like, that's not a very interesting show. That's not, me and my guys get around, we talk shit. We just, if I ever get a radio show, I'm gonna make sure it's entertaining. I'm gonna make sure that it's a show. So if there was another thing that I was good at, I think that I, for whatever reason, I just started doing something that had never been done. You know, I've even heard you give

me credit for this that my whole thing was I was declarative. Like here is my take. Here is my opinion. What is yours? What is yours? Let's do a show here. Let's do a show. Well, you were sort of before what the one of the forms that you pioneered is that before debate television, you're sort of aligned with your audience and all of you are just sort of arguing with sports but you're all on the same side. You weren't against anybody. You brought in the culture of the take almost starts with you in sports. It's either you or Mike and the Mad Dog, isn't it? I don't know who actually started it.

I was on the West Coast, so I didn't hear those guys, but I had obvious respect for those guys because it was FAN, believe me. Then one of my goals was to get a job at FAN until one day I was sitting over the ticker tape, the old AP machine, when I was in Santa Barbara and I'm reading it, reading it, reading it, and then it comes across 690 AM San Diego going all sports

and then I went full press. All I did was try to get a job at that radio station to get my shot. But I also had this weird thing that I did back in the day, not so much now, but we had a thing called the glossary where I would just see things a certain way and we would just drop names on, that's where the Chris Everthing came on.

You know, the Knicks were the bricks and things that seem really lame now were very cutting edge at the time. Oh no, but it was a language. It was a vernacular. You developed, look, I mean, one of the very cool things that you developed is it felt like Southern California

had a national show on the air and it had a Southern California attitude trained by the circus leader who's making his audience go and compete on Clever. Go – That's it. That was the point. It's the favorite part of my audience is when oh my god these people are smart, they can write, they're funny and now they can produce the show even better than we can

because they're competing to be clever against each other. That was the whole point. I had something called the huge call of the day where I knew that not every call was good, but I was trying to get them to compete and then the winner would either win something, but they would get their call played back at the end of the day.

I was trying to cultivate an audience of competition and help me create the content. Look, I was not looking for you to do any of the heavy lifting, but I just knew, I knew that you could always count on my consistency and my crew's consistency, but damn, how dominant would this product be if I could get them to bring their game up as well? And they didn't all do that,

but they kind of embraced the culture. The show has a culture. Even the ones who fail and are bad you can sink into that and I always say give me an air give me an F. Give me an air. Give me an F I don't want to see see does nothing for me. Give me an air. Give me an F and F is an A Along the path when did you stop and and and Enjoy with gratitude where it is that you arrive because something that perhaps people don't understand, and I don't know how calculated this was.

If at the beginning you're just finding ways in high school, get me in front of these people, I've got a plan, you figured out from an angle how to conquer the business of syndicated radio, and I don't know how calculated that was, is that you or a good I don't know how calculated that was. Is that you or good management team? Oh no, that was fascinating. That is, I'm as proud of that

as almost anything we've ever done. The short version of syndicated radio is this. I started on 690 AM, this was a 50,000 watt blowtorch in San Diego. The guy who owned that radio station at that time owned the biggest radio network in America, but before deregulation, there was like 19 stations. The guy who owned the station was John Lynch Sr.

The father of John Lynch, the GM of the 49ers. John Lynch comes to me one day and says, "'Jim, I think,' "'cause now I'm a star on this station, Jim, I think your show would work. And I think it would work outside of this market. I want to syndicate your show. So now there is no ESPN, there is no Fox,

there is no CBS, there's no network. We built that thing door to door. We went door to door. We started with four stations that were I think already in his group that he made carry the show. We had a guy that was under contract who had lived either in Kansas City or Houston,

a radio vet named Brian Purdy, who was a great guy. And Purdy was under contract, but was not working. And John Lynch said, you got to work, I'm paying you. Go clear stations. Purdy would go around the country banging on doors and try to sell the station. And we went from four to six to nine to 12 to 15. And every time we added a station, it was beautiful, man.

There was like this hazing process and the existing stations would try out the new station. And it was, every day was different, man. It was incredible. Point of the story is, I've had this nationally syndicated network now for 30 years, but we built this thing brick by brick. No, but hold on, the exciting part you're talking about,

you're going door to door, city to city, you're growing your business, growing your thing you care about, and you're pioneering, right? Like you're, this is an unusual thing you're doing, you're selling yourself door to door, you're making yourself a business. It's not just, you're now is an unusual thing you're doing you're selling yourself door to door. You're making yourself a business It's not just you're now both executive and talent because you're this is I don't know if you're somebody who has business acumen

But this is cert. This is a surgical strike you became Annually you were being Reportedly being paid more than any athlete because you figured out this game and very few people have made more money in syndicated radio than you have, right? Possibly. There aren't many. You know, I understood the business because I always treated it like a business

because I grew up in a family business and I was not an idiot talent that let it get away from me and always treated it as such. I understood the business. As an example, when I was coming up, I'd look in the parking lot. All the nice cars were driven by the sales reps, not the talent.

Like talent's like, hey man, none of these people exist without me. When I kind of inverted it and understood that, no, we don't exist without them. They need to sell the show. They're the ones with the nice exotic whips, not us. We're grinding. So I always understood that.

What was really interesting on the way up business-wise, when I started to make it, when I was in local radio, man, they'd make me endorse everything. And I would just, I'm like, I would never use that. And they're like, you really? Just do it. And I would just, I'm like, I would never use that. And they're like, you really? Just do it. And I really resented it. Like, I'm like, they made me,

they used my voice on everything. So when I finally got enough leverage, I went into the GM's office one day, I'm like, hey, you know what? Guess what? I'm never doing another commercial again the rest of my career, ever, ever. That's how we solved that problem.

Now we no longer have to worry about what I will and won't do. I'm doing nothing because I had a hammer at that point. Finally, finally. And then Premier Radio Networks bought my show. That's how we kind of built the thing out after we started to syndicate. And there's a guy who's my manager,

who's an icon of the business, Craig Kitchen. And he approached me totally differently. And he's had enormous clients, you know, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck. He's built some incredible businesses. He ran Clear Channel back in the day. He sits me down and he goes, Hey Jim, now that we have an agreement,

great to have you. Listen, can we talk about commercials? I'm like, yeah. He's like, no, I know where you stand on this. Let me explain to you how this could benefit your brand and your business if you have these brand partnerships. And he didn't jam it down my throat and bang me over the head with it.

And then I understood. So yeah, I've always understood kind of the business and never thought that I was more important. It's business, man. It's the show is business. I understand this. As show business, I could make the argument that your entity is the most successful

in the history of sports radio. If I combine everything, longevity, ability to do it over a sustained period, audience sustained grows, and also totally conquered the business. Dude, I'm shocked at how much you like me, Dan. What's up? I'm impressed and I admire that you're-

No, no, I mean it's not me being flipped. I really, really respect and admire you, and I really respect you saying that. Thank you. I don't know. Longevity. Longe longevity, I do have that. I, you know, there are bigger shows, there are bigger platforms, there are people with bigger followings.

I'm just worried about me, I'm just worried about my show, my people, you know, making that show better. But I'm talking about your legacy, I'm talking about the thing, I'm talking about the thing, I'm talking about the thing you've dedicated yourself so much to that sometimes dad's not gonna be present because dad cares about this thing in a way that makes him not like the other dads.

But at the same time, I know that you want that to be a thing and I would own it, but I'll give you an example, this birthday that I just hit. So the kids come in, my wife Janet, who, a whole different deal. I married the best person I ever met. Full stop. I married, I'm looking you in the eye,

I married the best person I ever met. She was in the business. When I met her, she made way more money than me. She was way more successful than me. She actually tried to fire me when I first met her because she was a VP of human resources. She throws this party because she'd never heard anything like me, right?

VP tried to fire you, VP of human resources. Because that same station, all of the corporate executives had a say in programming. It was really bizarre, like accounting, HR. They would sit around this conference room table and talk about the product because the corporate flagship station for this national group was all in San Diego,

and I show up out of nowhere and I'm just talking junk. The point of that was, I don't even know what the point of that was, where were we going with that? That she almost fired you, or that she needed to fire you because- No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, the birthday, so the kids, you know, that point that you're or that she needed to fire you because- No, no, no, no, no, no. No, the birthday, so the kids. You know, that point that you're trying to get me to admit that they don't-

No, no, no. They, they- No. You were an absentee father. No, no, no, no, no. Let me correct myself before you go any further on this. The reason I keep asking you about father and son stuff is just because so much in sports

has father and son stuff in it. I did a television show with my father. Yeah, I know you did. These sessions are something where I'm always probing around in the childhood of people to figure out who they are, how they are, where they are. Exactly, the generations are so interesting. Like, again, my father,

I got a whole father thing to tell you too, if you want that story, but I'm in this because of my father. He loves sports and passed it on to me. My son, who that one day said to me, I'm not sure, or you're not like all the other dads, but for this birthday, last weekend, my wife gets rent a house in the desert.

One son, Jake, comes in from Wisconsin. Our other son, Logan, comes in from Boulder and we're all hanging out. It's awesome. It's awesome. I'm more proud. Here's what I'm most proud of in my entire life. My entire life.

And I credit my wife almost exclusively for this because luckily I did well enough that she was able to quit her job, which she loved and was good at. And she was beloved. Everybody loves my wife. She's amazing. But she wanted to stay home and raise her kids

because that's how she was brought up. And she wanted to be there and be active in everything. And she was president of everything and was involved in every part of their lives. And there's no way these kids would be what they are without my wife. So there is no resentment, man. I love these boys, they're great dudes.

The thing that I'm most proud of in my whole life, and I get this a lot, Jim, your boys are great. They look you in the eye. They have conversations with you. They're respectful. They're not entitled. They're great kids. They're great dudes.

They're charismatic. What an amazing job you guys did. I'm like, well, what an amazing job Janet did. And I had to bad cop him. Somebody had to discipline him. But that I'm most, most proud of. So I would say to you, dude, if I was really, really regretful

and man, I wish I could change that, I would own that, but just a little wistful. But if you sat with these boys, they would say to you, we love pop. We love pop, we're proud of pop. This is why I'm asking you all of this, okay? And I'm not interested actually in regretful or wistful, but I did not have kids. I have dedicated my life to working maniacally at this thing and then I have a bunch, an

economy that sprouts around me that ends up being a thing I'm taking care of like a baby. I did not have children. If I had had children before my present wife, I would have been too much of a maniac at work to even understand what it meant to have to be present at events, not in attendance, not in attendance, present at events, because daddy's not thinking about work over here. Okay. And so when I see your success. I disagree with that on one level, because you don't have kids, you don't understand this,

but one of the other joys of my life, and this I do miss, those kids playing high school baseball, and you would have been present. You would not have been on your phone, you would not have been making your been present. You would not have been on your phone. You would not have been making your phone calls. You would not have been working your sources. If you had kids, and whatever it is they did,

even if it was not baseball, baseball was great because I love baseball. But whatever it is, you would love those kids so much, I disagree with you. You would be locked in. Now, once that event was over, man, you would get back to work. You would get back to work.

But I disagree. You would not, I understand, maniacal. You would have been locked in. And we still miss those days, man. And I'm not even talking about big time baseball. I'm talking about Irvine baseball, where we were okay. But man, oh my God. Watching my kids play baseball was better

than almost any day I've ever had at work. It was awesome. You would have felt the same way and you would have been present. I know you would have been. Well, I don't think I was mature enough then, right? I don't know that. Okay, we were older parents too, I will say that.

My wife and I are definitely older parents. So we got a lot of that maniacal stuff and whatever else we did, we got out of our systems. So we were financially more secure and I was established professionally, fair question by you. So we were a little bit older when we had kids. So by the time we had them, we were ready to be focused. Get a credit card annual fee waiver

and earn C plus points faster with the Scotiabank ultimate package and bank more entertainment Learn more at scotiabank.com Banking packages conditions apply scotiabank. You're richer than you think. Do you look back at anything in your career? I'm not talking about isolated instances, but just choices you wished you had made differently Not so much choices, but here's what I do wish now that I've hit this age. I wish I had been, and my wife disagrees,

we talk about this all the time, because everybody in the world says, if I had known then, what I know now, what I would have given. And you know, I'm really amazed. I talked to a lot of young athletes like you do, and it's the mindset, you know, because they're groomed early on.

Like, so I think they're more present and they're more locked in and all the cliches. They are where their feet are and they understand the standard is the standard. My regret is that I did work so hard, so long, that I was not more intentional or focused in the moment at what was going on to appreciate it, to slow the clock down.

And then I looked up and I'm like, there's almost 10 unaccounted four years. Didn't we live in that neighborhood for nine years? The hell happened in those nine years? Let's see what happened. I got up early, I went to work, I kept my head down. I was present for the family when I came home, but then I went to work and then I did it.

And I just, that was my process. Like, damn, there it goes, 10 years. Damn, now I'm 40, now I'm 50, now I'm 60. That's my only regret, that I didn't have a better appreciation and understanding every single day while I was in it, because I was always moving on to the next show the next thing because You know this on a daily show you go back to zero every single day

Yeah But a lot of joy gets lost in there like I've been wanting to be somebody at this point who finds a lot more Joy around all those so why don't so why don't you because time is short now that you know this why don't you? I'm in the process. Right. It is an active exercise that requires some work because the way I've been wired has resulted. And you have a beast to feed.

You gotta feed that beast every single day. You have this beast you have to feed. You have a whole staff, you have a whole thing. You have a whole, people are invested in you. Lots of people are invested in you. So how do you feed the beast, but at the same time take a step back and enjoy what it is you've created?

It's hard, right? I have found it difficult, but I'm being more actively conscious about the idea that I must. What's the point of it all? Right. With, I mean, time is short. I just lost my brother recently.

You were, if I may betray a mild confidence, you came in just off of your birthday saying this is the first one I've felt. It stung a little. This one stung because you've always been the young voice. You've always been out. It's a ridiculous thing to say, but you started as Romy in California, 24 years old, and in some ways you've always been that dude, even as you get to 30 and 40 and 50. It's funny, I talked to Trevor Hoffman,

you know what's funny about it, it's like you were ahead of me on this, but now that we streamed the show, we had not done that. So now everybody sees me, and I talked to Trevor Hoffman the other day, because the Padres and Dodgers, and I used to talk to Trevor when he was in it, and he Romy'd me the other day.

Somebody Romying me at 60 is kind of funny, right? Well, but I mean, it's still, you're a voice for 30 years, and to Trevor Hoffman, who grew up surfing around here, like you were representing him to others. And I was there, and I was in San Diego. But to your point, I always thought the dynamic was incredible. When I came in, everybody I interviewed,

I was younger then, everybody I interviewed, I was younger then, everybody I interviewed was older than me, and then I was older than a lot of them, and then I interviewed guys over the course of their entire hall of fame careers, which I always thought was amazing. Then I started interviewing guys' kids. Like a guy that I was really, really good with for years was Howie Long, and we didn't start off good.

He was one of those guys that heard me on the radio. Didn't get it. Oh no, he threatened to kick my ass. And I remember Janet being terrified because I was gonna interview Howie in person and in a remote. And she's like, he's going to break your face. I'm like, maybe, maybe.

She's like, what is the matter with you? I'm like, I don't know. It is what it is, we'll find out. But then Howie and I, he was funny. I'll never forget Howie's like, yeah, you're bigger than I thought you were, like ooh, roasted. It was really funny, you know?

But he was such a good dude, but then when I would talk to him, he would talk about his kids. And they were kids. He's like, yeah, roll me a taste of them. I got a nine year old who'd beat your ass right now and come to find out probably whether it was Kyle or Chris. They's like, yeah, Roman, let me tell you something. I got a nine-year-old who'd beat your ass right now and come to find out probably whether it was Kyle or Chris, they would have, you know?

But my point is, I interviewed guys. I was the youngest, your point is. And then I would interview their kids. I wanna stay in it long enough to interview grandkids, man. I want, there's somebody, somebody needs to get pregnant so I can interview a grandkid. I've already interviewed kids. Well the next step is the last couple of months I've been eulogizing people.

That's the next step for us where we're eulogizing the athletes whether it's Matumbo or the... How's that make you feel? I mean the mortality of it. As you've just turned 60 and as every day is the Super Bowl because it matters to you to keep your standard where it is, yeah, I can't help but think about the mortality, not of our careers, we've had wonderful- No, a step more important than our careers, our lives. But what we've dedicated our lives to and what it is that's gotten missed in the pursuit,

right? You don't have regrets. Well, similarly, that I've arrived now at needing to actively activate joy so that I don't at 60 have what you're saying if I've got one wistful thing. The wistful thing is, ah, I would have enjoyed that a little more instead of like I got to get ready for the next day. See, it's good you know this. You know this. You're passing it you're passing it down five years ahead of me. You know this but it doesn't make it easy and I don't have the answer but you know this so you're five years

ahead of me and what I love about my 23 year old he knows this already although he's grinding you know so he's watched this and probably learned the do's and don'ts. But the sooner we figure this out, the better. But I would argue that, and I think you're a more talented person than me, but we didn't get here. You and I are not sitting down having this conversation in Hollywood, if not for our process and our standard.

And is it a blessing and a curse? Yes. Yes. The chip on your shoulder, I still don't understand, though, process and our standard. And is it a blessing and a curse? Yes. Yes. The chip on your shoulder, I still don't understand though, because I haven't had, I didn't have one of those. So when you keep saying why I've had since I was X years old, chip on my shoulder. You know what?

You know what is my favorite question ever. And I have a side hustle to my side hustle called the reinvention project, where I talk to really high achievers, because I'm trying to learn. And it's my favorite question. It's a guy, there's a guy named Ed Mylett, who's a really good friend of mine, who's huge in that space,

and we talked about it on his podcast, nature or nurture, nature or nurture. I do not know the answer to that, nature or nurture. Are you pre-wired to be like this? Are you built to be like this? Or frankly, we didn't come up, I didn't come up through the mud, but I've talked to a lot of athletes

that overcame a lot of adversity. There's no way they would have the chip or the hunger had they not come up the way they did. So nature or nurture, I don't know the clean answer, but I think it's both. I don't really know where it came from. For a while it went away, and now I'm trying desperately to get it back.

Put it this way, I'll give you something. You think that it makes you miserable. Some of the happiest times of my life was when I was in college fighting hard and winning and my self-esteem had never been higher because I was all in and making good choices and doing the right things. I don't think that's unhealthy. In fact, I felt damn good, man. I felt great. So I'm constantly trying like, hey man, can I flip that switch? Can I go back to being that guy? Probably not, I don't have that same energy,

but could I be that guy? I did the funniest thing, I did the commencement speech for my son when he graduated the J-School in Wisconsin, and I worked that thing hard, I worked that thing hard, I took great pride in that. I'm looking over the kids. Some tears while writing it, some tears,

a few tears while writing it, can it get in there? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no And my son's real careful about he doesn't tell anybody who his old man is because he wants to be his own guy Which I really respect unless maybe it benefits him and he'll drop that name But you know he did he's been doing this thing with Donald driver because he's in Wisconsin He's done several shoots with Donald driver And he wouldn't tell him who I am and he finally dropped it on the other day and they had a kind of a good moment Point is dude. Here's how the speech. Every kid in the audience was either hungover, drunk, wanting to get drunk, and wondering who the old man was.

Hey Jake, who's your old man and what's he doing up there? And every parent was like, go Rome, go Rome! Because they all knew who I was and they wanted their kids to get the message. You know? So time, time. So did you crush it? Did you crush the commencement speech?

I thought that I did pretty well, but I don't know, those kids didn't, they're not, okay, a number of them came up afterwards like, really good speech, that's what I needed to hear. But I think most of them went running for the bars. But the parents loved it, if you ask them I crushed it. Jim, I appreciate the time, I appreciate the work for many, many years. Yes, I'm sorry I embarrassed you by honoring a career

that doesn't have a lot of parallels in our business. Don't you dare leave, let me walk here and think that I did not appreciate that or that I was mocking you. Dude, I have such immense respect for you. And in a life where everybody was going well out of their lane to crush me, you are one of the guys who has defended me and supported me and said, look, I understand what that guy's

about. I understand what price that guy paid. Dan, I'm not leaving this room if you think that. I appreciate you so much. Thank you. I am not in any way disregarding what you did, what this represents and what you said. Don't you think that, because if you think that we need to continue this until you don't think this. Okay, well we'll do it again.

We'll do it again. No, I'm not leaving if you think that. I don't, no, you honor me by driving over here and my support for you throughout your career I don't know, you honor me by driving over here and my support for you throughout your career was genuine because you were doing something differently your way and you had a bit of a creative bent to it that I wasn't seeing in a lot of places and to the degree that you developed a community around.

If we end this right now, are you gonna be like, why did I defend that guy that whole time? Because I had him on our show and I complimented him and he didn't take the compliment? Dude, I was just playing. Okay, I'll accept the compliment. It means- I'm not great at that.

No, no, you are great at what you do. And I deem this an immense compliment that you wanted to spend time with me. And I really appreciate your support because there are a lot of people that were not in any hurry to give me any credit. And by the way, when you know this business, people don't give each other credit.

And I do more so now than ever before because we're older, man. I know what it takes. And there's enough for everybody. There's enough for everybody. Isn't that the truth? So I need you to know. I... I got it, received. I'm sorry for being bad at receiving.

Thank you, sir. Yes, I want you to know that. I don't want you to think that I did not appreciate that. All right. Also, you've been a crazy person for 35 years, Jim. Like a crazy person, a glass-eating crazy person. It's just how I am. I don't know.

I don't feel like it's anything out of the ordinary. You know what I mean? No, it's unusual. It's unusual how I am. I don't know. I don't feel like it's anything out of the ordinary. You know what I mean? No, it's unusual. It's unusual for 35 years. It's made, well, yes, there are no, who's the next closest to Jim Rohn? I think there are people in other walks of life that work much harder than me.

There are maniacs that get up, if I get up at 430, there are maniacs who get up at 230 and they lift and they do crazy things. I don't know, I just, this was my way of staying in the game. Hey man, it got me to this desk. Congratulations, the height of the show business ladder. Look at this, Jim Rome has finally arrived. This was uncomfortable how loving it was, yes?

Everyone's made uncomfortable. It was really loving. If it is, you can talk some shit. It was really loving. You can insult me some more. No, but it was it was Syrup all over the place. I know who loves who more I love you more. No, I love you more You know, you know why? ridiculous You know why because we're a couple of dudes that have done for a long time

Do we have to do it apologize for that? I'm feeling a bit of... I mean it was just so loving. Alright, so take some shots man, talk some shit. Let me know what's wrong with you. I gotta have a take. Folks, it's the holidays. Christmas is around the corner. No better time to get with family, get with friends, and enjoy an ice cold Miller Lite. It's what we do. Me and my dad, we pop a Miller Lite, we cheers. It's a family tradition. From family gatherings to holiday parties with friends, this season is for enjoying time with the most important people in your life. Make the holidays even better with Miller Lite, the great tasting light beer for people

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